The Express.
London, England, 1851-06-14 00:00:00

THE EXPRESS, SATURDAY EVENING, JUNE 14, 1851.

bees a priaeipal feature in the °See of the Lied Chew 1 gaol ofor that if it is thought right that the
IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. Mier. To that, likewise, I believe, the house was disposed , Lord abnimallor should be commuted with political affairs
--- to assent I further stated that it was desirable that the —if thee eannexima between the Lord Chancellor and I
ROUSE OF COMMONS.—FIUDAT, .11:s6 13. Lord Chancellor should remain the Speaker of the House the executive government is not to be dissevered—then it j
of Lords, and should still preside in the House of Lords as is very desirable that the Lord Chancellor should he able to
The SPIAIIIII Wilk the chair at 4 o'clock. the highest court of appeal in the kingdom. I considered give his mind fully and deliberately to the political quer 1
PRIVATE BUSINESS. that tae house abo agreed that the Lord Chancellor should dons while eerie Wan bias. Per them room I
The Lade aniondineets to the Briton Ferry, Docks, and
mown,.
and the hesth Deem. Railway Bills, were cowl- retain thes.: functions. I then proposed, in order to relieve think it Misll dr bars gheeld adept liM
dived
sad
„mod to.him fro= tome portion of his present labours, that other tion whisk I isow wake, and that it shod' eoread Irefferet 1
judges sh odd sit in the Court of Chancery, either to assist to bring in a bill which shall establish two new judges in
'ennui RIADIIIO•.—The following bills were read a third
rim, or, dureing his absence, to carry on the judicial bud- ' the Court of Chancery, to be called Judges of the Court of!
einio and rowed : Copper Miner% in England Company ;
Dahlia. Thisdesoi. ad Rothfaeohom Roilemy;. omot Mel. seer of '.h Lord Chancellor's Court. I stated that I Appeal, and who shall have the functions I have described.very
thought that the Master of the Rolls end one of the judges With respect to the financial view of this question I have to
were Improvement, Police Sewers, Waterworks, flas, and
mutat. ; sheiveshure ithi Chester Railway i and Water- of the commas law courts might perform those functions. observe that Ido not think the burthen will be exceedingly
And this was a proposition to which great objection heavy upon the public, ; because I propose, as I stated on
Red, Wexford, Wicklow, and Dublin Railway. was made. It was urged,
. for instance, that it would be im- a former occasion, that the Lord Chancellor should in future
/DLLS CoxisIDIBMID.—The following bills were considered
possible to obtain the assistance of the Master of the Rolb receive only 10,000!. a year instead of the 14,000!. which
end agreed to : Cheltenham Improvement and Health ;
without taking him away from his own court, god thereby he hes hitherto received, the retiring pension to remain uRI
East Anglian Railways ; Electric TcicgraV Company ; ^
:emmh-opoo. depriving the public of that judicial assistance in that di- now is, whereby there would be a saving 0( 4,000!. a year.
MagutElectric Telegraph Company ; reet.ou to which they were entitled. Now dace I obtained I aleo propose that the Master of the Rolls, who has hitherto ,
Trent Improvement and Market ; and United Kingdom
leave from the home to introduce the former bill on the received 7,0001. a year should for the futare have only i
Mlectrie Telegraph Company.
(Southwark) subject. 1 have endeavoured very generally to collect opi- 6,000!. a ear,y and this being a Baring of 1,0001. a year, I
Sect's") Raisin et a.—T he Christchurch '
with, on this subject from those wlio are most conversant there would be, on the whole, in regard to the Lord Chau-I
Parish Bill was read second time, with its difilculties—from come persons holding judicial eellor and the Master of the Rolls, a saving of 5,0001. a
PUBLIC BUSINESS.
NEW MEMBER. positions—from other learned gentlemen who have a large year. With regard to the two new judges to be appointed
amount of practice in the Court of Chancery—and from by the crown, I propose that they should be placed on the
Sir A. CA m ,the newly-elected member for Ar-
others who hare been formerly conoected with that court. same footing, as to salary, as the Master of the Rolls—that
gyleohire, ,took the oaths and his mat. lie was introduced
And, among others, I received a letter from my lamented is to say, that each of those judges should receive 6,0901. •
by Sir K. laglis and Sir J. Hope.
PETITIONS PRESENTED. friend, the late Lord Cottenharn--an authority which is en- year. Thus there would be an increased expense of 12,000'.
titled, on every account, to be listened to on this question a year to be taken out of the Suitors' Fund, set off by a
1111111WATIII AMP MAIWATE II ensues Due.A.—By Mr. objections to the proposal which saving, on the other hand, of 5,9001. a year. But I eon- I
ANDERSON. from the Steam ship Owners' Association of —(hear, nes )--tdabing
made to lust ; and stating that, in his template another great convenience from this arrangement,
London, eomplalaing that no measure had yet been adopted I bad
to
give drat ti, the recommendation of a select committee opinion., the measure ought to be directed rather if it should be adopted by the house. I certainly should expert
the Lord Chancellor than to relieving that, both in the Court of Chancery and in the general bud-
of last Wasioll of paritainenk:to relieve shipping from the to relieving
I the court in which he presided. On the whole, I deemed ness of the country, we should derive some advantages from
heavy and unnecessary tolls now levied for supporting
itamsgate and Marge o harbours, and to substitute for the i it far better to submit the question to the consideration of enabling the Lord Chancellor to relieve himself from some
same moderate tonnage dues sea vessels actually
using those I such authorities, than to proceed with the bill to which parts of his judicial duties. And the house will observe
harbours.
!persons whose opinions were of so much weight offered such that in this proposal, as in the former proposal, I do not at-
. Mr. SPOONER, from ; v..trnag Plifin.vit.ii.m• (Hear :hear.) I will now state., there- tempt in any way to diminish the dignity of the Lord
-- - "bancellor ; I do not -- to change the character of
- • ....

KILLA.II /ROM NRIMATT--Ily Mr. o.
Henry Edwards, a prisoner confined in Newgate fur a
breach of the privileges of the House of Commons, stating
that he was deeply contrite for his misconduct, that be was
miff. ring from Oily's*, that his farm of 200 acres was going
to ruin because there wen no one to mind it in his absence,
that he had now been confined right weeks, and that he
threw himself on the mercy of the house, confidently hoping
that he would be speedily discharged from custody.
COrilt./LI/ Lawns.—Dy Mr. BEST, from Kiddermin-
Myr. preying for the speedy enfranchisement of copyhuld
nee.
METROPOLITAN WATER.
Sir MOREY moved that it be an instruction to the Com•
mints of Selection to refer the several bills connected with
the supply of water to the metropolis to the same committee
to which the Metropolis Water Bill is to be referred.
Agreed to.
ADJOURNMENT OF TIIE HOUSE.
It was agreed that the house at it. rising should adjourn
to Woodsy.
ALLEGED OPPRESSION OF A BRITISH MER-
CHANT BY THE VENEZUELAN GOVERNMENT.
Mr. DISRAELI bold in my hand a petition,
which gave notice about a week ago I would present to
the home. It is • petition from a British merchant of the
ease of Mr. George Ward, long resident at Caracas, in the
state of Venezuela. Ile states that having been esta-
blished at Csracas fur mire than a quarter of
a century. and being mainly instrumental in pro-
ducing that state of commercial relations between
Venezuela and this country which was established about
two years ago, he was suddenly arrested at his pri-
vate residence by the government of Venezuela, thrown
iato • cosmos prison, and there kept as a prisoner 28
days, in violation of all the principles of the constitution of
that country, sad of all the ruler of legal procedure ac-
knowledged there, and which regulate the relation of the
subjects of that state with the government: in violation
also, he states, of that treaty of ComiTle'ree, which in the
year 1825 was carried into effect between this country
and the state of Venezuela, and under which
protection was secured to all British subjects,
and wader which and coeval with which the establishment
of Mr. George Ward at Caracas took place. The petition
also states that, afterthe termination of those 20 days—the
government not being able to substantiate any charge what
ever against him, and he having been arrested only on a
vague suspicion that he was connected with wine revolu-
tionary transactions in the interior provinces of the state—
he was dismissed from the prison by the government, but
kept as a prisoner in Caracas fur the space of seven
month.. Ile states that in consequence of his first
imprisonment, and his subsequent detention within
the walls of the city of Caracas for seven months, his affairs
were greatly injured,--especially a coffee estate, situate
shout two days' distance from Caracas, which was under
his superintendenee. was wasted in a great dere°, and,
after be was free, in consequence of representations made
by the British government, the damages he incurred with
respect to this coffee estate were assessed, accord-
ing to the custom of the country, and by one of the
lewd tribunals of the country, at the amount of
25,1100 dollars. He states that, beyond this claim
of 35,000 dollars, he has another of 2.4,000 dollars, in
consequence of the initiate and injuries he received, espe-
cially as regarded his lousiness in Caracas. He states that
in consequence of not having received any redress from the
government of Venezuela be has come over to Ensiond,
and that he has appealed to her Majesty's governineets but
hitherto without receiving redress. He states that there JO
ao doubt of the validity of his claim on the goverment* of
Venezuela, because that government has partially /OW
uisesl it, inasmuch as, in consequence of the represses
lotion of her Majesty's government, they appointee&
compensation to the amount of 241 a day for the
26 days he was in the prison, making Gio/., which he, under
protest, has received, end which does not amount to the
legal exposes be incurred in consequence of that iroprisoa-
meat. He slats, that not having received redress from her
Mejesty's government with respect to this claim on the
Vesemselea government, he has thought it his duty to
appeal to the House of Commons.
The petition was oedered to lie on the table.
HAULBOWLINE ISLAND.
Mr. Serjeant MURPHY gave notice that on Monday,
before going into committee of supply. he would call apse-
Lou to the want of
.Inealla for repairing steam vesicle at

tae, obit I think can be done. One measure which might
him been taken, and which origin illy was much considered
by the government, and indeed, contains the idea on which
the bill of Lord Cottenham, of 1836, was founded, was a
measure for entirely separating the judicial functions of the
I.ord Chancing, I. the Court ul Chancery from the judicial
functions of the Loud Chmeellor in the House of Lords, and
also from all the *idea functions attached to the office :
that is to say, leaving a chief judge to sit in the Court of
Chancery, and another judge, holding the title of
Lord Chancellor (so we undentood the noble lord, who,
however, at intervals wan imperfectly heard), presiding in
the House of Loma, and continuing the exercise of political
functions. The objection made to that plan, and which
was eertisialy found to be entertained by persons to whose
authority I feel myself, in this matter, compelled to bow,
was that unless the judge i 3 at some tune or other, during
same pert of the exams of his judicial functions, in an
esigisal court, he will net be able to preserve that ability
whisk he saterally poaaawe, and that his decisions would
not carry that weight which attends the decision of the
' Lord Chancellor or of say other learned person in a similar
eituatitm to that of the Lord Chancellor sitting in the Court
of Chancery, and et the ors time exereisix4; the functions
of • judge of elliatehli appeel. That was an opinion to
which I was comotholered to submit; it rested on the state-
ments of 'pastor, beginning with Sir Samuel [tonally, fa-
miliar with the subject; and it would have been obviously
impossible to have introduced • measure so opposed.
Another course which would have been open to
me was to persevere with tie measure which I ob-
tained leave to introduce, and the objections to which
I have detailed. Another mode of legislation would have
been to appoint a vice-chancellor or some person holding
• similar title, who should sit in the place of the Lord
Chancellor when he was detained elsewhere, either by his
politicalpoliticalduties, or by his judicial duties in the House of
Lords. To that plan, however, the objection arose, that
although the name and the authority of the Lord Chancellor
carried such weight that the Lord Chancellor might sit
alone—yet, if you bad a judge who was of no higher au-
thority or title than the Master of the Rolls, or a Vice-
Chancellor, the appeals tried being appeals to one subordi-
nate judge as against another, you would never be able to
satisfy either the public or the profession. There remained,
then, only the plan which I now propose, and which I
have found recommended by agreat concurrence of opinion.
This plan is, that during the absence of the Lord Chancel-
lor there should sit in his court two judges, appointed
for that special purpose, to ho called judges of the
appellate court, and who either, at one time sitting with
the Lord Chancellor, or, in his absence, sitting together,
ms decide in the clauses which are to be reheard or ap-
ed from the Master of the Rolls or the Vice-Chnneellors.
. ow, the only objection that I can foresee as likely to be
made to such a proposal is that it is • great amount of judi-
ael force, and that • great amount of additional expense
Seall faaillher upon the country or upon the suitor's fund.
on the ether hand, we have to consider that a very
peat book b to be conferred. I cannot exaggerate the
"idea mhillt I, myself, entertain in consideration of the
eppreedve duties of the Lord Chancellor—of the
taxes of his 2*.itaiiiing some further time for the exer- '
she of other duties than those which he now alone per-
forms in the Court of Chancery. In the first place,
with respect to his judicial duties, we have to
bear in mind that the amount of property which
is hams* auto the Court of Chancery, and the
umber of causes which arc brought into that court, and
widish are heard by the various judges who sit in that
searkhave gene on increasing. Since the introduction of
the MI is appoint a Vice-Chancellor, in 1813, the increase
bus been mormerw. I have before me a return which has
been mode to the House of Lords with respect to the quan-
tity of buelsoss dose between Nov. 2, 18.50, and May 30,1851.
With regard to appeal motions and special motions, In that
time, the Lord Chancellor has had 36 • ' the Master of the
Rolls, 273 ; Vice-Chancellor Knight Bruce, 878 ; Vice-
' Chancellor LordCranworth,679; and Vice-Chancellor Turner,
who has only recently been appointed, has had 21 ; making
the number 1,887 of that class of business. With regard to
petitions, the Lord Chancellor has had 16 ; the Master of
the Rolls, 333 ; Viee-Chancellor Bruce, 886 ; Vice-Chan-
cellor Lord Craaworth, 1,051 ; and Vice-Chancellor
Turner, 27: total, 293. The causes of exceptions, further
directions, pleas, and danarren were thus divided :—The
Master of the Rolls, 96; Vice Chancellor Bruce, 353 ;
"..neellor Cranworth, 216; and Vice-Chancellor

; . Propose
his functions. I should leave him both as a political judge
connected with the executive government and to preside an
the House of Lords; and I should likewise leave him to sit
in the Court of Chancery and to carry on the ordinary
business of that court. I certainly, however, think, in the
palmist circumstances, and remembering how greatly busi-
ame bas increased in the Court of Chancery, that it is im•
=that the Lord Chancellor can continue with any
to the public to undertake the whole of the duties
mil& be has hitherto performed. But, as I have said, if
this pima is carried out, it will likewise enable me
Its tusks another change which would be most
beesiteial, I mean in the Judicial Committee o
tie Privy Council. It appears that upon various
tenalsions great difficulty has been experienced in obtaining
neffilikient number ofjudges for the judicial committee. It
b welded by the act that four judges shall make a quorum
Isibe judicial committee; and oftentimes it is • matter of great
piegkeity how to procure the four; and I know that an
ba, sad learned gentleman opposite his complained that
Mader to get the quorum, the administration of stice in
rasamarts boo been interfered with, and the Master of
lbe /alb his hem eingetied to leave his own court, to the
IRONS din bob= brims his own court. I should also
maths dirt It is preeelled by the act, with regard to the
jeflishlimmittee, that the puisne judges of the courts of
esamea kw, who are privy councillors, may sit on that
sensmitese. Objections to this practice crow—not very
grave objections, but still worthy of attention ; and it was
urged as unfair for the crown toselect certain persons out of
the list of puisno judges, and to give them a rank and dig-
nity not belonging to other judges. And, on all accounts,
it was desirable to avoid questions of dignity and preciidesau
What I propose, therefore, is not e that the
jes two udg of the Court of Appeal, if privy
councilors, should be members of the Judicial Committee,
but also that three, instead of two, should be a quorum of
the committee. I think that, with this arrangement, it
would seldom be difficult to obtain a quorum; and it trill
be seen that in this case, as in the others, I de net
to change the constitution of the court. TM Juiisisl
Committee has, I think, worked usefully; it le regarded
with great respect; and all I propose is, to enable it to
work with greater facility in the performance of its present
functions. The noble lord in conclusion moved for leave to
bring in " a bill to improve the administration of junto,
in the Court of Chancery, and the Judicial Com-
mittee of Privy Council," and "a bill to regulate the
salaries of the Chief Justice of the Court of Queen's
Bench, and the Chief Justice of the Court of Common
Pleas."
Mr. STUART thought that the house would perceive
an illustration of the remark of the noble lord in reference
to the dangers of ill-digested and ill-considered legislation
in the proceedings of *at day. When they remembered
that the noble lord in the early part of the session intro-
' clued a measure and stated opinions on this question
essentially differing from the measure now introduced and
the opinions now expressed, they would see a new warning
not to do anything in a hurry. Much of the pressure which
now existed in the Court of Chancery had arisen from the
reckless manner in which business had been thrown upon
that court, of a kind which did not properly belong to it
and it might be useful to inquire how far a portion of that
business could not be advantageously transferred to some of
the other courts, and how many of the cases referred to took
no time whatever to dispose of. Having dwelt upon the diffi-
culties that surrounded the subject, and noticed the fact that
the Lord Chancellor, the Master of the Rolls, and one Vice-
Chancellor were new to office, haying occupied their several
poets but a few months or weeks, Mr. Stuart trusted that
no inconsiderate step would be taken, and recommended
the prime minister to postpone pressing his measure until
next session.
Mr. BETHELL regarded this measure as an instalment
of the reform that was wanted in the Court of Chancery,
es pin conjunction with another bill, which would
relieve the Masters' office of great part of the pressure which
now impeded its functions. The objection of Mr. Stuart
was in the very spirit of Chancery delay. The
scheme of the noble lord was the result of the collective
opinions of the most competent persons, and could
'not be termed ill-considered legislation. His hon. and
learned friend would be happy to learn that there was
another bill in progress, which would, in a most material
degree, facilitate the administration of the Court of Chan-
and relieve
.the Masters from a great portion of the

Island, cove of CO6.

inquire whether
it was the intention of the government to supply that de-
ficiency.
WIRINESS OF THE HOUSE.
On the nation of Lord J. RUSSILL, it was agreed, after
rmonatrances [ISM MT. DIA ILI. Mr. W. WILLIAMS. and
Lord MAAS, that efts, the tat of July orders of the day shall
take precedence et nestions on Thursdays.
During the ronmweation which took place on the subject,
Kir D. UAL!. put a questrm to the Secretary of State
for the HAMM De t. If the motion were pared, the
goverment woMld be afforded time for bringing forward
their MITIIIIMISO sad he wanted to know whether they
tarried to isdreduse a hill to continue the present rem-
arias er sewers, or a bill to alter the eliding codstitu-
ties of that moutimiess ?
Led 1. &MILL said that his right hon. friend the
Ann Matey ward bring in • hill ea the subject, bet
that. efeeerse, its purport canal met mew he rated. Ile
them* the astir Aare the he.. perk* reseesalds.
Ormersat bad M iatrodaes several merlins, wad to
=he with the simpßes—the military, naval,
mad estimates. At the 'arms of the am
ism Tuesdays. Wedweedays, mad were at the
=of Ora ma
ells
rat theme sosiabese were she
epperraides for salmaitrui madam ea =cis
eirmillee of 'apply. The government. on the other
lad at the meet sally eight days at their disposal is the
anions ; aai yet, ivies two months of the simian bed
Aped. K was freaseutly said that government had
flow awestorward, forgetting that Day had ZZ
.sly slalom days ea whkb they could have dame so. (Hear,
bear) It was well Maya that there was a better
attewleace of members is hay Ikea be the cubic.-
worst meatles—(' hear, bear," made laugh)--and therefore
it wag desirable that the genniassat 'bald have the
Tlaindsp is that math. if the miles wereha
would Am be able is la s day he the
math.. of the rm. member for Mastrme, withathe
Bonsai.
Mr. H. lIRRBERT mad that a bill called "the Sun
sides he Advaasee (Inilaad) Bid" wan ben& hi Lit an
den mai witithwr Ho
not
to luny wham II wet
lanaled to Wag is • noir bill this nor. lansia.
M, me it MOO Wanly allissWil de, every nweithithe 111
diamisiog it aught bt
got O. OBIT slid that Aar the hill bggitith bag
bizerve• up last 'mama • kw wafter of lift ainhen
ir
apes the greonnen awl pequestal of thin ta
teems K agate ; sad the mama why it Wan haa
nes& lerand tha yen an sesanned by the ear hi
pries the Kerkeiastaeal Titles Dill.
THR COURT OF CHANCERY, THE JUDICIAL
OF TIIX PRIVY COUNCIL, AND

pressure with which they are now ovensden, Mr. Bethell
then adverted to the evil effects of delay in the Court of
Chancery, the causes of it, and the nature of the remedies,
in order, he said, to show the great value of the measure
now proposed, which among other things gave an appeal,
not from a single mind to • single mind, but to a plurality
of minds.
Mr. WALPOLE thought the measure, as far as he
could follow it, deserved the approbation of the house and
the public. Three important consequences would flow from
it: Grit, all the courts would be sitting continuously; se-
=there would be a permanent Court of Appeal ; and,
j the Lord Chancellor, instead of being removed en-
tirely Mem the Court of Chancery, would be continually
redraft himself by coming into the court and keeping up
his Maliarity with its practice.
L. ELLICE, who expressed his sincere gratification
at the sea lord bevies began his work of chance ry re-
▪ made some observations upon the state of the Mu-
le& elks and Mr. Horseman with reference to the judges'
slash.
Mr. BOUNDELL PALMER said, the house was bound
masowledge the rest candour with which this whole
stali_ lad been considered by the noble lord, whose plan
he barred to be one that united • greater number of ad-
vantage than any other, while it was difficult to conceive a
adearbeintieda of securing its advantages. He thought the
pies te meet with very general approbation ; if it did
not, be shoal despair of a remedy.
Attie a Ass words from Mr. HENLEY, who hoped that
this meassue would not be the means of stopping other
mama of importance
The SOLICITOR-GENERAL said that the ban. mem-
ber for Oxfordshire appeared not to have exactly under-
stood the nature of the bill originally introduced by the
noble lord as compared with the present measure. The
present bill we not in any way different in
from the former ear. The only difference was, Pitile:l
the GM bill en Meng* wee man to remedy the evils k
hem the VIM Forme in the present appellate )u-
-two jape tram other courts to 'moist the Lord
Chant:eller—gas hors the Courts of common law, and
the other he. the primary jurisdiction of the Court of
Chancery, mot the eomploint of the profession was, that
the Chasm platy *indiction was not too strong, and
mrempt to take the Master of the Rolls from his court,
it might beak the suitor in appeal, would injure
Yee In another way, by depriving him of the adjudication
at tie Master of the Rolls to his own court. (Hear.) This
assure provided a Court of Appeal, without depriving
the Cart of Chancery of any of its jurisdiction. He wished
newts cell the attention of the house to one fact. It would be
hand by • return he held in his hand of all the business
despatched by the Court of Chancery from 1841, when two
new vice-chancellors were appointed to take a share of
primary jurisdiction, as compared with 1849, just before
the Introduction of an new business into Chancery by the
operation of the Winding-up Act, that although there had
been daring those years an increase of the natural business
ef the court, by no fewer than 1.300 cases, yet that
the mean had 'Mee greatly dialehhed in 1849 as com-
pared with 1841. There was =ether he which he would
meatier with semen to the Walked labour thrown
gee he Load Obeneellor. Lard Oelhahen, with his great
pear end anise all he could to menet* the hearing of
rirhe Clum time, wery, was able at ear , at a peat seed-
lheelth. to bring down the museum of
la amber between 60 and 80—hetwein
hem end the following Michaehme teem, le the number of
IL Clem hear.) But his heelkleipee to decline, and
Ihe eeneennees was, that in the Maaebass term of the
nest year the number of appeals, Instead of being only 18,
Mad at 80. That circumstance had left an arrest to the pre-
sent Lord Chancellor which would hare taken the preftding
Lord Chancellor a year and • half to :dispose of, even if no
other appeals had been put down on the paper. That was
the state of things which the present Lord Chancellor had
found on his accession to office. When the bon. and learned
gentleman talked of hasty legislation, he should re-
' member that =say were the widows and orphans wearing
from the expense sad delay of their cases, which woe ever
tined is the alumna of effective and prompt Meade..
lime be veil esfy also that this measure was not to
bu ellaiilllllll as tie termination of Chancery reform.
The hems wee aware that a miaminioti was at that
memmt sitting to mender the fajta of
sedum la 011 beatings mai 1111101111)1114 and Chancery
he ant ant meembien wadi babe annual ef pat-
hem& mete sea a meet se wade lue e
le take nee thaw emidisellen a complete eys-
Ms team behave the Keeton' *Sleet

Tuner, 19 ; taking 684. There were other dames of
ear, appeals and re-hearings ; the Lord Chancellor
17. Of claims, the Master of the Rolls 28,
TiN-Ohandllor Bruce 267, Vice-Chancellor Cranworth 80,
ami Vice-Chancellor Turner 16; the total of all matters
that have been disposed of in the Court of Chancery during
the time I have referred to being 6,277. Now this is an
enormous amount of busineu, and it shows how mch per-
sons who are engaged in transactions connected with pro-
perty come more and more to the Court of Chancery for the
disposal of their business. And while it is quite true, as I
think experience of late years has shown, that if each of the
judges in chancery, the Lord Chancellor, the Master of the
Rolls,and dseVie•-Ctsancellors,can attend the courts regularly
there will be a sufficient judicial force, as Lord Cottenham
said to me before that ilium which terminated in his death,
for all the business of the court, though not sufficient to
dear off previously accumulated arrears, yet it is evident
that, if an illness occurs from overwork, or from any other
MN*, to which all persons are subject, some arrears will
innmedistely arise, die whole machinery will get out of
eeffee.end justice this cannot be done to the persona who
gps bate the Court of Chancery. (Hear, hear.) This, in-
deed, is so vase ea evil that I think some adequate effort,
however costly, should be made without delay to prevent it.
Mew the way I. which the proposal I have to make
in this bill would remedy that evil would be this :
while the Laid Chancellor is employed elsewhere,
if dream in the House of Lords or attending some
eaumlUse of the Hones of Lords, the two judges in the
Coat of Appeal would sit for him, and, in that cue, the
basins. of the mart would not be interrupted. I propose
haltar, SIONIMBi to a provision in the bill which I wish
to istemhice, in ere of the illness of the Master of the
Relk. or of ow of the Vice-Chancellors, the Lord
Chancellor dwell have power to make arrangements by
which one of the judges of the Court of Appeal may be en-
abled to sit in the ether eismete, and to dispose of the busi-
ness in those eenet• I mg allude to such a case as that of
Vi 11110111111.1.1, No or would wish that an
eadatally sea like Vice-Chancellor Wigwam,
hilly IVA., reheadag to the eatiebersa of
the petits all the Emir which were ealrarod to
\in--Cheer, had—mesh retire because of esewisatieue
agree or berme of a public complaint, la seregeemer
wig Omar or Oman which might only be eta
haeallea, bat 'disk whir it existed, iaragoci=lf oi
lb= allerrime la hie roars. MM. her.) Nevertheless,
se MON Used. he retired has his sort; a groat
Mr at harem were ; w tar add sat be disposed of
* mem at the Vir-Chreellues; Ass Ole Tiee-Chan-
osier toe ea mash briars is his era mart se he CAA get
It therefore, I be desirable to have
efaloVithees Saigon of the Court of to sit, in such
• ase, he thus weeks, or for three swaths, possibly, in
eviler to see whether the Judge whe led retired tempora-
rily hem his awl because of indisposition would not,
within • eared& ties, be susciently recovered to resume
the esenise of Me important functions. The other quie-
tism new Meld relates to the political and other
hariose of the Leed Chancellor. And I must say,
at this doe when we are called upon
eemply ea he es with the general wish to see im-
provements sad effected in the law, that it is very
sdebabie that the Lewd Chancellor, holding the higher
Ctallll=llllllllll4.l law In this metre, sad weaker r
rs theif H. gaarres of the urines droll be
rolled ho are lb rare sad doiliones atlaafiea he eat
Sor hat rot lir le de Nimbi i became, on the a
It wear he a per lablereeme sloths ormatry if really
esibises moor be =wog in eassequence of the
Lei Ohanealler ant baying thae hilly to master men-
MU As the impinempat of the ;ad bemuse, on the
ear Wok i maid be a saber= in rim illemeiderel
am& 11141gulail abrader of the law rehab. whatever the
seal awl errirby with which they ist have been tint
m ed. wadi la • fret years be disearbi raps aiming in
He bream eaticipMml and dared. Oa
bealt =Tama& It sure to re to be very eawateary dot
ung gromedber iambi be rased ia a prigs& la which
be war be die la glee a lore perks of his gam and
M.lllhe ark err Ilar. I have And with regard to
. 01111rbewb the rte Lord Chaaseller, and with regard
Ire reser Lied Obeseellor. that with every desire on
hale part le allied to Wrote of this nature, and to be
In ealnitilleet et the Hew of Lords on nett gab.
}acct baabsupleg anew, they had neural'.
bra sorpird la Shaw feeling—and I think
Ant duty to the public was to
of
eel illgare their judieW functions
in the Oman of Charery. There are, also, other
graeriar whisk air eater into meableratioa. I

JUDICIAL

Lord J. ItUSSILL roes and said —Sir, I sow rise to I
is,. he liars to War is two bills, of whisk I bare given
tralete. With swat loth, resead of these bilk, it is sanely
• ve-leireiesde• of • bill which 1 introduced last year. It
le he the wpm, et NNW( diet the sa:ary of the Chief
Imam et tho Qum% Pm& shall be by law what it has
been by mem tee is. time—eemely, COM. • yew, sad
that die obey of the Chief hedge er the Cameo rams,
*Ma W law as 8,000/. • year.thell beeselbedi be TAW. •
peer, Da Ike owe imprint 1111, to which I um widt
to ell the aitemien el' the lemees, is • bill to tweet the
administrable' of i.r m to the Court of Chaeeeey la
tho Jedisiel Oier the Prig Council. 1 do set
Walt it KOS sew b t= ends in reference to
whim la I sinbal as = 1 thest it desh,
aide to tams • ram is the Cost of Clammy. I
wish only to meld dr been thee this wore certain
=TI dm made 'Web bed die pond. though
O' the uminsite. soloet of Ile bow; sed
*et then wee seeleis ether peele of the yee to
which gime oldeetlems yew totem bee saw Minot
quarten. I state& ea the Amer eeseelos, thee I elati-
dwell it deardie—eleles re moat of *Wel beano
wild wend epee tb• Lod Chancellor, sal ire very
p••• Nesseoemeeof lie peaks' functiess—thad isms
nettaisee sisaid bs %km be th• perms of rdieefag
Yet atom poetise of thew eelesoi we dellee. I elotod that
this tee deebobio ea aseert et the phis. be thee se
gem add dive awe this a aerials than vWe
hie moyielploi. So ie. I think. th• been Ike it
vas iledoolio tint coma aseirare of this Idol be fe-
*Wend.Fable sated. be the memo I this
Ihot I tt dedeehie ilea the Lead
Crsa-
u abseil rotas his riled thoellar—that be
druid met be island sue* to his julletal
bet that be ahead soils Nat Oiliest eo -
NNWwit Ha aeoeillte peeeelemt die Womb bee

and other matters not embraced in the present bill. (Rear.)
Mach consideration would, however, be required, in
reference to all matters of deta,l. One of the lint
to be door, as regarded Chancery reform, was, it
wosM be evident. to relieve the Lord Chancellor from the
present state of his duties. The Lord Chancellor was a
penes whoa it was desirable to consult on all such subjects,
load at dm pawl limo they wished that he could be able
_to devote obi to this subject. As matters at present
I stood, this, however, was not possible, for every moment of
the Lord Chaneeller's time was takea up by one or other of
his pressing and onerous duties. By relieving him from his
duties in the way contemplated, they would not only confer
lan those benefits brought out in the course of the present
debate, but give the government a auitable head, with
whom they might consult, and by whom they might be
guided in carrying out all measures of law reform. (11.ar.)
After a few words from Mr. J. STUART and Mr. ELLICE,

Sir HTRILLOUGHBYtrusted that the Attorney-0e:
neral would be able to give them the assurance that the
question of fees in the Court of Chancery would be taken
u-The ATTORNEY-GENERAL said there was nothing in
the machinery of the Masters' ofces• which rendered them
incompetent to the discharge of the functions which
devolved on them ; but they were so overlaid
I with business that they could not get through it, so that if
they could be relieved of the country business, as proposed
by the County Court Extension Act, it was quite clear that
great benefit would ensue. (Hear, hear.) He was glad to
see that, on the part of the profession, there existed a most
laudable anxiety to render their best assistance in the carry-
ing out of those legal reforms which it was so desirable
should be effected.

Mr. HUME hoped the house would give due consider*.
tion to the bill, but admit of no delay. (A laugh.) He
concurred in all that had been said as to the necessity
of reform in the Court of Chancery.
After a few words from the Attorney-General, Mr. J.
Evans, and Mr. Mullings,
Lord J. RUSSELL was exceedingly gratified with the
reception with which the measure he had announced had
met from honourable and learned members on both sides of
the house. There might be other reforms desirable, be-
sides what the present bill accomplished, and these, it was
to be hoped, would ere long be overtaken. (Hear, hear.)
IHe had long been aware that the Masters' offices were
liable to improvement. The subject, however, was one in-
volving considerable difficulty, and requiring the most
careful consideration. The bill which had been introduced
from the other house of parliament would, if carried, be at.
tended with considerable benefit. Ile was, however, disposed
to think that much further amendment was requisite.
Leave was then given to introduce the first Mil.
On the question being put fur leave to bring in the second
bill,
Mr. HUME urged the necessity of an annual statement
of the Suitors' Fund being laid before the house, in order
that they might be aware what were the receipts. It was
highly necessary that the fees should be reduced.
Lord J. RUSSELL, who was very indistinctly heard,
was understood to reply that the Lord Chancellor had re-
duced the fees by the sum of 22.000 f. a year.
Leave was then given to bring in the second bill.
Both bills, it was announced, were in charge of Lord
John Russell, the Atturney-General, and the Solicitor-
General.

/1.7 UNION.

On the motion for going into committee of supply,
Sir L. O'BRIEN called attention to the eetition presented
by the late guardians of the Ennistymon L nion. He dwelt
upon the difficulties with which tho board, of which he was
a member, had bad to contend, the enormous expenditure
for relief; the exhausted state of the union; and the inces•
sant frauds that were attempted by the inhabitants in order
to obtain the outdoor allowance when not entitled to it. He

submitted that the board ought in justice to be allowed to
vindicate their management, lying as they did under the
stigma of a summary dismiusl by the cominissionen ; and
therefore he moved for the appointment of a committee of
inquiry.
Viscount BERNARD having seconded the motion,
Sir W. SOMERVILLE opposed it. entering at consider-
able length into a detail of the circumstances, which, he
contended, fully justified the commissioners in superseding
the board of guardians at Ennistymon, and placing the
management of the union under a paid board. As a proof
of the calm temper which governed the proceedings of the
commissioners, he instanced the fact that, throughout Ire-
land, they had only in this one case dismissed a board of
guardians.
After some discussion, Sir L. O'Batits withdrew his mo-
tion.

SUPPLY.—THE KAFFIR WAR.
On the motion that the Speaker do leave the chair,
Mr. ADDERLEY consented, at the request of Lord
John Russell, to postpone • statement which he had to
make until a later stage.
The house then went into committee.
The first vote was that a sum not exceeding 300,000 f.
should be granted to her Majesty towards defraying the
expenses of the Kaffir war, in addition to the ordinary votes
for the army, ordnanesi commissariat, &e.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER rather an-
ticipated from what had just fallen from the hon. gentle-
man, that probably in the discussion which might arise
upon this motion, some objection might be taken to
the expensiveness f this war; end therefore he would leave
what he had to say until he had heard the observations of
the hon. member. They were all sufficiently well
aware that a war was raging with the Kaffir tribes, and that
• considerable expense must necessarily be incurred for the
purpose of putting an end to it. Nor need he hardly remind
them of the character of those hostilities, which were carried
on between a civilised people and a nation less civilised.
They were frequently waged in a very barbarous spirit;
and unless the interference of some government took place
border hostilities were generally of a very sanguinary
nature. The more enlightened spirit of modern times
had in great measure put an end to the barbari-
ties that used to prevail; but he believed a necessary
consequence of that was, that the warfare so carried on be-
came of a more expensive nature. He considered, how-
ever, that it was well worth while to incur that additional
expense, for the sake of preventing those atrocities which
had signalised the old wars. (Cheers.) In the late Kaffir
war very considerable expense was incurred for the par-
pme of putting down the hostilities ; but that mainly arose
from the officers in the colony being unprepared with the
means of supplying the troops with necessaries. They had
then no proper staff upon the spot ; and it was then neces-
sary to convey the supplies to the troops over a great dis-
tance. At that time the stores were landed at Fort Eliza-
beth, and conveyed to Graham's Town, and from thence to
the seat of war. Fortunately the expense on the present
occasion was very much diminished, owing to our possession
of a landing place on the Buffalo River, which was called,
he believed, East London, and which was neer the ter-
ritories of the Kaffirs. (Hear, hear.) When he last ad-
dressed the house on this subject he certainly was
under the apprehension that a far greater expenditure would
have been necessary than would now probably be required.
The first estimate that was sent home by the Commissary
General was a probable extraordinary expenditure of
400,000!. for six months. He (Sir Charles Wood) had,
therefore, proposed 300,000!., at the same time expressing a
hope that the war would be speedily brought to a termite-
ton. He was afraid that hope was very much diminished,
but he was happy to state that the probable expenditure
for a time was very much diminished also. (Hear, hear.)
Profiting by the experience of the last war much more
rigid measures had been enforced; and the Commissary
General had the advantage of the services of persons
conversant with the business. Formerly a large portion
of the expenditure was entrusted to parties in the co-
lony, ever whom it was impossible for the Commissary-
General to exercise anything like a complete check or
audit, for it was found exceedingly difficult to obtain
their accounts. The whole of the commissariat officers had
rendered theirs, and they had been audited—so far, that
was, as it was possible to audit three-fourths of the accounts
when the other fourth was wanting. A much more rigid
system of accounts, however, had now been established ;
and he (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) was happy to say
that he had received such statements from the Commissary-
General as would probably render a much less grant neces-
eery ; and at the same time, Sir Harry Smith de-
clared that the troops were never in a better
state of efficiency or better supplied. (Cheers.) The actual
extraordinary expenditure to the end of January was about
12,0001. ; and the estimated sum that would be required up
to the end of July was 202,000 i., making, with the 12,000 i.
already expended, • total of 214,0001. instead of 400,0001.
Mr. HUME—But you have not got all the accounts.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER—That was
very probable, as the end of July had not yet arrived.
(Laughter.) On the 15th of April there were 15,000 men
under arms, to whom rations were supplied; and there were
also 15,000 other persons, consisting of the wives and fami-
lies of the levies in the field, to whom rations, or allow-
ances instead of rations, were supplied. He hoped that
the war would not last till the end of July,
' but he could not pretend on that account to
reduce the vote, though, of course, the money would not
be spent unless it was absolutely necessary. It was only
justice to the Commander-in-Chief to say that, while he
required from the Commissary-General that all necessary
supplies and stores should be furnished, he had joined heart
and soul in cutting down the expenses on the frontier to the
lowest possible sum. (Cheers.) Formerly there had been
—he could call it by no milder term—a great system of
jobbing, but that had been entirely put down, and • strict
' authority was now exercised over the subordinate officers.
(Cheers.) The right hon. gentleman concluded by moving
the vote.

produced seven wars with a frontier tribe in so short a time.
It was said that the last war took us by surprise, that
zweristhetcedigoaar
hadworamdida
lonnito:si,teenymowafe,hboringhadw to
nothing; but the sixth war,
a much more satisfactory and economical plan. It was
tahise°:huutpetpthlhieesisgo. government
them such a lesson, that the seventh was to be cone°dTucuih7tediallfiovne.
Tbw:rea
ak.an
audited
r.dtat h;. t
thedo ni only
remaindert
hemt three-fourths
aatveryiaw ea
country,
expensive
rthe
y,
nobodymining,on accountsthat
lying in a confused heap in the Secretary's ofecerhadaartatClrehiddepead
s
house wished to see them, as nobody at the Cape wined W
*end them. (Laughter.) They certainly never woad be
sent here; they never had been, and they never would be
audited. What ground bad the Chancellor of the Exche-
quertth2 0
or y result
tproportionh a !fon
fb thet
sentrwe sti
expensealready,cue t10 hVwro
that
epe fiotner becausecum
arno more
nere e:wbe bill
dahrafßefore
agiree—ingwhthythisate
expense had
hadcommittee
been
incurredmustcooside_r three point-
what chance then
was of its continuing and what was the proba-
bility of the recurrence of these wars. It had been laid
down as a maxim by many of the colonial ministers, and
by none more distinctly and emphatically than by Lord
Grey himself—that every colony having a representative
govcrnmcut should bear the expenses of its own internal
defence. Lord Grey had distinctly laid down this proposi-
tion, within the bat twelvemonth, with regard to New
Zealand. It would bo better for the committee to inquire
why the colony had not representative government that
to consider the expenses of the war. The only question
were, whether there was a prospect of the war coming to
a speedy conclusion, or of such a constitution being given
to the colony as would throw all the expenses upon it, and
save this country from the chance of such an expenditure
recurring. Were a representative government given to
the Cape these wars would cease—at least it would be a
great check on their recurrence if the colonists had to bear
the cost themselves. They would not then so thoughtlessly
run into war. At all events this country would cease
to bear the expense. The question was, why the Cape
at this moment had not representative government ? In
the early part of 1850 her Majesty sent out letters patent to
the governor of the Cape authorising him, with his legisla-
tive council, to form representative institutions for the
colony. An outline was soot, which they had full latitude
in filling up. As soon as the letters patent arrived
the first task of the governor was to summon his
legislative council, which for two years previously had not
met, the only government having been that of the governor
himself. In doing this he acted upon the suggestion of
Lord Grey, and appealed to popular election to till up the
council. The council was elected ; they proceeded to frame
the new constitution; but the legislative council broke
down in the task. Many supposed that the resignations
were owing to minor differences, or differences so to the
formation of the constitution. This was not so. The
elected members of the council were ready to take any
constitution offered them, and would have been perfectly
thankful to receive it as delineated in the letters patent.
The sole ground of their resignation was this—after they
had entered into discussion on the new constitution the
governor presented to them a aeries of bills on subjects of
ordinary legislation, and this led them to suppose that they
had been tricked into being elected to that council, to be
used as an ordinary leoslature instead of acting as •
constituent assembly. They refused to do so, believing
that they were not authorised so to act. 'f hey wished
the question to be postponed till the new constitution was
formed ; and upon that point they resigned. They met, and
prepared a draft constitution, in accordance with the ex-
pressed views of the majority of the colonists. They had
come to this country with their proposition, which was sup-
ported by every municipality but two, and by nine-tenths
of the future proposed electoral body of the colony. That
constitution, consisting of sixteen articles, was the consti-
tution proposed by Sir A. Stockenstrom and Mr.
Fairbairn, who were now in this country as the accredited
representatives of nine-tenths of the colonists. The rem-
nant of the council had been formed by the governor into a
board. They also had framed a draft constitution which had
likewise been sent to this country for her Majesty'sconside-
ration. The first delegates had been kept four months, wait-
ing the arrival of despatches from the Cape. There were
now on the table of the house, and they showed that Lord
Grey, on reading what had been done, hail reprimanded Sir
Harry Smith on two grounds, because he had appealed to
popular election in filling up his council, and because,
when the elected members resigned, he had not gone on
with the remnant of the council. Sir Harry defended his
appeal to popular election on the double ground that he
had no other mode of filling up his council, and that he
had done it at the distinct suggestion of Lord Grey himself.
A reference to the despatches would show that Sir Harry
was fully justified in this. As to the other ground of repn-
mend, he said he had consulted his law officers, and they
had given a decided opinion that he could not legally go on
with the remnant of the council, which was reduced below
the legal number. Lord Grey had written back to say
that he could not agree in the opinion of the
legal officers of the colony, and that he believed
the law officers of the crown in this country would give
a different opinion. He said he would scud out fresh in-
structions, by which the governor would be enabled to
carry on the ordinary affairs of the government with the
remnant of the council. Whether her Majesty had power
to issue such instructions, after the letters patent had
gone out, was for the law officers of the crown to
determine. At this moment, Sir H. Smith being
away at King William's Town, the Cape was under
the government of Mr. Montagu, the government secretary,
and no other man. it was a secret, nameless, irresponsible
Montagu government. There was no governor, and there
had been no council for three years. How had the expenses
been carried on ? For three years there had not been a single
legal vote legalising the appropriation of the revenue in any
one instance. The revenue, which was chiefly derived
from permanent taxes, had been received, and it had been
appropriated on the secret responsibility of the government,
trusting to future sanction. It had not met the expendi-
ture, and the deficiency had been made up by the Governor
borrowing from such funds as the pauper guardians' fund,
the fund arising from the estates of minors, of which he
was the legal guardian. It was not necessary that he
should allude te the Kaffir war ; the house knew perfectly
well how it had arisen • but it was important to inquire
whether the policy which had led to it was in process of being
brought to a conclusion, or was likely to be persisted
in. h was the general impression that the house would be
willing to vote the two millions or what might be required,
with the indefinite notion that this policy would be checked.
Instead of this, it was in process of being exaggerated, to
such an enormous and gigantic extent, that all which had
hitherto occurred would appear as nothing compared with
what might now be anticipated. In July last Sir H.
Smith wrote to Lord Grey to tell him, as a piece of good
news, that a new lake, surrounded with the most fertile
land, had been discovered in the interior of Africa, 700
miles beyond the northern frontier of our colony; that the
Dutch tigers, discontented with our rule, were giving up all
their own possessions, and making their way there, because
it was out of the reach of the 6 & 7 Wm. IV., which ex-
tended ourjuriniction beyond the frontier of the colony.
But Sir Harry said he had been beforehand with them, for
he had sent his agent into the district; and he begged
Lord Grey to get an act of parliament passed extending
the 6 & 7 Wm. IV. to the Equator, (Laughter.) He
advised that a recent commissioner should be appointed,
and recommended • missionary for the purpose, observing
that there was great danger to the natives from the presence
of the boers. Thus he held up the beers to the hatred of
the natives. Lord Grey, in his reply. of the 12th of Novem-
ber, said that Sir H. Smith was right in his determination
not to declare the whole country under British rule, and
directed him to enter into friendly relations with the chiefs,
to advise them to combine in a general confederacy, and to
promise them the support of the British government. The
first step, he said, was to induce the chiefs to establish a
confederacy against the been, and to invite the residence of
a British officer among them, who might act as the com-
mandant of Kaffraria had acted, and would virtually direct
the affairs of the confederation. He advised that a tax
should be imposed on the natives, and said he hoped to ob-
tain an act in the next session extending British rule to the
Equator. Were this done, the expense would be carried to
an amount which would laugh to scorn all that had yet
been expended. If the house had voted millions for • Kaffir
war, they would have to vote tens of millions for wan be-
tween the Orange River and the Equator. It was
gratifying to be able to refer to some cheering cir-
cumstances. Oa the arrival of Sir Andric, Stockenstrom
and Mr. Fairbairn, they made a solemn appeal to the noble
lord at the head of the government, setting calmly and
deliberately before him the crisis to which their affairs
had arrived and the danger in which the colony was
placed ; they pointed out the means which the
noble lord had in his hands of putting an end
to this disastrous state of things. The noble lord's
answer gave them the greatest encouragement; it was
nothing less than he (Mr. Adderley) had anticipated from
the noble lord, not only from his character as a man and
his position in the government, but from his antecedents in
the colonial department, for every one allowed he was one
of the best governors the colonies had ever possessed. His
answer was a request that they would state what altera-
tions they wished to have in the constitution offered by her
Majesty, and the reasons they had for
.proposing those alto-
rations. Their reply was, that they wished for no altera-
tion whatsoever, that they never had stood out for any
alteration, but merely wiahed to be put back in the position
they were in in the legislative council when the constitution
was brought under discussion, with this little differ-
ence, that there should be no previous legislation neces-
sary on the part of the legislative council. That was
assuming the position which they had previously assumed
in the legislative council ; and they stated that if the noble
lord would only give them a promise of a constitution free
from delays and impediments, they would not only feel
satisfied, but that their gratitude would know no bounds.
The noble lord had given them a second answer, and though
as kind as the first, yet it was not, perhaps, altogether so
encouraging as they were led to expect. For though they
understood it to mean that the noble lord sympathised with
them in the immediate necessity of their application
being complied with, yet the noble lord felt it
asemeary to wait for further despatches, to see
what the chances were of the war being concluded,
Wore he could give • definitive answer as to when the con
Istitution would be granted. (Hear, hear.) The noble
lord also alluded to certain difficulties, which he said he
tit bound to consider before he could say whether the new
elmeitution would be sent out directly from this country
without the intervention of the legislative council on the
spot. Now, though these were the answers of the noble
lord, yet the deputation considered that he had held out
great encouragement to them • and. they also considered
that he might have acted more resolutely and decisively fa

awning out at once his views. A week ago, when
monnotht least
come. chance
(ieat:f,
the noble lord replied to these gentlemen, he
s to
had not the despatches from the seat of war.
hear.) What, then, could stop the noble lord from pro-
ceeding to the completion of that constitution, possessing, as
he did, the means in his own hands ? (Hear, hear.)
conperoludveded ftobrere many was
tThhee These gentlemenubeig
Lord J. RUSSELL wished, in speaking on the vast sub-
jmt then before the house, to compress within the shortest
the facts of the case. The statement of the hon.
ppmtLman
making war for war's sake, upon bodies of un-
reeolved itself into this that they were
offending natives, and that the war was wanton
sad unnecessary. The statement of the honourable
gmtleman also went to this, that the colony of the
Cape, withe representative system, would undertake the
expenses of such wars, and that they, consequently, would
have an interest in such cessation. Now, all that theory
was based on the supposition that these savage hordes were
made war upon with no other object than for war's sake by
the Queen's troops with a view to their destruction. (Ilear,
hear.) But any man who had looked into the history. of
the colony, as well before as since it had come into Bnte.h
possession, would see that the state of things was
quite different. (Hear, hear.) Ho would see that
the Dutch, having extended their settlements and
dwellings beyond the immediate frontier of Cape Town,
kept their flocks at pasture ; and that the Kaffir,' occasion-
ally rushed down, destroyed their dwellings, and carried off
their herds. Such had been the history of the settlement.
(Hear, hear.) Accounts informed them that in 1811, on
the occasion of the last war, ten thousand men entered the
settlement within the frontier, destroying the farm-houses,
murdering the inhabitants, and carrying off the cattle that
belonged to them. (Hear, hear.) No wanton act on the
part of the colonists called for that ; and, therefore, how
could this parliament turn round on them and say, " You
must bear all the expenses for running the risk of
allowing yourselves to be murdered ? " (" Hear, hear," and
laughter,) They might naturally say, "If left to ourselves
we will defend our lives and onr homes; but surely you,
having the sovereign authority, are called upon to protect
us, and therefore we demand your aid." (Hear, hear.)
The honourable gentleman (Mr. Adderley) seemed to sup-
pose that the possession of the constitution would be of
such value as to induce the Cape colonists to defray the
expenses of all future wars. (Hear, hear.) Ile (Lord J.
Russell) doubted not the honourable gentleman had re-
ceived assurances of that nature ; but he (Lord J. Russell)
found no party coming forward with any such assurance.
(Hear.) According to the hon. gentleman, the colonists
called for a representative constitution, in consideration
of which they would supply future taxation for war
purposes' to' such an amount that the United Kingdom
would be at no further expense. Now, on the contrary,
Mr. Fairbairn laid a different view before the committee,
and declined—very properly, no doubt—to commit himself
by an undertaking that the colonists would entertain such
agreement. (Hear, hear,) Such being the ewe, it would
be impossible—considering the revenues of the Cape—that
the expenses of the war could be defrayed from any other
source than by this country. (Hear, hear.) There
were various questions connected with this subject,
some of which would be considered by the select
committee, whilst others would more naturally form the
subject matter of debate in that house : but at present it
could not be said with accuracy what the plan to be adopted
should be to provide security in this matter. lie (Lord J.
Russell) was aware that the war at present going on was of
a very destructive character, and that many savage acts had
been committed. Ile was also aware that the plan adopted
had not been so successful as to enable them to say when it
might be terminated. But hon. gentlemen should recollect
that the policy at present pursued by this country
had been adopted, partly on the advice of those
able men, Sir Benjamin D'Urban and Sir Henry
l'ottinger, who had tilled the office of governor in the
colony, and partly in consequence of the strong feeling
prevalent in this country, namely, that they ought not, for
their characters' sake, support the system of the old Boers,
who we.,t out with their titles and shot the native, whether
engaged in aggression or not. (Laughter.) Therefore, the
house and the country, and the various governors, had
adopted the present system, with a view to effect that very
necessary alteration. At the present moment the only
question for the house was that advanced by the hon.
gentleman (Mr. Adderley), as to whether this country should
or should not bear the expenses of wars in those colonies
that were not able to defray them themselves? (Hear,
hear.) The hon. gentleman asked whether this country
was prepared, at the present moment, on other grounds, to
issue the immediate grant of a constitution? Upon that
subject he (Lord J. Russell) should recallthe circumstances
that had occurred, and which were not entirely in confor-
mity with the statement of the hon. gentleman. It should
be recollected when the proposal of a representative consti-
tution was conveyed from the governor of the colony to
Lord Stanley, the then Secretary for the Colonies, that ho
hesitated; and that consequently from 1849 to 1849 there
was little said about the matter. However, upon recon-
sideration of the whole matter it was resolved by the
government to attempt to establish it. Sir Harry Smith
had taken the opinion of his law officers, and Lord Grey
found fault with the decision to which he (Sir Harry) hail
come. But, most unfortunately, the persons whom Sir 11.
Smith called to his councils with a view to assist him in
entering into the details of the representative constitution,
on such terms that the whole instrument should be sent
home to receive the approbation of the imperial govern-
ment—these persons, instead of aiding him, set themselves
at the very outset to thwart him and his project by every
means in their power. Sir Hurry Smith declared it to be has
conviction that from the first their object was to mis-
lead the council. (Hear.) They commenced in the
first place by disputing the right of two members, whom Sir
Harry Smith had called into the council, to sit at the board ;
and subsequently their conduct was such as to put an end
to the possibility of any decision being arrived at by the
council. (Hear, hear.) Whether that representative con-
stitution would have acted for good or for evil, it:was plain,
if they then said, " We will accept the instrument sent us
from London ; we will take the representative constitution
sent us, and fill up the details ourselves"—it was plain,
if they had so said, before the present time
a representative constitution would have been in
operation. (Hear, hear.) Therefore it was naturally and
entirely their own doing and their own act that they had
not now a representative constitution. (Hear, hear.) And,
therefore, when hon. gentlemen asserted that the council
had exercised despotic authority, they should recollect all
the circumstances of the case, as also the authors of all
that had occurred. (Hear, hear.) There were only two
things more to which ho would advert, one was that her
Majesty a government were determined to carry into effect
their proposal of a representative constitution; and tho
second, that, however anxious they might be to introduce
these institutions, there did appear, considering the last
disturbance, to be insuperable difficulties to putting that
constitution in force and operation. (Hear.) if any
separate commissioner should go out to the Cape, in order
to open the elections, with a view to carry the constitutional
principle into effect, he would not be able to do so ; for a
great many of those who would be entitled to take part in
that proceeding were away and actively engaged in the
war. (Hear, hear.) Therefore, whilst that was the case,
there would be a difficulty in holding elections, or attempt.
ing to carry into effect the constitutional principle. (Hear,
hear.) He was not aware he need say anything of the
nature of that constitution. lie thought it would be
_ • .

necessary to have some law passed 'Which would re-
quire the assent of the legislative council to provide for
the executive and judicial establishments of the colony.
lie believed some provision of that kind was necessary.
lie thought the house was bound to support those who went
out—and thus prevent murder—encouraged as they were
by the government, and with the entire approbation of tho
hon. member for Montrose ; and, with regard to the ques-
tion of defence, he thought there could be no doubt in tho
mind of any lion, gentleman. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. HUME enforced, with many arguments, the asser-
tion that the war was altogether aggressive on our part,
and refused to concur in a vote that affixed a parliamentary
sanction to so unwarrantable a proceeding. Ile laid to the
fault of the government and Si. H. Smith the delay that
had occurred in putting in motion the constitution designed
for the Cape, and insisted on the necessity of removing the
obstacles that stood in the way of that consummation.
Mr. HAWES maintained that whatever might be the
•
judgment passed upon the war, on the score of prudence
or morality, it was necessary, for the sake of our colonists
all over the world, to pass the present vote, as an mu-
' ranee that the money requisite for their defence would
be duly provided. He sketched the history of recent events
to show that the pending war was not one of aggression, and
that the various projects and expeditions undertaken by
the present governor were not inspired by an empty love of
glory or conquest. The difficulties that had prevented the
immediate introduction of the prepared mechanism for self-
government were of the colonists' own raising. Now that
war existed, it was judged inappropriate to commence a
system of popular representation; but as soon as peace was
restored, there was no reason why the inhabitants of the
Cape colony should not at once enter upon the enjoyment of
liberal institutions.

Mr. V. SMITH admitted that the di.cussion had trans-
the literal bounds assigned by the terms of the vote
fore them. It was, however, impossible to get colonial
questions fairly considered, except upon a money vote. Re-
viewing the recent system of colonial policy, he contended
that it was characterised by a dangerous spirit of extension
aid absolutism.

After an explanation by Lord J. Rotianu.,
Mr. BRIGHT declared his conviction that the popular
constitution ought to be immediately conceded on their own
terms to the Cape colonists. The inhabitants evidently felt
no sympathy with the governor, who was a military °Meer.
fitter to conduct a war than administer tho affairs of a free

Mr. ADDERLEY did not derive much consolation
from the arguments of the right hon. gentleman. First, as to
the smallness of the vote. The sum now asked for was a
mere exponent of the total expenditure which the war would
render necessary, for, under present circumstances, and un-
der their present policy, it promised to be interminable.
(Hear, hear.) As to the nature of the war, he could not
conceive anything more atrocious, or more barbarous,
then the civilised warfare which was now being waged
in the Cape. Was not the war carried ou by burning
the harvests and crops of the Kadin, amid by catching prison-
ers and roasting them alive ? It would be better that the
discussion on the vote should be adjourned until further in-
formation was received. What was this 300,0001. which
the committee was asked to vote ? A vote of half a crown,
or any trifling sum, would be just as good an exponent of
the boundless expense they were inearring, as the arbitrary
sun of 300,0001., which had been fixed oa without any data
whatever. No proportion would exist between it and
the Waal expense of the war, even for the present year.
It was oda that these expenses were incurred la a much
nun satisfactory way than on the last occasion. But this
was the seventh Kaffir war for which this country had had
to pay. (Hear, hear.) What a policy that man be which

..„
community.
Mr. LABOUCHERE reiterated and enlarged the de-
fence of the Cape policy previously offered by his colleague
in the administration.
After a few words in explanation from Mr. Ilvsig and
Mr. Ala/MILEY, who moved that the chairman report pro-
gress, a miscellaneous conversation ensued, in the course of
which

Mr. HAWES stated that the war would prove a hind-
rance to the establishment of a constitution in the colony
only so long as the exigencies of the service retained the
governor and chief functionaries at a distance front the
capital.
The motion for adjournment was finally withdrawn by
consent, and the vote passed the committee.
The house then resumed.