The Express.
London, England, 1853-05-20 00:00:00

HACKNEY CARRIAGES BILL.

On the motion for going into committee on this bin,
Sir R. INGLIS said he regretted to detain the Louse, but
the subject of this bill was so new and important that be
hoped other members were not in the same state of ignor-
ance as he had been with regard to the amount of property
involved. They bad dealt with property in one civision
of hackney carriages,—namely, that of omnibuses, exceed-
ing 1,700,000/ , and as regarded cabs something like 800,0001.
was involved. Besides this the livelihood of many thousands of
persons was involved, and when that was considered, the
question of pounds, shillings, and pence was merged in the
higher consideration of the permanent interests itvolved.
A bill involving interests so high was never submitted to
the house without a previous investigation of the subject.
He was sure his hon. friend, whose name was on the back
of the bill, did not know, or, if he did, he had not infermed
the house, that precisely the same bill was brought forw..rd
eighteen or nineteen years ago, and was submitted to the
tribunal to which he wished this bill to go.
It was not usual to legislate on these subjects withcnt a
previous investigation by a select committee. Hod his hon.
friend satisfied the house that he had investigated the
matter, and that he was prepared without consulting the
parties interested to fix the amount they were to recei se for
their remuneration. But the bill involved other considera-
tions. It involved the liberty of the subject. In the 14th
clause there were a number of offences without any defined
penalties, but clause 7 enacted that if any offence were
committed against the provisions of the act to which no
specific penalty was attached, the magistrate before whom
the conviction took place might either inflict a penalty of
40a., or a term of imprisonment not exceeding a month.
He moved that the bill be reterted to a select committee.
Lard D. STUART seconded the amendment. .

Mr. FITZROY considered the hon. baronet and the
noble lord had failed to make out any sufficient cave for a
select committee. They had only suggested amendments
which could be well enough discussed In the committee of
the whole house. The amendment would, in fact, destroy
the chance of the bill's ever becoming law. The select com-
mittee would only take the evidence of cab and
omnibus proprietors, for who would there be to represent
the public interests ? (Hear, hear.) The house itself
was quite competent to consider the entire subject. (Hear,
hear.) Tho hon. baronet was somewhat in error in saying
that there had been no measure respecting hackney car-
riages for It) years; for the act by which the licensing
system was established was passed is the Gth and 7th year
of the present reign. The powers proposed to be given to
the commissioners of police were not more than were abso-

lowly essential to the efficient working of the measure, and
av they would be exercised under the control of the Home
Secretary there need be no fear lest they should be abused.
The power of appeal contended fur would render the bill
nugatory, for it might permit hones and vehicles wildly
unlit for public use to be employed for a period of nearly
three months after the license had been suspended. (Hear,
hear.) When hon. members talked of the immense amount
of property embarked in the trade, they should also bear in
mind the immense number of persons using public vehicles
in the metropolis. Allowing each omnibus to have only
250 passengen per diem, it would give • total of 300 mil-
lions of persons conveyed in a single year. (Hear, hear.)
He should certainly resist the amendment. (Cheers.)
Mr. B. DEXISON supported the proposal for a select
committee.

Sir J. SHELLEY remarked that neither the hon. bart.
nor the noble lord noticed the great feature of the bill--
namely, the reduction of fares ; a reduction which he (Sir
J. Shelley) thought would prove in the long run beneficial
even to the proprietors themselves. (Hear, hear.) lion.
members had alluded to the property invested in cabs and
omnibuses; but he appealed to the house whether there
was a large town either in England or on the continent
where the public vehicles were of so wretched a character.
As an instance of the good that would result from the bill,
be might mention a circumstance which had recently we
curred to himself. Some days ago he Lad accidentally
left a large bundle of papers distinctly marked with his
name in a cab, and it was only that very day thecae
Hansom cabdriver—(a laugh)—had brought them to his
house in the hope of obtaining a reward. If the bill had
been law he should have been furnished with a ticket spe-
' cifying the number of the cab, and should have been able
to find the driver in an hour or two. (Hear, bear.)
Mr. NEWDEGATE, amidst some impatience, dwelt on
the public inconvenience of the proposed enactment, by
which he supposed any passenger in an omnibus who might
have a dispute with the conductor might demand to be
driven from police office to police office until he found one
open.
It was, however, explained to the hon. gent:cman that
the clause only applied to cabs.
Mr. MALINS said the present cabs were a di,.graca to
Vie metropolis ; they were nothing but boards famed toge-
ther. (Hear, hear.) They had no springs, and the drivers
. were the most ignorant men in the world ; they did out

1

hews ILe dilference be ea-t and west, re north and §
sth. sena ) There ought to be an examination of
• n.• !h es well as the cabs. Ile hoped the hoe. geutle-
ycs suited
persertru with his bill, there was no necessity
tu,stec.v es feud it to a committee up stairs. (hear.)
Xi% Lilldll f sai•l as t' ere was al much willingness on
the part of the promoter of the Li:l to receive suggkstions
fo ,u,pru§cruent, a committee of the house might answer
mil a. a cow miller up stairs. But they should beware
datiusitig their feelintrs to lead them away in legislating
es *Lis subject; la perhaps se class of the public used
ohs mire than the naeuib••rs of parliament. Ile thought
th.jeii tr. 'acre ofurn and p. rhapa they were •pt to
lle intoned many of the e .mplaints made against
thou to the want of • proper municipal government is
'hy which the accessary rimulatioc§ might have
b.s' nnide. Ile did nut antic`. pate touch good from the
bd., bat Inhering the lion. geutlemsu was nut obstinate in
imt.strung the hill as it stood, he would vote for the house
ij lat..e.mmittre.
ItTEI: referred to the privations to
which Oar cahrut n were subject, and the temptations to
shish tiny IS, re eapowd. They admitted that Wally itII-
Djullalatata e.ipahle of being effecled by legislstion
who had gad calls would readily 'Omit to the
.u. Ile was to favour of the hail being referred to a
eel. c: e.
Mr. LOCKS said the cals-oween ought not to be pre-
lid Crum before a Select Committee. ILO such
soon, Len propustil with reference to any larger intt rest
it would at once have beta acceded to as a matter of justice.
It'sile math imprus,mt lit was required iu the cabs, and a
hill hr that purp,c might be neee•sary, they ought not at
the ~m' time to twist on a reduction of the farts, which
w,a:l he an iuterfer ace with the rights of property and
commit:4d eaterprise.
'I he house then divided:
for going into committee
Ao.smat
The house th n went jute committee, and immediately
afterwards resumed
CONVICTED r4IftpnyS...._RESIOVAL AND CON-

FINEMENT BILL.
The bin was read a eteond time.
CLITHEROE.

Oa the motion of Sir O. GOODMAX, a new writ was or-
&reelThho
lor
use sojourned shor ihr e!ection of wintly otter I. ember for Clitheroir.
e

PARLIAMENTARY DIT7SION.

HOUSE OF COMMONS-LAST NIGHT.

fL`IIIY7.-11A—VNOOT11.11R.N SPOONER'S ARILNDNENT.
Ay Ls 71. oes H.
ATEi.
-

And,r,cl s,r J. Gwyn. Iftwrei Montgomery, Sir 0.
Arbail, ~t,llon.Ges. 11..01,1.1, George Takhsgton, air J.
Papa., W. Hamilton. Lord C. Perim, Aos:ey
EALte, 11. J. Mane, Alt:. Phials, Thomas
Barrow, W. U. lia•tle, Archibald Itobertson, P. F.
Sc.!, J. liiglia, Sir B. U. &obeli. Captain
r gv, W. Jones, Capt. Scott, Hon. Francis
5t1..11. L W. Joan, David Seymour. W. D.
But rr, C. S. lenting, N.B. Shelley, Wr J. V.
Bat. U. Al. licnotill, Madan South, W. M.
Cart, U. M. Kershaw, JAWS S.:.oiilEt, Alexander
Chon'i./1, M. Kinnmrd, lion. A. r. Stu ,rt, lord D.
Ch.;', S. Lee, ism. Taylor, Colonel
C10g..., Lied C. P. Lockhart, Wm. Tollernache, John
Cob t, J. 31. Ling. Walter Turner, Charles
Rim, at Ilon. II L. Lmther, Hon Col. Vance, J Auk
CtAU:g.i.r.i. L. U. J. Maarcipw, Ju. Vamittart. O. H.
Vales D. A. 8. ht•Creg. r, John - Verner, Mr W.
leuusnraal, B. IV fAiegat, dir John Waloott, Mmtral
MM.% U. MAIL ~ itt.:hard WU una Willi-all
Pergus*n, Jr Martin, John Wordd, pall T.
Ir.oer J. Massey, W. N. Wince, W. W. Z.
FM w. J. Maittflll in, John
Paso" Coked Miall. E.da .rd 'RUIZ&
G......0aa, Su 0. Milligan, oiacrt Spooner, Mr.
o..ire, W. 0. Melia. William bream; Mr.

-----• - - - 1
NOES.
Atiand, Sir T. D. Graham, sir J. Ricardo, 0.
iliCoart, C. H. W. GlV"e• J. Rowell, Lord..
Atherton, W. Ilsomsr. Sir J. nee, W.
Eases. it Weli.T. II aid, J. I. Strait, Mt. lion. E.
berlieley,C. L. O. Ikasey. D. OConnor swift. K.
Ilene I, IL llerbert, S. 'nutted, FL W.
&or, er, 0. Ihrrey, Lard A. 'Maltese', R. A.
31-417, J. Hutt, W. Thornily, T.
Br. therm.. J. illhlllll. R. Towneley, C.
Ordwell, kt.flow. E. liooticg. R. Walmsley, Slr J.
Cluirurris, Iles. F. Lucas, V. Wilkinson, W. A.
Coy, sir W. Noheworth, Sir W. Wuloos, B. N.
l&les.ra, Sir A.J.E. Non.ell. W. Wilson, J.
tr.,wder, B. B. Narrough, J. I'. Winologton, Sir T. Z.
An„J. D. Oitioirms, S. wina, K.
taro, w. reel. F. Young, lit. Roo. Sirl.
Ifanir, Doe. H. l'hillipps, J. Ili. TILLIAIL
fon. L. ii. Power, N. Ilayter, W. 0.
WailstoacJlLlluir.W. Prise, Sir IL Maim.% Earl of
FAIRS ON THE GRAY? TO MAYNOOTE.—Iir. F. Scully
for, with Mr. Sanders against; Mr. F. Known fog, with
Mr. Palmer against; Sir John Ramadon 10r, with Mr. P.
Bennet against.