The Express.
London, England, 1849-02-27 00:00:00

NORTH AMERICAN RAILWAYS.

Mr. J. 8. SMITH asked whether it was true that a de-
spatch had gone oat stating that government would seder-
take if the legislature of the North American colonies
would charge the revenues with a sum sufficient to pay .5 per
cent. on the Imlay, to provide the means for constructing a
railway from Hal fa: to Quebec

Leal J. RUSSELL said there bad been some corresp3n-
dense au the subject between the Colonial Secretary and the
governors al the North American colonies, but govern-
ment was not involved in any guarantee.

FINANCIAL REFORM.

The question that the Speaker leave the chair having been
Pat

Mr. COBDEN roes and said,—l have ventured, Sir, to
introduce the amendment which has been placed in
your hands, because I thought it would be advan-
tageous to the house and to the country that before
we went into committee of supply, or into the details of the
estimates' we should have the opportunity of discussing the
question of the financial enchtson and prospects of the
country, and the cause which has given rise to the great in-
CMOS in the public expenditure which has been tadag an
during the last ten years; and I have considered that by
Ides so we "ball afford the government the opportunity of
amertdning the MSC of the house, and I hope also the sense
of the country, on this subject. In giving notice of this
motion as an amendment to the motion for going into
committee of supply, I by no means wish lion. gen-
tlemen to infer that the plan I propose here or have pro-
pounded elsewhere, is one that I expect the government
will bring forward in their estimates to-night or on Friday
next. I have no mach expectation, and should be sorry to
take the division in such a shape as to leave any hon. gentle-
man to infer, still lens to argue, that what I propose to do
can be done Instanter. All I wish is that the house
should have the opportunity of expressing its opinion
as to the dedrableneses and the necessity of the great
reductien in the expenditure which I advocate.
Now, sir, there is just one other point to which I will feta
for a moment. I have stated in the beginning of my rest>
laden that our net expenditure for the year 1835 amounted
to 44,422,0001., and that It was 64,185,0001. down to the am-
meneernent of the present year. I would have inserted the
roes expenditure if I could have obtained it from the lest
amounts, because we are under a great delusion in this house
and in the country in supposing that our expenditure
amounts only to that which comes int) the net account of
our finances. (Hear, hear.) Now, dr, on this subject we
can take a very much more severe view of our neighbours'
affairs than we can of our own. We have had the finances
of the French government very much criticised and rem asked
upon in this country of late. Now, the French accounts are
kept in a very different, and I think superior way from
ours. In the French 'counts you have the gross
.61.8 pat dawn en the debit and credit aides. For instance,
the ail et eallseden, all the drawbacks, sad everything
viii le tads esantry Is put down ea charges of collection of
maw, yea lave pat down in the gross revenue of accounts
in Plena Besides, in France you have a great number of
items charged that we put down here as local expenditure.
For insures, they have a large item for the religious in-
sulation et the people; tbeyhant also items for roads and
Wien% tie whole of their ideation, and ateliers osatiesatiz
We lave heard a grist deal of their eat of workshops, for-

getting that we have our ateliers nationaux in every
workhouse in England. (Hear, hear.) I will just read to
the house what is the amount of expenditure in Enelind
for public objects of the suns kind as are inserted in the
French budyst. Our imperial expenditure is 54,000,0001. ;
and here I beg to say that I will only give the figures in round
numbers, omitting the hundreds and thousands, and that in
every am I will engage to be under the real 'mounts.
(Hear.) Oar imperial expenditure, then. is 64,000,0004
Unr emit of colleen= and other amounts not paid into the
emievar,F is 7,000,0001. Our expenditure for the relief of
the poor in the United Kingdom is 8,000,0001. Our county
rates I put down at 1,006,0001. • our highway rates are
1,000,0001. ; religion. 6,ooo,ooo4—making a gross total
altogether of 77,000,000. Now, we bay., heard it stated in
this country that the French Government, in the year of
the revolution, and when they were in an excaptional state,
had expended 72,000,0001. In this country we expended
77,000,0001. for similar objects. Nay more, I have left
sot oar expense for hospitals and education, though I be-
lieve that if every item was included, and a fair
comparison made, we should have an expenditure of
80,000,0001. in England against 72,000,0001. in Franc*, for
a population of 29.000,000 against a population of 36,000,000.
(Hear, hear.) Now, air, that I think is calculated to make
us enter on the consideration of this question in a node cal-
mired, if possible, to diminish this enormous amount of
expenditure ; and in bringing forward tinily local charges,
I must say that we have lint sight, a great deal ton much, of
the increase of late years which has taken plans in the local
taxation of this country - (beer, bear)—for this country
differs from every other in this respect, that we have four or
five different local and legislative bodies taxing the people in
different ways for a variety of objects. If we look at the
incresee in our local expenditure, we shall see something
deserving of our serious and solemn attention.
I will tale the amount for the relief and maintenance of the
poor in the United Kingdom. In the year 1837 that amount
was 4,300,0001. ; by the latest accounts it was 8,341,0001. •,
and I take 1837 as the first starting point, because, in that
year, the new poor law was brought into full operation in
this country, and we had effected a considerable reduction in
the expenditure for the relief of the poor, and thought that
the new law would hive prevented any increase. Why, in
England alone, since that time the increase has been 60 per
cent. for the relief of the poor. (Hear, hear.l In ciunty
rata it has been the same. For the year 1835 the enmity
rates amounted to 671,0001. For the year ending Michael-
mas 1847 they. were 1.266,0004—near1y double spin for
musty rates same 1885. (Hear.) And I must ray that
I think local charges of this kind form • much tenor
index of the state of the country than the imperial taxation,
for bear in mind that these items of poor rates and county
rates are for the support of pauperism, the construction and
maintenance of gaol end other objects of that kind. In
fact, your local taxation Is a kind of barometer, showing the
social state of the country ; and I must say that the pro-
grits of these rates for the last 14 or 15 years has bean
of a moat discouraging and alarming kind. (Hear,
hear.) And there it another view of this question.
You cannot diminish these local rates, you cannot keep them
down, or prevent their increase, by any means you may 're-
sort to in the lucilities themselves. It is ID, firm Wier that
the progress of extravagance in your imperial legislature
is the cause of the growth of pauperism and crime in your
several localities, and that to amend and check this you must
apply the remedy in this house by general legislation.
(Hear, hear.) Now, sir, I think these facts will prepare us
all tor entering into this subject with a desire, if visible, to
find a means of reducing the expenditure which leads to
these evils. And now I come to the point upon which I
have heard much cavilling, sod which I do not wish to be
an obstacle in the way of any hon gentleman joining with
me this evening. It has been objected to me and asked,
" Why do you take 1836 as the standard to judge by in
making your calculatioas ?" (Hear.) Why, I have taken
it because I would avoid doing that, which indeed
I have been charged with doing, I would avoid taking an
arbitrary standard. (Hear.) I have been charged with
being dogmatical and fenolia taking an arbitrary standard.
No; I have not done so. I have done as we all would do lithe
management of our private affairs. If we have done wrong,
we would look back ad see when we began to get wrong.
(" Hear, hear," and cheers). And in doing this, I have
only followed precedents set me by others who discussed
similar questions before. Why I appeal to the hon. member
for Montrose, and other hon. members of this hone, whe-
ther, after the Rumba revolutionary war, it was not the
practice here to refer to the standard of 1792 ?
Mr. HUMS.—Whig end tory did so. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. COBDEN.—Whig and Tory, my hon. friend reminds
me, pointed back to 1792 as the point at which they fell into
these unhappy hostilities. (Hear, hoer.) I believe it
was the practice of Mr. Pitt to refer back to the peace
establishment after the seven years' war. Even the finance
committee of 1817, appointed by Lord Castlereagh—evan
they referred to 1792 as the standard, as the point of depart-
ure to which they should endeavour to return. (Hear.) Why,
I could quote from
every leading men, who rat on the oppo-
sition side of the house in 1816, down to 1822, arguments to
show the propriety of the eourso I am pursuing. I will take
one. I will quote from the Marquis of Lansdowne, who
moved a resolution analogous to mine in March 1816, and
saidt upon that eensaiou,
.th this Mew it would be necessary for him to compere the pre-
sent with former estimate' ; and, Indeed, this was the any prone'.
ble way la which they could be considend, drawing in aid of that
conelitentian the experiesce and wisdom of former times. That this
heel be the prattles firmer occasions was proved by the eon.
duet of a right has. whom authority the sable lords oppo-
site °sold warmly dispute► be meant Er. Pitt,q who, In 17163„, bad a
oramnietee appehsted be the papaw of stssidMsg what woald be
Or velar estiontes he the this peeve establishmant, taking ae •
geaaNfor timer Makin the eattmalm at the pros of 1763; thus
taat the aseeprieem with farmer aetimetse, and the mote
mese/ those. homed thease=sel grounds on which
ongettems of Ode satire seal* be
Now, Sir, I hope I easy net be sonsiderad as unjustified by
precedent. I am not oast of three who attach an undue
importance to precedent; but I think the case I have re-
ferred to forms • good example for me in drawing attention
to the expenditure of 1835. And when I say 1836, I might
take the average of '34, '35, and '36, because it would make
very little difference in the calculation; but I take 1835 and
draw a comparison between that and the expenditure of last
year. I find that the interest of the funded and unfunded
debt in 1835 was 28,614,0001., that in 1848 it was 28,563,0001.,
so that there is not a ;difference of 60,0001. between
the interest on the debt then and at the present
time. Then I And that the expenditure for the
army, navy, and ordnance in 1835 was 11,657,0001.,
that in 1848 it was 17,645,0004, and that the
Kaffir war in 1848—for I cannot separate that from our
warlike estimates, because I know not when it may com-
mence again—(hear, hear)—cost 1,100,0004, making a total
for army, navy, and ordnance of 18,745,0001. for last year.
The civil expenditure, consolidated fund, and miscellaneous
for 1836 was 4,251,0001. • for 1848, it was 6,698,0001. ; and
the distress in Ireland iast. year cost 276,0001. The total,
therefore, of expenditure in 1836 was 44,422,0001. against
64,182,0001. in 1848. (Hear, hear.) Now I wish
every hon, member to look at this point. You have
28,663,000Lf0r the interest of the funded and unfunded
debt which you cannot touch for any reduction of your
expenditure. Then, for civil expenditure, you have
6,698,0001, which comes under our review every year. Well,
by nearly the half of that which goes to the consolidated
fund you might probably, and you will in time, I hope, be
able to make considerable reductions ; but that sum, which
is voted under present acts of parliament, ie, I believe, the
sum to which you will apply at last for any reduction of
expenditure. Well, then, air, we come to • sum of 3,000,0001.
or 4,000,0001. a year for your miscellaneous expenditure,
upon which you are to itemise the pruning knife, unless
you adopt the plan which I most unfeignedly re-
commend, to reduce that enormous item of 18,000,0004,
for your military establishment. (" Hear," and cheers.)
Now, I have always advocated, feeling the necessity of a re-
duction of expenditure, the going to that enormous item
where any great practical relief can be had. Hon. gentlemen.
connected with the military service may think that there is •
spirit of hostility in my mind to them, because I touch that
item. I do it from abaolute necessity. (Hear, hear.) If
you will give any substantial relief to the country, and make
such a reduction as will amount to a sensible diminution of
expenditure, you must apply to that great item of army,
navy, and ordnance. (Hear, hear.) Now, sir, I will en-
deavour—for that almost is the whole gist of the argument I
have to offer upon that item of army, navy, and
ordnance—l will endeavour, with your permission, to
show what has been the expenditure upon that since 1835,
what went the causes of the increase, aed I will then leave
it to the house to decide whether those causes which led to
the increase exist at petite. (Hear, hear.) Now, in 1836
there was an additional vote of 6,000 seamen to the navy.
In 1836 there was • great apprehension felt in this
country respecting the Russian invasion. We had two or
three gentlemen then in England who, I thought, had a
monomania on the subject. (Laughter.) I was
so struck with that impression that, although cons.
pied at that time in private pursuits, I did
perpetrate two or three pamphlets in answer to those gentle-
men, who, as I said before, had, asj I thought, a monomania
about Russia. (Renewed laughter.) But the cry was pro-
pagated by those individuals, and echoed in the press, and in
this house, and the result was that the hon. member for
Halifax proposed the increase of 60,000 men for the navy.
The kings speech recommended it; and it is rev secret in the
present day that the king had a strong feeling on the subject.
Well, is there any ground now for summing that Russia is
coming to invade us) (Hear.) Why, we were to have had
the French invasion aline that—(A laugh) ; bur who will
now my that we want these 60,000 seamen to protect us ? Still
there they remain. (Hear, bear.) Now I come to 1838.
You remember the rebellion in Canada in 1838.
That gave rime to an increase of 8,000 to our army. (Hear,
hear.) That rebellion was put an end to very soon. Canada
since then obtained mrthing • country can desire in the
shape of self-government, (Hear.) I can only say that
I wish the people here were in u 'nippy a position as the
population of Canada are. I suppose hon. gentlemen will
not imagine that there is any danger now of a rebellion or of
any collision between England and Canada, yet there the
8.000 soldiers still remain. (Hear, hear.) Now, in
1839, the right hon. member for the city of London
(Lord J. Rumen), who was then Home Secretary, moved
for an increase of 6,000 men rank and fi'e for the
army, and he told us what they were wanted for.
There had been an apprehended insurrection at Monmouth ; I
allude to the affair of Frost, Williams, and Jones. There
was some turbulence in that part of the country by the char-
tist party, and the noble lord told us that 5,000 men were
required to meet those domestic troubles. Well, but we have
had an interval of several years of uninterrupted peace at
home, during which the chartists have been scarcely heard
of, sad yet there remain these 6,000 men. (Loud cheers.)
We never heard of their reduction. (Hear, hear.) Now I
come to the years 1840 and 1841. We had the China war, •
war in Syria—we had • threatened rupture with France,
and we were embroiled with America with respect to the
arrest and trial of M'Leod. These were times of
excitement, and I admit they were not without some
peril to the peace of the country, bat there was an
addition of 6,000 sailors made at that time. Well, bat
the China war is at an end. Syria is in the bands of the
Turks. There is no longer a threatened rupture with
Franco or with Amnia, and the M'Leod matter; has been
settled. Yet, here are the 6,000 sailors—(hear, bear)—we

tflaer hai them recalled. (Hao, hear.) Well. I eom now
smile. V. had di this with the tinted hates
=lle Made beandirye.in hunt the Minden between
sad Amines me mod by the basabas of tbe
Oasides, when the Man beeidaty raestL wel salibtolt
and flea there was .stigma" enellimmitk Aesseio,
and ism neitemeat here. Four dissimei Mors
were added to our marine ; but Fwrd Asiehartea
ear bash with an makable train MIME the
whole dispels about the hemilary. Yet we had no re.
Medea of them mikes. (Rear, bona Welli_tbsat solo
1845. That was a useless stale ef Often. We ked • dis-
pute with the waited mess imaidete OnSto
My. Peesiding Palk seat own smelba mange. General
Oms gook Mme &dews ind iallment oembillb .111 thin
sous • feeling Sheet we were is &Maim anger ef a Wines
en that Mader, questisu Amiss dedered that the
wend cake missies of the territory, sad admiaktir bee
he. tame. "ad we said we weld act submit to have
Oregsa Moe tram us. Well, there was a pepsin to
Meese our navy and 'inhibit a fleet of online&
We aceardiagly had a fleet at Spithead, and
her Majesty weal there to see it, and I resel-
ls* it was stated In the poen at the time to be mere
formidable Ikea the fleet that gained the battles of Trafalgar
ad she Nile. (A Mgt.) Well, la that year we bad sa
11111P10110 of 1,700,0001. in the army, navy, sad °dame do.
penmen mad my hon. kind the member for Mentrom
gen • M;ULE meat to that increase seder the sheen
Maces the, detailed. (" Her, hese," sod laughter.) WeD,
ben the Oregee qsedan was settled in the summer 01846
I believe its was the lest act performed by the
right Ma. harem the member for Timmth beton ha
mat out of odes be 1846. When, thee, is the plea
in keeping up that enormous armament? (" Her,
hear," and cheers.) Be, in 1846, no sooner was
the Oregon queens. settled, than we erten.' late diplo-
matic quarrel with Freaes reepectiew the lipsain maims.
I call it • diplomatic quarrel, though I might call it a mart
quatrel—(beer, bear)—for the people of this country had no
isterest he it, Bet It gave tie. to bad blood in Frames, and
to • state of irritatien in this country, and the men of the
two marks famed the flame, and no one could delay that
there was • great alienation, if not hostili:y, between the
two matries. That was ineressei by the previous public
dee of Prime idaville's pamphlet, and also by the old
nudge is the case of Mr. Pritchard. This produced a had
spirit between us and France, and, accordierly, we
bewessed our "miscellaneous" that year by 1.200,0031.
Is 1847 the mme spirit contieued Wm* the two countries,
mail we had diseuen.ne about forts tag ear comet against an
amok Arm France; and at the end of '47 we had a panic
maw as, end we were then persuaded by Mr. Pign, the
ouspoirder maker—(l4od laighter)—that the French were
Manly mains to attack as. (Renewed laughter.) We
had another lactose of army and ordnance in '47 to the
moan of 1,000,0001. The actual increase for army, navy,
*ad caimans' in '47 wee, I believe, 1,600,0001., but whether
be takes to same of the item I know not. I ask
dam how whether there is one of the causes which led to these
monsive augmeatatioes of our marine, army, and ordnance
that sow remade? (Rear, hear.) The last of which I
have spoken, I think, might have been the most serious of
all, though, as I stated, it was only a diplomatic quarrel ;
bet as it bourse dream, and as the second generation in
the person of Prim Joiaville, had entered into it, it might
have grown into something serious between the two man.
trim, if the question had not been Eared by • very rads
had—the late revolution in France, which has pet an end
to all ponibility of quarrelling between us and Frame on
the susjece of the marriages in Spain. (Rear, Mar.)
Per, whatever other grounds of danger and apprehension
may resale., no on. need apprehend that France
sad Bagdad will quarrel about the successor to
the Spanish crown. (Rear, hem.) Well, I ask hon. mem-
bers who are going isogon me—those who will not admit
that we may return es speedily NI practicable to a standard
nib as we had is 1836 and IM6—n put their linger oa any
of the ceases for this. seenessive augunntations of our
gr, sad tall me on. that new remains (Hear,lsear.)
eir, we stead at the present omelet in inlaid, a
anon:ior ponies es mewed with our foreign reddens to
what we did in '35; for, in '36, when we had reduced ear •
expenditure to th.t point, hone gentlems will resamber
that we were not in a very friendly position with soda.
Per several years we bad no .mh at St. Peniehmg.
We wen marauding, too, on the eosin of Spain, br we lad
our quadruple treaty, by which we famine& mersimeies
wader or kreiga some. We wen, thee, In 1833, net is
se seem a state with our foreign relating es we an new.
I ask say one to point oat when the danger is now throe-
tmed. Is it with Amite, and on amount of these boundary
CarAswhin we were enured were to germinate a war
ner of a eatery ? Is it with Frame ? Is it with
Reds? who is ecessious that, with her twenty millions of
eds. she has quite m meek to do at home is say other
many. (Rear, km.) I say that if Ragland takes dm
selvenige of he dealer position, and condo herself to her
own been—(bear, keer)—and does not ran into needless
and rash disputes with other countries, there never was a
time when she stood so free from danger of war as at the pro-
em moment. (Rear, hear.) On present political slats, as
regards err foreign relations, might be said to be as calm
as still water. It may be objected, when asked to go back
to the standard of 1836, that the expenditure of that year
was too low. I do not admit that, my bon. friend the mem.
her fortMoatrese will not admit it. (A laugh.) It has been
said that the services were left in en inefficient state in
1815. My hon. friend the member for Skid Id said on
a bran masks that the dockyard. had been loft in • state
of destantion. My hon. friend ought to lean remembered
that that was said once before. In 1816, when the and
teed the ember for London, and all kis leading whip en-
leagues were advocating a reduction of the naval and military
eignikameats to the standard of 1792, it wee said that the
Mahal mainjudiciously low, and that Mr. Pitt had ever after
regraded be bed made It so low. This was repeated by Lord
Caidegook and ethers, ad ourearan, until Lord Grenville
denied Mat Ik. Fat 'Outdated such an opinion, and that
hem ths itsalsory always esagratilsted himself that he had
Mused them eitaldishmente so low after the Anteriean war,
because it enabled this country to come into war with Frame
with recruited forces. For the reduction of 11133 we are
mainly indebted to • right hon. gentleman (Sir J. Gra-
ham), her whose administrative talents I entertein the great-
est respect and admiration, and I call upon hies to say who-
Dm the dockyard, were left by him in the state of &Mea-
th& dineribed by the hon. member for Sh. Meld. Turning
from em foreign relations, I feel myself bound to ad-
vert to a quedon which ie always presented to
as in amebas et this nature. Let any hoe. amber
ask kr a rednedea of establishments, ad he is imam&
Maly told that they are memo, for the maintenance of
our south a. The right bon. baronet, the member for Tan-
a ner*, in his celebrated budget epoch of Feb. 14,1846,
d-
-0f the In battalions of aeon fats hid* minim thewere
en el in lad* 30 are =albs Maim Mho snag Ode
mem. mildeg h an rt he the &Mei
dm staid maire. Wilms Sta=wellt ,ski
sapplasi. far dee paeans et atakalake the peneatim hr
pumas, awl eis dint it nssmbidy. ef metandeg the system if
Mins kr ear redmeassesemo-oesed.
Now I ask the hones if the time is an come Whit WO
ought seriously to comider whether we amen nem Me
MIMS= expenditure lacuna by this erwary !sr earisle.
Mal pesinden ? (Hear, hear ) That minim was wag.
ogled by agesaintto of the Muse in 1834; bas hew math
mine aematary is it to mender it mw. What the ground
b spec whin keeMaliers on jemdbly adverb the lmegisg
up of that mina.manse I am at • Iso le
ea undentend madmen who are preteadeeises .pea the
prinelple that our eadmive trade win the misnies imam-
Moos ft the tomes of the Weald mialiklnnesn:,
estisallead them Mktg be nem mnaMlebnimin se : a as
they lad a be
Iteeplag wp Me_ minsipie
Bat if there be pratectionine who *Lk that the Ned peters-
peinsiple am be restored, I am willing that they shield
veto mean me ea this occedien. If, en the Maw head,
there be frootenders who think that freeMede is only as
eaperbeent, I am willing that they Is. skald take a
✓im lr Nam. Rat I ask how they whe think
with on, that foes-trade is sot as slOodniaate bat
Ape/main sale gad principle, on say Mow vele for
the minimises of those otablinanate In ea admin.
(Rear. bear.) Attaining to oar them el gees bale, we
eassidar that we gin the colones iset been ki elloring
them le Owls where they plum. We have gee thialawny
kr omens% isd by Olaf; it to them we amen • gnat
Meta
to ty. Bat: we my they is, Mad
ini kr those selehibhmente whisk are
wattasay ha their ma defence and their awn geversissat.
I bier seen geademen say that we nest make them an
integral part of the Idaidem. But If we do, wall they pay
our taxes and share oar dept ? It that is &se, I can under-
stand the plasipla of &lag se; bat enemies the
ties mom sic—r. The peat mass ierthe
people of this atentry on Ann no hessafrom oar solenies
Men through the median et trade. It is only •
very few who benefit b Mecum and mointsmata.
(Rear. hear.) Such being the ease, 1 say
is amiketly, unjust and indefensible, that you
should tea the_people of tbis country for the means of
oar ooleales. There was a great difference Mimes some
plass, ask es Gibraltar and Melts, is whisk we met
• limbos, and embalm sash as Andrade. New
ibe Gm of Geed Mos whisk an iakeleited
bye egal MIN whin an pined in a tospegage same,
andisheme Inglidemen on homme indigenous. I say it is
moinireas lid the meek! of England should be tatted foe
sasiataineg the milWielenots of them colonies. I wish
that has. nembese wield fast reflect • li'tls apMthe sem
matinamelition of the inhabiteate of these Male amd the
anis anatry ; for if they did they would led that
thelwmr wen in an enviable state compesed with the
lads, • mad that a labourer in Australia is open a with
a Deisokire farmer. If bon. genitalia asasldae that
I am waning logically and fairly, and ANION from
the of free trade, they wad go with see es this ex-
tent-
at ail events, that we must from this time peeper* to
relieve ourselves as speedily r s possible from the meandieure
we have .caned on account of our military mendihments
in our micsits. In New Z-alsnd you have 2,000 risk end
file, And net, 20,000 European inhabitants ; that is ablest ame
soldier he awn ten catenate ; that one soldier MM.
hem NUM from Zeeland, at the expense of the people of
the ovate& • diabase of 12,000 or 16,000 miles, to be fed
sad MOM is the midst of • people every one of whom
moles W own tide, end knows how to use it. In Australis
yea wee bound to end as armed force of 2,000 or 3,000 as •
=Mb after the canine ; bat where then is no sash
where there are no aboriginal inhabitants, and not
men • ?met of pey to injure the colonists, I do say it is
lead paw ma won injustice to compel Ihrisigaz
Or a Mingo establishment which the colonists i
mad enter Meg without, provided you give them the
omen of thee, ma affairs. 1 do believe that mask of this
fir*, is kept up
yminable on Colonel-Oho to Moiablo be
affaim in the wa it APO. (Wm. hem) TIM it is boil
up seen to enable prousaisat %keep dews the pone.
ties than to rigid that maladies against ea enemy.
(Her, Mr.) I esasider that kes bade has enabled you to
Mate your expenditare to a kW min than 1835, and yet
leave you all the accessary force yea may require for pro-

Meths at hems. It hie lien Own that any ens-
thhd of en hums an Nemat loffiffria Y this ennui,
udtle two-thine= sielondmil air the okras. That is a
whist requires a Mel
ehmse, en if you
rinse ft yea um se have any dinesdty
sandeg the reigns IV for. I am aware
that respeeling amernede at hose, yes ham
Now a faun larger hem le' hashed sad Irian
than is VOL lam veryeerry it is se; and I think nen
hes prevailed a most osaggeraled idea es te the mewls, of
that Versa. Lest year we IMO ell ia a penis, std send net
reason en the siabjeet. But we hem as larger that MON.
while the trials in the roans of law in sahreire le the
nehmen that did take plan have them sane light mess
what has beat unworthily dignified :by the name of ken.
realm It has ben dearly shown that neither is igisd
erg been have them been 100 mat cionederMsd Wisner
with arms to war against the cavern and ormenment
of this neantay. I believe that that esnesay of a
reventice was never onstaieed by mitellege of mere
thatßo mat,and of them six or eight will Inn (A
WOO I holism, 1101•7114 if what I have been from
moshirstes end ohms be Was, that whatever of meentios-
hales there wee hi the &Linehan' hers mime ken
ingleatim, that if it had net hen he Ma
eleessals there wend hove been ne tannins' amethenshhe
Beglisis perinhalea. Bann ft should be ressionell
jades to thil country and le the as. of the working pee.,
that lbw eighteen months previous to the timbre* if the
French winelmiss, they had paned through a ends of
great 111suity, phallus and mitering. (Hear, Mar.)
This prresan of 1847 was felt particularly in the moan
of Yesk and Lenesater, and yet not the Ashen
tendency to totem* or political enlistment ef
any kind was ninon. The people believed to their
ISIISSIOW that every once of food that fend An
he tam le this sentry was admitted into it —they knew OM
the naelpilhe laws were suspended, and they hit thet the
pmentment had sot placed itself in antagonism to themo awl
with tide sonection on their mind they abstained hem ell
sets of hmtility towards the government, and ninon
those of perfect loyalty and order. (Hear, hear.) Notwith-
standilig WS, attempts, which I own have filled me with
feelings of surprise, not wunized with indignation, have
been made to prove that it has been our troops, and our ar-
tillery, and ike hundreds of thousands of special constables
alone who prevented a large portion of the people of this
country from rising into rebellioa. I don't believe it—(hear,
hear)—aad I am happy to think I bars no mom to believe
it; for If it wets true it would be very 'mahatmas for the
country. There is another point I teal bend to Mies
in justice to the people of this country, sod in many to
then&laded mea who are now expiating their arises se
tellies, or both. I hope that at some huge thus it will be
conedrred, particularly in reference to the cam of the young
men, that when they erred this country was exposed to the
influence of an electric shock which had bees felt all
through Europe, sad that it was not an unnatural thing that
men with vivid faacies or sanguine temperaments, or who
felt keenly for the sufferings of the people, should have
been seized with the idea of revolutionising the country.
You had every reason to expect some attempt of
the kind, and you have now reason to congratulate
yoesesives that after a short interval you should find so little
teem of it. Dat the conclualen I draw from all this is, that
yes mann at the mein neaten take the condition of the
people
iegviesildestioa he keeping up a larger military force
nee nun Os the ground, therefore, of our
hedge relatitmeope the ground of ger aline connexions,
and with reformist to ear domestic positita, I see no reason
whatever to prevent the executive government from being
authorised by this Mx se, as an act of justice and mercy to
the taxpayers of the nation, largely to reduce our naval and
military iO/ofll. (Hear, hear.) It is not mT intention to
tell you on this omen what I would do with the mono
saved, or how you might relieve the commercial and
entrust industry oldie country by a large rendition of tax .
I will not anticipate the opportunities which hon. gentlemen
opposite will give me of proving to them that if they wish to
abolish the sash tax gad the kap duties, it must and can only
be Ousel by their wades he sine sash measure as I pen-
Mt sea M remove every obstacle I can to the
use end of labour and capital, whether in
agriculture or measheturts (Hear, hear.) But I toll hon.
gentlemen that it h useless to go to agricultural meetings,
and talk 010/11111/ift bas malt tax and the hop duties, un-
less they look at the arithmetical table which I have placed
before them, and as whether lan net right in saying that
it is only by rehash( naval and military
establishments this oar
aan nt y large reduction of
taxation ; without whiff their scheme of abolishing those
taxes which me alleged to be an exude in the way of the
agriculturist cannot wall be carried out. There are
other taxes as well w dein consideration. There is the
tax upon Shaba?, which the government, I doubt not, desire
to make corollary to the removal of the navigation laws.
There are also bricks, and soap and paper, and tea—l hoer
gentlemen to the right and left whispering some favourite
tax for repeal. (A laugh.) You will have those doors
besieged by petitioners anxious for the removal of those
tax:s. It is not necessary that I should now dwell
upon the necessity of removing them—ample opportunity
will be afforded me on future aseMons, and I shall
now conclude by urging, that if you are determined to
maintain these eicarnams establishments, you are incurring
far greater Tiers to this country than by reducing them
yon have any reason to apprehend from the chance of col-
lision with foreign powers. I wish hon. gentlemen to bear
that in mind when arguing with me. They may say there
Is danger abroad, that at some distant time there any be a
combination of foreign powers sufficient to threaten the
peace or security of this country. If we had nothing else
to do but hunt about for collisions with some
foreign power, I might take the same view ; but in
jetties to myself I Inver look at the question without
considering what is the danger of reducing our forces,
and what the danger if we continue the present
enermoua amount of taxation. I have already shown that
the increase in our establh/mtenb km token place to
meet particular ease and alleged MeNetitille which no
larger exist. It Is said now, that they mean be reduced,
Decease other sountries have ineretrid their establishment.,
and that we must sot redoes, bemuse they do not. lam
strongly of ephien that rosposths the navy we ere the
odendeir:taa:gi the dist loweass, and brstdl Inman-
ing. to the unmak of e opinion ln Frazee, there
is now a pmt fie feeling amongst the people of that
country ; and I believe that sny overture made by this hone
or the country in a reduction of armaments would be freely
met and 111.111,64 to by them. It is acknowledged by
them, that theirllneaces farm the great danger and diffi-
culty tithe mew republic ; and that the only means of meet-
ing it h by a large reduction of their warlike establish.
ments. But I would apply the pruning-knife to our
civil establishments as wall, and have included in
the list el our Will the amount for civil !M-
--rsa idge I think may justly be taken of
werdi eprip it dais the civil expenditure of the country ;
the east is smaihr eseten/y, but a great deal too exorbitant.
Bat, be it remmillsrell, it Is not only the net amount of the
revenue, *MS which Ins its way tato the easalidated fund,
batwe hen le make war soonomy from —awe is • large
ameeml whin mint eon's into the meow% se all, which
goes in ablemements. sad In the ant of seasedes sad if
it Iran Meld& *a noun in the spas
the anent of new whisk hue rush the exeC
env. Thresh pea have but time err tear millions in the
erff onpanditure whisis=cr thetimaint
yet yen
mass
oohs Hem)
Ia ISO WM alone pia may On a saving, that
en whin the sable hid (Dumas) the nienber
foe Bath obtained a onssittee lest year, • the
weeds and hens. (Haar, hear.) Lad year when
that noble hied made a aeon •1=;
he appeal to this
hems for the mune of the wino , told us that
he nand ge Into that semmittes (on the ens and Forests)
M nee 110,0001. a year. Well, if he saves only one-half of
that sem. it willurirtrest way towards enabling the Ohm-
age, of the 11 civil
M reduce our expenditure by a
milks end a half. or I take it that the consolidated fund
is esalinally throttles up the means from time to time, of
entpreming gensemeary Mots, and reducing oaten. At all
events, I Oink k will not be difficult to runes the expendi-
ture to what h was in 1116. (Heir, hear.) I eta only may,
if it were lot le ma to de it, I would do it is this way I
would spend not men than to million. for our armaments;
I would have them as ellelset es they could be, but they
sheen set met MOM than In millions. I would have the

remainder kr Eaglet atptelliinst ; I would have 1,600,000 L
more for that as than west be 1,600,000 lase for
the military end navel expenditure. (Hear, hear.)
Thu preserving the total amount as it was In 1146 ; but
giving one and • half million more to the civil expenditure,
and taking it front the military and natal expenditure, Ms
may, I am confident, return is the expenditure of MS.
(Hest, kat.) And I venture to prods; having bad some
previous madame it watritiag the development of public
opinion, that nothing lees wM satisfy the people of this
country. The feeling in favour of economy has grown mach
within the last year. (Hear, hear.) This hems itself
bears witness of it. (Hoar hear.) I have seen each ',i-
deas, of the of opinion on this subject that I have
not the least dos t, in a comparatively short time, the ex-
penditure of this country may be brought back to the expen-
diture of 1816. (Hear, hear.) I will conalade by merely
saying, that i eassider, in advccatlag the redaction of es-
• tare, laa advocating the removal of those impedi-
menta to industry which canes disease, pauperism, and
aims is the country ; a measure which will tend to
make the people contented and happy china, instead of
being miserable, dejected, end dhafected, In giving men
something to tight for in this country, soeurtMesto reams
:
and to love, instead of making them the e of our is
agitation*. (Hear, hear.) Every step that you take in tleall
way, in mitigating the pressure of taxation on the peoaie
and showing that a government of this kind may be carried
en ea cheaply as the governments in other countries, will fle
mon to preserve your institutions; are, and will de UM
to preserve yourselves from foreign attache thew ley
mount whisk you eta upend in military and naval=
dons. (Chute.) Si; I re sew to non the
moieties:
/Meths set expeeilline of the yevereesat be the yew MI (me.
fle. ISW) unarm W 44. SKIM
nrilarePlCihe theyear tai/ la 1,1010 (yeellmolery ism
No.l M meneled 4.1/11141.; Ole Weems et awl, lei
sadness Inelag bee waren gdesfidk by sesemlut erepeohileee
ofoar media eawbffibmwete.- aul-sys our admire armideb s
theigi=etranisiw letwesay NOE the aid
use fir as onion IN sir
alradi want Ihe emliseme of We brews
that Ow how MOW le me Is melee IMPINIIIIINSI WIL
op ef eitre menee. Owhish blab
he Chao
n ef Lbw le el huwire
eel als=ellee
Ismehe weeptiew Mau
the Mei eed wi ynd Wefts et the peegie: :.the le
lulu It le melba the Ws here Me .
el Uwe rehrea
l th
tee
ell preadeable speed as siassid Nei
al
Os inn 'dab the kit 14 yam la bleu yawl 111:da
shot Ow We matelweese of the wwidlr, leaser, eel 411.1. et fike
MN& Allierjass.)
M. esemial the masa.
TheCHANCIILLOR of the lIIICILEQI33II said that
lady se he did hen the esetelosies some to by the his.
member for the West Riding, be mut yet bear his
blithnOmy to the fair and temperate meaner In whicittiti