The Express.
London, England, 1848-04-06 00:00:00

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IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.—WEDS .DAY, APRIL S.
The SPBente. took the chair at 12 o'clock.
PUBLIC BUSINESS.
FIRST READINO.--Public Works (Ireland) Act Amendm m
SECOND READINGS- —Poor Hour. (Ireland); ?Corny; 31iritte
Mutiny; Great Vermouth Freemen Disfranchisement Oa.
PETMONS.—By Mr. Catenroan, from tOokeertown, Km .on..
bridge, and other plenee, in favour of his Tenant-Right Bth —Mr.
SPoOnlea, from Great Yarmouth, against • bill for rag tin` tbe omil
duties in that port.
RETURNS ORDERED.—On the motion of Mr. Baorniumrs, re,
turn of the number of petitions primates' and printed in each LA the
15 years from 1833 to 1847 inclusive, showing the total number to each
auceereive p riod afire yews, and the average number ; afro of the
number of signatures to petition. for seek of the said
15 Yoko, ami the total number; and abstract the
sums paid for printing reports and appendixes, awl in-
dexes to reports on public petitions from 1837 to 1847 inelm..re.—
On the Motirel of Mr. Erma, return dal admirals, vice, rear. and
retired admin./a, retired captains, captains, mencianders, and lira.
Want. in the royal navy. promoted on and since the 18th slay of
July 1843; chstinguithing thces •rem led on full p•y from nu
half pay at th- time of Ma:. promotion, stating the date of entry of
etchMeer into the nary, end the dates of the several cement,. me
tuereasively attained; eke, the period which each raker had -erred
in each commission, and the per od oo half-pay in earl, corn.
mission, and the eel/negate time of full pay and or half-
pay of each Aker to tee Ist day of January, 1646: aim, abstract
return of the total number of promotions in the royal navy, ewer the
15th day of May, 1843, Siam the rank of midshipman to lad et
admiral, inclueire ; • elating the number of each rank pi rem ted
in each year, sad dietinguiehing the number of tech rank pro.
mated, when employed and afloat, from those on hall-pay, and aim
from that on the coast guard service in sea yew else retitle of
the number of sea of/leers on the Ist lay of January ie each of
the year. 1846 and 1848 ; and also, the total meow t per annum for
the sea-pay of those employed, end ter the half-pay of thaw noes-
ployed, at each of those periods Asians a/se the number of mak
rank employed and =mop:clad at each of those periods, and the total
number of each clam. And, showing lha lad asialor d 011"1" fa
the royal nary on the 1,4 day of January in wed the rat', from
1844 to January, 1849, both inclusive ; distinguiehing the number of
each rank, from admiral to lieutenant, tnclundve, on half-pay ..nd in
conntimion ; alto, distinguishing the number of oaken, and their
ranks to the coent-guard service in each of thom years (all in conti-
nuation of Parliamentary Paper, Nu. 448, of derision 1848). Ale°. re-
turn. relatire to the ordnance survey of the Vetted Kingdom.
NOTICE OF MOTION.—Yr. Menai, on Tuesday next, to move
an addre-a to her klalesty, in terms of the motion bleb he made
yesterday (Tormisy), niative to the Independence of Poland.
MISCELLANEOUS ESTIMATES.
Mr. BBIUILL brought up the report of this committee on
the aimeellaaieva estimates.
COMMITTEE ON DIVORCE BILLS.
Mr, FLATTER mend the amWeeities et depctellenfoi
gentlemen on this committee:— Borer, Mr. Crippe,
Mr. Burroughes, Mr. Tancred, Sir .1. T. Buller, Mr W
fat-
ten. Mr. W. Evans, Mr. Baines, Mr. Wood, Mr. S. Woe Ley,
Lord Courtenay, Mr. Pinney, Mr. W. Lameaes, and Sir J.
Pakington.

ECCLESIASTICAL COMMISSION.
Mr. E. DENISON moved lex a select comraittse to inquire
into the composition and man.gement of the ecchsis•tical
commission, to which he understood there was no oyp•sitiun
on the part of the government.—Agreed toe
POORHOUSES (IRELAND) BILL.
Mr. S. CRAWFORD moved the second reading of this
bill.
Sir G. GREY, in consenting to the second re Idthg. re-
;erred to himself the right of objecting afterwards to thrtsin
of its provisions.

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OUTGOING TENANTS (IRELAND) BILL.
Mr. NAPI ER resumed the adjourned debate on the itecend
reading of this bill. He contended that any legislation on the
subject must be an invasion of existing rights either un the
one side or the other. The utmost uncertainty prevailed as
to what was tenant right; four hills on the subject were HOW
before the house, no two of which agreed in their provi•itins;
and the most contradictory deficitions of the term had bees
given. This confusion of ideas was evident in the bill before
the house, which was nothing less than a transfer to the em-
cupiers of the rights of proprietors. It confounded improve..
meat, a fair 'l.llliett fur compensation, with an actual right
in the soil. IS was important that these two matters should
be viewed distinctly. Compensation for improvement st as a
difficult subject for legislation ; and it was highly desirable
to avoid, in a time of discontent like the present, inepuing
hopes which could never he realised. Legislation on this
subject had often been attempted, but with little succes., ow-
ing to the complication of the machinery proposed. The
present bill, he wee convinced, would convert the whole of
Ireland into a field of litigation. (Hear.) Cases might
arise where compensation ought to be given for speciel im-
provements; but if the proprietor objected to these improve-
ments, they ought not to be forced upon him against his
will. Hence, all really useful improvemeres should be ha.ed.
on mutual agreement between landlord and tenant. To a
certain extent, legislation on this subject might be really
useful, by empowering holders for a term to consent to im-
provement by tenants. To leave a tenant at liberty to l'oNcr
a form with budding., would be to encourage the sulelis i-
non of land and the continuance of the population on the
soil—two of the great evils of Ireland. (Hear, hear.)
Compensation for drainage R 23 already provided for, and
large soma had been advanced for the purpose under the late
act. The greatest difficulties would arise from an attempt to
enforce the provisions of the bill before the house ; it would
give rise to arbitration upon arbitration, and appeals
without end. The bill most improperly assumed that all
landlords were oppressors and all tenants virtuous ; and in
the provisions for arbitrations and appeals the existence of
middlemen had been overlooked. It remained to be seen
whether that grinding, unhappy system could not be put
down, by some wise alteration in the poor laws, and by a
law which should do ample justice between the landlord and
occupier. The hon. member for Rochdale had only lien
able to cite one case of hardehip, in the county of Armagh,
from the absence of tenant.nght, in which the Duke of
Manchester was charged with ejecting a tenant because he
wee a Roman catholic, and war about to build a chapel on
his land. lie regretted that suck a statement had been
made, and was prepared to contradict every word of it.
(Hear.) The tenant held under a lease for lives, renewable
for ever; the property was close to his grace's demesne, who
wanted posseesion of it. It was not until after the tenant
had given up posse pion that the priest had incited him to
set up a claim for tenant-right, which had been beard and
decided against in the courts of law. This was the only case
which the hon. gentleman had been able to cite in support
of the provisions of his bill. (Hear, hear.) The great in-
;wince of the bill was, that while it obliged the land-
'wed, it left the tenant at liberty. An occupier might
exhaust his land, or sub let it, and then put an end to his
tenancy by a six months' notice ; and the landlord was left
without remedy. This would be not only a gross injustice
to the landlords of Ireland, but a permanent injury to the
nation at large. (Ilene.) As yet, he had heard no measure
proposed which apps ee .t to be practically useful ; the un-
wieldy machinery of arbitrations and appeals would destroy
the kind feeling between lai dlord and tenant, and inflict a
deadly wound on the community. But, he contended, the
real abject of the bill was to create fixity of tenure. While a
tenancy existed there was no need of legislation ; for the
tenancy was a valuable interest which-the occupier might at
any time dispose of. There was no such legislation in Eng-
land, nor was it needed. When the tenant came to he Ills-
pnoset,red the value of his right must depend in great
measure on his character as a tenant; it would ale.,
be modified by the character of the neighbourhood;
thus proving to the people of Ireland that tneir
rights depended on their moral conduct. (Hear, hour.)
Was tenancy from year to year to be abolished' That was
the question. This bill would destroy it on one side; :end
the effect would be, particularly in a country like Ireland,
where there was such competition, to impoverish the land,
by depriving the in-coming tenant of the capital which he
would otherwise have to expend in improving it. In a
moral neighbourhood, the best of all tenures was a tenancy
from year to year. What he complained of was, that there
had been too much legislation far Ireland. While in Eng-
land there were bat six statutes since the union relatine to
landlords and tenants, there were sixty-one in Ireland. If
they wanted to do anything for the benefit of the tenant, of
Ireland, they sh.,uld the care in the first imtence to ab,...in
from doing anything which would encourage litigation. What
was wanted in Ireland was a code consolidating the existing
laws, by which tenants and landlords would know what they
were about. 'The tenant-right of Ulster was not the cause of its
prosperity, hut the test of its peace. He attributed the
superiori,y of Ulster to the morals of the people; end h" did
not think it wo old be possible to transfer that right to Tip-
perary, where a different state of society prevailed. They
might, indeed, by legislation turn Ulster into a Tipperary. In
the one place there was &combination of good men in favour of
law and order, in the other there was a combination of had
men against law and order. At the late special commission
the crimes for which so many had suffered were not eon-
. fleeted with the question of land tenure. He thought
that the legislation proposed by the bill would be not
only useless but mischievous. lie wee afraid it would
lead away men's minds to visionary anticipations. It was
the misfortune of Ireland that the people of that country
were taught to leek at everything proceeding from linen-6
legislation with jealousy and hatred. Continuous attempts
were made to sow dissensions between landlords and tenants.
Till that system was put an end to there could be no hope
for the progressive improvement of the soil either morel!]]
or natured,. In order to permeate and energise the sod
below, the) must first of all clear away the weeds that en-
cumbered the surface. He hoped the house would not par
a bill which would spoliate the landlords, under the pretence
of benefiting the tenanuy, and which was therefore founded
on injustice. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. J. O'CONNELL said that the hon. and learned
gentleman had with the usual dexterity of an adsocate en-
deavoured to make the worse appear the better reason, by
distracting the attention of the house from the polio at
issue at the sacrifice of truth acd justice itself. -The
honourable and learned gentleman deprecated bitterness,
but his speech was full of bitterness. He arrogated a
superior moral tone for the people of Ulster above the rest of
Ireland. He repudiated any such pretension. Did not the
right hon. baronet the Home Secretary know, that there
were bands of orangemen allowed to wander about that
province, who were not to be found in any other
part of Ireland. He was afraid that the honourable
and learned gentleman, who professed to
.despise an
ignominious popularity, was himself pandering to the
pewee and prejudices of the landlords. The hon. and
learned gentleman said that the crimes which it was the ob-
ject of the special commission to try and punish were Lot
connected with the tenure of land. He (Mr. O'Connell)
maintain, d that every one of these. with the exceptien of
cases of abduction, could be traced to the insecurity of
tenure. The relation of landlord and tenant in Ireland was
a mere robbery of the latter fur the supposed benefit of the
former. The definition which he gave of tenant-right was
founded on the report of the Devon commission, and it
11,..
meant the tenant's right to sell his occupancy. Tenant- •
existed in Ulster, and the people therewere combo t••••
was en undisputed fact, and all he wan • -egret; .:
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same right aimed be extended to the rest ireledd. e •
li,
wanted that the tenant should not be turn oat phiseKet'•
cupancy without at least having the me nftztelee-
where. Under the present system, the to V, no
security, endeavoured to get as much as he tgeild out o the
land while be held it, but if he had any recurrtithrst it
would be left him he would permanently ailiorkst• ..LW'
..:. :