The Express.
London, England, 1849-03-13 00:00:00

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•
, ..; • . ...
1 ....... =ix ~ . ~..
sup • • a fr the rasiztot
.iiiro .
porr -
M. . _ o -etowthisur fit
tkiestroiry.llllll.4
est Malted sibillier tair7tieritze an-Iw..
fres ligisleilea wadi ask be bLeatte.itglsisitia.
as thatawier orairtseeriesi. 01110_14100111111 IMO WA*
Zilla ibll essired seeillog et* deft. Alinefit
laws sight aresaried witheat begat* the
sigolargirgea oaral be
eels say peittealer lateral.
• M. I. FOR de/laded the tete be was about is give,
immesh as it weal& beta meignat to the parley whl* be
liwititheet. willterWar BSI,
_..f fr" Ira"- T1642E"
of eaggassity wee arnecospretery Wows OM ill*
frso wefts, 'ad. Wait it was rather polar tr. le
sok lingind tea give ap sad amiss nothing rs ozogger
he rdoeld vole @galore** bill. •
Mr. MIIVWT. *ported * wan" fa thi.itra
belief Sat IWO* weal& ass be reduced to say sinoggiologg
nasal it erseesa. earl that the legitimate tale of Ike
Jidda s ewasr would sot be Wesel! ; bat on the *wary
that It wain pine the rate of freights sa • sore 'VC:
bah mg breatt Edith 111. Mena' al that big
was, mai midis as it wee 11111 ritelasifas fa
pima whites IS was kakelle so trueiga.

Mr. WINN reasmied die MI as beefs. he its object the
arstreettea at PAWL &Wag, mai be elteuld therekee mat
earsertly appear it.

Kr. C. BRUCE, ea the groand that the measure would et
serve redoes the meratatile nuke to a wholly lafesior con-
dition, and endures the miaow, of the navy, would vote
7eit, and Gaffed spat the government, and Sir R. Peel,
kld power than the pvereseest, not to 'evolve
the peat 'hippie' interests of the empire pia the anis Ma
width had Idle& apes the loaded Lamest
Mr. WILCOX seseplsissi et the iatealleast the givers-
neat to retain the alms shish 'suspense AMA ship-
owners to have thsotudinsthe of their ems Mei seam a,
bums& es that reuteletlas easease tb pestedisstses an
=llthat while prolesies was take. away hest these
1; was still paellally gem to the atureastes iwurias.
Prelleades had ewe bees the brae et that shish r was
elasitis. The protein= width the nein*
VCnirrequired wad against the Trisity-Hew, whisk
tsise pretense of providing safety far the assets, had
established one hags system of extortion.

Mr. IL C. HILDTARD said that the bill laths the
he... had not boss very fairly latrakeell be thtthrt kn.
gemdemmea epte,
_when he mewed' the resens ea
whirr le was tsssdsd ; fir he Ikea mat= thet the isitgation
lam mthibiled the last reasset of as exploded pads!, gad
he mad= to the fredrethrs behind his by stating that
edema the bums was
Stangeseri= to seeds fres the policy
adept= limmids ether bill
sight boa. pathmea did not dialthe USA gees. The
fairly by wouldown re
whoa be abet= this line of stenos. H adeit
that both the leibilllFDOTl of England and the West India
pliaten bad mimed a monopoly when foreign own and
sager were shut eat by high protective degas from the con-
, ammetioa et He#seol. Bat la what way did the shipowners
, enjoy a nesserly ? What restrictions were there
alga the angierseat of capital in their Wainer ? Did
not the ships of the Tyne compete with the 'ships of the
Humber, iski did not Tyne, Humber, Mersey, and
Timms ell with each oer ? (A laugh.) But it
IC
night le alt true, free trade exists in respect to the
hane•hallt bet we want it to extend to foreign-built
=The laws user did exclude foreign ships
the hem teak of England. All they did was to pre-
set the =portly; British goods to the West India
,=. There was sea so restriction upon American ships
. oat from Lisspeol with a cargo of British inane-
bases for the =eat Indies ; nor was there any restriction
.epos their doing the sem thing to neutral ports. Bo far as
gempatition ma emeneed, the foreignen were enabled to
dew uponnearly equal terms in all the ports of En-
Led, as would be shown by the evidence la the bin, books.
He =tad why were they ogled upon to nage this fearful
mmppmmmeat? They were told that it was in justice to the
odemies; and last year the West Indies were put In the fore-
armed, but now, however, Canada was brought the most
preeminently forward. He admitted that the government
had long given the most unequivocal symptoms of their
anxiety to get rid of the =Ogaden laws ; and no doubt that
as far as the legislature of Omsk was concerned, they had
encased= in obtaining a =amist from that body ; but he
was yet to lams that a immtnial !tom Canada was to guide
the fmpmial legidetare, mere emesially when the arguments
employed were owe as that house 'odd not rely upon. The
boa. and leased geademem the member for Liverpool (Mr.
Cardwell) stated lia other doming that MIN correspoedent
of his at ',leaped geode= a died time me a quatity of
corn In ma Animism Mid. Befog a conadiatloss man,
however, a= diewriging that the core was Canadian,
he appthled to the awthstilles at Liveepeol whether
that cora night be eared fee home consumption,
and he was tell that it might not. Now this had
been Let: a= es a bard ease ; bat what did it
amount to ? Why, to seething more than that the hon.
gmthema's unespeademi had made the blunder of
doaaselss icestats an Amerkan, instead of a
el—aad that was the whole sheens o(which he
. (Hear sad a kagh.) Now, with regard to the
imeaserial which the right boa. gentleman opposite had pre-
saged from Jemeiga. The horse was aware that every me-
morial hem the imidelare of Jamaica ought to go through
the form of a predene husky. What wasthe case In the
premed Sebum ? Oa the night bat ome before the legisla-
tes hake up, the& memorial was herded through the
_hens
=thug that hem sad it was inesedistely &seabed be
:led to be WWI era in the prams debate. Me us
that the =modal did aet, in fad, ragement the
Wimp 0 the leghimaire La Jassies, ,and hen= m leriy theme
neasems. These maths beim there was ea lag,
whisk a asemesiel we headed, kb the grieemant of the ro-
de of hawk% mad la that mienedel the 'eleven= of =Lich
Slimy sesisked mar Mani wrist*, bus not me we= was
miatined abed the ameigellia laws. Nice =SW after
there was smother mennial also minutely detellig their
pavanes and in treat also there was no Quin to the na-
vigation laws. (Ler, bear.) The fees with regard to that
memorial had beta dished by the committee of the House
of Lords. It had the been elucidated in eddies before that
committee, that as sass as the West Indians beard that the
repeal was not to be main= to the West Indies alone, but
was to extend gemerally, they saw that it would be an evil
sad net a boos; busses it would be dads( Cabs and their
ether groat rival fa a better peddle that themselves.
(Hie, nar.) Now, with nines* es the pielsded oyages,
the iambs* of 'gore from Pan bad been paYsalarly ro-
lled apse. It spread from the sidemen en this petit that
the wide freight *odd be IL, orespileass2l.,sie Ma more
lima if there weer elicited • bet =Mike
shipeweer gained by the protected hems fres Pere
was he by the low freight oat; for
the l=1111$1:1 mall take out masked of goods
eassaiinted k We imatry. (Hear, hear.) The mann-
heiseee them the advairge of die lowerrt. and
he dialed the esavemer rid the high t home,
beam% If was as, whet wag beams their ma-
mma =oat thin seers being required la jostles to our
'dodge ? Hs beim= that • eyetea of modesde import
Adige is all media of esmeaaglim woad Neill oat of the
Odor et the hedge pedals, a= would net askew the
rise ea the esawierise et aIL Me would set rotor upon that
=:ofi the salted, hawse, thethw than to say, that he
that was the rindes ma la this coantry, and
that ft that gram they meet mom al het The right ho n.
=7"llthe =saber kr the Umigereity of Oxford, had
140mesd that the prinstele whisk was dear to the Ame.
sass was act that cited -Imaile,hat of proteadoe, mad that
they sail taka all we would give then, mai weed
bit us have mina' ia rotas. Now he (Mr.
Iliblysed) asked whether this gauntry had not a
sight to desplaia of the aenner in whisk OW
amedations with Amides upon the sulret of those
law had been earned en. Mr. Biaggi's words had Mee
fgeely quoted; bat we had wamaranee that wilt Mr. Bea-
med remised woad be envied Late deg if we gage gave
up ear =dram laws; and he Nana= that the bthe re-
peal* dine laws skald have Sawed the two leridares
iii lessee mashed& abaultsamindy have km mend
to. The hewn was aware that ace rd to the laws of the
Umbel &Mu two-third. of the wale end omment to eery
testy ; gad that to the ametion ef the leer of the Jest
there mast be the mesas if the wiefilitlisidows. And he
asked the home, after the severe wrest hr the Preakleset.
ship whisk had meetly tae. Oise, based Aqua the wipes
die Ogden if tree awls aid readisa, and =the hinith
sated la favour of the team whether it was likely that
the &seems worali mar paaa seek a bill as tbss present
(rte.g tithed
Mew what , 7=. was
SZ:Virililliale a ria:
. Wicks ? The mists Led at the head of the liseeign dmni.
meet bad written letters to a samba of states aeon the
salrek sad most of themadeZied that they had mot the
• Mild *IWO lassatioa of a Mailer men to that
ISIS Meek= wend Wilde that Rugs,
paregaimest as C/1".4,.. he • ~.. ty of her
gonads, wenn =mid to retaliatey
sejoyieg se mhe elld at preasat fall rips ielaiitheirlaa
trade emememed? If Basis vodka= era
it • that arse to its haadatimm and =lt
volts nest other asides in run. ("Hes *a= "Oh. el:")
Tee ; 1,111,1110 OM Or tallow, the remit past of it from
5/111111
mks annually into this matey •t and he
pea=systemsea ia of Militias wadi excuse the
Buma to itsgpm and would;skis thst emirs least' misilmo. Me new some
to bee great isoonla the bill itself, and
*se was we* nor" to the emearien male ia behalf of the
eining teals. He WU* Ida the sight las gestlemama
Mae gle grade. trails et
woad relm b =tar
N.
ei nook nem
kid memedem and ed am* mesh to
her ison America; bet, lie soled, was a mailing trade of
Upset
AmniaMs gad of theet no incidents to this wank,e ? (ffsme hem. hew.)
*dg
_be r a sty
impeded demansiat salleallid tea the Wale tee of the
, Buil= litatie, by the umentlige their h
liver impeedwienta, la the atrium ellsmen year* . I aebour and
t appeared
that ea the gam great lakes of Asides, sight dates wire
matey dipeadmat for thole oseamanial idsrovaree ; sad
that Me Ike domed et than eight Oates was mot leas than
3,000 mks. Ia MI the timer era these sewn lakes
was WOO team. Is INII that ammiews ammo had it.
ereasise 106,1100igas, and efeemse they mad net lint their
eyes to the led that Amides wee OW nahkg Wet rapid
=salsa. Apia the Misideptizci._ ~ge dare were
7,000 Was a yen made& That had mew issued
to 660,00rissest rear, bra) ma nn. slates sad a Dope-
lati=o was depaileat spas the lassimia mat
to their esmassagial iIIiONIMMIS. He now

°alp apekaa of the blue cad the Miedmippi ; bat wiry hats.
member best be swam that the oesetfai trade from Maine
to the eattlatua eztruaity was inflabely more importaat than
that :a whisk be had jam alluded. It was, then, of very
peat importsoa, if coacessiosa were to be made, that we
lima participate in their waiting trade. Yet by the 11b11-

IG, MARCE

~L ~~

1.

eel& Vilna • b4Siolla•— 117:
MI6 , bear.; i sea
mall, wok . 1:12"1"
ao WM aflari ' mike
ORO most haperatt • whielethe easmaer-
i
dal policy el tbis emotry bad rag
saleseted.
--
. ; -wes:onsprieed at the reeimeaty Af Me
sibmiadeZt sat dews, who said, what
yea , e-e
mons IMlNkiezetillialt"ll4l
Isms MOD 001.401. "Mb:
*dolma us thsosiers to ell Eta ....la
Woos Whisk we luta& Bad& ..
hubs awe —, east beim to We Wet he tali
we =PI not admit the elite of Raids. That was Ms
aegumemt. 1!w was sunfishes woo
=l:irt "wit ;assail W the right has. patlema, Oa
member kir Illmeassik who would shut oat may
ship of this ennieleise whisk he mild shut oat without
setaliatisa ; bat Do sales assesehat starriest at hieriag
right hes. guelimeno the mosaber far Wood, whoa
having "leafy demonstrated she saheltief and
aflame lam tented round sad said that we
war algenation of this saisoldel and laconmaisom ..ii-
twit go fts4=alissistbsr manes. The *AI he..
whisk M tram the huh as
WIPP almast Werilisseeimit mid skit we ought me ft ha
etemitay Usreent=dnitsibriaguathdsT:ulawsiethsemild
abia...e.....1.4 =did thossoeummial may al
the ditht . gentismn member fee Telmer* ; that
he pee In . bit ailismisa to the repeal of the ems laws, and
the admimien of Seaga OUNMI_oa oval bums with *emu
of war oinks ; and Im(Mr. Haute) MUM ass midersand
on what peeled he mild my that it was net wise te admit
the shipping a otha ceentriss Wee them °Pantries ad-
mind ow. This Maths ams, as
M bad sheep aesei===esh:sel 4 Oa whim ar
meat in &Om Kisses trade upuponthe Antrim laid demli
the right henwarabie barenet, that it was advisable
ornate, should bay •liisply. whether other wealth' alms
to bay dam* er mil t Salim *sold net make ism palsy
dimodsat sag.. Sr paw of Wm ementrise, bat pima is
oar mu with the fan cenvistien thin if we mild net
get all, we shwll get an advantage by adopting oar own
gZey. He bad vaulted this debate very closely, and had
iVer
to fled that uo new argument had been
broughtd • all the old fallacies about the cheapness of
=ilidp bad' beam didaterred. In spas ti the lower
lwillos• given ever and over again to honourable
'oedema, they would persist in wag that an
Amara ship was built amps: than as Zeglialt
ship. It was • matter of Isothomatioil demmateetisa that
we bad sway eleaseat et delp-I=eliajor than thio
Americus ; ken, sepper,thaber, sashes, one-
Stied cheaper than la the Unitas Salm. Tim the; said
that our mania wets not &mime he bam more ships ; that
in the committee of the House of Leeds it was clearly proved
sad attested by several wither= that the West Indies pre-
ferred being mama to Ecilish ships. The right IPS.
Igtl"the samba for Stamford bad brought
.• • reasoa why they were not injured by
these navigation laws that they. were Iguana
of the stalest altogether. The right km. goads
man was perfectly right. It might be reseUeeNd Sat
a committee was moved for in another plate, on the pretext
that the seminithie tithe Hones of Commons bad not ismer-
tially coasidered the subject, and, accordingly, in the House
of Lords, they undertook to throw freeh light on the subject,
and teach law a committee ought to inquire, and the first
six witnesses gave extraordinary evidence. Mr. Bosanquet,
a West India merchant, and shipowner also, said that he
was not read to the navigation laws; he was not
musieted with tbs effect they would have on
the local interest of the West Indies. Mr. Ellis,
a merchant end shipowner, was asked if he had ever eon+
dared the navigation laws, and he said he had not ; he could
not answer the question whether an English ship could go
to the United States, and thence to the Wert Indies, with In
American cargo. Then came Mr. Davis, • shipowner, who,
on being asked whether he had coalidered the way in
which trade had been affected by the navigation laws, said
he had never particularly attended to' it; and Mr. Gower, a
Miorettant and shipowner, said that he never heard of the na-
vigation laws until lately. The inference which was drawn
from this woe most extraordinary. It was as if you were to ask
a New Zealand chieftain whether he expenenoed any in-
commience from walking stark naked, and feeding on
human flesh, and on hie answering no, you were to Infer
that he was in the state in which he ought to be. Then it
was said that he (Mr. Ricardo) had held that the mercantile
marine of this country was of no importance ; that he had
undervalued the importance altogether of the mercantile
marine, and that a mercantile marine was of no advantage to
a country having a maritime power. There never was •
=ly net defended on same great constitutional 1
. When it was a question of corn laws,
we heard of the yeomanry of the country ; when
it was a question of the sugar. duties, we heard that
the colonies were our great stay in time of war, and now
the monopoly was dithisdiod on the plea of the maritime
defame of the country. What be said was, that the neer-
esatilo mane 'alibi' chantey was Independent altogether of
Ms of parliament; that it was our iinnssulas position; our
daily entamistian with tholes who spoke our own lam-
inar and bad this same wants with ourselves; that the
people wets nititrally • seafaring population; it was these
things that andkellf mercantile marine. If it were not so,
how was it that hams sal Spain, who had navigation laws
more adages* lbw ... had, had no mercantile marine ?
What he said WI this, that it was most dangerous that
we should be deprama upon the mercantile marine (or the
rasulaksi etas regal Amy. Hon. madame had several
times quad the maden of Sir B. Martin, but his opinion
was that ma waselis• of this nature °Man of the royal
navy were age Ilio best qualified to give an opinion. Seem
such planes then of Sir J. Stirling ought to be adopted.
How did you mecums the mercantile marine by mem
of the royal navy in she time of peace ? Capt. Nicolas
stated that belag on • voyage from Chian to Valparaiso,
and Marla, that a war woeabout to take place, on his arrival
at Rebut Town he pieked out all the wont men he had fa
his ship, is the number of 100, and induced them to became 1
colonies. Hs then went to the merchant ships which hap-
pened to be lying la the place, and from those metebant ships
took 100 men to repass these bad men. Here were 100
good men ipst, and the merchant ships were left sheet-
headed, without the mama of obtaining freights ; and
this was the way the Navigatiou Act, in time ef
peace, helped the ramantile nutria" ! They. had been
reprearhed to-night.asod reproached tho other night by the
hem. member ler Samford with the statemeat OW them
woe no feeling in this country on the sub** if the owei-
gado& laws. And she hen. patinas. had pasted, with
singular emplassosy, to the petitions which were laid upait.
the table. A reproach of this sort ems with a bad
grace from the other ado of the house,a for he rmsWsbi
that had repromited others wving la
the feelings and padres of the peopithle. h
It would have bees
easy to have slam the sailors how they were the met ill-
Meted tithe made, daises of this country; how a cow
pact had bees made with the English shipowner to ads-
tan that monspoiy, and that the sailors were the victims of
this aremegmasur. It would have been easy to have
into the manallseturing towns and hays atom the
classes that the greatest east of every ariiira
imam was freight,, and that therefore the prise
of all luxuries was enhanced by this asompely
for the benefit of sertain classes of this country.
Bet confident in the goodness of their Me they had re-
*aimed hem doing what mild only have bad the offset of
=dimension between the employer and the sm-
ile bad been emptied to hear the right hen.
iambs, fag Sesenfeed enestes that no matter what might
Mies with*" bill in the Hew of Commons it was sum
to he them as by the Icrl.. (Hear, hear.) Ho bad
nisiesslesd the right hen. member so to express himself.
(Mr. limas ensile a gesture of diem) He was delighted
se led Mat hebad misundentiod the right boa. gentleman,
fir a was satelnly a most mitiesediery threat. He should
not ter, treats. the bones, but would content himself
with hi nioNeses le wept la committee any er-
nom=as bona if the shi which would
with the pahelple of the

Admiral 110WLES had during the discussion of last year
expressed Hamill hostile to any alteration in the principle
of the untied= laws, and subsequent experience had not
tended to alter his opinion. He wee not inclined to pin his
faith to the promben or mediations of hon. membtn op-
posite es to the blades to be expected from the proposed
change, obaldM iltet dmiasz promises had been made for the
menseres of an. sad the pretest nats of oar West
Indian colonies Mewed how those promises had been fulfilled.
He called Ike leverament to eouskter the reepsasibility
they were iassuilti la emanating to abrogate the laws upon
winnk see Ade wilekkais tfintent win founded, sad to re-
member that le this. sadist to individual members, would
the nation look in awe the expectation now held out
should end, es he believed they would, in disappointment.
(Hear, hem.)

Mr. DRUMMOND said that the right bon. member for
Oxford Univemity bad called upon government to act in this
matter ea one compacted body, but had himself set the:at: rem
ba4 having spoken on one ride, while he ex
his het el robe on the other. (Hier, hear.) e
Drummed) agreed with the boa. member for Stoke, in
alat the hill lad been hitherto dimmed, not on its
AIM ea its details; but that might be acootmted
Er Mt that taneiple of the bill was no where to
be Mod ha IL (A .) It wu called a to reread a
tell, sad Ike way in it proposed to amend win, by ab-
=tilts redeems°, altogether. They sould, tholudare,
the palmist, of theespb:riallen epsilon of
those who ersul it. The of all etatsmien
hitherto had been la keep in minty as a asses
of eseploplag hear, but the principle of the premed hill
wee to key mild in the otrunVy, bat sotto employ the
labour. (Hear.) They had beard in lieredare of a .deals
'Moot of poetry, end surely if there was a satanic Mimi of
politics earn a Owl* beluga to it. (A kmgl.) It wee the
remarkable *ramie of the present' day that every Mamas
was obliged to set his own words, and to go agaiet fumy
peiswiple width he bad ever 'risers M aelag. 8o
that if he wanted an argument against any meow* which
was brought forward, he had only to leek beak to hatter
=of the prometers,—to appeal, is fast, hem Philip
Philip sober. (Loughter.l They had beta far name
years soder evil guidanes. (User,, hoar.) It Medd MOM
as if, seconliag to tke ay* they were boned down to a
rock while every sucesmive Waiter preyed upon their livers
ad libitum. (A laugh.) Rs feared that the deetlafm of the
country were about to be given up to men who ammured the
happiness of mankind by the rate of exchange, and who
coaceived that =Wag mould be good for the poi* which
was not also good hr button spinning. (Protectionist charm)
Those gentlemen bought their cotton In Attica or America,
and having manufactured it in their mills, sent it back to
Franco it Frenzh wines without having employed any
E'igi labour throughout the traneatti in. (Cries of " Oh,
th," and laughter.) They were mea, in fact, without a

oonotry. The post ozdained, to if midair for an !sopa-
Donato then ora tut* oral so dud,
Wit, sow to WNW boo NY,
Mt lo ay own, sty mate had

Re Null mower that in Marmasater there were a Atm-
semi each awn. (Chew and laughter.) They, mai gay
they, supporead ths prourat isseenre, bat he trusted that'
how would be guided by baler esseela
sham) He would remind them that dame bad beat a theq
when we had a national faith, a time when we had—he war
set afteid to ay it—a warship for satimemi, a reveres..
essi=ead magistrate, and an ainhalles the @Wien
who had deserved well of that elowlep—a time
Whew tho noblest wad we hod was " Rae Beffnemin"...
(loud laughter, sad cries of " Sing")—and the sweatstools
anthem la our ritual, " God save the Owen." (Hew, heat)
Mr. LABOUCHEEE could assure the house that ha'
was net at all disposed to bass hie support of the wen
sent sossure upon cosmopolitan patriotism. Oa the
contrary, if he were not fully persuaded that it woo Wean-
tageou on strictly British grounds, it should net have had
his support. It was with dater, reluctance that he aria
intruded upon the notice of the house, bat he hod beta on
frequently alluded to in the amuse of the hissamisa, that he
must main claim their indulgence. The pestles new bolero
the house was the principle of the muienso. That primal*
he apprehended to be—the virtual abendeasiteat sf war pre-
ant system of restrictions as applied to the navigatiom of the
country. (Hear, hear.) Undoubtedly there were she details
of this utmost conesquenos connected with the pastiest—
duals as to the manning of ships, the mina-
don of ships and many others—each, perhapaibet-e
volviag considerations of deep consequanos.
details he traded and he was ours would naive all
the attention they deserved when the bill was in committee.
For Memoir he begged to repeat the assurance he bad before
made, that though he had, in conjunction with his collespos
in the government, paid very greet attention to all the de-
tails, he had not the vanity to swam that they wen. par-
feet that important altareas tied locreameeds might net
be made in many of these in Om semen of thole tihearies
by the house, and that therein whatever endes_ • might
be made with that view should have his hth issideration.
(Hear.) Bat as he had maid they were sew &deists upon
the principle of the measure—the abandonment of the
a gees of restrictions. And in considering this
princip he had first to iKairs what whore
the main restrictive' of our =Anion laws? What
were the fundamental principles ea whit& those nevi-
melon laws rated ? Those resisted'sa were of three Mods.
• thew applying to the colonial leads ; second, those by
which we endeavoured to escort to oursalves the carrying
trade ; and third, those which had been emoted with the
view to secure to us also the long-voyage trade. These ware
the fundamental principles an which our navigation laws
rested, and the more he considered the subject the more
convinced was he that,.for the national interest, as well as
the national character of the country, and, above all,
for the sske of the prosperity of the mercantile In-
taeurtne the time had arrived when they should re-
those principles, and see whether their =oin-
tmene was not calculated, as he believed it was, to
saddle u with a great amount of mischief. First,
with regard to the colonial trade. He must say he was our-
=lat the manner in which the right hon. member for
ad spoke of the claims which had been made from all
parts slow colonial possessions for the removal of the restric-
tions by which their trade was now crippled and confined.
In the first place, it was not starling a priori, now that we
had abolished the system of protection colonial produce, that
the colonies should demand the removal of the restrictions we
had impend on their trade. The right hon. member for Stam-
ford bad referred to a meeting in Canada West, and stated
that that meeting, which was called to petition in favour
of the repeal of a navigation laws, ended in petitioning for
the rosewallosizretection. True it was so ; but that was
the only sue exceptional case out of slugs number in which the
imperial leg' tun had been urged by the colonists to abolish
those laws. Another right hon. member omitted in regard to
Canada altogether to notice that the provincial legislature,
by a majority of no less than 49 to 14, passed an address
urging on this country in the strongest terms, on
the ground of the interest of the colony, the neces-
sity of departing from the principle of our navi-
gation laws so far as they affected the colonies—
and that the minority of 14 who voted against that address
did not vote for the retention of the navigation laws, but
desired only to couple with the demand for their alteration
a demand for the renewal of protection. Then the right
hen. gentleman stated that the object of the Canadians
might be almost, if not quite' met by making Montreal a tree
part, and quoted • despatch from Lord Elgin in favour of
that view. But the right hon. gentleman forgot that Lord
Elgin mad' that statement at a time when the navigation
laws wen suspended, and ships of all nations might take
cargoes from the St. Lawrence to this country. The only
difficulty. than was as between Montreal and the mouth
of the river, and Lord Elgin was perfectly warranted
in saying that under existing circumstances all
the difficulty would be removed by making Montreal a free
port; but when the navigation laws came again into opera-
tion the difficulty remained as it was before, and could only
be obviated by the removal of the restriction altogether.
(Mr. Harries here made an observation acmes the table,
which was inaudible.) The right hon. gentleman (Mr.
Retries) then adverted to the cue of the West India.
There was a name amongst the governors of the West India
islands always pronounced with respect by hon. gentlemen
opposite—he meant Lord Harris. (Hear, hear.) When
that nobleman expressed opinions favourable to hon.
gentlemen oppoeite they invariably quoted them,
justly relying on his sagacity and intelhgesce—(hear,
hear)—but there was no governor amongst these of
the West India islands, who had premed with more perti-
nacity and perseverance on the government the importance,
for the sake of the West India colonies themselves, of abro-
gating the restrictions which the existing navigation laws
imposed. The house would remember what he had quoted
last year, as to the opinion of Lord Harris, of the importance
of allow* the Woad of Trinidad to have direct communica-
tion with the ports of France and Spain ; and only a few
days ego a despatch had arrived from Lord Harris—he was
worry to say that it had toms to hand so recently that it bad
not yet been laid before this house, showing how the navigation
laws, in another way, impeded the prosperity of the island
which he governed. Lord Harris said that it was moat
important that Trinidad should have a constant and direst
communication with the Spanish main, and he added that a
company had at length established • line al themes be-
tween the island and the main lead sailing ander ths Merits
flag, but being all American vessels. "You coast believe,"
said Lord Harris, " the consequence to Trinidad which your
navigation laws occasion.' In this as in numberless other
instances it was in the suppression of trade which never
cams into existence that the injury was felt, and the Pm&
parity of** wittetarded. It was true that from we of
oar other most Important eolcnies no groat amount of
actual eomplaints had come--especially from those in the
eastern hemisphere. But those who considered
how Interested they were in • constant supply
of freights at • moderate price in consequence
of the bulkiness of their exports—as for instants the
colonies of Australia and New Zealand, whose wedged=
consisted chiefly of corn, wool, and such articles—awl ow
what an interest thaw colonies had in the removal of the
restrictions of our navigation laws, end must swat
complaints of the gravest character to come from them
also. He now came to the 'wit part of the prin-
ciple involved the carrying trade. Hon. gentle-
men camas argued that in this respect we were
free :r the
ela deaths( wzr=mecolualrios. Those who
441 messily laid es
table wadi dithiVthat wee a amplete ashram, sad that
amen sake up tide alai Bruit ios4Ssassepsedsted is
maintaining their present raftistioth would
not anti= to treat with es on seek teems. He
had heard ltai. gentians say
_they aildicef the
threats of Barsia, with with country we melted sa a
valuable trade ; and one lea. sideman went so far as to
say that Rorie had sash an Wane in maintaining that
trade that she would net dere to retaliate us. Ns-
tins, like individuals, often sated born and tali%
more than from interest, aad it was either with re-
gard to Russia or Austria, totem the quition on any seek
principle. (Hear.) The t hon. gentleman adverted
to the case of Belgium, and ring pronounced a glottis
panegyric on that country for protesting their own promety,
and taking sere other countries did not obtain advantages
at their exposes, he put their conduct forward as an example
for others to follow. But if ths advice of the right hon.
gentleman was taken—if all other countries adopted his
principles, and followed the example of Belgium, what
would bosoms of one keg voyage trade, of our carrying
trade, and the rest of the restrictions we were forcing ape
the world on these unequal terms ? With regard to the
long reap trade, for a miry such as England,
it would be always its interest too obtain the imported articles
direct from the original source. And, generally veal
English ships would not go to Havre for attest, bat
Charlestown ; nor to Hamburg for sugar, bat to Cuba and
Jamaica. In nineteen cases out of twenty this would
be the course of trade. It would only he in the twee-
Utah case, perhaps, that it would be our lateral to oe
to the foreign port for the articles leased of Me
pelts of the country in which they wore
'Oa the contrary, it often might, and did hippest, IC=
the interest of other European countries to tome to Landes,
Hall, and Liverpool for cargoes of sugar and tattoo ; but by
ear system we were depriving England of thoa adv=
erhbth pmewsd as a great general depot, without
tfinagmeecile=slaiaidt.up
to
iblif the
elvea asmlls witit:hruhol
hem the pais of the pretest he believed the mat
hoed= of ad eras, that ear shipbuilding hosier would do.
ON" be H we weld not make ship in this country
might at ones be athatteed that we Gould make nothing
dm. It might, with min Muth, be mateaded that it was
haposable to carry ea a make menzistere in Enstead in
the fan of a rivalry with other Radom. The duty
ea the timber used in machinery, the excise duty
eit bricks, the pressure of anther, the neoossif.ofbringing
fift raw mamba Om Or sash' es wOrlao might au
lit
me arsenates mime possibility of English-
men being able to 110111,061 with the miles manufacturers of
Amides ; but with regard to shimbildiar, what grounds
wire there for midi at apprehends'? We had in this
coy the mode* hem ef timber of any country in the
world; and, with regard Is the herein of force in the
building materials for ships, there was no country so well
of as England in that re peel (Hear.) The right hon.
gentleman the member for the university of Oxford had
pressed the government strongly to remit the timber duties,
in order to give relief to tho shipbuilder. Now, he
(Mr. Lthouchere) would be as glad as any honourable
member of that house to ass the timber duties re-
moved, because he believed that suck a measure
would be mast useful, not rely for:the shipbuilding iniesose,
but the community at large. Bat he must say that !fibs
government felt unwillinr, in the present condition of the
tattoo, to make any breach in the timber duties of this
country, that furnished no ground for the delay or postpone-
meat of the measure now before the house. But if the timber

I---

,

*

duties were still retained in England, let it be boiraTh.,,,,"
that a committee of a commercial deputations had lei
at Frankfurt, and declared that the duty as hem Li"
crowd the lost of a Palladia vessel built at 8
omit. (Hear.) He had already stated that he er4 ogra„
confine himself to what he ermeelved ts h '
' of 'this bill, but some armunats had beanusg
thetsgrimati;:4:l";:Litarbs/Itu gitsfiortreehmeled.b4theinutenimairto:lltheldtblawaich it
nt o:ll4Thimmi...o.4bl:to6l4l4l,4bu4..inirbs
he took • totally difhrent view upon amp
o
question. He stated that he believed the right .....1"64
ample of r. Htukision when he the reelmd,
treaties, and to adopt conditional legisttton this i
Now he (Mr. Lhouchere) confessed that he shoulat
be surmised if the house adopted that suggestion.
hear.) The more he considered the nutter the aeonNit(Bll4
was he convinced that they would take a most eh
loanwded.erna" suchusa vpielawnof !
thanerlihicsymaustthisdmvenyal' t if
asts
hon. gentleman had any right to quote the example It
Haskbeen In asking the government to follow that,
For, it would be found that the example of Mg. It
told in a precisely «pposite direetien, and that he (Mr lob*
'here) was entitled to claim the authority of Mr.
ma supporting the °ourse he had recommended to the
smit-
h was true that Mr. dutkisson had entered into the red.,
city duties with different notions touching their equgt,,—,
but was that all he did which at the tint. pie
adopted ? Quite the contrary. There ware reef
branches of commerce which he, for the firsttime, nao4
threw open, the plan he pursued was exactly the corns ho
government were now taking—namely, to ti
to ththecrowa the right of retaliation, net trasillu
neassearily exercised, but still reserving the right,
--
order that, in extreme eases and when the interests of dm
country required it, it might be exerted. Mr. Roddii
took off the prohibition relative to the importation of us,
from Germany ; he relaxed the laws affecting the ouga''
rat wdass;natrerlopehetpr bdutrneottradawithaotanf thdien7larilesthist°, the
at the
game time introduced the principle of retaliation. fieo4.
Labonchere) had therefore proved that the right hoc.
►
tleman was not correct in quoting the great 'tithe*, u
question • but this was far from being the only objection
entertained to the course that the right hon. gentians
had suggested. He altogether objected to the
which would make a foreigner the legislator of this mu*,
because he believed it was not our interest to make our sea
menial restrictions and intercourse dependent on thole
and ;Aware of other countries. That might be tolerated('
the ease of toe United States of America, but it weak eft
be found so practicable hen, where we had a
colonial empire. That alone was a greet objection't
conies suggested. The right bon. gentleman mumd to
think that although there might be some dale*e
with regard to tho colonies, the principle would inek
well. He (Mr. Labeuchan) totally differed fthm that vim
We did not stand with regard to our colothis so aegaa
countries did with respect to their.. We had ab
rogeted the system of protection in regard to ie
lonial produce ; other colonies had high digerati,'
duties; and therefore the eases were net parallel. Bak*
the right hon. gentleman must bear in mind that retslistka
was by no means reciprocity. He quite agreed that it meld
be moat desirable for this country, at a time when we were
admitting other nations to compete with our ship, to agis
any course which would be most likely to induce thew Subsnations to deal with opal liberality towards us; bat se
doubted s hether the course proposed by the right hos. go.
tleman would produce that result. The notice of an eased.
merit had, however, been given ; and is that would bug
the whole bearing, of this question under considers* as
would refrain from saying more upon the sub) et lag to
bad an opportunity of discussing it again hereafter imeta
mittee. (Hear.) He would not anticipate the delete AU
must arise upon the alleged necessity of allowingongaide
shipowner in future to obtain seamen from any/page of tie
world, though he believed the grievance complaundof sodathis head was far more nominal than real. Them, 'gds,with regard to apprentices. He believed that taus*,
shipping interest at large, no one who knew the feels et the
ease could entertain the opinion that we were depriftui
interest of the right to take apprentices. (lieu
At this very moment, wording to the evidence if
Browne, the Registrar-General, the number of appeals
which the mercantile navy was obliged to take was rdem,
and the number actually employed 33,000, shoeing ha
there were 11,000 voluntarily employed, or more thao sea
compelled by the restriction. As to the effect of the
upon the maritime power of the country, he thought that as
man could dispute that a great commercial can
only sure foundation of a great military navy. Indeed I
held that the position of England would be insecure Ws
she had a large seafaring population, and men heti
to the habits and hardships of a seafaring life,from wham
could at all times supply our navy. (Hear, hear.) If to
bill, therefore, was calculated to increase the commerce mi
enlarge the trade of this empire, it must of necessity Wenn
and encourage our maritime navy ; and if he could kin
moment suppose that its effect would be to cripple oar con
menial navy, nothing would induce him to supportit
good deal had been said about the cowing trade; mins
regulations respecting it were, he admitted, full of dificein
But the question did not stand upon the footing now eh
nial trade, our long voyage trade, or our carrying teak;
and we could arrange it to suit our convenience. (Cris d
"Divide.") He would respond to the desire of bon. ph
men to come to a division by saying a very few words. Bs
believed it was of the utmost consequence that this quern
should be settled without delay, satisfied that suspense in
uncertainty. were producing the worst effects upon the an
candle marine interest of the country. It must be thast
that the great majority of opinions had already decided Ito
the time bad arriv.d when • great alteration is do
navigation laws ought to take place ; and he hod
that honourable gentlemen, especially these emand
with that interest, would not interpose any come eini
might delay the settlement of the question. He belies ft
was best promoting the interests of that great else tie
were connected with the commercial I • f the eon
if he did not wait, as it was said Mr. Hinduism did, MO
the Board of Trade was besieged by complaints, or math
question was forced upon him by eireumstaneee,. panne*
when be remembered under what aspect those arcumstsins
might come, and bow much the complaints of our raindrop
and the remonstrances of foreign powers might increase*
difficulties of the question. He implored of the house, thee
fore, to agree to the second reading of the bill, and coshed
that he would be greatly disappointed lift were not nand
by a large majority. (" )ear, hear," and cries of "Divide!)
Mr. MUNTZ said that, coupling the speech of the
hon. gentleman with that part dins bill which required
three-fourths of the men employed by shipowners should
of this country, he though the right hon. gentlemen NM
have great doubts as to the effect of it. Now he dis
Manta) was going to do what hon. gentlemen mil
sralting on one side and voting on the An
(Lughter.) But if hon. gentlemen would la
to separate questions, they would not find that a very ion
sistent course. There was a great difference haws*
Questions, whether the law was justifiable as it stood, tai
whether the measure proposed for its alteration wee he
Talk of economy ! Why, who had ever gained by Tm
r,
dfioniubngt redoneu'eeNethwe the
firetPitaidothfi
teletrnaadvige oaftEionnehliewsh shiwffildrpis:
a law ? (Loud ahe from the protectionists.)
took from the shipownen, they gave to another ; as they
taken from the English agriculturist to give to mob&
(Renewed cheering from the same quarter) He had. Id
to learn what saving had been effected by tier
free trade measure.. There was a great disdains
between a saving te the nation and a saving to dew Be
had invariably voted for those measures. (Load Is2V
To that laugh he could onl upply the words of Go
l
"And the loud laugh p the vacant mind." (Eh
flawed laughter.) Show him the repeal of any duty the
had wished the nation. No ; these measures only meth
heed one clam for the benefit of another. In the gnaw
joeity awes that was right. (Laughter.) la this iutass
the change was similar—it was only a change of profits fres
one hand to another. He hailed the measure as contsinirg
this advantage—that it would take away the excuse With.
navigation laws were the cause of the failure of all the odor
ftee-trad• measures. (Muth laughter.) It ens no cols!
matter to get rid of that excuse. He quite agreed thin
was not just to maintain protection in one case and eneou
it in all the other.. The hon. member for Liverpool 'Poke
ef our large capital. Where was our capital ?He helical
of our being able to compete with every other nation WI:
was in our land, our houses, sad our ships ; sad iftfiff
adopted measures which would reduce the value of then no
was not quite sure we should have the large capital retie
He thought they ought to consider what had been dr.get
ens of the measure already adopted. Take the cWz.o!
sine. It we. imported at from 181. 10a. to led 101, 'add
was made in England for 181. A shopkeeper in Birn!ing
ham headed his advertisement "Effects of Free Trades_' 01°
went on to say that he had just imported from Oar
superior tools (a list of which the hon. gentleman nos 'fa
eluding echoers, penknives, he.), and although at a aotlf
10 per cent., he could offer them at from 30 to 60 per
"6"
cheaper than English-made articles of the same dump
An How. Mitunin.—lt is • puff.
Mr. MIINTZ.—He knew the advertiser to be a suet wspectable man, not only incapable of such a puff, battening
town:are it where,if it were a puff,it would soon be
dfsteeaad
For the last 25 years he had been competing with OW"'
chantn in hole othwenwtohwnou,o7 are,
them ad ancedasedintoduatrybe
with manly an exception, in the foreign trade. Ho_
now that trade almost entirely to himself; but it bad_ In
so much injured by the competition of foreigners, 186121
was not worth following, and was not worth iftlilditr
altogether. (" Hear, bear," and laughter.) Sole rn'
which he had formerly sold in large quantities at P!'
profit of 12 or 15 per cent., now left only 3; to 5 per seats
and would not cover general expenses and general we
as
was owing solely to the increase of manufactures ea?!
continent, not only in quantity, but in skill. Some sida o_ll_
ought to buy in the cheapest, and sell in the dearelsal
het. (Hear, hear) That waa a pretty
cheap or
blast
cheap or dear. Take any article manufactured in kg!
as
quantities In England, and ask if there was a saving 0.. r.;
whichu twt °lobes
per cent. in buying elsewhere. On the contrary. It, lir:
very often be found dearest to do se. (Hear, hear 4 .0."4
pose iron, which sold here at 101. per toe, could be Wes _
the continent At 91. ; according to the theory that weclot °,l
trachecatrapiteeantwcwhhithiclrtnigdee diethathingi
a wing. Bet if, by buying on the continent, we :t lt_ot
would he the consequence ? Instead of being chear.L.l
would be infinitely dearer for this country. Oleo,
and lands, and labour unemployed ;
were unemployed, and there was no man cakable f
romf,,o.
)
them, though they existed to • great event
ath sli%
Thourisaiwinuesthe case at preeent with all our sine iniGionw; that
out the country. The answer to this Yocato7
the politicc-troonomical argument, " I

owe Th.—.7;--ertiale so sheep ea moo ether esnaily, make mew
Wag elk" Lit Ole le opplied keisal Ti. kola bike
*km sot et mattlisdere. what kW Nikko km key no
Oki thanksloos ? Mae.) VAN, tisk Wane
ef dat offoolikt ? If key let thole had go wt .f who
eva and-their** p to b. gym we kook hoes to keep
*Sok la Ibis milley. And it wee weak it akki mks to
era VMS elleW lieglkid week go sot el eakkodem ;
and le firelyMnski it weak be at. He emoiloil Is
we the keine of kis ormatry ma kw is
did met pay tho Ike mai whhh
low, ere set: Oki (Hme.
wet) 'Tba eght hoe.getikkos jut mkt bp &kid
gas very ash le taloa" day off . hot fir the m
w. ail&dl poodeatiL Dada moil sat he Ulm adr with-
" ageollelepkvain Albums" kVillatiel7
Theme abbots is Gomm seaendly woo Nay .Mat ens
okd a come Hue we had a lud -sneak of mask to
we; and itinragaire
_we lowered the ploo et the yeepsety,
roam, Of the ram a ea enatry, the=
.00 wew wee propertiesadip ismoond spas the
Yom. Mal; how)tho Rd koriffire the mom up=
IMF gisoisied *WNW of disk orkpaing with
the Minim of .leer eammile, who hod ...irk Mmes
(des. Mk) Whoa Soy head their hods or
"Mk bade poolithak and the memo Mac
rv= diem bake ken we ackesidaushe wanting
Wake aterrom rriodpks et mono.. (Hear, beer.)
Ik. SCHOLEFULLD and Nohow Gawk aurami kat
as ewe Oak hem the vepael of teak He kaki that die
khohimais el Eirmiegbua erne key aka kilmoloil k the
.peal.( the navigation laws. They hod Map aided es •
limaikkg wade is the aoloale% whisk was sow doillolos.
It markt no mid this woe owing to free-trade; bat r ms-
wad. hod Med. hew either beam it had set beim Idly
wild eat, or at esmisysaled with aorverdiguolidos
rthe maosissymossor. (Hear. berm.)
mmilonis mold bo olooldevably hemeltsil lay tie ro-
wel of the antplish
Tie hook Om dividsd—Fes the woad reading 266
Fee the ameadmeat .. 210-66
The esameneeneat tho Bombers was followed by load
limn ben too emitter bombes.
The boll we ken mad a mond time and ordered to he
...Mod w Fikay week.

ESTIMATES.
Lewd J. RUSSELL annennold that be would pressed
with the vete of nen in the as estimates on Friday sent,
Ind with the amy estimatas as Monday next

SICILY.
Oa the seed= elf Yr. BANK" the followlep addition to
Viessant Pelamoshia's mandated ea the non" to rife-
ness to the dein et Say was speed to :—" Also, copies
of an mempowiles. Irmo: pawed buttress teens of
tits Bawd of Wessel sad say other departments of his
%deity% geeenweest, with rOweaos to the treassedas la
ratties ; end espies of ell eoataniniestioss ea this rolotat
whisk have pissed between lie Majesty's government sae
stke repressatetine of his Majesty at the emit piths Wag of
the Twe thediss."
NSW BILL. . .

Os dm motion of Mr. :I& orn;:lesse woo given to Miss Is
shill bit Ibir rootalstion of pomospro is merchant TONE.
TM boom sajostrosi st m quarter to 1 o'clock.