The Express.
London, England, 1847-02-05 00:00:00

expressed en this plan, fur if be did not he would lsehurled
from power amidst the eel:teatime of the Irish people.
Mr. LABOUCHERE said it was with the greatest rehic-
fano* that he interposed between the conclusion of the de-
bate, fur he thought it meet desirable that this discussion
should conclu le, and the house should apply them-elves to
urgent meaeures which had been devised to prevent the
destitutioa of Ireland. But the hon. member for Limerick
bed made such extraordinary miestatements that in juetiee
to the government he felt called on to make a few remarks.
The hou. mineher stated that his noble friend (Lewd J. Rus-
sell, had said that it was hi. principle to encourage no works
hut such as wi re of a smite, and unproductive nature. Had
it escaped tee recollection of the honourable mem-
her,—he was sure it hod not escaped the reccelee-
lion of the house, that the main measure which
was thought likely to la, most advantaetoes to Ireland
was one whirl. proposed to advance a million sod a hal to
enable the lueillords to give employment to the people, to
relieve filigree,, and ericeurege the cultivation ef the soil for
next year? It required great powers of misstatement to
declare that it was the policy of the government
to encourage unless and unproductive works, and
that they w. re not prepared, when they were sure
that the mosey would not fall into the hands of
speculators, to , ncourage those which were useful awl pro-
ductive. Another misstatement, of the hon. member
was, that the government had refueee to auction certain
presentments L r railways. The hon. member hail forgotten
the circumstsbees under which it was done, and which he
(Mr. L ilmachere) would state to the house, and he would
ask if the go. ernmeut was justified iu allowing a pre.
liontment foe a line for which no act of par:iament
had been obt,inerl. It was a mere speculation, and
the government was asked to ride over the law and acts of
patliement in is favour, a course which they would hare
been inexcusable if they had pursued. The hon. inemiier
was in error in saying that when there was a proper case,
the governmeut did not encourage presentments for rail-
ways. The pr. iciple was laid down in a tre ism), minute
of 16th Octolr, 1846, which stated that the trea-
sury would be prepared to give their sanction to
presentments fir railways on certain conditions—one
of which was thee the money should not he advanced for a
lino which had lof obtained an act of parliament. It would
have been unjue ifiable in the govenimeat,unler it had been
s frictional by th • legistereve, to take upon them to soy where
a railway should be executed. He begg. vt pardon of the
house fee having interposed between the conclusion of the
debate, even for each it short time, which he sh•,uld not have
done if he had not been provoked into it by the misstatements
of the hon. member fur Limerick.
The Marquis of GRANBY begged to return his thanks
to his noble Irien l (Lee' G. Ilenffuck) fur the introduetion
of this measure. Ile was not one who thought railways an
unmitigated good, and he thought they had been pushed too
far in this country; but Ireland was a place where they
would be most beneficial, and if ever there was
a time when they should be introduced, it was this.
Mr. MUNTZ remarked that the proposition of
the noble lord opposite (Lord G. Bentinck) proprieed to lend,
and not to give the money to Ireland. (Hear, hear.) And
the only difficulty in the measure would he, to protect Ire-
land from an ex ens of railways, which would not only be
injurious to Ireland, but also to the government, who
afforded the cred•t to make them. On all grounds he hailed
the introduction of this measure, to which he trusted the
' noble lord at the head of the government would give a re-
consideration. (lear, hear.)
Mr. W. P. COLLETT thought that the measure of the
noble lord the iember for Lynn would afford a way of
giving far more immediate relief than any Draivago Act or
amended poor-1n v.
Mr. M. GORE remindedthe honse, that while they might
be anxious to c instruct railways, they ought not to lose
sight of another source of iuduetry and employment—the
fisheries of Ireland.
Mr. GILOGAN, in reference to the treasury minute to
which the right lion. geutleman opposite (Mr. Labouchere)
had called the attention of the house, could elate that its
conditions were of a character which, rendered the minute
wholly inoperative.
Mr. M. J. O'CONNELL said that if lie thought the pro-
poaition of the noble lord the member for Lynn would en-
danger the finances of the country, he wouhl he as unwilling
to press the measure on the consideration of the government
and the house, as would any English or Scotch represetea-
live. Ile thought. however, that the noble lord had
fenced the measure with safeguards, which were quite suffi-
cient to prevent any danger from its operation. On these
grounds he was serry that a more encouraging tone had not
been held out by the government.
Mr. G. A. HAMILTON corroborated the statement
made by the hon. member for Dublin (Mr. Grogan)
as to the conditions of the treasury minute alreldy
referred to, rendering that minute wholly inoperative.
(Hear, hear.) By the proposition of the ',Mile lord the
member for Lynn, good a cerity would he afforded for all
the money advanced by this eoantry—(hea-, he arl—sod it
was the only propreition by which the taxation of this coun-
try would he lightened. (Hear, hear.)
Capt. HARRIS, Mr. P. S. BUTLER, Lord .1. MAN-
NERS, and Sir W. VERNER, approved of the measure of
the noble lord the clamber for Lynn.
On the motion that the bill be brought up,
Mr. ROEBUCK begged to throw himself on the considera-
tion of the house fora few minutes. Ile would appeal to the
fleece whether there was anything iu the tone or manure of
his address that evaiine to warrant the language applied to-
warde him. (Hear.) He stated simply, plainly, and withnut
equivocation, his objections without us net one harsh word.
(Cries of The clause.") Olt ! was that the vituperatioa
(Hear, hear.) It might be disagreeable to have se eh a clause
in the bill, but it was of the highest importance to the dig-
nity of the house that it should lie above suspicion that none
of the money intend, d for the benefice( the people of Ireland
• should be apportioned to any member of that or the other
house of parliament. (H' ar, hear.) With regard to the
speech of Mr. Grattan, there was no form of violence
which the hon. member had not recourse to. Whole-
sale phials of the hon. gentleman's wrath were broken over
his head. He began with accusing him of malignity, and
ended with calling him a " shrivelled adder." (Much
laughter.) That was his expression in the frantic exhibition
[ of his impotent indignation. But the adder had a sting and
• was a dangerous enemy, and it might happen that when he
stung the poor ox the venom of the stie.g WAS iu the truth
of whet he said. When he wanted to make the arrow eti.k
he barbed it with truth. (Hear, hear.) That made it hang
and mart, and hence, he believed, the anger of the hen.

gentleman.
Col. RAWDON believed that the adder was a dangerous
thing, and that language, such as had been teed by
the honourable member for Bath, was dangerous, in the
present circumstances of Ireland. But it was not
the first time the boo. and learned member hail proved him-
self dangerous to the empire ; for there was a strong suspi-
cion that the hon. and learned member was the hired advo-
cate of rebels. (" Hear, hear," and " order, order.")
The SPEAKER said the hon. and gallant member was
mit of order.
Col. RAWDON submitted at once—(hear, hear)—but he
felt strongly the manner in which the hon. and learned gen-
tleman addressed the house. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. F. FRENCH said if no other benefit was derived
from that d.seassion than the altered manner and tone of the
hon. and learned memb r for Btth in his last allusions to
Ireland, that hon. and learned gentleman at least would
have some rause for cougratulation—(Hear, hear.)
Mr. H. GRATTAN sad that the hon. and learned mem-
ber fur Bath having accused the Irish members of an inten-
tion to put money in their pockets, he would only inform
him that when Mr. Tierney was charged by Sir F. Burdett
with pocketing the public money, the then Speaker called
him to order; but, notwithstanding, Mr. Tierney gave him
a good johation. (Laughter.)
The bill was then brought in and read a first time, and
notice was given that the s.cond reading should be moved on
Thursday neat.
LETTING AND MANAGEMENT OF LANDED
PROPERTY IN IRELAND.
Mr. S. CRAWFORD postponed his motion on this sub-
jact until that day week.
RELIEF OF DISTRESS IN IRELAND.
Lord CLEMENTS said that, in consequence of a litter
which he had seen, stating that it was intended that the
police should interefere in the distribution of relief in Ire-
land, he felt bound to enter his protest in the strongest pos-
oible manner against such a step.
Mr. LABOUCHERE said that in the letter alluded to, it
was provided that one of the members who were to super-
intend the relief committees in Ireland was Col. M'Gregor,
and he believed that the character of that gentleman was
enough to prove that there was no person who could be more
generally trusted. He believed that the noble lord stood
alone in his opinion as far as that matter was concerned.
Lord CLEMENTS said that he said nothing that could
touch in any way the character of Colonel M'Gregor,
Nobody entertained a higher opinion of that gentleman's
character than he did, but he had the strongest objection to
such an office being imposed upon the police of Ireland.
DESTITUTE PERSONS (IRELAND) BILL.
The house went into committee ea this bill. On the motion
of the CUANCELLOS of the Ext iii4ll.:ER, that a resolution
to the effect that the sum of 300,0001. be advanced for the
purpose of carrying the bill into effect, from the consolidated
fund, on the security of • poor-rate to be levied, be carried,
Mr. P. SCROPE said that as the security depended on
the collection of the rates, and as that depended on the
exertions of the poor-law commissioners., and as he had a
strong opinion upon the laxity of the C01111711,114011P111 now
exiting, he wished to oak the Secretary of State whether
the same commissioners were to carry this act into execution,
or whether any alteration was to be made in that body.
Sir G. GREY said that it was not intended that any al.
terstion was to be made.
POOR RELIEF (IRELAND) BILL.
Lord J. RUSSELL said that he wished to state to the
house that, as is consequence of the long debate which had
taken place, it would be impossible for them to go into com-
mittee on this bill for the immediate relief of the poor in
Ireland, he would give notice that he would move that
the house go into cemmittee on it to-morrow. Ile would,
however, take the bill for the use of sugar in breweries and
distilleries first.
ST. ALBAN'S ELECTION.
The SPEAKER said that be had received a letter from
Lord Lit4o. el, saying that he did not intend to proceed wilh
his petition against Mr. Bond Cabbell's election for St.
Alban's.
The house then adjourned at twelve o'clock.

CUSTOMS.—SICK Per.—The authorities of the
customs department being of opinion that in cases of the ab-
sence of inferior officers an the service, by hurts received in
the actual execution of their duty, they should be allowed
sick pay for Sundays as well as other days, orden have been
issued to the comptroller-general, that the accounts for pay-
mint should be computed accordingly.