The Express.
London, England, 1851-06-28 00:00:00

THE EXPRESS, SATURDAY EVENING, JUNE 28, 1851.

writing signed by him, to require such person to depart out ,
of the realm within a time to be limited in such notice, and
if such person shall be afterwards found therein it shall he
lawful for her Majesty's Secretary of State for the Home
Depirtment, by warrant under his band, to give such per-
son in charge of one of her Majesty's messengers, or of such'
other person or persons to who:n he shall think fit to direct
such warrant, in order to his being conducted out of
the kingdom." Ile thought that now that the bill was be-
fore them for consideration it became individual mem- '
ben to see whether its previsions wens such as woald '
not only stop present encroachments, but also prevent any
future aggressions ; and if it appeared that the bill, token as
a wh,le, did not carry out the opinions which hod been
expressed by the premier and by the vast protestant meet- I
ings which had taken place throughout the country, it be-
came bon. members to place their opinions on record, and
do whatever was in their power towards repelling these'
aggressions. It might be said by the noble lord, that if
the bill were not sufficiently stringent, all that was neeee
nary was to come down and bring in a more stringent
measure next session. He would ask, however, if it would
be politic, after the delay which had occurred, and the
acrimony of feeling which bad been displayed on this sul..-
jiet during the present session, to brim.; forward any new
bill next year. The present he thought was the time for
them to make the bill as effective as possible.

Keogh) therefor,: hoped that the noble lord would allow
his men to do so. (Cheers and laughter.) It was per-
fectly clear that there would be a large majority for the
clause, if the noble lord had not seen fit to change tho de-
termination to which the legal advisers and the principal
members of his government had come. (Cheers.)
Sir G. GREI said the boo. and learned member must
be under a mistake, for ho had given no consent to the
clause. Ile had certainly thought, on further considera-
tion, that the clause was wholly unnecessary, and he had
certainly said he should not make any strong objection to
it. As it was, however, mere surplusage, he quite con-
curred with the course taken by his noble friend. (Cheers.)
Mr. SCULLY thought the explanation quite satisfactory
as far as the right hon. baronet was concerned, but he con-
sidered that some explanation was also due from the Secre-
tary for the Treasury. (Loud cheers, and cries fur Mr.
Hayter.)
Mr. HAYTER, on rising, was greeted with loud cheers.
Ile said, 1 am perfectly ready to admit that a conversation
did take place between myself and the hon. and learned
member for Athlone, but that conversation was totally
different in mauncr from what the bon. and learned gentle-
man has stated. (Cheers.) It was not an authorised com-
munication made by me from the members of the govern-
ment to him. (Cheers.) It is true that I stated to him
that I understood—l did not say from whom I understood
—(" hear," and laughter)—that there would be no objec-
tion to the clause. (Mr. Keogh, " Hear, hear.") I stated,
moreover, that 1 would request hon. members to stay in the
house, but that was in order that there might be a fair
division. (Cheers.) I never stated to the hon. gentleman
that I had received* communication from the noble lord or
from the right hon. baronet (Sir G. Grey).
Mr. KEOGH—Hear, hear. I never said so. (Cheers.)
Mr. HAYTER—I made the statement in a conversa-
tional and confidential tone, which is uniformly adopted and
respected by the members of this house. (Cries of
" No, no.")
Mr. KEOGII—Sir. (Cries of " Order, order.") I rise
to explain—(cheers)—and I beg the right hon. gentleman—
(Mr. 'byte* who was rising from his scat, to remain
until he has heard it. The right hon. gentleman says his
communication was made in a confidential manner, but I
beg leave to tell him that, at all events, his conversation did
not convey such an impression to me. (Cheers, and cries of
" Order, order.")
The SPEAKER—The hon. and learned gentleman must
feel that this is not explanation, but reply. (Cheers.)
Mr. GRATTAN rose and uttered a few words, but they
were inaudible, owing to the vociferated cries of " Spoke, '
"order," and "chair." At last the hon. gentleman, gel-
tieulating violently, sat down.
Mr. MOORE-1 beg leave to move that the house do
now adjourn. (Cheers.)
Mr. GRATTAN—I second it.
Lord J. RUSSELL (who was rising when the adjourn-
ment of the house was moved) said that though the hon.
and learned gentleman was not strictly in order, yet, as the
matter was entirely a personal one, he thought that, accord-
ing to the usual courtesy of the house, the hon. gentleman
ought to be allowed to proceed. (Cheers.)
The question having been put from the chair,
Mr. KEOGH-1 do not wish to sot contrary to the rules
of the house, but now that I am in order, I will proceed
with the matter which has arisen between me and the right
hon. Secretary for the Treasury. The right hon. gentle-
' man has admitted that every statement I made, so far us I
gave an account of the transaction between us, is correct.
Cheers.) He distinctly admits that there was a communi-
cation between us (and that was all I asserted), to the effect
that the government would support my proposition.
(Cheers, and cries of " No, no.") I did not assert—(cries
of Spoke ")—that the right hon. gentleman told me that
the noble lord or any other person had communicated with
his; hut he being the recognised officer of the govern-
ment, and I seeing in him the recognised officer of the
government, coming to me and telling me what I have
stated, I concluded that he intended to keep his party in
the house to support my motion. (Cheers.) I will now
mention another circumstance which I did not state before.
The right hon. gentleman said the hon. and learned Mem-
ber for Abingd in's motion would not of course be pressed,
for if my :notion was carried it would be an ex-
press negative of that of the hon. and learned member.
The right hon. gentleman said his conversation to Inc was
confidential, but. if that was the case, why did he after
wards come to me and tell me that the noble lord woald
ROL support my clause, sod that therefore I was not bound
by any understanding to limit my observations. (Cheers.)
hone PAW given a plain, fair, and candid statement of this
lummetion ; end the ijuestion which remains is, whether
vs are to place any reliance upon communications of the
Med hon. gentleman whets he comes from the government,
lee whether the noble lord is to repudiate the right hon.
goollommt and my he has given him no authority. (Cheers.)
TM motion for the adjournment was then withdrawn.
Sir F. THESIGER bad been unexpectedly introduced
Mb this discussion, and he begged distinctly to state that
holed not had the slightest communication with the hon.
gmtleman.
Mr. S. WORTLEY had no doubt the hon. and learned
=man (Mr. 'Keogh) had no intention in moving his
to do more than to prevent prosecutions by indict-
ment from being taken ; but the effect of his clause might
be to prevent parties from bringing suits relating to private
isterest.,

Mr. Sl'OONElt seconded the clans,
Sir G. GItEY said that a similar clause had formerly
been proposed by the hon. and learned member for Mid-
burst; only there was this important difference between
the two, that tho clause of the lion. and learned member,
if ailopt,d as he proposed it, would have effected something,
whereas the present clause would be totally inoperative,
oaks it were followed up by imposing a severer penalty.
Parties might be removed from the shores of England and
return within the neat half-hour, and then they would have

to commence proceedings dr Noco.
The house divided, when there appeared—
For the clause
Against it

The el;nwr was therefor: lost.
Mr. KEOGH had to propose a now clause, saving the
Powers of the 7 and 8 Victoria, c. 97. It was to the follow-
ing effmt Be it enacted, that nothing herein contained
Audi he construed to annul, repeal, or in any manner affect
any prevision contained in an act passed in the eighth year
of the reign of her present Majesty, intituled ' An Act for
the more effectual Application of Charitable Donations and
Bequests in Ireland, or to render illegal or void any Diva-
@Rion of Property by will or otherrise already made,
which but for the passing of thin Act would have been le-
gal and valid.' "
Mr. REYNOLDS seconded the motion.
Lewd J. ItI:3BELL said that there was no intention of
affecting the provisions of the Bequests Act by the present
measure, and he would be quite willing to adopt the dig.
prorid,d it were restricted to the words down to the mei
" Ireland."
Mr. NAPIER expressed his concurrence in the claim
down as far as the word " Ireland." And
The dense as restricted was unanimously agreed to.
Mr. KEOGH then moved a C 1.111141 saving the right of
giving letters of ordination in evidence. s' Be it enacted,
that nothing herein contained shall iu any manner prevent
the reception in evidence in any court of law or equity in
this kingdom of any letter of ordination or other document
conferring ecclesiastical powers upon any cler,qm /II of the
Raman catholic church, which, but for the passing of this

act, would hare been so receired." _
Mr. REYNOLDS seconded the clause.
The ATTORNEY-OE:Kb:UAL thought the hour: ought
not to adopt such a clause.
The house then divided—
For the clause
• it
. _ .

Against ..
Mr. KEGUIL then moved the addition of the following
clause : Be it enacted that nu proceeding shall be taken
nailer this act save and except by her Majesty** Attorney-
Genera for the time being in England and Ireland and by
the Lort Advocate in Scotland." He said he had commu-
nicated with the hew officer, of the crown respecting this
clause, and was received with all courtesy, though of course
they Kaye him no intimation of what they should do till
they had consulted their colleagues ; but within the last five
minutes the Secretary of the Treasury told him to be brief
in his observations, as goverrunent would support
him, and now the noble lord (Lord J. Russell) told
him he would not support the clause. (Hear.) There had
been a good deal of turning and changing with respect to
this bill ; but this was the most rapid change of all.
laird J. RUSSELL said, when ho came into the house
he had not the smallest intention of agreeing to this clause.
Ile had not paid much attention to it, but it was his inten-
bun to oppose any clause proposed by the hon. and learned
gentleman, with the exception of that relating to the Cha-
ritable Requests Act. His friends around him thought
that, as this clause would not do more than they had al-
Mealy done, namely, provide that all actions should be
t by the Attorney-General, this clause might be
without any mischief into the bill • but,
as he had said, it was not his intention to admit; this
clause, although ho was disposed at first. Ile thought
it far better not to introduce any clause that had not
been maturely considered. With respect to the substance
of the clause, the hon. and learned gentleman could not
deny that the penalty of 10(11. for the assumption of titles
could only be enforced on the prosecution of the law Mg-
cera of the crown. That provision was in the act of 18:0,
and they preserved the same in the present act. With re-
spect to the first clause, which toes the only clause the hon.
and learned gentleman expressed any doubt upon, it was
stated by the Attorney-General thet no indictment would
lie under that clause. If that w.O the case, therefore, if
there could be no prosecution under the first clause, and
under the second clause there could be no prosecution
except by the law officers of the crown, he submitted to
the house that this clause was unnecessary, and he there.
fore should be Air retaining the bill in its present shape.
Mr. REYNOLDS said it appeared to him that the reasons
assi med by the noble lord against this clause were of no weight.
Ile said the Attorney and Solicitor-General were of opinion
that no prosecutions could be instituted under the first
clause; if so, what harm could be done by inserting this
douse ?
Mr. GRATTAN asked was the noble lord aware of the
spirit now raging in Ireland, that within the last two
mouths catholic altars had been violated, and that parties
had rushed in and attacked the priests?
Sir J. GRAHAM said ho did not wish to enter into a
legal argument, but be still entertained the opinion he had
before expressed with respect to the legal effect of the first
clause. lie expressed that opinion with diffidence, and he
understood that the law officers on the treasury beach
dissented from it; but at the same time he stated then,
and ho repeated now, that the breach of that clause
was an indictable offence. The first clause of the bill,
now under discussion, was not only a declaratory but an
enacting clause. It declared that the brief in question was
Hiegel and void, and, as he contended, its so declaring it
illegal and void removed every doubt that an indictment
would lie fir the violation of that act. But a far greater
extent bad been given to the operation of this clause, more
particularly by the Attorney-General for Ireland, whom he
inideneiod distinctly to say that all similar briefs fell under
the operation of this declaration in the act. Similar briefs—
briefs in the usual manner appointing Roman catholic
archbishops and bishops in Ireland—could be declared
Illegal and void, and indictments would lie against such
persons. If that were the right operation of the clause,
any person in Ireland—and he feared there were vindictive
feelings on the part of some protestants against the
Roman catholics in that country—any individual, with-
lout the sanction of her Majeety's law advisers, would
have it in his power to present a bill before the grand jury,
sad the majority of the grand jury would have it en their
power to return a true bill, and the archbishops and bishops
would he put to trial on the charge. Ile did not wish to,
pursue this question further, but with reference to the 11.11011
of Irela I and the good government of Ireland, he had the
[strongest opinion that the clause proposed by the WI. sad
learned member for Athlone was indispensably necessary.
Strangers were then ordered to withdraw, preparatory to
a division, when—
Mr. M. J. O'CONNELL said he hoped if the catholic, of
Ireland were strangled, they would not be strangled by
mutes. Surely, after the irresistible manner in which the
right hon. baronet opposite hail shown the dangers to
which they would be exposed if this clause were not intro-
duceal, the noble lord would not suffer the house to go to a
division without saying something about it.
Mr. LAWLESS asked the noble lord at the head of the
=alliwhether he would have presumed to have
tt. }Seglish member as he had treated the ho-
signmaiseindisarned member for Athletic. He did not think
It we MIMI civility to that hon. gentleman, who repre-
sented sheet 40 Irish members • and it was a want of
that would be remembered at some future time.
ter.))
e.itUSSELL said there were two things which be
eddied to explain to the house. In the first place, he did
net authorise any one to communicate to the hon. and
learned gentleman that he should not oppose hie clause.
He (the noble lord) came into the house with the intention
of opposing it, and therefore he considered himself per-
fectly at liberty to do so. With regard to the speech
of the right hon. baronet (Sir J. Graham), who bad
spoken as to the effects which would follow from the re-
jection of the clause, he (Lord J. Russell) had stated
in the speech he had made that it was his intention to
gave both the motion of the hon. and learned member for
Abingdon and that of the hon. and learned member for
Athlone. He did not think that any injustice would be
done byhat course, as it was not intended that any prase-
cation had/Marin *weld take place except at the in-
seam. the law officers of the crown. (Cheers.)
Mr. KEOGH rose, but was received with loud cries of
" spoke." As he was only going to allude to a personal
transaction he hoped the house would permit hint to ad-
dress them again. (Hear, hear.) He had communicated
with the Attorney-General and the Solicitor-General, and
both of them were in favour of the clause. They commu-
nicated with the right hon. Secretary for the Home Depart-
ment, but the right bon. bart. was at first opposed to the
ChM,. Afterwards, however, en intimation was made to
Idea that the right bon. hart. nd yielded, and was also is
bow ff the clause ; but he (Mr. Keogh) could not act
met Ihofealli they had communicated with the noble lord.
14100) was in the lobby with the noble lord and
the de* la beet, when the communication was made. He
mearael W dm beg; a new motion was made, and a
vow Mal= was Wig for. After the house had been
ellaassis theeriviba7 le the Treasury, the recognised Meer
ela=mrh wrammehaticam told him that the govern-
mit la the dame, and divide with
; sad br rapport required that he would there-
gees be Met in his observations. (Cheers.) The right
hea. reatiemea (Yr. Hayter) stated that be would keep
Me ma la the home to support the motion, sad he (Mr.

Mr. KEOO Ii begged to alter his clause to avoid the diftl•
I may pointed out by the right hon. Recorder
The house then divided,
Ayes 7l
Noes 232

Majority against the clause l6l
Mr. REYNOLDS moved the following clause: " Be it
enacted, that nothing herein contained shall be construed
is repeal or affect an act passed in the tenth year of her pre-
sent Majesty, intituled ' An Act for the Maintenance of the
Cemeteries at Golden-bridge and l'roepect, in the county of
Dublin, and to create a perpetual succession in the govern-
ing body or committee for managing the same.' "
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL said that nothing could
be further from his wish than in any way to interfere with
the act to which the clause referred ; but it did not appear
to him that the present bill would do so, and he should
wait with great curiosity to hear in what manner the
hon. gentleman thought it would. He objected to the
confirming by a public act what was at present only a
clause in a private act.
Mr. REYNOLDS begged to cypress his surprise at hear-
ing the Attorney-General calling this a local or private act,
whereas its last clause expressly declared that it was a pub-
lk act.
Sir F. TIIESIGER said the Attorney-General was
gaits right. In spite of the clause referred to, the Ceme-
teries Act was a private act.
Sir R. H. INGLIS contended that the insertion of the
title of archbishop in a private bill was not a recognition of
it by the legislature.
The house then divided—
For the clause
Against it
The clause was accordingly negatived.
Sir F. THESIGER, after bespeaking the attention of
the house (which was just then in a state of great uproar,
owing to a crowd of members leaving for dinner), said this
was probably the last opportunity they would have of mak-
ing their legislation correspond with that which the occa-
sion demanded. Had it not been that we had broken
down restrictions and taken the sting out of penal laws,
the aggression now complained of would never have occurred.
On its perpetration, the tone and language of the noble
lard were fitting; he marshalled the nation, who were
ready to follow him in all that was necessary to repel the
aggression. (Hear, hear.) Atter the protestant feeling
had been stirred from one end of the nation to the other,
I it was ridiculous to suppose that all these throbs should
' end in the puny and abortive issue of the noble lord.
(Hear, hear.) Had he been permitted to pursue the dic-
tates of his own feeling., the noble lord would have pre-
sented a very different measure ; but it was to be feared, that
by yielding to the suggestions and solicitations of others,
and letting "I dare not" wait upon "I would," he bail
lost the meet splendid character that could have awaited
him in the page of history. (Hear, bear.) Had he pur-
sued the course his language indkated,—had he in ez-
and positive terms made no distinction between the
diMst parts of the Kingdom, he (Sir F. Thesiger) should
have aempted the bill with gratitude, as a sufficient protec-
tion against the encroachments that had been made. As
the act of Richard 11. was clearly law both in Ireland and
Ragland, the noble lord at the head of the government had
wisely refused to introduce anything into the bill before the
house exempting Ireland from its operation; and he had,
in of declared this in opposing the amendment of the
Ws- marker for Rochdale (Mr. S. Crawford). Had any-
mourred since to induce a change of conduct on the
pre of the government ? The Tablet recently, in alluding
ire bull for the consecration of the Bishop of Killaloe,
mad this almost profane language, " The law is broken—
ffininles be to God." On another occasion, the same organ
Another rescript—another crime—another cause for
ffintidldnest to Almighty God." (Hear, bear.) After
Sloe eepeelod defences, would it not be disgraceful in the
lam to allow this measure to go forth without
selibeg I effective for the protection of all parts of
lbe mein from these acts of aggression ? (Hear, hem.)
The Nib Ind said be meant to include Ireland in his le-
elm masr let them see how he intended to carry out
The preamble of the bill was directed at
lelnenaltnenelmt solely and exclusively to the rescript
bend la MN, sad which altogether applied to England.
The lAN UMW sold it would be absurd to make it
511dWoo bens et reseripu for the creation of bishops
esos la Wood end to permit such to be legal in Ire-
land. Then the esti, lord, by his own words, meant to
Include the ram* lately received in Ireland.
If so, he wished to ask the noble lord would
it not be the taste Me and open and manly course, to de-
dare arch en dos bee of his bill, instead of leaving it to
the bed= me notertelsty of isdereme ; and if it would
Nog le bay to=mids=issonavielon el the enactment
ler edger led He (Sir Y. Tlsseiger)
Wpm& to do that for the noble bet which he no-
pamois be some undefinable BM to have the cour-
age is do himself. (Haw, bre.) Sr ',Goosed to make
en low in the very elms too iellek Übe -noble lord evi-
Away intended it should be emeeleL Therefore, if hon.
gentlemen turned their easielles le his fIrM amendment to
he introduced into the penomlies instead of reciting " that
dime et bee Majesty's soldsmo hod assumed titles of arch-
eda= under ale. at a certain authority,"
be Mk knowing out the views of
re salb_les.. TibrNa Sat any rescript sent into
Ireland boold los=esgal, proposed to &saga
do mole a bit • sr marls," to " by nest
WA et seistiple." , he
He thought It
right Y eilllba le broom in all eases, within
the MIMI& tie walk tell s view to mark and

tinguish the particular brief, to add the words, " and par-
Ocularly by a certain brief, reseript, or letters apostolical
[ given, or purported to be given, at Rome on the 29th
S.ptember, 18.50." (Hear, hear.) These were the amend-
ments he intended to propose, and he coiled upon the noble
lord to say whether or nut it was his intention to include
Ireland withia the provisions of the bill. (Hoar, hear.) If
° his (sir F. Tksiger's) ainendmeuta militated not with the
intentions of the noble lord, he asked him how he could

conwientiously and consistently oppose the introduction of
these words, particularl when ho remembered what
had lately passed in Ireland? (Hear, hear) The noble
lorl should remember that their legislation on this subject
had been converted into an occasion for deliance ; and that

if he abandoned the position he had assumed, or showed
any hesitation on the subject, he would give encouragement
to those who encroached upon them ; and he, therefore,
. .

called upon the noble lord to say whether he intended the
provisions of this btll should apply to Ireland, and if so,
why not declare as much on the face of the hill ? (Hear,
hear.) The preamble standing then in the position in
which he had placed it—and which poiition he considered
to bo. impregnable—he would take the liberty of calling the
attention of the house to the other amendments, which, fol-
. .

lowing immediately on that which he had proposed in the
preamble, became absolutely necessary as a logical conse-
quence. They were now coining front the preamble of the
bill to clauses that had not alone a declaratory but an en-
acting nature • and again he appealed and asked why, if the
rescript introduced into Ireland were illegal, why not state
so? His hon. and learned friend, the Solicitor-tietieral, was
pressed on that subject by the hon. member for the Univer-
sity of Orford, as to whether this declaratory clause
was not inconsistent, by being confined to a particular
brief or rescript, when it was known that by another brief
or rescript the rope had created a bishop for the diocese of
Noss. His lion. and learned friend replied that the clause
would have elf.et in Ireland ; because the judges, in case of
prosecution, would adopt the clause and apply it to Ireland.
Now he conceived his hon. and learned friend laboured

orieti
gentleman should be successful in -se might -_
lug his amendment it would be to their aid he would
hon. andilleaajrn
owe that success. lie (Lord J. Russell) must consider
carry-
•hem resynsible for the result . (Ilear, hear.) For him-
self, he saw nothing in these amendments—objectionable
though they were, for the reasons he had stated—which
should induce him, if they were passed, to abandon the
bill. (Cheers.)
After a few words from 111 r. Nariza in support of the
amendment,
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL, after recapitulating the
substance of the amendments proposed by the hon. and
learned member for Abingdon, said ho did not see any
great objection to the first of those alterations, although he
would rather see the bill remain us it stood, or in the form
which hail been proposed by the hon. and learned member
for Midhurit. But ho must join issue with his hun.
and learned fri,mil on his proposition to include Ireland.
The second proposal of his honourable and learned
friend was to render the introduction, publishing, or put-
ting into use any pupal bull, brief, or rescript Riegel, and
the only objection he saw to that was, that as the assump-
tion of titles would in the majority of instance follow the
introduction of the briefs, the penalties would be made
cumulative. With that exception be did not see much
harm in the proposal. But it was unquestionably contrary
to law to introduce those briefs or remripts, and it seemed
clear that the law would he enforced in both
instances. The third proposal of his hon. and learned
friend was fur more objectiocab e, because it involved
the introduction of the common in:ormer. That appeared
to him a matter of serious importance upon which it be-
hoved the house to reflect before they decided. This was
no case in which a common iuformcr ought to be allowed
to interfere ; it was no case of police or of the infraction of
some minor law on which the vigilance of the common in-
former, owing to the want of more direct protection, was
allowed to operate. This was a matter affecting the attic
and the sovereign. That was the only ground of inter-
ference, and such interference ought to be left to the re•
sponsibility and sauction of the government, of which the
Attorney-General was In such a case the representative.
By the ameudinent now proposed the responsibility of
the public prosecutor would be lessened, the charac-
ter of his office would be lowered when he was mixed
up with common informers, and, worst of all, the
nature awl description of the offence would be lowered.
(Rear. hair.)
The house then divided, and the numbers were—
For Sir F. Thesiger's first amendment
Against
On our re-aduliei,on to the gallery,
Lord J. RUSSELL was speaking across the table, and
we understood the noble lord to say that it would be useless
to divide on the second amendment of the hon. and learned
gentleman on the preamble, as it was merely a formal
sequence to the first, and the re suit would, of course, be the
same
This arrangement being agreed to, the third amendment
of Sir E. Thesiger, which was to insert in clause 1 instead
of the words " the said brief rescript " the words " all such
brief rescripts," was put to the house.
The SOLICITOR-GENERAL, in opposing this amend-
ment. said it now remained to the house to deal with the
enacting part of the bill, and they would do well to consider
a little on the course from which they had so lately de-
parted; not because this amendment effected very impor-
tant alterations in the bill, but rather fur the contrary ma-
son, that they were not holding out delusions to the public
leading to the supposition that in the alterations suggested
by the hon. and learned member for Abingdon they were
building the towers of their church and raising up the
bulwarks of their Zion. (" Oh, oh," and laughter.)
Those were the words of the honourable and learned
member for Abingdon. (Rear, hear.) That honour-
able and learned gentleman had not only said that
he would make by his amendments the bill complete, per-
fect, and effective; but with great eloquence he had stated
that hie reasons for so doing were that we had arrived at a
period of our history when every step was of the utmost
importance, and that when we found an enemy was crouch-
ing to surprise us, it were well to fortify our towers and set
up our bulwarks ; and the hon. and learned gentleman had
also told the house that he proposed to do all this by sub-
stituting his masonry for the rubbish of this bill. lie (the
Solicitor-General) now proposed to examine the masonry of
his hon. and learned friend is little, and to see what were the
bulwarks he proposed to set up for the church. It was nut the
first time that the church had had to rely upon an act of parlia-
meet fur support. lie believed it to be important ,
that there should be a public declaration on the
part of the parliament of England of those great
political principles which had animated our ancestors, and
had prevented any foreign interference with their domestic
affairs, even of that semi-spiritual: character which were
difficult to define, but which they had repelled. But, ut the
same time, he believed also that our religion and our faith
stood on higher principles—principles which required
no act of parliament for their guarantee, but had
found their way into the hearts of the people
of this country, who ho held were sincerely attached to the
religion established in this realm as the religion of the
church. Let the house see what were the bulwarks his
hon. and learned friend proposed to append to the rubbish
of the government bill—let them sea what additional works
he proposed. His first master-stroke was this—that
I whereas the government recited intheir bill that a bull had
been introduced into this country from the Pope of Rome,
which had caused the greatest indignation throughout the
land, not only in its religious but mainly in its political as-
pect ; that the government had seized upon that bull and
denounced it by a political enactment, saying that the bull
haul violated the law inasmuch as it revived those preten-
sions which our &mestere rejected centuries ago. The govern-
' agent proceeded to recite in the preamble that the rescript
was null and void, and the hon. and learned member for
Widhurst thought it right that there should be added a
wdeclaration" that it was null and void, and in directing
Ws attention to this bill or rescript only he had taken the
correct view. That, however, was not the plan of the hon.
and learned member for Abingdon. lie proposed to add
other bulwarks to the bill. The hon. and learned member
stated that besides this letter, which had pulled down Can-
terbury and set up the new see of Westminster—which had
parcelled out the country, abolished the ancient sees, and
set up a new hierarchy—that besides all this he had dis-
covered something else : he had found out that a bishop of
Roes had been created, and that twenty or thirty years
ago the see of ()tawny had been erected. (" Hear,
hear," and laughter.) The honourable and learned mem-
ber had argued that attention should be directed to all those
minor details, neenuse if one bull was declared illegal, and
others were not referred to,it would:place thejudgesinlreland
in a position of embarrassment. No such effect, he contended,
would follow ; for, if they took up the great instrument,
the cause of the whole of our legislation, and declared it
illegal and void, and raid that was the state of the law as
regarded that instrument, why it followed as a matter of
course that every other instrument of the same character
was also illegal and void. The second bulwark proposed
by the hon. and learnt* Member, under a penalty of
a hundred pounds prohibited any person from procuring
from the see of Rome, or putting in use, any such bull or
rescript. Now, this had been anticipated by the act of the
2nd Elizabeth, cap.!, and this act the legislature had in Isl 4
refused to repeal. (Divide, divide.) The act of Elizabeth
made it penal " to put in effect" the jurisdiction or authority
of the l'ope, and the publishing of a bull was certainly put-
ting such authority into effect. The last guarantee which
his hon. and learned friend offered was this—that whereas
the bill proposed to put it in the power of the Attorney-
General to prosecute parties who violated its provisions,
the hon. and learned member proposed that the power of
prosecuting should not be confined to the Attorney General,
but be exercise,' by anybody with the consent of the Attor-
ney General. He could see no advantage in this. They
were not, by adopting such amendments, achieving any
additional security for our protestant rights and privileges,
but were destroying the whole effect of the manner in
which the bill bad hitherto been carried through the house.
(Hear.)
The house then divided :
_ _ _

under considerable misapprehension. lie (Sir F. Thesiger)
held that the judges would not decide by that declaratory
CLAIM, but according to the law as it esisted before the act
was passed. In his opinion if anything would em-
barrass the decision of the judges la Ireland, it was
the very clause which the Solicitor-General thought would
be effective. (The Solicitor-General was understood to say
ft would be effective.) Then if so, and if ouch were the
intention of his hon. and learned friend, why not honestly
express it, and not leave it to inference? If the noble
lord intended Out the statute of Richard 11, should be
available then lie could not object to the clauses introduced
by him (Sir F. Thesiger). Because the benefit of them
was this, that they brought down the law to the present
day. No person could plead ignorance of the law when
declared now by that house, and also, instead of the parties
being open to prznnuire, his clauses would make all bulls,
briefs, and rescripts, illegal for the future tinder the very
penaltywhich the noble lord had declared suilicient to meet
the emergency. (Hear, hear.) lie could not conceive
how anything short of what he proposed could
give security against these encroachments. (Hear,
hear.) None of his amendments appeared inconsistent
with what had been expressed by the noble lord.
Therefore he desired that those who, in language, agreed
in every proposition, should now be prepared to carry that
language into effect. (Hear, hear.) Their establishment
stood assailed within and without. (Hear, hear.) Without
her, fighting*, within her, fears. (Hear, bear.) It could
not bo denied that the late attempt of the papal govern-
ment was aimed at temporal as well as spiritual authority
in that kingdom. It comprehended the right to govern all
persons who might be within the limits of territorial outdo-
! city: all heretics and apostates, and, in fact, its category in-
eluded ell baptised amts. They were dealing witha wary foe
who knew when to advance his claims, and when to lie
dormant. That file would lie crouching for his opportunity,
1 but when once he sprung it were vain to struggle, for his
strength was irresistible. (Hear.) Therefore now was the
time ter them to walk round their protestant lion, and tell
all her towers and bulwarks ti at they might be able to
show those who came after them that they were not inat-
tentive to, or regardless of, their most sacred and precious
interests. (Hear, hear.) They were then engaged in a
contest in which the eyes of the world were upon them,
and to fail in which would be both scandalous and disgrace-
ful. (Hear, be ie.)
Lord J. It USSELL did not consider the alterations, for
ho could sot consider the amendments, proposed by the hon.
and learned gentleman, and which dealt with points al-
ready touched upon in the bill as valuable and efficient as
the hon. and learned gentleman seemed to think them.
What was it that in the first instance constituted the
offence, and next, what was the course of proceeding pro-
, puled to meet that offence? The offence was in the first place,
the issuing of a merlin, authorising the assumption of tern-
, tonal tides without the consent or knowledge of the Queen, in
defiance, in fact, of the throne of this country; and in the
second place there was an assumption of certain titles pre-
tended to be conferred by such authority. And what the
government proposed was, in the first place to recite, in an
act of parlament a declaration, that a certain rescript,
which had come from Rome, pretending to confer these
titles, was void and illegal. This was declared in the pre-
amble. Such was the first step, and it was strengthened
by the introduction of the first clause. And if it stood
▪ this appeared to him the best mode of meeting one
part of the offence, because what they had to deal with
was that which, it was to be remembered, was an
open, arrogant, generally proclaimed act, which hail
been boasted of and repeated by the various organs
is the press and the pulpit of the adherents of the l'ope in
this country. What was under these circumstances re-
quired was, as some thought, a declaration, a proclamation
by the government —others considered the aggression
should be met by a declaration of parliament—and the go-
vernmcnt themselves thought it should be by a parlia-
mentary declaration in the shape of tai act of parliament,
carrying with it the concurrence of both houses of parlia-
ment and of the crown. (Hear, hear.) But whether they
decided upon the one or the other, what was really required
was a declaration aimed at the particular act which it was
intended to meet, reciting that act, and declarint
it to be void and illegal, and thereby also declaring
that if any foreign power issued or committed any
act pretending to sovereignty in these realms, such acts and
such pretensions were illegal and void, and that from the
morneut of such declaration by parliament, if not before,
such act or anything that might be done under its autho-
rity, ceased to have any legal effect in this country. But
then his hon. and learned friend said Very true, but you
have not declared that other rcscripts, bulls, or letters
apostolic which may hereafter be issued by the Pope of a
similar nature are equally void." (Hear, hear.) He
(Lord J. Russell) owned it appeared to him that in-
stead of strengthening the declaration by so extending it
they would really weaken it. (Hear, hear.) The hon. and
learned gentleman had commented very severely on the
terms of the first clause. It was true the government were
responsible for that clause in so far as that they had adopted
it. (Hear, hear.) The hon. and learned gentleman argued
that that clause was insufficient,inasmuch as it was confined
to the one rescript, but if on that account censure fell upon
the government it must fall much more heavily on
the honourable and learned member for Midhunt, who
bad proposed it in its present form, confining it to
the one rescript. (Heir, hear.) With regard to
the particular case of Ireland, he had always con-
tended that any bill of this nature introduced into par-
liament must affect del whole of the United Kingdom, last
at the same time he considered the circumstances

1 Ireland in regard to this act very different from
doss of this country. The present Pore, when he
was appointed, found that from some forty years
subsequent to the Reformation the I'ope had continued to
appoint archbishops and bishops in Ireland by the titles of
the ancient sees and he found that not more than 50years ago,
when Dr. Trov was appointed, he was styled by the lord
lieutenant of that day the Roman c itholic archbishop of
Dublin; and following the example of his predecessors, he
bad gone on appointing bishops and archbishops in that
country. In so doing he might have been acting against
the law, but that was a different matter from issuing letters
apostolic, parcelling out this realm of England into
new dioceses and archdioceses, and appointing persons
to rule over them in ecclesiastical affairs as bishops and
archbishops. (Hear, hear.) With respect to the Irish
bishoprics it was hardly to be expected that the Pope would
act differently from his predecessors, and that he would ab-
stain from appointing bishops as vac melee occurred, but
with regard to the rescript of 18-10, that was an aggression
he might easily have refrained from, and before issuing the
rescript he should have inquired whether or not it would be
offensive to the government and people of this country, and
whether it would not be exceeding the limits of respect duo
to a foreign power? (gear, hear.) Then the hon.
and learned gentleman turned to the enacting
parts of the bill, with respect to which he pro-
posed certain amendments. One of these, which had
already been discussed at some length, went to inflict a pe-
nalty of 1001. for putting in use any bull, rescript,or apostolic
letter, for forming a Roman catholic hierarchy in this coun-
try or constituting and appointing to sees. It appeared to
him (Lord J. Russell) that it would be wise to limit this
part of the bill to that which was already especially for-
bidden by the 10 Geo. IV., and to confine it to titles.
(Hear, hear.) The next amendment was perhaps of
more importance. The hon. and learned gentleman
proposed not that any person should be at liberty to
bring a suit and endeavour to recover the penalty of 1001.
against any person who might infringe the provisions of the
act, but that any person might apply to the Attorney-Ge-
neral for his consent, and having such consent might pur-
sue a suit against any party offending. Now with regard
M that question, it dad appear to him that the matter was
MR OR nearly ffecting the state that the state itself, or
Ilsase who represented the state, should be the parties to
sorry out the prosecution. Let them consider what was
the course in regard to a government prosecution in a
ease on which public interest was excited. In all
such cases there were four conditions which the govern-
ment should consider before instituting a state prosecution.
The first was, had the offence been committed ?—the
second, had they legal evidence of it ?—the third, were
they likely to obtain a verdict ?—end the fourth was,
would any public end be answered by the prosecution ?
Now with regard to the two first questions there was not a
week passed in which there were not libels published
which were offences against the laws, and on which evi-
dence to sustain a prosecution might not be obtained, but
in most of them they would find that though a judge
would pronounce the act charged to be • libel under the
law, the jury and the public would be likely to look on
the prosecution as an act of tyranny instituted
for the purpose of screening a corrupt government,
and the liberty of the press would be referred to and main-
tained, and the government would be defeated. Then came
the fourth question—the public end to be answered. It was
always a serious matter for the government to decide

For the amendment lB5
Against it
The announcement of the result was received with loud
cheers from the opposition benches.
Lord J. RUSSELL said he would not divide at that time
on the remaining amendments, but that he would take the
sense of the house upon them on the third reading.
Sir J. GRAHAM asked the noble lord if he intended to
have the bill reprinted, and when he would take the third
reading.
Lord J. RUSSELL said he had no objection to the bill
being reprinted. He intended to propose the third reading
on Friday next.
The amendments were then agreed to, and the bill as
amended was ordered to be reprinted and the third reading
wu fixed for Friday.
OATH OF ABJURATION (JEWS) BILL.
Lord J. RUSSELL said he would take the third reading
of this bill on Thursday.
SUPPLY.
The report oanszaliply, misoel
brought up and to.
C URT OF CHANCERY.
On the order of the day for the adjourned dente On MO-
don for an addrole to the crown,

estimates, w

whether or not any public advents's, would be derived The 80LICITOR-GENERAL stated that the Chancery
from a state prosecution. (Hear, hear.) If the Attorney- commission was not. he thought, in need of any addition to
General and the government acted as he supposed its numbers, but that it was pursuing a well-directed and
they would act, they would prosecute, if the case extensive course of investigation, and he hoped that it
was a proper one for a prosecution ; and, if they would enable him to place before the house a mass of
thought it was not, the Attorney-General would tefuse his valuable and practical information.
permission. The lion. and learned gentlemen's clause, Mr. E. ELLICE said that the lay world deriv.al very
therefore, would be useless. (Hear.) With regard to the little advantage from inquiries by professional men. Ile
offence which had been committed by a foreign power, it dwelt upon the iniquities and abuses of the Court of Chan-
was their duty to declare that that offence was eery (especially the masters' offices), and said that there was
against the law of this country, and thereby to an absolute denial of justice there. He could not conceive
vindicate the majesty of the throne and the why measures of reform which had been applied to other
freedom and independence of the nation. That they departments of the law could not be enforced in regard to
(the government) proposed to du by the preamble, with the Chancery, but he was quite certain that nothing would be
addition of the first clause. And they should by penalties done so long as the affair was left to the lawyers. The
prevent assumption of titles under the rescript, and that assistance of merchants and accountants ought to be in-
they did by the second clause. The hon. and learned gcn voiced for dealing with the purely commercial matters
fieman proposed to divide the house on the nature of the which formed so large a share of the business of the Court
first declaration, and to add another offence to that of the of Chancery.
assumption of titles. His opinion was, instead of strength- The MASTER of the ROLLS declared his willingness to
ening the bill by that change he would but divide romote any chancery reform which was really consistent
those who were the opponents of this aggression, with equity. But he did not think that accountants could
and thereby weaken the effect of the measure. deal with the complicated questions which made necessary
(Hear, hear.) On this it would be fur the house the majority of chancery suits. Misapprehension of the
to decide. They could not but have remarked—tor it was real character of the chancery suit frequently misled those
done significantly—the retirement from the house of the who, being practically unacquainted with it, expected it to
whole body of Roman catholic members who represented he terminated like an ordinary action at law. He dwelt
boroughs and counties in Ireland : it was done in an oisten- upon the reforms which he said had already been effected,
tatious manner, as it' those hon. members intended to take and added that many more were under consideration.
no part in the proceedings on this question. By their ab- After a few remarks from Mr. Co ItISTUPII
seine they must be considered as consenting parties to what- Mr. BETIIELL gave further details respecting the titan-
ever the - • of the house - decide, told if the eery business, and the improvements contemplated by the

, Mr. HENLEY, whom it was proposed to add to the com-
mission, urged the necessity of reforming this branch of our
judicature, and hoped that government would tuna their
attention speedily to the subject.
Mr. J. EVANS confirmed the statement of Mr. ELLICE,
that the great source of mischief was in the master's office.
Sir .1. GRAHAM told the house frankly that he was
weary of inquiry, and that on this subject they had inquired
too much. lie had for two sessions devoted a large portion
of his time to un inquiry before a committee of that house,
composed of some of the most distinguished lawyers. in
their report they were unanimous; iu fact they had pre-
sented two reports. The facts on which the committee had
reported were before the house two sessions, and yet nothing
had been done. This was a fatal omen. It showed how
fruitless reports and investigations were when the house
had not the spirit to act, and make improvements. The
noble lord at the head of the Treasury could not do better
than give effect to the recommendations of the committee.
If there was one abuse more patent than another it was
that with reference to the hour warrants, an abuse which
in Ireland had been abolished years ago. The masters,
moreover, went to their offices much later, and left them
much earlier, than the judges of the common law courts. If
the government would propose a great, extensile, and satis-
factory reform they might succeed in effecting it, even in
the present session of parliament, and with the consent of
both houses; and the profession itself ought to to anxious
to see a reformation brought about. (Hear, hear.)
Lord J. RUSSELL said he seas ready to admit that
many reforms ought to be made in the Court of Chancery.
At the same time, it was uo great encouragement to make
reforms when it would place complaints exactly as they
were before the reforms were made. Ile had made inquiries
and found that the suits set down at the beginning of the
term were heard before the end ; and the late Lord Cotten-
hum had intarrned him that at the termination of the term he
had asked whether there were any further appeals, and that
he was answered in the negative. Doubtless there was a
very considerable arrest at present in the Court of Chan-
cery; still, few would deny that it was far better conducted
now than it had been 15 or 20 years ago. The hour war-
rants, fur instance, had for some time past been set aside.
In a complicated state of society like that in England, it
would be impolitic to say that the existing system should at
once be set aside. The house must act in a right direction,
and on a proper foundation • and every plan of improvement
must be sifted,examined, and deliberately considered before
it was adopted. It was very easy to say that the whole sys-
tem ought to be put an end to. Let it be recollected that
there never was a country in which there was a more com-
plicated system of accounts, connected with land at home
and tramaetious abroad, than England ; and if they asked
him why matters of this kiwi should not be rolved by one
simple process, he would inquire of them why they didnot
explain the whole Notarial theory by one simple proposi
tion. (Hear, hear.) The system of keeping the
accounts at the war and naval offices could be
altered at the end of the year if they were
faulty, but the Court of Chancery hail uo such power. At
i the mine time there was no part of the business of the
Court of Chancery which appeared so much to require
amendment as the matter of complicated accounts. It was
one of those questions which ought to lie decided according
to the usual method in which men of business keep their
accounts; and when the Masters of Chancery had decided
questions of law and title they should say, with regard to
matters of account, " we have now laid down the principle's
of law applicable to this case, and you, as men of
business, must now look into these matters of account."
Ile thought that an amendment of that kind was very
much wanted, and be saw no obstacle that could he alleged
in the way of making it. (Hear, hear.) There were other
questions with which it would not be so easy to deal. As
to fees, on which it was said the bill was silent, he had
thought it right that the Lord Chancellor should have the
opportunity of looking at all those matters; his attention
had been called to them from the first day he held the
great seal; and he was really desirous of establishing such a
sat= wfro.usldtowoirikiewacinllofournttheorsu.,oitors.l.ll.eyheaadr already,ar
hear)—a proof that he was not opposed to reform in this
matter. l'ho office of the " chaff.wax," as the right hon.
bare. called him, hail been abolished. (Hear, hear.)
Sir J. GRAHAM—And his deputy ?
Lord J. RUSSELL—No, not the deputy. With regard
to the seven secretaries the number might be too many;
but it should be remembered that the Lord Chancellor
j was at the head of a great department, embracing a vast
variety of subjects; and with respect to lunacy and, other
matters it was necessary that he should have persons of
considerable ability and knowledge of the law. To the
motion of the hon. and learned gentleman (Mr. Stuart),
fur adding to the commission two persons not belonging to
the profession of the law, he had no objection if it were
thought that such appointment would be of utility. It
might be productive of some benefit to the public ; and it
was desirable also that some non-professional gentlemen—
though he did not envy them their task—(laughter)—
should get an insight into these technical details, which,
without a great deal of attention, it was very difficult to
understand, and which was certainly one of the obstacles
to reform in the Court of Chancery. As to any proceeding
in the present session, he thought that if, in the course of
the recess, the commission was enabled to make a report,
they might next session proceed effectually upon a matter
which, two centuries ago, had baffled the genius and sturdy
' wills of the reformers of Cromwell's time. (Hear.)
Mr. .1. ST I.:ART expressed his gratitude to the noble
lord for consenting to his proposal with regard to the ap-
pointment of two non-professional gentlemen on the coin-
: mission. The other part of his motion referred to hour-
: warrants,
Lord J. RUSSELL.—I do not object to that either.
The motion was then agreed to.
COURT OF CHANCERY AND JUDICIAL colt-
miTTEE (ANNUITY.)
After a few wards from Sirli. Wilmot:m[Bv, this report
was received,
SEQUESTRATION OF BENEFICES BILL.
On the motion for the second reading of this bill,
Sir G. GREY opposed it, on the ground that no reasons
had been shown for the bill. Ile moved that it be real a
second time that day six months.
Mr. FItEWEN said that the bill was one which ought to
be taken up by the government themselves. After this he
gave them notice that he would divide on every govern-
ment bill till the end of the session that was brought on
after 12 o'clock.
The gallery was then cleared for a division, but none
took place ; and it was understood that the bill had been
negatived.
An attempt was then made to count out the house, and
the gallery was again cleared ; but there being 10 mem-
bers present, the remaining orders were disposed of, and
the house adjourned at a few minutes before one o'clock.

ECCLESIASTICAL TITLES BlLL—Pairs on Sir F.
Thesiger's amendment: Mr. Clements against with Sir It.
Gore Booth fur; Mr. Lloyd Moityn against with Sir Wm.
Codrington for ; Sir R. F. Davie against with Mr. Brent-
ridge for; Mr. C. W. Grenfell against with Lord Edwin
Rill for.
Mr. Beaumont Coles was shut out and prevented
voting in favour of Mr. Roebuck's motion on the Danish

GREENWICH ELECTION-RETURN OF

ALDERMAN SALOMONS.

The following appeared in our second edition last
night:—
TII KEE O'CLOCK.
Salomon 1,901
Wire

Majority for Salomon+, 083.
CLOSE OF THE POLL.
Fora O'CLOCK.
Salomon
Wire
Majority fur Salomons, 897.
Alderman Salomona appearing on the hustings, was
received with loud cheers. He said that, although the of
result would not be announced until the morning (this
' day), he knew enough from the committees to know that
he had to thank them for electing him a representative for
their large and populous horough. Ile considered it no
small honour to have such a majority—nearly 900—the
largest, he believed, ever obtained by any member returned
for Greenwich. (Cheers.) He hoped to be able to realise
the most sanguine expectations of the electors.

LORD BROUOITAII AND " COURTS OF RECONCILE-
ifirer."—A somewhat singular return has just been printed
by order of the Rouse of Lords, on the motion of Lord
Brougham, showing for 20 years the great advantage which
it is stated has resulted from the cases treated by the Com-
missioners of the Courts of Reconcilement in Denmark. It
will be sufficient to give the result of the last year in the
return-1846. In that year 24,625 cases were undertaken.
16,068 were adjusted or stopped, 324 were postponed, 8,233
wtn referred to the liTf courts, and 2,761 were tne4,

gite erpregigs.

TO CORRESPONDENTS.

• liserad Mitten et" Tao Tawas," esstataras some evoshirs
• Gosette "Is pablimated every Tuesday sad Friday siglit. Is Use

be
Mew oerobrills Weeded Ax "Me Expnee," Landow Evening pew.
met be et the Ono% 10, bouveriwaines, by Two o'clock ow tbe
day of put/wide&

HIGH WATER AT LONDON BRIDGE.
Tina D4T—Monaag. 121 . saw Atianioan, lb. 1381.
To•nosion—Martina, lb. 4781. Annum. 1L bas.

LONDON, SATURDAY, JUNE 28.

THE soreness manifested by the protectionist
Organs whenever they have occasion to touch upon
the Industrial Exhibition is amusing. They cannot
repress their admiration of the building; they are
carried away by the gorgeous spectacle of the trea-
sures it contains; but as soon as they have time to
recollect themselves they fall to carping. The In-
dustrial Exhibition is not, it is true, a free-trade
bazaar; still it suggests the idea that every nation
has mouthing that it can do better than any other,
and that all nations would be wise to work in their
own peculiar line, and avail themselves of their
neighlieurs' assistance in other matters. Tho pro-
tectionist*, though gratified with the show, cannot
help bearing a grudge to the Exhibition for its silent,
unconseiowi contradiction of their pet dogmas.
Among other splenetic effusions on the part of our
protectionist brethren of the press, was their laboured
attempt to prove, some week or ten days back, that
in so fur as the anticipated resort of strangers to Lon-
don was concerned, and the anticipated profits of the
London tradesmen, the Exhibition was a failure.
Tho thronged state of all our great thoroughfares
daring the present week must surely have convinced
these gentlemen that their croaking was premature.
They belong, however, to a class remarkably tena-
cious of first impressions—. wax to receive, and
marble to retain "—and it will noways surprise us to
bearthem re-asserting the opinion that our numerous
Tinhorn bring no profit to London trade.
In arguing this point,thcy have evinced their usual
one-sided dexterity. They have gone the round of our
show haberdashery and millinery stores, and asked
theirowners whether their gains have been unwontedly
great this season. They have asked our showmen
of all kinds--from Her Majesty's Theatre to Vaux-
ball—whether they have lad crowded exhibitions.
They not only begun their inquiries too early: they
made them of precisely those classes who were least
likely to benefit by the influx of strangers. The great
show in Hyde-par.k must of necessity, from its no-
velty. east others into the shade, for a time at least.
And even our lady visitors come to see sights, not
to go a-shopping. Thanks to railways and other im-
provements in locomotion, our provincial belles find
almost as irresistible temptations in the silk, lace,
and ribbon line at their own doors as in the metro-
polis. They are case-hardened against the fine rai-
ment and ruinous bargains of London.
But an influx of strangers which has, even
at this curly period of the season, visibly aug-
mented the chronic crowding of London tho-
roughfaree, cannot but affect beneficially the
pockets of our London tradesmen. Already we
feel that they have diminished our elbow room.
Look to the crammed condition of every 'bus that
passes you. As for cabs, whole stands appear to be
permanently denuded of them, and the chances of
catching an empty cab passing are rare indeed. Now
all the strangers who thus thrust themselves uncere-
moniously into oar accustomed seats must sleep some-
where, must eat somewhere, must seek fur repairs of
the wear and tear of their garments somewhere.
Like Launcelot G01.b.), they must (at times) " eat,
and snore, and rend apparel out. The periodical
cravings of' nature must be assuaged, and even those
who bring a stock of clothing from home must em-
ploy the tailor occasionally. A great deal of money
is being distributed among our lodging-house
keepers, butchers, and bakers ; the market-
/faracners, and dairymen, and cattle-feeders,
or miles and miles around, are driving a
brisker trade. and those who are making
more money than usual arc in turn spending more
money than is their wont. Let our croakers ask in
autumn at the banker's, and the increased rapidity of
operations in the circulating medium during the half
year will convince them that in declaring no money
has come to our tradesmen front all this unwonted
bustle, they have been hallooing before the hounds
are out of the wood.
And after all, this money view of the
.question is
infinitely the least important. London is not only
more crowded, it is more gay than in customary
years. We do not use the word to designate a mere
increase of dissipation; we mean that the faces which
pass us in the street wear a more cheerful, a more
gladsome expression. Steady industry pursues its
wonted course, and vet men are more lively, more
prone to look upon the bright side of things. JOHN
BULL'S proverbial habit of grumbling and vexing
himself is 'intermitted for once. It is no trifling gain
to be shaken out of our habitual care and corking.
This, in fact, is the great practical benefit which
all redacting men have from the beginning antici-
pated from the Industrial Exhibition. They saw in
it a leverage sufficiently powerful to hoist men out
at their jog-trot routine, and they knew that, if this

could be accomplished, new ideas must crowd in upon
society, and new modes of action must in time fol-
low. They did not regard the Crystal Palace as a
mere museum for illustrating lectures by ex-members
of the defunct Society for the Diffusion of Useful
Knowledge. They estimated such pedantry at its
true worth. But they anticipated—and time will
yet justify their anticipations—results the exact
nature of which could not, and cannot, be foreseen,
by bringing men into contact with something entirely
new and surprising.

As a subdivision of parishes measure, the " Church
Building Acta Amendment Bill" is perfectly. worth-
less. it does not contain a single provision that
will actively promote the breaking up of our mew-
star parishes into separate, independent, and distinst
ecclesiastical districts, and divide amongst their in-
cumbents rateably the property belonging. to the
church in the parish. It does not put into the
hands of parochial officers, or inhabitants, the ma-
chinery whereby to originate such repartition ; it
does not enable the Church Building Commission to
carry out the wishes of a parish in that respect, when
authoritatively expressed; it leaves the general
law on that important subject just where it
found it—in a state of helpless confusion and
mischievous embarrassment. It is not, we repeat,.a
subdivision of parishes bill ; and that was what the
public had a right to expect from the persons who
had assumed the management and, of course, the
bility of that question.
It ought to be rejected on that ground alone ; for
it is idle and useless to go on fussing, and meddling
with and making, and marring all the petty details
of district churches ; when to some general and com-
prehensive scheme of parochial subdivision we must
come at last; seeing that by such small legislation
we are only creating difficulties, obstacles, interests,
and pretensions that are certain to be used in
their turn against the greater measure when it
arrives. On this general principle, then, it is fur
better to refuse to reject any minor bill ; for, by such
'refusal, the necessity for thorough legislation will be
greatly promoted. Small measures are the excuses
of small ministers for not attempting greater things.
The bill, bad in this its acts of omission, is, how-
ever, worse in its acts of commission. It is a delibe-
rate proposal to break and violate public faith ; to
place the pews of every church consecrated since
1800 at the mercy of the Church Building Commis-
sioners ; to restrict the number of free scats in new
churches to one-third of the total number; to make
the patronage of all such churches dependent
en the whim of the commission ; to de-
prive select vestries of the little power they
now have under the Church Building Acts ; to in-
crease the income of incumbents either by taxing
the poor or by driving them out of churches, and
taking in the rich in their stead, and to augment the
power of the bishops.
In every section their authority is swelled out ;
nothing has to be commenced without their leave
and license; nothing inquired into and investigated
except on their appointment ; nothing to be con-
cluded except with their consent. From first to last
every clause is be-bishopped. Now this was not so
in the bill as originally introduced into the Lords ;
there was, to be sure, even in it, a strong
sprinkling of episcopal authority, but no such aur-
as there is now. 'fake, for example, the
second section : it enables the commissioners (not the
churchwardens, who arc clearly the proper persons)
teerder a certain number of free scats to be espe-
cially appropriated to certain deserving poor inha-
bitants; and, in case of disputes as to such scats,
the bill originally proposed that the Archdeacon
should arrange them ; but as the clause comes down
to the Commons, "the same shall be decided summa-
rily by the Bishop of the diocese;" living, it may be,
some one hundred and filly miles off, and knowing
little or nothing of the circumstances of the district.
And this is now the spirit of all our church
legialation • it treats the working clergy as persons
of no discretion, judgment, trust, or responsi-
bility; it regards churchwardens with contempt ;
and as for the laity, their feelings or wishes, it does
not condescend to notice their existence. Thus, this
measure, after the bishops and the Church Building
Commissioners have for a quarter of a century been
exciting them to give sites, and to give money for
the building and endowment of new churches, on
condition that a certain number of the seats therein
should be free for ever, now proposes to place every
such free seat at the disposal of the commissioners,
without the consent, or assent, without even refer-
ence to those who really erected and founded the
church.
The folly of this seems to be quite on a par with
the injustice : for, if good faith be not kept in this
respect with those who in times past gave their
money to provide church room for the poor, what
secunty can those who may be hereafter inclined to
follow their example, and build other churches, have
that better faith will be kept with them? And if
no such security exist, who will hereafter subscribe?
If the episcopate violate their engagement, what con-
fidence can there be in man?
At present churches are usually built partly by •
grant from the Church Building Commissioners or
Society, partly by subscriptions; and the patronage is
either vested in the bi.,hop of the diocese, or in
the incumbent of the -benefice. The present
bill affects to be more liberal • it pretends
to vest such patronage in the lay founders or in trus-
tees to be appointed by them. But it is pretence
only. For all that it enacts is that the Church
'Building Commissioners may, with the bishop's con-
vent, and if they think fit, se vest the patronage.
But no body of men, under such clauses as it con-
tains, can build and endow a church wider its provi-
sions with any certainty that they will have its
patronage. Whether they get it or not will depend
first on the consent of the bishop (who, by his refusal,
will secure the patronage to himself), and that ob-
tained, then, on a secret conclave that will admit et
no access to their deliberations, and assign no reasons
for their decision. And to bad faith is added bad
po Inshort the objections to the bill are endless. It
will increase the patronage of the bishops, says Mr.
Hum& It will deprive the poor of their free seats,
Says SIR BENJAMIN HALL. It Will prevent men
from building and endowing new churches, con-
tends Mr. Nlowsrr. It will introduce into the
Church of England the worst feature of voluntaryism,
quietiv observes Mr. W. J. Fox. It is a bad bill
undoubtedly, remarks the sagacious Mr. Heater.
It is not my bill, replies Sir GEORGE GREY. Per-
haps Mr. SIDNif Brit? can tell us whose bill
it is.