The Express.
London, England, 1853-04-16 00:00:00

ALLEGED REFUGEE CONSPIRACY.

Sir J. WALMSLEY rose for the purpose of asking a
question of the noble viscount the Secretary of State for
the Home Department with reference to an illustrious
exile in this country whom it would be the wish of this
Luse and of the country to protect, so long as he conducted
himself in conformity with our lowa. (Hear, hear.) He
was induced to ask the question he was about to put to the
noble lord in consequence of a statement in a " leading
journal " this morning to the following effect : "We be-
lieve that we are correctly informed whoa we state that,
upon intelligehee received by the Secretary of State for the
11. me Department and the Commissioners of Police for the
metropolis, active measures have been taken to substantiate
the charges which have king been vaguely preferred against
M. Kossuth and his adherents. Upon this legal inferma-
tim a house is the occupation of M Kossuth was searched
yesterd iy morning at an early hour by the competent autho-
rities, acing, we presume, under the Secretary of State's
warrant, and the rasult of this investigation was the disco-
very of a 'arge store of arms, ammunition, and materials of
war." (Hear, hear.) Now, the question which he (Sir
J. Walm.ley) had to ask of the noble lord was this—Wu
there any foundation for that statement with respect
to Louis Kossuth ; and also had her Majesty's government
given any assurance to Austria,or any other foreign powers,
with respect to the surveillance of political refugees in this
country ? (Hear, hear.) Perhaps it would be for the con-
venience of the house it the hon. gentleman, the Secretary
for the Treasury, would permit him at the same time to
move that the house at its rising de adjourn till Monday
next. (Hear, hear.)
Viscount PALMERSTON.—I am not going to second
the motion of my hon. friend, although it is pretty obvious
what is the reason why that motion is proposed—(a laugh) ;
but I shall confine myself to answer the question miff no
such proposition had been made. The facts are these—
namely, that information had been received that there were
in a house somewhere at Rotherhithe—not a house. own-
_ .

pied by M. Kossuth—a quantity of warlike stores, and that
there was a larger quantity of gunpowder than is permit-
ted by law, even to dealers in that article. A search war-
rant was issued in the ordinary course by a magistrate to
the police, and the house was entered yesterday
at an early hour. In that house were found
upwards of 70 cases closely packed, intended apparently for
transmission to sumo distance, and containing several thou-
sand rockets—not such rockets as are used at Vauxhall—
(loud laughter)—but for the purposes of war. There were
also found a considerable number of rockets in various
stages of manufacture, and iron cases containing combusti-
ble materials. There were found 2,000 shells, not as yet
loaded, and a very considerable quantity of the composi-
tion with which rockets are filled. there was also about
500 lbs. of gunpowder. These things were seised by the
police, but who belonged to the house, and who was the
permn employed in making them, I suppose the house will
not expect me now to state. (Hear, bear.) These are
questions which will require future consideration; but I
think the house will be of opinion that the Secretary of
State having been informed that there was reason to think
that there was such an immense amount of warlike stores
in a private dwelling. was justified in taking steps for the
purpose of taking possession of those arms, and of founding
! upon them any such proceedings as the law officers of the
`crown, whom we shall have to consult, may think there is
ground for sustaining. (Cheers.) I can assure my hon. friend
that he is entirely mistaken in supposing that her Majesty's
government are acting under any pledge, promise, or en-
gagement to any foriign state, except those which were
men-
force th in e
the
ewfs ofac e of
o country t parliament,
artiamen
t prevent namely, thate shelterew which,
I trust, will always be girt n to foreign exiles, whatever
may bo the political cause which has led them to take that
shelter, from being abused for the purpose of organ-
ising or carrying on hostile proceedings against foreign
powers. (Ii! ud cheers )
Mr. T. DUNCOMBE was very much afraid the state-
meat of the noble lord was much calculated to alarm the
public. and therefore he would put another question to the
I noble lord. Ile would ask the noble lord whether he did
not know that a sort of manufactory of rockets had been
I carried on at the house at Rotherhithe—e Lich was no house
at all—for the last six years past? (Hear, hear.) He had
' made inquiries into the facts, and could detail the real state
of the case to the house. As far as it related to Kossuth,
i the whole statement in the Times appeared to lee • perfect
i fabrication ; and he believed that there had been at Bother-
hit he a most illegal proceeding.of which an explanation would
have to be given in a court of law. There was a certain
gentlemen named Hale, and there was another named Capt.
! Warner. (A laugh.) Now, these gentlemen were rivals in
! the Flll3O line, except that Mr. lisle was the more success-
ful of the two. Did the noble lord mean to sae that he did
! not know that six years ago Mr. Hie took out a patent for
the manuf tcture et this wet of war rocket ; that he had
offered them to our government ? The sale of them had
been going on fur years. Various tureen governments—
Denmark, Prussia, and others—had purchased them; and
I,iter!t,, he Lad tit .oura-turc I them h, n hrtte amount. Ile
(Me. hy.c Rabe) latgicvell that Mr. Hale had also received
an order from Culm—(laughter)—and that et ry recently—
within the Let few mouth:—lte hail dieted to the govern-
ment the whale of the prom.. stock w1..!;..h he pessessed of
I these rockets, but which the government had refused, as

they bad done Captain Warner's invention. lie (Mr. Dun-
comb') remembered that when Lord Ingestre was a mem-
ber of this house he took a great interest in Captain
Warner ; he had taken him (Mr. Duncombe) to see all the
gallant captain's instruments and implements of war that
' were at the house of my Lord Salisbury, in Arlington.
street. (Laughter,) The government might, therefore.
just as well have issued a warrant to search the noble lord's
residence. (Hear, bear.) He was informed that Mr. Hale
had not a single ounce of gunpowder on his premises, and
that his rockets were originally made close to the arsenal
at We lefich. (Hear, hear.) The premises at Itotherhithe
were not a dwelling at all, and Mr. Hall resided at Chel-
sea. A very unlawful act had been committed by the
police, and now they were trying to ride off on the plea
• that the warrant was one under the Custom-house regula-
tions to starch for gunpowder. The rocket composition did
not contain gunpowder at all, and therefore the custom-
house had no right to break into the premises. (Hear,
hear.) He had had this statement from Mr. Hall's own
son, and he believed it to bo strictly correct. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. BRIGHT would also ask the noble lord a 11.1C,1i00.
Whatever K- muth might have done in Hungary, in this
country, or elsewhere, no one could doubt that the cha-
racter of such a man must be dear to himself, and that none
of them nor the press of England ought to defame such a
man. (Cheers.) On that ground he wished to ask the
noble lord whether there was any reason to believe that
Kassuth was in any degree whatsoever comprumieeel in
this matter more than any of the Orleans party now in this
country ? (Cheers.) He (Mr. Bright) thought he had a
right to ask that question, because he had been on a plat-
form—(lauehter)—with the distinguished individual in
question ; and although nothing would induce hint to say
that liberty was more likely to be promoted by the course
M. Koseuth had pursued, than by another course of pro-
ceeding which would more commend itself to his Olr.
Bright's) judgment and principles, he should be extremely
sorry it either there or elsewhere anything should occur
that would induce him to disavow his connexion with or his
admiration of that distingpished individual. (Cheers.) Ile
therefore felt, like many other persons in this country,
interested in knowing whether there was any ground what-
ever tor this statement, which had appeared in a powerful
orsn of the press. (Hear, hear.) Ile must ask for an
,explicit answer to this question, because it was only just
thet immediately alter the charge had been made which
was now travelling over the wide world, if an answer
could be given that would acquit him of doing what
would have been an unjoetifiable r.ct, it ought to be given,
PO that his character might be cleared, and the explana-
tion be as widely circulated as the charge. (Cheers.)
Lord PALMERSTON—With regard to the question of
my hon. friend (Mr. Duncombe) he really knows so much
more than I do myself about the matter, that if tll,re were
to be any interchange of questions and answers between us
I think I ought to be the questioner, and he answerer.
(Laughter.) It is, therefore, out of no disrespect that Ido
not answer the inquiry which he has put to tne, and I refer
him to his own knowledge.
Mr. DUNCOMBE.—What I asked was, do you not
know that this manufactory has been carried on there for
some time?

Lord P ALMERSTON —No, I really don't. (Laughter.)
I can only say that I don't moan to dispute the hon. gen-
tleman's assertion with regard to these rockets. (Cheers.)
It is very possible ; but I don't know any thing about it.
With regard to the other question put by the hon. gentle-
man (Mr. Bright), I am quite sure that the house in the
Present stage of the matter will not think it desirable that
I should answer it. Ido not mean to cast any imputation
upon any one. I have stated that it remains to be ascer-
tained who the persons are who are concerned in this great
manufactory of rockets, and at all events it would be most
improper to enter further upon the subject. (Cheers.)
Lord D. STUART reprehended the tendency of the noble
lord to treat subjects of every description with levity. Whe-
ther it was •j edge on the bench who was betrayed by his tem-
per into treating with cruelty an unfortunate criminal,or whe-
ther it was the character of a man like Kense th, the noble lord
indulged in jocularities which the house, however it might
relish them at the time, could not really approve of.
(Hear, hear.) He (Ln•d D. Stuart) was enabled to state
on the authority of M. Kossuth himself, that that gentle-
man denied all knowledge whatever of the transaction. M.
Kossuth declared that ho had no knowledge whatever of
the matter until he saw the article that morning in the
paper which ha,l so hastily, to say tho least of it, given cur-
rency to it. (Cheers.)
Mr. AGLIONBY knew nothing about the matter. (A
laugh.) He should like to see the gentleman in the house
who knew more—(hear, hear)—hut, though knowing no-
thing of the affair except what ho had heard that night,
he thought that it bed been shown by the statement of the
noble lord to be unfounded ; and it would only be due to
the press, and to the character of the paper itself which
had circulated the statement, that the contradiction should
be immediate. (Hear, hear.)
The motion for adjournment to Monday was then
agreed to.
CONDUCT OF INDIAN MAGISTRATES.

Mr. KPIIILLIMORE asked the President of the Board
of Control whether any steps had been taken to investiote
the charges made by Iludall Seth, of Bellungury, 11th July,
18.50, at Agra, against Mr. C. B. Denison, and his imme-
diate superior, Mr. Gubbins, the joint magistrate and ma-
gistrate of Agra ; and whether those gentlemen still hold
official situations in India.

Sir C. WOOD said the Governor-General bad sent one
of the chief judges of the Sudder Court of Calcutta to inves-
tigate these charges; and ho was anxious to as.nriate with
him one of the judges of the Supreme Courts. Sir Robert
Barlow was sent down to Agra for the express purpose of
conducting this inquiry. It resulted in the complete excul-
pstion of Mr. Oubbins from all the charges preferred
against him, except that of having demanded excessive bail.
With respect to Mr. Denison, he had only used some intem-
perate language.
Mr. PHILLIMORE asked if both those gentlemen were
still holding official situations in India ?
Sir C. WOOD said that Mr. nubbins was still holding
office. Mr. Denison also continued t 3 act in a judicial situa-
tion, bat not in Agra.
Mr. OTWAY asked whether intelligence had been re-
ceived of the dismissal of two judges of the Sudder Adaluut
by the Bombay government, and what was the cause of
their dismissal ?
Sir C. WOOD said he had received by that morning's
mail a private letter stating that the fact was so ; hut the
papers would not come until the next mail, and perhaps he
had better defer any further answer till ho received the
official account.
Mr. OTWAY—Then am I to understand that we are to
have no information till the next mail arrives ?

Sir C. WOOD—I have no information myself except by
private letter, which merely states the fact.
Mr, OT WAY—What is the fact ?

Sir C. WOOD—I don't think it fair to the parties that I
should state it, either one way or the other.
Mr. OTWAY said he should take the earliest opportu-
nity of bringing the subject before the house.
MAILS TO THE CAPE AND AUSTRALIA. _ _

Mr. MUNTZ asked whether the steam-ship Osmanli had
not put back to Liverpool in a leaky state, and whether the
mails she was to have carried for the Cape of Good Hope
had not been transferred to the General Screw Company's
ship Indiana, to sail for the Cape and Calcutta to-morrow;
also, what arrangen'ent, if any, had been now made for the
carriage of the mails to Australia ; are they to be taken b
the Argo, belonging to the Screw Steam Company, which
ship sails on the 4th day of May ?
Sir J. GRAHAM, who spoke with his back to the gallery,
was understood to say that the arrangements to which the
question referred were not under the management of the
Admiralty, but of the General Post office. As to the se-
cond question, the Admiralty had made a representation to
the Poet-Ake ; but an answer had not yet been received.
ARTERIAL DRAINAGE IN IRELAND.

Col. DUNNE asked the Secretary for Ireland whether
he had received complaints from certain proprietors inte-
rested in arterial drainage, that they have net received
sufficient notices of the local meetings of a commission of
engineers (appointed by the government to examine into
the circumstances of such works), and have been thereby

prevented making a statement to the commissioners of the
objections they feel to the proceedings of the Board of
Works with regard to those drainages : when the report of
that commission will be made; whether it will be presented to
the house before the end of the session ; and, whether there
is any objection on the past of the government to refer all
works of arterial drainage to this commission, as there is
only a limited number by the present instructions.
Sir J. YOUNG made a brief statement in reply, the pur-
port of which was not heard in the gallery, further than that
the report was in preparation.
RETURNS ORDERED.

On the motion of Mr. ELLICE, returns for each year
since 1840, of the number of barrels of cared herrings ex-
ported from Great Britain ; of the number of barrels so ex-
ported that have previously received the brand of the
Board of the British Bening Fishery ; and, of the number
of officers employed by that board in the process of brand-
ing, the annual expense of such officers, and the stations
where they aro placed.
On the motion of Mr. ENYART, return from the Ecclesi-
astical Commissioners for England of every payment made
to theta since the lit day of January, 1852, on account of
any suspended stalls in the cathedral and collegiate churches
of England and Wales; the return to give each church
separately, and to state the number of suspended stalls on
account of which each payment was made (in continuation
of Parliamentary l'aper, No. 549, of session 1832). Return,
(principally in continuation of Parliamentary Paper, No.
309, of session 1850) from the Ecclesiastical Commissioners
for England, of the grants er reductions respectively
allowed by them since the Ist day of January, 1850, to the
several chapter a of England and Wales, wherewith to pay sub-
stitutes for performing the additional duties cast upon them
by the suspension of eanonries, and of the names of the per-
sons who, as such substitutes, have received such grants.
On the motion of Mr. BRIGHT, return of all sums spent
on native education in India, since April, 1834, specifying
the various forms, and other particulars, in which such
expenditure has been made. Return of all sums spent on
Ouldic works (not of a military kind) iu India, since April,
MI, keeping distinct the amounts spent on the repairs of
eld and on the construction of new works, together with
the objects of the works newly constructed, and stating,
when remunerative, the amounts received from such works.
Copy of the statistical papers, illustrated by maps, relating
to India, recentlT prepared and printed for the Court of
Directors of the East India Company.