The Express.
London, England, 1853-06-01 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.

HOUSE OF LORDS.—TTESTAT, MAT 81.
The Loss Csaecettou took his meat 5 o'clock.
PETITIONS PRESENTED.
Pe ntte-liot ea.—By the East of 11A1t1IOWEY, from
a place in S atfonhhire, Bristol, Barking, Tiverton, Ports-1
m net. and other tines, against the opens; of public-
bouts on the Lord's day.
Atiste.iiis or Jaws TO PAULIANIZNT.—rIy the Earl
of 11A tlllO W BY, Mtn Nuneaton and ether places, offend
the adenines of Jews to peirliamet.
Caterat PALACIL—Ity the Earl of HARM/WET',
frets linemen. in Norhaniptonshire, against the °peeing
alike Crystal Panes on Sauey..
IMLIA.—By the Earl of HARROWEY, from the Lien-
poul East India and China Aeweiatioo, oar the subject of
the renewal of the East India Company's charter. The
noble earl seemed that this petition be referred to the select
committee now sitting on this subject.—Agreed
INVESTMENT OF CHANCERY SUITORS FUNDS.
Lord St. LEONARD'S wished again to refer to the sub-
ject he had mentioned last night. He wished to ask a
question with reit fence to the stock to he converted by the
act before the other h use. It was directed that those
persons, suitor in Chancery, who did not elect to have
their money before that eery day, should take the Two-
sad-a-Hell per Cent. Stock at 1101. The time was too
ahor:, and many persons entitled t• hundreds of thousands
of pound. would not have had the opportunity of making
their election. If the order was made the moment it took
effect not only.could the interest be reduced, but the capi-
tal would also be reduced by 7 per cent. The Chanceilor of
the Eachequer hod failed in his scheme, because he sup-
posed the rate of interest in the market to be 2'; per tent.,
whereas it was 3 per cent. The Consolidated Annuities
and the Reduced Annuities were at par, so that if the
parties bad their money they could select the stock they
might prefer. Ho wished to know what the Siltation of
his noble and 1 Diesel were ?
The LORD CIL'eNCELLOR had felt great difficulty in
discharging his duty in this matter. Ile had been in corn-
munic.tion that day with the broker for the Court of
Chancery and the Accountant-Genenl, and it appeared
that the new Two-aud-a-Half per Cents. were not yet gene-
rally in the market, and the price was but nominal, but it
was thought that the stock would sell at from 90 to 92. If
it only sold at 90 it would he better, no doubt, for the
suitor to have 1001. If his noble end learned
Diced was right that there would be a loss of
7 or 8 per cent., but a small portion would be
taken, bet he •as informed that his noble and learned
friend was wrong in supposing there would he a lost. If
the stock was taken at 91 there would be no loss upon the
1101. There stood to the credit of suitors in the Court of
Chancery in the South Sea and other small annuities
eG9.0001., and he had made an order that any party who
wished to hare any other description of stock should apply.
Two applications, however, hail only been made, one to
take money., and the other stock, and they both amounted
to only 9,0001. The Accountant-General's chief clerk, •
gentleman in whom he had the greatest confidence, iaformed
him that he had had many applications that day to see what
his (the Lord Chancellor's) order was, and the parties had
said if he had made an order to take 21 per cent they
wished to take it. The only course he could take was to
desire the Accountant-General not to signify his assent
until Friday next—the last day—and to let him know on
Thursday what the then state of the market was. The
funds were now looking down, and if there should be any
further material alteration in that direction he should re-
voke the order.
Lord St. LEONARD'S said he had been told by one of
the first bankers in the city that the loss mem the 1101.
stock would be 7 per cent.; and if the suitors were fixed
with this 2j per cent. stock, it would iellict a loss of many
thousands of pounds on them.
THE CRIMINAL LAW DIGEST.
Lord CAMPBELL said, in answer to a question from
Lord Buovomem, that he would arrange with his leaned
brethren in the Court of Queen's Bench for an early day
to attend the Criminal Law Commission.
Lord LYNDHURST stated that Lord Truro, who had
been absent for some time from ill health, would shortly
return to town, and be able also to attend the commission.
ALTERATION OF OATHS BILL
Lord LYNDHURST, in moving the second reading of
this bill, said that he found • great extent of misapprehen-
- lion had gone abroad as to the object of this bill, and
he was, therefore, desirous of explaining its nature and
purpose. The object of the bill was simply this: to strike
out of those oaths which parties were bound to take, as •
qualification for • seat in parliament, or for holding certain
offices, such parts of those oaths as were inoperative, idle,
and, if he might be permitted to say so, absurd. (Hear,
hear.) It appeared to him that no well-founded objec-
tion could be made to such a course of proceeding. Some
friends near him had stated that they did not understand
precisely what the bill meant. He would state its meaning
is a few words, and with as much plainness and simplicity
as he could. The oaths required to be taken for sitting in
parliament were in number three : first, the oath of alle-
giance ; secondly, that of supremacy ; and, lastly, the oath
of abjuration. As to the oath of allegiance, nothing could
be more plain than the language of that oath it was
coeval with the common law of this country ; and Lord
Hale, in speaking of this oath, had said, " Herein is oh-
servable the prudence of the common law—it is short, plain,
and not entangled with declarations." Its meaning he also
thought was short and plain, end embraced the whole ditty
of the subject to the Sovereign ; and he had no wish to
alter the terms of that nth. With respect to the
second the oath of supremacy that oath owed
its origin to the reign of Elisabeth—it was dated front the
first year of that reign .• and it underwent no alteration
until the first year of William 111. It was then altered,
and had continued down to the prams time is the hem in
which we now found it. That oath was dints& astalost
the Roman catholiev, which was obvious him the time
when it was originally framed; sad bum tho doom of the
statute it was impossible se doubt that the buslature, la
pulsing that sot, had the Boman aleolim sot* in view.
(Hese Mar.) So that they was in this sirdar posi-
tion, ;hat an oath which was famed to be applied to
Roman cathodes had born repealed is ihr as they were con-
seised, sad was kept in farm eel y
_against persons whom it
was sever intended Air. But ha did MN rest the case here;
he was boned to say that he ritlios the oath wesordiag
to the plain ordinary ssiwlssil.g of the words, it con-
tained that which was sawn. (Hoer.) From the amommat
the state tolerated the Balms catholic religion, they ad-
matted the Popo had spiritual authority In this realm
The spiritual authority of the Pops was a part of the Ro-
man catholic religion—it was biased withit, and amid
sot be separated from it—by sitrallaiog the oath of
The
mach that aut h ority was amarroadvoly admitted.
oath could not bs agglied i he peeper terms without qua-
'Motion ,
_• they were obliged to newt to that whisk they
reprehended is
the lemma Mirth@ : they wen Wised to
qualify the oath ond apply to it a mental moireatioa when
they swore OM no Weirs potentate had any as-
therity in this realm. (Hoer. hear.) Dot pavan that
me* Ito relied is support of the Ime Mode ler the
sheepdog of that esth. ea its thomplithtlia, UM, sad
istheradth. Mar. haw.) Is the Me ism as kw as pro-
teams% three easeeemok sad *widows sheath not be per-
sisted la. Meow, luar.) He had great medlihmes is the
wisdom and Jahrmont et the right rev. bunk for whom
he ethertehmed bights reugeat, that they would assist
him is ahollthimg the poetise et selthth on the Almighty
le wheals as iW mod imeleseameada.~, is his opisiouh
wee wthholith, mad at woken with the longuage of
dodgem If tag youth limas lha wok ea Quire—
Nes Dm Istoodte cow dipmeisitur mina
was mot a mmomium fie
.ffi =slut lateaded also
to m mailed lo (Hear, hear.) em
Thom abesthatimem agglisii—lGThe oath et supremacy and
he thmaiht la hod slated ondldmat to eathfy their lorishipe
that. Misr am poleeleate amassemeth the oath ought
so long* to essmis se tho almithe book. (Hear, hear.)
He trusted their Isodthipe would bear with him patiently,
for his strong& usebre, malideat for the task he had
sadertakok (land shoe..) Ith ems new n the oath of
abjuration—OM Nth that was notoormly feamsd es the
model of the oath of allogionth mead Is the third year of
James 1., after the Memory et the gunpowder plot, and
the trial and coaviatios of this maspiraton. That oath of
abjuration hero detain the thitheesth year of the misratig
William 111., and the mosoloa ad its pining was
in the preens of the set moody, the prosismatim of
James 111. by the King of Frame being the proclamation
of the Pnteader as King of That England. oath Mated
merely to the praterther,esd attested that he had no right
or title to ths dune of Woad, at the same time adjuring
all alleglases and thedieseis to him. Such were the terms
of the oath of adjuration stated rather shortly, and that
oath was altered from time to time in point of form, as
change of circumstances might call fur alteration. It was
altered on Usa secession of Anne, and 'also on the
union with &Wand. It was afterwards altered on
the accession of George I.; and, last!, after the
death of the old pretender, it was altered in the reign
of George 111., adapted to the new state of things, and
applied to the descendants of the pretender. Their lord-
ships would see, then, that this oath was altered from time
to time, to adapt it to the state of the facts, and it was
reasonable to suppose that, when the whole GM of the pre-
tender was at en end, and, (following the previous prece-
dents, it would have died out and terminated altogether.
(Hear, hear.) To take it at the present day when there
was no pretender to adjure, nor one of his descendants in
existence, was an idle mockery, an obvious absurdity.
(Loud clime) If any person were voluntarily to enter a
grave monthly, and say, " I do sincerely in my
conscience, before God and this world, declare that no
descendants of the late pretender"—there being no such
known in existence, and us pemiMßty of any one coming
into existence—. That act wmposenm have a right to the
throne of Great Britain, and I abjure ell obedience to them
or any et slain thie is the true and ordinary sense
()lithe wand, arysaasa at mental veneration, and
on the tree tiath eta " He said that If any one
came voluntarily hats pane assembly and made each a
statement, such MUM% meld only be looked on as a ease
for some personal reetraMt.(Cheen and laughter.) But noble
lords came into that hewn sad stood at that table—all busi-
ness being asearttr=oaded.and his noble and teamed
friend on the additionel gravity
for the solemn imetatism—tod""ti that sideman not
voluntarily, but an emerthice, and called ea the Almighty
to witness it. (Loud cries of " Hear,
_burs.") To make
the matter more ridicules*, oath noble lead Aped his name,
in order that this absurdity might be men of being
headed down to posterity. (Heat) Surely, hearing all
this, their lordships could not sanction soft an absurdity
fora moment after it has been fairly brought under their
Awn. (Cheers.) In addition to what Maud said relative
towhat he might call the expansion of the oath of alle-
=nles would refer to what he had before stated to
ow necessary that expansion was. To continue it to

'suit present exigencies he proposed to strike out every part
of the oath to wh ch he had referred, except that part
which related to the succession to the throne ma settled by
the act, and to the character of the sovereign in
as far as regarded religion. Ha retained this latter
because he could conceive no greater calamity that could
betel this country, judging not ouly from past
expenence, but from what was daily pawing before their
eyes, than the allowing the crown of these realms to be
placed on the head of a Roman catholic. (Load cheers.)
Now, several unfounded rumours had been spread abroad
respecting the fourth clause of this bill, among others. that
by that clause members of the Jewish religion
might be introduced into either house of par-
liament. Respecting this clause he had been attacked
in various shapes, as if he had introduced the clause with
such an intention. But he could assure their lord-hips
he should nut feel justified in attempting to do that by a
side wind which he dared not du openly. (Loud
cheers.) There was no lawyer who would put such a con-
struction on the fourth clause as he had heard applied to it,
oant.ly. that by its provisions members of the Jewish reli-
gion might go into the House of Commons, and make •
ileclaratieu, or take eke oath therein specified. Why, at
that very moment the wordy, "on the true faith of a
Christian," were not is the affirmation of the Quaker, nor
in the oath of the Roman catholic, and if a person f the
Jewish persuasion were to take either the affirmation or
the oath, it would be a mere nullity, and he would
be jolt as liable alter the oath to he prosecuted for pe-
nalties as if no such oath or affirmation had been made.
But he admitted that the clause was copied from • bill
which had been laid on their lordships table by a noble
acid learned friend SOMP years since, and contained some
general words having reference to the prohibition of aliens
and separatists from sitting in the House of Commons.
However, as he bad no intention to alter the classes of per-
sons who were permitted to sit, he should propose to strike
out those general ROfJP, and confine himself to the words
used by the Qdakers in affirmation. Ile would be asked why
he did not extend this bill to the Roman catholic*.
The answer wu very short and plain. Ile was anxious
that the bill should pan, and therefore did not wish to en-
tangle with it any matter that might render its passage
difficult. (Hear, hear.) That was the simple answer he
had to give, and if any noble lord thought right to alter
the oath taken by Roman catholic it was perfectly com-
petent
for him to bring in • bill ; but he had not thought
right to encumber this bill with any attempt of the kind.
Further, he had been pressed much more strongly to strike I
out the words "On the true faith of • Ch ri rr tan." The'
answer he had given to such applications was, that he felt
bound to respect a decision of their lordships'
house recently and decisively pronounced. (Opposi-
tion cheers.) He could not strike out these words,
because, if he struck them out, there would be no
chance of passing the bill, and therefore he yielded to ne-
cessity in the matter. (liese, hear.) But at the same time
he mast be allowed to say, after having voted in the mino-
rity on the former occasion, that although he yielded to
necessity it was against his own convictioo. (Hear, hear.)
Perhaps he might he allowed in jostafication to state very
shortly the grounds of that conviction, so far as it related to
the words to which he had referred. The introduction of
these words was very curious, and, it might not be out of
place to detail them is their lordships in as few words as
possible. (Hear, hear.) After the discovery of the gun-
powder plot in the third year of the reign of James I.
search was made in the chambers of apenoa named PillffiCill
Trishaw, one of the conspirators who had chambers in the
Temple. During the search • manuscript was found, en-
titled "A Treatise on Usurpation." The manuscript was
altered in the handwriting of Garnett, the superior of the
Jesuits, and had the imprimatur of Blackball, at that time
the archpriest of the Roman catholic'. It was made use of
on the trial of the persons implicated in the plot, and after-
wards found its way through the hands of Archbishops
Abbott and Laud into the Bodleian library, where it re•
maimed for many yean, and was only lately brought is
light. It bad recently been reprinted with • suitable pre-
face, and was well worthy their lordships attention. It
had marginal notes in the handwriting of Sir E. Coke,
the Attorney-General for the prosecution, and its object
was to show how the obligations of an oath might be
avoided. It contained many chapters, and the doctrine was
laid down that if a question was put to you that you thought
in your conscience you were not bound to answer, you
might answer that question aloud, bat might at the same
time qualify it with other words, spoken mentally, so that
the whole being taken together, the "aloud " with the "re-
serve " mentally expressed, if the whole was true, then you
might, without being considered guilty of taking a false
oath, swear to the truth of the proposition, so that,
while the person addressed applied only the words
that he heard, the person who took the oath
applied the whole of the proposition, the " aloud" and the
"reserve." For instance, if you were asked by a person
whom in your conscience you thought you were not bound
to answer—a magistrate, perhaps, " Were you in London
to-day ?" you might say you had not been in London,
provided you added mentally," For say improper purpose."
(Hear, hear, and laughter.) The reserve saved the truth of
the proposition. It was remarkable that in the letters of
Pascal, he ascribed to the Jesuits exactly that doctrine, and
here in this manuscript, in the handwriting of the superior
of the Jesuits, they bad it laid down as a principle
of the Roman catholic church, or rather of
the Jesuits who formed a part of that church.
In addition to what he had stated there were some excep-
tions, and these west to show that the words, " On the
truth faith of a Christian," were used to prevent the
Haman catholics taking an oath of that description. It
IMO remarkable that in the year in which the plot was dis-
aineind the oath of allegiance was introduced, and then for
the Pint time the words without equivocation, evuion, or
meant reservation, and on the true faith of a Christian,"
IMO istroduced. (Hear, hear.) There could be no doubt
Bled BM Path was framed by Sir E. Coke while in
pmeilles of this document, carefully suited to the
4111111111.1. veld so worded in order to prevent
Iliemsa milmilso taking it evasively. He trusted that on
ONO Swan& he should have their lordships' concur/owe,
tn.& anaMed reading of the bill. (Cheers.)
TM Earl of DERBYI was melded gdat his midi
learned friend had no intention of reversing their ahis
' decision given on the subject of the admis-
sled the Jews. The question had been solemnly
=and and decided by a considerable majority
his noble friend retained the words whisk
it.,,r,te x elusion of Jews. But he confessed that ewe
Mkt Me Me of his noble and learned friend, he regiled
dot be iimeld have prejudiced the chances of his
introdasigg a vary elaborate argument for the admission%
the Jewise,Ssikewieg exceedingly good reasons erM.
the e verde should be struck out. He
. leek with sovietism en this bill.
111:1151 eel Seemed friend maid be retained those words
he Me ea mews of facilitating the peening of the bill.
Weems lb edge led bused friend referred only to the
:f TM 141 ilmegla their lordships' house, for the
if Ow wire meld give no additional facility
far parks to desalt the other house. Now he would put
this to Me mile sed learned friend. This bill was intro-
dosed an the lase day is May. The House of Caninoas
WOO IPS Oielnileifted with business that they had made
_

ney little peeress with legislation; sad whit sertinty
had their lordships that if this bill wen passed by their
lordshi sad sent down to the House of Coismana,
worded as it was, it would sot be amended by
the 0110.404 of those weeds is the latter end

OF July 67 tie eovasseissa 7;in .1 Augwt, sad
thorn bum& book fps the meat of the few poem who still
romoimpi M amp, their seats is pediatrist ?
He wee net dislosos thimft any impediment la the way
of the fair sad Impeedal soatilta of the sideet which
W noble tad lessord friss" lad is view ; bat be hoped he
Amid not be thought uareasoaside it. leohies Armed to
Tim ho deemed ast a very improbable oesuneeso be put
• phis quails to oak kris weeks, way. what
MIMI they would mows Hee* so easeadment were in-
Maimed ? (liesetkera_
TM Hod of /1/11191331 acid—l do not wish to in-
tab,a with the and ewer of a measure Of mani-
festly osweisteat wltr mama sad mows sense I. the bill
proposed by ray &ebb mid domed friend. (Cheers.) I
therelbro Asada Wisely km 'sweetie( with say of the
el *it bid, ad Sea will be the coarse of her
grj=goversourit. As to what we shell do in Goose-
queues of maw asouthomet baby Introduced in the House
of C 0....- I most um pop decline to give any
pledge on iat subject. (Hear, hear.)
The Earl of CLANCARTY approved of that part of
the bill which related to the oath of abjuration, but ob-
jected to the retsina by a side-wind of the security
Hives to the protestant church by the Catholic Belief
al.

Lord REDESDALE said, feeling that the oaths re-
quired ansendsseat, he was prepared to assent to the
second reeding of this bill; Mt, considering that no
assurame was given by the government as to what
would be done in ease the bill came boa
frem the other house in an altered shape, be
did not think it would be safe for their lordship to legit p
beyond a second stage.
Lord CAMPBELL hoped that the oath of Mission',
would soon be the only oath required to be taken in either
house of parliament. (Hear, hear.)
Lord BROUGHAM hoped this bill would receive the
assent of their lordship P all its stages, thereby removing
a great blot from their legislature, not merely in a civil
bat in a religious point of view.
The Earl of DERBY said that ha did not ask the govern-
ment to pledge themeelves, wr to elate what course they in-
tended to pursue Si ISM 1/1/11111 pried, and with respect
Man indefitfite oldest. What be asked wait this, that se
there wu reason for supposing that an attempt might bo
made by means of this bill at reversing the decision to which
their lordships had come in the present session, thereby
altering the object and character of the bill, her Majesty's
government would give them an assurance that they would
use their influence in the other house of parliament for
the purpose of p ing a specific amendment being
carried—(hear, hear)—that if an amendment were proposed
in the other house to undo what had been done in their
lordships' house, the government would use their inflames
to prevent that object being effected by a side wind.
Lord BROUGHAM said that there was more than one
course which might be pursued. There were two ways of
proceeding, so different that a person might consistently
approve of the one and consistently disapprove of the other.
An amendment might be moved either for leaving out the
words " on the true faith of a Christian," or the words
"on the true faith of a Christie.," might be postponed
after the words "So help me, God." A man might con-
sistently vote for the one and oppose the other.
The Earl of WICKLOW was glad that a case which had
truth and justice on its side bad fallen into the able hands of
his Lob's and learned friend.
The Earl of lIARROWBY, after putting a question to
the Earl of Aberdeen, the answer to which was not heard,
said that it war quite clear that there was a desire on the
part of the Howie of Commons to admit the Jews to par-
' Bement, and this bill might be easily adapted to that pm-