The Express.
London, England, 1849-02-24 00:00:00

THE tE%PRES§, SATURDAY`,

Afar • few wads in esphifedira hens the Earl of Astrn.
nee sod Stream ad 1111191ffiallawle
Mr. J. O'CONNELL Semi* litehosse ought to geraider
whether the present waresdar 41aakki
be Roam eatheat mambo. lied& any Wager e
He was willies to sae suck a derigrawy ost as that referred
to by the right Ma. the Megrat of the Mkt
order that the tams of the oath mighthesaMitesassala
et gnome he was plead la • semewlat He
heil anodes of media far w a sow modifica-
tion ell the rename of OD
hat of mans he weal last Wank itilinirilleemilratear"
interferieg in ohm* tarttses, Ihe was Mlle Milfkagy le the
oath he hal Mims. Tim gasalka, however, eseelval Itself
taco
thle—wego the milledies mlanosiented ei4=
they set bhh Wham INS weft
for thelbalkille and the Eleghle estigaite; god, two
of the biter had spokes thea times thee wintleek they
mut goodleM *et what/nee gadealwahog Ober* had some
We I upon. the bkh eathelise ad sot entered
whit their hands tied. The ease alluded
ythe wags lord (Anutdel and Barmy), was inapplicable,
becaltre the bah emboli's would have rejected emancipation
were it clogged with any objectionable condition,. The
viatica, however, which bad now arisen was in every
respect • most important one, for it resolved itself into this
the of Ireland, who paid their money to the
support of the church of the minority,were to haven° voile in
any matter pertaining to the temporalities of that establish-
ment. He called upon the right hen. berated, the member for
Tamworth, to answer this intseroptory, sad to explain the
views he entertained in proposing the Boman catholic oath.
(Hear, hear.)
Sir R. PEEL said, that as the imprettsios of the bon. mem-
ber Frr Limerick was incorrect that the oath to which he
referred had been introduced into the Emancipation Act
upon his (Sir R. Peel's) motion, it appeared to him that be
should set most improperly it he personally and individually
were to undertake to say what he thought was the prop, r
construction of that oath. (Hear, hear.) Its adoption was
the act of the House of Cnamone and the legislature. Votes
had since been given by Roman catholic members which
had been questioned when viewed in connexion with the
oath ; bat the honourable member for Limerick would
do him (Sir R. Peel) the justice to say that
sines the year 1829 he bad never apenided any boa. mem-
ber from Ireland with having acted otherwise than in what
he believed to be a comdentious manner. (Hear, hear,
from Mr. J. O'Connell). But the oath not having been in-
troduced upon his motion, nothing would be so unfair to-
wer& Irishmen, who had been all along acting upon their
construction of its contests, than to undertake to say, in
reply to the boo, member, what the legislature thought of
that oath. If the legislature did not now feel satisfied with
the course hon. gentlemen were taking, it was the duty of
the house to establish a new rule for their guidance and to
ma what the thought ought to be done with Tee to the
of Boman catholic members. (Hear, r.) He
was willing to believe that hon. members acted on the ton
adentions construction they put upon the oath they had
taken ; but the hon. member for Limerick was entirely in
error In supposing that the oath in 1829 had been introduced
by kit (Sir R Peel). In that year • proposal was attempted
to be made by extent enactment to limit the functions of
Roman catholic* taking their nab in that house. It was
thus proposed by an honoured and now deceased friend of
his (Mr. Wilberforce) that Roman catholics should not
be permitted to vote on occasions affecting the interests,
spiritual or temporal, of the established church. He (Sir R.
Peel) stated his objections to that motion. He admitted
that his late right hon. friend had brought it forward with •
view to calm the fears of those who objected to the admis-
sion of Roman catholic' into parliament, and who
thought that, if admitted, they should be disqualified
by; law from voting on matters relating directly or io-
directly to the church of England. Teen ap-
peared numerous objections to the proposal in the
mind of him (Sir R. Peel). First of all, that it would be
dangerous to limit the tuoctioos of any member of that
blew; eeooadk, that it was difficult to say what were the
questions which affected the interests of the church, because
some,apparently trivial inthsraselvm, might have • particular
bearing on its welfare ten times more important than others
of seemingly greater moment ; and thirdly. that by exclud-
ing a Roman catholic from giving his vote you deprived him
of a power of which, Iva" porremed of it, he might not
avail himielf. For these remoss he was unveiling to deprive
the Roman catholic members of the house of
their hoe right of discussion and voting on them
gesetiens; but, at the suns tints, he might observe that the
sal of 1829, which required en oath to be taken by those
members, did not impose *Meath for the first time. It was
adopted from acts passed in 1774 and 1793, end it was arranged
in earnests wilt Roman esthetic gentlemen, who made no ob-
jection whatever to it. Hon. members might recollect that
it was no easy matter to carry the Emancipation Bill (hear,
hear,) and that if he and those who acted with him had
parted altogether with the security for the church which then
existed, • greater objection to the measure would
have been raised; but the security was taken and
assented to by tee Roman catholic"' themselves.
He would nod the oath which was required to he taken by
the act of 1793, which act conferred very important privi-
leges on the Roman catholic', and provided that they might
he elevated to all offices under the crown, with some few ex-
ceptions, provided they could take the oath. They consented
to do so, and then it was that they became relieved of many
clink:ices under which they laboured with reference to the
possession of landed property. In fact, they were then
placed on the earns footing as other subjects. Now, the oath
they took was to the effect that they would defend
to the utmost of their power the several arrange-
ments of property in this country as established by the
law—that they disclaimed, renounced, and abjured any at-
tempt to subvert the present protestant establishment with
the view of hassling • catholic establishment in its stead,
and that they woad not exercise any privilege of which
they were or Night become pored to weaken the pro
aslant religion eml preaseleaM government. (Hear.) Every
sae appeased to Age ender the el of 1793, and every free-
holder who exercised the fraashise, had questions of this
ldad pat to him • sad at the taw of the palming of the
Imeacipation Ant, ad now, he wee content to leave it
to the conselsome the Remo catholic, to my
whether or not they mold safely take the oath, which,
as be had said before, was copied, very nearly, from the bill
of 1791. He agreed with the right hen. gentleman opposite
(Mr. Shell), that it was for the Roman Catholics to consider
the purport of that oath; and if they, after having taken it,
emented to vote on particular questions, all he could say
was, that he had yet upbraided them for a breach of
what they had contracted to perform. (Hear.) He left it
to their own consciences and Jude/meats to decide the con-
sanction which ought fairly to be pat spa the oath.
Mr. J. O'CONNELL raw amid loud cries of "Oh ! Oh !"
gad said it now appeared hoot the course the ditcusion
had taken that this question must now be @staid aninso
neeigiststis. He wished to me • short derimakay bill intro-
dosed whisk would settle the matter at ogee, and to its pro.
Aims, it adopted, he promised to yisid a nedygegoisessace.
Zs admitted that the right hon. Unmet the member for
Tammy* had Bowe Memsd the sahib members ef per-
Poylei, bat thee hb elm % when the asap am edeemeall,
opmetskpelailaighy se he as ir simssliss was
sessissi. Hs re ginied the dole ben.tht Woad that there
Wes a masiltrabh dillweate between the wasselphea oath
end the oath of 179; and he had always been of cztti:
that according to the words in which the
was couched he we net _ presladed teen speaking
end rating ea the limplaillM el die skunk.
He was psrfselly Witte adept the leagenge used by the
if& ilatirittlw9 tithe mint oa this subject,
sad le wi w what he Wilimerlf previously said whoa
advertise to the oath.
Mr. LAW said that In sides the reseirtisa tritz
without requiring Ow Waft to &vide upon it, be
to state that he neseved hinesif the full power of preening
the subject to a division ea a fatale worrier.
The erigiaal motion washers pat sad agreed to without a
divides.
Mr. DARIUS asked when the noble lard at the head at
the government would proceed with the mend reading ?
Lord J. RUSSELL, who brought up the bill and laid It
ape these of the loam fixed Monday the 16th of April
Iss the mad*.
Thu CHAIRMAN then reported program, and the house
reamed.
RELIEF OF DISTRESS (IRELAND) BILL.
On the order of the day hr the snood reading of this
Mr. HUME protested against the swam upm the
that it would muse an extravagant expenditure of
Figitareladrea sad
Intimated
thatre tite
would on-
Ths bit ins Slim send a second time, end ordered to be
egnealttel ea Me day.
IRISH COLLEGES.
Ito. BAII sell he had bees gives to understand
thltthaoollsgotelehliMed by the government In Ireland
wow now sraitana to be useless. lie wished to know if they
weee fa opeollek es Iff any salaries were being paid to the
em sod sidlia
Lied J. RINIBILL replied that there had been • ram
vsteilicpserna he the erection sad maintenance of
these and that the were now nearly com-
pleted. would be ready ion month of Octobsr, and
• peat saszeispreleseers had already beenman appointed.y
So hr
*ma the hag a ssign, a great penes,
biskut sespeetablAty is the Rama Whelk chunk at
wotheo
their wages eapportere. (Hoar, hear.)
IRISH MEASURES.
Mr. HUMS seised the noble lord what other messures for
Inked he inhaled to bring forward in the present masks ?
Lord J. RUSSELL wss andantes& to reply that his right
hoe. fraud, the Secretary for Ireland, would presently
iatrodace two or three bills, and on a future octagon gate
his views with regard to these and other mesearee.
Mr. HUME.—De you intend to stand by the Irish church
as it now exists, or do you net ? (Laughter.) That is the
question.
Lord J. RUSSELL said that it was not his intention to
give any nodes of motion respecting the Irish church.
TICE-GUARDIANS OF UNIONS (IRELAND) BILL.
Oa the order of the day for the second reading of this
bill, which provides for the payment of vise-guardians from
the 98th of Man* to the 26th of Sept.,
Leud LINCOLN, and expound a hope that the
wad et toyingould be postponed to the Mk
of Mon* 1860, as he saki -the winter six
waits was the melt important MMUS for the vim-
swam@ le &lathery their dudesd
he ofhailadtsrm:disbegtheirdiaz
meat might est be provide hops&
bill Mood as at present, and paw was pegregisi at the
meal time.
Sir G. ORBY, who was *eat whiff, ahlthilhe ley
le the umber of members iambi tha Mee" testmaisset
Mead to reply that the sanguine% led the ea** '
timed by the noble ked %odor Wit sonekileitlah .1
At bit was ass seed a 9010 ad *es.

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%tali a%keit on X
nu kOzitTILTURAL-lirrahlatii. ' •
' Mr. DISSAILI inurcareed are it was $1 kiioooo6 06
byeday, sod probably on Marday, is whichp the
f Via 10•10 lb* sp•ailk fiteltile, 4 es lard
given socks tatt mid Thursday work, relative NI rho whorl-
surd in sal tiro battle's. tir 'Adak drir..bruarr& *sr
sal4seted— boar.)
_ IRISH MHZ/WM

Ups. the swim el Mt. Awu, OQtdn doonaota
Wog to the lAA YEW true ordered to
the amities am *deg yea that wabjeee. be bad before

IRISH BILLS.
St W. 15011211 VILLE brought up and id as the table
the Ortorhal Whew Orelead) Billtthe Ounnary Convic-
tions Ordeal)) dm Protection of Justices (fraud) Bill;
sod dig were ordered to be reed a Ant tine ea Friday, the
9th et &Ink.
no Woe sijoursed at tea minutes after eaten o'clock.