The Express.
London, England, 1847-02-23 00:00:00

THE EXPRESS, TUESDAY EVENING, FEBRUARY 23, 1847.

from the Uncertainty of the amount required, and portly
from the necessity of dealing next year with that large
source of revenge, the income-tax. Cucumatancce may be
such—the prosperity of the agricultural, commercial, and
manufacturing interests may increase in such a manner, that
it may not he necessary nest year to take more decided mea-
sures; but if such should be necessary nest year, I nay most
distinctly I shall be prepared to propose an increase of the
burdens of the country : for it would be unjustifiable to
allow such a state of things to cantinue fur more than one
year. And if a necessity shall arise when next year conies,
I shall not shrink from proposing
those measures which I
may thiuk most expedient or bringing the revenue of the
country in a more proper proportion to the expenditure than
lam now enabled to exhibit. (Hear.) I think, from the
statement which I have made, it must be evident to every
member of the committee that this year I can ill /mare any
revenue—(hear, hear)—and this statement most be my an-
swer to those hon. members opposite who have pressed me
at various times to reduce the du ies on tea,
tobacco, paper, copper, and some other commodities,
which reduce a considerable amount of revenue.
It u impossible this year to spare any of the ampules
of those burdens. (Hear.) I take this opportunity of
answering, as I promised, a question put to me as to whether
it was my intention to propose an annual duty in lieu of the
existing auger duties. Ido not thiok so much importance
attaches now to that question as formerly belonged to it,
because ebere are two votes of this house (one of which will
be proposed to-night), without which it is impusaible that
the expenditure for the ordinary service of the country can
be provided; but hon. members will bear in mind that now we
have a duty winch we must renew meet year, and therefore
we have the frt.) advantage of an anneal regulation, sad hence
h is not my intention to propose any other duty in lievof that
already voted thivsession. Before lat down, I wish Amply
to say (though it is idle to talk of perusal regret in son a
matter) that no prreou can regret more* sincerely than I do
this interruption to: that course of fiaanefed and commereal
policy which has foe some time prevailed, and for the hat
four yeses with unexampled success. (liter, hear.) It s
true that I may have opposed the imposition of an income.
tax to meet a deficiency of 2,600,0001., but when it has bean ,
tofiow, S by the beneficial results which the rfuht hon. hart.
opposite Mir It. Peel) has effieted, though I do not mean
now to say that I approve of all the details, no
person can more fully convict. than I do in the general
scope and policy of those measures which hove relieved
our trade from all unnecessavy restrictions. which have fos-
tered the industry of the people, sad which have provided
most material additions to their comfort. (Hear, hear.) Just
before I entered the house this evening a paper woe put into
my hands, a peetion of the cuntette of which I feel confident
it will be satisfactory to the committee to hear, ns it tends to
f dispel some portion of the gloom which my statement to- I
night may have cast over the minds of some honourable
members. It is a statement of the quantities of a certain I
number of articles taken into consumption during the last
four years. They are articles which enter among the great
body of the people, and I think, front the guard!, its I
.am about to read, the document chow, how materially
their comfort and happinese must have been increased by
the increased quantities they have been enalled by the
removal of restriction, to consume. The first article I take
is that of coffee, and I find that of it there were entered Cr
home consumption in 1843, 30.000,000 lbs.; in 1841,
31,391,000 lbs. ; in 1845, 34,318,000 lbs ; and in 1846,
36,781,000 lbs. (Hear, hear.) I next take the article of
butter, and I find that of it there were entered for home
consumption in 1843, 148,000 cwt. ' • in 1844, 181,000 cwt. r
in 1845, 210,000 cwt. ; and in 1846, 253,000 cwt. The ne-ct
article is cheese, and of this, in 1843, there was entered for
home consumption 166,000 ewt. ; in 1814, 212,000 ewt. ; in
1845, 258,000 cwt. ; and in 1846, 327,000 cwt., and yet I have
not beard that the farmer of Chothire have been ruined

(‘. Hear, hear," and a laugh.) Currants is the next article
to which I will allude. I find that of currants there were
entered for home consumption in 1843, 2;4,000 cwt. • in '
1844, 285,000 cwt. ; 1845, 309,000 evrt.; and in 1846, 359,000
cwt. In sugar the return is as follows : In 1843, 4,071,000
cwt. •in 1844 4,139,090 cwt. ; 184.5, 4,880,000 cwt. ; and
in 186, 5,231,000 cwt. were entered for home tronevimptimi.
(Hear, hear.) Now on all these article, the duties have
been reduced, and I have reserved the gr. at snide of tea,
for the reduction of duty on which so much interest has
been excited ; but it Ls only fair to state thataltheugh the duty
on tea has not been reduced, yet by various circumstances I
well known to the commercial world, the prices of that
I:mann:l34 have been much reduced. 1 find, however, that I
of tea there were entered for home coseuraption in
1843, 40,304,000 lbs., in 1844, 41,369.00011., in 1815, I
44,183,000 lbs., and in 1846, 40,728,000 lbs. (Ike, hear.) i
All of these are articles which are largely consumed by the I
great body of the people, and it certainly must be satisfactory 1
to the committee to observe the enormous extent to which i
the consumption of each has increased. This increase can-
not be aceountxl for by the consumption of the higher and
wealthier classes, hut it must have been caused by that of I
the mass of the people down to tee working man. (Hear.) It
gives me great satisfaction to be able to read these extracts,
as showing the results which have ffowed from the policy
of the right honourable baronet opposite (Sir B. Peel), I
and as proving that the continuance in the same course .
tends most to the prosperity of the country and the
well being of the people, with 'whose prosperity and well
being all classes are inseparably connected. (Cheers.) I I
have now concluded the statement which it has been my
duty to make on this occasion ; I hope I base made that '
statement clear. (Cheers.) If not I must request any
hon. member who desires to put any question to me to do so I
at once, as I fear it will not be ismy power to remain in the I
house. (Hear, hear.) The vote which I have to put into '
the hands of the chairman has nothing to do with the state- I
ment I have made. It is a mere vote of coarse, and I con. I
elude with now moving its adoption. (The risht hon.
baronet, who seemed much exhausted and to be suffering
from pain, resumed his seat amidst general cheering.)
The CHAIRMAN then put the resolution, which was a vos
of 8,000,0001., out of the consolidated fund, in aid of the pub-
lic service for the current year.
Mr. HUME said the right hon. gentleman had made his
statement particularly clean, and a most melancholy state-
ment it was. His details of the decrease of employment in
this country, and of the increase of destitution in Ireland,
must present unpleasant forebodings to those who had the
management of the country's finances. He (Mr. Hume-)
complained not of the sacrifice of eight or ten millions ; but
after this large sum was expended, the country would be
apparently in a worse condition than at present; for net one
remedial measure had been proposed, to avert the evil,. and
to enable Ireland to regenerate itself. It was to be regretted
that the right hon. gentleman had not proposed such &ether
reforms as would further increase the commerce of the coun-
try. The recent reduction in the sugar duty had shows that
this might safely be done ; then, why not remove from the
statute-book all remaining restrictions, and allow commerce
to put forth that elasticity by which alone the exhaling bur-
dens could be alienated ? As to the duty on tea., the loss
that would result from its reduction would he trisSag, com-
pared with the great advantage that would cries from the
extension of our exports to China. Out of 600,000,000 of
yards of common calicoes, 180,000,000 went to China alone,
and this quantity might be doubled if we took more of their
produce, while the revenue might be at the sense time in-
creased. The duty on copper ore, which producedenly 40,0001.
or 50,0001., cost probably throe times that amount, by losing,
us the markets of the whale world. The reduction of the.
duty would not affect the peoducen of ore ih this country
and it was extremely bed policy to allow France and the
United States to obtain the market from us, by smelting. foe
themselves, owing to our duty of 50 or fid per cent. or-the
ore. In like manner, the duties on 150 or 200 other articles
ought tobe swept away, in order to gleeful, scope tosiom-
mere& The expenditure for Ireland being an extraordinary
one, government ought to have applied, the surplus ordinary
revenue in carrying out those great, commercial reforms
which were now exciting the attention of the commercial
world. Instead ottbis, it was proposed, by limiting the hours
of labour in factories, still further to enpple the productive
power of the country, and to; lessen the meanest meeting
the extraordinary expenditure now required. A recent state-
ment from the manufacturing disisiets, showed a decrease of
the number of hands in full work, an ISM**, of those
working only half-time, and a very marked increase of those
entirely idle. Last year, the surplus revenue was estimated
at 78,0001. ' • It was actually v,soo,oooa—a most striking
proof of the advantage of removing the shackles ffom
commerce, and an encouragement to proceed in that
course. Unless this was done, the country would
' be ruined ; for the expenditure was incressan,g,
em-
ployment was becoming less abundant, and pauper-
ism 'ma rapidly extending in Scotland and lingland.
The financial operations of the government would also pro-
duce a scrims effect on the money market; this would
increase the expenses. et the manulisetivers, and, tender them
leas able to compete with foreigners in neutral porta. As to
; the income-tax, he was an advocate for, its extension to

Ireland ; let evesy tax paid in lingland and Scotland be ex-
tended to Ireland, and let the Irish have fair play—
(langhter)—both in regard to civil rights and everything
else. Should the next harvest prove unfavourable, with the
expenditure increased in every item, and no provir.ion made
for raising Ireland up to the level of Engiand and Scotland,
the necessary consequence would be that England and Soot-
land must come down to the level of Ireland. They ought
not to proceed further without en amurance from govern-
ment that measures would be adopted for regenerating Ire-
land. It was said that Irish property could not bear this ;
but it was quite certain that, without it, Irish property
would be lost. The time was come when all the sources of
expenditure ought to undergo a critical examination ; end
let the country gentlemen bear in mind, that if the present
course was persevered in, on them would fall the burden of
a tan per cleat. interne-tax, for nothing lees would
RTC.
Mr. W. WILLIAMS said the statement of the right hoc.
gentleman would be the most unsatisfactory and unpalatable
to the country that any Chancellor of the Exchequer had
made since the termination of the last war. In every de-
partment of the *spew iitare there was an increase, especially
in the army, the navy, and the ordnance. Surely "one
grounds should have been shown for this increase, especially
as compared with last year. He entirely disapproved of the
way in which the right hon. gentleman proposed to make up
the eight millions; it ought not to have fallen upon the per-
manent and ordinary sources of revenue; and its repayment
aught to have been provided for within a very limited period.
In 1840, when we were engaged in a war with Chins, and a
dispute with France—when we had an immensely large Beet
la the Mediterranean, when the siege of Acre took place;
and when a large amount of the Canada expenditure was
unpaid, the expenditure for the army, navy, and ordnance
was 2,093,00 W. less than in the present year. ( Hear, hear.)
He objected to the manner in which the right hon. gentle-
man proposed to raise the eight millions. II we were to
borrow money in t'me of peace, we ought to begin on a new
principle—the Chancellor of the Exchequer should get 1001.
in money for 1001. of stock, whereas in the present state of
the money market the proposed loan of 8,000,000!. would in
fact be 8,800,0001. ( Hear, hear.) By this system of bor-
rowing money,upearils of 6,000,000!. might have been saved
in the country from 1775 down to 1817.
Mr. ROEBUCK wished, at the earliest moment, to enter

his solemn protest against the proposition of ti..o govern-
ment. Tie was willing to admit that the statemm. t of the
Chanceller of the Exchequer could not have Iva' more
frank, lucid, and complete—(hear, hear)—and he (len Roe-
buck) was not actuated by any spirit of hostility to lie Jo-
yernmeng in else :ennuis which he was about to make, be. t
he thought it hie de•ty at once to state his objections to the
course proposed; and he must, in the first place say, that a
suspicion was created in his mind, in consequence of the
altered course of promee'ing on the part of the government.
Tucy had paned a bill iriarch gave them the lower over all
the money to be approprieed by parliament; iu addition to
which, a bill had beeu pan. 'd, called an indemnity bill, but
which, in reality, would rs oiler valid every presentment
that might be mode in Irelans 1; and when all this had been
done, the Chancellor of the E. schequer asked for a loan of
eight millions sterling. Now, ;the noble lord at the head of
the government had stated that ise hoped he should encoun-
ter no opposition to the prine2ple of his Irish poor-
law bill—that principle being, he (Mr. Roebuck) under-
stood, teat property in Ireland !Moult be taxed for the poor
of Ireland. (Hear, hear.) It appem-ed, however, that 70
Irish proprietors had signed a paper in opposition to the
principle of the bill : the Irish clergy ej ere alarmed at the
conduct of the Irish party, the membe.-s of which he be-
lievel had banded themselves together to o oposeen efficient
poorlaw for Ireland—(Year, hoer)--and heat circumstance
threw a shade of suspicion over hie mini wh en he regarded
the measures he had before referred to for the relief of Irish
digress. He hoped English gentlemen in that house would
MAC • stand, and not permit a loan of eight on Miens to be
made for any purpose until they were su.'e of the
mutiny of a poor-law for Ireland. (Cheer s.) The
Chancellor of the Exchequer had glided over a great
part of the difficulty: he had not edentate, d upon
the evil for the whole ear, and no ens mole 1 carry
his propmele through, if they would make the tales of the
year meet she exigencies of the year—(hear, hear) ;—a.ed he
would here'aek why taxatimo should not be luidon the s hole
property of Treland. (Hear, hear.) Why ware Irish Cen-
tletnen allowed to come to this-country and etre' for ihe or
six months, geirig to any amount of expense taw/ please 1.
end not pay that class of taxes, which an Englishman wa
oeliged to, even if he was a poor artisan. (Hear, hear.)
Where was the justice of this at a time when his (Mr.
Roebuck's) pooreountrymen were th, msclves metering so
much misery. Why should he seal his professional erethren
ea.* to deduct the income tax from the reward of their
.arbour, when no each tax was impeeed on any profession in
Ireland ? (Hear, hear.) Why, he would ask, did net the
noble lord at the h nd of the government propose a property
and income tax for Ireland ? (Hear, hem.) Before the pro- I
posed loan received the sanction of the home, he would bring
&newel that question, and he hoped Englishmen would mod-
hot that they would coon have to meet their constituents. ffb
should moose the simnie and honest measure of malaise,
property, whether in Ireland or England, subject to the •
same liabilities, and mekine every man according to his
utilities, contribute to the taxation of the country. The
present calamity had been called au impede' calamity—let
them then provide an imperial remedy, and tax with fair-
ueas and equality the impiniel kingdom. (Hear, hoar.) Ile
would take the poor-rate in Ireland as some guide for
levying a property tax, and in answer to the objection that
such a tax would not be paid, he would say then seize the
property and sell it—there could be no difficulty insetting it, '
for land sold at a higher rate in Ireland than io England. •
It wax but an act of common justice to their own fellow-
countrymen to impose this tax. en Isishmen. They were
now giving daily employment to 600.000 persees in that
country, and the great difficulty was to disband this great •
body of people. (Hear.) They had been withdrawn from
their ordinary occupation—that of cultivating the soil—and
employed upon other works, and the difficult problem they •
had to deal with wee how to get them back to their usual
labours. Now, one great advantage of the income
LAM would he that they would thereby give a direct
interest to the owners of Irish property to withdraw
the people from Isbouring upon the works, and to employ
them in the cultivation of the land. The government had
the greatest problem to solve that men ever brought upon
themselves. The people of Ireland bad been forced on to a
higher description of food than they were accustomed to, one
more costly and Vero able to feed a number of persointat a
given expense. But they had not 8,000,000 of people to feed,
owl 6,000,0001. worth of food had been imported from Ire-
land, for which a 7usd pro quo. was given. There had been
instances of similar calamities in other countries. India had
bees visited in the same way. But the East India
Company, which was &government of great power and guided
by great intelligence, came to the wise resolution not to
interfere for the future in these dispensations, farther than to
remove an obstructions in the way of procuring food.
He believed that in Ireland, main India, the consequence of
interference had been to increase the misery. (Hear,
hoar.) They bad the whole population thrown upon the
government, owing to their benevolent intentions. They
had 3,000,000 of people to feed, and were spending 1,000,0(101.
a month. ( Hear.) They were told that this was to coil iu
August. Ile did not think that woe likely to be the case.
They had promised seed to the people, and consequently tile
people eat the seed which they would otherwise keep. In-
stead of 50,000/., he was of opinion that 1.000,0001. would
not answer for seed. They had demoralised the people by
destroying whatever foresight they had. The government
had converted themselves into corn chandlers; they fancied
they could govern a kingdom as they did a farm, and never
was there a more dresdful mistake. (Hear, hear.) He hart
seen letters from all parts of Ireland, in which it was stated
that the people would not sabeerese because it was expected
that government would do everything. (Hear, hear.) He
warned the government to beware how they proceeded
before the whole mischief was done. They might make
their loan of 8,000,000 e, and calculate that August
would put an end to this state of things, but
never would people fwd themselves more surely
disappeinted. when August came. 'They would then And
Memse.ves with an empty exchequer, parSament not
sitting, theaame state of misery existing, the same deafen-
ing cry of "•give, give," more loudly repeated, and their be-
nevolence merely ending in making the large mass of pre-
sent misery still greater. (Hear, hear.) Therefore, beware
in time;, stop thu state of things while you are able, ards
in justice to the people at England, impose ea those
in Ireland who are able to bear it their quota of the =
and do not drag the people of England, who ask for nothing
but protection, down to-the miserable condition to which we
see our fellow-countrymen in Ireland. reduced. (Cheers.)
Lord J. RUSSELI. said he nee teteddress the house, not
for the purpose of adding anything to the financial statement
of hie right hon friend who had stated bionic sea so clearly, as
to render any explanation on his part unnecessary, but in
order to enter at once into discussion with the hen. and
learned gentlemanwho had just sat down, because, though
he admitted the hon. and learned gentleman was conscien-
tiously persuaded his views were foe the benefit of the
country, he thought the hon. and learned gentle-
man was so deceived himself, and would, if he
ware listened to by the house, so completely de-
ceive parliament, that there' would be great danger
the following his counsel. (Rear, hear.) The hen. and
learned gentleman said that the income tax ought to be im-
mdiately applied to Ireland—that this oalarnity was an
imperial calamity, and ought to be met by imperial means.
Yet, though it was an Imperial calamity, it ought to be
recollected that it pressed mom severely in Ireland; that
those prorrietors in Ireland who had taken shame of the
destitute people in their neighbourhood and on their own
estates had done that at a considerable saorifice, having re-
ceived perhaps only a small portion of their rents—(bear,
hear, and cheers)—and expended the whole of their
used income. (Hear, hear.) He should say, therefore, that
whilst such was the condition of Ireland, and admitting, as
he did admit, that while it was wise in the right hon.
gentleman opposite (See It. Peel) not to impose an income-
tax on Ireland in the first instance, if it was only to be a tem-
porary burden, it would be only just to extend that tax
to 'inland if it were to continue to any length of time.
(*ear, hear.) *eking that admission, yet he did not think
it would be wise, or just, or considerate to impose that tax on
.Ireland at the present time. (Hear, bear, hear.) He could
' not, therefor*, agree in the first proposition of the hon. and
learned gentleman. But the hon. and learned gentleman
went on to show that the present calamity was nothing but
the ordinary state of Ireland, and referred to a report of a
committee of inquiry iota the state of Mellow. He (Lord
J. Russell) had that repose brought under his notice in Octo-
ber, and although it tweezed from it that some of the ani-
mus and small shopkeepers in the towns lived, in ordinary
years, oa a miserable pittance of food for a portion of the
year, yet it would be rash to conclude from that that the
present state of Ireland was at all similar to what
It was in ordinary years. (Hear, hear, hear.) Let
him :suppose that three-fourtbe of the wheat crop, and a
portion of the oat crop failed in England, would it not be
mid that an extraordinary want of food had befallen the
country ? (Hear, hear.) Now the potato crop, which was
the general food of the people of Ireland, having failed, was
it not an extraordinary calamity, and the more ao for this
very reason, that so large a portion of the people were on the
border of starvation in ordinary years? (Hear, hear.) Let
them look to the condition of the people of this country when
some staple manufacture failed, or when there was a scarcity
of Provision. A poor family were accustomed to their tea
and sugar, they perhaps sent two children to school, and
they were able with their small income to provide for these
expenses. A year of calamity mine, and they reduced their
food to what was barely necessary for their sustenance. They
cut off every other sort of expenditure. If that was not all f-
talent, they came to the parochial board—to the board of
guerdians—and stated the distress of the family. The
man was put upon the roads to break stones, and the
family received enough for their sustenance. That was a
melancholy rate of things and a state of great distress, but it
was a state of distress which was to be borne, and it was
borne. (Hear, hear.) And it was remarlarbio that in that
tract which had Teen often quoted for other purposes Mr.
Burke's " Thoughts on Scarcity," in which he lays 'down
the wise doctrine of non-interference, it is said

iu this year of crest scarcity" (and it was a
year of great scarcity), " I have not heard of one
person who has been starved to death in this country."
(Hear, hear.) Was not that a veer different state of things
from what prevailed in Ireland ? (Hear, hear.) And when
they heard of the number of deatha which were every day
°catering, was it net clear that unless some means were
adopted to preserve the people the number of deaths,
instead of being what they had heard, wou'd be
multiplied ten and • hundred fold? (Hear, hear.)
Now, seeing that the calamity week) extraordinary, and that
the immediate resources of Ireland were not sufficient to
meet it in a single year, they had telvit the resource which
had been applied in England ; making a list of those persons
who required relief, giving them money to purchase food,
sad, at the same time, imposing the performance of task-
work, in order to ascertain that the patties were really des-
titute, and as &return for the wages given. That was the
course nsually taken in England, and in that way millions
had been annually spent in this country ever 'Moe the I oor-
law had been in raistPlice. in the ease of Ireland, seeing that
no -law existed which was adequate to the emergency,
and
thit if one were enacted, there were not resources
to provide for the calamity, they ademmed large swim from

the imperial exchequer to enable the people to ward off, in
some degree, the famine which was hanging over them.
The plan proposed might be defective ; but he owned that
he could not reconcile it to himself, as a minister of this
I country, to lay down the principle that no effort should be
made—(cheers)—that the legislature should abandon the
people to the calamity, and have them dependent on the
ordinary operations of trade, in the hope that they would
ob 'sin a subentence by such meanie (Hear, hear, hear.)
He did certainly think that the feeling aad opinion of the
house would have been against the government if
they hale taken that course—that Niehaus unwise economy,
would not have been supported by the votes and approbation
of partisans... (Hear.) While he said this, he also gave the
hon. and learned gentleman (Mr. Roebuck) full credit for
believing, that Oat was the course which ought to be pur-
sued, end which would produce the best results as regarded
Ireland. Now, as respected the poeition of the people of
that country, there wan, no doubt, a very formidable tranai.
tion to be paased through. Probably there was soma truth
in the hon. and learned gentleman's statement, that people
who had been employed on public works, had been with-
drawn
from field labour; but ho thought the nine-
sentations on that subject were very mutt crag-
gender!. (Hear, hear.) Now, the great question was
whether Ireland could be safely conducted through the great
change which mast come; whether those who were now
mere cattier tenants could be turned into labourer..;
whether the lantords and farmers together could employ as
much capital on the land as would make the work oflabourers
necessary and useful, and thereby raise a sufticent quantity
of food from the soil? (Hear.) He believed that if there
had been coefficient time to effect thin object ; if, instead of wait-
ing to gain experience from the lamentable potato failure, all
had agreed that the potato culture was injunous, and, having
come to one salad on the subject, had endeavoured to change
the face of the country in seven or eight years, sock an
effort would have been attended with success. He hoped that
the object might still be accomplished ; but, at the same
time, it would not be, he feared, without very great distress
in the present year, and for souse years to come. (Hear,
hear.) The process was one which evidently involved very
great changes and sacrifices. It would be necessary to carry
through that and the other house of parliament a more ex-
tended poor-law for Ireland; and he still entertained the
opinion which he had expensed the other night, that to the
nnaciple of that law there would be no objection on
e, ho part of Irish members or proprietors in that house, ,
th ough there might: be a difference of opinion as to the
det ails, the mode of rating, and the district is which I
the rate should apply. As regarded the question of finance,
the t emourable member for Coventry had complained of •
very Treat increase of expenditure. lie (Lord J. Russell)
would not say anything with respect to the miscellaneous
ntimat es, which consisted of such various items that it was
not pose ihle then to enter into them. He did not believe
that the increase in the army, navy, and ordnance at all ex-
ceeded se, eat was necessary for the defence of the country ;
on the con trary, he thought that if their means were more
ample, it would be wise to propose a larger expeu-
diture for St 'me of the military and naval Manche, of the
public serve. 'e, Monier to bring them into that state of effi-
ciency in wh.'eh it was desirable that they should be found
ir. case of ch tors. (Hear, hear.) There was no very
great increase in teen estimates as compared with last year.
The eommitteo wood recollect that,* order to attain greeter
uniformity end .regebnity the accounts, the estimates in
the last year, whh respect to several breaches both
of the military ante the naval service, were takes for
only three questa.* of the year. The estimate for
the army last y ear was 6,035,000 J. ; this year it was
6,840,0001. ; the dofereed votes of the quarter amounted to
192,1722., leaving, al, th a real increaser, 12,8284 The ord-
naner estimate of last year was 8.543,00 fee. this 'eerie wan
2,679,0001., and the defected vote being 67,2991., the veal'
increase under that he ad was 68,7011. The increase kr the
ordnance estimate was for the purpose of mronenticg the
number of men in that :Terportent branch of the actelee.
Hon. members were awam that a considerable pined
was required to make men efficient in that depot.
meat, and it was in order' to give the necessary pea
baton that the government proposed tkis increase.
For the navy, there was an increase of 77,428/1, allowing en
addition of 1,500 men to the marines. ft had been intended
to rid 3,000, but it was found that not morathan 1,509
could be added in the present year. Although he admitted
that the increase was considerable, as compared with the
years to which the how. gentleman had alluded, 1834 and
1835, yet he did not think it was at all too much for the
defence of a great empire like their own. The novenae of
commerce rendered it necessary that they should have a
large fleet; and the seaseity which their trade and commerce
derived from tee knowledge that Oro naval and militeey ser-
vile' were efficient, woo one great reason why they were now
se nourishing and prosperous. (Cheers.)
Lord G. BRNTINCK said his right hon. friend the
Chancellor of the Exchequer had stated as a reason fee not
adding to the income-tea that such • course would produce a
eirgaetion of trade. He (Lord G. Hentincke thought that
one reason. why the government would not meet the men-
Om of renewing the income-tax was that the present
to ent w supposed be in the last year of
rtriirxistence—as
(Laughter) and that the government
were not willing to go to an election with the di advantage
of having proposed what some years ago they so loudly con-
demned. (Hear, hear) He was not surprised that the
hon. na mbar for Coventry had expressed disappointment at
the increase of the navel and militaryservices of the coantry.
Remembering the high-flown promises in which his noble
friend the member for the West Riding of Yorkshire in.
dulged on a late occasion, when he rose from his own
natural Woods and espies*, and assured the people of
Shedleld that the first result of free trade in corn would he
that his Mead Mr. Ward would be able to maintain the
nosy of Englend without applying to hie friend Mr.
Parker for taxes—(laughter)—one necessary nansequence
being that the sword of the soldier would drop from hie
hand, and the red artillery quench its murderous Bashes—
(Renewed laughtee)—remembering this, he thought
the honoarable member for Coventry had great
reason to be disappointed at the result of free trade.
He (Lord G. Bannock) was mach surprised to hear
that the government would prefer spending 10,000,000(.
sterling, of which England should pay 5,000,0001., to speed-
, ine the same money in profitable employment. (Hear.)
Hs right hon. friend had observed that capital had of late
taken the direction, not of Mieeiseeppi loam, bat of enterprise
at home. That was, he thought, a good argument for
encouraging railway enterpese in Ireland. His right boo.
friend congratulated himself on an Menem in tbe consump-
tion of butter; hut he forgot to state that there hod been
an increase, from 1843 to 1845, from 148,000 cwt. to 240,000
cwt., showing that a gradual increase had, in fact,
arises from the improved circumstances of the people. In
like warmer the consumption of cheese had increase I before
as well as after the period specified, so that there was no
real ground of congratu!ation as regarded free trade. His
right hors. friend had further told them of an increase in
the consumption of tea ; but, if he had looked at the case
of hops, malt, anal British spirits, be would have found a
corresponding one. In the case of hops the increase
from 1843 to 184.3 was from 27,000,0001b5. to V,000,0001ba;
in that of malt, from 1843 to 1844 it was from 35,000,000 to
41,000,000 bushels. What had free trade to do with this ?
He believed it was railway enterprise which bad effected the
change, by luereasing the means of those who depended
upon it. Ho could not join in the congratulation offered oa
aoeount of the increase in the consumption of slave-
grown mew (hear, hear) or the increased
revenue derived from the silk manufaetures. (Hear,
hear.) if nowing the present condition of the Seital-
field weavers, and how their wages bad been reduced, he
could not rejoice in any increase derived from that source.
Three days ago he hind received a letter from these antes,
Waste weavers, a part of which he would read to the house.
The noble lord then read an extract stating that his lord-
ship's own predictions respecting the new law bad been pain-
fully realised, that one-half of the trade were out of employ-
ment, that hundreds had gone to the workhouse, and that
great. Jumbles had died and were dying. The wages had,
it was dated, hesavedneed from 10 to 30 per cent. This was
standla a postneript—the letter referred especially to the dia-
tremeandand in which the parties expressed their sympathy.
They esid, " We have read the speeches of your lor;
we am mask delighted with the spirit they evince, and we
NOMA' th ides that had you held the reins of government
—(lead laeghber)--the people of Ireland would not have
to the extent they have, because you would not
hue segarled these new-fangled doctrines of political Geo-
=y." (Lead laughter) These were the expressions of a
y of the working clams', and
be Usatll rriseellmelt) fully approved of them. (Hear, and
kallair.) And when he heard the Chancellor of the Ex-
Anger my, that cut of the immense sum that had bees
agent la Ireland, only 295,0001. had been expended in feeding
the stoning people of that country, be must say that he Mt
great regret at the smallness of that sum, and thought it was
a scandal in the face of Europe that 25,000
should absolutely have perished of starvation in =
whilst under the paternal government of the Xing of
the French, whose ministers bad bought no less than
two million quarter. of grain, not a man, woman, or child,
in that country had died of starvation ! Was it possible, he
would ask, that the Irish, who had perished by thousands,
could abstain from contrasting their condition with the
people of France ? (Hear, and laughter.) But he would
not detain the home ; indeed there was only one more
remark shill he had to make. The Chancellor of the
Exchequer had told them that it was his expectation or in-
tention to pay 31 per cent. for the loan. It was surprising
to him that the Chancellor of the Exchequer should have
made this statement before the loan was contracted for.
34 percent. was not the interest which the funds bore at
their present prices ; and when those who had money to
lend, heard that 34 per cent. was expected to be paid, le
thought it very likely that they would be determined to
have 31 per sent., whether it was offered or not.
Mr. SHAW recurred to the speech of Mr. Roebuck. That
hon. gentleman was assuredly the only member of that
home who would have thought the present • good opportu-
nity to impose a tax on Irish property. He was wrong in
saying that the public works drew people from their ordi-
nary occupations on the land. The cause of their deserting
the tillage of the land was simply that the total failure of
the potato crop rendered it absolutely necessary that they
should work for mosey wages. The hon. member who lad
the Irish representatives as being " handed tegether."
There was nothing astonistsiog in At is. meeting, at such a
moment as this, to consult fur the benefit of their country.
But, be said, they were met to oppose the introduction of
peer law. That was not the case. They might not think
thin a favourable opportunity to propose a poor law, but they
were not banded together to oppose it. Their resistance
was limited to the principle of out-door relief, which
they thought would be 1111110W1 to the property, and most
derroraliaing to the people of Ireland. With regard to the
proprietors, he believed the resident landlords subscribed to
benevolent object. to the utmost of their ability.
Mr. ROEBUCK said the opinions of the hon. member
upon that point were no better than the opinions of any one
else. The fact of his having been in Dublin did not show
him better acquainted with the state of the Irish provinces
then he (Hr. Roebuek) was, who resided in Leaden, He

refer the

(Mr. Roebuck) had had a deputation of Catholic dere,
knocking at his door that very morning—ay, and upon fie('
subject of the poor-law too! As for information, all the ben
Irish journals were sent to him—and w hot did he find there'
Why, that very large numbers of proprietor., resident ss
well as non-resident, had never contributed • halfpeoey
to the poor! It was a constant complaint that it
was not amongst the poor farmers and small shopkeeper',
but amongst the gentry, that reluctance wai shown to cootei.
bute. There were people who should be made to jay ; and
if he (Mr. Roebuck) could prevail upon his Ecgllao friends
behind him to join him, he would swallow up every atom—
ay, evert atom—of Iri.h property by taxation. (Hear,
hear.) be sure English land (he wos proud to say it) was
mortgaged deeply for the support of the English poor: and
Irish land should be mortgaged too, or, if mortgaged already,
should be sold.
Mr. OOULBURN did not intend to prolong this discus.
sion upon the Irish poor law, or the way in which Irish land-
lords diacharged their duties. His purpose was to addreas
himself to the state of the revenue, as it had been explained
by his right hon, friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer.
For himself he knew no situation more painful or dish.
cult than that in which a Chancellor of the
Exchequer was placed, who came down to the house to pro.
pose an increase on the burdens of the people; and in WM.
mon with all who had addreseed the house, he must lair his
tribute of approval to the way in which his right ban. friend
had met the present d'lfieulty, and stated the case for which
they had to provide. (Hear.) That the increase of revenue
which had occurred last rear was the result of t''e measure'
which the parliament bad sanctioned—measures which freed
commerce from trammels, and cheapened the necessaries of
life to the consumer—no man, in his opinion, could enter:sin
the 'lightest doubt. The noble lord, indeed, said, that be.
rouse the consumption of butter and cheese had increased in
former years without any reduction of taxation, they had no
right to argue that the greater consumption of other articles
was, last year, the result of such reduced taxation. He
(Mr. Cote:burn) admitted that with the general prosperity
of the country there must be a greater consumption of the
necessaries of life, whether taxes on those articles were re-

' duce I or not; but it was equally undeniable that by the
• reduction of such taxation, coseumption was also greatly
• increased; and that, with that increased consumption, there
must be a great increase in the comforts of the people.
The noble member for Lynn had attribut d the increase of
revenue from articles of consumption, entirely to the capital
expended by railway companies. lie (Mr. Goulbern) did
not undervalue the benefit derivable from this source. but
he would beg to remind the noble lord that railways were
not the growth of last year. Before 1841 there had been
enormous sums expended by some of the greatest railway
companies, yet concurrently with that expenditure, amount-
ing to millions and millions, there had been a censiderably
decreasing revenue. (Hear, hear.) The hon. member for
Montrose, in the face of the great emergency which the
country was called upon to meet, propos-it that still
further reductions 'should be made in taxation; the
hon. member did not consider that the tom( r reduction
which had met with such favourable resuita hod beet, only
made with the uta.oOt eau' inn, and at periods when thie ac-
tual circumstances and near prospects cf the slave permitted
them. If the extreme views of the hon. gentleman had
been adopted but a few years back, England, in this hoer of
storm, would he far from occupying that inmparieively fa.
vouratie position to meet it which had joa been described.
(Hear, hear.) As to the mode of encountering the gnat
difficulty before them—a difficulty let it be ever borae
in mina, not occasioned by human agency, bat the result
of a yin/mien from on high—he thought the plan of the
right hon. gentleman the best that could, under the circuits
stances, be sdopted ; the distinct understanding being that
the loan advanced to Ireland should be repaid by those for
whose benefit it was made. lieabove all cordially approved
of the determination expressed by the right bon. g• ntleman
t• uphold the balance of the Exchequer, and to take care
that the income sbusld be equal to the expenditure of ths
country. (Hoer.)
Mr. V. 8:11f H thought that instead or a perma-
nent loan at 3 or ilk per cent., it would he far better to raise
the account required by way of terminable annuities--a elan
of lean, fade tel, leas pomtlar in the money-market, but far
more advantageous, ultimately, fbe the country, even
thound not raised upon terms as immediately favourable.
Alderman THOMMIc had heard with great pleasure
the Chancellor of the Exchequer dilate on the advantages
of a surplus revenue. ft was a long time since he had
heard that doctrirm Melte:, preached or practised, as we
generally had had an cress of expenditure. He feared
that the right hon gentleman would not have it to boast of
long, seeing that nacordirrg to his present estimate there
was a surplus of only 332,1180 f. on an expenditure of above
fifty millions. Ile thought it would have been better if the
right hon. gentleman had taken a larger margin the his loan,
seeing, that after having takeutikree millions cut of the E ache-
qaer for Ireland, he might hawadifficulty in getting eash for
his deficiency bills. Another lemon for doing this wa. that
it wee clearly impoesiblo to tell what would he the exact
amount required for Ireland. (Hear, hear.) On the whole
he had nothing to complain of to the financial statement of
the year, and he woo very much pleased to hear that no
additional taxation was intended,

Mr. MOFFATT complained of the withdrawal of the
Anneal Duties Bills.
Mr. F. T. BARING did not regret the withdrawal of the
Annual Duties Bill. He had always held that exposing any
particular trade to annual uncertainty was at beat but ques-
tionable constitutional policy. (Hear, hear.) He wan,
therefore, far from regretting that the Chancellor of the
Exchequer did not think it necessary to put any tax under
this annual investigation and botheration. (A laugh.) Hs
did not quite concur with the late Chancellor of the Exche-
quer in his congratulations on the prosperous state of oar
tinaacen. It appeared to him that putting aside the Irish
loan, the position in which we stood was not entirely com-
fortable. Without reckoning the Chinese money and other'
incidents, the whole surplus on the year did not exceed
400,000!. The real principle of the present budget—the
rest was merely figures, and they were remarkably well does
—the real principle was, whether it was advisable to
meet the probably increased expenditure by an increased
income, or to provide for the temporary emergency by a
loan. On the whole, he thought that his right hon. friend
had acted wisely in the course he bad taken, although ha
could not conceal from himself that next year it would most
probably be necessary to review our finances, with • view of
equalising our income and expenditure.
Mr. MUNTZ had always contended that if it were neeeo
lacy to raise money for the service of the state it should be
done at once, and that posterity should not be taxed for the
wants of the present generation.
Mr. B. ESCOTT remarked that this being the last year
of the present parliament, was the reason there was nothing
in the budget beneficial to the people. The sooner the pre-
sent parliament was dissolved end its successor conveoed, the
better for all the interests of the country.
Mr. EWART complained that the budget took too little
care for the future, and concurred with the last speaker is to
the policy of abolishing the duties on provisions.
Mr. G. BANKES observed that the difference between
bin noble friend's t Lord G. Bentinck's) plan and that of the
government wan, fie '.{the former proposed to advance the
credit of the envern'eent, while the latter proposed to ad-
vance eight millions ol.money for the relief of Irish distress,
without providing for a return. The ministry had that night
acknowledged the merits ofhis noble friend's proposition for a-
vaneing 16,000,000!., by themselves proposing an advance of
10,000,0001. That *bowed at least tbst his noble friend"
proposition was not so extravagant, while it would hare die'
trihuted assistance in the present distressed state of Ireland
more widely. (No, uo.)
Mr. M. J. O'CONNELL denied that the noble lord's pro-
position was at all a substitute for that of the government.
(Hear, hear.)
Mr. FINCH considered the statement of the Chancellor of
the Exchequer as fair as could be expected under the present
circumstances and in the present objectionable state of the
currency.
The resolution wee then agreed to, and (the house having
resumed) was ordered to be reported this day.
AGRICULTURAL TENANT RIGHT BILL.
Mr. PUSEY moved the second reading of this bill, and
stated his intention, in compliance with the wishes of •
body of members interested in agricultare, to
to the consideration of • select committee.

Colonel SIBTHORP expressed his determination strenu-
ously to oppose the bill, which would uproot all that good
feeling which ought to exist between landlord and tenant
Mr. S. HERBERT said that though he was not pre-
pared to vote for the bill se it at present stood, still Its
thought it might be so disused up stain as to elicit much
valuable information, and to lay the foundation of a ler
objectionable measure.
Mr. MILES and Mr. FINCH both expressed similar
opinions.
Mr. NEWDEGATP. thought it undesirable that any
absolute bar should be placed in the way of mutual agree-
ments between landlord and Unlit.
Mr. B. ESCOTT feared that, if the bill was sent up
stairs, the house would hear no more of it this session.
Mr. HENLEY was certain that the bill required amend-
ment.
Sir W. JOLLIFFE said if the bill was to extend to all
parts of the country, in many places tenant rights would
be very much curtailed.
Mr. T'USEY said the tenant rights referred to were acts
of husbandry, and would not be affected by the bill.
The bat was then read a second time, and ordered to be
referred to a select committee.
BILL FOR REGISTERING BIRTHS, DEATHS, AND
MARRIAGES IN SCOTLAND. . . _

The LORD ADVOCATE moved fur leave to introduce
this bill. which be said was similar to the act in force in
England.
Mr. FORBES, without Wishing to oppose the introduc-
tion of the bill, regretted that it had not been brought
forward when a greater number of Scotch members were
present.
The bill wa. then read a first time.
MARRIAGES IN SCOTLAND.
The LORD ADVOCATE, in moving for leave to bring
in a bill to amend the law of Scotland affecting the constitu-
tion of marriages, said his boll would not affect the principle
of the law of Scotland, but he wished to prevent the vague,
indefinite, and, in some instance*, clandestine manner is
, which marriages were now effected.
Sir J. GRAHAM thought there should be some restraint
upon clandestine marriages in Scotland between parties not
living in the country, but merely poising over the border for
the purpose of marriage.
The LORD ADVOCATE thought it was a subject well
worth consideration, although it would be attended with
some difilcultics.
The bill was then read a first time.
The house adjourned at twenty-five minutes to ene o'clock

WRECK OF A FRENCH STEAM FRIGATE.—A Icttr
from the Tioe-admiral, Montagnies de la Rogue, &name .
that hie ateaza-frigate Le Cararbe, was wrecked on the 16.
ult., near the settlement of St. Louis.—Aventoi dee Debate

IN THREE OR YOUR DAYS,
WAGHOHN'S THIRD PAMPHLET on
STEAM to AUSTRALIA.Letter addressed to Earl Grey.
SnSib, Elder. and Co.