The Express.
London, England, 1853-07-19 00:00:00

NATIONAL EDUCATION IN IRELAND.

TM sail of DO:WOO/1HOUR roes to call the attention
N the been to the present condition of the system of
aellesal education in Ireland, sad to move for • copy of the
reelleals lately adopted by the Board of National
Ichumnien excluding the we of certain books for
the wheels under their sanagensent; and to sok
whetbw, is consequeasse of such reedutioa, may sad
wad amber' have realgasi their sesta at the board
Is midi that is bringing &smut this abject, be did not
esunelate the opiate.- of say Indy or clue of me. The
spas had now Less hs igen*. for twenty yeseedcanag
bees originally Amid by Lord Derby, who demdbld it as
es an of mailed easalier and separate religions baron
tbs. It was net hiesded, however, that the rellgloue
etrastrta should be entirely seprened from the mass. as
wesevideme hen a Isnot of ish lertaiWe is Oseeher, 1831.
The guesting he virtu& to pat to au milk earl were
—tree, whether the reilltioas boobs, the yew • ex-
trade, and the 'climes of Christiaaity, telish• gri-
t dry Maud put of the origrtal eyeless of an
eleatien, led bun prohibited by a neela•
(theme heard ? and, timidly, whinber a neon ewe. pre-
lude Archbishop et Dublin) sad nee ether distin-
guished member of the heard had resigned their Nan in
aniegnease et that suelaties I The nest TIM Mkt.,
Gem he amesssumeat of the nubs, had certainly
been its peat supp derived for "*e gnat influence
which be so deservedly from his vast knowledge
sad his high pities la ths church had always been applied
for the IIISIMINI•11111 sag "Mention of the system of as-
timed deed's. lithe nod reverend prelate had resigned,
be apprehended that his pace's hopes meat have been dis-
=a ted, end that he bad found it impossible to stem the
of altassostane opinions which appeared to have
bronco ia upon the board. If that were so, he could not
but think the government bad considered it necessary to
revise the whoa system with a view to see whether some
other system might not be adopted for Ireland to meet the
views of all parties by removing the existing reetriodean
(Bear, bar.) The noble earl corcluded by noting lee a
copy of the resolution of the board.
The Earl of ABERDEEN said it was quit* a mistake to
appose that all the books had beenobjected to. The Scripture
lessons and the volume of sacred poetry still continued to be
used just as they always bad been. (Hear.) The only work in
question was the " Lemons on the Truth of Christianity,"
which had always been objected to by Rearm catholic' in-
terested in schools, and the board had now dessesdead so
longer to use it as • part of the joint educedca bat mites it
was read in schools to ass it as a part of the ammo Bali.
giros instruction. The united system bad conferred Woo
adaatage,
advantagee on the people of Ireland. Indeed, he (the Earl of
Aberdeen) dil not know anything that had ever brought such
blessings upon that country;—(cheers)—end notwithstand-
ing the differences to which be had referred, he still
trusted that nothing would take place to impair, or even to
p , the extension of a system hole which so much
good hail been derived and from which so much more might
be hoped. (Hear, hear.) He was sorry to my that he did
not perceive any great probability of an understanding being
arrived at with respect to those differences ; but the most
rev. prelate had not ceased to be a member of the board.
He bad had no communication with any other member of
that body, and therefore he was unable to answer the
question of the noble earl respecting them. Of mane there
mold not be the aliehtert obj.ction to the motion of the
noble earl; for the paper for which he asked wcoild, a. a
matter of course, have been laid in due time before par•
Dement. In conclusion, he had only te add that he (Lord
Aberdeen) saw nothing whatever is what had recently ft-
mimed to make him alter his opinion as to the value of the
eyelets, or his expectations of the ultimate success that
would attend it.

The Earl of LIARIi.OWDY inquired whether the fact
was nnt, that wherever the parents of any one child objected
to the nee of these books, the scripture eztncts were not
read in the school ?

The Earl of ABERDEEN replied that, under the Bth
rule, wherever the parents of any c,ald objected to the joint
study of any hook, such book was to be transferred to the
time for separate instruction. Recently, however. a
member of the beard, had moved and carried en alte-
ration of that rule, and the matter was now under a diffe-
rent regulstion.

Lord MONTEAGLE considered that to allow a single
parent not to withdraw his child from the study of any book
to which be objectvd but entirely to negative the use of that
book, was a proposition too monstrous to admit of defence.

The Earl of ABERDEEN—That was under the old
system, and that had always been the regulation from the
very first, until hat week, when an alteration.had been
muds which prohibi!ed a single child sir his parents from
cawing a book to be transhrred from the united to the
srperate instruction. The present state of the matter was
this—instead of the former erbi,rary rule, it was provided
that instead of the boa Was rejected on the complaint of

• child's parent, the child himself should be withdrawn
while the loy.k was being taught. (Cheers.)
Lord MONTEAGLE said that that was precisely what
he was contending for. With respect to the scripture ex-'
tracts, they had received the sanction of the highest Roman
catholic authorities, and had bean used is the model schools
at Dublin. They ware used in the schools with which he
(the noble lord) wee himself connected, and in all the best
regulated institutions of the kind in the kinglets.; and
their withdrawal would be • matter of thd greatest poesible
regret. (Hear, hear.)
The Earl of DERBY.—If the question had been, as
stated by the noble earl opposite, it was difficult to imagine
bow the right rev. prelate could have thought of retiring
from the boaro. But he (Lord Derby) was much afraid
that the noble earl was wholly mistaken in the effect which
he had attributed to the resolution ; and that so far front
its having been one of the purport stated by the noble earl, it
war one of a precisely opposite character. If the system was
now so altered u altogether to e eel ude all religions instruction
from Roman catholic children frequenting the achools,then he
said one of the great and paramount objects contemplated
by the original system would be defeated, and the system
would be justly open to that censure which he thought it
had not hitherto been open to, via., that it was exclusively
• secular system of education altogether disregarding
religious instruction as a matter of no moment or necessity.
He should be extremely glad to find that the noble earl's
was Ilse correct version of the ease ; they would see whether
the as so or not when the resolution itself was laid upon
the table of the house; but he would at once grant
to the noble earl opposite that the exclusion of the
book on the Evidence of Christianity was not of
itself a sufficient ground for breaking up the board,
but if the resolution in question would bear the sense
that it was intended to exclude still further anything
like religious instruction from the schools it would be fatal
to the object, as well as the beneficial effects of the system,
in such cane the protestant members of the board who could
not conscieotiou.ly assent to such a determination, would
not only be justified but bound to withdraw from • system
which, from the first depended for its success upon the
mutual and harmonious working of the members of the
different religions persuasions, and especially upon the
balance being impartially held between protestant and
Roman catholic. But if the protestant members of the
board were now to be outvoted, whatever respect or regard
he might have for the system, he should not hesitate in
coming to the conclusion that the basis upon which it was
originally founded had been broken.
The Earl of ABERDEEN must still adhere to his on
ginal statement—that the resolution did not preclude re-
ligious teaching in the schools.
The Earle( DERBY did not think so, but at all events
it was at direct variance with the principle of • combined
system of education. Ceder this resolution any child in
the school might object to the Scripture lessons being
read, and then it would not form part of the combined in-
struction which it was originally contemplated was to be
given in these schools. In point of fact, as the resolution
stood, the parent or guardian of any child had the power of
putting a veto upon the book being used in the ordinary
schools, and thus the beneficial ir Beene. of the system in •
religious point of view would be entirely destroyed.
The Estl of HARROWBY had been ignorant until now
that the parent or guardian of the child possessed the
power of objecting to the use of religions books, but cer-
tainly whether that had been the ease hitherto or not, this
resolution would bear such an interpretation as to give it to
him now. _ _

Lord MONTRAOLIC said he had never heard any sug-
gestion before now of the right of • parent or guar-
dians to object to a book in such a manner as to alter the
discipline in practice at a school, and he did not think such
an interpretation of the rule could be allowed to prevail
long.
Lord DONOUGHDIORE thought the resolution was
manifestly open to great objection, while he was afraid it
would give rise to great injustice. Suppose, for instance,
that there was a school entirely composed of protestanta
and protestant dissenters, under this resolution the Roman
catholic priest could get a child sent to the school in order
to prevent the Scripture 'struts being read during the
ordinary school hours, and it was perfectly plain that in the
end the whole system of a combined secular and religions
education would be set aside.
The motion was then agreed to.
PUBLIC-ROUSES (SCOTLAND) BILL.
The house then went into committee.
The bill then passed through committee, and was
reported to the house.

THE EXPRESS, TUESDAY EVENING, JULY 19, 1853.

1 mendatiems was limited to two, and this was the letter of
Capt. Richards, the superintendent of the Chatham yard.
(The right • honourable baronet then read a letter, to
the effect that both the parties recommended
were deserving, but giving the preference to Baines.)
The paragraph in the Morning Harald stated that the per-
sons recommended were Pattison and Baines. Those
were the two names, but the order in which they stood
was esaetly the reverse of that given. The recommenda-
tion was "Charles Baines, shipwright, or Thomas Pstti-
sen." (Rear, hear.) Re held in his hand the report of 1
the surveyor of the navy, on which the board acted, and
;it declared that the first of the men named was first in
order of merit and claim to be advanced. In consequence
of seeing the paragraph on Saturday, he consmunicated
with Captain Richards, the superintendent of the
1 Chatham Dockyard, and he would now read to the house
the answer to his inquiries. Captain Richards said :
; (The rightibon. baronet then read the letter,:in which Capt.
1 Richards declared that he placed Baines first because he
was the better man, and had had twenty•nine years' ser-
' Tice, while Pattison had had only twelve; and that their
leanings were, the writer heard, as described in
' the newspaper. It was added that Baines was
' forty-nine years of age arid Pattison tLirty• four.)
Now, there was a colour of truth in the statement which
appeared in the Morning Herald. It was true that Pat•
t son had been for some time employed at the mast-house,
and that Baines bad been only recently employed there.
The ezplaaation of the matter, however, was this. For
some time past, antecedently, he believed, to the appoint-
ment of the former Board of Admiralty, Pattison, having
a disease of the heart, had been allowed to work in the
mast-house, on aecount of the labour there being lighter
than on the dock side. On the other hand, Baines
was • hard working shipwright, older than the man who
had such indulgence shown him in being admitted into the
mast-house; and asthe reward of harder work, greater age,
longer service, better health, and greater fitness, he had
been preferred. (Hear, hear.)

SEIM:RR OF COSTA AT SMYRNA.
Sir J. WALMSLRY asked the noble lord the member for
whether he will

the City of London —...enicate to the
house any information with respect to the violation of the
Turkish territory by the captain of an Austrian ship of war,
who was reported to have seized an Hung irian refugee, resi•
dent in Smyrna, and to have carried him on hoard the Aus-
trian vessel without the concurrence of the Turkish autho-
rities ; and also whether it was true, as reported, that the
Austrian government had demanded the expulsion of all
Hungarian refugees from Turkey ?
Lord J. RUSSELL said—Sir, with regard to the first
question of the hon. gentleman, I have to state that it sp.
peen that when the Austrian government claimed the
surrender of certain refugees who were residing in Turkey
two or three years ago, there was among them a person
nameu Costa. The 'Turkish government did not agree to
surrender those refugees ; but it consented to send them
out of the territory of Turkey. Accordingly, among those
who left the territory of Turkey was a person of the name
of Costa. It was understood that he went to the United
States of America. He latel returned to Constantinople,
and he was afterwards at Smyrna. It appears further,
that the Austrian consul, instead of applying to the Turkish
authorities for adopting means for the remival of this per-
son. according to the agreement between the Austrian
and the Turkish governments, took steps for
seizing him and placing him on board an Aus-
trian ship of war. It is, at the same time,
stated, as I understand, by the Austrian consul, that he
did this with the consent of the Turkish governor at
Smyrna. On that point I have not any positive informa-
tion, but that statement has been made. With regard to
the second point, whether it is true that the Austrian go-
vernment has demanded the expulsion of all Hungarian re-
fuges' from Turkey, I beg to say that her Mojesty's go-
vernment have received no intelligence to that effect.
THE SITTINGS OF THE HOUSE.
Mr. H. DRUMMOND said, on the motion for the ad-
journment of the house on Friday next, he should put a
question to the noble lord the member for the City of
London, with the view of assertaining whether or not it
was possible to have the pabßeemonets made op to another
period of the year, in seder that parliament might not sit
during the winter, bat daring the summer ?

PRIVILEGE.
Mr. BRIGHT moved for a select committee to inquire
into the allegations contained in the petitions of certain
electors and iehahittusts of the city of Peterborough, which
were presented upon the Ist day of July, complaining of
the interference of the Earl Fitswilliam, s peer of the
realm, at the election in December lest, and at previous
elections of members to
city. Io moving ter this committee he should take up very
little time of the house, because he did not wish to create
controversy in the house with regard to this question. He
should confine himself to a few simple fates. It was painful
to him to appear in the position in some degree of accuser
of Lord Fitzwillisso for whose private character, and for
whose public character du, in many respects, he
had always entertained a very high regard ; but,
having had pieced in his bands a petition signed
by 219 eleeton of the borough of Peterborough, there being
not more than 600 in all, he felt that it was quite impossible
to refuse to mann iS me it would be impossible, he be-
lieved, for the house to refuse inquiry slier hearing the
statements which it contained. The petition referred to
the election which took place in July last at the general
election, and then to the election which took place in De-
cember consequent upon the death of the gentleman who
was returned to July. The petitioners stated that at both
the elections the Right Hon. Earl Fitzwilliam, through the
instrumentality of Misstate and servants, interfered for the
purpose of controlling the voters. Another allegation was that
the petitioners believed that the petition presented to that
hous against the return of one of the pres.nt sitting mem-
bers for the borough was not the petition of the perdu
whose assess were appended to it, but Earl Fitzwilliam,
and that the expense, incurred in prosecuting that petition
were defrayed by his lordship. They stated that Earl
interference would completely destroy the
independence of the city. They stated, further, that notices
to quit bad been served on all Lord Fitswilliasn's tenants
who had refused to vote for his lordship's nominee, and in
other cases when the tenants had voted against him, or
abstained from voting at all. They stated, also, that the
local interests of the borough were injured by its being repre-
sented by &nominee, as the representative was bound to study
the interests of his patron and not awe of his constituency.
in parliament. The petitioners, who were exceedingly
modest in their aspirations, thought that the time bad come
when they should have the 'election of one of their own
members, and they were perfectly willing that the nomi-
nation of the other should remain with Eul Fitzwilliam.
(Rear, hear.) He had also to state that another petition
had been presented to the house, signed by • large number
of ratepapen, who were not electors, praying that the house
would give its attention tie the prayer of the electors, and
give such relief u parliament in its wisdom might deem
expedient. The electors' petition declared that the exer-
cise of the franchise was calculated to inflict positive
injury upon those who ventured to vote against Lord
Fitswillians's candidate, as they became the object of the
most vindictive persecution ; while, on the other hand, if
they violated their consciences by supporting him, they out-
raysd their ova selfastenn,and sank in the opinion of their
fellow citizens. The petitioners were aware that it was • high
misdemeanour for • peer to interfere In the election of
members of the House of Commons, and they prated, there-
fore, that a select committee might be appointed to inquire
into the allegations of their petition, and also into the asser-
tion that the charges of the recent election petition bad been
defrayed by Earl Fimwilliam, and not by the ostensible
petitioners. The hon. member concluded by moving for •
"sleet committee. _

Mood—was left ati oast. for life with remainder to his son
in tail, a duty of 10 per cent. was first levied on the father,
and on the succession of the eon, perhaps in a very short
time, he would have aloe to pay 10 per cent. The case
would press particularly hard in the case of a provision for a
natural child, to whose son the estate would come in direct
succession. He moved, as • proviso, the following:—
" Provided always that-when • father is tenant for life of a
properly, and his son is either tenant for life, or tenant in
tail, fee, remainder, or reversion of the same property, con-
veyed to him by the same instrument, he shall be deemed a
lineal descendant, and pay duty accordingly."
The SOLICITOR-GENERAL said this came bad not
escaped the attention of the framers of the bill, but if the
principle of the bill was considered it would be found to be
no hardship. The hon. gen leman said that a successor in
such a cam ought not to pay duty according to the relation
in which he stands to the giver of the property, but ac-
cording to his relation to his father, the principle of the bill
was, that each person should pay according to the measure
of his interest and enjoyment, and as if it was • life annuity.
If an old man of 80 vs, left an estate with re-
mainder to his son who was 40, be would in the
first instance pay duty according to the measure of
enjoyment, perhaps one year or two, and when the
son succeeded his would also pay according to the
measure of his enjoyment also—were the amendment to
be admitted, it would cause great irregularity in the work-
ing of the bill. All the different relations of consanguinity
must be specially provided for, and the bill would be one
entirely of exemptions.
After a few words from Mr. Mumastem and Mr. MALMO,
urging the adoption of ,he amendment,
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said it
would be impossible to accede to the amendment, if only on
the ground that the hon. gentleman bad not laid down any
reason for this exemption without the necessity of others
being provided for. It seemed to apply only to the case of
illegitimate children while it raised the whole question of
the consanguinity scale, which this was not the time to dis-
cuss.

Biz J. PAKINOTON said that the amendment applied
to all bequceta to -^ in blood, with limitation to
•

, strangers
their desetiondants, and not as the right hon. hon. gentle-
man said, only to the case of illegitimate children. In
the cue of a stranger the property would be entailed en h;s
legitimate son, and he and all his successors would each
have to pay ten per cent. instead of nine per cent.
The house divided.
For the amendment lOO
Against it
Mr. FRESHFIELD then moved an amendment, the
effect of which was to alter the power of appointment in the
fourth clause.
The SOLICITOR-GENERAL complained that the hon.
and learned gentleman should at this stage re-raise a ques-
tion fully decided in committee; and, after some conversa-
tion, the amendment was withdrawn.
Some verbal amendments proposed by Mr. Fresbfield
and the Chancellor of the Exchequer, were agreed to on
clause 7.
On clause 23,
Sir J. PAKINOTON proposed the omission of words
with a view to doing away with the cumulative operation
of the tax, which, when small proprietors had to pry the
arrears of four yearo, would cause the greatest mischief,
amounting almost to confiscation.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER pointed out
that what the right hon. gentleman objected to had been
proposed as a great leniency to the landowner. The ques-
tion that this was a legitimate tax had already been de-
cided ; and that being so, it was a palpable benefit to the
landowner that in certain eases he should have a credit of
four or five years to pay the tax in. (Hear, hear.)
After setae farther discussion the amendment was nega-
tived.
Mr. MALINS proposed to leave out the whole of the
23rd clause. He considered that nothing could be more un-
reasonable than to tax ornamental timber, which the owner
did not cut.
The house divided:—
For the amendment " 77
Against it ll7-40
Mr. CAYLEY said as a general rule timber land was not
more valuable than arable or pasture land, while single
trees and did harm than good. He would,
•

hedgerows, _more _ ee.
therefore, move as an amendment that it should be at the
option of the successor to have timber estimated fer the
purposes of the act at the same ree as arable, pasture, or
other land of similar quality immediately adjoining.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER was sorry
that he could not consent to the insertion of the proposed
words, first because it would not be applicable to park tim-
ber, and secondly because it would create the greatest pos-
sible difficulty in the assessment of value. All ground of
objection was removed by the fact of the successor having
the option of either paying on the annual receipts or com-
muting.
The amendment was negatived without a division.
Sir J. PAKINOTON then moved an amendment, the
object of which was to prevent the bill from being retro-
spective. He could not allow this bill to be passed without
again recording his strong objection to what appeared tobim
the excessive injustice of adding to the burdens of property,
which was already over-taxed.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said the
reason why he had not spoken on the point referred to by
the hon. and learned gentleman of late was, that not in one
debate only, but in three or four debates, he had said every-
thing which it wee within the limits of his capacity to con-
ceive or to inflict on the house. (Hear, hear.) The hon.
and learned gentleman's question, whether he thought
this clause just; he had not the ).cast hesita
tion in replying that he thought it was just.
It was not, as the hon. and learned gentlemen supposed, the
principle of the bill that men. should pay duty merely on
that to which they actually succeeded, but that they should
pay it on that to which it was in their order, choice, and
option to succeed. (Hear, hear.) If a person anticipated
his succession by spending the fruits beforehand the re-
quirieg him to pay the duty was founded in general justice.
It was not desirable for the country that those who
had nominally 60,0001. a year, and had pledged 45,0001.,
should remain in imaginary possession of the whole estate.
The principle required by justice was that the succession
which had been anticipated should not be placed in a better
position than that which had been waited for until the legal
and proper time of enjoyment.
The house divided—
For the amendment 93
Against it
On the question that the bill do pus,
Mr. MALINS proposed amendments leaving out clause
23, and exempting " titles to land " Rein the operation of
clause 49. He considered the power taken unnecessary,
and likely to prove oppressive and offensive even to the
small freeholders.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said be had
already shown that the production of deeds was absolutely
necessary.
Sir C. BURRELL supported the amendment.
The house divided—
For the amendment llO
Against it
, A verbal amendment was made at the instance of Mr.
CRAUFVED.
On the question that " the bill do now pup," another
division was insisted upon by the opposition, the numbers
on which were—
' For the motion
Afainstit lO4-72
The bill then pulled, amid considerable cheering from
the ministerial side of the house.
INDIA BILL.
The house then went into committee on the India Bill.

—....
Mr. G. W. FITZWILLIAM, in seconding the motion, Clauses 16 to 22 were agreed to_- -- ----
thanked the honourable member for Manchester for the On clause 22, which refers to the appointment of legisla-
seamier in which he had brought it forward. He had tile councillors to be added to the Council of India for
merely stated the ease as it had been put into his hands, making laws and regulations, and empowers the Court of
and had not made anyeemmatsealeulated toexcitedisegree- Directors, if they should think it expedient, to add, under
able discussion. The aDeptioa cut merlons imputations the control of the government, two persons, having been
upon Lord Fitzwilliam, and he (Mr. Fitzwilliam) felt that ten years in the civil service, to the Legislative Council,
he should be acting unfairly, both to his noble relative and Mr. HUME said that before that motion was put he had
his constituents, did he not rise at once to second the an amendment to propose—namely, that of the councillors
proposition. (Hear, hear.) to be appointed one of them be a Hindu and the other a
Lord J. RUSSELL was quite ready to concur in the Mahomedan. Some person" thought that the natives had
motion before the house, but there remained the question of not conducted themselves so well in other situations that
time. (Hear, hear.) There was a very recent precedent, they should be appointed to the Legislative Council. He
that of Durham, in which a select committee was granted, differed very much from those persons, because when he
but not named for some time. The committee on the elec- was in India be was as well and faithfully served by natives
tion petition for Durham was named on the 2nd June, as ever he was in England. He believed that if a Hindoo
and on the 9th it made its report, and not un- and Mahomedsn were appointed it would tend to give cou-
ld the 14th was the other committee nominated. fiance to the natives of the country, and would prevent
There was this difference in the present case, that it did not those mistakes with respect to their customs and usages
I
refer to the recent election, but on the other band he did which led to so much =nand.
not see that it was any argument to say that the session Sir C. WOOD said that there wete two questions now for
was drawing auks close. If the house made a general consideration : the proposition of the hon. member for
rule that while an election petition was pending another Rochester, with regard to the number of the legialative
petition affecting the same constituency,. and complaining council ; and that of his bon. friend the member for Mon-
et undue influence, should not be considered, he thought true, who, in addition to the twelve members proposed by
that that general rule should not be infringed on account the bill, wished an addition of two natives. He agreed
of the period of the session. With respect to the motion with the hon. member for Rochester, that the government
itself he had no objection to offer. of India must be despotic, and that was the principle the
After some discussion,
The motion was put and agreed to. bill intended to carry out. As regarded the natives, he
SUCCESSION DUTY BILL. hoped that by increased education and intercourse with
Europeans, they would soon acquire their share in the
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER moved the
third reading of Ibis bill. government of India. The evidence before the committee,and
Mr. LIDDELL, who spoke amid a hum of voices which
eepecially that of Mr. Halliday, went to show that the
character of the native judges had greatly improved, and
rendered it impossible to gather more than the general per.
be bed not had the honour port of his remarks, the tenor of the whole of the evidence was, that the ap-
said that as I
rintment of natives to offices was increasing all over
of a seat in the house during the previous discussion on the ndia ; but that the time bad not come when they should
bill, be could not permit it to pass this, its final stage, with- be admitted into the Legislative Council. So far as out ezprewing his strong objection to it. He complained liming the good opinion of the natives, he did not think
conci-
that it was moot unjust towards the landed interest, upon that anything would be gained by putting two natives into
which the stamp duties on conveyances and other taxes the council. If the natives were not fitted for admission
already bore most severely; and that it would be unequal,
into the civil service, as the hon. member for Rochester
and consequently unfair, in its operation. That part of the said, were they fit for admission into the Legislative Count'
which effected trusts and trustees would occasion infi-
ml ? The evidence before the committee went te
ehis, that by
nits embarsamment and difficulty ; and then the inquieito. means of increased education the natives wer becoming
rial nature of the sax was a grouud for gravo objection. more fit for employment in important offices in the service
There would be the greatest difficulty in estimating the
--- I of the company , and in this he (Sir C. Wood) concurred ;
value of successions to mines, toll, arising from
rights of way, and property of that description, but it decided that whatever else they were fit for,they were
I not fit for the Legislative Couticil. With regard to the
winch varied in value according to circumstances.
The hon. ((cabman then urged that srgununte in favour number of the council all the evidence agreed in this,—that
there should be a council of twelve, including gentlemen
of the imposition of a succession duty became there was a from all the presidencies, which was an important and see
• legacy duty ought not to be allowed any great weight, as
they did not avail to enable Mr. Pitt to carry a mature for usury eddition. He did not think it would be wise to
• tax on succession, increase the number of the Executive Council, but it wouldsuccession, after he had carried the legacy duty;
and those duties were proposed at a time when the country be very advisable to have the information in the Legislative
Councilw hid/ gentlemenfrom all the presidencies eou Id atiard.
was in • position to require every available means to raise
A question had been raised whether it was advisable to the necessary supplies during a period of war, whereas this
vise the law commission in labs. He thought the best
re-
was a time of peace and prosperity, and it shoeld be the
coupe to proceed was as the Lill proposed. Ito did not
business of a Chancellor of the Exchequer rather to relieve
the country from odious taxation than to impose it. Alto-
think it advisable either to decrease or add to the numbers
gi•Cler the tax was so unjust that he could not resist the of the legislative council.
opportunity of lately stating his objections to it, and saying Lord STANLEY was as desirous as any one to see native
nu to the passing of the bill. talent admitted to the highest Oka in India, but he saw
The bill was then read a third time. great difficulty in doing it in the way proposed by Mr.
Mr. SPOONER rose to move a proviso to the second Hume.
clause, aid to call the attention of the Chancellor of the I Lord JOCELYN thought it desirable that the highest
Exchequer to a great hardship. If a person—a stranger in offices should be open to the satires, but could not concur

in the piopriety of pie* those appointments to the Go.
Term- 6 eneral.
The committee divided—
For the amendment 39
Against it
The amei dment was therefore lost.
Clause 22 was then agreed to.
On clause 23,
Mr. BRIGHT objected to proceeding further.
Sir C. WOOD said he only wished to proceed with the
clauses that were unopposed.
Mr. BRIGHT said if they were unopposed now they
would be unopposed afterwards.
Mr. HUME moved that the Chairman report proven.
He had been in the house since 12 o'clock.
The CHAIRMAN then reported progress, and obtained
leave to sit again on Thursday.
COLONIAL BISHOPS BILL.
This bill was read a second time.
LAND-TAX REDEMPTION BILL.
This bill was read a second time.
THAMES EMBANKMENT BILL.
On the order of the day for going into committee on this
bill,
Sir W. MOLESWORTH said he promised the hon.
member ler He nitan to make a statement with regard to
this bill. In 1813, the Royal Commissioners for Metropo-
litan Improvements, in their second and fifth reports
recommended that a new park should be formed
in Battersea fields, end that, in connection
with it a bridge should be built across the
Thames at Chelsea, and that a new street communicating
with Lower S:oane-street ehould be made on the embank-
ment from Vauxhall-bridge to Battersea-bridge, and along
that embankment a road was to be made about two miles
long. Inconsequence of this report, in 1816 two acts were
passed, one to make a park in Battersea-fields and the
other to empowr r the Commissioners of Works 4 make a
bridge at Chelsea. and to make an embankment from
Vauxhall to Battersea. For the making of the
bridge and the new street, the commissioners were
empowered to borrow 120,000/. from the Exchequer
Loan Commissioners, which was to be raid partly by Mena
of a general rate and partly by contributions from persons
whose property would thus be improved. Those contribu-
tions were not to be commenced till agreements, approved
of by the Treasury, had been entered into by the parties
whose property was to be improved. The time for making
those agreements would expire on the lot of August next,
and one object of the bill was to extend the time till
July next year. The bridge at Chelsea was in
process of construction, but the embankment bed
not been commenced, except a portion of it, which had been
commenc•d by an agreement with Mr. Cubitt. The esti-
mate for the bridge was 70,0001., and for the embankment
and new street 146.0001., making 216,000/. altogether. It
was expected that 62,0001. would be received partly from
persons whose property would be improved, and partly
from the resale of property along the embankment and the
new street. The neat expenditure therefore would be
154,000/.,in return for which it was expected there would be a
net Income from tolls on the bridge and from the piers
amounting to about 6,600/. a year, making a return of
about four per cent. on the outlay. The park of Bermes
would be comparatively of little use to the inhabitants on
the north bank of the Thames, unless there was a bridge at
Chelsea ; and the bridge would be of little use to it unless
approaches were made to it from the east and west, from
Vauxhall-bridge and Battersea ; and the embankment
and roadway would be of the greatest benefit to the public.
Mr.LOCKE said the observations he made the other night
were not to oppose this bill, but were of a more extensive
character, and intended to apply generally to schemes which
were brought forward without an estimate of the expeese.
The estimate in this case was 266,0001., but he wished to
know if the funds were forthcoming, oe if the parties having
property were to Lave this bill hanging over their heads
four years longer, alter being threateued with another bill
seven years.
Sir BE L. EVANS thought the observations of the hen.
gentleman were entitled to consideration. So far as this
bill went, it was unobjectionable, except as to the tolls
which he should propose to strike out.
Sir H. WILLOUGHBY observed that without tolls
they would not he able to get any revenue.
Sir J. V. SIIELLEY believed the inhabitants of the
metropolis generally would submit to an improvement rate
if the representative system were introduced, so as to have
a control over the expenditure.
The house then went into committee on the bill, and it
passed through committee without amendment.
Mr. HENLEY objected to the levying of a toll on the
bridge, which be said would be depriving the poor of thp
benefit of the park. (Cheers.)
HIGHWAY RATES BILL.
This bill was read a second time and ordered to be com-
mitted en Thursday.
TURNPIKE TRUSTS ARRANGEMENT BILL.
This bill was read a second time and ordered to be com-
Witted on Thursday.
TURNPIKE ACTS CONTINUANCE BILL.
The bill was read a second time and ordered to be com-
mitted on Thursday.
METROPOLITAN SEWERS ACTS CONTINUANCE
BILL.
On the order of the day fur the second reading of this
bill.
Sir J. V. SHELLEY said he understood it was only to
continue the committee for another year, otherwise he
should have objected to the bill
Lord PALMERSTON said next year he intended to
bring in a bill for the permanent continuance of the com-
mission, with en infusion of the representative principle.
(Hear, hear.)
After a few words from Mr. FREWEN,
The bill was read a second time, and ordered to be com-
mitted.
SHEEP, dec., CONTAGIOUS DISEASES PRE-
VENTION BILL.
This bill yes read a second time, and ordered to be
committed.
ASSISTANT JUDGE (MIDDLESEX SESSIONS)
BILL.
• On the motion for the third reading of this bill,
Mr. ALCOCK moved as an amendment that the bill be
read a, third time that day six months, as the people of
Surrey thought the judge was already paid most hand-
somely, considering the honourable position which the office
gave him. (Hear, hear.)
Sir DE L. EVANS was never more surprised in hie life
than when he heard of the introduction of this bill ; fir it
r would be in the recollection of the house that it was only a
, abort time ago that:he brought the conduct of this judge
under the notice of parliament with reference to the case
of Mary Hill, and then not all the adroit-
nese, and all the talent, and all ;the plea-
, Beatty of the noble lord at the head of the
Home Department could get rid of the bad impression
which the conduct of the learned gentleman created in the
minds of bon. members. (Hear, hear.) And yet within
three months after that occurrence the house was asked to
increase the learned gentleman's salary, thus as it were
, passing a vote of confidence in the judge and stultifying its
own previous decision. (Hear.) The eccentricities and
• peculiarities which characterised the administration of
justice in the learned judge's court were too well known
to need recapitulation ; but nevertheless there were one or
two instances of scenes in the court which he must be per-
mitted briefly to refer to. He held in his band• report of
, the proceedings in the Middlesex Court, wherein it was
stated that a person was brought before this gentleman to
be re-examined, and he told the accused that he was con-
vinced he was a thief, although there was no evidence
adduced against him, nor kad any trial taken place. (Hear,
hear.) Immediately another pnsoner was brought before
him, a woman who was not blessed with handsome features,
and the learned judge becoming jocular upon the villanous
character of her countenance, a juryman was induced to ask
whether the woman was to be tried according to her phy-
siognomy or according to the evidence. (A laugh.) Scenes
of this unseemly nature were constantly taking place in the
court over which this gentleman presided, and they did not
always partake of the ludicroue—since in two cases where
an acquittal had taken place the judge went the length of
pronouncing the parties to be guilty, in spite of the verdict
of the jury to the contrary. (Hear, hear.) Now he would
ask the house to add these eases to the medium instance of
the poor woman who had three years' transportation clapped
on to her sentence for simply using an offensive expres-
sion,and then tosay whether they could with common decency
pass this bill / There was, however, another ease to which
he must call attention in the hope that the noble lord at the
head of the home department would be enabled to give
some satisfactory account of it to the house. It might be
entirely unfounded, for aught that he knew to the contrary,
but at the same time it was to be found in the published
reports of the trials of this gentleman's court, and lie
should treat it as a fact unless it was contradicted by the
noble lord. It occurred on the 22nd of June, 1832, and
was the case of a man named James, who was charged with
having stolen a purse containing 11. Is. 6d. For this, en
beingfound guilty, he was sentenced to ten years' transpor-
tation.
Lord PALMERSTON was sorry to interrupt the hon.
member, but he found that an understanding had been
come to with an hon. baronet opposite, that this bill should
not be discuesed until Thursday. It would perhaps be con-
venient, therefore, if the debate was adjourned until then.
(Cries of' " No, no," and " Oo on.")
Sir D. L. EVANS said he could not consent to this delay
without conclueing the only other statement of importance
that he had to make with reference to this bill. (Hear,
hear.) Well, then, this man was said to have been sentenced
to ten years' transportation. Certainly a very severe
punishment, considering the insignificant nature of the
offence, and upon Inuring the sentence the man, who was
of a rather violent temper, somewhat alter the manner of
Mary Hill, let fly a penny ink-bottle at the judge—(a
laugh) —who thereupon, without any trial whatever, or
hwiimt n ;sou t
five
goingvey .. b
arst.ru ug
additionalh anytil
ae
:Bpi proceedings,rt.tion.
u e r, sentenced
hear.)
He would say no more at present upon this to him painful
topic, but before this bill passed, he begged the
noble lord to inform the house whether what he had stated
was a fact oe net. (Hear, hear.)
weared—
F Lir the third reading .
divSitdread, ngwershewnetiheerteLean ordered to withdraw, sad the house
Against it
The bill was cone, quently thrown out.
BURIAL OROUNDS• Lord PALMERSTON moved fo re:
to authorise the clueing of burial gre. •it
vl: i
LLATT,
u reply to a question from Mr. A..
Lad PALMERSTON said the oho Oct of the sca
t
visions contained in the met of last yearvii
ow bringns tn a bill
, - i leaving t to
the Secretary of State to close churchyards,
the parishes to make provision for burial. hi in
and Leave was then given, and the bill was broug
:e.tirvoiopgolirs
power
erprrt o
simply to Extend to districts beyond the ca-
simply
read a first Lime.

FACTORY BILL.
Lord FALMEItSTON obtained leave to bring in a
bill
M limit the hours of ',ploys's, of children I n factories.
Lou„ Laving bees given, the bill was brought in and
rad • tirst Urge,
'lts how, &arena at twenty minutes to 2.

rAins ON SUCCESSION TAX BILL.
rua. AOAINIIT.
Mr Wm. brows. Mr.O. Start.
Mr. Uriind. Mr. Wynn.
Mr lhompson (Aberdeen.) Sir F. Thesiger.
ts-i Cynic. Mr. Knight.
Mr, Slug/ante. Sir Wm. Codrington.
Mr. Beard, Sir GI one Welby.
Mr Rich. Lord Wm. Graham.
Plr. Dubow. Mr. Corry.
Mr Elliot. Mr. T. Baring.
mr. C. Scrope. Mr. G. Dar du,
Mr. Enact. Dlr. Fellowes.
Cu:. Feel. Lord Malley.
Sir Rub. rt Frier. Mr. E. Vivian.
MW r• in. Mr. Cairns.
rAt...—Mr. Bennet paired off in f f Mr. Ball's
gietim on tho malt duties on Tuesday lut with Ur.
gli.ccr Gillum; Mr. Mundy paired in favour of Mr.
glislios's Iwendment on the timber clause is the Sue-
ess.iu Duties Bill with Mr. Hastings Russell ; Hon. A.
FJrevaby and Lind R. Grosvenor for government, with
CJI :art Illiir and Mr. Knigtaley against, from 8 tiil 10 last
~,,,,,gg. The Hun. U. llyng has paired with Sir Geo.
Fester from July IS for the remainder of the erasion.

gtit exa3rtsfs•