The Express.
London, England, 1853-04-09 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT

HOUSE OF LORDS.—FRIDAY, APRIL 8.
The LOUD CsiescuLton took his seat at 5 o'clack.
PETITIONS PRESENTED.
AtOrtairlON or laws INTO PAIILIAWINT.—By the
Earl ot RODEN. from l'ortarlington, from Team, from
Le nester, and from places in the counties& nf Armagh,
Wexfonl, and Louth; by the Earl of SHAFTESBURY,
ft m Mosetan ; against.
MAYNCsirtt.—by the Earl of ItODEN, from Cavan; and
the Earl of SHAFTESBURY ; against the grant to
StinntrY CuouTs (*wet sou; Lord CAMPBELL,
from Sttiliag, praying fur a to lUT6IIIII the, courts..
!trot-erne (IngLaxo).—By the E irl of RODEN, pray-
ing for an improved registry in Ireland.
METROPOLITAN IMP.:OVEMENT (REPAYMENT
OCT Oh'THE CONSOLIDATED I, UND) BILL.
This bell (mem the manioc of the Earl of Geeevieen),
was read • second time.
NAVIGATION LAWS.
The Earl of ELLENBOROUGH nee to present
• petition loam the muster mariners, mates, and
seamen of Hartlepool, against any repeal of the
provisions of the act of the 12 Pict, with respect to
the Lumber of f Tei.to vostneas is British ships. The peti-
tioarrs had been greatly alarmed ley reports which bail
reached them that it was the intent,n of the government
to propese as alterati in in the act of parliament for rept.
Utica this mutter. By the law as it stood at present, any
ship employed in the coasting trade must b. manned by
British seamen, while ships in the Awn in trade west have
three-fourths or their crew British subjects. This was the
regulation which the petitioners understood that it was in-
tended to alter, and against any alterative they entered
their most salemu protest. A. Novi etion was given to the
interests of capit d, they desired that the house should like-
wise protect the rights of labour. Now, upon looking into
the details which had been hid before their lordships,'
and eensidi rime the position of the mercantile marine
of this country, the house was not in a position
to trifle with the existence of our maritime trade
by carrying out provisions which may have the effect
of diminishing the number of seamen. Ile (Lord Ellen-
borough) kw w that sine* the alteration made in the navi-
gation laws six or seven years ago, there had been a very
great increase in the commerce ef the cs uutry—(hear,
hear)—sod that there had been • very large increase in
the navigation. But that appeared to be only halt the
question. The real questiou was this, had the increase of
the navigation of our own land been equal to the increase
of foreign navigatian ? Mach had been said upon the sub-
ject of the number of our Aim, but on reference to the
returns it would be found that in no ion year since 1816
had the number of vessels built in B h ports equalled
what it was in 1839, 1810, 1911, or 1812. Again, upon look-
ing to the ips of vessels belonging to the foreign trade
entered inwards during the years 1811 and 1815, and com-
paring it with the average of the years 1840 and 1841
(which were the last in the returns), he found that
the tonnage of this country had increased 21 ler cent.,
While the tonnage of foreign vessels earning to this country
had increased 10 rer cent. Ile found also that the total in-
crease of British tonnage was 840,000 time, while the total
increase of foreign tonnage was 1,098,000 tons, so that the
actual increase of foreign tonnage was 258,000 tons more
than the actual increase of British. Now, the petitioners
stated that their particular branch of employment—viz., the
collier trade—had decreased, and that the decrease was not
less than 364 tons. This of course entailed a corresponding
diminution in tee number of the seamen employed. In
regard to this question of the number of British seamen, he
(Lard Ellenberough) would call their lordships' attention
to • return made about November last, in which, he be-
lieved for the first time, a truthful statement of the actual
number of seamen belonging to this country was made. It
appeared that the total number of seamen, exclusive of Mts.
ters, actually employed in the coasting trade was about 43,000.
In addition to this there were about 9,000 employed in
trade described as partly British and partly foreign—a
trade confined to the Channel and the ports on the other
aide of the North Sea. The 43,000 men employed in the
coasting trade would always be under their lordships
handy, together with half ot those employed in the trade
partly British and partly foreign. Within a fortnight or
three weeks the whole of these latter might be available.
The number of seamen employed upon the foreign trade
was 90,000, of which • pcnion must always be in this
country. If they assumed that this portion was 1-12th,
then the number always present would be about 7,500 ;
and theref ire, taking all classes, their lordships bad ready
under their hand. about 60,000 seamen. Bat the house
would observe that they would have the smallest number
of seamen under their hands during the summer, and that
was precisely the time when there was the greatest probe-
bility of an enemy coming against us. That being the
case, awl it seeming to him (the Earl of Ellenborough) that
it would be highly imprudent to adopt any measures by
which this stash number of seamen would be diminished,
he thought it right to state to their lordships what the
present circumstances of the petitioners were, and the house
should then consider whether it became the legislature to
make the aLerations against which the petitioners protested.
These poor earn made shout eight voyages& year. For each
of these Tomes they received a sum of from 31. 10e. to
41. 10s.—that is, upon the average, 321. a year. Their ex-
penses were as follows: Clothes about 101. a year, shoes,
3/. ; house rent, certainly not under IL ; coals, about 21. ;
water rate 10s. Although supplied with provisions on
board, they bad to find for themselves tea, eaffee, and
soap, and this could not be done for less than 24 10s. • year.
The total amount of these expenses was 231., which being
deducted from the hotel of their receipts left • sum of about
9/. a year, or lees than 3s. 6d. a week, to maintain their homes
cad families. Now the object of the measure, which the peti-
tioners understood was in the contemplatioa of her Ma-
jesty's government, was to aid shipowners by diminishing
the wages of seamen. But when their lordships conaidered
the number of oar seamen and the small sum which they
received to support their families, could they say that it
was fit, or just, or proper, that an ende venue should be made
to increase the profits of the shipowners, by taking away
from the poor pittance which remained to the seaman ?
Bach • course was to the last degree impolitic, sod he re-
petted to inform their lordships that he had observed an
amount of strong feeling and excitement in these men,
against conduct which they conceived to be unjust. Ile had
observed this feeling with great pain and some apprehension.
It was not satisfactory to him to hear British seamen talking cf
• determination to adopt the service of a foreign state. It
had been said that nothing was more difficult to remove
than man. They had, however, seen great revolutions in
inion in modern time, and now it would appear that uo-
thing was easier than to transfer from one country to an-
other • large portion of population. The noble earl
dreaded an exodus of the British names. He per-
fectly admitted all the general advantages which arose
from the operation of free trade under ordi-
nary Circumstance., but these advantages ought
not to enter into calculation is a question which involved
the stational security. And this question did involve the
security of the ratios. It was their duty to maintain, as
far as ramble, their maritime strength, in order to prevent
the great mischief and danger of an invasion. lie (the
Earl of Ellenborough) was not prepared to bring into the
service of this country the hired foreigner. It appeared to
him that in public as in private life then were things more
valuable than money. They could not estimate in money
the tabu of the hearts of British seamen, of men whom
they might require in the hour of danger. Ile dared to
say that the Roman detainees who first invented the hiring
atlas Oaths, thought that he had achieved a great triumph
of &uncial economy. He bought soldiers in the cheapest
market, but he isesatiouslysold the empire he was bound
to preserwellear, bear.) Ile (Lord Ellenborough) trusted
that their lordships would not have to regret a similar error ;
bat that, disregarding • small additional profit to one party
of persons engaged in mercantile transactions—however
iallueatial they might be, sad however much they might
hang together—they would decide this question with a view
only to the interest of an honest body of men, to whom they
had had recourse upon former occasions under circum-
stances of danger, and to whom they might again under
simile eitcunicances have recourse, it they would only
treat them justly. But they might depend upon this, that
it was not safe to act towards large bodies of men with in-
justice, and that there was no loss this country could sus-
Min comparable to the loss of the hearts of one of the best
and most useful portions of its population. (Cheat)
Earl GRANVILLE thought that, instead of the intended
alteration being detrimental to British seamen, the slight
competition which It would cause would be beneficial to
their character. In feet, the real difficulty connected with
the coasting trade was how to enable it to compete with the
present increased facilities of inland communication ; and
the only way to do this was to give the shipowner every
possible means to enable them to employ the largest possible
number of ships.
Lord COLCHESTER said it had been stated that
20,000 British seamen were in the American service. Why
was this ? Because they received in that service higher
wages them in their own. Let them get the same wages,'
and those men would enter our own service; and let not
the shipowner possess the power to go into the cheaper mar-
ket for that labour which his own country could so well
supply.
Earl GREY could not avoid entering his protest against
the assertion which represented the measure which would
shortly come before them, as • measure of injustice to the
British sailor.
After a few words from • noble lord (wheee name we
could not ascertain) expressive of an opinion, that if we
permitted foreigners to have the same advantages as our
own mariners, the latter would soon leave the country,
The Duke of ARGYLL said it was not proposed on the
part of the state to engage in the service of the country
mercenary *Ooze, and that so far from this change being
made by the government on the ground of decay in our
naval spirit, they brought forward the proposition,
being convinced that such was the naval capacity of this
country, that it would be promoted instead of impeded by
competition with all the world. (Hear.) On the general
question respecting the navigation laws, noble lords oppo-
site entertained the same misgivings as they now appeared
to enteitsin on this question. They then thought that we
should be driven from the seas by the rapid increase in navi-
gation of other countries, and as noble lords opposite did
then rot, rtain doubts—doubts which a few years had set
at rest—and as they did not then feel confidence in the Ca-
pacity and energy of the shipping interest, so did they not
now feel contelenee in the capacity and the enetgy of our
shipping marine. The government had formed a higher
estimate of Pie rapacity of our merchant seamen. (Hear,
hear.) They believed that they posed all those virtues
which tho noble earl had so well described, but they be-
lieved also that we were so essentially a maritime people
above all nations of the earth, that we need not fear open
and free competition with all or any of them. (Rear.)
The subject then dropped.
The Poor Removal and Local ASSCSOIent Dill was read a
second time.