| [01:31] <ryanakca> mdke: d'you have write access to the wiki themes? bug 253931 has been dragging around for three months... | |
| [01:31] <ubot3> Malone bug 253931 in kubuntu-website "Documentation tab on http://wiki.kubuntu.org/ should be removed" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/253931 | |
| [03:10] <pufuwozu> I really like the http://ubuntu.com/ animations | |
| [06:54] <mdke> ryanakca: no, sorry | |
| [11:59] <tuxice> mpt? | |
| [13:55] <ryanakca> mdke: thanks anyways :) | |
| [13:56] <ryanakca> could you take care of bug 253931 and bug 255390 please? | |
| [13:56] <ryanakca> newz2000: ^^ | |
| [13:56] <ubot3> Malone bug 253931 in kubuntu-website "Documentation tab on http://wiki.kubuntu.org/ should be removed" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/253931 | |
| [13:56] <ubot3> ryanakca: Error: Could not parse data returned by Malone: The read operation timed out | |
| [13:57] <newz2000> hey ryanakca, sorry I missed what was above, you'd like me to make a change to the wiki theme? | |
| [13:57] <ryanakca> newz2000: please :) | |
| [13:58] <ryanakca> same bugs I emailed you about a few months ago :) | |
| [13:58] * newz2000 hides in shame | |
| [13:58] <newz2000> let me see if I still have edit permission on the wiki | |
| [13:59] <ryanakca> thanks :) | |
| [14:00] <newz2000> it's not looking good, I might need to file an RT to find out how todo this | |
| [14:01] <ryanakca> Ok, thanks | |
| [15:54] <qense> hello | |
| [17:49] <Turl> newz2000, are you there? | |
| [17:49] <newz2000> hey Turl | |
| [17:49] <newz2000> I'm here | |
| [17:49] <Turl> please, don't put me in a compromise :p | |
| [17:49] <newz2000> what do you mean? | |
| [17:50] <Turl> I received a mail from Kat | |
| [17:50] <newz2000> oh, she's the one I said was so appreciative | |
| [17:50] <Turl> she offered me some merchandise as a token of gratitude | |
| [17:51] <newz2000> Wow, that's nice | |
| [17:51] <newz2000> is there something wrong with that? | |
| [17:51] <Turl> but I don't want to accept it, I don't think it's necessary nor I (I don't know the english word for it) "merecer" it | |
| [17:52] <newz2000> That's fine, there's no shame in saying, "no thanks." I think it's noble. | |
| [17:52] <Turl> ok then :) | |
| [17:52] <Turl> I don't know how to write a "no thanks" letter, but I'll try to do my best :p | |
| [17:54] <newz2000> so you're in Argentina, are you by chance in Beunos Aries? (sorry if I misspelled that) | |
| [17:55] <Turl> nope, not in Buenos Aires | |
| [17:56] <Turl> do you have offices there btw? | |
| [17:56] <newz2000> not quite, there are four people from Canonical there, including one of my favourite web hackers in the company | |
| [17:57] <Turl> :) | |
| [17:57] <Turl> I used to live in BA | |
| [17:57] <Turl> not in the capital city though | |
| [19:08] <mdomsch> greetings | |
| [19:08] <mdomsch> various fedora folks sent me here after there was some interest expressed in mirrormanager | |
| [19:09] <mdomsch> I'm on IRC a good bit, so feel free to grab me anytime to discuss | |
| [19:09] <mdomsch> I'd love for Ubuntu to make use of MM as a download redirector for ISOs | |
| [19:10] <mdomsch> apt doesn't (presently) handle HTTP 30x redirects (seemingly by design) so it'd be harder to use MM to serve as an apt.sources.d/ entry | |
| [19:11] <mdomsch> apt/sources.list.d/ that is | |
| [19:13] <mdomsch> if apt grew the ability to retrieve a list of sources (e.g. a mirrorlist), then MM could easily provide such a list to clients on request. | |
| [19:19] <newz2000> mdomsch: thanks for stopping in | |
| [19:19] <newz2000> I'm very interested in investigating it. I've scheduled some time to meet with the IS team (our infrastructure guys) later on this year to work out possible solutions. | |
| [19:19] <newz2000> We're not quite ready yet but it's something we're starting to think about | |
| [19:20] <mdomsch> newz2000, ok, poke me if you have questions | |
| [19:21] <newz2000> cool, I will | |
| [19:21] <mdomsch> the only real PITA thing about MM is that it needs (at least r/o) access to a copy of the "master" content, however you want to define that | |
| [19:21] <mdomsch> to know what remote mirrors should have | |
| [19:21] <newz2000> oh, interesting | |
| [19:21] <newz2000> we actually have something like that now built into launchpad | |
| [19:22] <newz2000> it probes the mirrors continuously to see that they're up to date | |
| [19:22] <newz2000> and it drops mirrors and brings them back up as appropriate | |
| [19:22] <mdomsch> yep, MM does exactly taht | |
| [19:22] <newz2000> my interest is in making it easier for people to get CDs | |
| [19:22] <newz2000> I feel there are too many choices on the website | |
| [19:23] <newz2000> I love mozilla's. They have everything filled out in advance so if you want the sane option you just click the big button | |
| [19:23] <mdomsch> fedora is moving in that direction too | |
| [19:23] <mdomsch> moving all the advanced user options to another page | |
| [19:24] <mdomsch> bittorrent, various spins, manual mirror selection, ... | |
| [19:24] <newz2000> the manual mirror selection is my next target | |
| [19:24] <mdomsch> metalinks | |
| [19:24] <newz2000> it's challenging because we have a very technical culture and we like to see technical stuff. :-) You know how it is I'm sure. | |
| [19:26] <newz2000> mdomsch: so do you have rules for challenging locales, for example country X has no mirror and has poor international bandwidth unless it goes through Y | |
| [19:26] <mdomsch> yes | |
| [19:26] <newz2000> very interesting | |
| [19:27] <mdomsch> only a few times we use it though | |
| [19:27] <mdomsch> for example, per GeoIP, Israel is part of Asia | |
| [19:27] <mdomsch> but it's connectivity is to Europe | |
| [19:27] <mdomsch> so, we "move" Israel into the Europe continent list | |
| [19:28] <mdomsch> basic algorithm is | |
| [19:28] <mdomsch> 1) do you have a mirror on your local network (IP block)? If so, use it | |
| [19:28] <mdomsch> 2) do you have a mirror in your country? If so, use it. | |
| [19:28] <mdomsch> 3) do you have a mirror on your continent? | |
| [19:28] <mdomsch> 4) use a mirror from the global list | |
| [19:29] <mdomsch> for each answer above, randomly return one, weighted by the bandwidth that server has | |
| [19:30] <newz2000> That's about what I'd worked out | |
| [19:30] <newz2000> For a while I tested some ajax based javascript that pre-selected an option using similar rules | |
| [19:30] <newz2000> someone convinced me the rules were way too complex though | |
| [19:31] <newz2000> as in my rules weren't complex enough for reality | |
| [19:31] <mdomsch> 1b) are you a client on Internet2 or another high-speed research/education network? Try a mirror in your country on same | |
| [19:32] <mdomsch> so students at universities and big labs get their bits over I2 | |
| [19:32] <mdomsch> NCREN, RedIRIS, NLR, ... | |
| [19:33] <newz2000> mdomsch: so are you a web guy? | |
| [19:33] <mdomsch> how so? | |
| [19:33] <mdomsch> HTML/CSS, no | |
| [19:33] <mdomsch> JavaScript, no | |
| [19:34] <mdomsch> (my pages aren't very pretty, and what's there I had help with from graphic artists) | |
| [19:34] <mdomsch> http://mirrors.fedoraproject.org/ | |
| [19:34] <newz2000> I was thinking more along the lines of "interested in the user experience" | |
| [19:37] <newz2000> I like your system. I like that disk image has a single url. | |
| [19:37] <mdomsch> yeah, there are things like that I care a lot about | |
| [19:37] <mdomsch> but artwork - I'm lousy at | |
| [19:38] <newz2000> me too | |
| [19:38] <newz2000> mdomsch: where in the world are you located? | |
| [19:38] <mdomsch> now note - the single URL trick works great, but hitting it you get a HTTP 30x redirect to one of the mirrors | |
| [19:38] <mdomsch> Austin, TX | |
| [19:38] <mdomsch> so your client app has to handle redirects - apt doesn't | |
| [19:39] <newz2000> well, the part I'm interested in is downloading CD images | |
| [19:39] <mdomsch> all download tools I know of handle redirects | |
| [19:39] <mdomsch> browsers, wget, curl, ... | |
| [19:39] <newz2000> indeed | |
| [19:40] <newz2000> I'm in Des Moines Iowa, due north from you. A fellow "central time zone" person | |
| [19:41] * mdomsch grew up in KC | |
| [19:42] <mdomsch> I've been through Des Moines a lot going to MN | |
| [19:42] <newz2000> it's a small world ;-) | |
| [20:00] <ryanakca> newz2000: you still redoing the layout of the download page? | |
| [20:01] <newz2000> my download page or yours? | |
| [20:01] <ryanakca> newz2000: well, both... you had sent me a penned out mockup and asked for my opinion on it... that one? | |
| [20:02] <newz2000> yes, the ubuntu.com one is done, I did not finish the kubuntu one in time | |
| [20:02] <ryanakca> If you change yours, I'll almost surely change mine so that it matches | |
| [20:02] <newz2000> you should check it out, also I blogged about it | |
| [20:02] <newz2000> http://www.bearfruit.org/blog/2008/10/30/the-new-ubuntu-download-page | |
| [20:03] <newz2000> Yours is easier because you only have two versions (no server) | |
| [20:03] <newz2000> did you see the usability test results on the mailing list from Erik (sent yesterday)? | |
| [20:03] <newz2000> very thought provoking feedback | |
| [20:04] * ryanakca has fallen behind on *buntu stuff over the past two weeks, need to catch up | |
| [20:04] * ryanakca fires up mutt | |
| [20:11] <ryanakca> newz2000: I still think you should apply to Ubuntu Members btw :) | |
| [20:11] <newz2000> yes, I should | |
| [20:11] <newz2000> are you an ubuntu member? | |
| [20:12] <ryanakca> newz2000: yes, through kubuntu-members | |
| [20:13] <newz2000> you could blog about my blog post and also about Erik's usability testing. https://lists.canonical.com/archives/ubuntu-website/2008-October/000475.html | |
| [20:13] <newz2000> it would be interesting to hear broader feedback | |
| [20:13] <newz2000> ah, too bad the formatting of that message was poor | |
| [20:13] <ryanakca> *nods*, will do. | |
| [20:17] * ryanakca thinks he'll also try to steal mdke's sweet wiki theme and change the colors to suit Kubuntu some time soon, if it hasn't been done already | |
| [20:18] <newz2000> I don't think it's been done | |
| [20:20] <ryanakca> Erik's thread is quite interesting | |
| [20:21] * ryanakca needs to fix the drupal theme too... it doesn't look it's best in IE6... | |
| [20:21] <ryanakca> anyways, bbiab | |
| [20:21] <newz2000> ttyl | |
| [20:23] <newz2000> wow, pidgin is crashing on me a lot lately | |
| [20:48] <Turl> it used to crash more often in intrepid alphas :p | |
| [20:49] <newz2000> well, improvement is good I guess | |
| [20:50] <Turl> yeah | |
| [20:50] * Turl tries to set up sendmail | |
| [20:51] <newz2000> yuck, why sendmail? | |
| [20:51] <Turl> erm, it's the best? postfix was too difficult and complicated :p | |
| [20:51] <Turl> also, sendmail works in php afaik | |
| [20:52] <newz2000> they all work with php. postfix and exim are both sendmail compatible | |
| [20:52] <Turl> qmail? | |
| [20:52] <newz2000> I've never used it. When I evaluated it a while back it was non-free | |
| [20:52] <newz2000> (don't know if it is now or not) | |
| [20:52] <Turl> what one would you recommend then? I'm on a debian etch box | |
| [20:53] <newz2000> exim is one of the simplest, but my fav is postfix. | |
| [20:53] <newz2000> sendmail is a major chore to reconfigure with it's m4 files and etc. | |
| [20:53] <Turl> postfix is a pain in the neck :p | |
| [20:53] <newz2000> well, for most tasks postfix installation asks you what type of configuration you want. You choose from a list of about four options and you're done. | |
| [20:54] <Turl> erm, no user login, no tls, ... | |
| [20:54] <newz2000> well, if you get frustrated with sendmail then maybe try exim. It is probably the simplest out there. | |
| [20:55] <Turl> I just need something simple, php compatible that works with vBulletin and it's easy to configure and (not obligation) has a webmin module | |
| [20:55] <Turl> and sends mail (no need to receive) | |
| [20:55] <newz2000> ah, if you're using webmin then sendmail will be OK since it hides the gory details | |
| [20:57] <newz2000> I'm running windows in a virtual machine (for web testing) and I think it's locked up and taken one of my virtual desktops with it. :-/ | |
| [20:57] <Turl> :p using seamless aren't you? | |
| [20:57] <newz2000> yes | |
| [20:58] <Turl> press host key + s | |
| [20:58] <Turl> iirc it should make windows a window :p | |
| [20:58] * newz2000 tries | |
| [20:59] <newz2000> its really frozen. The only thing that works is blindly clicking until you hit the workspace picker applet to get to a diff desktop | |
| [21:01] <Turl> hostk + f ? | |
| [21:01] <newz2000> I don't think the window is responding to any keyboard shortcuts. | |
| [21:01] <Turl> if it doesn't work then the best solution is change desktop, run a console, sudo htop and kill all those virtualboxes | |
| [21:02] <newz2000> ah | |
| [21:02] <newz2000> computer is happy now. ;-) | |
| [21:03] <Turl> beware your windows might break :p (well, there's always the possibility heh, even if idle) | |
| [21:04] <Turl> :/ webmin crashed or sth :S | |