2008/05/02/#edubuntu.txt

[00:00] <growlyae> some brazilian here ?
[00:41] <msaul> I have a question regarding Server Edition Hardy Heron...
[00:41] <msaul> In previous version it ran automatically in X-Windows...
[00:42] <msaul> This version, it doesn't, is this to increase performance?
[00:42] <msaul> In this case, is the idea to log in graphically to perform
[00:42] <LaserJock> msaul: how do you mean?
[00:42] <msaul> When I installed desktop - full graphical
[00:42] <msaul> When I wiped system and installed server, it is just text based
[00:43] <msaul> No graphics
[00:43] <msaul> It mentions this in documentation as difference
[00:43] <LaserJock> servers generally don't have graphical programs on them
[00:43] <msaul> between 8.04 desktop and server versions...
[00:43] <msaul> Can LTSP be run on desktop version?
[00:43] <LaserJock> sure
[00:44] <msaul> So I could install just desktop versions
[00:44] <LaserJock> well
[00:44] <msaul> and it has LTSP automatically installed?
[00:44] <LaserJock> first tell me what you're trying to do
[00:44] <msaul> Setting up lab with 15 thin clients
[00:44] <msaul> Already did over 3 years
[00:45] <msaul> with high schools with 5.10, 6.04, 6.10 and 7.10
[00:45] <msaul> Liked the automatic install of LTSP
[00:45] <msaul> so I could connect
[00:45] <LaserJock> ok
[00:45] <msaul> to thin clients with PXE 2.0 nic cards
[00:45] <LaserJock> so you want to get the Ubuntu Alternate CD
[00:46] <msaul> i.e. kiss principle
[00:46] <msaul> I can understand if server version is more efficient
[00:46] <LaserJock> no, it's not really about that
[00:47] <LaserJock> there's only one CD that will automatically install LTSP for you
[00:47] <msaul> Is that the server edition?
[00:47] <LaserJock> no
[00:47] <LaserJock> the Ubuntu Alternate CD
[00:47] <msaul> I saw that, but was confused ...
[00:48] <msaul> wasn't intuitive to me...
[00:48] <msaul> when selecting download path...
[00:48] <LaserJock> check out https://wiki.edubuntu.org/HardyClassroomServer
[00:48] <msaul> Thanks, I will do that, and burn that CD...
[00:48] <LaserJock> The server edition won't work because LTSP is a desktop server
[00:48] <LaserJock> so it needs all the desktop packages
[00:49] <msaul> OK
[00:49] <msaul> I will check out your link and save for future reference....
[00:49] <msaul> Thanks
[00:49] <LaserJock> no problem
[00:52] <riched_> ping ogra
[00:53] <LaserJock> riched_: is that you?
[00:53] <riched_> hi LaserJock
[00:53] <riched_> on the classmate ... my notenbook s dinged :(
[00:54] <ogra> oh, what did you do to it ?
[00:54] <riched_> ever seen this before ? system boots okay ... get gui login
[00:54] <riched_> accepts user / pass
[00:54] <riched_> tt1 shows up for 1 sec
[00:54] <riched_> screen blanks
[00:54] <riched_> back to login
[00:54] <riched_> infinite cycle
[00:54] <riched_> ???
[00:55] <ogra> hmm, no
[00:55] <ogra> thats your lappie ?
[00:55] <riched_> if i give incorrect credentials ... it tells me ...
[00:56] <ogra> sounds like an X server issue
[00:56] <riched_> so my login in is correct
[00:56] <riched_> yep my HP
[00:56] <ogra> did you do an upgrade ?
[00:56] <riched_> what command line util can i run to correct / diagnose
[00:57] <riched_> nope ... did not upgrade ... am doing so over weekend
[00:57] <ogra> get me your /var/log/Xorg.0.log
[00:58] <ogra> and .xsession-errors from your homedir
[00:58]  * riched_ tries that ... hang on
[01:00] <riched_> no .xsession-erros
[01:00] <riched_> no .xsession-errors file
[01:00] <ogra> weird
[01:01] <ogra> that gets created if your gnome session starts
[01:01] <ogra> so it dies before
[01:01] <ogra> which indicates even more its an X prob
[01:01] <ogra> but its strange that you have a login manager then
[01:02] <ogra> did you try to select a different session ?
[01:04] <riched_> how do i output a file contents from the command line ?
[01:04] <riched_> grep ?
[01:04] <ogra> cat or less
[01:05] <riched_> triedn default gnome
[01:05] <riched_> same damn thing
[01:05] <ogra> try failsafe Xterm
[01:06] <ogra> then run gnome-session in there
[01:06] <ogra> and see if you get any error
[01:06] <riched_> tried failsafe gnome ... GDM filespace error
[01:06] <ogra> aha
[01:06] <riched_> that's the prob
[01:06] <ogra> smells like a full disk
[01:06] <riched_> suspected that
[01:06] <riched_> me goes to do some culling
[01:06] <ogra> empty your evolution trash
[01:07]  * ogra usually forgets about that and often finds several 100M to make room 
[01:08] <ogra> did yu recently install any updates ? sudo apt-get clean could then already save your butt
[01:09]  * LaserJock has been grading lab reports for hours
[01:09] <LaserJock> man my brain is fried
[01:09] <ogra> with a laser ?
[01:10] <riched_> how do i see free space from command line /
[01:10] <ogra> df -h
[01:12] <LaserJock> ogra: no lasers today
[01:16] <riched_> it
[01:16] <riched_> iws
[01:16] <riched_> bah  ... small kbd big fingers tired brain
[01:16] <riched_> it is alive again ... ;0
[01:17]  * riched_ can now go to bed without a morning panic :)
[01:17] <riched_> thanks fellows
[01:17] <riched_> sleep well ogra
[01:18] <ogra> you too
[01:18] <riched_> have a nice day LaserJock ... less acid dude ... no more brain frying
[01:18] <ogra> i'll go on to do some merges, intrpid just opened
[01:18] <riched_> bye
[01:35] <LaserJock> ogra: wow, gcompris is up-to-date. I thought for sure we'd need a merging :-)
[01:35] <ogra> heh
[01:36] <ogra> i only have four pkgs on the list
[01:36] <LaserJock> I don't have any in Main
[01:36] <LaserJock> 2 in Universe
[01:36] <ogra> lenny is keeping debian from doing updates i guess
[01:36] <LaserJock> that may be it yeah
[01:36] <ogra> i know vagrant is *very* cautious to do any updates
[01:37] <LaserJock> or maybe we did a better job in Hardy of keeping up-to-date :-)
[01:37] <ogra> even though he doesnt belive lenny will happen before dec
[01:37] <LaserJock> my bet is on lenny ;-)
[01:37] <ogra> yeah
[01:38] <LaserJock> well, I go with the release date and then add ~ 6 months
[01:38] <ogra> heh
=== johnny8 is now known as johnny_
[01:38] <ogra> i said feb :)
[01:38] <johnny_> uggh
[01:38] <johnny_> is flash broken on amd64 again?
[01:38]  * LaserJock cries
[01:39] <LaserJock> johnny_: in general or just on LTSP?
[01:39] <johnny_> in general
[01:39] <ogra> should work with nspluinwrapper
[01:39] <ogra> +g
[01:40] <johnny_> 	libgcc_s.so.1
[01:40] <johnny_> says that is missing
[01:46] <johnny_> that is npviewer.bin itself
[01:46] <ogra> weird
[01:46] <ogra> i know many people use it
[01:46] <johnny_> it's a registered bug i think too..
[01:46] <johnny_> now if only i can find it
[01:48] <johnny_> 180478
[01:48] <johnny_> it is bug 180478
[01:50] <johnny_> i am just not good enough debian/ubuntu to be able to fix this crap
[01:50] <johnny_> but that is what we have..
[01:50] <johnny_> an earlier version if ia32-libs has it i think
[01:51] <johnny_> Flash Plugin installed.
[01:51] <johnny_> /usr/lib/nspluginwrapper/i386/linux/npviewer.bin: error while loading shared libraries: libgcc_s.so.1: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
[01:51] <johnny_> nspluginwrapper: no appropriate viewer found for /usr/lib/flashplugin-nonfree/libflashplayer.so
[01:56] <johnny_> ogra, any ideas for me?
[01:56] <johnny_> to figure this thing out?
[01:57] <ogra> not really, i'm not really familiar with ia32-libs, but i know many people use it with success
[02:01] <johnny_> ugghz
[02:02] <johnny_> i feel like since the upgrade didn't complete all the way through
[02:02] <johnny_> i missed af ew things
[02:02] <johnny_> ie: the cleanup phase never ran
[02:02] <johnny_> also.. the internet just goes down randomly now
[02:02] <johnny_> i can't pinpoint why
[02:02] <johnny_> but at least once a day, i have to restart the computer
[02:02] <ogra> run u-m again ?
[02:02] <johnny_> it says it's done
[02:03] <johnny_> but it's hard for me to believe
[02:03] <ogra> did you do y proper update from gutsy-updates before starting ?
[02:03] <ogra> s/y/a
[02:03] <johnny_> i did do all the updates i had
[02:04] <johnny_> before starting the upgrade
[02:04] <ogra> strange
[02:04] <ogra> lsb_release -a ?
[02:04] <johnny_> it says hardy
[02:04] <johnny_> there goes the internet again
[02:04] <johnny_> only a reboot solves it
[02:04] <johnny_> there's nothing in dmesg
[02:06] <ogra> NM works properly ?
[02:06] <johnny_> i guess.. :)
[02:06] <ogra> and ubuntu-desktop is installed?
[02:06] <johnny_> yes
[02:07] <ogra> i dont really have an idea ... you might want to talk to mvo tomorrow who does u-m
[02:09] <johnny_> well .. this internet problem is more important
[02:09] <johnny_> i'm getting serious flack now
[02:10] <johnny_> there's nothing in the logs either :(
[02:11] <johnny_> i need to figure out if it's the driver
[02:11] <johnny_> or some random software
[02:11] <ogra> what card ?
[02:11] <johnny_> b44
[02:11] <ogra> eeek
[02:11] <johnny_> it is onboard
[02:11]  * ogra boggles facing the boradcom
[02:11] <johnny_> it worked great until hardy
[02:12] <ogra> firmware out of date ?
[02:12] <johnny_> for wired ?
[02:12] <johnny_> wired
[02:12] <ogra> hmm, i never had a wired bracom
[02:12] <ogra> *broadcom
[02:12] <johnny_> it's not bcm43xx or anythign
[02:12] <johnny_> it's just b44 :)
[02:12] <johnny_> hmm.. maybe i should migrate back to the 22 kernel
[02:13] <ogra> there is a fresh kernel in hardy-proposed
[02:14] <johnny_> so.. what should i do to upgrade
[02:14] <ogra> hmm, nothing about b44
[02:15] <johnny_> i just wish i could tell if twas the driver somehow
[02:17] <johnny_> any suggestions on that?
[02:20] <johnny_> test
[02:20] <johnny_> am i still here
[02:20] <ogra> yes
[02:21] <johnny_> uggh.. stupid internet
[02:21] <ogra> i wont be much longer ... nearly 3:30 here
[02:21] <ogra> (am)
[02:21] <johnny_> yeah.. figured
[02:29] <kingair_six> hello, I am a relative noob in linux and have some issue with burning cds. i probably tried 3 different media and it always came up with an error. now online it says to add my username after "disk" in etc/group , so far so good, but how can I save group after I changed it?
[02:39] <kingair_six> any idea?
[02:44] <johnny_> uggh... this is lame
[02:45] <johnny_> after every upgrade of ubuntu.. i have to spend at least 6 hours trying to figure something out
[02:45] <kingair_six> what is that?
[02:53] <kingair_six> this burning stuff is so devestating... going through cds like sherman through atlanta...
[02:56] <LaserJock> kingair_six: whe does it give you an error?
[02:58] <kingair_six> when using the nautilus feature with right klick "write to disc"
[02:58] <kingair_six> it gives it immediately
[02:58] <kingair_six> with k3b it does not let me choose a drive or does not recognize the empty media
[02:59] <LaserJock> man
[02:59] <LaserJock> that stinks
[02:59] <LaserJock> I haven't had problems like that for years :/
[02:59] <kingair_six> now i found one possible solution, to write my username into etc/group after disc, but i couldnt figure out how to save groups after i edited it, wouldnt let me
[02:59] <kingair_six> i'm sorry to bring it up... i just started with linux three days ago
[02:59] <LaserJock> you need to have administrator permissions
[03:00] <kingair_six> well, it's an administrator account
[03:00] <LaserJock> how did you edit it?
[03:00]  * johnny_ cries 
[03:00] <LaserJock> what app?
[03:00] <kingair_six> holdon, checkin
[03:00] <kingair_six> gedit
[03:00] <LaserJock> from the menu?
[03:01] <kingair_six> jup, rightclick-> text editor
[03:01] <kingair_six> or something like that
[03:01] <LaserJock> ok, I'll give you an easier way to do it
[03:01] <kingair_six> thx!
[03:02] <LaserJock> go to System -> Administration -> Users and Groups
[03:02] <kingair_six> yep
[03:02] <LaserJock> hit "unlock"
[03:02] <kingair_six> k
[03:02] <LaserJock> then hit the "Manage Groups" button
[03:02] <kingair_six> alright,
[03:03] <LaserJock> that gives you a list of all the groups
[03:03] <kingair_six> yup
[03:06] <LaserJock> kingair_six: not sure if that'll help your Cd problem but that's the best way to mess with users and groups
[03:07] <kingair_six> oke, then i just add disk there?
[03:09] <LaserJock> no
[03:09] <LaserJock> find the disk group and hit Properties
[03:09] <LaserJock> then it'll give you a list of users that you can add to it
[03:09] <kingair_six> it is not in there though?
[03:10] <LaserJock> ok
[03:10] <LaserJock> hmm
[03:13] <LaserJock> kingair_six: do you have a link for the reference that said to use the disk group?
[03:13] <kingair_six> nope, i'm sorry, was on a different computer
[03:13] <LaserJock> k
[03:14] <LaserJock> what error do you get with the "write to disc" method
[03:14] <LaserJock> ?
[03:17] <kingair_six> aehm, hang on a sec
[03:18] <kingair_si1> alright, aehm
[03:19] <kingair_si1> There was an error writing to the disc:
[03:19] <kingair_si1> Could not run the necessary command: Failed to execute child process "wodim" (Permission denied)
[03:22] <kingair_si1> alright, it just worked for the first time on a try with gnome baker or so, i gotta leave now, thank's for the help, appreciate this open community!
[06:34] <johnny> dpkg -L ia32-libs | grep gcc
[06:34] <johnny> nothin..
[06:34]  * johnny looks for the old version
[06:45] <johnny> hmm.. guess not..
[06:53] <johnny> ok.. wrong place for that..
[06:53] <johnny> must be a path issue somehow then
[06:59] <johnny> finally thought about the issue
[06:59] <johnny> where does ubuntu handle 32bit library path handling?
[07:00] <johnny>  i see no /lib/32  in /etc/ld.so.conf
[07:00] <johnny> i don't have any other 64bit ubuntu installs to check with
[07:16] <johnny> oh.. looks like my updatedb wasn't cronned anymore..
[08:39] <schregge> hi
=== gnomefre1k is now known as gnomefreak
[14:04] <killsalad> hi all i've got a problem with ltsp-bulid-client it fails to complete and complains about lacks of package xubuntu-artwork-usplash
[14:04] <killsalad> any idea?
[14:05] <ogra> you ned to use --components main,restricted,universe with ltsp-build-client
[14:05] <ogra> xubuntu is built from universe now, ltsp only builds from main ackages by default
[14:06] <ogra> *packages
[14:06] <killsalad> ok i see
[14:06] <ogra> so: sudo ltsp-build-client --components main,restricted,universe
[14:07] <killsalad> ok - let's find out
[14:10] <killsalad> i've got another question : have somebody tested terminals running kde4 ?
[14:11] <ogra> why should that be any different from any other desktop ?
[14:12] <ogra> it runs on the server in a ssh session or with forwarded DISPLAY ... shouldn make a difference if you run kde 3 or 4
[14:14] <killsalad> well i know that i only wondered if Kde4 is light enough
[14:15] <killsalad> at least compareble with Xfce
[14:16] <ogra> light/heavy will only affect your server
[14:16] <killsalad> i'm setting right now LTSP in some NGO - a lot of "voulonteers" are working on therminals and i want to give them the best impression about Linux
[14:16] <ogra> not the clients ...
[14:17] <ogra> so if your server is capable of handling kde4 sessions for every user that should be any issue
[14:17] <ogra> *shouldnt
[14:18] <killsalad> hm what is capable - it's pentium D 2.8 and 2 GB ram
[14:19] <killsalad> thanks for advice - about ltsp-build-clients it worked
[14:19] <ogra> general rule for an ubuntu desktop: 256M for running the server plus 128M for every running session
[14:19] <ogra> do the math :)
[14:19] <killsalad> hm i've got 5 termials
[14:20] <ogra> then you have a good buffer :)
[14:20] <killsalad> ;)
[14:20] <killsalad> ok just one more question
[14:21] <killsalad> i've got a printer pluged to terminal it's often 'gets down' and it is nessesery to reboot terminal
[14:21] <killsalad> is it mine's issue or is it LTSP wide ?
[14:22] <ogra> how much ram does the client have ?
[14:22] <killsalad> 128
[14:23] <killsalad> all cilents have 128 (dell GX1)
[14:24] <ogra> hmm, should actually be enough
[14:24] <ogra> which release are you using ?
[14:25] <killsalad> right now none ;) previously 7.10
[14:25] <ogra> none ?
[14:25] <killsalad> today i've upgraded server to 2GB Ram and bigger drive
[14:26] <ogra> on what are you running ltsp-build-client atm ?=
[14:26] <killsalad> 8.04
[14:26] <killsalad> problem was in 6.10 - 7.10
[14:26] <ogra> there were some fixes  ...
[14:26] <ogra> but also one bug in 8.04 with printing
[14:27] <ogra> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+bug/224259
[14:28] <killsalad> ok - to set a printer i edit lts.conf and add an ipp printer ?
[14:28] <ogra> that will affect you as well (workaround included)
[14:28] <ogra> no, ltsp uses HP Jetdirect
[14:29] <ogra> you set PRINTER_0_DEVICE to point to the lp device in lts.conf
[14:29] <killsalad> silly me (i mean JD)
[14:29] <ogra> and in the users session set up a jetdirect printer pointing to the client IP
[14:30] <killsalad> so like in LTSP 4.x
[14:31] <ogra> well
[14:31] <ogra> you only need one option in lts.conf
[14:31] <ogra> in 4.2 you needed a whole bunch
[14:31] <ogra> but beyond that, yes
[14:32] <ogra> (i'm planning to get rid of the last option as well btw :) and automate it through udev if a printer is detected )
[14:33] <killsalad> it were nicer if it all was transparent to admin - just plug printer and serwer detects it ;)
[14:34] <ogra> right
[14:34] <ogra> we'll get there :)
[14:34] <ogra> just takes development time
[14:34] <killsalad> how about local media - is any progres in this area
[14:35] <ogra> only small changes in comparison to 7.10
[14:35] <killsalad> my dummies ;) are confused when i told them you have to go to /media/[username]/drive
[14:36] <ogra> well, gnome handles it fine
[14:36] <killsalad> how about xfce?
[14:36] <ogra> if you would use nautilus instead of thunar :)
[14:36] <ogra> whatever thunar uses in the backend doesnt monitor /media
[14:37] <ogra> but the ltspfsmounter script is a trivial little python thing, it should be easy to add two lines to put links on the user desktops on plug and remove them accordingly
[14:38] <ogra> its just nothing we'D ever do my default (putting links on desktops)
[14:38] <killsalad> hm - i konw a python
[14:39] <killsalad> where can i find ltspfsmounter
[14:39] <killsalad> ?
[14:40] <ogra> /usr/sbin/ltspfsmounter
[14:40] <ogra> on the server
[14:40] <killsalad> thx
[14:41] <killsalad> well i would like to contribute to ltsp in ubuntu but i'm only fluent in python and php
[14:42] <killsalad> is there something that i can do
[14:42] <killsalad> with such skils?
[14:42] <ogra> there are three functions, add remove and cleanup ... removoe the links in cleanup and remove, add a link in add :)
[14:42] <ogra> python is fine :)
[14:42] <ogra> we dont really do php anywhere
[14:42] <stgraber> some shell scripting knowledges would probably also help
[14:42] <ogra> indeed
[14:43] <ogra> but there is nothing in a shellscript you couldnt also do with py ;)
[14:44] <stgraber> indeed
[14:47] <killsalad> stgraber: in theory i also know C,C++, Java ;) but i've never wrote somthing bigger than excercise on classes
[14:48] <stgraber> LTSP also has some part written in C (jetpipe and ldm IIRC) but most of it is shell scripts and some python scripts
[14:48] <ogra> jetpipe is still python
[14:48] <killsalad> ok - a general question has E/K/X/Ubuntu any gui-tool that allows user to change their password
[14:48] <stgraber> killsalad: yep
[14:48] <ogra> and i dont really want to change it, C would add extra complexity
[14:48] <stgraber> System -> Preferences -> About Me
[14:49] <killsalad> stgraber: not present in Xubuntu
[14:50] <stgraber> that's in gnome, so Ubuntu and Edubuntu
[14:50] <stgraber> Kubuntu probably has something similar, not sure about Xubuntu
[14:55] <killsalad> ok - it seams that user manager is capable
[15:01]  * ogra sighs about https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/FirewallConfiguration
[15:15] <killsalad> hm i was wandering if it could be possible to have one guest account with ability to multile login
[15:21] <ogra> technically yes
[15:21] <ogra> but none of the desktops likes that
[15:21] <killsalad> yeah
[15:21] <ogra> nor firefox or openoffice
[15:49] <stgraber> you would need some kind of temporary home directory that would copy the main one /home/xyz to something like /tmp/xyz.pid. But then changes would be dropped when closing the session.
[17:51] <highvoltage> hey LaserJock
[18:27] <scrapbunnyserver> does anyone have suggestions of the best apps/games to run on thin clients for 1st-5th grade?
[20:37] <scrapbunnyserver> anyone here running edubuntu classroom server?
[20:38] <johnny> i tend to just call that ltsp :)
[20:41] <scrapbunnyserver> as i think you are on the ltsp channel too, i'm looking for recommendations of games or websites that run well on thin clients
[20:43] <johnny> it all depends on your network
[20:46] <scrapbunnyserver> i am working on getting more memory but for now we have a dell poweredge with dual core intel xeon 2.40 ghz processors and 3 gig memory. clients are dell gx110 with 128 ram
[20:46] <johnny> and the network?
[20:47] <johnny> i found out recently that our switch has gigabit uplink
[20:47] <johnny> when i have time to move things around.. i'll see if it makes any real difference
[20:48] <scrapbunnyserver> we have T1 lines and use a gig switch
[20:49] <scrapbunnyserver> think that is right, the recommended switch for ltsp
[23:29] <tw33k> Hello
[23:30] <tw33k> Anyone available to answer an error question about ubuntu 8.4 AMD64 ? I'm a new user