The Express.
London, England, 1851-02-12 00:00:00

mists of the day to be at the ate of not km
than 5 per cent. question, then, in a temperate rind in a considerate spirit.
But, sir, it is often said by thole who arc of opi- Remember who these men are, the farmers of itugland, for
nion that the land of Eugland m, perhaps, euleeet to some whom in especial I speak—men who, under circumstances
severe taxation, and who may not have taken that general of great trial, have I think &hewn great virtues—(hear)--
, view which I have requested the house to favour me by and who in th' course of these changes have, wo all admit,
' taking to-night--it is often said by the gentlemen to whom endured great injustice. Consider the question in a spirit
I allude, "It is very true ; there is something in what you of equity. Ido nut ask you to-night to give any vote upon
say ; it cannot be denied that nearly half our custoinsduties any specific measure ; for to ask that would i.e to act un-
are raised by restricting or prohibiting agricultural Indus- wisely and most unfairly with the house. It is not my
try ; it cannot be denied that two-thirds of our inland re- duty to make a definite proposition. Transferring to the
venue is raised by an impost on agricultural produce; it ministry the task of proposing specific measures, Mr.
cannot be denied that seven-twelfths of our local taxation Disraeli, in conclusion, called upon them at once to recog-
falls on agriculture; but then the land has a groat exemp- Ui4i.` the duty of providing a remedy. for the injustice that
tem." In other wends, the enormous injustice I have was now inflict:a upon the most important class in the
sketched to-night is attempted to be palliated by a state- country. In case they declined this task, he hinted that
meat of this kind. Well, lam going to meet it. (Rear.) the present crisis offered to the opposition a " golden oppor-
lam going to see, as an advocate anxious to arrive at the tutu y" of stepping in and settling it for them. The hon.
truth, and whose sole object in making this motion is to member sat down amidst great cheering.
terminate the public. controversies which lease injured The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER (who was
the public spirit of this country—(hear, hear)—l occasionally indistinctly heard) said that he could hardly
am going to inquire into the justice of this guess on what possible grounds the present proposal
allegation; and, if there be great exemptions enjoyed by the was to be supported. The hon. gentleman, in former ses-
land, then I will say that I will place fairly before public Won., had made clear and definite proposals; but what he
opinion, and fairly before the agricultural holy, my irupar- now &eked was utterly ineompreheneible. The hon.
' tial decision, so far as that can influence them upon the sub- gentleman had introduced a vast variety of subjects, =my
ject. I will not attempt to state their case in that respect of which alone would take two nights' discussion,
upon any representation of what Ido not sincerely believe ; such as general taxation, local burthens, national rate,
and as my statements rest entirely on facts and areuinents, settlement of the poor, the Bank Act of 1814 ; and, in fact,
not upon sentiment, it is open to every gentleman epponite there was no one of thaw questions which had occupied the
who condescends to listen to me, toprove that mystatemente house for the last five years which the honourable) gen-
tire erroneous, or to demonstrate that my conclusions are tleman had not now thrown into the bodge-ledge of his
fallacious. (Ilene hear.) The ease of agricultural exemp- speech. (Hear, bear.) And after all the honourable
tions bring); us now to the consideration of another branch gentleman did not ask the house to come to any practical
of our system of revenue—namely, that of the decision in his statements and arguments,. Ile
stamps; and, though I will treat these points us would, however, offer some observation'. Ile begged,
lightly ne I can, I hope the house will favour however, that the house would nut forget tit, cir-
me with their attention. (Hear, hear.) Now, sir, in agri- cumetincea which lie had stated that night. He had
I cultural discussions, this io the usual position taken—the already announced that on Friday he would submit
probate and legacy duties are brought forward. A case is a statement of the financial measures of the session ; and it
made out. An agricultural gentleman throws the stemps would not, of course, be expected that hi: should now anti-
and conveyances at the head of the free trader, because he cipate that discussion (Hear), or do more than to speak to
feels indignant at paying such an impost on personal pro- the general question. The bon. gentleman, in hie prclimi-
perty. I admit that under these duties personal property nary remarks, had referred to the former debates on this
pays more than real property. I will even admit that the eubject, and to the unintentional mierepresentatione and
payment of real property upon stamps is not a charge, on mistakes made, re alleged, on that (the ministerial) site of
the whole, countervailing the excess paid on personal the house. Now, he had lint to meet the hon. gentleman
property. But, I must first of all observe, that a on these points in 1819. The argument of the hon. gentle-
' monstrous error exists about these legacy end pm- man, however, then was, not only that the mai-
-1 bate duties, and that, if you investigate the sub- cultural interest, but that the whole country, were
ject of stamps with reference to these two &scrip- in a condition of absolute distress and ruin. (Loud
time of property, you will arrive at conclusions cries of " Hear, hear.") The words of the lune gentleman
not quite consonant, perhaps, with those sometimes enter- then were that, whether he welt to the marts of commerce
taiued. Now, remember this, as proved by etatemente or to the fields of agriculture, the result was still the same,
made beton:committees of this house that at this moment and that everywhere there prevailed a universal distress.
of the legacy duty an amount is raised of 1,200,000/. per (Item:, hear.) The answer of the government was that as
minute, 500,0001. per annum of which is paid directly Iry the far as manufactures and trade were concerted the assertion
hind ; for. although Mr. Pitt did not carry his original bill was totally contrary to the facts, and that as regarded acti-
on this subject, his subsequent bill made all laud sold under culture the representation of the hon. go ntleruen ae very
wills liable to this net. The cousequeuce now is that five- greatly exageereteol, and, at any rate premature. Ile (the
twelfths of the probate and legacy duties are paid directly Chancellor of the Exchequer) had said that when the pares
by the land ; and, therefore, so far as the burden, on land of corn had been in 181 i at 695. N., on an average of the
are concerned, this is a fart which ought not to be omitted year, when in ISIB the prime had fallen only to net. 6d.,
from conaideration. (Hear, hear.) Bear in mind that all about the prices at which they had been in 1815-6—that
leasehold property, all ecelessiestical tenures, pay these it was perfectly impossible, alter a year of sue la eatraorili-
duties, and tat, in the remaining sum of 700,0001., nary prices, followed by a year of nn cetraordinary deprese
which these duties produce, the amounts paid by leasehold elan, that the statement of the hon. gentlemen mulct be
property and evelestaetical tenure:sere included. But, when trite. It was even hefore the free admission of corn had
we are considering the burden of these tame upon land, let taken plans that the hon. gentleman alleged that the agri-
us not forget that all the stork in trade of the fanner pays culturists were ruined, and that they had been ruined
both legacy and probate duties ; and when you take this by prices unexampled fur several years. Now, he
into consideration, and add to it what he pays directly in (the Cleancellor of the Exchequer) found, on re-
other respects, you will find that he has a heavy burden to (erring to the prices of wheat in the year 1418, that they
bear. (Hear.) Sir, I have now gone through with were higher in 1818 than they had beet in 1814, and that
one great exception, almost every important feature of they had been rising from 1841 to 1848. lle had not been
our financial system. I have viewed the taxation of the iu tse house at the time the hon. gentleman made hi, motion
country very imperfectly, from the greatness of the subject, lad year, and lie would therefore stand aeoptitted of has ing
and my unwillinsmen to press too much upon the house, in tole any of the prophecies referred to by the hon. gentle-
but I have viewed the taxation of the country generally mall at to "diminished supply" and " rise in prices." Such
with reference to its bearing upon the owners and coempiere arguments were uuqueetionahly used in reply to the hon.
of the land—upen that important class of her Majesty's gentleman, and on no insufficient grounds, and by men most
subject. who are suffering difficulties, depressions, die- competent to give opinions on the subject. The hon. gen-
trona, and who continue to suffer them, in a country tleman referreel to a statement made on the occasion by
where all other classes, we are informed by the Sovereign the
.Marquis of Lansdowne, to • the effect that ho
and her ministers, are prosperous. (Hear, hear.) anticipated a diminished supply of foreign corn, and a pro-
That it is very possible that classes may flourish when liable rise in price. Now it was not without data, that his
they are living on the capital of a particular cliies—(loud noble friend made these calculations. The returns now on
cheers)—i4 a result which I think is not to be wondered at the table would show, that in the six months outing the
(Renewed cheers.) But Ido nut forget the great financed sth April last, the time when the statement was
miracle which has oecupieol my attention merely by that made, the importations of wheat end the importa-
said hypothesis, because I sec before me gigantic and sinus of fleet were leas by one-half than in
Curious machinery, by which we have been carried through the six months ending on the sth April, 1849.
sears of unrestricted importations, and of restricted cultiva- The importation had diminished six months before the Ise-
iinn, of reetrieted induetry, and of colooseil imports. rind of which the hen. member had spoken, and had that
(Cheers.) We know well that an instruntent—e great affected the falling off. When hon. gentlemen Said that
financial inetrenient—was brought into this honer by the they (the government) had 'reeled the twine, let them re-
eminent minister whose pride it was te introduce this new member that they who had led that movement had
commenial system, the fruits of which I am not here to been equally mistaken. Ile had heard then all sorts of
challenge, but the telvantages of which upon the part of the representatioms, such as that corn would come from America
owners and occupiereof the land I wish to enjoy. We know at :Ps., mid the like. But one remarkable eircunt-
what that wonderful financial instrument wee--it was the stance connected with the change wilas this, that of
property and income tin. (Laughter and cheers.) lle- all those gnat entrees from which the, largest mid mod er-
ne:oler, said Sir Robert Peel to the Manchester school—re- aggeretelexpeetationeofenormouesuppliteleul been eortned,
number that in order that you should have your cotton' free in no one case had the expectations been fulfilled, or the
the land cone:need to the imposition of a property tax. anticipate' importation* arrived, but, on the contrary,
Gee:rows aisd confiding man! (Renewed !engine: and there had been a gnat supply of corn from these
divers). And, by that powerful and efficient increment, toiletries from which uo one had exmyted env supply
this remarkable system bus beet awried into me:notion, con- at all. (liver' hear.) This proved that booth teepee who
ducted in its course, and permitted to accomplish its results. luul Iseen eonficlent and those who heel lwen alarmed at the
(Great applause.) And what is the result of that fiscal change: were equally mistaken with respect to the supply of
law? Suppose the men of eluncloater and the merchant% foreleg) corn, and it showed also that it was a state of things
of England to have met and said to the minister, Here the continuance of which might probably be dcoubbel.
we will euherribe 5,0110,000 i. a year, give us free trade, and When it was found that the country from which the largest
we will keep the old system," still the land might have supply had beet expected was conserted from an exporting
said, " Sulescribe what you please, bat, if we are to have to an importing country, when for some year, up to 1846,
unrestricted ecompetitiens, we demand unreetrieted industry." and inclueing the years of the famine, the lowest average
(Cheers.) But, the- retunes of the property and ineunio: tax price of corn in this country was from .15e. to 48e.
stein to have preauced this great resale. I tied that a it might lie concluded that this was au exceptional
moiety, and, perhaps, the Kreuter moiety, of it, is levied date of thing* that such a price el el prevail in Fronee
from the owners and occupiers of loud—(loud cheers)— as to enable her to import large queutities of corn. no
from the owners, se hose rents have been mantel, and from the did think that this was a matter of some little importance
occupier., who make no protest. If you ask me what are my re- to consider. Ile was not one of those who were disposed tb
medics forth° difficulties of tite owner, anoloccupiers of the he anxious for the raising of the prier of corn, hut the fact
land, I answer, that I haivethe homourtoorepreeent an English showed that there was nothing more than importution of
county depending on the cultivation of the Feel. and that as foreign corn affected price when the some effect was pro-
one who, however unworthily. tend no one is more e:neitile duel in an exporting and an animating country. and
of the unworthiness than niyeelf, is still the organ of the when the exporting country was sufficing great detnes.
friends around me, I will tell you the remedy we require— The price of corn at Michaelmas lust in France was 'ewer
we roquin: justice. (Loud protectionist cheers.) We ask than it had been for the preceding thirty yours, and the
you that you should not prohibit or netriet our industry. prim there now was nearly a, low as it had been at
7.1.1 W, sir, there have been severel suggietione mad,,elivimelmae indeed, on spree Sahlin few centimes
in this house for the relief of the land, and I will, lower. In the yea 1849, 740,000 quarters had
very briefly, more briefly than their merits require, bo:eu imported,andin 18e0 about 1,100,000 quarters.enter into their discussion. I will take the two remedies, What, then, was the state of distress among the agricul-
which are somewhat vague in their expression, which have turist, of France at the present moment, with thus advantage
been principally counselled by die gentlemen of Manche- of exportation to this country to the amount he had stated ?
ter. They busy always laid it down as a principle, that (Some interruption was here given by Mt hen. member ex-
what was wanted for the hind was moire labour and more pressing dissent.) Ile was attempting to peeve his views to
capital. " Employ more labour and snorer capital, and you i.e right, and he ought to he allowed to state his opinion on
will be able to contend with the difficulties waited which the state of the corn market, and if the him. member did
you ere struggling." Let me remind you that while for not admit that it was thirty brought into the argument, he
four years the owner" and occupier, hive been cnuneelled could not be in a fit state to bestow that calm deliberation
to employ more labour and capital, there have existed on upon the subject which it required. The right hon. gentle-
our statute books two codes of law the very object of which man then read from a French paper of about u fort-
wes to restrict the employment of labour and the distribu- night old the following passage on the prices of agricultural
teem of capital. Before you advise the cultivator of the soil produce in France :
which semen in our coustey districts otimemfert and misery IS to
to employ more labour, why don't you deal with the law of The deplorable ants which le pressing upon our 'sericulture, and
tArelniotteuoi.cotc.ineit;...n,,..re ell•precr.iato:nboyf priwcedo,f cora continues.
settlement ? (Cheer%) Sir H. Pail felt the necessity of
meeting that question. He devolved the duty of con the -
prgrovai that a sup. raborilial'harvrat may bemi; real g•l',.rotriltniewnidaictlit
sidering it on a member of his cabinet, but, unfor-
tunately, that 'great change in the agricultural policy divert more and more from agriculture both that capita which will
of England took place in a moment of precipitation, and he more neeeseary for it than
three years, been subject to the greaten aofferinx, and it has 'wen ever and manufacturing industry has
then the house was little inclined to ennsider a question of been able in pan to repairir it. lawn. Agriaulture alone has, for the
so difficult a character as the law of settlement, and that last
prapreset its without any prospect, at
law still remained preventing the owner and occupier of
land from employing more labour. (Hear, hear.) Thom lie
Now, if a country, enjoying at this moment the absolute
was told that more capital ought to be employed ; but in prohibition of all foreign corn, with the beneficial privilege
1811 the house tweed a law the whole object of which war
off exporting corn to this country, was neverthelees in such
to restrict the employment of capital. Besides this, the a state of distress, MS implied in the paper he had read, it
appeared theft the price was more to be attributed to some-
house seemed to forget that the laws of partnership now in
thing besides the importation of foreign corn then it had
You have had before you, by favour of the House of
existence were almost a barrier to the introduction of capital.
been. Ile believed that the price hied been greatly affected
by the bad quality of the corn of the lure harvest. A gen-
Lords, a project for a national rate, which has been
matured by a noble lord, a member of the other house tleman connected with Sufielk said the other de that not
'of parliament. This also is a subject which has en-
huh' of the produce was fit to come to the flail); and that
growled a large degree of public attention and appro-
not more than half of that was tit to bring into the market.
bation, but on which also there are great olifferenees of lie now begged to say, as regarded himself, that he had
never held out any expectation that prices would be
opinion. lam not giving any opinion specifically in favour
high, nor hail he ever expressed any wish that they should
of a national rate. There are great objections to a national
be high. (Hear, hear.) On the contrary, he had fro-
rate for the relief of the poor; but then is no) evil attend-
queutly stated his belief, that it was for the interest and
Mg such a rate so great as the enormous injustice of the
land paying, in its present condition, the greater proportion advantage of the great body of the people of this country
of that rate. (Cheers.) And there is no fallacy so great as
ments of the country—to the workinse classesof this e
that always brought forward by the Chancellor of the Ex- belonging to all dames employed in the industrial d -
Mee --that the price of their food, of their bread country,and their
chequer and his friends when he shows us that house
that th
piety pays a greater proportion of the poor rate than it meat, should be cheap ; and he had stated iu the last do-
ought
to do—a sum which is teed to rival and ex-
bate that it was wise, exof this country should bup
e
ytheirdient
,
and
meat justund bread use h ) plya seed the amount paid by the land. As respectsa national
rate, urged as a measure of relief to the rural districts, as the world meld afford it to them. (Hear, hearer ...With
which pay that rate, this objection is quite fallacious. Its respect to another item—the price of meat—to which the
quite possible that the house property of Lancashire may eon. gentlemen had referred, it was perfectly true that to a
pay more. Tourney have reduced the poor rate in amount, small extent
thntte .
the imp rt of
but these circumstances do not affect my argument. You u
theforr ignyearealtB4tle9.hmßl uintrtrehe"-re.dhadin
have not reduced the poor rates in Kent and Sweet. teen more than a corresponding fall in the importation of
(Hear, hear.) They feel the injustice the same ; and the provisions. Beef and beacon had fallen off more than enough
Injustice is as great whatever may be the proportion tu counterbalance the increase in cattle. 11. es conviction
of the poor rate paid by house property in the north was that the price of meat was owing to the increased pro-
of England. (Hear, hear.) The noble lord, the other d,tetion in this country. (Hear.) The right hon. gentle-
night, got up, and with a sorrowful expression of man here quoted from returns some details relating to
countenance, and shrugging his shoulders, as if he =know- the two ports of Newcastle and Glasgow, which were
lodged in his heart that the land was unjustly'
treated,
and unaffected by foreign. . It - seemed
I that something ought to be done for the land exclaimed, to impossible
suppose but that !mporte the tncreaaed consumption must
" What can Ido ; I don't know that ads. (betel duty would tell beneficially upon the agricultural interest, when
do anything for the farmers." Why, the farmers don't it caused so greatly an increased demand for
want a ss. duty., or an Bs. duty, or a 10s. duty. (Cheers.) If their produce from all our great manufacturing towns. It
you propose a m., an 134., or a 10%. duty, after reviewing the was impossible to suppose that, with the improvements of
circumstances of all classes, and determining what ought manufaures and the extension of melee co, a larger
to be the legislation for all, your propositions will proportion of cattle could not be produced yt. a cheaper
h be for us to consider, as members of parliament, and as re- rate in spite of the increased demand for meat! In fact, it
meewntatives of the whole community. (Hear, hear.) But wee eamomible to account for it except by the increased
in the name of the agricultural interest I eolemnlyeo • test production of cattle. By the poor-law returns on the
L against considering etch measures as specific remedies for table, it appeared that there had been great reduce
ithe special advantage of the agricultural clauses. (Cheers.) tions in both the expenditure and iu the number of
We have been eked sometimes why we, the landed pro- reliefs to the poor; and, us the hon. gentlemen had referred
prictors and farmers, thu., come to the House of Com- to this as a particular burden on the agricultural interest,
MOMS with the tale of our sufferings. We are told that no he (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) was happy in show-
other proprietary class—no other industry—takethat ing that that burden had been diminished —(hear, hear)—
course. Well, my answer is, find a revenue raised in not only in amount but in numbers of persons relieved. The
this country with regard to any article of manufacturing right hon. gentleman here quoted fromthe poor law returns
production, such as is raised on articles of agricultural several extracts, to prove more in detail the diminution in
production. (Cheers.) Why, if that were so, should we expenditure and numbers. Among them we gathered the
not find you coing to thie home ? (Hear.) What petitions! fasts that, "in the year ending Lady-day,lBso, as compared
What speeches! motion's! And what leagues—(cheers with the same period in 1849, there had been a diminution
and laughter) You are no habituated to your financial sys- in expenditure of no less than 397,0061.; that in the year
tern that, in fact, the public mind of England cannot see ending Michaelmas last, there had been a reduction in
' these enormities. Suppose you pawed a law affecting the expenditure as compared with the year ending Michaelmas
stockinger'oo trade : and that we laid a duty of 1,200 per 1819, of 409,0001." It might be argued that, great as
cent. upon the production of stockings ? What would the was the boon to the country of this expenditure, it was
manufacturers say to that ? Yet that is the position in only owing to the low price of
provisions, and that there
which you place the occupiers of land ; and we say it is had been no diminution in the numbers of persona
strange that the land should be so treated. I be- relieved. But the fact was, that the diminution in
lieve that if you persevere in this system, not merely the numbers relieved had been in greater proportion than
the owners and occupiers of the sod but the whole the diminution of expense. Last year the member had been
country will eager fatally. (Hear, hear.) Consider this 6 per cent, lower than it in general had been. In answer to