The Express.
London, England, 1853-07-12 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.

ROUSE OF WHIM—MONDAY, RIX IL
The LORD ettliNCiLLUlltook his seat at 5 o'clock.
RUMOURED ENTRY OF THE AUSTRIAN ARMY
INTO BOSNIA.
The Earl of MALMESBUIIY wished to ask a simple
question, which he would Lot preface by any observations,
sanely, whether her Maj. sty's government had received
say authentic account of Om entrance of the Austrian army
into 11, Shia; and. if so, on what plea they had taken such
• step?
The Earl of ABERDEEN said that her Majesty's go-
vernment had aot received any communication whatever to
that 'Ave
The Earl of DERBY (who entered the house shortly
after) said he understood the noble earl opposite had stated
that her Majesty's government had not received any infer.
motion ss to the correctness of the telegraphic despatch
which had been received, intimating the entrence of the
Austrian army into the Turkish province of It snia. He
wished vi ask whether they l.ad received, either now or on
any former occasion, any information from the Austrian
minister at this court, intimating the possibility of any such
event ; and, if an, on erl.at grounds it could be justified ?
The E.:I of ABERDEEN—As far as direct intelligence
is coacerne.l, 1 have received no such information of any
sort. I hare seen it stated M various papers, but I have
received no such information; and I believe my noble
'head the S •cretary of State for Furcign Affairs has not
received any such intelligence.
MANNINO THE NAVY.
Lor.l COLCHEST Eli gave notice that on Thursday next
be would ash if the government had any obj ctim to lay
before the house the evidence %bleb bed been given before
the a nunitter on the subj. ct of manniug the navy.
PROMOTION AND IREIIIiE'MENT OF NAVAL
OFFICERS.
The Earl of HARD WICK E rose, pursuant to notice, to
mill the attention of the house to the order in council of the
25th June, 1/411, be ,ring upon the promotion and retire-
ment of officers in the Navy. He was not desirous
of making any alteration as to the junior officers;
neither did he wish to iuterfere with the r.gulatimis
as to holi.pay ; but he would cell attention to the
effect produced by the order in council which regulated
the Pereira. of • post captain upon active service, so a.
to enntsle him to receive the rank of admiral. Ile must
serve six years in time of peace. finer years in time of war,
and five years in time of war ahil peace in a rated ship.
That was the entire test of ability of an olLer in the navy
of the upper class. The object, no doubt, was to
endeavour to place on the list young, active, in-
telligent officers, but it woo inefficacious in pro -
doeine that effect; and the injustice was this,
that an officer was required to serve a certain time in a
rated ship, and they did not pr ,ride such a ship for him.
Is all other profession. men rose by their talents, ability,
sad exertions. (Hear.) la the army no such orders
in council existed; but if an officer arrived at the
head of his list, he was carried on to the list of generals,
and if he had his retirement it was by selection. (Ilear,
hear.) And then as to the question of finance, the vmdi-
tioa of the half-par list, no advantage was gained by the
present system the recent ov'er in council was only •
repetition of an order passed in 13.7 ; but that order was
considered, as • whole, so unjust to the service, that it was
repealed. There was • remedy for many of the evils of
which he complained ; and he should ask their lordships
to restore a portion of the former order. This would pre-
went any suspicion of abuse of the governing powers.
The Earl of ABERDEEN said the noble lord had made
some observations on the subject of this order at the time
it was made, and they were then considered by the tome.
The subject was one on which much difference of opinion
prevailed in the profession ; and he was not very confident
as to the correctness of the view taken by the noble lord.
As he had done no more than call the attention of the
government to the matter, he would, without giving any
pledge, or expressing any opinions, engage that his right
hon. friend at the head of the Admiralty should have the
subject brought under his consist. ration; and no doubt Ye
would make such regulations as would give satisfacties.
The Earl of HADDINGION said the subject was one of
very considerable difficulty. It was much more easy to find
out defects than to provide a remedy. Ile doubted whether
any general registration whatever could be devised under
which cams of hardship would not occur. Ile knew an
officer who had served five years and some months, and was
put upon the retired list. ‘Vhile abroad he commanded a
sloop part ul the time, and continued to do so at the request
of the Ward of Admiralty ; but he was not allowed to
Count his servitude in the sloop, or he would have escaped
the retired list. The noble lord cited some other in-
stances of hardships, the particulars of which were not heard
in the gallery.
Lord COLCHESTER said it was extraordinary that
some officers arrived at their rank before completing their
sin years, while other.oaly attained it by hard se.-vice.
Earl TALBOT said that the Resent regulations gave
gnat dissatisfaction to naval officers generally.
After a few words from the Earl of WALDIOu.ATII, the

subject drooped.
TRANSPORTATION OF OFFENDERS BILL.
The LORD CHANCELLOR, in moving the second
reading of this bill, regretted that there was a necessity, at
the pr. sent day, to introduce a bill of that description.
The question was, whether fur our own social advantage, we
were to persevere in getting rid of the criminal popula-
tion of the United Kingdom at the expense of
those colonies where we had been hitherto in the habit of
sending them. At present, the colony which had been
our great depot for convicts, Van Dicnvn's Land, hail sig-
nified great riluctance to receive any more ; and the govern.
ment, fur the reasons stated in the late debate, had acceded
to their request. The question erase, what number could
be sent to the only colony, Western Australia, which was
still willing to receive them. That point ascertained, their
only coarse was to determine which of those offenders whom
they bad been in the habit of transporting should continue
to be sent out. He thought that they should only leave
as subjects for transportation, those who were now
liable for fourteen years and upwards, including cases of re-
ceiving stolen goods, outrages, assaults on the per-
son, attempts to do grievous bodily harm, house
breaking, burglary, cattle stealing, and matters of
that sort. The only remaining question was, what
should be substituted as a punishment for :the re-
mainder. The only effectual coons would be to par upon
them who would otherwise have been transported, a sentence
as little varied as possible from that which had been usual.
The course had been always this : where a party was son-
towed for seven years, ordinarily speaking, he was impel-
steed for a year ; then be was sent to the public works for one
or two year', either to the hulks, Dartmoor, Portland lur-
ked, Pembroke, or other places; and then he was seat
abroad with a ticket of leave. This, unfortunately, could
be done no longer. He had endeavoured to come as
mar as possible to it. These who would have bees
troaaproted for seven years were now to be kept in
cllwrested@ for a term of four years ; those transported
. years would undergo a penal servitude of six years;
those he 16, one of eight; and those above 15, one of 10
years. The bill them went on to explain that the penmen
sentenced would he liable to be dealt with just as pmeons
sow liable to transportation were liable to be dealt with—
after their service ea the public works they were to be sent
to any place either is sr oat of the kingdom, including
Bermuda, Malta, or Gibraltar. The question lay in a very
narrow amps'. Tee propositions were to be established
—what 'umber ef convicts they could continue to send to
the *denim, and how they could best deal with those who
were sot so mat. He had had sae or two esenssaisations
urging him to do aothi ins matter, es the ground that
there were statutes is •enabling the moies sot to
transport those who bad bees sentenced to traseportation.
This weakd certainly enable the mown to make a solidi=
ef these to be sent to the *sissies • Ant weighing the edam-
tails and the disedeenteeps together, it seemed to kiss a
wiry scandalous thiws dist messes of transportaties should
be pared era 6,ollllpesple at the various maces and as-
sists, when it wee well known that sot 1,000 would be
wtl=sw•eigelire b of was as inconvenience
traril NINO every other that could be seg-
rested.
Hart GRIT dad sot Mend to the second reeding,
for, slamd be aellesaved is Utis that traasportation
was the most ere fel t they possessed,
he was bona to admit It dodged that its
use, at lied to a great enlist, be disesstiased. He
agreed than they ought to Wag the peesties as seedy as
possible le the rigid eabiaamat af the saalansai messily
wed• and thematic@ semeding of tbe kind prepoesd by
and learned Mimi U.S be edephod, bemuse there
wpr
_sedan dos thatesianeeld stye Weep what was
.tired d ee6 Is melesio. Al the same time,
he hail bees greatly led that the setae and learned
lard had set gives • fuller explanation of the manner In
mid* her Majesty's government intended to deal with this I
most Mandl of adillerat subjects ; and he felt, moreover,'
id saw aim poodeismi of the bill were open to objeetioe.
Wilma be (the noble earl) was Secretary of State he
vents to the different colonies telling them that they
scald nett permitted to rend convicts any longer to
tb pool mathiments ; and he advised them, therefore,
M OrrielMawe le Improve their system of secondary
rtedieseate. Admipt the Mee/ores he recommended
leaden for that Neese was a plan of the kind he had
. ilesselbed ; sd id was adopted by the legislature of
ilaeledoss. The system had been found to answer es-
ti wady well there, and he did not see any reason why it
w•mid sot work as well in the mother country. (Hear.)
lie would not trouble their lordships with any further re-
marAs upon the bill except so my that although he had
asked many setae lords if they understood the 12th clause
he had net essessed is lading one that could do so. That
claws proposed to wed that maaportation should include
• banishment beyond*, seas." What did that mean ?
The LORD CHANCELLOR explained that the clause
bast been inserted, bosom be had found that by the Scotch
law there were some Isw offences that were punishable by
" basiAisat b•ricthe seas."
Lind ZIROU Grum Iffoally regretted that transportation
can silent .to be la nay large degree abolished, because it
endowed sia,ey advantages which belonged to no other
eseesdafy rai,hment whatever. He thought there was a
iii,;;Tessa ei Kni,:d muse in the recommendation of the
noble end (Lend Grs7). and that some such modification as
the noble sod had dersesitiftd ought to be introduced into
the
plan b. thecoverentent.
The DuG-ifittIICASTLB , in common with
other noble lords who had spoket:t,rd.....ity of reducing
the punishment of transportation to its minimum. lie con-
curred with them in the advantage of the present system.'
There teemed, however, to be as agredneat on all hands

that out of regard to our colonies it was necessary tea federal
this punishment. He hoped that out of this evil good
might yet coat. , for he could not help thinkiag that, with
the cessation of tramvirtation to the extent to which it was
now carried, the government slid the whole inhabiiants of
the ceuntre would turn their attention to the improvement
of our penal system. He did not anticipate that this
bill now on the table would be by any means
the last that would be brought in on the subject. The
noble earl of jeeted to limiting the term of transportation.
Tate reason was twofold. In the first place, those who had
watched the progress of penal servitude, as it was called by
this bill, were of opinion that the time now allotted would
lie too great for the endurance of criminals, and would be
a much hirin;er amount of punishment than that for which
it was substituted. lu the seciind place, as their lordships
were aware, sentences of seven years' transportation hail
not been ordinarily carried into (tree', but the Con-
victs had been liberated after three years' pun-
ishment. Two years was the minimum, but three
years was the ge. It was proposed by this
bill to award four years, which was in effect a year longer
than a nominal seven years' transportation. At the tame
time it was worthy of consideration whether they should
not in the first instance awed a heavier punishment, with
a power to the executive to short( n the period as a reward
for guu t conduct. Another suggestion by the noble earl
was whether the ticket of leave sys•em, which bad worked
so well in the relnuies, might not work well its this country.
The attention of wiverumeur had been turned to that
point, and his noble friend on the woolsack wouid
make a proposition respecting it on going into
committee. One difficulty was whether the convicts should
have tickets of leave given them to live under surveillance
in any part of the country, or whether they should be per-
mitted themselves to select their residence in any part of
the roman), or in any particular county or district. That
was under consideration. l'ublic works which were now
going on, defensive works sod harbours of refuge, facilitated
a measure of that kind. His noble friend (Earl Orey)
asked what was proposed to be dine with regard
to those criminals who had already been sen-
tenced to transportation, and to whom promise bad been
made by announcements bung up in the prisons, that
they should be sent to the colonies with ticki.to of leave.
He thought his noble friend at the head of the goveranseat
had already answered the quotion, but he would repeat.
that if this bill passed in the form in which it iw stood. !
they would suffer no longer punishment in the prison thaw
was pmeillcd to future prisoners. That would apply °sly
to culprits in the prison to whom promises had been made.
They had accumulated, but were no longer increasing, as
the promisi s se. re withdrawn as loon as it was ascertained
that the punishment of transportatian was to cease. With
regard to the capability of the prisons to held an increased
number of prisoners, he apprehended there would be
no difficulty, and that it would not be necessary to incur
any expense before parliament met next year.
Lord CAMPBELL cordially supported the second read-
ing of the bill.
The Marquis of CLANRICARDE hoped that there
would be some cl statement as to what was to be done
with the convicts to whom promises had been made, because
he understood that from SOO to 1,200 would be let loose upon
society in this country.
The bill was then read a second time.
CHANCERY SUITORS RELIEF BILL.
This bill pawed through committee.
SAVINGS BANKS ANNUITY BILL.

The holm went into committee on this bill.
The clauses Were agreed to after a brief eonvetsation, in
which Earl Powir, Earl Granville, ar.tl the Lord Chen-
efillor took part, and the house having resumed, the bill
was reported forthwith.
The Bishop of OXFORD pry seated a petition from Banff
praying till ir lordships to reconsider the laws respecting
Scotch ordinations.
Their lordships then adjourned at a quarter put eight
o'clock.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.—MONDAY, JULY 11.
The Seiminft took the chair at 2 o'clock.
PRIVATE BUSINESS.
The Lords' Amendments to the South Eutem Railway
(North Kent Railway to the Thames, &c.) Bill, and Wild-
more Fen, sod East and West Fens Highways Bill were
considered and agreed to.
The Chard Railway Bill was read a third time and passed.
The following bills were considered and ordered to be read
• third time, sm. —Eastern Union Railway ; Warrington
and Altrincham Junction Railway (Warrington, &c.) ;
Westminster Improvements (Dwellings of the Working
Classes).
Hall Dares Estate Bill, and the Sneed Park Estate Bill
were read a second time, and ordered to be committed.

NEW MEMBERS.
Mr. IloitsraLL and Mr. LIDDELL took the oaths and
t►eir seats for Liverpool. The honourable gentlemen, who
were introduced by Lord John Manners, Alderman Thomp-
son, and others, were received with cheers from the opposi-
tion benches.