The Express.
London, England, 1853-08-05 00:00:00

THE EXPRESS, FRIDAY EVENING, AUGUST 5, 1853.

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.
HOUSE OF LORDS.—iIICRBDAY, AUGTST 4.
ROYAL ASSENT.
The Royal anent .0 given by commission to upwards of
10) bill., including the Sian don Duty Bill ; the COnigeOn
Lndging Reines Bill; Convicted Prisonen Removal and
Conanewient Bill ; Savings Binh' Annuities Bill; Coinage
Offences (Colonies) Bill; Colonial Bishops Ain Estension
Patronage Eschange Bill; "'acing Officers Bill; Common
Law Business (Ireland) Bill; Bankruptcy (Scotland) Bill;
Copylsold BM; Customs Decks Bill; Stamp Duties Bill;
Stamp Duties (No. 2) Bill; and a large number of railway
bills. _ _

chequer, to that effect, which, after a short coneemation,
was agreed to.
Some verbal amendments WIN is ndy:eel in other
clauses.
Lord J. RUSSELL then "weed to add the pedeiso of
which he bad given notice ea Tanday, to exclude Roman
catholic charities from the operation of the bill.
Sir F. TIMMER looked: with considerable alarm on
this amendment, and considered the introduction of the
words proposed into this bill pregnant with mighty copse-
quences. The noble lord bad Yid similar aneeptione
' had been introduced from time to time into similar bills,'
as for instance the bill for establishing the Charities Com-
mission, and that such an exception was in the bill of 183.5.
In that the noble lord was no doubt correct, but he had
far understated his own argument, for in every bill having
reference to the commission of inquiry into charities there
was this and other exemptions also. The 6 and 6of
William IV.,
C' passed in the year 1833, exempted the Uni-
versities sad Collage. of Oxford and Cambridge, the public
schools of Westminster and Eton, the cathedral churches,
and any charitable fends belonging to Jews, Quakers, or
Roman catholic', and in the bands exclusively of persons
belonging to those penunions. The noble lord is reading
this list of exceptions mid, he did not know that any claim
for exemption bad been set up by the Jews or by the
Quakers. Bat what did the noble lord mous by the ob-
serrations ? Was it that the Quaker and Jew had the 1
same right to the exemption, as the Roman catholic? if
that was the noble lord's meaning, did he mean it to be
inferred thatjustiee was only to be conceded to those who
demanded ? This bill did not in any way change
the law, but merely provided for the better adminis-
tration of existing trusts. As the law stood any one, or the
Attorney-Dental es officio, might file an Information and
impeach a Roman catholic trust, and if it was found to
come within the law against superstitious uses, the Lord
Chancellor would declare that trust void. But ne such
proceedings had ever taken place; therefore the house
would understand that there was not the slightest
alteration proposed in the law which would in the
least degree affect Roman catholic trusts. This bill
was introuduced into the House of Lords under the
sanction of the government, and it was suggested
there that any sucu exception was necessary, and it came
down to this house substantially as it was framed by the
House of Lord., and he would ask it it was fair that in
such a measure, at this period of the seances, and in the
present state of the house there should be introduced such
an important and formidable alteration, and whether the
proper wens would not be to leave the bill as it was—be
iOving as he did that it would not be injurious to the Ro-
man catholic' ; let them remain as was originally intended,
included under its operation ; then if it was found
that any real grievances or danger to their trusts
let the noble lord come forward with a healing measure,
and he (Sir F. Thesiger) would give it his cordial assist-
ance, and he believed that the g 1 feeling of the house
would be in favour of preserving !Leman catholic trusts.
Under these circumstances he should feel it his duty to
resist the addition of the words proposed by the noble
lord. (" Hear, hear," and cheers.)
Lord J. RUSSELL admitted that in many reepects this
was a question of confidenee on the one side and a
question of suspicion on the other. But he would show
that that suspicion on the put of the Roman catholic.
was justifiabt., and ens which ought to be listened to
by the house. The question was as it bad been stated
to him—he would deny it—by a Roman catholic bar-
rister—that many Roman =tholes charities were void in
point of law. The has. and learned gentleman said
that be (Lard J. It Gesell) had not mentioned that on die
second reading of the bill ; but he would show how the
matter had proceeded, and what was the fact ? When he
moved the second reading of the bill, be was eutitely igno-
rant of any each complaint, and not knowing of any such
grievance, and it was only just before they proposed to go into
committee, he was informed that suce apprehensions ex-
fated. The bon. and learned gentleman bad taken advan-
tage of some word, which he (Lord J. Russell) bad used
with regard to Jews and Quakers being excepted from in.l
juries under the bill of 1515. He had, however, mentioned,
that no complaint had been made by Jews and Quakers ;
but if there had been any such complaint, he would have re
quired them, as be would now, in the first place to state
that they felt themselves aggrieved, and in the next place
that there were adequate reasons for their exemption audit
they had failed in showing that he would have refused to
grant them any exemption. But the hooouratle and
learned gentleman said that it was quite sufficient for
Roman catholic, to have faith that the Attorney-
General would never think of bringing a suit to set aside
Raman catholic charities on the ground of their coming
wider the law against superstitious uses. At the same
time the bon and learned gentleman said what security had
they that any member of tho present government would
bring in a measure to apply the law to Homan catholic
charities. If there was no security that such • law would
be introduced, he (Lord J. Russell) would say likewise
that the Roman catholic* had no security that the Attorney-
General, be would not say the bon. and learned gentle-
man himself, or the hon. member for Warwickshire if he
was at the head of the law, would not
thick it his bounden duty to institute a suit
against charities, which is his view were promoting purpo.
see the most mischievous and supentitints. (" Hear, hear,'
and laughter.) It was his opinion that it was not safe
for Roman catholic charities to be included in the operation
of this act, and he (Lord J. Russell) should therefore
contend for the retention of the proviso.
Mr. NEWDEGATE opposed the proviso, sad protested
against the house giving its ,suction to a power given to
Cardinal Wiseman by the Court of Rome to deal with
!tomes catholic chanties.
Mr. HEADLAI( proposed as an amendment to the pro-
view words which would limit the duration of the exemp '
tics to two years.
Mr. BOWYER assured the hon. member for Warwick-
shire that the brief sent to Cardinal Wiseman and the pre-
sent Roman catholic bishops made no alteration in Roman
catholic charities.
Sir F. THESIGER could not accept the amended pro-
viso, because it laid down the principle of making a diffe-
rence between Roman catholic and other trusts.
The proviso as amended was then put.
The house divided—
For the proviso
Against it 76-11
Mr. PHI NN said it appeared that sumo intelligible prin-
ciple ought to be followed with respect to schools. lie
should move an amendment baying this for its object.
ROYAL COMMISSION.

The Lords Commissioners were—the Duke of Argyll, the
Margeis of Breads'base, and Lord Colchester.
YIN LOIU) CUVICILLOS took his seat at 5 o'clock
PETITION PRESENTED.
SALM or SPIMTI.—By Lord MILFORD, from limos,
against the sal, of ardent spirits.
EAST INDIA COMPANY.
Lord WINFORD presented • petition from the East
ladle Company in general court assembled against the bill
which hail Just pas.ed the House of Commons, complaining
that the bill propose,' to deprive the company of their right
to elect their one directors. The petitioners prayed that
the houso would preserve the efficiency and independ-
ence of the Court of Directors, and expunge
those clauses which bad inference to the Long.
awe of the crown. In presenting this petition
be must say that he fully concurred in its prayer. The
directors did not &sire to retain ezelusive power to them-
selves, but to share it with any persons parliament might
appoint. As, however, the duties of the Court of Directors
were now so °norms, the.proposal to reduce the number
of directors could hardly trejustified. The petition did not
seaanate from the Court of Directors, but from the Court of
Proprietors, Roving that their confidence in the directors
remained unsaaken, and that they approved of the mode in
which the affairs oflndia had hitherto been conducted.
______

Earl GRANVILLE was sure that the house would al-
ways receive with respect a petition emanating from any
considerable body of her Majesty's subjects. But he trusted
that the house would not, on the subsequent discussion
of the subject, yield to the request of the petitioners.

PARISH VESTRIES (No. 2) BILL:—MUNICIPAL
CORPORATIONS ACT AMENDMENT BILL.—
BURGH HARBOURS (SCOTLAND) BILL.
The above bills were read 'third time and passed.
BILECON COLLEGIATE CHURCH BILL.

This bill went through committee.
SUMMARY JURISDICTION (IRELAND) BILL.—
PETTY SESSIONS k IRELAND) BILL.
Them bills were read a third time and passed.
ENTRY OF SEAMEN BILL.
-- • •

Oa the gunmen that the house go into committee on this
The Earl of HARDWICKE said, he approved of the
general principle of the bill, and hoped it would make the
envies more popular ; hut he thought they would not in-
duce seamen to enter fir 10 years, unless they gave them
WIN large and immediate advantages.
The bill then went into committee.
Clauses 1 to 7 inclusive were agreed to without discussion.

On clause 8,
The Earl of ELLENIIOROUGH complained that, fa
consequence of an absolute limit having been fixed to the
number of men, great ineenvenience was often experienced
in manning her Majesty's ships. lie also remarked that
the i.w eniriev were nut of so good a description as they
seed to be, and that the manning of the navy pareally
was inferior now to what it vru during the war with Frame.
Earl OItAN VILLE said one great object contemplated
Is the bill was the prevention of the constant shifting of
mews by entering men for a longer period than heretoftre.
Notwithstanding the noble earl's last remark, he believed
there had a been a period when the navy stood so high
aa it did at present.
Clause 8, and the remaining clauses of the bill were then
agreed to.
PUBLIC

(SCOTLAND AND IRELAND)
BILL.
This bill was reported, with amendments.
TURNPIKE ACTS, As., CONTINUANCE BILL.
Passed through the same stage.
HIGHWAY RATES BILL.
This bill was read a third tiros.
SHERIFF COURTS (SCOTLAND) BILL.
This bill also was read a third time.
NATIONAL EDUCATION IN IRELAND.

The Earl of CLANCARTY, in pursuance of notice, in-
quired of her liteje.ty's g cot " at what time the
report of the Commissioners of National Education in Ire-
lead for IM2 would be laid before parliament ; also at what
time the following returns might be expected to be laid
spas the table of teat house, vin., returns respecting ed.-
intim I. Ireland moved for en the 7th March and 18th April
respectively, and return' moved for thi3rdk Jane last respect-
tag crime iu England, Scotland, and Irelaad respectively."
The eob!ti lord thought the government were highly repro-
IMssible for the manner in which they treated the ques-
tion. (Seas.)
The Earl of ABERDEEN said that he did not think it
moormary to enter on the present occasion 1110 or discussion
of the eyetem of national education in Ireland. H• presumed
it wwi bo aarogesseary for him to repeat that her ]ls sistre
gaisement could have no possible object In delaying or
audios any returns of the description asked for. But as
there was a delay in obtaining the returns which be (the
Host of Aberdeen) thought required explanation, he wrote
he Alois that eaplana'inn. Tht answer of the secretary to
the Nadonall Board of Education was, that the clerks were
an hew so plealblq, and were working extra hours in order
to prime sod at them ready. It would be impossible to
Yams am mode beim the end of the session, but every
neatly ereald be Web te have them prepared with as
little, Mint as goolkle. There was one portion of the ni-
ters, wbidt lima the wawa: of the forthcoming 19th
report, white be limit romind that morning, and which he
would bestir" keliessed to the noble earl, though he could
set lay it Of Hien 'On the table of the house. He hoped,
la the courier of the present month, to be able to lay the
whole of the 19th report on the table.
The Esti of CLANCARTY es reseed his dis,atisfaetioa
with the reply of the noble earl. It was now five months
alai* be asked for the retsina, and he was told that there
would be no delay is fernishiog them. His impression was
that the returns were deliberately delayed for the appose
of evading discussion and investigation.
The kid of ABERDEEN said that when the noble earl
Stated that there was a design to evade investigation, be
wee labouring under a species of hallucination which it
was difficult to comprehend. All he could do was to treas-
on the orders of the hens* to the proper officer, and to
ask he esplanstioe when he thought there had bees
tee great • delay In furnishing them. He bad done that,
sod having resolved the reply of t
eretisproarineatow. h
tention ost
sktiltlaght aim
_it was
dieereotet to noble earl.
Reel GRANVILLE said it was sot use, sites a
sell* Issi
ber silted for volundomas r•quiteturns, to complain of
dalm IMO furnish soon as Its whited.
The O Ndot I:M lintOM MedORK said that the maw of
want of tine so the part of the elleiele mold hardly apply
to the team *Mb bad Isis wilted be Ile loooshe ego by
the wide aid. II had bees vepootialsi that be, la 'deo-
=lqil essldtataT
a WI woks eissetto7, woe is Ay:: of
nth.
The Shosibt time had ben grew
strls OM N....
ir hash* wood at sem Vele*.

The Yeoman Usher of the Black • Rod here appeared at
the table and summoned the hoist to the Rouse of Lords,
to Ism the 'oral assent gives by commission to various
bills, for a list of which an Lords report.
The flitzazaa having recanted,
Mr. PHINN was happy to interim the hones that daring
the temporary teem which had taken place, the Solicitor
General had consented to amend the clause in accordance
with his views.
Sir R. H. INGLIS then proposed to add to the list of
anempdone, the royal hospitals la the City of Loudon,
lihieldtal, the Corporation of the Sons of the Clergy,
OM elegy Orphan Co .
.6., igesedame. to, and Corporation
reading if the bill flied
Tr
MUSSED TAXES BILL.
Some unitninali dames were added to this bill.
PILOTAGE BILL.
Lord J. KUSBELL mentioned that this bill would be
taken thourrew at 12 o'clock.
METROPOLITAN SEWERS ACTS CONTINUANCE
BILL.
This bill was postponed until Meaday neat.
HOUSE OF COMMONS.—TITURSDAY, Auo. 4. The house adjourned at 4 o'clock.
The Brialtan took the chair at 12 o'clock. The hoses resumed at six o'clock.
PUBLIC BUSINESS. TRU'K ACT AMENDMENT BILL.
BEDFORD CHARITY ESTATE BILL. Lord PALMERSTON moved that the order for the
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL, is swung the snood second reading of this bill should be discharged. The Elsa-
seberehewara: a.neyselary ens, brat the masters were. entitled to
readiag of this bill, esplsined that its object was to far before • committee ; m
he therefore proposed to
Pm* and amend, the edmiMetreebne of the charity. The beam in a bill early neat session, and give bothmasters
dimity, as it was now administered, was made an intim aid men an opportunity of stating their respective views.
aeon he polislai itstrigu in the borough, while many of He w...uld move that the bill be read a second time that day
the eail'fiai truism so far forgot their duty to the publie, three months.
as he diololhooll Portions of the charity eolooloe thole ow* 111 r. C. FORSTER eapreesed his disappointment at the
Immediate fOlati•OL bill being withdraws, and maid he hoped it would be brought
Sr J. WALMSLEY (in the abases of the two hen- forward early neat yea r.
oust& members for the borough) had bees requested by The motion was d
agree to.
esearal oPthe inhabitants to represent to the house their
linagnones to the present hill, which they stated to be ad- OFFICE OF SPEAKER.
verse Nebo wishes of nineteen out of every twenty of the Sir R. H. INGLIS said this subject bad already been
istepayers, several times before the house, and had been received with
Sir F. THESIOER remarked that what he theneht encouragement. The report of the committee had been
bodied to the vicious system whieb sew prevailed was Mimed to unanimously, and there had been no &n-
-th, law which allowed 18 of the trances to he sins on the quenioa. For his part be thought the
usaally elected by the soot sad lot voters of the committee did not go far enough in proposing a remedy for
borough. This low bad enabled seedy sun to get the editing evils, which all deplored. It was &tensity
late the Trust, and the coasequense was that while that some one should he empowered to fill the chair of the
many relatives of these trustees had become recipients house when the Speaker was unavoidably absent. Consider.
ed the charity, mind the trustee. himself was actually as ing bow thankfully they ought to regard the long cantina-
Inmate of the shapeliest which the shark, supported. It since of the Speaker's presence among them, they must be
was hardly tasty that yeah wee mold administer the careful not to tax his strength and ies too far. In the
chanty with strict jespartjajjty, and heap this =emir" course of last month the house had sat 22 days, and 223
had been intrmisnsd at the earnest @stmty of some of tits boors, giving in average of more than ten hours to each day.
mom mysembis and inensithd inhabitants of the Immo. The Speaker had taken the chair on must of those days at
The house then divide whey there appeared,— 12 o'clock, and on several days had sat in the hone more
Fee F the seemed
Theirit B-62 day, 10 hours; Tuesday, 151 hoots; Thursday, 14 hours;
s:t
a assordingly teed a second time, and ordered and Friday, 131 hour,. 'l be attention of toe Speaker
to be committed, to his duties was suck as very few other human beiags—
The order of the day for the second reading of the Upper certainly very few members of that house—would be able
ladle Railway Fill was discharged. to give. Ile would now move that the house should concur
NEW WRIT. with the committee in the following resolutions :—" That
On the motion of Mr. HATTES. • new writ was ordered wb the Ileum shall be informed of the unavoidable
for the southern Division of siniyordshiso in the mu of absence of Mr. Speaker, the chairman of the Committee of
Ways and Means do take the chair for that day only "
Major-Geural Amon, who since his elution had aocepted „
the Chiltern Hundreds. And in the event of Mr. Speaker's absence continuineOr
CHARITABLE TRUSTS BILL. more than one day, do, if the home shad think fit, and
Lord On the motion that this hill be countered u amended,
J.USSELL had grest pleura in seconding the
shall so order it, take the chair in like manner on any sub-
tor during such absence."
oent da y
The SOLICITOR-GENERAL obtained leave to add •
se
clause to the bill, relative to the rights and jurisdiction is 1
certain
hu of jtjesthe Palatine Court of the county of i motion of his bon friend, and be trusted it would meet
Luicaster. with the concurrence of the house.
TheSOLICITOLGENERAL also proposed to add a clause Mr. BRIGHT thought the committee was doing all that
enabling trustees to purchase lands as sites for building was necessary to remedy the Inconvenience ; for he bed been
re from persons who we under disability. This clause wool !in the house about ten year, and bad not known more than
oorrimpend with a Singh!' clause in the Land Clauses Con- 1 one occasion when the Speaker had not been able to take
addition Act. the chair. It might be a great hardship with him on some
Agreed to, as was also • clause robstituted for clause 20,1 omeMage ; if so, that was an argument for the change
is which several amendments had seen introduced in Co.. about to be made. But as the chairman of the committees
mittee. This clause gives trustees power to apply moneys `of ways and means would have a new character and dignity
for works and improvements, and In payment of debts in- from the passing of this resolution, his own appointment
courted tor such purposes mitt to be made in a manner different from what had
Lord J. RUSSELL, anticipating that the business of the hitherto prevailed. Ile said this the more freely, being
eeestajedem would diminish after the hest two or three the last person who would object to the appointment of
years, seating the commission, after 31st March Ur. B.uiverie. He had no objection to the resolution of
1867, rilim:ri to
onnwitsioner ; and that with regard to the the committee.
ether tormaniskeste, he should receiyn his salary of 1,2001. g Mr. DISRAELI said he thought the resolution cape.
year only to that dam; and be moved an amendment is the dime, and the best that could be come to. Almost every
4412 Wallas at the instance of the Chancellor of the En- oembiaatitin of eircumstaacts that could occur respecting