The Express.
London, England, 1853-04-09 00:00:00

THE EXPRESS, SATURDAY BVENING, APRIL 9, 1858

~,,,,▪
darable soma. If you balance year alternatives pro-
ray stns sgaiast the other, you will hod that the increase
ay lig. per e, sit. w..t be more than redeemed by the home-
to., J
misaet of the capital of the debt by the
.
englen uf go '1 hree-and-a-llalf per Cs ot. Stock. (Hear.)
~cibt, it you an to succeed in your operation, to be
ambled to eller to the stock holder two alternatives as
aims! able as two pins, if poesibie. You ought to be able
i,se bins the choice .1 %%As., two stocks, which should be
a. warty espial in value that the choice could only be Jet, r-
ma,,g by bie prilerene• which be will take. It that b. the
0., the presumption is that you will h sve as much taken
td r„, ate kas the other. (Hear. hear.)
Mt HUME. —But suppose that should not be ?
/be CHANCELLOR, of the EKCIIRQUEIt Then you
tba Whiner right. 1 'amp it in the option .
▪ public to pay or not to pay the interest which the stock.
:t..e is en to d 'TM sad. l do nor deny that the stock-
F.d.sier Laois to the alresisite assomat of the stock as well as
the annual interest, but I nay that he leaks to the annual
tautest in pseferes.-a to the amount of cupital. There-
jaw, d your duty to balance the two, to that ,
%Loy .hall be tea cleat preponderance of interest
egher way. It is y sue date so b. counterhalince the tul-
uatrops Coat the et-ck shall ant be on. quail; taken. In the
ease or a former Operlitiall, the re.hse'l sit of the interest
MB to per cost-, the terms suffered included alterna-
bees SCaRtISSMI of this kind. remiss holding the Four per
Ceps el. re offered two alternatives; the one was Ti!. of
▪ et .1 per teat., eil,ich wou'al hare briar an average so-
t. rest r l a.. hI ; the other was a cora at par, bearing an
l*tere.t of 3i per emit. Every hady riser the lOW. of
et Cent stack, ratio r than the 751. of
Fits per Cent. Because there was 1.1 elitforence la the rate
of interest of c sum they chore the higher amount. (Ilene
heir.) That is nit the ease here. Thy man who choose:
the steremad-a-11.11 per Cent. stock must chums as aauuity
at 2/.1.15. • the to in who elvasees the Thres-sou'.-4-Half per
Cs ut. -mei sal obtain ::a annuity of V. 17s. 61. That is
the disyLeence b,tween the cases. (1.1e.e. hear.) But this
• quite dill. rent from the case of the Wait,. made during
the war. (lhar, hear.) I have looked bad., like other
men, to those 1-sine, and have groaned inwardly at the
tosiopeesess. (Hear, bear.) The practiro of burrowing
at 3 per tent. daring the war, when the natural rate of in-
syrest was :lead per tent , secured us an advantage, it is
true, at the time, but an advantage which was utterly in-
waiting. It lowered t int, rest at the time ; but it es,-
tailed epee as a perinamoit deb!, which it is clear, if a
wise system bad been pursues', we might have reduced by
this time by something like one hundred to two hundred
nosivais steel my (Hear, hear.) That was uudoubtedly
an erronemis conic, and to repeat it would be most un-
wise. It was hotted entailing en exceedingly heavy charge
ou p,sterity, oral Rival.; them a debt almost irredeemable
for the sake of a very small present advantage. Surely th tt
is not to be compared with a case of this kind, the whole
basis of which as both advantageous at the present time am'
to posterity. I am not psis g to sacrifice the intsrests of
posterity, and to 'Med on them an additional burden ; but
I am sicking to it CUM to I, aterity au absolute redoc-
ticn
of the annual charge of the debt we now
Tosco.. (Hear, hear.) But I beg the committee to
uslers:and that white I urge these pleas on behalf
of the proposal, I freely as-cut to the general doctrine,
thst it is nut desirable to increase the nominal capital of
the debt. (Hear, hear.) All I ask of you is this—that
you will,-1 will nut say indulgently, fur indulgence is nut
required,—but that you mid fairly and cat... Belly look at the
use as it stands, and consider the public policy which we

have in view. The govornment may be right or they may
wrong in making any proposal of this kind ; bat it un-
quedienahly rest...p.m a broad ground. (Hear, hear.) I
I said that the great obju ct which the government loud in
view was to establish, it it be possible, an irredeemable I
pul'ln sancta, which shill bear a respectable price in the
ineek.t, and bear an interest of not more than tea and a
half per cent. It Ia for that purpose that we pro;icise to
include this amongst the venom farms of conversion which
we shall leave open to the Three per Cent. stockholders.
Perhaps you will tell me, " You will secure that object
by means of the Exchequer bowls." I shall be delighted
d do. (Hear, hear.) I trust we may. Bat
we may Hod that we cannot float these Exchequer Bonds ;
that us eaunot bring them into credit and character, unless
we Site a power of redemption to the owners. That may
be all very well ; hut any operation of that kind, which is to
involve redemptioumt a particular time, when we may be
in difficulties or war, must necessarily leo a limited opera-
tion, end does not lay the ground for what we want to see—
sanely tho creation of a 21 per cent. irredeemable
public stock. (live us this, and then I say we shall have
lid a solid ground where it is now only a morass. We
then can tread where now we cannot tread. We shall have
a excel point, up to which, or rather down to which, we
can work. We shall Mtn have something fined and cer-
tain, where now all is comp natively speculation and expe-
rinteat. (Hear, hear.) If the committee think it is a
great public object to establish firmly this Two-and-a-Half
per Cent. stock in such n manner as shall make it
an ordinary subject of comm.rcial dealing, then I
hope they will nut exe:ude this part of the
prormition. If they do not, or if they think that
the course we propota will cot be likely to effect
that object, then I admit that nominally to increase the ca-
pital,/ the debt is per ut an evil (Cheers.) Now I come
to the point to which I am meet maxi nu t• call the atten-
tion of the rommittee. It is said that, as the resolutions at
first stood, it would b • open to ell the holders of Torte per
Cent. Stark to effect this c emersion int, the new Two-and-
a-Half per Cent. Stock; and that the pecnienetion was, sr
at least it was a supposablii case, that they would all effect
that converses.. The fact of the holder, of 500 minions of
Three per Cent. Stook, all ru.biug to exchange it for stock
at Twomad-a-Half per Cent. would have effected • reduc-
tion in oar annual burdens, which would indeed have been
gratifying to me ; it emend hive ;AT irded a relief to our
bosoms, not for the present time merely, but for ever, of
I think 1,500,0001. a year,—• most grate, sag circumstance.
(lieu, hear) I was not 'antrum° cuough ta anticipate
that. But it has home pointed out that this conversion, if
fumy effected, would entail a nominal increase of the
capital of the debt to the event of 50 millions.
Per, I at once demur to that objection. I do
not think that any mach increase ought to be
allowed. (Hear, he ar ) It is not necessary for the
purpose which we have in view. The purpose we have
in view is to ley the foundation of a new irredeemable
public stock, bearing a low rate of interest. For that great
and essential purpose, we ask you to allow %I/ to create this
21 per cent. stock ; but it is not in the slightest degree
aneesory that we should allow it to he carried to any such
intent as would he sanctioueil by the terms included in this
resolution. And here I must make so apology to the house.
The resolution was at first framed st.deirently, and, uit
stood, there would have been a diffieuity in imposing an
effective limit. It is often difficult fur the most skilled per-
sons to draw resolutions so as to coafurm to the rules of
the house end to fulfi, the precise conditions required ; and
I must admit th it, in drawing out Ode resolution, it took
a (ow which I did not at once perceive would make it
apply to the whole extent Of this 3 per cent. stock, and
taus entail a difficulty. lat once admit that that
was not meant. (Hear, hear.) Anal I propose to
meet the objection by an alteration which has
been introduced into the reprint of the resoluti ans.
It is in the 10th resolution ' and the amount of Three per
Cents. to be thus converted is limited by the alteration to
30 millions. This limits the utmost possible creation of thi,
new Two-and-a-Half per Cont. stock to the extent of 30
mil:ions. The Ezehequer Bonds are likewise limited to
that amount ; and I propose, in order to meet the objection
that has been raised, to limit this new Two-sad-a-Half per
Cent. stock to the same amount.

Mr. J. L. RICARDC—How is it to be apportioned ?
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER—Amongst
the applicants, do you mean ?
Mr. RlCAltDO—y,e,
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER—By prio-
rity of application. That is all done in the books of the
Bank. As soon as there are entries in the books of the
Bank to the extent of 30 millions, of parties wishing to
maks the conversion, it will be done. The operation will
be u simple as possible ; it will be determined entirely by
priority. Therefore, the effect will be that the utmost
Avelinol addition that can take place to the national
debt, under the power which I a k yen time to
cooler, will be an addition of something more than
three millions. And what I pet to the committee is, that
a nominal addition of capital like this, connected with a
re:taunt advantage in the reduction of interest, is a very
entail price indeed to pay for the attainment of the great
object which the government have in •i....w—namely, the
laying the foundation of an irredeemable and permanent
per cent. stock. (Hear, hear.) I know of no other
way in which we can certainly attain that end. If we could
c.rtainly attain it by means of the Exchequer Bonds, I
should prefer it ; but seeing that we cannot attain it in
that way, I venture to hope that this proposal will have
not only the candid but the favourable consideration of
the house. (Hear, I have, at a length very much greater
then I myself anticipated, gone through the details of this
propuition. I have endeavoured to keep close to the sub•
Ai. (Cheers.) I know that, upon questions of this kind
to attempt to belonci.e might wily have led me into ob-
scurity, and have undo any attempted explanation unin-
telligible. But I have now come to the end
of these explanation., and all that I have
farther to say may be comprised in a very
few sentences. With regard to the discretion which I ask
you to confide to the government that discretion may he
limited at any stage in the program of the bill which is to
be founded upon these resolutions. It would be objection-
able to introduce new powers to the government in the
curse of that bill ; but the limitation of thou powers may
be considered at any stage. There is likewise a subject
w%.ch, although isolated, I may u well refer to here. It
ism' of great importance ;—the large stocks now held by
the amountanti-general in Chancery, and in bankruptcy.
I do ant propose by thew resolutions that the accountants-
Mimi in Chancery ard in bankruptcy shall have the
power to exercise the option of commutation, except as to
the limited amount of minor stock which they may hold ;
but as to the greater stock., it is not proposed that they
ghould have that power. And the main reason is this. It
is wi'h great reason supposed—l wiz not say it is an ab-
solute eonelu.itin of the government—that more extensive
changes may be introduced into the law with
motet to these very large amount of money. (Hear,
bean) The system appears to be at present
of a rittut defective gilifiet.r. No doubt, as regards the
red faith under which this large property is held, that is
leaseaulahle, and eeeee can be rendered more certsin.
hr ir.) But it is, in its nature, a fluctuating capital.
Tie interest, in the case of funds in Chancery, is compare-
tttely immaterial ; what is important is the integrity of
the capital, and the power to rcali.e at any raiment. (Hear,
low) It is extremely hard that the property of patties,
"4 ion hatred by legal difficulties from its enjoyment,
should be subject to change., and great and vital chueges,
V...4:71 (men eiseuenstances entirely inwl.,ndent of their
hal— rue Irtprs that it may be in the power of
.' rtm‘t.t— I Ca .not ven•urc t. commit it CM tLtt

i subject—to propose a measure which shall piece these trust .
Innis on a bans more satisfactory to the partire interested
therein. On that account Ido not propose that the power
of commutation of the greater stocks shall extend to the
accountants-general in Chancery and in bankruptcy.
I hove now only just to mention to the coin-
Mitt! C for their convenience what are the alter-
ations which have be, n introduced into these rem,.
Intiens. An hon. gentleman asked me what the
amount of saving would b (Hear, hear.) lam sorry to
say that I cannot condescend upon the precise amount.
(Laughter.) I don't know what the precise amount will
be. If our proposal succeeds, the amount of saving will he
very considerable. It cannot be but there must be s•iate
amount of saving. I would rather not make a calculation,
seeing that it depends not on eircum• tutees under uur con-
trol, but on those which are hey ind our reach. (ILar,
hear) If we get out the 30 millions of Exchequer Bonds
at 2i per cent., the caving upon them, as compared with
the commuted stock, will be, fur the first ten yeare,l7s,ooo/.,
and after the first ten years. 1.10,000! a year. That will he
upou the whole amount of :3) millions. But I do by no
means absolutely limit my expectation to that. What I
wish t secure is the framework of the system ; so that we
should come back and render an account of the success of
this operation, when it will he in your power to
ray whether it shall be extended or uot. (Hair,
hear.) As to the changes in the resolutious, I will
nut venture to say that they are of a trifling
character. The third reseention, as it stands here, is a nee
resolution. But the object of that is not to make any sale
steatite change ; it is ou:y to make sure that the resolu-
tion shall convey to the government the powers which I
have endeavoured to explain, and with regard to which a
doubt tad been raised whether the language of the second
reeolution, standing alone, was sufficient to convey those
powers. The eighth again is a new resolution, but that is
merely a formal resolution. The most important change
in the resolutions is that on which the right hon. gentle-
man, with great rapidity, fixed his eve. It is continued in
the tenth resolution, uud its eU•ct is simply this. It limits
the commutation which may he made out of the consoli-
dated 3 per cent. annuities and the reduced 3 per cent.
annuities—that ie. Alt of the greater stocks—into the
new '2; per cent. stuck, to the sum of 30 million, as a
maximum. (Hear, hear.) It leave, it entirely free to the
holders to go intuthe 3) per cent. steckii, ideas they choose.
As far as the government is concerned, they would not
ohject to any limitation on this stork also; but
they do not think there is any danger attend-
lag leaving it open. The only 12ar we have
is about the 2) per cent. stock. We. therefore, propose to
fix this, which we think will he an a Motive limit upon the
21 per cent. stock to be crc ikeel uuder these resolutions.
That is the only change affecting the general description of
the plan which has been made in what 1 may call the second
ei.ition of the resolutions. There is no other change of an
important character. The committee will now be in a
' condition to judge whether that change is of a character
that would make it desirable for then: to take further time
for consideration, or whether they will cheese to proceed at
the present moment. I have now discharged, as well is I
could, the duty that was incumbent upon me. I have only
r to thank the committee for the great patience with which
, they have listened to me—(cheers)—and to say that I shall
be most happy, if on any point I have failed to convey an
accurate description of the intentions of the government, to
i supply it in answer to any gentleman who may ask for fur•
they information. (Cheers.)
The CHAIRMAN then read the first reaolutiofi.

Mr. HUME, on the whole, thought the scheme laid before
the house was likely to open a door to ezteusive geod—it
was taking a step in the right way. It would he an im-
mense convenience to the public, and in that light it would
be more valuable than even the saving of money. ne would
only make one further observation, namely, that as the
right hon. g ntlensan by this scheme would diminish the
incomes of a great number of people, he lived he woald
now turn his attention to a diminution of‘tnzation. (Hear,
hear.) The interest of the exchequer ought not alone to
be considered; they should likewise pay regard to the re-
' Wive price of articles of consumption. The 18:h was ap-
proaching, and be hoped he could congratulate the right
hon. gentleman on his budget as he did on the present
occasion

WILLIAMS said that as the right hon. gentle-
man was only adding to the debt to a small amount he would
not offer any ohketion, but if it were not for the alteration
made in the resolution that day he would offer the propose
tion every opposition. (Hear, beer.)
Mr. HENLEY urged various reasons for nut passing
the resolutions at once, and as no public inconvenience
mild arise from a few hour.. delay, he hoped the right bon.
gentleman would not press them to-night. (Hear.)
Mr. E. ELLICE entreated the right hon. gentleman,
unless he were met with an hostility which ceuel not be
anticipated, to proceed at once witlehis experiment. (Hear,
hoar )
Mr. Alterman THOMPSON said he could not acquiesce
in the advice which had just been given to the government.
(Hear, hear.) fie admitted that the subject was one of
immense magnitude; during the whole period that he had
sat in that house, upwards of 30 years, he had never before
beard frum a minis-er of the crown so bold a proposition
with regard to the national debt. (Hear.) He was quite
=prepared to enter that evening at any great length into
the important question under consideration ; and ne eve
tianly thought the consideration of it should be paetponed,
at least, until the following Monday. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. J. B. 8111TH said that a little time was certain',
necessary to consider it, and in the meantime he would ask
the Chancellot of the Exchequer whether the time had not
arrived fir making some more extensive attempt at re-
daring the capital of the national debt? (Hear, hear.)
That was a subject worthy the consideretion of a
Chancellor of the Exchequer, and therefore he in-
vited the right honuureble gentleman to reflect
whither he might not some day forms a committee to in-
quire into the practicability of the project. At all events he
trusty d that the present motion would not be pressed until
the house had a fuller opportunity of considering the de-
tails.
Sir F. KELLY believed that the committee could not
with any propriety proceed to a division ou the question
that evening. (11.4 e, hear.) These resolutions proposed
to deal with a portion of the national debt not less than
tO millions, and pea ibly with an amount of that debt not
less emu 500 millions. And even since they had come into
the house, an important change bad been made in the rent-
lutiona. Now this chonge must be considered with refe-
rence not only to its effect on the resolution it,elf, but
also with reference to its operation on the permanent
interests of the country, and further as to its effect
on the option profes,ed to be given to the funciholder. Ile
would then see in what way the option given to the fund•
holder would be affected by this resolution, and he must
say that unless he laboured under a misapprehension with
reference to the language in which that resolution was
framed, the option given of taking this Three-and-a-Half
per Cent stock, or of accepting the Exchequer Bonds, was
neither more nor less than a mere delusion. The question,
then, was, whether the purchaser would be better con-
tent to invest his 1001. in consols as they now existed, or
would be disposed to accept the Two-and-u-Half per Cent.
stock which formed the second proposal in the resolution.
Where was the man, in his senses, who would hesitate be-
tween investing 1001. to receive 15s. for forty years, and
then becoming cred,itor to the government for 1101., and ac-
cepting either the 3j stock or the Exchequer bond ? If any-
thing could render this question moreimportant, he might
say more alarming, it was that by these resolutions the go-
vernment were making the house to adopt, without COUSHIIIIII.
Lion, a plan which they themselves admitted to be an entirely
new operation, unexampled in its effects and its novelty.
and—be must beg to submit also to the consideration of Ifs
government—an operation which, if ever there was a time
la which they must proceed to the consideration of financial
measures with caution, was one requiring the utmost deli-
beration at the present moment. The present was a time
in which the finances of the country were in a state of tran-
sition, arising from the eats aordinern influx of gold, and
therefore he thought it wee the last period in our history
when the government should tie up their heads for a period
of 40 years in the arrangement of the national =ea=
Mr. J. WILSON said there were but one or two paints
in the hon. and learned gentleman's speech which required
observation. The hon. and learned member had commenced
his observations by fallowing the example of a right he.
member en that, the ministerial side, in illustrating his opt-
nioa by an arithmetical problem. He (Mr. Wilson) pro-
posed to follow the same course. The bon. and learned
gentleman said—and arithmetically he would appear Oe be
perfectly correct—that if a man wanted to invest 1001. ea
government security, he could not conceive how that man
would accept an Exchequer bond bearing interest at 21. 16e.
per cent., iu preference to the 1101. stock, seeing that the
security was the same in both cases. He thought he could
show the hon. and learned gentleman the fallacy that
lurked in this view apparently so arithmetically and ma-
thematically correct. Die hon. and learned gentleman
should remember that within the last mouth, with
Consuls at pare government issued securities no
better than the Three per Cents., and yet there were
numbers of people found to accept them at the
rate of lj per cent. The lion. and 1 d member had
completely overlooked the most important feature in the
question—namely, the character of the security which was
issued. (Hear.) Was it the same thing to have a security
never redeemable except at the option of government, and
tied up by a great number of restrictions with regard to its
negotiable character, as to have a security that might go
hum hand to hand, and which was similar in character
to an Exchequer Bill? Such a security had, he submitted
an extraneous value far above that of one which was haal
round with various restrictions in its passage from hen Ile
hand. The hon. amid learned gentleman had therefore
overlooked what hail e-coped no other speaker—an advs.-
tags which was appreciated in proportieu to the extent in
which persons understood the subject. The hon. and
learned gentleman gad or, rireilse rl the convenience which
these bends would be to bankers, assurance offices,
or other patties belting tenteerery investments to
make, and whose only present means of making
such investments was an Exchetiner Bill. The
The honourable and learn. d gentleen in had in the
one case to which he h .d (hewn attention—that of
the Exchequer Bond--made no allowance fur the re-
, marleetle facilities which tee one class of security to which
he had adverted, offered to the iuonied interest in carrying
out commercial trausa -'ions, as C rillpAfe4 with permanent
seventies, and, in the other, he had fallen into the ordinary
mistake of coesiderine the national debt a, so much money
• owing, to be repaid on 'I to ii,d, whereas it was eimely a
claim fur a certain MIMIC:), a e 1 at the end of tee 40 years
it was an more a po..itiee b. of I'ol. than it wes now.
Sir F. KELLY-1. e :ewe lie paid of or les..
Mr. WILSON—N I doubt it could nut be paid
off for lees— (•ippusitiun eh .ers)— but they would
never be hound to pay it off or to pay
more than 21 15s. per annum for each present 1001.
(Hear, hear.) An oloserverien had been made by another
h •o. gmit'eman a. to the ehjectieu to incr.:mine the capital
of the el.bt In that üb,erv,.tiun ho (Mr. Wilson) entirely

concurred. (Hoar, hear.) He thought there was nothing ,
to be more lamented—that nothing placed the management
of the public debt and of the tinauces of the country in a
worse light than the improvident mode in which a great
part of that debt was contracted in the course ofd
the last century. In point of principle therefore he entirely
concurred in the observation as to the undesirableneta of
increasing the nominal amount of the capital of the debt;
hut he must call the attention of the hon. gentleman to
this point. The whole amount with which it was proposed °
to de 4 in this way was 31,000.0091., therefore the highest :
nominal amount oy the increase would be but 3,000,0001.
Mr. Alderman THOMPSON—No; 4,000,00dt. The
amount of stock converted is 40,000,0001.
Mr. J. WlLSON—Taking it far granted that the whole
of the South Sea Stock wan taken up in these bonds it
would certainly he 40,000,0001., hut that would not be the
case. Now, the holders of this stock, instead of receiving
3 per cent. an at present, would in future receive only
21. Lis—that was a quarter per cent. p'r annum saved to
the country on the whole 30,000,0001.—a saying equal ,
at once to 75,0001. a year. If that was funded—it 'flawed
of taking advantage of the annual eavinz, thi y funded the
amount for the wl ole period, this 75,000 a year would be
exactly equivalent to the notoinal addition which at the
end of the 40 years would he made to the capital—via.,
three million—and that without taking interest upon the
amount so feuded into ace iuut at all. And if they took
credit for comp moil intertat, which they had a right to do,
they would have a further sum fir benefit of posterity
of between 300,0002. and 401,000!. ; eo that taking it ac-
cording to the view of the hon. and learned gentleman,
that the repayment of the nominal capital might be de-
; mandril, they would be that amount the better by the
' transaction. Thu item Hid, however, could not be made ;
the liability bring confined to the annuity of 21. 15s. for
each present luOl, of stock, and he had put forward this
calculation merely Sy way of illu-:ration. He thought he
had sufficiently answered the ohjoctions to which he had
nildremed himself, •asd he would not pursue the subject
further on the present occasion, considering, after the full
explanation of his right lion. friend, it was unnecessary tot
him to do so.

Mr. SPOONER, after all tho explanalions which had
been given, regarded the proposition as the most unintelli-
gible that had ever been brought forward.
Mr. 2d•GREGUR (Glas;ow) urged upon the !mule to
consent to the resolution., in order to put an end in any sus-
pense or doubt in the country on the aubject, being con-
vinced t.oit all clAsses of the c,•mmunity would regard them
with satisfaction.

Mr. WILKINSON thnught some further delay was
necessary before they were called upon to give their assent
to the scheme.
Mr. S. LAING hoped the right hon. gentleman the
C:.ancellor of the Exchequer would not accede to the invi-
tation for delay, as he relieved the proposition now before
them was very generally understood. The question had
been fully and anxiously discussed during the last three
days in the City, and he believed the amendment made
this evening for limiting the amount of stock to be con-
verted, would remove any serious objection that might be
entertained to the proposal. There could be no doubt that
amotipt men of business in the City, who viewed these
mantis in a clear and practical light, the proposal of the
government met with universal approbation.
Mr. DISRAELI in a low tone of voice made an appeal to
the government to postpone proceeding further with the
resolution till a future day.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL did not think it would be con-
venient to the public service not to go on this evening, for
it was of great importance when a question of this kind was
proposed in committee that they should so far decide upon
the resolutions as to say whether or not they would permit
a bill to be brought in according with the terms of the
resolutions. (Hear, hear.)
Mi. DISRAELI was not aware that the question had
been so amply debated by his friends around him, but at
all events he had no wish to enter into any length-
ened discussion upon this subject. lie confessed
he had thought better, indeed he had been under the im-
pression that an understanding had been come to between
the Chancellor of the Exchequer and himself that no dis-
cussion should take place to-night. That, lie thought, bad
been the feeling of the house; and considering that it was
only at the last moment that they were informed of an im-
portant alteration which had heen made in one of the reso-
lutions, he thought they were entitled to expect some
delay. As to the insinuation that some of his hon. friends
had laid themselves open to the charge of having approached
the question with a bitterness of feeling, lie at least had failed
to observe such a display, if any indeed had taken place.
but it was now to be understood that all they were re-
quired to do was simply to give the Chancellor of the Ex-
chequer leave to bring in a bill, of course that understand-
ing would remove much of the objection which they enter-
tained to coming to a decision to-night. (Hear, hear.) '
But if, on the other hand, the object of the government
was to have it go forth to the country that the House of
Commons had solemnly assented to the proposition, why
then he should certainly feel it to be his duty to
take a division for the purpose of showing
the small numbers of members present at the
moment. (Hear, hear.) They had been told by a right
hon. gentleman that it was the business of the House of
Commons always to facilitate the hudness of the govern-
ment; but, although he was generally disposed to comply
, with that proposition, he must beg to remind hon. mem-
bers that if they pushed it to the fullest limits, they would
often lose opportunities of discussing suhjccts of great im-
portance, such as this—a subject on which, according to the
hon. and learned member who last addressed the house,

there wan not the slightest mistake among men of business;
a subject which, according to the hon. and learned gentleman,
men of business could not have two opinions about. The men
us fact who lived absolutely amongst figures could gee no
injury in a proposal like this, even though it added largely
to the permanent debt of the country, while the Secretary
to the Treasury had just shown them, by an ingenious ar-
gument, that there would not by these res diatoms be any
increase to the permanent debt, but, on the contrary, rather
a diminution of it. If the resolutions hod remained as they
were originally framed, when there waste much alarm excited
amongst the men of business at the prospect of adding
50,000,0001. to the permanent debt of the country, there
would, according to the Secretary to the Treasury, be •
diminution instead of an increase of the debt. (A laugh.)
The mat of business said his object was to increase the
dept, while the Secretary of the Treasury was anxious to
diininieh it; and it appeared to him that there was so much
discrepancy between the two—the man of business and the
official—that he found some difficulty in meeting them.
The proposal was objected to amongst men of business, ac-
cording to the hou. and learned gentleman who last all.
diessedehem,:because it would increase the permanent debt,
but the Secretary to the Treasury now declared that neither
the original resolutions nor the mitigated form of them
would add to the permanent burden of the country. Well,
now, he wished to remind the committee what the proposi-
tions were in their original shape, by which it appeared
that there might possibly have been: added 50.000,0001. to
the national debt, butt that was a mistake of the men of
business, for, instead of increase, there would have been a
diminution. That was a coasulatiou for the men of busi-
ness who were going to vote for these resolutions. (A
laugh.) He should abstain from entering into any lengthened
discussion of the details of this plan, because there world
be another opportunity for his doing that; but before they
separated be wished to arrive, if possible, at soma clear
conception of what they were hereafter to debate. (Hear.)
There had already Leen a considerable change in the pro-
position before them. They however bad had the proposition
described to them by an eminent member of the house,
namely, the member for Coventry, as a most important
measure. The right hon. gentleman in fact said it was the
most gqantie financial proposition that was ever brought
forward • but in another part of the right hon. gentleman's
speech this colossal proposition figured as a 11011 tao-and-a-
half per cent. stock. That was the great result, although
there had been a general impression in town, if not in the
country, that the right hon. gentleman the Chancellor of
the Exchequer was going to pay off the national debt.
(A laugh.) Well, the change in the resolutions,
and the discussion to-night, had thrown sem
light upon the proposition : but, nevertheless,
if the Chancellor of the Exchequer really had brought for-
ward a proposition to pay off the national debt it could not
have been described in langusge more glowing than that
used by dot hon. member for Coventry. (Hear, hear.) But
he thought tonight they ought to have a clear conception
of what the government proposed to do, and upon what
part of it the government mainly rely. Well, then, he had
a note before him made upon the first propositi in. He
mentioned the first because the calculations he
had made were based epos the first resolution ;
but the plan had been described as a great financial pro-
pond, which must be viewed in its completeness. Now,
omitting that part of the first resolution which related to
the interest of the South Sea Annuities, he wanted to know
what would be its possible effect upon 500,000,0001. of Con-
sols. The first proposition proposed t 3 alter the 1001. Three
per Cent. stock into 821. 10s. New Three-and-a-Half
per Cent. stock, with a guaranteed rate of into-
rest up to 1894. He was not going to contrast
the comparative advantages of the three resolutions, or to
enter into any argument to prove that they were not of
co-relative value, as be thought that point had been ably
disposed of by his bon. and learned friend the member for
Suffolk ; he was only going now to show to the committee
what the effect of the original proposition would be, taken
as a whole. Now, what was the debtor an I creditor ac-
count of this ant financial proposition, viewed in its'
possible completeness, because that was the only way to
tot it. What would he its effect upon the 500.000,000 . of
Consols if carried out to its fullest effect ? If the whole
500,000,0001. were converted, as the resolution proposed,
the result would be as follows : At present the fundholder
received 15,000,0001. a year, and if this conversion took
place they would receive 14,435,.5001.; the country would,
therefore, gain .5645001. So that if the first proposition of
the government were caned into effect in its r .m-
-pleteness, and applied to the whole 500,000,0001.
Consols, there would be, according to the first
proposition, a profit somewhat exceeding 540,0001.
The second proposition, ho need hardly remind the com-
mittee, proposed to alter the 1001. stuck of 3 per cent. into
1101. 21 per cent., with the same rate of interest guaran-
teed f •r the period specified in the first resolution. Now,
let him see what would be the effect of this proposition
upon the d 90,000,0001. of Consols converted according to
the second proposition of the government. The landholder
was now in receipt of 15,000.000/. per annum; but, if this
conversion according to the second resolution took pla?r, lie
would receive only 13,750,0901.; and the (tract, then fore,
of carrying out th • first p opo-ition would he, to produce a
Keil% not of 56 eOOOl., but of 1450.0001. So that, accord-
ing to the second proposition, the country would gain
1,250,0001. a par, but it would still he sad-
dled with the additional debt of 50,000,0091.
Now, let him see what would be the effect
in the diminution of burdens, from carrying out the third
ProPositi 'll in all its completeness. According to the third
proposition, the present Lod der of 101. stack wool 1 ne i....

a 1001. Elebequer bond, carrying interest at the rate of
21. 15s. per cent. per annum up to 1801, and 2!. 10s. up to
1891 By this proposal the country would gain 1,250,000!.
until 1804, and two and a half 'editions from thence un to
1894, but then the country would be bound to pay in 1801
the whole of the 500.000,0401. of consols. Now, these were
the three propositions, sad the effect they would each pro-
dbuutee if
theyas werete aspect which
edo
the question
out
t th ehtitin !eoteheethaet
assumed by the changes announced tonight? (Hear.)
They might he very laudable resolutions, and more safe in
their being earri into operation than the original Ot184;
but after the admissions which had been made, tho altera-
tions which had been introduced, sad the explanations
which bad been given, did this question any longer possess
the features of moguitude and interest which it possessed
when they awoke that morning ? Let them look at the
different character which the proposition. had now assumed.
The lira. related to Exchequer Bond., and they were
hunted in amount ; they were limited to thirty milli ins in
the ori,cnal resolutions. But the right h to. gentleman, in
his atetement, very candidly iaf,rmed the house that,
although be hail limited himself to 30 millions as
the amount, be should uit hesitate to come to
parliament for fresh and fresh powers to enable
him to deal with that amount if the scheme
proved successful. But hail the discussion which
had taken place and the speeches that hal been made sup-
ported that idea and sanctioned the sanguine expectations
which lie nppeared to entertain ? On the contrary, allthat
had been said with regard to the Exchequer Bonds on both
sides of the house, and whether the !deposition of the go-
vernment was looked upon with suspicion or with favour,
shoe eil that Exchequer Bonds might be an efficient and a
valuable instrument of finance, but that it was an instiu•
Lunt which must be limited in its use ; and yet it was
by Exchequer Betels that it was proposed sensibly to
reduce the national debt. Ile now came to the
second proposition, that which had so astonished and
alarmed the country, and eve.. the ban. gentleman (Mr.
Laing) who had addressed the house with so much ability.
It was nut intended to act upon 500,009,000/. be the second
proposition, fur the Chancellor of the Exchequer had altered
the proposition, and ho was now bound to a maximum. Ile
wished to impress on the house that by the second proposi-
tion, which, according to the hon. gentleman (51r. Laing),
was to have increased the debt, and according to the hon.
gentleman the Secretary to the Treasury was to have re-
duced it, there was no great chance of dealing effictually
with the public burdens, nor was it such as to authorise the
magnificent expression of the right hon, gentleman the
member for Coventry. Neither the Exchequer Bondi
nor the new Two-and-a-llaif per Cent. fund, which
were both limited to thirty million's, would pro-
duce such effects as were apparent to the glowing lam-
ginetieu of the right hon. gentleman the member for Co-
ventry, and which prompted hint to pronounce the opinion
that these propositions were the most important which
were ever made. Neither by the second nor the Bird pro-
position would you be able to deal largely with the public
debt. He then come to the first preposition, which was to
exercise such a magical influence on the public burdens,
and to justify the description which had been bestowed on
it by the right hon. gentleman the member for Coventry.
Now, unfortunately the first proposition was the one which
everybody decried. It was the only one not limited
in its operation, and yet it was the very one which all
were agreed iu saying would not produce any eff,ct on the
public fortunes. He (Mr. Disraeli) thought that as far as
they had gone (aim that perhaps was the reason which
caused the noble lord to he so desirous of proceeding at once)
it was clear that the country would understand that this
was not such a very important subject. What then were
they going to do? What was ad this bather about 2
(liear and a laugh.) What was the meaning of this special
financial announcement only a week before the bringing
forward of the budget ? Certain important resolutions were
announced heralded by rumours which were of such a
nature that the funds rose, although it was
now said that was a mistake. (Hear, hear, and a
laugh) Then the resolutions were changed, and that to
such a degree that it seemed impossible, by carrying them,
to deal with the object which they were intended to gain,
or to have any practical effect on the finance of the country.
The object of the right hoe. gentlemen, in this unexampled
feat of a Chancellor of the Exchequer, was to create a new
two-and-admif per cent. fund. That was the great object.
Every age had its objects, and this being a fluancial age, at
all coats and at all hazards there must he created a two-
and-a-half per cent. fund. (" Hear, hear," and a laugh.)
But the most curious part of the whole was, that two separate
propositions were made for the creation of • Three-and-a- Half
per Cent. and a Two-aud.a-Half per Cent. fund, and on the
first night of the discussion it was said we will have nothing to
do with the Cleo-and-a-Hall-per Cent. fund, which is limited
to thirty millions ; but we will concentrate our energies
in the Three-and-a-Half per Cent. fund. If the first ob-
ject was a new Two-and a-Hal f per Cent. fund, why was
the greatest part of the scheme devoted to the Thrt c•and-
a-Half per Cent. fund ? Thu magical amount which had
been enlarged as being of so much importance was the
Three-and-a-Half per Cent. fund ; and, if the pubic debt
was to be operated on powerfully, it was to be by the
'ffiree-and-a Half per Cent. Fund, and not by the Two-
and a-Half per C. nt., although they were told that by the
creation of a Two-and-a-Half per Cent. fund only, sacrifice
was to be Midi.; and that that feat alone wee sufficient to
render a financial minister celebrated. (Hear, tear.) If
the object was the creation of is Two-and a-Half per Cent.
fund it might have been created by much simpler means.
The issue of ten millions of Exchequer Bills would have
created a Two-and-a-Half per Cent. fund, and the right
honourable gentleman might have accustomed the country
to the receipt of 21 per cent., and that might have been
done without exciting the idea that the public burdens were
to be decreased, and that a sew machinery was invented
by which the whole of the pubic debt would be removed.
You were to have a Twee and-a-Half per Cent. fund, but it
was to be gained by increasing the public debt, to the
amount of four millions. It would have been cheaper to
have funded Exchequer Bills for that purpose. But it
was not financial relief that was wanted either by the
right honourable gentleman or the country, but what
was really wanted was that there might be greeted a kind
of normal stock which was only to pay two and a half per
cent. (Hear, hear.) That seemed to be the object which
the government now had in the resolutions proposed, and
it was not impossible that it might be obtained. He (Mr.
Disraeli) thought it was of importance, that although these
resolutions might pass without a diviaiiin on the understand-
ing, as stated by the mild.. lord, that they were only in-
tended as a basis on which the Minister of Finance should
found a bill; it was, lie said, important that the country,
after all the excitement which had been caused, should have
a clear idea of the question. He did not say
that the proposition. would not be recognised
as safe, but they did not profess much, and it
was probable they would perform less. (Hear, hear.)
Bat it was only fair that the couutry should think that the
public debt was about to be extremely reduced, when the
Chancellor of the Exchequer and his colleagues were only
desirous of having a twe-and-a-half per cent. stock. That
was the object of the resolutions; and there seemed to be
es
complicated machinery for the attainment of so slight a
result, as ever was devised by the most skilful plagiarist.
(Hear, hear.) In "Thomas Aquinas" there was a chapter
which was devoted to a dissertation as to how many angels
could dance upon the point of a needle, and he could not
but recognise in these resolutions something akin to that
important matter. He should be happy if on future
discussions more unanimity was attained with regard to
the reeolutions, but as it was Friday night be should be sorry
that her Majesty's subjects should go to their slumbers be-
lieving that the National Debt was going to be paid off.
(" Hear, hear," and laughter.)
Captain LAFFAN contrasted the position of two per-
sons who were possessed of 1001. in the funds. One of
these, A, as proposed by the resnlution, would receive an
annuity of 21. 17a. 9d. for forty years, and would then be
paid 82t. 10s.; while the other, B, would receive an annuity
of 21. 155., and would be liable to be paid off at 1101., and
contended that that was an inequality which was not
just.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that
the hon. gentleman overlooked the fundamental idea of
the national debt, and which had been also overlooked by
his hon. and learned friend the member for Suffolk, and
treated it as a national debt which the public creditor could
recover. It was no such thing ; there was so agreement to
pay the national creditor a capital sum, but only to pay
him a perpetual annuity, which was redeemable at certain
times on the payment of certain sums. That was very dif-
ferent to there being an obligation to pay him off. He
maintained that in the case put by the hon. gentleman, B
would not receive 11101., anima it was to the interest of the
State to give it him ; nor did it depend on B, or on the
amount of his stock, but on what was for the interest of
the State.

•
Captain LAFFAN believed that the value or security of
the funds depended on the amount which they were liable
to pay off, and in proportion to that was the value at which
they were rated.
Mr. MALINS protested against the doctrine laid down
by the Chancellor of the Exchequer that the nation was not
liable fur a particular aunt. It was true that there was no
real legal liability to psy anything but an annuity of 30
millions, but that could only be got rid of by the payment
of 800 millions, and that was to be looked at as the amount
of ; and he could not agree in the abstract proposi-
tion of the Chancellor of the Ezesequer that the nation was
not liable to pay a capital suns of money, but only as an•

amity. . . .
The first resolution was then agreed to.
On the second being read,
Mr. DISRAELI reminded the committee that this, by
the admissions of Ministers, was the important resolution ;
and when it came to be viewed, in the form which it would
subsequently take, it would be a grave question to consider
whether for a gain of 530,000/. it would be worth the while
of the country to guarantee A 21 per cent. for forty years—
that being a rate of interest higher, he believed, than what
would prevail. (Hear, hear.)
The second and the other resolutions were then read
seriatim, and agreed to.
Upon one of the resolutions a convervation took plaice
between Mr. A. WILKINSON and the CIIANCLLLuIt Of the
EICREQUEU respecting South Sea Stock; but the expla-
nation was unimportant.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER gave notice
that on Mondry he would more the necessary resolutions of
form, which would be the notice to the parties.
The house thiit resumed.
The forms! motion was put and carried that the house at
its risin2 should adjourn to Mouthy.
SUPPLY.— CIVIL SERVICE ESTIMATES.

On the motion that the house should go iut committee
of supply on the Civil S.:7%km F...timat,
Mr. W. WILLIAMS express 'I an earnest hop, though
ha had no objection, of course, to the motion to go auto
committee being taken advantage of by bon. members who
had notices on the rlp:r to the purnok of d scu.sion, that
the goverue.rnt would not as'.: for any rota to-night ; and
hr gru laded this rolaest on the fact that the estimatvs

had only been delivered the preceding of ernoon, and
that members had consequently had no time to bestow
proper examination on the items.
Mr. EWART said that a notice stood in his (Mr. Ewart's)
name, "to call attention to the expediency of instituting
examination of candidates for the diplomatic service." Re
would not detain the house by:going over the whole ground,
but would simply ask what prospect there now was of a
system of examination being adopted, and whether the
government would In the papers on the table ?
Lord J. RUSSELL could nut say that, during the short
time he had held the seals of the Foreign Oilier, he had
paid attention to the subject; but he had heard from
Lord Clarendon (ca we understood) that all the papers
were now completed, and that noble lord would probably
take some steps upon them.
Lord STANLEY bad no hesitation in saying, that attar).
continued to make the diplomatic service a profession,
then, iu order to guasd ast.,inst abuses, it uss essentially
nectseiry to establish some test, so that these oho were
incapable of &dug good service to the retinue should be
unable to eater on diplomacy as a profi snot.. (near.)
Lord PALIMERS TON —A.s reAards th question of my
hon. and le irned friend (Mr. Ewan), I hove to state that
when I hell the seals of the Foreign-othee, I took steps
with the vie re of tusti.uting an examination of persons
entering the diplomatic service, and my notion on this sub
j-et was much the same as that of the stable lord
who has just addressed the house. I proposed
to institute a moderate examination for the person
appointed an unpaid attocU, and a more complete
and stringent examination for the party seeking the
office of a Raid attach 4. I entered into a communica-
tion on the subject wits the no:ix lord (Lord J. Russell),
and had already taken considerable steps in the arrange.
ment. I cannot, however, after what has fdleit from the
noble lord opposite (Lard Stanley), eantine myself to this
brief statement, fur I feel bound t t say I do not concur in
the opiuions expressed by the noble lord. Ile smuri to
think it bettor that we should chance the existing system,
and that we should no banger consider diplo:tatists
as • professional body. In support of this view the
noble lord quotes the example of the tinited States.
but the bowie will recoilect how different is the condi•ion of
the United States as regards Eur mean affairs with the
condition of this country. (Rear, hear.) Except us regards
this country and France, the United States have hardly
any interest in what is passing throughout Europe. Let us
look, however, to the ex imple of those countries which
possess the greatest influence in }..uropran affaire. Let us
see what is done by France, what is done by Russia and
by Austria. (Hear, hear.) They feel it to be an advant-
age to employ persons in this trade—or pro-
fession, or whatever you like to call it—they feel it
expedient, I sty—when they employ pecans to do
a thing, to employ those who understand how it ought t
ho done. (Laughter.) Well, gentlemen to whom, doubt-
less, it would be very agreeable to pass a few years in a
foreign court, say—" Throw open the diplomatic service ;"
but the noble lord (Stanley) admits that the lower posts
should be tilled by those very men whom he wishes to
abolish, and that tile principal, totally ignorant of his duty,
should be supported by the subardirateetiieer who knew it.
(Laughter.) Now, let the house just fancy the ease of an
ignorant superior being called to a conference with the roi-
, eider of that country for which he was accreditel,and when
some difficult point was mooted, suppose It should say, " I
am only here to do the ornamental part—(laughter)—hut
have a secretary, who does the real work at ray °thee at
home; and I must really send for him before I solve the
question you are greed enough to propose." (Loud laugh-
ter.) I should say, it is the fashion of many men to speak
disparagingly of the diplomatic body. I have had seine
experience of that body—(hear, hear)—and I say with all
siuevrity that no government in Europe is better onved
or so well informed—l will not sty setter informed, but so
wall informed—lay the shields she employs than England
is. (Rear, hear.) We had correct information of all that
was going on when the sgeuts of other countries were M
error or were deceived sato what had really taken place. The
rule, however, fished the unbending rule winch the house
might expect from the statement of the noble lord. In all

the'suboidinate racks promotion took place in the body.
The unpaid attache, and he might be so for five or six years,
became a paid attaché, then a secretary of legation un an
embassy, but there was no rule that missions should be
filled from the next rank belo.v them. Thsre were
twa or three mutes which I can refer to. These
is the noble lord, now Secretary for Foreign
Affairs (I.srd Clarendon), who went to Spain
as ambassador though he bad not gone through the infe-
rior ranks; there is Sir 11. Bulwer, who had gone nonii-
nail), through the inferi tr ranks ; and there is Mr. Wye°
at Athens, who has not gone through the interior ranks ; so
that in point of fact the country is not deprived of the ser-
vices of these who have cot gone through a diplomatist
career, and yet are qualified by their general knowledge
and attainments to till a high wsition in our d plomutic
service. But to fill those pasts we select men, sometimes
members of bath houses, who are acquainted
with the events which have taken place abroad,
who aro conversant with pablic law, and with the political
events of their own country. We have, in tact, • mixt d
system. We have thq advantage of having men iu the in-
ferior ranks who have acquired a knowledge of diplomacy,
and when a vacancy occurs it is filled by that person who
has evinced the most capacity, or it is filled from the racks
of those public men who from their capacity and acquire-
ments are best calculated to take share iu the diplomatic
service of their country.
Mr. DISHABLI said that the noble lord had in the last
part of his speech cempletely answered the first par!.
(Hear, hear.) The noble lord assumed that every person
who was not trained to diplomacy would be ignorant and
inefficient, for that was the whole foundation in kis speech ;
and then he ended by proving that persons selected from
ether positions—members of both houses ut the legislature
—as the noble lord said, were with advantage to the
ctuntre called upon to lid the higher positions.
Now *their own experience contradicted the firs: Vill-
clu.ion at which the nuble lord opposite had arrived.
It was his (Mr. Disraeli'e) opinion that sooner or later they
would have to introduce into their diplomatic service a
thorough reform on the principles laid down by his noble
friend, and by that reset= render the cavica more efficient
and economical (Hear, hear.)
Atter a few words in explanation front Mr. ENVAIir,
Mr. BOWYER. said that although it could nut be denied
that there were instances of distiuguished men having
filled high diplomatic posts who had not passed through a
diplomatic traiaing, yet he could not see why a complete
system of education could nut he adopted for that
Without a knowledge of the civil law, it is impossible to
attain a competent knowlede of the international law ;
and those who were in training far the diplomatic service
should therefore be instructed in the civil law.
After • few words from Mr. J. PHILLIMORE and Mr,
R. PHILIAMORZ, the subject dropped.
MIL JUSTICE PERRIN AND THE SIX..MILE
BRIDGE AFFRAY.

Lord A. VANE then brought forward his motion—
That the exposition of the law set forth by Mr. Justice
Perrin, in his charge to the grand jury of the county of
Clare, on the 22nd day of February, 18°3, with referenee
to the duty of soldiers employed for the suppression of
riots, or on emergencies, is at variance with the opinions
of former judges, opposed to the rules up to the present
time laid down for the instruction of military and civil
fure,s, and antagonistic to the principles and orders of the
Mut;ny Act and Queen's regulations. That it is the opinion
of this house that the conduct of the soldiers
employed at Siwmile Bridge was thoroughly justifiable,
and necessitated by the position they were placed in.
Ile considered that they were bound to put the military
when called out to keep the peace in the same position that
they put the police. Any one, rich or poor, who interfered
with the police in the execution of their duty, was
punished severely, and he conceived that soldiers wore en-
titled to the same protection. In this case, however, they
had put the soldiers on their trial, while the instigators of
the riot (the priest.) escaped without their conduct being
impugned. Be conceived Mr. Justice Perrin's charge to
be a mast preposterous one. Tile Attorney-General for
England told him that gentlemen of his profession
received the law from the judges. Ile was glad Li
find, however, that teem were others of his profession
who disowned the preposterous doctrine of Judge Perrin.
The Attorney-General for Ireland had declared that the
soldiers were perfectlyjustified. Thu noble lord concluded
by quoting a number of legal authorities, both civil and
military, in confirmation of the right hon. gentleman's view
of the case.
Sir W. VERNER seconded the resolution, which after
some discussion was withdraws..
The House went, pro forted, into Committee of Supply ;
and, having ri.sunted, adjourned at 10 minutes to 1.

Pains.—Mr. Pugh paired with Sir J. Walmlay ell Fri-
day night. Captain Pakenham for, with Mr. Stirling
against, Mr. Muore's motion on the Irish Consolidated An-
nuities.

THE GOVERNMENT FINANCIAL PROJECT.

The following arc the three additional Resolutions
of the Chancellor of the Exchequer:
That the Commissiouers of her Majesty's Treasury be
authorised and empowered to tit the number of years
during which the interest of 21. 11s. per centum shall be
payable on such Ilona, subject to the limitation of the fore•
going resolotiou ; awl likewise to determine whethar such
bond, after the let of September, 1594, shall be redeem-
able at their option only, or shall also he redeemable at the
option of the holder; and that the said commissioners shell
give notice in the London Gazette of what they shall de-
te mine in these respects as YOULI as may be after the pant-
ing of any act in pursuance of thee resolutions.
That provision shall be made for paying off suchas-
prietor or proprietors of tiny of the said capital Tr
stuck or capital stocks of annuities nwfore mentioned u •
not eignity his assent to accept and receive New V. Ids. per
Ceutum Anumtiee. or New 21. 10s. per Ceutum Annuities,
or Exchequer Donde, in lieu thereof.
That hottaii,g herrin marine 1 btuiS extend to authorise
the CUllllllUtill .011 of the said Consolidated W. per Ceotum
Annuities, or the said Reduced 3/. per Ceutum Annuities,
situ the win New 21. Ins. per Cullum Aouuities, alter he
amount entered for contioutstian into such New 2/. 10s.
per Cent= Aneuai,s iu the said books of the Bank of
England, and Dank of Ireland, shall hut reached the sum
of Vial) millions; awl that the power of commutation of
the said 3r. per Ceutum Stocks shall thereafter he limited
to the two other options liereittlselora given : that is to say,
and the option of exchange for Eachequer Donde.
the owlet' of exchange fur 3!. Ills per Centom Aufklutfob,

HER MAJESTY'S TIIKATRE.—The purchaser of the
prop( rti, s of her I'4 qeAty... Tit( etre in ono lot, oanurele7,
ie Jdr. (Awl. s Lee, of ft,), Ooldea•squar.•.