The Express.
London, England, 1849-04-21 00:00:00

2 .

abodes el the tseast-ierseen is beleadaliktudt reseall. y
balms ei* of the enemsess hy w-
ale of every elms sal peehries. soil als. daps=
alvidilatia=sorla litengen"s"l6:lll7:mat,
the shit segieelmass assmis shish lied oasis
he ha sell isseavelloa seder lieLbres4lll abb.
Ile ease se ease
_.' istrallWad*
id save it of the ipen uul
' • . at. the
Whig perilles of nierdimaimessae.
fleass/Mos masa boa la mind the gime that
onoiffen the pile rebiester is awl the
toemlbab=asestierZu do ad wee
• 0M.% Ind weld make wan seseurney ant fir
1= is tint; hat when the hi list peetooded to
111:111 the Wainer. se et the eseembered isnd- ,
I:::,.ljp_Se IMMO savareet_reet. or to make a mut I
of HI eepElimirste, mi_esek a smarted
ihtzr maim ef sPik tbs. iMill'
_.. re seek that their rim
rtheedlitle"litir turlistry se trael et Call
el (Hese. bear.) • We weld refer the amiss le a
troa Ha Weed. • gmattemen radii is Bentels-
. la the Cheisn't ems% si=aaa *in inilt=
itildSel4ool747=a lib he
MI thM teen gent LOW m:aesgE
bed, be the diadem of ems
to thetas**
thatn INS re Ink& * .
Heedted the-qua et id that lessis7==
O.
Maws bra" at Mare *IV Ike, amaisdas,
O. othee mei teas whisk so same be
ores team Nita lit sithithil, he would nib
sir • niggle between le_Ored aM Mit meth as Inked
sew saw and the rusk la Aida wadi be aeivereal.
(Rem, h*r.) He was eggisei, them, es enema of the
pest tad gement dinar, the vilest die of • Tate he
oil' or Ohm beim las. (ft. ab.- Hes /Mims might
bed.bet be: aired what due)n buil woe It thee
hit set esibred deeply teem the Witty of tie=
%lie P—whes does is Ireland was it that the
martiesi tors oreopmenon as to stake it grim a pellie,a
impseensey sew bardsupon them ? (Hear, is) Ile
wee peter aspirated with Irelond, and be must
say that he= as meth aims. Disease bad decimated the
medical orelliske--it bad struck down ambers of the
elergy--liad Mad bests of bademeste--end bad made
mimes of commereiel tae besiege. taliq a him oe-,
melon he led aided to the a( in the
quantity of lie applied to the ' soil the anus/
of Kilkenny, hitherto always
_nobrions for its emmarkabb
wheaten milks. sot bah* elated that whereas 180,000
giOnsf.linie ewe ilia be it purfere Is WO& 'WY
bash rose mull bol yen% Oasibmaseg a that
Mos. bell isWim* a tsetse hem Th. Palsy,
the *ai Wins Cletweey ot Iralsmo..mi webs
of b• quomtity of ants wit mall coal used he dee inalbe-
tan of limn, mid ." The mean quastity et Wm sell is
1848 s attributable to die peverb, apathy, sad dap* et
the brown, our great restemon, who thb yea an sanely
ploughing the ley for crops ot ems and barley, with the in.
tendon of gisring up their lands and emigrating in the mar
ing autumn.' Mr. Parley added, that in 1844, 45,112 is
of cube had bins sold, whilst in 1848 the quantity only
amounted to 11,918 tone. (Hear, hear.) He had also before
biro another letter from a gentleman who had the control
of a small property in one of these districts, in which be
stated, that of 43 beads of families on the estate, nine had
died within the last two months of starvation—one half 1
of the tenantry were now on out-door relief, sad
all were anxious to surrender their land if they
were allowed to retain their cabins—the poor wretches
were dying by incites. That was one of the dis-
tricts not included in the Chancellor of the Exchequer's plan
of relief—it was one from which the rate in aid was to be
levied, and the committee were now called upon to sanction
• scheme by whist money was to be wrung from districts
ouch as be bad been describing. Could anything be more
delusive or trifling ? It was absurd to put forward such •
proposition for the consideration of men of business. It was
a shrinking from their duty —a warding off of a difficulty
which they could not avoid. For these reasons
then he opposed nay application, either of • rate
in aid or as income tax to Ireland. And what be
wished to impress upon the committee was, that they must
make up their minds to surrender to soma; mentleiegon the
power of speedily and cheaply ascertaining the tharair
and titles of iacumbered estates, and they mud Invest than
with the authority of conferring • puliansentas 1 dile VIM
those who were willing to parches* those estate I j flw thee
alone could they removes the difficulties with whin ll /mess-
bared estates were surrounded difficulties which da-
m+ged the interests of proprietors and creditors, re,q
_uoted
the effort', and blasted the Lopes of the occupiers. (11
He had ices the most intricate tides unravelled and stoked
on the spot in • awe 'pow of time, whilst, it it bad bean
attempted thrsigh the -operation of the Court of Chaseary,
it would have been an op.eralion of 20 .or 80 years' duration.
Mr. CLEMENTS said that everything which the hon.
member had adduced to night was an argument in favour of
the motion of the hon. member for Kerry. Eves ything con-
nected with the preservation of the farming Chile, every-
thing connected with the appreheuaion which was telt as to
the burden of the par rates was in favour of adopting an
income Us instead of a rote in aid. It they had to con-
sider whether Ireland should, under existing circumstances,
be taxed, all that the hon. member had said would lead to
the conclusion that it should not be so, and, in ordiaare
circumstances, be (Mr. Clemente) should he quite ready to
support his view of the case, lie did not think that say
meseaber woo was aware of the prostration of Inland would
advosate a new Landon under existing circumstances. flts
mask had been said by the hon. mover of the amendment
it She great difficulty that would atteud the levy of any new
tax in Ireland that be was not going to attempt to add any-
thing on the subject. It was admitted Oust the general feel-
ing wee against affording further aid to Ireland ; yet tho
distress must be relieved, and the question was from whence
was the sang to come ? It was clear that
it mite come from Irish resources, end what was the
tax to be 1 lie had hear i nothing from the Chancellor of the
Exchequer to chow the superiority of a rate in aid. The
principle that would be established by the amendment of his
hon. friend IN ould get rid of the very secret point sought to
be established by the rate in aid. The noble lord had done
nothing to solve the difficulty in which they were placed.
When the hoe. memffir for Kerry had put his notice on the
paper, the noble lord called the Irish me ..bers together,
and stated that if Ireland were to adopt an income-tax as a
substitute for a Me in aid, they must oho propose some far-
ther aid to make up the imaginary difference between
the income-tax and the rate in aid; but the noble lord had
not favoured the house with the grounds an which
It was imagined that the deficieney would arise.
He (Mr. Clements) bad no hesitation in saying that • rate
of 6d. is the pound, on the net annual valued any distriet,l
estald not be enlisted by any rats short of 94. in she pound. '
Mr. RICE said that the proposition of the hoe. member
ler Kerry had made this an liaglish gustiest ; whilst this
vestry was burdened with an income tax, it was meet un-
it that another large portion of the smagi:iedthould be
estkely exempt from the tax. He bed voted in
favour of as income ea being impart on Ireland, and for
that ream his vote would now be gins in favour of the
sib in aid. His role reason foe dais' this was, that he
bind • rate is aid would save Wpeople of Ireland from
ellemiliss. where's he believed an imams tax would not'
boa thalami. It had been stated by gennementthatit was
ess sees dad. in the pound., for two yeses, in the provisos
ot Mi. It appeared to him that an sasseessuy degree of
and • vest number of very begat spore se, bad
libe= is wombat to seek • mresesdsa. One ele-
=metellet MI lioss staled hy the les. member for
vb. that it was tat avers whether this rate
Imola be die limited in mooed se Ilembed is intim, he
leek le be a *SI objesticen, and be Vaught It to be
sat et vest at emelt the government. le *sip Mimi rate
dada be Sahel loth be time end visa I be should be
=1 lona be •
thenpropos tildes the tire, to one
the emit to 6d. Is prank mad the when the
ale in MI mid the ism, ken
should esamenes.
Ho is emery to Mar emit statements as h had
id ben members who this* themois eto be
regemembeine .1 the feelings el tier; who in Ulster
wen perstent it pesepress. NA in Cossenesea were
peeves* b diem Whin *0 Soma tax Irmo proposed,
he droll Ithe le most the wise ef the hen. easeahre for
Dowpowas id he Mid it ale es imperial tax. H.
dwell Ithe to gin the set* id ea immasse that i would
he an i it lax a the masisisse whisk, he believed,
the the isms be et this ovary led ellebed. Having pre-
via* *ad foe an WWII* is be Lind, he had thought
It Ali le rate hie erase the gbh. whet might other-
awes to be en yes vets. He petered
so trimaran es to Imbed. (" Hear, hear," hem
Isi mane hoes.) 'then bow add be est as en Bassi
smember, in
ithes peememmtheame=p
uon the
Wormed= or of
deo Emsis
_had Mtritoe to mows Ilme lie of the
pimple al beid that *gime* this ate, end on that
pima bie Oge, Ilkas) SPOTlllitli right to moon it. It
might borteilusei la ptiodpishat they siold not now
Masai on mil matia. He withod to give the people et
bibmirdielbe and roma bw, sad to do bathe -to the
thb ssemay, by lapdog as equal burden of
=s. b,
basmi
Hr. (CULLY theerved that he was Mil the hem member
ethe bed last min had not been is Inlaid, ese be would ,
been semi to • 'Wiest aside& The hen. member boa
gin • tate in aid ler eve year, ad en Meer
teCa to
nest. He (Hr. lily) would say to hi " (Me
se the rate in ea dad lime tan too ; let me haw the
rest." He
.mad i ltmadond is thisof debate to take labia
it part, to sa,es li ble thip
Srpos y i net in seas to be poomeasellibmed. a
sate in Sid or by an berme *hi. re
vas
hone the serneeste dthlieter of the orainal.
When this mosey mos udwid, bow wee the 'Mrs lie he
it. They dwell lea lavabo by • sommittee lithe sal
seinuesse, mod the stets red oesdiden of belarL If the
eammitise wan to sat is Iseless/, whether in the tea a
erffereay dikes they wadi Ist oath meetsof
shah ens hi the mseshenet bees.,that they=:ll
this Is net a tine to pat villa el drape at
Coal set seassig he epos. he the lei el to pow Am
Ito ismarialidai at dm ldim Ohm& The ems somasoi
W time ealoblimliod dumb is ballot *5 She soles
1 oisesolai So pa, ainAtibtreoi,
WIMP alka ask 4 ma et
did,
as
avenge of in be each iseers.:76lserm.)
pret agg, ily s elitism sowssea so la sake at doe
eople? (Hear. 4 aMildlOr mum atela he hued in
W mint of abiles Isailas, as Ilmt sill be Islam
mot dews at Weil% rartair. Than via she
atr=
=Ms brio so Al set see why
tea the rale Op& shookl lest =eat
Crel the riar, so Imo as thee
eat may other Mimes in e2LIP:=I res.
and • imeintittes et Isimary sopreelbq et the ilea nesse-
dty. se wet. ad thetethie lat the heed de=
mod *at the people a Ireland bad lost mild A

the month of Jimmy following, he thooght peeper to der
same expimeadens to the 'winsome el the Two Sit Hes.
The et the 'obis load's low, Is wkialt he deiced
to bap the asiesdes of the boast, ran due •• "It is peon&
that the lisemetitoo rovers sent may wmpem to yes el this
taammedoa o the ground that althea* us Oat eanielanae
war Imobliad by her Illegesty'a ero•comMen3 to the govern-
el Shay, yet hanky was afforded 10 1111 a sentraeW who
Leisgegodpe pleavito_ supplies for that gevernmens. If
aimy ewe Itrellinniniell Da min to yes by the go-
vernonsat of lEtsphs.yem else that lice antardm h gees
Nos was give) ipidieetsmilp ; dot haw litedgs IsmrPmai
wet what Soh umanntaEd. Ili no MEIN", WNW has
Wee gives. Vibe
to peewee es is
101.111mcnt. the alillsrenam between the sad
die Ling ANspies StO mmettinde--1 ulttigel.1.111"•"
lila wows SO welt the aside WI ess leant
was ea ha pananmed, to be Ulm se leder suss
Vs= ''theft of the RAWL tesorimesent ei Greet
erarite wadi wiz Iffes what it wee that
lbsitals •beraml Beliefs al " ifts,.
War aet Oen resmolued tbe " Siam
t," beaseiwei that IN mkt.* wee lOW,
111=0. It had talbeemill mai mar* to the preen& but
In Or Stare, skeeleslag as it did dm" *seine& has
am glows, er will he giaeat 1;t goverommet
is posses esep!oyed k to ffie
eilsOlw
gmeemmelle," =Realm literoey burgle*.
Vimennt PALMERSTON amid—ln arm to the tint
marration, I have etaso the boa. sanaller that this letter
ems east by the est tali, as Is* pate t, "of the
united govesseasat of Orftt Britain," Dui •03 the govern.
sent oftho Volts* Ziagdom of Ones Babel& (Laughter.)
:r
useregari to the woad quirk, I have se sure that the
t b• . govessment of Sicily, adios Is toted
Wing **affairs of skit Wand, was acknowledged by her
Itsjesty's perfumes% as early as the laminate, of last per
hear)—when, at the request of tke nig if 16.01.
Lori Mato pieced himself in conimunketkia with Mat
wonernmeat, far the puepos3 of effecting en mnisabla setae-
• kik of the differthess between than. From tlassOme a
t has existed. We scognise that Welsh* (hear,
t Fad", theasph the We, gentleman may shot Ida ayes to
tSet, m • lost to which the governamst of Naples
' ree not teen obis to that theirs (Laughter.)
Ir. BANILFJL—Do I ontlentand that the /Dag ef
des has eeotimised the government of ? I had
rat
ratted tt • eastrarp.
avant PALIEIRSTON.—The hen. Bentham refers
inipreasice *de on ley Wed se to the tailor of a
is ea
bow whisk the Neepokient sinister read to me is the
of a enversellua which took ;lase between r is
mum
Dm& votress Whitt I here now bees stating ism le-
o weaseseisse ebb* taok place at Naples.
litswoo t
Mr. B. tNEES.—Awe Ito usidersband that the govern•
d
w emersion the Neill= mtherameet se separate
Mel no
hum ow 6 nversmest of the Riau of Naples ?
Ylemonta feet
that —Her Mijmly 's government
• the feet that there is in &sly • goverameat
eik-amidxft, . the Whirs ef Sicily. It is a government do
iblio; it tolmpassible for the hon. gentleman or anybody
cis to deny t "t• (Luffhtsr.)
COviestiMMeaUNLAMTIrO.BNwWIAxTT,II FRANCE.
• IsPoll.2..ttel. a
SELL stated that comisnelestions were still
••••• u tia the government of this country and that of
• , 'or their of a reduction is the rate el
,TaTtral the correspondent* wee not yet ready to be
=the table. CEYLON.
mi,, tiAccdtgat. wing the hon. trader Secretary far
ao. *Ammo to ha p. thee, asked whales: it was sae that in
,W,ibt ao,:to a awe, dkr the Ocivemement Bank, the it-
tanassant of Ceylon km .stied to offeeleriete the feeds of the
anisas book. jott is weedlike ire of the executive. Was
this the feet ?
Mr. Hewn said theft ' eeeethat.._ had ben loch • report
drealated in
_Ceylon, bat t woo was sot the saellest or
teeniest fooodatles tor the . eta mmout.
COMMITTEk: OF SUPPLY.
The hogs • thee west into es an Wine of soppily.
Oa the motion that the sum oi 360,0001. be voted on as-
Gant, towards defraying the elta. 'd• of wages cil the
artif
ewe, labourers, dos ,is her Majesty's navel lishments
at hems,
Copt. FITZROY opposed the motive, on the ground
Ow she s) stem el cods, same on accost wan alike rat Tooth
genstitir ional priempise sad tit sound polisy. Brides,
the new c nnatisdoscr of the Lulea Ides& might her on
the eve of d.- par on Re his goverment and it wee kora.
keg peculiarly undesirable to vote seas on 's'e'at. la his
greet department, at lii he had gives a fall explanklee of
it eatkeetes to which they applied.
Mr. HUME telly concurred in the opinion that the poe-
tise of voting oats es amount was most objectionable in
every juror Of view, end be toasted that so sue. proposition
would ever again be made, but he was go maims to have
the rest debate Wore the nom* brought to a clam that
be should be sorry to sanction my niwitseion which might
delay that coadosion. Would the hon. gentleman inform
the house what proplrtioil the sums asked on account bore
to the intenaed estimates ?
Mr. WARD replied that the peportion in no cam n-
eeded one-half.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that he
Wes quite ready to admit the ioexpedience, as a general
principle, of voting IMMO em account; but the canna on the
present occasion had been forced apes the poverament by
the position in which the adjournment of the Irish debate
bed placed the public business.
Mr. BERRIES said he should be sorry to impede the
regress of the government budgie, but he bad a very
'Wag feeling so to the great impropsiety ot these sumo en
amount, and certainly it his hon. and gallant friend pressed
his objeciioa, he could not do otherwise than vote with him.
The attention of the whole country we directed closely open
that house, and it was most desirable that the house should
to *taw itself really determined to carry out all the reductions
espenoiture that were at all praeitcable. It was dearly
inexpedient, in this point of view, that the house should
yea sums without full inquiry into the actual requirements
of the ease.
Lord J. RUSSELL said it weld have been far more eon-
vestient to the government to have gone moistly int, the
steal estimates dist evening ; he should infinitely have pre-
bend it, and his hon. friend was quite prepared with any
explanations that might have been required ; but the coarse
which the house had taken in relation to the rate in aid de-
bate had rendered it impossible for the government to pur-
est the course it would have preened as to these estimates.
There we* no question t' at the principle of voting thms on
'sonar was an objectionable one, sod to be avoided on all
pestitile CCCASiOI2S.
Carat FITZROY hiving consented to waive his oh-
,
The Tout was "greed to, as were also the followieg:
360,0001. on assount, towards defraying the expense of
meal steles, ewer, tik.
MMES. en seerant towards defraying the charge of naval
ea askant towards the charge of military pin-
ion ski ellowenees.
- 11111,601. ow asesset, towards the charge of civil pen-
ding.' allisuaneem.
TM bones resumed, and the resolutions were reported.
BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE.
In reply to Mr. Ross,
Lord J. RUSSELL said he 'Usti peaked with the
Wed reading of the Navigatioa Bill am Monday ; b. would
lot Otto what beans. would next be taken ual he taw
has Wm the on that motion should ematinee.
HATE AID.—ADJOURMED DEBATE.
BADLEIS elponOl the aliened deist* by WS-
Wats halluatimais give the meows Wire the Mem lds
appeaMett. He Freaked sided the esommthe
that the Id* =Ware who voted egeleff Ws hit=
itterela sestease Mime* apes basked' thsementle
thrnew.erentsymm Oa the ettakemy, he seeddereiltbat the
datesive sesenve sew Wine the home wee note-
day to eaten& the desk of destkarkse. He hawse that
H the ameamere wen deisseed it woad be Iffiewel h some
better empeliowt Ors the &tie Bake! die Cleksffier of
the Eulogise, übmovessitility of inventis• W imeableted
raliebeamtheme weal lisiyelielt M
AW_ peened me vita
kale essita. Men mak esk Wake lisvethe
mask elikeTlyntieletey ebbit had demikheat
ad ite utter to matt the esirksime of the
Mak Re regarded nememre as sksgether emend to
the sawsilty sad *ley of a seri peer lawt saki
se law- to grease* eememasseares,
hoar Nos
a atimudime to emplopmet,
tiarelisees. He viewed aMe in aid es
spooks of imam Ins ; es as Meson kw imposed es the emit
seemier kessee, or the null trader, the any dares
who be thM caoraly were ezompled from WNW. ton.
Ike nab lea auk set dela& brink or the house tato
the belief that a pekes MAW bleu enpeemeded ie Inked
by the more gawks ese eta meat abdomens Met. The
dist bed bees
stisyd, it was tee., but by a tersip
Shish wee it
arsehe pespie. Week eight
te id* a steel maw uip &IL Nor eteali be
haw the awes sillettila the Whisk lope that the rate to
aid wadi milks slaw off starvation k helms& The
/110,111111. di the atoffikhedeetimested the rmeweehlyeedees
vas WAsely imediquele to Gerry the Ira people through the
=IV why they bedyma seasester. Therm was
Wye Ha he coshed to show se the lame is the
isgasoaat that bad boas fwd 011 the other side by the lien.
rinsaw grg>fershoeler—sauelly, the merles that an the
tilitta tidal, Illeter wee bound to sestribato to
esestese el the Aber dietewesd pads of Ireland. On
liedemffile of vkiniff. Leuerehtie was soarer to Cos-
set Li:~ ern lOW wee. The power
71=1 brought Liverpool milli' ISO slekee Meknes of
Pullin. es diet tar ell preselme peeress Laneashke was
Sum te the ibtrened
as Mkt Water was. Thebes.
11101ber Niewheller, as well se ether of the manisks-
dlion Unisqlkee had eta ilegetien ta• i
ts
whisk
Uiburei dukes from Irishmen% tamer ia the helcaiss;
bad the be Modesties between Imiblisase
sml blame ever bees draws when Barden& had beer
tired is her wan by the intregMlly eel velour el the Irish
silks le her army. With reglad to the mmeentive aide
Me eight ben. tereast the samba her Tanswerb,
hal emend the Mk of 1,103,0001. isememil W
the beildimg a bar oaks weeldeseeme, he dialed thme thls
disk lad ever Bess veredimeed. The reitespeve bed seked
Mr Sao to pay it la, mad the asneeller, fi last, replied te
Orb request that as their resperme 11410 set leanly et-
bemstod, they west pap. whom the Iskla toneut.formse
inked far wen tire is pay their bop detise, they did 'at
get mesh es answer—dley were allowed dr • and
ewe was the mown of peal *ties 'aka get le hike&
The sight hen. b'e'set had said that I he SSW Weed
sob" any greet Mottos he relieve twrosit, be 'raid eseasat
beck
hoellAlerts by abed* her addltiseeliti
Okla rig'. , Went visited as ha bad des' the

the Irish members of that house took upon themselvis the
payment of Mt, 6d. rate. He believed it would cause ea.
Meuse dissatisfaction smengett a clue of person who were
well entitled to the consideration of that house kg
their good conduct, their prudence' their inanity.
and their constant loyalty. But if the owners
property in Ireland took it upon themselves it we*
not be such a heavy tax. Thou who had 1,0001. e eoo
woald be called on to pay only 261. for twoyeara. He
not think that this could be a thing of such great -
quasi to the gentry of Ireland, who were disposed to Mee,
some sort of national feeling on the matter. The other*.
jeation was one connected with the income tax. Now net*
Hued that no puma who knew Ireland would deny oat it.
was batter for Ireland that she should pay this tax fur Wa-
ymire than that she should pay an income tax of 7d, lath
pound for an interminable period, which•sated
cause an enormous expenditure for collection ie
first instance, together with the annoyance of having goo
affairs inquired taut. With reopen to the objection that loses
esowellzroperty we not liable to the rate in aid, sod too, I,
be liable under the Meanie tax, he believed that the
amount which would be levied on personal property gme
the tax would be very small. These were the firms width
induced him to support the proposition of the goyeennieut.
Mr. STAFFORD said that the hon. and learned gratis.
man was the second English member, the hon. member fa,
Dover being the first who spoke in support of the propootegi
of the government, and he believed the home would Iwo,
in opinion with him that that support, scanty as it had h*
might have been well spared. (Hear, hear.) The km.
member for Dover supported the measure, but he did not
seem to be pleased with it ; whilst the hon. and learned
member who had just at down voted for it because hew
that the Irish people should be made to have sersregesos
and dependence on themselves—(hear, bear)--that warm
my, he would impose this tax on his beloved pretty',•
who bad anticipated his instructions and learned to demo
on themelves; he would make them contribute from the hulk
of their industry to support in idleness and indep.ndencethe
people of the south and west of Ireland. (Hear, bear.) tetw
hon. and learned gentleman said he was unwilling mall=
properties of the Munster and Connaught propnetoo fte a
debt which they did not contract, but then he would lay hie
hands on the property of the other two proviccestokep
them to pay this debt. (Hear, hear.) It was not meal so
ewe the houre so badly attended as it then was on the erect
a division, but he believed the absence of English means'
might bo explained by the speech of the noble lord het
night, who said that it it was the wish of the fug),
of Ireland to have an income tax for the taw Se
aid, he would favour their inclination in that rennet
The position of the hum in regard to this rite in aid ass
unprecedented. As an English member he (Mr. theikeet
bad, in fact, no voice in the decision of the question, sae
the other hand the bon member for Kinsale would lots
without being hampered in the leant by olden.' taloa*
(Laughter.) When the division list wee lettltiliktt
Downing-street on the following day, the government week
merely examise whether a majority or a minority of Inett
members had voted in favour of their measure. *The Irish
members bad two alt-rnotives placed before them ; they bed
to decide, not whether relief should be afforded from the
imperial treasury, but whether they would take an income
tax or ame in aid. Their position reminded him of die
words addressed by Prior to a lady,
Now, Emma, now, tby last reneetton make,
Which thou wilt follow, which thou must foruke ;
Poe by ill-omened er ore and adverse heaven,
No mkldle object to Illy choice is given.
The right hon. gentleman, the Chancellor of the Extliffitirf,
had calculated that 250,0001. would be produced by the rate
in aid. It should be undsrstood that, immediate to pope
laid before the Lords enamittee, there was, on the 25th Sept,
1613, 800,0001. of uncollered poor TAW ie Ireland, ant dm'
it also appeared (roman official document that seven them=
armed men were employed lest year in the work of eel*.
Con. Under such circumstances it was tor the house town
eider what securoy war afforded fir the realisation of theta.
pectations of the government. On the 11th of March, 1842,
the right hon. baronet the member for TeMliorth Wonted
that the extensioa of the income tax to Ireland es pry
duos only about 410,0001. a year. Upon what the Chan-
cellor of theltichequer had based his calculations he (Mend.
ford) could not pretend to divine. As regarded Inh
members, he must observe that the goverment ought,
upon their own showing, to pay greater detersnce is the
opinions of thou members for that enemy wko, feeling that
it was necessary for Ireland to make some exertion, collie
upon the ministry to tax all property alike. The hon. mem•
bey for the Wait Riding of Yorkshire had, at two meetings
which he bad att. nded during the r. eta stated di At cat,
which was now 465. per quarter, would, if the dlidicgoeol
had been in existencenhave realised 70s. attributing the
difference to the free importati on of foreign corn. Now,
upon the petition whether that reducJ,.n of price were ht•
companied by counterbalancing disadvantages, or unit the
pure good which the hon. gentleman enstdezed it to be, he
would net then pronounce any opinion ; but as any beuedt
which m` ht have arisen was contin n 1 to the constanto he
appealed both to the right non. gentleman who had pro.
pomd the repeal of the eornslaws, and to the hon. membet
for the West Riding of Yorkshire, wheth. r it would be right
now to =pest ar de which would fall
mainly on the agricul.
tural classes who had been the .hiefsuffercre by Menage
This was no question of town egoinet country ; It wis a
question which de. ply affected the hard.eorking peopled
the towns, in the heavy tax which it would impose ape
their best customers, the agriculturists. If the right has.
member for Tamwerth was going to vote for this weave, a
most onside explanation would be expected at as ..ands Ey Ms
interests in Ireland whose hopes he had so highly aroused
the scheme he had lately propoundea. The proposine of
his hon. friend might involve an evil, but it was distinctly
the least of the two evils presented to the house. Utile it
be borne in mind that his hon. friend carefully guideline.
self from inflicting an income tax upon the small fawn or
the petty traders of Ireland. At all events, any tax was
better than a tate in aid. If government persisted is the'
plan, it would turn out the dearest el:pence that England MY
coined.
Mr. GROGAN said he was placed in so extraordinary
position by me amendment of his hon. trisnd the memat
for Kerry, that he must say a few words in explanation of
the course he should pursue on tin toresent consion. Oa the
one side there was a rate in aid, to which he mould =-
tin= to give hie most strenuoite apposition. On dis otter
hand, there was the extraordinary Calk movemart of libber
friend for imposing an income tee, to which re could not
give a vote. But inasmuch as he mold not consult to vote
for an advance of 100,0001. on the security of a rate in old,
to which he would not be a party, he should give no vote at
aIL If the house thought proper to grant 100,0001. oat of
the consolidated fund on such a security, he could only my
they were very welceme to don, but he would not unit in
the vote. His view of the emereency was that imperial ca-
lamities, such as the present Irish distress wee, ought to be
met by wears of imperial resources, and that grants for such
a purpose should not be levied lip means of a tate in lid.
Lord CASTLEREAGH paid that he bed only one wad
to offer between the present ntornent and the dirison.
He
bad been placed in a most embarrassing position, partly
ley
the noble lord (J. Russell), and portly by his hon. friend the
member for Kerty. He bad been in hopes he Mould hits
been spared the alternative put to him that night. Re had
equally strong objections to the motion and to the amends
anent. He would, therefore, only ask the noble lord whit
additional taxation he proposed to levy on Ireland in am
be failed to carry his rate in aid ? He bad never aeon=
upon being asked to take such a leap in the dark as wee Fos
posed to
Lord J. RUSSELL cud that he bad no further uswes le
give to the noble lord than that which lie had already
r memberfohr
gives,
iilmerryby
.the amendment of his hon. friend ths
The noble lord, fllowedGrogan and several other
members, then quitted the house before the phone was
cleared.

would, be WM sum bakes keg, rake Imbed tea math,
mom pramorma ioudliou. In boom of this wed elhabol
emigratisa, be world maiden an case mom -IS Illtheliedle
two thlbelent electoral die bontrag in eask LIAO per-
rao
Ism La the cos which senteked the orate of the Rothe
led the ffaintary of State fer IP Allan, 2,000 of tb•
MOD bad bees gent, in tho of UM to mother
someleye Whin they wars now whenos they
cow moilipg moon to the In the other
!Midst, whits this plan hai Mt 110111relan: 2, _
_OOO men
ems raw in their grans, sisi the 4,000 were
_.
=l.-f-dieti iii -- - -
a ai the usepent of membeatfes kr,.
...-- ,esoodiTia -tio sa._ _ . _ .
Uri:Ma ell delinglog' the of thelpseglisTlMPt
' ifi-OPpti-rith Odd; eit-ik-eiiria.
botimieuissAszloto
to
semaioteaslNS altaidarithlthaftheth• Mt' la
bdaaltl tea IL IL
ufas -
tate-.... deliglalakii dis, wer. mmeedieg meolategemegasion meg mislay, sad gradually hopstethig the
sad ha did set till- 'olothiffsaist thernek he felt that if they neglected tit:=
ill" set lat lialea. dig" • sliquilidball ug ill- -thaviessiglina- '411.486
emressoda tiluseslidaby the' jinn worth"' tread brine Mon themselves the i
rinks ;al
irmivilmiendia . eigg.ita e ganwoment
sentletimat shoed ia tit Mr. T wal Mktg% nem of IteMea•
With re-
alert ibsimaineemoome it iies---Viegotten that gir B. so gement es was Wed. When lad. pothismemellated Sk H. BAAMi.safd that, knowing as he did from his
Mad larseasP fflat Ps medal south iii th• Beene 7 (Hoar.) own olpeervailem fist the distress in Ireland wall cepffhtkitodir.'"Vra.."__**Srora to and *en the Pamela elm Met rides, alth the outeP- beg to all claims that tho shopkeepers in many o large
spirit doom. At unse KIM t estimated its tea of Bath* aping the rats in aid ? He believed that tome is the swath of Ireland wen absolutely rolling or
was an index of *OW, ceasing to buy, that ma of re-
probes. at 110,0361. eres at a tons woes • the corileradoes of Dubin and Lhaelich had Petitteeed la oleakka their Ma in trade to suable them to pay the rang,
=wee coorwenegy taw it would mmehoy its favour. (lie.ar, het) But them.
votes of
Matostoes went . .
M Moth less oaken the 13', absentee nate wen °Plaices in 'Telma gar mess important men the es e'er- putid lag* blooms were girieldrngthar carriages and or
meant, the voice and influence ofservants,thus to the misery ; that the
throw* into seek. glom ATM ham iamb* the ben or lrealigira-ba to . bad ehmllll4l ma fly to Lames end the
hr Buckinhamstore bed in ha oho Dueness) egiemo km the tioachlsmof..the great body of the people , and he gof extoadve hymen were
• a lima tee 'ewe we gee review venieom. es me owe to remind the 00,...u50 that the ottholio clergy Yid that email legmees VA the_ poor-house. or rem.ising outdoor
lesell at the Mothofths Mingionat kr Ikea theben. member sooner than risk lug or SOMplua• income tax, y would eau sag
;toad
its_ he ,au were verging townies me temmesa
0111011110 *ebb kith's witastiothlthemel eandast fa Mind for the ratie-Ineld. (Hear and cheers.) Thh was a most Tula
the kith members to a stosollatisio nio (Osi. Danmettl important fact. But Mr. Twistleton hadeiriven evidence far non oa g gggellg gg circumstanced. Bat he feared he had
a Mama rim of the noble ban% ogadaso me moaned more hanortant, walk= which he differ
eel. When Sakai what would restore ladastrial life in the declared that the Hone of Commons would not aid their
quits so strorgly. no chaos image cocasioe, as the minister of the crown had
it ftheditsZiterraastetheg7,:eir?bitmerfalsorstemitiyesalititaitkalistakenalley—'her western parts of Ireland, he stated that his sole brethren in Ireland out of the resources, not of the
hops lay atnt in the revival of the potato English Exchequer, but out of the common resources of the
tiejeoty's Meknes. . crop, and thin ease that crop should fail onto common Exchequer of England and Ireland, but that Ire-
Mr. BANKES found himself in the painful position of more, he thought toppling mast come from the laud must be thrown on her own resources exclusively.
giving a negative on this ocassion, when he would willingly, sources from which they bad hitherto emanated. The parliament had acknowledged, in 1846, that the distress
if he could, come to an oppaite concluskca" and, though behe Now, he (Mr. M'Cullagh) objected to both the one and the of Ireland ought to be relieved out of imperial resources;
issuevine for the et. after watt.aaa osetamd other of these °plaices. He could conceive no advice more but sow, after three years of most intense modeling, the
mould not contemplate its omen, for the government had fatal than to tell the people of Ireland to depend on that crop principle was for the first time denied. As he bad but a
cast so ma* discouragement upon it-had interposed 10 which, though it hit kept existent in them for yeah, choine of two evils in this CSSO-ell income tax or a rate in
moth of Oillisolty, that many althea* (sad the Irish mem- bad been their greatest Mime. (Chem.) Why, what was aid-he would unhesitatingly support the amendment, be-
lies especially) who were disposed to view it with favour, this bat the political equality of national gambling ? (Hear.) lining it to be more just in principle; for it did not by a
would find it impossible, after** intimation givee by the Were they to oscillate between chronic misery and perk- separate to on Ireland for Irish purposes. For the last four
*obis lord, to give it their support. (Hear, hear.) The disal destitutiao-to make the people mere sponges for rent years,
only_near two millions of additional taxation had been
noble lord bad stated ' that Ii the amendment was ear- for the absentees or stimndiaries on the exchequer. (Cheers.) Inflicted r, including the stamp duties, the county
ried he should feel it hie dots propose addi- What man was thane who desired to woo the people of Ireland cue to repay advances, and a poor rate of 1,800,0001. o and
ikon/--the nature of which be Dad not salaam° raised to the condition of the people of this countty who this owlet circumstances the most unfavourable, after a loss
-to the taxation of Ireland. It therefore would wished for such a prospect? But the hon. member for Back of between 30 and 40 millions of capital. Now it was pro-
be idle to expect that the' Irish members would inthaankirs (Mr. Disraeli) bad put this question, in a few posed by tee noble iced to ingiot another tax of 300,000 i, per
support it. Re war not one of those who act Peet words, on its right footing. He had told the honey the night annum; and what 'gyrated the evil beyond all en-
nead** it stil sad hoar of the Irish people stamingmitbout
dram( Ms the House of Commons. He ad- before that he would vote for amendment of the hon. durance was, that agricultural produce had bean de-
, say member for Kerry (Mr. Herbert), because it involved the based in value 20 to 30 per cent. This fact was no-
same principle for which he would contend-flat the pro. torious to any one acquainted with the oriole of evi-
-1 04.1111011 th was ad a Inge to lay additional taxation
.on
bid Inseeremethlted Placed members in **position oerty at present retied* to the poor should not be the el- cultural produce in Ireland. Was this a time to propose an
I. el nefut'hr a nessauto they did not wholly approve of,, or elusive property rated to the poor, but that personal property additional tax? • Let ths Debit, lord (Russell) recollect that
goithstate perolliks go panting any relief to the starving .honld be taken is. Well, that might be a very friendly aid it was the infliction of an odious tax which lost Britain the
elm mostiy•drdiews bad they, in gush an user-
Is 10 opinion, it would have teen to the hon. member for Kerry's amendment, but was it brightest jewel in her crown, her American provinces ; and
cote en the peat or n
quite wise in hon. members for Ireland to agree that the that the attempt to enforce an odious tax in this country coat
consented to waive WOW of those politis oeseenemical
matter should rest upon that footing t If they invited the a monarch not only his crown but his head, and inflicted the
, ...
'' Oen which now stood in the way of giving relief wino support of the hon. member for Buckinghamshire nom that most wide-spread misery. He meant not to insinuate that
oat additional taxation OD those who were so ill
principle, did they not raise here a preliminary controversy this would lead to a rebellion in Ireland ; but it would net
'
ninobleploebrdruelornytinlassetd, on Irish ground, Involving the whole question of where the fail to weaken the attachment of the country. Taxation
without representation was admittedly unjust; but how
burden of the support of the poor should lie, and did they
not tell the English members that they. were not safe in much more unjust was it to give a people • mockery of a re-
tim
' relief of Irish distress. He thought it would not have boon too tempering for a moment with the admission of this prin. presentation, and still to inflict a tax in opposition to their
afterresaartetraritlongde:rthwtoikearwwhioultiihdliheaadsitirthgeolo,oool. to apply to the
, much for the noble lord to have called on hi, supporters to cipls, that fretted should have en income tax in aid of the wishes. There were 69 Irish members opposed to this rate
waive th
poor rates? (Hear, hear.) For clear hs was, that in aid, and only 14 in its favour. Ministers were thus treat-
t heis rprinciple of en income lag Ireland worse than America was treated, by inflicting
basehite rpl;laginge
e he
nt_s Bova-Degaiut (thMeri.m Banks) war we:
a assuerci
if
they
once
admitted
the
(Protectionist cheers.) There an another tax in aid of rates, they would be very soon forced to taxes, not without, but contrary to representation. Let the
idtainutim
revenueof°ll"3. on which the noble lord had given no an femme tax instead of rates. (Neer, hear.) It was not noble lord, whom he once supposed an admirer of the con-
which might have been made available t,
fer him to enter on the wide field of discussion which this etitution, ink himself if this was not clearly uneonstitu-
, model pledge,
amen of the question opened, but he warned them that, tional ? Would the English people submit to any burden so
ammenut thleuriigteenoetypostm. Whye? n(octlfeeorrsaantimdelautoghbueo limsiteued,
Such
when the quesn to of the rate in aid was put on that ground, unustly impoeed ? Believing this tax contrary to the eon.
a there would not produce probablyd bring an additional on double the amount they must regard It as involving them as isardeans on the one stilution, he would protest meant it in the strongest terms ;
saw mind from that item, but it woul side or on the other. (Hear, beer.) Wed, then, the hon. and relying the poverty of Ireland, and on the protest of
200,0001. or 300,0004 which was more than' ministers member for Buckinghamshire and the hon. member fur Irish members against thi• tax, he called on the house to re-
said they required for present pursing. lie felt Cockermouth united for once in their lives, and d: dared that not it.
his had as much right to make this demand as they wanted a policy-that all the amendments of the poor Lord C. HAMILTON said the hon. member for Dundalk
governmest had to ask him to vote away the money of law would not do; and they bad asked what was to come
his co/oakum* when he knew they could not pay it with- next, and whether propositions of the present kind would (Mr. 111•Ctillegh) in a speech which bore evident marks of
preparation, had been very liberal in oeneoricus remarks on
out a great addition to the sufferings they were now labour- alleviate permanent evils and staunch tie wound? He (Mr.
ing under ; and they knew that, whether the security WAS a
, M'Cullagh) answered that he did not believe they would. MMus hon, members,
amorget others on the hon. member
for Cockermouth-towhose talents, upright bearing, and
rate in aid or an income tax, the repayment would be de- He believed it perfectly impossible to look at the present manly expression of bin epic ions, he "Lord C. Hamilton)
fond for a long period, it it ever came. For one, he could data of things in Ireland, and say that any amount of poor-
not consent to advance this money cm the security of W rate laws or police, or temporary, expedients, could do that, must bear testimony. (Hear, hear.) That hon. member
had ever advocated hie opinions in a manner which deserved
in aid, denounced as it had been by the Irish members them- which be believed in his continence no legislature could do,
the respect of the house ; and no one could have Mooned to
selves, and in spite of their warning' that it would behopes-
until a change took place in the tone and in the intentions of
Ibis to rake such a rats. He should therefore vote for the a number of these who represented Ireland on both sidesof his speeches, on two recent occasions, without being im-
pressed with the ability and r.search which he had brought
amendment, but without any hops that it would be tarried, the house, until they did themselves enact o' justice, of which to bow on the subject. (Hear) He had advocated what he
Sir L O'BRIEN observed that it had been shown teat the he was not now about to inform them for the first time. He
rate in sid would prods°, the most detriosental effects-that meant this-that the Irish landlord', who did their duty, and deemed justice for Ireland, regardless of what might be
thought by his constituents - a trait most honourable io
it would paralyse industry, and 'insert On working of the who kept faith with their tenantry, should no longer teal any member of parliament. (Hear.) Then the hon. mem-
poer He should have thought that the generosity of bound to make common cause with those who did neither- bee for Dundalk had fallen foul of Mr. Twiselton ; and atter
this country world have prevented such a preposition being that they should not feel haunted by the mere superstition
made. They should remember what exertion Ireland had or en esprit au corps to shelter their class or kindred when raising himself to a great moral elevation, had proceeded to
deal out his censure to the landlords of Ir.-land, and had
herself made during the last year for the support of her poor thou men abandoned their country, who made the people
They should seediest that nearly 2,000,0001. had boon paid the mere tools of their pupae so long as the potato lasted, charitably warned them not to become accomplices after the
fact to the crimes of three bad men who were deserters from
durieg that you on account of the poor-rate, and that on a and, wheiOthe potato failed, expected the pressure to come on
valuation of 13,000,0001.-end that valuation being before the Treasunt. (Cheers.) He knew land:ords who discharged w-A
.their c untry. (A laugh.) But this the hon. gentleman
i.e. apparently meaat as au argument ill favour of the rate
the famine and th.- Colors of the potato crop, which had ma- their duty well, but he mid it with grief that tip-, were i 4 aid, pressed as he evidently was for aigunont. Ile had
terially deteriorated all propetry in that country. The hon. aecemplices niter the factby upholding thole who bed not rnade
stated that the Roman catholic clergy had came forward and
member for Montrom had arid they should throw on the Irish common cause with the muddle end labouring climes. Some
petitioned that their poor flocks should not be burdened with
members the responsibility of preserving the lives of their landlords were in the habit of eying-" You mistake ; we er, income tee. (Hear.) Did be mean to represent that the
starving fanowooountrynien. He did not **ink from that live at home-we employ our pi note. No dout.t they did;
responesbility, but did it not apply with egos
o' force to the but they knew that half the landlords of Ireland did not de general condition of We flocks of the catholic clergy was such
that they would Le subject to the income tax ? (Hear, hear.)
English and Scotch members ? What interest had he ihis. (.• No, no," " Yes, yes," and cheers.) This was not But this was part of an argument which had been made use
more in the coarty of Mayo than they had ? What region a question of fraction :it was • question of facts ; and in of in other quarter', to the effect that the landlords resisted
was there for calling upon him more than rho people of God's name he meted open them to deal with it. (Hear, the rate in aid because it would fall heavily on themselves,
Middlesex to support the poor of a country in whim% he never bear.) They could not by a poor Iso nacos Con- an alloaation which was too absurd to be worthy
went, and in which he had no other interest:thew tact which naught. It was beyond the power of any legislature of further notice. (Hear, hear ) He believed the
was Wined equally by all his fellow-subjects ?At present odo so, except they ainsidoned all reined for rights end amendment bad been proposed from an opinion that an
the rates were enormously high. In Ennistynroa Union property ; and that they would not do. But if the
he paid lie. Bd. in the pound on his property, tad eat still, and me:stained she eights of property for men who
y income tel would be more egos' and just than a rate in yid;
and though the c)laiss punned by the lionb member fur
they were now about to Memos that amount said did not deserve it, they would be told that there were tke Kerry might 'object him to some cesium, his motives mist
in many cases to take not only the last farthing !TOM She wrongs of labour and indostry : and for the sake of thous rights command reuses. The proposal had arisen out of what FM
landlord, but more than he received ; for, under the Inch of property they must recoiled that the state could not afford expressed in the preceding debate, when many hon. mem-
poor law, the landlord was liable to pa oven though tin rent to allow the secrifim of human life. For the sake of the hers from Ireland, 'misting the rate is aid, had alluded to
was not collected. He thought to this part of the law country, therefore, he implored the house to consider the poosibility of Ireland being subjected ta some additional
the -.averment was bound to apply a remedy. If goreon- whether they would not come forward Led support stringent permanent taxation. On this ground they were supported
meat brought forward an income tax on their own respond- and unusual manures, and so deal with an unprecedented
bility, he snould be prepared to era it his best consideration, state of things. (Loud cheers.) in their opposition to the rate in aid by many English mem-
ben ; and now, to show that the Irish members wished not
aad be would not say that he would vote against it; but be Mr.Mr.KONSELL said that he could not understand bow to shrink tram their fair mid just share of the burden, the
must give his derided opposition to the rata in aid. With &mg hon. gentlemen, knowiag the state of misery in Ire- amendm• nt of the hon. member fur Kerry had been pro-
regard to the plan of the nghthoo. baronet (Sir R. Peel), he land, and that funds must be had to meet it, could conscien- posed. Of this amendment, though not perhaps expressed
doubted whether it would restore confidence, and without dead, oppose the rate in aid, without accepting the props- in the best possible way, he approved, and believed his con-
confidence there could be neither capital, eaterpriss, nor seen of the hon. member for Retry, or proposing some stituents approved of it, so far as the principle was concerned,
prosperity. He believed that beneficial results would foilow other substitution. (Hear, hear.) He addressed himself which was, that Ireland and England *maid be put on the
from the messing of a bill to facilitate the transfer of pro- partioulerly to the noble lord, the member for Down, who same footing as regarded Or it liability to general taxation.
peaty in Ireland. he said that it must be clear to those hon. gentlemen that 'lli- right hot. gentleman tho Chancellor of the Exchequer
Mr. biICULLAGH said, he had been mull struck with ens of the two propositions before the house would be carried. had lest night stated that this measure first originated is a
•
the observations which had folks from the hor • member fee It therstom followed that if the course punned by that noble recommendation of what he called delegate, from the OH-
Dorsetshire (Mr. Bankes) with reference to the pmeetitiee lord and these acting with him was adopted, with the view ferent poor law unions of Ireland, who met last autumn fa
of the right bon. baronet the member for Tunworth which of defeating the proposition of the hon. member for Kerry, Dublin, to consider the question of the poor law. The taco
hail deservedly engaged so much of the attention of the they would be substantially misting the government in was qui.e different. A committee of seven persons was ap-
house and the country. It appeared to him (Mr. M'Cullagh) carrying the rate in aid. pointed to draw up certain queries. One of these was, whe-
that the hon. member for Dorestahim was rather braised to Lord CASTLI;RE6.OII-I do not me that. then a rate in aid would be advisable ? Now, each of the
deprecate that measure, and seemed to think that the house Kr, moping/x-1f the noble lord did net see ft he would 131 unit), ato which this query was addressed expressed its
had been too precipitate in indoiag favourably of it. Now, very Nee feel it by having the rate in aid adopted If the hi- disapprobation of the rate is aid. The right hon. gentleman
of all she thought that the hos. gentleman in migration some sin were rejected. Ito was surprised to hear his hen. whit alleged the proceedings nth. meeting in Dublin as the
the be the last to maw such a complaint, became, if friend the member for Dundelk talking of the income tax on of this measure might therefore see on what a frail
memory did not deceive, ber was foremost in sashimi as an iatjumice, and as • sort of landlord's question, when it bees he placed it. (Hear, hear.) He believed that it was
• persdnal appeal, as eloquent as it was touching, and mud be known to him that an income tax rather than a rata a measure which would create discontent in Ireland, that it
complimentary to the genies and experiemeof the right hon. in aid would relieve an enormous portion of the farmers would pull down those who were now comparatively pros-
baronet, to come forward and help her Ildejestro govern- of Ireland from taxation, as the vast asokrity of them perms to **level of those who were in the greatest distress,
ment out of their embarruement and, he country oat of its would be sated under 3001. a year. (Hear, bear.) It and that it would loosen the boucle of social order through-
difficulties. (Hear, hear.) But now, when the made had was plainly no laadlord's question, and for this other ma. out the entire tawdry. (Hear, hear.)
spoken, and the plan had hem devolved, the hem gentle- sea u well, that they would have to pay infinitely more into Mr. B. MARTIN said that however unwilling he was to
man had began to repeat. He moth slather endue the the Imperial treasury by an income tax than a rata in aid. *opals on the time of the house, and however he partici-
•ilenoe of the right boa. baronet star his speech. He (Heir, Mar.) Them was a resolution adopted a few days posted in the feelings and wishes of a great number of persons,
could as little conteet himself with the oblerratleas of the ago by the Limerick board of guardians, moved by a chop- who he believed were more opposed than any others to
right has baroastas he amid with thoposposiotion.ofthe right keeper, seconded by a gentleman who was sot a landholder, tbis rate in aid, he thought it right to state the mesons why
hon. leader of the, misktooklbeasies.- gikar, hear.) The dosed by tho thaireasa, who wan a inseehant, and mooed he should vote for it. He believed that of all classes of her
boa. member for (otherellettlit illnoMena) bed Pro- unanimously, In which, after protesting strenuously against Majesty's subjects those who were most opposed to the rate in
ainaced • sall more eirtratettalry sneak He bad a rata in aid, they said that if the lagishiture should think fit aid were thepresbyteriansof Ulster, and when he spoke of them
melintakaa to inform the right howielelfae baronet of to refuse all farther succour, it would be more just to invoke he alluded more particularly to the presbyterian farmers,
chat he ceeeeivei to have lass enstedeei kola his all the aid the oevasay meld afford. They did not repudiate who would be called on to pay the tax, and with whose feel-
plan, and be hod sitenadartalone to sagged milieu the necessity of exertion on the port of the Irish people, ings and Mehemet the subject he was well acquainted. Every
alterations ia the plea Welt ; tat the dismiss of that hon. but they objected to a national rate kr local purpose". In person, he believed, would agree that the state of distress in
gentleman had extdbind a more marked eentratt between the ease of Soothed, under the 24 Geo. 111. merit counties the west of Ireland was such sa to require immediate assist-
the subject and the eseasoestary than be (Mr. M'Callagb) in the north of Scotland wars allowed to tax themselves for once. Moat persons would also concur in the opinion that
had over heard. Thoingit eon hen. numb= might not be the support'of the poor, except the lowlands. In every pro- the means of relieving that distress should be sought, in' the
satisfied with the lamas pammenthatecLas eras care that position fora- national rata it wee proposed to be levied upon first instance, in the vicinity of the locality where that din '
so mss of goad tone ter illaildleale eig t could have all descriptions of property. Even in Jersey the national tress existed. Bat it wee acknowledged on all hands that
kthowl feast the met nolority of dupe in thosseription rata was 3 par nat upon the income of the island. So that the moans of relieving that distress from such s
to the speech of as sight hon. ballast al that laiktine dr- everything was against tke proposition of the government, source was now totally exhausted. There was no
campsolina,natioa. sad, he woad add, that humility of including the opinions of Kr. Kills and Mr. M'Cullagh. mode of collecting the moans of relief where the distress
Madam,- Milk was oas of the best and truest attributes of Let them consider for a moment what the present existed; and he was not prepared to say, nor, he believed,
great agerkesee, loag habits of respoosibility, and taxation of Ireland was. English gentlemen werehardly was the house prepared-to say that it would be fair or right,
that power of reaping details and principles which the aware of the great disproportion of taxation in the rateable in respect to a rate merely imposed by parliament forcibly to
boom choerthlly worded to the right boa. member property of England and reland. The rateable property of take their land from the owners of property in those districts
foe Tamwcrth. (Hear, bar) But the house had oh - Reeked was about 103,000,0001. a year-the taxation upon in order to sell it for the non-payment of a tax which they
served as great a prohibit:of over-oonildeme en the one side it only 12,000,0001. The landed property of Ireland before had not the mesas of paying. (Hear, hear.) Such a power
as there had bees singular dilates* ea the ether. (Nean) the potato Mime was valued at 13,000,0001. Ho admitted never was, and he hoped never would be, ezerdsod. It
There was net anybody who had seat hem intared. As that wee a low matted= ; but add 16 per cent., and say it would be most unjust to adopt suck a measure against per-
to her Majentes. goverangen, 11 WOW iwaspatis awl was fairly
,valoth at 15,000mpoi. • year. From that most sous for a debt whisk had been contracted against their will,
t, and thith umearos wars errntbire and sams. Bat be Waned at least 20 per cont. In consequence of the and which they were totally without the means of paying.
rz-was sae piss at praise awarded to hie which potato failure, which would leave it at 12,000,0001. And (Hear, hoer.) That being so, and every paten being
the smaggthili libel of th heasorabla bassist what was the taxation on that 12,000,0001. ? The conaty ass, agreed that relief should come from some quarter, ths mien
mast Mos monk pliers& _ ~dam mime the ham- oa the-ammo of three years, after the payment of advaoces don areas where was it to come from. Ho talked not of ab-
able member fir Oselawmonth sammiath to tbo pants that was 1,143,6001., the poor-rate for the last year mm 1,600,0001., strut principles, but he would ask any man whether it was
already the plea had beebe. burin aad destroyed am- the repayment of relief advance* 272,0001.. which, with the not right, that intemperate Irish distress Ireland should pay
treats, sad fa fret that **right hen. beeeset nOtwitheera• Mmosat chargeable on mount of Sir J. Burgoyne's relief in the fleet instance. (" Hoer, hear," and " No, no.") An
lug luseastioa bad ban waiatentioaally wigging the lead eosaialon, made a total of than 4,000,000 L, or, putting it at hon. gentleman said "No ,
.•" but he put it to every person in
kat. (" Hear" and knoMen) With ramegt to the Of the lowest ken, 3,800,0001. se ; that, while the rateable that house whether it did not Mike the feeling of each,
the hobs eases the mamba for Clam (ter Lorin ), property of England, amounting to 103,000,0001., paid only without at all reasoning on the matter, that Ireland, Soot-
, M (Mk ) amnia an say much. He was sorry at 12,000,0001, that of Ireland, amounting to 12,000,000!., land, and England should psi eerily be each responsible for
I =,W teas Of is, bin he orasted that has. baronet's paid something like 4000,0001., in taxation. Surely that the relief of say distresittist might exist in these countries.
Oil ailkiikk {chinks too highly to find kult with wee a state of -*lnge to claim the liberal own- (Hear, ham.) Be had heard, indeed, that Ireland was to be
mass lid Atha floomalsa. (Hear.) And he would frankly derma= of that house, and to justify him in eall- considered a part of &natant, and should be looked upon in
IMMO Ike Lida am were set ia • positka at present tog upon them net to endeavour to squeeze out of the same light as Yorkshireor Lancashire: yet he believed
til:or edited
be lasseris seek other. Bat then wore other the load every shilling it was possible, Is the shape of rates it would be absurd to consider both cometries in that light,
width elsould be sorry to pass over un- for the sawn oflocaldistrms, without giving any assistance and although ao person was more favourable than he was to
The bastoorablo member for -Cositarminth, by by some seek sensedial lasesares as migration. He would the maintenance si the Union, he neoerthalem hoped
=anti puska pt the 'videos gives bakes die poor- not slaw into the dada of this IMMISIWO midge had beta strik- that Ireland would always remain to some extent
iase nesaiatase,led impinal the duty Wes Imo hen. mom ingly pat fireread hy the *la hca. harenet, the member for a separate country. 'He therefore wished that Ireland
her or other to Kos hi agates upon thesthataass M that Tame n*, sad the ban. member for Cookeranutit ; but should, in the 'first intann, be lulled on to rapport
name; and 110 (Mr. 11,04) shed& endeavour to do would natant htragsllby tialling attention to one case, which its own poor • and after the millions upoh milikna
d so, in terms as eamostkl as le the witness would illustrate these of important measures, which had bear; gins to Ireland during the last three years
who wee examined, kr idles he entertained which it was laSsmtial he Ireland's welfare to con- he cud not se how this could be oomd erect an unreasonable
s high esteem-be ended le • Now there ridar• At • Mimes ed &bent 12 miles from Lime- propesitiom Government hadotherafore, proposed a rate in
wore few pergoushe thismailny who was so well Informed as rick, there us ea melds a 4,500 acres, which had aid, to be imposed on the wholly 'reload. Tbea objections
18the preedeabikty et the rale le aid, ended sleet of the keen foe it laig time sabeist to tho jurisdiction of lad been made to this proposal by tho hon. member for
pose-law oysters, as Mr. Twhtleton • "edited he given Isis the Comet of Chambers. TM teamtry belonging to it were Buckinghamshire in his speech last night. In the tint
opiates en these sebiooile end es
Ild to the ma- in a most miserable mediate awl Grime prevailed upon it to plan, ho said that there was no murky that
MUD ea whisk it was based, he (Ms. ollagh), for a gnat eaten. At length en eminent Limerick merchant this tax, which was now proposed for only two
moss ilauld lave hem very meek staggered se to the purchased it, aad at ones adopted a course which restored noes, would not be extended for' an interminable period. a IAT TEI iv.
eels la to we, Mr. Twistleten behic far more dim tranquillity ODOM part of the meaty, and he would not say Now he was prepared to state that if the poopleof Ireland, eaTATIMICB OF TIIII CONVIVIALITY
sis , tsi
Lifail alleggise in Irate& mow tams les a party &adamant easeogitliheArekaßle course was simply that of the failure of the rtrito crop, strfil persevered in its cultl-
• than he wee. Wad gentleman tadored, fir it hid sot balm Mllere,but produced prosperity sitar the soPerienos width they had for the lasi does years DI ynam.-The iliational says:. "It appe_re_f7/ Si
I. tic sindnitontlas if the law, aad Hit wets pmetbk to ofessiming Ilbs to emigrate. He did not Teflon, they must UM the sionsequeson upon themes' Seine have worthily sustained the repute s
sag gioggvisitg ma welottegilaseey,eask IS ad of gear. easeerage tiles to eadgeato who were emigrating (Oh, oh.) Gentlemen might cry, "Oh oh, " n ~neldi the mold
Tim' ;vigour, so generally attributed to their compatnea , ..1
elsi .fall sadilesd lila le theaboasiii blase poseming segital-hie kept them at home-(hear, assure them if such • practice were Englisk who were invited to t_ e soiree of the
no
oroccatetel
ors well informed, they were shout 300 in nom ie
without his assistance. But Om yam; the time would come when relief from others tar,C, onameilleg he (M. ll'Oelegh) beer)-brt ha and 'misted thou other persons mate results followed Min it u hel followed 'foliar and
1
Weds eaddiseppotatee at WNW= Mimi . Wile nold sot lava lr eloquence , ,
ago Ambit yeses adman ad the whet mu the now i Why, although he had mast nage, and when the people of that co try tbe room that there are some sods of combat in o luck e
ibetkersuesseuematainconsupagamsed
rBi,goOurOesglaseeshave
thof. punch... :sot
across the Channel are sure of victory."
Kgokw he had tosigaedlukessa" gad motor .04 tilt OilatO - this mosporous oonditien, he war left to their owe resources. If they did not tele them"
IRMO to contrilmas Imply to the rates required, to support ordinary amuse which prudence dictated, to help thernsearvesl
.ALDOOMON GIBBS.-On Tuesday -„.
1ee...,,t Alaer66l is
ri4tretlilliTillg that las resigned
are Wary which added on another estate in the seam they must take upon *omelets the mosequelices of such a Gibbs was elected chairman of the City
of the mesas. fa Inland, *ha •
al tee etability of the mks ; and he stated, thot oliedoral eivkion, thatetato be .ing aril in the Court of Chan- come of easaset, (Hen) TM second objection WAS, that the 13th tines. On Thursday last the Haut beam r'''Ver
istioseild ant los a party to administer a law kg. which SEIII, es 1. Tie had frequently leforeurgiid upon the homes the ne- these upon nritone this rate in aid wee now to be thrown the Central School District Union took elect, mose
olosaft might be caused. Now, with submission, he (Mg oessity of adopting some system of emigration, which, with ware unwilling to boar their portion of it. That • i. Im
was quite man Gibbs and the Rev. Dr. Russ ~ WC'. ii.
laTurlagli) did not hesitate to toy, though ha was tliO • mere simple and easy mode of txansterring landed property true, and•fot his part it would give him infinitel if Wiesen 1 • hair for th^ pa . -
p easure Chola% 9 an' eitt-c mita of Lon, ...thd.--- of

A
-- The committee then divided.
For the amendment l4B
Against it .... 194-48
Upon our admission, strangers were again immediately
ordered to withdraw, but the second division did not at the
moment take place. On our re-entrance we found
Mr. HUI4II upon his legs. It was imposaihe amidst the
confusion which prevailed to catch the precise import of th
words, hut we understood him to inquire, as the tease hidwords,
sow pronounced against the principle of the income us,
whether the government would take it upon themselves to
wham) any money to Ireland if the Rate on Aid Billerica
kik and it so, upon what security ?
. Lord J. RUSSELL—I do not propose to issue any 00111
upon this vote until the act L passed. Still, it euuldheat
our power to issue money in the event of soy nears.ok
contingency. and then come down to this house and ask al
peelh
vote to supply that emergency ; and, if we found the
in danger of perishing by starvation, I should have so Wie
tation m adopting that course. (awn.)
Mr. GIOULBURN—It L quite clear that the
cannot by any possibility ism any money .s
granted
bill until the bill shall have rewired the royal worst
only fund from which money can be advanced is that n__.tim
parliament has placed at the disporal of the gocro.r.
under the head of civil contingencies—tkat fund beingwbt
at the discretion of the government, subject aftereftro "
the confirmation of this house. (Hew, heir.)
Mr. HUMR—The noble lord distinctly stated tlal,
would not vote more than 6,0001. or 7,0001. out of that nr,
—that that was to be the limit. I consider, thereisfe.T.
' any hon. gentleman who votes for this measure votes
that assurance. (Cheers.)
The committee then divided upon the origined_rites**
For the resolution 7v!
Agalbst it lo6—'w
The *house resumed and the CHeismer reported*. Mil"
lotions. Bill kial
The Apprehension of Deserters Portugal)
through committee. affect the
On the motion of Lord I. Rtreani, it was or
the house at its rising do adjourn till Monday. . tie
The other orders having been dicepwta of
journed at a quarter betorc one o'clock.

THE EXPRESS, EXPRESS, SITUED r"
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lil 1— .° • . IIIZ. see
VI./ • , il.."1111,111114 'I. 1:0:17111"Pi AO, . 4111 had
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Imville II ,Ait • a lo elk •• A esti wok ' "4, bit • our
tire rinsi , vwe '. '''t`. ot 4.--'-' bat ` `"r • ~e___, `td tee
•••••••••• -o^^'" `4 "4'4' 4' "" • . F iedast ind would Ma...A efuNE- 4h• frigh
et rand itighettew be yeah% le a ` ebsistsas people. He OIL NON boo biota be u mach mil-
t° thsh held. del OPIMMIN htliho this ' alausitly takes es to what its effect woad. !—STI die people, ea be wee in
um whoa Ile* imesieteases =Pt as enselaiiireg vs& a ea the duet one
01 MINIM weviii opus Wallis ' vespessi for bh de. He ad tee AU 6* fladlidr•
.... las seesiedweew ef Km id& hiellithemewhicht ism, 'W.- Ireland in ths fano 'manner ea it_tes
wsitseseii ..orti---ionoisi a& or vie awe&