The Express.
London, England, 1848-05-19 00:00:00

THE EXPRESS, FRIDAY EVENING, MAY 19, 1848.

commissioners.
Lord DUNCAN had no objection to the noble lord at the
head of the Woods and Forest• being the mouthpiece of the
commission in this house ; and, if necessary, they might
have one in the other house; but he was most anxious that
there shoti:d be one paid and responsible commissioner.
Mr. W. MILES advocated the appointment of • corn-
tnission on ill.. basis of the hick:sure commission.
Lord DUNCAN proposed to alter his amendment so as to
authorise the appointment of one paid commissioner, with
two unpaid commissioners, one in this house, the other in
t 1..• Lmds.
Lord J. RUSSELL thought it appeared reasonable, after
what had been stated, that there should be one paid com-
missioner. The other commissioners, of whom his noble
friend near nim (Lord Morpetb) might be one, would of
course he consersant with the business transacted at the
board. If the noble lord the member for Bath (Lord Dun-
caw) would withdraw- his amendimnt, the sixth clause might
he so modified as to authorise the appointment of a paid
commjssioner, with the othertwo COMMill&Ce111,

Lord DUNCAN &mod to withdraw his amendment.
Col. 818 IHORP opposed the withdrawal of the amend-
ment, sod said he should move that the chairman do report
progress, as the hour had arrived (nine o'cloek) at which it
was arranged the house shoulrddroceed to other business.
Viscount MORPETH ho the ben. and gallant mem-
ber would allow this one clause to be agreed to, and they
would thee report program, (Hear, hear.)
After a conversation (Col. SIDTKORP insisting on the ful-
filment of the pledge given by the noble lord at the head of
the government, that the house should resume at!) o'clock;
and Lord J. Redeem. admitting that he was bound by that
pledge if any hon. member claimed its fulfilment), the me'
tion for reporting progress was agreed to, and the house re-
sumed.
BOROUGH ELECTIONS (No. 2) BILL.
Sit J. HANMER moved the second reading of this bill.
He entreated the attention of the house on eccount of the
great Importance of the measure. On various occasions,
when new writs had been moved in lieu of members who
had been unseated, he had thought it right to oppose their
issuing ; and he had now deemed it necessary to submit a
general measure applicable to such cue.% having failed to in-
duce any member of the government to do so. Ile did not
assume the responsibility of presenting a now and un-
heard-of measure to parliament. Ile had consulted
precedents, and had taken the opinion of various
hon. members; and he believed his measure would be found
perfectly constitutional. (" Hear," and laughter.) Taking
the case of Sudbury as a precedent—a ease which was caro-
-1 fully considered at the time—he proposed this bill, which
was strictly one for inquiry. By passing it parliament would
abandon none of its discretion, but might still institute a
*pedal inquiry where circumstances called for it. This was
a measure merely authorising inquiry where wale were de-
clared void through corruption: he bad not thought it
neesmary to carry it further. He contemplated only such
eases as came before parliament in the regular way by peti-
tion, without interfering with any other places, whatever
might be their character. The hon. member then referred
to what bad been done in the Sudbury ease. This hill fol-
lowed the precedent in that case. The measure was a mess
sure of inquiry, which pledged the house to no particular I
course hereafter. It was must desirable indeed that they
should have fell and perfect information before them, before
they proceeded to any act of legislation on the subject. He
proposed that in future, whenever a parliamentary com-
mittee reported that corruption bed prevailed at any elec-
tion, then that the house should have the power to cause
inquiries to be instituted on the *pot by parties specially
appointed by the Speaker to examine into the facts. The
tall rested entirely on precedent, and het wished the house
earnestly to affirm its principle.
The question having been put,
Col. 8113THORP said the hon. member who brought
forward this bill, now member for the Flint boroughs, was
formerly member fur Hull. Ile did not know why the hon.
member had deserted that pure constituency. (A laugh.)
Would the circumstances beat israestigation lie feared
not. " Conscience made cowards of us all." The hon.
member also sat for Shrewsbury. Ile did net know why he
left that almost equally pure borough. lie was not
there to tell why.
Sir J. HAN MER—I will. (A cry of " Question ")
Col, SIBTHORP—Oh, the honourable member who
called " Question " was probably in a similar portion.
" Let the galled jade wince." (A laugh.) Ile was
too old a soldier to be caught asleep on his post.
He had never represented but one city—the city of
his disinterested choice —the purest city in the country.
But he pissed to the bill. This bill was just as objec-
tionable as the last. There were to be commissioners—
most extravagantly paid. Commissioners to go down to
places like Lincoln to inquire what had been going on. Why,
where could any one be safe ? He did not tear the bill, nut
he ! Ob, nu! Let the bon. member's COMM6bluller coon
down to that highly honourable professional man who
was his agent in Lincoln (loud laughter) —or let
him come down to 'his own house at Washing-
borough, and he (Col. Sibthorp) would do what he
hod any British gentleman would do on a similar occa-
sion—kick him out ! (Great laughter, and cries of " Oh.")
Oh ! let the hon. member remember the passeee of scripture
—the beam and the mote. (Oh.) Ile hoped he had peed
legal expenses at Hull, and no more. When a member of
the Conservative Club went over and sat on the other side,
he must forgive him for saying he suspected his public con-
duct. (Coes of "Oh, and "Question.") lie moved that
the bill be read a second time that day six months.
Mr. HILDYARD supported the 'intendment, considering
that committees of that house were ales ally inverted with
sufficient powers to enable them to deal with corrupt consti.
tuencies. He could not help thinking that there was some
thing of a desire to get rid of the small boroughs, mixed up
very intimately with the sympathy manifested in particular
quarters for this bill; that hon. mitt:eaten, doubtful, after
the noble premier's finality declaration, how far they could
succeed in any direct proposition for abolishing the small
boroughs, were willing to avail themselves of the indirect
means afforded to this end by the present bill.
Mr. BAGSHAW gave notice that he should in committee
move that the borough of Harwich be excluded from the
operation of the bill. ( Laughter.)
Mr. HUDSON opposed the measure, as one which, while
it would throw a firebrand into every constituent place
throughout te country, woueffect no practical good. At
all events, leth the house wait and see what plan the hon.
member fer Montrose would propose.
Mr. HUME said, that the house annually neolved, that
bribery and undue intluence in elections were infractions of
its privileges, and the question now was, merely whether
they would pass • bill confirmetory of their own resolutions.
The only object of the bill was, to institut, an inquiry into
the practices which bad been already partially developed be.
fore parliamentary committees, end on this ground he
trusted it would meet with the approval of the house. The
scenery was cleared fora divisim, but none took place. On
our return we found
Mr. J. STUAItT attempting to address the house, but the
impatience fur a division prevented his obtaining a hearing.
The bun. member moved the adjournment of tie house.
After a few words from Sir J. HANSOM,
Mr. DISRAELI said that the house had a right to expect
some explanation from the government as to the withdrawal
of the Horsham bill before it came to a division on the pre-
sent measure. It was rather a new practice for government
to introduce a measure intended to legislate for the house
itself, and then suddenly to withdraw it in deference to the
proposition of one who was pleased to call himself a private
member of parliament.
Lord J. RUSSELL—It was very difficult fur hint to say
what were the circumstances which the bon member wished
to have explained. He ( Lotd J. Ruesell) hail thought that
when the Horsham bill was before the house sufficient ex•
planation bad been given. The question was extremely
simple, but he would state again in a few word.' what was
the pasition of that bill and of the Present measure. When
the ease of Ilorsham was before the house, and when the
house decided that the writ should be suspended, ho was
asked by several persons, both those who agreed to and those
who opposed the suspension of the writ, to introduce a hill
upon the eubject. Ile was not very willing, but consented
in obedience to the generally expressed wish. After.
wards, however, there occurred other esses, especially
that of Derby, in which the write were ale,. suspended,
and the names of more were mentioned in which
it was likely that special reports would be made. The
hon. but. (the member for the Flint boroughs) undertook
to bring in a bill which should include all, and provide for
inquiry by means of a commission. On consideration, it ap-
peared to him (Loot J. Russell) that to include all iu our
bill would be the better mode of proceeui ding. He had had, 25
years since some experience of inqries into the corrupt
praetices of 'boreughs, and knew very well Unit after a com-
mittee and the house had been eatistied of the prevalence of
bribery, the House of Lords called for further evidence, and
generally threw out the bill. It was evident, therefore, that
the mode of redress formerly practised was very likely to fail,
and that that proposed by the hon. hart., which was similar
to what had been done in the case of Sudbury, was the only
one calculated to procure evidence which should be batistes-
tmy to both houses. If the house should see fit to reelect this
bill, he (Lord J. Russell) could then proceed with his own
bill, which, although not so good, might still afford some
means of useful inquiry. lie thought it desirable that the
house should come to a decision, there being two or three
writs suspended. If the house accepted the bill, there would
be good reason for continuing the euepcnsion ; while, if
they rejected it, there would he equally strong tied constitu-
tional reasons for causing them to issue. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. HENLEY was not surprised that the hon. and
learned member for Newark had moved the adjournment of
the home, seeing the clamour that had 10(:(1l raised against
him by the immediate supporters of government. If the
hon. and learned member went to a diviaion, he (Mr. lien.
ley) should support the motion.
The house divided For the adjournment—. 69
Against it
The house then divided on the second reading.
Ayes
Noes
The bill was accordingly road a second time, and ordered
to be committed.
INCUMI3ERED ESTATES (IRELAND) BILL.
The SOLICITOR GENERAL moved the second reading
of this bill, iu order that it might be committed pro forma,
with the view of introducing some amendments,
After a conversation as to the propriety of that course,
Mr. BRIGHT expressed a hope that the could
ti would be given to this measure, for he state on
legal authority entitled to the highest respect, *at no mea-
sures that could be devised for Ireland would prove
useful unless facility were given for the transfer of Moan-
bered property. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. STAFFORD concurred fully in that opinion, and
sutured the house that no measure was more earnestly de-
sired by those whose wishes ought to be consulted.
Lord LINCOLN likewise agreed in thinking the bill one
of paramount importance ; but before they agreed to its
second reading on the terms proposed, he wiehed to have au
aasurance hum the government that the amendrutnta pro-
poeed to be introduced were already prepared.
Lord J. RUSSELL said that the amendments were in
course of preparation, and would be submitted to the house
on the bill being committed.
After some further conversation, the bill was read a second
time, and ordered to be committed on Monday.
NAVIGATION LAWS.
On the motion of Mr. LAHOUCHERR, the adjourned debate
on the resolutions respecting the Navigation Laws was post-
poned until Monday, the 29th inst.
SLAVE TRADE COMMITTEE.
On the order of the day for rearming the debate on the
nomination of Mr. Cardwell to serve on the select committee
on the sleeve trade being read,
Lord PALMERSTON said that as he understood it was
the opinion of several members that the members of the com-
mittee should be increased he should not press the suttees,
lion he made on Thursday, but would oil Monday sub-
mit a distinct motion, that Admiral Bowles he added to the

committee.
Mr. CARDWELL underatood the noble lord to withdraw
the objection to his (Mr. Cudwtll's) name being added to

the committee. lie hoped the noble lord would also with..
draw the imputation he bad cast on the merchants of Liver-
pool, that they were interested in the quitous slave trade.
lie (Mr. Cardwell) begged to state, that, co far from that
Eels g the case, the merchants of Liverpool `
bemusewee inter-
ested la the suppression of the traffic In slaves, they
found from experience that where the slave trade was carried
on for commerce languished.
Lord PALMERSTON udd he had made no imputation;
be had merely stated facts which he believed to be true; and,
therefore, he was not sow going to gainsay his former date-
ment, that there was sent from Liverpool a vast quantity of
and
modities which found their wa to the coast of Africa
and were exchanged for slaves. Ii the hon. member wee
prepared to disprove that fact, then he (Lord Palmerston)
should be quite ready to withdraw his statement, which as
yet was uncontradieted,
Mr. CARDW ELL did not deny that some of the exports
of Liverpool did find their way by a circuitous rude to the
coast of Jiffies but to thit. the merchants QI Liverpool were
no parties. emphaticall7 denied' that any person in
Lverpool was interested in the slave trade.
Lord PALMERSTON had no objection to the bon. mew
her being on the committee, but he should propose
Monday to add Admiral Bowles.
After a few words from Mr. DARKLY and Mr. HUTT,
The Earl of LINCOLN said that he believed the noble
lord opposite had been an unsuccessful candidate fer Liver-
pool, and had he been otherwise he could not have repre-
sented the foreign affairs of the country ; becauee' on his
own principle, it the member for Liverpool was unfit to sit
on a committee on the *lave trade, he was assuredly unfit to
carry out the laws passed for the suppressionof that trade.
(Hear, and laughter.)
Lord PALMERSTON said he bad never been a candidate
for Liverpool. His name had certainly been put up there
by the elector, bu, if he had been returned he should have
declined to sits fur that borough, high as was that honour,
but should have remained the member fur the borough he
now repreecated.
The motion that Mr. Cardwell's name be added to the
enmmittee was then put, and agreed to. On the motion
that Sir E. Buxton be added,
Mr. JACKSON, adverting to the previous conversation,
remarked that the merchants of Liverpool merely received
orders from the Brazils for British manufactures, which
they forwarded. They were nu more connected with the
slave trade than were the manufacturers of the goods so
ordered. The law made it criminal to deal in slaves, and if
anybody was engaged in that traftic the law ought to be put
in force.
Copt. PECHELL expressed the satisfaction he felt that
Admiral Bowles would be added to the committee.
Mr. OLADSTONE said that as the noble lord (Pal
merston ) hod shown so much good humour to night, be
bored the noble lord would not hesitate to qualify, if not
withdraw, what he had said with respect to the merchants
of Liverpool. There could he no doubt that goods shipped
by them found their way into the slave market; but to
charge them with being connected with the slave trade was
as unjust as to make thet charge against the proprietors
of the Liverpool and Manchester Railway, because they con-
veyed the goods when manufactured to Liverpool fur ship-
ment.
Lord PALMERSTON observed that all he had stated on
the fermi r evening had just in substance been repeated by
the right hen. gentleman (Mr. Gladstone), who admitted
that from Liverpool eon& were exported which eventually
reached the slave market.
'I he conversation here dropped, and the name of Sir E.
Buxton was ordered to be added to the committee.
QCOAD SACRA CHURCHES IN SCOTLAND.
Mr. COWAN moved for leave to bring in a bill to provide
so equitable arrangement of the differences in Sc. tland
affecting church. s and chapels commonly known by the term
of gunnel sacra churches
Mr. DUNCAN seconded the motion.
I The LORD ADVOCATE opposed the bill, on the
ground that the matte? was now before the law courts.
Alter a conversation, in which Mr. Wawn, Sir G. Orey,
and Mr. F. Mauls bolt part, the motion was withdrawn.
KITCHEN AND REFRESHMENT ROOMS.
Mr. STAFFORD moved:
nut a standing commitee be op 'tiled, to control the armee-
ownts of the kitchen and the refs t rooms in the department
of the Serjennt attending this house, emulating of Mr. Stafford, Alder-
man Humphrey, the Kat of Warrant, Capt. Berleley. Mr. Itaatie,
Lord M. 11,11, awl Mr. V. Dawson, of whom three shall he a 't, gum.
That it be en instruction to this committee to carry into edict such
of the recommendations of the Pe lea committee appointed " in-
quire into the proposed arnwiresnents of the kitchen and eating and
accoennastatiou rooms for frietlltlerfl and ulteera of the House of Coln-
moon In the New fatter of Weatminster, and to repot whether any
and what improvements could be made In the percent system of IMP.
iny ing refreshment ; and who were Inatructed to inquire into the do-
tter of the retie:int-at-rums of this house, and the salary, melamine,
and patronage of the office, with a view to the regulati m of thu
same to fore the occupation of the new how" of parliament, and
who were impiwerral to report from time to time to the hotly," as
they mar deem expedient.
Agreed to.
Upon the question of Winging ep some papers, the house
was counted out at two Vete*.

ELECTION CONINIITTEE.
LANCASTIOL—The committee yesterday proceeded
with the mutiny, and struck off two votes.

civil strife, unless the middle classes of this
country unite, claim, and win right and law nce
not only in behalf of themselves, but in behalf of
those below them, and thus form a league to resist at
once the retrograde fears and tendencies of the Eng-
lish aristocratic and ministerial classes, as well as the
subversive and mad hallucinations of continental

theorists.
'lbis league, entered into by the reform party,
is the great life-boat that has been launch, din
the midst of present, and in the face of coming
storms. Many yet hesitate to embark in it, either
foolishly imagining that a calm may succeed, or that
England may be secluded from continental storms—
vain ideas both of them. Contingencies are arising,
contingencies inevitable, both in foreign and in ii'.:
mestie politics, the difficulties of which, if not met by
a united country, by all classes sympathising and act-
ing together, and trusting each other, cannot but pro-
duce a terrible catastrophe.
In furtherance of this great, popular, and truly
conservative move, a meeting was convened by the
sheriffs of the county of Middlesex, on Wednesday, in
oonnexion with the meetings which have been held in
all parts of the country for the same important object.
A fitter person than Mr. WILLIANN, the ex-member
for Coventry, could not have been found to open the
business, and explain the purport of such a meeting.
Mr. WILLIAMS, ono of the most useful and prac-
tical of the members of the last parliament,
' finds himself ejected from the present by a combi-
nation of influences, which have gulled the good
people of Coventry into a complete nullification of their
parliamentary representation by a return of a Whig and
a tory, whose votes completely neutralise each other,
except in caseswhere a great popular claim is brought
forward, and then of course both unite against it.
Mr. WILLIAMB, however, made himself beard at the
Middlesex meeting, and summed up in one clear,
and cogent speech—a speech so forcible and plain,
that it almost might be retained in the memory—
the results, economical and otherwise, which the
country has derived from the great measure of 1831.
If any man can meet such arguments by the cold
denial that England does not require the complement
of reform promised at that time, and out of which it
has been cheated since, that man must be deaf to
logic, and inaccessible to fair argument and common

sense.
Mr. WILIJAMS'I4 speech was addressed to the tax.
payers of the country, and thus specially to the
middle classes, and incumbent it is upon each and all
of them to read and "take a note thereof." Mr. IiCME
went more immediately and fully into the great object
of the meeting, which was to hoist such a banner of
reformas would unite the desires and aims of the mid-
dle classes, and content all the intelligent champions
of the operatives. Mr. Hume pointed out four
demands, as including all fair desires and practical
reforms. Of these, vote by ballot and triennial par-
liaments are understood by all. The exact limits of
the extension of the franchise, and the precise nature
of how electoral districts are to be formed, have
given rise inevitably to some differences of sentiment
We do not think, however, that these differences are
important. household suffrage is a limit to which
every reformer that deserves the name must go. And
those who do not must declare themselves, and must
be known to their constituents and to the country as
finality-men—as enemies of progress and popular
rights.
Whilst strongly insisting upon a close union of re-
formers, and a fair understanding between all classes
interested in the emancipation of parliament and go-
vernment from mere class and narrow influences, we
see by no means the absolute necessity for
all reformers adopting precisely the same
credo in all its minute points. Let them
be agreed on the main and the great features, such as
the ballot shorter parliaments, suffrage to household
extent, or to a low rating or residential qualification,
and electoral divisions other than the present juggling
system. On this basis the standing up of the middle
clawes for their own emancipation and rights will
include the same aims and boons for the working
classes ; and all malcontent or revolutionary or
visionary ideas and efforts will be absorbed and lost
in what will be a practicable, an intelligible, and a
constitutional struggle.