The Express.
London, England, 1847-02-27 00:00:00

merchants, in the conveying of corn and previsions from
foreign countries into the ports of the united Lingdom.
Lord J. RUSSELL said the suggeotionhe embodied in the
motive bad been brought under t consideration of the
government some time ago, and they had decided against its
adoption. There were now a great number of steam-gnarls
and soiling ships belonging to the navy employed in the re-
, lief service between this country and Ireland, especially
those district. of the latter, in which the greatest distress
prevailed. There were 30 steam-vessels, 12 sailing-vessels,
and 5 store ship, all usefully engaged in this service—(Hear,
hear)—some of which were stationed on the coast of Ireland
as depots. With regard to sending ships-of war to foreign
ports to obtain supplies of grain, he thought the len, gentle-
man had not calculated the cat such a proceeding would oc-
casion, and oorapared it with the result likely to be obtained.
The hon. gent. had talked of 17,000,000 of quarters of corn,
as the disposable produce of the but American harvest. lie
believed that estimate was
wastrite'2lnearernt
but the amount which could be brought over by our ships
of war, if so employed, would be but a very small propor-
tion, indeed, of that estimate, and would by no means tem-
per:date for the expense. In the first place, it would be ne-
ceaary to fit up the ships for the purpaae, end the cost of
such fitting up, in a ship like the Bellmsle, would be about
19,000!., and, after all, some 10,000 ton, would probably be
so much corn as she could brit g-60,000 quarters would be
as much am could be expected to be conveyed in this
way ; and, looking at the time which must be
lost in altering the Teasels, and the expense, it
was obvious that no adequate result could be obtained.
There would, however, be this certain evil consequence—
when it was once known and proclaimed that the govern-
ment ships were to be so employed, a very great discourage-
ment would be given to the merchant service.—(Hear,
hear)--and great reluctance to send private vessels to foreign
ports for grain would ensue. There would be fewer ships
consequently at Odessa and America, and freights at those
places would still further increase. (Hear.) It was not
merely the want of ships at New York and the other Ame
rican ports tbat constituted the dillicuhy in conveying
food from the United States. There was great
difficulty in finding the means of conveyance from
the western states where the bulk of the Indian corn was
produced to the ports of the Atlantic. The coat in the states
where it grew was 7d. a bushel, but ax the pore from whence
it was exported it was worth several shillings.
Mr. S. CRAWFORD would not press his motion after
the explanation of the noble lord. He had not said that
seventeen millions of quarters were require I—he believed one
and a half million quarters would be sufficient to meet the

wants of Ireland.
Lord J. RUSSELL thought it right to state that a propo-
sition had been made to him by some members of the Society
of Friends, who had been engaged most laudably to relieving
the distress of Irclaad—they informed him that extensive
contributions were being made in America fur the virchase
of corn for the Irish poor, and asked if a ship of war
might be placed at their disposal for the conveyance of such
corn to Ireland. He had declined a literal compliance with
that request, but had informed the parties that if the corn
was subscribed for, the government would pay the freight of

ftTothis country.
Mr. KER. considered that a system of emigration might,
with great advantage, be carried on in connexion with the
import of corn by means of the Poor-law or otherwise, and
some arrangement made by which the vessels employed in
importing corn might be made available in conveying to the
colonies some of those who could not be supported in

Ireland.
Lord J. RUSSELL could offer no direct encourageme,.
toenail a plan. There was already a power under the Irish
Poor-law to apply funds to the pupae of emigration ; and
it was already permitted to those foreign vessels which, by
virtue of the suspension of our tussigation laws were now
bringing corn into this country, to take out passengers, pro-
vided they did not take out merchandise u well. Itis belief
wee, that emigration would proceed during the season to a
great extent.
THE EIGHT MILLION LOAN.
Mr. HUME had observed in the public pepsin of that
day, a statement that the loan about to be contracted for by
government, was t i be effected in the 3 per cents., instead of
the higher stock. Such a proceeding was, he believed, op-
posed to all former experience as to the result upon the
finances of the country generally. In the case of the
20,000,0001. loan, the lose to the country, from the selec-
tion of that particular stock for the operation, had been
260,0001. He thought it would be better to borrow the
money at the lowest rate of interest at which it could be
got, and agree to par the money hack again in six years,
than consent to take WC for every 1001 of stock.
Lord J. RUSSELL replied, that after receiving all the
information Ord could be obtained, and giving the fullest
consideration to the subject, the government were con-
vinced that the loan could he raised on much better terms
to the public by the means proposed than by any other.
The order of the day for the committee of supply was then
read.
PADDLE-130X SAFETY BOATS—SIGNALS.
In answer to a question from Mr. Goan,
Mr. WARD said there would be no objection to produce
the correspondence which bad taken place on the subject of
paddle box safety boats; and in reply to Mr. lion:, the
same hon. gentleman expressed his willingness to produce,
next week, returns, showing the result of the trials which
had been made of certain signals for preventing accidents at
sea.
POOR-LAW COMMISSION.
Mr. ROEBUCK inquired whether there would be any
objection to lay on the table the opinion which bad been pre-
viously relined to, confirming the authority of the commis-
sioners in the proceeding. they had taken.
Lord J. RUSSELL did not think there would; but
would confer with his right hon. friend (Sir G. Grey) on the
subject.
STATE OF THE NAVY.

On the motion for going into committee of supply,
Sir C. NAPIER complained of the large sums wuich had
been spent during the last Ave years in altering and cutting
down vessels of war-8 three-deckers, 13 two-deckers, and 10
frigates, had been cut down since 1800 ;30 ships had been
altered by oar surveyors, many of them never having been
at sea since they were built. Several 44 gun frigates had
been cut down to 20 and 22 gun corvettes, a class of vessels
by no means as effective as the frigates. Then there were
several 110 gun ships on the stocks, built on the model of
the " Queen, although that vessel had been admitted to be
a failure as she was first launched. By the cobbling up she
had since been subjected to he believed she had been made a
pretty fair vend and had acted well enough in the two first
trial mina, but in the last trial, when the other ships rolled
so much, she had taken no part; so that what she
could do in rough weather was not known. (Hear.)
The Vanguard was at first looked upon as an excellent ship,
hut found to be the very reverse in a heavy gale of wind.
Besides, when in the Mediterranean, she sailed in yacht
trim, a thing which was overlooked at the time, but when
she had to carry stores and provisions, she was beaten by
many other ships. The Albion, owing to her rolling motion,
was rendered useless; one sea she took to leeward having
covered her ports exactly like a cascade. The St. Vincent,
on her second cruise, was obliged to reduce her tonnage
about 100 tons, while she carried her guns only 6 feet out of
water. As for the steam fleet, be considered it the disgrace
of the navy. The late Board of Admiralty went on
building steamers at a railway pace. lie asked
I for a commission to examine into the subject, hut
I was denied it. We began to build staiun.frigates in 1882.
The first was the Gorgon, but he did not blame the con-
structor of that, because it was the first, and because her
saes had been altered from his plan. The next was
the Cyclops, which drew too much water—her shafts and
puns wine too low ; it was impossible to mount her main
desk gem, and her main-deck ports were obliged to be
eaulked In. In that enormous frigate, the Terrible, the
stern ports were altogether forgotten. She was made with
theview to carry NO tons of coals, but when they came to
be put in she would only. hold 550 tons, or about seven days'
consamption. Her engines and steam boilers were abso-
lutely upwards of five feet out of the water, so that if a shot
went through her into the boiler, every man of them would
he completely cooked. (Laughter.) The Retribution,
of 1611 tons, carried her main-deck only five feet four
from the water. Similar, or equally bad, defects might be
pointed out in the Vengeance, the Sampson, the Centaur,
the Gladiator, the Firebrand, and others, but it was useless
to go through them. Indeed, there was not one of them,
except the Terrible, fit to go into action—unable to carry
more than seven or eight days' fuel, and every man exposed
to destruction, owing to the position of the boiler sad engines.
Since 1840 there had been laid down no lees than 33 iron
steam-veuels, and yet it was not until 1847 that the govern-
ment thought of having a shot fired at an iron boat, to try
how she would stand it; and then it was found that the shot
went clean through one side, and nearly knocked the other
side cut altogether. (Laughter.) These stem-boots cost
more than 1,500,0001.; hut, looking to their imperfections,
he thought the best possible thing that could be done was
to sell them all, for they were only fit to make coal-tugs of.
One of them, the Birkenhead. had been converted into a
troop-ship, but she was only capable of carrying 450
boptroos,
and had no place to put her cable-tiers. She might a
good troopship in time of peace, but in time of war
no man had a chance of being saved in her, unless provided
with air collars. (A laugh.) The Rattler, which had been
sent to the coast of Guinea, opened at the sides and took in
so much water, that they were obliged to bale her out. He
objected to the use of the screw in steam men-of-war, be-
cause it took up the entire of their hold. Indeed, very great
blame attached to the Board of Admiralty ever since he had
been in her Majesty's service, for the thoughtless manner in
which they had continued to build ships; deriving no ad-
vantage from past experience, or from experiments of their
own. The bon. and gallant admiral then turned to the
subject of promotions in the navy, which he said had been
carried on upon a very large scale from 1818 to 1830, when
Lard Melville, after doing all the mischief possible for 16
came to the resolution to sap them. Hence the
Utiritii'te of the Admiralty, dated Ist Feb., 1830, resolving
that no promotions should take place beyond lin 3. Now,
if they *mild adhere to that rule he would be satisfied ; bet
they did not. A sum of 30,0001. was granted last year for
the retired list, upon the express understanding that the list
should be reduced It was stated that the flag officers wore
to be reduced to 160, and the captains to 600. Now the flag
eredownhadthott palmy bian'Tedliardto 600,16° ; and, instead of keep-
log
60 commanders had been
i!asPemmtadhigstriamiranisetevent/A.hasdregar-trrahwiere:ra.tbrchaowgnoodinoftofrilirrate ral-ceewuthk
turned into a bad steamer. He understood a commission
was sow sitting at the Admiralty to c onsider the increase of
the pay of the men in the navy, and of the engineers. No
steamer was ever sent to sea that did not break down, for,
owing to the parsimonious way in which the engineers were
paid, the wont of the clam were employed. If they had
larger pay and the rank e lieutenants at least, and w
allowed to superintend :be putting on of the machinery, this
would not happen. And halides, if the men generally
were better paid, the beet puzishinent would be found to his
their dieehine. He wished to know # the edosizalty mead