The Express.
London, England, 1848-07-26 00:00:00

THE EXPRESS, WEDNESDAY EVENING, JULY 26,. 1848.

Samuel Act evinced itself in parliament ; and after an in-
quire by &select committee, it was thought that thesevere and
unequal pressure of the burden on particular parishes should
be guarded against by enlarging the siva of the rating district,
the rate equally to all the union. Accord-
inandvb, to carry eat that object; and the
principle of that act, he proposed, should be continued, and
by
passed
that the irremovable poor should be a charge not
on the particular parish in which they might be, but upon
the union generally. It had also appeared to him impossi-
ble to leave the question of vagrancy on the footing on
which it now stood. Upon this subject icirculaz letter had
been gent ley the poor law board to the several boarde of
guardians, containing instructions which he trusted woulu
put a stop to the evil, it being his opinion that it was one
which could not be met by an act of parliament. He thought
the law against vagrancy was strong enough, or almost so,
now ; but there was wanting • different administration
of that law, above all a different administration with
regard to vagrants on the part of those who were charged
with administering the poor law. He believed that the
whole system of vagrancy which was now so intolerable an
evil and such a stigma upon the country was very much the
result of the injudicious administration of the law during
the last seven or eight years. He was perhaps wrong in
using the term injudicious administration, for probably no
other interpretation of the law could be given at the time
than that which was then pet upon it, and which had ever
since been acted upon. But the truth undoubtedly wee,
that the law with regard to vagrants had been adminhtered
with too much laxity; acd though they might not
be able to contend against the evil by any alte-
ration in the law, it might be diminished to
a very great extent by a wise and discriminating course
the administration of the law as it now existed. (Hear
hear.) The board had, in their letter of instructions, directed
the relieving officers to exercise some discretion in respect to
vagrants, and to refuse, on their own responsibility, relief in
all cues where they consider it ought not to be given ; and
be (Mr. C. Buller) had assured them that if they would ad-
, minister the law in that fair, discriminating, and honest
spirit, he would take his share of the responsibility of their
acts in the performance of that which he contended was their
duty, in contending against this frightlel and growing evil.
He would within a week lay before parliament his circular
letter, containing his plan of dealing with thin subject, toge-
ther with the various papers showing the extent to which
this evil prevailed. (Hear.) There was one question con-
nected with this subject of vagrancy which had been forced
on his attention by communications from all parts of the
country, showing that some alteration in the law was neces•
sary. He referred to the charge of supporting vagrants.
That charge wax now thrown entirely on the parish to which
they might apply for relief; and, in ninety-nine cases out of
one hundred, the application was made in that parish
where the workhouse was, or where the re-
lieving officer happened to reside. Frem parishes so cir-
cumstanced he had received numerous and loud complaints.
They said, and with justice, that it was no act of theirs that
the workhouse was erected, or that :the relieving officer re-
sided in their parish. The first was the act of the union
generally, and the second of the individual himself, who
chose that place for his residence which was most convenient
for him in the performance able duties. He need scarcely
detail the extraordinary expenses this state of the law en-
tailed on some parishes, or the more extraordinary shifts and
devices to which they sometimes resorted to throw the
burden on their neighbours. In one parish in the South of
England, which was much inconvenienced by the number
of vagrants that became chargeable upon it, in consequence
of the residence of the relieving officer being therein, the autl
Titles offered a boon, in the shape of a house rent free, to the
officer, if he would move to the other aide of the street, which
happened to be in the adjoining parish. Of course this was
a temptation too great for the officer to resist, and the Testa
was, that the parish in question succeeded in throwing the
whole burden of the vagrants upon its neighbour. (Hear,
hear.) But in dealing with the question, it was not merely
the matter of expense he bad considered—though that
was great anal unjust—but there was another great evil :
that was, that the whole administration of the law
' was in the hands of the boards of guardians, by whom all the
officers were appointed, and who regulated the mode by
which the relict should be given, These boards had no
direct interest in suppressing vagrancy, because the charge
did not fall on the union generally, while the pariah upon
which the whole burden fell bad no power to appoint the
officers by whom the relief was to be distributed. And in
many instances in the north of England the attempts on the
part of those parishes which bore the burden to suppress
vagrancy had been rendered abortive by the adverse votes
of those guardians who represented parishes which were en-
tirely free from it. (Hear.) For these reasons it was, in his
opinion, absolutely necessuf that the charge on account of
vagrancy should be made a union charge. (Hear, hear.)
lie thought also that the establishment charges should he
spread equally over the union. At present the establish-
ment charges were made on each parish on the average of
the expenditure for the three years previous to tho pesoing
of the poor law. When the workhouses were first erected,
and the officers appointed, it was hut fair that each parish
should contribute according to the amount of pauperism it
brought to the union, but the same cause for this
apportionment no longer existed, and the charge for
irremovables and vagrancy now could not, in justice,
he charged upon each parish in proportion to its former
pauperism. The result of this system was that where a
parish, from its faults or misfortunes, had been subject to
heavy charges, the great proportion of the burden WAX placed
on it, while the lightly burdened parish was lift compara-
tively free. Many complaints had been made in this respect
of Mr. Bodkin's bill, and Mr. Rawly, an inspector of poor
laws, had addressed a letter to the poor law board, pointing
out the injustice with which, is numerous instances, this
nysfem of charging operated. He proposed by the present
hill to make the principle of Mr. Bodkin's act pi eminent—
that the charge of vagrancy should be thrown permanently
on the union fund, and that the coat of supporting irremov-
ables and vagrants should be thrown fairly and equally on
the whole rateable property of the union. (Hear, hear.)
The change be then proposed as to vagrants and irre-
movable' would establish for the first time en uniform
union rate. It would be mist inconvenient, as it appeared
to hiss, to have two union rates founded on d,fferent princi-
plee—one on that of a uniform and equal rating of the whole
property in the union, the other on that of the old averages.
And though, at the commencement of the operation of the
present poor law 15 years ago, it would have been impossible
to establish unions, except on the principle of each parish
contributing its fair proportion, according to its previous
overage expenditure, it was not so now, after they had been
established from 10 to 15 years when the whole administra-
tion of the law had been taken out of the hands of the
parishes, and placed in those of the union officers. They
could no longer then hold any particular parish responsible for
the whole of the burden it brought to the union. Let them
inquire what those establishment charges were, and whether
they were such as ought to he thrown on the parish, accord-
ing to their proportion of pauperism. They were comprised
under two heads : first, the expense of building and main-
taining the workhouses; secondly, the salaries of officers.
The charge for builiing the workhouses was in most
cases already incurred, and when any part of the
outlay had yet to be made, he had provided for it in the bill,
by requiring that each pariah should continue to pay its
share of any debt due on account of building the workhouse.
Then the establishment charges were reduced to but little
more than the salaries of the officers. It could not lie said
that the services of these officers were required in proportion
to the pauperism of the several parishes. The duty of the
clerk and other union officers was required equally for the
whole of the union, and with regard to the medical officers,
the medical relief under the Poor law could no longer be con-
sidered as a mere poor law charge, but had become a system
of medics.) relief extending to the working classes of each
parish. He feared that those classes generally now were ac-
customed to look to the medical relief under the poor law as
iutended for them. They could not look, then, to the duties
of the union officers as pertaining more to one parish in the
union than another, and the charge for this part of the esta-
blishment should consequently. he borne by the union gene-
rally. It was known how anxiously the guardians looked to
the reduction of the establishment charges, in order to reduce
the average expenditure ; but unfortunately such reductions
are not always effected by legitimate means. Last year they
had heard much of an chute which prevailed in some pars
3i Englar.d, and which, if allowed to continue, would
bring the whole system of the present mode of ad-
ministering relief to the poor about their ears—he
refernal to the practice of clearing parishes. In some
instances, when the property in the parish was
almost wholly in the hands of one proprietor, it had been
attempted to lessen the expense of maintaining the poor, not
by giving them employment, but by allowing all the small
cottages to tall down, and in some cases be was son y to say
pulling them down, and thus throwing the burden of their
poor on parishes the property of which was more sub
divided. This practice was occasioning numerous complaints
of the whole system of levying the funds for the relief of the
poor, and was turning the public mind to demand changes so
large and so extensive as would materially interfere with the
effective administration of the law and peril the general wel-
fare of the country. (Hear, hear.) This was an abuse which
in his view ought to induce the house to abolish the average
system. (Hear.) In some parishes also the practice was
resorted to of reducing the amount of the poor rate by plac-
, ing a part of the poor on the highway rate, thus making the
highway rate the means of parochial jobbing. (Hear, hear.)
Another mode wax for two or three inhabitants to raise a
rate amongst themselves in parishes where there were but
few paupers, thus keeping their poor out of the workhouse,
and, though paying as much for their support, avoid-
ing their share of the average establishment charges.
These were the ground, on which he proposed to make the
third change. Ile further proposed to raiss the union fund
chtirely by a union rate, proportioned to the property of the
whole union. Tho parochial assesrment act had proved
wholly ineffectual for the protection of some parishes, one
pariah being valued at a rack rent, and another at not half
the amount. Upon inquiry, through the inspectors, he
found that in England theirs were only four counties, Buck-
higham, Shropshire, Suffolk, and Westmoreland, where
there was a satisfactoty county rate, or in which it had not
been charged or modified. Indeed, of only ono of there
wax he certain, namely, the unhappy and heniehted county
of Suffolk ; and even here his noble friend near him (Lord
Ebrington) suggested that the straw was beginning to
move ; so that throughout the country g nuttily the county
magistrates had been fore( d ton re-adjustment of the county-
rate, 'principally by bearing the expense* of lunatic neylums
end gaols thrown upon them. lie saw, therefore, that the
county rate would not be a satisfactory Nixie ; and
he moped by this bill, that the union charg s
should be based upon the valuation of each parish for the
county or benne) rate. He begged to remark that the Gth
clause, to which he anticipated objection would be made,
was only declaratory, and intended to put an end to Rome
mischievous doubts respecting the Poor ltemovel Act and
Irish vagrancy. If it were the opinion of the house, he had
no objection to defer legislating. on that subject, hut as it was
not at all necessarily involved in the principle of the bill, he
hoped hon. gentlemen would discuss the ball without refer-
ence to it. But besides esme object:one to the (kWh he

had reason to think some opposition would be given to the
principle of the bill, although from other quieten he
expected it would gain him much support. It was said that
they amid not topsider this bill without substituting union
for parochial rating; and however humiliating might appear
r
the confession to many sincere reformes, be must say that
he was not yet a convert to the doctrine ed substituting
union for the old system of parochial chargeability for the
poor. It appeared to him of the greatest moment to make
the pr of every part of England • matter of interest, pecu-
niarilyooas well a.s in feeling, to those who by property or
vicinity had any influence over their condition—(hear); and
he should be loth to assist in any change which would
at once deprive the proprietors and occupiers of
estates in parodies of that direct interest which they now
had in upholding the condition of the working classes. The law
of settlement lie regarded as a great hardship, and he hoped
parliament would soon relieve the poor man from it. lie be-
lieve.' that a great interference might be made in that law
without any change in the general principle ; that the charge
of the resident poor should be thrown upon the particular
parishes in which they had resided all their lives. But while
he upheld the principle of parochial rating, he could not con-
tend against the growing feeling which was animating not
only the ratepayers of towns, but even members act that house
and gentlemen throughout the country most inky sted by
property in maintaining the present system, who wished
to extend the area of chargeability he felt he could not
struggle against that wish, unless he were prepared to put
' the law of parochial liability upon a just and satisfactory
footing. There was so much of cruelty and injustice in the
present system, that he was sure they would not be able to
uphold the principle of parochial chargeability as the basis of
the poor law, unless they modified it so as to meet the claims
of justice, feeling, and 'policy. After taking great pains to
ascertain the feeling of the country in reference to the ad-
ministration of the poor law, he found prevailing
a very general opinion that there ought to be a
greet change made in the area of rating, to the extent even
of what appeared to him a most dangerous and impracticable
scheme—namely, of a national rate. (Hear, hear.) He
called it impracticable because it could not be carried
into effect without opening the door to the widest abuses.
Either the beards of guardians throughout the country
should be able to dip their hands into the public purse, and
incur expense without the slightest regard to the conse-
quences ; or, on the other band, all local contracts must be
done away with--(hear, hear)—and the national rate bo
placed, whore only such a rate .tight to be, under the hands
of a national administration. (Rear, hear.) Now for these
evils he did not believe that • practical remedy could in the
nature of Wags be found. These were the grounds on
which he proposed a modified system of union rating. Ile
did not abandon psrocbial chargeability ; but if they wished
to uphold it they must discriminate between those parts of the
charge which would entirely fall upon the parishes and
those which were to be diffused over the area ot the union.
He proposed simply, in order to keep up the parochial
charge, that the parishes should at once cheer-
folly submit to its being extended to the whole usion.
Another part ofthe bill made extraparochial places charge.
able for the support of their poor. They were generally
very small, and contributed little to pauperism; and it was
therefore only just to make them chargeable with their own
' poor. All he proposed, as a general principle, was, that the
poor-law commissioners might call for the appointment of
overseers to levy a rate in those extraparochial places. The
right hon. gentleman concluding by moving the second seal-
ing of the bill.
Mr. HENLEY thanked the right hon. gentleman for the
clear and lucid manner in which he had treated so complex
and difficult a subject. But he did not thine the right hon.
gentleman was consistent even to his own principles. lie
(Mr. Henley) contended that this measure would break
down altogether the parochial system, upon which large pur-
chases of property and long leases had been made—(hear,
hear) and that once done, he never heard any argument,
and knew of none, which could prove it possible
to stop there, and not go at once to what the
right honourable gentleman so much deprecated—
a national rate. In the committee in which be sat with the
right hon. gentleman every reason given for extending the
area applied with equal force to its being univ. real. The
right hon. gentleman was of opinion there should be a wide
area, but lie had offered no argument whatever to show why
one description of charges should be made on a wide area
and the others left to a small area. He saw no reason why
they should make an invasion of settled rights in one in-
stance, and omit doing so in another. With regard to vagrancy,
the right hon. gentleman, in his opening statement stated
that the law against vagrancy was sufficiently atringentS,but
required a different administration. From tho year 1839 to
1842 there were increasing complaints in large towns about
the number of vagrant peon Those poor persons were
taken to the police-office, and then public attention was
directed to the circumstance. Various measures were
adopted by the poor law commissioners, who endeavouren
to guard against the evil. Various orders were issued, under
which relieving officers and workhouse muters considered
themselves bound to give relief to almost every person who
could be considered destitute. The consequence was that
they took possession of the vagrant wards in tho work-
houses, and went on day by day horsing contributions. Un-
fortunately the relief in these cases was given at the cost of
the poorer class of ratepayers. In many cases these persons
went among the poorer classes, who were always accessible
to charity, and thus succeeded very often in levying a sort of
black mail upon the poorer and inure industrious class of the
community. Ile did not know how the right hon. gentle-
man intended to check this evil, but he hoped that he would
turn hie serious attention to it. Many persons were of opi-
nion that it should be altogether apart from the poor-law;
that it was a mere police question; and that a police reguis.
lion should be made to meet the evil. (Hear.) Thereby
there would be a greater means of detecting imposition, and
preventing the money of the ratepayers from being impro-
perly applied. lie saw no justice in confining relief in
cases o' vagrancy to a limited area of taxation. They
punished crone and placed the expenditure on the country,
and why not pursue the same course in this instance?
The new system got rid of one safeguard. as it took from the
hands of the parish the control of the expenditure under the
poor law of 1831, and now when cases of vagrancy arose they
were disposed of by the union officer, who of course did not
care to what expense he put the parish to relieve that va-
grancy. Did they imagine that if the charge was thrown
over the whole union there would be that careful vigilance
which previously existed ? If this system were ,adopted no
person would have an interest in checking the evil.
Mr. C. BULLEB.—The union will have an interest in
checking it.
Mr. HEN LEY.—Yes; but the charge would be so diluted.
so spread over the whole union, that it would be lost by the
extent of surface. Would the board of guardians establish a
staff of officers to detect vagrancy ? No ; they would only
treat it as a matter of pounds shillings and pence, and
would not use due vigilance to protect the interests of the
public. Ile believed that the people would call for a national
rate if the house passed the bill. They were new going to
shift the charge, and were going to throw a rate upon
extraparochial property. If they were to do this, upon what
rinciple of justice could they refuse to charge mine.,
landed property, and money in the funds? The right hon.
gentleman did not attempt to show upon what valid ground
he was going to shift these charges. The right hon. gentle-
man spoke as if they were going to make tl•is alteration for
the first time. Take the case of a labourer in the south of
England, with 4 or S children and 10s. a week to live upon ;
that would give them Is. Bd. per weer per head to live Orion,
but if that man was obliged to go into the workhouse his
family would cost the union 3s. per head. With respect to
rating, the right hon. gentleman admitted in argument that
it would be very inconvenient if they were to subject the
union to acre rating, and that for this reason he had made
the alteration. The system of an equal rating in a whole
county was almost an impossibility, and, therefore, the
county rate could not he taken as a fair basis. if minute in-
quiry was instituted they would find that throughout vari-
ous counties the rating was very unequal. The right hon.
gentleman should have told the -house how many unions ran
into two counties. It happened in his own county that several
unions ran into two counties. The right hon. gentleman
made some strong -statements as to the clearance system,
but he did not believe that it existed to so great an extent
as he (Mr. Buller) would lead the house to imagine. The
truth was that cottages had not been built to meet the gra-
dual increase of the population. With regard to public and
private rates, stone misunderstanding might mast if the
sweeping condemnation of the right hon. gentleman was not
alluded to. He believed that a great deal of misery was
relieved by the means which the right hon. st. ntleman so un-
scrupulously condemned. Take the case of a man and his
wife and three or four children, what relief could they pes-
sibly get gleam physical causes he was unable to work in
the fields and could not get work on the roads ? It was far
better that a man should get employment on the roads for
Gs. or 71. per week than live on a pittance of 2s. or 3a.
a week doled out by a relieving officer. It was a question
certain', whether the labourer gave the worth of his week's
wages, hut it was better to give him Is. for doing half-a-
crown's worth of work than give him 3s. for doing nothing.
He regretted that a principle so important as that involved
in this bill should be introduced on so small a basis. It was
better to meet the evil full in the face than to endeavour to
remedy it by small and inefficacious measures. Hebelieved that
if the house were to proceed in this way they would over-
turn the present system altogether, and cause the establish-
ment at a national rate. He could not heln thinking that
this measure would inflict a burden on the agricultural dis-
tricts which was previously thrown on towns. It was not
just further to oppress a class which was already too heavily
burdened. Not only were the agricultural parishes deprived
by this bill of the advantages which they had enjoyed, but
additional charges were thrown on them for a staff from
which they derived no assistance. In his opinion it would
lead to a breaking down of the entire narochial system. He
moved that the bill be read a second time tbis day three
months.
Mr. RICE consileredthat thSe parochialnysct of tem had alread
He
been broken down by the Settlement A 1811.
moved that the debate should now be adjourned till 'Thurs-
day morning.
After a few words from Mr. CHRISTOPHER the motion
was agreed to, end the house adjourned at a few minutes
alter three until five o'clock.
The house resumed at 5 o'clock.
MARRIAGE ACT.
Sir R. 11. INGI.IS asked if ;he right hon. member for
llutc intended to press dur;ng the present session the
measure of which he had given notice upon this subject.
Mr. J. S. WORTLEY said he was very anxious to call
attention to the present lamentable state of the law upon this
subject—(hear, hear):—but in consequence of the report of
the committee havingsbeeu only very recently circulated, and
there being several notices on the paper on the subject, he
should not bring forward the question to-morrow. He should
do so, however, in the course of the ensuing week, unless,
indeed, her Majesty's government would take up the
subject.
tit G. GREY said ha should be very sorry to do soothing
which would Like this. important matter out of the 'hands
9i the right hon. geutleman, than whom 119 one was hater

capable of dealing with it. He thought the report to which
the right boo. gentleman had directed attention was a most
important one, and certainly if a bill founded on it were in
troduced, he-fer one should be most anxious, even at that
tete period orthe session, to give its principle his support.
DENMARK AND PRUSSIA.
Mr. B. DISRAELI wished to put a question to the noble
lord, the Secretary, for Foreign Affairs, relative to the con-
' dation of the negotiations for an armistice between the powers
of Denmark and Germany. It was generally known that
the King of Denmark had been induced to sign that armis-
tice with great reluctance. Its terms were not too favoura-
ble to his kingdom, end his signature was very dissatisfactory
to his subjects. But he was anxious to consult the feeling
which he knew to prevail in this country, and to terminate a
conflict so disastrous to commerce. The armistice having
been accordingly si,ned, it was sent to Berlin, where it was
signed and ratified by the King of Prussia. The house, how-
ever, would be surprised to hear, that even after the armistice
had t,een thus ratltied and subscrihed,theK ing of Denmark had
it thrown in his face, and Europe was again threatened with
a renewal of the war. Under this state of things he was in-
duced to ask if any communication had been received by her
Majesty's government on the subject of this unprecedented
occurrence in our diplomatic relations—if they had received
any explanation of the circums.ances—if it was a fact that the
King of Prussia kat informed the Court of St. James's that
under the new constitution promulgated in Germany, and
which the King himself did not appear to understand, he had
no authority to sign and ratify the armistice tin question.
and if he intended, is con,iquence, to terminate any
diplomatic negaciations between his crown and our court. He
was sure tee noble lord would reply to these questions with
all the speciality their importance demanded, and he should
be glad it he was able to hold out any promise of the pro.
bability of terminating the controversy between Denmark
and Germany.
Viscount PALMERSTON said ho had much pleasure in
giving such explanations as it was in his power to afford re-
garding this interesting and important matter, and he hoped
the answer he had to make would be more encouraging to
the house and the country than the speech of the bon.gentle-
man might have led then, to anticipate. The great difficulty in
this case had sprung from the circumstance of there being so
many different parties to consult. The state of the matter was
this: Her Majesty's government proposed to Denmark and
Prussia articles of an armistice which contained the basic of
a future and permanent settlement of their dispute. As this
appeared to involve questions which might lead to dircua
mon, the Prussian government sent to Schleswig an officer
who in consultation with the representatives of Denmark and
Sweden arranged articles for an armistice which did not con-
clude the basis so proposed. Those articles ware agreed to,
though they were not, as the hon. gentleman supposed, ab-
solutely signed. They were then sent to Berlin. At Be:lin
some details were objected to, and some qualifications intro-
duced. The armistice so amended was sent to Denmark and
accepted. Undoubtedly it might have been supposed that it
would have then been signed. But when orders were sent to
the Prussian general in Schleswig on the subject, that
officer stated difficulties in regard to the position in which he
considered himself placed in reference to his own govern-
ment and the confederation, whose organ resided at Frank-
foi t. From communications, however, which he (Lori
Palmerston) had received from Berlin, he hoped that these
difficulties, which were difficulties of form rather than of sub-
stance, would be surmounted, and he still felt confident
hopes that the armistice would be signed and concluded.
The house, however, would understand that the main ques-
tion in this case still remained to be settled. That question
her Majesty's government would continue their good offices
to urge, and he did hope that it would be brought to a speedy
withoutsettlement by the xercise of the spirit of mutual conciliation,
without which note
tUement could, he was sure, be satisfac-

;;;i1; effected.
RUSSIA AND TURKEY.
Mr. URQUHART asked for some information respecting
the events its the Danubian provinces, and inquired in what
character the Russian troops had marched into that terri-
tory? lie also wished to ask whether any information had
been received of a treaty of commerce having been entered
into between Russia and Turkey!
Viscount PALMERSTON said, with regard to the finst
question her Majesty's government had received information
of a revolution in Wallachia, but had not received any Intel-
' ligence of the invasion of that province either by a Russian
or a Turkish force. He should conceive, however, that if a
Russian or Turkish force should enter the principalities they
would not eater with a view to collision, but upon an under.
standing between the sovereign power and the protecting
power under the treaty of Adrianople. With regard to the
twitter of the treaty, he had no information of any negotiation
for a new treaty between Russia and Turkey.
VICE-ADMIRALTY COURTS.
Capt. PECIIELL asked what steps hail been taken to put
an end to the abuses in the Vice•Admirelty Courts of our
colonies?
Mr. WARD said the subject had been considered, and
with the able assistance of Dr. Lushiogton the government
lead arrived at a very clear conception of the evil, without,
however, arriving at a conclusion as to the remedy. The
costs of there courts consisted of fees and expenses. The
(-is were very moderate, but there was a discretionary
power in the court to make other charges, about the legality
of which, however, there was considerable question. The
only remedy they could devise would be to allow the bills of
these courts to be taxed by the Admiralty Court at home.
The matter was under consideration.
OVER-CROWDI NO OF STEAM-BOATS.

In rePIY to Mr. C. LUSK INOTON,
Mr. LABOUCHERE said his attention had been directed
to this subject. By the Steam Navigation Act owners of
steam-boats were obliged to present to the Board of Trade
once in six months a certificate of the era-worthiness of their
vessels, but unfortunately the act did not enforce a penalty
upon the owners of river steam-boats. From information
which had reached him he believed, however, that it would
be necessary to legislate further upon this subject, and he
had accordingly given directions that a bill should be drawn,
giving power to the Board of Trade to enforce the provision
of the Steam Navigation Act to which he referred, and also
Ovine power to the same board to limit in certain cases the
number of passengers on board steam-vends.
TILE CHOLERA.
Mr. WYLD asked whether any measures had been taken
to subject to quarantine vessels cornier from certain ports ?
Mr. LABOUCHERE regretted his noble friend (Lord
Morpeth) was not in his place to reply to the question. He
had been enraged in endeavouring to provide, as far as
human means could do so, ageing the scourge of cholera
being brought to our shorex.
DUTCH SUGARS.
Lord G. BENTINCK asked whether any correspondence
would be laid on the table on the subject of Dutch sugars ?
Viscount I'ALMEItSTON said the correspondence re-
ferred to between her Majesty's government and the govern-
ment of Holland was still going on.
Lord G. BENTINCK asked if there had been any corre-
spondence on this subject during the last three months?
Viscount PALtdERSTON.—No ; not within the lastthree
months.
CASE OF SIR JOHN CLARIDGE.
Mr. GLADSTONE they moved " An address to her Ma-
josty, setting forth, that by an order in council, which his
late Majesty was pleased to approve on the Ifith day of De-
cember, 1831, Sir John Thomas Claridge, then recorder of
Prince of Wales's Island, was removed from the said office
on account of an ' irritation between the local government
and himself,' which, in the opinion of the lords of the com-
mittee of council, acting judicially in the case, princi-
pally to be attributed' to the conduct of the said local
government and of the home authorities; also setting forth,
that it further appeared to their lordships in their investi-
gation of the case,' that no imputation rested on the capacity
or integrity of Sir J. T. Claridge in the exercise of his judi-
cial functions, so as to preclude his Majesty frnm employing
him in his service In some other judicial situation:' and
praying that her Majesty, graciously taking into considera-
tion the expectations which the terms of the said order in
council were calculated to create, may be pleased to direct
that Sir J. T. Claridge may receive an tomeintment in her
Majesty's service, of such u class as to her Majesty shall seem
meet." The right hon. member said that he rested his
ease entirely on this document, and would not enter into the
charges on which Sir J. Claridge had been tried. He con-
tended that the words of the order in council were such as
to lead Sir J. Claridge to expect employment from the crown
in some other judicial capacity, and the object of his motion
Was for the house to interfere to assist the crown in carrying
out its expressed intention.
Sir J. C. HOBHOUSE observed that he bad had nothing
to do with Sir J. Claridge's appointment or removal, and
was in no way responsible for any part of the transaction,
except so far as that he had not thought fit to recommend
him for an Indian judgeship. But supposing that the case
did involve so great a hardship me the right hon. gentleman
tcpreseuted, how was it that durin., the five years he had
himself been connected with the government, it had never
pressed itself on his attention ? The proviso in the order in
councii on which the right hon. gentlemen depended was
extra-judicial—but it contained no promise er recommenda-
tion, it merely said that there was nothing in Sir J. Claridge's
conduct which should prevent his being employed in some
i other judicial station. It did not enjoin his employment on
Ithe minister, sod it would be odd if it did. (Oh.) Hav-
ing looked over the papers, he could say also that there was
uething in them to impugn the conduct or ability of Sir J.
Claridge. Ile would follow the example of the right hon.
gentleman by not entering into the causes which led to Sir J.
Claridge's removal, as he was not desirous of saying anything
which might appear to bear hard upon that gentleman and
be painful to his feelings. All he would say was, that he bad
rather not recommend him for an Indian judgeship. The
case had been brought before Lord Cilenelg, Lord
Ellenborough, Lord Fitzgerald, Lord Ripon, and htmself, as
presidents of the Board of Control, and they had fonnd no
ground to interfere. Suppose the address agreed to, where
would be the advantage ? Such an ieterferenco he considered
moat unconstitutional ; and whatever might be the opinion
of the house as to the hard.hip of the cese, he hoped they
would not agree to this motion.
Sir F. THESIOER supported the motion, and contended
that there was precedent in favour of this motion, but there
v.as no precedent of a gosernment r.fusing or neglecting to
carry out the recommendation of the ;.rivy council.
Lord J, RUSSELL knew nothing of the case until
brought forward by the right hon. gentleman; but he must
express his dissewt from the unconstitutional doctrine that
the committee of the Pets y Council not only recommended Sir
J. Claridge to the favour of the crown, but gave a pledge
that he should be reappoint:A to as Indian judgeship or
atone other vacancy whenever it oxurred. lie had never
heard before of such a pledge having been given by the
Privy Council. But the right hon. gentl, man went fur:Moo,
and said it was to be carried into cti. et by an address to the'
House of Commons, calling upon the crown to rna.lu, good
that pledge. He was surprised to hear such au uneonstitu-
ti anal doctrine enunciated not only 'oy the righthon.gentletaan,
bat by the hon. and learned gentleman who speAte last, who
had himself nerved under the crown, and who nod no excuse
for so far mistaking the prerogative of the crown and the
functions of the House of Commons. But it appeared to
his that the judicial committee of the Pricy Council gm