The Express.
London, England, 1847-12-07 00:00:00

z

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.

HOUSE OF LORDS.—MoNOAT, Dec. 6.
The Earl of SHAFTESBURY took hie seat, et psivatl"
Speaker, at rive o'clock.
PUBLIC BUSINESS.
PETITIONS.—By Earl Pogroms, from the Waterford Union; for
the continuant* of the relief workn—The Bishop of Sr. Assam, Hutu
airborne Hospital, Durham, prayhtg for the consideration of the
ersdnert pursued by certain members of the
r. Roman catholic tier f o in
behind, in denouncing persona from the alta
CONDUCT OF THE ROMAN CATHOLIC PRIESTS.
In reference to the petition presented by the Bishop of St.
Aaaph from Shoehorns College, Durham, in reference to
the papal bull " in ca' Domini," and complaining of the
conduct of the Irish Roman catholic priests,
Lord BEAUMONT believed the bull in question had
been yearly renewed by the Propaganda ever once the esta-
blishment in England of the reformed religion. The object
was merely to denounce what the Propaganda considered
error. The bull was a mere matter of form—a form which
he admitted was absurd and ridiculous, and it would be a
subjeet of congratulation if in this country, as well as in
Rome, all such useless forme were abolished. In the present
instance, however, he believed the whole difficulty resulted
from the abeence of diplomatic relations between the Sove-
reign of this country and the Pope of Rome
Lord FARNHAM had certain questions to put to the
noble marquis the President of the Council, in reference to
certain denunciatory speeches reported to have been recently
delivered by sane members of the Irish Roman catholic
priesthood, calculated to incite the people to the commission
of crime, and which in some instances had been almost im-
mediately followed by the perpetration of murder. He
would mention certain facts, and give the substance of
' certain speeches as they had been reported, which, he thought
the house would agree formed a case justifying him in put-
ting the questions, and hoping for a favourable answer. He
disclaimed being influenced by any hostility to the govern-
ment, or any desire to throw obstacles in the way of their
difficult task of governing Ireland ; neither was it his object
to make any attack on the Irish Roman catholic clergy as a
body, many of whom had distinguished themselves by their
exertions in relieving the distresses of the people, and in as-
sisting the authorities in preserving the peace. He referred
in terms et the highest praise to the conduct of the Right
Rev. Dr. Ryan, and the Rev. Father Mathew, both of whom
had denounced crime' and used their influence to prevent it
The influence of the Roman catholic priest. possessing, as
he did, the right of administering absolution and extreme
unction, if it was powerful for good was unfortunate' quite
as mar
se he ave. dodos shoirieg *at that ioflreee
lemellessllgroftememelliredlinftpoons, be weld ail their
lead hips attention, in the fret plain, to two wedeln wield
had bum: made by Roman catholic pries's, tram the plat-
forms of public meetings, and then to instates it which
bad been denounced by them from the altar. The
persona
to which he would refer, was delivered by Arch-
deacon Laffan, at a public meeting, at Cashel, on Sunday,
the 14th of Nov., a period when the country was in a state
of great alum; when every loyal subject—Roman ca-
tholic as well as protestant—was exposed to great
danger; and when murders of the most atrocious
character were of constant occurrence. This reverend
gentleman was reported to have mid: . He looked around
him, and he saw an useable., of his brother Tipperary
men—the good and the noble-hearted, though, yerhapa, ex-
citable Tipperary men—(This was cheered by his audience.)
—who were called by the Englishmen murderers. (Here
there were groans.) The Saxon eceundrel, with his bellyful
of Irish meat, could very well afford to call his poor, honest,
starring fellow-countrymen, savages 'and assassins ; but if
in the victualling department John Ball suffered one-fifth
of the privations to which the Tipperary men were subject,
if he had courage enough, he would stand upon one side
and shoot the first man he would meet with a decent coat
on his back. (Cheers again.) But the Saxon had not
courage enough to do anything like a man; he growls out
like • hungry tiger. (" Hear," and laughter.) Look to
that fertile valley teeming with luxuriance and beauty be-
neath our eyes—taking in the richness of the district to the
Devil's Bit, and from Barnene to the princely Shannon—
inhabited by as line a race of mess, and by as lovely and
*Mous a race of women as any to be found in the
meatd—with all this richness, all this beauty, and all this
gembame, what was it that made Tipperary so often • scene
of Wei p The cause was evident to all men's eyes—land-
IMAM was the demon that blasted what was meant for
t=but landlordism which, without mercy, would
ovels of the poor man—which had sent the boos
and anew et the land to fertilise and enrich the forests and
prairie dAwarica—which bad seat the year man to starve
In weekleeneos, er to die by the reed Ale beneath the canopy
of Hesomit, sod under the min side Gad led sent to fee.
illietheenoilk. Eli he shod lip be deism of the mot-
hew? Ski Jidda l" Anima iselemen She ores chair-
men et ibe mein bed shoe Mated in his pleas in another
haus, that Hilts tee. giehmen had nuniftued his speech
in the eras elm* le sheebi have felt it his duty to remon-
state with Yon, eel t him fret psesseding. It would
be seen that though' randeaoon Isle did not denounce any
by name, kit denunciations wore levelled against
Cdl7rds as a clam Another rev. gentleman speaking at a
meeting at Caatlebar, in Mayo, on Nov. 25, had, according to
the reports of hie speech, stated that " the poor were lett to
the mercy of those heartless extortioners their landlords ; that
the poor were artrificed to the cupidity of the landlords ;"
1 and " that as the proprietors woad not interfere to improve
the condition of the tenants, he hoped the tenants would do
se themselves, for there was nothing remaining for them but
the wild jios of revenge." The Irish were • quick and
laleWgent people, and readily understood th& hint thus,
glen to them by this priestly agitator. Whaphance, he
woad mak, was there of administering the law is Ireland,
whoa ii. p..ple .rsee thaw told by thwr clew that they
mast look for redress to the wild justice of revenge ?
(Hear, hear.) He was fully aware that a great
regpsemilkilitar rested on the Irish, and that there
ems imenteat duties es well LI rights attaching to
he pommels' et property ; bat as a petrel role, In
me sonaW_ hell those duties been mere faithfully
bin in biked lig the tablet Ledford.: and t7i=
aia.'ilir Velhelo mai= amilhiwite), thosyli net wlei.
SIMI te the tenfarte of his ilesalab
iirgelellaldi hie dada es •• landlord as siteiteally as ray
de endig 4114,==.7. he it wm In vele dam to
the eddies between lesdhe
211.1liellot the anneteres or spindlurs of the emery,
ailLan me led to Mt te resew it Mem
nier ale ewe in whit pedalo& been h-
kn
i tiatoZaiLiiM he eimesqvinees wide bed ha-
Theleteass wee en ezarrestinie
intriost he serderit a peer mum nentodCellaghen,
einombed else els tenths yen the pee who was ma.
aka and. Idol we asked, "Did yea denenes the war-
ded mon he the slier ?" Answer: " I ad."—Clusine:
"cols. ?" Answer: "On Seeey, el aless."—Quesdem_:
w Whin was the man murdered I" drew :"At 5 o'itteit
ea he mine erecting."—The next ONO he would allude to
nes hot of the denumistioa el one of the best Leash sod
led limed and eked mee in Ireland, Major hake
wires murder hod oho followed the dissidation.
On tanish the Let day of October, the Re. Michael
hoolloson theented Milder Mahon free the altar,
illalleliala, _ as
acoragurollttY7:he chapel m tkaa
il w`?lPf
1111.11..... g.... lives after this, it's a wonder." The Witted
was shot ilmt hoes dim thet eiress.
rrtr, He veil ina3la their Wade with none
'dela boa essiber kite mitten by the inedenten who
et hate*. midi Mika
_Mahon at the dme elle ant-
deg, la that War it wee shied dmil pp a the faid emeriat
'the den* the while esereeden el the morked gentle-
rim teed ma herb could mho the peek esuketable.
TY fah lei pomaded to nese from tow lease written
Okla* IMleben impostively in 1546 and 1846, by the Rev.
lb. AVDIMMNON Waking in terms of high eulogy of
de.
,eri iseduct to the poor, and mirky that
ihiseghout a long life nip- he fruits
OE W besnelenor. The remaining doseme with
width he would trouble tie house win sie in Major
atemoiwe handwriting, in which the writer stated
heard that the following 'anginas bad been
the altar concerning him : ' There is Major
Kam here frr omyou all the week, net looking after you,
lot MEW htesegL He returns, finds his property all
clloeiiiiial eiseelatal aleasining, burning your houses, and
the mesh in the roads." He would leave it
Sio of lima lie as were learned in the law to say
ethernet or no soh know and conduct were punishable
di low. He we the last man to advocate stringent
except when there ens stringent naceenty,
tee
esetended that that necessity existed at the
went. (Heer hear.) The noble marquis the
et the Council had, on • former evening, said that
elelenen prevailed in "some" districts in Ireland. He could
=
he noble marquis and the house that the whole of
was tainted with • deep rooted conspiracy, which,
eldieugh it broke out in different places, was every where pre-
lot i sag unless beat down by the strong arm of the law
Soma eventuate in the rain of the country. He (Lord
remiltem) had no personal object to serve in urging the
Ada el affairs on their lordships. He had no personal fear,
Mot be did sot think he we going too far in saying that
Whom Tens every des sommitted in Ireland which would
be a &gem to New or Madagascar. (Hear, hear.)
Is mild then eye the govenunint, upon their lordships,
an up. the oats hew et es they valued the
▪ dhow Isphsi and and above all, the
esteiftMds,l give gealw to the law, rateisvi seem diem et these mauler evils. To •
ion the he wee not a erten view or standing
slime fa advenatieg semi 2111181111 M, he wooed gall their
leehbfg otheion to ea tome from the Debits trir
edoerwledged organ et theseveraerat fa
filitdit It wee said, " Sonata* at be done te put down
thii erode." The organ it the sense crow he would
' aill it, the bad section of the Zeman catholic clergy, spoke
esmiliwhat differently. His lordship reed en extract
from the paper be resnisk the pupae of which
woo thglllllllllll4 need net meet the coientien
tithe will the plink*" approlimes demonise.
They posple) law INN day dm polies pest in Miley
air landlord in bendy beer, dkaaising
= and terabit oat eddied people to peek ea the
reed ,• and if, on the nod, they saw a Womble rosin,
red by misery, emelt a sd t, it was not likely they
vent& mist in his eaters. They weld et, sod in the
miter% maks they ought net. Ake that be had
=std the denamenb be had nod, he tread that he
have the ammo. of the goverment het means
weed be taken to provost the repetition of soh kompme.
The aside lord esseleasd by ' whether the
=id sehmand the bogeys he bad quoted Ie ries%
et dr sew* with a v!w to a criminal premed= i
end. what If the kw we act at present ailleient hr
the it wee intosid to apply to pullemne far nap
qui: of LANEIDOWNII NM that the noble hod
• ow owe with a knee ell dimness, whisk 111111
M mks a deep kipiemion es he Irma. Mod
let he (the Memplo et Insidowne) with it wee
Ms le Say, het be hi. not billetillhaer te
iii adds lord lel saillsit. Tier bo ,
\ be mil 'Ay, *id be ins ale et sgbdia. mow
. .

dim diseased( net_ mly at public nestiags, but in
Wetly Melee to the meet nerd pupate,
been red, and sentiments had been
, most dangerous and mischievous to the
well-being of society, most iooonsistent with the sacred
damn, of thoee who uttered them, enci ,7ith the Christian
ate which it was their boast and their tliTofeethm to
iitish. (Hear, hear.) He feared that tbc noble 131Z"state.
moo -.ere too 4114 ; but if the noble lord asked him What
seeps led been taken by the Irish government la the mattalt
he ma act able to state that any steps whatever bad heed
=
This much he might say, that the subject had at-
the most serious attention of his noble friend the
Lord Lieutenant of Ireland, and that he would, if necessary,
put himself in communication with his law oßeere. But he
was not in a condition to state that one sworn information had
been submitted ; and their lurdshipe wall knew that there was
a wide difference between reports generally mending, of
language need at any meeting, and the certainty and accu-
racy noesmary for the purposes of criminal prosecution.
(Hear, hear.) Thais circumstances formed the difficulty of
the ease, and all he could say was, that his noble friend was
ring his hest exertions to bring the participator' in such
estrageo—he called them outrages, for they were incentives
to outline—to condign punishment. Nor, let noble lords
think that the law as it at present stood! was wholly
without means for the purpose. The statute book was
clear on the subject. In the tint place, be believed, that
to excite persons to violate the law was in itself, by the
common law, a misdemeanor. But the law did not stop
there. Not =ay years before, an act had been parsed for
the express purpose of applying to Ireland the law punishing
persons who should excite to outrage mid violence, and
making such conduct a felony. It might be desirable that
persons in Ireland should know exactly the amount of cri-
minality they incrumml. The 9 Geo. IV. enacted that any
person who Should rumba others to commit felony, whether
erred by rearea kw or by statute, each person should
i handl he eaWilielled guilty of felony, and be prosecuted as
ma esesseity behre the feet, either before or after
the enterilma et the peiselpal. There was also a subs,.
Er* est In whisk the toms were, if possible, stricter.
awe UP Gest TV. snared, that any person who should
Ulla Sr 11WISINage, er who should procure another person
M sommffinsmier, should be guilty of capital felony, and
bony seneled should suffer death. It might not be wholly
rains et make them quotations. An apprehension had
goes forth, that the acts in question did not apply to Ireland,
but they specifically did, and he would take upon hicaself
to say, that they would be enrolled in Ireland wherever
possible. (Hoer, hear.) The Lord-Lieutenant would use
everyeurtiesie are the requisite information, and would
ernes the of the law in every cam ro in which p-
temaMica at • (Hear, hear.) The tio&W
ins laid whether it was Wended to seek fee mu
=than ware maimed In the bill then before the other
I pediment ? His (the Marquis of Lansdowne) was
act premed at that moment to say that any extra powers
would be asked for; bet this he could meet undoubtedly
say, that, the moment it should appear that the milder
measures were insufficient, that moment her Majesty's
advisers would come again to the house and ask parliament
for more effectual measures, andhe thought thattheir applica-
tion would not have less force from the fact of their having in
the &AMA-Ince tried the mildest expedient whithwas possible
under the circumstances. (Hear, hear.) He coi0:1 not con-
clude without expressing his pleasure, that while the noble
lord had found it necessary to condemn the language of cer-
tain members of the Roman catholic priesthood, he had at
the same time borne testimony to the general Christian de-
meanour and exemplary conduct of that body. As fez as
his emperWoos went, he could fully corroborate the noble
MI. ile had during a period of unexampled waft men
the Roman catholic clergy perform their duty is the rest
aside, pions, 'and disinterested manner ; and if it woes so.
emery to visit some of the order with punishment, it berm
the more necessary to honour the untiring, zealous and
Christian exertions of the great majority. (Hear, hear.)
The Earl of MALMESBURY said, that from one end of
England to the ether there was but one sentiment of indig-
nation at the crimes which were every day being committed
in the sister country. But even this indignation was super-
aided by the horror evinced at seeing such crimes encouraged
by ministers of God. (Hear, hear.) He regretted that the
noble marquis had not given them any hope of more strin-
gent measures. With respect to the language alleged to
have been used in chapels, he thought it might be possible
to get at proof of its utterance, seeing that it must have been
spoken in the hearing of hundreds of persons.
Lord STANLEY said that although there were portions
of the statement of the noble ma quis to which he had lie.
toned with some satisfaction, as indiat rig en his part, and,
no doubt, on the part of the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland, a
determination, as fares passible, to grapple with the great
evil so forcibly brought under their lordships' notice by his
Webb Mead; yet he had, at the same time, to regret the
indefinite and indistinct diameter of the &newer given by
the noble marquis. The questions put to the noble marquis
were Mein distinct, definite questions. They brought
be-
fore their lordships in the strongest admire, yet colours not
Moore than the occasion warranted and rendered neomesry
math in which it was quite clear that either at public meet-
ings, or in the awful form of denunciations from the altar of
God, there had been put forth on the part of some of the
Roman catholic clergy, of soma individual members of that
clergy.—far be it from him to attribute such atrocities to the
body in general—incentives to murder, which, in general,
had been immediately followed up by the execu-
tion of the sentence. Under them eircurestaneet, it
11 was not too much for his noble friend to ask
the government whether the facts stated had been
I communicated to the Lord-Lieutenant of Ireland; if es,
whether the Lord-Lieutenaut bad referred them to
the law officers of the Crows • if so, whether it was the
opinion of those officers that the law, as it stood, was strum
enough to meet these cuss- end if seek was net the *puma
of these oilmen, whether it'wee the intenties of the govern-
ment to seek to reed sod strengthen the law i (Hear,
hear.) He rem say, that theist no sedge of these ques-
tions bud her Mem by his WO friend, he was earried to
hod that the nein asilipil Wall not able to Mate wham at
me titre feats bad bra senmted to the Lord.Lierentrell
(" Hear, hear," from Laud Lowiewsra) Oh I shen be wed
I le understand that they boa been onmeneated to Lad
Olerades. This, homwa arid se mower to the ern
Larlisaid was Molar the err bad besaaniniliell to
'w
diem et the erre in Inland, and dame" in
the-ap& the bole unmated the peerentissa
eteilleMeg nadir I (Hear, hear.) Tali this
grodea, as he reehool, the dle mantel e wee
not able, without aolastaisatka with the -I.leate-
mot, to answer. Such belay the het, be hoped that kis
softie friend woad not dew lie ass to rest as it stew, but
would, after the brat el thether week, renew his emestions
distinctly with ramose to time particular cues, se thus :
I Was it or was ft net true, that In the year 1838 a Emma
catholic priest mutate a landed proprietor in Ireland. in the
mom laudatory teem of his charity, his brevolorm hie
mum heart, lus labours of love for the emmumbas_Espuls.-
1 titan? Wes it or was it not true, that In ANION leas that
mnei, from the altarof God, denomederemin leaded
as an absentee, a tyrant, and en I Was
E`.l7-Z-it not true, that this same this
ram landlord as worse than Crom art said " Doss
this me yet lire I" (Hear, hear.) Wes or wes illastroe.
that fa earning out of chapel, after list elitinsmakilfige
a renestable person who had heard It 28101•Meell millE,
iii
" This man must be immortal if, after eh • be
minim ?" (Her, hear.) Was it or Iris It the WSW
within 48 hours alter this denunciation, that • e
humane, praiseworthy man in every respect-
_-• Ms
11... his am(ghboan, was eat off by the
den /
beau.)_ If these die wise ime, then
lid • sigitt to ask whetter they Mahan to
the kw diem or the =Wit in .td—erlsethee, is the
Caet lime diem, that priest was I y, iftif the
mas es Jerk he wee morally, is the el Mel and
me, golV et the lied et the manure,lllbleva--
whether, it soh waft& *them, it MO by the
government to peemethe the wee who bed deemelei the
altar of God by thhothating teem hen therthe to
murder —or whither, If orb nee not Orr epithets
it was interim* so to mid sod dompthth the
law r to arts it to Neel those Wades, eases ?
(Hear, bear.) The sable amp& had, so hi gra- .
tiled him by resift wroth thise already on the
book, which mild to soh othomos ; but then care the
farther owidiry bow for was it in the power sewriss_eiried
to enforce dim laws, and bow far was it sesil aim
dient to do es ? He had himself bed the Mem or, pr-
imps, rather the misfortune, to ad Ow a ties as
secretary for Ireland, sad was quite aware et the adulasi
' of obtaining. effectual rides*, in wielt mat, vitae
of prosecuting with any bop et MONIS • N=
priest, beim a jury een may lest ems et the
lower ern el Bow .wthosztastortiserwooi
range diem en theme- sib et own
but he still thought they ball alO right to knew brim
it was the davit of gthassient to attempt, at beak is
effect a prosecution el mob offender', because, how-
ever lamentable ea the teen hand the fallen at
a prosecution, yet, en the ether hand, its Wham
in consequence of the asiesssinst et a jury would go far to
enlighten the parlimomontned Imill of this emery rto
the real nature of the Mffilee and the extort et the
i
remedy to be mend (Hear, bear.) Whatever ihe ob-
stacles n the way-,-he regeriol it as the der duty et pews-
mint to run the o di so valor minnittO, rather then
hays it to be saw n& that in dire sad ioilar err the
government won powairs, or time, whether the
of the statute book, they were sited tatter, sad Cil‘th:e.
was prodkel impunity for Ames of this deseriplima.
(Hear hew.) He must mitoses the hope that Ida Oak
fri.na'wewiff repeat his emedians alter lb. Met el an in-
ternal sdisient le amide the meth pimple as asmaaaasto
with the swarmed a Maud. (Sea, boar.)
Lord CAMPBELL said that his applenes es • law
officer of the crown told kin, what the Mile Lees ii
mos as • Ws sairster et the sews night else law taii=
that to resevr ark querieth ea these sew maw
such eireenolompie,
_wadi le In the
rent, end prejudicial to the erase ed IXei
law Aare- d the crown mat bar sunset dm .
them he Milling to the ing et thdr Jalimat the abeam
*dim Impsad ipso tbmierszart or. berm they AU
net sat vlth the 1. '
tradel al eiee En the let 171 hires :111:1111v= to
M(11400 To the quindsm, whether the
a= solliest to most oath asses as them, 11724t1
nply, abudeede edielent. (Hear, hear.)
=lll.7.mig be go &egg net my balsam* le fer-
al a felony voodend Ss party ft* the
wesomaLlothse. the Willa Niels el
laritement an
ere, in Ironed se to of
to the same prallment
with the .dent putpdrater of the dines; tol lo the
ales et wader, 'rim --4th the !Law.is
.stiorpt the
pasionimat et
mot flora
lbs. the oral dm '
)Mlt fos Mao f
ale, " • or 7
er MOM to that
' Oros belie a
te ihe ewer of 4n.
Mr, le Weald WWWW,
leara. mi be MI s.-

~„~.

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