The Express.
London, England, 1847-04-24 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.

120 USE OF LORDB.—Faumor, Arau. 23.
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land, man* the Caster' Deans Bill.
dFICOND REA DI-Cnetons Duties WM
ROYAL COMMISSION.
The assent of the crown was given be royal commission to
the following hills:--Ersh quer Bills; Mutiny; Marine
Mutiny; Indemnity; Markets and Fairs Clauses; Gas
Works Clauses; Commissioners Classes: Water works
Clauses; Troops during Elections; General Register Rouse
Edinburgh; and District Fire Insurance Company of Bir-
mingham;
Tne commisvioners were, the Lord Chancellor, the Earl of
Minto (Lord Privy Seal), and the Marquis of Clanricarde
(l'ostmaster General). The back benches were tilled with
ladies who came down to witness this ceremonial, the first of
the kind encrusted in " her Majesty's new palace at West-
minster."
- -

•
INCUMBERED ESTATES (IRELAND) BILL.
The Earl of WICKLOW begged to ask the noble and
'game I lord on the woolsack when it was his intention to
move the second reading of this bill. The session was fast
advancing, and the bill had been upan their lordships' table
for aconniderable time.
The LORD CHANCELLOR replied, that in consequence
of information which had reached him from Ireland, he had
beea induced to change the shape or the bill, but he would
now give notice of his intention to move the second reading
on Tuesday neat.
NEW BISHOPRICS COMMISSION.
The Mar9uia of LANSDOWNE pre:anted (by command
of her Majesty) the first report of the commissioners ap•
pointed to inquire into the state of the bishoprics in England
and Wales.

.......
THE LATE EXECUTION AT BURY ST. EDMUNDS.
The noble M•SQUIS, referring to a question put to him on
a formsr evening by his noble friend behind him (the Mar-
quis of Westmeath) on the subject of the recent execution
at Bury St. Edmunds, observed, that front the statement
made by his noble friend, the house would have been led to
believe that great want of order and. decorum had been ex-
hibited on an occasion when the utmost solemnity and
regularity ought to be observed. The unfortunate wo-
man who underwent capital punishment had been
convicted of murder, of which she confessed herself to be
guilty, and it had been stated by the noble marquis, on
newspaper authority, that the execution had been carried
into effect in a manner most revolting to the feelings of the
populace, who gave utterance to language of execration in
consequence of the sufferings of the unhappy woman being
greatly aggravated. He (the Marquis of Lansdowne) had
caused inquiries to be made, and be was able to inform the
noble marquis that no occurrence of the kind stated had
taken place. On the contrary, the whole of the painful
proceedings hid been conducted with the greatest de-
cornea and solemnity, and the unfortunate culprit did not
suffer in any greater degree than was u.ual. He the Mar-
quis of Lansdowne) had in his possession a letter from the
clergyman who attended the wretched woman in her last
moments, and he stated that she expressed herself fully
satisfied with the attentions which had been shown to ber I
by the authorities, and he added that noti.ing could exceed
the awe and effect which attended the moment of her
execution.
The Marquis of WESTMEATH was understood to ex-
press himself satisfied with the explanation, and the matter
dropped
CUSTOMS DUTIES BILL.

Lord STANl:ii3OnpreseiTitiogiheinveral petitions en-
trusted to him against the Customs Duties Bill, observed
that he felt it might save time in reference to the debate
which was about to arise on that measure, if he stated some-
what is detail the purport of the petition which he had to
present from the distillers resident in and in the neighbour-
hood of the metropolis. Those who were not conversant
with the subject would be surprised to hear that the number
of those petitioners did not exceed eight, and that, in fact,
the whole of the distillers of England were in the hands of
ten individuals. The cause, he begged to remark, of this
apparent close monopoly of so large a branch of the industry
of the country was not merely the advantage which large
capital possessed over smell capital, but still more the
legislative restrictions imposed by parliament,—restrictions
which unnecessarily, except (or fiscal purposes, required a
large amount of capital, and which practically confined the
blamer of distillers to those persons who could command a
largeramount of capital than, but for the restrictive laws, was
necessary to carry on that branch of the manufactures of the
country. Although these petitioners were only eight
is number, the interests of their vast concsrns
might be measured by the fact that the duties
of excise paid upon the article produced by them eight
gentlemen amounted to no less than 3,100,0001. per amine;
the whole excise duties on spirits manufactured in the
united kingdom were 6,000,0000/., of which the petitioners
paid 3,100,0001., and in the course of their trade used
1,300,000 quarters of grain in the course of each year.
Therefore, although the number of petitioners was small, the
interests they represented were very great, and consequeutly
legislation with respect to them ought in proportion to be
carefully. considered. The petitioners stated that the exist-
ing law anipmel upon them the necessity of brewing and
distilling alternately; that this virtually deprived them of
half the time they might when to their trade, and compelled
them to erect works on a scale of more than double
the magnitude than was necessary. This led to an
unnecessary increase of expenditure, and in practice
prevented their adoption of improvements which
science pointed out, and placed them in a dis-
advantageous position as regarded competition with
other manufacturers. The article manufactured by the
petitioners was known by the name of " raw spirit," and he
must mention that there was this difference between the
English distillers and those of Scotland and Ireland. The
spirit distillers of Ireland distilled chiefly from raw grain,
but some distilled from malt. In Scotland, they distilled
wholly from malt ; but in England, the manufacturer of
spirits distilled entirely from raw grain, and hence the spirits
they produced were known by the name of " raw spirits."
To bring those spirits into cinsumption in this country, it
was necessary that they should go through the prose's of
rectification, which, however, was not permitted to be car-
ried on within a quarter of a mile from the premises in which
the previous process of distillation was performed. Hence,
ander the existing laws, the English distiller was ,obliged to
have no less than three distinct places of manefocture,
though the whole process might be gone through within the
same premises, at a great saving both of capital and cost.
The petitioners made no complaint of these regulations in
the abstract, but desired to bring to the recollection
of the house what had been done by the legislature.
Au offer had been made by the government to increase the
duty of sixpence to ninepenee, which, unimportant as it
might seem, made a difference of fifteen to twenty per cent.
on the whole value of articles au bject to taxation. The
petitioners prayed their lordships to avert the ruin which
would be brought on them by passing this bill, and that
they might be allowed to state their case before • select
committee. He had also several other petitions from the
distillers of Islay, Koss, Inverness, Sutherlandshire,
and Kilmarnock, in Scotland, on the same subject, stating
the 'the Scotch distillers, besides the excise restrictions, had
a further complaint, inumuch as they had to pay the duty
on malt, and that the distillers of Inlay and others in the
north of Scotland caused much improvement in agriculture
and increased the cultivation of land. . .

Lord 110NTEAOLE in presenting petitions from the
Scotch and Irish distillers, praying fur a select committee,
said they did not ask for protective duties, and complained
that colonial spirits might be kept in bond ; and the duty
wan only paid when they were taken out, whereas British
spirits must pay it. It was a cue that required close inves-
tigation, and ought to be referred to a select committee.
The Earl of CLARENDON in moving the mond reading
of the bill, said that no eppesitioa to the principle of the bill
was intended. The Brithi old colonial prodneare of spirits
claimed to be placed on perfect equality, and the government
had no other object in this bin. It was aim& to estimate
the money value of the proem of distillation, and the ex-
aggerated statements of the dhtillers, and the eennterwtate-
Rents of the Weet India predawn incurred that didisalty.
His right hon. friend the Cluaredier of the linehequirhavirig
last year publicly undertaken te he prepared thie swim to
bring before parliament a reined= el the duty, applied
himself to the subject, and haling winsulted different parties
interested as well as the offklais of the excise, felt no doubt
that a differential duty of sixpence would be sufficient to
meet the jus:ice of the ewe, and to cover any extra expense
to which the British pore were subject, and from
which the wiestial produewe was free. Afterwards, finding
that swim the smsdisato of the bill there was a
ipmet miens is to the operation the duty, in order to secure
Melt sonsaresee he sorosted to add fifty per cent. to the
differeskol duty, and it wee fixed at ninepenoe. By this
he ewes& himself to the eharge of inconsistency, and
dintielled the West Indio interest; but the House
of Owner sautiegiod hie propseition by • majority of 177.
As the Hum of Citonsams woo endstod that a protective
duty of W. wasonffiniumt, and s.efeto mark all who desired
fMr asannition and sot , be was taro 'rued that the
nide asks (11konoor) whited ter friar inquiry. The duty
• amSO& ipMewatiti WI, an la. gd, sod on Dirk
Id. Tin duty wee benorly for the three
countries Is. 6d., bat it lied been redeed to le., and it now
proposed to make it AL, making the Import duty Is. 74. for
England, 44. 6d. fee Soidand, and as. AL tor Ireland. The
distillers chained 1.. 4et,wlie the Witt India interest main-
tained that IL was onospb, sod that alb whit key weld
wit aesspola wkh this.. The hens um whir\ kb was
Mod won r flante:—The fist was 11. kw the vats.
ditty, .hut ao damp was new as duty on Ms. than
would he so allomamot kw that. The seat woe lei. hr
wit the third 11 hr the tanuand expense kr
additional punts,' ash foorittly, 4d., at ea ellownee
vrbat IMO Mai assay. whereas It, in het, way
emesated te a halfunty. The filth item woe Id., for die
inn rapine of reettfire sa operate pontom, of whisk
2id. woo far mak. Bat, if nettled ea their ewe pew
Nam, they onaglan nwaned plod, midi was nail
tose=att lain the anomma key thammives diorgvillt oti hit
plank, whiff maw to ham off, ka
IK. shad is the clay node lit tad am this
ri4lll
We that Tight ham. kkri Anita IL at
1.. w bet nook enellsr, man non rpm,

when the eats-liew of 1813 was in operation, and slave labour
existed in the West ladies ; but, in consideration of the ex-
cise duties, and the expense of distilleries, the differential
duty was shed to Is. &L •• but Mr. ooulburn, when
he was Chancellor of the Exchequer, in 1830,
thought it so urgent that be determined to reduce it to Is.,
but was prevented doing so by his going out of office. With
regard to the Scotch and Irish distillers, they claimed a larger
protection in consequence of the greater quantity of malt
which they used. The whole duty on malt was le. 4c1., and
it was formerly allowed to the Scotch distillers as a drawback,
solely to enable them to compete with illicit distillation. i
In 1832 a committee of the House of Commons recommended
that the drawback should be reduced, although th re was
much malt spirit distilled in Ireland, but no drawback was
allowed at the request of the distillers themselves, as it give
rise to fraud. The Irish distillers said that they used more
malt than the English, and that lid. was not enough, hut that
they required 2W. ; they did not, however rectify un separate
premises. If they allowed the claim of the &cote h di-tiller on the
ground of his using malt, and thereby admitted the principle
that the amount of protection should depend upon the ingre-
dients used in the distillation of the sp:rit, the English dis-
tiller would not be slow to advance the same claim, and if
they gave a protection to the one became he distilled from malt,
he could not see how they could refuse it to the other who
distilled from raw grain. Theee was no ground for the alle-
gation that Scotch and Irish spirits did nut come fairly into
competition with English spirits. The quantity distilled in
England was 6i millions of gallons. The quantity impelled
from Scotland was 2,130,000; and from Ireland. 1,400,000
gallon: together, three-and-a-half millions of gallons,
which was equal to three-fifths of the whole quan-
tity distilled in England. Then, with regard to there
being any real ground of &pp', pension that colonial spirit
would to any extent displace those of British manufacture
in the home market. The whole consumption of spirits in
this country, at the present time, was about '26,000,000 of
gallons annually, whereof only some 2,000,000 were rum;
and inasmuch as the whole industry of our sugar-
growing colonies was now directed to the improvement
of the manufacture of sugar, and as such improve-
ment would necesssrily diminish the production of
rum, there was no probability of there being any great li
increase in the expo' tof that articie. lie trusted their lord-
shim
would not agree to the proposition of which the noble '
duke (Montrose) had given notice, to refer this bill to a select
committee; but that they would follow the course which had
been pursued in the other house, and refuse to alter a mea-
sure which bed been brought in by the government, on the
conviction that it would afford eqbal protection and equal
bustice to all the interests concerned. He moved that the
ill be now read a second time. .

Lord STANLEY understood that the government bad
brought forward this measure entirely apart from the gene-
ral question of free trade, but that the principle upon which
the bill was founded was the equitable adjustment of
the claims of the colonial and the British distillers. (Hear,
hear.) He and those of his friends who took the same view
asked for no preference on behalf of the British producer as
against the colonial ; they were, therefore, perfectly pre-
pared to meet his noble friend on the ground of placing the
parties on a footing of perfect equality ; and the only ques-
tion to determine was the figure at which the differential
duty should be fined. This he contended was a matter
which it was far more convenient should be decided by a
select committee than by the house itself. lie thought
there would be no objection to the bill being read a second
time, and the discussion taken afterwards it the noble earl
wished it.

After a few words from the Earl of CLARENDON,
The Duke of MONTROSE rose to move, pursuant to his
notice, to refer the bill to a select committee. All the
British distiller demanded was to be put upon a footing of
equality with his colonial rival—he solicited no nazi advan-
tage, but to be placed in a position to be enabled fairly to
compete with the colonial producer. The excise regulations,
from which the colonial distiller was altogether free, entailed
groat loss upon the British distiller. This the distil.
lee, who had petitioned on the subject undertook
to prove if a committee were granted, and also
that such loss had not been taken into account in the
present measure. This of itself he contended was a
sufficient ground for referring the biU to a select committee.
The case of the Scotch distiller was one of peculiar hardship
as compared with that of the colonial distiller. Spirits could
only be sent from Scotland to England by sea, and as the
duty on all British spirits was levied previous to their going
into bond, it followed that if a cask was staved on the pas-
sage, not only did the distiller lose his spirits, but the duty
also ; whereas the duty on rum was not payable until
it was taken out of bond for consumption is this country.
The Chancellor of the Exchequer had stated in the other
house, that as Scotch spirits came free'y into competition
with English spirits, no hardship was inffilted on the Scotch
distillers, and hart also stated that the reduction of the draw-
back from id. to fid. had not operated prejudicially to them.
Formerly, the duty on Scotch spirits was tie. 2d. ; now it was
3s. Bd. ; but, notwithstanding that reduction, the quantity
of malt spirits distilled in Scotland bed decreased from
6,466,000 gallons in 1834, to 5,368,000 in 1845.
Mr. Goulburn had alleged that the Scotch distillers had
overstated their ease, and that he did not believe the duty
would amount to more than Is. 4d. To support this
assertion that right hon. member stated that a large quantity
of Scotch whisky was made from bete. The right hon.
gentleman's notions regarding Scotland were somewhat ante-
diluvian, seeing that it was many years since bee had been
seed in the manufacture of whisky in that country. (Hear,
hear.) But, supposing it were so, it happened that from the
nature of the excise regulations the &stairs were compelled
to draw less spirits from here than from barley, and conse-
quently the duty came to nearly the same amount. Bu' the
distillers were prepared Nether to prove that, under the pro-
posed bill, the duty would amount to Is. 10d. or Is, lid. the
'Tenon. He trusted that if government persisted in depriving
the distiller of bin differential duty, they would also remove
those vexatious excise regulations by which his trade was
crippled. But for them he might have an extensive export
trade, as was already the case with beer, and that would be
some compensation for the rivalry of foreign spirits in the
home market. With respect to the Irish distillers, he would
leave them in the hands of a noble lord who was intimately
acquainted with the subject, merely making this one obser-
vation, that they looked Lpon the bonding system by which
they paid duty on all the whisky lost during its detention
in the warehouse, ss a very great hardship. He thought
he had proved the Scotch "Heinen to be suffering
great hardship from the excise regulations, and that
they were at least entitled to the existing coun-
tervailing duty. (Hear, hear.) The noble duke concluded
by moving that the bill be referred to a select committee.
The Earl of EGLINTON seconded the motion. By the
proposed bill the Scotch distiller would be left with so little
protection as te entirely annihilate his trade. He begged their
lordships to remember that trade in Scotland numbered 250
distillers, had embarked in it half • mil lion of capital, employed
many thousand men, and contributed one million and a half
annually to the revenue. They would hardly, he hoped, by
one false and hasty step, run the risk of destroying so
important a trade. (Hear, hear.)
Lord CAMPBELL, who was bet imperfectly audible, was
understood to say, that the noble duke who moved the
amendment had not spoken on one of the arguments of the
noble earl who had moved the second reacting of the bill.
There was a strong prima facie case in favour of the go.
vernment. They could have no motive in introducing this
measure but the public good; nor could it be said to be in
any view of the case a party question. From all the informa-
tion he had been able to obtain, he thought that sixpence
would bean ample indemnity fee the distillers, but instead of
that the government had raised the differential duty to nine-
pence. The bill had received the fullest consideration in the
other house of parliament, and a majority of 170 had decided
in its favour. He did not think that its peeling would give
any encouragement to illicit distillation; the only question
was, whether it would increase the duty on rum.
The Duke of RICHMOND was of opinion that all the
two noble lords opposite had advanced, went to prove that
the bill ought to be referred to a select committee.
Lord STANLEY said it might be very true that the
I question of free trade did not enter into this discussion, but
the question of justice did—of justice to an important branch
of industry, menaced, as those engaged in it affirmed,
with destruction by the measure now before their lordships.
The threepence in question might appear a small matter,
but let it be recollected that this threepence per gallon wss
upon an article, the intrinsic value of which wag only two
shillings. He believed that no one could charge him with
• disposition to act unfairly towards the West I Ad', oroprie-
tors ; he had taken an active part in recommending to par-
liament, in favour of the West India proprietors, one of the
largest peeunisry sacrifices ever made by this country.
(Hear, hear.) But neither West India proprietors, nor
East Indian, nor Cuban, nor Brazilian, had any right to ask
for greater advantages in the British market than were en-
joyed by our own immediate countrymen. (Hear, hear.)
The distillers of this country did not shrink from competition
on equal terms with any other distillers ; but they
said that this measure would place them on terms of
utter inequality with colonial and foreign distillers ;
and they asked to be allowed to confirm this state-
ment by the evidence they were prepared to adduce.
These things altogether depended on accurate calculs-
lion ; twopence, • penny, nay, • halfpenny, more or less,
made all the difference, and, therefore, not a step ought to
be taken until the perfect 'minty of the calculation upon
which the step proceeded had been clearly ascertained.
(Hear, hear.) The committee of the House of Commons in
1834, under the chairmanship of Bir Henry Parnell, pub-
lished in its report seven folio pages exhibiting in detail the
restrictions placed by excise regulations upon the process of
distillation in this country. The distillers here did not so
moth comp/sin of these restrictions as that they should be
called upon to compete, under their burden, with other dia.
tillers whom no such restrictions impeded. The West
India planters were allowed to distil from molasses, but this
our own distillers were strictly prohibited to do, or the case
would be very different.
Earl GREY said that after the able and compre-
hensive speech of his noble friend, it would be unnecessary
for him to trouble their lordship!' at any length, the more so
that neither in statement nor in argument had his noble
friend's speech been controverted by noble lords opposite.
H. himself, as a matter of opinion, retained the conviction
that 'depose would be the fairer differential duty, but
government had consented to make it ninepence, for the
simple and sufficing reason that they had good reason to
believe that the miller sum would not receive the sanction
of either home. He did not understand what advantage
could aria from referring this bill to a select committee :
thwheireeli:Targeeennowt westftistot6bebefeemeitirdwe;reallalreadtheyfar ful)eatuP"
detail bake the hoses. A eenuaittee could do no more
lintlxsth.draizeiimitiLina
thinitheaeßyedLielat
elyffiffircotren.siot,...i:ifimerentLf:,dm.bthareyiy:
not to be
of that the authority of • repast of • @sleet
committee thet lordships, carried by gig
three to two, was to govern the decision utv=,,sgar
(Hear.) The noble viscount proceeded to contend that
under the preset corn law, was as high • discriminating"
duty as could be fairly deskaadad by the British diedlisi.

That the Scotch and Irish distillers were well off, was proved
by the fact that they were enabled in the English market to
compete with the English distiller, in spite of those onerous
reetrie4oas upon thew to which the noble duke (Montrose)
apposite had, alioded. By a reformat to figures he (Earl
Grey) yield pave that of the whole quantity of spirits con.
sawed in the waited kingdom, the proportion of English
distilled sprite wee very little more than so five to four, as
ampere' with the amount of Scotch and Irish spirits, there-
fore, he reputed the Scotch and Irish distillers had no real
ground for complaint. (fi,ar, hear.) lie (Earl Grey)
trusted that for theso reason', without going into minute cal-
culations, he had shown that the bill now before their lord-
ship would du no injustice to the British distiller, whether he
carried on his trade in England, Scotland, or Ireland ; but, if
nut, heearnest ly entreated their lordship' not to reject the bill.
Last year the legislature had consented to pass a measure, by
which the col iota producer of sugar would, in a very short
time, be expo-ed to unrestricted competition in the British
markets. In the fivancial difficulties of this year, that mea-
sure had been of inestimable service, and it promised to be
of equal service for the future. (Hear, hear.) It was not
to be denied it had created the greatest alarm among the
colonists, and also the English farmers. (Hear, hear.) But
he was happy to inform their lordship' that measure, as
also the act for allowing sugar to be used in breweries and
distilleries, together with the prospect of good crops, had
tended greatly to mitigate the alarm which lathe first instance
existed in the colonies. By the last advice' which he bad
received, he was happy to tied a more cheerful tone prevsiled
among the colonists, and that they were looking forward, by
means of increased exertions, to meet the competition to
which the last year's legislation exposed them, and he must
say that after having so exposed them tot their own welfare,
and for the well are of this country, it would be an act not
easy to justify, if their lordship should, by rejecting this bill,
dash the cup of hope from their lips, and disappoint the high
expectations which had been raised. (Hear, hear.) He
earnestly hoped their lordships would not be induced to take
that course ;—if this measure was allowed to pass he was
sanguine—(and every day's eaperience made him more so)—
that in a very rig years the condition of the colonists would
be unproved, while, on the other hand, he could conceive no
course so calcu :aril to shake the coutidenee of the colonists
in the British parliament—to injure their trade and
with their to de the revenues of this country, as to
reject this bill sent up by so overwhelming a majority
composed of ono of all parties in the other house of parlia-
ment. He believed that it would be impossible that the
production of rum in the colonies could be carried to a point
that could injuriously affect the English distiller, and, there-
fore, the apprehensions in that respect were utterly vision .ry.
On the whole he was perfectly persuaded that, by adopting
this bill, their lordships would do standard justice to the
colonists, and he could not believe their lordship would be
induced to reject the bill by sending it to a select committee
Up stairs. (Hear, hear).
Lord MONTEAOLE remarked that there never was •
class of manufeetwers who had been exposed by the legiMa-

Lure to so many alternations and so much practical injimitice
as the distillers of the three kingdoms, England, Scotland,
and Ireland. He admitted that the case on both sides
had to-night been most ably opened and discussed ; there
was no contest of principle ; the struggle was as to detail,
and the decision upon those details were peculiarly fitting
for a select committee. The distillers did not seek the re-
jection of the bii', but by their petition made the very mo-
derate request 64 there should be an inquiry. Acting in
perfect consistence with the course he had taken with re-
ference to the sultiect, he should give his hearty support to
the amendment proposed by the noble duke opposite
(Montrose).
Their lordships then divided.
Fer the original motion 57
For the amendment
The bill was th,:n read a wooed time, and the house ad
journed at half-past nine o'clock to Monday neat.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.—FRIDAY, APRIL 23.
The Speaker t ,ok the chair at four o'clock.
PRIVATE BUSINESS.

PETITIONS—Bp against the Bury and
Ipswich 3W. Lord SAI.DON, two petitions in favour of the Liverpool
Watenrorlia Bill. Mr. D.MITTOUM, wort the North Brßritishie
ilail-
vey Si L Mr. Loco aepainet the f and Perth beltway and
other Scotch railway WM.

BEX)ND RRADINGIL—Batheiek Church; Imperial Continental
orddield,Oes Amchitka • liingutortun,N Itc. Rates; Puyne's Patents
Atrt ; Elba
iteltTo.—oleheter, Lour Valley, Sudbury, and Halstead Rail-
way (attention to Mefferd, Lev, abate, and CLee); Great Northern
Railway (deviations between Peterbotough, Beaton, and Gains-
borough); Bills.