The Express.
London, England, 1853-02-26 00:00:00

NORWICH PETITION.

Mr. F. MACH:EWlllWrshecrici Vllow what steps the
bon. member for Finsbury meant to take with this petition,
which contained charges involving the character of a gen-
UNE4II.

Mr. T. DUNCOMBE said that if the house bad allowed
him to have his own way yesterday it would not now have
found itself in the ridiculous and absurd predicament in
which it stood. (" lieu, hear," and laughter.) Serious
charges had been made, and there was no way of inquir-
ing into them. (Hear, bear.) As to referring it to the
committee of the hon. member fee Surrey, that would be
quite idle, for that committee had yet no existence—it was
at pretest as subsbirs. Ile believed that the wry party
had been very badly treated by the wry party in that
house. (" Hear, hear," and laughter.) He believed that
Mr. Brown bad no authority for withdrawing the petition,
and that a fraud had been committed on the house. But
the Speaker had decided that a fraud was no breach of
the privileges of the house. (Laughter.) He, however,
was ready to proceed with the inquiry, and ar thin Pus.
Pees he 1-4 to give _notice that Le would on Monday
mwe that tas p;,...."6na PO rosined to a committee of In-
quiry- (Rear, hm.)
PUBLIC BUSINESS.
Lord J. RUSSELL informed the house that he would
proceed with the Ordnance estimates m Monday, and with
the Clergy Reserves Bill on Friday.
SUPPLY.—ARMY ESTIMATES.
On the motion for going into Committee of Supply on the
Army estimates,
Sir DE L. EVANS in answer to a remark made by
Col. North that be (Sir De Lacy Evans) had in a previous
discussion stated that only 15,000 men could be spared from
the French army for the purpose of en Weeds., explained
that what be had really said was that eandibent with the
maintenance of the scrotal French guidons, Frames had
not, at present, a larger amount of diagmeable ems.
Mr. RICH then brought under the sedge of the brae,
the expediency of gradually inonesing the siselese and
efficiency of the reserve force of pears bellielleso, with-
out detriment to our establieW militia 111111 regular
forces. What he proposed was that the MOWS should
commence after ten years' Navies (so is the Excise,
Customs, and other girememeat degsrlinents), the
amount of course being in pengsetka tithe number of
years served ; and that all eddies aseeldsg their discharge
with the pension should, if abie-bedie4 Weaselled. In •
very few yews this would give es wary of reserve of
130,000 men. In addition to an arely of memo at boa%
the plan he proposed would provide eillient means of de-
fence for our colonise, for there could be Ms doubt that
large numbers of these men, after their discharge on the
short service, or lowest amount of pension, would be but
too happy to volunteer as soldier colonists.
Mr. S. HERBERT had listened to the statement of his
hon. friend on a subject which deserved attention, namely,
the advantage which would result from a different system
for the organisation of pensioners for the army. He had
heard the same arguments from his hon. friend during the
discussion on the Militia Bill, and it appeared to him then
that there was not security for the obtaining of a reserved
force by means of pensioners from the ten-years' service,
even as there would be from the militia. But he con-
fessed that in consequence of the very proper measure
with regard to enlistment which was introduced by Lord
Panmure, it would be necessary ere long to adopt some
measure for the organisation of soldiers who bad left the
army. He did not think the effect produced by short ser-
vice pensions could be so great as was supposed by his hon.
friend, for when the short service system was introduced by
Lord Ilardinge, by ISO means SO May men availed them-

selves of it as was expected, and the hews would he sur-
prised to hear bow few had availed themselves of it. lie
(Mr. Herbert) thought it possible that when the ten years'
service men's time expired, instead of retiring, many of
them would continue in the army. He did eat say this
was a reason against an alteration in some form, such as
hos been suggested by hiv hon. friend; because it was a
sound principle that there should not be a bealy of men
trained to arms, spread over the country without there
being some hold upon them. Whether that should be done
by means of deferred pensions, or by small pensions after
ten years' service, were questions of detail, which could
only be decided on after some experience and ecnsideration.
Commanding officers were always unwilling to lose
the ten year service men, as they contributed greatly to
keeping up the spirit and discipline of a regimeat. (Hear.)
But when those men did retire it would be well to have
tome hold upon them, so that their services might be se-
cured if necessary, and that would also have the effect of
encouraging them to renew their term of service. The
question was one so worthy of consider Awn os to justify his
hon. friend in bringing it forward, and he could assure
him it should receive tho consideration of the Miitary
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