The Express.
London, England, 1849-07-13 00:00:00

all its details. (Hear, hear.) In making thump few observa-
tions, he had no wish to t►row ivy impediment in tte way
of the right hon. gentleman. On the contrary, he heartily
wishadhiin sums; in the attainment of the very diffizult

LIGHT-HOU SE D ITE S.—MARINEPILOTAHE.—COM-
MERCIAL .
The bow* bevies gone into committee on the Merchm.
Seamen and Pilots Bill,
Mr. LABOUCHERII said he proposed, in redemption of
an engagement made by him in the early pert of this seldom,
to call the attention of the committee to various subjects eon-
netted with the mercantile marine of this country. In
proposing to the committee measures for the improvement
of our merchant service, and for the relief of our cemmercial
marine, he could not, consistently with the arguments he
had used in support of the repeal of the navigation laws,
put forward these measures as any sort of compensa-
tion for *juries inflict. d on the merchant service by
such repeal. Had be considered that the merchant ser-
vice would be injured by that alteration, nothing would
have induced to make or to support the proposition—(hear,
ltear)—but his opinions were wholly the other way,
ands no
Injury having been occasioned by the repeal of the vga-
tion laws, but the enntrery, he had no compensation to prn-
poss. (Hear, hear.) At the same time there was no doubt
that the attention of the merchant service would now be di-
rected with more clearance of perception to the grievances
which they had felt and complained of, more or Int, in the
days of what they deemed protection; and this was an addi-
time mum why the parliament should lose no time in
coseleediale Am grievances. He did not propose, on the
rem& easseles, to make a complete review of all the gate.
liens eilieling oar merchant service. There were, however,
several paints of vast importance to which Inked specially at
plied hie alleation, with &view to the proposition, in tenting,
of what r trotted would be accepted as measures of Immo-
', dine gelid to the merchant service, and, in a third latrines,
glellnment of a subject, on which, though at ouch an
aninsene period of the session he could not hope to
peepers any measure which could be sufficient`y con-
Mend to pass into law this year, a penitent might
hid before the house in the shape of a bill, which
eider the leisure of the recess might rev ire the
MOM eonsideration of all parties more immediately
leiggested and of the public at large. The first question to
wad* be would solicit the attention of the calamine*, IMO
a• maim of the light dues, a burden, in their pewter t Amp,
MS, gemeantile marine of this country, wh'c% had big
les Ile mitdeat of just complaint, as well by mesa
lit re by reason of its unequal
telballem. and kg ender ewes connected with
Ihe velem urn which it was feuded. (H case, hear ) In
gangenninedes the sea-lights were maintainei at the public
=Bl:eat et the public treason—(hear. hear)—but in
14doisi a different system bad prevailed Here the
fights were maintained by toll, levied upon shipping, under
the management, not as elsewhere, of a general b aid, re-
'Foible to the government and to the !runny, but of
indent corporation', which. in England, Scathe I, and Ire-
land nereised separate jurisdictions, under the general con-
trol of a most impelled and inconvenient kind of pevy
council. He had en former mediae. expressed the opinion
that there was very much in the system w- ieh r q lea
amendment; that though it might be 1111001.0.141 to deal
with the question es if it were a mere tab's& rasa, and not
an existing institution, yet that it was the duty of the ga
Irtillilellt and of parliament, at the earliest possible moment,
to apply themselves to improve the system, and to render it
more in harmony with the wants of the per.oi and with the
'Avowed pri eiples of administration now acknowledged in
this country. (Hear, hear.) He had embodi d these views
ha a bill which last %mien he laid Were the house.
The prinriple of that measure was to place the management
of the lights more efficaciously under governtend control,
and to commute the present payment of a tell by each par-
ticular verse' for a tanners duty upon our shipping at large.
To this priniple he still arlh•red, and hod he c whined it
desinble, at this period of the sr saint, to lay on the table of
the house a bill to regulate the general management of light
dues, it would he founded noon that pried I improved as
to details by rev eel emendates% which had sine. presented
themselves to hi• mind ; but as he felt that it would Ise Im-
possible for the house to legislate satilfseVaily neon as her
and oomplieared a -ulsj et in the brief spec • which now re.
maned sf the vs-ion, he abstained hem brineine forward
the bill this veer. (Hen.) Without going into minute
detail, he wriuti state generally that the great ppriuti of the
burden now imposed upon the merchant semi se of this coun-
try by tolls aeon from a debt contract d ruse vp.,Ts aim by
the 'Dishy House, in buying up certain Oyes light. (the
money for which was rather more than a million
Vie urgent soli itation of the !enchant set-
aviieved by the tolls which the private
those li Jilts had exacted, the Trinity
- oa themselves the future nesipt

-------------
---------------------and intent of the tolls. The Trinity House of the crimps. A bill had, however, been brought in lest
had from that time yet only paid interest upon the money year, by which some restrictions a ere placed epee these
teiesd for the purchase of the se tolls, but bad, from time to crimes, be rendering it necessary for them to procure licenses
• , by instalments farmed the eaeitge debt, so that, at the from the Board of Trade. He was not prepared to say that
toegem"• • runt, lb. Trinity House only owed rather mere consielerable prod had not be. n effected by tbis reguletion ;
than 600,0001. on this account. (Hear, hear.) There was bet still it fell very far short of the degree of protection
en a gement still subsisting with the Bank of Ragland, neecuary for the tailor ; and he felt bound to declare that
by which the Trinity Ileum was bound to pay oft Is re- be leteslature was called upon also to have this businets
mainder debt at the rate of 60,00G1. per annum. It wa ub- transacted In • different woy to what it now was. There
vious that any material redeciun of the eght tolls now wes 'nether subject on which he must say a few words,
hued on the seepplog of thi, country could only be effected nattily, on the sanitery condition of the sailor when
byuns:reading the repayment of 'hie debt over a greeter on board his ship. No one who hail read the report
• of years—(bear, bear)—red in hie 'vireos the mer- which had b. en printed on this subject, but would admit the
shame service was fully entileed to relief ghee by such 1111 just and general dissatisfaction which existed on this score,
suaarement. The premee.t lama receipts from the tolls for and also the ne well. fur loin ' • something to render the
lighting the English create—there were not the same tom- sailor less liable to imbibe the seeds of disease than
Sainte in relation te. the Snatch and Irish lights—the total he now was. At present there was no d. pertinent
Woes receipts or. the English lighthouses was in 1847 of the government responsible for the coaditcn of
318,0001. in mend numbers, being from coasters 145.000 e, the mercantile marine. The Admiralty and the Board of
and from over-sea tea :era 173,000'. The Trinity House Tribe bad a sort of divided authority in the matter, but
proposed to reduce this burden of 318,0001. by no lees a sum neither of those boards possessed a supremacy. Ile there-
than 100,0001., or ate-third ef the amount. (Hear, hear.) tore proposed tit give the Board of Trade increased authority,
When he had come to consider the eemparative meaner in and as a matter of course increased responsibility, in all
which the rearm of light does fell upon the different matters relating to the mercheet seaman. He proposed to
climes of our commercial navy, he had found that the add a department to that board to be called the Mercantile
pressure weighed far more heavily upon the coasting than Marine, which should not be constituted a meliorate
upon the over-ilea trad -is. (Hear, ear.) The present beard, but only a branch department of the Board of
system was that every ship el ould pay for • light as she used Trade. He proposed that there should be two persons
it, an arrangement which, at first glance, seemed fair and attached to thot board who had been captains of merchant
equal enough, more especially if the receipts were applied vessels, as it was but fair that merchant-seamen should loth
I wholly and exclusively to the maintenance of the lights ; but fur advice and protection to men of their own clan. He
1 who n it was considered that a ',orlon of the revenue went to proposed that there should be issued by this department
' particular charities, the burden could s arcely be said to fall certificates of quelifieation divided into three classes, accord-
with only a fair end equal pressure upon the coasting treas. log to the size and tonnage of the ships. At pees int cert:ll-
- hear.) There was another important consideration cotes of qualification were 'fleeted after a voluntary
which had not been omitted in coming to a judgment on this examination had been undergone by those seamen who
part of the subject : the yoke of the cargo constituted car- applied for them, and whilst he admitted this had been pro- I
tend, not lees an element in fairly estimating the due ductive ot much good, he was briund to soy that at the out-
which should he paid than the tonnage of a slip ports a very lax system of granting certificates pr veiled.
(Hear, her.) Now the cerres of vessels engaged He mast also °heave that it W4ll not his intention to make
in the foreign trade were, generally speaking, far more this certificate system retrospective. That would be unjust to
valuable than the cargoes of colliers: or other coasting vesiele, the present race of masters and mates. All he bottle require
(Hear, hear.) All throe considerations had induced him to on their part, therefore, Was, that they present, d them-
believe that, having this sum to apply 09 the relief of our selves to the Bard of Trade and furnished pruo'e of their
merchant Levy, it was not just to give the larger share of the having commanded or officered • ship previous to the peeling
relief to our coasting trade. (Hear, bear.) Aecerdingly, of the set, and that they should be at once entitled to a on-
of the 100,0001. in question the government proposed to ap- tificate to that effect, which would qualify them to r ntinue
pie 70,0001. in reduction of the dues now paid by roues, in their present situations. But if a master or mate hold-
being a reduction of nearly 50 per cent. of their present bur lug • certithate of that class should n.ise.rluet himself, or
den—(hear, hear)— the relief, moreover, being immediate, show himself so be unfit to cowinue in his po.ition, he should
for it was proposed that the change should come into opera- then be deprived of his certificate, as well of command as of
tion en the Ist of October. (Hear, hear.) There was far. qualification. Such • regulation was indepecsable for the
they one particular class of Hebb in relation to which special safety of life and property on board merchant ships. He
relief would be effected for this service; upcn particular propoed, also, that in ours of gross miseondues
portions of the coast there were lights for which double tolls oa the part of the captain and OffiC'TO at Sea
were now paid ; that was to say, a chip not only paid the or elsewhere, of a vessel they should bee 'facto he
duty on peering these lights, but bad also to pay the due deemed te beets committed a misdemeanour, and that they
upon repassing it on her return to port. ;Hear, hear.) It should be liable to be tried for such offence before the 'A-
wes proposed in all these eases to ah dish the double toll alto- Mauls of their country. He proposed to substitute for the
gether, leaving ships to pay the single reduced duty only on present agents and crimps a set of men who should be termed
passing them on their voyage, and not on their return shipping office re, and who should be statiored at all the pores
to port—(hear, hear); this was a relict which would of the United Kingdom. He was not without a precedent
alike affect over-sea traders and c Jesters. The amount for this proposal, nami ly, the port of Q clue, where the
of reduction which over-sea traders would benefit by Canadian legislature had appointed such en efficer, wh
had
ose
would be in round numbers 27,0001. per annum. or about six- agency had been attended with the happiest results, and
' teen per cent. of their present burde.i. The prop sea rendered Quebec, from being the pest of shipowners and cap-
reduction, Le would add, could be carried into operation tains, ens of the best regulated ports for seamen in
without an set of
_parliament, it being competent in the the world. (Hear.) The shipping officers he proposed to
Trinity House to effect the change with the consent of the establish in the various ports of the United Kingdom we tile
Privy Council. (Hesse hear.) The system of pilot- be the instruments whereby the seaman's condeCon would
age in England was under the control of three jun dic- be improved, and be their means also he hoped to be able to
bone ; the Lord Warden of the Cinque Ports had the restore that discipline amongst the merchant ships whet was
control of the pilotage of the Cinque Ports ; some of so much wanted lie proposed that when a seaman was
the greatest of our sea-ports were under the con- bired tat ot tbese officers snould b 3 present to ermine and
trot of local and special jurisdictions, and all the approve orbs agreement ; and to explain it to the sailor in
rest of the kingdom, comprising the north Fore. the presence of his captain or some of the officers. The
land, and including a great portion of the slipping shipping agent would state to the seaman the length and
wining to Landon, was under the jurisdiction of the Thee, nature of the voyage be was about to embark on—tuel offer
House. In his communications with that corporation upon the scale of provisions—end regulate the atieulations as to
the subject of lights, he had felt it to be his duty to call their the fish[ and other matters of internal discipline on board
attention also to the subject of pilotage, end upon this gees. the p. Tee latter stipulation would be a velure
Mon, too, he had found them quite ready to meet the pit toy act between the captain and the seaman, and
demamds of the shipping interest and the views of the in well conducted ships this system had been found
t. (Hear, beer) Considerable improvements, to work well. The Board of Trade would, therefore rum-
Cv:nalliM entherefore in a position to say, would also be intro- late the teeters of flues and other punishments, and when
dead into this branch of the service. (Hesr.) What could nice the bailor had voluntarily given his assent to them the
be a more marked anomaly than this,which hap- agreement should be held binding.
pened now every day : • vessel ping from Liverpool Mr. GLADSTONE—Is the bargain as to diet, which the
to Dublin, and stopping there, was not obliged to take sailor makes between himself and the captain, to be volun-
• pilot on board on gating into Dublin harbour ; but a yes tart' or a fixed one ?
set going from Liverpool to Dublin, end thence to Brest or any Mr. LABOUCHERB—The dietary would be a fixed one
other foreign port, was compelled to take a pilot on board, in all cases and compulsory on the captain, es under the pre-
though her master or mate might be thoroughly competent sent system it was erten found that the poor sailors were half-
to pilot her. (Hear, hear.) He was most happy to inform starved. The dietary would be explained to the see-
the committee, that the Trinity Corporation had expressed man by the shipping officer when his agreement was signed
their readiness to allow any over sea trading vessel, brine A. I, g. hook, teamed according to a model which would
on board • master or mate, of whose fitness to pilot be furnished by the Board of Trade, would be required to be
the vessel they were satisfied, to dispense with • Trinity rigidly kept by the captain of every merchant vessel, where-
pilot. (Hem, hear.) To effect this object it would by a check would be maintained over him, and the state of
be souse ary to pass a bill throueh parliament—a bill discipline of his crew would be clearly observable, anti there-
of a permissive, and not of a compulsory nature, ensblieg by a protection to the seaman against brutality or ill treat-
the Trinity House or any, other pilotage juriedic:ien, aunt provided. Ile was so much impressed with the absolute
to dispense, in such cases, with the services of a pilot on
beard over-sea tra 'ers. There was anotherof necessity of strengthening the discipline of the merchant
euellien is, rain., that he proposed to give to captains having first-
the highest importance and of the greatest difficulty, to , airs certificates, and commencing alevessels of • certain
amount of tonnage, the power, for specific offences, of a
which, though he did not propose to ask the judgment of the
limited period of imprisonment on board ship, although he
house upon it this year, the limited space now remaining of
the session rendering it wholly impossible adequately to con- admitted that it was a power against the abuse of which they
must carefully guard. (Rear, hear.) But again, with regardsider the subject, he should request the attention of parka- mot
the exercise of that rower, the log.book would act as a
meat by embodying the views which he entertained respect-
ing it, in a bill which he seould lay on the table of the house, very material cheek. Any one acquainted with the practice
that it might be considered during the recess with that eare of the American merchant navy would be aware that there
which its importance and difficulty demanded ; he referred to was a much more stringent discipline exercised there than
the g I condition of our mercantile marine—(bar, bear) anything now proposed would amount to. In that navy
corioral punishment was very frequently had recourse to,
—he desired to seek the consideration by the house of this
and publicuptai
ne oinpintihoen e
linercits
ofU United
peSta.Ce: suHreporrtreod.
subject, with regard to the character and quay tica'iona of the
masters and mates, the discipline of the crews, and the gene- the
also, that when a ship should return to port
ral well.beieg and condition of the seamen. There had been
ineldentri discuesioas on this subject in the course of the her crew should be paid off, not on board ship, as was,
debates on the navigation laws; and he could now only re- now the ease ; but In the prunes of the shipping I fficer be-
fore referred to—that the shipping officer ebould then put what be had them rated, that while rothing was further
in-
from his intention than to cast any sweeping and indisere effect the log book—that be should hear anything the crew
laminate censure on the officers of our mercantile marine, yet, had to say in the way of complaint—that with regard to dis-
on the other hand, truth and a sense of e'uty obliged him to pastes between the captain and a tailor, he should have a
state to the house his opinion—an opinion founded on summary power of jurisdiction under the amount of 40e,
inquiries of no limited or superficial description—bet and that above that amount, if both parties sue. d to refer it
there wadi much in the present state of qualification of to him, he should also have jurisdiction, otherwi-e the case
the officers of our mercantile marine, mach in the conditien I to be dealt with in the label way. He attached groat im-
of discipline of their crews, much in the general condition portatee to this part of the subject; because, by establishing
of the mere haat seamen, which required urines consideration. a tribunal of this nature, they would save the sailor from
lie believed that England had the best and hardiest race of the clutches of low 'monies, they would prevent much
seamen that was to be found amongst nations. He had no squabbling and discontent, gad he believed that in the
doubt that by judicious treatment that race of seamen might main substantial justice would be done. (Hear.) With re-
again be restored to the pre-eminent !widen they had ward ti the 'snits"). condition of the ships, lee should pro-
formerly held. There were one or two statements made by pose that a space of not lees than eight square feet should he
eminent shipowners before the Leeds' committee, which, appropriated to each seamen in that part of the vend where
coming from uabiassed quarters, might be safely relied were the crew were located. There was also another matter
as a corroboration sr these eonsula accounts of the Batiste in which he believed the new functions of the Board of
mercantile seamen. Mr. Money Wigram, who was ewe Trade might be exercised with advantage—be meant with
mined before the Leeds' committee, said : regard to the registering of ...amen. Hole lieved that the pre-
Are your captains in general as well e hicated and as trustworthy sent system of registering had toe great degree disappointed
10111 as the American capt ans!—Yee. 1 believe they are ; bat I dohadproposed it. That
not mean to apply that to the European tract. generally; the rebut, the capectamons of Mote who system
of the comma on the continent are too authentic to leave a doubt 011 of tickets had been ford on the one hand very grievous to
that point. Rave TOW seen the repine from the consuls !—I have not the sailor, and on the other hand very ineffectual to rrevent
read them attentively, but I knew their general character, and I em the mat extensive frauds. He believed now that one could
afraid that ere too correct- I dare not challenge their neepurum buy in Wapping forged registry tickets as many
as reepects tbc contineetal trade. (Mr. Wlgram's ships are
EMI,
entterd to the Fain India and China trade.) as he pleated. (Hear, hear.) the ought rebate to
Mr. Richmond, another einem, stated : have stated in a former part of his observations that
It I were to say,
the English captains bad Improved, I mine 1 he proposed that a small fine should be taken on signing
should state that which was not the feet ; for the last 25 sears 000/0- *peewit!, between the sailors and their employers—and that
taVe people hardly ever send a boy to see, and the consequence bas that fee should not be higher than the sum new paid to the
been that we have hail to take the captains of our merchaut ships from licensed agents for performing the some duties , but from
rather a less educned clam of men than the' used to be 50 or Bat ymrs
Mo. 1 do not think their seaman bit is one lota impaired, but per- the paidand the fines levied the sailor in the
fees thus
baps their manner. may be a little lees refined. matter of discipline there would be a certain fund
And Mr. 0 F. Young, a protectionist, and opponent of raised. It was difficult to form an estimate of
the change in the navigatim laws, also thus expressed his what that would amount to, but he thnught it would
opinion : probably reach 40,0001. a year. In considering the disposal
Too indiscriminate censure has been thrown noon the commanders of that sum, it was necessary to observe from whom it came
of British shies, sod not sufficient allowance made far the very Vrge in the first instance ; and it was evident that that which
number we require ; believes, that taking the whole course of our
trade, the toptainsof many foreign chips are a better clan than many are, from agreements came out of the pockets of the owner..
and that raised from fines from the sailors. He prep' std in
in our own shim. the first place that the expense of the chipping offic re
But, in addition to these, he had happened to light upon
should be defrayed out of that fund ; but be did not ...emote
a paragraph in a Neel which had been quoted in that oust
•0001 There then remained 30,000/
—he meant Mr. Macfarlane's Italian Politics, wherein he that at above 10, . a year.
found a paragraph eminently illustrative of the pesitien ofmight be effected. He had 110
which he thought mht constitute a fund, by means of
the Bete& merchant seamen in the Mediterranean. Mr. which verY 'lief° purposes
matured scheme, however, to lay before the house with re-
Medial roe says : d to the disposition of that fund, and the bill dealt with
It eroded my national pride tore the general run of oar skippers
cut so mean a figure, mot oaly in dregs but in manner', when am- if goal see-
p areal with these smart Italian captains. No farther tab then 20 vice pensions and gratuities could be given to the most mere
ran the most general mane r ; but bethought g .
Tears ago the Italian skipper was mostly sesame dirty Mow, in an torions masters and mates in the merchant service, an exce I-
Mem weather jacket or great with a fres? hat and • very empty. lent purpose would be answered. In giving, for example, to
h underit. .11".0..ehangelwit..P"digims'.2 t seemed to me that "captains who had obtained first-class certificates. some badge
cheat revels,. it bad bee • change for the imam. This is meter of
there
bed
been
any
lige'''. t—
masters
our own c•wm•-• ner- r dietinetion which would give them an authority in foreign
serious comiikrailmle and eraciallY now that hazardous changes aro ports, and would raise them in their own estimator, and in
contemplated in ear nariestion laws. Statists may Melo; their tables the estimatioa of others, he thought that a portion of that
and bewilder us with rattan and long arrays of figures, and trent fund would be well applied. (Hear.) In conclusion he would
men aeciphers, hut If the condition of the merchant captain Is getting
worse instead of bear% it mart be retiously doubted whether our ult. t of greater interest to this country than that which he
mercantile navy is hooraying : and, without that nursery and tree- s ic
Only say that he was greatly deceived if there could be any
my what is to beosneof our national navy I Twenty-five Imago had now ventured to bring before the house. Te right
In • ' part of the Mediterranean the preferenoe was given to ang- hon. gentleman concluded by placing in the Fan's ofthe
fish b.ttoens wherever they could be procured, and the rate of instil.. chairman a resolution fur leave to bring in a 1331 to amend
sees was increased noon go res shipped le country vessels. There Is the laws relating to pilotage.
no suck preference now, nor, as I believe, any difference ma:, in in-
surances. Mr. GLADSTONE said he was sure the house and the
And lady, the Chamber of Commerce of Bombay, in a country were much indebted to the right hon. gentleman for
memorial sent in by them in the year 1842, stated that even the very clear, interestingeandeonaprehensive view with which
in the Indies trade the same waist of scientific knowledge, he had favoured them of • Class or subjects which had ve
me
ry
conduct, and discipline were observable in the mates of East little of popular exterior attraction, bat which at the se
Indian trading vessels which were noticed in time was of most vital impertanee, and tested the real Ina-
European merchant ships, and that, owing to this nation of a minister to do good to his fellow-subjects in the
cause, if the captain became die abled at tea,
most OtTiOIIs cots-reiences frequently *milted from the gentleman through the whole of his speech, but would bre
fiy
way ollegislation. (Hear.) He would not follow the rivet hen.
mates sot beirg gasified to supply his place in taking
command of the ship. He wend not weary the house exceedingly glad to find that the right hon. gentleman had
the touch upon one or two points. In the fi et place, he was
with further details r-apecting t` e subject of discipline, but succeeded in ohtunine a very considerable remi sine of the
be would state that all who were conversant with the state light dues, and he thought that those who we re connected
of the merchant service not only knew but lamented the with the Trinity Howe deserved the highest sporobation of
want of it amongst their crews. The whale fishery bad that house for the course they had taken. (H iar, hear.)
been entirely lot to Reiland owing
prattle source of employment and gain had hen transferred was that he regretted the right hon. gentleman had not made
to this cause, and this With respect to the question of pilot-we all he we.ul4 say
to the American whoeirs purely because of the superior die- his statement earlier in the session, becaute there might he
ripen, maintained onboard their ships. He wool I now call those who conceived they had vested interests which weal.'
their attention to the third point—namely, the general ton- be interfered with, and who might have wiehea for time to
diens of the British seaman. This view of the question examine the propwed measure. (Hear, Dear) There was
might properly • x:itre very great alarm if the facts were one important emission in the right hon. gentleman's state-
d s. /y looked at. Durirg US° lost Year there had been, as- went, and that was that he his. not given them his views
cording to the registrar's report, no lem than with regard to the merchant seamen's fund. 'Hear, bear.)
13,000 desertions from merchant ships. That fact He now passed on to the great and comprehensive scheme
alone sh wed the sailor's dissatisfaction with his which the right hon. gentleman develope I in the lett.r part ,
position. It was sufficient in itself to induce the lentos to of his speech; and he entirely agreed is the principle be '
torn its attention to the improvement of the seaman's eon- had laid down that if they wished to make a reel reform is
dition. The ref .tion between a seaman and his ems toyer the condition and character of the mercantile marine they
sea a very p collar one, and bad always an been dealt by. must look first and foremost to the character of the masters
The sailor had never been left to make his own hareiain with end the mates ; for he was convinced that in prom- ion only
his employer, as other lahouries were. In the United Bates to what they achieved with respect to them, could they hoe.
their remteetion was cersinee by the law insisting upon every to accomplish web reward to the seamen. (Hear, hear.)
sailor's contract being [bead by a notary. There was no class HO was glad cn the whole that the right hon. gentleman in-
of reruns in England of the rank or condition of a notary misted on the system of the compulsory examinations of mu-
to on account of
whom these contracts were entrusted. The brokers won el tors and metes in all future win • but he suggested
not act in the 111 l t r, and the miter em conrquently left i¢ with regard to the withdrawal of certificate
the hands of crimps or agents. Practically speaking, there• minonduct, that the mole of proof of such misconduct was
for, the whole of the merchant seamen were in the bra a matter which would require the closest examination in

Lord ASHLEY obs reed that the Board of Health was
paralysed. It had no jurisdiction whatever except in cues
where cholera had breken out, and then it cleansed the dis-
trict. But its cleansing wag serfsee cleansing, which did
not remove any standing or real nuisance.
Lord EBRINGTON, as a member of tee Cemmissionen
of Sewers, assured the house that that baud eel ennead
thousands of sewers, and flushed away the depoets of
hundreds of thousands of drains. lie believed that the
drains under the Howe of Commons were clean and clear.
The coremesioners. howcv.r. hod no pewer to remove the
pestilential exhalation, arising from decomposing bodies in
St. Margaret's churchyard. The commisaioners had to
accept of a quantity of defective map, and plans handed to
them by deer predecessors, and unul a proper survey was
made it was impouible that say very effieent improvements
could be effected.
ask was
gwrase a !the;
Mr. LIEN LEY wished to ask the noble lord at the head of
the goveremete a question. The noble loru (Ashley) who
represented the hoard ot health in that house, had stated that
ils
cot It that
ptanr
edddoi
fd.
noTthpersqu'r seirlaTertoiseaedb
ate
whether those who remiss. nted the board in the house had
not, at the time of the passing ot the Health of Towns Bill,
and against the wishes of many hon. members, exempted
the metropolis from the operation if that bill, which pro-
fessed to deal with great nuisances ?
Lord J. RUSSELL said the reason why the metropolis
bad not been included is the Health of Towns Bill was be-
cause the Commissioners of Woods ael Forests were of
opinion that it would be necessary to have a distinct mea-
sure parsed for London Teat distinct measure had not yet
been parsed, but in the meantime the commissioners of
sewers were armed with eremite sanitary powers.
THE QUARANTINE SYSTEM.
Mr. HUME wished to ask her Majesty's government
whether they would take any measures to lessen the incon-
venience trade suffered by the pres nt oy stratisn of the qua-
rantine system, and whetter they would propose any altera-
tion with respect to the eget Aron on the coast of Africa ?
Lord PALMERSTON said that he had placed bimsell
in a mmunication with toe commis abroad, on the et/eject of
the quarantine system, in weer to ascertain whether any
changes could be made in regulatiors which operated Mitt-
ricusly to the advancement of commerce. When he re-
ceived the replies of the consul', he shoal hove much plea-
sure in stating them to the house. (Hear.) With referees*
to the second question, he micht rate at once tied it was not
his intention at present to prepaid any alteration with re-
spect to the squadron on the coast of Africa.
THE RUSSIAN TROOPS IN TRANSYLVANIA.
Mr. OSBORNE ask, d whether the noble lord the secre-
tary for foreign affairs had received aey official communics.
Ran of the advance of the Russian troops into Transylvania?
Lord PALNIERSEON replied that he had received a
communication that the Rump= troops tad advanced into
Transylvania, and that they had obtained possessien of
Cronstadt.
AUDIT OF RAILWAY ACCOUNTS BILL.
In reply to a gyration from Mr. HENLY r,
Mr. LABOUC ERE the would fix this bill for Mon-
day, and then state upon what day he would move the
second reading.
DUTIES ON COD FISH.
In reply to a question from Mr. RUBINSON, which was
inaudible,
Lord PALMERSTON said, that in reply to the hon,
gentleman's question, who then the government had received
any information resperieg the augmentation of the duties
cc cod fish, he had ti state that the Smallish government
had propelled to modify their tariff generaly, and substitute
other duties for the present, which hewever, he feared,
espee'ally as regarded cod fish, would still be high man
to make smuggling profitable. When he received that tariff
he would lay a copy of it before the house.
NEW SOUTH WALES.
Mr. F. SCOTT inquired whether any documents bad
been received from the late governor of N. w South Wales,
expressing an opinion teat it would be advisable to estab-
lish a second legislative chamber in that colony.
Mr. HAWES said he would look through the mere and
let the hon. member know to morrow (this day.)
COLONIAL GOVERNMENT BILL.
Mr. F. SCOTT asked if it were intended to bring on this
bill on Monday, and if so, whether it would be taken first?
Lord J. RUSSELL said he would state tomorrow (this
day) what would be the course of business on Monday ; bat
he might say, generally, that they would go through com-
mittee of supply, and take the report on ways and means
before the other erden of the day.
THE MARRIAGE AND
LAND) BILLS REGISTRATION (SCOT-
Lord J. RUSSELL announced that after the expression
of opinion by that house, and the statements made respect-
ing the feelings of the people ot Scotland in reference to these
bills, it was not his intention to proceed with them. But
from what passed in the debate, and eepecislly from the ob-
jections raised by an hon. and learned gentleman not then
in the house, he (Lord J. Resell) was strengthened in the
opinion that the marriage law of Scotland wss very defec-
tive, and ought to be emended. (Hear, hear.)
INCUMBERED ESTATES (IRELAND) BILL.
Lord .7. RUSSELL said that, as 1 gentlemen in-
tereste in this measure found it imposible to attend at 12
o'clock on Friday, he would postpone the consideration of
the Lords' amendments to it until Monday evening. But it
was intended to g son with the Poor•law Bill at 12 o'clock
on Friday (this dey).
VAN DIEMEN'S LAND.
On the motion that the house go into a committee of
supply,
Mr. ANSTEY moved for an address to her Majesty on
the subject of certain illegal ordinances or acts of council for
the taxation of the people et VanDiemen's Land, the attempts
of Lieutenant-Governor Sir William Denison to intimidate
the judges of the supreme c .tart of that island into dezlering
such ordinances or acts to be legal, and the grievances com-
plained of by the colonists of that island in their petition pre-
sented last year to her Majesty, and printed by order of this
house ; and that her Majesty may be pleased to direct the
local authorities in future to respect the independence of the
judicial functions of that court, and also to signify her dis-
allowance of any ordinance or act subeequently passed by the
said lieutenant-governor in council, for giving to such illegal
ordinances or acts the force of law.
Mr. HAWES resisted the motion, as conveying a direct
and undeserved vote of censure on the governor, whose con-
duct througboutthe many difficult trans.coons alluded to in
the motion, had been sanctioned by the law officers.
Mr. HUME wished to know whether the letter conveying
the disapprobation of the Secretary of State would he laid on
the table of the house. It was necessary that that letter and
THE CUSTOMS. any other document. that ceuld explain the transscti m should
Mr. THORNELY asked the right hon. gentleman the be produced before the house was called on to pronounce its
Chancellor of the Exchequer, whether any reports had been judgment.
made by the commissioners for inquiring into the manage- Mr. GLADSTONE raid he did not perceive any parlia-
ment of the department of customs ; and, if such reports mentary necessity for insisting upon the production of these
had been merle, whether the government would, in collie- papers, and he therefore thought the government was quits
quence, be able to effect any materiel saving in the cost of justified in declining to produce them.
imilecting the revenue of customs, and whether the inquiries Captain HARRIS opposed the amendment.
of the commissioners were still proceeding ? Mr. ROEBUCK contended that the judges in this case
Tree CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that had only done their duty.
a rep art had been made by the commissioners which had Mr. E. DENISON regretted very much the conduct of
come time sines been adopted. The reductions effected in his relative towards Mr. Justice Polder; but with due con-
the expenditure in consequence of their suggestions would sideration he did not think any good would be done by
amount to 60,0001. annually ; hut, out of this, some allow- pressing the motion.
Rens would have to be deducted for superannuated officers. The house then divided. The numbers were,
The commiseeners had made other suggestions, which For the amendment
would cause a saving of 10,0001. a year ; and, as the inquiry Against it 72-48
was proceeding, it was not improbable that still further re- Mr. HUME then asked if there was any objection on the
ructions wand hereafter be made. part of the noble lord to lay on the table a copy of Earl
Mr. THORN ELY asked whether the reports of the coon- Grey's despatch wherein he censured and disapproved el Sir
missieners would he laid upon the table? W. D:nison's conduct.
the CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER was not Lord J. RUSSELL said that inasmuch as society
pr pared to say that It would be d, eirebte to lay the in Van Diemen' Land was in a very disorganised
whole of the valence taken by the commissioners upon the state, and as he had stated expres.ly that Earl
table. Grey had disapproved of and censured Sir W. Den-
THE CHOLERA IN THE METROPOLIS. ison's conduct towards Mr. Justice Feeder, he did not
Mr. BERNAL said that seeing the right hon. gentlemen think, considering the difficulties which the governor of that
the Secretary for the Home Department in his place, he colony had already to contend with that any good would result
hoped he weal he excused if he asked a question relative to from making public a document which might have the effect of
the unitary condition of the metropolis. (Het.) lie un- lowering the governor in the eyes of the colonists, and of
der,tood that the disease called cholera was spreading its seljecting him to their criticism and censure. The better
savages in different parts of London. He was only surprised course, therefore, was not to lay the des; etch on the
that hon. members could submit to the state of discomfort table.
to which nuisances in the immediate vicinity of the house Mr. ANSTEY asked how it was the t the despatch was
occasionally subjected them, particularly as they had not included in the return of all despatches ad :Tweed to the
to Pit there very often from twelve o'clock in the governor of Van Dismen's Lend by Rail Grey, ordered by
dey until two in the morning. The stench from the the Route of Commons to be laid on the table.
churchyard (Hear, bear) from ewer the vaults Mr. HAWES said that in all probability it was
of St Margaret's Church, were declared by persons in the because the despatch in questioi was not written at the
neighbourhood to be so dew* and deleterious es to oblige date when the return was ordered to be made.
them to clue their windows. (He r, hear.) Even at the Mr. ROEBUCK would only rema.k that as the nob'e
vry table of the house, at the head of which he was often lord had described the colony of Van Diemen's Land to be
obliged so sit, odours arose the offensiveness of which it was in a most disorganised state, the maxim omne ignotuni pro
quite impossible for hon. gentlemen to conceive. (Loud mognifico in sal sense might be replied to the pre
laughser.) Of course nuisances of such a nature would act sent case, for it was above all things important that in such
upon the state of health of hon. eentlemen who were ens- a state of society as that described by the noble lord, the
charging their duties onerously and feithfully in the house. governor and heads of departments should stand pure and
(Hear, hear.) He wished also te incite the oaten- free from all imputation or even au, irion of bad conduct.
tion of his right hon. friend to the general sanitary
SUPPLY.—THE ORDNANCE ESTIMATES.
cor.eition of London. The sewers were a perfect disgrace
the wuth ' ' s. (Hear, and cheers.) N ewi In,
The house then went into committee of supply on the
to
all that the commissioners of sowers had done, the sewers Ordnance estimates.
were so bad in his nriahbourheol, that at night he was The first vote was for the sum of 361,8951. to complete the
Wised to close the windows of his bed-chamber in order amount necessary for the pay allowencei and contingencies
to prevent the entrance of effluvia of a mat injurious of Ordnance military corps.
nature. Persons were dying in the neighbourhood. The Mr. HUME asked if the ordnance estimates could not be
erains were improperly attended to. After all the talk, allowed to stand over until Monday next, as he should not
and all the effort,' of gentlemen wb a addressed them- bein possession of the report of the committee until Saturday.
selves te the subject, tho sanitary condition of tee Lord J. RUSSELL said that the ordnance estimates had
metropolis was a great deal worse at minuet than it been deferred until an unusually late perio lin the hope that
had been in former days. He knew not whether the report of the committee would have been presented.
the blame rested with the Don or Chapter or with But at the present late period of the session it was a question
the City auth• ritieo, hut of this he felt convinced that for the house to decide whether they ought to be pestponed
every part of London was in a shameful state for the year any longer, as such delay might carry the se'sion into the
1819, when the City was surrounded a ith disease. (Hear.) month of September, and so keep parliameut sitting until
Sir G. GREY said that the hon. gentleman had no doubt it would be very inconvenient.
introduced a very important subject. He could only any in Mr. BERRIES said that the house was certainly Put
reply that when any representaunn bed been made to bim into a difficulty by the answer of the noble lord. They
of a ruisanee existing in any neighbourhood he had called were now toll that although the committee had come to a
the attention ref the Board of Health and of the police to it. report and resolution reap'mine the ordnance estimates, the
No representation had been made to him relative to the beet way was to defer the consideration of that report
unannto'e
state of the neighbourhood of the House of Commons, but next moon, and in the meantime to agree to thou o
the observations just made by the hon. gentleman would estimates which the committee had probably condemne.
attract observation to the nuisances to which he had This was a very awkward posioien for the how, to be place", id.
alluee 1. He believed that, with regard to she state of Lon• Last year the same thing happened. It was annottneed to
don generally, the powers conferee' ow th' Board of Health them that they should have the valuable assioanse of the
had been used to remove the nuisances, and that many of testurches of •coneneittee ; but still they were it the end
the existing nuisances had arisen from the warm state of the called upon to discuss the estimates, without tb• ee remote
weather. being before them, He would not throw OA.; impediment
Mr. GOULBURN sail that when a Rant had been some in the way of public business, but trusted that the con-
tins • sine • m eyed for the repair of St. ei erearees Church, mitten wield report as early as possible.
the house was told that the parte a cons. cted with the Me. COBDEN concurred with his,-ben. friend, theme ta:
church were in treaty for the purcha•e of pica of ground
toes for Montrose, in requesting thet tee tooee lord would
for another burying-ground. Re whew), to know whether
'sot peen the estimates that conies, The noble lord Wee
that treaty had been effected ?
IMotes
could not have mut retool the ease nut by his boa.
ELT G. GREY said he should make inquiry on the eettieect. or he would not have answered Stil he had dane. On Igor

object before him. (Hear, hear.)
Sir G. CLERK should confine his observations to these
two measures to which the right hon. gentleman opposite
had referred, which were to come into operation at a very
early period—the one with regard to the modification of the
'Lehi dues, at d the other with regard to the law of pilotage.
With regard to the modification of the light dues, be thought
the bill which the right hon. gentleman proposed to intro-
duce was one which, from the reduction of the light dues it
we old effect, was likely to be of great immediate benefit to
the mercantile community. As to the law of pilotage, the
right hon. gentleman had asked fur leave to introduce • bill
which he had stated he wished to pose this session. As
member for Doer, he must protest against a measure
which so nearly affected the interests of his constituents
h token at so late • period of the session.
Till a full opportunity had been afforded the country for
censiderng the dill, lee hoped it would not be persevered is;
but, at all events, if it were, it would meet with his most
decided opposition. jlear, hear.)
Mr. M GIBSON observed that a pilot question never
m
could he brought before parliament, wit
ut it always being
thtughe neceessry to introduce a clause to this effect, " Pro-
vided always that nothing in this bill contained Real' affect
the rights and privileges of the Cinque*Ports." With regard
to the pilot system itself, this was the way In which it worked :
when ships d.d not want a pilot be was forced upon
them, and when they did want a pilot they could not
get one ; and fie this simple reason, that the system secured
to the pilot a certainty of employment and of come,
in fine weather, which induced him not to take trouble and
go to sea in bad weather. If the system secured him an in-
come in fine weather, it was not likely that he would run
the risk and danger, and incur the weer and tear of encoun-
tering the sea in rough weather; and the cons• quesce was
that very often at the South Foreland vessels which were
compelled to submit to the charge of a pilot in fine weather,
ran the risk of being lost through the neglect of the pilot to
go to sea in rough weather. With regard to the corpora-
tion of the Trinity Rouse, he wee one of thole who hal
never joined in a tilt against them, because the evils of the
light dues had been occasioned by the acts of the crown and
of the legislature. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. CARDWELL said if he understood the statement of
the right honourable gentleman opposite, he had brought
three questions before them upon which he prop, szei to take
the opinion of the house. The brit of these was to give an
important re lief to the mercantile marine, and as that mea-
sure was not to be disposed of in the present session, he
she uld say nothing against it then. With regard to the
sec ind question, that of pilotage, the right bon. gentleman
proposed to I rind in a bill which he was anxious to pass in
the present session of parliament. It was merely of a per-
missive nature, to enable those parties who had the control
of the pilotage to make certain remissions in regard to taking
pilots where it would be expedient; and, at the first view, it
certainly did appear a reasonable proposal, which lie was not
then prepared to object to. (Hear, hear.) With regard
to the third and by far the most important subject,
the right honourable gentleman had proposed a course
which must be eminently satisfactory to the house. He
proposed to lay before them in detail a cemprehensive
scheme with regard to the mercantile marine, and
having done so he proposed to give the country a
lug opportunity of considering the measure before any
opinion of the house should be asked fur. He would,
therefore, be no party to railing any r bjection to this bill
at the present moment, nor did he think any of those
obstacles suggested by the right hon. gentleman would be
thrown in his way.
Mr. LABOUC HERE said that it being now three o'clock
he trussed that the committee would at once agree to the re-
solution, and postpone the consideration of its bearings until
the second tending of the bill.
Capt HARRIS gave the right hon. gentleman great
credit for the measure he had brought before the house,
we ich no doubt had been dictated by a desire to benefit the
me rcantile marine; but there was one point which he had
heard with extreme regret, and that was, that it was in-
tended to do away with the registry certificate. (Hear.)
Mr. HENLEY said, after the right hon. geatleman had
quoted disputed evidence in such • wholesale manner, he
did not think that it was quite fair, at three o'clock in the
afternoon, suddenly to cut short the oiscussion without giving
any parts an opportunity of answering it.
A resolution, agreeing with the necessity of introducing
measures upon the subject, was then agreed to.
The house then resumed, and leave was given to bring in
the necessary bills.
The house then adjourned until 5 o'clock.
The house resumed at five o'clock.
ROYAL PAVILION (BRIGHTON) BILL.
Mr. HATTER moved, that standing order. No. 167, be
scope sec d, that the committee on the Royal Pavilion (Heigh-
ten) Bill, have leave to sit ard proceed on Tuesday next,
and that Mr. Armstrong be substituted for Lord Harry Vane
On the sail committee.
Mr. W PATTEN moved an addition, that it be an in-
struction to the committee to ascertain we-ether any private
interests would be affected by the WI, and to report their
opinion to the house.
The motion with the addition was agreed to.
THE UNIVEReITIES.
On the motion of Mr. HEYWOOD the following return
was ordered.—Retorns, for the test five years, from the
Vice-Chancellor and Heads of Houses is Word and Cam-
bridg and the Provost of Triuity College, Dublin, of the
number of Students entered annually. in the hooks of each
College or Hen within the Universeire of Oxford, Cam-
bridge, and Dublin ; the number of Candidates in each
year for the degree of Bachelor of Arta, specifying the
number both of successful and of unsuccessful Candidates in
the Degree examination ; the number of testimonials for
Holy Or era granted annually by each College or Hall within
the said Universities; the average number in each year of
resident Undergraduates in New College, Word, and in
King's College, Cambridge, and the annual member of
Candidates from those two Cullegee in the University
examinations for the Degree of Bachelor of Arts.
WELSH CHURCHES AND CHAPELS.
Mr. J. WILLIAMS asked the Tient hon. gentleman the
Under-Secretary of State for the Home department why a
portion of the return relative to churches and chapels In
Wales had not been presented to the house on Friday lest ?
Sir 0. GREY said that the Under-Secretary of State
would be able, when in his place, to answer the question.
Mr. J. WILLIAMS said he would move to morrow that
the returns relative to two Welsh dioceses be laid upon the
table forthwith.