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of working on the next stage. Um so I'll be putting the minutes of this uh this meeting into the project documents folder. Um so uh I guess just to just to confirm that we know what we're doing in the next {disfmarker} well in the thirty minutes after lunch anyway,Marketing: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: um for uh our Industrial Designer, you're gonna be thinking about the components concept. Um User Interface Designer gonna be thinking about our user interface, and marketing you're gonna be thinking about trend watching. Um and you'll all get specific instructions as well. So um I dunno, just just to to ask now if you've got anything else you've thought about while we've been talking.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Um, do you wanna start with David. Anything else to say at allIndustrial Designer: Mm no, not really.Project Manager: No, okay. {vocalsound} AndrewMarketing: Um yeah, just {disfmarker} I just wanted to ask then before we wrap up, shall we agree for sake of um sort of clarity and when we when we r resume that we'll u use this idea David's proposed, where we think of these three sort of buckets and anything anything we discuss about them is sort of, okay, we're talking about this.Project Manager: Yeah, yeah I think that's definitely a good idea.Industrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: Uh-huh.Marketing: Shall we do that, thenProject Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Okay, great.User Interface: Um just about the three buckets, um what would go in the the device functions oneIndustrial Designer: Um things like on off. Because they don't have anything to do with what you see. I me mean in terms of picture and the entertainment value,Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: you know, um so um {disfmarker}Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: Um {disfmarker}Marketing: And and channel.Industrial Designer: And channel. Because the on there needs to be some kind of selling point to it.Marketing: Yeah. Sure. Sure.Project Manager: So um anybody {disfmarker} anything there to add {disfmarker}Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Just kind of young professionals, uh th like {vocalsound} if we are going to include speech recognition, it's kind of between fifteen and thirty five seems to be like a really high response to that. So we could say that was our target.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: I I think twenty five to thirty five is is is fair to add that in as a group as wellProject Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: because that's more than half your group of people who are willing to at least try and use your technology.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Okay, so fifteen to thirty five, look fairly young.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: You know, they have bit of expendable income to spend on this sort of thing.Marketing: Yeah.Industrial Designer: I think perhaps that age group is significant as well because those are people who use the computer,Marketing: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: who are familiar with their {disfmarker} with computers in in their everyday work.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: I think people who are maybe about {disfmarker} I wouldn't say thirty five,Marketing: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: but people who are about forty-ish and above now would not be so dependent and reliant on a computer or a mobile phone or something like that.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. But {disfmarker} yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah, sure.Industrial Designer: So these are people who are gadgety, rightProject Manager: So {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound} Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: People who are u growing up used to, you know in schools and in universities,Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: when you go on to their working lives, people who would you know regularProject Manager: Yeah. So they'll not sh not shy away from something quite high-tech.Industrial Designer: the thing open,Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: I think that's a good idea.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: I think it's a good idea. {vocalsound}Marketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Um, {vocalsound} do we have any functions that um we'd want on itMarketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: I mean so far I've got um on and off, um switch the channel up and down, and put the volume up and down.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Uh-huh.User Interface: Um they're just the the very basics you could use for a T_V_.Project Manager: Uh-huh, and then actual numbers for channels as well, yeah.User Interface: Okay. Um, you say that's a h a required one or a requested one Would you likeMarketing: Which was thatUser Interface: um the channels like the the numbers on thing, um {disfmarker}Marketing: Up {disfmarker} the numbers, or the up downProject Manager: God, I wou I would say that's required,Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: I mean there's no way anybody's gonna buy a remote control these days when if you can't actually individually select channels,Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: I mean would anybody disagree with thatMarketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Um, what else, uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} So don't need to worry about teletext,Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: don't need to worry about V_C_R_, uh any kind of like display controls at all do you think we need to worry about,Marketing: We don't NoProject Manager: you know like brightness and contrastMarketing: Yeah. Well I think I think es essentially what we're doing right now is we're categorising. We're saying well we want this to be a product that offers all the sort of more tricky features but we want them to be in another areaProject Manager: Mm.Marketing: Is that rightProject Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Is that what we're we're doingUser Interface: Um, yeah.Marketing: We're kind of like sorting them an Or are we actually eliminating things we just don't want the that'll happen.Marketing: Which is ma not necessarily a bad thing, but may what I've already started doing is cr I created a slide in in my presentation here so um so that we kind of think well what's the cumulative effect of what we've taken from your ideas and and mine, because certainly I I have a hard time separating separating things completely.Project Manager: Mm hard to know what {disfmarker} where your role ends, yeah.Marketing: Obviously obviously what you've just told me what you've just told me impacts a lot on what um like market research mm that that I've been {disfmarker}Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: So how do I how do I get this upIndustrial Designer: Um function F_ eight.Project Manager: Uh pr yeah, press function and F_ eight, yeah.Marketing: Okay. Okay. Alright. So {disfmarker} F_ eightIndustrial Designer: Function, the blue button. Next to the control on the left. Yeah.Marketing: Oh, and F_ eight. Okay.Industrial Designer: You have to push it together.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Yep.Marketing: Okay, I think that that's doing it now.Industrial Designer: Nope. Try that again.Marketing: Uh, againIndustrial Designer: Wait.User Interface: Think maybe the the wire in the back might be loose.Marketing: Okay.Project Manager: Yeah, you wanna {disfmarker} Oh oh here we go.Marketing: Um,Industrial Designer: Yep, there we go.Project Manager: There you go.Marketing: {vocalsound} okay great. Okay. Just um {disfmarker} Before I bring this up what I'll just say is um what I've what I've done is tried to collect some information so that I can then relay this to to you guys so that it's {disfmarker} now becomes a collective thing. And then kind of lead us in the direction of deciding,'kay what what are our options, what should we decide and do you know what I mean, so.Industrial Designer: {gap} Increase that'cause we can't see off also goes, you know, like on off like power, not on off sound.Marketing: Right.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Not on off video. Although you don't turn off the video on your T_V_, but um you might wanna you know turn off the sound,Project Manager: Okay.Industrial Designer: say you wanna pick up the phone, there's a mute button, right, so you you have you have a choice of putting it on to um others or a device.Project Manager: Okay.Industrial Designer: Device is basically anything which we can't categorise, right. We put it out.Project Manager: Okay, so you're gonna have um audio which is gonna be like you know your bass settings and actual volume {disfmarker} hiMarketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Yeah, anything to do with what you hear, right. You you put that into audio.Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: And then video is anything that you can see.Project Manager: Okay, and then visual {disfmarker}Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Okay, so brightness, contrast, things like that,Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Um. Yep.Project Manager: and then just actual device things,Marketing: Colour, yeah.Industrial Designer: Yep.Project Manager: like what channel you're watching, turning on an off,Marketing: Sure. Sure.Industrial Designer: Yep.Project Manager: stuff like that.Marketing: Okay.Project Manager: Okay, um {disfmarker}Marketing: And then k I suppose quite likely what would happen is in the d device category there might be some which are just like the habitual standard and then others which are maybe a bit more {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Like random which we have no other place to put, but we need it somewhere there.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Yeah. Sure, okay. Okay.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Um even even if it doesn't map very clearly what happens is that people at least have some in their mind.Project Manager: Okay.Industrial Designer: It's easy to use, I think that's one thing that um {disfmarker} and I guess from the component point of view it's easy to build as wellProject Manager: Okay.Industrial Designer:'cause things are like fixed. {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Okay.Marketing: Okay.Project Manager: Um so yeah, I guess just things to think about are you know like the fact it's gotta look good,Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: because of who we're we're, you know, targeting this at. Um something maybe kind of quirky in design maybe. Make it kind of ergonomic kind of to hold,Marketing: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.Project Manager: you know, things like that. Um, {vocalsound} so I guess I guess that's it. That's the meeting over.Marketing: Great.Project Manager: Whoohoo.Marketing: Then we get to go find out what was picked up for lunch for us. {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}

Summarize the whole meeting.

This meeting was about the functional design of the remote control. Firstly, User Interface presented on the technical function design. For the previous remote, User Interface found it was clunky but the functions were basic, or the remote was too complicated with lots of buttons. Based on this, User Interface demonstrated two kinds of buttons access to advanced functions. Next, Marketing presented on market trends and proposed three inspirations including the fancy look and technology innovation based on the customer needs. Then, Industrial Designer presented on the working design and introduced the working design logic of the battery and power source. Lastly, the group discussed the remote functions. They decided to have fifteen to thirty-five-year-old target groups as well as to have video controls map to advanced functionality so that they could skip the basic channel button.

It includes removing the mandatory 10-day reflection period and the number of required witnesses who will witness a person's consent. The petitioners urge the House of Commons to immediately discontinue the removal of safeguards for people requesting euthanasia, and to put in place additional measures to protect vulnerable people. This would require that bill to be amended or not passed. The second petition is with respect to Senate public bill S-204. This is on organ harvesting and trafficking. Petitioners call on members of the House, and hopefully the Senate as well, to support Bill S-204, which would make it a criminal offence for a person to go abroad and receive an organ for which there has not been consent. It would also create provisions under which a person could be made inadmissible to Canada if they had been involved in organ harvesting or trafficking. Thank you very much.The Chair: Thank you. I want to remind all the members that there are specific headsets that have been mandated to all of us. If you don't have one, please talk to your IT ambassador and they will get one to you as quickly as possible. The reason for them is not so much for what you hear, but that our interpreters are working and there are work conditions that really make it difficult. Part of that is not having the appropriate boom on your headset, which will make it very difficult for them to hear and interpret for our members. Now we go to the member for BeachesEast York, Mr. Erskine-Smith.Mr. Nathaniel Erskine-Smith (BeachesEast York, Lib.): Mr. Chair, I had to learn how to tie my tie all over again. It's been so long. I want to thank Jenna Robar, who's led this petition e-2453. The petitioners have noted that there are approximately 60 indigenous languages in Canada and that 2019, last year, was declared by the UN to be the year of indigenous languages. They draw attention to article 13 of the UNDRIP and to the TRC's calls to action numbers 13 to 16. Fundamentally, they call upon the Government of Canada to recognize indigenous languages as being official languages of Canada and to have each language recognized nationally, with implementations on regional and provincial levels, acknowledging that many regions have different languages.Mr. Eric Duncan (StormontDundasSouth Glengarry, CPC): Mr. Chair, I am proud to present a petition on behalf of one of my constituents, Myles Lynch of St. Andrews West in my riding. Myles made history as the first Canadian ever to survive three double-lung transplants. Myles lives with cystic fibrosis and has had three lung transplants in the last five years, and he's only 22 years old. Myles created a documentary called 8 Thousand Myles, which had a few showings in my riding. It documented his journey across Canada. One thing Myles has been advocating for is the creation of a national opt-out program for organ donation. Myles asked me how he could help raise awareness of that issue. I mentioned to him e-petitions online and getting people across the country to sign them. I am proud to have this certified today, with 1,318 signatures, asking the Standing Committee on Health to launch a study into the feasibility of the creation of a national opt-out program. I give kudos to Myles not only for his strength personally but also for his advocacy for others and for saving lives in our country by advocating for a better and an improved organ donation system. Kudos to Myles. I'm proud to present this petition today.Mr. Peter Julian (New WestminsterBurnaby, NDP): Mr. Chair, I'm committee, members may not take photographs of their colleagues or film the proceedings. In order to facilitate the work of our interpreters and ensure orderly meetings, I will outline a few rules. Interpretation of this video conference will be done as it is at normal committee meetings and in the House. At the bottom of your screen, you can choose floor, English or French. As you have seen, I change as I am speaking. I have now switched over to English in order to speak English. If you look at the bottom, you have a little flag that indicates whether it's English or French, and that's how we will be speaking. It makes it easier. That was where we had a little bit of a glitch in the last session. I understand that there are no statements by ministers. We can now proceed to presenting petitions for a period not exceeding 15 minutes. I would like to remind members that petitions presented during a meeting of the special committee must already have been certified by the clerk of petitions. In addition, to ensure that the petition is considered to have been properly presented, the certificate of the petition and each page of the petition for petitions certified in a previous Parliament should be emailed to the committee no later than 6 p. m. on the day before the committee. I thank all the members for their usual co-operation. Thank you all. Now we'll proceed to presenting petitions. Our first petition comes from the honourable member for Sherwood ParkFort Saskatchewan, Mr. Genuis.Mr. Garnett Genuis (Sherwood ParkFort Saskatchewan, CPC): Mr. Chair, I'm pleased to be presenting two petitions today. The first petition is with respect to government Bill C-7. Petitioners raised concerns that this bill removes safeguards from the current euthanasia regime. That's why we're considering our approach. Of courseMr. Damien Kurek: I have a point of order.The Acting Chair (Mrs. Alexandra Mends): MinisterMorneau, please wait a moment. A member is raising a point of order. Mr. Kurek, do you have a point of order You have to unmute yourself.Mr. Damien Kurek: Yes. It's that the translation is at the same volume as the minister.The Acting Chair (Mrs. Alexandra Mends): You'll have to put yourself on English. Rather, the minister has to put himself on French.Hon. Bill Morneau: Sorry. I was on the English channel. We know that the people who need the Canada emergency response benefit must have access to it. That's why we're considering the challenges each time. If I receive a letter, I'll look at it. Once we have a response, we'll pass it directly on to the member.The Chair: The next question will go to Mr. Richards.Mr. Blake Richards (BanffAirdrie, CPC): This question is for the tourism minister. The tourism ministry was one of the first and hardest-hit industries during this crisis, yet despite the Prime Minister's announcement over three weeks ago now of a plan to bring forward a tourism-specific aid package to help the businesses who employ millions of unemployed Canadians who work in tourism, there's still been nothing from this government. When will the government finally act to provide help to this nearly crippled industryHon. Mlanie Joly (Minister of Economic Development and Official Languages): Mr. Chair, obviously we know that the tourism sector has been deeply impacted. I had the chance to talk to many of the leaders in the sector, and clearly there's a lot of anxiety. We also had the chance to work with all the G20 ministers of tourism all together, and we know we have to actThe Chair: We'll now go Justin Trudeau: Yes, Mr. Chair, we have moved forward with a historic national housing strategy that puts $40 billion toward housing. Working with partners, we have reduced poverty by over a million people in this country, but there is more to do. We are reducing homelessness by half with historic investments. We recognize that during this pandemic there's even more to do for vulnerable Canadians, and we are partnering with orders of government to make sure that happens.Mr. Jol Godin (PortneufJacques-Cartier, CPC): A point of order, Mr. Chair.The Chair: Order. Mr. Godin has a point of order.Mr. Jol Godin: Mr. Chair, I cannot hear the French interpretation. Could we please check so that I can hear in French what the Prime Minister is sayingThe Chair: Okay. Can we check thatMr. Jol Godin: Thank you.Right Hon. Justin Trudeau: I can try speaking English. I believe I was on the English tab, as is important. Are you hearing the translation nowThe Chair: That is exactly what the issue was. I just want to point that out to all the members. I'm speaking English right now and I'm on the English toggle at the bottom of the screen. It does create a bit of a disjoint when we're speaking, but it's the way to get around that so we have interpretation that works for everyone. The next question will go to the Leader of the Opposition, Mr. Scheer.Hon. Andrew Scheer (Leader of the Opposition): Mr. Chair, as this is our first opportunity to meet in any forum, I want to take this opportunity to express my condolences to the families of the brave men and women who lost their lives in the helicopter crash. I know that I speak for all parliamentarians when I extend our sympathy to their families and loved ones.

Summarize the discussion about introduction of petitions and prioritization of government matters.

The Chair brought the meeting to order, announcing that the purpose of the meeting was to discuss COVID-19's impact on Canada. Five petitions were presented: to recognize indeginous languages as official languages of Canada, to improve the organ donation system, to push for a made-in-Canada green economy, to decriminalize drug possession to improve public health, and to protect firearm ownership of law-abiding firearm owners. Mr. Pierre Paul-Hus suggested that the government should not try to pass gun-control legislation or release prisoners during the pandemic. The Prime Minister disagreed, claiming that both passing gun-control and releasing imprisoned Canadians who did not pose a threat to society advanced the safety of Canadians.

It includes removing the mandatory 10-day reflection period and the number of required witnesses who will witness a person's consent. The petitioners urge the House of Commons to immediately discontinue the removal of safeguards for people requesting euthanasia, and to put in place additional measures to protect vulnerable people. This would require that bill to be amended or not passed. The second petition is with respect to Senate public bill S-204. This is on organ harvesting and trafficking. Petitioners call on members of the House, and hopefully the Senate as well, to support Bill S-204, which would make it a criminal offence for a person to go abroad and receive an organ for which there has not been consent. It would also create provisions under which a person could be made inadmissible to Canada if they had been involved in organ harvesting or trafficking. Thank you very much.The Chair: Thank you. I want to remind all the members that there are specific headsets that have been mandated to all of us. If you don't have one, please talk to your IT ambassador and they will get one to you as quickly as possible. The reason for them is not so much for what you hear, but that our interpreters are working and there are work conditions that really make it difficult. Part of that is not having the appropriate boom on your headset, which will make it very difficult for them to hear and interpret for our members. Now we go to the member for BeachesEast York, Mr. Erskine-Smith.Mr. Nathaniel Erskine-Smith (BeachesEast York, Lib.): Mr. Chair, I had to learn how to tie my tie all over again. It's been so long. I want to thank Jenna Robar, who's led this petition e-2453. The petitioners have noted that there are approximately 60 indigenous languages in Canada and that 2019, last year, was declared by the UN to be the year of indigenous languages. They draw attention to article 13 of the UNDRIP and to the TRC's calls to action numbers 13 to 16. Fundamentally, they call upon the Government of Canada to recognize indigenous languages as being official languages of Canada and to have each language recognized nationally, with implementations on regional and provincial levels, acknowledging that many regions have different languages.Mr. Eric Duncan (StormontDundasSouth Glengarry, CPC): Mr. Chair, I am proud to present a petition on behalf of one of my constituents, Myles Lynch of St. Andrews West in my riding. Myles made history as the first Canadian ever to survive three double-lung transplants. Myles lives with cystic fibrosis and has had three lung transplants in the last five years, and he's only 22 years old. Myles created a documentary called 8 Thousand Myles, which had a few showings in my riding. It documented his journey across Canada. One thing Myles has been advocating for is the creation of a national opt-out program for organ donation. Myles asked me how he could help raise awareness of that issue. I mentioned to him e-petitions online and getting people across the country to sign them. I am proud to have this certified today, with 1,318 signatures, asking the Standing Committee on Health to launch a study into the feasibility of the creation of a national opt-out program. I give kudos to Myles not only for his strength personally but also for his advocacy for others and for saving lives in our country by advocating for a better and an improved organ donation system. Kudos to Myles. I'm proud to present this petition today.Mr. Peter Julian (New WestminsterBurnaby, NDP): Mr. Chair, I'm committee, members may not take photographs of their colleagues or film the proceedings. In order to facilitate the work of our interpreters and ensure orderly meetings, I will outline a few rules. Interpretation of this video conference will be done as it is at normal committee meetings and in the House. At the bottom of your screen, you can choose floor, English or French. As you have seen, I change as I am speaking. I have now switched over to English in order to speak English. If you look at the bottom, you have a little flag that indicates whether it's English or French, and that's how we will be speaking. It makes it easier. That was where we had a little bit of a glitch in the last session. I understand that there are no statements by ministers. We can now proceed to presenting petitions for a period not exceeding 15 minutes. I would like to remind members that petitions presented during a meeting of the special committee must already have been certified by the clerk of petitions. In addition, to ensure that the petition is considered to have been properly presented, the certificate of the petition and each page of the petition for petitions certified in a previous Parliament should be emailed to the committee no later than 6 p. m. on the day before the committee. I thank all the members for their usual co-operation. Thank you all. Now we'll proceed to presenting petitions. Our first petition comes from the honourable member for Sherwood ParkFort Saskatchewan, Mr. Genuis.Mr. Garnett Genuis (Sherwood ParkFort Saskatchewan, CPC): Mr. Chair, I'm pleased to be presenting two petitions today. The first petition is with respect to government Bill C-7. Petitioners raised concerns that this bill removes safeguards from the current euthanasia regime. That's why we're considering our approach. Of courseMr. Damien Kurek: I have a point of order.The Acting Chair (Mrs. Alexandra Mends): MinisterMorneau, please wait a moment. A member is raising a point of order. Mr. Kurek, do you have a point of order You have to unmute yourself.Mr. Damien Kurek: Yes. It's that the translation is at the same volume as the minister.The Acting Chair (Mrs. Alexandra Mends): You'll have to put yourself on English. Rather, the minister has to put himself on French.Hon. Bill Morneau: Sorry. I was on the English channel. We know that the people who need the Canada emergency response benefit must have access to it. That's why we're considering the challenges each time. If I receive a letter, I'll look at it. Once we have a response, we'll pass it directly on to the member.The Chair: The next question will go to Mr. Richards.Mr. Blake Richards (BanffAirdrie, CPC): This question is for the tourism minister. The tourism ministry was one of the first and hardest-hit industries during this crisis, yet despite the Prime Minister's announcement over three weeks ago now of a plan to bring forward a tourism-specific aid package to help the businesses who employ millions of unemployed Canadians who work in tourism, there's still been nothing from this government. When will the government finally act to provide help to this nearly crippled industryHon. Mlanie Joly (Minister of Economic Development and Official Languages): Mr. Chair, obviously we know that the tourism sector has been deeply impacted. I had the chance to talk to many of the leaders in the sector, and clearly there's a lot of anxiety. We also had the chance to work with all the G20 ministers of tourism all together, and we know we have to actThe Chair: We'll now go Justin Trudeau: Yes, Mr. Chair, we have moved forward with a historic national housing strategy that puts $40 billion toward housing. Working with partners, we have reduced poverty by over a million people in this country, but there is more to do. We are reducing homelessness by half with historic investments. We recognize that during this pandemic there's even more to do for vulnerable Canadians, and we are partnering with orders of government to make sure that happens.Mr. Jol Godin (PortneufJacques-Cartier, CPC): A point of order, Mr. Chair.The Chair: Order. Mr. Godin has a point of order.Mr. Jol Godin: Mr. Chair, I cannot hear the French interpretation. Could we please check so that I can hear in French what the Prime Minister is sayingThe Chair: Okay. Can we check thatMr. Jol Godin: Thank you.Right Hon. Justin Trudeau: I can try speaking English. I believe I was on the English tab, as is important. Are you hearing the translation nowThe Chair: That is exactly what the issue was. I just want to point that out to all the members. I'm speaking English right now and I'm on the English toggle at the bottom of the screen. It does create a bit of a disjoint when we're speaking, but it's the way to get around that so we have interpretation that works for everyone. The next question will go to the Leader of the Opposition, Mr. Scheer.Hon. Andrew Scheer (Leader of the Opposition): Mr. Chair, as this is our first opportunity to meet in any forum, I want to take this opportunity to express my condolences to the families of the brave men and women who lost their lives in the helicopter crash. I know that I speak for all parliamentarians when I extend our sympathy to their families and loved ones.

What did Paul-Hus think about the introduction of petitions and prioritization of government matters

Mr. Paul-Hus thought that the government should not take firearms away from law-abiding Canadian citizens. He inquired into how the government would take guns from criminals. He also expressed concern about the quick release of dangerous criminals during the pandemic and China's intransparency with regards to the pandemic.

It includes removing the mandatory 10-day reflection period and the number of required witnesses who will witness a person's consent. The petitioners urge the House of Commons to immediately discontinue the removal of safeguards for people requesting euthanasia, and to put in place additional measures to protect vulnerable people. This would require that bill to be amended or not passed. The second petition is with respect to Senate public bill S-204. This is on organ harvesting and trafficking. Petitioners call on members of the House, and hopefully the Senate as well, to support Bill S-204, which would make it a criminal offence for a person to go abroad and receive an organ for which there has not been consent. It would also create provisions under which a person could be made inadmissible to Canada if they had been involved in organ harvesting or trafficking. Thank you very much.The Chair: Thank you. I want to remind all the members that there are specific headsets that have been mandated to all of us. If you don't have one, please talk to your IT ambassador and they will get one to you as quickly as possible. The reason for them is not so much for what you hear, but that our interpreters are working and there are work conditions that really make it difficult. Part of that is not having the appropriate boom on your headset, which will make it very difficult for them to hear and interpret for our members. Now we go to the member for BeachesEast York, Mr. Erskine-Smith.Mr. Nathaniel Erskine-Smith (BeachesEast York, Lib.): Mr. Chair, I had to learn how to tie my tie all over again. It's been so long. I want to thank Jenna Robar, who's led this petition e-2453. The petitioners have noted that there are committee, members may not take photographs of their colleagues or film the proceedings. In order to facilitate the work of our interpreters and ensure orderly meetings, I will outline a few rules. Interpretation of this video conference will be done as it is at normal committee meetings and in the House. At the bottom of your screen, you can choose floor, English or French. As you have seen, I change as I am speaking. I have now switched over to English in order to speak English. If you look at the bottom, you have a little flag that indicates whether it's English or French, and that's how we will be speaking. It makes it easier. That was where we had a little bit of a glitch in the last session. I understand that there are no statements by ministers. We can now proceed to presenting petitions for a period not exceeding 15 minutes. I would like to remind members that petitions presented during a meeting of the special committee must already have been certified by the clerk of petitions. In addition, to ensure that the petition is considered to have been properly presented, the certificate of the petition and each page of the petition for petitions certified in a previous Parliament should be emailed to the committee no later than 6 p. m. on the day before the committee. I thank all the members for their usual co-operation. Thank you all. Now we'll proceed to presenting petitions. Our first petition comes from the honourable member for Sherwood ParkFort Saskatchewan, Mr. Genuis.Mr. Garnett Genuis (Sherwood ParkFort Saskatchewan, CPC): Mr. Chair, I'm pleased to be presenting two petitions today. The first petition is with respect to government Bill C-7. Petitioners raised concerns that this bill removes safeguards from the current euthanasia regime. That's why we're considering our approach. Of courseMr. Damien Kurek: I have a point of order.The Acting Chair (Mrs. Alexandra Mends): MinisterMorneau, please wait a moment. A member is raising a point of order. Mr. Kurek, do you have a point of order You have to unmute yourself.Mr. Damien Kurek: Yes. It's that the translation is at the same volume as the minister.The Acting Chair (Mrs. Alexandra Mends): You'll have to put yourself on English. Rather, the minister has to put himself on French.Hon. Bill Morneau: Sorry. I was on the English channel. We know that the people who need the Canada emergency response benefit must have access to it. That's why we're considering the challenges each time. If I receive a letter, I'll look at it. Once we have a response, we'll pass it directly on to the member.The Chair: The next question will go to Mr. Richards.Mr. Blake Richards (BanffAirdrie, CPC): This question is for the tourism minister. The tourism ministry was one of the first and hardest-hit industries during this crisis, yet despite the Prime Minister's announcement over three weeks ago now of a plan to bring forward a tourism-specific aid package to help the businesses who employ millions of unemployed Canadians who work in tourism, there's still been nothing from this government. When will the government finally act to provide help to this nearly crippled industryHon. Mlanie Joly (Minister of Economic Development and Official Languages): Mr. Chair, obviously we know that the tourism sector has been deeply impacted. I had the chance to talk to many of the leaders in the sector, and clearly there's a lot of anxiety. We also had the chance to work with all the G20 ministers of tourism all together, and we know we have to actThe Chair: We'll now go Justin Trudeau: Yes, Mr. Chair, we have moved forward with a historic national housing strategy that puts $40 billion toward housing. Working with partners, we have reduced poverty by over a million people in this country, but there is more to do. We are reducing homelessness by half with historic investments. We recognize that during this pandemic there's even more to do for vulnerable Canadians, and we are partnering with orders of government to make sure that happens.Mr. Jol Godin (PortneufJacques-Cartier, CPC): A point of order, Mr. Chair.The Chair: Order. Mr. Godin has a point of order.Mr. Jol Godin: Mr. Chair, I cannot hear the French interpretation. Could we please check so that I can hear in French what the Prime Minister is sayingThe Chair: Okay. Can we check thatMr. Jol Godin: Thank you.Right Hon. Justin Trudeau: I can try speaking English. I believe I was on the English tab, as is important. Are you hearing the translation nowThe Chair: That is exactly what the issue was. I just want to point that out to all the members. I'm speaking English right now and I'm on the English toggle at the bottom of the screen. It does create a bit of a disjoint when we're speaking, but it's the way to get around that so we have interpretation that works for everyone. The next question will go to the Leader of the Opposition, Mr. Scheer.Hon. Andrew Scheer (Leader of the Opposition): Mr. Chair, as this is our first opportunity to meet in any forum, I want to take this opportunity to express my condolences to the families of the brave men and women who lost their lives in the helicopter crash. I know that I speak for all parliamentarians when I extend our sympathy to their families and loved ones. Arnold, it's the second time that I note you've threatened to cut off a Conservative microphone. I'm just wondering, given that this isn't the House of Commons and it's structured as a committee, what standing order would give you the right to cut off a member of Parliament using a mute button. It seems a little dictatorial, and I was just wondering whether you could clarify that, based on the Standing Orders.The Chair: I don't think I threatened to use mute, but thank you for bringing that up. I am trying to keep the rules where the questions and the answers are equal, so that there are no interruptions on either side. That's how we're going to continue. I didn't use the mute. I did it verbally and I think that's a little more civil way of doing it. I hope you approve. I'm not asking you to comment on that. We'll go over to Ms. Harder. Thank you.Hon. Michelle Rempel Garner: But, on the point of order, Mr. Chair, you actually, to me, last week, and to Mr. Arnold, did suggest that you were going to use the mute button.The Chair: I believe that if we take everything out and go over it. . . . Bring the papers with the actual verbiage on it where I threatened, and we'll go over it, but I don't think this is the venue to do that. If you want to bring forward a point of order, I'm all in favour of it.Hon. Michelle Rempel Garner: Well, I am bringing forward a point of order. I've asked you to clarifyThe Chair: Very good. We'll look into it and get back to you. Thank you. We'll go on to Ms. Harder.Ms. Rachael Harder (Lethbridge, CPC): Canadians have outrightly expressed outrage and disappointment with

Did the Prime Minister agree with Mr. Pierre Paul-Hus when talking about introduction of petitions and prioritization of government matters

The Prime Minister disagreed with Mr. Paul-Hus. He expressed that he had a mandate from the last election campaign to ban military-style assault weapons, and expressed disappointment about Conservatives'not wanting to do the same. He also claimed that speedy releases of inmates were governed by strict rules and were important to ensure that correctional services were protected from the virus.

That's why we're considering our approach. Of courseMr. Damien Kurek: I have a point of order.The Acting Chair (Mrs. Alexandra Mends): MinisterMorneau, please wait a moment. A member is raising a point of order. Mr. Kurek, do you have a point of order You have to unmute yourself.Mr. Damien Kurek: Yes. It's that the translation is at the same volume as the minister.The Acting Chair (Mrs. Alexandra Mends): You'll have to put yourself on English. Rather, the minister has to put himself on French.Hon. Bill Morneau: Sorry. I was on the English channel. We know that the people who need the Canada emergency response benefit must have access to it. That's why we're considering the challenges each time. If I receive a letter, I'll look at it. Once we have a response, we'll pass it directly on to the member.The Chair: The next question will go to Mr. Richards.Mr. Blake Richards (BanffAirdrie, CPC): This question is for the tourism minister. The tourism ministry was one of the first and hardest-hit industries during this crisis, yet despite the Prime Minister's announcement over three weeks ago now of a plan to bring forward a tourism-specific aid package to help the businesses who employ millions of unemployed Canadians who work in tourism, there's still been nothing from this government. When will the government finally act to provide help to this nearly crippled industryHon. Mlanie Joly (Minister of Economic Development and Official Languages): Mr. Chair, obviously we know that the tourism sector has been deeply impacted. I had the chance to talk to many of the leaders in the sector, and clearly there's a lot of anxiety. We also had the chance to work with all the G20 ministers of tourism all together, and we know we have to actThe Chair: We'll now go back to Mr. Richards.Mr. Blake Richards: I didn't really get much of an answer there. I hear a lot about talking and not much on action. Tourism-based communities like the ones in Banff and Canmore, which I represent, are tourism-based economies and have unemployment rates of 85% or higher. They also don't qualify for a lot of the programs because they're seasonal businesses and make most or all of their revenues for the year from May to October, so they're at risk of losing their entire season. I have a couple of very specific questions. Will the government consider making changes to the programs to make sure that seasonal businesses can get help What does the government plan to do to help the tourism industry recover after the pandemicHon. Mlanie Joly: Thank you. Obviously, the tourism sector has access to many measures, including the CEBA account, the $40,000 account. They also have access to the wage subsidy. They have access to rent relief. They will be having access also to funding through the regional development agencies, and we'll be coming up with the details soon. Of course, in my colleague's riding of Banff, which is a fantastic place and a tourism gem, they will have access to the support through WD, western economic diversification. If there are particular cases you would like to raise with me, I would be more than happy to talk to you to see how, on the ground, we can help the tourism operators.Mr. Blake Richards: Mr. Chair, clearly the tourism minister hasn't been listening. She says she's talking to the industry. She's not hearing their concerns. What she just said does not address many of the concerns they have about being seasonal industries. It doesn't address anything about their concerns about the hard economic recovery about individual cases. When we receive those inquiries, we follow up immediately. I want to assure the member that we'll continue to do that. The work we are doing to stop non-essential travel has been important for the health and safety of Canadians, and we will continue with that work.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: Mr. Chair, my next question has to do with sole proprietor businesses. We see that many of them are not eligible for any of the benefit packages that have been rolled outEI, CERB, the wage subsidy, etc. What is the government going to do to address sole proprietors who are currently falling through the cracksHon. Bill Morneau (Minister of Finance): Mr. Chair, first, let me say that we absolutely recognize there are businesses across the country of all sizes that are finding this to be extremely difficult. The intent of the measures we put forward is obviously not only to give individuals a bridge but to give businesses a bridge. We are looking at ways that we can ensure that the Canada emergency business account has the broadest possible application. More than 500,000 businesses have already been approved for these loans, representing over $20 billion. We are looking at ways we can consider that eligibility process, recognizing that we need to make sure that the program continues to have its desired impact, and we will have more to say on that.The Chair: The next question will go to Mr. Arnold.Mr. Mel Arnold (North OkanaganShuswap, CPC): Mr. Chair, this is my first appearance, so I hope you can hear me okay.The Chair: We can hear you fine. Please proceed.Mr. Mel Arnold: Thank you, Mr. Chair. It's good to see everyone's faces. On April 3, the fisheries minister said opening dates would be determined by harvesters. Since then the minister see that she doesn't want to answer my question. I'll ask her another question. Can she tell me how many companies legally take advantage of tax avoidance in tax havens How much money escapes taxation through this legal mechanism The government could invest this money in its economic recovery post-COVID-19.Hon. Diane Lebouthillier: MadamChair, I completely understand my colleague's impatience. However, she must understand that this type of issue is very complex. Under the former Conservative government, the issue wasn't a priority at all. Regarding tax evasion abroad, our leadership made it possible for the agency to conduct twice as many audits in three years as it conducted in 10 years under the Conservatives. Over 50criminal investigations related to international tax evasion are ongoing.The Acting Chair (Mrs. Alexandra Mends): Go ahead, Madame DeBellefeuille.Mrs. Claude DeBellefeuille: MadamChair, I'm not impatient. However, I don't understand the government's lack of willingness to eliminate this mechanism, which is legal but completely immoral. Our questions remain unanswered. My next question is for the Minister of Finance. The Fdration de la relve agricole du Qubec and the UPA approached the Minister of Finance two weeks ago and still haven't received a response regarding the following issue. We know that many farms don't pay wages. As a result, these farms are being penalized because they aren't eligible for the $40,000 in loans available through the Canada emergency business account. To qualify for these loans, the farms needed a payroll of $20,000 to $1. 5million in 2019. Does the Minister of Finance plan to respond to the farmers who want to access the $40,000 in loansHon. Bill Morneau: Thank you, Ms. DeBellefeuille. We know that the Canada emergency response benefit must be made available to the people who need it.Mr. Damien Kurek: On a point of orderHon. Bill Morneau: reacts and deals with it, particularly in northern and vulnerable communities. This is something for which we will need to have a serious approach, with both the Minister of Natural Resources and also our provincial counterparts, to make sure that we aren't taking hasty measures to reopen the economy while we're trying to protectand this is our most important goalindigenous communities from getting exposed and spreading COVID-19.Ms. Niki Ashton: Madam Chair, my question is for the Minister of Fisheries. Hundreds of fishers and their families here in Manitoba who work with the Freshwater Fish Marketing Corporation are desperately calling for emergency support. Many are calling on the federal government to also work with them and the FFMC to redirect their product to domestic markets and communities here at home to address the growing food insecurity people are facing. When will your government announce support for inland fishers, including here in Manitoba, and will you work to ensure that their product, healthy fish, can be provided here at home for people who need itHon. Bernadette Jordan: Madam Chair, we know that COVID-19 is having extreme impacts on northern first nations communities, especially with regard to fisheries in areas that rely on it for not only their livelihoods but also for the cultural importance. Indigenous harvesters are able to access through the aboriginal financial institutions the $306 million we've put in for support for indigenous small and medium-sized businesses. The funding allows for short-term interest-free loans as well as for non-repayable contributions. We also announced earlier that the Canadian Northern Economic Development Agency has made available $15 million in non-repayable support for businesses. We know that there's more that needs to be done to support our first nations communities as well as our harvesters. We're doing everything we can and we will

Summarize the discussion about restoring Canadian businesses during the pandemic.

Members expressed concern that pandemic related restrictions were harming businesses and that the government was not reopening businesses and providing stimulus in an effective fashion. Emphasis was placed on reopening fishing, restoring agricultural supply chains, and supporting farmers. Many members inquired as to why the government had only furnished $252 million of the promised $2. 6 billion fund to maintain food security in Canada.

That's why we're considering our approach. Of courseMr. Damien Kurek: I have a point of order.The Acting Chair (Mrs. Alexandra Mends): MinisterMorneau, please wait a moment. A member is raising a point of order. Mr. Kurek, do you have a point of order You have to unmute yourself.Mr. Damien Kurek: Yes. It's that the translation is at the same volume as the minister.The Acting Chair (Mrs. Alexandra Mends): You'll have to put yourself on English. Rather, the minister has to put himself on French.Hon. Bill Morneau: Sorry. I was on the English channel. We know that the people who need the Canada emergency response benefit must have access to it. That's why we're considering the challenges each time. If I receive a letter, I'll look at it. Once we have a response, we'll pass it directly on to the member.The Chair: The next question will go to Mr. Richards.Mr. Blake Richards (BanffAirdrie, CPC): This question is for the tourism minister. The tourism ministry was one of the first and hardest-hit industries during this crisis, yet despite the Prime Minister's announcement over three weeks ago now of a plan to bring forward a tourism-specific aid package to help the businesses who employ millions of unemployed Canadians who work in tourism, there's still been nothing from this government. When will the government finally act to provide help to this nearly crippled industryHon. Mlanie Joly (Minister of Economic Development and Official Languages): Mr. Chair, obviously we know that the tourism sector has been deeply impacted. I had the chance to talk to many of the leaders in the sector, and clearly there's a lot of anxiety. We also had the chance to work with all the G20 ministers of tourism all together, and we know we have to actThe Chair: We'll now go back to Mr. Richards.Mr. Blake Richards: I didn't really get much of an answer there. I hear a lot about talking and not much on action. Tourism-based communities like the ones in Banff and Canmore, which I represent, are tourism-based economies and have unemployment rates of 85% or higher. They also don't qualify for a lot of the programs because they're seasonal businesses and make most or all of their revenues for the year from May to October, so they're at risk of losing their entire season. I have a couple of very specific questions. Will the government consider making changes to the programs to make sure that seasonal businesses can get help What does the government plan to do to help the tourism industry recover after the pandemicHon. Mlanie Joly: Thank you. Obviously, the tourism sector has access to many measures, including the CEBA account, the $40,000 account. They also have access to the wage subsidy. They have access to rent relief. They will be having access also to funding through the regional development agencies, and we'll be coming up with the details soon. Of course, in my colleague's riding of Banff, which is a fantastic place and a tourism gem, they will have access to the support through WD, western economic diversification. If there are particular cases you would like to raise with me, I would be more than happy to talk to you to see how, on the ground, we can help the tourism operators.Mr. Blake Richards: Mr. Chair, clearly the tourism minister hasn't been listening. She says she's talking to the industry. She's not hearing their concerns. What she just said does not address many of the concerns they have about being seasonal industries. It doesn't address anything about their concerns about the hard economic recovery about individual cases. When we receive those inquiries, we follow up immediately. I want to assure the member that we'll continue to do that. The work we are doing to stop non-essential travel has been important for the health and safety of Canadians, and we will continue with that work.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: Mr. Chair, my next question has to do with sole proprietor businesses. We see that many of them are not eligible for any of the benefit packages that have been rolled outEI, CERB, the wage subsidy, etc. What is the government going to do to address sole proprietors who are currently falling through the cracksHon. Bill Morneau (Minister of Finance): Mr. Chair, first, let me say that we absolutely recognize there are businesses across the country of all sizes that are finding this to be extremely difficult. The intent of the measures we put forward is obviously not only to give individuals a bridge but to give businesses a bridge. We are looking at ways that we can ensure that the Canada emergency business account has the broadest possible application. More than 500,000 businesses have already been approved for these loans, representing over $20 billion. We are looking at ways we can consider that eligibility process, recognizing that we need to make sure that the program continues to have its desired impact, and we will have more to say on that.The Chair: The next question will go to Mr. Arnold.Mr. Mel Arnold (North OkanaganShuswap, CPC): Mr. Chair, this is my first appearance, so I hope you can hear me okay.The Chair: We can hear you fine. Please proceed.Mr. Mel Arnold: Thank you, Mr. Chair. It's good to see everyone's faces. On April 3, the fisheries minister said opening dates would be determined by harvesters. Since then the minister reacts and deals with it, particularly in northern and vulnerable communities. This is something for which we will need to have a serious approach, with both the Minister of Natural Resources and also our provincial counterparts, to make sure that we aren't taking hasty measures to reopen the economy while we're trying to protectand this is our most important goalindigenous communities from getting exposed and spreading COVID-19.Ms. Niki Ashton: Madam Chair, my question is for the Minister of Fisheries. Hundreds of fishers and their families here in Manitoba who work with the Freshwater Fish Marketing Corporation are desperately calling for emergency support. Many are calling on the federal government to also work with them and the FFMC to redirect their product to domestic markets and communities here at home to address the growing food insecurity people are facing. When will your government announce support for inland fishers, including here in Manitoba, and will you work to ensure that their product, healthy fish, can be provided here at home for people who need itHon. Bernadette Jordan: Madam Chair, we know that COVID-19 is having extreme impacts on northern first nations communities, especially with regard to fisheries in areas that rely on it for not only their livelihoods but also for the cultural importance. Indigenous harvesters are able to access through the aboriginal financial institutions the $306 million we've put in for support for indigenous small and medium-sized businesses. The funding allows for short-term interest-free loans as well as for non-repayable contributions. We also announced earlier that the Canadian Northern Economic Development Agency has made available $15 million in non-repayable support for businesses. We know that there's more that needs to be done to support our first nations communities as well as our harvesters. We're doing everything we can and we will my best to try to keep it about level. Maybe I'll start muting if it's necessary, but interrupting is not going to solve anything. Mr. Arnold, I'll let you continue. You have three minutes and nine seconds left.Mr. Mel Arnold: Thank you, Mr. Chair. West coast fishing tourism is a key economic driver in British Columbia, especially in coastal communities, and yet the public fishery gets no respect from the government. Last year, the public fishery was weakened by restrictions based on ideology and not science. A year later, the fisheries minister refuses even to discuss viable, science-based solutions to conserve B. C.'s public fisheries. Does the minister and her government have a will and a plan to support Canada's west coast fisheries and the communities they sustainThe Chair: The hon. minister in 30 seconds, please.Hon. Bernadette Jordan: Mr. Chair, the fishery is important in every coastal community. I recognize its value for our economy, as well as what it means to our coastal communities. That's why we continue to work with those communities and with the fisheries to make sure that we're doing everything we possibly can to support them. During these extremely difficult times, we're working on measures with the fishery in B. C. , as well as on the Atlantic coast and eastern Quebec, to make sure that we're delivering for them and that all of the issues they're having are being addressed.The Chair: Mr. Arnold.Mr. Mel Arnold: Mr. Chair, Canada's seniors, especially those on basic incomes, are being hard hit by the COVID-19 crisis as they face new rising costs and scarcity of services. Seniors require adequate caregiver supports, physical safety and freedom to access their savings to reinforce their financial security. Why has the government failed to recognize the increasing challenges that seniors are facing

What did Heather McPherson think about restoring Canadian businesses during the pandemic

Ms. McPherson wanted to know how the government will respond to outbreaks in meat-packing plants since workers'pleas to place effective safety protocols have been fruitless. She further inquired if the federal government would provide financial support to the workers if they declined to work under unsafe conditions, and, if it comes to it, shut down the plants. She finally wanted to know if the Cargill business, which uses Luxembourg as a tax haven, was the recipient of pandemic relief funds.

That's why we're considering our approach. Of courseMr. Damien Kurek: I have a point of order.The Acting Chair (Mrs. Alexandra Mends): MinisterMorneau, please wait a moment. A member is raising a point of order. Mr. Kurek, do you have a point of order You have to unmute yourself.Mr. Damien Kurek: Yes. It's that the translation is at the same volume as the minister.The Acting Chair (Mrs. Alexandra Mends): You'll have to put yourself on English. Rather, the minister has to put himself on French.Hon. Bill Morneau: Sorry. I was on the English channel. We know that the people who need the Canada emergency response benefit must have access to it. That's why we're considering the challenges each time. If I receive a letter, I'll look at it. Once we have a response, we'll pass it directly on to the member.The Chair: The next question will go to Mr. Richards.Mr. Blake Richards (BanffAirdrie, CPC): This question is for the tourism minister. The tourism ministry was one of the first and hardest-hit industries during this crisis, yet despite the Prime Minister's announcement over three weeks ago now of a plan to bring forward a tourism-specific aid package to help the businesses who employ millions of unemployed Canadians who work in tourism, there's still been nothing from this government. When will the government finally act to provide help to this nearly crippled industryHon. Mlanie Joly (Minister of Economic Development and Official Languages): Mr. Chair, obviously we know that the tourism sector has been deeply impacted. I had the chance to talk to many of the leaders in the sector, and clearly there's a lot of anxiety. We also had the chance to work with all the G20 ministers of tourism all together, and we know we have to actThe Chair: We'll now go back to Mr. Richards.Mr. Blake Richards: I didn't really get much of an answer there. I hear a lot about talking and not much on action. Tourism-based communities like the ones in Banff and Canmore, which I represent, are tourism-based economies and have unemployment rates of 85% or higher. They also don't qualify for a lot of the programs because they're seasonal businesses and make most or all of their revenues for the year from May to October, so they're at risk of losing their entire season. I have a couple of very specific questions. Will the government consider making changes to the programs to make sure that seasonal businesses can get help What does the government plan to do to help the tourism industry recover after the pandemicHon. Mlanie Joly: Thank you. Obviously, the tourism sector has access to many measures, including the CEBA account, the $40,000 account. They also have access to the wage subsidy. They have access to rent relief. They will be having access also to funding through the regional development agencies, and we'll be coming up with the details soon. Of course, in my colleague's riding of Banff, which is a fantastic place and a tourism gem, they will have access to the support through WD, western economic diversification. If there are particular cases you would like to raise with me, I would be more than happy to talk to you to see how, on the ground, we can help the tourism operators.Mr. Blake Richards: Mr. Chair, clearly the tourism minister hasn't been listening. She says she's talking to the industry. She's not hearing their concerns. What she just said does not address many of the concerns they have about being seasonal industries. It doesn't address anything about their concerns about the hard economic recovery see that she doesn't want to answer my question. I'll ask her another question. Can she tell me how many companies legally take advantage of tax avoidance in tax havens How much money escapes taxation through this legal mechanism The government could invest this money in its economic recovery post-COVID-19.Hon. Diane Lebouthillier: MadamChair, I completely understand my colleague's impatience. However, she must understand that this type of issue is very complex. Under the former Conservative government, the issue wasn't a priority at all. Regarding tax evasion abroad, our leadership made it possible for the agency to conduct twice as many audits in three years as it conducted in 10 years under the Conservatives. Over 50criminal investigations related to international tax evasion are ongoing.The Acting Chair (Mrs. Alexandra Mends): Go ahead, Madame DeBellefeuille.Mrs. Claude DeBellefeuille: MadamChair, I'm not impatient. However, I don't understand the government's lack of willingness to eliminate this mechanism, which is legal but completely immoral. Our questions remain unanswered. My next question is for the Minister of Finance. The Fdration de la relve agricole du Qubec and the UPA approached the Minister of Finance two weeks ago and still haven't received a response regarding the following issue. We know that many farms don't pay wages. As a result, these farms are being penalized because they aren't eligible for the $40,000 in loans available through the Canada emergency business account. To qualify for these loans, the farms needed a payroll of $20,000 to $1. 5million in 2019. Does the Minister of Finance plan to respond to the farmers who want to access the $40,000 in loansHon. Bill Morneau: Thank you, Ms. DeBellefeuille. We know that the Canada emergency response benefit must be made available to the people who need it.Mr. Damien Kurek: On a point of orderHon. Bill Morneau: about individual cases. When we receive those inquiries, we follow up immediately. I want to assure the member that we'll continue to do that. The work we are doing to stop non-essential travel has been important for the health and safety of Canadians, and we will continue with that work.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: Mr. Chair, my next question has to do with sole proprietor businesses. We see that many of them are not eligible for any of the benefit packages that have been rolled outEI, CERB, the wage subsidy, etc. What is the government going to do to address sole proprietors who are currently falling through the cracksHon. Bill Morneau (Minister of Finance): Mr. Chair, first, let me say that we absolutely recognize there are businesses across the country of all sizes that are finding this to be extremely difficult. The intent of the measures we put forward is obviously not only to give individuals a bridge but to give businesses a bridge. We are looking at ways that we can ensure that the Canada emergency business account has the broadest possible application. More than 500,000 businesses have already been approved for these loans, representing over $20 billion. We are looking at ways we can consider that eligibility process, recognizing that we need to make sure that the program continues to have its desired impact, and we will have more to say on that.The Chair: The next question will go to Mr. Arnold.Mr. Mel Arnold (North OkanaganShuswap, CPC): Mr. Chair, this is my first appearance, so I hope you can hear me okay.The Chair: We can hear you fine. Please proceed.Mr. Mel Arnold: Thank you, Mr. Chair. It's good to see everyone's faces. On April 3, the fisheries minister said opening dates would be determined by harvesters. Since then the minister reacts and deals with it, particularly in northern and vulnerable communities. This is something for which we will need to have a serious approach, with both the Minister of Natural Resources and also our provincial counterparts, to make sure that we aren't taking hasty measures to reopen the economy while we're trying to protectand this is our most important goalindigenous communities from getting exposed and spreading COVID-19.Ms. Niki Ashton: Madam Chair, my question is for the Minister of Fisheries. Hundreds of fishers and their families here in Manitoba who work with the Freshwater Fish Marketing Corporation are desperately calling for emergency support. Many are calling on the federal government to also work with them and the FFMC to redirect their product to domestic markets and communities here at home to address the growing food insecurity people are facing. When will your government announce support for inland fishers, including here in Manitoba, and will you work to ensure that their product, healthy fish, can be provided here at home for people who need itHon. Bernadette Jordan: Madam Chair, we know that COVID-19 is having extreme impacts on northern first nations communities, especially with regard to fisheries in areas that rely on it for not only their livelihoods but also for the cultural importance. Indigenous harvesters are able to access through the aboriginal financial institutions the $306 million we've put in for support for indigenous small and medium-sized businesses. The funding allows for short-term interest-free loans as well as for non-repayable contributions. We also announced earlier that the Canadian Northern Economic Development Agency has made available $15 million in non-repayable support for businesses. We know that there's more that needs to be done to support our first nations communities as well as our harvesters. We're doing everything we can and we will

What did Chrystia Freeland think about restoring Canadian businesses during the pandemic

Hon. Chrystia Freeland was thankful for the farmers who worked hard to feed the country and was pleased that partisanship had been pushed aside to fight the coronavirus. She stood by the idea that no Canadian should have to work in an unsafe environment and put her trust in the Food Inspection Agency to regulate working conditions.

It includes removing the mandatory 10-day reflection period and the number of required witnesses who will witness a person's consent. The petitioners urge the House of Commons to immediately discontinue the removal of safeguards for people requesting euthanasia, and to put in place additional measures to protect vulnerable people. This would require that bill to be amended or not passed. The second petition is with respect to Senate public bill S-204. This is on organ harvesting and trafficking. Petitioners call on members of the House, and hopefully the Senate as well, to support Bill S-204, which would make it a criminal offence for a person to go abroad and receive an organ for which there has not been consent. It would also create provisions under which a person could be made inadmissible to Canada if they had been involved in organ harvesting or trafficking. Thank you very much.The Chair: Thank you. I want to remind all the members that there are specific headsets that have been mandated to all of us. If you don't have one, please talk to your IT ambassador and they will get one to you as quickly as possible. The reason for them is not so much for what you hear, but that our interpreters are working and there are work conditions that really make it difficult. Part of that is not having the appropriate boom on your headset, which will make it very difficult for them to hear and interpret for our members. Now we go to the member for BeachesEast York, Mr. Erskine-Smith.Mr. Nathaniel Erskine-Smith (BeachesEast York, Lib.): Mr. Chair, I had to learn how to tie my tie all over again. It's been so long. I want to thank Jenna Robar, who's led this petition e-2453. The petitioners have noted that there are committee, members may not take photographs of their colleagues or film the proceedings. In order to facilitate the work of our interpreters and ensure orderly meetings, I will outline a few rules. Interpretation of this video conference will be done as it is at normal committee meetings and in the House. At the bottom of your screen, you can choose floor, English or French. As you have seen, I change as I am speaking. I have now switched over to English in order to speak English. If you look at the bottom, you have a little flag that indicates whether it's English or French, and that's how we will be speaking. It makes it easier. That was where we had a little bit of a glitch in the last session. I understand that there are no statements by ministers. We can now proceed to presenting petitions for a period not exceeding 15 minutes. I would like to remind members that petitions presented during a meeting of the special committee must already have been certified by the clerk of petitions. In addition, to ensure that the petition is considered to have been properly presented, the certificate of the petition and each page of the petition for petitions certified in a previous Parliament should be emailed to the committee no later than 6 p. m. on the day before the committee. I thank all the members for their usual co-operation. Thank you all. Now we'll proceed to presenting petitions. Our first petition comes from the honourable member for Sherwood ParkFort Saskatchewan, Mr. Genuis.Mr. Garnett Genuis (Sherwood ParkFort Saskatchewan, CPC): Mr. Chair, I'm pleased to be presenting two petitions today. The first petition is with respect to government Bill C-7. Petitioners raised concerns that this bill removes safeguards from the current euthanasia regime. Justin Trudeau: Yes, Mr. Chair, we have moved forward with a historic national housing strategy that puts $40 billion toward housing. Working with partners, we have reduced poverty by over a million people in this country, but there is more to do. We are reducing homelessness by half with historic investments. We recognize that during this pandemic there's even more to do for vulnerable Canadians, and we are partnering with orders of government to make sure that happens.Mr. Jol Godin (PortneufJacques-Cartier, CPC): A point of order, Mr. Chair.The Chair: Order. Mr. Godin has a point of order.Mr. Jol Godin: Mr. Chair, I cannot hear the French interpretation. Could we please check so that I can hear in French what the Prime Minister is sayingThe Chair: Okay. Can we check thatMr. Jol Godin: Thank you.Right Hon. Justin Trudeau: I can try speaking English. I believe I was on the English tab, as is important. Are you hearing the translation nowThe Chair: That is exactly what the issue was. I just want to point that out to all the members. I'm speaking English right now and I'm on the English toggle at the bottom of the screen. It does create a bit of a disjoint when we're speaking, but it's the way to get around that so we have interpretation that works for everyone. The next question will go to the Leader of the Opposition, Mr. Scheer.Hon. Andrew Scheer (Leader of the Opposition): Mr. Chair, as this is our first opportunity to meet in any forum, I want to take this opportunity to express my condolences to the families of the brave men and women who lost their lives in the helicopter crash. I know that I speak for all parliamentarians when I extend our sympathy to their families and loved ones. That's why we're considering our approach. Of courseMr. Damien Kurek: I have a point of order.The Acting Chair (Mrs. Alexandra Mends): MinisterMorneau, please wait a moment. A member is raising a point of order. Mr. Kurek, do you have a point of order You have to unmute yourself.Mr. Damien Kurek: Yes. It's that the translation is at the same volume as the minister.The Acting Chair (Mrs. Alexandra Mends): You'll have to put yourself on English. Rather, the minister has to put himself on French.Hon. Bill Morneau: Sorry. I was on the English channel. We know that the people who need the Canada emergency response benefit must have access to it. That's why we're considering the challenges each time. If I receive a letter, I'll look at it. Once we have a response, we'll pass it directly on to the member.The Chair: The next question will go to Mr. Richards.Mr. Blake Richards (BanffAirdrie, CPC): This question is for the tourism minister. The tourism ministry was one of the first and hardest-hit industries during this crisis, yet despite the Prime Minister's announcement over three weeks ago now of a plan to bring forward a tourism-specific aid package to help the businesses who employ millions of unemployed Canadians who work in tourism, there's still been nothing from this government. When will the government finally act to provide help to this nearly crippled industryHon. Mlanie Joly (Minister of Economic Development and Official Languages): Mr. Chair, obviously we know that the tourism sector has been deeply impacted. I had the chance to talk to many of the leaders in the sector, and clearly there's a lot of anxiety. We also had the chance to work with all the G20 ministers of tourism all together, and we know we have to actThe Chair: We'll now go about individual cases. When we receive those inquiries, we follow up immediately. I want to assure the member that we'll continue to do that. The work we are doing to stop non-essential travel has been important for the health and safety of Canadians, and we will continue with that work.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: Mr. Chair, my next question has to do with sole proprietor businesses. We see that many of them are not eligible for any of the benefit packages that have been rolled outEI, CERB, the wage subsidy, etc. What is the government going to do to address sole proprietors who are currently falling through the cracksHon. Bill Morneau (Minister of Finance): Mr. Chair, first, let me say that we absolutely recognize there are businesses across the country of all sizes that are finding this to be extremely difficult. The intent of the measures we put forward is obviously not only to give individuals a bridge but to give businesses a bridge. We are looking at ways that we can ensure that the Canada emergency business account has the broadest possible application. More than 500,000 businesses have already been approved for these loans, representing over $20 billion. We are looking at ways we can consider that eligibility process, recognizing that we need to make sure that the program continues to have its desired impact, and we will have more to say on that.The Chair: The next question will go to Mr. Arnold.Mr. Mel Arnold (North OkanaganShuswap, CPC): Mr. Chair, this is my first appearance, so I hope you can hear me okay.The Chair: We can hear you fine. Please proceed.Mr. Mel Arnold: Thank you, Mr. Chair. It's good to see everyone's faces. On April 3, the fisheries minister said opening dates would be determined by harvesters. Since then the minister

Summarize the whole meeting.

The meeting of the standing committee took place to discuss matters pertinent to the Coronavirus pandemic. The main issue at stake was to ensure that the government was doing everything in its power to assist vulnerable Canadians during the pandemic, as well as to help reopen the economy. While many discussions focused on temporary assistance that the government could provide during the pandemic, like a $25 weekly bump in old-age security, some discussions talked about the intersection of these programs with general social welfare initiatives, like reducing homelessness and poverty. Canada's agricultural and fishing economy was highlighted as one of the industries in the greatest need for stimulus. Conservative ministers tried to bring attention to the government's recent gun control laws.

there are lots of different ways it's being done.Postdoc E: OK. Interesting question.Grad D: There's a {disfmarker}Postdoc E: Yes. OK, now first of all {disfmarker} Ooo - ooo! Very important.Grad D:" Ooo - ooo." Postdoc E: Uh Chuck {disfmarker} Chuck led to a refinement here which is to add" NUMS" if these are parts of the read numbers. Now you already know i that I had, uh, in places where they hadn't transcribed numbers, I put" numbers" in place of any kind of numbers, but there are places where they, um, it {disfmarker} th this convention came later an and at the very first digits task in some transcripts they actually transcribed numbers. And, um, d Chuck pointed out that this is read speech, and it's nice to have the option of ignoring it for certain other prob uh p uh, things. And that's why there's this other tag here which occurs a hundred and five {disfmarker} or three hundred and five times right now which is just {disfmarker} well n n" NUMS" by itselfGrad D:" NUMS" , yeah.Postdoc E: which means this is part of the numbers task. I may change it to" digits" . I mean, i with the sed command you can really just change it however you want because it's systematically encoded, you knowGrad D: Yep.Postdoc E: Have to think about what's the best for {disfmarker} for the overall purposes, but in any case, um," numbers" and" NUMS" are a part of this digits task thing. Um, now th Then I have these numbers that have quotation marks around them. Um, I didn't want to put them in as gloss comments because then you get the substitution. And actually, th um, {vocalsound} the reason I b did it this way was because I initially started out to read it as digits not as connected numbers.Postdoc E: Mm - hmm.PhD G: Right, and you can give an example like, you know," six {disfmarker} sixty - one would be read as six one" .Grad D: Right.Postdoc E: Mm - hmm. And i actually it's no more artificial than what we've been doing with words.PhD G: And I think people will get it.Postdoc E: I'm sure people can adapt to this, read it single.PhD G: Right, right.Postdoc E: The spaces already bias it toward being separated.PhD G: It's just easier to read.Postdoc E: And I know I'm gonna find this easier than words.PhD G: Right.Grad D: Oh yeah, absolutely, cognitively it's much easier.PhD G: OK I also had a hard {disfmarker} hard time with the words,Professor F: Yeah.PhD G: but then we went back and forth on that. OK, so let's give that a tryGrad D: OK. And is the spacing alright or do you think there should be more space between digits and groupsProfessor F: OK.PhD G: and {disfmarker}Grad D: Or is that alrightPhD G: I mean what do other people think cuz you guys are reading {comment} them.Postdoc E: I think that i it's fine.Grad D: OK.Postdoc E: I it {disfmarker} it {disfmarker} to me it looks like you've got the func the idea of grouping and you have the grou the idea of separationPhD G: OK.Postdoc E: and, you know, it's just a matter of u i the instructions, that's all.PhD G: Great. OK.Grad D: And I think there are about ten different gouping patternsProfessor F: Let's try it.PhD G: Well let's give it a try.Grad D: isn't that right, Liz That we did.PhD G: Righ - right, and you just {disfmarker} they're randomly {nonvocalsound} generated and randomly assigned to digits.Postdoc E: I did {disfmarker} Mm that we would do it as a separate session,Professor F: yeah.PhD G: Yeah.Grad D: something like that rather than doing it during a real meeting and you know, do two people at a time then three people at a time and things like that. So.PhD G: Can try it out.Grad D: See {disfmarker} see what Dan thinks.PhD G: If we have nothing {disfmarker} if we have no agenda we could do it some week.Grad D: Yeah, right.Professor F: Yeah, yeah. Spend the whole time reading digits with different qu quantities.PhD G: OK.Grad D: I thought this was gonna be fast.Postdoc E: c c Can I can I have an another {disfmarker} another question w about thisGrad D: Oh well.Postdoc E: So, um, there are these digits, which are detached digits, but there are other words that contain the same general phon phoneme sequences. Like" wonderful" has" one" in it and {disfmarker} and Victor Borge had a {disfmarker} had a piece on this where he inflated the digits. Well, I wonder if there's, um, an if there would be a value in having digits that are in essence embedded in real words to compare in terms of like the articulation of" one" in" wonderful" versus" one" as a digit being read.Professor F: That's" two" bad. Yeah.PhD G: I'm all" four" it.Postdoc E: There you go.Grad D: Not after I" eight" though.Professor F: Uh, they don't all work as well, do they Hmm. What does nine work inGrad C: Nein!Grad D: Uh.Professor F: Uh,Grad C: You scream it.Grad D: Nein! You have to be German,Professor F: Oh. In German,PhD A: That's German, yeah.PhD B: It's great for the Germans.Professor F: yeah.Grad D: yeah.PhD G: Oh, oh!Postdoc E: Nein.Professor F: That's right!PhD A: Yeah.Grad D: Oh!Grad C: It only sounds w good when cause the people who would have been collecting digits the other way to not have the digits.Professor F: Yeah. We can go back to the other thing later.PhD G: So {disfmarker}Professor F: I mean we s we {disfmarker} we've {disfmarker} We can do this for awhilePhD G: OK.Professor F: and then go back to digits for awhile, or um. Do yo I mean, do you want {disfmarker} do you want this {disfmarker} Do you need training data or adaptation data out of thisPhD G: OK.Professor F: How much of this do you need with uh the {disfmarker}PhD G: It's actually unclear right now. I just thought well we're {disfmarker} if we're collec collecting digits, and Adam had said we were running out of the TI forms, I thought it'd be nice to have them in groups, and probably, all else being equal, it'd be better for me to just have single digitsProfessor F: OK.PhD G: since it's, you know, a recognizer's gonna do better on those anyway, um, and it's more predictable. So we can know from the transcript what the person said and the transcriber, in general.Professor F: OK, well if you prePhD G: But if they make mistakes, it's no big deal if the people say a hundred instead of" one OO" . and also w maybe we can just let them choose" zero" versus" O" as they {disfmarker} as they like because even the same person c sometimes says" O" and sometimes says" zero" in different context,Professor F: Yeah.PhD G: and that's sort of interesting. So I don't have a Specific need cuz if I did I'd probably try to collect it, you know, without bothering this group, but If we can try it {disfmarker}Grad D: OK so {disfmarker} so I can just add to the instructions Yeah.PhD G: if that's what people want. I {disfmarker} I'mPostdoc E: Yeah.PhD G: don't think that'd be that hard to read them as single digits.Postdoc E: I agree.PhD G: Um, and it seems like that might be better for you guys since then you'll have just more digit data,Grad D: Right.PhD G: and that's always a good thing.Grad D: Yep.PhD G: It's a little bit better for me too because the digits are easier to recognize. They're better trained than the numbers.Grad D: So we could just, uh, put in the instructions" read them as digits" .Professor F: Right.PhD G: Right. Right, read them as single digits, so sixty - one w is read as six one,Postdoc E: Mm - hmm.PhD G: and if people make a mistake we {disfmarker}Grad D: How about" O" versus" zero" Professor F: I mean, the other thing is we could just bag it because it's {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker} it's - I'm not worrying about it I mean, because we do have digits training data that we have from uh from OGI. I'm sorry, digits {disfmarker} numbers training that we have from OGI, we've done lots and lots of studies with that. And um.PhD G: But it's nice to get it in this room with the acousProfessor F: Yeah.PhD G: I mean {disfmarker} for {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker}Professor F: No, no, I guess what I'm saying is thatGrad D: Just let them read it how they read it.Professor F: to some extent maybe we could just read them {disfmarker} have them read how {disfmarker} how they read it and it just means that we have to expand our {disfmarker} our vocabulary out to stuff that we already have.PhD G: Right. Well that's fine with me as long as {disfmarker} It's just that I didn't want to

Summarize what was said about digits form

Digits forms will instruct speakers to read digits separately and not as connected numbers. A tentative decision was made to collect overlapping digits from speakers.

there are lots of different ways it's being done.Postdoc E: OK. Interesting question.Grad D: There's a {disfmarker}Postdoc E: Yes. OK, now first of all {disfmarker} Ooo - ooo! Very important.Grad D:" Ooo - ooo." Postdoc E: Uh Chuck {disfmarker} Chuck led to a refinement here which is to add" NUMS" if these are parts of the read numbers. Now you already know i that I had, uh, in places where they hadn't transcribed numbers, I put" numbers" in place of any kind of numbers, but there are places where they, um, it {disfmarker} th this convention came later an and at the very first digits task in some transcripts they actually transcribed numbers. And, um, d Chuck pointed out that this is read speech, and it's nice to have the option of ignoring it for certain other prob uh p uh, things. And that's why there's this other tag here which occurs a hundred and five {disfmarker} or three hundred and five times right now which is just {disfmarker} well n n" NUMS" by itselfGrad D:" NUMS" , yeah.Postdoc E: which means this is part of the numbers task. I may change it to" digits" . I mean, i with the sed command you can really just change it however you want because it's systematically encoded, you knowGrad D: Yep.Postdoc E: Have to think about what's the best for {disfmarker} for the overall purposes, but in any case, um," numbers" and" NUMS" are a part of this digits task thing. Um, now th Then I have these numbers that have quotation marks around them. Um, I didn't want to put them in as gloss comments because then you get the substitution. And actually, th um, {vocalsound} the reason I b did it this way was because I initially started out to read it as digits not as connected numbers.Postdoc E: Mm - hmm.PhD G: Right, and you can give an example like, you know," six {disfmarker} sixty - one would be read as six one" .Grad D: Right.Postdoc E: Mm - hmm. And i actually it's no more artificial than what we've been doing with words.PhD G: And I think people will get it.Postdoc E: I'm sure people can adapt to this, read it single.PhD G: Right, right.Postdoc E: The spaces already bias it toward being separated.PhD G: It's just easier to read.Postdoc E: And I know I'm gonna find this easier than words.PhD G: Right.Grad D: Oh yeah, absolutely, cognitively it's much easier.PhD G: OK I also had a hard {disfmarker} hard time with the words,Professor F: Yeah.PhD G: but then we went back and forth on that. OK, so let's give that a tryGrad D: OK. And is the spacing alright or do you think there should be more space between digits and groupsProfessor F: OK.PhD G: and {disfmarker}Grad D: Or is that alrightPhD G: I mean what do other people think cuz you guys are reading {comment} them.Postdoc E: I think that i it's fine.Grad D: OK.Postdoc E: I it {disfmarker} it {disfmarker} to me it looks like you've got the func the idea of grouping and you have the grou the idea of separationPhD G: OK.Postdoc E: and, you know, it's just a matter of u i the instructions, that's all.PhD G: Great. OK.Grad D: And I think there are about ten different gouping patternsProfessor F: Let's try it.PhD G: Well let's give it a try.Grad D: isn't that right, Liz That we did.PhD G: Righ - right, and you just {disfmarker} they're randomly {nonvocalsound} generated and randomly assigned to digits.Postdoc E: I did {disfmarker} Mm Yeah.PhD G: if that's what people want. I {disfmarker} I'mPostdoc E: Yeah.PhD G: don't think that'd be that hard to read them as single digits.Postdoc E: I agree.PhD G: Um, and it seems like that might be better for you guys since then you'll have just more digit data,Grad D: Right.PhD G: and that's always a good thing.Grad D: Yep.PhD G: It's a little bit better for me too because the digits are easier to recognize. They're better trained than the numbers.Grad D: So we could just, uh, put in the instructions" read them as digits" .Professor F: Right.PhD G: Right. Right, read them as single digits, so sixty - one w is read as six one,Postdoc E: Mm - hmm.PhD G: and if people make a mistake we {disfmarker}Grad D: How about" O" versus" zero" Professor F: I mean, the other thing is we could just bag it because it's {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker} it's - I'm not worrying about it I mean, because we do have digits training data that we have from uh from OGI. I'm sorry, digits {disfmarker} numbers training that we have from OGI, we've done lots and lots of studies with that. And um.PhD G: But it's nice to get it in this room with the acousProfessor F: Yeah.PhD G: I mean {disfmarker} for {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker}Professor F: No, no, I guess what I'm saying is thatGrad D: Just let them read it how they read it.Professor F: to some extent maybe we could just read them {disfmarker} have them read how {disfmarker} how they read it and it just means that we have to expand our {disfmarker} our vocabulary out to stuff that we already have.PhD G: Right. Well that's fine with me as long as {disfmarker} It's just that I didn't want to cause the people who would have been collecting digits the other way to not have the digits.Professor F: Yeah. We can go back to the other thing later.PhD G: So {disfmarker}Professor F: I mean we s we {disfmarker} we've {disfmarker} We can do this for awhilePhD G: OK.Professor F: and then go back to digits for awhile, or um. Do yo I mean, do you want {disfmarker} do you want this {disfmarker} Do you need training data or adaptation data out of thisPhD G: OK.Professor F: How much of this do you need with uh the {disfmarker}PhD G: It's actually unclear right now. I just thought well we're {disfmarker} if we're collec collecting digits, and Adam had said we were running out of the TI forms, I thought it'd be nice to have them in groups, and probably, all else being equal, it'd be better for me to just have single digitsProfessor F: OK.PhD G: since it's, you know, a recognizer's gonna do better on those anyway, um, and it's more predictable. So we can know from the transcript what the person said and the transcriber, in general.Professor F: OK, well if you prePhD G: But if they make mistakes, it's no big deal if the people say a hundred instead of" one OO" . and also w maybe we can just let them choose" zero" versus" O" as they {disfmarker} as they like because even the same person c sometimes says" O" and sometimes says" zero" in different context,Professor F: Yeah.PhD G: and that's sort of interesting. So I don't have a Specific need cuz if I did I'd probably try to collect it, you know, without bothering this group, but If we can try it {disfmarker}Grad D: OK so {disfmarker} so I can just add to the instructions that we would do it as a separate session,Professor F: yeah.PhD G: Yeah.Grad D: something like that rather than doing it during a real meeting and you know, do two people at a time then three people at a time and things like that. So.PhD G: Can try it out.Grad D: See {disfmarker} see what Dan thinks.PhD G: If we have nothing {disfmarker} if we have no agenda we could do it some week.Grad D: Yeah, right.Professor F: Yeah, yeah. Spend the whole time reading digits with different qu quantities.PhD G: OK.Grad D: I thought this was gonna be fast.Postdoc E: c c Can I can I have an another {disfmarker} another question w about thisGrad D: Oh well.Postdoc E: So, um, there are these digits, which are detached digits, but there are other words that contain the same general phon phoneme sequences. Like" wonderful" has" one" in it and {disfmarker} and Victor Borge had a {disfmarker} had a piece on this where he inflated the digits. Well, I wonder if there's, um, an if there would be a value in having digits that are in essence embedded in real words to compare in terms of like the articulation of" one" in" wonderful" versus" one" as a digit being read.Professor F: That's" two" bad. Yeah.PhD G: I'm all" four" it.Postdoc E: There you go.Grad D: Not after I" eight" though.Professor F: Uh, they don't all work as well, do they Hmm. What does nine work inGrad C: Nein!Grad D: Uh.Professor F: Uh,Grad C: You scream it.Grad D: Nein! You have to be German,Professor F: Oh. In German,PhD A: That's German, yeah.PhD B: It's great for the Germans.Professor F: yeah.Grad D: yeah.PhD G: Oh, oh!Postdoc E: Nein.Professor F: That's right!PhD A: Yeah.Grad D: Oh!Grad C: It only sounds w good when

What's the status of digits data

A test set of digits data totalling two hours is nearly complete. Digit extraction has been performed on roughly half of this data

readability to such an extent by simply something like" percent" . Now I {disfmarker} I could have adopted a similar convention for" percent" , but somehow percent is not so hard, you knowGrad D: Hmm.Postdoc E: i It's just when you have these points and you're trying to figure out where the decimal places are {disfmarker} And we could always add it later. Percent's easy to detect. Point however is {disfmarker} is uh a word that has a couple different meanings. And you'll find both of those in one of these meetings, where he's saying" well the first point I wanna make is so - and - so" and he goes through four points, and also has all these decimals.PhD B: So Liz, what does the recognizer do,Postdoc E: So.PhD B: uh,Professor F: Hmm.PhD B: what does the SRI recognizer output for things like that" seven point five" . Does it output the word {disfmarker}PhD G:" Seven point five" .PhD B: Right, the word" seven" Grad D: Well, the numbersPhD B: The number" seven" PhD G: The word.PhD B: The word" seven" , OK.Professor F: Yeah.PhD G: Yeah.Professor F: So I'd {disfmarker} so" I'd like {disfmarker} I'd like to talk about point five" .PhD G: And {disfmarker} and actually, you know the language {disfmarker}Professor F: Yeah.PhD G: it's the same point, actually, the {disfmarker} the p you know, the word" to" and the word y th" going to" and" to go to" those are two different" to's" and so there's no distinction there.PhD B: Mm - hmm.PhD G: It's just {disfmarker} just the word" point" has {disfmarker} Yeah, every word has only one, yeah e one version even if {disfmarker} even if it's {disfmarker} A actually even like the word" read" {comment} and" read" Those are two different words. They're Yeah.PhD G: if that's what people want. I {disfmarker} I'mPostdoc E: Yeah.PhD G: don't think that'd be that hard to read them as single digits.Postdoc E: I agree.PhD G: Um, and it seems like that might be better for you guys since then you'll have just more digit data,Grad D: Right.PhD G: and that's always a good thing.Grad D: Yep.PhD G: It's a little bit better for me too because the digits are easier to recognize. They're better trained than the numbers.Grad D: So we could just, uh, put in the instructions" read them as digits" .Professor F: Right.PhD G: Right. Right, read them as single digits, so sixty - one w is read as six one,Postdoc E: Mm - hmm.PhD G: and if people make a mistake we {disfmarker}Grad D: How about" O" versus" zero" Professor F: I mean, the other thing is we could just bag it because it's {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker} it's - I'm not worrying about it I mean, because we do have digits training data that we have from uh from OGI. I'm sorry, digits {disfmarker} numbers training that we have from OGI, we've done lots and lots of studies with that. And um.PhD G: But it's nice to get it in this room with the acousProfessor F: Yeah.PhD G: I mean {disfmarker} for {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker}Professor F: No, no, I guess what I'm saying is thatGrad D: Just let them read it how they read it.Professor F: to some extent maybe we could just read them {disfmarker} have them read how {disfmarker} how they read it and it just means that we have to expand our {disfmarker} our vocabulary out to stuff that we already have.PhD G: Right. Well that's fine with me as long as {disfmarker} It's just that I didn't want to to read it as digits not as connected numbers.Postdoc E: Mm - hmm.PhD G: Right, and you can give an example like, you know," six {disfmarker} sixty - one would be read as six one" .Grad D: Right.Postdoc E: Mm - hmm. And i actually it's no more artificial than what we've been doing with words.PhD G: And I think people will get it.Postdoc E: I'm sure people can adapt to this, read it single.PhD G: Right, right.Postdoc E: The spaces already bias it toward being separated.PhD G: It's just easier to read.Postdoc E: And I know I'm gonna find this easier than words.PhD G: Right.Grad D: Oh yeah, absolutely, cognitively it's much easier.PhD G: OK I also had a hard {disfmarker} hard time with the words,Professor F: Yeah.PhD G: but then we went back and forth on that. OK, so let's give that a tryGrad D: OK. And is the spacing alright or do you think there should be more space between digits and groupsProfessor F: OK.PhD G: and {disfmarker}Grad D: Or is that alrightPhD G: I mean what do other people think cuz you guys are reading {comment} them.Postdoc E: I think that i it's fine.Grad D: OK.Postdoc E: I it {disfmarker} it {disfmarker} to me it looks like you've got the func the idea of grouping and you have the grou the idea of separationPhD G: OK.Postdoc E: and, you know, it's just a matter of u i the instructions, that's all.PhD G: Great. OK.Grad D: And I think there are about ten different gouping patternsProfessor F: Let's try it.PhD G: Well let's give it a try.Grad D: isn't that right, Liz That we did.PhD G: Righ - right, and you just {disfmarker} they're randomly {nonvocalsound} generated and randomly assigned to digits.Postdoc E: I did {disfmarker} Mm there are lots of different ways it's being done.Postdoc E: OK. Interesting question.Grad D: There's a {disfmarker}Postdoc E: Yes. OK, now first of all {disfmarker} Ooo - ooo! Very important.Grad D:" Ooo - ooo." Postdoc E: Uh Chuck {disfmarker} Chuck led to a refinement here which is to add" NUMS" if these are parts of the read numbers. Now you already know i that I had, uh, in places where they hadn't transcribed numbers, I put" numbers" in place of any kind of numbers, but there are places where they, um, it {disfmarker} th this convention came later an and at the very first digits task in some transcripts they actually transcribed numbers. And, um, d Chuck pointed out that this is read speech, and it's nice to have the option of ignoring it for certain other prob uh p uh, things. And that's why there's this other tag here which occurs a hundred and five {disfmarker} or three hundred and five times right now which is just {disfmarker} well n n" NUMS" by itselfGrad D:" NUMS" , yeah.Postdoc E: which means this is part of the numbers task. I may change it to" digits" . I mean, i with the sed command you can really just change it however you want because it's systematically encoded, you knowGrad D: Yep.Postdoc E: Have to think about what's the best for {disfmarker} for the overall purposes, but in any case, um," numbers" and" NUMS" are a part of this digits task thing. Um, now th Then I have these numbers that have quotation marks around them. Um, I didn't want to put them in as gloss comments because then you get the substitution. And actually, th um, {vocalsound} the reason I b did it this way was because I initially started out cause the people who would have been collecting digits the other way to not have the digits.Professor F: Yeah. We can go back to the other thing later.PhD G: So {disfmarker}Professor F: I mean we s we {disfmarker} we've {disfmarker} We can do this for awhilePhD G: OK.Professor F: and then go back to digits for awhile, or um. Do yo I mean, do you want {disfmarker} do you want this {disfmarker} Do you need training data or adaptation data out of thisPhD G: OK.Professor F: How much of this do you need with uh the {disfmarker}PhD G: It's actually unclear right now. I just thought well we're {disfmarker} if we're collec collecting digits, and Adam had said we were running out of the TI forms, I thought it'd be nice to have them in groups, and probably, all else being equal, it'd be better for me to just have single digitsProfessor F: OK.PhD G: since it's, you know, a recognizer's gonna do better on those anyway, um, and it's more predictable. So we can know from the transcript what the person said and the transcriber, in general.Professor F: OK, well if you prePhD G: But if they make mistakes, it's no big deal if the people say a hundred instead of" one OO" . and also w maybe we can just let them choose" zero" versus" O" as they {disfmarker} as they like because even the same person c sometimes says" O" and sometimes says" zero" in different context,Professor F: Yeah.PhD G: and that's sort of interesting. So I don't have a Specific need cuz if I did I'd probably try to collect it, you know, without bothering this group, but If we can try it {disfmarker}Grad D: OK so {disfmarker} so I can just add to the instructions

What additional assignments were proposed about the digits

Future work may involve experimenting with the reading of digits in different prosodic groupings.

there are lots of different ways it's being done.Postdoc E: OK. Interesting question.Grad D: There's a {disfmarker}Postdoc E: Yes. OK, now first of all {disfmarker} Ooo - ooo! Very important.Grad D:" Ooo - ooo." Postdoc E: Uh Chuck {disfmarker} Chuck led to a refinement here which is to add" NUMS" if these are parts of the read numbers. Now you already know i that I had, uh, in places where they hadn't transcribed numbers, I put" numbers" in place of any kind of numbers, but there are places where they, um, it {disfmarker} th this convention came later an and at the very first digits task in some transcripts they actually transcribed numbers. And, um, d Chuck pointed out that this is read speech, and it's nice to have the option of ignoring it for certain other prob uh p uh, things. And that's why there's this other tag here which occurs a hundred and five {disfmarker} or three hundred and five times right now which is just {disfmarker} well n n" NUMS" by itselfGrad D:" NUMS" , yeah.Postdoc E: which means this is part of the numbers task. I may change it to" digits" . I mean, i with the sed command you can really just change it however you want because it's systematically encoded, you knowGrad D: Yep.Postdoc E: Have to think about what's the best for {disfmarker} for the overall purposes, but in any case, um," numbers" and" NUMS" are a part of this digits task thing. Um, now th Then I have these numbers that have quotation marks around them. Um, I didn't want to put them in as gloss comments because then you get the substitution. And actually, th um, {vocalsound} the reason I b did it this way was because I initially started out this master copy of the transcript, it's gonna be modified by scripts t into these two different functions. And actually the master {disfmarker}PhD B: Two or more. Two or more different functions.Postdoc E: Two {disfmarker} two or more. And that the master is gonna be the channelized version.PhD B: Right.Postdoc E: So right now we've taken this i initial one, it was a single channel basically the way it was input. And now, uh, thanks to the advances made in the interface, we can from now on use the channelized part, and, um, any changes that are made get made in the channelized version kind of thing. But I wanted to get all the finished {disfmarker} all the checks {disfmarker}PhD B: Yeah, so that has implications for your script.Grad C: Yeah. So, uh, have those {disfmarker} e e the vis the ten hours that have been transcribed already, have those been channelized And I know {disfmarker} I've seen @ @ {disfmarker} I've seen they've been channelized,Postdoc E: Yes, they have.Grad D: All ten hoursGrad C: butPostdoc E: Except for the missing thirty minutes.Grad C: have they uh {disfmarker} have they been {disfmarker} has the time {disfmarker} have the time markings been adjusted, uh, p on a per channel {disfmarker}Grad D: Great.Postdoc E: Uh, for {disfmarker} for a total of like twenty m f for a total of {disfmarker} Let's see, four times {disfmarker} total of about an {disfmarker} {pause} thirty minutes. That's {disfmarker} that's been the case.Grad C: So,Postdoc E: And plus the training, whatever you have.Grad C: I guess, I mean, I don't know if we should talk about this now, or not, but IGrad D: Well it's just we're {pause} missing tea.Grad C: Yeah, I know.Grad D: So.Grad C: No, but I mean my question is like should - repairs and all these other factors, that there're lots of things to be, um, s standardized and streamlined and checked on. And, um, so, I did a bunch of checks, and the first thing I did was obviously a spell - check. And at that point I discovered certain things like, um," accommodate" with one" M" , that kind of thing. And then, in addition to that, I did an exhaustive listing of the forms in the data file, which included n detecting things like f faulty punctuation and things {disfmarker}PhD B: I'm {disfmarker} I'm sorry to interruptPostdoc E: YeahPhD B: you could {disfmarker} could I just back up a little bitPostdoc E: Sure, please,PhD B: and {disfmarker}Postdoc E: yeah, please, please.PhD B: So you're doing these {disfmarker} So {pause} the whole process is that the transcribers get the conversationPostdoc E: Yeah, yeah, yeah.PhD B: and they do their pass over it.Postdoc E: Yes.PhD B: And then when they're finished with it, it comes to you,Postdoc E: That's right.PhD B: and you begin these sanit these quality checks.Postdoc E: Exactly. I do these checks.PhD B: OK.Postdoc E: Uh - huh.PhD B: OK.Postdoc E: Exactly. Yeah. Thank you. And so, uh, I do a {disfmarker} an exhaustive listing of the forms {disfmarker} Actually, I will go through this in {disfmarker} in order, so if {disfmarker} if we could maybe wait and stick keep that for a second cuz we're not ready for that.Grad D: So on the fifth page, seven down {disfmarker}Postdoc E: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly! Exactly! Alright so, {vocalsound} a spelling check first then an exhaustive listing of the, uh {disfmarker} all the forms in the data with the punctuation attached and at that point I pick up things like, oh, you know, word followed by two was just {disfmarker} I mean, originally I had done before like the channelized versions were coming out.PhD B: Right. Right.Grad C: Um,PhD B: So I {disfmarker} I th I think probably the way it'll go is that, you know, when we make this first general version and then start working on the script, that script @ @ that will be ma you know primarily come from what you've done, um, we'll need to work on a channelized version of those originals.Grad C: and so it's a question of like what {disfmarker} Mm - hmm. Mm - hmm.Postdoc E: Mm - hmm.PhD B: And so it should be pretty much identical to what you have t except for the one that they've already tightened the boundaries on.Postdoc E: Yep. Mm - hmm.Grad C: Right.PhD B: Um, SoPostdoc E: Yeah, I mean {disfmarker}PhD B: uh, and then probably what will happen is as the transcribers finish tightening more and more, you know, that original version will get updatedPostdoc E: yeah.PhD B: and then we'll rerun the script and produce better uh versions.Grad C: OK.PhD B: But the {disfmarker} I guess the ef the effect for you guys, because you're pulling out the little wave forms into separate ones, that would mean these boundaries are constantly changing you'd have to constantly re rerun that,Grad C: I know.PhD B: so, maybe {disfmarker}Grad C: Right.Postdoc E: But that {disfmarker}PhD G: But that {disfmarker} that's not hard.Postdoc E: Mm - hmm.Grad C: No.PhD G: I I think the harder part is making sure that the transc the transcription {disfmarker}PhD B: OK.PhD G: So if you b merge two things, then you know that it's the sum of the transcripts, but if you split inside something, you don't where the word {disfmarker} which words moved.PhD B: Mm paper.Grad D: OK.PhD G: Yeah, yeah.Grad D: OK then, it's already been mailed.PhD G: So, we basically, um, did a lot of work on thatProfessor F: yeah.PhD G: and it's {disfmarker} Let's see, th I guess the other neat thing is it shows for sure w that the lapel, you know within speaker is bad.Grad D: HorriblePhD G: And it's bad because it picks up the overlapping speech.PhD A: So, your {disfmarker} your ASR results were run on the channels synchronized,PhD G: Yes, cuz that's all that w had been transcribed at the time,PhD A: OK. OK. OK.PhD G: um but as we {disfmarker} I mean I wanted to here more about the transcription. If we can get the channel asynchronous or the {disfmarker}PhD A: Yeah.PhD G: the closer t that would be very interesting for usPhD B: So if {disfmarker}PhD G: because we {disfmarker}Professor F: Yeah, that's {disfmarker} that's why I only used the part from usePhD A: Yeah.Professor F: which we had uh about uh about the alt over all the channelsPhD A: Yeah.PhD G: Right. That's {disfmarker}PhD A: Yeah sure. Yeah.Professor F: or mixed channelPhD A: Yeah.Professor F: rather mixed signal.PhD B: So if there was a segment of speech this longPhD G: cuz {disfmarker}PhD A: Yeah.PhD B: and oh and someone said" oh," the whole thing was passed to the recognizerGrad D: And someone said" oh" in the front {disfmarker} in the middle.PhD A: There were several speakers in it, yeah.PhD G: That's right. In fact I {disfmarker} I pulled out a couple classic examples in case you wanna u use them in your talk ofPhD B: That's why there's so many insertion errorsGrad C: Mm - hmm.PhD G: Chuck on the lapel, so Chuck wore the lapel three out of four times.Grad C: Mmm.Grad D:

What was said on the status of transcription

Transcription checking procedures were reviewed, and efforts to coordinate the channelization and presegmention of data with the tightening of time bins were discussed.

this master copy of the transcript, it's gonna be modified by scripts t into these two different functions. And actually the master {disfmarker}PhD B: Two or more. Two or more different functions.Postdoc E: Two {disfmarker} two or more. And that the master is gonna be the channelized version.PhD B: Right.Postdoc E: So right now we've taken this i initial one, it was a single channel basically the way it was input. And now, uh, thanks to the advances made in the interface, we can from now on use the channelized part, and, um, any changes that are made get made in the channelized version kind of thing. But I wanted to get all the finished {disfmarker} all the checks {disfmarker}PhD B: Yeah, so that has implications for your script.Grad C: Yeah. So, uh, have those {disfmarker} e e the vis the ten hours that have been transcribed already, have those been channelized And I know {disfmarker} I've seen @ @ {disfmarker} I've seen they've been channelized,Postdoc E: Yes, they have.Grad D: All ten hoursGrad C: butPostdoc E: Except for the missing thirty minutes.Grad C: have they uh {disfmarker} have they been {disfmarker} has the time {disfmarker} have the time markings been adjusted, uh, p on a per channel {disfmarker}Grad D: Great.Postdoc E: Uh, for {disfmarker} for a total of like twenty m f for a total of {disfmarker} Let's see, four times {disfmarker} total of about an {disfmarker} {pause} thirty minutes. That's {disfmarker} that's been the case.Grad C: So,Postdoc E: And plus the training, whatever you have.Grad C: I guess, I mean, I don't know if we should talk about this now, or not, but IGrad D: Well it's just we're {pause} missing tea.Grad C: Yeah, I know.Grad D: So.Grad C: No, but I mean my question is like should - repairs and all these other factors, that there're lots of things to be, um, s standardized and streamlined and checked on. And, um, so, I did a bunch of checks, and the first thing I did was obviously a spell - check. And at that point I discovered certain things like, um," accommodate" with one" M" , that kind of thing. And then, in addition to that, I did an exhaustive listing of the forms in the data file, which included n detecting things like f faulty punctuation and things {disfmarker}PhD B: I'm {disfmarker} I'm sorry to interruptPostdoc E: YeahPhD B: you could {disfmarker} could I just back up a little bitPostdoc E: Sure, please,PhD B: and {disfmarker}Postdoc E: yeah, please, please.PhD B: So you're doing these {disfmarker} So {pause} the whole process is that the transcribers get the conversationPostdoc E: Yeah, yeah, yeah.PhD B: and they do their pass over it.Postdoc E: Yes.PhD B: And then when they're finished with it, it comes to you,Postdoc E: That's right.PhD B: and you begin these sanit these quality checks.Postdoc E: Exactly. I do these checks.PhD B: OK.Postdoc E: Uh - huh.PhD B: OK.Postdoc E: Exactly. Yeah. Thank you. And so, uh, I do a {disfmarker} an exhaustive listing of the forms {disfmarker} Actually, I will go through this in {disfmarker} in order, so if {disfmarker} if we could maybe wait and stick keep that for a second cuz we're not ready for that.Grad D: So on the fifth page, seven down {disfmarker}Postdoc E: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly! Exactly! Alright so, {vocalsound} a spelling check first then an exhaustive listing of the, uh {disfmarker} all the forms in the data with the punctuation attached and at that point I pick up things like, oh, you know, word followed by two language, finds the time - marks for that particular one, do it that way. The way they're doing it, you have that already extracted and it's embedded in the file name. And so, you know, you just say {disfmarker}PhD G: We - yeah that's {disfmarker} so that's part of itGrad D: y so you just say you know" asterisk E asterisk dot wave" , and you get what you want.PhD G: is {disfmarker} Right. And the other part is just that once they're written out it {disfmarker} it is a lot faster to {disfmarker} to process them.Grad D: Rather than doing seeks through the file.PhD G: So. Otherwise, you're just accessing {disfmarker}Grad D: This is all just temporary access, so I don't {disfmarker} I think {disfmarker} it's all just {disfmarker} It's fine. You know. Fine to do it however is convenient.PhD G: Right.Professor F: I mean it just depends how big the file is. If the file sits in memory you can do extremely fast seeksPhD G: Right. The other thing is that, believe it or not {disfmarker} I mean, we have some {disfmarker}Professor F: but.Grad D: Yeah and they don't. Two gigPhD G: So we're also looking at these in Waves like for the alignments and so forth. You can't load an hour of speech into X Waves.Professor F: Yeah.PhD G: You need to s have these small files, and in fact, even for the Transcriber program Um {disfmarker}Grad D: Yes you can.PhD B: Yeah, you {disfmarker} you can give Waves a start and an end time. And middle.PhD G: Yeah, if you try to load s really long waveform into X Waves, you'll be waiting there for {disfmarker}PhD B: No, I {disfmarker} I'm not suggesting you load a long wave file,PhD G: OhPhD B: I'm just saying you was just {disfmarker} I mean, originally I had done before like the channelized versions were coming out.PhD B: Right. Right.Grad C: Um,PhD B: So I {disfmarker} I th I think probably the way it'll go is that, you know, when we make this first general version and then start working on the script, that script @ @ that will be ma you know primarily come from what you've done, um, we'll need to work on a channelized version of those originals.Grad C: and so it's a question of like what {disfmarker} Mm - hmm. Mm - hmm.Postdoc E: Mm - hmm.PhD B: And so it should be pretty much identical to what you have t except for the one that they've already tightened the boundaries on.Postdoc E: Yep. Mm - hmm.Grad C: Right.PhD B: Um, SoPostdoc E: Yeah, I mean {disfmarker}PhD B: uh, and then probably what will happen is as the transcribers finish tightening more and more, you know, that original version will get updatedPostdoc E: yeah.PhD B: and then we'll rerun the script and produce better uh versions.Grad C: OK.PhD B: But the {disfmarker} I guess the ef the effect for you guys, because you're pulling out the little wave forms into separate ones, that would mean these boundaries are constantly changing you'd have to constantly re rerun that,Grad C: I know.PhD B: so, maybe {disfmarker}Grad C: Right.Postdoc E: But that {disfmarker}PhD G: But that {disfmarker} that's not hard.Postdoc E: Mm - hmm.Grad C: No.PhD G: I I think the harder part is making sure that the transc the transcription {disfmarker}PhD B: OK.PhD G: So if you b merge two things, then you know that it's the sum of the transcripts, but if you split inside something, you don't where the word {disfmarker} which words moved.PhD B: Mm cause the people who would have been collecting digits the other way to not have the digits.Professor F: Yeah. We can go back to the other thing later.PhD G: So {disfmarker}Professor F: I mean we s we {disfmarker} we've {disfmarker} We can do this for awhilePhD G: OK.Professor F: and then go back to digits for awhile, or um. Do yo I mean, do you want {disfmarker} do you want this {disfmarker} Do you need training data or adaptation data out of thisPhD G: OK.Professor F: How much of this do you need with uh the {disfmarker}PhD G: It's actually unclear right now. I just thought well we're {disfmarker} if we're collec collecting digits, and Adam had said we were running out of the TI forms, I thought it'd be nice to have them in groups, and probably, all else being equal, it'd be better for me to just have single digitsProfessor F: OK.PhD G: since it's, you know, a recognizer's gonna do better on those anyway, um, and it's more predictable. So we can know from the transcript what the person said and the transcriber, in general.Professor F: OK, well if you prePhD G: But if they make mistakes, it's no big deal if the people say a hundred instead of" one OO" . and also w maybe we can just let them choose" zero" versus" O" as they {disfmarker} as they like because even the same person c sometimes says" O" and sometimes says" zero" in different context,Professor F: Yeah.PhD G: and that's sort of interesting. So I don't have a Specific need cuz if I did I'd probably try to collect it, you know, without bothering this group, but If we can try it {disfmarker}Grad D: OK so {disfmarker} so I can just add to the instructions

What solution was proposed for the transcribers

Transcribers will be given channelized data that has been segmented for speech/non-speech boundaries to determine whether such pre-processing facilitates the transcription process.

this master copy of the transcript, it's gonna be modified by scripts t into these two different functions. And actually the master {disfmarker}PhD B: Two or more. Two or more different functions.Postdoc E: Two {disfmarker} two or more. And that the master is gonna be the channelized version.PhD B: Right.Postdoc E: So right now we've taken this i initial one, it was a single channel basically the way it was input. And now, uh, thanks to the advances made in the interface, we can from now on use the channelized part, and, um, any changes that are made get made in the channelized version kind of thing. But I wanted to get all the finished {disfmarker} all the checks {disfmarker}PhD B: Yeah, so that has implications for your script.Grad C: Yeah. So, uh, have those {disfmarker} e e the vis the ten hours that have been transcribed already, have those been channelized And I know {disfmarker} I've seen @ @ {disfmarker} I've seen they've been channelized,Postdoc E: Yes, they have.Grad D: All ten hoursGrad C: butPostdoc E: Except for the missing thirty minutes.Grad C: have they uh {disfmarker} have they been {disfmarker} has the time {disfmarker} have the time markings been adjusted, uh, p on a per channel {disfmarker}Grad D: Great.Postdoc E: Uh, for {disfmarker} for a total of like twenty m f for a total of {disfmarker} Let's see, four times {disfmarker} total of about an {disfmarker} {pause} thirty minutes. That's {disfmarker} that's been the case.Grad C: So,Postdoc E: And plus the training, whatever you have.Grad C: I guess, I mean, I don't know if we should talk about this now, or not, but IGrad D: Well it's just we're {pause} missing tea.Grad C: Yeah, I know.Grad D: So.Grad C: No, but I mean my question is like should - repairs and all these other factors, that there're lots of things to be, um, s standardized and streamlined and checked on. And, um, so, I did a bunch of checks, and the first thing I did was obviously a spell - check. And at that point I discovered certain things like, um," accommodate" with one" M" , that kind of thing. And then, in addition to that, I did an exhaustive listing of the forms in the data file, which included n detecting things like f faulty punctuation and things {disfmarker}PhD B: I'm {disfmarker} I'm sorry to interruptPostdoc E: YeahPhD B: you could {disfmarker} could I just back up a little bitPostdoc E: Sure, please,PhD B: and {disfmarker}Postdoc E: yeah, please, please.PhD B: So you're doing these {disfmarker} So {pause} the whole process is that the transcribers get the conversationPostdoc E: Yeah, yeah, yeah.PhD B: and they do their pass over it.Postdoc E: Yes.PhD B: And then when they're finished with it, it comes to you,Postdoc E: That's right.PhD B: and you begin these sanit these quality checks.Postdoc E: Exactly. I do these checks.PhD B: OK.Postdoc E: Uh - huh.PhD B: OK.Postdoc E: Exactly. Yeah. Thank you. And so, uh, I do a {disfmarker} an exhaustive listing of the forms {disfmarker} Actually, I will go through this in {disfmarker} in order, so if {disfmarker} if we could maybe wait and stick keep that for a second cuz we're not ready for that.Grad D: So on the fifth page, seven down {disfmarker}Postdoc E: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly! Exactly! Alright so, {vocalsound} a spelling check first then an exhaustive listing of the, uh {disfmarker} all the forms in the data with the punctuation attached and at that point I pick up things like, oh, you know, word followed by two language, finds the time - marks for that particular one, do it that way. The way they're doing it, you have that already extracted and it's embedded in the file name. And so, you know, you just say {disfmarker}PhD G: We - yeah that's {disfmarker} so that's part of itGrad D: y so you just say you know" asterisk E asterisk dot wave" , and you get what you want.PhD G: is {disfmarker} Right. And the other part is just that once they're written out it {disfmarker} it is a lot faster to {disfmarker} to process them.Grad D: Rather than doing seeks through the file.PhD G: So. Otherwise, you're just accessing {disfmarker}Grad D: This is all just temporary access, so I don't {disfmarker} I think {disfmarker} it's all just {disfmarker} It's fine. You know. Fine to do it however is convenient.PhD G: Right.Professor F: I mean it just depends how big the file is. If the file sits in memory you can do extremely fast seeksPhD G: Right. The other thing is that, believe it or not {disfmarker} I mean, we have some {disfmarker}Professor F: but.Grad D: Yeah and they don't. Two gigPhD G: So we're also looking at these in Waves like for the alignments and so forth. You can't load an hour of speech into X Waves.Professor F: Yeah.PhD G: You need to s have these small files, and in fact, even for the Transcriber program Um {disfmarker}Grad D: Yes you can.PhD B: Yeah, you {disfmarker} you can give Waves a start and an end time. And middle.PhD G: Yeah, if you try to load s really long waveform into X Waves, you'll be waiting there for {disfmarker}PhD B: No, I {disfmarker} I'm not suggesting you load a long wave file,PhD G: OhPhD B: I'm just saying you there are lots of different ways it's being done.Postdoc E: OK. Interesting question.Grad D: There's a {disfmarker}Postdoc E: Yes. OK, now first of all {disfmarker} Ooo - ooo! Very important.Grad D:" Ooo - ooo." Postdoc E: Uh Chuck {disfmarker} Chuck led to a refinement here which is to add" NUMS" if these are parts of the read numbers. Now you already know i that I had, uh, in places where they hadn't transcribed numbers, I put" numbers" in place of any kind of numbers, but there are places where they, um, it {disfmarker} th this convention came later an and at the very first digits task in some transcripts they actually transcribed numbers. And, um, d Chuck pointed out that this is read speech, and it's nice to have the option of ignoring it for certain other prob uh p uh, things. And that's why there's this other tag here which occurs a hundred and five {disfmarker} or three hundred and five times right now which is just {disfmarker} well n n" NUMS" by itselfGrad D:" NUMS" , yeah.Postdoc E: which means this is part of the numbers task. I may change it to" digits" . I mean, i with the sed command you can really just change it however you want because it's systematically encoded, you knowGrad D: Yep.Postdoc E: Have to think about what's the best for {disfmarker} for the overall purposes, but in any case, um," numbers" and" NUMS" are a part of this digits task thing. Um, now th Then I have these numbers that have quotation marks around them. Um, I didn't want to put them in as gloss comments because then you get the substitution. And actually, th um, {vocalsound} the reason I b did it this way was because I initially started out Right. Definitely {disfmarker}Grad D: And {disfmarker} and I have scripts that will extract it out from" key" filesPhD G: Uh, and Don should {disfmarker}Grad D: and {disfmarker} and do all the naming automatically,PhD G: OK.Grad C: Alright.Grad D: so you don't have to do it by hand.PhD G: Great.Grad C: You've compiled the list of, uh, speaker namesPhD G: So that that's it for the {disfmarker}Grad D: Mm - hmm.PhD G: Speakers and {disfmarker} OK.Grad C: Not names, but I Ds.Grad D: Yep. Yeah, names {disfmarker} names in the {disfmarker} names to I Ds,Grad C: OK.Grad D: so youPhD G: Great.Grad D: and it does all sorts of matches because the way people filled out names is different on every single file so it does a very fuzzy sort of match.PhD G: Right.Grad C: Cool.PhD G: So at this point we can sort of finalize the naming, and so forth,Grad C: Mm - hmm.Grad D: Yep.PhD G: and we're gonna basically re rewrite out these waveforms that we did because as you notice in the paper your" M O in one meeting and" M O - two" in another meeting and it's {disfmarker} we just need to standardize theGrad C: Yeah. That was my fault.PhD G: um, no it's {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker}Professor F: No, I didn't notice that actually.PhD G: um, that's why those comments are s {vocalsound} are in there.Grad C: Yeah. Then disregard it then.Grad D: Yep. So th I now have a script that you can just say basically look up Morgan,PhD G: So {disfmarker}Professor F: Yeah.PhD G: Right. OK.Grad D: and it will give you his ID.PhD G: Great, great.Grad C: OK.Grad D: So. Um,PhD G: Terrific.Grad D: alright. Do we {disfmarker} Don, you had disk space and storage formats. Is that something we need to

What was included in the transcription formalization

Transcription checking procedures have been formalized, including a spell check, producing an exhaustive list of forms identified in the data, attributing every utterance to the appropriate speaker ID, glossing spoken forms with their full orthographic counterparts, e. g.'cuz'and'because', transcribing acronyms, and encoding comments, i. e. glosses, vocalic and non-vocalic non-speech events, pragmatic cues, and the standardization of spoken forms, e. g.'mm-hmm'.

there are lots of different ways it's being done.Postdoc E: OK. Interesting question.Grad D: There's a {disfmarker}Postdoc E: Yes. OK, now first of all {disfmarker} Ooo - ooo! Very important.Grad D:" Ooo - ooo." Postdoc E: Uh Chuck {disfmarker} Chuck led to a refinement here which is to add" NUMS" if these are parts of the read numbers. Now you already know i that I had, uh, in places where they hadn't transcribed numbers, I put" numbers" in place of any kind of numbers, but there are places where they, um, it {disfmarker} th this convention came later an and at the very first digits task in some transcripts they actually transcribed numbers. And, um, d Chuck pointed out that this is read speech, and it's nice to have the option of ignoring it for certain other prob uh p uh, things. And that's why there's this other tag here which occurs a hundred and five {disfmarker} or three hundred and five times right now which is just {disfmarker} well n n" NUMS" by itselfGrad D:" NUMS" , yeah.Postdoc E: which means this is part of the numbers task. I may change it to" digits" . I mean, i with the sed command you can really just change it however you want because it's systematically encoded, you knowGrad D: Yep.Postdoc E: Have to think about what's the best for {disfmarker} for the overall purposes, but in any case, um," numbers" and" NUMS" are a part of this digits task thing. Um, now th Then I have these numbers that have quotation marks around them. Um, I didn't want to put them in as gloss comments because then you get the substitution. And actually, th um, {vocalsound} the reason I b did it this way was because I initially started out to read it as digits not as connected numbers.Postdoc E: Mm - hmm.PhD G: Right, and you can give an example like, you know," six {disfmarker} sixty - one would be read as six one" .Grad D: Right.Postdoc E: Mm - hmm. And i actually it's no more artificial than what we've been doing with words.PhD G: And I think people will get it.Postdoc E: I'm sure people can adapt to this, read it single.PhD G: Right, right.Postdoc E: The spaces already bias it toward being separated.PhD G: It's just easier to read.Postdoc E: And I know I'm gonna find this easier than words.PhD G: Right.Grad D: Oh yeah, absolutely, cognitively it's much easier.PhD G: OK I also had a hard {disfmarker} hard time with the words,Professor F: Yeah.PhD G: but then we went back and forth on that. OK, so let's give that a tryGrad D: OK. And is the spacing alright or do you think there should be more space between digits and groupsProfessor F: OK.PhD G: and {disfmarker}Grad D: Or is that alrightPhD G: I mean what do other people think cuz you guys are reading {comment} them.Postdoc E: I think that i it's fine.Grad D: OK.Postdoc E: I it {disfmarker} it {disfmarker} to me it looks like you've got the func the idea of grouping and you have the grou the idea of separationPhD G: OK.Postdoc E: and, you know, it's just a matter of u i the instructions, that's all.PhD G: Great. OK.Grad D: And I think there are about ten different gouping patternsProfessor F: Let's try it.PhD G: Well let's give it a try.Grad D: isn't that right, Liz That we did.PhD G: Righ - right, and you just {disfmarker} they're randomly {nonvocalsound} generated and randomly assigned to digits.Postdoc E: I did {disfmarker} Mm that we would do it as a separate session,Professor F: yeah.PhD G: Yeah.Grad D: something like that rather than doing it during a real meeting and you know, do two people at a time then three people at a time and things like that. So.PhD G: Can try it out.Grad D: See {disfmarker} see what Dan thinks.PhD G: If we have nothing {disfmarker} if we have no agenda we could do it some week.Grad D: Yeah, right.Professor F: Yeah, yeah. Spend the whole time reading digits with different qu quantities.PhD G: OK.Grad D: I thought this was gonna be fast.Postdoc E: c c Can I can I have an another {disfmarker} another question w about thisGrad D: Oh well.Postdoc E: So, um, there are these digits, which are detached digits, but there are other words that contain the same general phon phoneme sequences. Like" wonderful" has" one" in it and {disfmarker} and Victor Borge had a {disfmarker} had a piece on this where he inflated the digits. Well, I wonder if there's, um, an if there would be a value in having digits that are in essence embedded in real words to compare in terms of like the articulation of" one" in" wonderful" versus" one" as a digit being read.Professor F: That's" two" bad. Yeah.PhD G: I'm all" four" it.Postdoc E: There you go.Grad D: Not after I" eight" though.Professor F: Uh, they don't all work as well, do they Hmm. What does nine work inGrad C: Nein!Grad D: Uh.Professor F: Uh,Grad C: You scream it.Grad D: Nein! You have to be German,Professor F: Oh. In German,PhD A: That's German, yeah.PhD B: It's great for the Germans.Professor F: yeah.Grad D: yeah.PhD G: Oh, oh!Postdoc E: Nein.Professor F: That's right!PhD A: Yeah.Grad D: Oh!Grad C: It only sounds w good when cause the people who would have been collecting digits the other way to not have the digits.Professor F: Yeah. We can go back to the other thing later.PhD G: So {disfmarker}Professor F: I mean we s we {disfmarker} we've {disfmarker} We can do this for awhilePhD G: OK.Professor F: and then go back to digits for awhile, or um. Do yo I mean, do you want {disfmarker} do you want this {disfmarker} Do you need training data or adaptation data out of thisPhD G: OK.Professor F: How much of this do you need with uh the {disfmarker}PhD G: It's actually unclear right now. I just thought well we're {disfmarker} if we're collec collecting digits, and Adam had said we were running out of the TI forms, I thought it'd be nice to have them in groups, and probably, all else being equal, it'd be better for me to just have single digitsProfessor F: OK.PhD G: since it's, you know, a recognizer's gonna do better on those anyway, um, and it's more predictable. So we can know from the transcript what the person said and the transcriber, in general.Professor F: OK, well if you prePhD G: But if they make mistakes, it's no big deal if the people say a hundred instead of" one OO" . and also w maybe we can just let them choose" zero" versus" O" as they {disfmarker} as they like because even the same person c sometimes says" O" and sometimes says" zero" in different context,Professor F: Yeah.PhD G: and that's sort of interesting. So I don't have a Specific need cuz if I did I'd probably try to collect it, you know, without bothering this group, but If we can try it {disfmarker}Grad D: OK so {disfmarker} so I can just add to the instructions Yeah.PhD G: if that's what people want. I {disfmarker} I'mPostdoc E: Yeah.PhD G: don't think that'd be that hard to read them as single digits.Postdoc E: I agree.PhD G: Um, and it seems like that might be better for you guys since then you'll have just more digit data,Grad D: Right.PhD G: and that's always a good thing.Grad D: Yep.PhD G: It's a little bit better for me too because the digits are easier to recognize. They're better trained than the numbers.Grad D: So we could just, uh, put in the instructions" read them as digits" .Professor F: Right.PhD G: Right. Right, read them as single digits, so sixty - one w is read as six one,Postdoc E: Mm - hmm.PhD G: and if people make a mistake we {disfmarker}Grad D: How about" O" versus" zero" Professor F: I mean, the other thing is we could just bag it because it's {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker} it's - I'm not worrying about it I mean, because we do have digits training data that we have from uh from OGI. I'm sorry, digits {disfmarker} numbers training that we have from OGI, we've done lots and lots of studies with that. And um.PhD G: But it's nice to get it in this room with the acousProfessor F: Yeah.PhD G: I mean {disfmarker} for {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker}Professor F: No, no, I guess what I'm saying is thatGrad D: Just let them read it how they read it.Professor F: to some extent maybe we could just read them {disfmarker} have them read how {disfmarker} how they read it and it just means that we have to expand our {disfmarker} our vocabulary out to stuff that we already have.PhD G: Right. Well that's fine with me as long as {disfmarker} It's just that I didn't want to

Summarize what was said about digits form

The group discussed digits data, recent ASR results, the status of transcriptions, and disk space and storage format issues. Approximately two hours of digits have been recorded, half of which have been extracted. Researchers doing ASR are looking into methods for generating a better channel-based segmentation to improve recognition results for close-talking microphone data. Transcription checking procedures were reviewed, and efforts to coordinate the channelization and presegmention of data with the tightening of time bins were discussed. The group also talked about downsampling and strategies for coping with low disk space.

gonna conclude that, um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} They want to view it with probability, you know, point four. They want to enter it with probability, uh {disfmarker} with probability point five and they want to approach it probability point one, say {disfmarker} Right So we come up with these l little tables for each of those OK. And the final thing is that, um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} this is a deterministic function of these, so we don't need to specify any probabilities. We just have to, um, say what function this is, right So we can let this be, um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} G of E - one comma E - two. E - three, E - four. Right and our example G would be, um, {vocalsound} a majority vote RightProfessor B: Well. OK, so th so the important point {disfmarker} is {disfmarker} W not what the G function is. The important point is {disfmarker} that {disfmarker} Um {disfmarker} There is a {disfmarker} a {disfmarker} a general kind of idea of shortcutting the full CPT. Th - c the full conditional probability table {disfmarker} with some function. OK Which y w you choose appropriately for each case. So, depending on {vocalsound} what your situation is, there are different functions which are most appropriate. And {disfmarker} So I gave {disfmarker} eh {disfmarker} Bhaskara a copy of this, eh {disfmarker} sort of" ninety - two" {comment} paper. D and you got one, Robert.Grad D: Mm - hmm.Professor B: I don't know who else has seen it.Grad D: There's {disfmarker} I mean {disfmarker} yeah. it's Heckerman and Breese.Professor B: It's short. It's short.Grad D: Yeah.Professor B: So, I u w Um, yo uh {disfmarker} you {disfmarker} Have you read it yetGrad D: Uh, you can {disfmarker} Yeah, you should take a look at it, I there's {disfmarker} there's two separate things, Robert. The f the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the Bayes - nets in general are quite good at saying," if you have no current information about this variable just take the prior for that." OK Th - that's what they're real good at. So, if you don't have any information about the discourse, you just use your priors of {disfmarker} of whatever {disfmarker} eh the {disfmarker} discourse {disfmarker} uh, eh, basically whatever w it's {disfmarker} Probabilistically, whatever it would be. And it's {disfmarker} it's sort of not a great estimate,Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: but {disfmarker} it's the best one you have, and, so forth. So that, they're good at. But the other problem is, how do you fill in all these numbers And I think that's the one he was getting at.Grad E: Mm - hmm.Grad D: Yeah. So, specifically in this case you have to {disfmarker} f have this many numbers,Grad E: Yeah.Grad D: whereas in this case you just have to have three for this, three for this, three for this. RightGrad C: Mm - hmm.Grad D: So you have to have just three N So, this is much smaller than that.Grad A: Asymptotically.Grad E: Mm - hmm.Professor B: Well, pretty quickly.Grad D: Yeah. Right.Grad A: U yeah, yeah.Professor B: I mean {disfmarker}Grad E: So, you don't need da data enough to cover {disfmarker} uh, nearly as much stuff.Grad D: I don't know.Grad A: So, really, i What a {disfmarker} A Noisy - OR seems to kind of {pause}" neural - net - acize" these Bayes - netsProfessor B: Eh {disfmarker} well to some No, no. So," Noisy - OR" is a funny way of referring to this, because {vocalsound} the Noisy - OR is only one instance.Grad D: Yeah. This its little table, and you'd add up the total evidence for" V" ," E" , and" A" .Grad D: Mmm. I don't think you can do this, because {disfmarker} {vocalsound} G is a function from {pause} that {vocalsound} to that.Grad E: Mm - hmm.Professor B: Yep. Right.Grad D: Right So there's no numbers. There's just {disfmarker} quadruplets of {disfmarker} well, N - duplets of, uh, E Vs.Professor B: I i i No, no {disfmarker} But I'm saying is {disfmarker} There {disfmarker} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} There is a w I mean, if y if {disfmarker} if you decide what's {disfmarker} what is appropriate, is probablistic evidence combination, you can write a function that does it. It's a pui it's actually one of the examples he's got in there. But, anyway, s skipping {disfmarker} skipping the question of exactly which functions {disfmarker} now is it clear that you might like to be able to shortcut the whole conditional probability table.Grad C: I mean, in some {disfmarker} it seems very plausible in some sense, where we will be likely to not be {disfmarker} observe some of the stuff. Cuz we don't have the a access to the information.Grad D: Oops, {comment} sorry.Professor B: Right. That's one of the problems, is, W Is {disfmarker} is, Where would th Where would it all come fromGrad C: Yeah. So.Grad D: Is {disfmarker} Oh, right. W would not be ab able to observeGrad E: Mmm.Grad D: WhatGrad C: I if it's a {disfmarker} a {disfmarker} a discar Discourse Initial Phrase, we will have nothing in the discourse history. So, if {disfmarker} if we ever want to wonder what was mentionGrad D: Oh {disfmarker} Oh. A are you saying that we'll not be able to observe certain nodes That's fine. That is sort of orthogonal thing.Professor B: Yeah, so guess.Grad A: OKProfessor B: OK, so you should take a look. Nancy, I'm sure you read it at some point in life.Grad E: I {disfmarker} yeah. I {disfmarker} I think so, yeah.Professor B: OK. And {disfmarker} so, you other guys can decide how interested {disfmarker}Grad E: Yeah, @ @.Professor B: Anyway. So the paper isn't th isn't real hard.PhD F: OK.Professor B: And {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Uh {disfmarker} One of the questions just come at Bhaskara is," How much of this does JavaBayes support" Grad D: Yeah, it's a good question. Um {pause} {vocalsound} {nonvocalsound} The {disfmarker} so what we want, is basically JavaBayes to support deterministic, uh, functions.Professor B: Right.Grad D: And, um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} In a sense it sup we can make it supported by, um, {vocalsound} manually, uh, entering, you know, probabilities that are one and zeros, rightProfessor B: Right. So the little handout that {disfmarker} The little thing that I sent {disfmarker} I sent a message saying, uh, here is a way to take {disfmarker} One thing you could do, which is kind of s in a way, stupid, is take this deterministic function, and use it to build the CPT. So, if Ba - JavaBayes won't do it for you,Grad C: Mmm.Professor B: that you can convert all that into what the CPT would be. Um {disfmarker} and, what I sent out about a week ago, was an idea of how to do that, for, um, evidence combination. So one of {disfmarker} one function that you could use as your" G function" is an e e Evidence - Combining. So you just take {vocalsound} the {disfmarker} uh, if each of th if each of the ones has its own little table like that, {vocalsound} then you could take the, uh, strength of each of those, times or complication.Grad D: Mm - hmm. Yeah. I don't think {disfmarker} I mean, the fact that it blown u blows up is a huge issue in the sense that {disfmarker} I mean, OK. So say it blows up, right So there's, like, the you know, ten, f ten, fifteen, uh, things. It's gonna be like, two to the {disfmarker} that, which isn't so bad.Professor B: I I understand. I'm just saying tha that w That was wi that was my note. The little note I sent said that. It said," Here's the way you'd take the logical f G function and turn it into a CPT." Grad D: Mm - hmm. Mm - hmm.Professor B: I mean that {disfmarker} the Max - the Evidence - Combining function. So we could do that. And maybe that's what we'll do. But, um don't know. So, I will, e {vocalsound} e before next week, uh, @ @ {comment} p push {disfmarker} push some more on {disfmarker} on this stuff that Dekai Wu did, and try to understand it. Uh, you'll make a couple of more copies of the Heckerman paper to give to peopleGrad D: p Sure.PhD F: Yeah, I {disfmarker} I would like a copy,Professor B: OK.Grad D: OK.PhD F: y y yeah.Professor B: And, umPhD F: OK.Professor B: I think {disfmarker}Grad C: OK. And I I'll {disfmarker} I'll think s through this, uh, {vocalsound} eh {disfmarker} getting EVA vectors dynamically out of ontologies one more time because I s I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I'm not quite sure whether we all think of the same thing or not, here.Professor B: Well, you and I should talk about it.Grad C: Yeah, uh - huh. OK.Professor B: Alright, great! And, Robert, thank you for {vocalsound} coming in under {disfmarker} He {disfmarker} he's been sick, Robert.Grad C: Und.Grad A: I was thinking maybe we should just cough into the microphone and see if they can't {disfmarker} th see if they can handle it.Grad E: Mm - hmm.Grad D: Yep.Grad E: Sure.Grad C: Um {disfmarker} is this, uh {disfmarker}

What was the advantage of using Noisy-ORs

The actual number of the inputs in the Bayes-net can create a combinatorial explosion when setting the probabilities. Noisy-OR's can help avoid this by simplifying the probability tables and applying a deterministic function to produce their complete version.

there's {disfmarker} there's two separate things, Robert. The f the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the Bayes - nets in general are quite good at saying," if you have no current information about this variable just take the prior for that." OK Th - that's what they're real good at. So, if you don't have any information about the discourse, you just use your priors of {disfmarker} of whatever {disfmarker} eh the {disfmarker} discourse {disfmarker} uh, eh, basically whatever w it's {disfmarker} Probabilistically, whatever it would be. And it's {disfmarker} it's sort of not a great estimate,Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: but {disfmarker} it's the best one you have, and, so forth. So that, they're good at. But the other problem is, how do you fill in all these numbers And I think that's the one he was getting at.Grad E: Mm - hmm.Grad D: Yeah. So, specifically in this case you have to {disfmarker} f have this many numbers,Grad E: Yeah.Grad D: whereas in this case you just have to have three for this, three for this, three for this. RightGrad C: Mm - hmm.Grad D: So you have to have just three N So, this is much smaller than that.Grad A: Asymptotically.Grad E: Mm - hmm.Professor B: Well, pretty quickly.Grad D: Yeah. Right.Grad A: U yeah, yeah.Professor B: I mean {disfmarker}Grad E: So, you don't need da data enough to cover {disfmarker} uh, nearly as much stuff.Grad D: I don't know.Grad A: So, really, i What a {disfmarker} A Noisy - OR seems to kind of {pause}" neural - net - acize" these Bayes - netsProfessor B: Eh {disfmarker} well to some No, no. So," Noisy - OR" is a funny way of referring to this, because {vocalsound} the Noisy - OR is only one instance.Grad D: Yeah. This gonna conclude that, um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} They want to view it with probability, you know, point four. They want to enter it with probability, uh {disfmarker} with probability point five and they want to approach it probability point one, say {disfmarker} Right So we come up with these l little tables for each of those OK. And the final thing is that, um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} this is a deterministic function of these, so we don't need to specify any probabilities. We just have to, um, say what function this is, right So we can let this be, um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} G of E - one comma E - two. E - three, E - four. Right and our example G would be, um, {vocalsound} a majority vote RightProfessor B: Well. OK, so th so the important point {disfmarker} is {disfmarker} W not what the G function is. The important point is {disfmarker} that {disfmarker} Um {disfmarker} There is a {disfmarker} a {disfmarker} a general kind of idea of shortcutting the full CPT. Th - c the full conditional probability table {disfmarker} with some function. OK Which y w you choose appropriately for each case. So, depending on {vocalsound} what your situation is, there are different functions which are most appropriate. And {disfmarker} So I gave {disfmarker} eh {disfmarker} Bhaskara a copy of this, eh {disfmarker} sort of" ninety - two" {comment} paper. D and you got one, Robert.Grad D: Mm - hmm.Professor B: I don't know who else has seen it.Grad D: There's {disfmarker} I mean {disfmarker} yeah. it's Heckerman and Breese.Professor B: It's short. It's short.Grad D: Yeah.Professor B: So, I u w Um, yo uh {disfmarker} you {disfmarker} Have you read it yetGrad D: Uh, you can {disfmarker} Yeah, you should take a look at it, I guess.Grad A: OKProfessor B: OK, so you should take a look. Nancy, I'm sure you read it at some point in life.Grad E: I {disfmarker} yeah. I {disfmarker} I think so, yeah.Professor B: OK. And {disfmarker} so, you other guys can decide how interested {disfmarker}Grad E: Yeah, @ @.Professor B: Anyway. So the paper isn't th isn't real hard.PhD F: OK.Professor B: And {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Uh {disfmarker} One of the questions just come at Bhaskara is," How much of this does JavaBayes support" Grad D: Yeah, it's a good question. Um {pause} {vocalsound} {nonvocalsound} The {disfmarker} so what we want, is basically JavaBayes to support deterministic, uh, functions.Professor B: Right.Grad D: And, um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} In a sense it sup we can make it supported by, um, {vocalsound} manually, uh, entering, you know, probabilities that are one and zeros, rightProfessor B: Right. So the little handout that {disfmarker} The little thing that I sent {disfmarker} I sent a message saying, uh, here is a way to take {disfmarker} One thing you could do, which is kind of s in a way, stupid, is take this deterministic function, and use it to build the CPT. So, if Ba - JavaBayes won't do it for you,Grad C: Mmm.Professor B: that you can convert all that into what the CPT would be. Um {disfmarker} and, what I sent out about a week ago, was an idea of how to do that, for, um, evidence combination. So one of {disfmarker} one function that you could use as your" G function" is an e e Evidence - Combining. So you just take {vocalsound} the {disfmarker} uh, if each of th if each of the ones has its own little table like that, {vocalsound} then you could take the, uh, strength of each of those, times to put it in the ontologyProfessor B: Absolutely.Grad D: OK.Professor B: Uh, or, link to {disfmarker} or {disfmarker} but {disfmarker} but in any case {disfmarker} i View it logically as being in the ontology. It's part of what you know about {disfmarker} a {disfmarker} an object, {vocalsound} is its EVA vector.Grad D: OK.Professor B: And, if yo As I say, if you know about a specific object, you put it there.Grad D: Mm - hmm.Professor B: This is part of what Dekai was doing. So, when we get to Wu, The - e We'll see w what he says about that.Grad D: Right.Professor B: And, then if you {disfmarker} If it isn't there, it's higher, and if you don't know anything except that it's a b it's {disfmarker} it's a {disfmarker} building, then up at the highest thing, you have the pr what amounts to a prior. If you don't know anything else about a building, {vocalsound} uh, you just take whatever your crude approximation is up at that level,Grad D: Right.Professor B: which might be equal, or whatever it is.Grad D: Yeah.Professor B: So, that's a very pretty relationship between these local vectors and the ontology. And it seems to me the obvious thing to do, unless {vocalsound} we find a reason to do something different.Grad D: Yeah.Professor B: Does this make sense to youGrad D: So {disfmarker}Professor B: Bhask -Grad D: Yeah. So, we are {disfmarker} but we {disfmarker} we're not doing the ontology, so we have to get to whoever is doing the {disfmarker} u ultimately,Professor B: Indeed. So, that's another thing we're gonna need to do, is {disfmarker} is, to, either {disfmarker}Grad D: we have to get them to {disfmarker}Professor B: We're gonna need some way to either get a p tag in the ontology, or its little table, and you'd add up the total evidence for" V" ," E" , and" A" .Grad D: Mmm. I don't think you can do this, because {disfmarker} {vocalsound} G is a function from {pause} that {vocalsound} to that.Grad E: Mm - hmm.Professor B: Yep. Right.Grad D: Right So there's no numbers. There's just {disfmarker} quadruplets of {disfmarker} well, N - duplets of, uh, E Vs.Professor B: I i i No, no {disfmarker} But I'm saying is {disfmarker} There {disfmarker} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} There is a w I mean, if y if {disfmarker} if you decide what's {disfmarker} what is appropriate, is probablistic evidence combination, you can write a function that does it. It's a pui it's actually one of the examples he's got in there. But, anyway, s skipping {disfmarker} skipping the question of exactly which functions {disfmarker} now is it clear that you might like to be able to shortcut the whole conditional probability table.Grad C: I mean, in some {disfmarker} it seems very plausible in some sense, where we will be likely to not be {disfmarker} observe some of the stuff. Cuz we don't have the a access to the information.Grad D: Oops, {comment} sorry.Professor B: Right. That's one of the problems, is, W Is {disfmarker} is, Where would th Where would it all come fromGrad C: Yeah. So.Grad D: Is {disfmarker} Oh, right. W would not be ab able to observeGrad E: Mmm.Grad D: WhatGrad C: I if it's a {disfmarker} a {disfmarker} a discar Discourse Initial Phrase, we will have nothing in the discourse history. So, if {disfmarker} if we ever want to wonder what was mentionGrad D: Oh {disfmarker} Oh. A are you saying that we'll not be able to observe certain nodes That's fine. That is sort of orthogonal thing.Professor B: Yeah, so

What was suggested to incorporate the EVA into the Bayes-net

Object representations will include an EVA vector. This can be incorporated in the database entry for a particular building or inherited from the ontology of the building type. As the project evolves, further enrichment of the ontology (actions, linguistic features) will be necessary.

there's {disfmarker} there's two separate things, Robert. The f the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the Bayes - nets in general are quite good at saying," if you have no current information about this variable just take the prior for that." OK Th - that's what they're real good at. So, if you don't have any information about the discourse, you just use your priors of {disfmarker} of whatever {disfmarker} eh the {disfmarker} discourse {disfmarker} uh, eh, basically whatever w it's {disfmarker} Probabilistically, whatever it would be. And it's {disfmarker} it's sort of not a great estimate,Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: but {disfmarker} it's the best one you have, and, so forth. So that, they're good at. But the other problem is, how do you fill in all these numbers And I think that's the one he was getting at.Grad E: Mm - hmm.Grad D: Yeah. So, specifically in this case you have to {disfmarker} f have this many numbers,Grad E: Yeah.Grad D: whereas in this case you just have to have three for this, three for this, three for this. RightGrad C: Mm - hmm.Grad D: So you have to have just three N So, this is much smaller than that.Grad A: Asymptotically.Grad E: Mm - hmm.Professor B: Well, pretty quickly.Grad D: Yeah. Right.Grad A: U yeah, yeah.Professor B: I mean {disfmarker}Grad E: So, you don't need da data enough to cover {disfmarker} uh, nearly as much stuff.Grad D: I don't know.Grad A: So, really, i What a {disfmarker} A Noisy - OR seems to kind of {pause}" neural - net - acize" these Bayes - netsProfessor B: Eh {disfmarker} well to some No, no. So," Noisy - OR" is a funny way of referring to this, because {vocalsound} the Noisy - OR is only one instance.Grad D: Yeah. This its little table, and you'd add up the total evidence for" V" ," E" , and" A" .Grad D: Mmm. I don't think you can do this, because {disfmarker} {vocalsound} G is a function from {pause} that {vocalsound} to that.Grad E: Mm - hmm.Professor B: Yep. Right.Grad D: Right So there's no numbers. There's just {disfmarker} quadruplets of {disfmarker} well, N - duplets of, uh, E Vs.Professor B: I i i No, no {disfmarker} But I'm saying is {disfmarker} There {disfmarker} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} There is a w I mean, if y if {disfmarker} if you decide what's {disfmarker} what is appropriate, is probablistic evidence combination, you can write a function that does it. It's a pui it's actually one of the examples he's got in there. But, anyway, s skipping {disfmarker} skipping the question of exactly which functions {disfmarker} now is it clear that you might like to be able to shortcut the whole conditional probability table.Grad C: I mean, in some {disfmarker} it seems very plausible in some sense, where we will be likely to not be {disfmarker} observe some of the stuff. Cuz we don't have the a access to the information.Grad D: Oops, {comment} sorry.Professor B: Right. That's one of the problems, is, W Is {disfmarker} is, Where would th Where would it all come fromGrad C: Yeah. So.Grad D: Is {disfmarker} Oh, right. W would not be ab able to observeGrad E: Mmm.Grad D: WhatGrad C: I if it's a {disfmarker} a {disfmarker} a discar Discourse Initial Phrase, we will have nothing in the discourse history. So, if {disfmarker} if we ever want to wonder what was mentionGrad D: Oh {disfmarker} Oh. A are you saying that we'll not be able to observe certain nodes That's fine. That is sort of orthogonal thing.Professor B: Yeah, so add fields, or {disfmarker} {comment} {comment} {vocalsound} some way to associate {disfmarker} Or, w It may be that all we can do is, um, some of our own hash tables that it {disfmarker} Th - the {disfmarker} th you know, there's always a way to do that. It's a just a question of {disfmarker}Grad A: Yeah, hash on object name to, you know, uh, the probabilities or whatever.Professor B: i th Yeah. e Right. And, so, i uh {disfmarker}Grad C: But it's, uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Well, it strikes me as a What For If we get the mechanism, that will be sort of the wonderful part. And then, {vocalsound} how to make it work is {disfmarker} is the second part, in the sense that {disfmarker} I mean, m the guy who was doing the ontology {disfmarker} eh, eh, s ap apologized that i it will take him another through {disfmarker} two to three days because they're having really trouble getting the upper level straight, and right now. The reason is, {vocalsound} given the craw bet uh, the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the projects that all carry their own taxonomy and, on all history, {vocalsound} they're really trying to build one top level ontology ft that covers all the EML projects, and that's, uh, uh, sort of a tough cookie, a little bit tougher than they {vocalsound} figured. I could have told them s so.Professor B: Right. Yeah.Grad C: Uh. But, nevertheless, it's going to be there by n by, uh, next Monday and I will show you what's {disfmarker} what some examples {vocalsound} from that for towers, and stuff. And, um, what I don't think is ever going to be in the ontology, is sort of, you know, the likelihood of, eh, people entering r town halls, and looking at town for us, and necessaryProfessor B: Uh, th I think they're necessary. This {disfmarker} The permission form.Grad C: Mmm.Professor B: Uh, there has to be one,Grad C: Nuh. N.Professor B: and I think we're just gonna use it as it is, and {pause} UmGrad C: N. You happy with thatProfessor B: Well, yeah. There's one tricky part about, um, they have the right um I The last paragraph {comment}" if you agree to participate you have the opportunity to have anything excised which you would prefer not to have included in the data set." OK Now that, we had to be included for this other one which might have, uh, meetings, you know, about something.Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: In this case, it doesn't really make sense. Um, so what I'd like to do is also have our subjects sign a waiver saying" I don't want to see the final transcript" .Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: And if they don't {disfmarker} If they say" no, I'm not willing to sign that" , then we'll show them the final transcript. But, um.Grad C: Yep. Makes sense.Professor B: That, uh {disfmarker} yeah, so we might actually, um S i Jane may say that," you know, you can't do this" , uh," on the same form, we need a separate form." But anyway. I'd {disfmarker} I'd {disfmarker} I'd like to, e e um, add an a little thi eh {disfmarker} a thing for them to initial, saying" nah, do I don't want to see the final transcript." Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: But other than that, that's one's been approved, this really is the same project, uh, rec you know. And so forth. So I think we just go with it.Grad C: Yeah. Yeah. OK. So much for the data, except things.PhD F: That's great! Right.Professor B: Not precisely what we want, and that's {disfmarker} {vocalsound} that's wh where it {disfmarker} it gets difficult. And I {disfmarker} I don't pretend to understand yet what I think we really ought to do.Grad C: OK. So, e enough of that, but I, uh, um, mmm, the e sort of, Johno and I will take up that responsibility, and, um, get a first draft of that. Now, we have um just, I think two more short things.Professor B: OK.Grad C: Um, y you guys sort of started fighting, uh, on the Bayes - net" Noisy - OR" frontGrad D: Hmm. Yeah, I thought I should, um, talk a little bit about that, because that might be a good, uh, sort of architecture to have, in general for, uh, problems with, {vocalsound} you know, multiple inputs to a node.Professor B: Good! OK. Good. And what's the other one so that {disfmarker} just we know what the d agenda isGrad C: Um, the Wu paper, I think maybe {disfmarker}Professor B: Oh, yeah. I've got a couple new Wu papers as well. Uh, so I {disfmarker} I've been in contact with Wu, so, probably let's put that off till I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} till I understand better, {vocalsound} uh, what he's doing. It's just a little embarrassing cause all this was in his thesis and I was on his thesis committee, and, so, {vocalsound} I r really knew this at one time.PhD F: Ugh.Professor B: But, I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} It's not only uh Is {disfmarker} Part of what I haven't figured out yet is {disfmarker} is how all this goes together. So I'll dig up some more stuff from Dekai. And {disfmarker} so why don't we just do the, uh {disfmarker}Grad D: OK. So {disfmarker} should

What was said about data collection

As the data collection is about to begin, there are some minor changes to be done in the design of the experiment, the script and the permission forms. Subjects can be recruited either from within the university or through other social circles.

its little table, and you'd add up the total evidence for" V" ," E" , and" A" .Grad D: Mmm. I don't think you can do this, because {disfmarker} {vocalsound} G is a function from {pause} that {vocalsound} to that.Grad E: Mm - hmm.Professor B: Yep. Right.Grad D: Right So there's no numbers. There's just {disfmarker} quadruplets of {disfmarker} well, N - duplets of, uh, E Vs.Professor B: I i i No, no {disfmarker} But I'm saying is {disfmarker} There {disfmarker} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} There is a w I mean, if y if {disfmarker} if you decide what's {disfmarker} what is appropriate, is probablistic evidence combination, you can write a function that does it. It's a pui it's actually one of the examples he's got in there. But, anyway, s skipping {disfmarker} skipping the question of exactly which functions {disfmarker} now is it clear that you might like to be able to shortcut the whole conditional probability table.Grad C: I mean, in some {disfmarker} it seems very plausible in some sense, where we will be likely to not be {disfmarker} observe some of the stuff. Cuz we don't have the a access to the information.Grad D: Oops, {comment} sorry.Professor B: Right. That's one of the problems, is, W Is {disfmarker} is, Where would th Where would it all come fromGrad C: Yeah. So.Grad D: Is {disfmarker} Oh, right. W would not be ab able to observeGrad E: Mmm.Grad D: WhatGrad C: I if it's a {disfmarker} a {disfmarker} a discar Discourse Initial Phrase, we will have nothing in the discourse history. So, if {disfmarker} if we ever want to wonder what was mentionGrad D: Oh {disfmarker} Oh. A are you saying that we'll not be able to observe certain nodes That's fine. That is sort of orthogonal thing.Professor B: Yeah, so or complication.Grad D: Mm - hmm. Yeah. I don't think {disfmarker} I mean, the fact that it blown u blows up is a huge issue in the sense that {disfmarker} I mean, OK. So say it blows up, right So there's, like, the you know, ten, f ten, fifteen, uh, things. It's gonna be like, two to the {disfmarker} that, which isn't so bad.Professor B: I I understand. I'm just saying tha that w That was wi that was my note. The little note I sent said that. It said," Here's the way you'd take the logical f G function and turn it into a CPT." Grad D: Mm - hmm. Mm - hmm.Professor B: I mean that {disfmarker} the Max - the Evidence - Combining function. So we could do that. And maybe that's what we'll do. But, um don't know. So, I will, e {vocalsound} e before next week, uh, @ @ {comment} p push {disfmarker} push some more on {disfmarker} on this stuff that Dekai Wu did, and try to understand it. Uh, you'll make a couple of more copies of the Heckerman paper to give to peopleGrad D: p Sure.PhD F: Yeah, I {disfmarker} I would like a copy,Professor B: OK.Grad D: OK.PhD F: y y yeah.Professor B: And, umPhD F: OK.Professor B: I think {disfmarker}Grad C: OK. And I I'll {disfmarker} I'll think s through this, uh, {vocalsound} eh {disfmarker} getting EVA vectors dynamically out of ontologies one more time because I s I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I'm not quite sure whether we all think of the same thing or not, here.Professor B: Well, you and I should talk about it.Grad C: Yeah, uh - huh. OK.Professor B: Alright, great! And, Robert, thank you for {vocalsound} coming in under {disfmarker} He {disfmarker} he's been sick, Robert.Grad C: Und.Grad A: I was thinking maybe we should just cough into the microphone and see if they can't {disfmarker} th see if they can handle it.Grad E: Mm - hmm.Grad D: Yep.Grad E: Sure.Grad C: Um {disfmarker} is this, uh {disfmarker} to put it in the ontologyProfessor B: Absolutely.Grad D: OK.Professor B: Uh, or, link to {disfmarker} or {disfmarker} but {disfmarker} but in any case {disfmarker} i View it logically as being in the ontology. It's part of what you know about {disfmarker} a {disfmarker} an object, {vocalsound} is its EVA vector.Grad D: OK.Professor B: And, if yo As I say, if you know about a specific object, you put it there.Grad D: Mm - hmm.Professor B: This is part of what Dekai was doing. So, when we get to Wu, The - e We'll see w what he says about that.Grad D: Right.Professor B: And, then if you {disfmarker} If it isn't there, it's higher, and if you don't know anything except that it's a b it's {disfmarker} it's a {disfmarker} building, then up at the highest thing, you have the pr what amounts to a prior. If you don't know anything else about a building, {vocalsound} uh, you just take whatever your crude approximation is up at that level,Grad D: Right.Professor B: which might be equal, or whatever it is.Grad D: Yeah.Professor B: So, that's a very pretty relationship between these local vectors and the ontology. And it seems to me the obvious thing to do, unless {vocalsound} we find a reason to do something different.Grad D: Yeah.Professor B: Does this make sense to youGrad D: So {disfmarker}Professor B: Bhask -Grad D: Yeah. So, we are {disfmarker} but we {disfmarker} we're not doing the ontology, so we have to get to whoever is doing the {disfmarker} u ultimately,Professor B: Indeed. So, that's another thing we're gonna need to do, is {disfmarker} is, to, either {disfmarker}Grad D: we have to get them to {disfmarker}Professor B: We're gonna need some way to either get a p tag in the ontology, or add fields, or {disfmarker} {comment} {comment} {vocalsound} some way to associate {disfmarker} Or, w It may be that all we can do is, um, some of our own hash tables that it {disfmarker} Th - the {disfmarker} th you know, there's always a way to do that. It's a just a question of {disfmarker}Grad A: Yeah, hash on object name to, you know, uh, the probabilities or whatever.Professor B: i th Yeah. e Right. And, so, i uh {disfmarker}Grad C: But it's, uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Well, it strikes me as a What For If we get the mechanism, that will be sort of the wonderful part. And then, {vocalsound} how to make it work is {disfmarker} is the second part, in the sense that {disfmarker} I mean, m the guy who was doing the ontology {disfmarker} eh, eh, s ap apologized that i it will take him another through {disfmarker} two to three days because they're having really trouble getting the upper level straight, and right now. The reason is, {vocalsound} given the craw bet uh, the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the projects that all carry their own taxonomy and, on all history, {vocalsound} they're really trying to build one top level ontology ft that covers all the EML projects, and that's, uh, uh, sort of a tough cookie, a little bit tougher than they {vocalsound} figured. I could have told them s so.Professor B: Right. Yeah.Grad C: Uh. But, nevertheless, it's going to be there by n by, uh, next Monday and I will show you what's {disfmarker} what some examples {vocalsound} from that for towers, and stuff. And, um, what I don't think is ever going to be in the ontology, is sort of, you know, the likelihood of, eh, people entering r town halls, and looking at town things.PhD F: That's great! Right.Professor B: Not precisely what we want, and that's {disfmarker} {vocalsound} that's wh where it {disfmarker} it gets difficult. And I {disfmarker} I don't pretend to understand yet what I think we really ought to do.Grad C: OK. So, e enough of that, but I, uh, um, mmm, the e sort of, Johno and I will take up that responsibility, and, um, get a first draft of that. Now, we have um just, I think two more short things.Professor B: OK.Grad C: Um, y you guys sort of started fighting, uh, on the Bayes - net" Noisy - OR" frontGrad D: Hmm. Yeah, I thought I should, um, talk a little bit about that, because that might be a good, uh, sort of architecture to have, in general for, uh, problems with, {vocalsound} you know, multiple inputs to a node.Professor B: Good! OK. Good. And what's the other one so that {disfmarker} just we know what the d agenda isGrad C: Um, the Wu paper, I think maybe {disfmarker}Professor B: Oh, yeah. I've got a couple new Wu papers as well. Uh, so I {disfmarker} I've been in contact with Wu, so, probably let's put that off till I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} till I understand better, {vocalsound} uh, what he's doing. It's just a little embarrassing cause all this was in his thesis and I was on his thesis committee, and, so, {vocalsound} I r really knew this at one time.PhD F: Ugh.Professor B: But, I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} It's not only uh Is {disfmarker} Part of what I haven't figured out yet is {disfmarker} is how all this goes together. So I'll dig up some more stuff from Dekai. And {disfmarker} so why don't we just do the, uh {disfmarker}Grad D: OK. So {disfmarker} should

What did the team say about interaction of data participants with their data

The team wanted the data participants to minimize their contact with their data. They wanted them to sign a waiver first not to view the transcript by default only allowing them to view it.

gonna conclude that, um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} They want to view it with probability, you know, point four. They want to enter it with probability, uh {disfmarker} with probability point five and they want to approach it probability point one, say {disfmarker} Right So we come up with these l little tables for each of those OK. And the final thing is that, um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} this is a deterministic function of these, so we don't need to specify any probabilities. We just have to, um, say what function this is, right So we can let this be, um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} G of E - one comma E - two. E - three, E - four. Right and our example G would be, um, {vocalsound} a majority vote RightProfessor B: Well. OK, so th so the important point {disfmarker} is {disfmarker} W not what the G function is. The important point is {disfmarker} that {disfmarker} Um {disfmarker} There is a {disfmarker} a {disfmarker} a general kind of idea of shortcutting the full CPT. Th - c the full conditional probability table {disfmarker} with some function. OK Which y w you choose appropriately for each case. So, depending on {vocalsound} what your situation is, there are different functions which are most appropriate. And {disfmarker} So I gave {disfmarker} eh {disfmarker} Bhaskara a copy of this, eh {disfmarker} sort of" ninety - two" {comment} paper. D and you got one, Robert.Grad D: Mm - hmm.Professor B: I don't know who else has seen it.Grad D: There's {disfmarker} I mean {disfmarker} yeah. it's Heckerman and Breese.Professor B: It's short. It's short.Grad D: Yeah.Professor B: So, I u w Um, yo uh {disfmarker} you {disfmarker} Have you read it yetGrad D: Uh, you can {disfmarker} Yeah, you should take a look at it, I its little table, and you'd add up the total evidence for" V" ," E" , and" A" .Grad D: Mmm. I don't think you can do this, because {disfmarker} {vocalsound} G is a function from {pause} that {vocalsound} to that.Grad E: Mm - hmm.Professor B: Yep. Right.Grad D: Right So there's no numbers. There's just {disfmarker} quadruplets of {disfmarker} well, N - duplets of, uh, E Vs.Professor B: I i i No, no {disfmarker} But I'm saying is {disfmarker} There {disfmarker} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} There is a w I mean, if y if {disfmarker} if you decide what's {disfmarker} what is appropriate, is probablistic evidence combination, you can write a function that does it. It's a pui it's actually one of the examples he's got in there. But, anyway, s skipping {disfmarker} skipping the question of exactly which functions {disfmarker} now is it clear that you might like to be able to shortcut the whole conditional probability table.Grad C: I mean, in some {disfmarker} it seems very plausible in some sense, where we will be likely to not be {disfmarker} observe some of the stuff. Cuz we don't have the a access to the information.Grad D: Oops, {comment} sorry.Professor B: Right. That's one of the problems, is, W Is {disfmarker} is, Where would th Where would it all come fromGrad C: Yeah. So.Grad D: Is {disfmarker} Oh, right. W would not be ab able to observeGrad E: Mmm.Grad D: WhatGrad C: I if it's a {disfmarker} a {disfmarker} a discar Discourse Initial Phrase, we will have nothing in the discourse history. So, if {disfmarker} if we ever want to wonder what was mentionGrad D: Oh {disfmarker} Oh. A are you saying that we'll not be able to observe certain nodes That's fine. That is sort of orthogonal thing.Professor B: Yeah, so or complication.Grad D: Mm - hmm. Yeah. I don't think {disfmarker} I mean, the fact that it blown u blows up is a huge issue in the sense that {disfmarker} I mean, OK. So say it blows up, right So there's, like, the you know, ten, f ten, fifteen, uh, things. It's gonna be like, two to the {disfmarker} that, which isn't so bad.Professor B: I I understand. I'm just saying tha that w That was wi that was my note. The little note I sent said that. It said," Here's the way you'd take the logical f G function and turn it into a CPT." Grad D: Mm - hmm. Mm - hmm.Professor B: I mean that {disfmarker} the Max - the Evidence - Combining function. So we could do that. And maybe that's what we'll do. But, um don't know. So, I will, e {vocalsound} e before next week, uh, @ @ {comment} p push {disfmarker} push some more on {disfmarker} on this stuff that Dekai Wu did, and try to understand it. Uh, you'll make a couple of more copies of the Heckerman paper to give to peopleGrad D: p Sure.PhD F: Yeah, I {disfmarker} I would like a copy,Professor B: OK.Grad D: OK.PhD F: y y yeah.Professor B: And, umPhD F: OK.Professor B: I think {disfmarker}Grad C: OK. And I I'll {disfmarker} I'll think s through this, uh, {vocalsound} eh {disfmarker} getting EVA vectors dynamically out of ontologies one more time because I s I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I'm not quite sure whether we all think of the same thing or not, here.Professor B: Well, you and I should talk about it.Grad C: Yeah, uh - huh. OK.Professor B: Alright, great! And, Robert, thank you for {vocalsound} coming in under {disfmarker} He {disfmarker} he's been sick, Robert.Grad C: Und.Grad A: I was thinking maybe we should just cough into the microphone and see if they can't {disfmarker} th see if they can handle it.Grad E: Mm - hmm.Grad D: Yep.Grad E: Sure.Grad C: Um {disfmarker} is this, uh {disfmarker} things.PhD F: That's great! Right.Professor B: Not precisely what we want, and that's {disfmarker} {vocalsound} that's wh where it {disfmarker} it gets difficult. And I {disfmarker} I don't pretend to understand yet what I think we really ought to do.Grad C: OK. So, e enough of that, but I, uh, um, mmm, the e sort of, Johno and I will take up that responsibility, and, um, get a first draft of that. Now, we have um just, I think two more short things.Professor B: OK.Grad C: Um, y you guys sort of started fighting, uh, on the Bayes - net" Noisy - OR" frontGrad D: Hmm. Yeah, I thought I should, um, talk a little bit about that, because that might be a good, uh, sort of architecture to have, in general for, uh, problems with, {vocalsound} you know, multiple inputs to a node.Professor B: Good! OK. Good. And what's the other one so that {disfmarker} just we know what the d agenda isGrad C: Um, the Wu paper, I think maybe {disfmarker}Professor B: Oh, yeah. I've got a couple new Wu papers as well. Uh, so I {disfmarker} I've been in contact with Wu, so, probably let's put that off till I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} till I understand better, {vocalsound} uh, what he's doing. It's just a little embarrassing cause all this was in his thesis and I was on his thesis committee, and, so, {vocalsound} I r really knew this at one time.PhD F: Ugh.Professor B: But, I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} It's not only uh Is {disfmarker} Part of what I haven't figured out yet is {disfmarker} is how all this goes together. So I'll dig up some more stuff from Dekai. And {disfmarker} so why don't we just do the, uh {disfmarker}Grad D: OK. So {disfmarker} should for us, and necessaryProfessor B: Uh, th I think they're necessary. This {disfmarker} The permission form.Grad C: Mmm.Professor B: Uh, there has to be one,Grad C: Nuh. N.Professor B: and I think we're just gonna use it as it is, and {pause} UmGrad C: N. You happy with thatProfessor B: Well, yeah. There's one tricky part about, um, they have the right um I The last paragraph {comment}" if you agree to participate you have the opportunity to have anything excised which you would prefer not to have included in the data set." OK Now that, we had to be included for this other one which might have, uh, meetings, you know, about something.Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: In this case, it doesn't really make sense. Um, so what I'd like to do is also have our subjects sign a waiver saying" I don't want to see the final transcript" .Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: And if they don't {disfmarker} If they say" no, I'm not willing to sign that" , then we'll show them the final transcript. But, um.Grad C: Yep. Makes sense.Professor B: That, uh {disfmarker} yeah, so we might actually, um S i Jane may say that," you know, you can't do this" , uh," on the same form, we need a separate form." But anyway. I'd {disfmarker} I'd {disfmarker} I'd like to, e e um, add an a little thi eh {disfmarker} a thing for them to initial, saying" nah, do I don't want to see the final transcript." Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: But other than that, that's one's been approved, this really is the same project, uh, rec you know. And so forth. So I think we just go with it.Grad C: Yeah. Yeah. OK. So much for the data, except

Summarize the meeting.

The meeting discussed various topics such as data collection and updates on the German parser. They discussed XML modifications and future thoughts on the ontology. Additionally, object representations will include an EVA vector. This can be incorporated in the database entry for a particular building or inherited from the ontology of the building type. The actual number of the inputs can create a combinatorial explosion when setting the probabilities. In any case, further to fulfilling the basic requirements (translating the parser and the generator into english), the project is entirely open-ended in terms of focus of research.

the English channel, and if you want to speak in French, you should be on the French channel. Should you wish to alternate between the two languages, you should change the channel to the language that you are speaking each time you switch languages. Should members participating by video conference wish to request the floor outside their designated speaking times, they should activate their mic and state that they have a point of order. Those in the Chamber can rise in the usual way. Please note that today's proceedings will be televised. I understand that there are no ministerial announcements for today, so we'll continue to the presentation of petitions, for a period not exceeding 15 minutes. I would like to remind members that any petition presented during a meeting of the special committee must have already been certified by the clerk of petitions. For members participating in person, we ask that they please come and drop the signed certificate off at the table once the petition is presented. The first petition goes to Mr. Manly, who is joining us via video conference.Mr. Paul Manly (NanaimoLadysmith, GP): Thank you, Mr. Chair. This is a petition that calls on the government to deal with helping our honey bees. They are crucial to our food system. They provide hundreds of billions of dollars worth of services to commercial agricultural crops and other ecological services every year, and the European Union has put heavy restrictions on the chemicals that are affecting them, the neonicotinoids. This petition calls on the Government of Canada, for the sake of bees and our food security, to follow Europe's lead and adhere to the precautionary principle by banning the use of neonicotinoids in Canada.The Chair: The next presenter of petitions will be Mr. Genuis, who is very parliamentary to their CERB. We are working with employers to perhaps provide the $1,000 in lieu of the SUB plans.The Chair: We will continue with you, Mr. Barsalou-Duval.Mr. Xavier Barsalou-Duval (Pierre-BoucherLes PatriotesVerchres, BQ): Thank you, Mr. Chair. On April27, Option consommateurs sent a letter to the Minister of Transport to warn him that the airlines'refusal to reimburse their customers for cancelled flights was contrary to Quebec's laws. What is the minister going to do to put an end to this situationHon. Marc Garneau (Minister of Transport): Mr. Chair, I sympathize with the people who would have preferred to get a refund, and I understand their frustration. It is not an ideal situation. The airlines are going through a very difficult time right now. If they were forced to refund their customers immediately, many of them would go bankrupt.Mr. Xavier Barsalou-Duval: Mr. Chair, the minister sounds like a broken record. A few hours ago, the following motion was passed unanimously: THAT the National Assembly ask the Government of Canada to order airlines and other carriers under federal jurisdiction to allow customers whose trips have been cancelled because of the current pandemic to obtain a refund. What will the Minister of Transport tell the National Assembly of QuebecHon. Marc Garneau: Mr. Chair, as my hon. colleague knows, the Canadian Transportation Agency has ruled on this issue and has ruled that, in the present circumstances and in a non-binding way, it is acceptable for airlines to offer credits for up to two years. In the case of Air Canada, the credit has no expiry date.The Chair: Mr. Barsalou-Duval, you have about 15seconds for a question.Mr. Xavier Barsalou-Duval: Mr. Chair, I find it rather odd that the Minister of Transport and the Canadian Transportation Agency are telling the airlines that Quebec's regulations and laws are No one ever deserves to be treated the way they were. I am talking about humanity, about compassion and mercy. It is up to each and every one of us to make sure no elderly person is ever hurt in this vile manner again. I take this moment to honour these victims.The Chair: Before moving on, I want to remind the hon. members that, as the rules state, statements by members should be 60 seconds. That's one minute. Usually there are a few extra seconds, which doesn't matter, but some of them have gone quite a bit over time, so starting Monday we'll be cutting them off at 60 seconds. I encourage everyone to practise them or take a look at them, and try to keep them within the 60 seconds so that we don't go over our allotted time. We will now proceed to the questioning of ministers. I would like to remind members to speak fairly slowly so that the interpreters can understand what they're saying. I know sometimes we get excited in the House and we speak a little quickly. Just be conscious of it. I'm sure it will be appreciated by the interpreters and those at home who are listening in, as then they can make out the important questions and answers that are being given in this chamber. We will go to our first question. We will begin with Mr. Barlow.Mr. John Barlow (Foothills, CPC): Thanks, Mr. Chair. The government has consistently worked to shut down Parliament and undermine personal sittings and has argued that the business of this country can be done by Zoom. However, for work of the G7 the Prime Minister said, theres no question that in-person meetings. . . are much more effective than even virtual meetings. By pushing to go and dressed from the waist up, I understand.Mr. Garnett Genuis (Sherwood ParkFort Saskatchewan, CPC): Thank you, Mr. Chair, and that is all you need to see for the moment. Canadians are horrified by the military report on the conditions of long-term care in Ontario. It raises big questions about the choices facing seniors in certain situations, which is what makes this first petition particularly timely. I am tabling a petition related to Bill C-7, the government's euthanasia bill, which seeks to dramatically remove safeguards that the government said were vital only a short time ago. When some people are living in deplorable conditions, we cannot truly speak of them as having a choice of when they ought to die. Especially in light of that new information, I commend this petition for the consideration of members of the House. The second petition is in support of Bill S-204 on organ harvesting and trafficking, put forward in the Senate. The bill would make it a criminal offence for a person to go abroad and receive an organ without the donor's consent. This bill seeks to combat the horrific practice of forced organ harvesting and trafficking.The Chair: The next petition presenter will be Ms. May.Ms. Elizabeth May (SaanichGulf Islands, GP): Thank you, Mr. Chair, and greetings from SaanichGulf Islands. The petition I'm presenting today is petition e-2509, which has been duly certified. It relates to what I think many of us will regard as the real heroes of the last few months. In this pandemic, there have often been very underpaid and overworked front-line workers who receive minimum wage and nothing more, and who are of course deemed essential services. The petitioners have asked the government to implement a wage supplement as a temporary measure to bring the wages for those who are and support freedom of speech and freedom of expression.Mr. David Sweet: Mr. Chair, I'm going to give the minister another opportunity to answer the third question that I asked. Yesterday, the rubber-stamp National People's Congress passed the national security bill, undermining Hong Kong's autonomy and strengthening the iron grip of the Chinese Communist Party. Will this government condemn that law todayHon. Mary Ng: Canada will continue to support Hong Kong's high degree of autonomy and freedoms under the Basic Law and the one country, two systems framework. Canada and our international partners, with the U. S. , Australia and the U. K. , have made a joint statement deeply expressing our concern regarding China's imposition of a new security law for Hong Kong.The Chair: The floor goes to Mr. Lvis.Hon. Steven Blaney (BellechasseLes EtcheminsLvis, CPC): Thank you, Mr. Chair. Some hon. members: Ha, ha! Hon. Steven Blaney: I am pleased to represent the city of Lvis, because it is a privilege, Mr. Chair. It is the city where Alphonse Desjardins, who spearheaded the largest financial cooperative movement, was born. I hope you will not take that away from my time. My question is for the Minister of Employment, Workforce Development and Disability Inclusion. On April8, the minister announced measures for the Canada summer jobs program. We thought it was to improve the program, but can the minister confirm that the budget remained the same between April7 and9Hon. Carla Qualtrough (Minister of Employment, Workforce Development and Disability Inclusion): Mr. Chair, I can confirm that we have increased the wage subsidies for Canada student jobs. We have added flexibilities, including the ability to have part-time work and the ability to have the jobs extended until February of next year. That said, the budget was not changed. It remains at 70,000 job placements

What was stated in petition e-2509

The petitioners had asked the government to implement a wage supplement as a temporary measure to bring the wages for those who were in contact with the general public and working in what had been deemed an essential service to no less than $20 an hour, in light of their service and the risks they were taking for all Canadians.

to their CERB. We are working with employers to perhaps provide the $1,000 in lieu of the SUB plans.The Chair: We will continue with you, Mr. Barsalou-Duval.Mr. Xavier Barsalou-Duval (Pierre-BoucherLes PatriotesVerchres, BQ): Thank you, Mr. Chair. On April27, Option consommateurs sent a letter to the Minister of Transport to warn him that the airlines'refusal to reimburse their customers for cancelled flights was contrary to Quebec's laws. What is the minister going to do to put an end to this situationHon. Marc Garneau (Minister of Transport): Mr. Chair, I sympathize with the people who would have preferred to get a refund, and I understand their frustration. It is not an ideal situation. The airlines are going through a very difficult time right now. If they were forced to refund their customers immediately, many of them would go bankrupt.Mr. Xavier Barsalou-Duval: Mr. Chair, the minister sounds like a broken record. A few hours ago, the following motion was passed unanimously: THAT the National Assembly ask the Government of Canada to order airlines and other carriers under federal jurisdiction to allow customers whose trips have been cancelled because of the current pandemic to obtain a refund. What will the Minister of Transport tell the National Assembly of QuebecHon. Marc Garneau: Mr. Chair, as my hon. colleague knows, the Canadian Transportation Agency has ruled on this issue and has ruled that, in the present circumstances and in a non-binding way, it is acceptable for airlines to offer credits for up to two years. In the case of Air Canada, the credit has no expiry date.The Chair: Mr. Barsalou-Duval, you have about 15seconds for a question.Mr. Xavier Barsalou-Duval: Mr. Chair, I find it rather odd that the Minister of Transport and the Canadian Transportation Agency are telling the airlines that Quebec's regulations and laws are Wagantall: Without price insurance, how many ranchers have had to address cash flow by selling cattle at the bottom of the marketHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: Mr. Chair, we have established a number of programs in order to help our beef producers. For example, we are providing $50million through the AgriRecovery program and $77. 5million for food processors.Mrs. Cathay Wagantall: On May 1, the Young Cattlemen's Council asked the minister to extend the deadline for attaining calf price insurance. Today is that deadline. Did the minister meet itHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: Mr. Chair, we discuss different options with representatives of various organizations almost every day. We are trying to work with them to improve the various programs and to meet their needs, in addition to the risk management programs, of course.Mrs. Cathay Wagantall: She didn't respond to the request of the Young Cattlemen's Council. The minister is telling farmers to access the BRM program, but just now I got a text from a young cattleman in my riding who's losing $250 to $300 per head and just told me that those programs in no way increase their capacity to deal with this crisis. The Farm Credit Canada lending capacity was increased by $5 billion, but only to service and manage loans of current customers. How many farmers have applied for that assistanceHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: However, Mr. Chair, there is a whole range of programs for our producers, whether they be specific programs for the agriculture sector, or the Canada emergency business account, the CEBA, the criteria of which have been broadened. This allows us to provide more loans, also with a forgivable portion of 25%, which could amount to $670million for the agricultural sector.Mrs. Cathay Wagantall: What percentage of Canada's farmers are customers of Farm Credit CanadaHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: Mr. Chair, Farm Credit same time, we are exercising all due diligence to ensure that we prevent non-essential travel to protect the health and safety of Canadians. We've been working very hard to ensure that we have a solution for those individuals who need and want to reunite with their families. We will have further information on that as soon as we're able to resolve that difficulty.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: Mr. Chair, the Minister of Agriculture has known there's been a capacity issue on cattle processing for more than a year and has done nothing. We don't have a BSE exemption that would allow us to use American processors, and there's been no incentive to create additional capacity to process. How bad does it have to get for the minister to actHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau (Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food): We have done a great deal for the meat sector lately. We have invested $100million in the beef and pork sectors through the AgriRecovery program. That's a significant increase, because in the last few years the program has provided between $7million and $15million only. That is significant. We have also invested $77. 5million to improve the capacity of processorsThe Chair: We'll go back to Ms. Gladu.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: It still hasn't solved the problem. That's not a beef burger; that's a nothing burger. What is the minister going to do to help the cattle farmers who are struggling, especially in this pandemicHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: Mr. Chair, once again, we have helped the meat sector through the AgriRecovery program and we have put in place a $77. 5million program to help meat processors deal with the situation and reorganize their work environment in a way that is safe for workersThe Chair: We will go back to Ms. Gladu.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: It's not enough for the farmers in to mention, as my colleague from across the way said, that it's national tourism week, so please take the time to get out and thank the tourism and hospitality businesses in your ridings. Most businesses around the world were hit hard by COVID-19. The tourism economy was hit very hard, especially seasonal and rural operations and the 1. 8 million people the industry employs. However, this industry knows how to work hard. They know how to partner. They know how to look after their employees and their guests. They will find new and innovative opportunities and experiences. They will build new business and they will continue to attract visitors. We know that the domestic and local markets will recover first. I know that the operators in my riding are getting ready just for that. It's exciting to speak with them about how they're working on their new normal and how it's going to be developed and implemented here in the Long Range Mountains. Remember too that many of our national parks are opening on June 1, so get out and explore the park in your backyard. I look forward to working with the Tourism Industry Association of Canada, Destination Canada and my colleagues so that when we turn the corner of this pandemic, we are ready to rebuild a stronger tourism economy. Friends, go out and discover the tourism treasures in your province. They need your support. Tourism matters. Thank you, Mr. Chair.The Chair: Mr. Gourde, you have the floor.Mr. Jacques Gourde (LvisLotbinire, CPC): Thank you, Mr. Chair. Some people were already too few in number and already burdened with heavy responsibilities even before the COVID-19 crisis occurred. I would like to take this opportunity to express my admiration for the dedication of all the essential workers who stepped up it forward to me and I will take a look.The Chair: Ms. Gladu, you have time for a 15-second question.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: Many are struggling with mental health in this pandemic. Can the Minister of Health tell us what she is doing to increase the capacity to help people who are sufferingHon. Patty Hajdu: I know I don't have much time, but let me repeat our infomercial to Canadians. They should visit Wellness Together Canada, the portal that will provide access for Canadians to a variety of mental health supports, including connection to professionals.The Chair: Mr. Champoux, you have the floor. I'm sorry, Mr. Champoux; you are next. Mr. Waugh now has the floor. Oh, it's Mr. Waugh. My apologies.Mr. Kevin Waugh (SaskatoonGrasswood, CPC): Thank you, Chair. Major events and mass gatherings being really out of the conversation for the foreseeable future, many event venues right now, such as concert halls and fairgrounds, are looking at the possibility of going more than a year without any revenue. Many are owned or managed by non-profit organizations. I can think of many in my riding, such as the Saskatoon Fringe Festival, Shakespeare on the Saskatchewan, the jazz festival, the folk festival, along with WDM and the Aviation Museum. Can the Minister of Canadian Heritage tell us what support has been made available to date to these organizations that are left up in the airHon. Steven Guilbeault (LaurierSainte-Marie, Lib.): As the member knows, we have done a number of things in the past weeks to help the arts and culture sector. We could talk about the Canadian emergency response benefit, or the wage subsidy. We have provided advance help to a number of organizations from Canadian Heritage programs or the Canada Council for the Arts on top of the $500-million program, which has

What was the difficulty faced by the tourism industry

Mr. Blake Richards suggested that Tourism Week in Canada, the annual celebration was a time to recognize the contributions and experiences of Canada's tourism industry. The ongoing coronavirus crisis had closed provincial and international borders to recreational travel, and tourism operators from coast to coast had been among the first and hardest hit due to the government-mandated lockdowns. The 1. 8 million Canadians whose jobs depended on a thriving tourism sector were counting on it.

to mention, as my colleague from across the way said, that it's national tourism week, so please take the time to get out and thank the tourism and hospitality businesses in your ridings. Most businesses around the world were hit hard by COVID-19. The tourism economy was hit very hard, especially seasonal and rural operations and the 1. 8 million people the industry employs. However, this industry knows how to work hard. They know how to partner. They know how to look after their employees and their guests. They will find new and innovative opportunities and experiences. They will build new business and they will continue to attract visitors. We know that the domestic and local markets will recover first. I know that the operators in my riding are getting ready just for that. It's exciting to speak with them about how they're working on their new normal and how it's going to be developed and implemented here in the Long Range Mountains. Remember too that many of our national parks are opening on June 1, so get out and explore the park in your backyard. I look forward to working with the Tourism Industry Association of Canada, Destination Canada and my colleagues so that when we turn the corner of this pandemic, we are ready to rebuild a stronger tourism economy. Friends, go out and discover the tourism treasures in your province. They need your support. Tourism matters. Thank you, Mr. Chair.The Chair: Mr. Gourde, you have the floor.Mr. Jacques Gourde (LvisLotbinire, CPC): Thank you, Mr. Chair. Some people were already too few in number and already burdened with heavy responsibilities even before the COVID-19 crisis occurred. I would like to take this opportunity to express my admiration for the dedication of all the essential workers who stepped up me to remind the hon. member opposite what we're doing to support Canadians: more than 8million Canadians have received the Canada emergency response benefit. In addition, 635,000businesses have received loans through the Canada emergency business account.Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe: Mr. Chair, I'll take that as a yes. Does my hon. colleague take into account the fact that the billions of dollars that are currently being handed out come from taxpayers'pockets It even comes from the pockets of people who have lost their jobs and who pay taxes when they go to the corner store. On the other side of the House, is it considered justified for multi-million dollar parties to finance themselves with public funds, yes or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, I would like to continue by reminding my colleague opposite what our government is doing today to support Canadians and Quebeckers: 293applications for the Canada emergency wage subsidy have been approved. Over 2million Canadians today haveThe Chair: Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe, you have the floor.Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe: Mr. Chair, I'll take that as a yes. It's fantastic! The money that the Liberals are going to get from the wage subsidy is going to go directly into their election kitty. When they go to get their election expenses reimbursed, they're going to get 60%of that money back. So they'll have made the wage subsidy work for them. The businesses that'll have access to it won't, but the political parties will. Doesn't that contravene the Canada Elections Act, yes or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, our programs don't discriminate. They're there to help all workers, to help all Canadians, to help all Quebeckers. The hon. member talked about companies and sectors that need more help. We agree with that. We think we all need to work together to continue to help Canadians and have had discussions and we have reached a number of agreements with our friends in the Bloc Qubcois. It was going very well, but there was one agreement they did not like and they went off and sulked. When you are not happy, you do not go off and sulk; you stay at the table and negotiate. That is how things work.Mrs. Marilne Gill: I urge the honourable Leader of the Government to recall the House. I am ready to be here, on the ice, all the time. I must remind him that we are not sulking. The Bloc Qubcois has self-respect and respect for the public. An agreement is not a promise, it is an agreement. A word is given in dignity and sincerity; a bond of trust is created. When a player decides not to play by the rules, I do not let myself be taken in twice. I prefer to negotiate here, as we should be doing all the time in Parliament, not trying to play with someone who never keeps his word. I would just like the Leader of the Government in the House to tell us that the measure about the 10days is not up to him and so he will not be able to make it happen. I could also ask him whether he found out from the Government of Quebec whether it agreed with the measure.Hon. Pablo Rodriguez: Mr. Chair, of course, it is not in my jurisdiction personally. We agree on that. It depends on a number of players, including the provinces and the private sector. We at federal level are holding discussions with the provinces and people in different areas. Of course, we are holding discussions with everyone involved. I want to know what my colleague has against having six hours my riding could not make rent on April 1 and May 1, and June 1 is coming up. When will the government act to ensure that families and individuals make their rent paymentsHon. Bill Morneau: Mr. Chair, for individuals, of course we've worked hard to provide support. Over eight million individuals are taking the Canada emergency response benefit. For businesses, of course, we've put in place not only the business account for small businesses but additional support through the wage subsidy program. We know that the rent approach is one that can have an important impact. I would encourage landlords toMs. Leah Gazan: Mr. Chair, I have a point of order.The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): Ms. Gazan, just a moment. Go ahead on your point of order.Ms. Leah Gazan: I just want to remind my honourable colleague that his response is supposed to be within the same time period as the question I asked. It's just a friendly reminder.The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): That is accurate. In fact, the minister was just coming up to the same amount of time it took for your question. I am monitoring that, and we will interrupt if one of the ministers responding goes more than just a short time over. In fact, we try to cut it off at the appropriate time, allowing a word or two perhaps to finish a phrase, and that's the extent of it. I'll watch that closely, the member can be assured. Let's go ahead then and finish up. You have another minute and 20 seconds to finish up, Ms. Gazan.Ms. Leah Gazan: Mr. Chair, Winnipeg Centre is the third-poorest riding in the country, and COVID-19 has put many of the residents in my riding on the verge of homelessness. Instead of bailing out its corporate it forward to me and I will take a look.The Chair: Ms. Gladu, you have time for a 15-second question.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: Many are struggling with mental health in this pandemic. Can the Minister of Health tell us what she is doing to increase the capacity to help people who are sufferingHon. Patty Hajdu: I know I don't have much time, but let me repeat our infomercial to Canadians. They should visit Wellness Together Canada, the portal that will provide access for Canadians to a variety of mental health supports, including connection to professionals.The Chair: Mr. Champoux, you have the floor. I'm sorry, Mr. Champoux; you are next. Mr. Waugh now has the floor. Oh, it's Mr. Waugh. My apologies.Mr. Kevin Waugh (SaskatoonGrasswood, CPC): Thank you, Chair. Major events and mass gatherings being really out of the conversation for the foreseeable future, many event venues right now, such as concert halls and fairgrounds, are looking at the possibility of going more than a year without any revenue. Many are owned or managed by non-profit organizations. I can think of many in my riding, such as the Saskatoon Fringe Festival, Shakespeare on the Saskatchewan, the jazz festival, the folk festival, along with WDM and the Aviation Museum. Can the Minister of Canadian Heritage tell us what support has been made available to date to these organizations that are left up in the airHon. Steven Guilbeault (LaurierSainte-Marie, Lib.): As the member knows, we have done a number of things in the past weeks to help the arts and culture sector. We could talk about the Canadian emergency response benefit, or the wage subsidy. We have provided advance help to a number of organizations from Canadian Heritage programs or the Canada Council for the Arts on top of the $500-million program, which has

Why were the thanks expressed to the House of Commons today from Whitehorse

Hon. Larry Bagnell (Yukon, Lib.) suggested that as a great historic Canadian event last week, Yukon became home to Canada's first university north of 60. Yukon University would provide Yukoners with educational opportunities closer to home, expand the research capabilities and expertise on the Arctic and climate change and allow those who want to study northern and first nations governance to do so in the north.

to mention, as my colleague from across the way said, that it's national tourism week, so please take the time to get out and thank the tourism and hospitality businesses in your ridings. Most businesses around the world were hit hard by COVID-19. The tourism economy was hit very hard, especially seasonal and rural operations and the 1. 8 million people the industry employs. However, this industry knows how to work hard. They know how to partner. They know how to look after their employees and their guests. They will find new and innovative opportunities and experiences. They will build new business and they will continue to attract visitors. We know that the domestic and local markets will recover first. I know that the operators in my riding are getting ready just for that. It's exciting to speak with them about how they're working on their new normal and how it's going to be developed and implemented here in the Long Range Mountains. Remember too that many of our national parks are opening on June 1, so get out and explore the park in your backyard. I look forward to working with the Tourism Industry Association of Canada, Destination Canada and my colleagues so that when we turn the corner of this pandemic, we are ready to rebuild a stronger tourism economy. Friends, go out and discover the tourism treasures in your province. They need your support. Tourism matters. Thank you, Mr. Chair.The Chair: Mr. Gourde, you have the floor.Mr. Jacques Gourde (LvisLotbinire, CPC): Thank you, Mr. Chair. Some people were already too few in number and already burdened with heavy responsibilities even before the COVID-19 crisis occurred. I would like to take this opportunity to express my admiration for the dedication of all the essential workers who stepped up but today I also call on the family and friends of gay men and trans women to step up now and donate blood in place of those of us who cannot. When it comes to blood donations, we really should all be in this together.The Chair: Mr. Desilets, you have the floor.Mr. Luc Desilets (Rivire-des-Mille-les, BQ): Good afternoon, Mr. Chair. I've missed you, by the way. On another note, the emergency wage subsidy was created for people who fear for their jobs or their businesses. It's for people who need it, not for millionaire political parties like the Liberals and Conservatives. In Rivire-des-Mille-les, as in many other ridings, we respond daily to businesses that don't have access to it. Unfortunately, there are people in our ridings who won't have the opportunity to hire staff this summer. There are businesses that are losing less than 30%of their revenues; they are losing29%. These businesses won't have access to it. Everywhere we look, there are businesses that are falling through the cracks. Meanwhile, the Liberals and the Conservatives are getting the wage subsidy to fund partisan activities. I repeat: it is to fund partisan activities. The Liberals and Conservatives don't even do it on the sly; they do it openly. These two parties have raised millions of dollars since January. Every dollar that's taken comes out of the taxpayers'pockets. It's the workers'money, not the political parties'. It's so embarrassing that it's shameful, disrespectful and ridiculous. The Liberals and the Conservatives have to pay that money back. I think that's obvious. For the Bloc Qubcois, its immeasurably clear. It's a question of ethics, morality and respect for citizens.The Chair: We'll now go to Mr. Schmale.Mr. Jamie Schmale (HaliburtonKawartha LakesBrock, CPC): Thank you, Chair. This week is Paramedic Services Week, and I would like to I offer my most sincere condolences to FrancisDufour's family and loved ones. Thank you.The Chair: We are continuing with MartinezFerrada.Ms. Soraya Martinez Ferrada (Hochelaga, Lib.): Thank you, Mr. Chair. The pandemic has greatly affected Montreal East, particularly the riding of Hochelaga, which I represent. Today, I'd like to recognize the exceptional work of all the volunteers and organizations in Hochelaga that are helping the more vulnerable populations, including Anonyme, CAP St-Barnab, CARE Montral, the Cuisine collective Hochelaga-Maisonneuve, Bouffe Action, the Centre Communautaire Hochelaga, Chic Resto Pop, Jojo Dpannage, Groupe d'Entraide de Mercier-Ouest and many others. I'd like to acknowledge the commitment of the merchants who have rolled up their sleeves, including the Coop Couturires Pop, to make masks. I'd especially like to recognize essential workers, especially attendants. Allow me to offer our condolences to the loved ones of the attendants who have lost their lives to protect ours. The citizens of Hochelaga are resilient and unified. I am proud to rise in the House to salute them.The Chair: The next presentation will be by Mr. Cumming.Mr. James Cumming (Edmonton Centre, CPC): Mr. Chair, I rise today to pay tribute to a great Albertan and former parliamentarian, Louise Feltham, who passed away this Monday after a lengthy battle with cancer. Louise was an entrepreneur, a public servant and a force of nature. She inspired the family motto How hard can it be by creating communities and building several homes in her lifetime. In all that she did, Louise broke glass ceilings. Her many firsts included being the first woman to serve as a councillor in rural Alberta, the first female reeve in rural Alberta and the first woman born in Newfoundland to serve in this chamber. She was the MP for Wild Rose from 1988 to 1993. Her son Glenn served we are very aware of how important it is to keep our municipalities functioning, particularly as we move into the restart. We're working with municipalities and are urging them to work with their provinces, as we are doing too.The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): We have about 30 seconds left. Go ahead, Mr. Bachrach, for 30 seconds.Mr. Taylor Bachrach: I have a very simple question, through you to the minister. Are there emergency federal dollars on the table for Canada's cities, yes, or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, the federal government very much understands and appreciates the importance of municipalities. We are prepared to support them. Provinces need to do their share too.The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): I now invite the honourable member for Manicouagan to take the floor.Mrs. Marilne Gill (Manicouagan, BQ): Thank you, Mr. Chair. At a time when we are asking our fellow citizens and Quebeckers to make sacrifices and even greater efforts, the Liberal Party, the government, is directly pilfering from a subsidy program that should be going to those who need it, not to rich political parties and their millionaire supporters. At a time when the work in the House is even more essentialwe should be working even harder, just as we are asking the people to dothe government, with the complicity of the NDP, decides to suspend the work of the House. This is the result of an absurd agreement that is absolutely impossible for it to implement. Can the government confirm to the House, and simultaneously to the NDP, that the measure involving 10days of leave is absolutely not something it can do It is not in its jurisdiction, so it is a measure that it cannot implement.Hon. Pablo Rodriguez (Leader of the Government in the House of Commons): Mr. Chair, in me to remind the hon. member opposite what we're doing to support Canadians: more than 8million Canadians have received the Canada emergency response benefit. In addition, 635,000businesses have received loans through the Canada emergency business account.Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe: Mr. Chair, I'll take that as a yes. Does my hon. colleague take into account the fact that the billions of dollars that are currently being handed out come from taxpayers'pockets It even comes from the pockets of people who have lost their jobs and who pay taxes when they go to the corner store. On the other side of the House, is it considered justified for multi-million dollar parties to finance themselves with public funds, yes or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, I would like to continue by reminding my colleague opposite what our government is doing today to support Canadians and Quebeckers: 293applications for the Canada emergency wage subsidy have been approved. Over 2million Canadians today haveThe Chair: Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe, you have the floor.Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe: Mr. Chair, I'll take that as a yes. It's fantastic! The money that the Liberals are going to get from the wage subsidy is going to go directly into their election kitty. When they go to get their election expenses reimbursed, they're going to get 60%of that money back. So they'll have made the wage subsidy work for them. The businesses that'll have access to it won't, but the political parties will. Doesn't that contravene the Canada Elections Act, yes or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, our programs don't discriminate. They're there to help all workers, to help all Canadians, to help all Quebeckers. The hon. member talked about companies and sectors that need more help. We agree with that. We think we all need to work together to continue to help Canadians and

What were the reasons to thank the members of the Canadian Armed Forces

Ms. Anju Dhillon would like to thank the members of the Canadian Armed Forces for their invaluable assistance in the long-term care facilities. Since many seniors, the most vulnerable ones desperately needed them and they had offered great assistance.

million dollars is the cost of installing air conditioning for a number of rooms in a CHSLD; it is a new fire station; it is 200more student jobs for day camps in Quebec. With $1million, the Liberal government plans to give an annual bonus to the president of the Canada Infrastructure Bank. Does the Minister of Infrastructure agree with the bank's board, which is being so generous to its president with Canadians'moneyHon. Catherine McKenna (Minister of Infrastructure and Communities): Mr. Chair, I am very proud of what our government has done to invest in communities across the country. We are investing in infrastructure. We are building by investing in renewable energy, green infrastructure and public transit, including in the member's riding. That is what we will continue to do. I am very proud that Michael Sabia has decided to join the Canada Infrastructure Bank. We are going to continue our work.Mr. Luc Berthold: Mr. Chair, could the infrastructure minister explain to Canadians how it is better to give $1 million in bonuses to the CEO of the Canada Infrastructure Bank than to invest in roads, schools, hospitals and long-term care homesHon. Catherine McKenna: Mr. Chair, I am very happy to explain to the member opposite that we are doing just that. Perhaps he isn't aware of our $33 billion infrastructure program in which we are working directly with the Government of Quebec to build infrastructure that's making a huge difference, including projects in the member's riding. We are going to continue doing that.Mr. Luc Berthold: Mr. Chair, she is not answering the question at all. On April3, the previous president of the Canada Infrastructure Bank left his position for reasons that remain unclear. How much did he receive in bonuses for his years at the helm of the Canada Infrastructure Wagantall: Without price insurance, how many ranchers have had to address cash flow by selling cattle at the bottom of the marketHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: Mr. Chair, we have established a number of programs in order to help our beef producers. For example, we are providing $50million through the AgriRecovery program and $77. 5million for food processors.Mrs. Cathay Wagantall: On May 1, the Young Cattlemen's Council asked the minister to extend the deadline for attaining calf price insurance. Today is that deadline. Did the minister meet itHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: Mr. Chair, we discuss different options with representatives of various organizations almost every day. We are trying to work with them to improve the various programs and to meet their needs, in addition to the risk management programs, of course.Mrs. Cathay Wagantall: She didn't respond to the request of the Young Cattlemen's Council. The minister is telling farmers to access the BRM program, but just now I got a text from a young cattleman in my riding who's losing $250 to $300 per head and just told me that those programs in no way increase their capacity to deal with this crisis. The Farm Credit Canada lending capacity was increased by $5 billion, but only to service and manage loans of current customers. How many farmers have applied for that assistanceHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: However, Mr. Chair, there is a whole range of programs for our producers, whether they be specific programs for the agriculture sector, or the Canada emergency business account, the CEBA, the criteria of which have been broadened. This allows us to provide more loans, also with a forgivable portion of 25%, which could amount to $670million for the agricultural sector.Mrs. Cathay Wagantall: What percentage of Canada's farmers are customers of Farm Credit CanadaHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: Mr. Chair, Farm Credit but today I also call on the family and friends of gay men and trans women to step up now and donate blood in place of those of us who cannot. When it comes to blood donations, we really should all be in this together.The Chair: Mr. Desilets, you have the floor.Mr. Luc Desilets (Rivire-des-Mille-les, BQ): Good afternoon, Mr. Chair. I've missed you, by the way. On another note, the emergency wage subsidy was created for people who fear for their jobs or their businesses. It's for people who need it, not for millionaire political parties like the Liberals and Conservatives. In Rivire-des-Mille-les, as in many other ridings, we respond daily to businesses that don't have access to it. Unfortunately, there are people in our ridings who won't have the opportunity to hire staff this summer. There are businesses that are losing less than 30%of their revenues; they are losing29%. These businesses won't have access to it. Everywhere we look, there are businesses that are falling through the cracks. Meanwhile, the Liberals and the Conservatives are getting the wage subsidy to fund partisan activities. I repeat: it is to fund partisan activities. The Liberals and Conservatives don't even do it on the sly; they do it openly. These two parties have raised millions of dollars since January. Every dollar that's taken comes out of the taxpayers'pockets. It's the workers'money, not the political parties'. It's so embarrassing that it's shameful, disrespectful and ridiculous. The Liberals and the Conservatives have to pay that money back. I think that's obvious. For the Bloc Qubcois, its immeasurably clear. It's a question of ethics, morality and respect for citizens.The Chair: We'll now go to Mr. Schmale.Mr. Jamie Schmale (HaliburtonKawartha LakesBrock, CPC): Thank you, Chair. This week is Paramedic Services Week, and I would like to same time, we are exercising all due diligence to ensure that we prevent non-essential travel to protect the health and safety of Canadians. We've been working very hard to ensure that we have a solution for those individuals who need and want to reunite with their families. We will have further information on that as soon as we're able to resolve that difficulty.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: Mr. Chair, the Minister of Agriculture has known there's been a capacity issue on cattle processing for more than a year and has done nothing. We don't have a BSE exemption that would allow us to use American processors, and there's been no incentive to create additional capacity to process. How bad does it have to get for the minister to actHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau (Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food): We have done a great deal for the meat sector lately. We have invested $100million in the beef and pork sectors through the AgriRecovery program. That's a significant increase, because in the last few years the program has provided between $7million and $15million only. That is significant. We have also invested $77. 5million to improve the capacity of processorsThe Chair: We'll go back to Ms. Gladu.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: It still hasn't solved the problem. That's not a beef burger; that's a nothing burger. What is the minister going to do to help the cattle farmers who are struggling, especially in this pandemicHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: Mr. Chair, once again, we have helped the meat sector through the AgriRecovery program and we have put in place a $77. 5million program to help meat processors deal with the situation and reorganize their work environment in a way that is safe for workersThe Chair: We will go back to Ms. Gladu.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: It's not enough for the farmers in it forward to me and I will take a look.The Chair: Ms. Gladu, you have time for a 15-second question.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: Many are struggling with mental health in this pandemic. Can the Minister of Health tell us what she is doing to increase the capacity to help people who are sufferingHon. Patty Hajdu: I know I don't have much time, but let me repeat our infomercial to Canadians. They should visit Wellness Together Canada, the portal that will provide access for Canadians to a variety of mental health supports, including connection to professionals.The Chair: Mr. Champoux, you have the floor. I'm sorry, Mr. Champoux; you are next. Mr. Waugh now has the floor. Oh, it's Mr. Waugh. My apologies.Mr. Kevin Waugh (SaskatoonGrasswood, CPC): Thank you, Chair. Major events and mass gatherings being really out of the conversation for the foreseeable future, many event venues right now, such as concert halls and fairgrounds, are looking at the possibility of going more than a year without any revenue. Many are owned or managed by non-profit organizations. I can think of many in my riding, such as the Saskatoon Fringe Festival, Shakespeare on the Saskatchewan, the jazz festival, the folk festival, along with WDM and the Aviation Museum. Can the Minister of Canadian Heritage tell us what support has been made available to date to these organizations that are left up in the airHon. Steven Guilbeault (LaurierSainte-Marie, Lib.): As the member knows, we have done a number of things in the past weeks to help the arts and culture sector. We could talk about the Canadian emergency response benefit, or the wage subsidy. We have provided advance help to a number of organizations from Canadian Heritage programs or the Canada Council for the Arts on top of the $500-million program, which has

Would there be more room for profit in the care of the seniors

Hon. Chrystia Freeland suggested that after what it had been learned this week, all options must be on the table when it came to how care for the elders would be provided in Canada in the future. Currently, it is clear to all that root-and-branch reform was necessary. All participants would need to act with speed but not haste, and work with the provincial partners.

million dollars is the cost of installing air conditioning for a number of rooms in a CHSLD; it is a new fire station; it is 200more student jobs for day camps in Quebec. With $1million, the Liberal government plans to give an annual bonus to the president of the Canada Infrastructure Bank. Does the Minister of Infrastructure agree with the bank's board, which is being so generous to its president with Canadians'moneyHon. Catherine McKenna (Minister of Infrastructure and Communities): Mr. Chair, I am very proud of what our government has done to invest in communities across the country. We are investing in infrastructure. We are building by investing in renewable energy, green infrastructure and public transit, including in the member's riding. That is what we will continue to do. I am very proud that Michael Sabia has decided to join the Canada Infrastructure Bank. We are going to continue our work.Mr. Luc Berthold: Mr. Chair, could the infrastructure minister explain to Canadians how it is better to give $1 million in bonuses to the CEO of the Canada Infrastructure Bank than to invest in roads, schools, hospitals and long-term care homesHon. Catherine McKenna: Mr. Chair, I am very happy to explain to the member opposite that we are doing just that. Perhaps he isn't aware of our $33 billion infrastructure program in which we are working directly with the Government of Quebec to build infrastructure that's making a huge difference, including projects in the member's riding. We are going to continue doing that.Mr. Luc Berthold: Mr. Chair, she is not answering the question at all. On April3, the previous president of the Canada Infrastructure Bank left his position for reasons that remain unclear. How much did he receive in bonuses for his years at the helm of the Canada Infrastructure but today I also call on the family and friends of gay men and trans women to step up now and donate blood in place of those of us who cannot. When it comes to blood donations, we really should all be in this together.The Chair: Mr. Desilets, you have the floor.Mr. Luc Desilets (Rivire-des-Mille-les, BQ): Good afternoon, Mr. Chair. I've missed you, by the way. On another note, the emergency wage subsidy was created for people who fear for their jobs or their businesses. It's for people who need it, not for millionaire political parties like the Liberals and Conservatives. In Rivire-des-Mille-les, as in many other ridings, we respond daily to businesses that don't have access to it. Unfortunately, there are people in our ridings who won't have the opportunity to hire staff this summer. There are businesses that are losing less than 30%of their revenues; they are losing29%. These businesses won't have access to it. Everywhere we look, there are businesses that are falling through the cracks. Meanwhile, the Liberals and the Conservatives are getting the wage subsidy to fund partisan activities. I repeat: it is to fund partisan activities. The Liberals and Conservatives don't even do it on the sly; they do it openly. These two parties have raised millions of dollars since January. Every dollar that's taken comes out of the taxpayers'pockets. It's the workers'money, not the political parties'. It's so embarrassing that it's shameful, disrespectful and ridiculous. The Liberals and the Conservatives have to pay that money back. I think that's obvious. For the Bloc Qubcois, its immeasurably clear. It's a question of ethics, morality and respect for citizens.The Chair: We'll now go to Mr. Schmale.Mr. Jamie Schmale (HaliburtonKawartha LakesBrock, CPC): Thank you, Chair. This week is Paramedic Services Week, and I would like to it forward to me and I will take a look.The Chair: Ms. Gladu, you have time for a 15-second question.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: Many are struggling with mental health in this pandemic. Can the Minister of Health tell us what she is doing to increase the capacity to help people who are sufferingHon. Patty Hajdu: I know I don't have much time, but let me repeat our infomercial to Canadians. They should visit Wellness Together Canada, the portal that will provide access for Canadians to a variety of mental health supports, including connection to professionals.The Chair: Mr. Champoux, you have the floor. I'm sorry, Mr. Champoux; you are next. Mr. Waugh now has the floor. Oh, it's Mr. Waugh. My apologies.Mr. Kevin Waugh (SaskatoonGrasswood, CPC): Thank you, Chair. Major events and mass gatherings being really out of the conversation for the foreseeable future, many event venues right now, such as concert halls and fairgrounds, are looking at the possibility of going more than a year without any revenue. Many are owned or managed by non-profit organizations. I can think of many in my riding, such as the Saskatoon Fringe Festival, Shakespeare on the Saskatchewan, the jazz festival, the folk festival, along with WDM and the Aviation Museum. Can the Minister of Canadian Heritage tell us what support has been made available to date to these organizations that are left up in the airHon. Steven Guilbeault (LaurierSainte-Marie, Lib.): As the member knows, we have done a number of things in the past weeks to help the arts and culture sector. We could talk about the Canadian emergency response benefit, or the wage subsidy. We have provided advance help to a number of organizations from Canadian Heritage programs or the Canada Council for the Arts on top of the $500-million program, which has same time, we are exercising all due diligence to ensure that we prevent non-essential travel to protect the health and safety of Canadians. We've been working very hard to ensure that we have a solution for those individuals who need and want to reunite with their families. We will have further information on that as soon as we're able to resolve that difficulty.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: Mr. Chair, the Minister of Agriculture has known there's been a capacity issue on cattle processing for more than a year and has done nothing. We don't have a BSE exemption that would allow us to use American processors, and there's been no incentive to create additional capacity to process. How bad does it have to get for the minister to actHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau (Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food): We have done a great deal for the meat sector lately. We have invested $100million in the beef and pork sectors through the AgriRecovery program. That's a significant increase, because in the last few years the program has provided between $7million and $15million only. That is significant. We have also invested $77. 5million to improve the capacity of processorsThe Chair: We'll go back to Ms. Gladu.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: It still hasn't solved the problem. That's not a beef burger; that's a nothing burger. What is the minister going to do to help the cattle farmers who are struggling, especially in this pandemicHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: Mr. Chair, once again, we have helped the meat sector through the AgriRecovery program and we have put in place a $77. 5million program to help meat processors deal with the situation and reorganize their work environment in a way that is safe for workersThe Chair: We will go back to Ms. Gladu.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: It's not enough for the farmers in and support freedom of speech and freedom of expression.Mr. David Sweet: Mr. Chair, I'm going to give the minister another opportunity to answer the third question that I asked. Yesterday, the rubber-stamp National People's Congress passed the national security bill, undermining Hong Kong's autonomy and strengthening the iron grip of the Chinese Communist Party. Will this government condemn that law todayHon. Mary Ng: Canada will continue to support Hong Kong's high degree of autonomy and freedoms under the Basic Law and the one country, two systems framework. Canada and our international partners, with the U. S. , Australia and the U. K. , have made a joint statement deeply expressing our concern regarding China's imposition of a new security law for Hong Kong.The Chair: The floor goes to Mr. Lvis.Hon. Steven Blaney (BellechasseLes EtcheminsLvis, CPC): Thank you, Mr. Chair. Some hon. members: Ha, ha! Hon. Steven Blaney: I am pleased to represent the city of Lvis, because it is a privilege, Mr. Chair. It is the city where Alphonse Desjardins, who spearheaded the largest financial cooperative movement, was born. I hope you will not take that away from my time. My question is for the Minister of Employment, Workforce Development and Disability Inclusion. On April8, the minister announced measures for the Canada summer jobs program. We thought it was to improve the program, but can the minister confirm that the budget remained the same between April7 and9Hon. Carla Qualtrough (Minister of Employment, Workforce Development and Disability Inclusion): Mr. Chair, I can confirm that we have increased the wage subsidies for Canada student jobs. We have added flexibilities, including the ability to have part-time work and the ability to have the jobs extended until February of next year. That said, the budget was not changed. It remains at 70,000 job placements

Where was the $75 million towards sexual exploitation and human trafficking had gone

Mrs. Karen Vecchio joined critics from the NDP, the Bloc and the Green Party who delt with women's issues and gender equality to ask where the $75 million toward sexual exploitation and human trafficking had gone. As a result of financial shortage, last week organizations had to close their doors and the programs that helped vulnerable women and girls. Hon. Bill Blair (Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness) introduced that the government had launched a new, comprehensive national strategy to combat human trafficking, and had incorporated a new pillar in that strategy of empowerment to ensure that focus.

No one ever deserves to be treated the way they were. I am talking about humanity, about compassion and mercy. It is up to each and every one of us to make sure no elderly person is ever hurt in this vile manner again. I take this moment to honour these victims.The Chair: Before moving on, I want to remind the hon. members that, as the rules state, statements by members should be 60 seconds. That's one minute. Usually there are a few extra seconds, which doesn't matter, but some of them have gone quite a bit over time, so starting Monday we'll be cutting them off at 60 seconds. I encourage everyone to practise them or take a look at them, and try to keep them within the 60 seconds so that we don't go over our allotted time. We will now proceed to the questioning of ministers. I would like to remind members to speak fairly slowly so that the interpreters can understand what they're saying. I know sometimes we get excited in the House and we speak a little quickly. Just be conscious of it. I'm sure it will be appreciated by the interpreters and those at home who are listening in, as then they can make out the important questions and answers that are being given in this chamber. We will go to our first question. We will begin with Mr. Barlow.Mr. John Barlow (Foothills, CPC): Thanks, Mr. Chair. The government has consistently worked to shut down Parliament and undermine personal sittings and has argued that the business of this country can be done by Zoom. However, for work of the G7 the Prime Minister said, theres no question that in-person meetings. . . are much more effective than even virtual meetings. By pushing to go have had discussions and we have reached a number of agreements with our friends in the Bloc Qubcois. It was going very well, but there was one agreement they did not like and they went off and sulked. When you are not happy, you do not go off and sulk; you stay at the table and negotiate. That is how things work.Mrs. Marilne Gill: I urge the honourable Leader of the Government to recall the House. I am ready to be here, on the ice, all the time. I must remind him that we are not sulking. The Bloc Qubcois has self-respect and respect for the public. An agreement is not a promise, it is an agreement. A word is given in dignity and sincerity; a bond of trust is created. When a player decides not to play by the rules, I do not let myself be taken in twice. I prefer to negotiate here, as we should be doing all the time in Parliament, not trying to play with someone who never keeps his word. I would just like the Leader of the Government in the House to tell us that the measure about the 10days is not up to him and so he will not be able to make it happen. I could also ask him whether he found out from the Government of Quebec whether it agreed with the measure.Hon. Pablo Rodriguez: Mr. Chair, of course, it is not in my jurisdiction personally. We agree on that. It depends on a number of players, including the provinces and the private sector. We at federal level are holding discussions with the provinces and people in different areas. Of course, we are holding discussions with everyone involved. I want to know what my colleague has against having six hours we are very aware of how important it is to keep our municipalities functioning, particularly as we move into the restart. We're working with municipalities and are urging them to work with their provinces, as we are doing too.The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): We have about 30 seconds left. Go ahead, Mr. Bachrach, for 30 seconds.Mr. Taylor Bachrach: I have a very simple question, through you to the minister. Are there emergency federal dollars on the table for Canada's cities, yes, or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, the federal government very much understands and appreciates the importance of municipalities. We are prepared to support them. Provinces need to do their share too.The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): I now invite the honourable member for Manicouagan to take the floor.Mrs. Marilne Gill (Manicouagan, BQ): Thank you, Mr. Chair. At a time when we are asking our fellow citizens and Quebeckers to make sacrifices and even greater efforts, the Liberal Party, the government, is directly pilfering from a subsidy program that should be going to those who need it, not to rich political parties and their millionaire supporters. At a time when the work in the House is even more essentialwe should be working even harder, just as we are asking the people to dothe government, with the complicity of the NDP, decides to suspend the work of the House. This is the result of an absurd agreement that is absolutely impossible for it to implement. Can the government confirm to the House, and simultaneously to the NDP, that the measure involving 10days of leave is absolutely not something it can do It is not in its jurisdiction, so it is a measure that it cannot implement.Hon. Pablo Rodriguez (Leader of the Government in the House of Commons): Mr. Chair, in virtual, is it the Prime Minister's goal to make Canada's Parliament less effectiveHon. Chrystia Freeland (Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs): Mr. Chair, it is absolutely not. In fact, I am pleased to be here in person meeting with members from across the country and pleased that our colleagues who live further away from Ottawa than I do have the opportunity to join us. Parliament plays an essential role in our democracy, and it'sThe Chair: We will go back to Mr. Barlow.Mr. John Barlow: Mr. Chair, that is exactly the point. This isn't Parliament; this is a committee meeting. We do not have Parliament. This is a virtual committee. A Saskatchewan producer called me and said that he tried to use the online AgriStability calculator. He said that most farmers can't use it, that in fact they can't put in their inventory changes. This means it will give them erroneous information. Why is the agriculture minister touting this lifeline for farmers when it doesn't actually workHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, the agricultural sector is critical to our country, and the questions some of us have been asking around food security have reminded us how lucky we are, as Canadians, to be living in an agricultural superpower. When it comes to the specific technical questions that farmers have, they should turn to the Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food, who will be delighted to help.Mr. John Barlow: Could the Deputy Prime Minister tell me how much it cost to develop this online AgriStability calculatorHon. Chrystia Freeland: What I can say is that we are very mindful of and very grateful for the extremelyThe Chair: We'll go back to Mr. Barlow.Mr. John Barlow: Mr. Chair, farmers have even hired accountants to try to navigate this shiny online calculator, but they've been and dressed from the waist up, I understand.Mr. Garnett Genuis (Sherwood ParkFort Saskatchewan, CPC): Thank you, Mr. Chair, and that is all you need to see for the moment. Canadians are horrified by the military report on the conditions of long-term care in Ontario. It raises big questions about the choices facing seniors in certain situations, which is what makes this first petition particularly timely. I am tabling a petition related to Bill C-7, the government's euthanasia bill, which seeks to dramatically remove safeguards that the government said were vital only a short time ago. When some people are living in deplorable conditions, we cannot truly speak of them as having a choice of when they ought to die. Especially in light of that new information, I commend this petition for the consideration of members of the House. The second petition is in support of Bill S-204 on organ harvesting and trafficking, put forward in the Senate. The bill would make it a criminal offence for a person to go abroad and receive an organ without the donor's consent. This bill seeks to combat the horrific practice of forced organ harvesting and trafficking.The Chair: The next petition presenter will be Ms. May.Ms. Elizabeth May (SaanichGulf Islands, GP): Thank you, Mr. Chair, and greetings from SaanichGulf Islands. The petition I'm presenting today is petition e-2509, which has been duly certified. It relates to what I think many of us will regard as the real heroes of the last few months. In this pandemic, there have often been very underpaid and overworked front-line workers who receive minimum wage and nothing more, and who are of course deemed essential services. The petitioners have asked the government to implement a wage supplement as a temporary measure to bring the wages for those who are

Would the Prime Minister condemn this law concerning the national security bill undermining Hong Kong's autonomy

Hon. Mary Ng suggested that Canada, with our international partners in the U. S. , Australia and the U. K. , made a joint statement in which countries were expressing deep concern regarding China's imposition of a new security law for Hong Kong. Moreover, with hundreds of thousands of Canadians living in Hong Kong, the government had a vested interest in Hong Kong's stability and prosperity, the foundations of which were Hong Kong's relative autonomy and basic freedoms. Canada would always support and promote freedom of speech, freedom of expression and freedoms of the press around the world.

order to be part of any agreement, you have to negotiate and be sitting at the table. The Bloc Qubcois says it wants to make gains for Quebec, but in order to do that, it must be sitting at the table, not outside the room. It's like a hockey game; if you want to score goals, you have to be on the ice. The other day, I asked this question: how many of Guy Lafleur's 560goals were scored when he was sitting on the benchMrs. Marilne Gill: Let me shoot the puck back to the Leader of the Government in the House. He himself decided to close the rink, to shut down Parliament. That is where the teams are, and that is where the goals are scored. But when you play a sport, when you are on a team, and when you are in Parliament, you still have to play by the rules. But the government does not keep its word. It made a promise to us as well, just like it made one to the NDP. It was about the Canada emergency student benefit. The Deputy Prime Minister herself said that it was certainly a good idea. What did the government do It backed away. I play on a team and I play by the rules. I take it at its word because this is the right place. Here, in this chamber. So I would like the government to tell people that this measure is absolutely not in their jurisdiction. That was my previous question. It was not about which parties were negotiating or not and when they kept their word or not. The NDP has to realize that their agreement is absolutely worthless.Hon. Pablo Rodriguez: Mr. Chair, my colleague is alluding to previous current and future agreements. We have had discussions and we have reached a number of agreements with our friends in the Bloc Qubcois. It was going very well, but there was one agreement they did not like and they went off and sulked. When you are not happy, you do not go off and sulk; you stay at the table and negotiate. That is how things work.Mrs. Marilne Gill: I urge the honourable Leader of the Government to recall the House. I am ready to be here, on the ice, all the time. I must remind him that we are not sulking. The Bloc Qubcois has self-respect and respect for the public. An agreement is not a promise, it is an agreement. A word is given in dignity and sincerity; a bond of trust is created. When a player decides not to play by the rules, I do not let myself be taken in twice. I prefer to negotiate here, as we should be doing all the time in Parliament, not trying to play with someone who never keeps his word. I would just like the Leader of the Government in the House to tell us that the measure about the 10days is not up to him and so he will not be able to make it happen. I could also ask him whether he found out from the Government of Quebec whether it agreed with the measure.Hon. Pablo Rodriguez: Mr. Chair, of course, it is not in my jurisdiction personally. We agree on that. It depends on a number of players, including the provinces and the private sector. We at federal level are holding discussions with the provinces and people in different areas. Of course, we are holding discussions with everyone involved. I want to know what my colleague has against having six hours we are very aware of how important it is to keep our municipalities functioning, particularly as we move into the restart. We're working with municipalities and are urging them to work with their provinces, as we are doing too.The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): We have about 30 seconds left. Go ahead, Mr. Bachrach, for 30 seconds.Mr. Taylor Bachrach: I have a very simple question, through you to the minister. Are there emergency federal dollars on the table for Canada's cities, yes, or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, the federal government very much understands and appreciates the importance of municipalities. We are prepared to support them. Provinces need to do their share too.The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): I now invite the honourable member for Manicouagan to take the floor.Mrs. Marilne Gill (Manicouagan, BQ): Thank you, Mr. Chair. At a time when we are asking our fellow citizens and Quebeckers to make sacrifices and even greater efforts, the Liberal Party, the government, is directly pilfering from a subsidy program that should be going to those who need it, not to rich political parties and their millionaire supporters. At a time when the work in the House is even more essentialwe should be working even harder, just as we are asking the people to dothe government, with the complicity of the NDP, decides to suspend the work of the House. This is the result of an absurd agreement that is absolutely impossible for it to implement. Can the government confirm to the House, and simultaneously to the NDP, that the measure involving 10days of leave is absolutely not something it can do It is not in its jurisdiction, so it is a measure that it cannot implement.Hon. Pablo Rodriguez (Leader of the Government in the House of Commons): Mr. Chair, in me to remind the hon. member opposite what we're doing to support Canadians: more than 8million Canadians have received the Canada emergency response benefit. In addition, 635,000businesses have received loans through the Canada emergency business account.Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe: Mr. Chair, I'll take that as a yes. Does my hon. colleague take into account the fact that the billions of dollars that are currently being handed out come from taxpayers'pockets It even comes from the pockets of people who have lost their jobs and who pay taxes when they go to the corner store. On the other side of the House, is it considered justified for multi-million dollar parties to finance themselves with public funds, yes or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, I would like to continue by reminding my colleague opposite what our government is doing today to support Canadians and Quebeckers: 293applications for the Canada emergency wage subsidy have been approved. Over 2million Canadians today haveThe Chair: Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe, you have the floor.Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe: Mr. Chair, I'll take that as a yes. It's fantastic! The money that the Liberals are going to get from the wage subsidy is going to go directly into their election kitty. When they go to get their election expenses reimbursed, they're going to get 60%of that money back. So they'll have made the wage subsidy work for them. The businesses that'll have access to it won't, but the political parties will. Doesn't that contravene the Canada Elections Act, yes or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, our programs don't discriminate. They're there to help all workers, to help all Canadians, to help all Quebeckers. The hon. member talked about companies and sectors that need more help. We agree with that. We think we all need to work together to continue to help Canadians and and support freedom of speech and freedom of expression.Mr. David Sweet: Mr. Chair, I'm going to give the minister another opportunity to answer the third question that I asked. Yesterday, the rubber-stamp National People's Congress passed the national security bill, undermining Hong Kong's autonomy and strengthening the iron grip of the Chinese Communist Party. Will this government condemn that law todayHon. Mary Ng: Canada will continue to support Hong Kong's high degree of autonomy and freedoms under the Basic Law and the one country, two systems framework. Canada and our international partners, with the U. S. , Australia and the U. K. , have made a joint statement deeply expressing our concern regarding China's imposition of a new security law for Hong Kong.The Chair: The floor goes to Mr. Lvis.Hon. Steven Blaney (BellechasseLes EtcheminsLvis, CPC): Thank you, Mr. Chair. Some hon. members: Ha, ha! Hon. Steven Blaney: I am pleased to represent the city of Lvis, because it is a privilege, Mr. Chair. It is the city where Alphonse Desjardins, who spearheaded the largest financial cooperative movement, was born. I hope you will not take that away from my time. My question is for the Minister of Employment, Workforce Development and Disability Inclusion. On April8, the minister announced measures for the Canada summer jobs program. We thought it was to improve the program, but can the minister confirm that the budget remained the same between April7 and9Hon. Carla Qualtrough (Minister of Employment, Workforce Development and Disability Inclusion): Mr. Chair, I can confirm that we have increased the wage subsidies for Canada student jobs. We have added flexibilities, including the ability to have part-time work and the ability to have the jobs extended until February of next year. That said, the budget was not changed. It remains at 70,000 job placements

What did the meeting discuss about the measures taken for the Canada summer jobs program

Hon. Carla Qualtrough (Minister of Employment, Workforce Development and Disability Inclusion) said that it could be confirmed that the government would increase the wage subsidies for Canada student jobs. The program had added flexibilities, including the ability to have part-time work and the ability to have the jobs extended until February of next year. That said, the budget was not changed. It remains at 70,000 job placements for 70,000 students, with 100% of them being subsidized at 100%.

million dollars is the cost of installing air conditioning for a number of rooms in a CHSLD; it is a new fire station; it is 200more student jobs for day camps in Quebec. With $1million, the Liberal government plans to give an annual bonus to the president of the Canada Infrastructure Bank. Does the Minister of Infrastructure agree with the bank's board, which is being so generous to its president with Canadians'moneyHon. Catherine McKenna (Minister of Infrastructure and Communities): Mr. Chair, I am very proud of what our government has done to invest in communities across the country. We are investing in infrastructure. We are building by investing in renewable energy, green infrastructure and public transit, including in the member's riding. That is what we will continue to do. I am very proud that Michael Sabia has decided to join the Canada Infrastructure Bank. We are going to continue our work.Mr. Luc Berthold: Mr. Chair, could the infrastructure minister explain to Canadians how it is better to give $1 million in bonuses to the CEO of the Canada Infrastructure Bank than to invest in roads, schools, hospitals and long-term care homesHon. Catherine McKenna: Mr. Chair, I am very happy to explain to the member opposite that we are doing just that. Perhaps he isn't aware of our $33 billion infrastructure program in which we are working directly with the Government of Quebec to build infrastructure that's making a huge difference, including projects in the member's riding. We are going to continue doing that.Mr. Luc Berthold: Mr. Chair, she is not answering the question at all. On April3, the previous president of the Canada Infrastructure Bank left his position for reasons that remain unclear. How much did he receive in bonuses for his years at the helm of the Canada Infrastructure me to remind the hon. member opposite what we're doing to support Canadians: more than 8million Canadians have received the Canada emergency response benefit. In addition, 635,000businesses have received loans through the Canada emergency business account.Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe: Mr. Chair, I'll take that as a yes. Does my hon. colleague take into account the fact that the billions of dollars that are currently being handed out come from taxpayers'pockets It even comes from the pockets of people who have lost their jobs and who pay taxes when they go to the corner store. On the other side of the House, is it considered justified for multi-million dollar parties to finance themselves with public funds, yes or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, I would like to continue by reminding my colleague opposite what our government is doing today to support Canadians and Quebeckers: 293applications for the Canada emergency wage subsidy have been approved. Over 2million Canadians today haveThe Chair: Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe, you have the floor.Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe: Mr. Chair, I'll take that as a yes. It's fantastic! The money that the Liberals are going to get from the wage subsidy is going to go directly into their election kitty. When they go to get their election expenses reimbursed, they're going to get 60%of that money back. So they'll have made the wage subsidy work for them. The businesses that'll have access to it won't, but the political parties will. Doesn't that contravene the Canada Elections Act, yes or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, our programs don't discriminate. They're there to help all workers, to help all Canadians, to help all Quebeckers. The hon. member talked about companies and sectors that need more help. We agree with that. We think we all need to work together to continue to help Canadians and QuebeckersThe Chair: Order. We are returning to Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe.Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe: I don't know how to take it this time. I didn't get it all. I think it's necessary to stop, eject and throw the tape out, and provide an honest answer to the questions we ask. Can my colleague across the way answer a very simple question Are their employees going to be used for political fundraising and so, once again, make the generous wage subsidy they receive work for them, yes or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, I want to point out something important when we talk about our work and our economy. The important thing is that we have put in place unprecedented economic measures that are absolutely urgent and necessary. That's what we'll continue to do.Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe: Mr. Chair, we've already seen a Duceppe who denounces the use of federal programs by the Liberal Party for the Liberal Party. Can my hon. colleague tell me if she's able to look the entrepreneurs in her riding in the eye and tell them that they don't deserve the wage subsidy, because their loss of income is only28% or29%, while her party is dipping into the cookie jar, yes or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, I am absolutely willing to look into the eyes of the entrepreneurs and workers in my riding because they know that our government is doing a lot to help Canadians in this historic crisis. Our economic support program is the largest program in Canada's historyThe Chair: We will now continue with Mr. Singh.Mr. Jagmeet Singh (Burnaby South, NDP): Thank you, Mr. Chair. The Canadian Armed Forces report showed the relationship between equipment costs and the lack of care for our seniors. Will the government admit today that there is no room for profit we are very aware of how important it is to keep our municipalities functioning, particularly as we move into the restart. We're working with municipalities and are urging them to work with their provinces, as we are doing too.The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): We have about 30 seconds left. Go ahead, Mr. Bachrach, for 30 seconds.Mr. Taylor Bachrach: I have a very simple question, through you to the minister. Are there emergency federal dollars on the table for Canada's cities, yes, or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, the federal government very much understands and appreciates the importance of municipalities. We are prepared to support them. Provinces need to do their share too.The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): I now invite the honourable member for Manicouagan to take the floor.Mrs. Marilne Gill (Manicouagan, BQ): Thank you, Mr. Chair. At a time when we are asking our fellow citizens and Quebeckers to make sacrifices and even greater efforts, the Liberal Party, the government, is directly pilfering from a subsidy program that should be going to those who need it, not to rich political parties and their millionaire supporters. At a time when the work in the House is even more essentialwe should be working even harder, just as we are asking the people to dothe government, with the complicity of the NDP, decides to suspend the work of the House. This is the result of an absurd agreement that is absolutely impossible for it to implement. Can the government confirm to the House, and simultaneously to the NDP, that the measure involving 10days of leave is absolutely not something it can do It is not in its jurisdiction, so it is a measure that it cannot implement.Hon. Pablo Rodriguez (Leader of the Government in the House of Commons): Mr. Chair, in to deliver on his promise to assist Canada's energy sector. Small oil and gas companies still can't qualify for BDC loans, and last week's announcement for large employers, in my opinion, was nothing of exploitive. If the government doesn't fulfill its promise to provide support for the energy sector, it is in turn supporting unethically sourced foreign oil and costing good reliable Canadian jobs. After 64 days, when will the credit options be available to Canada's small and medium-sized energy companiesHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, I agree with the member opposite about one thing: The energy sector and energy workers are absolutely essential to our economy, and we support them. One of the things I am most proud of is the $1. 7 billion our government has committed to cleaning up orphan wells. That money today has created jobs in Alberta, B. C. and Saskatchewan. People are working because of it, and they are cleaning up their communities thanks to that support.The Chair: Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe.Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe (Lac-Saint-Jean, BQ): Mr. Chair, I'll try not to spend too much time. Will the Liberal Party of Canada pay back the money it took from the wage subsidy program, yes or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, the purpose of the wage subsidy is to support workers, help them keep their jobs and keep them connected to their workplaceThe Chair: Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe.Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe: Mr. Chair, I'll take that as a no. In my riding, Trillium Media owns several weeklies. The company doesn't qualify for the wage subsidy because it has suffered losses of28% instead of30%. The historic village of Val-Jalbert is in the same situation. Does the Liberal Party of Canada consider itself to be in greater financial difficulty than the historic village of Val-Jalbert and Trillium MediaHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, allow

Would the government enhance the Canada summer jobs program

Hon. Steven Blaney questioned that the Canada emergency student benefit did not encourage young people to go to work, and employers had difficulty hiring them. Yet they had applied for the Canadasummer jobs program. Hon. Carla Qualtrough ensured the committee that the member opposite was not implying that offering young people income support that they took out of necessity would make them not want to work. The reason why the government was creating these additional jobs beyond the Canada summer jobs program was the young people wanted to serve the community.

BankHon. Catherine McKenna: Mr. Chair, the change of management at the Canada Infrastructure Bank marks a new phase in the development of the bank. We are working to build a modern, public infrastructure, to create jobs, and to make Canada more competitive internationally.Mr. Luc Berthold: We are talking about the bonuses given to the president of the Canada Infrastructure Bank. We have received no answer on that. What were the evaluation criteria that led to the decision that the former CEO had delivered a performance worthy of a bonus, when few, if any, projects were financed by the bankHon. Catherine McKenna: Mr. Chair, I would like to thank the former CEO, Pierre Lavalle, for his contribution to the establishment of this new institution. I am very proud that Michael Sabia has joined the bank. We will continue to work to build Canada and create good jobs.Mr. Luc Berthold: How much did he receive in bonusesHon. Catherine McKenna: The range of compensation for the CEO is set by the bank and is publicly available.Mr. Luc Berthold: Did the minister approve the bonuses paid to the former president of the Canada Infrastructure BankHon. Catherine McKenna: As I have already said, the compensation range for the CEO is determined by the bank and is public knowledge because of the legislationThe Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): Mr. Berthold, the floor is yours.Mr. Luc Berthold: Thank you, Mr. Chair. If the new president stays in the position for five years, he could be entitled to a bonus totalling $4million, in addition to his salary of $3million. Does the Minister of Infrastructure and Communities consider that this is a good way to spend taxpayers'moneyHon. Catherine McKenna: We have to build our country, create good short-term jobs, ensure that we have a cleaner future, invest in renewable million dollars is the cost of installing air conditioning for a number of rooms in a CHSLD; it is a new fire station; it is 200more student jobs for day camps in Quebec. With $1million, the Liberal government plans to give an annual bonus to the president of the Canada Infrastructure Bank. Does the Minister of Infrastructure agree with the bank's board, which is being so generous to its president with Canadians'moneyHon. Catherine McKenna (Minister of Infrastructure and Communities): Mr. Chair, I am very proud of what our government has done to invest in communities across the country. We are investing in infrastructure. We are building by investing in renewable energy, green infrastructure and public transit, including in the member's riding. That is what we will continue to do. I am very proud that Michael Sabia has decided to join the Canada Infrastructure Bank. We are going to continue our work.Mr. Luc Berthold: Mr. Chair, could the infrastructure minister explain to Canadians how it is better to give $1 million in bonuses to the CEO of the Canada Infrastructure Bank than to invest in roads, schools, hospitals and long-term care homesHon. Catherine McKenna: Mr. Chair, I am very happy to explain to the member opposite that we are doing just that. Perhaps he isn't aware of our $33 billion infrastructure program in which we are working directly with the Government of Quebec to build infrastructure that's making a huge difference, including projects in the member's riding. We are going to continue doing that.Mr. Luc Berthold: Mr. Chair, she is not answering the question at all. On April3, the previous president of the Canada Infrastructure Bank left his position for reasons that remain unclear. How much did he receive in bonuses for his years at the helm of the Canada Infrastructure but today I also call on the family and friends of gay men and trans women to step up now and donate blood in place of those of us who cannot. When it comes to blood donations, we really should all be in this together.The Chair: Mr. Desilets, you have the floor.Mr. Luc Desilets (Rivire-des-Mille-les, BQ): Good afternoon, Mr. Chair. I've missed you, by the way. On another note, the emergency wage subsidy was created for people who fear for their jobs or their businesses. It's for people who need it, not for millionaire political parties like the Liberals and Conservatives. In Rivire-des-Mille-les, as in many other ridings, we respond daily to businesses that don't have access to it. Unfortunately, there are people in our ridings who won't have the opportunity to hire staff this summer. There are businesses that are losing less than 30%of their revenues; they are losing29%. These businesses won't have access to it. Everywhere we look, there are businesses that are falling through the cracks. Meanwhile, the Liberals and the Conservatives are getting the wage subsidy to fund partisan activities. I repeat: it is to fund partisan activities. The Liberals and Conservatives don't even do it on the sly; they do it openly. These two parties have raised millions of dollars since January. Every dollar that's taken comes out of the taxpayers'pockets. It's the workers'money, not the political parties'. It's so embarrassing that it's shameful, disrespectful and ridiculous. The Liberals and the Conservatives have to pay that money back. I think that's obvious. For the Bloc Qubcois, its immeasurably clear. It's a question of ethics, morality and respect for citizens.The Chair: We'll now go to Mr. Schmale.Mr. Jamie Schmale (HaliburtonKawartha LakesBrock, CPC): Thank you, Chair. This week is Paramedic Services Week, and I would like to we are very aware of how important it is to keep our municipalities functioning, particularly as we move into the restart. We're working with municipalities and are urging them to work with their provinces, as we are doing too.The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): We have about 30 seconds left. Go ahead, Mr. Bachrach, for 30 seconds.Mr. Taylor Bachrach: I have a very simple question, through you to the minister. Are there emergency federal dollars on the table for Canada's cities, yes, or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, the federal government very much understands and appreciates the importance of municipalities. We are prepared to support them. Provinces need to do their share too.The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): I now invite the honourable member for Manicouagan to take the floor.Mrs. Marilne Gill (Manicouagan, BQ): Thank you, Mr. Chair. At a time when we are asking our fellow citizens and Quebeckers to make sacrifices and even greater efforts, the Liberal Party, the government, is directly pilfering from a subsidy program that should be going to those who need it, not to rich political parties and their millionaire supporters. At a time when the work in the House is even more essentialwe should be working even harder, just as we are asking the people to dothe government, with the complicity of the NDP, decides to suspend the work of the House. This is the result of an absurd agreement that is absolutely impossible for it to implement. Can the government confirm to the House, and simultaneously to the NDP, that the measure involving 10days of leave is absolutely not something it can do It is not in its jurisdiction, so it is a measure that it cannot implement.Hon. Pablo Rodriguez (Leader of the Government in the House of Commons): Mr. Chair, in Wagantall: Without price insurance, how many ranchers have had to address cash flow by selling cattle at the bottom of the marketHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: Mr. Chair, we have established a number of programs in order to help our beef producers. For example, we are providing $50million through the AgriRecovery program and $77. 5million for food processors.Mrs. Cathay Wagantall: On May 1, the Young Cattlemen's Council asked the minister to extend the deadline for attaining calf price insurance. Today is that deadline. Did the minister meet itHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: Mr. Chair, we discuss different options with representatives of various organizations almost every day. We are trying to work with them to improve the various programs and to meet their needs, in addition to the risk management programs, of course.Mrs. Cathay Wagantall: She didn't respond to the request of the Young Cattlemen's Council. The minister is telling farmers to access the BRM program, but just now I got a text from a young cattleman in my riding who's losing $250 to $300 per head and just told me that those programs in no way increase their capacity to deal with this crisis. The Farm Credit Canada lending capacity was increased by $5 billion, but only to service and manage loans of current customers. How many farmers have applied for that assistanceHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: However, Mr. Chair, there is a whole range of programs for our producers, whether they be specific programs for the agriculture sector, or the Canada emergency business account, the CEBA, the criteria of which have been broadened. This allows us to provide more loans, also with a forgivable portion of 25%, which could amount to $670million for the agricultural sector.Mrs. Cathay Wagantall: What percentage of Canada's farmers are customers of Farm Credit CanadaHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: Mr. Chair, Farm Credit

How did the infrastructure minister explain to give $1 million in bonuses to the CEO of the Canada Infrastructure Bank rather than to invest in roads, schools, hospitals and long-term care homes

Hon. Catherine McKenna started by introducing the $33 billion infrastructure program in which the government was working directly with the Government of Quebec to build infrastructure that was making a huge difference, including projects in the member's riding. Moreover, the change of management at the Canada Infrastructure Bank marked a new phase in the development of the bank. The government was working to build a modern, public infrastructure, to create jobs, and to make Canada more competitive internationally.

to mention, as my colleague from across the way said, that it's national tourism week, so please take the time to get out and thank the tourism and hospitality businesses in your ridings. Most businesses around the world were hit hard by COVID-19. The tourism economy was hit very hard, especially seasonal and rural operations and the 1. 8 million people the industry employs. However, this industry knows how to work hard. They know how to partner. They know how to look after their employees and their guests. They will find new and innovative opportunities and experiences. They will build new business and they will continue to attract visitors. We know that the domestic and local markets will recover first. I know that the operators in my riding are getting ready just for that. It's exciting to speak with them about how they're working on their new normal and how it's going to be developed and implemented here in the Long Range Mountains. Remember too that many of our national parks are opening on June 1, so get out and explore the park in your backyard. I look forward to working with the Tourism Industry Association of Canada, Destination Canada and my colleagues so that when we turn the corner of this pandemic, we are ready to rebuild a stronger tourism economy. Friends, go out and discover the tourism treasures in your province. They need your support. Tourism matters. Thank you, Mr. Chair.The Chair: Mr. Gourde, you have the floor.Mr. Jacques Gourde (LvisLotbinire, CPC): Thank you, Mr. Chair. Some people were already too few in number and already burdened with heavy responsibilities even before the COVID-19 crisis occurred. I would like to take this opportunity to express my admiration for the dedication of all the essential workers who stepped up been amazed with the support within our community for the Scouts'food drive. David and his group of Scouts raised over $46,000 worth of food last year for the Mississauga Food Bank and The Compass. Again, I give a huge virtual high-five to all of our young Scouts, who have taken the lead with lots of compassion and care.The Chair: We'll now go on to Mr. Richards.Mr. Blake Richards (BanffAirdrie, CPC): May 24 to May 31 is Tourism Week in Canada. This annual celebration is a time for us to recognize the contributions and experiences of Canada's tourism industry. This is a very important industry, and this year's Tourism Week is a little different from what it normally is. The ongoing coronavirus crisis has closed provincial and international borders to recreational travel, and tourism operators from coast to coast have been among the first and hardest hit due to the government-mandated lockdowns. Clear criteria regarding border reopenings and health and safety requirements will allow hospitality and tourism businesses to sufficiently prepare to reopen. This includes rehiring employees, ordering supplies and putting together tour packages and marketing plans. Operators do not need to be set back any further because of a lack of clarity around reopening. While this Tourism Week is not a celebration like the one we had expected, I anticipate next year's celebration to be a celebration of an even stronger and more successful tourism industry in Canada. The 1. 8 million Canadians whose jobs depend on a thriving tourism sector are counting on it. Bonne semaine to tourism.The Chair: We'll go on to Mr. Rogers.Mr. Churence Rogers (BonavistaBurinTrinity, Lib.): Mr. Chair, Monday was a sad day in my riding of BonavistaBurinTrinity, and indeed our entire province. Please join me as I offer sincere condolences to the families of the have had discussions and we have reached a number of agreements with our friends in the Bloc Qubcois. It was going very well, but there was one agreement they did not like and they went off and sulked. When you are not happy, you do not go off and sulk; you stay at the table and negotiate. That is how things work.Mrs. Marilne Gill: I urge the honourable Leader of the Government to recall the House. I am ready to be here, on the ice, all the time. I must remind him that we are not sulking. The Bloc Qubcois has self-respect and respect for the public. An agreement is not a promise, it is an agreement. A word is given in dignity and sincerity; a bond of trust is created. When a player decides not to play by the rules, I do not let myself be taken in twice. I prefer to negotiate here, as we should be doing all the time in Parliament, not trying to play with someone who never keeps his word. I would just like the Leader of the Government in the House to tell us that the measure about the 10days is not up to him and so he will not be able to make it happen. I could also ask him whether he found out from the Government of Quebec whether it agreed with the measure.Hon. Pablo Rodriguez: Mr. Chair, of course, it is not in my jurisdiction personally. We agree on that. It depends on a number of players, including the provinces and the private sector. We at federal level are holding discussions with the provinces and people in different areas. Of course, we are holding discussions with everyone involved. I want to know what my colleague has against having six hours same time, we are exercising all due diligence to ensure that we prevent non-essential travel to protect the health and safety of Canadians. We've been working very hard to ensure that we have a solution for those individuals who need and want to reunite with their families. We will have further information on that as soon as we're able to resolve that difficulty.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: Mr. Chair, the Minister of Agriculture has known there's been a capacity issue on cattle processing for more than a year and has done nothing. We don't have a BSE exemption that would allow us to use American processors, and there's been no incentive to create additional capacity to process. How bad does it have to get for the minister to actHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau (Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food): We have done a great deal for the meat sector lately. We have invested $100million in the beef and pork sectors through the AgriRecovery program. That's a significant increase, because in the last few years the program has provided between $7million and $15million only. That is significant. We have also invested $77. 5million to improve the capacity of processorsThe Chair: We'll go back to Ms. Gladu.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: It still hasn't solved the problem. That's not a beef burger; that's a nothing burger. What is the minister going to do to help the cattle farmers who are struggling, especially in this pandemicHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: Mr. Chair, once again, we have helped the meat sector through the AgriRecovery program and we have put in place a $77. 5million program to help meat processors deal with the situation and reorganize their work environment in a way that is safe for workersThe Chair: We will go back to Ms. Gladu.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: It's not enough for the farmers in the funding, especially for the meat industry.The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): We'll now go to Ms. Wilson-Raybould in Vancouver Granville.Hon. Jody Wilson-Raybould (Vancouver Granville, Ind.): Thank you, Mr. Chair. The Minister of Employment has stated that measures would be forthcoming for individuals with disabilities, similar to the one-time payment increase given to seniors on OAS and GIS. Could the minister please provide some more details with respect to the statement she made When can individuals with disabilities expect meaningful financial assistanceThe Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): The honourable minister.Hon. Carla Qualtrough: Mr. Chair, we know that Canadians with disabilities are disproportionately impacted by COVID in terms of both their own personal health and the access to supports that they have, or don't have, more specifically. We are three days away from National AccessAbility Week, the first week after we legislated it in the Accessible Canada Act. I would expect something from our government during that week.Hon. Jody Wilson-Raybould: Thank you for that. My office has heard from many constituents who are frustrated over the lack of information on eligibility requirements from the government regarding the business credit availability program. Furthermore, banks are giving small and medium-sized businesses mixed messaging. How will the government ensure that the messaging for BCAP and similar programs is articulated properlyThe Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): The honourable minister.Hon. Mary Ng: Thank you, Mr. Chair. I want to thank the honourable member for her question. Nothing is more important to us right now than making sure our small and medium-sized businesses are supported. The lending program through BCAP is available through financial institutions; that's banks and credit unions across the country. The money is flowing to those businesses. I would encourage Canadian businesses to get in touch with their financial institutions. Thank you so much.Hon.

Would the government commit to immediately examine all the trade barriers that could affect interprovincial trade of essential goods due to COVID-19

Hon. Chrystia Freeland introduced that the government was very committed to removing barriers to interprovincial trade. It was something that we have been working on with the premiers. Obviously the coronavirus has taken precedence in recent weeks, but it's a priority. It was the right thing to do. The government had been meeting every week for more than two months, to be focusing on the urgent threat posed by the coronavirus to ensure that there would be no delay.

to their CERB. We are working with employers to perhaps provide the $1,000 in lieu of the SUB plans.The Chair: We will continue with you, Mr. Barsalou-Duval.Mr. Xavier Barsalou-Duval (Pierre-BoucherLes PatriotesVerchres, BQ): Thank you, Mr. Chair. On April27, Option consommateurs sent a letter to the Minister of Transport to warn him that the airlines'refusal to reimburse their customers for cancelled flights was contrary to Quebec's laws. What is the minister going to do to put an end to this situationHon. Marc Garneau (Minister of Transport): Mr. Chair, I sympathize with the people who would have preferred to get a refund, and I understand their frustration. It is not an ideal situation. The airlines are going through a very difficult time right now. If they were forced to refund their customers immediately, many of them would go bankrupt.Mr. Xavier Barsalou-Duval: Mr. Chair, the minister sounds like a broken record. A few hours ago, the following motion was passed unanimously: THAT the National Assembly ask the Government of Canada to order airlines and other carriers under federal jurisdiction to allow customers whose trips have been cancelled because of the current pandemic to obtain a refund. What will the Minister of Transport tell the National Assembly of QuebecHon. Marc Garneau: Mr. Chair, as my hon. colleague knows, the Canadian Transportation Agency has ruled on this issue and has ruled that, in the present circumstances and in a non-binding way, it is acceptable for airlines to offer credits for up to two years. In the case of Air Canada, the credit has no expiry date.The Chair: Mr. Barsalou-Duval, you have about 15seconds for a question.Mr. Xavier Barsalou-Duval: Mr. Chair, I find it rather odd that the Minister of Transport and the Canadian Transportation Agency are telling the airlines that Quebec's regulations and laws are we are very aware of how important it is to keep our municipalities functioning, particularly as we move into the restart. We're working with municipalities and are urging them to work with their provinces, as we are doing too.The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): We have about 30 seconds left. Go ahead, Mr. Bachrach, for 30 seconds.Mr. Taylor Bachrach: I have a very simple question, through you to the minister. Are there emergency federal dollars on the table for Canada's cities, yes, or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, the federal government very much understands and appreciates the importance of municipalities. We are prepared to support them. Provinces need to do their share too.The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): I now invite the honourable member for Manicouagan to take the floor.Mrs. Marilne Gill (Manicouagan, BQ): Thank you, Mr. Chair. At a time when we are asking our fellow citizens and Quebeckers to make sacrifices and even greater efforts, the Liberal Party, the government, is directly pilfering from a subsidy program that should be going to those who need it, not to rich political parties and their millionaire supporters. At a time when the work in the House is even more essentialwe should be working even harder, just as we are asking the people to dothe government, with the complicity of the NDP, decides to suspend the work of the House. This is the result of an absurd agreement that is absolutely impossible for it to implement. Can the government confirm to the House, and simultaneously to the NDP, that the measure involving 10days of leave is absolutely not something it can do It is not in its jurisdiction, so it is a measure that it cannot implement.Hon. Pablo Rodriguez (Leader of the Government in the House of Commons): Mr. Chair, in QuebeckersThe Chair: Order. We are returning to Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe.Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe: I don't know how to take it this time. I didn't get it all. I think it's necessary to stop, eject and throw the tape out, and provide an honest answer to the questions we ask. Can my colleague across the way answer a very simple question Are their employees going to be used for political fundraising and so, once again, make the generous wage subsidy they receive work for them, yes or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, I want to point out something important when we talk about our work and our economy. The important thing is that we have put in place unprecedented economic measures that are absolutely urgent and necessary. That's what we'll continue to do.Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe: Mr. Chair, we've already seen a Duceppe who denounces the use of federal programs by the Liberal Party for the Liberal Party. Can my hon. colleague tell me if she's able to look the entrepreneurs in her riding in the eye and tell them that they don't deserve the wage subsidy, because their loss of income is only28% or29%, while her party is dipping into the cookie jar, yes or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, I am absolutely willing to look into the eyes of the entrepreneurs and workers in my riding because they know that our government is doing a lot to help Canadians in this historic crisis. Our economic support program is the largest program in Canada's historyThe Chair: We will now continue with Mr. Singh.Mr. Jagmeet Singh (Burnaby South, NDP): Thank you, Mr. Chair. The Canadian Armed Forces report showed the relationship between equipment costs and the lack of care for our seniors. Will the government admit today that there is no room for profit and dressed from the waist up, I understand.Mr. Garnett Genuis (Sherwood ParkFort Saskatchewan, CPC): Thank you, Mr. Chair, and that is all you need to see for the moment. Canadians are horrified by the military report on the conditions of long-term care in Ontario. It raises big questions about the choices facing seniors in certain situations, which is what makes this first petition particularly timely. I am tabling a petition related to Bill C-7, the government's euthanasia bill, which seeks to dramatically remove safeguards that the government said were vital only a short time ago. When some people are living in deplorable conditions, we cannot truly speak of them as having a choice of when they ought to die. Especially in light of that new information, I commend this petition for the consideration of members of the House. The second petition is in support of Bill S-204 on organ harvesting and trafficking, put forward in the Senate. The bill would make it a criminal offence for a person to go abroad and receive an organ without the donor's consent. This bill seeks to combat the horrific practice of forced organ harvesting and trafficking.The Chair: The next petition presenter will be Ms. May.Ms. Elizabeth May (SaanichGulf Islands, GP): Thank you, Mr. Chair, and greetings from SaanichGulf Islands. The petition I'm presenting today is petition e-2509, which has been duly certified. It relates to what I think many of us will regard as the real heroes of the last few months. In this pandemic, there have often been very underpaid and overworked front-line workers who receive minimum wage and nothing more, and who are of course deemed essential services. The petitioners have asked the government to implement a wage supplement as a temporary measure to bring the wages for those who are same time, we are exercising all due diligence to ensure that we prevent non-essential travel to protect the health and safety of Canadians. We've been working very hard to ensure that we have a solution for those individuals who need and want to reunite with their families. We will have further information on that as soon as we're able to resolve that difficulty.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: Mr. Chair, the Minister of Agriculture has known there's been a capacity issue on cattle processing for more than a year and has done nothing. We don't have a BSE exemption that would allow us to use American processors, and there's been no incentive to create additional capacity to process. How bad does it have to get for the minister to actHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau (Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food): We have done a great deal for the meat sector lately. We have invested $100million in the beef and pork sectors through the AgriRecovery program. That's a significant increase, because in the last few years the program has provided between $7million and $15million only. That is significant. We have also invested $77. 5million to improve the capacity of processorsThe Chair: We'll go back to Ms. Gladu.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: It still hasn't solved the problem. That's not a beef burger; that's a nothing burger. What is the minister going to do to help the cattle farmers who are struggling, especially in this pandemicHon. Marie-Claude Bibeau: Mr. Chair, once again, we have helped the meat sector through the AgriRecovery program and we have put in place a $77. 5million program to help meat processors deal with the situation and reorganize their work environment in a way that is safe for workersThe Chair: We will go back to Ms. Gladu.Ms. Marilyn Gladu: It's not enough for the farmers in

What guidance would the federal government have for the employment with concerns

Mr. Daniel Blaikie asked about the government's guidance towards people who felt that their workplace was not safe at this time and that their employer had not done its due diligence, and were concerned about losing access to the CERB. Hon. Carla Qualtrough suggested that the government were working very closely with the provinces on occupational health and safety guidelines and taking an all-of-government approach to ensure that workers were safe and that the government could support them in these efforts.

the English channel, and if you want to speak in French, you should be on the French channel. Should you wish to alternate between the two languages, you should change the channel to the language that you are speaking each time you switch languages. Should members participating by video conference wish to request the floor outside their designated speaking times, they should activate their mic and state that they have a point of order. Those in the Chamber can rise in the usual way. Please note that today's proceedings will be televised. I understand that there are no ministerial announcements for today, so we'll continue to the presentation of petitions, for a period not exceeding 15 minutes. I would like to remind members that any petition presented during a meeting of the special committee must have already been certified by the clerk of petitions. For members participating in person, we ask that they please come and drop the signed certificate off at the table once the petition is presented. The first petition goes to Mr. Manly, who is joining us via video conference.Mr. Paul Manly (NanaimoLadysmith, GP): Thank you, Mr. Chair. This is a petition that calls on the government to deal with helping our honey bees. They are crucial to our food system. They provide hundreds of billions of dollars worth of services to commercial agricultural crops and other ecological services every year, and the European Union has put heavy restrictions on the chemicals that are affecting them, the neonicotinoids. This petition calls on the Government of Canada, for the sake of bees and our food security, to follow Europe's lead and adhere to the precautionary principle by banning the use of neonicotinoids in Canada.The Chair: The next presenter of petitions will be Mr. Genuis, who is very parliamentary order to be part of any agreement, you have to negotiate and be sitting at the table. The Bloc Qubcois says it wants to make gains for Quebec, but in order to do that, it must be sitting at the table, not outside the room. It's like a hockey game; if you want to score goals, you have to be on the ice. The other day, I asked this question: how many of Guy Lafleur's 560goals were scored when he was sitting on the benchMrs. Marilne Gill: Let me shoot the puck back to the Leader of the Government in the House. He himself decided to close the rink, to shut down Parliament. That is where the teams are, and that is where the goals are scored. But when you play a sport, when you are on a team, and when you are in Parliament, you still have to play by the rules. But the government does not keep its word. It made a promise to us as well, just like it made one to the NDP. It was about the Canada emergency student benefit. The Deputy Prime Minister herself said that it was certainly a good idea. What did the government do It backed away. I play on a team and I play by the rules. I take it at its word because this is the right place. Here, in this chamber. So I would like the government to tell people that this measure is absolutely not in their jurisdiction. That was my previous question. It was not about which parties were negotiating or not and when they kept their word or not. The NDP has to realize that their agreement is absolutely worthless.Hon. Pablo Rodriguez: Mr. Chair, my colleague is alluding to previous current and future agreements. We have had discussions and we have reached a number of agreements with our friends in the Bloc Qubcois. It was going very well, but there was one agreement they did not like and they went off and sulked. When you are not happy, you do not go off and sulk; you stay at the table and negotiate. That is how things work.Mrs. Marilne Gill: I urge the honourable Leader of the Government to recall the House. I am ready to be here, on the ice, all the time. I must remind him that we are not sulking. The Bloc Qubcois has self-respect and respect for the public. An agreement is not a promise, it is an agreement. A word is given in dignity and sincerity; a bond of trust is created. When a player decides not to play by the rules, I do not let myself be taken in twice. I prefer to negotiate here, as we should be doing all the time in Parliament, not trying to play with someone who never keeps his word. I would just like the Leader of the Government in the House to tell us that the measure about the 10days is not up to him and so he will not be able to make it happen. I could also ask him whether he found out from the Government of Quebec whether it agreed with the measure.Hon. Pablo Rodriguez: Mr. Chair, of course, it is not in my jurisdiction personally. We agree on that. It depends on a number of players, including the provinces and the private sector. We at federal level are holding discussions with the provinces and people in different areas. Of course, we are holding discussions with everyone involved. I want to know what my colleague has against having six hours No one ever deserves to be treated the way they were. I am talking about humanity, about compassion and mercy. It is up to each and every one of us to make sure no elderly person is ever hurt in this vile manner again. I take this moment to honour these victims.The Chair: Before moving on, I want to remind the hon. members that, as the rules state, statements by members should be 60 seconds. That's one minute. Usually there are a few extra seconds, which doesn't matter, but some of them have gone quite a bit over time, so starting Monday we'll be cutting them off at 60 seconds. I encourage everyone to practise them or take a look at them, and try to keep them within the 60 seconds so that we don't go over our allotted time. We will now proceed to the questioning of ministers. I would like to remind members to speak fairly slowly so that the interpreters can understand what they're saying. I know sometimes we get excited in the House and we speak a little quickly. Just be conscious of it. I'm sure it will be appreciated by the interpreters and those at home who are listening in, as then they can make out the important questions and answers that are being given in this chamber. We will go to our first question. We will begin with Mr. Barlow.Mr. John Barlow (Foothills, CPC): Thanks, Mr. Chair. The government has consistently worked to shut down Parliament and undermine personal sittings and has argued that the business of this country can be done by Zoom. However, for work of the G7 the Prime Minister said, theres no question that in-person meetings. . . are much more effective than even virtual meetings. By pushing to go QuebeckersThe Chair: Order. We are returning to Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe.Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe: I don't know how to take it this time. I didn't get it all. I think it's necessary to stop, eject and throw the tape out, and provide an honest answer to the questions we ask. Can my colleague across the way answer a very simple question Are their employees going to be used for political fundraising and so, once again, make the generous wage subsidy they receive work for them, yes or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, I want to point out something important when we talk about our work and our economy. The important thing is that we have put in place unprecedented economic measures that are absolutely urgent and necessary. That's what we'll continue to do.Mr. Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe: Mr. Chair, we've already seen a Duceppe who denounces the use of federal programs by the Liberal Party for the Liberal Party. Can my hon. colleague tell me if she's able to look the entrepreneurs in her riding in the eye and tell them that they don't deserve the wage subsidy, because their loss of income is only28% or29%, while her party is dipping into the cookie jar, yes or noHon. Chrystia Freeland: Mr. Chair, I am absolutely willing to look into the eyes of the entrepreneurs and workers in my riding because they know that our government is doing a lot to help Canadians in this historic crisis. Our economic support program is the largest program in Canada's historyThe Chair: We will now continue with Mr. Singh.Mr. Jagmeet Singh (Burnaby South, NDP): Thank you, Mr. Chair. The Canadian Armed Forces report showed the relationship between equipment costs and the lack of care for our seniors. Will the government admit today that there is no room for profit

Summarize the whole meeting.

The meeting was with the Special Committee on the COVID-19 Pandemic. First of all, petitioners presented several petitions including to call the government to implement a wage supplement. Later the committee expressed the thanks to different departments and people for the contribution to the society under the Covid-19 situation. When it came to questions, the committee discussed the financial support from the government to various industries as well as groups to ensure equal rights of different groups of people, especially the most vulnerable ones. Moreover, the meeting discussed the new law in Hong Kong and issues related to community services in Canada. In the end, the committee discussed the recent and upcoming solutions to battle the Covid-19 concerning various aspects.

Yeah. Um. And so I guess the issue there is, are we {disfmarker} are we using neural - net - based TRAPS, and {disfmarker} and how big are they So that'll {disfmarker} that'll be, you know, an issue.Grad C: Oh, right.Professor B: Maybe they can be little ones.Grad C: Yeah. Cuz sh Right.Professor B: Mini - TRAPS.Grad C: Cuz she also does the, uh {disfmarker} the correlation - based, uh, TRAPS, with without the neural net, just looking at the correlation between {disfmarker}Professor B: Right. And maybe for VAD they would be OK. Yeah. Yeah.Grad C: Yeah.Professor B: That's true.PhD D: Yeah.Professor B: Or a simple neural net, right I mean, the thing is, if you're doing correlation, you're just doing a simple {disfmarker} uh, uh {disfmarker} uh, dot product, you know, with some weights which you happened to learn from this {disfmarker} learn from the data.Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: And so, uh, putting a nonlinearity on it is, {pause} you know, not that big a deal. It certainly doesn't take much space.Grad C: Mm - hmm. Right.Professor B: So, uh, the question is, how complex a function do you need Do you need to have an added layer or something In which case, uh, potentially, you know, it could be big. So.Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So, uh, uh {disfmarker} So what's next Maybe s s remind us.PhD E: So the meeting with Hynek that you guys just had was to decide exactly what you were gonna freeze in this system Is that {disfmarker} Or was there {disfmarker} Were you talking about what t new stuff, or {disfmarker}Professor B: What to freeze and then what to do after we froze.PhD E: Mmm.Professor B: Yeah. And like I was saying, I think the {disfmarker} you know, the their two systems. SoProfessor B: Oh, are wePhD A: I {disfmarker} It is a triumph.PhD D: Yeah.Professor B: Is itPhD D: Their {disfmarker} their first system is fifty - four point something. And, uh, we are fifty - three point something.PhD A: But everything is {pause} within the range of one {disfmarker} one percent.PhD D: And their second system is also fifty - three point something. Yeah, one percent.Professor B: Yeah, so {disfmarker} so basically they're all {disfmarker} they're all pretty close.PhD E: Oh, wow!PhD A: So.PhD E: That's very close.PhD D: Yeah.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: And {disfmarker} and, {vocalsound} um, you know, in some sense we're all doing fairly similar things. Uh, I mean, one could argue about the LDA and so forth but I {disfmarker} I think, you know, in a lot of ways we're doing very similar things. But what {disfmarker} what {disfmarker}PhD E: So how did they fill up this {disfmarker} all these {disfmarker} these bits I mean, if we're uProfessor B: Um, why are we using half Well, so you could {disfmarker} you cPhD E: Yeah. Or how are they using more than half, I guess maybe is what I {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah, so I {disfmarker} I think {disfmarker} uh, you guys are closer to it than me, so correct me if I'm wrong, but I {disfmarker} I think that what's going on is that in {disfmarker} in both cases, some kind of normalization is done to deal with convola convolutional effects. Uh, they have some cepstral {pause} modification,PhD A: Mm - hmm.Professor B: right In our case we have a couple things. We have the on - line normalization and then we have the LDA RASTA. And {pause} they seem to comple complement each other enough and be different enough that they both seem techniquesPhD A: So finally it's {disfmarker} it's, um, Wiener filtering on FFT bins. And it uses, uh, two steps, smoothing of the transfer function, the first step, that's along time, which use recursion. And {vocalsound} after this step there is a further smoothing along frequency, which use a sliding window of twenty FFT bins. Mmm. And, uh {disfmarker}PhD E: So this is on the {disfmarker} uh, before any mel scaling has been donePhD A: Yeah, yeah.PhD E: This is {disfmarker}PhD A: It was {disfmarker}Professor B: This {disfmarker} this smoothing is done on the estimate, um, of what you're going to subtract Or on the thing that has already had something subtractedPhD A: Yeah. Uh, {vocalsound} it's on the transfer function. So {disfmarker}Professor B: Oh, it's on the transfer function for the Wiener filter.PhD A: Yeah.Professor B: Yeah, OK.PhD A: Yeah, so basically we tried {vocalsound} different configuration within this idea. We tried u u applying this on mel bands, having spectral subtraction instead of wiener filtering. Um. Well, finally we end up with {pause} this configuration that works, uh, quite well. So we are going to fix this for the moment and work on the other aspects of {vocalsound} the whole system.PhD E: Mm - hmm.PhD A: So {disfmarker}Professor B: Actually, let me int eh, Dave isn't here to talk about it, but let me just interject. This module, in principle, i I mean, you would know whether it's {vocalsound} true in fact, is somewhat independent from the rest of it. I mean, because you {disfmarker} you re - synthesize speech, rightPhD A: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So, um. Uh, well you don't {disfmarker} I guess you don't re - synthesize speech, but you could {disfmarker}PhD A: We {disfmarker} we do not foProfessor B: Uh, but you could.PhD A: Well is {disfmarker} is considerable. And that's I mean, in the past we've looked at, uh, and this is hard enough, the interaction between channel effects and {disfmarker} and, uh {disfmarker} and additive noise, uh, so convolutional effects and {disfmarker} and additive effects. And that's hard enough. I mean, I don't think we really {disfmarker} I mean, we're trying to deal with that. In a sense that's what we're trying to deal with in this Aurora task. And we have, uh, the, uh, uh, LDA stuff that in principle is doing something about convolutional effects. And we have the noise suppression that's doing something about noise. Uh, even that's hard enough. And {disfmarker} and the on - line normalization as well, in that s category. i i There's all these interactions between these two and that's part of why these guys had to work so hard on {disfmarker} on juggling everything around. But now when you throw in the reverberation, it's even worse, because not only do you have these effects, but you also have some long time effects. And, um, so Dave has something which, uh, is doing some nice things under some conditions with {disfmarker} with long time effects but when it's {disfmarker} when there's noise there too, it's {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker} it's pretty hard. So we have to start {disfmarker} Since any {disfmarker} almost any real situation is gonna have {disfmarker} uh, where you have the microphone distant, is going to have both things, we {disfmarker} we actually have to think about both at the same time.PhD E: Hmm.Professor B: So, um {disfmarker} So there's this noise suppression thing, which is sort of worked out and then, uh, maybe you should just continue telling what {disfmarker} what else is in the {disfmarker} the form we have.PhD A: Yeah, basic directions are, uh, uh {disfmarker} I mean, there's lots of little things, such as improve the noise estimator but the bigger things are adding on the neural net and, uh, the second stream. And then, uh, improving the VAD. Uh. So.PhD D: So, I'll, um {disfmarker} I'll actually {disfmarker} after the meeting I'll add the second stream to the VAD and maybe I'll start with the feature net in that case. It's like, you're looking at the VAD, rightPhD A: Uh, yeah. I I've a new feature net ready also.PhD D: I'll {disfmarker} For the VADPhD A: No, uh. Well p two network, one VAD and one {pause} feature net.PhD D: Oh, you already have itPhD A: Mm - hmm.PhD D: OK, so just figure how to take the features from the final {disfmarker}PhD A: Yeah.PhD D: OK.PhD A: Um. But, yeah, I think there are plenty of issues to work on for the feature net @ @.Grad C: Feature net.PhD E: What about the, um {disfmarker} uh, the new part of the evaluation, the, uh, Wall Street Journal partProfessor B: Right. Right. Um. Have you ever {disfmarker} Very good question. Have you ever worked with the Mississippi State h uh, softwarePhD A: Sorry.PhD E: No. Not yet.Professor B: Oh. Well you {disfmarker} you may be called upon to help, uh, uh, on account of, uh, all the work in this stuff here has been, uh, with small vocabulary.PhD E: OK. Mm - hmm. So what {disfmarker} how is the, uh, interaction supposed to happen Uh, I remember the last time we talked about this, it was sort of up in the air whether they were going to be taking, uh, people's features and then running them or they were gonna give the system out or {disfmarker}PhD D: Yeah.

Summarize the discussion on project logistics

The team had pushed their code and was curious to know if the CVS system was working well. It was, at least from Belgium. Other team members needed to come back for the team to complete a few tasks.

Yeah. Um. And so I guess the issue there is, are we {disfmarker} are we using neural - net - based TRAPS, and {disfmarker} and how big are they So that'll {disfmarker} that'll be, you know, an issue.Grad C: Oh, right.Professor B: Maybe they can be little ones.Grad C: Yeah. Cuz sh Right.Professor B: Mini - TRAPS.Grad C: Cuz she also does the, uh {disfmarker} the correlation - based, uh, TRAPS, with without the neural net, just looking at the correlation between {disfmarker}Professor B: Right. And maybe for VAD they would be OK. Yeah. Yeah.Grad C: Yeah.Professor B: That's true.PhD D: Yeah.Professor B: Or a simple neural net, right I mean, the thing is, if you're doing correlation, you're just doing a simple {disfmarker} uh, uh {disfmarker} uh, dot product, you know, with some weights which you happened to learn from this {disfmarker} learn from the data.Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: And so, uh, putting a nonlinearity on it is, {pause} you know, not that big a deal. It certainly doesn't take much space.Grad C: Mm - hmm. Right.Professor B: So, uh, the question is, how complex a function do you need Do you need to have an added layer or something In which case, uh, potentially, you know, it could be big. So.Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So, uh, uh {disfmarker} So what's next Maybe s s remind us.PhD E: So the meeting with Hynek that you guys just had was to decide exactly what you were gonna freeze in this system Is that {disfmarker} Or was there {disfmarker} Were you talking about what t new stuff, or {disfmarker}Professor B: What to freeze and then what to do after we froze.PhD E: Mmm.Professor B: Yeah. And like I was saying, I think the {disfmarker} you know, the their two systems. SoProfessor B: Oh, are wePhD A: I {disfmarker} It is a triumph.PhD D: Yeah.Professor B: Is itPhD D: Their {disfmarker} their first system is fifty - four point something. And, uh, we are fifty - three point something.PhD A: But everything is {pause} within the range of one {disfmarker} one percent.PhD D: And their second system is also fifty - three point something. Yeah, one percent.Professor B: Yeah, so {disfmarker} so basically they're all {disfmarker} they're all pretty close.PhD E: Oh, wow!PhD A: So.PhD E: That's very close.PhD D: Yeah.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: And {disfmarker} and, {vocalsound} um, you know, in some sense we're all doing fairly similar things. Uh, I mean, one could argue about the LDA and so forth but I {disfmarker} I think, you know, in a lot of ways we're doing very similar things. But what {disfmarker} what {disfmarker}PhD E: So how did they fill up this {disfmarker} all these {disfmarker} these bits I mean, if we're uProfessor B: Um, why are we using half Well, so you could {disfmarker} you cPhD E: Yeah. Or how are they using more than half, I guess maybe is what I {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah, so I {disfmarker} I think {disfmarker} uh, you guys are closer to it than me, so correct me if I'm wrong, but I {disfmarker} I think that what's going on is that in {disfmarker} in both cases, some kind of normalization is done to deal with convola convolutional effects. Uh, they have some cepstral {pause} modification,PhD A: Mm - hmm.Professor B: right In our case we have a couple things. We have the on - line normalization and then we have the LDA RASTA. And {pause} they seem to comple complement each other enough and be different enough that they both seem basic directions are, uh, uh {disfmarker} I mean, there's lots of little things, such as improve the noise estimator but the bigger things are adding on the neural net and, uh, the second stream. And then, uh, improving the VAD. Uh. So.PhD D: So, I'll, um {disfmarker} I'll actually {disfmarker} after the meeting I'll add the second stream to the VAD and maybe I'll start with the feature net in that case. It's like, you're looking at the VAD, rightPhD A: Uh, yeah. I I've a new feature net ready also.PhD D: I'll {disfmarker} For the VADPhD A: No, uh. Well p two network, one VAD and one {pause} feature net.PhD D: Oh, you already have itPhD A: Mm - hmm.PhD D: OK, so just figure how to take the features from the final {disfmarker}PhD A: Yeah.PhD D: OK.PhD A: Um. But, yeah, I think there are plenty of issues to work on for the feature net @ @.Grad C: Feature net.PhD E: What about the, um {disfmarker} uh, the new part of the evaluation, the, uh, Wall Street Journal partProfessor B: Right. Right. Um. Have you ever {disfmarker} Very good question. Have you ever worked with the Mississippi State h uh, softwarePhD A: Sorry.PhD E: No. Not yet.Professor B: Oh. Well you {disfmarker} you may be called upon to help, uh, uh, on account of, uh, all the work in this stuff here has been, uh, with small vocabulary.PhD E: OK. Mm - hmm. So what {disfmarker} how is the, uh, interaction supposed to happen Uh, I remember the last time we talked about this, it was sort of up in the air whether they were going to be taking, uh, people's features and then running them or they were gonna give the system out or {disfmarker}PhD D: Yeah. {disfmarker} well, we do, but we don't {disfmarker} don't re - synthesize. In {disfmarker} in the program we don't re - synthesize and then re - analyze once again. We just use the clean FFT bins.Professor B: But you have a re - synthesized thing that you {disfmarker} that's an {disfmarker} an option here.PhD A: This is an option that {disfmarker} then you can {disfmarker} Yeah.Professor B: Yeah, I gu I guess my point is that, um, i in some of the work he's doing in reverberation, one of the things that we're finding is that, uh, it's {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker} for the {disfmarker} for an artificial situation, we can just deal with the reverberation and his techniques work really well. But for the real situation uh, problem is, is that you don't just have reverberation, you have reverberation in noise. And if you don't include that in the model, it doesn't work very well. So in fact it might be a very nice thing to do, to just take the noise removal part of it and put that in front of what he's looking at. And, uh, generate new files or whatever, and {disfmarker} and, uh, uh {disfmarker} and then do the reverberation part.PhD A: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So it's {disfmarker}PhD D: Mmm.Professor B: Anyway.PhD E: So Dave hasn't {pause} tried that yetProfessor B: No, no. He's {disfmarker} I mean, ePhD E: I guess he's busy with {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah, prelims, right.Grad C: Pre - prelim hell.Professor B: Yeah.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: So.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: Uh, but {disfmarker} but, you know, that'll {disfmarker} uh, it's clear that we, uh {disfmarker} we are not {disfmarker} with the real case that we're looking at, we can't just look at reverberation in isolation because the interaction between that and noise improve stuff. There's questions about {pause} various places where there's an exponent, if it's the right exponent, or {pause} ways that we're estimating noise, that we can improve estimating noise. And there's gonna be a host of those. But structurally it seemed like the things {disfmarker} the main things that {disfmarker} that we brought up that, uh, are {disfmarker} are gonna need to get worked on seriously are, uh, uh, a {disfmarker} {vocalsound} a significantly better VAD, uh, putting the neural net on, um, which, you know, we haven't been doing anything with, the, uh, neural net at the end there, and, uh, the, uh, {vocalsound} opening up the second front. Uh.PhD E: The other half of the channelProfessor B: Yeah, yeah, I mean, cuz we {disfmarker} we have {disfmarker} we have, uh, uh, half the {disfmarker} the, uh, data rate that they allow.PhD E: That what you meanProfessor B: And, uh, so the initial thing which came from, uh, the meeting that we had down south was, uh, that, um, we'll initially just put in a mel spectrum as the second one. It's, you know, {pause} cheap, easy. Uh. There's a question about exactly how we do it. We probably will go to something better later, but the initial thing is that cepstra and spectra behave differently,PhD E: Mm - hmm.Professor B: so. Um, {comment} I think Tony Robinson used to do {disfmarker} I was saying this before. I think he used to do mel, uh, spectra and mel cepstra. He used them as alternate features. Put them together.PhD E: Hmm.Professor B: Uh.PhD E: So if you took the system the way it is now, the way it's fro you're gonna freeze it, and it ran it on the last evaluation, where it would it bePhD A: Mm -

What did the team discuss about CVS security

While remote CVS access seemed to be working, the team was unsure about setting up a CVS server on a new port. That required a password mechanism. But the team thought an anonymous CVS might be good to store transcripts as it relied on open source software.

Yeah. Um. And so I guess the issue there is, are we {disfmarker} are we using neural - net - based TRAPS, and {disfmarker} and how big are they So that'll {disfmarker} that'll be, you know, an issue.Grad C: Oh, right.Professor B: Maybe they can be little ones.Grad C: Yeah. Cuz sh Right.Professor B: Mini - TRAPS.Grad C: Cuz she also does the, uh {disfmarker} the correlation - based, uh, TRAPS, with without the neural net, just looking at the correlation between {disfmarker}Professor B: Right. And maybe for VAD they would be OK. Yeah. Yeah.Grad C: Yeah.Professor B: That's true.PhD D: Yeah.Professor B: Or a simple neural net, right I mean, the thing is, if you're doing correlation, you're just doing a simple {disfmarker} uh, uh {disfmarker} uh, dot product, you know, with some weights which you happened to learn from this {disfmarker} learn from the data.Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: And so, uh, putting a nonlinearity on it is, {pause} you know, not that big a deal. It certainly doesn't take much space.Grad C: Mm - hmm. Right.Professor B: So, uh, the question is, how complex a function do you need Do you need to have an added layer or something In which case, uh, potentially, you know, it could be big. So.Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So, uh, uh {disfmarker} So what's next Maybe s s remind us.PhD E: So the meeting with Hynek that you guys just had was to decide exactly what you were gonna freeze in this system Is that {disfmarker} Or was there {disfmarker} Were you talking about what t new stuff, or {disfmarker}Professor B: What to freeze and then what to do after we froze.PhD E: Mmm.Professor B: Yeah. And like I was saying, I think the {disfmarker} you know, the their two systems. SoProfessor B: Oh, are wePhD A: I {disfmarker} It is a triumph.PhD D: Yeah.Professor B: Is itPhD D: Their {disfmarker} their first system is fifty - four point something. And, uh, we are fifty - three point something.PhD A: But everything is {pause} within the range of one {disfmarker} one percent.PhD D: And their second system is also fifty - three point something. Yeah, one percent.Professor B: Yeah, so {disfmarker} so basically they're all {disfmarker} they're all pretty close.PhD E: Oh, wow!PhD A: So.PhD E: That's very close.PhD D: Yeah.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: And {disfmarker} and, {vocalsound} um, you know, in some sense we're all doing fairly similar things. Uh, I mean, one could argue about the LDA and so forth but I {disfmarker} I think, you know, in a lot of ways we're doing very similar things. But what {disfmarker} what {disfmarker}PhD E: So how did they fill up this {disfmarker} all these {disfmarker} these bits I mean, if we're uProfessor B: Um, why are we using half Well, so you could {disfmarker} you cPhD E: Yeah. Or how are they using more than half, I guess maybe is what I {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah, so I {disfmarker} I think {disfmarker} uh, you guys are closer to it than me, so correct me if I'm wrong, but I {disfmarker} I think that what's going on is that in {disfmarker} in both cases, some kind of normalization is done to deal with convola convolutional effects. Uh, they have some cepstral {pause} modification,PhD A: Mm - hmm.Professor B: right In our case we have a couple things. We have the on - line normalization and then we have the LDA RASTA. And {pause} they seem to comple complement each other enough and be different enough that they both seem {disfmarker} well, we do, but we don't {disfmarker} don't re - synthesize. In {disfmarker} in the program we don't re - synthesize and then re - analyze once again. We just use the clean FFT bins.Professor B: But you have a re - synthesized thing that you {disfmarker} that's an {disfmarker} an option here.PhD A: This is an option that {disfmarker} then you can {disfmarker} Yeah.Professor B: Yeah, I gu I guess my point is that, um, i in some of the work he's doing in reverberation, one of the things that we're finding is that, uh, it's {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker} for the {disfmarker} for an artificial situation, we can just deal with the reverberation and his techniques work really well. But for the real situation uh, problem is, is that you don't just have reverberation, you have reverberation in noise. And if you don't include that in the model, it doesn't work very well. So in fact it might be a very nice thing to do, to just take the noise removal part of it and put that in front of what he's looking at. And, uh, generate new files or whatever, and {disfmarker} and, uh, uh {disfmarker} and then do the reverberation part.PhD A: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So it's {disfmarker}PhD D: Mmm.Professor B: Anyway.PhD E: So Dave hasn't {pause} tried that yetProfessor B: No, no. He's {disfmarker} I mean, ePhD E: I guess he's busy with {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah, prelims, right.Grad C: Pre - prelim hell.Professor B: Yeah.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: So.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: Uh, but {disfmarker} but, you know, that'll {disfmarker} uh, it's clear that we, uh {disfmarker} we are not {disfmarker} with the real case that we're looking at, we can't just look at reverberation in isolation because the interaction between that and noise Yeah.PhD E: Oh, so they're gonna just deliver a system basically.PhD D: Yeah, yeah.Professor B: Do we already have itPhD D: Yeah, th I {disfmarker} I guess it's almost ready.PhD E: Uh - huh.PhD D: So {disfmarker} That's what {disfmarker} So they have released their, uh, document, describing the system.Professor B: Maybe you could, uh, point it {pause} at Chuck,PhD E: I see.Professor B: because, I mean {disfmarker}PhD D: Sure.PhD E: So we'll have to grab this over CVS or somethingPhD D: It - no, it's just downloadable from their {disfmarker} from their web site.PhD E: Is that how they do it OK.Professor B: Cuz one of the things that might be helpful, if you've {disfmarker} if you've got time in all of this is, is if {disfmarker} if these guys are really focusing on improving, uh, all the digit stuff, uh, maybe {disfmarker} and you got the front - end from them, maybe you could do the runs for the {disfmarker}PhD E: OK. Mm - hmm.Professor B: and {disfmarker} and, you know, iron out hassles that {disfmarker} that you have to, uh, tweak Joe about or whatever,PhD E: Sure.Professor B: because you're more experienced with running the large vocabulary stuff.PhD E: OK.Professor B: SPhD D: So I'll point you to the web site and the mails corresponding. So IPhD E: And it {disfmarker} but it's not ready yet, the systemPhD D: Uh, I {disfmarker} I think they are still, uh, tuning something on that. So they're like, d they're varying different parameters like the insertion penalty and other stuff, and then seeing what's the performance.PhD E: Are those going to be parameters that are frozen, nobody can change Or {disfmarker}PhD D: Uh, w I guess there is, uh, time during which people are gonna make suggestions.PhD E: Oh, but basic directions are, uh, uh {disfmarker} I mean, there's lots of little things, such as improve the noise estimator but the bigger things are adding on the neural net and, uh, the second stream. And then, uh, improving the VAD. Uh. So.PhD D: So, I'll, um {disfmarker} I'll actually {disfmarker} after the meeting I'll add the second stream to the VAD and maybe I'll start with the feature net in that case. It's like, you're looking at the VAD, rightPhD A: Uh, yeah. I I've a new feature net ready also.PhD D: I'll {disfmarker} For the VADPhD A: No, uh. Well p two network, one VAD and one {pause} feature net.PhD D: Oh, you already have itPhD A: Mm - hmm.PhD D: OK, so just figure how to take the features from the final {disfmarker}PhD A: Yeah.PhD D: OK.PhD A: Um. But, yeah, I think there are plenty of issues to work on for the feature net @ @.Grad C: Feature net.PhD E: What about the, um {disfmarker} uh, the new part of the evaluation, the, uh, Wall Street Journal partProfessor B: Right. Right. Um. Have you ever {disfmarker} Very good question. Have you ever worked with the Mississippi State h uh, softwarePhD A: Sorry.PhD E: No. Not yet.Professor B: Oh. Well you {disfmarker} you may be called upon to help, uh, uh, on account of, uh, all the work in this stuff here has been, uh, with small vocabulary.PhD E: OK. Mm - hmm. So what {disfmarker} how is the, uh, interaction supposed to happen Uh, I remember the last time we talked about this, it was sort of up in the air whether they were going to be taking, uh, people's features and then running them or they were gonna give the system out or {disfmarker}PhD D: Yeah.

What did the team discuss about OGI and CVS

The team wanted to know if OGI was using CVS to access the code. It seemed that they were not. No one there was working on Aurora. Though, they were expecting Sunil to grab it and start working on Aurora once he returned.

conversion, rightProfessor B: Yeah. So, I mean, to do it after the mel conversion {disfmarker} uh, after the noise removal, after the mel conversion. There's even a question in my mind anyhow of whether th you should take the log or not. Uh. I sort of think you should, but I don't know.PhD A: What about norm normalizing alsoProfessor B: Right. Uh. Well, but normalizing spectra instead of cepstraPhD A: Yeah.Professor B: Yeah, probably. Some kind would be good. You know I would think.PhD D: Well, it {disfmarker} it {disfmarker} it {disfmarker} it {disfmarker} so it actually makes it dependent on the overall energy of the {disfmarker} uh, the frame.Professor B: If you do or don't normalizePhD D: If yo if you don't normalize and {disfmarker} if {disfmarker} if you don't normalize.Professor B: Right. Yes, so I mean, one would think that you would want to normalize. But I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} w w My thought is, uh, particularly if you take the log, try it. And then if {disfmarker} if normalization helps, then y you have something to compare against, and say," OK, this much effect" {disfmarker} I mean, you don't want to change six things and then see what happens. You want to change them one at a time.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So adding this other stream in, that's simple in some way. And then {pause} saying, oh {disfmarker} uh {disfmarker} particularly because we've found in the past there's all these {disfmarker} these {disfmarker} these different results you get with slight modifications of how you do normalization. Normalization's a very tricky, sensitive thing and {pause} you learn a lot. So, I would think you would wanna {pause} have some baseline that says," OK, we don't normalize, this is what we get" , when we do this Yeah. Um. And so I guess the issue there is, are we {disfmarker} are we using neural - net - based TRAPS, and {disfmarker} and how big are they So that'll {disfmarker} that'll be, you know, an issue.Grad C: Oh, right.Professor B: Maybe they can be little ones.Grad C: Yeah. Cuz sh Right.Professor B: Mini - TRAPS.Grad C: Cuz she also does the, uh {disfmarker} the correlation - based, uh, TRAPS, with without the neural net, just looking at the correlation between {disfmarker}Professor B: Right. And maybe for VAD they would be OK. Yeah. Yeah.Grad C: Yeah.Professor B: That's true.PhD D: Yeah.Professor B: Or a simple neural net, right I mean, the thing is, if you're doing correlation, you're just doing a simple {disfmarker} uh, uh {disfmarker} uh, dot product, you know, with some weights which you happened to learn from this {disfmarker} learn from the data.Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: And so, uh, putting a nonlinearity on it is, {pause} you know, not that big a deal. It certainly doesn't take much space.Grad C: Mm - hmm. Right.Professor B: So, uh, the question is, how complex a function do you need Do you need to have an added layer or something In which case, uh, potentially, you know, it could be big. So.Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So, uh, uh {disfmarker} So what's next Maybe s s remind us.PhD E: So the meeting with Hynek that you guys just had was to decide exactly what you were gonna freeze in this system Is that {disfmarker} Or was there {disfmarker} Were you talking about what t new stuff, or {disfmarker}Professor B: What to freeze and then what to do after we froze.PhD E: Mmm.Professor B: Yeah. And like I was saying, I think the {disfmarker} you know, the their two systems. SoProfessor B: Oh, are wePhD A: I {disfmarker} It is a triumph.PhD D: Yeah.Professor B: Is itPhD D: Their {disfmarker} their first system is fifty - four point something. And, uh, we are fifty - three point something.PhD A: But everything is {pause} within the range of one {disfmarker} one percent.PhD D: And their second system is also fifty - three point something. Yeah, one percent.Professor B: Yeah, so {disfmarker} so basically they're all {disfmarker} they're all pretty close.PhD E: Oh, wow!PhD A: So.PhD E: That's very close.PhD D: Yeah.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: And {disfmarker} and, {vocalsound} um, you know, in some sense we're all doing fairly similar things. Uh, I mean, one could argue about the LDA and so forth but I {disfmarker} I think, you know, in a lot of ways we're doing very similar things. But what {disfmarker} what {disfmarker}PhD E: So how did they fill up this {disfmarker} all these {disfmarker} these bits I mean, if we're uProfessor B: Um, why are we using half Well, so you could {disfmarker} you cPhD E: Yeah. Or how are they using more than half, I guess maybe is what I {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah, so I {disfmarker} I think {disfmarker} uh, you guys are closer to it than me, so correct me if I'm wrong, but I {disfmarker} I think that what's going on is that in {disfmarker} in both cases, some kind of normalization is done to deal with convola convolutional effects. Uh, they have some cepstral {pause} modification,PhD A: Mm - hmm.Professor B: right In our case we have a couple things. We have the on - line normalization and then we have the LDA RASTA. And {pause} they seem to comple complement each other enough and be different enough that they both seem basic directions are, uh, uh {disfmarker} I mean, there's lots of little things, such as improve the noise estimator but the bigger things are adding on the neural net and, uh, the second stream. And then, uh, improving the VAD. Uh. So.PhD D: So, I'll, um {disfmarker} I'll actually {disfmarker} after the meeting I'll add the second stream to the VAD and maybe I'll start with the feature net in that case. It's like, you're looking at the VAD, rightPhD A: Uh, yeah. I I've a new feature net ready also.PhD D: I'll {disfmarker} For the VADPhD A: No, uh. Well p two network, one VAD and one {pause} feature net.PhD D: Oh, you already have itPhD A: Mm - hmm.PhD D: OK, so just figure how to take the features from the final {disfmarker}PhD A: Yeah.PhD D: OK.PhD A: Um. But, yeah, I think there are plenty of issues to work on for the feature net @ @.Grad C: Feature net.PhD E: What about the, um {disfmarker} uh, the new part of the evaluation, the, uh, Wall Street Journal partProfessor B: Right. Right. Um. Have you ever {disfmarker} Very good question. Have you ever worked with the Mississippi State h uh, softwarePhD A: Sorry.PhD E: No. Not yet.Professor B: Oh. Well you {disfmarker} you may be called upon to help, uh, uh, on account of, uh, all the work in this stuff here has been, uh, with small vocabulary.PhD E: OK. Mm - hmm. So what {disfmarker} how is the, uh, interaction supposed to happen Uh, I remember the last time we talked about this, it was sort of up in the air whether they were going to be taking, uh, people's features and then running them or they were gonna give the system out or {disfmarker}PhD D: Yeah. normalization, when we do that normalization. But {disfmarker} but the other question is {disfmarker} So I think ultimately we'll wind up doing some normalization. I agree.PhD E: So this second stream, will it add latency to the systemProfessor B: No, it's in parallel.PhD E: or {disfmarker}Grad C: ParaProfessor B: We're not talking about computation time here.PhD E: SProfessor B: We're ta I think we're pretty far out.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: So it's just in terms of what data it's depending on. It's depending on the same data as the other.PhD E: Same data.Professor B: So it's in parallel.PhD E: OK.Professor B: Uh - huh.Grad C: So with this, uh, new stream would you train up a VAD on both {disfmarker} both features, somehowPhD D: No, I guess the VAD has its own set of features.Grad C: OK. that's {disfmarker}PhD D: I mean, which could be this {disfmarker} one of these streams, or it can be something derived from {pause} these streams.Professor B: Yeah.Grad C: OK.PhD A: And there is also the idea of using TRAPS, maybe, for the VAD, which, um {disfmarker}PhD D: Yeah, that's also {disfmarker}PhD A: Well, Pratibha apparently showed, when, she was at IBM, that it's a good idea. So.Grad C: Would {disfmarker} would that fit on the handset, or {disfmarker} Oh!PhD A: I have no idea.Grad C: OK.PhD D: Well, it has t I mean the {disfmarker} thPhD A: It would have to fit but {disfmarker} Yeah.PhD D: Yeah, if it has to fit the delays and all this stuff.Professor B: Well, there's the delays and the storage,Grad C: OK.Professor B: yeah. But I don't think the storage is so big for that.Grad C: Right.PhD D: Yeah.Professor B: I think th the biggest we've run into for storage is the neural net. RightPhD D: Yeah.Professor B:

What did the team discuss about evaluation

The professor informed the team that the evaluation was on November 13. He encouraged the team to run experiments to learn which factors were the most important. The team was concerned about how the evaluation would be weighted, but they did not expect it to be significantly different. There was a chance that the evaluation would be pushed.

Yeah. Um. And so I guess the issue there is, are we {disfmarker} are we using neural - net - based TRAPS, and {disfmarker} and how big are they So that'll {disfmarker} that'll be, you know, an issue.Grad C: Oh, right.Professor B: Maybe they can be little ones.Grad C: Yeah. Cuz sh Right.Professor B: Mini - TRAPS.Grad C: Cuz she also does the, uh {disfmarker} the correlation - based, uh, TRAPS, with without the neural net, just looking at the correlation between {disfmarker}Professor B: Right. And maybe for VAD they would be OK. Yeah. Yeah.Grad C: Yeah.Professor B: That's true.PhD D: Yeah.Professor B: Or a simple neural net, right I mean, the thing is, if you're doing correlation, you're just doing a simple {disfmarker} uh, uh {disfmarker} uh, dot product, you know, with some weights which you happened to learn from this {disfmarker} learn from the data.Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: And so, uh, putting a nonlinearity on it is, {pause} you know, not that big a deal. It certainly doesn't take much space.Grad C: Mm - hmm. Right.Professor B: So, uh, the question is, how complex a function do you need Do you need to have an added layer or something In which case, uh, potentially, you know, it could be big. So.Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So, uh, uh {disfmarker} So what's next Maybe s s remind us.PhD E: So the meeting with Hynek that you guys just had was to decide exactly what you were gonna freeze in this system Is that {disfmarker} Or was there {disfmarker} Were you talking about what t new stuff, or {disfmarker}Professor B: What to freeze and then what to do after we froze.PhD E: Mmm.Professor B: Yeah. And like I was saying, I think the {disfmarker} you know, the basic directions are, uh, uh {disfmarker} I mean, there's lots of little things, such as improve the noise estimator but the bigger things are adding on the neural net and, uh, the second stream. And then, uh, improving the VAD. Uh. So.PhD D: So, I'll, um {disfmarker} I'll actually {disfmarker} after the meeting I'll add the second stream to the VAD and maybe I'll start with the feature net in that case. It's like, you're looking at the VAD, rightPhD A: Uh, yeah. I I've a new feature net ready also.PhD D: I'll {disfmarker} For the VADPhD A: No, uh. Well p two network, one VAD and one {pause} feature net.PhD D: Oh, you already have itPhD A: Mm - hmm.PhD D: OK, so just figure how to take the features from the final {disfmarker}PhD A: Yeah.PhD D: OK.PhD A: Um. But, yeah, I think there are plenty of issues to work on for the feature net @ @.Grad C: Feature net.PhD E: What about the, um {disfmarker} uh, the new part of the evaluation, the, uh, Wall Street Journal partProfessor B: Right. Right. Um. Have you ever {disfmarker} Very good question. Have you ever worked with the Mississippi State h uh, softwarePhD A: Sorry.PhD E: No. Not yet.Professor B: Oh. Well you {disfmarker} you may be called upon to help, uh, uh, on account of, uh, all the work in this stuff here has been, uh, with small vocabulary.PhD E: OK. Mm - hmm. So what {disfmarker} how is the, uh, interaction supposed to happen Uh, I remember the last time we talked about this, it was sort of up in the air whether they were going to be taking, uh, people's features and then running them or they were gonna give the system out or {disfmarker}PhD D: Yeah. {disfmarker} well, we do, but we don't {disfmarker} don't re - synthesize. In {disfmarker} in the program we don't re - synthesize and then re - analyze once again. We just use the clean FFT bins.Professor B: But you have a re - synthesized thing that you {disfmarker} that's an {disfmarker} an option here.PhD A: This is an option that {disfmarker} then you can {disfmarker} Yeah.Professor B: Yeah, I gu I guess my point is that, um, i in some of the work he's doing in reverberation, one of the things that we're finding is that, uh, it's {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker} for the {disfmarker} for an artificial situation, we can just deal with the reverberation and his techniques work really well. But for the real situation uh, problem is, is that you don't just have reverberation, you have reverberation in noise. And if you don't include that in the model, it doesn't work very well. So in fact it might be a very nice thing to do, to just take the noise removal part of it and put that in front of what he's looking at. And, uh, generate new files or whatever, and {disfmarker} and, uh, uh {disfmarker} and then do the reverberation part.PhD A: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So it's {disfmarker}PhD D: Mmm.Professor B: Anyway.PhD E: So Dave hasn't {pause} tried that yetProfessor B: No, no. He's {disfmarker} I mean, ePhD E: I guess he's busy with {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah, prelims, right.Grad C: Pre - prelim hell.Professor B: Yeah.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: So.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: Uh, but {disfmarker} but, you know, that'll {disfmarker} uh, it's clear that we, uh {disfmarker} we are not {disfmarker} with the real case that we're looking at, we can't just look at reverberation in isolation because the interaction between that and noise is {disfmarker} is considerable. And that's I mean, in the past we've looked at, uh, and this is hard enough, the interaction between channel effects and {disfmarker} and, uh {disfmarker} and additive noise, uh, so convolutional effects and {disfmarker} and additive effects. And that's hard enough. I mean, I don't think we really {disfmarker} I mean, we're trying to deal with that. In a sense that's what we're trying to deal with in this Aurora task. And we have, uh, the, uh, uh, LDA stuff that in principle is doing something about convolutional effects. And we have the noise suppression that's doing something about noise. Uh, even that's hard enough. And {disfmarker} and the on - line normalization as well, in that s category. i i There's all these interactions between these two and that's part of why these guys had to work so hard on {disfmarker} on juggling everything around. But now when you throw in the reverberation, it's even worse, because not only do you have these effects, but you also have some long time effects. And, um, so Dave has something which, uh, is doing some nice things under some conditions with {disfmarker} with long time effects but when it's {disfmarker} when there's noise there too, it's {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker} it's pretty hard. So we have to start {disfmarker} Since any {disfmarker} almost any real situation is gonna have {disfmarker} uh, where you have the microphone distant, is going to have both things, we {disfmarker} we actually have to think about both at the same time.PhD E: Hmm.Professor B: So, um {disfmarker} So there's this noise suppression thing, which is sort of worked out and then, uh, maybe you should just continue telling what {disfmarker} what else is in the {disfmarker} the form we have.PhD A: Yeah, Yeah.PhD E: Oh, so they're gonna just deliver a system basically.PhD D: Yeah, yeah.Professor B: Do we already have itPhD D: Yeah, th I {disfmarker} I guess it's almost ready.PhD E: Uh - huh.PhD D: So {disfmarker} That's what {disfmarker} So they have released their, uh, document, describing the system.Professor B: Maybe you could, uh, point it {pause} at Chuck,PhD E: I see.Professor B: because, I mean {disfmarker}PhD D: Sure.PhD E: So we'll have to grab this over CVS or somethingPhD D: It - no, it's just downloadable from their {disfmarker} from their web site.PhD E: Is that how they do it OK.Professor B: Cuz one of the things that might be helpful, if you've {disfmarker} if you've got time in all of this is, is if {disfmarker} if these guys are really focusing on improving, uh, all the digit stuff, uh, maybe {disfmarker} and you got the front - end from them, maybe you could do the runs for the {disfmarker}PhD E: OK. Mm - hmm.Professor B: and {disfmarker} and, you know, iron out hassles that {disfmarker} that you have to, uh, tweak Joe about or whatever,PhD E: Sure.Professor B: because you're more experienced with running the large vocabulary stuff.PhD E: OK.Professor B: SPhD D: So I'll point you to the web site and the mails corresponding. So IPhD E: And it {disfmarker} but it's not ready yet, the systemPhD D: Uh, I {disfmarker} I think they are still, uh, tuning something on that. So they're like, d they're varying different parameters like the insertion penalty and other stuff, and then seeing what's the performance.PhD E: Are those going to be parameters that are frozen, nobody can change Or {disfmarker}PhD D: Uh, w I guess there is, uh, time during which people are gonna make suggestions.PhD E: Oh, but

What did the team discuss about insertion penalties

The Aurora staff was tinkering around with various parameters, like the insertion penalty. The professor expressed interest in knowing what the exact penalties were to make decision about the team's models.

Yeah. Um. And so I guess the issue there is, are we {disfmarker} are we using neural - net - based TRAPS, and {disfmarker} and how big are they So that'll {disfmarker} that'll be, you know, an issue.Grad C: Oh, right.Professor B: Maybe they can be little ones.Grad C: Yeah. Cuz sh Right.Professor B: Mini - TRAPS.Grad C: Cuz she also does the, uh {disfmarker} the correlation - based, uh, TRAPS, with without the neural net, just looking at the correlation between {disfmarker}Professor B: Right. And maybe for VAD they would be OK. Yeah. Yeah.Grad C: Yeah.Professor B: That's true.PhD D: Yeah.Professor B: Or a simple neural net, right I mean, the thing is, if you're doing correlation, you're just doing a simple {disfmarker} uh, uh {disfmarker} uh, dot product, you know, with some weights which you happened to learn from this {disfmarker} learn from the data.Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: And so, uh, putting a nonlinearity on it is, {pause} you know, not that big a deal. It certainly doesn't take much space.Grad C: Mm - hmm. Right.Professor B: So, uh, the question is, how complex a function do you need Do you need to have an added layer or something In which case, uh, potentially, you know, it could be big. So.Grad C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So, uh, uh {disfmarker} So what's next Maybe s s remind us.PhD E: So the meeting with Hynek that you guys just had was to decide exactly what you were gonna freeze in this system Is that {disfmarker} Or was there {disfmarker} Were you talking about what t new stuff, or {disfmarker}Professor B: What to freeze and then what to do after we froze.PhD E: Mmm.Professor B: Yeah. And like I was saying, I think the {disfmarker} you know, the Yeah.PhD E: Oh, so they're gonna just deliver a system basically.PhD D: Yeah, yeah.Professor B: Do we already have itPhD D: Yeah, th I {disfmarker} I guess it's almost ready.PhD E: Uh - huh.PhD D: So {disfmarker} That's what {disfmarker} So they have released their, uh, document, describing the system.Professor B: Maybe you could, uh, point it {pause} at Chuck,PhD E: I see.Professor B: because, I mean {disfmarker}PhD D: Sure.PhD E: So we'll have to grab this over CVS or somethingPhD D: It - no, it's just downloadable from their {disfmarker} from their web site.PhD E: Is that how they do it OK.Professor B: Cuz one of the things that might be helpful, if you've {disfmarker} if you've got time in all of this is, is if {disfmarker} if these guys are really focusing on improving, uh, all the digit stuff, uh, maybe {disfmarker} and you got the front - end from them, maybe you could do the runs for the {disfmarker}PhD E: OK. Mm - hmm.Professor B: and {disfmarker} and, you know, iron out hassles that {disfmarker} that you have to, uh, tweak Joe about or whatever,PhD E: Sure.Professor B: because you're more experienced with running the large vocabulary stuff.PhD E: OK.Professor B: SPhD D: So I'll point you to the web site and the mails corresponding. So IPhD E: And it {disfmarker} but it's not ready yet, the systemPhD D: Uh, I {disfmarker} I think they are still, uh, tuning something on that. So they're like, d they're varying different parameters like the insertion penalty and other stuff, and then seeing what's the performance.PhD E: Are those going to be parameters that are frozen, nobody can change Or {disfmarker}PhD D: Uh, w I guess there is, uh, time during which people are gonna make suggestions.PhD E: Oh, but improve stuff. There's questions about {pause} various places where there's an exponent, if it's the right exponent, or {pause} ways that we're estimating noise, that we can improve estimating noise. And there's gonna be a host of those. But structurally it seemed like the things {disfmarker} the main things that {disfmarker} that we brought up that, uh, are {disfmarker} are gonna need to get worked on seriously are, uh, uh, a {disfmarker} {vocalsound} a significantly better VAD, uh, putting the neural net on, um, which, you know, we haven't been doing anything with, the, uh, neural net at the end there, and, uh, the, uh, {vocalsound} opening up the second front. Uh.PhD E: The other half of the channelProfessor B: Yeah, yeah, I mean, cuz we {disfmarker} we have {disfmarker} we have, uh, uh, half the {disfmarker} the, uh, data rate that they allow.PhD E: That what you meanProfessor B: And, uh, so the initial thing which came from, uh, the meeting that we had down south was, uh, that, um, we'll initially just put in a mel spectrum as the second one. It's, you know, {pause} cheap, easy. Uh. There's a question about exactly how we do it. We probably will go to something better later, but the initial thing is that cepstra and spectra behave differently,PhD E: Mm - hmm.Professor B: so. Um, {comment} I think Tony Robinson used to do {disfmarker} I was saying this before. I think he used to do mel, uh, spectra and mel cepstra. He used them as alternate features. Put them together.PhD E: Hmm.Professor B: Uh.PhD E: So if you took the system the way it is now, the way it's fro you're gonna freeze it, and it ran it on the last evaluation, where it would it bePhD A: Mm - basic directions are, uh, uh {disfmarker} I mean, there's lots of little things, such as improve the noise estimator but the bigger things are adding on the neural net and, uh, the second stream. And then, uh, improving the VAD. Uh. So.PhD D: So, I'll, um {disfmarker} I'll actually {disfmarker} after the meeting I'll add the second stream to the VAD and maybe I'll start with the feature net in that case. It's like, you're looking at the VAD, rightPhD A: Uh, yeah. I I've a new feature net ready also.PhD D: I'll {disfmarker} For the VADPhD A: No, uh. Well p two network, one VAD and one {pause} feature net.PhD D: Oh, you already have itPhD A: Mm - hmm.PhD D: OK, so just figure how to take the features from the final {disfmarker}PhD A: Yeah.PhD D: OK.PhD A: Um. But, yeah, I think there are plenty of issues to work on for the feature net @ @.Grad C: Feature net.PhD E: What about the, um {disfmarker} uh, the new part of the evaluation, the, uh, Wall Street Journal partProfessor B: Right. Right. Um. Have you ever {disfmarker} Very good question. Have you ever worked with the Mississippi State h uh, softwarePhD A: Sorry.PhD E: No. Not yet.Professor B: Oh. Well you {disfmarker} you may be called upon to help, uh, uh, on account of, uh, all the work in this stuff here has been, uh, with small vocabulary.PhD E: OK. Mm - hmm. So what {disfmarker} how is the, uh, interaction supposed to happen Uh, I remember the last time we talked about this, it was sort of up in the air whether they were going to be taking, uh, people's features and then running them or they were gonna give the system out or {disfmarker}PhD D: Yeah. {disfmarker} well, we do, but we don't {disfmarker} don't re - synthesize. In {disfmarker} in the program we don't re - synthesize and then re - analyze once again. We just use the clean FFT bins.Professor B: But you have a re - synthesized thing that you {disfmarker} that's an {disfmarker} an option here.PhD A: This is an option that {disfmarker} then you can {disfmarker} Yeah.Professor B: Yeah, I gu I guess my point is that, um, i in some of the work he's doing in reverberation, one of the things that we're finding is that, uh, it's {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker} for the {disfmarker} for an artificial situation, we can just deal with the reverberation and his techniques work really well. But for the real situation uh, problem is, is that you don't just have reverberation, you have reverberation in noise. And if you don't include that in the model, it doesn't work very well. So in fact it might be a very nice thing to do, to just take the noise removal part of it and put that in front of what he's looking at. And, uh, generate new files or whatever, and {disfmarker} and, uh, uh {disfmarker} and then do the reverberation part.PhD A: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So it's {disfmarker}PhD D: Mmm.Professor B: Anyway.PhD E: So Dave hasn't {pause} tried that yetProfessor B: No, no. He's {disfmarker} I mean, ePhD E: I guess he's busy with {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah, prelims, right.Grad C: Pre - prelim hell.Professor B: Yeah.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: So.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: Uh, but {disfmarker} but, you know, that'll {disfmarker} uh, it's clear that we, uh {disfmarker} we are not {disfmarker} with the real case that we're looking at, we can't just look at reverberation in isolation because the interaction between that and noise

What did the team discuss about the Wall Street Journal data

PhD E informed the team that Guenter was putting the Wall Street Journal data on the team's disks. There was a lot of data so it would take some time to run the models.

techniquesPhD A: So finally it's {disfmarker} it's, um, Wiener filtering on FFT bins. And it uses, uh, two steps, smoothing of the transfer function, the first step, that's along time, which use recursion. And {vocalsound} after this step there is a further smoothing along frequency, which use a sliding window of twenty FFT bins. Mmm. And, uh {disfmarker}PhD E: So this is on the {disfmarker} uh, before any mel scaling has been donePhD A: Yeah, yeah.PhD E: This is {disfmarker}PhD A: It was {disfmarker}Professor B: This {disfmarker} this smoothing is done on the estimate, um, of what you're going to subtract Or on the thing that has already had something subtractedPhD A: Yeah. Uh, {vocalsound} it's on the transfer function. So {disfmarker}Professor B: Oh, it's on the transfer function for the Wiener filter.PhD A: Yeah.Professor B: Yeah, OK.PhD A: Yeah, so basically we tried {vocalsound} different configuration within this idea. We tried u u applying this on mel bands, having spectral subtraction instead of wiener filtering. Um. Well, finally we end up with {pause} this configuration that works, uh, quite well. So we are going to fix this for the moment and work on the other aspects of {vocalsound} the whole system.PhD E: Mm - hmm.PhD A: So {disfmarker}Professor B: Actually, let me int eh, Dave isn't here to talk about it, but let me just interject. This module, in principle, i I mean, you would know whether it's {vocalsound} true in fact, is somewhat independent from the rest of it. I mean, because you {disfmarker} you re - synthesize speech, rightPhD A: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So, um. Uh, well you don't {disfmarker} I guess you don't re - synthesize speech, but you could {disfmarker}PhD A: We {disfmarker} we do not foProfessor B: Uh, but you could.PhD A: Well basic directions are, uh, uh {disfmarker} I mean, there's lots of little things, such as improve the noise estimator but the bigger things are adding on the neural net and, uh, the second stream. And then, uh, improving the VAD. Uh. So.PhD D: So, I'll, um {disfmarker} I'll actually {disfmarker} after the meeting I'll add the second stream to the VAD and maybe I'll start with the feature net in that case. It's like, you're looking at the VAD, rightPhD A: Uh, yeah. I I've a new feature net ready also.PhD D: I'll {disfmarker} For the VADPhD A: No, uh. Well p two network, one VAD and one {pause} feature net.PhD D: Oh, you already have itPhD A: Mm - hmm.PhD D: OK, so just figure how to take the features from the final {disfmarker}PhD A: Yeah.PhD D: OK.PhD A: Um. But, yeah, I think there are plenty of issues to work on for the feature net @ @.Grad C: Feature net.PhD E: What about the, um {disfmarker} uh, the new part of the evaluation, the, uh, Wall Street Journal partProfessor B: Right. Right. Um. Have you ever {disfmarker} Very good question. Have you ever worked with the Mississippi State h uh, softwarePhD A: Sorry.PhD E: No. Not yet.Professor B: Oh. Well you {disfmarker} you may be called upon to help, uh, uh, on account of, uh, all the work in this stuff here has been, uh, with small vocabulary.PhD E: OK. Mm - hmm. So what {disfmarker} how is the, uh, interaction supposed to happen Uh, I remember the last time we talked about this, it was sort of up in the air whether they were going to be taking, uh, people's features and then running them or they were gonna give the system out or {disfmarker}PhD D: Yeah. improve stuff. There's questions about {pause} various places where there's an exponent, if it's the right exponent, or {pause} ways that we're estimating noise, that we can improve estimating noise. And there's gonna be a host of those. But structurally it seemed like the things {disfmarker} the main things that {disfmarker} that we brought up that, uh, are {disfmarker} are gonna need to get worked on seriously are, uh, uh, a {disfmarker} {vocalsound} a significantly better VAD, uh, putting the neural net on, um, which, you know, we haven't been doing anything with, the, uh, neural net at the end there, and, uh, the, uh, {vocalsound} opening up the second front. Uh.PhD E: The other half of the channelProfessor B: Yeah, yeah, I mean, cuz we {disfmarker} we have {disfmarker} we have, uh, uh, half the {disfmarker} the, uh, data rate that they allow.PhD E: That what you meanProfessor B: And, uh, so the initial thing which came from, uh, the meeting that we had down south was, uh, that, um, we'll initially just put in a mel spectrum as the second one. It's, you know, {pause} cheap, easy. Uh. There's a question about exactly how we do it. We probably will go to something better later, but the initial thing is that cepstra and spectra behave differently,PhD E: Mm - hmm.Professor B: so. Um, {comment} I think Tony Robinson used to do {disfmarker} I was saying this before. I think he used to do mel, uh, spectra and mel cepstra. He used them as alternate features. Put them together.PhD E: Hmm.Professor B: Uh.PhD E: So if you took the system the way it is now, the way it's fro you're gonna freeze it, and it ran it on the last evaluation, where it would it bePhD A: Mm - {disfmarker} well, we do, but we don't {disfmarker} don't re - synthesize. In {disfmarker} in the program we don't re - synthesize and then re - analyze once again. We just use the clean FFT bins.Professor B: But you have a re - synthesized thing that you {disfmarker} that's an {disfmarker} an option here.PhD A: This is an option that {disfmarker} then you can {disfmarker} Yeah.Professor B: Yeah, I gu I guess my point is that, um, i in some of the work he's doing in reverberation, one of the things that we're finding is that, uh, it's {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker} for the {disfmarker} for an artificial situation, we can just deal with the reverberation and his techniques work really well. But for the real situation uh, problem is, is that you don't just have reverberation, you have reverberation in noise. And if you don't include that in the model, it doesn't work very well. So in fact it might be a very nice thing to do, to just take the noise removal part of it and put that in front of what he's looking at. And, uh, generate new files or whatever, and {disfmarker} and, uh, uh {disfmarker} and then do the reverberation part.PhD A: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So it's {disfmarker}PhD D: Mmm.Professor B: Anyway.PhD E: So Dave hasn't {pause} tried that yetProfessor B: No, no. He's {disfmarker} I mean, ePhD E: I guess he's busy with {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah, prelims, right.Grad C: Pre - prelim hell.Professor B: Yeah.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: So.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: Uh, but {disfmarker} but, you know, that'll {disfmarker} uh, it's clear that we, uh {disfmarker} we are not {disfmarker} with the real case that we're looking at, we can't just look at reverberation in isolation because the interaction between that and noise everybody's gonna have to use the same values.PhD D: After that.PhD E: Oh! Interesting.PhD D: Yeah, I guess.PhD E: OK.PhD D: So these sugges these {disfmarker} this, uh, period during which people are gonna make suggestions is to know whether it is actually biased towards any set of features or {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah, so I th th certainly the thing that I would want to know about is whether we get really hurt, uh, on in insertion penalty, language model, scaling, sorts of things.PhD E: Using our features.Professor B: Yeah, yeah.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: Uh, in which case, um, H Hari or Hynek will need to, you know, push the case {pause} more about {disfmarker} about this.PhD E: Mm - hmm.Professor B: Um.PhD E: And we may be able to revisit this idea about, you know, somehow modifying our features to work with {disfmarker}Professor B: Yes. In this case, that's right.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: That's right. Um, some of that may be, uh, a last minute rush thing because if the {disfmarker} if our features are changing {disfmarker} Uh.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: Uh. But, um. Yeah, the other thing is that even though it's months away, uh, it's starting to seem to me now like November fifteenth is right around the corner. And, um, if they haven't decided things like this, like what the parameters are gonna be for this, uh, when" deciding" is not just somebody deciding. I mean, in fact there should be some understanding behind the, uh, {vocalsound} deciding, which means some experiments and {disfmarker} and so forth. It {disfmarker} it {disfmarker} it seems pretty tight to me.PhD E: So wha what's the significance of November fifteenthProfessor B: That's when the evaluation is.PhD E: OK.Professor B: Yeah. So, yeah, so after {disfmarker} But, you know, they may

Summarize the meeting

The meeting occurred close to the finalization of the model for Aurora. The team had put together a model and was tweaking it to see what achieves best performance. The professor suggested that it was time to make some decisions, have several constants, and then test other theories on remaining features. The neural net, for instance, was yet to come together. Still, the model was second in ranking for the task, behind the leader by only one point. The evaluation criteria for the tasks was still not completely clear, but the team seemed to be doing well.

I needed to put together for the subspace approach. And I'm in the process of, like, building up that stuff. And, um, uh {disfmarker} {nonvocalsound} Yeah. I guess {disfmarker} Yep. I guess that's it. And, uh, th th that's where I am right now. So.PhD F: Oh. How about you, CarmenPhD E: Mmm. I'm working with VTS. Um, I do several experiment with the Spanish database first, only with VTS and nothing more. Not VAD, no LDA, nothing more.PhD F: What {disfmarker} what is VTS againPhD D: New {disfmarker}PhD E: Eh, Vectorial Taylor Series.PhD F: Oh, yes.PhD E: To remove the noise too.PhD F: Right, right. I think I ask you that every single meeting, don't IPhD E: WhatPhD F: I ask you that question every meeting.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: So, that'd be good from {disfmarker} for analysis.PhD E: If {disfmarker} Well {disfmarker}Professor B: It's good to have some, uh, cases of the same utterance at different {disfmarker} different times.PhD F: Yeah.Professor B: Yeah.PhD F:" What is VTS" PhD E: VTS. I'm sor Well, um, the question is that {disfmarker} Well. Remove some noise but not too much. And when we put the {disfmarker} m m the, em, VAD, the result is better. And we put everything, the result is better, but it's not better than the result that we have without VTS. No, no.Professor B: I see. So that @ @ {comment} given that you're using the VAD also, the effect of the VTS is not {pause} so far {disfmarker}PhD E: Is not.Professor B: Do you {disfmarker} How much of that do you think is due to just the particular implementation and how much you're adjusting it Or how much do you think is intrinsic to {disfmarker}PhD E: Pfft. I don't know because {disfmarker}PhD C: Are you still using I have now, uh, sixty - four {nonvocalsound} Gaus - Gaussian.Professor B: Uh - huh. And what are you using for the noisy {disfmarker} Y y doing that strictly {disfmarker}PhD E: Of the noise {disfmarker} I estimate the noises wiProfessor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: Well, for the noises I only use one Gaussian.Professor B: And {disfmarker} and you {disfmarker} and you train it up entirely from, uh, nonspeech sections in the testPhD C: Hmm.PhD E: Uh, yes. The first experiment that I do it is solely to calculate the, mmm {disfmarker} well, this value {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah.PhD E: uh, the compensation of the dictionary o one time using the {disfmarker} the noise at the f beginning of the sentence.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: This is the first experiment.Professor B: Yeah.PhD E: And I fix this for all the {disfmarker} all the sentences. Uh, because {disfmarker} well, the VTS methods {disfmarker} In fact the first thing that I do is to {disfmarker} to obtain, uh, an expression for E {disfmarker} probability e expression of {disfmarker} of E. That mean that the VTS {disfmarker} mmm, with the VTS we obtain, uh {disfmarker} well, we {disfmarker} we obtain the means for each Gaussian {comment} and the variance.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: This is one. Eh, this is the composition of the dictionary.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: This one thing. And the other thing that this {disfmarker} with these methods is to, uh, obtain {disfmarker} to calculate this value.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: Because we can write {disfmarker} uh, we can write that {vocalsound} the estimation of the clean speech is equal at an expected value of the clean speech conditional to, uh, the noise signal {disfmarker} {vocalsound} the probability f of the {disfmarker} the statistic of the clean first order of the vector st Taylor series of the {disfmarker} of the {disfmarker} of {disfmarker} well, the order that we want, increase the complexity of the problem.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: And then when we have a expression, uh, for the {vocalsound} mean and variance of the noisy speech, we apply a technique of minimum mean - square estimationProfessor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: to obtain the expected value of the clean speech given the {disfmarker} this {vocalsound} statistic for the noisy speech {disfmarker}Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: the statistic for clean speech and the statistic of the noisy speech. This only that. But the idea is that {disfmarker}PhD C: And the {disfmarker} the model of clean speech is a codebook. RightPhD E: u Yeah. We have our codebook with different density {vocalsound} Gaussian.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: We can expre we can put that the {vocalsound} PDF {comment} for the clean test, probability of the clean speech is equal to {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah.PhD E:PhD C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So, um, how {disfmarker} h how much {disfmarker} in {disfmarker} in the work they reported, how much noisy speech did you need to get, uh, good enough statistics for the {disfmarker} to get this mappingPhD E: I don't know exactly.Professor B: Yeah.PhD E: I {disfmarker} I need to sProfessor B: Yeah.PhD E: I don't know exactly.Professor B: Cuz I think what's certainly characteristic of a lot of the {pause} data in this test is that, um, you don't have {disfmarker} {vocalsound} the {disfmarker} the training set may not be a {disfmarker} a great estimator for the noise in the test set. Sometimes it is and sometimes it's not.PhD E: Yeah. I {disfmarker} the clean speech {disfmarker} the codebook for clean speech, I am using TIMIT. And speech and the statistic of the noise.Professor B: Mm - hmm. Mm - hmm.PhD E: This is the methods that say that we're going obtain this.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: And we can put that this is equal to the estimated value of E minus a function that conditional to E to the T {disfmarker} to the noise signal. Well, this is {disfmarker} this function is the {vocalsound} the term {disfmarker} after develop this, the term that we {disfmarker} we take. Give PX and, uh, P the noise.PhD D: X K C noise.Professor B: Mmm.PhD E: And I can {vocalsound} put that this is equal to {pause} the {pause} noise signal minus {disfmarker} Well, I put before {pause} this name, uh {disfmarker} And I can calculate this.Professor B: What is the first variable in that probabilityPhD E: Uh, this is the Gaussian.Professor B: No, no. I'm sorry. In {disfmarker} in the one you pointed at. What's that variablePhD E: v Uh, this is the {disfmarker}PhD D: Weak. So probably it {disfmarker} it would do that.PhD E: like this,PhD C: It's one mixture of the model. RightPhD E: but conditional. No, it's condition it's not exactly this. It's modify. Uh, if we have clean speech {disfmarker} we have the dictionary for the clean speech, we have a probability f of {disfmarker} our {disfmarker} our weight for each Gaussian.Professor B: OK.PhD E: No. And now, this weight is different nowProfessor B: Yes.PhD E: because it's conditional. And this I need to {disfmarker} to calcu I know thisProfessor B: Uh - huh.PhD E: and I know this because this is from the dictionary that you have.Professor B: Uh - huh.PhD E: I need to calculate this.Professor B: Yes.PhD E: And for calculate this, {vocalsound} I have an {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I can - hmm.Professor B: Um. So maybe if you tested it using that, {vocalsound} you'd have more reliable {pause} stretches of nonspeech to do the estimation from and see if that helps.PhD E: Yeah. Another thing is the, em {disfmarker} the codebook, the initial codebook. That maybe, well, it's too clean and {disfmarker}Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: Cuz it's a {disfmarker} I don't know. The methods {disfmarker} If you want, you c I can say something about the method.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: Yeah. In the {disfmarker} Because it's {vocalsound} a little bit different of the other method. Well, we have {disfmarker} If this {disfmarker} if this is the noise signal, {nonvocalsound} uh, in the log domain, we have something like this. Now, we have something like this. And the idea of these methods is to {disfmarker} {vocalsound} n given a, um {disfmarker}Professor B:PhD E: How do you say I will read because it's better for my English. I i given is the estimate of the PDF of the noise signal when we have a, um, a statistic of the clean speech and an statistic of the noisy speech. And the clean speech {disfmarker} the statistic of the clean speech is {pause} from a {pause} codebook. Mmm This is the idea. Well, like, this relation is not linear. The methods propose to develop this in a vectorial Taylor series {pause} approximation.Professor B: I I'm actually just confused about {pause} the equations you have up there. So, uh, the top equation is {disfmarker} is {disfmarker} is {disfmarker}PhD E: No, this in the {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker} this is the log domain. I {disfmarker} I must to say that.Professor B: Which is {disfmarker} which is the log domainPhD E: Is the T {disfmarker} is egual {disfmarker} {comment} is equal to, uh, log

Summarize the discussion on the Eurospeech paper and on-line normalization

PhD C informed the team that the Eurospeech paper had been accepted and the conference would take place in Aalborg Denmark in September. The team was making progress on on-line normalization, taking two approaches.

I needed to put together for the subspace approach. And I'm in the process of, like, building up that stuff. And, um, uh {disfmarker} {nonvocalsound} Yeah. I guess {disfmarker} Yep. I guess that's it. And, uh, th th that's where I am right now. So.PhD F: Oh. How about you, CarmenPhD E: Mmm. I'm working with VTS. Um, I do several experiment with the Spanish database first, only with VTS and nothing more. Not VAD, no LDA, nothing more.PhD F: What {disfmarker} what is VTS againPhD D: New {disfmarker}PhD E: Eh, Vectorial Taylor Series.PhD F: Oh, yes.PhD E: To remove the noise too.PhD F: Right, right. I think I ask you that every single meeting, don't IPhD E: WhatPhD F: I ask you that question every meeting.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: So, that'd be good from {disfmarker} for analysis.PhD E: If {disfmarker} Well {disfmarker}Professor B: It's good to have some, uh, cases of the same utterance at different {disfmarker} different times.PhD F: Yeah.Professor B: Yeah.PhD F:" What is VTS" PhD E: VTS. I'm sor Well, um, the question is that {disfmarker} Well. Remove some noise but not too much. And when we put the {disfmarker} m m the, em, VAD, the result is better. And we put everything, the result is better, but it's not better than the result that we have without VTS. No, no.Professor B: I see. So that @ @ {comment} given that you're using the VAD also, the effect of the VTS is not {pause} so far {disfmarker}PhD E: Is not.Professor B: Do you {disfmarker} How much of that do you think is due to just the particular implementation and how much you're adjusting it Or how much do you think is intrinsic to {disfmarker}PhD E: Pfft. I don't know because {disfmarker}PhD C: Are you still using I have now, uh, sixty - four {nonvocalsound} Gaus - Gaussian.Professor B: Uh - huh. And what are you using for the noisy {disfmarker} Y y doing that strictly {disfmarker}PhD E: Of the noise {disfmarker} I estimate the noises wiProfessor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: Well, for the noises I only use one Gaussian.Professor B: And {disfmarker} and you {disfmarker} and you train it up entirely from, uh, nonspeech sections in the testPhD C: Hmm.PhD E: Uh, yes. The first experiment that I do it is solely to calculate the, mmm {disfmarker} well, this value {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah.PhD E: uh, the compensation of the dictionary o one time using the {disfmarker} the noise at the f beginning of the sentence.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: This is the first experiment.Professor B: Yeah.PhD E: And I fix this for all the {disfmarker} all the sentences. Uh, because {disfmarker} well, the VTS methods {disfmarker} In fact the first thing that I do is to {disfmarker} to obtain, uh, an expression for E {disfmarker} probability e expression of {disfmarker} of E. That mean that the VTS {disfmarker} mmm, with the VTS we obtain, uh {disfmarker} well, we {disfmarker} we obtain the means for each Gaussian {comment} and the variance.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: This is one. Eh, this is the composition of the dictionary.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: This one thing. And the other thing that this {disfmarker} with these methods is to, uh, obtain {disfmarker} to calculate this value.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: Because we can write {disfmarker} uh, we can write that {vocalsound} the estimation of the clean speech is equal at an expected value of the clean speech conditional to, uh, the noise signal {disfmarker} {vocalsound} the probability f of the {disfmarker} the statistic of the clean {disfmarker} and in principle get rid of the {vocalsound} effects of the average complex spectrum. But {disfmarker}Grad G: And, um, actually, regarding the phase normalization {disfmarker} So I did two experiments, and one is {disfmarker} So, phases get added, modulo two pi, and {disfmarker} because you only know the phase of the complex number t t to a value modulo two pi. And so I thought at first, um, that, uh, what I should do is unwrap the phase because that will undo that. Um, but I actually got worse results doing that unwrapping using the simple phase unwrapper that's in Matlab than I did not unwrapping at all.PhD D: Mm - hmm.PhD F: Hmm.Professor B: Yeah. P So.Grad G: And that's all I have to say.PhD F: Hmm.Professor B: Yeah. So I'm {disfmarker} I'm still hopeful that {disfmarker} that {disfmarker} I mean, we {disfmarker} we don't even know if the phase {vocalsound} is something {disfmarker} the average phase is something that we do want to remove. I mean, maybe there's some deeper reason why it isn't the right thing to do. But, um, at least in principle it looks like there's {disfmarker} there's, uh, a couple potential ways to do it. One {disfmarker} one being to just work with the complex numbers, um, and, uh {disfmarker} in rectangular kind of coordinates. And the other is {vocalsound} to, uh, do a Taylor series {disfmarker} Well. So you work with the complex numbers and then when you get the spectrum {disfmarker} the average complex spectrum {disfmarker} um, actually divide it out, um, as opposed to taking the log and subtracting. So then, um, um, you know, there might be some numerical issues. We don't really know that. The other thing we talked a little bit about was Taylor series expansion. And, you {disfmarker} it would {disfmarker} {vocalsound} something would occur to you of how to deal with that.PhD C: Mm - hmm. Mm - hmm.PhD D: Hmm.PhD C: Alright. Mmm. Yeah. W um, So that's it, I think, for the on - line normalization. Um {disfmarker} Yeah. I've been playing a little bit with some kind of thresholding, and, mmm, as a first experiment, I think I Yeah. Well, what I did is t is to take, um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} to measure the average {disfmarker} no, the maximum energy of s each utterance and then put a threshold {disfmarker} Well, this for each mel band. Then put a threshold that's fifteen DB below {disfmarker} well, uh, a couple of DB below this maximum,Professor B: Mm - hmm. Mmm.PhD C: and {disfmarker} Actually it was not a threshold, it was just adding noise.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD C: So I was adding a white noise energy, uh, that's fifteen DB below the maximum energy of the utterance. And {disfmarker} Yeah. When we look at {disfmarker} at the, um, MFCC that result from this, they are {pause} a lot more smoother. Um, when we compare, like, a channel zero and channel one utterance {disfmarker} um, so a clean and, uh, the same noisy utterance {disfmarker} well, there is almost no difference between the cepstral coefficients of the two.PhD F: Hmm.PhD C: Um. And {disfmarker} Yeah. And the result that we have in term of speech recognition, actually it's not {disfmarker} it's not worse, it's not better neither, but it's, um, kind of surprising that it's not worsePhD F: Hmm.PhD C: because basically you add noise that's fifteen DB {disfmarker} just fifteen DB below {pause} the maximum energy.Grad A: Sorry.PhD C: And at least {disfmarker}PhD F: So why does that m {pause} smooth things before, so it's interesting to get your {disfmarker} get your feedback about it.PhD E: It's another type of approximation because i because it's a statistic {disfmarker} statistic approximation to remove the noise. I don't know.Professor B: Right.PhD F: Great. OK. Well, I guess we're about done. Um, so some of the digit forms don't have digits. Uh, {vocalsound} we ran out there were some blanks in there, so not everybody will be reading digits. But, um, I guess you've got some. Right, MorganProfessor B: I have some.PhD F: So, why don't you go ahead and start. And I think it's {pause} just us down here at this end that have them.PhD D: SPhD E: umPhD F: So.Professor B: Uh, OK.PhD D: S so, we switch off with thisPhD F: Whenever you're ready.PhD D: or nPhD F: Uh, leave it on,PhD D: No. OK.PhD F: uh,Professor B: They prefer to have them onPhD F: and the {disfmarker}Professor B: just so that they're continuing to get the distant, uh, information.PhD F: Yeah.PhD D: OK. OK.PhD F: OK.Professor B: OK. S

What did PhD C think about on-line normalization

PhD C told the team about two approaches to on-line normalization. On was using a time constant and the other was using different means for silence and speech. But the means were not behaving as expected. Addition of white noise made it such that the important difference between the means disappeared.

I have now, uh, sixty - four {nonvocalsound} Gaus - Gaussian.Professor B: Uh - huh. And what are you using for the noisy {disfmarker} Y y doing that strictly {disfmarker}PhD E: Of the noise {disfmarker} I estimate the noises wiProfessor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: Well, for the noises I only use one Gaussian.Professor B: And {disfmarker} and you {disfmarker} and you train it up entirely from, uh, nonspeech sections in the testPhD C: Hmm.PhD E: Uh, yes. The first experiment that I do it is solely to calculate the, mmm {disfmarker} well, this value {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah.PhD E: uh, the compensation of the dictionary o one time using the {disfmarker} the noise at the f beginning of the sentence.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: This is the first experiment.Professor B: Yeah.PhD E: And I fix this for all the {disfmarker} all the sentences. Uh, because {disfmarker} well, the VTS methods {disfmarker} In fact the first thing that I do is to {disfmarker} to obtain, uh, an expression for E {disfmarker} probability e expression of {disfmarker} of E. That mean that the VTS {disfmarker} mmm, with the VTS we obtain, uh {disfmarker} well, we {disfmarker} we obtain the means for each Gaussian {comment} and the variance.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: This is one. Eh, this is the composition of the dictionary.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: This one thing. And the other thing that this {disfmarker} with these methods is to, uh, obtain {disfmarker} to calculate this value.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: Because we can write {disfmarker} uh, we can write that {vocalsound} the estimation of the clean speech is equal at an expected value of the clean speech conditional to, uh, the noise signal {disfmarker} {vocalsound} the probability f of the {disfmarker} the statistic of the clean first order of the vector st Taylor series of the {disfmarker} of the {disfmarker} of {disfmarker} well, the order that we want, increase the complexity of the problem.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: And then when we have a expression, uh, for the {vocalsound} mean and variance of the noisy speech, we apply a technique of minimum mean - square estimationProfessor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: to obtain the expected value of the clean speech given the {disfmarker} this {vocalsound} statistic for the noisy speech {disfmarker}Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: the statistic for clean speech and the statistic of the noisy speech. This only that. But the idea is that {disfmarker}PhD C: And the {disfmarker} the model of clean speech is a codebook. RightPhD E: u Yeah. We have our codebook with different density {vocalsound} Gaussian.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: We can expre we can put that the {vocalsound} PDF {comment} for the clean test, probability of the clean speech is equal to {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah.PhD E:PhD C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So, um, how {disfmarker} h how much {disfmarker} in {disfmarker} in the work they reported, how much noisy speech did you need to get, uh, good enough statistics for the {disfmarker} to get this mappingPhD E: I don't know exactly.Professor B: Yeah.PhD E: I {disfmarker} I need to sProfessor B: Yeah.PhD E: I don't know exactly.Professor B: Cuz I think what's certainly characteristic of a lot of the {pause} data in this test is that, um, you don't have {disfmarker} {vocalsound} the {disfmarker} the training set may not be a {disfmarker} a great estimator for the noise in the test set. Sometimes it is and sometimes it's not.PhD E: Yeah. I {disfmarker} the clean speech {disfmarker} the codebook for clean speech, I am using TIMIT. And - hmm.Professor B: Um. So maybe if you tested it using that, {vocalsound} you'd have more reliable {pause} stretches of nonspeech to do the estimation from and see if that helps.PhD E: Yeah. Another thing is the, em {disfmarker} the codebook, the initial codebook. That maybe, well, it's too clean and {disfmarker}Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: Cuz it's a {disfmarker} I don't know. The methods {disfmarker} If you want, you c I can say something about the method.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: Yeah. In the {disfmarker} Because it's {vocalsound} a little bit different of the other method. Well, we have {disfmarker} If this {disfmarker} if this is the noise signal, {nonvocalsound} uh, in the log domain, we have something like this. Now, we have something like this. And the idea of these methods is to {disfmarker} {vocalsound} n given a, um {disfmarker}Professor B:PhD E: How do you say I will read because it's better for my English. I i given is the estimate of the PDF of the noise signal when we have a, um, a statistic of the clean speech and an statistic of the noisy speech. And the clean speech {disfmarker} the statistic of the clean speech is {pause} from a {pause} codebook. Mmm This is the idea. Well, like, this relation is not linear. The methods propose to develop this in a vectorial Taylor series {pause} approximation.Professor B: I I'm actually just confused about {pause} the equations you have up there. So, uh, the top equation is {disfmarker} is {disfmarker} is {disfmarker}PhD E: No, this in the {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker} this is the log domain. I {disfmarker} I must to say that.Professor B: Which is {disfmarker} which is the log domainPhD E: Is the T {disfmarker} is egual {disfmarker} {comment} is equal to, uh, log before, so it's interesting to get your {disfmarker} get your feedback about it.PhD E: It's another type of approximation because i because it's a statistic {disfmarker} statistic approximation to remove the noise. I don't know.Professor B: Right.PhD F: Great. OK. Well, I guess we're about done. Um, so some of the digit forms don't have digits. Uh, {vocalsound} we ran out there were some blanks in there, so not everybody will be reading digits. But, um, I guess you've got some. Right, MorganProfessor B: I have some.PhD F: So, why don't you go ahead and start. And I think it's {pause} just us down here at this end that have them.PhD D: SPhD E: umPhD F: So.Professor B: Uh, OK.PhD D: S so, we switch off with thisPhD F: Whenever you're ready.PhD D: or nPhD F: Uh, leave it on,PhD D: No. OK.PhD F: uh,Professor B: They prefer to have them onPhD F: and the {disfmarker}Professor B: just so that they're continuing to get the distant, uh, information.PhD F: Yeah.PhD D: OK. OK.PhD F: OK.Professor B: OK. S speech and the statistic of the noise.Professor B: Mm - hmm. Mm - hmm.PhD E: This is the methods that say that we're going obtain this.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: And we can put that this is equal to the estimated value of E minus a function that conditional to E to the T {disfmarker} to the noise signal. Well, this is {disfmarker} this function is the {vocalsound} the term {disfmarker} after develop this, the term that we {disfmarker} we take. Give PX and, uh, P the noise.PhD D: X K C noise.Professor B: Mmm.PhD E: And I can {vocalsound} put that this is equal to {pause} the {pause} noise signal minus {disfmarker} Well, I put before {pause} this name, uh {disfmarker} And I can calculate this.Professor B: What is the first variable in that probabilityPhD E: Uh, this is the Gaussian.Professor B: No, no. I'm sorry. In {disfmarker} in the one you pointed at. What's that variablePhD E: v Uh, this is the {disfmarker}PhD D: Weak. So probably it {disfmarker} it would do that.PhD E: like this,PhD C: It's one mixture of the model. RightPhD E: but conditional. No, it's condition it's not exactly this. It's modify. Uh, if we have clean speech {disfmarker} we have the dictionary for the clean speech, we have a probability f of {disfmarker} our {disfmarker} our weight for each Gaussian.Professor B: OK.PhD E: No. And now, this weight is different nowProfessor B: Yes.PhD E: because it's conditional. And this I need to {disfmarker} to calcu I know thisProfessor B: Uh - huh.PhD E: and I know this because this is from the dictionary that you have.Professor B: Uh - huh.PhD E: I need to calculate this.Professor B: Yes.PhD E: And for calculate this, {vocalsound} I have an {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I can

What did the professor think about the difference between means of silence and speech

The professor suggested delving deep into the different types of errors in the difference between silence and speech means. He thought that training and testing in the same kind of white noise would be an effective strategy. In his opinion, the differences were hurting the recognition, even though they were not too big.

I have now, uh, sixty - four {nonvocalsound} Gaus - Gaussian.Professor B: Uh - huh. And what are you using for the noisy {disfmarker} Y y doing that strictly {disfmarker}PhD E: Of the noise {disfmarker} I estimate the noises wiProfessor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: Well, for the noises I only use one Gaussian.Professor B: And {disfmarker} and you {disfmarker} and you train it up entirely from, uh, nonspeech sections in the testPhD C: Hmm.PhD E: Uh, yes. The first experiment that I do it is solely to calculate the, mmm {disfmarker} well, this value {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah.PhD E: uh, the compensation of the dictionary o one time using the {disfmarker} the noise at the f beginning of the sentence.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: This is the first experiment.Professor B: Yeah.PhD E: And I fix this for all the {disfmarker} all the sentences. Uh, because {disfmarker} well, the VTS methods {disfmarker} In fact the first thing that I do is to {disfmarker} to obtain, uh, an expression for E {disfmarker} probability e expression of {disfmarker} of E. That mean that the VTS {disfmarker} mmm, with the VTS we obtain, uh {disfmarker} well, we {disfmarker} we obtain the means for each Gaussian {comment} and the variance.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: This is one. Eh, this is the composition of the dictionary.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: This one thing. And the other thing that this {disfmarker} with these methods is to, uh, obtain {disfmarker} to calculate this value.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: Because we can write {disfmarker} uh, we can write that {vocalsound} the estimation of the clean speech is equal at an expected value of the clean speech conditional to, uh, the noise signal {disfmarker} {vocalsound} the probability f of the {disfmarker} the statistic of the clean {disfmarker} and in principle get rid of the {vocalsound} effects of the average complex spectrum. But {disfmarker}Grad G: And, um, actually, regarding the phase normalization {disfmarker} So I did two experiments, and one is {disfmarker} So, phases get added, modulo two pi, and {disfmarker} because you only know the phase of the complex number t t to a value modulo two pi. And so I thought at first, um, that, uh, what I should do is unwrap the phase because that will undo that. Um, but I actually got worse results doing that unwrapping using the simple phase unwrapper that's in Matlab than I did not unwrapping at all.PhD D: Mm - hmm.PhD F: Hmm.Professor B: Yeah. P So.Grad G: And that's all I have to say.PhD F: Hmm.Professor B: Yeah. So I'm {disfmarker} I'm still hopeful that {disfmarker} that {disfmarker} I mean, we {disfmarker} we don't even know if the phase {vocalsound} is something {disfmarker} the average phase is something that we do want to remove. I mean, maybe there's some deeper reason why it isn't the right thing to do. But, um, at least in principle it looks like there's {disfmarker} there's, uh, a couple potential ways to do it. One {disfmarker} one being to just work with the complex numbers, um, and, uh {disfmarker} in rectangular kind of coordinates. And the other is {vocalsound} to, uh, do a Taylor series {disfmarker} Well. So you work with the complex numbers and then when you get the spectrum {disfmarker} the average complex spectrum {disfmarker} um, actually divide it out, um, as opposed to taking the log and subtracting. So then, um, um, you know, there might be some numerical issues. We don't really know that. The other thing we talked a little bit about was Taylor series expansion. And, - hmm.Professor B: Um. So maybe if you tested it using that, {vocalsound} you'd have more reliable {pause} stretches of nonspeech to do the estimation from and see if that helps.PhD E: Yeah. Another thing is the, em {disfmarker} the codebook, the initial codebook. That maybe, well, it's too clean and {disfmarker}Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: Cuz it's a {disfmarker} I don't know. The methods {disfmarker} If you want, you c I can say something about the method.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: Yeah. In the {disfmarker} Because it's {vocalsound} a little bit different of the other method. Well, we have {disfmarker} If this {disfmarker} if this is the noise signal, {nonvocalsound} uh, in the log domain, we have something like this. Now, we have something like this. And the idea of these methods is to {disfmarker} {vocalsound} n given a, um {disfmarker}Professor B:PhD E: How do you say I will read because it's better for my English. I i given is the estimate of the PDF of the noise signal when we have a, um, a statistic of the clean speech and an statistic of the noisy speech. And the clean speech {disfmarker} the statistic of the clean speech is {pause} from a {pause} codebook. Mmm This is the idea. Well, like, this relation is not linear. The methods propose to develop this in a vectorial Taylor series {pause} approximation.Professor B: I I'm actually just confused about {pause} the equations you have up there. So, uh, the top equation is {disfmarker} is {disfmarker} is {disfmarker}PhD E: No, this in the {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker} this is the log domain. I {disfmarker} I must to say that.Professor B: Which is {disfmarker} which is the log domainPhD E: Is the T {disfmarker} is egual {disfmarker} {comment} is equal to, uh, log you {disfmarker} it would {disfmarker} {vocalsound} something would occur to you of how to deal with that.PhD C: Mm - hmm. Mm - hmm.PhD D: Hmm.PhD C: Alright. Mmm. Yeah. W um, So that's it, I think, for the on - line normalization. Um {disfmarker} Yeah. I've been playing a little bit with some kind of thresholding, and, mmm, as a first experiment, I think I Yeah. Well, what I did is t is to take, um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} to measure the average {disfmarker} no, the maximum energy of s each utterance and then put a threshold {disfmarker} Well, this for each mel band. Then put a threshold that's fifteen DB below {disfmarker} well, uh, a couple of DB below this maximum,Professor B: Mm - hmm. Mmm.PhD C: and {disfmarker} Actually it was not a threshold, it was just adding noise.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD C: So I was adding a white noise energy, uh, that's fifteen DB below the maximum energy of the utterance. And {disfmarker} Yeah. When we look at {disfmarker} at the, um, MFCC that result from this, they are {pause} a lot more smoother. Um, when we compare, like, a channel zero and channel one utterance {disfmarker} um, so a clean and, uh, the same noisy utterance {disfmarker} well, there is almost no difference between the cepstral coefficients of the two.PhD F: Hmm.PhD C: Um. And {disfmarker} Yeah. And the result that we have in term of speech recognition, actually it's not {disfmarker} it's not worse, it's not better neither, but it's, um, kind of surprising that it's not worsePhD F: Hmm.PhD C: because basically you add noise that's fifteen DB {disfmarker} just fifteen DB below {pause} the maximum energy.Grad A: Sorry.PhD C: And at least {disfmarker}PhD F: So why does that m {pause} smooth things MFCC's.PhD F: For each, uh {disfmarker}Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD C: But {disfmarker} Mm - hmm.PhD F: Yeah. I {disfmarker} I thought, Morgan, you brought it up a couple meetings ago. And then it was something about, uh, some and then somebody said" yeah, it does seem like, you know, C - zero is the one that's, you know, the major one" or, uh, s I can't remember exactly what it was now.PhD C: Mmm. Yeah. There {disfmarker} uh, actually, yeah. S um, it's very important to normalize C - zero and {pause} much less to normalize the other coefficients. And, um, actu uh, well, at least with the current on - line normalization scheme. And we {disfmarker} I think, we {vocalsound} kind of know that normalizing C - one doesn't help with the current scheme. And {disfmarker} and {disfmarker} Yeah. In my idea, I {disfmarker} I was thinking that the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the reason is maybe because of these funny things that happen between speech and silence which have different means. Um {disfmarker} Yeah. But maybe it's not so {disfmarker} {vocalsound} so easy to {disfmarker}Professor B: Um, I I really would like to suggest looking, um, a little bit at the kinds of errors. I know you can get lost in that and go forever and not see too much, but {disfmarker} {vocalsound} sometimes,PhD C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: but {disfmarker} but, um, just seeing that each of these things didn't make things better may not be enough. It may be that they're making them better in some ways and worse in others,PhD C: Yeah. Mm - hmm.Professor B: or increasing insertions and decreasing deletions, or {disfmarker} or, um, um, you know, helping with noisy case but hurting in quiet case. And if you saw that then maybe

Summarize the discussion on quals and phase normalization

Grad A was working on cheating experiments to study classification of phones for his qualifying exam. Grad G fixed a bug in his Matlab code for phase normalization and started receiving better results.

{disfmarker} and in principle get rid of the {vocalsound} effects of the average complex spectrum. But {disfmarker}Grad G: And, um, actually, regarding the phase normalization {disfmarker} So I did two experiments, and one is {disfmarker} So, phases get added, modulo two pi, and {disfmarker} because you only know the phase of the complex number t t to a value modulo two pi. And so I thought at first, um, that, uh, what I should do is unwrap the phase because that will undo that. Um, but I actually got worse results doing that unwrapping using the simple phase unwrapper that's in Matlab than I did not unwrapping at all.PhD D: Mm - hmm.PhD F: Hmm.Professor B: Yeah. P So.Grad G: And that's all I have to say.PhD F: Hmm.Professor B: Yeah. So I'm {disfmarker} I'm still hopeful that {disfmarker} that {disfmarker} I mean, we {disfmarker} we don't even know if the phase {vocalsound} is something {disfmarker} the average phase is something that we do want to remove. I mean, maybe there's some deeper reason why it isn't the right thing to do. But, um, at least in principle it looks like there's {disfmarker} there's, uh, a couple potential ways to do it. One {disfmarker} one being to just work with the complex numbers, um, and, uh {disfmarker} in rectangular kind of coordinates. And the other is {vocalsound} to, uh, do a Taylor series {disfmarker} Well. So you work with the complex numbers and then when you get the spectrum {disfmarker} the average complex spectrum {disfmarker} um, actually divide it out, um, as opposed to taking the log and subtracting. So then, um, um, you know, there might be some numerical issues. We don't really know that. The other thing we talked a little bit about was Taylor series expansion. And, before, so it's interesting to get your {disfmarker} get your feedback about it.PhD E: It's another type of approximation because i because it's a statistic {disfmarker} statistic approximation to remove the noise. I don't know.Professor B: Right.PhD F: Great. OK. Well, I guess we're about done. Um, so some of the digit forms don't have digits. Uh, {vocalsound} we ran out there were some blanks in there, so not everybody will be reading digits. But, um, I guess you've got some. Right, MorganProfessor B: I have some.PhD F: So, why don't you go ahead and start. And I think it's {pause} just us down here at this end that have them.PhD D: SPhD E: umPhD F: So.Professor B: Uh, OK.PhD D: S so, we switch off with thisPhD F: Whenever you're ready.PhD D: or nPhD F: Uh, leave it on,PhD D: No. OK.PhD F: uh,Professor B: They prefer to have them onPhD F: and the {disfmarker}Professor B: just so that they're continuing to get the distant, uh, information.PhD F: Yeah.PhD D: OK. OK.PhD F: OK.Professor B: OK. S you {disfmarker} it would {disfmarker} {vocalsound} something would occur to you of how to deal with that.PhD C: Mm - hmm. Mm - hmm.PhD D: Hmm.PhD C: Alright. Mmm. Yeah. W um, So that's it, I think, for the on - line normalization. Um {disfmarker} Yeah. I've been playing a little bit with some kind of thresholding, and, mmm, as a first experiment, I think I Yeah. Well, what I did is t is to take, um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} to measure the average {disfmarker} no, the maximum energy of s each utterance and then put a threshold {disfmarker} Well, this for each mel band. Then put a threshold that's fifteen DB below {disfmarker} well, uh, a couple of DB below this maximum,Professor B: Mm - hmm. Mmm.PhD C: and {disfmarker} Actually it was not a threshold, it was just adding noise.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD C: So I was adding a white noise energy, uh, that's fifteen DB below the maximum energy of the utterance. And {disfmarker} Yeah. When we look at {disfmarker} at the, um, MFCC that result from this, they are {pause} a lot more smoother. Um, when we compare, like, a channel zero and channel one utterance {disfmarker} um, so a clean and, uh, the same noisy utterance {disfmarker} well, there is almost no difference between the cepstral coefficients of the two.PhD F: Hmm.PhD C: Um. And {disfmarker} Yeah. And the result that we have in term of speech recognition, actually it's not {disfmarker} it's not worse, it's not better neither, but it's, um, kind of surprising that it's not worsePhD F: Hmm.PhD C: because basically you add noise that's fifteen DB {disfmarker} just fifteen DB below {pause} the maximum energy.Grad A: Sorry.PhD C: And at least {disfmarker}PhD F: So why does that m {pause} smooth things MFCC's.PhD F: For each, uh {disfmarker}Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD C: But {disfmarker} Mm - hmm.PhD F: Yeah. I {disfmarker} I thought, Morgan, you brought it up a couple meetings ago. And then it was something about, uh, some and then somebody said" yeah, it does seem like, you know, C - zero is the one that's, you know, the major one" or, uh, s I can't remember exactly what it was now.PhD C: Mmm. Yeah. There {disfmarker} uh, actually, yeah. S um, it's very important to normalize C - zero and {pause} much less to normalize the other coefficients. And, um, actu uh, well, at least with the current on - line normalization scheme. And we {disfmarker} I think, we {vocalsound} kind of know that normalizing C - one doesn't help with the current scheme. And {disfmarker} and {disfmarker} Yeah. In my idea, I {disfmarker} I was thinking that the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the reason is maybe because of these funny things that happen between speech and silence which have different means. Um {disfmarker} Yeah. But maybe it's not so {disfmarker} {vocalsound} so easy to {disfmarker}Professor B: Um, I I really would like to suggest looking, um, a little bit at the kinds of errors. I know you can get lost in that and go forever and not see too much, but {disfmarker} {vocalsound} sometimes,PhD C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: but {disfmarker} but, um, just seeing that each of these things didn't make things better may not be enough. It may be that they're making them better in some ways and worse in others,PhD C: Yeah. Mm - hmm.Professor B: or increasing insertions and decreasing deletions, or {disfmarker} or, um, um, you know, helping with noisy case but hurting in quiet case. And if you saw that then maybe develop an expression that isPhD D: It's overlapping.PhD E: that. I can calculate {disfmarker} I can {disfmarker} I calculated this value, {vocalsound} uh, with the statistic of the noisy speech that I calculated before with the VTS approximation.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: And {disfmarker} well, normalizing. And I know everything. Uh, with the, nnn {disfmarker} when I develop this in s Taylor {disfmarker} Taylor series, I can't, um, {vocalsound} calculate the mean and the variance {vocalsound} of the {disfmarker} for each of the Gaussian of the dictionary for the noisy speech. Now. And this is fixed.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: If I never do an estimat a newer estimation of the noise, this mean as {disfmarker} mean and the variance are fixed.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: And for each s uh, frame of the speech the only thing that I need to do is to calculate this in order to calculate the estimation of the clean speech given our noisy speech.Professor B: So, I'm {disfmarker} I'm not following this perfectly but, um, I {disfmarker} Are you saying that all of these estimates are done {pause} using, um, estimates of the probability density for the noise that are calculated only from the first ten frames And never change throughout anything elsePhD E: Yeah. Never cha This is one of the approximations that I am doing.Professor B: Per {disfmarker} per {disfmarker} per utterance, or per {disfmarker}PhD E: Per utterance. Yes.Professor B: Per utterance. OK.PhD E: Per utterance. Yes.Professor B: So it's done {disfmarker} it's done new for each new utterance.PhD E: And thProfessor B: So this changes the whole mapping for every utterance.PhD E: Yeah. It's not {disfmarker} Yeah.Professor B: OK.PhD E: Yeah. It's fixed, the dictionary.Professor B: OK.PhD E: And the other estimation is when I do the

What did the professor think about phase normalization

The professor thought that the Broadcast News net could be scaled down. The big one took two to three weeks. Phase normalization experiments relied on it. He also suggested that the math can be simplified to just complex numbers.

I needed to put together for the subspace approach. And I'm in the process of, like, building up that stuff. And, um, uh {disfmarker} {nonvocalsound} Yeah. I guess {disfmarker} Yep. I guess that's it. And, uh, th th that's where I am right now. So.PhD F: Oh. How about you, CarmenPhD E: Mmm. I'm working with VTS. Um, I do several experiment with the Spanish database first, only with VTS and nothing more. Not VAD, no LDA, nothing more.PhD F: What {disfmarker} what is VTS againPhD D: New {disfmarker}PhD E: Eh, Vectorial Taylor Series.PhD F: Oh, yes.PhD E: To remove the noise too.PhD F: Right, right. I think I ask you that every single meeting, don't IPhD E: WhatPhD F: I ask you that question every meeting.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: So, that'd be good from {disfmarker} for analysis.PhD E: If {disfmarker} Well {disfmarker}Professor B: It's good to have some, uh, cases of the same utterance at different {disfmarker} different times.PhD F: Yeah.Professor B: Yeah.PhD F:" What is VTS" PhD E: VTS. I'm sor Well, um, the question is that {disfmarker} Well. Remove some noise but not too much. And when we put the {disfmarker} m m the, em, VAD, the result is better. And we put everything, the result is better, but it's not better than the result that we have without VTS. No, no.Professor B: I see. So that @ @ {comment} given that you're using the VAD also, the effect of the VTS is not {pause} so far {disfmarker}PhD E: Is not.Professor B: Do you {disfmarker} How much of that do you think is due to just the particular implementation and how much you're adjusting it Or how much do you think is intrinsic to {disfmarker}PhD E: Pfft. I don't know because {disfmarker}PhD C: Are you still using {disfmarker} and in principle get rid of the {vocalsound} effects of the average complex spectrum. But {disfmarker}Grad G: And, um, actually, regarding the phase normalization {disfmarker} So I did two experiments, and one is {disfmarker} So, phases get added, modulo two pi, and {disfmarker} because you only know the phase of the complex number t t to a value modulo two pi. And so I thought at first, um, that, uh, what I should do is unwrap the phase because that will undo that. Um, but I actually got worse results doing that unwrapping using the simple phase unwrapper that's in Matlab than I did not unwrapping at all.PhD D: Mm - hmm.PhD F: Hmm.Professor B: Yeah. P So.Grad G: And that's all I have to say.PhD F: Hmm.Professor B: Yeah. So I'm {disfmarker} I'm still hopeful that {disfmarker} that {disfmarker} I mean, we {disfmarker} we don't even know if the phase {vocalsound} is something {disfmarker} the average phase is something that we do want to remove. I mean, maybe there's some deeper reason why it isn't the right thing to do. But, um, at least in principle it looks like there's {disfmarker} there's, uh, a couple potential ways to do it. One {disfmarker} one being to just work with the complex numbers, um, and, uh {disfmarker} in rectangular kind of coordinates. And the other is {vocalsound} to, uh, do a Taylor series {disfmarker} Well. So you work with the complex numbers and then when you get the spectrum {disfmarker} the average complex spectrum {disfmarker} um, actually divide it out, um, as opposed to taking the log and subtracting. So then, um, um, you know, there might be some numerical issues. We don't really know that. The other thing we talked a little bit about was Taylor series expansion. And, before, so it's interesting to get your {disfmarker} get your feedback about it.PhD E: It's another type of approximation because i because it's a statistic {disfmarker} statistic approximation to remove the noise. I don't know.Professor B: Right.PhD F: Great. OK. Well, I guess we're about done. Um, so some of the digit forms don't have digits. Uh, {vocalsound} we ran out there were some blanks in there, so not everybody will be reading digits. But, um, I guess you've got some. Right, MorganProfessor B: I have some.PhD F: So, why don't you go ahead and start. And I think it's {pause} just us down here at this end that have them.PhD D: SPhD E: umPhD F: So.Professor B: Uh, OK.PhD D: S so, we switch off with thisPhD F: Whenever you're ready.PhD D: or nPhD F: Uh, leave it on,PhD D: No. OK.PhD F: uh,Professor B: They prefer to have them onPhD F: and the {disfmarker}Professor B: just so that they're continuing to get the distant, uh, information.PhD F: Yeah.PhD D: OK. OK.PhD F: OK.Professor B: OK. S was looking at the peak value.PhD F: Uh - huh.Professor B: Right And then {disfmarker}PhD C: Uh - huh.PhD F: And {disfmarker} and so what's {disfmarker} ho I don't understand. How does it go If it {disfmarker} if {disfmarker} if the peak value's above some threshold, then you add the noise Or if it's below sPhD C: I systematically {comment} add the noise, but the, um, noise level is just {pause} some kind of threshold below the peak.PhD F: Oh, oh. I see.PhD C: Mmm.PhD F: I see.Professor B: Yeah.PhD C: Um. Yeah. Which is not really noise, actually. It's just adding a constant to each of the mel, uh, energy.PhD F: Mm - hmm.PhD C: To each of the {pause} mel filter bank. Yeah.PhD F: I see.PhD C: So, yeah, it's really, uh, white noise. I thProfessor B: Yeah.PhD F: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So then afterwards a log is taken, and that's so sort of why the {disfmarker} {vocalsound} the little variation tends to go away.PhD C: Mm - hmm. Um. Yeah. So may Well, the {disfmarker} this threshold is still a factor that we have to look at. And I don't know, maybe a constant noise addition would {disfmarker} {vocalsound} would be fine also, or {disfmarker} Um {disfmarker}Professor B: Or {disfmarker} or not constant but {disfmarker} but, uh, varying over time {pause} in fact is another way {pause} to go.PhD C: Mm - hmm. Mm - hmm.Professor B: Um.PhD C: Yeah. Um {disfmarker}Professor B: Were you using the {disfmarker} the normalization in addition to this I mean, what was the rest of the systemPhD C: Um {disfmarker} Yeah. It was {disfmarker} it was, uh, the same system. Mm - hmm.Professor B: OK.PhD C: It was the same system. Mmm. Oh, yeah. A third thing is that, um, um, uh, actually I was talking to Dick Karp about it a little bit, and {disfmarker} and {disfmarker} and, since I got thinking about it, and {disfmarker} and, uh, so one thing is that y you'd have to do, I think, uh {disfmarker} we may have to do this on a whiteboard, but I think you have to be a little careful about scaling the numbers that you're {vocalsound} taking {disfmarker} the complex numbers that you're taking the log of because {vocalsound} the Taylor expansion for it has, you know, a square and a cube, and {disfmarker} and so forth. And {disfmarker} and so if {disfmarker} {vocalsound} if you have a {disfmarker} a number that is modulus, you know, uh, very different from one {disfmarker} {vocalsound} It should be right around one, if it's {disfmarker} cuz it's a expansion of log one {disfmarker} one minus epsilon or o is {disfmarker} is {vocalsound} one plus epsilon, or is it one plus {disfmarker} Well, there's an epsilon squared over two and an epsilon cubed over three,Grad G: OK.Professor B: and so forth. So if epsilon is bigger than one, then it diverges.Grad G: Oh.Professor B: So you have to do some scaling. But that's not a big deal cuz it's the log of {disfmarker} {vocalsound} of K times a complex number, then you can just {disfmarker} that's the same as log of K plus {vocalsound} log of the complex number.Grad G: Oh.Professor B: Uh, so there's {disfmarker}Grad G: OK.Professor B: converges. But.PhD F: Hmm. OK. How about you, SunilPhD D: So, um, I've been, uh, implementing this, uh, Wiener filtering for this Aurora task. And, uh, I {disfmarker} I actually thought it was {disfmarker} it was doing fine when I tested it once. I it's, like, using a small section of the

What did Grad A think about the experiments Grad A was running

Grad A thought that the experiments would explain which categories were good for speech recognition. The experiments would do phone recognition with TIMIT and the output would go into a standard recognizer, maybe Chronos.

I needed to put together for the subspace approach. And I'm in the process of, like, building up that stuff. And, um, uh {disfmarker} {nonvocalsound} Yeah. I guess {disfmarker} Yep. I guess that's it. And, uh, th th that's where I am right now. So.PhD F: Oh. How about you, CarmenPhD E: Mmm. I'm working with VTS. Um, I do several experiment with the Spanish database first, only with VTS and nothing more. Not VAD, no LDA, nothing more.PhD F: What {disfmarker} what is VTS againPhD D: New {disfmarker}PhD E: Eh, Vectorial Taylor Series.PhD F: Oh, yes.PhD E: To remove the noise too.PhD F: Right, right. I think I ask you that every single meeting, don't IPhD E: WhatPhD F: I ask you that question every meeting.PhD E: Yeah.Professor B: So, that'd be good from {disfmarker} for analysis.PhD E: If {disfmarker} Well {disfmarker}Professor B: It's good to have some, uh, cases of the same utterance at different {disfmarker} different times.PhD F: Yeah.Professor B: Yeah.PhD F:" What is VTS" PhD E: VTS. I'm sor Well, um, the question is that {disfmarker} Well. Remove some noise but not too much. And when we put the {disfmarker} m m the, em, VAD, the result is better. And we put everything, the result is better, but it's not better than the result that we have without VTS. No, no.Professor B: I see. So that @ @ {comment} given that you're using the VAD also, the effect of the VTS is not {pause} so far {disfmarker}PhD E: Is not.Professor B: Do you {disfmarker} How much of that do you think is due to just the particular implementation and how much you're adjusting it Or how much do you think is intrinsic to {disfmarker}PhD E: Pfft. I don't know because {disfmarker}PhD C: Are you still using first order of the vector st Taylor series of the {disfmarker} of the {disfmarker} of {disfmarker} well, the order that we want, increase the complexity of the problem.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: And then when we have a expression, uh, for the {vocalsound} mean and variance of the noisy speech, we apply a technique of minimum mean - square estimationProfessor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: to obtain the expected value of the clean speech given the {disfmarker} this {vocalsound} statistic for the noisy speech {disfmarker}Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: the statistic for clean speech and the statistic of the noisy speech. This only that. But the idea is that {disfmarker}PhD C: And the {disfmarker} the model of clean speech is a codebook. RightPhD E: u Yeah. We have our codebook with different density {vocalsound} Gaussian.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: We can expre we can put that the {vocalsound} PDF {comment} for the clean test, probability of the clean speech is equal to {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah.PhD E:PhD C: Mm - hmm.Professor B: So, um, how {disfmarker} h how much {disfmarker} in {disfmarker} in the work they reported, how much noisy speech did you need to get, uh, good enough statistics for the {disfmarker} to get this mappingPhD E: I don't know exactly.Professor B: Yeah.PhD E: I {disfmarker} I need to sProfessor B: Yeah.PhD E: I don't know exactly.Professor B: Cuz I think what's certainly characteristic of a lot of the {pause} data in this test is that, um, you don't have {disfmarker} {vocalsound} the {disfmarker} the training set may not be a {disfmarker} a great estimator for the noise in the test set. Sometimes it is and sometimes it's not.PhD E: Yeah. I {disfmarker} the clean speech {disfmarker} the codebook for clean speech, I am using TIMIT. And speech and the statistic of the noise.Professor B: Mm - hmm. Mm - hmm.PhD E: This is the methods that say that we're going obtain this.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: And we can put that this is equal to the estimated value of E minus a function that conditional to E to the T {disfmarker} to the noise signal. Well, this is {disfmarker} this function is the {vocalsound} the term {disfmarker} after develop this, the term that we {disfmarker} we take. Give PX and, uh, P the noise.PhD D: X K C noise.Professor B: Mmm.PhD E: And I can {vocalsound} put that this is equal to {pause} the {pause} noise signal minus {disfmarker} Well, I put before {pause} this name, uh {disfmarker} And I can calculate this.Professor B: What is the first variable in that probabilityPhD E: Uh, this is the Gaussian.Professor B: No, no. I'm sorry. In {disfmarker} in the one you pointed at. What's that variablePhD E: v Uh, this is the {disfmarker}PhD D: Weak. So probably it {disfmarker} it would do that.PhD E: like this,PhD C: It's one mixture of the model. RightPhD E: but conditional. No, it's condition it's not exactly this. It's modify. Uh, if we have clean speech {disfmarker} we have the dictionary for the clean speech, we have a probability f of {disfmarker} our {disfmarker} our weight for each Gaussian.Professor B: OK.PhD E: No. And now, this weight is different nowProfessor B: Yes.PhD E: because it's conditional. And this I need to {disfmarker} to calcu I know thisProfessor B: Uh - huh.PhD E: and I know this because this is from the dictionary that you have.Professor B: Uh - huh.PhD E: I need to calculate this.Professor B: Yes.PhD E: And for calculate this, {vocalsound} I have an {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I can - hmm.Professor B: Um. So maybe if you tested it using that, {vocalsound} you'd have more reliable {pause} stretches of nonspeech to do the estimation from and see if that helps.PhD E: Yeah. Another thing is the, em {disfmarker} the codebook, the initial codebook. That maybe, well, it's too clean and {disfmarker}Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: Cuz it's a {disfmarker} I don't know. The methods {disfmarker} If you want, you c I can say something about the method.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD E: Yeah. In the {disfmarker} Because it's {vocalsound} a little bit different of the other method. Well, we have {disfmarker} If this {disfmarker} if this is the noise signal, {nonvocalsound} uh, in the log domain, we have something like this. Now, we have something like this. And the idea of these methods is to {disfmarker} {vocalsound} n given a, um {disfmarker}Professor B:PhD E: How do you say I will read because it's better for my English. I i given is the estimate of the PDF of the noise signal when we have a, um, a statistic of the clean speech and an statistic of the noisy speech. And the clean speech {disfmarker} the statistic of the clean speech is {pause} from a {pause} codebook. Mmm This is the idea. Well, like, this relation is not linear. The methods propose to develop this in a vectorial Taylor series {pause} approximation.Professor B: I I'm actually just confused about {pause} the equations you have up there. So, uh, the top equation is {disfmarker} is {disfmarker} is {disfmarker}PhD E: No, this in the {disfmarker} it's {disfmarker} this is the log domain. I {disfmarker} I must to say that.Professor B: Which is {disfmarker} which is the log domainPhD E: Is the T {disfmarker} is egual {disfmarker} {comment} is equal to, uh, log you {disfmarker} it would {disfmarker} {vocalsound} something would occur to you of how to deal with that.PhD C: Mm - hmm. Mm - hmm.PhD D: Hmm.PhD C: Alright. Mmm. Yeah. W um, So that's it, I think, for the on - line normalization. Um {disfmarker} Yeah. I've been playing a little bit with some kind of thresholding, and, mmm, as a first experiment, I think I Yeah. Well, what I did is t is to take, um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} to measure the average {disfmarker} no, the maximum energy of s each utterance and then put a threshold {disfmarker} Well, this for each mel band. Then put a threshold that's fifteen DB below {disfmarker} well, uh, a couple of DB below this maximum,Professor B: Mm - hmm. Mmm.PhD C: and {disfmarker} Actually it was not a threshold, it was just adding noise.Professor B: Mm - hmm.PhD C: So I was adding a white noise energy, uh, that's fifteen DB below the maximum energy of the utterance. And {disfmarker} Yeah. When we look at {disfmarker} at the, um, MFCC that result from this, they are {pause} a lot more smoother. Um, when we compare, like, a channel zero and channel one utterance {disfmarker} um, so a clean and, uh, the same noisy utterance {disfmarker} well, there is almost no difference between the cepstral coefficients of the two.PhD F: Hmm.PhD C: Um. And {disfmarker} Yeah. And the result that we have in term of speech recognition, actually it's not {disfmarker} it's not worse, it's not better neither, but it's, um, kind of surprising that it's not worsePhD F: Hmm.PhD C: because basically you add noise that's fifteen DB {disfmarker} just fifteen DB below {pause} the maximum energy.Grad A: Sorry.PhD C: And at least {disfmarker}PhD F: So why does that m {pause} smooth things

Summarize the meeting

The meeting consisted of participants giving an update on their projects. The team learned that the Eurospeech paper was accepted. PhD C told the team about strange activity in on-line normalization with regards to C-zero and C-one. Grad A shared his work on quals and intention to start cheating experiments. Grad G informed the team that phase normalization was coming along after a bug was fixed, but the results were still not great. Finally, the team discussed Weiner filtering for the Aurora task and the mathematical formulation of the VTS.

targetProject Manager: Yes I mean well yes w who are we going to uh to well to sell this,Marketing: Mm.User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: Oh the customers, okay.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: the customers, indeed yes. Think that's that's important matter.Marketing: That's the big question yeah.Project Manager: Uh. {vocalsound} So {vocalsound} And then uh we will close this meeting uhUser Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: and after this meeting we'll uh we'll have a lunch. Good. Um. Maybe um why uh Anna can you c do you have a presentationsMarketing: No, I don't.Project Manager: You don't have presentationMarketing: I wasn't. No.Project Manager: Uh you want a table to to uhMarketing: I c I can talk about it but I have no slides or anything.Project Manager: Yes yes maybe maybe you can uh can just talk about it or maybe you can use the whiteboard if necessary um.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Well I've just been um presented with some research we've done in a small focus group so, a hundred people, just asked them about their remote control usage habits and what they want in a remote control. Um. It's {disfmarker} probably can't email this to you, I've just got a web page with some data on it. Um basically it's saying that users generally dislike the look and feel of their remote controls. Um seventy five u seventy five percent of users find most remote controls ugly. Um.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Eighty percent of users would spend more money when a remote control would look fancy. Um. Current remote controls do not match well the operating behaviour of the user. Uh seventy five percent of users said they zap a lot, so they use their remote control quite frequently while they're watching television. Uh. Fifty percent of users say that they only use ten percent of the buttons, so they've got a remote control with a lot of functionality but really most of the time they only use a small part of that.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um.Project Manager: Do you Do you have this uh information on the web page you saidMarketing: I have an a web page yes.Project Manager: Yes, mayb maybe you can can send an email to me later uh. Uh about this.Marketing: Yep. Yep, sure. Mm-hmm. So basically um there's a breakdown of how much they use the different functions on a rem remote control. Um, power and volume selection are only used a few times within this uh per hour. Um, channel selection is used a hundred and sixty eight times um {vocalsound} and then there's things like channel settings, audio settings, which are only used very infrequently.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um. Teletext is used um fourteen times in the hour, so it is used but not nearly as much as the channel selection is used. Um.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: An interesting thing that this report has brought up is that um fifty fifty percent of users report that the remote control gets lost a lot of the time in the room, so some way of some way of locating the remote control would be very useful to a lot of users. Um.Project Manager: Yes yes, I have {vocalsound} that too {vocalsound}.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Thirty four percent said it takes too long to learn to use a remote control, they want something that's easier to use straight away, more intuitive perhaps.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um.Industrial Designer: It's it's easy to learn or how do you say it's {disfmarker}Marketing: Thirty four percent said it took too much time to learn to use a new one. Yep.Industrial Designer: Okay too much time to learn. Okay.Marketing: Um. And thirty {disfmarker} the board uh {disfmarker}Marketing: Mm. But I think taking the idea of getting inspiration from mobile phones is interesting, especially if we're going after a younger market,User Interface: Yeah so.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: Hmm. Yes yesMarketing: that's the the the mm the new and the funky things,Project Manager: moIndustrial Designer: Because they are already used to that, you know, product.Marketing: that's,Project Manager: Yes it's recognisable {gap}Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: yeah, there's lot there's lots of pretty mobile phones, not too many pretty remote controls.Project Manager: Mm mm.Marketing: That's {disfmarker}Project Manager: And and they are skilled uh by using it.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: So for example uh {disfmarker} Well uh {vocalsound} {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm. . . .User Interface: Okay, it works. Fine. So, for example you have uh presently uh keys like one, two, three like this, actually, and uh uh four five six like that and uh you can have keys like this in form like uh keys like thatProject Manager: Mael can you hand me over this uhIndustrial Designer: Yes. {gap}Project Manager: Uh thank you.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Okay. How much longer have we got for the meeting by the wayProject Manager: Mm wellMarketing:'Cause we haven't talked about demographic at allProject Manager: I think fi five minUser Interface: Forty minutesMarketing: and it's a very important issue.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Yeah so you you you can have uh keys like uh which are which are like so. {vocalsound} too sorry, so we basically don't change the uh original order of themIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}User Interface: but then the keys are more spacious,Marketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: they don't look uh {disfmarker} so there there is a very sligh thing, so if you press on the top it takes the one, it takes the three, uh four, sorry four here uh five and six,Marketing: Mm. Mm.User Interface: uh uh R_C_Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Universal.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: because it has more uh it it is in some kind universal.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: But if we're going for the say fifteen to twenty five age group then not many of them would actually own T_V_s to use a remote control on.Project Manager: Mm yes but w we're targeting I think on more on the on the twenty to forty group.Marketing: Okay. So they're {disfmarker} yeah.Project Manager: People {disfmarker} yes. Who just have or already have a job and have the money but may not want to spend that much money on a on a universal universal control.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yep. I don't know really what the the price range for remote controls is. Are we gonna be at the very bottom of the price range, or are we kind of middle to bottom I don't know.Project Manager: Uh wellIndustrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} I think uh when we think it over I thi I think we are trying to offer the a kind of universal control for for less money.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Mm. Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: So d Do you agreeUser Interface: Well {disfmarker} Well I it's fine with me like the price as long as it is uh not too expensive.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} YeahUser Interface: Uh and it d uh {disfmarker} Our provinIndustrial Designer: because we have to take into account that we are gonna b we are gonna sell uh four aro around four million so when we speak about these numbers uh the price of a chip is {vocalsound} uh price of a chip is very cheap.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} So I'm okay for designing um a ne uh less {vocalsound} yeah a a kind of universal uh R_C_ yeah.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. But it's quite noisy if there is the T_V_ uh shouting.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yes,User Interface: It's it's going to be liProject Manager: that that that that's mm.User Interface: it's not going to be s so easy but u usually it's going to be more of an isolated caseProject Manager: Do you have some more important factsUser Interface: but it's {disfmarker} but I don't know with twenty fiMarketing: Um {disfmarker}Project Manager: or can we go to the next presentationIndustrial Designer: Okay. SoMarketing: Well {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: you had to to to summarise maybe the {disfmarker}Marketing: This is now talking about um who would pay for speech recognition in a remote control, who would pay more for it, um. Ninety percent of the fifteen to twenty five year old market said that they would pay more, it goes down from there, seventy six percent for twenty five to thirty five, thirty five percent for thirty five to forty five, um twenty two percent for forty five to fifty five and then eight percent for fifty five to sixty five.Project Manager: Mm.User Interface: Okay it's uh decline.Marketing: Yeah.User Interface: Okay.Marketing: But we shProject Manager: Mm-hmm. Decline with age, mm.Marketing: Yeah, it really depends where we're gonna be targeting this product, um,User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm. {vocalsound}Marketing: which we'll be talking about later I think.Industrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: Yes. We will talk about it later. {vocalsound}Marketing: Did you get the emailProject Manager: Okay. {vocalsound}Marketing: Yep, that one.Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Just follow that link.Industrial Designer: {gap} I thi {vocalsound} You usMarketing: It'll be in a different window, yep.Industrial Designer: yeah yeah.Marketing: That's {disfmarker} left {disfmarker} that one.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: Yep.Industrial Designer: Okay perfect. . . .Marketing: Mm. So that's the figure that I was just talking about there, with the different demographics.User Interface:

Summarize the group discussion about video demand, teletext demand, and thick keys design.

First of all, Project Manager launched a discussion about video over-demand, during which User Interface and Industrial Designer mentioned some fancy functions like downloading and streamlining. Then, Project Manager announced that according to the account manager, teletext could be included in the discussion, though its obsolescence incurred doubts over its usability and necessity. After that, Project Manager offered a choice question between television and further recording devices represented by DVDs, VCRs, and hard disk recorders. Finally, to cater for the younger people, User Interface devised big thick keys for RC in imitation of mobile phones, which received positive feedback from other team members.

so they've got a remote control with a lot of functionality but really most of the time they only use a small part of that.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um.Project Manager: Do you Do you have this uh information on the web page you saidMarketing: I have an a web page yes.Project Manager: Yes, mayb maybe you can can send an email to me later uh. Uh about this.Marketing: Yep. Yep, sure. Mm-hmm. So basically um there's a breakdown of how much they use the different functions on a rem remote control. Um, power and volume selection are only used a few times within this uh per hour. Um, channel selection is used a hundred and sixty eight times um {vocalsound} and then there's things like channel settings, audio settings, which are only used very infrequently.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um. Teletext is used um fourteen times in the hour, so it is used but not nearly as much as the channel selection is used. Um.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: An interesting thing that this report has brought up is that um fifty fifty percent of users report that the remote control gets lost a lot of the time in the room, so some way of some way of locating the remote control would be very useful to a lot of users. Um.Project Manager: Yes yes, I have {vocalsound} that too {vocalsound}.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Thirty four percent said it takes too long to learn to use a remote control, they want something that's easier to use straight away, more intuitive perhaps.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um.Industrial Designer: It's it's easy to learn or how do you say it's {disfmarker}Marketing: Thirty four percent said it took too much time to learn to use a new one. Yep.Industrial Designer: Okay too much time to learn. Okay.Marketing: Um. And thirty {disfmarker} you have a standard T_V_ remote where you have just a on, off button and play, uh volume change and uh keys for the number and more than one digit option. And if you see for example righ right now uh uh even the one uh on more than one digit option is for two digit channel which is like ninety nine, but {vocalsound} tomorrow you might have one fifty channels you know to browse or two hundred channels to browse who knows, but uh uh. Then there is uh {vocalsound} this is the standard one with without any fancy thing you know like i it doesn't have teletext option, it can without any, it's a very simple thing, um which which you can vouch {vocalsound}. And then you have uh what's the v video remote file which is like usually it has almost all the keys over there and, but it then it has other options like stop uh and then you play the movie or uh or fo fast forward the movie or something like that so i it has thoseMarketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: so these are the standard uh commonly found remote controls in the uh market. And then {disfmarker} whi which is generally used by the people. And then {vocalsound} well personal preferences I would {disfmarker} uh basically think of having a kind of aim for the next generation thing where the {disfmarker} we could have both the uh the f a T_V_ and the remote {disfmarker} video remote control because uh some of the keys in the video's remote control and the T_V_ they could be integrated together so that uh we could um aim for the like in the f coming future um that type of uh applications with {disfmarker}Marketing: Okay. How would that work uh uh R_C_Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Universal.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: because it has more uh it it is in some kind universal.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: But if we're going for the say fifteen to twenty five age group then not many of them would actually own T_V_s to use a remote control on.Project Manager: Mm yes but w we're targeting I think on more on the on the twenty to forty group.Marketing: Okay. So they're {disfmarker} yeah.Project Manager: People {disfmarker} yes. Who just have or already have a job and have the money but may not want to spend that much money on a on a universal universal control.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yep. I don't know really what the the price range for remote controls is. Are we gonna be at the very bottom of the price range, or are we kind of middle to bottom I don't know.Project Manager: Uh wellIndustrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} I think uh when we think it over I thi I think we are trying to offer the a kind of universal control for for less money.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Mm. Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: So d Do you agreeUser Interface: Well {disfmarker} Well I it's fine with me like the price as long as it is uh not too expensive.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} YeahUser Interface: Uh and it d uh {disfmarker} Our provinIndustrial Designer: because we have to take into account that we are gonna b we are gonna sell uh four aro around four million so when we speak about these numbers uh the price of a chip is {vocalsound} uh price of a chip is very cheap.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} So I'm okay for designing um a ne uh less {vocalsound} yeah a a kind of universal uh R_C_ yeah.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. the board uh {disfmarker}Marketing: Mm. But I think taking the idea of getting inspiration from mobile phones is interesting, especially if we're going after a younger market,User Interface: Yeah so.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: Hmm. Yes yesMarketing: that's the the the mm the new and the funky things,Project Manager: moIndustrial Designer: Because they are already used to that, you know, product.Marketing: that's,Project Manager: Yes it's recognisable {gap}Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: yeah, there's lot there's lots of pretty mobile phones, not too many pretty remote controls.Project Manager: Mm mm.Marketing: That's {disfmarker}Project Manager: And and they are skilled uh by using it.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: So for example uh {disfmarker} Well uh {vocalsound} {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm. . . .User Interface: Okay, it works. Fine. So, for example you have uh presently uh keys like one, two, three like this, actually, and uh uh four five six like that and uh you can have keys like this in form like uh keys like thatProject Manager: Mael can you hand me over this uhIndustrial Designer: Yes. {gap}Project Manager: Uh thank you.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Okay. How much longer have we got for the meeting by the wayProject Manager: Mm wellMarketing:'Cause we haven't talked about demographic at allProject Manager: I think fi five minUser Interface: Forty minutesMarketing: and it's a very important issue.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Yeah so you you you can have uh keys like uh which are which are like so. {vocalsound} too sorry, so we basically don't change the uh original order of themIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}User Interface: but then the keys are more spacious,Marketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: they don't look uh {disfmarker} so there there is a very sligh thing, so if you press on the top it takes the one, it takes the three, uh four, sorry four here uh five and six,Marketing: Mm. Mm.User Interface: targetProject Manager: Yes I mean well yes w who are we going to uh to well to sell this,Marketing: Mm.User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: Oh the customers, okay.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: the customers, indeed yes. Think that's that's important matter.Marketing: That's the big question yeah.Project Manager: Uh. {vocalsound} So {vocalsound} And then uh we will close this meeting uhUser Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: and after this meeting we'll uh we'll have a lunch. Good. Um. Maybe um why uh Anna can you c do you have a presentationsMarketing: No, I don't.Project Manager: You don't have presentationMarketing: I wasn't. No.Project Manager: Uh you want a table to to uhMarketing: I c I can talk about it but I have no slides or anything.Project Manager: Yes yes maybe maybe you can uh can just talk about it or maybe you can use the whiteboard if necessary um.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Well I've just been um presented with some research we've done in a small focus group so, a hundred people, just asked them about their remote control usage habits and what they want in a remote control. Um. It's {disfmarker} probably can't email this to you, I've just got a web page with some data on it. Um basically it's saying that users generally dislike the look and feel of their remote controls. Um seventy five u seventy five percent of users find most remote controls ugly. Um.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Eighty percent of users would spend more money when a remote control would look fancy. Um. Current remote controls do not match well the operating behaviour of the user. Uh seventy five percent of users said they zap a lot, so they use their remote control quite frequently while they're watching television. Uh. Fifty percent of users say that they only use ten percent of the buttons,

What attitudes did Project Manager hold towards teletext

Project Manager first brought up teletext as a well-known feature of televisions, but then admitted that it was becoming obsolete due to the development of the internet, though it was still used. Under this circumstance, Project Manager put forward two options, one of which was to stop at the television phase, and the other was to go further to the phase of the recording device. Then he started to talk about target customers in the first place and laid teletext issues on the table.

so they've got a remote control with a lot of functionality but really most of the time they only use a small part of that.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um.Project Manager: Do you Do you have this uh information on the web page you saidMarketing: I have an a web page yes.Project Manager: Yes, mayb maybe you can can send an email to me later uh. Uh about this.Marketing: Yep. Yep, sure. Mm-hmm. So basically um there's a breakdown of how much they use the different functions on a rem remote control. Um, power and volume selection are only used a few times within this uh per hour. Um, channel selection is used a hundred and sixty eight times um {vocalsound} and then there's things like channel settings, audio settings, which are only used very infrequently.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um. Teletext is used um fourteen times in the hour, so it is used but not nearly as much as the channel selection is used. Um.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: An interesting thing that this report has brought up is that um fifty fifty percent of users report that the remote control gets lost a lot of the time in the room, so some way of some way of locating the remote control would be very useful to a lot of users. Um.Project Manager: Yes yes, I have {vocalsound} that too {vocalsound}.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Thirty four percent said it takes too long to learn to use a remote control, they want something that's easier to use straight away, more intuitive perhaps.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um.Industrial Designer: It's it's easy to learn or how do you say it's {disfmarker}Marketing: Thirty four percent said it took too much time to learn to use a new one. Yep.Industrial Designer: Okay too much time to learn. Okay.Marketing: Um. And thirty {disfmarker} targetProject Manager: Yes I mean well yes w who are we going to uh to well to sell this,Marketing: Mm.User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: Oh the customers, okay.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: the customers, indeed yes. Think that's that's important matter.Marketing: That's the big question yeah.Project Manager: Uh. {vocalsound} So {vocalsound} And then uh we will close this meeting uhUser Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: and after this meeting we'll uh we'll have a lunch. Good. Um. Maybe um why uh Anna can you c do you have a presentationsMarketing: No, I don't.Project Manager: You don't have presentationMarketing: I wasn't. No.Project Manager: Uh you want a table to to uhMarketing: I c I can talk about it but I have no slides or anything.Project Manager: Yes yes maybe maybe you can uh can just talk about it or maybe you can use the whiteboard if necessary um.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Well I've just been um presented with some research we've done in a small focus group so, a hundred people, just asked them about their remote control usage habits and what they want in a remote control. Um. It's {disfmarker} probably can't email this to you, I've just got a web page with some data on it. Um basically it's saying that users generally dislike the look and feel of their remote controls. Um seventy five u seventy five percent of users find most remote controls ugly. Um.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Eighty percent of users would spend more money when a remote control would look fancy. Um. Current remote controls do not match well the operating behaviour of the user. Uh seventy five percent of users said they zap a lot, so they use their remote control quite frequently while they're watching television. Uh. Fifty percent of users say that they only use ten percent of the buttons, uh uh R_C_Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Universal.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: because it has more uh it it is in some kind universal.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: But if we're going for the say fifteen to twenty five age group then not many of them would actually own T_V_s to use a remote control on.Project Manager: Mm yes but w we're targeting I think on more on the on the twenty to forty group.Marketing: Okay. So they're {disfmarker} yeah.Project Manager: People {disfmarker} yes. Who just have or already have a job and have the money but may not want to spend that much money on a on a universal universal control.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yep. I don't know really what the the price range for remote controls is. Are we gonna be at the very bottom of the price range, or are we kind of middle to bottom I don't know.Project Manager: Uh wellIndustrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} I think uh when we think it over I thi I think we are trying to offer the a kind of universal control for for less money.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Mm. Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: So d Do you agreeUser Interface: Well {disfmarker} Well I it's fine with me like the price as long as it is uh not too expensive.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} YeahUser Interface: Uh and it d uh {disfmarker} Our provinIndustrial Designer: because we have to take into account that we are gonna b we are gonna sell uh four aro around four million so when we speak about these numbers uh the price of a chip is {vocalsound} uh price of a chip is very cheap.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} So I'm okay for designing um a ne uh less {vocalsound} yeah a a kind of universal uh R_C_ yeah.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. uh devicesUser Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: So D_V_D_s and V_C_R_sProject Manager: Uh indeed indeed.Marketing: Mm.Project Manager: And and and the hard disk recorders. Um, furthermore, uh, w we need really need to interest uh {vocalsound} y younger customers and then with younger customers I mean people uh below the age of forty,Marketing: Mm-hmm. {vocalsound}Project Manager: and our our current customers are mainly forty plusMarketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: uh which wellIndustrial Designer: FourteenProject Manager: {disfmarker} Forty.Industrial Designer: or for O okay.Project Manager: SoIndustrial Designer: So {disfmarker}Project Manager: that's to that's I mean there's a market but uh they will grow older {disfmarker} olderMarketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: and you'll al {vocalsound} always need to have the the future with younger people.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um therefore, {vocalsound} younger people like trendy {disfmarker} trendy designs, so that's w we should make our our our R_C_ as trendy as possible but it should also be uh have a reliable image, so when it looks too too spacey or too fancy people will think well does it work at all.Marketing: Mm.Project Manager: Hmm.User Interface: Yeah it's uh well you you can follow the ideas how you want to keep the keys, you know right now if you take it you have like zero, one, two, three like a keys separately,Marketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: but suppose if you take the the present trend of mobile phones there are like big thick keysMarketing: Mm.User Interface: you press on the top, it takes one number, you press on the bottom it takes another number, and uh basically uh uh so the space covered so that you don't see two separate keys there actuallyIndustrial Designer: {gap} Mm-hmm.User Interface: so it it is like uh um i i it is like uh {disfmarker}Marketing: Mm.Project Manager: Ma Maybe Maybe you can draw it on the on you have a standard T_V_ remote where you have just a on, off button and play, uh volume change and uh keys for the number and more than one digit option. And if you see for example righ right now uh uh even the one uh on more than one digit option is for two digit channel which is like ninety nine, but {vocalsound} tomorrow you might have one fifty channels you know to browse or two hundred channels to browse who knows, but uh uh. Then there is uh {vocalsound} this is the standard one with without any fancy thing you know like i it doesn't have teletext option, it can without any, it's a very simple thing, um which which you can vouch {vocalsound}. And then you have uh what's the v video remote file which is like usually it has almost all the keys over there and, but it then it has other options like stop uh and then you play the movie or uh or fo fast forward the movie or something like that so i it has thoseMarketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: so these are the standard uh commonly found remote controls in the uh market. And then {disfmarker} whi which is generally used by the people. And then {vocalsound} well personal preferences I would {disfmarker} uh basically think of having a kind of aim for the next generation thing where the {disfmarker} we could have both the uh the f a T_V_ and the remote {disfmarker} video remote control because uh some of the keys in the video's remote control and the T_V_ they could be integrated together so that uh we could um aim for the like in the f coming future um that type of uh applications with {disfmarker}Marketing: Okay. How would that work

What were the advantages of big thick keys proposed by User Interface

User Interface gained the inspiration of big thick keys for remote control from mobile phones, which were already skillfully used by the younger generation and thus made thick keys familiar to youngsters. Also, according to Marketing, compared with ordinary keys for RC, thick keys fitted in with the trend, especially among youngsters. Moreover, every team member agreed that with thick design, keys would look less cluttered and more spacious.

targetProject Manager: Yes I mean well yes w who are we going to uh to well to sell this,Marketing: Mm.User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: Oh the customers, okay.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: the customers, indeed yes. Think that's that's important matter.Marketing: That's the big question yeah.Project Manager: Uh. {vocalsound} So {vocalsound} And then uh we will close this meeting uhUser Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: and after this meeting we'll uh we'll have a lunch. Good. Um. Maybe um why uh Anna can you c do you have a presentationsMarketing: No, I don't.Project Manager: You don't have presentationMarketing: I wasn't. No.Project Manager: Uh you want a table to to uhMarketing: I c I can talk about it but I have no slides or anything.Project Manager: Yes yes maybe maybe you can uh can just talk about it or maybe you can use the whiteboard if necessary um.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Well I've just been um presented with some research we've done in a small focus group so, a hundred people, just asked them about their remote control usage habits and what they want in a remote control. Um. It's {disfmarker} probably can't email this to you, I've just got a web page with some data on it. Um basically it's saying that users generally dislike the look and feel of their remote controls. Um seventy five u seventy five percent of users find most remote controls ugly. Um.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Eighty percent of users would spend more money when a remote control would look fancy. Um. Current remote controls do not match well the operating behaviour of the user. Uh seventy five percent of users said they zap a lot, so they use their remote control quite frequently while they're watching television. Uh. Fifty percent of users say that they only use ten percent of the buttons, so they've got a remote control with a lot of functionality but really most of the time they only use a small part of that.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um.Project Manager: Do you Do you have this uh information on the web page you saidMarketing: I have an a web page yes.Project Manager: Yes, mayb maybe you can can send an email to me later uh. Uh about this.Marketing: Yep. Yep, sure. Mm-hmm. So basically um there's a breakdown of how much they use the different functions on a rem remote control. Um, power and volume selection are only used a few times within this uh per hour. Um, channel selection is used a hundred and sixty eight times um {vocalsound} and then there's things like channel settings, audio settings, which are only used very infrequently.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um. Teletext is used um fourteen times in the hour, so it is used but not nearly as much as the channel selection is used. Um.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: An interesting thing that this report has brought up is that um fifty fifty percent of users report that the remote control gets lost a lot of the time in the room, so some way of some way of locating the remote control would be very useful to a lot of users. Um.Project Manager: Yes yes, I have {vocalsound} that too {vocalsound}.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Thirty four percent said it takes too long to learn to use a remote control, they want something that's easier to use straight away, more intuitive perhaps.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um.Industrial Designer: It's it's easy to learn or how do you say it's {disfmarker}Marketing: Thirty four percent said it took too much time to learn to use a new one. Yep.Industrial Designer: Okay too much time to learn. Okay.Marketing: Um. And thirty {disfmarker} uh uh R_C_Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Universal.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: because it has more uh it it is in some kind universal.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: But if we're going for the say fifteen to twenty five age group then not many of them would actually own T_V_s to use a remote control on.Project Manager: Mm yes but w we're targeting I think on more on the on the twenty to forty group.Marketing: Okay. So they're {disfmarker} yeah.Project Manager: People {disfmarker} yes. Who just have or already have a job and have the money but may not want to spend that much money on a on a universal universal control.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yep. I don't know really what the the price range for remote controls is. Are we gonna be at the very bottom of the price range, or are we kind of middle to bottom I don't know.Project Manager: Uh wellIndustrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} I think uh when we think it over I thi I think we are trying to offer the a kind of universal control for for less money.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Mm. Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: So d Do you agreeUser Interface: Well {disfmarker} Well I it's fine with me like the price as long as it is uh not too expensive.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} YeahUser Interface: Uh and it d uh {disfmarker} Our provinIndustrial Designer: because we have to take into account that we are gonna b we are gonna sell uh four aro around four million so when we speak about these numbers uh the price of a chip is {vocalsound} uh price of a chip is very cheap.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} So I'm okay for designing um a ne uh less {vocalsound} yeah a a kind of universal uh R_C_ yeah.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. uh devicesUser Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: So D_V_D_s and V_C_R_sProject Manager: Uh indeed indeed.Marketing: Mm.Project Manager: And and and the hard disk recorders. Um, furthermore, uh, w we need really need to interest uh {vocalsound} y younger customers and then with younger customers I mean people uh below the age of forty,Marketing: Mm-hmm. {vocalsound}Project Manager: and our our current customers are mainly forty plusMarketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: uh which wellIndustrial Designer: FourteenProject Manager: {disfmarker} Forty.Industrial Designer: or for O okay.Project Manager: SoIndustrial Designer: So {disfmarker}Project Manager: that's to that's I mean there's a market but uh they will grow older {disfmarker} olderMarketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: and you'll al {vocalsound} always need to have the the future with younger people.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um therefore, {vocalsound} younger people like trendy {disfmarker} trendy designs, so that's w we should make our our our R_C_ as trendy as possible but it should also be uh have a reliable image, so when it looks too too spacey or too fancy people will think well does it work at all.Marketing: Mm.Project Manager: Hmm.User Interface: Yeah it's uh well you you can follow the ideas how you want to keep the keys, you know right now if you take it you have like zero, one, two, three like a keys separately,Marketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: but suppose if you take the the present trend of mobile phones there are like big thick keysMarketing: Mm.User Interface: you press on the top, it takes one number, you press on the bottom it takes another number, and uh basically uh uh so the space covered so that you don't see two separate keys there actuallyIndustrial Designer: {gap} Mm-hmm.User Interface: so it it is like uh um i i it is like uh {disfmarker}Marketing: Mm.Project Manager: Ma Maybe Maybe you can draw it on the on But it's quite noisy if there is the T_V_ uh shouting.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yes,User Interface: It's it's going to be liProject Manager: that that that that's mm.User Interface: it's not going to be s so easy but u usually it's going to be more of an isolated caseProject Manager: Do you have some more important factsUser Interface: but it's {disfmarker} but I don't know with twenty fiMarketing: Um {disfmarker}Project Manager: or can we go to the next presentationIndustrial Designer: Okay. SoMarketing: Well {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: you had to to to summarise maybe the {disfmarker}Marketing: This is now talking about um who would pay for speech recognition in a remote control, who would pay more for it, um. Ninety percent of the fifteen to twenty five year old market said that they would pay more, it goes down from there, seventy six percent for twenty five to thirty five, thirty five percent for thirty five to forty five, um twenty two percent for forty five to fifty five and then eight percent for fifty five to sixty five.Project Manager: Mm.User Interface: Okay it's uh decline.Marketing: Yeah.User Interface: Okay.Marketing: But we shProject Manager: Mm-hmm. Decline with age, mm.Marketing: Yeah, it really depends where we're gonna be targeting this product, um,User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm. {vocalsound}Marketing: which we'll be talking about later I think.Industrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: Yes. We will talk about it later. {vocalsound}Marketing: Did you get the emailProject Manager: Okay. {vocalsound}Marketing: Yep, that one.Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Just follow that link.Industrial Designer: {gap} I thi {vocalsound} You usMarketing: It'll be in a different window, yep.Industrial Designer: yeah yeah.Marketing: That's {disfmarker} left {disfmarker} that one.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: Yep.Industrial Designer: Okay perfect. . . .Marketing: Mm. So that's the figure that I was just talking about there, with the different demographics.User Interface:

Summarize the group discussion about the target group and corresponding functionalities.

When Projected Manager announced that the group should decide on the target group, Marketing thought that with a tight budget, the functionality of the product would be greatly restricted. Hence, only a low market could be reached. However, after a brief discussion about LCR screen, Project Manager brought back the idea of universal remote control, and the group reached a consensus on the feasibility of designing a basic universal remote control at a low cost.

so they've got a remote control with a lot of functionality but really most of the time they only use a small part of that.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um.Project Manager: Do you Do you have this uh information on the web page you saidMarketing: I have an a web page yes.Project Manager: Yes, mayb maybe you can can send an email to me later uh. Uh about this.Marketing: Yep. Yep, sure. Mm-hmm. So basically um there's a breakdown of how much they use the different functions on a rem remote control. Um, power and volume selection are only used a few times within this uh per hour. Um, channel selection is used a hundred and sixty eight times um {vocalsound} and then there's things like channel settings, audio settings, which are only used very infrequently.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um. Teletext is used um fourteen times in the hour, so it is used but not nearly as much as the channel selection is used. Um.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: An interesting thing that this report has brought up is that um fifty fifty percent of users report that the remote control gets lost a lot of the time in the room, so some way of some way of locating the remote control would be very useful to a lot of users. Um.Project Manager: Yes yes, I have {vocalsound} that too {vocalsound}.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Thirty four percent said it takes too long to learn to use a remote control, they want something that's easier to use straight away, more intuitive perhaps.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um.Industrial Designer: It's it's easy to learn or how do you say it's {disfmarker}Marketing: Thirty four percent said it took too much time to learn to use a new one. Yep.Industrial Designer: Okay too much time to learn. Okay.Marketing: Um. And thirty {disfmarker} targetProject Manager: Yes I mean well yes w who are we going to uh to well to sell this,Marketing: Mm.User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: Oh the customers, okay.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: the customers, indeed yes. Think that's that's important matter.Marketing: That's the big question yeah.Project Manager: Uh. {vocalsound} So {vocalsound} And then uh we will close this meeting uhUser Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: and after this meeting we'll uh we'll have a lunch. Good. Um. Maybe um why uh Anna can you c do you have a presentationsMarketing: No, I don't.Project Manager: You don't have presentationMarketing: I wasn't. No.Project Manager: Uh you want a table to to uhMarketing: I c I can talk about it but I have no slides or anything.Project Manager: Yes yes maybe maybe you can uh can just talk about it or maybe you can use the whiteboard if necessary um.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Well I've just been um presented with some research we've done in a small focus group so, a hundred people, just asked them about their remote control usage habits and what they want in a remote control. Um. It's {disfmarker} probably can't email this to you, I've just got a web page with some data on it. Um basically it's saying that users generally dislike the look and feel of their remote controls. Um seventy five u seventy five percent of users find most remote controls ugly. Um.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Eighty percent of users would spend more money when a remote control would look fancy. Um. Current remote controls do not match well the operating behaviour of the user. Uh seventy five percent of users said they zap a lot, so they use their remote control quite frequently while they're watching television. Uh. Fifty percent of users say that they only use ten percent of the buttons, uh uh R_C_Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Universal.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: because it has more uh it it is in some kind universal.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: But if we're going for the say fifteen to twenty five age group then not many of them would actually own T_V_s to use a remote control on.Project Manager: Mm yes but w we're targeting I think on more on the on the twenty to forty group.Marketing: Okay. So they're {disfmarker} yeah.Project Manager: People {disfmarker} yes. Who just have or already have a job and have the money but may not want to spend that much money on a on a universal universal control.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yep. I don't know really what the the price range for remote controls is. Are we gonna be at the very bottom of the price range, or are we kind of middle to bottom I don't know.Project Manager: Uh wellIndustrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} I think uh when we think it over I thi I think we are trying to offer the a kind of universal control for for less money.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Mm. Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: So d Do you agreeUser Interface: Well {disfmarker} Well I it's fine with me like the price as long as it is uh not too expensive.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} YeahUser Interface: Uh and it d uh {disfmarker} Our provinIndustrial Designer: because we have to take into account that we are gonna b we are gonna sell uh four aro around four million so when we speak about these numbers uh the price of a chip is {vocalsound} uh price of a chip is very cheap.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} So I'm okay for designing um a ne uh less {vocalsound} yeah a a kind of universal uh R_C_ yeah.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. But it's quite noisy if there is the T_V_ uh shouting.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yes,User Interface: It's it's going to be liProject Manager: that that that that's mm.User Interface: it's not going to be s so easy but u usually it's going to be more of an isolated caseProject Manager: Do you have some more important factsUser Interface: but it's {disfmarker} but I don't know with twenty fiMarketing: Um {disfmarker}Project Manager: or can we go to the next presentationIndustrial Designer: Okay. SoMarketing: Well {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: you had to to to summarise maybe the {disfmarker}Marketing: This is now talking about um who would pay for speech recognition in a remote control, who would pay more for it, um. Ninety percent of the fifteen to twenty five year old market said that they would pay more, it goes down from there, seventy six percent for twenty five to thirty five, thirty five percent for thirty five to forty five, um twenty two percent for forty five to fifty five and then eight percent for fifty five to sixty five.Project Manager: Mm.User Interface: Okay it's uh decline.Marketing: Yeah.User Interface: Okay.Marketing: But we shProject Manager: Mm-hmm. Decline with age, mm.Marketing: Yeah, it really depends where we're gonna be targeting this product, um,User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm. {vocalsound}Marketing: which we'll be talking about later I think.Industrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: Yes. We will talk about it later. {vocalsound}Marketing: Did you get the emailProject Manager: Okay. {vocalsound}Marketing: Yep, that one.Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Just follow that link.Industrial Designer: {gap} I thi {vocalsound} You usMarketing: It'll be in a different window, yep.Industrial Designer: yeah yeah.Marketing: That's {disfmarker} left {disfmarker} that one.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: Yep.Industrial Designer: Okay perfect. . . .Marketing: Mm. So that's the figure that I was just talking about there, with the different demographics.User Interface: existsProject Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: and but we what we can do is uh uh adapting {vocalsound} the the chips inside uh to the best uh chips and uh infrared bubbles.Project Manager: Mm. Mm. Mm. Mm. Yes. Okay.Industrial Designer: Um. Okay. {gap}Project Manager: Thank you.User Interface: Well it to du it's just you had to change the frequencies.Industrial Designer: The frequenciesUser Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Yeah yeah. Of course yeahUser Interface: {vocalsound} But you should be careful,Industrial Designer: in the chip you have it yeah.User Interface: people are sometime becoming problem, like a guy has recently designed a remote uh uh uh which could switch off any other T_V_s {vocalsound}, so basically {gap} through all the things.Industrial Designer: That can control o other things. Yeah.Marketing: Ah.Project Manager: Mm.User Interface: So maybe we should think of {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Of course yeah we should take that into accountMarketing: That's handy.Project Manager: Yeah yesMarketing: So if the b T_V_ in the next apartment's really loud, you can just turn it off.Project Manager: I I I {disfmarker}User Interface: yeah.Industrial Designer: in the uh {disfmarker}User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah so you can just go on the street and then switch off everyone's T_V_ {vocalsound} and you can just walk away {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: You don't have to be near the T_V_ at all {vocalsound}.Marketing: Yeah. I like that idea.Project Manager: I I feel I I I think M Mael will will consider this uh th these things.User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Maybe Maybe we can go to to your presentation uh Matthew.User Interface: YeahProject Manager: I I I assume you were finished here.User Interface: so {vocalsound}.Industrial Designer: Yes.Project Manager: Uh okay.User Interface: Okay. {vocalsound} So I can take I think mine now there.Industrial Designer: Okay.User Interface: Okay so voila.Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Hmm I can take mine it's

Who did Marketing think the remote control should target and why

Marketing thought that remote control should be targeted at a low market. First, considering the tight budget, Marketing described the product as a cheap-end remote control, which would hardly gain the advantage over competitors in functionality. By saying that she implied that a high-end RC for a high market should be equipped with sophisticated functions, which were not possessed by a low-cost one anyway. Therefore, only a low market may want to buy it.

so they've got a remote control with a lot of functionality but really most of the time they only use a small part of that.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um.Project Manager: Do you Do you have this uh information on the web page you saidMarketing: I have an a web page yes.Project Manager: Yes, mayb maybe you can can send an email to me later uh. Uh about this.Marketing: Yep. Yep, sure. Mm-hmm. So basically um there's a breakdown of how much they use the different functions on a rem remote control. Um, power and volume selection are only used a few times within this uh per hour. Um, channel selection is used a hundred and sixty eight times um {vocalsound} and then there's things like channel settings, audio settings, which are only used very infrequently.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um. Teletext is used um fourteen times in the hour, so it is used but not nearly as much as the channel selection is used. Um.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: An interesting thing that this report has brought up is that um fifty fifty percent of users report that the remote control gets lost a lot of the time in the room, so some way of some way of locating the remote control would be very useful to a lot of users. Um.Project Manager: Yes yes, I have {vocalsound} that too {vocalsound}.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Thirty four percent said it takes too long to learn to use a remote control, they want something that's easier to use straight away, more intuitive perhaps.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um.Industrial Designer: It's it's easy to learn or how do you say it's {disfmarker}Marketing: Thirty four percent said it took too much time to learn to use a new one. Yep.Industrial Designer: Okay too much time to learn. Okay.Marketing: Um. And thirty {disfmarker} uh uh R_C_Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Universal.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: because it has more uh it it is in some kind universal.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: But if we're going for the say fifteen to twenty five age group then not many of them would actually own T_V_s to use a remote control on.Project Manager: Mm yes but w we're targeting I think on more on the on the twenty to forty group.Marketing: Okay. So they're {disfmarker} yeah.Project Manager: People {disfmarker} yes. Who just have or already have a job and have the money but may not want to spend that much money on a on a universal universal control.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yep. I don't know really what the the price range for remote controls is. Are we gonna be at the very bottom of the price range, or are we kind of middle to bottom I don't know.Project Manager: Uh wellIndustrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} I think uh when we think it over I thi I think we are trying to offer the a kind of universal control for for less money.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Mm. Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: So d Do you agreeUser Interface: Well {disfmarker} Well I it's fine with me like the price as long as it is uh not too expensive.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} YeahUser Interface: Uh and it d uh {disfmarker} Our provinIndustrial Designer: because we have to take into account that we are gonna b we are gonna sell uh four aro around four million so when we speak about these numbers uh the price of a chip is {vocalsound} uh price of a chip is very cheap.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} So I'm okay for designing um a ne uh less {vocalsound} yeah a a kind of universal uh R_C_ yeah.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. targetProject Manager: Yes I mean well yes w who are we going to uh to well to sell this,Marketing: Mm.User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: Oh the customers, okay.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: the customers, indeed yes. Think that's that's important matter.Marketing: That's the big question yeah.Project Manager: Uh. {vocalsound} So {vocalsound} And then uh we will close this meeting uhUser Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: and after this meeting we'll uh we'll have a lunch. Good. Um. Maybe um why uh Anna can you c do you have a presentationsMarketing: No, I don't.Project Manager: You don't have presentationMarketing: I wasn't. No.Project Manager: Uh you want a table to to uhMarketing: I c I can talk about it but I have no slides or anything.Project Manager: Yes yes maybe maybe you can uh can just talk about it or maybe you can use the whiteboard if necessary um.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Well I've just been um presented with some research we've done in a small focus group so, a hundred people, just asked them about their remote control usage habits and what they want in a remote control. Um. It's {disfmarker} probably can't email this to you, I've just got a web page with some data on it. Um basically it's saying that users generally dislike the look and feel of their remote controls. Um seventy five u seventy five percent of users find most remote controls ugly. Um.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Eighty percent of users would spend more money when a remote control would look fancy. Um. Current remote controls do not match well the operating behaviour of the user. Uh seventy five percent of users said they zap a lot, so they use their remote control quite frequently while they're watching television. Uh. Fifty percent of users say that they only use ten percent of the buttons, But it's quite noisy if there is the T_V_ uh shouting.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yes,User Interface: It's it's going to be liProject Manager: that that that that's mm.User Interface: it's not going to be s so easy but u usually it's going to be more of an isolated caseProject Manager: Do you have some more important factsUser Interface: but it's {disfmarker} but I don't know with twenty fiMarketing: Um {disfmarker}Project Manager: or can we go to the next presentationIndustrial Designer: Okay. SoMarketing: Well {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: you had to to to summarise maybe the {disfmarker}Marketing: This is now talking about um who would pay for speech recognition in a remote control, who would pay more for it, um. Ninety percent of the fifteen to twenty five year old market said that they would pay more, it goes down from there, seventy six percent for twenty five to thirty five, thirty five percent for thirty five to forty five, um twenty two percent for forty five to fifty five and then eight percent for fifty five to sixty five.Project Manager: Mm.User Interface: Okay it's uh decline.Marketing: Yeah.User Interface: Okay.Marketing: But we shProject Manager: Mm-hmm. Decline with age, mm.Marketing: Yeah, it really depends where we're gonna be targeting this product, um,User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm. {vocalsound}Marketing: which we'll be talking about later I think.Industrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: Yes. We will talk about it later. {vocalsound}Marketing: Did you get the emailProject Manager: Okay. {vocalsound}Marketing: Yep, that one.Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Just follow that link.Industrial Designer: {gap} I thi {vocalsound} You usMarketing: It'll be in a different window, yep.Industrial Designer: yeah yeah.Marketing: That's {disfmarker} left {disfmarker} that one.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: Yep.Industrial Designer: Okay perfect. . . .Marketing: Mm. So that's the figure that I was just talking about there, with the different demographics.User Interface: you have a standard T_V_ remote where you have just a on, off button and play, uh volume change and uh keys for the number and more than one digit option. And if you see for example righ right now uh uh even the one uh on more than one digit option is for two digit channel which is like ninety nine, but {vocalsound} tomorrow you might have one fifty channels you know to browse or two hundred channels to browse who knows, but uh uh. Then there is uh {vocalsound} this is the standard one with without any fancy thing you know like i it doesn't have teletext option, it can without any, it's a very simple thing, um which which you can vouch {vocalsound}. And then you have uh what's the v video remote file which is like usually it has almost all the keys over there and, but it then it has other options like stop uh and then you play the movie or uh or fo fast forward the movie or something like that so i it has thoseMarketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: so these are the standard uh commonly found remote controls in the uh market. And then {disfmarker} whi which is generally used by the people. And then {vocalsound} well personal preferences I would {disfmarker} uh basically think of having a kind of aim for the next generation thing where the {disfmarker} we could have both the uh the f a T_V_ and the remote {disfmarker} video remote control because uh some of the keys in the video's remote control and the T_V_ they could be integrated together so that uh we could um aim for the like in the f coming future um that type of uh applications with {disfmarker}Marketing: Okay. How would that work

What decision did the group make on universal remote

When Marketing first touched on the idea of a universal remote, she quickly rebutted herself, arguing that a high-end product was not achievable with a tight budget. However, Project Manager said that the group could make an attempt to provide a basic version of universal control, which could switch between stereo, VC, and TV. Thus, the group agreed to give universal remote a try and see if they could design a cheap one within budget.

uh uh R_C_Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Universal.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: because it has more uh it it is in some kind universal.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: But if we're going for the say fifteen to twenty five age group then not many of them would actually own T_V_s to use a remote control on.Project Manager: Mm yes but w we're targeting I think on more on the on the twenty to forty group.Marketing: Okay. So they're {disfmarker} yeah.Project Manager: People {disfmarker} yes. Who just have or already have a job and have the money but may not want to spend that much money on a on a universal universal control.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yep. I don't know really what the the price range for remote controls is. Are we gonna be at the very bottom of the price range, or are we kind of middle to bottom I don't know.Project Manager: Uh wellIndustrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} I think uh when we think it over I thi I think we are trying to offer the a kind of universal control for for less money.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Mm. Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: So d Do you agreeUser Interface: Well {disfmarker} Well I it's fine with me like the price as long as it is uh not too expensive.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} YeahUser Interface: Uh and it d uh {disfmarker} Our provinIndustrial Designer: because we have to take into account that we are gonna b we are gonna sell uh four aro around four million so when we speak about these numbers uh the price of a chip is {vocalsound} uh price of a chip is very cheap.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} So I'm okay for designing um a ne uh less {vocalsound} yeah a a kind of universal uh R_C_ yeah.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. targetProject Manager: Yes I mean well yes w who are we going to uh to well to sell this,Marketing: Mm.User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: Oh the customers, okay.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: the customers, indeed yes. Think that's that's important matter.Marketing: That's the big question yeah.Project Manager: Uh. {vocalsound} So {vocalsound} And then uh we will close this meeting uhUser Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: and after this meeting we'll uh we'll have a lunch. Good. Um. Maybe um why uh Anna can you c do you have a presentationsMarketing: No, I don't.Project Manager: You don't have presentationMarketing: I wasn't. No.Project Manager: Uh you want a table to to uhMarketing: I c I can talk about it but I have no slides or anything.Project Manager: Yes yes maybe maybe you can uh can just talk about it or maybe you can use the whiteboard if necessary um.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Well I've just been um presented with some research we've done in a small focus group so, a hundred people, just asked them about their remote control usage habits and what they want in a remote control. Um. It's {disfmarker} probably can't email this to you, I've just got a web page with some data on it. Um basically it's saying that users generally dislike the look and feel of their remote controls. Um seventy five u seventy five percent of users find most remote controls ugly. Um.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Eighty percent of users would spend more money when a remote control would look fancy. Um. Current remote controls do not match well the operating behaviour of the user. Uh seventy five percent of users said they zap a lot, so they use their remote control quite frequently while they're watching television. Uh. Fifty percent of users say that they only use ten percent of the buttons, so they've got a remote control with a lot of functionality but really most of the time they only use a small part of that.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um.Project Manager: Do you Do you have this uh information on the web page you saidMarketing: I have an a web page yes.Project Manager: Yes, mayb maybe you can can send an email to me later uh. Uh about this.Marketing: Yep. Yep, sure. Mm-hmm. So basically um there's a breakdown of how much they use the different functions on a rem remote control. Um, power and volume selection are only used a few times within this uh per hour. Um, channel selection is used a hundred and sixty eight times um {vocalsound} and then there's things like channel settings, audio settings, which are only used very infrequently.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um. Teletext is used um fourteen times in the hour, so it is used but not nearly as much as the channel selection is used. Um.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: An interesting thing that this report has brought up is that um fifty fifty percent of users report that the remote control gets lost a lot of the time in the room, so some way of some way of locating the remote control would be very useful to a lot of users. Um.Project Manager: Yes yes, I have {vocalsound} that too {vocalsound}.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Thirty four percent said it takes too long to learn to use a remote control, they want something that's easier to use straight away, more intuitive perhaps.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: Um.Industrial Designer: It's it's easy to learn or how do you say it's {disfmarker}Marketing: Thirty four percent said it took too much time to learn to use a new one. Yep.Industrial Designer: Okay too much time to learn. Okay.Marketing: Um. And thirty {disfmarker} the board uh {disfmarker}Marketing: Mm. But I think taking the idea of getting inspiration from mobile phones is interesting, especially if we're going after a younger market,User Interface: Yeah so.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: Hmm. Yes yesMarketing: that's the the the mm the new and the funky things,Project Manager: moIndustrial Designer: Because they are already used to that, you know, product.Marketing: that's,Project Manager: Yes it's recognisable {gap}Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: yeah, there's lot there's lots of pretty mobile phones, not too many pretty remote controls.Project Manager: Mm mm.Marketing: That's {disfmarker}Project Manager: And and they are skilled uh by using it.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: So for example uh {disfmarker} Well uh {vocalsound} {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm. . . .User Interface: Okay, it works. Fine. So, for example you have uh presently uh keys like one, two, three like this, actually, and uh uh four five six like that and uh you can have keys like this in form like uh keys like thatProject Manager: Mael can you hand me over this uhIndustrial Designer: Yes. {gap}Project Manager: Uh thank you.Marketing: Mm-hmm. Okay. How much longer have we got for the meeting by the wayProject Manager: Mm wellMarketing:'Cause we haven't talked about demographic at allProject Manager: I think fi five minUser Interface: Forty minutesMarketing: and it's a very important issue.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Yeah so you you you can have uh keys like uh which are which are like so. {vocalsound} too sorry, so we basically don't change the uh original order of themIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}User Interface: but then the keys are more spacious,Marketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: they don't look uh {disfmarker} so there there is a very sligh thing, so if you press on the top it takes the one, it takes the three, uh four, sorry four here uh five and six,Marketing: Mm. Mm.User Interface: Okay.Marketing: Another thing it's talking about there is the L_C_D_ screen but there's no figures apparently on that.Project Manager: Mm. Okay. {vocalsound} umIndustrial Designer: Mm'kay.Project Manager: Uh maybe uh Mael c c can you give uh uh your presentation uhIndustrial Designer: Yeah. Mm I okayProject Manager: Oh,Industrial Designer: I stay {disfmarker}Project Manager: this is {disfmarker}User Interface: Now you can move I think yeah.Project Manager: Mm-hmm, y y you can move, uh.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} I can move as far as {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Maybe I take your chairProject Manager: Yes. You can you can sa take my chair.Industrial Designer: I okay {vocalsound}.User Interface: It's a channel selection, a module {gap}, this and this function,Marketing: Sorry Oh.User Interface: go to the {gap}. Yeah.Industrial Designer: So I think as everybody knows uh I'm the uh Industrial Designer. And uh in this presentation uh this group presentation um {vocalsound} is gonna focus on the working design of the the remote control. Um I'd like first to give a quick a very simple introduction, how does it work, so that everybody knows even if you don't have a very uh technical background uh what is it because I think in the product it is important.Marketing: Mm. {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: So basically um the basic function of a remote control is to send uh messages to another system that is fixed.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: And so an energy source feeds an integrated circuit, the chip, that can compose messages, usually uh through a um infrared bitMarketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: and uh the user interface controls the chip and accordingly the the messages, alright. So my method for um designing the yeah the work design uh yeah first {vocalsound} the the main point is that I would wish to to make a really functional product. I would prefer to have very

Summarize the whole meeting.

The whole meeting was focused on the target group and the functionality of the new remote control product. After Project Manager briefly reaffirmed the meeting procedure, Marketing, Industrial Designer, and User Interface each gave a presentation about trend-watching, working design, technical function respectively. Then, Project Manager started a group discussion about the demand for teletext and video, for which thick key design was accepted as a feasible solution. Then, the group discussed the target group based on the predetermined budget, and accepted universality as an important feature.

Project Manager: Okay. Hello everyone. {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Hi.User Interface: Hi.Marketing: Hi.Project Manager: Um how uh how we doingIndustrial Designer: Yeah, good.Project Manager: Uh first we going uh over the minutes of the last meeting, more or less.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um in the last meeting uh the marketing manager had presented uh her method of working, meaning gathering i suggestions from everyone to see how she best could market uh this this product at the {disfmarker} within the budget uh that was given. Uh in general {vocalsound} the idea is that it should be something that is not difficult to use. Um it's also an item that people lose a lot. So we should address that. And, of course, it should be something s s that is very simple to use. In addition to that to make it sell, of course, uh the marketing manager w wishes that it be very attractive,Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or like she says put some sizzle into it in one way or another so that the people are buying it now because, in particular with smaller items, that's a very important fact,'cause um if they say, well, I go home and think about it, that won't work. Um also mentioned was it should be uh {disfmarker} it should have a very short learning curve. And maybe it could be sold by using a slogan.Industrial Designer: Hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Our technical manager has then said that she feels it should have a chipMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: that has infra-red bits and it has an interface controls w interface that controls the chip. Therefore, messages uh will be controlled in the same manner. There should be extra features like lid buttons, maybe a beep. If too many buttons are pressed, mm uh uh child lock um and three. Yes. Okay.Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: Now as an interface designer, I would give more emphasis on the interface, how the remote looks like so that it is sellable, it is attractive to customers. Next, please. Okay. Now the function of a remote is to send messages to the television. This messages could be uh switch on-off message or switch to next channel message or swapping the channels or switching onto a particular channel, like you can have the numbers one, two, three, four, up to nine.Project Manager: Nine what Nine channel uh switchesUser Interface: Pardon meProject Manager: Nine channel switches Is {disfmarker} Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: Yes, nine numbers. And then you have swapping of uh buttonProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: by which {disfmarker} using which you can swap the channels if you don't want to see the third channel you can swap it to the fourth channel or vice versa. Then it should have a next button, and next button channel by which you can keep on uh v uh mm eh scrolling the channels one by one.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Going to the nex next.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Next slide, please.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then you should have a button which should which ca which can be used for increasing or decreasing the volume.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, there should be a button which can give subtitles for a particular program which is going on a television. For example, if you are watching a French program and you would like to have a subtitles in English, then there should be a channel which can trigger this mechanism in the television so that the user can see uh the {gap} the subtitles on the screen.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then there should d uh there should be some buttons have a lot of time left and we will still have to make a decision, and the marketing expert has to present her her thing.Marketing: {vocalsound} Okay. Go right to my first {disfmarker} my next slide.Project Manager: Uh okay.Marketing: Um alright, my method is uh {disfmarker} I'm interested in what the competition is doing, and wanna see how we can make ourselves different from the competition, so I've really been looking at the press and the ads that are out there for other remote controllers. I s I {vocalsound} spend a lot of time on the internet um surfing around doing the same thing. And then when I'm out um in people's houses or at meetings or anything like that, I try to notice what kind of remote controls people have, and if it's convenient in the conversation I ask about it. And I would encourage you all to do the same. Um and my findings from this is that, you know, small is beautiful. Um people like something that really fits in their hand.User Interface:'Kay.Marketing: Simple is beautiful. They don't want to have to squint at small print um, they want buttons whose functions are obvious, and they want um as few buttons as possible, and they don't {vocalsound} care for the mode thing. They want each button to do something. And eye-catching is important. It's gotta look cute, it's gotta look appealing. Go ahead, I'm trying to finish fast for you. Um {vocalsound} and our preference is, as far as I'm concerned, are we got to get to the market before the competition. Ours has to be {disfmarker} look really great and it has to come out before the others, so that we have a leg up on time to sell it and push it before other people uh maybe a display clock so that people could um {disfmarker} you could see the time, you know, what show they want to watch. Also mentioned was uh maybe different shapes. So the components of the thing should be button, bulbs, infra infra-red bulbs, battery, chips, wires, and maybe some kind of a holder uh for the for the uh item. Francino who is our umUser Interface: Interface designer.Project Manager: interface designer um uh has mentioned that the {disfmarker} that it, of course, should have an on-off button, and also has mentioned an interesting feature that it should have maybe a channel lock. Particularly with maybe small children that they couldn't uh watch a channel that is undesirable. It should be compact. Her personal favourite was it should be T-shaped. And maybe have an anar alarm-clock. And the material should possibly be not of non-allergic nature. Uh the different systems uh that exist are infra-red or radio-waves. Uh maybe it should have uh electri electrici electricity saving feature.Marketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: And {vocalsound} even possibly a timer to {disfmarker} so that people can program {vocalsound} their favourite uh uh program on th right from the remote.User Interface: Yes.Project Manager: Uh are we all in agreement that that's about what we discussed last time Okay.User Interface: Yes.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah, I think that pretty much is it. Yeah. Mm-hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Okay, then we {disfmarker} I'm looking for three presentations. And uh I don't know whether the order matters much uh, I don't I don't think so, so whoever w wants {disfmarker}User Interface: Okay, I can start first.Project Manager: Yeah, okay.User Interface: Okay. Now my slide, please. {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay, your slides. Okay. Oh, come on, close already.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: And that's number two, rightUser Interface: Three.Project Manager: Three.User Interface: Participant which can control features like the colour, colour of the picture, the contrast, sharpness, brightness of the picture. Now there should be a memory switch. There should be a mute button. Suddenly if if if uh uh viewer he gets a telephone call, and if he want he doesn't want to switch off the uh T_V_, but he he can reduce the sound, he can bring the volume down and he can watch {disfmarker} he can uh {disfmarker} while talking he can watch the T_V_. Now the most important feature I would like to have in my remote would be the speech recognition feature. It's an integrated progra programmable sample sensor speaker unit. So a remote can be th can be uh designed which can have the voice recognisers, you can record your own voiceProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: which can be recognised by as voice recogniser in the television, for example, if you want to see {disfmarker} we if you want to see the ninth channel if you say just say ninth channel, uh th now the the {disfmarker} uh yeah, the remote will {disfmarker} automatically it will switch to the ninth channel.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So the T_V_ will have some recogniser which will recognise the user's voice and accordingly it will change its functionalities.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So this is one of the very important feature a remote control can have. So this is one one of the interface which can be created.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: A very simple interface which has all the t uh uh important features.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, please, next slide.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, these are some of the remotes which are different in shape and colour, but they have many buttons.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: So uh sometimes the

Summarize the recap of the last meeting.

The general idea for the remote was that it should be easy to use, attractive and electricity saving. People might lose it a lot and it could be sold by using a slogan. For the technical aspect, the remote should have a chip with an interface that controls it, infrared bulbs, battery, wires, buttons and holder. There should be extra features such as timer, lid buttons, on-off button, channel lock and display clock. The remote could be in different shapes, preferably compact and T-shaped. The material should be of non-allergic nature. The different systems that exist were infrared and radio-waves.

three. Yes. Okay.Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: Now as an interface designer, I would give more emphasis on the interface, how the remote looks like so that it is sellable, it is attractive to customers. Next, please. Okay. Now the function of a remote is to send messages to the television. This messages could be uh switch on-off message or switch to next channel message or swapping the channels or switching onto a particular channel, like you can have the numbers one, two, three, four, up to nine.Project Manager: Nine what Nine channel uh switchesUser Interface: Pardon meProject Manager: Nine channel switches Is {disfmarker} Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: Yes, nine numbers. And then you have swapping of uh buttonProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: by which {disfmarker} using which you can swap the channels if you don't want to see the third channel you can swap it to the fourth channel or vice versa. Then it should have a next button, and next button channel by which you can keep on uh v uh mm eh scrolling the channels one by one.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Going to the nex next.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Next slide, please.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then you should have a button which should which ca which can be used for increasing or decreasing the volume.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, there should be a button which can give subtitles for a particular program which is going on a television. For example, if you are watching a French program and you would like to have a subtitles in English, then there should be a channel which can trigger this mechanism in the television so that the user can see uh the {gap} the subtitles on the screen.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then there should d uh there should be some buttons Project Manager: Okay. Hello everyone. {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Hi.User Interface: Hi.Marketing: Hi.Project Manager: Um how uh how we doingIndustrial Designer: Yeah, good.Project Manager: Uh first we going uh over the minutes of the last meeting, more or less.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um in the last meeting uh the marketing manager had presented uh her method of working, meaning gathering i suggestions from everyone to see how she best could market uh this this product at the {disfmarker} within the budget uh that was given. Uh in general {vocalsound} the idea is that it should be something that is not difficult to use. Um it's also an item that people lose a lot. So we should address that. And, of course, it should be something s s that is very simple to use. In addition to that to make it sell, of course, uh the marketing manager w wishes that it be very attractive,Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or like she says put some sizzle into it in one way or another so that the people are buying it now because, in particular with smaller items, that's a very important fact,'cause um if they say, well, I go home and think about it, that won't work. Um also mentioned was it should be uh {disfmarker} it should have a very short learning curve. And maybe it could be sold by using a slogan.Industrial Designer: Hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Our technical manager has then said that she feels it should have a chipMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: that has infra-red bits and it has an interface controls w interface that controls the chip. Therefore, messages uh will be controlled in the same manner. There should be extra features like lid buttons, maybe a beep. If too many buttons are pressed, mm uh uh child lock um and which can control features like the colour, colour of the picture, the contrast, sharpness, brightness of the picture. Now there should be a memory switch. There should be a mute button. Suddenly if if if uh uh viewer he gets a telephone call, and if he want he doesn't want to switch off the uh T_V_, but he he can reduce the sound, he can bring the volume down and he can watch {disfmarker} he can uh {disfmarker} while talking he can watch the T_V_. Now the most important feature I would like to have in my remote would be the speech recognition feature. It's an integrated progra programmable sample sensor speaker unit. So a remote can be th can be uh designed which can have the voice recognisers, you can record your own voiceProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: which can be recognised by as voice recogniser in the television, for example, if you want to see {disfmarker} we if you want to see the ninth channel if you say just say ninth channel, uh th now the the {disfmarker} uh yeah, the remote will {disfmarker} automatically it will switch to the ninth channel.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So the T_V_ will have some recogniser which will recognise the user's voice and accordingly it will change its functionalities.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So this is one of the very important feature a remote control can have. So this is one one of the interface which can be created.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: A very simple interface which has all the t uh uh important features.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, please, next slide.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, these are some of the remotes which are different in shape and colour, but they have many buttons.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: So uh sometimes the such interface which can be created. {vocalsound} And the personal preference {vocalsound} uh would be a spe uh uh to incorporate speech recognisers uh which will respond to user's voice for a particular uh function.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Right.User Interface: Thank you, that's {disfmarker}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Okay, thank you very much. Uh any comments on uh her presentationMarketing: Well, um looks like we still have quite a choice of things out there.Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Um what uh {vocalsound} I'm {disfmarker} No suggestion's bad.User Interface: Mm yes.Marketing: But uh we're gonna have to narrow it down a little more. I don't think that we can get uh {disfmarker} The T-shape is good, the child one is good, the too big to misplace, I think it's just funny.User Interface: Okay. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} Um I don't think that's gonna be our impulse purchase at the checkout counter.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Yeah, I I th I think {disfmarker}User Interface: Okay. {gap} {vocalsound}Marketing: It's it's gonna be a little bit too unwieldy.User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: No, I think the these are her presentations, but uh as far as the decision making we getting to that after afterMarketing: Yeah mm. Mm-hmm. Have to come back to that later. Okay.User Interface: We can.Project Manager: but if {disfmarker} I just wanted to know whether anybody had any any anything to add to her presentation.Marketing: No, I think her presentation was good, and she really explored all the options. Yeah.Project Manager: Mm right. Mm-hmm. Ho who wants to go next um Mm-hmm. Okay,Industrial Designer: Yeah, maybe.Project Manager: and you {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Participant two.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh okay.Industrial Designer: Uh the next one, sorry.Project Manager: Oops.Industrial Designer: It's it was the old one.Project Manager: The components design.Industrial Designer: Components.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Okay.Industrial Designer: Um this time I'm I'm going to is a normal remote controller. And {gap} to the next slide, please.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: And where we had a a few buttons and all. And uh if you open the remote controller you have this circui circuit board and few electronic components,Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: like you can see a chip there which is having eighteen pins,Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: and also a capac uh a capacitor, three resistors and also a resonator uh um mm {disfmarker} yeah, and di and a diode transistor.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: The electronic components {disfmarker} uh all of the electronic components have all those uh things like a chip and d {vocalsound} diode transistors an Yeah, di um can y uh you can see the T_A_ double one eight three five labelled uh chip um.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Mm yes.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Yes.Industrial Designer: Uh you can also see the uh uh the green {disfmarker} two green things are uh these are {disfmarker} they are {disfmarker} they are resistors,User Interface: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: and uh just beside that you can see a transistor, and a uh uh cylinder shape, uh that one is a capacitor. Uh and also there are uh {vocalsound} um resistors {disfmarker} uh sorry, ther there is a diode.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Can you go {disfmarker} go on to the next slide.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: So uh this is the circuit board. The green one is a circuit board. Actually, uh building a circuit bo board is pretty pretty uh easy and also it's a it's a l l inexpensive. Uh it's it costs less than what you print on a paper, because uh {vocalsound} uh when you {disfmarker} when you are building uh some circuits {disfmarker} some um uh circuits and also wires, it's it's better to go for printing, because

What would be the interface design of the remote

There would be nine channel switches and a memory switch. There would be buttons for the next channel, subtitles, increasing and decreasing volume, mute and controlling features like colour, contrast, sharpness, brightness of picture. There also could be a speech recognition feature, which would be an integrated programmable sample sensor speaker unit that had voice recognizers to record the user's voice and change functionalities accordingly. It was agreed that the interface should be simple with important features.

which can control features like the colour, colour of the picture, the contrast, sharpness, brightness of the picture. Now there should be a memory switch. There should be a mute button. Suddenly if if if uh uh viewer he gets a telephone call, and if he want he doesn't want to switch off the uh T_V_, but he he can reduce the sound, he can bring the volume down and he can watch {disfmarker} he can uh {disfmarker} while talking he can watch the T_V_. Now the most important feature I would like to have in my remote would be the speech recognition feature. It's an integrated progra programmable sample sensor speaker unit. So a remote can be th can be uh designed which can have the voice recognisers, you can record your own voiceProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: which can be recognised by as voice recogniser in the television, for example, if you want to see {disfmarker} we if you want to see the ninth channel if you say just say ninth channel, uh th now the the {disfmarker} uh yeah, the remote will {disfmarker} automatically it will switch to the ninth channel.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So the T_V_ will have some recogniser which will recognise the user's voice and accordingly it will change its functionalities.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So this is one of the very important feature a remote control can have. So this is one one of the interface which can be created.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: A very simple interface which has all the t uh uh important features.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, please, next slide.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, these are some of the remotes which are different in shape and colour, but they have many buttons.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: So uh sometimes the three. Yes. Okay.Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: Now as an interface designer, I would give more emphasis on the interface, how the remote looks like so that it is sellable, it is attractive to customers. Next, please. Okay. Now the function of a remote is to send messages to the television. This messages could be uh switch on-off message or switch to next channel message or swapping the channels or switching onto a particular channel, like you can have the numbers one, two, three, four, up to nine.Project Manager: Nine what Nine channel uh switchesUser Interface: Pardon meProject Manager: Nine channel switches Is {disfmarker} Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: Yes, nine numbers. And then you have swapping of uh buttonProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: by which {disfmarker} using which you can swap the channels if you don't want to see the third channel you can swap it to the fourth channel or vice versa. Then it should have a next button, and next button channel by which you can keep on uh v uh mm eh scrolling the channels one by one.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Going to the nex next.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Next slide, please.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then you should have a button which should which ca which can be used for increasing or decreasing the volume.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, there should be a button which can give subtitles for a particular program which is going on a television. For example, if you are watching a French program and you would like to have a subtitles in English, then there should be a channel which can trigger this mechanism in the television so that the user can see uh the {gap} the subtitles on the screen.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then there should d uh there should be some buttons Project Manager: Okay. Hello everyone. {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Hi.User Interface: Hi.Marketing: Hi.Project Manager: Um how uh how we doingIndustrial Designer: Yeah, good.Project Manager: Uh first we going uh over the minutes of the last meeting, more or less.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um in the last meeting uh the marketing manager had presented uh her method of working, meaning gathering i suggestions from everyone to see how she best could market uh this this product at the {disfmarker} within the budget uh that was given. Uh in general {vocalsound} the idea is that it should be something that is not difficult to use. Um it's also an item that people lose a lot. So we should address that. And, of course, it should be something s s that is very simple to use. In addition to that to make it sell, of course, uh the marketing manager w wishes that it be very attractive,Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or like she says put some sizzle into it in one way or another so that the people are buying it now because, in particular with smaller items, that's a very important fact,'cause um if they say, well, I go home and think about it, that won't work. Um also mentioned was it should be uh {disfmarker} it should have a very short learning curve. And maybe it could be sold by using a slogan.Industrial Designer: Hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Our technical manager has then said that she feels it should have a chipMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: that has infra-red bits and it has an interface controls w interface that controls the chip. Therefore, messages uh will be controlled in the same manner. There should be extra features like lid buttons, maybe a beep. If too many buttons are pressed, mm uh uh child lock um and get out their Christmas item. And we should develop one or two features we can really dwell on in our ad campaign. If we try to tell people it has too many great features, um the consumer just gets confused and we don't get anywhere. So we've gotta narrow our selection down to {vocalsound} li {vocalsound} two things, I think, that we gonna say are really great about our our our new product. And I've been looking around um at what designs {disfmarker} every year different things are popular. And in my research this year I found out that fruit and vegetable shapes are really popular. And people are tired of hard plastic and hard metal. They are more back into soft feel, spongy feeling things, things with maybe a little cloth on them. So those are things maybe we wanna look at as far as saleability of the item.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh that concludes the presentation of everyone. And what we really have to decide in this meeting is um the concept of the remote.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: And uh so what do we think on the conceptMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: of the remote {vocalsound}Marketing: You wanna try to come back to yours, and limit yours a bitProject Manager: Y {vocalsound}User Interface: Uh yes, I would like to include this feature which is called as voice recogniser.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Okay. Mm-hmm. {vocalsound}Marketing: Okay.Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Marketing: So speech recognition is most important as far as you're concernedUser Interface: This could be uh one feature which could be sellable.Industrial Designer: Yeah, but wMarketing: Yeah h that could that could that could be our star feature.Project Manager: I think that's {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: That that {gap} be really good, yeah, I agree with that.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Yeah, but but have a lot of time left and we will still have to make a decision, and the marketing expert has to present her her thing.Marketing: {vocalsound} Okay. Go right to my first {disfmarker} my next slide.Project Manager: Uh okay.Marketing: Um alright, my method is uh {disfmarker} I'm interested in what the competition is doing, and wanna see how we can make ourselves different from the competition, so I've really been looking at the press and the ads that are out there for other remote controllers. I s I {vocalsound} spend a lot of time on the internet um surfing around doing the same thing. And then when I'm out um in people's houses or at meetings or anything like that, I try to notice what kind of remote controls people have, and if it's convenient in the conversation I ask about it. And I would encourage you all to do the same. Um and my findings from this is that, you know, small is beautiful. Um people like something that really fits in their hand.User Interface:'Kay.Marketing: Simple is beautiful. They don't want to have to squint at small print um, they want buttons whose functions are obvious, and they want um as few buttons as possible, and they don't {vocalsound} care for the mode thing. They want each button to do something. And eye-catching is important. It's gotta look cute, it's gotta look appealing. Go ahead, I'm trying to finish fast for you. Um {vocalsound} and our preference is, as far as I'm concerned, are we got to get to the market before the competition. Ours has to be {disfmarker} look really great and it has to come out before the others, so that we have a leg up on time to sell it and push it before other people

What did the team think about the slides with different types of the interface during the discussion of the interface design

The interfaces shown on the slides were a remote that had voice recognizer with multi-purpose use such as for TV and cable-satellite, a simple and compact one that a child can use and could play with it and a big oversized remote that cannot be misplaced. The team agreed that the T-shaped design and the children-friendly interface were nice but the over-big one was not ideal.

which can control features like the colour, colour of the picture, the contrast, sharpness, brightness of the picture. Now there should be a memory switch. There should be a mute button. Suddenly if if if uh uh viewer he gets a telephone call, and if he want he doesn't want to switch off the uh T_V_, but he he can reduce the sound, he can bring the volume down and he can watch {disfmarker} he can uh {disfmarker} while talking he can watch the T_V_. Now the most important feature I would like to have in my remote would be the speech recognition feature. It's an integrated progra programmable sample sensor speaker unit. So a remote can be th can be uh designed which can have the voice recognisers, you can record your own voiceProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: which can be recognised by as voice recogniser in the television, for example, if you want to see {disfmarker} we if you want to see the ninth channel if you say just say ninth channel, uh th now the the {disfmarker} uh yeah, the remote will {disfmarker} automatically it will switch to the ninth channel.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So the T_V_ will have some recogniser which will recognise the user's voice and accordingly it will change its functionalities.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So this is one of the very important feature a remote control can have. So this is one one of the interface which can be created.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: A very simple interface which has all the t uh uh important features.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, please, next slide.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, these are some of the remotes which are different in shape and colour, but they have many buttons.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: So uh sometimes the three. Yes. Okay.Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: Now as an interface designer, I would give more emphasis on the interface, how the remote looks like so that it is sellable, it is attractive to customers. Next, please. Okay. Now the function of a remote is to send messages to the television. This messages could be uh switch on-off message or switch to next channel message or swapping the channels or switching onto a particular channel, like you can have the numbers one, two, three, four, up to nine.Project Manager: Nine what Nine channel uh switchesUser Interface: Pardon meProject Manager: Nine channel switches Is {disfmarker} Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: Yes, nine numbers. And then you have swapping of uh buttonProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: by which {disfmarker} using which you can swap the channels if you don't want to see the third channel you can swap it to the fourth channel or vice versa. Then it should have a next button, and next button channel by which you can keep on uh v uh mm eh scrolling the channels one by one.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Going to the nex next.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Next slide, please.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then you should have a button which should which ca which can be used for increasing or decreasing the volume.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, there should be a button which can give subtitles for a particular program which is going on a television. For example, if you are watching a French program and you would like to have a subtitles in English, then there should be a channel which can trigger this mechanism in the television so that the user can see uh the {gap} the subtitles on the screen.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then there should d uh there should be some buttons Project Manager: Okay. Hello everyone. {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Hi.User Interface: Hi.Marketing: Hi.Project Manager: Um how uh how we doingIndustrial Designer: Yeah, good.Project Manager: Uh first we going uh over the minutes of the last meeting, more or less.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um in the last meeting uh the marketing manager had presented uh her method of working, meaning gathering i suggestions from everyone to see how she best could market uh this this product at the {disfmarker} within the budget uh that was given. Uh in general {vocalsound} the idea is that it should be something that is not difficult to use. Um it's also an item that people lose a lot. So we should address that. And, of course, it should be something s s that is very simple to use. In addition to that to make it sell, of course, uh the marketing manager w wishes that it be very attractive,Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or like she says put some sizzle into it in one way or another so that the people are buying it now because, in particular with smaller items, that's a very important fact,'cause um if they say, well, I go home and think about it, that won't work. Um also mentioned was it should be uh {disfmarker} it should have a very short learning curve. And maybe it could be sold by using a slogan.Industrial Designer: Hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Our technical manager has then said that she feels it should have a chipMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: that has infra-red bits and it has an interface controls w interface that controls the chip. Therefore, messages uh will be controlled in the same manner. There should be extra features like lid buttons, maybe a beep. If too many buttons are pressed, mm uh uh child lock um and such interface which can be created. {vocalsound} And the personal preference {vocalsound} uh would be a spe uh uh to incorporate speech recognisers uh which will respond to user's voice for a particular uh function.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Right.User Interface: Thank you, that's {disfmarker}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Okay, thank you very much. Uh any comments on uh her presentationMarketing: Well, um looks like we still have quite a choice of things out there.Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Um what uh {vocalsound} I'm {disfmarker} No suggestion's bad.User Interface: Mm yes.Marketing: But uh we're gonna have to narrow it down a little more. I don't think that we can get uh {disfmarker} The T-shape is good, the child one is good, the too big to misplace, I think it's just funny.User Interface: Okay. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} Um I don't think that's gonna be our impulse purchase at the checkout counter.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Yeah, I I th I think {disfmarker}User Interface: Okay. {gap} {vocalsound}Marketing: It's it's gonna be a little bit too unwieldy.User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: No, I think the these are her presentations, but uh as far as the decision making we getting to that after afterMarketing: Yeah mm. Mm-hmm. Have to come back to that later. Okay.User Interface: We can.Project Manager: but if {disfmarker} I just wanted to know whether anybody had any any anything to add to her presentation.Marketing: No, I think her presentation was good, and she really explored all the options. Yeah.Project Manager: Mm right. Mm-hmm. Ho who wants to go next um Mm-hmm. Okay,Industrial Designer: Yeah, maybe.Project Manager: and you {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Participant two.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh okay.Industrial Designer: Uh the next one, sorry.Project Manager: Oops.Industrial Designer: It's it was the old one.Project Manager: The components design.Industrial Designer: Components.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Okay.Industrial Designer: Um this time I'm I'm going to have a lot of time left and we will still have to make a decision, and the marketing expert has to present her her thing.Marketing: {vocalsound} Okay. Go right to my first {disfmarker} my next slide.Project Manager: Uh okay.Marketing: Um alright, my method is uh {disfmarker} I'm interested in what the competition is doing, and wanna see how we can make ourselves different from the competition, so I've really been looking at the press and the ads that are out there for other remote controllers. I s I {vocalsound} spend a lot of time on the internet um surfing around doing the same thing. And then when I'm out um in people's houses or at meetings or anything like that, I try to notice what kind of remote controls people have, and if it's convenient in the conversation I ask about it. And I would encourage you all to do the same. Um and my findings from this is that, you know, small is beautiful. Um people like something that really fits in their hand.User Interface:'Kay.Marketing: Simple is beautiful. They don't want to have to squint at small print um, they want buttons whose functions are obvious, and they want um as few buttons as possible, and they don't {vocalsound} care for the mode thing. They want each button to do something. And eye-catching is important. It's gotta look cute, it's gotta look appealing. Go ahead, I'm trying to finish fast for you. Um {vocalsound} and our preference is, as far as I'm concerned, are we got to get to the market before the competition. Ours has to be {disfmarker} look really great and it has to come out before the others, so that we have a leg up on time to sell it and push it before other people

What were the components discussed during the presentation of the component design that were required for the construction of the remote control

There should be a strong and recyclable case that was not made from harmful materials such as plastic. A resistor, capacitor, diode, transistor, circuit board and resonator should be in the remote, along with a timer and alarm facility. The integrated circuit could be highly sophisticated for higher efficiency and should be resistant to high and low temperatures. Also, colouring components could be used if the remote was to have different colours. For the battery, it could be rechargeable as people can use it for a long time and saves costs for production.

three. Yes. Okay.Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: Now as an interface designer, I would give more emphasis on the interface, how the remote looks like so that it is sellable, it is attractive to customers. Next, please. Okay. Now the function of a remote is to send messages to the television. This messages could be uh switch on-off message or switch to next channel message or swapping the channels or switching onto a particular channel, like you can have the numbers one, two, three, four, up to nine.Project Manager: Nine what Nine channel uh switchesUser Interface: Pardon meProject Manager: Nine channel switches Is {disfmarker} Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: Yes, nine numbers. And then you have swapping of uh buttonProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: by which {disfmarker} using which you can swap the channels if you don't want to see the third channel you can swap it to the fourth channel or vice versa. Then it should have a next button, and next button channel by which you can keep on uh v uh mm eh scrolling the channels one by one.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Going to the nex next.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Next slide, please.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then you should have a button which should which ca which can be used for increasing or decreasing the volume.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, there should be a button which can give subtitles for a particular program which is going on a television. For example, if you are watching a French program and you would like to have a subtitles in English, then there should be a channel which can trigger this mechanism in the television so that the user can see uh the {gap} the subtitles on the screen.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then there should d uh there should be some buttons which can control features like the colour, colour of the picture, the contrast, sharpness, brightness of the picture. Now there should be a memory switch. There should be a mute button. Suddenly if if if uh uh viewer he gets a telephone call, and if he want he doesn't want to switch off the uh T_V_, but he he can reduce the sound, he can bring the volume down and he can watch {disfmarker} he can uh {disfmarker} while talking he can watch the T_V_. Now the most important feature I would like to have in my remote would be the speech recognition feature. It's an integrated progra programmable sample sensor speaker unit. So a remote can be th can be uh designed which can have the voice recognisers, you can record your own voiceProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: which can be recognised by as voice recogniser in the television, for example, if you want to see {disfmarker} we if you want to see the ninth channel if you say just say ninth channel, uh th now the the {disfmarker} uh yeah, the remote will {disfmarker} automatically it will switch to the ninth channel.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So the T_V_ will have some recogniser which will recognise the user's voice and accordingly it will change its functionalities.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So this is one of the very important feature a remote control can have. So this is one one of the interface which can be created.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: A very simple interface which has all the t uh uh important features.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, please, next slide.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, these are some of the remotes which are different in shape and colour, but they have many buttons.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: So uh sometimes the have a lot of time left and we will still have to make a decision, and the marketing expert has to present her her thing.Marketing: {vocalsound} Okay. Go right to my first {disfmarker} my next slide.Project Manager: Uh okay.Marketing: Um alright, my method is uh {disfmarker} I'm interested in what the competition is doing, and wanna see how we can make ourselves different from the competition, so I've really been looking at the press and the ads that are out there for other remote controllers. I s I {vocalsound} spend a lot of time on the internet um surfing around doing the same thing. And then when I'm out um in people's houses or at meetings or anything like that, I try to notice what kind of remote controls people have, and if it's convenient in the conversation I ask about it. And I would encourage you all to do the same. Um and my findings from this is that, you know, small is beautiful. Um people like something that really fits in their hand.User Interface:'Kay.Marketing: Simple is beautiful. They don't want to have to squint at small print um, they want buttons whose functions are obvious, and they want um as few buttons as possible, and they don't {vocalsound} care for the mode thing. They want each button to do something. And eye-catching is important. It's gotta look cute, it's gotta look appealing. Go ahead, I'm trying to finish fast for you. Um {vocalsound} and our preference is, as far as I'm concerned, are we got to get to the market before the competition. Ours has to be {disfmarker} look really great and it has to come out before the others, so that we have a leg up on time to sell it and push it before other people Project Manager: Okay. Hello everyone. {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Hi.User Interface: Hi.Marketing: Hi.Project Manager: Um how uh how we doingIndustrial Designer: Yeah, good.Project Manager: Uh first we going uh over the minutes of the last meeting, more or less.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um in the last meeting uh the marketing manager had presented uh her method of working, meaning gathering i suggestions from everyone to see how she best could market uh this this product at the {disfmarker} within the budget uh that was given. Uh in general {vocalsound} the idea is that it should be something that is not difficult to use. Um it's also an item that people lose a lot. So we should address that. And, of course, it should be something s s that is very simple to use. In addition to that to make it sell, of course, uh the marketing manager w wishes that it be very attractive,Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or like she says put some sizzle into it in one way or another so that the people are buying it now because, in particular with smaller items, that's a very important fact,'cause um if they say, well, I go home and think about it, that won't work. Um also mentioned was it should be uh {disfmarker} it should have a very short learning curve. And maybe it could be sold by using a slogan.Industrial Designer: Hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Our technical manager has then said that she feels it should have a chipMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: that has infra-red bits and it has an interface controls w interface that controls the chip. Therefore, messages uh will be controlled in the same manner. There should be extra features like lid buttons, maybe a beep. If too many buttons are pressed, mm uh uh child lock um and such interface which can be created. {vocalsound} And the personal preference {vocalsound} uh would be a spe uh uh to incorporate speech recognisers uh which will respond to user's voice for a particular uh function.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Right.User Interface: Thank you, that's {disfmarker}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Okay, thank you very much. Uh any comments on uh her presentationMarketing: Well, um looks like we still have quite a choice of things out there.Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Um what uh {vocalsound} I'm {disfmarker} No suggestion's bad.User Interface: Mm yes.Marketing: But uh we're gonna have to narrow it down a little more. I don't think that we can get uh {disfmarker} The T-shape is good, the child one is good, the too big to misplace, I think it's just funny.User Interface: Okay. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} Um I don't think that's gonna be our impulse purchase at the checkout counter.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Yeah, I I th I think {disfmarker}User Interface: Okay. {gap} {vocalsound}Marketing: It's it's gonna be a little bit too unwieldy.User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: No, I think the these are her presentations, but uh as far as the decision making we getting to that after afterMarketing: Yeah mm. Mm-hmm. Have to come back to that later. Okay.User Interface: We can.Project Manager: but if {disfmarker} I just wanted to know whether anybody had any any anything to add to her presentation.Marketing: No, I think her presentation was good, and she really explored all the options. Yeah.Project Manager: Mm right. Mm-hmm. Ho who wants to go next um Mm-hmm. Okay,Industrial Designer: Yeah, maybe.Project Manager: and you {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Participant two.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh okay.Industrial Designer: Uh the next one, sorry.Project Manager: Oops.Industrial Designer: It's it was the old one.Project Manager: The components design.Industrial Designer: Components.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Okay.Industrial Designer: Um this time I'm I'm going to

What did Industrial Designer say about the working design of the remote during the discussion of the component design

When a button was pressed, a small circuit underneath the button would send signals through the wires to the chip. The chip would know which button was pressed and produce a morse code signal specific to that button, which the transistor would amplify the signal. The LED would receive the signal and translate it into infrared light. The sensor on the TV would receive the infrared light which contained the signals and would react accordingly.

three. Yes. Okay.Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: Now as an interface designer, I would give more emphasis on the interface, how the remote looks like so that it is sellable, it is attractive to customers. Next, please. Okay. Now the function of a remote is to send messages to the television. This messages could be uh switch on-off message or switch to next channel message or swapping the channels or switching onto a particular channel, like you can have the numbers one, two, three, four, up to nine.Project Manager: Nine what Nine channel uh switchesUser Interface: Pardon meProject Manager: Nine channel switches Is {disfmarker} Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: Yes, nine numbers. And then you have swapping of uh buttonProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: by which {disfmarker} using which you can swap the channels if you don't want to see the third channel you can swap it to the fourth channel or vice versa. Then it should have a next button, and next button channel by which you can keep on uh v uh mm eh scrolling the channels one by one.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Going to the nex next.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Next slide, please.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then you should have a button which should which ca which can be used for increasing or decreasing the volume.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, there should be a button which can give subtitles for a particular program which is going on a television. For example, if you are watching a French program and you would like to have a subtitles in English, then there should be a channel which can trigger this mechanism in the television so that the user can see uh the {gap} the subtitles on the screen.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then there should d uh there should be some buttons is a normal remote controller. And {gap} to the next slide, please.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: And where we had a a few buttons and all. And uh if you open the remote controller you have this circui circuit board and few electronic components,Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: like you can see a chip there which is having eighteen pins,Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: and also a capac uh a capacitor, three resistors and also a resonator uh um mm {disfmarker} yeah, and di and a diode transistor.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: The electronic components {disfmarker} uh all of the electronic components have all those uh things like a chip and d {vocalsound} diode transistors an Yeah, di um can y uh you can see the T_A_ double one eight three five labelled uh chip um.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Mm yes.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Yes.Industrial Designer: Uh you can also see the uh uh the green {disfmarker} two green things are uh these are {disfmarker} they are {disfmarker} they are resistors,User Interface: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: and uh just beside that you can see a transistor, and a uh uh cylinder shape, uh that one is a capacitor. Uh and also there are uh {vocalsound} um resistors {disfmarker} uh sorry, ther there is a diode.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Can you go {disfmarker} go on to the next slide.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: So uh this is the circuit board. The green one is a circuit board. Actually, uh building a circuit bo board is pretty pretty uh easy and also it's a it's a l l inexpensive. Uh it's it costs less than what you print on a paper, because uh {vocalsound} uh when you {disfmarker} when you are building uh some circuits {disfmarker} some um uh circuits and also wires, it's it's better to go for printing, because Project Manager: Okay. Hello everyone. {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Hi.User Interface: Hi.Marketing: Hi.Project Manager: Um how uh how we doingIndustrial Designer: Yeah, good.Project Manager: Uh first we going uh over the minutes of the last meeting, more or less.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um in the last meeting uh the marketing manager had presented uh her method of working, meaning gathering i suggestions from everyone to see how she best could market uh this this product at the {disfmarker} within the budget uh that was given. Uh in general {vocalsound} the idea is that it should be something that is not difficult to use. Um it's also an item that people lose a lot. So we should address that. And, of course, it should be something s s that is very simple to use. In addition to that to make it sell, of course, uh the marketing manager w wishes that it be very attractive,Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or like she says put some sizzle into it in one way or another so that the people are buying it now because, in particular with smaller items, that's a very important fact,'cause um if they say, well, I go home and think about it, that won't work. Um also mentioned was it should be uh {disfmarker} it should have a very short learning curve. And maybe it could be sold by using a slogan.Industrial Designer: Hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Our technical manager has then said that she feels it should have a chipMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: that has infra-red bits and it has an interface controls w interface that controls the chip. Therefore, messages uh will be controlled in the same manner. There should be extra features like lid buttons, maybe a beep. If too many buttons are pressed, mm uh uh child lock um and which can control features like the colour, colour of the picture, the contrast, sharpness, brightness of the picture. Now there should be a memory switch. There should be a mute button. Suddenly if if if uh uh viewer he gets a telephone call, and if he want he doesn't want to switch off the uh T_V_, but he he can reduce the sound, he can bring the volume down and he can watch {disfmarker} he can uh {disfmarker} while talking he can watch the T_V_. Now the most important feature I would like to have in my remote would be the speech recognition feature. It's an integrated progra programmable sample sensor speaker unit. So a remote can be th can be uh designed which can have the voice recognisers, you can record your own voiceProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: which can be recognised by as voice recogniser in the television, for example, if you want to see {disfmarker} we if you want to see the ninth channel if you say just say ninth channel, uh th now the the {disfmarker} uh yeah, the remote will {disfmarker} automatically it will switch to the ninth channel.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So the T_V_ will have some recogniser which will recognise the user's voice and accordingly it will change its functionalities.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So this is one of the very important feature a remote control can have. So this is one one of the interface which can be created.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: A very simple interface which has all the t uh uh important features.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, please, next slide.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, these are some of the remotes which are different in shape and colour, but they have many buttons.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: So uh sometimes the uh maybe a display clock so that people could um {disfmarker} you could see the time, you know, what show they want to watch. Also mentioned was uh maybe different shapes. So the components of the thing should be button, bulbs, infra infra-red bulbs, battery, chips, wires, and maybe some kind of a holder uh for the for the uh item. Francino who is our umUser Interface: Interface designer.Project Manager: interface designer um uh has mentioned that the {disfmarker} that it, of course, should have an on-off button, and also has mentioned an interesting feature that it should have maybe a channel lock. Particularly with maybe small children that they couldn't uh watch a channel that is undesirable. It should be compact. Her personal favourite was it should be T-shaped. And maybe have an anar alarm-clock. And the material should possibly be not of non-allergic nature. Uh the different systems uh that exist are infra-red or radio-waves. Uh maybe it should have uh electri electrici electricity saving feature.Marketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: And {vocalsound} even possibly a timer to {disfmarker} so that people can program {vocalsound} their favourite uh uh program on th right from the remote.User Interface: Yes.Project Manager: Uh are we all in agreement that that's about what we discussed last time Okay.User Interface: Yes.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah, I think that pretty much is it. Yeah. Mm-hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Okay, then we {disfmarker} I'm looking for three presentations. And uh I don't know whether the order matters much uh, I don't I don't think so, so whoever w wants {disfmarker}User Interface: Okay, I can start first.Project Manager: Yeah, okay.User Interface: Okay. Now my slide, please. {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay, your slides. Okay. Oh, come on, close already.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: And that's number two, rightUser Interface: Three.Project Manager: Three.User Interface: Participant

What was agreed by the team about the component design

It was agreed that the circuit board would be printed in bulk as it would be cheaper with no wires and both regular and advanced chips could be made on print, including the infrared sender. A scroll wheel, presented as an alternative to push buttons, required a more sophisticated chip, making it more costly than push buttons, which require a regular chip. Hence, the team agreed to have push buttons to save cost. On the other hand, the case would be bright, colourful and strong with a trendy design. The battery was foreseen to be the energy source of the remote.

three. Yes. Okay.Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: Now as an interface designer, I would give more emphasis on the interface, how the remote looks like so that it is sellable, it is attractive to customers. Next, please. Okay. Now the function of a remote is to send messages to the television. This messages could be uh switch on-off message or switch to next channel message or swapping the channels or switching onto a particular channel, like you can have the numbers one, two, three, four, up to nine.Project Manager: Nine what Nine channel uh switchesUser Interface: Pardon meProject Manager: Nine channel switches Is {disfmarker} Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: Yes, nine numbers. And then you have swapping of uh buttonProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: by which {disfmarker} using which you can swap the channels if you don't want to see the third channel you can swap it to the fourth channel or vice versa. Then it should have a next button, and next button channel by which you can keep on uh v uh mm eh scrolling the channels one by one.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Going to the nex next.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Next slide, please.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then you should have a button which should which ca which can be used for increasing or decreasing the volume.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, there should be a button which can give subtitles for a particular program which is going on a television. For example, if you are watching a French program and you would like to have a subtitles in English, then there should be a channel which can trigger this mechanism in the television so that the user can see uh the {gap} the subtitles on the screen.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then there should d uh there should be some buttons is a normal remote controller. And {gap} to the next slide, please.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: And where we had a a few buttons and all. And uh if you open the remote controller you have this circui circuit board and few electronic components,Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: like you can see a chip there which is having eighteen pins,Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: and also a capac uh a capacitor, three resistors and also a resonator uh um mm {disfmarker} yeah, and di and a diode transistor.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: The electronic components {disfmarker} uh all of the electronic components have all those uh things like a chip and d {vocalsound} diode transistors an Yeah, di um can y uh you can see the T_A_ double one eight three five labelled uh chip um.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Mm yes.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Yes.Industrial Designer: Uh you can also see the uh uh the green {disfmarker} two green things are uh these are {disfmarker} they are {disfmarker} they are resistors,User Interface: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: and uh just beside that you can see a transistor, and a uh uh cylinder shape, uh that one is a capacitor. Uh and also there are uh {vocalsound} um resistors {disfmarker} uh sorry, ther there is a diode.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Can you go {disfmarker} go on to the next slide.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: So uh this is the circuit board. The green one is a circuit board. Actually, uh building a circuit bo board is pretty pretty uh easy and also it's a it's a l l inexpensive. Uh it's it costs less than what you print on a paper, because uh {vocalsound} uh when you {disfmarker} when you are building uh some circuits {disfmarker} some um uh circuits and also wires, it's it's better to go for printing, because which can control features like the colour, colour of the picture, the contrast, sharpness, brightness of the picture. Now there should be a memory switch. There should be a mute button. Suddenly if if if uh uh viewer he gets a telephone call, and if he want he doesn't want to switch off the uh T_V_, but he he can reduce the sound, he can bring the volume down and he can watch {disfmarker} he can uh {disfmarker} while talking he can watch the T_V_. Now the most important feature I would like to have in my remote would be the speech recognition feature. It's an integrated progra programmable sample sensor speaker unit. So a remote can be th can be uh designed which can have the voice recognisers, you can record your own voiceProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: which can be recognised by as voice recogniser in the television, for example, if you want to see {disfmarker} we if you want to see the ninth channel if you say just say ninth channel, uh th now the the {disfmarker} uh yeah, the remote will {disfmarker} automatically it will switch to the ninth channel.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So the T_V_ will have some recogniser which will recognise the user's voice and accordingly it will change its functionalities.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So this is one of the very important feature a remote control can have. So this is one one of the interface which can be created.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: A very simple interface which has all the t uh uh important features.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, please, next slide.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, these are some of the remotes which are different in shape and colour, but they have many buttons.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: So uh sometimes the Project Manager: Okay. Hello everyone. {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Hi.User Interface: Hi.Marketing: Hi.Project Manager: Um how uh how we doingIndustrial Designer: Yeah, good.Project Manager: Uh first we going uh over the minutes of the last meeting, more or less.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um in the last meeting uh the marketing manager had presented uh her method of working, meaning gathering i suggestions from everyone to see how she best could market uh this this product at the {disfmarker} within the budget uh that was given. Uh in general {vocalsound} the idea is that it should be something that is not difficult to use. Um it's also an item that people lose a lot. So we should address that. And, of course, it should be something s s that is very simple to use. In addition to that to make it sell, of course, uh the marketing manager w wishes that it be very attractive,Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or like she says put some sizzle into it in one way or another so that the people are buying it now because, in particular with smaller items, that's a very important fact,'cause um if they say, well, I go home and think about it, that won't work. Um also mentioned was it should be uh {disfmarker} it should have a very short learning curve. And maybe it could be sold by using a slogan.Industrial Designer: Hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Our technical manager has then said that she feels it should have a chipMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: that has infra-red bits and it has an interface controls w interface that controls the chip. Therefore, messages uh will be controlled in the same manner. There should be extra features like lid buttons, maybe a beep. If too many buttons are pressed, mm uh uh child lock um and such interface which can be created. {vocalsound} And the personal preference {vocalsound} uh would be a spe uh uh to incorporate speech recognisers uh which will respond to user's voice for a particular uh function.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Right.User Interface: Thank you, that's {disfmarker}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Okay, thank you very much. Uh any comments on uh her presentationMarketing: Well, um looks like we still have quite a choice of things out there.Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Um what uh {vocalsound} I'm {disfmarker} No suggestion's bad.User Interface: Mm yes.Marketing: But uh we're gonna have to narrow it down a little more. I don't think that we can get uh {disfmarker} The T-shape is good, the child one is good, the too big to misplace, I think it's just funny.User Interface: Okay. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} Um I don't think that's gonna be our impulse purchase at the checkout counter.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Yeah, I I th I think {disfmarker}User Interface: Okay. {gap} {vocalsound}Marketing: It's it's gonna be a little bit too unwieldy.User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: No, I think the these are her presentations, but uh as far as the decision making we getting to that after afterMarketing: Yeah mm. Mm-hmm. Have to come back to that later. Okay.User Interface: We can.Project Manager: but if {disfmarker} I just wanted to know whether anybody had any any anything to add to her presentation.Marketing: No, I think her presentation was good, and she really explored all the options. Yeah.Project Manager: Mm right. Mm-hmm. Ho who wants to go next um Mm-hmm. Okay,Industrial Designer: Yeah, maybe.Project Manager: and you {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Participant two.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh okay.Industrial Designer: Uh the next one, sorry.Project Manager: Oops.Industrial Designer: It's it was the old one.Project Manager: The components design.Industrial Designer: Components.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Okay.Industrial Designer: Um this time I'm I'm going to

What was left open to discuss about the component design

Materials could be made from plastic, rubber or wood and the remote could be in different cases. Speech recognition was pending for more research on how much it cost. In addition, there were doubts from Industrial Designer on this feature as there might be trouble in recognizing different voices.

Project Manager: Okay. Hello everyone. {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Hi.User Interface: Hi.Marketing: Hi.Project Manager: Um how uh how we doingIndustrial Designer: Yeah, good.Project Manager: Uh first we going uh over the minutes of the last meeting, more or less.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um in the last meeting uh the marketing manager had presented uh her method of working, meaning gathering i suggestions from everyone to see how she best could market uh this this product at the {disfmarker} within the budget uh that was given. Uh in general {vocalsound} the idea is that it should be something that is not difficult to use. Um it's also an item that people lose a lot. So we should address that. And, of course, it should be something s s that is very simple to use. In addition to that to make it sell, of course, uh the marketing manager w wishes that it be very attractive,Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or like she says put some sizzle into it in one way or another so that the people are buying it now because, in particular with smaller items, that's a very important fact,'cause um if they say, well, I go home and think about it, that won't work. Um also mentioned was it should be uh {disfmarker} it should have a very short learning curve. And maybe it could be sold by using a slogan.Industrial Designer: Hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Our technical manager has then said that she feels it should have a chipMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: that has infra-red bits and it has an interface controls w interface that controls the chip. Therefore, messages uh will be controlled in the same manner. There should be extra features like lid buttons, maybe a beep. If too many buttons are pressed, mm uh uh child lock um and have a lot of time left and we will still have to make a decision, and the marketing expert has to present her her thing.Marketing: {vocalsound} Okay. Go right to my first {disfmarker} my next slide.Project Manager: Uh okay.Marketing: Um alright, my method is uh {disfmarker} I'm interested in what the competition is doing, and wanna see how we can make ourselves different from the competition, so I've really been looking at the press and the ads that are out there for other remote controllers. I s I {vocalsound} spend a lot of time on the internet um surfing around doing the same thing. And then when I'm out um in people's houses or at meetings or anything like that, I try to notice what kind of remote controls people have, and if it's convenient in the conversation I ask about it. And I would encourage you all to do the same. Um and my findings from this is that, you know, small is beautiful. Um people like something that really fits in their hand.User Interface:'Kay.Marketing: Simple is beautiful. They don't want to have to squint at small print um, they want buttons whose functions are obvious, and they want um as few buttons as possible, and they don't {vocalsound} care for the mode thing. They want each button to do something. And eye-catching is important. It's gotta look cute, it's gotta look appealing. Go ahead, I'm trying to finish fast for you. Um {vocalsound} and our preference is, as far as I'm concerned, are we got to get to the market before the competition. Ours has to be {disfmarker} look really great and it has to come out before the others, so that we have a leg up on time to sell it and push it before other people uh maybe a display clock so that people could um {disfmarker} you could see the time, you know, what show they want to watch. Also mentioned was uh maybe different shapes. So the components of the thing should be button, bulbs, infra infra-red bulbs, battery, chips, wires, and maybe some kind of a holder uh for the for the uh item. Francino who is our umUser Interface: Interface designer.Project Manager: interface designer um uh has mentioned that the {disfmarker} that it, of course, should have an on-off button, and also has mentioned an interesting feature that it should have maybe a channel lock. Particularly with maybe small children that they couldn't uh watch a channel that is undesirable. It should be compact. Her personal favourite was it should be T-shaped. And maybe have an anar alarm-clock. And the material should possibly be not of non-allergic nature. Uh the different systems uh that exist are infra-red or radio-waves. Uh maybe it should have uh electri electrici electricity saving feature.Marketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: And {vocalsound} even possibly a timer to {disfmarker} so that people can program {vocalsound} their favourite uh uh program on th right from the remote.User Interface: Yes.Project Manager: Uh are we all in agreement that that's about what we discussed last time Okay.User Interface: Yes.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah, I think that pretty much is it. Yeah. Mm-hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Okay, then we {disfmarker} I'm looking for three presentations. And uh I don't know whether the order matters much uh, I don't I don't think so, so whoever w wants {disfmarker}User Interface: Okay, I can start first.Project Manager: Yeah, okay.User Interface: Okay. Now my slide, please. {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay, your slides. Okay. Oh, come on, close already.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: And that's number two, rightUser Interface: Three.Project Manager: Three.User Interface: Participant three. Yes. Okay.Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: Now as an interface designer, I would give more emphasis on the interface, how the remote looks like so that it is sellable, it is attractive to customers. Next, please. Okay. Now the function of a remote is to send messages to the television. This messages could be uh switch on-off message or switch to next channel message or swapping the channels or switching onto a particular channel, like you can have the numbers one, two, three, four, up to nine.Project Manager: Nine what Nine channel uh switchesUser Interface: Pardon meProject Manager: Nine channel switches Is {disfmarker} Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: Yes, nine numbers. And then you have swapping of uh buttonProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: by which {disfmarker} using which you can swap the channels if you don't want to see the third channel you can swap it to the fourth channel or vice versa. Then it should have a next button, and next button channel by which you can keep on uh v uh mm eh scrolling the channels one by one.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Going to the nex next.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Next slide, please.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then you should have a button which should which ca which can be used for increasing or decreasing the volume.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, there should be a button which can give subtitles for a particular program which is going on a television. For example, if you are watching a French program and you would like to have a subtitles in English, then there should be a channel which can trigger this mechanism in the television so that the user can see uh the {gap} the subtitles on the screen.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then there should d uh there should be some buttons such interface which can be created. {vocalsound} And the personal preference {vocalsound} uh would be a spe uh uh to incorporate speech recognisers uh which will respond to user's voice for a particular uh function.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Right.User Interface: Thank you, that's {disfmarker}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Okay, thank you very much. Uh any comments on uh her presentationMarketing: Well, um looks like we still have quite a choice of things out there.Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Um what uh {vocalsound} I'm {disfmarker} No suggestion's bad.User Interface: Mm yes.Marketing: But uh we're gonna have to narrow it down a little more. I don't think that we can get uh {disfmarker} The T-shape is good, the child one is good, the too big to misplace, I think it's just funny.User Interface: Okay. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} Um I don't think that's gonna be our impulse purchase at the checkout counter.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Yeah, I I th I think {disfmarker}User Interface: Okay. {gap} {vocalsound}Marketing: It's it's gonna be a little bit too unwieldy.User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: No, I think the these are her presentations, but uh as far as the decision making we getting to that after afterMarketing: Yeah mm. Mm-hmm. Have to come back to that later. Okay.User Interface: We can.Project Manager: but if {disfmarker} I just wanted to know whether anybody had any any anything to add to her presentation.Marketing: No, I think her presentation was good, and she really explored all the options. Yeah.Project Manager: Mm right. Mm-hmm. Ho who wants to go next um Mm-hmm. Okay,Industrial Designer: Yeah, maybe.Project Manager: and you {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Participant two.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh okay.Industrial Designer: Uh the next one, sorry.Project Manager: Oops.Industrial Designer: It's it was the old one.Project Manager: The components design.Industrial Designer: Components.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Okay.Industrial Designer: Um this time I'm I'm going to

Summarize the presentation about findings for marketing.

People liked something that fit their hand and fewer buttons which the functions were obvious. They didn't want to squint at small prints and didn't care for different modes. The appearance of the remote should be eye-catching and appealing. The remote had to be in the market before competition for Christmas. Fruit and vegetable shapes were very popular this year and people were back into a soft and spongy feel with a little cloth. The star features of the remote should be narrowed down to one or two and voice recognizer could be an option.

Project Manager: Okay. Hello everyone. {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Hi.User Interface: Hi.Marketing: Hi.Project Manager: Um how uh how we doingIndustrial Designer: Yeah, good.Project Manager: Uh first we going uh over the minutes of the last meeting, more or less.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um in the last meeting uh the marketing manager had presented uh her method of working, meaning gathering i suggestions from everyone to see how she best could market uh this this product at the {disfmarker} within the budget uh that was given. Uh in general {vocalsound} the idea is that it should be something that is not difficult to use. Um it's also an item that people lose a lot. So we should address that. And, of course, it should be something s s that is very simple to use. In addition to that to make it sell, of course, uh the marketing manager w wishes that it be very attractive,Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or like she says put some sizzle into it in one way or another so that the people are buying it now because, in particular with smaller items, that's a very important fact,'cause um if they say, well, I go home and think about it, that won't work. Um also mentioned was it should be uh {disfmarker} it should have a very short learning curve. And maybe it could be sold by using a slogan.Industrial Designer: Hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Our technical manager has then said that she feels it should have a chipMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: that has infra-red bits and it has an interface controls w interface that controls the chip. Therefore, messages uh will be controlled in the same manner. There should be extra features like lid buttons, maybe a beep. If too many buttons are pressed, mm uh uh child lock um and three. Yes. Okay.Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: Now as an interface designer, I would give more emphasis on the interface, how the remote looks like so that it is sellable, it is attractive to customers. Next, please. Okay. Now the function of a remote is to send messages to the television. This messages could be uh switch on-off message or switch to next channel message or swapping the channels or switching onto a particular channel, like you can have the numbers one, two, three, four, up to nine.Project Manager: Nine what Nine channel uh switchesUser Interface: Pardon meProject Manager: Nine channel switches Is {disfmarker} Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: Yes, nine numbers. And then you have swapping of uh buttonProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: by which {disfmarker} using which you can swap the channels if you don't want to see the third channel you can swap it to the fourth channel or vice versa. Then it should have a next button, and next button channel by which you can keep on uh v uh mm eh scrolling the channels one by one.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Going to the nex next.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Next slide, please.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then you should have a button which should which ca which can be used for increasing or decreasing the volume.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, there should be a button which can give subtitles for a particular program which is going on a television. For example, if you are watching a French program and you would like to have a subtitles in English, then there should be a channel which can trigger this mechanism in the television so that the user can see uh the {gap} the subtitles on the screen.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then there should d uh there should be some buttons have a lot of time left and we will still have to make a decision, and the marketing expert has to present her her thing.Marketing: {vocalsound} Okay. Go right to my first {disfmarker} my next slide.Project Manager: Uh okay.Marketing: Um alright, my method is uh {disfmarker} I'm interested in what the competition is doing, and wanna see how we can make ourselves different from the competition, so I've really been looking at the press and the ads that are out there for other remote controllers. I s I {vocalsound} spend a lot of time on the internet um surfing around doing the same thing. And then when I'm out um in people's houses or at meetings or anything like that, I try to notice what kind of remote controls people have, and if it's convenient in the conversation I ask about it. And I would encourage you all to do the same. Um and my findings from this is that, you know, small is beautiful. Um people like something that really fits in their hand.User Interface:'Kay.Marketing: Simple is beautiful. They don't want to have to squint at small print um, they want buttons whose functions are obvious, and they want um as few buttons as possible, and they don't {vocalsound} care for the mode thing. They want each button to do something. And eye-catching is important. It's gotta look cute, it's gotta look appealing. Go ahead, I'm trying to finish fast for you. Um {vocalsound} and our preference is, as far as I'm concerned, are we got to get to the market before the competition. Ours has to be {disfmarker} look really great and it has to come out before the others, so that we have a leg up on time to sell it and push it before other people which can control features like the colour, colour of the picture, the contrast, sharpness, brightness of the picture. Now there should be a memory switch. There should be a mute button. Suddenly if if if uh uh viewer he gets a telephone call, and if he want he doesn't want to switch off the uh T_V_, but he he can reduce the sound, he can bring the volume down and he can watch {disfmarker} he can uh {disfmarker} while talking he can watch the T_V_. Now the most important feature I would like to have in my remote would be the speech recognition feature. It's an integrated progra programmable sample sensor speaker unit. So a remote can be th can be uh designed which can have the voice recognisers, you can record your own voiceProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: which can be recognised by as voice recogniser in the television, for example, if you want to see {disfmarker} we if you want to see the ninth channel if you say just say ninth channel, uh th now the the {disfmarker} uh yeah, the remote will {disfmarker} automatically it will switch to the ninth channel.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So the T_V_ will have some recogniser which will recognise the user's voice and accordingly it will change its functionalities.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So this is one of the very important feature a remote control can have. So this is one one of the interface which can be created.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: A very simple interface which has all the t uh uh important features.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, please, next slide.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, these are some of the remotes which are different in shape and colour, but they have many buttons.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: So uh sometimes the uh maybe a display clock so that people could um {disfmarker} you could see the time, you know, what show they want to watch. Also mentioned was uh maybe different shapes. So the components of the thing should be button, bulbs, infra infra-red bulbs, battery, chips, wires, and maybe some kind of a holder uh for the for the uh item. Francino who is our umUser Interface: Interface designer.Project Manager: interface designer um uh has mentioned that the {disfmarker} that it, of course, should have an on-off button, and also has mentioned an interesting feature that it should have maybe a channel lock. Particularly with maybe small children that they couldn't uh watch a channel that is undesirable. It should be compact. Her personal favourite was it should be T-shaped. And maybe have an anar alarm-clock. And the material should possibly be not of non-allergic nature. Uh the different systems uh that exist are infra-red or radio-waves. Uh maybe it should have uh electri electrici electricity saving feature.Marketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: And {vocalsound} even possibly a timer to {disfmarker} so that people can program {vocalsound} their favourite uh uh program on th right from the remote.User Interface: Yes.Project Manager: Uh are we all in agreement that that's about what we discussed last time Okay.User Interface: Yes.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah, I think that pretty much is it. Yeah. Mm-hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Okay, then we {disfmarker} I'm looking for three presentations. And uh I don't know whether the order matters much uh, I don't I don't think so, so whoever w wants {disfmarker}User Interface: Okay, I can start first.Project Manager: Yeah, okay.User Interface: Okay. Now my slide, please. {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay, your slides. Okay. Oh, come on, close already.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: And that's number two, rightUser Interface: Three.Project Manager: Three.User Interface: Participant

Summarize the wrap up of the meeting.

Industrial Designer was supposed to have the look and feel of the design, User Interface should have come up with user interface design and Marketing should have the product evaluation for the next meeting. Furthermore, User Interface and Marketing had to work together on a prototype using modelling clay and everyone would receive specific instructions sent by coaches.

Project Manager: Okay. Hello everyone. {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Hi.User Interface: Hi.Marketing: Hi.Project Manager: Um how uh how we doingIndustrial Designer: Yeah, good.Project Manager: Uh first we going uh over the minutes of the last meeting, more or less.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um in the last meeting uh the marketing manager had presented uh her method of working, meaning gathering i suggestions from everyone to see how she best could market uh this this product at the {disfmarker} within the budget uh that was given. Uh in general {vocalsound} the idea is that it should be something that is not difficult to use. Um it's also an item that people lose a lot. So we should address that. And, of course, it should be something s s that is very simple to use. In addition to that to make it sell, of course, uh the marketing manager w wishes that it be very attractive,Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or like she says put some sizzle into it in one way or another so that the people are buying it now because, in particular with smaller items, that's a very important fact,'cause um if they say, well, I go home and think about it, that won't work. Um also mentioned was it should be uh {disfmarker} it should have a very short learning curve. And maybe it could be sold by using a slogan.Industrial Designer: Hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Our technical manager has then said that she feels it should have a chipMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: that has infra-red bits and it has an interface controls w interface that controls the chip. Therefore, messages uh will be controlled in the same manner. There should be extra features like lid buttons, maybe a beep. If too many buttons are pressed, mm uh uh child lock um and which can control features like the colour, colour of the picture, the contrast, sharpness, brightness of the picture. Now there should be a memory switch. There should be a mute button. Suddenly if if if uh uh viewer he gets a telephone call, and if he want he doesn't want to switch off the uh T_V_, but he he can reduce the sound, he can bring the volume down and he can watch {disfmarker} he can uh {disfmarker} while talking he can watch the T_V_. Now the most important feature I would like to have in my remote would be the speech recognition feature. It's an integrated progra programmable sample sensor speaker unit. So a remote can be th can be uh designed which can have the voice recognisers, you can record your own voiceProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: which can be recognised by as voice recogniser in the television, for example, if you want to see {disfmarker} we if you want to see the ninth channel if you say just say ninth channel, uh th now the the {disfmarker} uh yeah, the remote will {disfmarker} automatically it will switch to the ninth channel.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So the T_V_ will have some recogniser which will recognise the user's voice and accordingly it will change its functionalities.Project Manager: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: So this is one of the very important feature a remote control can have. So this is one one of the interface which can be created.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: A very simple interface which has all the t uh uh important features.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, please, next slide.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, these are some of the remotes which are different in shape and colour, but they have many buttons.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: So uh sometimes the three. Yes. Okay.Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: Now as an interface designer, I would give more emphasis on the interface, how the remote looks like so that it is sellable, it is attractive to customers. Next, please. Okay. Now the function of a remote is to send messages to the television. This messages could be uh switch on-off message or switch to next channel message or swapping the channels or switching onto a particular channel, like you can have the numbers one, two, three, four, up to nine.Project Manager: Nine what Nine channel uh switchesUser Interface: Pardon meProject Manager: Nine channel switches Is {disfmarker} Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.User Interface: Yes, nine numbers. And then you have swapping of uh buttonProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: by which {disfmarker} using which you can swap the channels if you don't want to see the third channel you can swap it to the fourth channel or vice versa. Then it should have a next button, and next button channel by which you can keep on uh v uh mm eh scrolling the channels one by one.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Going to the nex next.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Next slide, please.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then you should have a button which should which ca which can be used for increasing or decreasing the volume.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then, there should be a button which can give subtitles for a particular program which is going on a television. For example, if you are watching a French program and you would like to have a subtitles in English, then there should be a channel which can trigger this mechanism in the television so that the user can see uh the {gap} the subtitles on the screen.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Then there should d uh there should be some buttons get out their Christmas item. And we should develop one or two features we can really dwell on in our ad campaign. If we try to tell people it has too many great features, um the consumer just gets confused and we don't get anywhere. So we've gotta narrow our selection down to {vocalsound} li {vocalsound} two things, I think, that we gonna say are really great about our our our new product. And I've been looking around um at what designs {disfmarker} every year different things are popular. And in my research this year I found out that fruit and vegetable shapes are really popular. And people are tired of hard plastic and hard metal. They are more back into soft feel, spongy feeling things, things with maybe a little cloth on them. So those are things maybe we wanna look at as far as saleability of the item.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh that concludes the presentation of everyone. And what we really have to decide in this meeting is um the concept of the remote.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: And uh so what do we think on the conceptMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: of the remote {vocalsound}Marketing: You wanna try to come back to yours, and limit yours a bitProject Manager: Y {vocalsound}User Interface: Uh yes, I would like to include this feature which is called as voice recogniser.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Okay. Mm-hmm. {vocalsound}Marketing: Okay.Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Marketing: So speech recognition is most important as far as you're concernedUser Interface: This could be uh one feature which could be sellable.Industrial Designer: Yeah, but wMarketing: Yeah h that could that could that could be our star feature.Project Manager: I think that's {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: That that {gap} be really good, yeah, I agree with that.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Yeah, but but is a normal remote controller. And {gap} to the next slide, please.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: And where we had a a few buttons and all. And uh if you open the remote controller you have this circui circuit board and few electronic components,Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: like you can see a chip there which is having eighteen pins,Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: and also a capac uh a capacitor, three resistors and also a resonator uh um mm {disfmarker} yeah, and di and a diode transistor.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: The electronic components {disfmarker} uh all of the electronic components have all those uh things like a chip and d {vocalsound} diode transistors an Yeah, di um can y uh you can see the T_A_ double one eight three five labelled uh chip um.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Mm yes.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Yes.Industrial Designer: Uh you can also see the uh uh the green {disfmarker} two green things are uh these are {disfmarker} they are {disfmarker} they are resistors,User Interface: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: and uh just beside that you can see a transistor, and a uh uh cylinder shape, uh that one is a capacitor. Uh and also there are uh {vocalsound} um resistors {disfmarker} uh sorry, ther there is a diode.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Can you go {disfmarker} go on to the next slide.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: So uh this is the circuit board. The green one is a circuit board. Actually, uh building a circuit bo board is pretty pretty uh easy and also it's a it's a l l inexpensive. Uh it's it costs less than what you print on a paper, because uh {vocalsound} uh when you {disfmarker} when you are building uh some circuits {disfmarker} some um uh circuits and also wires, it's it's better to go for printing, because

Summarize the whole meeting.

After Project Manager recapped the decisions made in the last meeting, such as having a child lock and display clock, User Interface started the presentation regarding how to make the interface more attractive to customers. Then, Industrial Designer gave the presentation on the component design of the remote, which was divided into two parts - the components in the remote and the working design. Afterwards, Marketing reported findings for marketing like the people wanting fewer buttons which the functions were obvious. In the end, Project Manager wrapped up the meeting, concluding what had to be done by each of them for the next meeting.

brilliant.User Interface: that we need to incorporate, it's very simple. If you do need buttons, you can flip it over, and there's some there,Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: um but mainly it's speech recognition.Project Manager: Okay, so the buttons would be like, you know individual users, or {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah and {vocalsound} yeah they might project things onto the screen which you can do on there.Project Manager: Alright, okay.User Interface: Mm I'm not sure about that. Um and this one is the one w more like the one w that we looked at earlier.Project Manager: Right.User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah, you guys can have a look at that if you want.Project Manager: That's groovy. {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {gap}Marketing: Yeah. {vocalsound} Uh can I have {gap}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Well I like the feel of it, I like the feel of it.User Interface: Yeah, sure. Um that one is {disfmarker}Marketing: Oh sorry s {vocalsound}User Interface: Oh no, it's delicate.Project Manager: At Oh dear.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: That's that's already got its stand that one. That's it stand.Project Manager: Alright, okay.User Interface: It does also lie flat, but that's the that yellow stand there represents the the charging stand.Project Manager: Okay, brilliant mm.User Interface: Um the black on the back is the slogan.Project Manager: Okay, nice and obvious there {vocalsound},User Interface: Uh yeah, that {gap} {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Well, we did think of that.Project Manager: if it's standing up, I guess, yeah.User Interface: Yeah, if it's standing up it's it's on there, but also we're gonna have the company name on the front, which is the little black kind of line in the middle.Project Manager: Oh right, okay, brilliant. Like that from its centre.User Interface: So um and that's the um transmit the L_E_D_ thing. These are the s two scroll Yeah.User Interface: Three. Go for three. That's fine.Marketing: Uh {disfmarker}Industrial Designer:'Kay. As far as the uh technology it its'got the latest trends in speech technology, but it's missing the screen, as we said, um but it does have the push-buttons, or the scroll-buttons, um but it doesn't have that fancy solar power or the the vibrating energy mechanism. So I give it a a four. I'd give it a kinda middle of the road forUser Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: for technology.Project Manager: Yeah, I am sort of pret uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Just the fruit does me in, I mean uh it mightUser Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: it might be trendy to some, but I'm just not swallowing the fruit, so um {vocalsound} {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh also uh I would have liked to have seen the L_C_D_ screen in it. Um so yeah I'd say about four as well.Marketing: Okay. Uh personally I wi uh I think that in terms of trends, these products are quite good, like, these products are in fruit shape, because that wha people now {disfmarker} our fashion trend shows that people like everything {disfmarker} all f everything that is being advertised, like clothes, shoes, and everything is being advertised in the form of fruits and vegetables, or getting them {gap} or showing some association with them.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: So and in this way our product is good. And the second thing, now people don't want any complicated or bulky products and ours is quite simple and quite handy.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: So that is also ef that also {disfmarker}User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Our product meets the f the fashion uh trends of the market. And yes. It is cus spongy also. So they can play with it, it's quite good.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: we h we are using these scroll buttons like this. These are new ideas we And new shapes, everythingProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: . At le {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm'kay. Groovy.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: So just general thumbs up for all of us then.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Hmm.Project Manager: That kind of unfortunately is too quick.Marketing: Hmm.User Interface: Okay.Industrial Designer: Okay.User Interface: Well um.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Uh {vocalsound}. I suppose yeah. Um.Industrial Designer: Uh so let's talk about our bonuses and the raises we're getting for this, right. {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} That's it, um I think another couple of days holiday pay might be well in order for all of you.User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: Right, right.Project Manager: Uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Let's see if I can get this bloody thing to work.Industrial Designer: Uh maybe we should start cleaning up the clay.Project Manager: Whoops. {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah, maybe.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: So {disfmarker}Project Manager: Does it go back in, does it Reusable.Industrial Designer: {gap}User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: Something we should get {gap}.Project Manager: I don't know what this is but it's really really annoying.Marketing: So {vocalsound} {disfmarker} Uh Brian, have you have you finishedProject Manager: Uh-huh.Marketing: Uh mine needs also this.Project Manager: Um I have, yes.Marketing: At last mine is also the presentation.Project Manager: Huh Oh right, okay, you've got more, okay.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah, yeah.User Interface: Oh, you got a presentation,Project Manager: Sorry uh.User Interface: sorry.Industrial Designer: Oh okProject Manager: It didn't bother to tell me that on thisMarketing: SIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: thing. Is it Okay.Marketing: Uh {vocalsound} is the project evaluated, that is mine.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Doesn't tell me. {vocalsound} Oh you're doing that. {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: We evaluated ourselves, we thought we were great. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial if there is anything you think we've missed out there, then, you know, feel free to add it. Maybe {disfmarker} I mean obviously it would be bigger so there might be more space for the the slogan on the front,Project Manager: Yeah yeah.User Interface: because it's not in an ideal place right now.Project Manager: Well that's that's uh {disfmarker} Okay, so project evaluation. We have under twelve {vocalsound} Euros fifty. Project process, how do we think that went Are we happyIndustrial Designer: Oh.User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: Yeah I think we have a a winning product.Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Okay. {vocalsound} Evaluation. Oh we've been writing this up for m months.User Interface: I think it went quite smoothly.Project Manager: Uh room for creativity, were we happy with thatUser Interface: W I think we were very creative.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: No, I mea I think it means sort of individually.User Interface: Oh right, okay.Project Manager: Yes, no, maybeUser Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Okay. Groovy. So uh we're just gonna. Uh yeah, okay. Teamwork Leadership, sorry.Industrial Designer: Great leadership. {vocalsound}User Interface: Excellent leadership. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Thank you very much. You're all get you're all getting a raise. Uh teamwork. I thought went well.Industrial Designer: Yeah, yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah, everyone got enough input, I think.Project Manager: Uh and well means, yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah, we {gap} {disfmarker}Project Manager: The technical stuff was brilliant.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Let's buy more.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Uh Right. UmIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound} These pens are are neat though.Project Manager: I don't know what, new ideas found, means, to be honest.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah, these are new ideas, like glow-in-the-dark or something like that. We discussed all the new ideas, but of course we couldn't reach any proper goals, we couldn't use these {gap}, but need.Industrial Designer: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Say it for the camera.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Lo Sort of Loch Ness banana. {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Right, right.Project Manager: Cool {gap} yeah. Well, nice to have uh options at least.Industrial Designer: Yep. {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager:'Kay and {disfmarker}User Interface: {vocalsound} So are there any um improvements or issues or {disfmarker} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: It won't stand.Project Manager: Oh there are issues, oh there are issues.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Just let it lie down, it wont stand. {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Um main problem that we have unfortunately being finance.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: Oh.Project Manager: Uh, let's just enter in the um evaluation criteria.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Um {vocalsound} unfortunately the unit we are currently going to produce minus the extra scroll buttons, uh it's gonna cost us fourteen point six Euros.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: Oh.Project Manager: So we have toIndustrial Designer: What's on the uh on the left {gap}Project Manager: rea Sorry, I've accidentally highlighted somehow {disfmarker} Um. {vocalsound} There we go.Industrial Designer: Okay.Project Manager: Oh god, why is it doing thatUser Interface: Ooh.Project Manager: There we go. {vocalsound} So basically, um in order to save our two Euros um I was thinking that we could have essentially the same shape, but just have it flattened.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um.User Interface: More like a traditional remote control.Project Manager: Yeah, I mean it's already got a kind of cool shape, so but it wouldn't have to be curved sort of in and out.User Interface: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.Project Manager: And by doing so {disfmarker} Oh no, hold on. Doesn't save us quite as much. I don't know what's going on with this again.Industrial Designer: W why is the uh double curved two of themProject Manager: Oh, good point.Marketing: And double curve on both sidesProject Manager: Um.Marketing:

Summarize the discussion about the cost control.

According to Project Manager, currently, the new remote controls would cost fourteen point six Euros each. Unfortunately, that was two Euros over the budget. Then the team had a little discussion on how to reduce the cost. Eventually, the cost was reduced to eleven Euros sixty by adjusting two parts of the design. That left them plenty of room to add some other designs to the existing models. The final cost of the new remote controls was set at twelve Euros fifty each.

brilliant.User Interface: that we need to incorporate, it's very simple. If you do need buttons, you can flip it over, and there's some there,Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: um but mainly it's speech recognition.Project Manager: Okay, so the buttons would be like, you know individual users, or {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah and {vocalsound} yeah they might project things onto the screen which you can do on there.Project Manager: Alright, okay.User Interface: Mm I'm not sure about that. Um and this one is the one w more like the one w that we looked at earlier.Project Manager: Right.User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah, you guys can have a look at that if you want.Project Manager: That's groovy. {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {gap}Marketing: Yeah. {vocalsound} Uh can I have {gap}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Well I like the feel of it, I like the feel of it.User Interface: Yeah, sure. Um that one is {disfmarker}Marketing: Oh sorry s {vocalsound}User Interface: Oh no, it's delicate.Project Manager: At Oh dear.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: That's that's already got its stand that one. That's it stand.Project Manager: Alright, okay.User Interface: It does also lie flat, but that's the that yellow stand there represents the the charging stand.Project Manager: Okay, brilliant mm.User Interface: Um the black on the back is the slogan.Project Manager: Okay, nice and obvious there {vocalsound},User Interface: Uh yeah, that {gap} {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Well, we did think of that.Project Manager: if it's standing up, I guess, yeah.User Interface: Yeah, if it's standing up it's it's on there, but also we're gonna have the company name on the front, which is the little black kind of line in the middle.Project Manager: Oh right, okay, brilliant. Like that from its centre.User Interface: So um and that's the um transmit the L_E_D_ thing. These are the s two scroll Yeah.User Interface: Three. Go for three. That's fine.Marketing: Uh {disfmarker}Industrial Designer:'Kay. As far as the uh technology it its'got the latest trends in speech technology, but it's missing the screen, as we said, um but it does have the push-buttons, or the scroll-buttons, um but it doesn't have that fancy solar power or the the vibrating energy mechanism. So I give it a a four. I'd give it a kinda middle of the road forUser Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: for technology.Project Manager: Yeah, I am sort of pret uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Just the fruit does me in, I mean uh it mightUser Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: it might be trendy to some, but I'm just not swallowing the fruit, so um {vocalsound} {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh also uh I would have liked to have seen the L_C_D_ screen in it. Um so yeah I'd say about four as well.Marketing: Okay. Uh personally I wi uh I think that in terms of trends, these products are quite good, like, these products are in fruit shape, because that wha people now {disfmarker} our fashion trend shows that people like everything {disfmarker} all f everything that is being advertised, like clothes, shoes, and everything is being advertised in the form of fruits and vegetables, or getting them {gap} or showing some association with them.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: So and in this way our product is good. And the second thing, now people don't want any complicated or bulky products and ours is quite simple and quite handy.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: So that is also ef that also {disfmarker}User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Our product meets the f the fashion uh trends of the market. And yes. It is cus spongy also. So they can play with it, it's quite good.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: we h we are using these scroll buttons like this. These are new ideas we And new shapes, everythingProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: . At le {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm'kay. Groovy.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: So just general thumbs up for all of us then.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Hmm.Project Manager: That kind of unfortunately is too quick.Marketing: Hmm.User Interface: Okay.Industrial Designer: Okay.User Interface: Well um.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Uh {vocalsound}. I suppose yeah. Um.Industrial Designer: Uh so let's talk about our bonuses and the raises we're getting for this, right. {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} That's it, um I think another couple of days holiday pay might be well in order for all of you.User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: Right, right.Project Manager: Uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Let's see if I can get this bloody thing to work.Industrial Designer: Uh maybe we should start cleaning up the clay.Project Manager: Whoops. {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah, maybe.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: So {disfmarker}Project Manager: Does it go back in, does it Reusable.Industrial Designer: {gap}User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: Something we should get {gap}.Project Manager: I don't know what this is but it's really really annoying.Marketing: So {vocalsound} {disfmarker} Uh Brian, have you have you finishedProject Manager: Uh-huh.Marketing: Uh mine needs also this.Project Manager: Um I have, yes.Marketing: At last mine is also the presentation.Project Manager: Huh Oh right, okay, you've got more, okay.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah, yeah.User Interface: Oh, you got a presentation,Project Manager: Sorry uh.User Interface: sorry.Industrial Designer: Oh okProject Manager: It didn't bother to tell me that on thisMarketing: SIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: thing. Is it Okay.Marketing: Uh {vocalsound} is the project evaluated, that is mine.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Doesn't tell me. {vocalsound} Oh you're doing that. {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: We evaluated ourselves, we thought we were great. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial need.Industrial Designer: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Say it for the camera.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Lo Sort of Loch Ness banana. {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Right, right.Project Manager: Cool {gap} yeah. Well, nice to have uh options at least.Industrial Designer: Yep. {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager:'Kay and {disfmarker}User Interface: {vocalsound} So are there any um improvements or issues or {disfmarker} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: It won't stand.Project Manager: Oh there are issues, oh there are issues.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Just let it lie down, it wont stand. {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Um main problem that we have unfortunately being finance.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: Oh.Project Manager: Uh, let's just enter in the um evaluation criteria.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Um {vocalsound} unfortunately the unit we are currently going to produce minus the extra scroll buttons, uh it's gonna cost us fourteen point six Euros.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: Oh.Project Manager: So we have toIndustrial Designer: What's on the uh on the left {gap}Project Manager: rea Sorry, I've accidentally highlighted somehow {disfmarker} Um. {vocalsound} There we go.Industrial Designer: Okay.Project Manager: Oh god, why is it doing thatUser Interface: Ooh.Project Manager: There we go. {vocalsound} So basically, um in order to save our two Euros um I was thinking that we could have essentially the same shape, but just have it flattened.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um.User Interface: More like a traditional remote control.Project Manager: Yeah, I mean it's already got a kind of cool shape, so but it wouldn't have to be curved sort of in and out.User Interface: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.Project Manager: And by doing so {disfmarker} Oh no, hold on. Doesn't save us quite as much. I don't know what's going on with this again.Industrial Designer: W why is the uh double curved two of themProject Manager: Oh, good point.Marketing: And double curve on both sidesProject Manager: Um.Marketing: if there is anything you think we've missed out there, then, you know, feel free to add it. Maybe {disfmarker} I mean obviously it would be bigger so there might be more space for the the slogan on the front,Project Manager: Yeah yeah.User Interface: because it's not in an ideal place right now.Project Manager: Well that's that's uh {disfmarker} Okay, so project evaluation. We have under twelve {vocalsound} Euros fifty. Project process, how do we think that went Are we happyIndustrial Designer: Oh.User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: Yeah I think we have a a winning product.Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Okay. {vocalsound} Evaluation. Oh we've been writing this up for m months.User Interface: I think it went quite smoothly.Project Manager: Uh room for creativity, were we happy with thatUser Interface: W I think we were very creative.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: No, I mea I think it means sort of individually.User Interface: Oh right, okay.Project Manager: Yes, no, maybeUser Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Okay. Groovy. So uh we're just gonna. Uh yeah, okay. Teamwork Leadership, sorry.Industrial Designer: Great leadership. {vocalsound}User Interface: Excellent leadership. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Thank you very much. You're all get you're all getting a raise. Uh teamwork. I thought went well.Industrial Designer: Yeah, yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah, everyone got enough input, I think.Project Manager: Uh and well means, yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah, we {gap} {disfmarker}Project Manager: The technical stuff was brilliant.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Let's buy more.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Uh Right. UmIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound} These pens are are neat though.Project Manager: I don't know what, new ideas found, means, to be honest.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah, these are new ideas, like glow-in-the-dark or something like that. We discussed all the new ideas, but of course we couldn't reach any proper goals, we couldn't use these {gap}, but

What did the team eventually come up with to reduce costs

In general, the team came up with two ways to reduce the costs. First, they would essentially remain the same shape as the prototypes, but just have it flattened. In User Interface's words, it would be more like a traditional remote control. Second, the team reached a consensus that the design of double curves shall be changed into a single curve since it was the biggest expense there. Luckily, after the discussion, the overall cost of the new remote controls went down to eleven Euros sixty.

brilliant.User Interface: that we need to incorporate, it's very simple. If you do need buttons, you can flip it over, and there's some there,Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: um but mainly it's speech recognition.Project Manager: Okay, so the buttons would be like, you know individual users, or {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah and {vocalsound} yeah they might project things onto the screen which you can do on there.Project Manager: Alright, okay.User Interface: Mm I'm not sure about that. Um and this one is the one w more like the one w that we looked at earlier.Project Manager: Right.User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah, you guys can have a look at that if you want.Project Manager: That's groovy. {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {gap}Marketing: Yeah. {vocalsound} Uh can I have {gap}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Well I like the feel of it, I like the feel of it.User Interface: Yeah, sure. Um that one is {disfmarker}Marketing: Oh sorry s {vocalsound}User Interface: Oh no, it's delicate.Project Manager: At Oh dear.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: That's that's already got its stand that one. That's it stand.Project Manager: Alright, okay.User Interface: It does also lie flat, but that's the that yellow stand there represents the the charging stand.Project Manager: Okay, brilliant mm.User Interface: Um the black on the back is the slogan.Project Manager: Okay, nice and obvious there {vocalsound},User Interface: Uh yeah, that {gap} {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Well, we did think of that.Project Manager: if it's standing up, I guess, yeah.User Interface: Yeah, if it's standing up it's it's on there, but also we're gonna have the company name on the front, which is the little black kind of line in the middle.Project Manager: Oh right, okay, brilliant. Like that from its centre.User Interface: So um and that's the um transmit the L_E_D_ thing. These are the s two scroll Yeah.User Interface: Three. Go for three. That's fine.Marketing: Uh {disfmarker}Industrial Designer:'Kay. As far as the uh technology it its'got the latest trends in speech technology, but it's missing the screen, as we said, um but it does have the push-buttons, or the scroll-buttons, um but it doesn't have that fancy solar power or the the vibrating energy mechanism. So I give it a a four. I'd give it a kinda middle of the road forUser Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: for technology.Project Manager: Yeah, I am sort of pret uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Just the fruit does me in, I mean uh it mightUser Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: it might be trendy to some, but I'm just not swallowing the fruit, so um {vocalsound} {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh also uh I would have liked to have seen the L_C_D_ screen in it. Um so yeah I'd say about four as well.Marketing: Okay. Uh personally I wi uh I think that in terms of trends, these products are quite good, like, these products are in fruit shape, because that wha people now {disfmarker} our fashion trend shows that people like everything {disfmarker} all f everything that is being advertised, like clothes, shoes, and everything is being advertised in the form of fruits and vegetables, or getting them {gap} or showing some association with them.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: So and in this way our product is good. And the second thing, now people don't want any complicated or bulky products and ours is quite simple and quite handy.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: So that is also ef that also {disfmarker}User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Our product meets the f the fashion uh trends of the market. And yes. It is cus spongy also. So they can play with it, it's quite good.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: need.Industrial Designer: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Say it for the camera.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Lo Sort of Loch Ness banana. {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Right, right.Project Manager: Cool {gap} yeah. Well, nice to have uh options at least.Industrial Designer: Yep. {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager:'Kay and {disfmarker}User Interface: {vocalsound} So are there any um improvements or issues or {disfmarker} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: It won't stand.Project Manager: Oh there are issues, oh there are issues.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Just let it lie down, it wont stand. {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Um main problem that we have unfortunately being finance.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: Oh.Project Manager: Uh, let's just enter in the um evaluation criteria.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Um {vocalsound} unfortunately the unit we are currently going to produce minus the extra scroll buttons, uh it's gonna cost us fourteen point six Euros.Marketing: Mm.User Interface: Oh.Project Manager: So we have toIndustrial Designer: What's on the uh on the left {gap}Project Manager: rea Sorry, I've accidentally highlighted somehow {disfmarker} Um. {vocalsound} There we go.Industrial Designer: Okay.Project Manager: Oh god, why is it doing thatUser Interface: Ooh.Project Manager: There we go. {vocalsound} So basically, um in order to save our two Euros um I was thinking that we could have essentially the same shape, but just have it flattened.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um.User Interface: More like a traditional remote control.Project Manager: Yeah, I mean it's already got a kind of cool shape, so but it wouldn't have to be curved sort of in and out.User Interface: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.Project Manager: And by doing so {disfmarker} Oh no, hold on. Doesn't save us quite as much. I don't know what's going on with this again.Industrial Designer: W why is the uh double curved two of themProject Manager: Oh, good point.Marketing: And double curve on both sidesProject Manager: Um.Marketing: if there is anything you think we've missed out there, then, you know, feel free to add it. Maybe {disfmarker} I mean obviously it would be bigger so there might be more space for the the slogan on the front,Project Manager: Yeah yeah.User Interface: because it's not in an ideal place right now.Project Manager: Well that's that's uh {disfmarker} Okay, so project evaluation. We have under twelve {vocalsound} Euros fifty. Project process, how do we think that went Are we happyIndustrial Designer: Oh.User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: Yeah I think we have a a winning product.Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Okay. {vocalsound} Evaluation. Oh we've been writing this up for m months.User Interface: I think it went quite smoothly.Project Manager: Uh room for creativity, were we happy with thatUser Interface: W I think we were very creative.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: No, I mea I think it means sort of individually.User Interface: Oh right, okay.Project Manager: Yes, no, maybeUser Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Okay. Groovy. So uh we're just gonna. Uh yeah, okay. Teamwork Leadership, sorry.Industrial Designer: Great leadership. {vocalsound}User Interface: Excellent leadership. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Thank you very much. You're all get you're all getting a raise. Uh teamwork. I thought went well.Industrial Designer: Yeah, yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah, everyone got enough input, I think.Project Manager: Uh and well means, yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah, we {gap} {disfmarker}Project Manager: The technical stuff was brilliant.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Let's buy more.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Uh Right. UmIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound} These pens are are neat though.Project Manager: I don't know what, new ideas found, means, to be honest.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah, these are new ideas, like glow-in-the-dark or something like that. We discussed all the new ideas, but of course we couldn't reach any proper goals, we couldn't use these {gap}, but we h we are using these scroll buttons like this. These are new ideas we And new shapes, everythingProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: . At le {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm'kay. Groovy.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: So just general thumbs up for all of us then.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Hmm.Project Manager: That kind of unfortunately is too quick.Marketing: Hmm.User Interface: Okay.Industrial Designer: Okay.User Interface: Well um.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Uh {vocalsound}. I suppose yeah. Um.Industrial Designer: Uh so let's talk about our bonuses and the raises we're getting for this, right. {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} That's it, um I think another couple of days holiday pay might be well in order for all of you.User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: Right, right.Project Manager: Uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Let's see if I can get this bloody thing to work.Industrial Designer: Uh maybe we should start cleaning up the clay.Project Manager: Whoops. {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah, maybe.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: So {disfmarker}Project Manager: Does it go back in, does it Reusable.Industrial Designer: {gap}User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: Something we should get {gap}.Project Manager: I don't know what this is but it's really really annoying.Marketing: So {vocalsound} {disfmarker} Uh Brian, have you have you finishedProject Manager: Uh-huh.Marketing: Uh mine needs also this.Project Manager: Um I have, yes.Marketing: At last mine is also the presentation.Project Manager: Huh Oh right, okay, you've got more, okay.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah, yeah.User Interface: Oh, you got a presentation,Project Manager: Sorry uh.User Interface: sorry.Industrial Designer: Oh okProject Manager: It didn't bother to tell me that on thisMarketing: SIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: thing. Is it Okay.Marketing: Uh {vocalsound} is the project evaluated, that is mine.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Doesn't tell me. {vocalsound} Oh you're doing that. {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: We evaluated ourselves, we thought we were great. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial

What kind of design did the team finally decide to add with the extra budget

Through a series of previous adjustments, the cost of the new remote controls had been effectively reduced. The team then decided to use some of the remaining cost budget to add another design to the new remotes. After discussion, the team thought it might be a good idea to have the slogan on the front because there was obviously more space there and the current slogan was not in an ideal place. With this little change, the overall cost of the new remote each went up to twelve Euros fifty, still under the budget limit.

brilliant.User Interface: that we need to incorporate, it's very simple. If you do need buttons, you can flip it over, and there's some there,Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: um but mainly it's speech recognition.Project Manager: Okay, so the buttons would be like, you know individual users, or {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah and {vocalsound} yeah they might project things onto the screen which you can do on there.Project Manager: Alright, okay.User Interface: Mm I'm not sure about that. Um and this one is the one w more like the one w that we looked at earlier.Project Manager: Right.User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah, you guys can have a look at that if you want.Project Manager: That's groovy. {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {gap}Marketing: Yeah. {vocalsound} Uh can I have {gap}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Well I like the feel of it, I like the feel of it.User Interface: Yeah, sure. Um that one is {disfmarker}Marketing: Oh sorry s {vocalsound}User Interface: Oh no, it's delicate.Project Manager: At Oh dear.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: That's that's already got its stand that one. That's it stand.Project Manager: Alright, okay.User Interface: It does also lie flat, but that's the that yellow stand there represents the the charging stand.Project Manager: Okay, brilliant mm.User Interface: Um the black on the back is the slogan.Project Manager: Okay, nice and obvious there {vocalsound},User Interface: Uh yeah, that {gap} {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Well, we did think of that.Project Manager: if it's standing up, I guess, yeah.User Interface: Yeah, if it's standing up it's it's on there, but also we're gonna have the company name on the front, which is the little black kind of line in the middle.Project Manager: Oh right, okay, brilliant. Like that from its centre.User Interface: So um and that's the um transmit the L_E_D_ thing. These are the s two scroll Yeah.User Interface: Three. Go for three. That's fine.Marketing: Uh {disfmarker}Industrial Designer:'Kay. As far as the uh technology it its'got the latest trends in speech technology, but it's missing the screen, as we said, um but it does have the push-buttons, or the scroll-buttons, um but it doesn't have that fancy solar power or the the vibrating energy mechanism. So I give it a a four. I'd give it a kinda middle of the road forUser Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: for technology.Project Manager: Yeah, I am sort of pret uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Just the fruit does me in, I mean uh it mightUser Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: it might be trendy to some, but I'm just not swallowing the fruit, so um {vocalsound} {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh also uh I would have liked to have seen the L_C_D_ screen in it. Um so yeah I'd say about four as well.Marketing: Okay. Uh personally I wi uh I think that in terms of trends, these products are quite good, like, these products are in fruit shape, because that wha people now {disfmarker} our fashion trend shows that people like everything {disfmarker} all f everything that is being advertised, like clothes, shoes, and everything is being advertised in the form of fruits and vegetables, or getting them {gap} or showing some association with them.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: So and in this way our product is good. And the second thing, now people don't want any complicated or bulky products and ours is quite simple and quite handy.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: So that is also ef that also {disfmarker}User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Our product meets the f the fashion uh trends of the market. And yes. It is cus spongy also. So they can play with it, it's quite good.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: if there is anything you think we've missed out there, then, you know, feel free to add it. Maybe {disfmarker} I mean obviously it would be bigger so there might be more space for the the slogan on the front,Project Manager: Yeah yeah.User Interface: because it's not in an ideal place right now.Project Manager: Well that's that's uh {disfmarker} Okay, so project evaluation. We have under twelve {vocalsound} Euros fifty. Project process, how do we think that went Are we happyIndustrial Designer: Oh.User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: Yeah I think we have a a winning product.Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Okay. {vocalsound} Evaluation. Oh we've been writing this up for m months.User Interface: I think it went quite smoothly.Project Manager: Uh room for creativity, were we happy with thatUser Interface: W I think we were very creative.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: No, I mea I think it means sort of individually.User Interface: Oh right, okay.Project Manager: Yes, no, maybeUser Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Okay. Groovy. So uh we're just gonna. Uh yeah, okay. Teamwork Leadership, sorry.Industrial Designer: Great leadership. {vocalsound}User Interface: Excellent leadership. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Thank you very much. You're all get you're all getting a raise. Uh teamwork. I thought went well.Industrial Designer: Yeah, yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah, everyone got enough input, I think.Project Manager: Uh and well means, yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah, we {gap} {disfmarker}Project Manager: The technical stuff was brilliant.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Let's buy more.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Uh Right. UmIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound} These pens are are neat though.Project Manager: I don't know what, new ideas found, means, to be honest.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah, these are new ideas, like glow-in-the-dark or something like that. We discussed all the new ideas, but of course we couldn't reach any proper goals, we couldn't use these {gap}, but we h we are using these scroll buttons like this. These are new ideas we And new shapes, everythingProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: . At le {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm'kay. Groovy.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: So just general thumbs up for all of us then.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Hmm.Project Manager: That kind of unfortunately is too quick.Marketing: Hmm.User Interface: Okay.Industrial Designer: Okay.User Interface: Well um.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Uh {vocalsound}. I suppose yeah. Um.Industrial Designer: Uh so let's talk about our bonuses and the raises we're getting for this, right. {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} That's it, um I think another couple of days holiday pay might be well in order for all of you.User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: Right, right.Project Manager: Uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Let's see if I can get this bloody thing to work.Industrial Designer: Uh maybe we should start cleaning up the clay.Project Manager: Whoops. {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah, maybe.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: So {disfmarker}Project Manager: Does it go back in, does it Reusable.Industrial Designer: {gap}User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: Something we should get {gap}.Project Manager: I don't know what this is but it's really really annoying.Marketing: So {vocalsound} {disfmarker} Uh Brian, have you have you finishedProject Manager: Uh-huh.Marketing: Uh mine needs also this.Project Manager: Um I have, yes.Marketing: At last mine is also the presentation.Project Manager: Huh Oh right, okay, you've got more, okay.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah, yeah.User Interface: Oh, you got a presentation,Project Manager: Sorry uh.User Interface: sorry.Industrial Designer: Oh okProject Manager: It didn't bother to tell me that on thisMarketing: SIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: thing. Is it Okay.Marketing: Uh {vocalsound} is the project evaluated, that is mine.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Doesn't tell me. {vocalsound} Oh you're doing that. {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: We evaluated ourselves, we thought we were great. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial User Interface: Okay.Industrial Designer: Okay, almost there.Project Manager: Okay. We'll sta I'll use the PowerPoint, I guess. How was that, was that funUser Interface: Mm. Very fun.Industrial Designer: Yeah, yeah.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Okay. Uh oh I've forgotten to mail you the minutes, but I will do.Industrial Designer: Okay.Marketing: Hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Upsidaisy. {vocalsound} Um {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Um we {disfmarker}Marketing: E excuse me I forgot myProject Manager: Yeah.Marketing: copy. {gap}Project Manager: Alright, okay, yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: He's gonna get his pen.User Interface: Oh right. Okay.Project Manager: Um {vocalsound} Will you guys first with your prototype um before we get to the good newsIndustrial Designer: Yeah, there's good newsProject Manager: Uh {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Oh.User Interface: Mm.Project Manager: we have budget problems.Industrial Designer: Oh. Cutbacks.Project Manager: I'm afraid you're all sacked. Oops.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: I don't even have this on. {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Okay, have you got a presentation to makeIndustrial Designer: Okay.Marketing: No, not mine yet.Project Manager: No. OkayIndustrial Designer: Oh.Project Manager: so it's just your your show.Industrial Designer: Um maybe we should bring {gap} so that the camera can see {gap}. Yeah.Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: Okay. Sure.Industrial Designer: Okay.Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: We made three for you.Project Manager: Three Oh.User Interface: Um one's based on the banana, one's based on the tomatoProject Manager: Tomato What tomato {vocalsound}User Interface: and the other one is stMarketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: I don't recall a tomato. {vocalsound}User Interface: Look. Oh yeah, well yeah, we had v some red left over.Project Manager: Ah I see, okay. {vocalsound}User Interface: So. Okay, so this is the um non to non uh no buttons one, or as mm few buttons as possible,Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: mainly speak recognition. The yellow there is the umProject Manager: Logo.User Interface: the slogan, yeah,Project Manager: Okay,

Summarize the discussion about the evaluation about the new remote controls.

Most time of the discussion of this meeting was devoted into the evaluation of the new remote controls. According to the whole team, this project was excellent because it was creative and with great leadership and teamwork. Also, the technical stuff was brilliant. Lots of new ideas were found, such as glow-in-dark, new shapes, etc. Generally, they all gave a thumb up to the new remote controls. The overall evaluation is around two.

Yeah.User Interface: Three. Go for three. That's fine.Marketing: Uh {disfmarker}Industrial Designer:'Kay. As far as the uh technology it its'got the latest trends in speech technology, but it's missing the screen, as we said, um but it does have the push-buttons, or the scroll-buttons, um but it doesn't have that fancy solar power or the the vibrating energy mechanism. So I give it a a four. I'd give it a kinda middle of the road forUser Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: for technology.Project Manager: Yeah, I am sort of pret uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Just the fruit does me in, I mean uh it mightUser Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: it might be trendy to some, but I'm just not swallowing the fruit, so um {vocalsound} {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh also uh I would have liked to have seen the L_C_D_ screen in it. Um so yeah I'd say about four as well.Marketing: Okay. Uh personally I wi uh I think that in terms of trends, these products are quite good, like, these products are in fruit shape, because that wha people now {disfmarker} our fashion trend shows that people like everything {disfmarker} all f everything that is being advertised, like clothes, shoes, and everything is being advertised in the form of fruits and vegetables, or getting them {gap} or showing some association with them.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: So and in this way our product is good. And the second thing, now people don't want any complicated or bulky products and ours is quite simple and quite handy.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: So that is also ef that also {disfmarker}User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Our product meets the f the fashion uh trends of the market. And yes. It is cus spongy also. So they can play with it, it's quite good.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: brilliant.User Interface: that we need to incorporate, it's very simple. If you do need buttons, you can flip it over, and there's some there,Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: um but mainly it's speech recognition.Project Manager: Okay, so the buttons would be like, you know individual users, or {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah and {vocalsound} yeah they might project things onto the screen which you can do on there.Project Manager: Alright, okay.User Interface: Mm I'm not sure about that. Um and this one is the one w more like the one w that we looked at earlier.Project Manager: Right.User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah, you guys can have a look at that if you want.Project Manager: That's groovy. {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {gap}Marketing: Yeah. {vocalsound} Uh can I have {gap}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Well I like the feel of it, I like the feel of it.User Interface: Yeah, sure. Um that one is {disfmarker}Marketing: Oh sorry s {vocalsound}User Interface: Oh no, it's delicate.Project Manager: At Oh dear.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: That's that's already got its stand that one. That's it stand.Project Manager: Alright, okay.User Interface: It does also lie flat, but that's the that yellow stand there represents the the charging stand.Project Manager: Okay, brilliant mm.User Interface: Um the black on the back is the slogan.Project Manager: Okay, nice and obvious there {vocalsound},User Interface: Uh yeah, that {gap} {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Well, we did think of that.Project Manager: if it's standing up, I guess, yeah.User Interface: Yeah, if it's standing up it's it's on there, but also we're gonna have the company name on the front, which is the little black kind of line in the middle.Project Manager: Oh right, okay, brilliant. Like that from its centre.User Interface: So um and that's the um transmit the L_E_D_ thing. These are the s two scroll if there is anything you think we've missed out there, then, you know, feel free to add it. Maybe {disfmarker} I mean obviously it would be bigger so there might be more space for the the slogan on the front,Project Manager: Yeah yeah.User Interface: because it's not in an ideal place right now.Project Manager: Well that's that's uh {disfmarker} Okay, so project evaluation. We have under twelve {vocalsound} Euros fifty. Project process, how do we think that went Are we happyIndustrial Designer: Oh.User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: Yeah I think we have a a winning product.Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Okay. {vocalsound} Evaluation. Oh we've been writing this up for m months.User Interface: I think it went quite smoothly.Project Manager: Uh room for creativity, were we happy with thatUser Interface: W I think we were very creative.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: No, I mea I think it means sort of individually.User Interface: Oh right, okay.Project Manager: Yes, no, maybeUser Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Okay. Groovy. So uh we're just gonna. Uh yeah, okay. Teamwork Leadership, sorry.Industrial Designer: Great leadership. {vocalsound}User Interface: Excellent leadership. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Thank you very much. You're all get you're all getting a raise. Uh teamwork. I thought went well.Industrial Designer: Yeah, yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah, everyone got enough input, I think.Project Manager: Uh and well means, yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah, we {gap} {disfmarker}Project Manager: The technical stuff was brilliant.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Let's buy more.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Uh Right. UmIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound} These pens are are neat though.Project Manager: I don't know what, new ideas found, means, to be honest.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah, these are new ideas, like glow-in-the-dark or something like that. We discussed all the new ideas, but of course we couldn't reach any proper goals, we couldn't use these {gap}, but we h we are using these scroll buttons like this. These are new ideas we And new shapes, everythingProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: . At le {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm'kay. Groovy.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: So just general thumbs up for all of us then.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Hmm.Project Manager: That kind of unfortunately is too quick.Marketing: Hmm.User Interface: Okay.Industrial Designer: Okay.User Interface: Well um.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Uh {vocalsound}. I suppose yeah. Um.Industrial Designer: Uh so let's talk about our bonuses and the raises we're getting for this, right. {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} That's it, um I think another couple of days holiday pay might be well in order for all of you.User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: Right, right.Project Manager: Uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Let's see if I can get this bloody thing to work.Industrial Designer: Uh maybe we should start cleaning up the clay.Project Manager: Whoops. {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah, maybe.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: So {disfmarker}Project Manager: Does it go back in, does it Reusable.Industrial Designer: {gap}User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: Something we should get {gap}.Project Manager: I don't know what this is but it's really really annoying.Marketing: So {vocalsound} {disfmarker} Uh Brian, have you have you finishedProject Manager: Uh-huh.Marketing: Uh mine needs also this.Project Manager: Um I have, yes.Marketing: At last mine is also the presentation.Project Manager: Huh Oh right, okay, you've got more, okay.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah, yeah.User Interface: Oh, you got a presentation,Project Manager: Sorry uh.User Interface: sorry.Industrial Designer: Oh okProject Manager: It didn't bother to tell me that on thisMarketing: SIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: thing. Is it Okay.Marketing: Uh {vocalsound} is the project evaluated, that is mine.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Doesn't tell me. {vocalsound} Oh you're doing that. {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: We evaluated ourselves, we thought we were great. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial ones which we thought could be channel up and down and volume up and down. We n were weren't sure about putting them there, because um i it's it kind of could get bashed.Project Manager: Where you're, yeah, uh were you're holding it kind of {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah. Well, if you hold it, you can {disfmarker} you all can hold it, is {disfmarker} it does actually feel quite ergonomic,Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: if you've got small hands.Project Manager: Yeah. {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Mm.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: {vocalsound} Um, obviously I don't think that's real sized {gap}.Project Manager: Yeah, okay.User Interface: It would have to be a bit bigger.Project Manager: Yeah, scale model, yeah.User Interface: Okay. Um that's a speaker at the top, so you can speak into it like a little walkie-talkie as well for speak recognition.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Um and {vocalsound} um then the buttons. Yeah kind of self-explanatory, just buttons whenever you need them. Tried to keep it simple. Oh that's the charging base prongs at the bottom.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Alright, excellent.User Interface: {vocalsound} We used those {gap}. And um then the big red button in the middle is the on and off one.Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: It's not in the traditional place,Project Manager: No.User Interface: but um it's quite an obvious place.Project Manager: It's out of the way as well, I suppose, so. Excellent.User Interface: So {vocalsound} there we go and and um we have the banana-based one too.Industrial Designer: Oh yeah, yeah.Project Manager: Yep. {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: This one is uh, I suppose for the younger audiences.User Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: A a more friendly type of {disfmarker}Project Manager: Okay, {vocalsound} so so Barney the banana {gap}.Industrial Designer: Right, right. It's to uh induce more television watching I suppose or {disfmarker}Project Manager: Ah excellent, just what we

What's the final evaluation of the project

In order to make the final evaluation, the team needed to give rating to these products. Of the design of the three fruits, the teams agreed to give two points. As for the trend, since fruits and vegetables were quite populous, the final rating was three. In terms of the company strategy, the rating was one because it perfectly conformed to the strategy. The overall evaluation is around two, which was quite good.

Yeah.User Interface: Three. Go for three. That's fine.Marketing: Uh {disfmarker}Industrial Designer:'Kay. As far as the uh technology it its'got the latest trends in speech technology, but it's missing the screen, as we said, um but it does have the push-buttons, or the scroll-buttons, um but it doesn't have that fancy solar power or the the vibrating energy mechanism. So I give it a a four. I'd give it a kinda middle of the road forUser Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: for technology.Project Manager: Yeah, I am sort of pret uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Just the fruit does me in, I mean uh it mightUser Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: it might be trendy to some, but I'm just not swallowing the fruit, so um {vocalsound} {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh also uh I would have liked to have seen the L_C_D_ screen in it. Um so yeah I'd say about four as well.Marketing: Okay. Uh personally I wi uh I think that in terms of trends, these products are quite good, like, these products are in fruit shape, because that wha people now {disfmarker} our fashion trend shows that people like everything {disfmarker} all f everything that is being advertised, like clothes, shoes, and everything is being advertised in the form of fruits and vegetables, or getting them {gap} or showing some association with them.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: So and in this way our product is good. And the second thing, now people don't want any complicated or bulky products and ours is quite simple and quite handy.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: So that is also ef that also {disfmarker}User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Our product meets the f the fashion uh trends of the market. And yes. It is cus spongy also. So they can play with it, it's quite good.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: brilliant.User Interface: that we need to incorporate, it's very simple. If you do need buttons, you can flip it over, and there's some there,Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: um but mainly it's speech recognition.Project Manager: Okay, so the buttons would be like, you know individual users, or {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah and {vocalsound} yeah they might project things onto the screen which you can do on there.Project Manager: Alright, okay.User Interface: Mm I'm not sure about that. Um and this one is the one w more like the one w that we looked at earlier.Project Manager: Right.User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah, you guys can have a look at that if you want.Project Manager: That's groovy. {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {gap}Marketing: Yeah. {vocalsound} Uh can I have {gap}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Well I like the feel of it, I like the feel of it.User Interface: Yeah, sure. Um that one is {disfmarker}Marketing: Oh sorry s {vocalsound}User Interface: Oh no, it's delicate.Project Manager: At Oh dear.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: That's that's already got its stand that one. That's it stand.Project Manager: Alright, okay.User Interface: It does also lie flat, but that's the that yellow stand there represents the the charging stand.Project Manager: Okay, brilliant mm.User Interface: Um the black on the back is the slogan.Project Manager: Okay, nice and obvious there {vocalsound},User Interface: Uh yeah, that {gap} {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Well, we did think of that.Project Manager: if it's standing up, I guess, yeah.User Interface: Yeah, if it's standing up it's it's on there, but also we're gonna have the company name on the front, which is the little black kind of line in the middle.Project Manager: Oh right, okay, brilliant. Like that from its centre.User Interface: So um and that's the um transmit the L_E_D_ thing. These are the s two scroll we h we are using these scroll buttons like this. These are new ideas we And new shapes, everythingProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: . At le {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm'kay. Groovy.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: So just general thumbs up for all of us then.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Hmm.Project Manager: That kind of unfortunately is too quick.Marketing: Hmm.User Interface: Okay.Industrial Designer: Okay.User Interface: Well um.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Uh {vocalsound}. I suppose yeah. Um.Industrial Designer: Uh so let's talk about our bonuses and the raises we're getting for this, right. {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} That's it, um I think another couple of days holiday pay might be well in order for all of you.User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: Right, right.Project Manager: Uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Let's see if I can get this bloody thing to work.Industrial Designer: Uh maybe we should start cleaning up the clay.Project Manager: Whoops. {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah, maybe.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: So {disfmarker}Project Manager: Does it go back in, does it Reusable.Industrial Designer: {gap}User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: Something we should get {gap}.Project Manager: I don't know what this is but it's really really annoying.Marketing: So {vocalsound} {disfmarker} Uh Brian, have you have you finishedProject Manager: Uh-huh.Marketing: Uh mine needs also this.Project Manager: Um I have, yes.Marketing: At last mine is also the presentation.Project Manager: Huh Oh right, okay, you've got more, okay.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah, yeah.User Interface: Oh, you got a presentation,Project Manager: Sorry uh.User Interface: sorry.Industrial Designer: Oh okProject Manager: It didn't bother to tell me that on thisMarketing: SIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: thing. Is it Okay.Marketing: Uh {vocalsound} is the project evaluated, that is mine.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Doesn't tell me. {vocalsound} Oh you're doing that. {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: We evaluated ourselves, we thought we were great. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial User Interface: Okay.Industrial Designer: Okay, almost there.Project Manager: Okay. We'll sta I'll use the PowerPoint, I guess. How was that, was that funUser Interface: Mm. Very fun.Industrial Designer: Yeah, yeah.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Okay. Uh oh I've forgotten to mail you the minutes, but I will do.Industrial Designer: Okay.Marketing: Hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Upsidaisy. {vocalsound} Um {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Um we {disfmarker}Marketing: E excuse me I forgot myProject Manager: Yeah.Marketing: copy. {gap}Project Manager: Alright, okay, yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: He's gonna get his pen.User Interface: Oh right. Okay.Project Manager: Um {vocalsound} Will you guys first with your prototype um before we get to the good newsIndustrial Designer: Yeah, there's good newsProject Manager: Uh {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Oh.User Interface: Mm.Project Manager: we have budget problems.Industrial Designer: Oh. Cutbacks.Project Manager: I'm afraid you're all sacked. Oops.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: I don't even have this on. {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Okay, have you got a presentation to makeIndustrial Designer: Okay.Marketing: No, not mine yet.Project Manager: No. OkayIndustrial Designer: Oh.Project Manager: so it's just your your show.Industrial Designer: Um maybe we should bring {gap} so that the camera can see {gap}. Yeah.Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: Okay. Sure.Industrial Designer: Okay.Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: We made three for you.Project Manager: Three Oh.User Interface: Um one's based on the banana, one's based on the tomatoProject Manager: Tomato What tomato {vocalsound}User Interface: and the other one is stMarketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: I don't recall a tomato. {vocalsound}User Interface: Look. Oh yeah, well yeah, we had v some red left over.Project Manager: Ah I see, okay. {vocalsound}User Interface: So. Okay, so this is the um non to non uh no buttons one, or as mm few buttons as possible,Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: mainly speak recognition. The yellow there is the umProject Manager: Logo.User Interface: the slogan, yeah,Project Manager: Okay, if there is anything you think we've missed out there, then, you know, feel free to add it. Maybe {disfmarker} I mean obviously it would be bigger so there might be more space for the the slogan on the front,Project Manager: Yeah yeah.User Interface: because it's not in an ideal place right now.Project Manager: Well that's that's uh {disfmarker} Okay, so project evaluation. We have under twelve {vocalsound} Euros fifty. Project process, how do we think that went Are we happyIndustrial Designer: Oh.User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: Yeah I think we have a a winning product.Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Okay. {vocalsound} Evaluation. Oh we've been writing this up for m months.User Interface: I think it went quite smoothly.Project Manager: Uh room for creativity, were we happy with thatUser Interface: W I think we were very creative.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: No, I mea I think it means sort of individually.User Interface: Oh right, okay.Project Manager: Yes, no, maybeUser Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Okay. Groovy. So uh we're just gonna. Uh yeah, okay. Teamwork Leadership, sorry.Industrial Designer: Great leadership. {vocalsound}User Interface: Excellent leadership. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Thank you very much. You're all get you're all getting a raise. Uh teamwork. I thought went well.Industrial Designer: Yeah, yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah, everyone got enough input, I think.Project Manager: Uh and well means, yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah, we {gap} {disfmarker}Project Manager: The technical stuff was brilliant.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Let's buy more.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Uh Right. UmIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound} These pens are are neat though.Project Manager: I don't know what, new ideas found, means, to be honest.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah, these are new ideas, like glow-in-the-dark or something like that. We discussed all the new ideas, but of course we couldn't reach any proper goals, we couldn't use these {gap}, but

Why did the team have different opinions when evaluating the design of three fruits

Basically, the dissent mainly came from Marketing. According to Marketing, the company failed to offer enough options to the customers (only three options). Therefore, customers were limited. By limiting the customers, sales and profits would definitely be limited as well. However, User Interface disagreed with him because he believed that electronics were not the same as other products, for example chocolate. There were not always quite so many choices in electronics.

brilliant.User Interface: that we need to incorporate, it's very simple. If you do need buttons, you can flip it over, and there's some there,Project Manager: Okay.User Interface: um but mainly it's speech recognition.Project Manager: Okay, so the buttons would be like, you know individual users, or {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah and {vocalsound} yeah they might project things onto the screen which you can do on there.Project Manager: Alright, okay.User Interface: Mm I'm not sure about that. Um and this one is the one w more like the one w that we looked at earlier.Project Manager: Right.User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah, you guys can have a look at that if you want.Project Manager: That's groovy. {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {gap}Marketing: Yeah. {vocalsound} Uh can I have {gap}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Well I like the feel of it, I like the feel of it.User Interface: Yeah, sure. Um that one is {disfmarker}Marketing: Oh sorry s {vocalsound}User Interface: Oh no, it's delicate.Project Manager: At Oh dear.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: That's that's already got its stand that one. That's it stand.Project Manager: Alright, okay.User Interface: It does also lie flat, but that's the that yellow stand there represents the the charging stand.Project Manager: Okay, brilliant mm.User Interface: Um the black on the back is the slogan.Project Manager: Okay, nice and obvious there {vocalsound},User Interface: Uh yeah, that {gap} {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Well, we did think of that.Project Manager: if it's standing up, I guess, yeah.User Interface: Yeah, if it's standing up it's it's on there, but also we're gonna have the company name on the front, which is the little black kind of line in the middle.Project Manager: Oh right, okay, brilliant. Like that from its centre.User Interface: So um and that's the um transmit the L_E_D_ thing. These are the s two scroll Yeah.User Interface: Three. Go for three. That's fine.Marketing: Uh {disfmarker}Industrial Designer:'Kay. As far as the uh technology it its'got the latest trends in speech technology, but it's missing the screen, as we said, um but it does have the push-buttons, or the scroll-buttons, um but it doesn't have that fancy solar power or the the vibrating energy mechanism. So I give it a a four. I'd give it a kinda middle of the road forUser Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: for technology.Project Manager: Yeah, I am sort of pret uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Just the fruit does me in, I mean uh it mightUser Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: it might be trendy to some, but I'm just not swallowing the fruit, so um {vocalsound} {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh also uh I would have liked to have seen the L_C_D_ screen in it. Um so yeah I'd say about four as well.Marketing: Okay. Uh personally I wi uh I think that in terms of trends, these products are quite good, like, these products are in fruit shape, because that wha people now {disfmarker} our fashion trend shows that people like everything {disfmarker} all f everything that is being advertised, like clothes, shoes, and everything is being advertised in the form of fruits and vegetables, or getting them {gap} or showing some association with them.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: So and in this way our product is good. And the second thing, now people don't want any complicated or bulky products and ours is quite simple and quite handy.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: So that is also ef that also {disfmarker}User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: Our product meets the f the fashion uh trends of the market. And yes. It is cus spongy also. So they can play with it, it's quite good.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: if there is anything you think we've missed out there, then, you know, feel free to add it. Maybe {disfmarker} I mean obviously it would be bigger so there might be more space for the the slogan on the front,Project Manager: Yeah yeah.User Interface: because it's not in an ideal place right now.Project Manager: Well that's that's uh {disfmarker} Okay, so project evaluation. We have under twelve {vocalsound} Euros fifty. Project process, how do we think that went Are we happyIndustrial Designer: Oh.User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: Yeah I think we have a a winning product.Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Okay. {vocalsound} Evaluation. Oh we've been writing this up for m months.User Interface: I think it went quite smoothly.Project Manager: Uh room for creativity, were we happy with thatUser Interface: W I think we were very creative.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: No, I mea I think it means sort of individually.User Interface: Oh right, okay.Project Manager: Yes, no, maybeUser Interface: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Okay. Groovy. So uh we're just gonna. Uh yeah, okay. Teamwork Leadership, sorry.Industrial Designer: Great leadership. {vocalsound}User Interface: Excellent leadership. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Thank you very much. You're all get you're all getting a raise. Uh teamwork. I thought went well.Industrial Designer: Yeah, yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah, everyone got enough input, I think.Project Manager: Uh and well means, yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah, we {gap} {disfmarker}Project Manager: The technical stuff was brilliant.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Let's buy more.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Uh Right. UmIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound} These pens are are neat though.Project Manager: I don't know what, new ideas found, means, to be honest.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah, these are new ideas, like glow-in-the-dark or something like that. We discussed all the new ideas, but of course we couldn't reach any proper goals, we couldn't use these {gap}, but we h we are using these scroll buttons like this. These are new ideas we And new shapes, everythingProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Mm-hmm.Marketing: . At le {vocalsound}Project Manager: Mm'kay. Groovy.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: So just general thumbs up for all of us then.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Hmm.Project Manager: That kind of unfortunately is too quick.Marketing: Hmm.User Interface: Okay.Industrial Designer: Okay.User Interface: Well um.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Uh {vocalsound}. I suppose yeah. Um.Industrial Designer: Uh so let's talk about our bonuses and the raises we're getting for this, right. {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} That's it, um I think another couple of days holiday pay might be well in order for all of you.User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}User Interface: Mm.Industrial Designer: Right, right.Project Manager: Uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Let's see if I can get this bloody thing to work.Industrial Designer: Uh maybe we should start cleaning up the clay.Project Manager: Whoops. {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah, maybe.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: So {disfmarker}Project Manager: Does it go back in, does it Reusable.Industrial Designer: {gap}User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: Something we should get {gap}.Project Manager: I don't know what this is but it's really really annoying.Marketing: So {vocalsound} {disfmarker} Uh Brian, have you have you finishedProject Manager: Uh-huh.Marketing: Uh mine needs also this.Project Manager: Um I have, yes.Marketing: At last mine is also the presentation.Project Manager: Huh Oh right, okay, you've got more, okay.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah, yeah.User Interface: Oh, you got a presentation,Project Manager: Sorry uh.User Interface: sorry.Industrial Designer: Oh okProject Manager: It didn't bother to tell me that on thisMarketing: SIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: thing. Is it Okay.Marketing: Uh {vocalsound} is the project evaluated, that is mine.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Doesn't tell me. {vocalsound} Oh you're doing that. {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: We evaluated ourselves, we thought we were great. {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial User Interface: Okay.Industrial Designer: Okay, almost there.Project Manager: Okay. We'll sta I'll use the PowerPoint, I guess. How was that, was that funUser Interface: Mm. Very fun.Industrial Designer: Yeah, yeah.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Okay. Uh oh I've forgotten to mail you the minutes, but I will do.Industrial Designer: Okay.Marketing: Hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} Upsidaisy. {vocalsound} Um {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Um we {disfmarker}Marketing: E excuse me I forgot myProject Manager: Yeah.Marketing: copy. {gap}Project Manager: Alright, okay, yeah.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: He's gonna get his pen.User Interface: Oh right. Okay.Project Manager: Um {vocalsound} Will you guys first with your prototype um before we get to the good newsIndustrial Designer: Yeah, there's good newsProject Manager: Uh {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Oh.User Interface: Mm.Project Manager: we have budget problems.Industrial Designer: Oh. Cutbacks.Project Manager: I'm afraid you're all sacked. Oops.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: I don't even have this on. {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Hmm.Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Okay, have you got a presentation to makeIndustrial Designer: Okay.Marketing: No, not mine yet.Project Manager: No. OkayIndustrial Designer: Oh.Project Manager: so it's just your your show.Industrial Designer: Um maybe we should bring {gap} so that the camera can see {gap}. Yeah.Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: Okay. Sure.Industrial Designer: Okay.Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: We made three for you.Project Manager: Three Oh.User Interface: Um one's based on the banana, one's based on the tomatoProject Manager: Tomato What tomato {vocalsound}User Interface: and the other one is stMarketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: I don't recall a tomato. {vocalsound}User Interface: Look. Oh yeah, well yeah, we had v some red left over.Project Manager: Ah I see, okay. {vocalsound}User Interface: So. Okay, so this is the um non to non uh no buttons one, or as mm few buttons as possible,Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: mainly speak recognition. The yellow there is the umProject Manager: Logo.User Interface: the slogan, yeah,Project Manager: Okay,

Summarize the whole meeting.

In this meeting, the team was very satisfied with the three prototypes presented. However, they had to take the budget limits into consideration. Their current cost per remote control was fourteen point six Euros, while the budget required them to cut two more Euros. Therefore, a series of changes were done in order to meet the criteria, such as making the remotes flattened. In the end, the team was asked to make an evaluation about the project. All of them were very satisfied with the final product.

gonna I'm gonna try to market it at a much higher price. I need to make it special with a high price tag. I don't want to make it economically uh g uh competitive.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: I want I want to market it as exclusive. So I would market this product it {disfmarker} at eighty-nine Euros and come up with some really {vocalsound} beautiful exterior design or something th but but I don't think we have that flexibility.Project Manager: But i if design if design is cheap and functionality is basic, then twenty-five Euros is probably a high price for a commoner garden {disfmarker} stan standard T_V_ so the place {disfmarker} uh remote the then the place we're going to justify that cost is through through design through making it a a sleek elegant {vocalsound} high-priced basic remote. Does that make sense, huhMarketing: No I no I I understand what you say,Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: but what I'm what I'm, okay {disfmarker} we probably need to move along,Project Manager: Yeah we probably should.Marketing: but my my concern is trying to find a marketing niche for this product,Project Manager: We we're doing alright for time.Marketing: and if I'm coming in with a with with twenty-five Euros, which is mid-market price, um then what am I going to give these people for thisProject Manager: Yeah.Marketing: So that's just my question, but we can keep talking.Project Manager: Okay. Sorry that kinda cut into you there.Industrial Designer: No just I I would I would advocate for continuing teletext and those would be the basic commands. Um as for, you know, the the case design uh maybe I'll come up with more concrete ideas. Right now it's just the idea of simplicity and slickness, cute and small um {disfmarker}User Interface: Right. I'm just thinking you know agree with you. I really do.Project Manager: So we really can't chase that.Marketing: That's why I say I quest I q I question the marketability of the product. I really question where we create the demand.User Interface: So I think what we {disfmarker}Project Manager: We're really looking for something basic.User Interface: So that's what I'm saying {disfmarker}Project Manager: The the one thing that that that you said really struck a chord with me here in that we're we're carrying the corporate identity with the product, but we're actually looking for a large profit at the same time where I'd be inclined to go back to upper-level management and say like let's just cut down our profit expected on this product because we are actually branding our company here. We're selling more than just the product. We're trying to get mind-share about uh Real Reaction to to the people who are gonna buy consumer electronics. We want people to eventually say, oh that's that's Real Reaction that's a good m make. It's reliable. And and we're gonna make it {disfmarker} we're gonna win mind-share by uh either being a fantastic productIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or for it working, it just being good, reasonable-priced, {vocalsound} and solid. So if we can make {disfmarker} if we can put an emphasis here on it not breaking I think that's in itself an extremely {vocalsound} big thing.User Interface: Mm-hmm. I think that's big.Marketing: W {vocalsound} okay if you if you drop the cost, now if you make if you make {disfmarker} go to the other side of the cost scale, and you make it less expensive, then all of a sudden now we're going into an a a new market area. So we can say low-cost uh uh um uh good design, beautiful, wa-da-da-da-da-da.Industrial Designer: thing better than {disfmarker}Project Manager: Well tha that first point could uh also be an op opportunity because in seeing that teletext is becoming outdated, some sort remote control that can work with the Internet {disfmarker} {vocalsound} there is the opportunity that's presented, I guess.Marketing: {vocalsound} Right. Yeah. No, I I agree with you.Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: So what I'm talking about is I see that one side we're eliminating something so we have to come up with another side which is, what are we gonna be targeting our market uh that {vocalsound} identifies our product as better than {disfmarker} because it doesn't have teletext it has ta-ta-ta-ta-ta.Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: So that's that's that was my reactions.Project Manager: Yeah. but but we are sort of being dictated that this should only be for the television.Marketing: Yeah yeah.Project Manager: So we're quite fixed. So we're really probably, in terms of marketing, are looking for that's uh that's a cost winner rather than a fantastic new feature product.Marketing: Yep.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Yeah bu but we we're designing only the remote,Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Okay.Industrial Designer: we not design the T_V_.Project Manager: Hmm.Industrial Designer: So uh we're gonna be removing the teletext out of any T_V_ that we {disfmarker} people use our remote with.Marketing: Yeah.'Kay.Project Manager: Hmm.Marketing: That's right.Industrial Designer: So it's kind of a stupid decision.Marketing: I think we take with you.Project Manager: But there's also the potential for mark there's a market here for our lost teletext.User Interface: Right.Project Manager: For example someone that just goes to the shop that wants a replacement {disfmarker} wants it as {vocalsound} cheap as possible. Twenty-five Euros is the selling price, we really have to innovate here I guess.Marketing: That's what I'm that's what I'm talking about is is that we have to find something that is Good design.Project Manager: We only have a few minutes left.Marketing: But what I'm saying is right now we're middle market.Project Manager: Is twenty-five Euros a mid-market price for a remoteMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: YeahUser Interface: I think so, yeah.Marketing: for for multi for a multi-function remote, that's a mid-market price. In a discount right now you can buy'em on sale sometimes for about about uh eighteen, nineteen Euro,Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: and that's for the multi-functions, uh D_V_D_, V_C_R_, uh catch-alls. And and they have'em in a little box in the middle, and and this is the consciousness that most people have about replacement remote controls. So to me {vocalsound}, to market this a t only a television remote control we have to change consciousness. We have to have something that will change people's thinking to identify this as advantageous, and I don't know what that is. It's gotta be low-cost or high-cost with with special design features.Project Manager: Well I'd be inclined to say, if we can make the design better than any comparable remote while reducing the cost, then that's the way we really should play it. If we can take it down to you know fifteen rather than twenty-five and make a low profit-margin on it,User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: but we're really doing that to sell the brand. Yep we have five minutes left. Uh rather th uh to to to sell for Real Reactions.Marketing: Or my d {vocalsound}Project Manager: And I can communicate this to to the more senior {vocalsound} uh mm people within the company here to to get a reaction. {vocalsound}User Interface: What about um the idea that I had with the cradle How do you feel about thatProject Manager: Well how does everybody feelUser Interface: Or how does everybody feelMarketing: {vocalsound} I mean I computers and and andProject Manager: Bu uh.Marketing: {disfmarker}'Cause we are designing something for a television, okay.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: I'll communicate that back to those guys there a a and th the message really we wanna be sending to them is that, although teletext may become outdated w there's no l logic in not having it in there anyway i if it doesn't affect the price.User Interface: Right it's just notIndustrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: Um but I I think what they're pushing us towards here is in terms of thinking of ways to future-proof our system for future systems that have something else other than teletext maybe.User Interface: {disfmarker} Yeah.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: We are selling it to an existing market.Project Manager: I dunno I'm {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yeah but we're not putting some {disfmarker} there's no no putting anything in in the place of teletext.Marketing: That's {disfmarker}Project Manager: Mm'kay.Marketing: Yeah,Industrial Designer: That's the problem.Marketing: and and, yeah, and and we're also {vocalsound} marketing a product. It's {disfmarker} what I'm seeing is a is a mid-range cost product.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: So so w we can't go and pump a whole bunch of technology into this thingProject Manager: Yeah.Marketing: because all of a sudden we are gonna have cost overruns. So if we drop {disfmarker} if we are gonna choose to drop teletext, again what are we adding to the product that makes it marketableProject Manager: Hmm. So if we're keeping it basic we're loo loo what we're looking to sell it basically is it's uh just being very easy to use, looking exceptionally good, that sort of thing.'Cause we really don't have anything else there, do weIndustrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: I don't I don't see it, and to me if I'm gonna market a product for b for beauty for for design I'm

Summarize the discussion about basic components and the cost.

The basic components included power source, user interface, a programmable digital signal processor, on-off switch, encryption codes for the different modes of TVs, and memory system. Then User Interface presented the basic layout of how the remote would work. In terms of the cost, the most costly component was the chip and the casing would be expensive as well. LED, the transistors and everything else were pretty cheap. The price of the chip depended on what functionality the product would have and how much the battery capacity and storage would be. For the moment, they didn't have a ballpark figure.

with all these universal remotes that are out there, how many people {vocalsound} how many people actually use every feature that ar you know i like these trainable remotes and things like that, where, you know, it's just so confusing to do {vocalsound} to use all these functions. Where I think the largest portion of the market is just gonna {disfmarker} you know they lost their T_V_ remote, they need another one that'll work with their T_V_. They want something that looks nice, that that that isn't gonna break when they drop it, that you know that maybe it's it's ergonomic, it feels good in your hand, something like that.Project Manager: Mm.User Interface: I think that's gonna be where you're gonna find the biggest, you know, market share.Project Manager: So we are looking for something that looks good and just works, rather than looking for any special features. Is that {disfmarker}User Interface: I think the more bells and whistles we add, it's just gonna cut into our into our profits.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Yeah.User Interface: Because I think as we as we add costs for things like uh {disfmarker} for like if we add the voice recognition and things like that, I think {vocalsound} you know what percentage of the of the um of the market is actually gonna use thatProject Manager: Mm.User Interface: Maybe five percent, you know,Industrial Designer: Yeah mm.Project Manager: But we can talk a little bit more potentially in the marketing marketing presentation about this.User Interface: and how much {disfmarker} Right. Yeah okay.Project Manager: Be a good idea.User Interface: I'm sorry.Project Manager: Uh sorry, I didn't mean to cut in {vocalsound}.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah.User Interface: Sorry boss {vocalsound}.Project Manager: I'm not the boss {vocalsound}. Okay.Marketing: Oh P Pedro, I just want to say quickly I I would really agree with you. I really do.Project Manager: So we really can't chase that.Marketing: That's why I say I quest I q I question the marketability of the product. I really question where we create the demand.User Interface: So I think what we {disfmarker}Project Manager: We're really looking for something basic.User Interface: So that's what I'm saying {disfmarker}Project Manager: The the one thing that that that you said really struck a chord with me here in that we're we're carrying the corporate identity with the product, but we're actually looking for a large profit at the same time where I'd be inclined to go back to upper-level management and say like let's just cut down our profit expected on this product because we are actually branding our company here. We're selling more than just the product. We're trying to get mind-share about uh Real Reaction to to the people who are gonna buy consumer electronics. We want people to eventually say, oh that's that's Real Reaction that's a good m make. It's reliable. And and we're gonna make it {disfmarker} we're gonna win mind-share by uh either being a fantastic productIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or for it working, it just being good, reasonable-priced, {vocalsound} and solid. So if we can make {disfmarker} if we can put an emphasis here on it not breaking I think that's in itself an extremely {vocalsound} big thing.User Interface: Mm-hmm. I think that's big.Marketing: W {vocalsound} okay if you if you drop the cost, now if you make if you make {disfmarker} go to the other side of the cost scale, and you make it less expensive, then all of a sudden now we're going into an a a new market area. So we can say low-cost uh uh um uh good design, beautiful, wa-da-da-da-da-da.Industrial Designer: Good design.Project Manager: We only have a few minutes left.Marketing: But what I'm saying is right now we're middle market.Project Manager: Is twenty-five Euros a mid-market price for a remoteMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: YeahUser Interface: I think so, yeah.Marketing: for for multi for a multi-function remote, that's a mid-market price. In a discount right now you can buy'em on sale sometimes for about about uh eighteen, nineteen Euro,Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: and that's for the multi-functions, uh D_V_D_, V_C_R_, uh catch-alls. And and they have'em in a little box in the middle, and and this is the consciousness that most people have about replacement remote controls. So to me {vocalsound}, to market this a t only a television remote control we have to change consciousness. We have to have something that will change people's thinking to identify this as advantageous, and I don't know what that is. It's gotta be low-cost or high-cost with with special design features.Project Manager: Well I'd be inclined to say, if we can make the design better than any comparable remote while reducing the cost, then that's the way we really should play it. If we can take it down to you know fifteen rather than twenty-five and make a low profit-margin on it,User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: but we're really doing that to sell the brand. Yep we have five minutes left. Uh rather th uh to to to sell for Real Reactions.Marketing: Or my d {vocalsound}Project Manager: And I can communicate this to to the more senior {vocalsound} uh mm people within the company here to to get a reaction. {vocalsound}User Interface: What about um the idea that I had with the cradle How do you feel about thatProject Manager: Well how does everybody feelUser Interface: Or how does everybody feelMarketing: {vocalsound} I mean I the television at the photo-transistor. So {vocalsound} those are the basic components that need to go into this and everything else is pretty much uh open to move around.Marketing: Now is {disfmarker} would this be {vocalsound} considered just a standard uh um {disfmarker}User Interface: I think any desMarketing: This is not this is not cutting edge technology we're talking here.User Interface: No.Marketing: We're talking about existing technology.User Interface: Right I think {disfmarker}Marketing: Nothing is being modified or upgraded or new discoveries.User Interface: Yeah this is just {disfmarker} this is just a basic layout of ev {vocalsound} of all the components that w w are gonna be absolutely necessary f to have a working remote. We can add things in like if we wanted some voice recognition, I mean that {vocalsound} I mean {vocalsound} that you can kinda say would {vocalsound} would fall under the user interface and the digital signal processing chip.Marketing: Okay. Okay.Project Manager: Do we have an idea of costs of different componentsUser Interface: Um well the most the most costly components are gonna be the chip and the uh th it could als basically the user interface and the casing are gonna be expensive as well.Project Manager:'Kay.User Interface: Um the L_E_D_ and the the transistors and everything else are you know they're they're pretty cheap. So depending on what we want our functionality to be, um the chip could be expensive or it could be cheap.Project Manager: Mm'kay.User Interface: Um depending on the n amount of memory we need in there and stuff like that and h and h {vocalsound} you know how much power.Project Manager: Do we have any ballpark figures for that yet No.User Interface: Uh I don't have any figures right now.Project Manager:'Kay.User Interface: We uh we have to wait until we get to computers and and andProject Manager: Bu uh.Marketing: {disfmarker}'Cause we are designing something for a television, okay.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: I'll communicate that back to those guys there a a and th the message really we wanna be sending to them is that, although teletext may become outdated w there's no l logic in not having it in there anyway i if it doesn't affect the price.User Interface: Right it's just notIndustrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: Um but I I think what they're pushing us towards here is in terms of thinking of ways to future-proof our system for future systems that have something else other than teletext maybe.User Interface: {disfmarker} Yeah.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: We are selling it to an existing market.Project Manager: I dunno I'm {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yeah but we're not putting some {disfmarker} there's no no putting anything in in the place of teletext.Marketing: That's {disfmarker}Project Manager: Mm'kay.Marketing: Yeah,Industrial Designer: That's the problem.Marketing: and and, yeah, and and we're also {vocalsound} marketing a product. It's {disfmarker} what I'm seeing is a is a mid-range cost product.Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: So so w we can't go and pump a whole bunch of technology into this thingProject Manager: Yeah.Marketing: because all of a sudden we are gonna have cost overruns. So if we drop {disfmarker} if we are gonna choose to drop teletext, again what are we adding to the product that makes it marketableProject Manager: Hmm. So if we're keeping it basic we're loo loo what we're looking to sell it basically is it's uh just being very easy to use, looking exceptionally good, that sort of thing.'Cause we really don't have anything else there, do weIndustrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: I don't I don't see it, and to me if I'm gonna market a product for b for beauty for for design I'm

Summarize the discussion about functional design and user interface design.

The group agreed that the product should be good-looking and branded with their company logo. Industrial Designer thought they should keep the functions simple and basic and aimed at the exterior design. As for the teletext, Project Manager had intended to remove it from their new product, but considering the popularity of teletext, they decided to keep it since it wouldn't affect the price anyway. Besides, the product was demanded to be only for TV, but Marketing thought they should design an all-in-one ultimate remote control which would be easier to sell.

agree with you. I really do.Project Manager: So we really can't chase that.Marketing: That's why I say I quest I q I question the marketability of the product. I really question where we create the demand.User Interface: So I think what we {disfmarker}Project Manager: We're really looking for something basic.User Interface: So that's what I'm saying {disfmarker}Project Manager: The the one thing that that that you said really struck a chord with me here in that we're we're carrying the corporate identity with the product, but we're actually looking for a large profit at the same time where I'd be inclined to go back to upper-level management and say like let's just cut down our profit expected on this product because we are actually branding our company here. We're selling more than just the product. We're trying to get mind-share about uh Real Reaction to to the people who are gonna buy consumer electronics. We want people to eventually say, oh that's that's Real Reaction that's a good m make. It's reliable. And and we're gonna make it {disfmarker} we're gonna win mind-share by uh either being a fantastic productIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or for it working, it just being good, reasonable-priced, {vocalsound} and solid. So if we can make {disfmarker} if we can put an emphasis here on it not breaking I think that's in itself an extremely {vocalsound} big thing.User Interface: Mm-hmm. I think that's big.Marketing: W {vocalsound} okay if you if you drop the cost, now if you make if you make {disfmarker} go to the other side of the cost scale, and you make it less expensive, then all of a sudden now we're going into an a a new market area. So we can say low-cost uh uh um uh good design, beautiful, wa-da-da-da-da-da.Industrial Designer: {disfmarker} I I think it's a good opportunity for the user design {disfmarker} or for {disfmarker} not just for the user design, but also for the {disfmarker} just for the look and feel of the remote as as a whole. You know you could have some kind of neat little, you know, {vocalsound} a sexy design for d a cradle and the remote itself.Marketing: {vocalsound} Blah, I like it. I like the idea, but we're talking about {disfmarker} in cost is gonna probably double.User Interface: It w it would increase the cost.Marketing: But boy, we can sell this thing, because there's no batteries, it's environmentally sensitive, i we can identify it as a safer product in some form.User Interface: And you could page the remote if you lose it. Maybe there's a button on the cradle.Marketing: Yep, that's right. I really seeProject Manager: Now the the question is can we make this for less than twelve-fifty perMarketing: But the cost i No no. No no, we have t we have to change the end cost.Project Manager: We we well do we necessarily have to change the end cost because uh {vocalsound} Can we dl can we do that without {vocalsound} uh changing it twelve-fifty per product, if we basically can sell more based on thisMarketing: There's uh {disfmarker} I mean I don't see it anyway. Yeah, that's gonna be up to these guys.User Interface: WellMarketing: I {vocalsound} {disfmarker} my reaction is no, butUser Interface: {vocalsound} what I can do is I can d look into ho well Pedro and I can look into how much this might increase our our costsProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: and you can look into what kind of effect an increased cost is gonna have on our on our final numbers.Project Manager: Yeah we we can with all these universal remotes that are out there, how many people {vocalsound} how many people actually use every feature that ar you know i like these trainable remotes and things like that, where, you know, it's just so confusing to do {vocalsound} to use all these functions. Where I think the largest portion of the market is just gonna {disfmarker} you know they lost their T_V_ remote, they need another one that'll work with their T_V_. They want something that looks nice, that that that isn't gonna break when they drop it, that you know that maybe it's it's ergonomic, it feels good in your hand, something like that.Project Manager: Mm.User Interface: I think that's gonna be where you're gonna find the biggest, you know, market share.Project Manager: So we are looking for something that looks good and just works, rather than looking for any special features. Is that {disfmarker}User Interface: I think the more bells and whistles we add, it's just gonna cut into our into our profits.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Yeah.User Interface: Because I think as we as we add costs for things like uh {disfmarker} for like if we add the voice recognition and things like that, I think {vocalsound} you know what percentage of the of the um of the market is actually gonna use thatProject Manager: Mm.User Interface: Maybe five percent, you know,Industrial Designer: Yeah mm.Project Manager: But we can talk a little bit more potentially in the marketing marketing presentation about this.User Interface: and how much {disfmarker} Right. Yeah okay.Project Manager: Be a good idea.User Interface: I'm sorry.Project Manager: Uh sorry, I didn't mean to cut in {vocalsound}.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah.User Interface: Sorry boss {vocalsound}.Project Manager: I'm not the boss {vocalsound}. Okay.Marketing: Oh P Pedro, I just want to say quickly I I would really thing better than {disfmarker}Project Manager: Well tha that first point could uh also be an op opportunity because in seeing that teletext is becoming outdated, some sort remote control that can work with the Internet {disfmarker} {vocalsound} there is the opportunity that's presented, I guess.Marketing: {vocalsound} Right. Yeah. No, I I agree with you.Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: So what I'm talking about is I see that one side we're eliminating something so we have to come up with another side which is, what are we gonna be targeting our market uh that {vocalsound} identifies our product as better than {disfmarker} because it doesn't have teletext it has ta-ta-ta-ta-ta.Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: So that's that's that was my reactions.Project Manager: Yeah. but but we are sort of being dictated that this should only be for the television.Marketing: Yeah yeah.Project Manager: So we're quite fixed. So we're really probably, in terms of marketing, are looking for that's uh that's a cost winner rather than a fantastic new feature product.Marketing: Yep.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Yeah bu but we we're designing only the remote,Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Okay.Industrial Designer: we not design the T_V_.Project Manager: Hmm.Industrial Designer: So uh we're gonna be removing the teletext out of any T_V_ that we {disfmarker} people use our remote with.Marketing: Yeah.'Kay.Project Manager: Hmm.Marketing: That's right.Industrial Designer: So it's kind of a stupid decision.Marketing: I think we take with you.Project Manager: But there's also the potential for mark there's a market here for our lost teletext.User Interface: Right.Project Manager: For example someone that just goes to the shop that wants a replacement {disfmarker} wants it as {vocalsound} cheap as possible. Twenty-five Euros is the selling price, we really have to innovate here I guess.Marketing: That's what I'm that's what I'm talking about is is that we have to find something that is Good design.Project Manager: We only have a few minutes left.Marketing: But what I'm saying is right now we're middle market.Project Manager: Is twenty-five Euros a mid-market price for a remoteMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: YeahUser Interface: I think so, yeah.Marketing: for for multi for a multi-function remote, that's a mid-market price. In a discount right now you can buy'em on sale sometimes for about about uh eighteen, nineteen Euro,Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: and that's for the multi-functions, uh D_V_D_, V_C_R_, uh catch-alls. And and they have'em in a little box in the middle, and and this is the consciousness that most people have about replacement remote controls. So to me {vocalsound}, to market this a t only a television remote control we have to change consciousness. We have to have something that will change people's thinking to identify this as advantageous, and I don't know what that is. It's gotta be low-cost or high-cost with with special design features.Project Manager: Well I'd be inclined to say, if we can make the design better than any comparable remote while reducing the cost, then that's the way we really should play it. If we can take it down to you know fifteen rather than twenty-five and make a low profit-margin on it,User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: but we're really doing that to sell the brand. Yep we have five minutes left. Uh rather th uh to to to sell for Real Reactions.Marketing: Or my d {vocalsound}Project Manager: And I can communicate this to to the more senior {vocalsound} uh mm people within the company here to to get a reaction. {vocalsound}User Interface: What about um the idea that I had with the cradle How do you feel about thatProject Manager: Well how does everybody feelUser Interface: Or how does everybody feelMarketing: {vocalsound} I mean I

What did Marketing think of the proposal of eliminating teletext technology from their product

Marketing disapproved of this proposal because though teletext was becoming outdated as Project Manager said, more than eighty percent of the current televisions were still teletext and people were very comfortable with the idea of having and using teletext. Besides, Marketing couldn't understand why the advent of the Internet would eliminate the need for teletext. Even so, if they were to remove the teletext from the controller, they had to bring something very attractive to take the place of it.

Good design.Project Manager: We only have a few minutes left.Marketing: But what I'm saying is right now we're middle market.Project Manager: Is twenty-five Euros a mid-market price for a remoteMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: YeahUser Interface: I think so, yeah.Marketing: for for multi for a multi-function remote, that's a mid-market price. In a discount right now you can buy'em on sale sometimes for about about uh eighteen, nineteen Euro,Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: and that's for the multi-functions, uh D_V_D_, V_C_R_, uh catch-alls. And and they have'em in a little box in the middle, and and this is the consciousness that most people have about replacement remote controls. So to me {vocalsound}, to market this a t only a television remote control we have to change consciousness. We have to have something that will change people's thinking to identify this as advantageous, and I don't know what that is. It's gotta be low-cost or high-cost with with special design features.Project Manager: Well I'd be inclined to say, if we can make the design better than any comparable remote while reducing the cost, then that's the way we really should play it. If we can take it down to you know fifteen rather than twenty-five and make a low profit-margin on it,User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: but we're really doing that to sell the brand. Yep we have five minutes left. Uh rather th uh to to to sell for Real Reactions.Marketing: Or my d {vocalsound}Project Manager: And I can communicate this to to the more senior {vocalsound} uh mm people within the company here to to get a reaction. {vocalsound}User Interface: What about um the idea that I had with the cradle How do you feel about thatProject Manager: Well how does everybody feelUser Interface: Or how does everybody feelMarketing: {vocalsound} I mean I with all these universal remotes that are out there, how many people {vocalsound} how many people actually use every feature that ar you know i like these trainable remotes and things like that, where, you know, it's just so confusing to do {vocalsound} to use all these functions. Where I think the largest portion of the market is just gonna {disfmarker} you know they lost their T_V_ remote, they need another one that'll work with their T_V_. They want something that looks nice, that that that isn't gonna break when they drop it, that you know that maybe it's it's ergonomic, it feels good in your hand, something like that.Project Manager: Mm.User Interface: I think that's gonna be where you're gonna find the biggest, you know, market share.Project Manager: So we are looking for something that looks good and just works, rather than looking for any special features. Is that {disfmarker}User Interface: I think the more bells and whistles we add, it's just gonna cut into our into our profits.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Yeah.User Interface: Because I think as we as we add costs for things like uh {disfmarker} for like if we add the voice recognition and things like that, I think {vocalsound} you know what percentage of the of the um of the market is actually gonna use thatProject Manager: Mm.User Interface: Maybe five percent, you know,Industrial Designer: Yeah mm.Project Manager: But we can talk a little bit more potentially in the marketing marketing presentation about this.User Interface: and how much {disfmarker} Right. Yeah okay.Project Manager: Be a good idea.User Interface: I'm sorry.Project Manager: Uh sorry, I didn't mean to cut in {vocalsound}.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah.User Interface: Sorry boss {vocalsound}.Project Manager: I'm not the boss {vocalsound}. Okay.Marketing: Oh P Pedro, I just want to say quickly I I would really agree with you. I really do.Project Manager: So we really can't chase that.Marketing: That's why I say I quest I q I question the marketability of the product. I really question where we create the demand.User Interface: So I think what we {disfmarker}Project Manager: We're really looking for something basic.User Interface: So that's what I'm saying {disfmarker}Project Manager: The the one thing that that that you said really struck a chord with me here in that we're we're carrying the corporate identity with the product, but we're actually looking for a large profit at the same time where I'd be inclined to go back to upper-level management and say like let's just cut down our profit expected on this product because we are actually branding our company here. We're selling more than just the product. We're trying to get mind-share about uh Real Reaction to to the people who are gonna buy consumer electronics. We want people to eventually say, oh that's that's Real Reaction that's a good m make. It's reliable. And and we're gonna make it {disfmarker} we're gonna win mind-share by uh either being a fantastic productIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or for it working, it just being good, reasonable-priced, {vocalsound} and solid. So if we can make {disfmarker} if we can put an emphasis here on it not breaking I think that's in itself an extremely {vocalsound} big thing.User Interface: Mm-hmm. I think that's big.Marketing: W {vocalsound} okay if you if you drop the cost, now if you make if you make {disfmarker} go to the other side of the cost scale, and you make it less expensive, then all of a sudden now we're going into an a a new market area. So we can say low-cost uh uh um uh good design, beautiful, wa-da-da-da-da-da.Industrial Designer: the television at the photo-transistor. So {vocalsound} those are the basic components that need to go into this and everything else is pretty much uh open to move around.Marketing: Now is {disfmarker} would this be {vocalsound} considered just a standard uh um {disfmarker}User Interface: I think any desMarketing: This is not this is not cutting edge technology we're talking here.User Interface: No.Marketing: We're talking about existing technology.User Interface: Right I think {disfmarker}Marketing: Nothing is being modified or upgraded or new discoveries.User Interface: Yeah this is just {disfmarker} this is just a basic layout of ev {vocalsound} of all the components that w w are gonna be absolutely necessary f to have a working remote. We can add things in like if we wanted some voice recognition, I mean that {vocalsound} I mean {vocalsound} that you can kinda say would {vocalsound} would fall under the user interface and the digital signal processing chip.Marketing: Okay. Okay.Project Manager: Do we have an idea of costs of different componentsUser Interface: Um well the most the most costly components are gonna be the chip and the uh th it could als basically the user interface and the casing are gonna be expensive as well.Project Manager:'Kay.User Interface: Um the L_E_D_ and the the transistors and everything else are you know they're they're pretty cheap. So depending on what we want our functionality to be, um the chip could be expensive or it could be cheap.Project Manager: Mm'kay.User Interface: Um depending on the n amount of memory we need in there and stuff like that and h and h {vocalsound} you know how much power.Project Manager: Do we have any ballpark figures for that yet No.User Interface: Uh I don't have any figures right now.Project Manager:'Kay.User Interface: We uh we have to wait until we get to {disfmarker} I I think it's a good opportunity for the user design {disfmarker} or for {disfmarker} not just for the user design, but also for the {disfmarker} just for the look and feel of the remote as as a whole. You know you could have some kind of neat little, you know, {vocalsound} a sexy design for d a cradle and the remote itself.Marketing: {vocalsound} Blah, I like it. I like the idea, but we're talking about {disfmarker} in cost is gonna probably double.User Interface: It w it would increase the cost.Marketing: But boy, we can sell this thing, because there's no batteries, it's environmentally sensitive, i we can identify it as a safer product in some form.User Interface: And you could page the remote if you lose it. Maybe there's a button on the cradle.Marketing: Yep, that's right. I really seeProject Manager: Now the the question is can we make this for less than twelve-fifty perMarketing: But the cost i No no. No no, we have t we have to change the end cost.Project Manager: We we well do we necessarily have to change the end cost because uh {vocalsound} Can we dl can we do that without {vocalsound} uh changing it twelve-fifty per product, if we basically can sell more based on thisMarketing: There's uh {disfmarker} I mean I don't see it anyway. Yeah, that's gonna be up to these guys.User Interface: WellMarketing: I {vocalsound} {disfmarker} my reaction is no, butUser Interface: {vocalsound} what I can do is I can d look into ho well Pedro and I can look into how much this might increase our our costsProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: and you can look into what kind of effect an increased cost is gonna have on our on our final numbers.Project Manager: Yeah we we can

What did User Interface recommend to do when discussing the functional design and why

User Interface recommended to design a power cradle for the controller so that it would be unnecessary to change batteries. In this way, users would always know where the remote was because they had to put the device back to the cradle to charge it, which addressed the problem of losing it. This attempt would also do good to the look and feel of the remote control as a whole. The idea would be considered by the group, but they had to look into how much this might increase the cost.

gonna I'm gonna try to market it at a much higher price. I need to make it special with a high price tag. I don't want to make it economically uh g uh competitive.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: I want I want to market it as exclusive. So I would market this product it {disfmarker} at eighty-nine Euros and come up with some really {vocalsound} beautiful exterior design or something th but but I don't think we have that flexibility.Project Manager: But i if design if design is cheap and functionality is basic, then twenty-five Euros is probably a high price for a commoner garden {disfmarker} stan standard T_V_ so the place {disfmarker} uh remote the then the place we're going to justify that cost is through through design through making it a a sleek elegant {vocalsound} high-priced basic remote. Does that make sense, huhMarketing: No I no I I understand what you say,Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: but what I'm what I'm, okay {disfmarker} we probably need to move along,Project Manager: Yeah we probably should.Marketing: but my my concern is trying to find a marketing niche for this product,Project Manager: We we're doing alright for time.Marketing: and if I'm coming in with a with with twenty-five Euros, which is mid-market price, um then what am I going to give these people for thisProject Manager: Yeah.Marketing: So that's just my question, but we can keep talking.Project Manager: Okay. Sorry that kinda cut into you there.Industrial Designer: No just I I would I would advocate for continuing teletext and those would be the basic commands. Um as for, you know, the the case design uh maybe I'll come up with more concrete ideas. Right now it's just the idea of simplicity and slickness, cute and small um {disfmarker}User Interface: Right. I'm just thinking you know thing better than {disfmarker}Project Manager: Well tha that first point could uh also be an op opportunity because in seeing that teletext is becoming outdated, some sort remote control that can work with the Internet {disfmarker} {vocalsound} there is the opportunity that's presented, I guess.Marketing: {vocalsound} Right. Yeah. No, I I agree with you.Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: So what I'm talking about is I see that one side we're eliminating something so we have to come up with another side which is, what are we gonna be targeting our market uh that {vocalsound} identifies our product as better than {disfmarker} because it doesn't have teletext it has ta-ta-ta-ta-ta.Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: So that's that's that was my reactions.Project Manager: Yeah. but but we are sort of being dictated that this should only be for the television.Marketing: Yeah yeah.Project Manager: So we're quite fixed. So we're really probably, in terms of marketing, are looking for that's uh that's a cost winner rather than a fantastic new feature product.Marketing: Yep.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Yeah bu but we we're designing only the remote,Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Okay.Industrial Designer: we not design the T_V_.Project Manager: Hmm.Industrial Designer: So uh we're gonna be removing the teletext out of any T_V_ that we {disfmarker} people use our remote with.Marketing: Yeah.'Kay.Project Manager: Hmm.Marketing: That's right.Industrial Designer: So it's kind of a stupid decision.Marketing: I think we take with you.Project Manager: But there's also the potential for mark there's a market here for our lost teletext.User Interface: Right.Project Manager: For example someone that just goes to the shop that wants a replacement {disfmarker} wants it as {vocalsound} cheap as possible. Twenty-five Euros is the selling price, we really have to innovate here I guess.Marketing: That's what I'm that's what I'm talking about is is that we have to find something that is Good design.Project Manager: We only have a few minutes left.Marketing: But what I'm saying is right now we're middle market.Project Manager: Is twenty-five Euros a mid-market price for a remoteMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: YeahUser Interface: I think so, yeah.Marketing: for for multi for a multi-function remote, that's a mid-market price. In a discount right now you can buy'em on sale sometimes for about about uh eighteen, nineteen Euro,Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: and that's for the multi-functions, uh D_V_D_, V_C_R_, uh catch-alls. And and they have'em in a little box in the middle, and and this is the consciousness that most people have about replacement remote controls. So to me {vocalsound}, to market this a t only a television remote control we have to change consciousness. We have to have something that will change people's thinking to identify this as advantageous, and I don't know what that is. It's gotta be low-cost or high-cost with with special design features.Project Manager: Well I'd be inclined to say, if we can make the design better than any comparable remote while reducing the cost, then that's the way we really should play it. If we can take it down to you know fifteen rather than twenty-five and make a low profit-margin on it,User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: but we're really doing that to sell the brand. Yep we have five minutes left. Uh rather th uh to to to sell for Real Reactions.Marketing: Or my d {vocalsound}Project Manager: And I can communicate this to to the more senior {vocalsound} uh mm people within the company here to to get a reaction. {vocalsound}User Interface: What about um the idea that I had with the cradle How do you feel about thatProject Manager: Well how does everybody feelUser Interface: Or how does everybody feelMarketing: {vocalsound} I mean I agree with you. I really do.Project Manager: So we really can't chase that.Marketing: That's why I say I quest I q I question the marketability of the product. I really question where we create the demand.User Interface: So I think what we {disfmarker}Project Manager: We're really looking for something basic.User Interface: So that's what I'm saying {disfmarker}Project Manager: The the one thing that that that you said really struck a chord with me here in that we're we're carrying the corporate identity with the product, but we're actually looking for a large profit at the same time where I'd be inclined to go back to upper-level management and say like let's just cut down our profit expected on this product because we are actually branding our company here. We're selling more than just the product. We're trying to get mind-share about uh Real Reaction to to the people who are gonna buy consumer electronics. We want people to eventually say, oh that's that's Real Reaction that's a good m make. It's reliable. And and we're gonna make it {disfmarker} we're gonna win mind-share by uh either being a fantastic productIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or for it working, it just being good, reasonable-priced, {vocalsound} and solid. So if we can make {disfmarker} if we can put an emphasis here on it not breaking I think that's in itself an extremely {vocalsound} big thing.User Interface: Mm-hmm. I think that's big.Marketing: W {vocalsound} okay if you if you drop the cost, now if you make if you make {disfmarker} go to the other side of the cost scale, and you make it less expensive, then all of a sudden now we're going into an a a new market area. So we can say low-cost uh uh um uh good design, beautiful, wa-da-da-da-da-da.Industrial Designer: the television at the photo-transistor. So {vocalsound} those are the basic components that need to go into this and everything else is pretty much uh open to move around.Marketing: Now is {disfmarker} would this be {vocalsound} considered just a standard uh um {disfmarker}User Interface: I think any desMarketing: This is not this is not cutting edge technology we're talking here.User Interface: No.Marketing: We're talking about existing technology.User Interface: Right I think {disfmarker}Marketing: Nothing is being modified or upgraded or new discoveries.User Interface: Yeah this is just {disfmarker} this is just a basic layout of ev {vocalsound} of all the components that w w are gonna be absolutely necessary f to have a working remote. We can add things in like if we wanted some voice recognition, I mean that {vocalsound} I mean {vocalsound} that you can kinda say would {vocalsound} would fall under the user interface and the digital signal processing chip.Marketing: Okay. Okay.Project Manager: Do we have an idea of costs of different componentsUser Interface: Um well the most the most costly components are gonna be the chip and the uh th it could als basically the user interface and the casing are gonna be expensive as well.Project Manager:'Kay.User Interface: Um the L_E_D_ and the the transistors and everything else are you know they're they're pretty cheap. So depending on what we want our functionality to be, um the chip could be expensive or it could be cheap.Project Manager: Mm'kay.User Interface: Um depending on the n amount of memory we need in there and stuff like that and h and h {vocalsound} you know how much power.Project Manager: Do we have any ballpark figures for that yet No.User Interface: Uh I don't have any figures right now.Project Manager:'Kay.User Interface: We uh we have to wait until we get to

Summarize the discussion about marketing positioning of the product.

The group decided to make the new product good-looking, durable and environmentally sensitive, but the opinion of User Interface had a little difference with Marketing's - the former thought the product should only have some basic functions but the latter thought there should be something special about the product to make it exclusive.

with all these universal remotes that are out there, how many people {vocalsound} how many people actually use every feature that ar you know i like these trainable remotes and things like that, where, you know, it's just so confusing to do {vocalsound} to use all these functions. Where I think the largest portion of the market is just gonna {disfmarker} you know they lost their T_V_ remote, they need another one that'll work with their T_V_. They want something that looks nice, that that that isn't gonna break when they drop it, that you know that maybe it's it's ergonomic, it feels good in your hand, something like that.Project Manager: Mm.User Interface: I think that's gonna be where you're gonna find the biggest, you know, market share.Project Manager: So we are looking for something that looks good and just works, rather than looking for any special features. Is that {disfmarker}User Interface: I think the more bells and whistles we add, it's just gonna cut into our into our profits.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Yeah.User Interface: Because I think as we as we add costs for things like uh {disfmarker} for like if we add the voice recognition and things like that, I think {vocalsound} you know what percentage of the of the um of the market is actually gonna use thatProject Manager: Mm.User Interface: Maybe five percent, you know,Industrial Designer: Yeah mm.Project Manager: But we can talk a little bit more potentially in the marketing marketing presentation about this.User Interface: and how much {disfmarker} Right. Yeah okay.Project Manager: Be a good idea.User Interface: I'm sorry.Project Manager: Uh sorry, I didn't mean to cut in {vocalsound}.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah.User Interface: Sorry boss {vocalsound}.Project Manager: I'm not the boss {vocalsound}. Okay.Marketing: Oh P Pedro, I just want to say quickly I I would really Good design.Project Manager: We only have a few minutes left.Marketing: But what I'm saying is right now we're middle market.Project Manager: Is twenty-five Euros a mid-market price for a remoteMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: YeahUser Interface: I think so, yeah.Marketing: for for multi for a multi-function remote, that's a mid-market price. In a discount right now you can buy'em on sale sometimes for about about uh eighteen, nineteen Euro,Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: and that's for the multi-functions, uh D_V_D_, V_C_R_, uh catch-alls. And and they have'em in a little box in the middle, and and this is the consciousness that most people have about replacement remote controls. So to me {vocalsound}, to market this a t only a television remote control we have to change consciousness. We have to have something that will change people's thinking to identify this as advantageous, and I don't know what that is. It's gotta be low-cost or high-cost with with special design features.Project Manager: Well I'd be inclined to say, if we can make the design better than any comparable remote while reducing the cost, then that's the way we really should play it. If we can take it down to you know fifteen rather than twenty-five and make a low profit-margin on it,User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: but we're really doing that to sell the brand. Yep we have five minutes left. Uh rather th uh to to to sell for Real Reactions.Marketing: Or my d {vocalsound}Project Manager: And I can communicate this to to the more senior {vocalsound} uh mm people within the company here to to get a reaction. {vocalsound}User Interface: What about um the idea that I had with the cradle How do you feel about thatProject Manager: Well how does everybody feelUser Interface: Or how does everybody feelMarketing: {vocalsound} I mean I agree with you. I really do.Project Manager: So we really can't chase that.Marketing: That's why I say I quest I q I question the marketability of the product. I really question where we create the demand.User Interface: So I think what we {disfmarker}Project Manager: We're really looking for something basic.User Interface: So that's what I'm saying {disfmarker}Project Manager: The the one thing that that that you said really struck a chord with me here in that we're we're carrying the corporate identity with the product, but we're actually looking for a large profit at the same time where I'd be inclined to go back to upper-level management and say like let's just cut down our profit expected on this product because we are actually branding our company here. We're selling more than just the product. We're trying to get mind-share about uh Real Reaction to to the people who are gonna buy consumer electronics. We want people to eventually say, oh that's that's Real Reaction that's a good m make. It's reliable. And and we're gonna make it {disfmarker} we're gonna win mind-share by uh either being a fantastic productIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or for it working, it just being good, reasonable-priced, {vocalsound} and solid. So if we can make {disfmarker} if we can put an emphasis here on it not breaking I think that's in itself an extremely {vocalsound} big thing.User Interface: Mm-hmm. I think that's big.Marketing: W {vocalsound} okay if you if you drop the cost, now if you make if you make {disfmarker} go to the other side of the cost scale, and you make it less expensive, then all of a sudden now we're going into an a a new market area. So we can say low-cost uh uh um uh good design, beautiful, wa-da-da-da-da-da.Industrial Designer: gonna I'm gonna try to market it at a much higher price. I need to make it special with a high price tag. I don't want to make it economically uh g uh competitive.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: I want I want to market it as exclusive. So I would market this product it {disfmarker} at eighty-nine Euros and come up with some really {vocalsound} beautiful exterior design or something th but but I don't think we have that flexibility.Project Manager: But i if design if design is cheap and functionality is basic, then twenty-five Euros is probably a high price for a commoner garden {disfmarker} stan standard T_V_ so the place {disfmarker} uh remote the then the place we're going to justify that cost is through through design through making it a a sleek elegant {vocalsound} high-priced basic remote. Does that make sense, huhMarketing: No I no I I understand what you say,Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: but what I'm what I'm, okay {disfmarker} we probably need to move along,Project Manager: Yeah we probably should.Marketing: but my my concern is trying to find a marketing niche for this product,Project Manager: We we're doing alright for time.Marketing: and if I'm coming in with a with with twenty-five Euros, which is mid-market price, um then what am I going to give these people for thisProject Manager: Yeah.Marketing: So that's just my question, but we can keep talking.Project Manager: Okay. Sorry that kinda cut into you there.Industrial Designer: No just I I would I would advocate for continuing teletext and those would be the basic commands. Um as for, you know, the the case design uh maybe I'll come up with more concrete ideas. Right now it's just the idea of simplicity and slickness, cute and small um {disfmarker}User Interface: Right. I'm just thinking you know the television at the photo-transistor. So {vocalsound} those are the basic components that need to go into this and everything else is pretty much uh open to move around.Marketing: Now is {disfmarker} would this be {vocalsound} considered just a standard uh um {disfmarker}User Interface: I think any desMarketing: This is not this is not cutting edge technology we're talking here.User Interface: No.Marketing: We're talking about existing technology.User Interface: Right I think {disfmarker}Marketing: Nothing is being modified or upgraded or new discoveries.User Interface: Yeah this is just {disfmarker} this is just a basic layout of ev {vocalsound} of all the components that w w are gonna be absolutely necessary f to have a working remote. We can add things in like if we wanted some voice recognition, I mean that {vocalsound} I mean {vocalsound} that you can kinda say would {vocalsound} would fall under the user interface and the digital signal processing chip.Marketing: Okay. Okay.Project Manager: Do we have an idea of costs of different componentsUser Interface: Um well the most the most costly components are gonna be the chip and the uh th it could als basically the user interface and the casing are gonna be expensive as well.Project Manager:'Kay.User Interface: Um the L_E_D_ and the the transistors and everything else are you know they're they're pretty cheap. So depending on what we want our functionality to be, um the chip could be expensive or it could be cheap.Project Manager: Mm'kay.User Interface: Um depending on the n amount of memory we need in there and stuff like that and h and h {vocalsound} you know how much power.Project Manager: Do we have any ballpark figures for that yet No.User Interface: Uh I don't have any figures right now.Project Manager:'Kay.User Interface: We uh we have to wait until we get to

Summarize the opinion of User Interface about Marketing positioning of the product.

User Interface believed that most people bought a new remote control just because they lost their old one and needed another one that could work with their TV. What they wanted was something ergonomic, durable, and good-looking. Actually, few people would use every function of the controller, so they should just keep the product simple instead of adding cost for advanced features.

with all these universal remotes that are out there, how many people {vocalsound} how many people actually use every feature that ar you know i like these trainable remotes and things like that, where, you know, it's just so confusing to do {vocalsound} to use all these functions. Where I think the largest portion of the market is just gonna {disfmarker} you know they lost their T_V_ remote, they need another one that'll work with their T_V_. They want something that looks nice, that that that isn't gonna break when they drop it, that you know that maybe it's it's ergonomic, it feels good in your hand, something like that.Project Manager: Mm.User Interface: I think that's gonna be where you're gonna find the biggest, you know, market share.Project Manager: So we are looking for something that looks good and just works, rather than looking for any special features. Is that {disfmarker}User Interface: I think the more bells and whistles we add, it's just gonna cut into our into our profits.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Yeah.User Interface: Because I think as we as we add costs for things like uh {disfmarker} for like if we add the voice recognition and things like that, I think {vocalsound} you know what percentage of the of the um of the market is actually gonna use thatProject Manager: Mm.User Interface: Maybe five percent, you know,Industrial Designer: Yeah mm.Project Manager: But we can talk a little bit more potentially in the marketing marketing presentation about this.User Interface: and how much {disfmarker} Right. Yeah okay.Project Manager: Be a good idea.User Interface: I'm sorry.Project Manager: Uh sorry, I didn't mean to cut in {vocalsound}.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah.User Interface: Sorry boss {vocalsound}.Project Manager: I'm not the boss {vocalsound}. Okay.Marketing: Oh P Pedro, I just want to say quickly I I would really agree with you. I really do.Project Manager: So we really can't chase that.Marketing: That's why I say I quest I q I question the marketability of the product. I really question where we create the demand.User Interface: So I think what we {disfmarker}Project Manager: We're really looking for something basic.User Interface: So that's what I'm saying {disfmarker}Project Manager: The the one thing that that that you said really struck a chord with me here in that we're we're carrying the corporate identity with the product, but we're actually looking for a large profit at the same time where I'd be inclined to go back to upper-level management and say like let's just cut down our profit expected on this product because we are actually branding our company here. We're selling more than just the product. We're trying to get mind-share about uh Real Reaction to to the people who are gonna buy consumer electronics. We want people to eventually say, oh that's that's Real Reaction that's a good m make. It's reliable. And and we're gonna make it {disfmarker} we're gonna win mind-share by uh either being a fantastic productIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: or for it working, it just being good, reasonable-priced, {vocalsound} and solid. So if we can make {disfmarker} if we can put an emphasis here on it not breaking I think that's in itself an extremely {vocalsound} big thing.User Interface: Mm-hmm. I think that's big.Marketing: W {vocalsound} okay if you if you drop the cost, now if you make if you make {disfmarker} go to the other side of the cost scale, and you make it less expensive, then all of a sudden now we're going into an a a new market area. So we can say low-cost uh uh um uh good design, beautiful, wa-da-da-da-da-da.Industrial Designer: gonna I'm gonna try to market it at a much higher price. I need to make it special with a high price tag. I don't want to make it economically uh g uh competitive.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: I want I want to market it as exclusive. So I would market this product it {disfmarker} at eighty-nine Euros and come up with some really {vocalsound} beautiful exterior design or something th but but I don't think we have that flexibility.Project Manager: But i if design if design is cheap and functionality is basic, then twenty-five Euros is probably a high price for a commoner garden {disfmarker} stan standard T_V_ so the place {disfmarker} uh remote the then the place we're going to justify that cost is through through design through making it a a sleek elegant {vocalsound} high-priced basic remote. Does that make sense, huhMarketing: No I no I I understand what you say,Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: but what I'm what I'm, okay {disfmarker} we probably need to move along,Project Manager: Yeah we probably should.Marketing: but my my concern is trying to find a marketing niche for this product,Project Manager: We we're doing alright for time.Marketing: and if I'm coming in with a with with twenty-five Euros, which is mid-market price, um then what am I going to give these people for thisProject Manager: Yeah.Marketing: So that's just my question, but we can keep talking.Project Manager: Okay. Sorry that kinda cut into you there.Industrial Designer: No just I I would I would advocate for continuing teletext and those would be the basic commands. Um as for, you know, the the case design uh maybe I'll come up with more concrete ideas. Right now it's just the idea of simplicity and slickness, cute and small um {disfmarker}User Interface: Right. I'm just thinking you know {disfmarker} I I think it's a good opportunity for the user design {disfmarker} or for {disfmarker} not just for the user design, but also for the {disfmarker} just for the look and feel of the remote as as a whole. You know you could have some kind of neat little, you know, {vocalsound} a sexy design for d a cradle and the remote itself.Marketing: {vocalsound} Blah, I like it. I like the idea, but we're talking about {disfmarker} in cost is gonna probably double.User Interface: It w it would increase the cost.Marketing: But boy, we can sell this thing, because there's no batteries, it's environmentally sensitive, i we can identify it as a safer product in some form.User Interface: And you could page the remote if you lose it. Maybe there's a button on the cradle.Marketing: Yep, that's right. I really seeProject Manager: Now the the question is can we make this for less than twelve-fifty perMarketing: But the cost i No no. No no, we have t we have to change the end cost.Project Manager: We we well do we necessarily have to change the end cost because uh {vocalsound} Can we dl can we do that without {vocalsound} uh changing it twelve-fifty per product, if we basically can sell more based on thisMarketing: There's uh {disfmarker} I mean I don't see it anyway. Yeah, that's gonna be up to these guys.User Interface: WellMarketing: I {vocalsound} {disfmarker} my reaction is no, butUser Interface: {vocalsound} what I can do is I can d look into ho well Pedro and I can look into how much this might increase our our costsProject Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: and you can look into what kind of effect an increased cost is gonna have on our on our final numbers.Project Manager: Yeah we we can thing better than {disfmarker}Project Manager: Well tha that first point could uh also be an op opportunity because in seeing that teletext is becoming outdated, some sort remote control that can work with the Internet {disfmarker} {vocalsound} there is the opportunity that's presented, I guess.Marketing: {vocalsound} Right. Yeah. No, I I agree with you.Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: So what I'm talking about is I see that one side we're eliminating something so we have to come up with another side which is, what are we gonna be targeting our market uh that {vocalsound} identifies our product as better than {disfmarker} because it doesn't have teletext it has ta-ta-ta-ta-ta.Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: So that's that's that was my reactions.Project Manager: Yeah. but but we are sort of being dictated that this should only be for the television.Marketing: Yeah yeah.Project Manager: So we're quite fixed. So we're really probably, in terms of marketing, are looking for that's uh that's a cost winner rather than a fantastic new feature product.Marketing: Yep.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Yeah bu but we we're designing only the remote,Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Okay.Industrial Designer: we not design the T_V_.Project Manager: Hmm.Industrial Designer: So uh we're gonna be removing the teletext out of any T_V_ that we {disfmarker} people use our remote with.Marketing: Yeah.'Kay.Project Manager: Hmm.Marketing: That's right.Industrial Designer: So it's kind of a stupid decision.Marketing: I think we take with you.Project Manager: But there's also the potential for mark there's a market here for our lost teletext.User Interface: Right.Project Manager: For example someone that just goes to the shop that wants a replacement {disfmarker} wants it as {vocalsound} cheap as possible. Twenty-five Euros is the selling price, we really have to innovate here I guess.Marketing: That's what I'm that's what I'm talking about is is that we have to find something that is

What was Marketing's opinion on Marketing positioning of the product

Marketing wanted the product to be exclusive, beautiful, attractive, and environmentally sensitive. It should be special in some way so that it could sell on its own. Marketing also wanted to sell their corporate identity along with the product. However, the fact was that they could not use some cutting-edge technology due to the limitation of cost, so they had to aim at the exterior design.

gonna I'm gonna try to market it at a much higher price. I need to make it special with a high price tag. I don't want to make it economically uh g uh competitive.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.Marketing: I want I want to market it as exclusive. So I would market this product it {disfmarker} at eighty-nine Euros and come up with some really {vocalsound} beautiful exterior design or something th but but I don't think we have that flexibility.Project Manager: But i if design if design is cheap and functionality is basic, then twenty-five Euros is probably a high price for a commoner garden {disfmarker} stan standard T_V_ so the place {disfmarker} uh remote the then the place we're going to justify that cost is through through design through making it a a sleek elegant {vocalsound} high-priced basic remote. Does that make sense, huhMarketing: No I no I I understand what you say,Project Manager: Mm.Marketing: but what I'm what I'm, okay {disfmarker} we probably need to move along,Project Manager: Yeah we probably should.Marketing: but my my concern is trying to find a marketing niche for this product,Project Manager: We we're doing alright for time.Marketing: and if I'm coming in with a with with twenty-five Euros, which is mid-market price, um then what am I going to give these people for thisProject Manager: Yeah.Marketing: So that's just my question, but we can keep talking.Project Manager: Okay. Sorry that kinda cut into you there.Industrial Designer: No just I I would I would advocate for continuing teletext and those would be the basic commands. Um as for, you know, the the case design uh maybe I'll come up with more concrete ideas. Right now it's just the idea of simplicity and slickness, cute and small um {disfmarker}User Interface: Right. I'm just thinking you know Good design.Project Manager: We only have a few minutes left.Marketing: But what I'm saying is right now we're middle market.Project Manager: Is twenty-five Euros a mid-market price for a remoteMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: YeahUser Interface: I think so, yeah.Marketing: for for multi for a multi-function remote, that's a mid-market price. In a discount right now you can buy'em on sale sometimes for about about uh eighteen, nineteen Euro,Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: and that's for the multi-functions, uh D_V_D_, V_C_R_, uh catch-alls. And and they have'em in a little box in the middle, and and this is the consciousness that most people have about replacement remote controls. So to me {vocalsound}, to market this a t only a television remote control we have to change consciousness. We have to have something that will change people's thinking to identify this as advantageous, and I don't know what that is. It's gotta be low-cost or high-cost with with special design features.Project Manager: Well I'd be inclined to say, if we can make the design better than any comparable remote while reducing the cost, then that's the way we really should play it. If we can take it down to you know fifteen rather than twenty-five and make a low profit-margin on it,User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: but we're really doing that to sell the brand. Yep we have five minutes left. Uh rather th uh to to to sell for Real Reactions.Marketing: Or my d {vocalsound}Project Manager: And I can communicate this to to the more senior {vocalsound} uh mm people within the company here to to get a reaction. {vocalsound}User Interface: What about um the idea that I had with the cradle How do you feel about thatProject Manager: Well how does everybody feelUser Interface: Or how does everybody feelMarketing: {vocalsound} I mean I the television at the photo-transistor. So {vocalsound} those are the basic components that need to go into this and everything else is pretty much uh open to move around.Marketing: Now is {disfmarker} would this be {vocalsound} considered just a standard uh um {disfmarker}User Interface: I think any desMarketing: This is not this is not cutting edge technology we're talking here.User Interface: No.Marketing: We're talking about existing technology.User Interface: Right I think {disfmarker}Marketing: Nothing is being modified or upgraded or new discoveries.User Interface: Yeah this is just {disfmarker} this is just a basic layout of ev {vocalsound} of all the components that w w are gonna be absolutely necessary f to have a working remote. We can add things in like if we wanted some voice recognition, I mean that {vocalsound} I mean {vocalsound} that you can kinda say would {vocalsound} would fall under the user interface and the digital signal processing chip.Marketing: Okay. Okay.Project Manager: Do we have an idea of costs of different componentsUser Interface: Um well the most the most costly components are gonna be the chip and the uh th it could als basically the user interface and the casing are gonna be expensive as well.Project Manager:'Kay.User Interface: Um the L_E_D_ and the the transistors and everything else are you know they're they're pretty cheap. So depending on what we want our functionality to be, um the chip could be expensive or it could be cheap.Project Manager: Mm'kay.User Interface: Um depending on the n amount of memory we need in there and stuff like that and h and h {vocalsound} you know how much power.Project Manager: Do we have any ballpark figures for that yet No.User Interface: Uh I don't have any figures right now.Project Manager:'Kay.User Interface: We uh we have to wait until we get to thing better than {disfmarker}Project Manager: Well tha that first point could uh also be an op opportunity because in seeing that teletext is becoming outdated, some sort remote control that can work with the Internet {disfmarker} {vocalsound} there is the opportunity that's presented, I guess.Marketing: {vocalsound} Right. Yeah. No, I I agree with you.Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: So what I'm talking about is I see that one side we're eliminating something so we have to come up with another side which is, what are we gonna be targeting our market uh that {vocalsound} identifies our product as better than {disfmarker} because it doesn't have teletext it has ta-ta-ta-ta-ta.Project Manager: Okay.Marketing: So that's that's that was my reactions.Project Manager: Yeah. but but we are sort of being dictated that this should only be for the television.Marketing: Yeah yeah.Project Manager: So we're quite fixed. So we're really probably, in terms of marketing, are looking for that's uh that's a cost winner rather than a fantastic new feature product.Marketing: Yep.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Yeah bu but we we're designing only the remote,Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Okay.Industrial Designer: we not design the T_V_.Project Manager: Hmm.Industrial Designer: So uh we're gonna be removing the teletext out of any T_V_ that we {disfmarker} people use our remote with.Marketing: Yeah.'Kay.Project Manager: Hmm.Marketing: That's right.Industrial Designer: So it's kind of a stupid decision.Marketing: I think we take with you.Project Manager: But there's also the potential for mark there's a market here for our lost teletext.User Interface: Right.Project Manager: For example someone that just goes to the shop that wants a replacement {disfmarker} wants it as {vocalsound} cheap as possible. Twenty-five Euros is the selling price, we really have to innovate here I guess.Marketing: That's what I'm that's what I'm talking about is is that we have to find something that is have thisProject Manager: Nah. So we have three presentations, and I think we'll go in order of participant number here. So we can have a look at the working design first from participant two. That's {disfmarker} {gap} Okay.Industrial Designer: Yes.User Interface: That's fine. Okay soProject Manager: Mm it's enough. But uh click it on offUser Interface: so you all know me, I'm the Industrial Designer. And we've some basic components that um our remote is gonna need, just basically every remote'll need'em.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: We need some kinda of power d power source. Um we have to decide on our our user interface, which is his department, but the in user interface is also a major component. Um we need a programmable digital signal processor to um to take the input from the user and translate that into uh into electronic signal, which we pass to the infra-red L_E_D_, which you aim at the television uh which {disfmarker} and it receives that signal. You need a on-off switch um I don't know how that got in there. And uh we also need to um have the {vocalsound} {disfmarker} if we want a universal remote we need to have encryption codes for the different makes of T_V_s. So we need to know all the different you know all the different signals and so that'll require some memory as well. Um so here's just a basic layout of how how the remote would work. You ha the v the power source is in the upper right-hand corner there, and you can see that uh we have the user interface here which is connected to the chip which does all our signal processing, and then passes that signal on to the infra-red L_E_D_ and that signal is then emitted and received by

Summarize the whole meeting.

The group had a heated discussion over the functional design and the market positioning of their new product. First, User Interface introduced the basic components of the remote control and the cost of them. When discussing the user interface design, the group agreed that the product should be good-looking and branded with their company logo. Industrial Designer thought they should keep the functions simple and basic and aimed at the exterior design. Then, the group talked much about the teletext and whether the controller should be only for TV. When it came to the market positioning, the opinion of User Interface differed from Marketing's - the former tended to keep it simple but the latter thought there should be something special about the product to make it exclusive.

of general interest or not.Professor G: Uh, bigramGrad A: IRAM.PhD D: IRAM.Professor G: IRAM.Grad A: IRAM, bigram,Professor G: Well, m maybe.PhD D: Bi - Bigram.Grad A: you know.Professor G: Yeah, let's {disfmarker} let's see where we are at three - thirty.PhD B: Hmm.Professor G: Um {disfmarker}PhD B: Since, uh {disfmarker} since I have to leave as usual at three - thirty, can we do the interesting stuff firstPostdoc F: I beg your pardonProfessor G: Well {disfmarker}PhD C: Which is {disfmarker}Grad A: What's the interesting stuffPostdoc F: I beg your pardonPhD D: Yeah.Professor G: Yeah. Th - now you get to tell us what's the interesting part.PhD E: Please specify.Professor G: But {disfmarker}PhD B: Well, uh, I guess the work that's been {pause} done on segmentation would be most {disfmarker}PhD C: Yeah.Postdoc F: I think that would be a good thing to start with.PhD B: Yeah.Professor G: OK. Um, and, um, {vocalsound} the other thing, uh, which I'll just say very briefly that maybe relates to that a little bit, which is that, um, uh, one of the suggestions that came up in a brief meeting I had the other day when I was in Spain with, uh, Manolo Pardo and {vocalsound} Javier, uh, Ferreiros, who was {pause} here before, was, um, why not start with what they had before but add in the non - silence boundaries. So, in what Javier did before when they were doing, um {disfmarker} h he was looking for, uh, speaker change {pause} points.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Professor G: Um. As a simplification, he originally did this only using {pause} silence as, uh, a {pause} putative, uh, speaker change point.PhD C: Yeah.Professor G: And, uh, he did not, say, look at points where you were changing broad sp uh, phonetic class, for instance. And for or did you just {disfmarker}PhD C: I did that for {disfmarker} for five minutes of one dialogueGrad A: Right.PhD C: and that was enough to {disfmarker} to train the system.PhD B: W What {disfmarker}PhD D: Yeah.PhD C: And so it {disfmarker} it adapts, uh, on {disfmarker} while running. So.PhD B: What kind of, uh, front - end processing did you doPhD C: Hopefully.PhD D: OK.PhD C: It's just our {disfmarker} our old Munich, uh, loudness - based spectrum on mel scale twenty {disfmarker} twenty critical bands and then loudness.PhD B: Mm - hmm.PhD C: And four additional features, which is energy, loudness, modified loudness, and zero crossing rate. So it's twenty - four {disfmarker} twenty - four features.PhD B: Mmm.Professor G: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: And you also provided me with several different versions,PhD C: Yeah.Postdoc F: which I compared.PhD C: Yeah.Postdoc F: And so you change {nonvocalsound} parameters. What {disfmarker} do you wanna say something about the parameters {nonvocalsound} that you changePhD C: Yeah. You can specify {vocalsound} the minimum length of speech or {disfmarker} and silence portions which you want. And so I did some {disfmarker} some modifications in those parameters, basically changing the minimum {disfmarker} minimum {pause} length for s for silence to have, er to have, um {disfmarker} yeah {disfmarker} to have more or less, uh, silence portions in inserted. So.Grad A: Right. So this would work well for, uh, pauses and utterance boundaries and things like that.PhD D: Yeah.PhD C: Yeah. Yeah.Grad A: But for overlap I imagine that doesn't work at all,PhD C: Yeah.PhD D: Yeah.Grad A: that you'll have plenty of s sections that are {disfmarker}PhD C: Yeah.PhD D: Yeah.PhD C: That's it. Yeah.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm, mm - hmm.PhD D: Yeah.Grad A: But {disfmarker}Postdoc F: That's true. But {nonvocalsound} it {disfmarker} think we {disfmarker} you know, with Eric's work, I sort of figure we {disfmarker} we can just treat that as a variant. But I told them if {disfmarker} if there's an obvious speech error, uh, like I said in one thing,Professor G: OK. Yes.Postdoc F: and I gave my {disfmarker} my example, like I said," microfon" {pause} in instead of" microphone" . Didn't bother {disfmarker} I knew it when I said it. I remember s thinking" oh, that's not correctly pronounced" . But it {disfmarker} but I thought {vocalsound} it's not worth fixing cuz often when you're speaking everybody knows what {disfmarker} what you mean.Grad A: You'll self - repair. Yeah.PhD C: Yeah.Postdoc F: But I have a convention that if it's obviously a noncanonical pronunciation {disfmarker} a speech error with {disfmarker} you know, wi within the realm of resolution that you can tell in this native English {disfmarker} American English speaker, you know that I didn't mean to say" microfon." Then you'd put a little tick at the beginning of the word,Professor G: Yeah.Postdoc F: and that just signals that, um, this is not standard, and then in curly brackets" pron {nonvocalsound} error" . And, um, and other than that, it's w word level. But, you know, the fact that they noticed, you know, the" nnn" ." He said" nnn" , not" and" . What shall I do with that" I mean, they're very perceptive. And {disfmarker} and s several of them are trained in IPA. C they really could do phonetic transcription if {disfmarker} if we wanted them to.Professor G: Mm - hmm. Right. Well {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Well, you know, it might be something we'd wanna do with some, uh, s small subset {pause} of the whole thing.Grad A: Hmm. Where were they when {pause} we needed themPostdoc Broadcast News, that was fine. Here obviously it's not.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: And, um, so one of the things that they were pushing in d in discussing with me is, um, w why are you spending so much time, uh, on the, uh, feature issue, uh, when perhaps if you sort of deal with what you were using beforePhD D: Uh - huh.Professor G: and then just broadened it a bit, instead of just ta using silence as putative change point also {disfmarker}PhD D: Nnn, yeah.Professor G: So then you've got {disfmarker} you already have the super - structure with Gaussians and H - you know, simple H M Ms and so forth. And you {disfmarker} you might {disfmarker} So there was a {disfmarker} there was a little bit of a {disfmarker} a {disfmarker} a {disfmarker} a difference of opinion because I {disfmarker} I thought that it was {disfmarker} it's interesting to look at what features are useful.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: But, uh, on the other hand I saw that the {disfmarker} they had a good point that, uh, if we had something that worked for many cases before, maybe starting from there a little bit {disfmarker} Because ultimately we're gonna end up {vocalsound} with some s su kind of structure like that,PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: where you have some kind of simple HMM and you're testing the hypothesis that, {vocalsound} uh, there is a change.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: So {disfmarker} so anyway, I just {disfmarker} reporting that.PhD D: OK.Professor G: But, uh, uh {disfmarker} So. Yeah, why don't we do the speech - nonspeech discussionPostdoc F: Yeah. Do {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I hear {disfmarker} you {disfmarker} you didn't {disfmarker}PhD C: Speech - nonspeech OK.Postdoc F: Uh - huh. Yeah.PhD C: Um, so, uh, what we basically did so far there there's two suggestions, really, which is, uh {disfmarker} what we said before is that,PhD D: Mmm, yeah.Professor G: um, it looks like, at least that you haven't found an obvious way to normalize so that the energy is anything like a reliable, uh, indicator of the overlap.PhD D: Yeah. Yeah.Professor G: Um, I {disfmarker} I'm {disfmarker} I'm still {pause} a little f think that's a little funny. These things l @ @ seems like there should be,PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: but {disfmarker} {vocalsound} but you don't want to keep, uh {disfmarker} keep knocking at it if it's {disfmarker} if you're not getting any {disfmarker} any result with that. But, I mean, the other things that we talked about is, uh, {vocalsound} pitch - related things and harmonicity - related things,PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: so {disfmarker} which we thought also should be some kind of a reasonable indicator. Um {disfmarker} But, uh, a completely different tack on it wou is the one that was suggested, uh, by your colleagues in Spain,PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: which is to say, don't worry so much about the, uh, features.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: That is to say, use, you know, as {disfmarker} as you're doing with the speech, uh, nonspeech, use some very general features.PhD C: Yeah.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: And, uh, then, uh, look at it more from the aspect of modeling.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: You know, have a {disfmarker} have a couple Markov models and {disfmarker} and, uh, try to indi try to determine, you know, w when is th when are you in an overlap, when are you not in an overlap.PhD D: Hmm.Professor G: And let the, uh, uh, statistical system {pause} determine what's the right way to look at the data.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: I {disfmarker} I, um, I

What did Speaker C say about detecting speech/non-speech options

Speaker C's efforts to detect speech/non-speech portions in the mixed signal (using an HMM-based detector with Gaussian mixtures) have produced pre-segmentations that facilitate the transcription effort.

or did you just {disfmarker}PhD C: I did that for {disfmarker} for five minutes of one dialogueGrad A: Right.PhD C: and that was enough to {disfmarker} to train the system.PhD B: W What {disfmarker}PhD D: Yeah.PhD C: And so it {disfmarker} it adapts, uh, on {disfmarker} while running. So.PhD B: What kind of, uh, front - end processing did you doPhD C: Hopefully.PhD D: OK.PhD C: It's just our {disfmarker} our old Munich, uh, loudness - based spectrum on mel scale twenty {disfmarker} twenty critical bands and then loudness.PhD B: Mm - hmm.PhD C: And four additional features, which is energy, loudness, modified loudness, and zero crossing rate. So it's twenty - four {disfmarker} twenty - four features.PhD B: Mmm.Professor G: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: And you also provided me with several different versions,PhD C: Yeah.Postdoc F: which I compared.PhD C: Yeah.Postdoc F: And so you change {nonvocalsound} parameters. What {disfmarker} do you wanna say something about the parameters {nonvocalsound} that you changePhD C: Yeah. You can specify {vocalsound} the minimum length of speech or {disfmarker} and silence portions which you want. And so I did some {disfmarker} some modifications in those parameters, basically changing the minimum {disfmarker} minimum {pause} length for s for silence to have, er to have, um {disfmarker} yeah {disfmarker} to have more or less, uh, silence portions in inserted. So.Grad A: Right. So this would work well for, uh, pauses and utterance boundaries and things like that.PhD D: Yeah.PhD C: Yeah. Yeah.Grad A: But for overlap I imagine that doesn't work at all,PhD C: Yeah.PhD D: Yeah.Grad A: that you'll have plenty of s sections that are {disfmarker}PhD C: Yeah.PhD D: Yeah.PhD C: That's it. Yeah.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm, mm - hmm.PhD D: Yeah.Grad A: But {disfmarker}Postdoc F: That's true. But {nonvocalsound} it {disfmarker} of general interest or not.Professor G: Uh, bigramGrad A: IRAM.PhD D: IRAM.Professor G: IRAM.Grad A: IRAM, bigram,Professor G: Well, m maybe.PhD D: Bi - Bigram.Grad A: you know.Professor G: Yeah, let's {disfmarker} let's see where we are at three - thirty.PhD B: Hmm.Professor G: Um {disfmarker}PhD B: Since, uh {disfmarker} since I have to leave as usual at three - thirty, can we do the interesting stuff firstPostdoc F: I beg your pardonProfessor G: Well {disfmarker}PhD C: Which is {disfmarker}Grad A: What's the interesting stuffPostdoc F: I beg your pardonPhD D: Yeah.Professor G: Yeah. Th - now you get to tell us what's the interesting part.PhD E: Please specify.Professor G: But {disfmarker}PhD B: Well, uh, I guess the work that's been {pause} done on segmentation would be most {disfmarker}PhD C: Yeah.Postdoc F: I think that would be a good thing to start with.PhD B: Yeah.Professor G: OK. Um, and, um, {vocalsound} the other thing, uh, which I'll just say very briefly that maybe relates to that a little bit, which is that, um, uh, one of the suggestions that came up in a brief meeting I had the other day when I was in Spain with, uh, Manolo Pardo and {vocalsound} Javier, uh, Ferreiros, who was {pause} here before, was, um, why not start with what they had before but add in the non - silence boundaries. So, in what Javier did before when they were doing, um {disfmarker} h he was looking for, uh, speaker change {pause} points.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Professor G: Um. As a simplification, he originally did this only using {pause} silence as, uh, a {pause} putative, uh, speaker change point.PhD C: Yeah.Professor G: And, uh, he did not, say, look at points where you were changing broad sp uh, phonetic class, for instance. And for and, uh, those {disfmarker} if {disfmarker} Boy, the guy I knew who built them, built them like twenty {disfmarker} twenty years ago,Grad A: Hmm.Professor G: so they're {disfmarker} {vocalsound} it's {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the techniques work pretty well.Postdoc F: Fantastic. Cuz there is one thing that we don't have right now and that is the automatic, um, channel identifier.Professor G: So.Postdoc F: That {disfmarker} that, you know, that would g help in terms of encoding of overlaps.Professor G: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: The {disfmarker} the transcribers would have less, uh, disentangling to do {pause} if that were available.Professor G: Yeah. So I think, you know, basically you can look at some {disfmarker} p you have to play around a little bit, uh, to figure out what the right statistic is,Postdoc F: But.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.Professor G: but you compare each microphone to some statistic based on the {disfmarker} {vocalsound} on the overall {disfmarker}PhD C: Yeah.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: OK.Professor G: Uh, and we also have these {disfmarker} we have the advantage of having {pause} distant mikes too. So that, you cou yoGrad A: Yeah, although the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} using the close - talking I think would be much better. Wouldn't itPostdoc F: Yeah.Professor G: Um. I {disfmarker} I don't know.Grad A: Yeah.Professor G: I just {disfmarker} it'd be {disfmarker} If I was actually working on it, I'd sit there and {disfmarker} and play around with it, and {disfmarker} and get a feeling for it. I mean, the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the, uh {disfmarker} But, uh, you certainly wanna use the close - talking, as a {disfmarker} at least.Grad A: Right.Professor G: I don't know if the other would {disfmarker} would add some other helpful dimension or not.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.PhD D: Yeah. Sure.Professor G: So {disfmarker} so I'd like to do that. But I think, do you, maybe, eh {disfmarker} Did you prepare some whole thing you wanted us just to seePhD D: Yeah. It's {disfmarker} it's prepared.Professor G: Or what was that Yeah.Postdoc F: Oh, k Sorry.Professor G: Uh, how long a {disfmarker}PhD D: I {disfmarker} I think it's {disfmarker} it's fast, because, uh, I have the results, eh, of the study of different energy without the law length. Eh, um, eh, in the {disfmarker} in the measurement, uh, the average, uh, dividing by the {disfmarker} by the, um, variance. Um, I {disfmarker} th iProfessor G: Yeah.PhD D: the other, uh {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the last w uh, meeting {disfmarker} eh, I don't know if you remain we have problem to {disfmarker} with the {disfmarker} {vocalsound} with {disfmarker} with the parameter {disfmarker} with the representations of parameter, because the {disfmarker} the valleys and the peaks in the signal, eh, look like, eh, it doesn't follow to the {disfmarker} to the energy in the signal.Professor G: Yes. Right.PhD D: And it was a problem, uh, with the scale.Grad A: With whatPhD D: Eh, the scale.Postdoc F: Scale.Grad A: Scale.PhD D: Eh, and I {disfmarker} I change the scale and we can see the {disfmarker} the variance.Professor G: OK. But the bottom line is it's still not, uh, separating out very well.PhD D: Yeah. Yeah.Professor G: RightPhD D: The distribution {disfmarker} the distribution is {disfmarker} is similar.Professor G: OK. So that's {disfmarker} that's {disfmarker} that's enough then. OK.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: No, I mean, that there's no point in going through all of that if that's the bottom line, really.PhD D: Yeah.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: So, I {disfmarker} I think we have to start {disfmarker} Uh, I mean, {disfmarker} I'm clear that we'll be able to do that.Professor G: That's great.Grad A: And did you, uh, forward Morgan Brian's {pause} thingProfessor G: Yeah.Postdoc F: I sent {nonvocalsound} it to, um {disfmarker} who did I send that to I sent it to a list and I thought {nonvocalsound} I sent it to {nonvocalsound} the {nonvocalsound} {disfmarker} e to the local list.PhD E: Meeting Recorder.Grad A: Oh, you did OK. So you probably did get that.Postdoc F: You saw that So Brian did tell {nonvocalsound} me that {nonvocalsound} in fact what you said, that, {nonvocalsound} uh {disfmarker} that {nonvocalsound} our {disfmarker} that they are {pause} making progress and that he's going {disfmarker} that {nonvocalsound} they're {nonvocalsound} going {disfmarker} he's gonna check the f the output of the first transcription and {disfmarker} and {disfmarker}Professor G: I mean, basically it's {disfmarker} it's all the difference in the world. I mean, basically he's {disfmarker} he's on it now.Grad A: Yeah.Postdoc F: Oh, that's {disfmarker} this is a new development.Professor G: So {disfmarker} so {disfmarker} so this is {disfmarker} so i it'll happen.Postdoc F: OK. Super. Super. OK. Great.Professor G: Yeah. I mean, basically it's just saying that one of our {disfmarker} one of our best people is on it,Postdoc F: Yeah.Professor G: you know, who just doesn't happen to be here anymore. Someone else pays him. So {disfmarker}PhD B: But about the need for transcription,Postdoc F: Isn't that greatPhD B: I mean, don't we {disfmarker} didn't we previously {vocalsound} decide that the {pause} IBM {pause} transcripts would have to be {pause} checked anyway and possibly augmentedProfessor G: So. {vocalsound} Yeah.Postdoc F: Yes. That's true.PhD B: So, I think having a good tool is worth something no matter what.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.Professor G: Yeah. S OK. That's {disfmarker} that's a good point.Grad A:

What did the team discuss about volume variation

Speaker mn014 trained the system to identify speech from loud versus quiet speakers. Such pre-segmentation modifications allow the experimenter to specify the minimum length of speech and silence portions desired, and also facilitate the identification of pauses and utterance boundaries.

had tried doing it by hand at one point with a very short sample,PhD D: NGrad A: and it worked pretty well, but I haven't worked with it a lot. So what I d I d I took a hand - segmented samplePhD D: Nnn, yeah.Grad A: and I added ten times the amount of numbers at random,PhD D: Yeah.Grad A: and it did pick out pretty good boundaries.PhD D: Oh. Yeah. But is {disfmarker} is {disfmarker} if {disfmarker}Grad A: But this was just very anecdotal sort of thing.PhD D: But it's possible with my segmentation by hand {pause} that we have information about the {disfmarker} the overlapping,Grad A: Right. So if we {disfmarker} if we fed the hand - segmentation to Javier's and it doesn't work, then we know something's wrong.PhD D: uh {disfmarker} Yeah. The {disfmarker} N n Yeah. No. The demonstration by hand. Segmentation by hand I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I think is the fast experiment.Grad A: Yeah. I think that's probably worthwhile doing.PhD D: Uh, we can prove that the {disfmarker}Professor G: Uh - huh.Grad A: Whether it'll work or not.PhD D: this kind o emph emphasises parameter and Gaussian {disfmarker}Grad A: Yeah.Professor G: Yeah.Grad A: Yep. Y do you know where his software is Have you used it at allPhD D: I yeah have. I have.Grad A: OK.PhD D:Grad A: So. I {disfmarker} I have as well, so if you need {disfmarker} need help let me know.PhD D: OK.Professor G: Let's read some digits.Grad A: OK. uuhPostdoc F: Mm - hmm.Grad A: And we are {disfmarker} and, uh, those {disfmarker} if {disfmarker} Boy, the guy I knew who built them, built them like twenty {disfmarker} twenty years ago,Grad A: Hmm.Professor G: so they're {disfmarker} {vocalsound} it's {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the techniques work pretty well.Postdoc F: Fantastic. Cuz there is one thing that we don't have right now and that is the automatic, um, channel identifier.Professor G: So.Postdoc F: That {disfmarker} that, you know, that would g help in terms of encoding of overlaps.Professor G: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: The {disfmarker} the transcribers would have less, uh, disentangling to do {pause} if that were available.Professor G: Yeah. So I think, you know, basically you can look at some {disfmarker} p you have to play around a little bit, uh, to figure out what the right statistic is,Postdoc F: But.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.Professor G: but you compare each microphone to some statistic based on the {disfmarker} {vocalsound} on the overall {disfmarker}PhD C: Yeah.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: OK.Professor G: Uh, and we also have these {disfmarker} we have the advantage of having {pause} distant mikes too. So that, you cou yoGrad A: Yeah, although the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} using the close - talking I think would be much better. Wouldn't itPostdoc F: Yeah.Professor G: Um. I {disfmarker} I don't know.Grad A: Yeah.Professor G: I just {disfmarker} it'd be {disfmarker} If I was actually working on it, I'd sit there and {disfmarker} and play around with it, and {disfmarker} and get a feeling for it. I mean, the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the, uh {disfmarker} But, uh, you certainly wanna use the close - talking, as a {disfmarker} at least.Grad A: Right.Professor G: I don't know if the other would {disfmarker} would add some other helpful dimension or not.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.PhD D: it saves so much time {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the {nonvocalsound} transcribersProfessor G: Um {disfmarker}Grad A: Yep.Postdoc F: just enormous, enormous savings. Fantastic.Professor G: That's great. Um, just qu one quickly, uh, still on the features. So {vocalsound} you have these twenty - four features.PhD C: Yeah.Professor G: Uh, a lot of them are spectral features. Is there a {disfmarker} a transformation, uh, like principal components transformation or somethingPhD C: No.Grad A: Yeah. It was IS two.PhD C: No. W w we {disfmarker} originally we did thatProfessor G: Just {disfmarker}PhD C: but we saw, uh, when we used it, uh, f for our close - talking microphone, which {disfmarker} yeah, for our {disfmarker} for our recognizer in Munich {disfmarker} we saw that w it's {disfmarker} it's not {disfmarker} it's not so necessary. It {disfmarker} it works as well f with {disfmarker} with {disfmarker} without, uh, a LDA or something.Professor G: OK. OK. No, I was j {pause} curious.PhD C: Yeah.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.Professor G: Yeah, I don't think it's a big deal for this application,PhD C: Yeah.PhD D: Right.Professor G: but {disfmarker} but {disfmarker} Yeah, it's a {disfmarker}Postdoc F: Mm - hmm. OK. But then there's another thing that also Thilo's involved with, which is, um {disfmarker} OK, and {disfmarker} and also Da - Dave Gelbart. So there's this {disfmarker} this problem of {disfmarker} and w and {disfmarker} so we had this meeting. Th - the {nonvocalsound} {disfmarker} also Adam, before the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} before you went away. Uh we, um {disfmarker} regarding the representation {nonvocalsound} of overlaps, because at present, {nonvocalsound} {vocalsound} um, because {nonvocalsound} of the limitations of {vocalsound} th the interface we're using, overlaps are, uh, not being {nonvocalsound} encoded by {nonvocalsound} the transcribers in as complete {nonvocalsound} and, uh, detailed a way as it might Markov models, uh, but in addition there's an expansion of what Javier did. And one of those things, looking at the statistical component,PhD D: One.PhD C: Yeah.Professor G: even if the features that you give it are maybe not ideal for it, it's just sort of this general filter bankPhD C: Yeah.Professor G: or {disfmarker} {vocalsound} or cepstrum or something, um {disfmarker} Eee {vocalsound} it's in there somewhere probably.PhD D: But, eh, what did you think about the possibility of using the Javier software Eh, I mean, the, uh {disfmarker} the, uh {disfmarker} the BIC criterion, the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} t to train the {disfmarker} the Gaussian, eh, using the {disfmarker} the mark, eh, by hand, eh, eh, to distinguish be mmm, to train overlapping zone and speech zone. I mean, eh, {vocalsound} I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I think that an interesting, eh, experiment, eh, could be, th eh, to prove that, mmm, if s we suppose that, eh, the {disfmarker} the first step {disfmarker} {vocalsound} I mean, the {disfmarker} the classifier what were the classifier from Javier or classifier from Thilo W What happen with the second step I {disfmarker} I mean, what {disfmarker} what happen with the, eh {disfmarker} the, uh, clu the, uh {disfmarker} the clu the clustering processGrad A: Mm - hmm.PhD D: Using the {disfmarker} the Gaussian.Grad A: You mean Javier'sPhD D: Yeah.Grad A: What do you meanPhD D: I {disfmarker} I mean, that is {disfmarker} is enough {disfmarker} is enough, eh, to work well, eh, to, eh, separate or to distinguish, eh, between overlapping zone and, eh, speaker zone Because th {vocalsound} if {disfmarker} if we {disfmarker} if we, eh, nnn, develop an classifier {disfmarker} and the second step doesn't work {pause} well, eh, we have {pause} another problem.Grad A: I {disfmarker} Yeah. I a while.PhD C: Yeah. Uh, I could have a look at it.PhD D: Javier {disfmarker}Professor G: Uh.PhD C: So.PhD D: You mean Ja - eh, eh, Javier programGrad A: Mm - hmm.PhD D: No, Javier di doesn't worked with, uh, a Markov {disfmarker}Grad A: Yeah, I didn't think so.PhD D: He on only train {disfmarker}Professor G: Oh, OK. So he's just {disfmarker} he just computes a Gaussian over potential {disfmarker}Grad A: Yep.PhD D: Yeah. It was only Gaussian.Professor G: Oh, I see. I see.Grad A: And so I {disfmarker} I think it would work fine for detecting overlap.PhD D: This is the idea.Professor G: And {disfmarker} and {disfmarker}Grad A: It's just, uh, that i it {disfmarker} he has the two - pass issue that {disfmarker} What he does is, as a first pass he {disfmarker} he {disfmarker} p he does, um, a guess at where the divisions might be and he overestimates. And that's just a data reduction step, so that you're not trying at every time interval.PhD C: OK.Grad A: And so those are the putative {pause} places where he tries.PhD D: Yeah.PhD C: Yeah. OK.Grad A: And right now he's doing that with silence and that doesn't work with the Meeting Recorder. So if we used another method to get the first pass, I think it would probably work.PhD C: Yeah. Yeah. Sure. Yeah. Yeah, OK.Grad A: It's a good method. As long as the len as long the segments are long enough.PhD D: Yeah.Grad A: That's the other problem.PhD C: So {disfmarker}Professor G: O - k OK. So let me go back to what you had, though.PhD C: Yeah.Professor G: Um.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Professor G: The other thing one could do is {disfmarker} Couldn't {disfmarker} I mean, it's {disfmarker} So you have two categoriesPhD C: Yeah.Professor

What problems were faced due to overlaps

There is no channel identifier to help in encoding speaker overlaps. Speech uttered while laughing is problematic for ASR. So far, speaker mn005's attempts to detect speaker overlap have been unsuccessful, as it has not been possible to normalize energy as a reliable indicator of overlap.

and, uh, those {disfmarker} if {disfmarker} Boy, the guy I knew who built them, built them like twenty {disfmarker} twenty years ago,Grad A: Hmm.Professor G: so they're {disfmarker} {vocalsound} it's {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the techniques work pretty well.Postdoc F: Fantastic. Cuz there is one thing that we don't have right now and that is the automatic, um, channel identifier.Professor G: So.Postdoc F: That {disfmarker} that, you know, that would g help in terms of encoding of overlaps.Professor G: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: The {disfmarker} the transcribers would have less, uh, disentangling to do {pause} if that were available.Professor G: Yeah. So I think, you know, basically you can look at some {disfmarker} p you have to play around a little bit, uh, to figure out what the right statistic is,Postdoc F: But.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.Professor G: but you compare each microphone to some statistic based on the {disfmarker} {vocalsound} on the overall {disfmarker}PhD C: Yeah.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: OK.Professor G: Uh, and we also have these {disfmarker} we have the advantage of having {pause} distant mikes too. So that, you cou yoGrad A: Yeah, although the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} using the close - talking I think would be much better. Wouldn't itPostdoc F: Yeah.Professor G: Um. I {disfmarker} I don't know.Grad A: Yeah.Professor G: I just {disfmarker} it'd be {disfmarker} If I was actually working on it, I'd sit there and {disfmarker} and play around with it, and {disfmarker} and get a feeling for it. I mean, the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the, uh {disfmarker} But, uh, you certainly wanna use the close - talking, as a {disfmarker} at least.Grad A: Right.Professor G: I don't know if the other would {disfmarker} would add some other helpful dimension or not.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.PhD D: also be interesting to have, uh, a couple of the meetings have more than one transcriber do,Professor G: Yeah.Grad A: cuz I'm curious about inter - annotator agreement.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.PhD D: Yeah.Postdoc F: OK. Yeah. Th - that'd be {disfmarker} I think that's a {disfmarker} a good idea.Professor G: Yeah.Postdoc F: You know, there's also, the e In my mind, I think A An - Andreas was {pause} leading to this topic, the idea that, um, {vocalsound} we haven't yet seen the {disfmarker} the type of transcript that we get from IBM, and it may just be, you know, pristine. But on the other hand, given the lesser interface {disfmarker} Cuz this is, you know {disfmarker} we've got a good interface, we've got great headphones, m um {disfmarker}Professor G: It could be that they will uh {disfmarker} theirs will end up being a kind of fir first pass or something.Postdoc F: Something like that.Professor G: Maybe an elaborate one, cuz again they probably are gonna do these alignments, which will also clear things up.Postdoc F: That's {disfmarker} that's true. Al - although you have to s Don't you have to start with a close enough approximation {nonvocalsound} of the {disfmarker} of the verbal part {nonvocalsound} to be able to {disfmarker}Professor G: Well, tha that's {disfmarker} that's debatable.Postdoc F: OK.Professor G: Right I mean, so the {disfmarker} so the argument is that if your statistical system is good {vocalsound} it will in fact, uh, clean things up.Postdoc F: OK.Professor G: Right So it it's got its own objective criterion.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: And, uh, so in principle you could start up with something that was kind of rough {disfmarker} I mean, to give an example of, um, something we used to do, uh, at one point, uh, back {disfmarker} Broadcast News, that was fine. Here obviously it's not.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: And, um, so one of the things that they were pushing in d in discussing with me is, um, w why are you spending so much time, uh, on the, uh, feature issue, uh, when perhaps if you sort of deal with what you were using beforePhD D: Uh - huh.Professor G: and then just broadened it a bit, instead of just ta using silence as putative change point also {disfmarker}PhD D: Nnn, yeah.Professor G: So then you've got {disfmarker} you already have the super - structure with Gaussians and H - you know, simple H M Ms and so forth. And you {disfmarker} you might {disfmarker} So there was a {disfmarker} there was a little bit of a {disfmarker} a {disfmarker} a {disfmarker} a difference of opinion because I {disfmarker} I thought that it was {disfmarker} it's interesting to look at what features are useful.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: But, uh, on the other hand I saw that the {disfmarker} they had a good point that, uh, if we had something that worked for many cases before, maybe starting from there a little bit {disfmarker} Because ultimately we're gonna end up {vocalsound} with some s su kind of structure like that,PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: where you have some kind of simple HMM and you're testing the hypothesis that, {vocalsound} uh, there is a change.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: So {disfmarker} so anyway, I just {disfmarker} reporting that.PhD D: OK.Professor G: But, uh, uh {disfmarker} So. Yeah, why don't we do the speech - nonspeech discussionPostdoc F: Yeah. Do {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I hear {disfmarker} you {disfmarker} you didn't {disfmarker}PhD C: Speech - nonspeech OK.Postdoc F: Uh - huh. Yeah.PhD C: Um, so, uh, what we basically did so far be, and as might be desired {disfmarker} I think would be desired in the corpus ultimately.Professor G: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: So we don't have start and end points {nonvocalsound} at each point where there's an overlap. We just have the {disfmarker} the {nonvocalsound} overlaps {nonvocalsound} encoded in a simple bin. Well, OK. So {nonvocalsound} @ @ the limits of the {nonvocalsound} over of {disfmarker} of the interface are {vocalsound} such that we were {disfmarker} at this meeting we were entertaining how we might either expand {nonvocalsound} the {disfmarker} the {vocalsound} interface or find other tools which already {pause} do what would be useful. Because what would ultimately be, um, ideal in my {disfmarker} my view and I think {disfmarker} I mean, I had the sense that it was consensus, is that, um, a thorough - going musical score notation would be {nonvocalsound} the best way to go. Because {nonvocalsound} you can have multiple channels, there's a single time - line, it's very clear, flexible, and all those nice things.Professor G: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: OK. So, um, um, I spoke {disfmarker} I had a meeting with Dave Gelbart on {disfmarker} on {disfmarker} and he had, uh, excellent ideas on how {pause} the interface could be {pause} modified to {disfmarker} to do this kind of representation. But, um, he {disfmarker} in the meantime you were checking into the existence of already, um, existing interfaces which might already have these properties. So, do you wanna say something about thatPhD C: Yes. Um, I {vocalsound} talked with, uh, Munich guys from {disfmarker} from Ludwi - Ludwig Maximilians University, who do a lot of transcribing and transliterations.Professor G: Mm - hmm.PhD C: And they basically said they have {disfmarker} they have, uh, a tool they developed {pause} themselves and they can't give away, of general interest or not.Professor G: Uh, bigramGrad A: IRAM.PhD D: IRAM.Professor G: IRAM.Grad A: IRAM, bigram,Professor G: Well, m maybe.PhD D: Bi - Bigram.Grad A: you know.Professor G: Yeah, let's {disfmarker} let's see where we are at three - thirty.PhD B: Hmm.Professor G: Um {disfmarker}PhD B: Since, uh {disfmarker} since I have to leave as usual at three - thirty, can we do the interesting stuff firstPostdoc F: I beg your pardonProfessor G: Well {disfmarker}PhD C: Which is {disfmarker}Grad A: What's the interesting stuffPostdoc F: I beg your pardonPhD D: Yeah.Professor G: Yeah. Th - now you get to tell us what's the interesting part.PhD E: Please specify.Professor G: But {disfmarker}PhD B: Well, uh, I guess the work that's been {pause} done on segmentation would be most {disfmarker}PhD C: Yeah.Postdoc F: I think that would be a good thing to start with.PhD B: Yeah.Professor G: OK. Um, and, um, {vocalsound} the other thing, uh, which I'll just say very briefly that maybe relates to that a little bit, which is that, um, uh, one of the suggestions that came up in a brief meeting I had the other day when I was in Spain with, uh, Manolo Pardo and {vocalsound} Javier, uh, Ferreiros, who was {pause} here before, was, um, why not start with what they had before but add in the non - silence boundaries. So, in what Javier did before when they were doing, um {disfmarker} h he was looking for, uh, speaker change {pause} points.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Professor G: Um. As a simplification, he originally did this only using {pause} silence as, uh, a {pause} putative, uh, speaker change point.PhD C: Yeah.Professor G: And, uh, he did not, say, look at points where you were changing broad sp uh, phonetic class, for instance. And for

What's the status of transcription

The transcriber pool is making quick progress, and may be used in the future to perform other types of coding, e. g. a more detailed analysis of speaker overlap. Transcribers are coding non-speech gestures, such as audible breaths and laughter, both of which are useful for improving recognition results.

also be interesting to have, uh, a couple of the meetings have more than one transcriber do,Professor G: Yeah.Grad A: cuz I'm curious about inter - annotator agreement.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.PhD D: Yeah.Postdoc F: OK. Yeah. Th - that'd be {disfmarker} I think that's a {disfmarker} a good idea.Professor G: Yeah.Postdoc F: You know, there's also, the e In my mind, I think A An - Andreas was {pause} leading to this topic, the idea that, um, {vocalsound} we haven't yet seen the {disfmarker} the type of transcript that we get from IBM, and it may just be, you know, pristine. But on the other hand, given the lesser interface {disfmarker} Cuz this is, you know {disfmarker} we've got a good interface, we've got great headphones, m um {disfmarker}Professor G: It could be that they will uh {disfmarker} theirs will end up being a kind of fir first pass or something.Postdoc F: Something like that.Professor G: Maybe an elaborate one, cuz again they probably are gonna do these alignments, which will also clear things up.Postdoc F: That's {disfmarker} that's true. Al - although you have to s Don't you have to start with a close enough approximation {nonvocalsound} of the {disfmarker} of the verbal part {nonvocalsound} to be able to {disfmarker}Professor G: Well, tha that's {disfmarker} that's debatable.Postdoc F: OK.Professor G: Right I mean, so the {disfmarker} so the argument is that if your statistical system is good {vocalsound} it will in fact, uh, clean things up.Postdoc F: OK.Professor G: Right So it it's got its own objective criterion.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: And, uh, so in principle you could start up with something that was kind of rough {disfmarker} I mean, to give an example of, um, something we used to do, uh, at one point, uh, back {disfmarker} it saves so much time {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the {nonvocalsound} transcribersProfessor G: Um {disfmarker}Grad A: Yep.Postdoc F: just enormous, enormous savings. Fantastic.Professor G: That's great. Um, just qu one quickly, uh, still on the features. So {vocalsound} you have these twenty - four features.PhD C: Yeah.Professor G: Uh, a lot of them are spectral features. Is there a {disfmarker} a transformation, uh, like principal components transformation or somethingPhD C: No.Grad A: Yeah. It was IS two.PhD C: No. W w we {disfmarker} originally we did thatProfessor G: Just {disfmarker}PhD C: but we saw, uh, when we used it, uh, f for our close - talking microphone, which {disfmarker} yeah, for our {disfmarker} for our recognizer in Munich {disfmarker} we saw that w it's {disfmarker} it's not {disfmarker} it's not so necessary. It {disfmarker} it works as well f with {disfmarker} with {disfmarker} without, uh, a LDA or something.Professor G: OK. OK. No, I was j {pause} curious.PhD C: Yeah.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.Professor G: Yeah, I don't think it's a big deal for this application,PhD C: Yeah.PhD D: Right.Professor G: but {disfmarker} but {disfmarker} Yeah, it's a {disfmarker}Postdoc F: Mm - hmm. OK. But then there's another thing that also Thilo's involved with, which is, um {disfmarker} OK, and {disfmarker} and also Da - Dave Gelbart. So there's this {disfmarker} this problem of {disfmarker} and w and {disfmarker} so we had this meeting. Th - the {nonvocalsound} {disfmarker} also Adam, before the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} before you went away. Uh we, um {disfmarker} regarding the representation {nonvocalsound} of overlaps, because at present, {nonvocalsound} {vocalsound} um, because {nonvocalsound} of the limitations of {vocalsound} th the interface we're using, overlaps are, uh, not being {nonvocalsound} encoded by {nonvocalsound} the transcribers in as complete {nonvocalsound} and, uh, detailed a way as it might think we {disfmarker} you know, with Eric's work, I sort of figure we {disfmarker} we can just treat that as a variant. But I told them if {disfmarker} if there's an obvious speech error, uh, like I said in one thing,Professor G: OK. Yes.Postdoc F: and I gave my {disfmarker} my example, like I said," microfon" {pause} in instead of" microphone" . Didn't bother {disfmarker} I knew it when I said it. I remember s thinking" oh, that's not correctly pronounced" . But it {disfmarker} but I thought {vocalsound} it's not worth fixing cuz often when you're speaking everybody knows what {disfmarker} what you mean.Grad A: You'll self - repair. Yeah.PhD C: Yeah.Postdoc F: But I have a convention that if it's obviously a noncanonical pronunciation {disfmarker} a speech error with {disfmarker} you know, wi within the realm of resolution that you can tell in this native English {disfmarker} American English speaker, you know that I didn't mean to say" microfon." Then you'd put a little tick at the beginning of the word,Professor G: Yeah.Postdoc F: and that just signals that, um, this is not standard, and then in curly brackets" pron {nonvocalsound} error" . And, um, and other than that, it's w word level. But, you know, the fact that they noticed, you know, the" nnn" ." He said" nnn" , not" and" . What shall I do with that" I mean, they're very perceptive. And {disfmarker} and s several of them are trained in IPA. C they really could do phonetic transcription if {disfmarker} if we wanted them to.Professor G: Mm - hmm. Right. Well {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Well, you know, it might be something we'd wanna do with some, uh, s small subset {pause} of the whole thing.Grad A: Hmm. Where were they when {pause} we needed themPostdoc and, uh, those {disfmarker} if {disfmarker} Boy, the guy I knew who built them, built them like twenty {disfmarker} twenty years ago,Grad A: Hmm.Professor G: so they're {disfmarker} {vocalsound} it's {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the techniques work pretty well.Postdoc F: Fantastic. Cuz there is one thing that we don't have right now and that is the automatic, um, channel identifier.Professor G: So.Postdoc F: That {disfmarker} that, you know, that would g help in terms of encoding of overlaps.Professor G: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: The {disfmarker} the transcribers would have less, uh, disentangling to do {pause} if that were available.Professor G: Yeah. So I think, you know, basically you can look at some {disfmarker} p you have to play around a little bit, uh, to figure out what the right statistic is,Postdoc F: But.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.Professor G: but you compare each microphone to some statistic based on the {disfmarker} {vocalsound} on the overall {disfmarker}PhD C: Yeah.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: OK.Professor G: Uh, and we also have these {disfmarker} we have the advantage of having {pause} distant mikes too. So that, you cou yoGrad A: Yeah, although the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} using the close - talking I think would be much better. Wouldn't itPostdoc F: Yeah.Professor G: Um. I {disfmarker} I don't know.Grad A: Yeah.Professor G: I just {disfmarker} it'd be {disfmarker} If I was actually working on it, I'd sit there and {disfmarker} and play around with it, and {disfmarker} and get a feeling for it. I mean, the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the, uh {disfmarker} But, uh, you certainly wanna use the close - talking, as a {disfmarker} at least.Grad A: Right.Professor G: I don't know if the other would {disfmarker} would add some other helpful dimension or not.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.PhD D: be, and as might be desired {disfmarker} I think would be desired in the corpus ultimately.Professor G: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: So we don't have start and end points {nonvocalsound} at each point where there's an overlap. We just have the {disfmarker} the {nonvocalsound} overlaps {nonvocalsound} encoded in a simple bin. Well, OK. So {nonvocalsound} @ @ the limits of the {nonvocalsound} over of {disfmarker} of the interface are {vocalsound} such that we were {disfmarker} at this meeting we were entertaining how we might either expand {nonvocalsound} the {disfmarker} the {vocalsound} interface or find other tools which already {pause} do what would be useful. Because what would ultimately be, um, ideal in my {disfmarker} my view and I think {disfmarker} I mean, I had the sense that it was consensus, is that, um, a thorough - going musical score notation would be {nonvocalsound} the best way to go. Because {nonvocalsound} you can have multiple channels, there's a single time - line, it's very clear, flexible, and all those nice things.Professor G: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: OK. So, um, um, I spoke {disfmarker} I had a meeting with Dave Gelbart on {disfmarker} on {disfmarker} and he had, uh, excellent ideas on how {pause} the interface could be {pause} modified to {disfmarker} to do this kind of representation. But, um, he {disfmarker} in the meantime you were checking into the existence of already, um, existing interfaces which might already have these properties. So, do you wanna say something about thatPhD C: Yes. Um, I {vocalsound} talked with, uh, Munich guys from {disfmarker} from Ludwi - Ludwig Maximilians University, who do a lot of transcribing and transliterations.Professor G: Mm - hmm.PhD C: And they basically said they have {disfmarker} they have, uh, a tool they developed {pause} themselves and they can't give away,

What did Speaker F state about the transcriber tool

Recent modifications to the Transcriber tool allow transcribers to listen to speech from different channels, as well as helping to preserve portions of overlapping speech, and enabling the creation of different output files for each channel for a cleaner and more segmentable transcript.

it saves so much time {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the {nonvocalsound} transcribersProfessor G: Um {disfmarker}Grad A: Yep.Postdoc F: just enormous, enormous savings. Fantastic.Professor G: That's great. Um, just qu one quickly, uh, still on the features. So {vocalsound} you have these twenty - four features.PhD C: Yeah.Professor G: Uh, a lot of them are spectral features. Is there a {disfmarker} a transformation, uh, like principal components transformation or somethingPhD C: No.Grad A: Yeah. It was IS two.PhD C: No. W w we {disfmarker} originally we did thatProfessor G: Just {disfmarker}PhD C: but we saw, uh, when we used it, uh, f for our close - talking microphone, which {disfmarker} yeah, for our {disfmarker} for our recognizer in Munich {disfmarker} we saw that w it's {disfmarker} it's not {disfmarker} it's not so necessary. It {disfmarker} it works as well f with {disfmarker} with {disfmarker} without, uh, a LDA or something.Professor G: OK. OK. No, I was j {pause} curious.PhD C: Yeah.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.Professor G: Yeah, I don't think it's a big deal for this application,PhD C: Yeah.PhD D: Right.Professor G: but {disfmarker} but {disfmarker} Yeah, it's a {disfmarker}Postdoc F: Mm - hmm. OK. But then there's another thing that also Thilo's involved with, which is, um {disfmarker} OK, and {disfmarker} and also Da - Dave Gelbart. So there's this {disfmarker} this problem of {disfmarker} and w and {disfmarker} so we had this meeting. Th - the {nonvocalsound} {disfmarker} also Adam, before the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} before you went away. Uh we, um {disfmarker} regarding the representation {nonvocalsound} of overlaps, because at present, {nonvocalsound} {vocalsound} um, because {nonvocalsound} of the limitations of {vocalsound} th the interface we're using, overlaps are, uh, not being {nonvocalsound} encoded by {nonvocalsound} the transcribers in as complete {nonvocalsound} and, uh, detailed a way as it might also be interesting to have, uh, a couple of the meetings have more than one transcriber do,Professor G: Yeah.Grad A: cuz I'm curious about inter - annotator agreement.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.PhD D: Yeah.Postdoc F: OK. Yeah. Th - that'd be {disfmarker} I think that's a {disfmarker} a good idea.Professor G: Yeah.Postdoc F: You know, there's also, the e In my mind, I think A An - Andreas was {pause} leading to this topic, the idea that, um, {vocalsound} we haven't yet seen the {disfmarker} the type of transcript that we get from IBM, and it may just be, you know, pristine. But on the other hand, given the lesser interface {disfmarker} Cuz this is, you know {disfmarker} we've got a good interface, we've got great headphones, m um {disfmarker}Professor G: It could be that they will uh {disfmarker} theirs will end up being a kind of fir first pass or something.Postdoc F: Something like that.Professor G: Maybe an elaborate one, cuz again they probably are gonna do these alignments, which will also clear things up.Postdoc F: That's {disfmarker} that's true. Al - although you have to s Don't you have to start with a close enough approximation {nonvocalsound} of the {disfmarker} of the verbal part {nonvocalsound} to be able to {disfmarker}Professor G: Well, tha that's {disfmarker} that's debatable.Postdoc F: OK.Professor G: Right I mean, so the {disfmarker} so the argument is that if your statistical system is good {vocalsound} it will in fact, uh, clean things up.Postdoc F: OK.Professor G: Right So it it's got its own objective criterion.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: And, uh, so in principle you could start up with something that was kind of rough {disfmarker} I mean, to give an example of, um, something we used to do, uh, at one point, uh, back {disfmarker} Yeah, and Dave Gelbart did volunteer,Postdoc F: Good.Grad A: and since he's not here, I'll repeat it {disfmarker} to at least modify Transcriber, which, if we don't have something else that works, I think that's a pretty good way of going.PhD C: Mmm.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.Grad A: And we discussed on some methods to do it. My approach originally, and I've already hacked on it a little bit {disfmarker} it was too slow because I was trying to display all the waveforms. But he pointed out that you don't really have to. I think that's a good point.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.Professor G: Mm - hmm.Grad A: That if you just display the mix waveform and then have a user interface for editing the different channels, that's perfectly sufficient.Professor G: Hmm.Postdoc F: Yeah, exactly. And just keep those {nonvocalsound} things separate. And {disfmarker} and, um, Dan Ellis's hack already allows them to be {nonvocalsound} able to display {vocalsound} different {nonvocalsound} waveforms to clarify overlaps and things,Grad A: No. They can only display one,Postdoc F: so that's already {disfmarker}Grad A: but they can listen to different ones.Postdoc F: Oh, yes, but {disfmarker} Well, {vocalsound} uh, yes, but {nonvocalsound} what I mean is {pause} that, uh, from the transcriber's {nonvocalsound} perspective, uh, those {nonvocalsound} two functions are separate. And Dan Ellis's hack handles the, {vocalsound} um, choice {nonvocalsound} {disfmarker} the ability to choose different waveforms {vocalsound} from moment to moment.Grad A: But only to listen to, not to look at.PhD C: Yeah.Postdoc F: Um {disfmarker}Grad A: The waveform you're looking at doesn't change.PhD C: Yeah.Postdoc F: That's true.Grad A: Yeah.Postdoc F: Yeah, but {nonvocalsound} that's {disfmarker} that's OK, cuz they're {disfmarker} they're, you know, they're focused on the ear anyway.Grad A: Right.Postdoc F: And then {disfmarker} and thenProfessor G: Hmm.Postdoc F: be, and as might be desired {disfmarker} I think would be desired in the corpus ultimately.Professor G: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: So we don't have start and end points {nonvocalsound} at each point where there's an overlap. We just have the {disfmarker} the {nonvocalsound} overlaps {nonvocalsound} encoded in a simple bin. Well, OK. So {nonvocalsound} @ @ the limits of the {nonvocalsound} over of {disfmarker} of the interface are {vocalsound} such that we were {disfmarker} at this meeting we were entertaining how we might either expand {nonvocalsound} the {disfmarker} the {vocalsound} interface or find other tools which already {pause} do what would be useful. Because what would ultimately be, um, ideal in my {disfmarker} my view and I think {disfmarker} I mean, I had the sense that it was consensus, is that, um, a thorough - going musical score notation would be {nonvocalsound} the best way to go. Because {nonvocalsound} you can have multiple channels, there's a single time - line, it's very clear, flexible, and all those nice things.Professor G: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: OK. So, um, um, I spoke {disfmarker} I had a meeting with Dave Gelbart on {disfmarker} on {disfmarker} and he had, uh, excellent ideas on how {pause} the interface could be {pause} modified to {disfmarker} to do this kind of representation. But, um, he {disfmarker} in the meantime you were checking into the existence of already, um, existing interfaces which might already have these properties. So, do you wanna say something about thatPhD C: Yes. Um, I {vocalsound} talked with, uh, Munich guys from {disfmarker} from Ludwi - Ludwig Maximilians University, who do a lot of transcribing and transliterations.Professor G: Mm - hmm.PhD C: And they basically said they have {disfmarker} they have, uh, a tool they developed {pause} themselves and they can't give away, and, uh, those {disfmarker} if {disfmarker} Boy, the guy I knew who built them, built them like twenty {disfmarker} twenty years ago,Grad A: Hmm.Professor G: so they're {disfmarker} {vocalsound} it's {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the techniques work pretty well.Postdoc F: Fantastic. Cuz there is one thing that we don't have right now and that is the automatic, um, channel identifier.Professor G: So.Postdoc F: That {disfmarker} that, you know, that would g help in terms of encoding of overlaps.Professor G: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: The {disfmarker} the transcribers would have less, uh, disentangling to do {pause} if that were available.Professor G: Yeah. So I think, you know, basically you can look at some {disfmarker} p you have to play around a little bit, uh, to figure out what the right statistic is,Postdoc F: But.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.Professor G: but you compare each microphone to some statistic based on the {disfmarker} {vocalsound} on the overall {disfmarker}PhD C: Yeah.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: OK.Professor G: Uh, and we also have these {disfmarker} we have the advantage of having {pause} distant mikes too. So that, you cou yoGrad A: Yeah, although the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} using the close - talking I think would be much better. Wouldn't itPostdoc F: Yeah.Professor G: Um. I {disfmarker} I don't know.Grad A: Yeah.Professor G: I just {disfmarker} it'd be {disfmarker} If I was actually working on it, I'd sit there and {disfmarker} and play around with it, and {disfmarker} and get a feeling for it. I mean, the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the, uh {disfmarker} But, uh, you certainly wanna use the close - talking, as a {disfmarker} at least.Grad A: Right.Professor G: I don't know if the other would {disfmarker} would add some other helpful dimension or not.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.PhD D:

What did the team say on alternative transcription tools

The Praat software package was discussed as an alternative transcription tool capable of representing multiple channels of speech. Cross-correlation was discussed as a means of enabling speaker identification, and may be integrated into future work.

also be interesting to have, uh, a couple of the meetings have more than one transcriber do,Professor G: Yeah.Grad A: cuz I'm curious about inter - annotator agreement.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.PhD D: Yeah.Postdoc F: OK. Yeah. Th - that'd be {disfmarker} I think that's a {disfmarker} a good idea.Professor G: Yeah.Postdoc F: You know, there's also, the e In my mind, I think A An - Andreas was {pause} leading to this topic, the idea that, um, {vocalsound} we haven't yet seen the {disfmarker} the type of transcript that we get from IBM, and it may just be, you know, pristine. But on the other hand, given the lesser interface {disfmarker} Cuz this is, you know {disfmarker} we've got a good interface, we've got great headphones, m um {disfmarker}Professor G: It could be that they will uh {disfmarker} theirs will end up being a kind of fir first pass or something.Postdoc F: Something like that.Professor G: Maybe an elaborate one, cuz again they probably are gonna do these alignments, which will also clear things up.Postdoc F: That's {disfmarker} that's true. Al - although you have to s Don't you have to start with a close enough approximation {nonvocalsound} of the {disfmarker} of the verbal part {nonvocalsound} to be able to {disfmarker}Professor G: Well, tha that's {disfmarker} that's debatable.Postdoc F: OK.Professor G: Right I mean, so the {disfmarker} so the argument is that if your statistical system is good {vocalsound} it will in fact, uh, clean things up.Postdoc F: OK.Professor G: Right So it it's got its own objective criterion.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: And, uh, so in principle you could start up with something that was kind of rough {disfmarker} I mean, to give an example of, um, something we used to do, uh, at one point, uh, back {disfmarker} of general interest or not.Professor G: Uh, bigramGrad A: IRAM.PhD D: IRAM.Professor G: IRAM.Grad A: IRAM, bigram,Professor G: Well, m maybe.PhD D: Bi - Bigram.Grad A: you know.Professor G: Yeah, let's {disfmarker} let's see where we are at three - thirty.PhD B: Hmm.Professor G: Um {disfmarker}PhD B: Since, uh {disfmarker} since I have to leave as usual at three - thirty, can we do the interesting stuff firstPostdoc F: I beg your pardonProfessor G: Well {disfmarker}PhD C: Which is {disfmarker}Grad A: What's the interesting stuffPostdoc F: I beg your pardonPhD D: Yeah.Professor G: Yeah. Th - now you get to tell us what's the interesting part.PhD E: Please specify.Professor G: But {disfmarker}PhD B: Well, uh, I guess the work that's been {pause} done on segmentation would be most {disfmarker}PhD C: Yeah.Postdoc F: I think that would be a good thing to start with.PhD B: Yeah.Professor G: OK. Um, and, um, {vocalsound} the other thing, uh, which I'll just say very briefly that maybe relates to that a little bit, which is that, um, uh, one of the suggestions that came up in a brief meeting I had the other day when I was in Spain with, uh, Manolo Pardo and {vocalsound} Javier, uh, Ferreiros, who was {pause} here before, was, um, why not start with what they had before but add in the non - silence boundaries. So, in what Javier did before when they were doing, um {disfmarker} h he was looking for, uh, speaker change {pause} points.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Professor G: Um. As a simplification, he originally did this only using {pause} silence as, uh, a {pause} putative, uh, speaker change point.PhD C: Yeah.Professor G: And, uh, he did not, say, look at points where you were changing broad sp uh, phonetic class, for instance. And for back when Chuck was here in early times, is we would take, um, {vocalsound} da take a word and, uh, have a canonical pronunciation and, uh, if there was five phones in a word, {vocalsound} you'd break up the word, {vocalsound} uh, into five equal - length pieces which is completely gross.Grad A: Wrong.PhD D: Yeah.Professor G: Right I mean, th the timing is off {pause} all over the place in just about any word.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm. OK.Professor G: But it's O K. You start off with that and the statistical system then aligns things, and eventually you get something that doesn't really look too bad.Postdoc F: Oh, excellent. OK.Professor G: So {disfmarker} so I think using a {disfmarker} a good {pause} aligner, um, actually can {disfmarker} can help a lot. Um. {vocalsound} But, uh, you know, they both help each other. If you have a {disfmarker} if you have a better starting point, then it helps the aligner. If you have a good alignment, it helps the, uh, th the human in {disfmarker} in taking less time to correct things.Postdoc F: OK.Professor G: So {disfmarker} so {disfmarker}Postdoc F: Excellent. I guess there's another aspect, too, and I don't know {disfmarker} uh, this {disfmarker} this is {disfmarker} very possibly a different, uh, topic. But, {nonvocalsound} uh, just let me say {pause} with reference to this idea of, um, {vocalsound} higher - order organization within meetings. So like in a {disfmarker} you know, the topics that are covered during a meeting with reference to the other, uh, uses of the data,Professor G: Mm - hmm.Postdoc F: so being able to {pause} find where so - and - so talked about such - and - such, then, um, um {disfmarker} e I mean, I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I did sort a while.PhD C: Yeah. Uh, I could have a look at it.PhD D: Javier {disfmarker}Professor G: Uh.PhD C: So.PhD D: You mean Ja - eh, eh, Javier programGrad A: Mm - hmm.PhD D: No, Javier di doesn't worked with, uh, a Markov {disfmarker}Grad A: Yeah, I didn't think so.PhD D: He on only train {disfmarker}Professor G: Oh, OK. So he's just {disfmarker} he just computes a Gaussian over potential {disfmarker}Grad A: Yep.PhD D: Yeah. It was only Gaussian.Professor G: Oh, I see. I see.Grad A: And so I {disfmarker} I think it would work fine for detecting overlap.PhD D: This is the idea.Professor G: And {disfmarker} and {disfmarker}Grad A: It's just, uh, that i it {disfmarker} he has the two - pass issue that {disfmarker} What he does is, as a first pass he {disfmarker} he {disfmarker} p he does, um, a guess at where the divisions might be and he overestimates. And that's just a data reduction step, so that you're not trying at every time interval.PhD C: OK.Grad A: And so those are the putative {pause} places where he tries.PhD D: Yeah.PhD C: Yeah. OK.Grad A: And right now he's doing that with silence and that doesn't work with the Meeting Recorder. So if we used another method to get the first pass, I think it would probably work.PhD C: Yeah. Yeah. Sure. Yeah. Yeah, OK.Grad A: It's a good method. As long as the len as long the segments are long enough.PhD D: Yeah.Grad A: That's the other problem.PhD C: So {disfmarker}Professor G: O - k OK. So let me go back to what you had, though.PhD C: Yeah.Professor G: Um.PhD D: Mm - hmm.Professor G: The other thing one could do is {disfmarker} Couldn't {disfmarker} I mean, it's {disfmarker} So you have two categoriesPhD C: Yeah.Professor {disfmarker} I'm clear that we'll be able to do that.Professor G: That's great.Grad A: And did you, uh, forward Morgan Brian's {pause} thingProfessor G: Yeah.Postdoc F: I sent {nonvocalsound} it to, um {disfmarker} who did I send that to I sent it to a list and I thought {nonvocalsound} I sent it to {nonvocalsound} the {nonvocalsound} {disfmarker} e to the local list.PhD E: Meeting Recorder.Grad A: Oh, you did OK. So you probably did get that.Postdoc F: You saw that So Brian did tell {nonvocalsound} me that {nonvocalsound} in fact what you said, that, {nonvocalsound} uh {disfmarker} that {nonvocalsound} our {disfmarker} that they are {pause} making progress and that he's going {disfmarker} that {nonvocalsound} they're {nonvocalsound} going {disfmarker} he's gonna check the f the output of the first transcription and {disfmarker} and {disfmarker}Professor G: I mean, basically it's {disfmarker} it's all the difference in the world. I mean, basically he's {disfmarker} he's on it now.Grad A: Yeah.Postdoc F: Oh, that's {disfmarker} this is a new development.Professor G: So {disfmarker} so {disfmarker} so this is {disfmarker} so i it'll happen.Postdoc F: OK. Super. Super. OK. Great.Professor G: Yeah. I mean, basically it's just saying that one of our {disfmarker} one of our best people is on it,Postdoc F: Yeah.Professor G: you know, who just doesn't happen to be here anymore. Someone else pays him. So {disfmarker}PhD B: But about the need for transcription,Postdoc F: Isn't that greatPhD B: I mean, don't we {disfmarker} didn't we previously {vocalsound} decide that the {pause} IBM {pause} transcripts would have to be {pause} checked anyway and possibly augmentedProfessor G: So. {vocalsound} Yeah.Postdoc F: Yes. That's true.PhD B: So, I think having a good tool is worth something no matter what.Postdoc F: Mm - hmm.Professor G: Yeah. S OK. That's {disfmarker} that's a good point.Grad A:

What was discussed in the meeting

The group talked about the ongoing transcription effort and issues related to the Transcriber tool, which despite its limitations for capturing tight time markings for overlapping speech, will continue to remain in use. Speaker mn014 explained his efforts to pre-segment the signal into speech and non-speech portions for facilitating transcriptions. Recording equipment and procedures were discussed, with a focus on audible breathing and the need for standards in microphone wear and use.

let's do this fast. Um {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} Well that didn't some up on mine.Project Manager: Should we have audio It only comes up on mine usually.User Interface: It w {vocalsound} it would seem silly if we'd {gap} having anything else, just have an audio button though.Marketing: Oh.Project Manager: Yeah,User Interface: Do you knowProject Manager: I don't, I {disfmarker} it's, it's a problem with the international uh appeal, I think. Um, if we have audio because we don't know how other televisions work. But we know that everyone has this and it's the same.User Interface: But we {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: I've {disfmarker}Marketing: Yeah I guess that it affects the marketing,'cause it, {vocalsound} mm it is a good sales ploy to say, aren't you annoyed with remote controls that have all these buttons.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: This one has channel, volume and your channe and your power.Industrial Designer: Yeah, that's it. We can just go for, make it a selling point that it is just the basic.User Interface: That could be a sales pitch.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.User Interface: Simple and {disfmarker}Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Yeah uh I {vocalsound} {disfmarker}Marketing: Okay.Project Manager: Alright.Industrial Designer: brilliant.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Good. And, okay, in closing,'cause we only have five minutes. We'll be meeting again in thirty minutes. Um, you'll be working, Poppy will be working on the look-and-feel design. Wait a minute. Is that rightIndustrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Yep, and um the user interface design, so this is where the trendy stuff comes in. And you'll be evaluating the product. Um, Poppy and Tara will have to work together, using modelling clay.User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: And, um, your personal coach will give you the rest of the information of what needs to happen.Industrial Designer: Okay.Project Manager: Alright. So, anyone else have something to sayIndustrial used.Project Manager: Yep.Industrial Designer: Yeah, it was minimaMarketing: Do you remember thatIndustrial Designer: well, it wasn't the lProject Manager: Yeah, it was hardly ever used really.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: {vocalsound} I w {vocalsound} Should I bring it upProject Manager: Yeah. And most televisions will come with a remote.Industrial Designer: Yeah. That would be good. Yeah, and surely that would be like quite specific to the individual television,User Interface: Yeah, each television.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: so {disfmarker}Project Manager:'Kay, well we know we want numbers.Marketing: The ch t Screen settings was used um zero point five times an hour. So tw twice every {disfmarker} once every two hours. Um, and it was considered a one point five relevance, on a scale of ten. That's brightness, colour, tone, all that.Industrial Designer: Mm. I think most of that comes like on the i individual television set itself,User Interface: You don't change that often, yeah.Industrial Designer: doesn't it I'm sure it has its own buttons, so you don't necessarily need to have it on remote.Project Manager: Yeah, it does.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Yeah, and different televisions.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Like we, I don't know if we can make a remote that would be universal to all the different kinds ofIndustrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: changes like that.Industrial Designer: So we're just going for power, channels, volume,Project Manager: Volume.Marketing: The other one was audio settings. Mono, stereo, pitch. I mean I sometimes use that. Some T_V_s will have the option of like living room style, movie style, um {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: and that, they say that's used zero point eight times an hour, which is actually somewhat high. Like almost once an hour.Industrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Um, relevance of two.Project Manager: Oh. We have five minutes to finish our meeting.User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Crap. Okay, um, that.Project Manager: Yeah, we'll be doing {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: It'll be more the on the numbers and the volume.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah. It'd be more a command interface, and then {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: I suppose we need to think of symbols for like the volume, display, and stuff like that.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: So it's just draf graphical for the pointing aspectIndustrial Designer: I {disfmarker}Marketing: The infrared is like, that's considered a {disfmarker}Project Manager: HmmUser Interface: No I think it's to do with the actual symbols that are on the, that's on the buttons of the remote control, and perMarketing: Okay. So when it says pointing device that doesn't include {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: For inpUser Interface: Well it could be a wee scroller thing, and something could come up on the screen.Project Manager: Yeah. I think they're talking about L_C_D_ type things.Industrial Designer: Mm.Marketing: Okay.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Okay.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: But um I think we're gonna go with the command interface anyway,Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: to make it more simplistic. But the, we could incorporate some of the graphical user um points,Marketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: as in {disfmarker} just to make it m um nicer to look at maybe. {vocalsound}Project Manager: What do you meanUser Interface: Like {vocalsound} I can't think of an example, but {disfmarker} Sort of like little pictures rather than {disfmarker}Project Manager: Oh yeah, like how the buttons {disfmarker}User Interface: Like a little sound. Instead of saying volume, like a little speaker or something.Project Manager: Yeah, as a button though.User Interface: Yeah, something yMarketing: Mm.Project Manager: So, it's a keyboard in the shape of it, rightUser Interface: Yeah m perha yeah. Yeah. Maybe.Project Manager: Okay. Yeah. I like that idea.User Interface: Um, the co uh {disfmarker} we've decided that the command interface would be the most useful for Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Like a few hours a day. {gap}.Project Manager: I think that might be a little impractical though.Marketing: Yeah. I think sometimes it's just shoved under, under a cushion,Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: and {disfmarker} yeah.Industrial Designer: That's true. It could easily {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Like people don't wanna have to worry about that.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: I suppose it would be really annoying if you get to think, oh no, I forgot to charge my remote today.User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Like if the kinetic thing, I think what's best about that is that it's instant energy.User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: You don't have to, you know, you can shake it a few times, or whatever.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: And it works.Project Manager: Or just like pick it up when you're gonna use it.Industrial Designer: Yeah. Instead of you don't have to like make sure it's in the right place to charge and {gap}.User Interface: Yeah, I suppose.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Alright. Cool.Industrial Designer: K okay.Project Manager:'S that the end of your presentation.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: Alright.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Thank you.Industrial Designer: There we go.User Interface: Thanks. Oh. {vocalsound} It's not on my screen.Industrial Designer: {gap} it wasn't on mine either.User Interface: Why {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: I don't know why. I think, I just, I just used the mouse on there.User Interface: You don't know why Oh okay. Is it that oneProject Manager: Yeah. That's um {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yeah.User Interface: Um, I'm just gonna go through the interface concept with yous now. Uh, first of all I'll explain what a user interface is. It's the aspects of a computer system which can be seen or otherwise perceived, for example, heard or felt maybe, or {vocalsound} by the your time to shine.User Interface: We decided on the component. I, I I'm sorry, I've lost my um {vocalsound} PowerPoint thing, so I can't remember what it's ca it's the component {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Your screenMarketing: Think it was called command interface.Industrial Designer: Was it {disfmarker}Project Manager: Oh, yeah. Yeah.Marketing: Command interface, {gap}.User Interface: The command interProject Manager: Command interface.Industrial Designer: Ouch.User Interface: The command line interface yeah.Project Manager: Did you say command line Okay.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Line interface.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Alright, and supplements. What's that all aboutUser Interface: Um, I think that is {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: well we haven't really made any decisions about what we're gonna do about the cluster of button functions, colours and forms, in the {disfmarker} in consistent use. Like what what are ideas to combat these problemsProject Manager: Um {disfmarker}User Interface: You know how um different interfaces are very different, and can be confusing because because of their difference, and because of the different clusters of buttons that they have.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: We haven't really decided what to do about that.Project Manager: Um, what are our choices hereUser Interface: {vocalsound} Well it's just um w where where shall we locate the buttons. What kind of functions wi shall we haveProject Manager: You mean like we'll have the numbers of the channels, and we'll have the channel-changer, and volume, and powerIndustrial Designer: The power. Volume.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um {disfmarker}User Interface: So pretty {disfmarker} just just the basic button functions.Project Manager: Yeah. Like I don't know if we should go into like adjusting light levels, things like that, because different televisions will have {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: May yeah.Project Manager: Um, yeah.Industrial Designer: Tone, contrast, and things. That's a bit {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound} That was on, um one of my presentations. About how often it was

Summarize the discussion about the options for energy sources.

First, Industrial Designer introduced three optional sources of energy and recommended kinetic energy as they were light, novelty, and environmental-friendly. Project Manager agreed, but Marketing suggested it should be corporated with a battery backup in case something went wrong. After that, the group discussed solar energy, considering it impractical for remote control although it can be stored. With complete confidence by Industrial Designer and Project Manager, the group finally reconciled with the idea of full kinetic energy and treated it as one selling point.

Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Like a few hours a day. {gap}.Project Manager: I think that might be a little impractical though.Marketing: Yeah. I think sometimes it's just shoved under, under a cushion,Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: and {disfmarker} yeah.Industrial Designer: That's true. It could easily {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Like people don't wanna have to worry about that.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: I suppose it would be really annoying if you get to think, oh no, I forgot to charge my remote today.User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Like if the kinetic thing, I think what's best about that is that it's instant energy.User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: You don't have to, you know, you can shake it a few times, or whatever.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: And it works.Project Manager: Or just like pick it up when you're gonna use it.Industrial Designer: Yeah. Instead of you don't have to like make sure it's in the right place to charge and {gap}.User Interface: Yeah, I suppose.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Alright. Cool.Industrial Designer: K okay.Project Manager:'S that the end of your presentation.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: Alright.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Thank you.Industrial Designer: There we go.User Interface: Thanks. Oh. {vocalsound} It's not on my screen.Industrial Designer: {gap} it wasn't on mine either.User Interface: Why {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: I don't know why. I think, I just, I just used the mouse on there.User Interface: You don't know why Oh okay. Is it that oneProject Manager: Yeah. That's um {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yeah.User Interface: Um, I'm just gonna go through the interface concept with yous now. Uh, first of all I'll explain what a user interface is. It's the aspects of a computer system which can be seen or otherwise perceived, for example, heard or felt maybe, or {vocalsound} by the used.Project Manager: Yep.Industrial Designer: Yeah, it was minimaMarketing: Do you remember thatIndustrial Designer: well, it wasn't the lProject Manager: Yeah, it was hardly ever used really.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: {vocalsound} I w {vocalsound} Should I bring it upProject Manager: Yeah. And most televisions will come with a remote.Industrial Designer: Yeah. That would be good. Yeah, and surely that would be like quite specific to the individual television,User Interface: Yeah, each television.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: so {disfmarker}Project Manager:'Kay, well we know we want numbers.Marketing: The ch t Screen settings was used um zero point five times an hour. So tw twice every {disfmarker} once every two hours. Um, and it was considered a one point five relevance, on a scale of ten. That's brightness, colour, tone, all that.Industrial Designer: Mm. I think most of that comes like on the i individual television set itself,User Interface: You don't change that often, yeah.Industrial Designer: doesn't it I'm sure it has its own buttons, so you don't necessarily need to have it on remote.Project Manager: Yeah, it does.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Yeah, and different televisions.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Like we, I don't know if we can make a remote that would be universal to all the different kinds ofIndustrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: changes like that.Industrial Designer: So we're just going for power, channels, volume,Project Manager: Volume.Marketing: The other one was audio settings. Mono, stereo, pitch. I mean I sometimes use that. Some T_V_s will have the option of like living room style, movie style, um {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: and that, they say that's used zero point eight times an hour, which is actually somewhat high. Like almost once an hour.Industrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Um, relevance of two.Project Manager: Oh. We have five minutes to finish our meeting.User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Crap. Okay, um, let's do this fast. Um {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} Well that didn't some up on mine.Project Manager: Should we have audio It only comes up on mine usually.User Interface: It w {vocalsound} it would seem silly if we'd {gap} having anything else, just have an audio button though.Marketing: Oh.Project Manager: Yeah,User Interface: Do you knowProject Manager: I don't, I {disfmarker} it's, it's a problem with the international uh appeal, I think. Um, if we have audio because we don't know how other televisions work. But we know that everyone has this and it's the same.User Interface: But we {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: I've {disfmarker}Marketing: Yeah I guess that it affects the marketing,'cause it, {vocalsound} mm it is a good sales ploy to say, aren't you annoyed with remote controls that have all these buttons.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: This one has channel, volume and your channe and your power.Industrial Designer: Yeah, that's it. We can just go for, make it a selling point that it is just the basic.User Interface: That could be a sales pitch.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.User Interface: Simple and {disfmarker}Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Yeah uh I {vocalsound} {disfmarker}Marketing: Okay.Project Manager: Alright.Industrial Designer: brilliant.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Good. And, okay, in closing,'cause we only have five minutes. We'll be meeting again in thirty minutes. Um, you'll be working, Poppy will be working on the look-and-feel design. Wait a minute. Is that rightIndustrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Yep, and um the user interface design, so this is where the trendy stuff comes in. And you'll be evaluating the product. Um, Poppy and Tara will have to work together, using modelling clay.User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: And, um, your personal coach will give you the rest of the information of what needs to happen.Industrial Designer: Okay.Project Manager: Alright. So, anyone else have something to sayIndustrial looking for here.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Um, titanium is not gonna be possible, even though it just it beyond our budget really. But, would've been maybe for future projects. Um right our choice for buttons as well. We've developed some {disfmarker} we've got some good advances in technology, with our research team have found some uh new multiple um option scroll buttons. I think that was brought up for, um, {disfmarker} they're basically quite a flexible design, modern, you don't have to use individual buttons. You can just slide up and down. I'm sure we're all quite familiar with those on mobiles or computer laptop pads.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Um one thing with the scroll buttons though. It, it {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: we would have to have an L_C_D_ umIndustrial Designer: Yeah. That's true.Project Manager: display, and the glow in the dark thing might be difficult.Industrial Designer: And that would lead to an advanced {disfmarker} yeah. If we have {disfmarker} yeah. We're going on to that later with the advanc with the L_C_D_ that means we'd need a really advanced chip.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: And it's unlikely that that's gonna be in our budget.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Um, also we've got the integrated pushbutton, which is what we're most familiar with. It's the most straightforward. But you can in like incorporate that with a scroll button as well. {gap}. Got decisions to make there. And this is what I was just saying before. Linked in the different {disfmarker} depends on what type of buttons we have and the inputs. Um simple would go with the pushbutton. Um, regular you could link with the scroll button. And the advanced we'd have to go with a L_C_D_ s display.Project Manager: Right.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} My personal preferences I think we could that.Project Manager: Yeah, we'll be doing {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: It'll be more the on the numbers and the volume.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah. It'd be more a command interface, and then {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: I suppose we need to think of symbols for like the volume, display, and stuff like that.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: So it's just draf graphical for the pointing aspectIndustrial Designer: I {disfmarker}Marketing: The infrared is like, that's considered a {disfmarker}Project Manager: HmmUser Interface: No I think it's to do with the actual symbols that are on the, that's on the buttons of the remote control, and perMarketing: Okay. So when it says pointing device that doesn't include {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: For inpUser Interface: Well it could be a wee scroller thing, and something could come up on the screen.Project Manager: Yeah. I think they're talking about L_C_D_ type things.Industrial Designer: Mm.Marketing: Okay.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Okay.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: But um I think we're gonna go with the command interface anyway,Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: to make it more simplistic. But the, we could incorporate some of the graphical user um points,Marketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: as in {disfmarker} just to make it m um nicer to look at maybe. {vocalsound}Project Manager: What do you meanUser Interface: Like {vocalsound} I can't think of an example, but {disfmarker} Sort of like little pictures rather than {disfmarker}Project Manager: Oh yeah, like how the buttons {disfmarker}User Interface: Like a little sound. Instead of saying volume, like a little speaker or something.Project Manager: Yeah, as a button though.User Interface: Yeah, something yMarketing: Mm.Project Manager: So, it's a keyboard in the shape of it, rightUser Interface: Yeah m perha yeah. Yeah. Maybe.Project Manager: Okay. Yeah. I like that idea.User Interface: Um, the co uh {disfmarker} we've decided that the command interface would be the most useful for

Why did Industrial Designer think rubber casing was the best when talking about the options for materials

Industrial Designer indicated rubber was softer than metal, cheaper than titanium that would exceed the budget, and more flexible to color alternatives. Although rubber couldn't work as the interior to protect innards, rubber coating would reduce the impact if the remote control was dropped.

Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Like a few hours a day. {gap}.Project Manager: I think that might be a little impractical though.Marketing: Yeah. I think sometimes it's just shoved under, under a cushion,Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: and {disfmarker} yeah.Industrial Designer: That's true. It could easily {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Like people don't wanna have to worry about that.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: I suppose it would be really annoying if you get to think, oh no, I forgot to charge my remote today.User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Like if the kinetic thing, I think what's best about that is that it's instant energy.User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: You don't have to, you know, you can shake it a few times, or whatever.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: And it works.Project Manager: Or just like pick it up when you're gonna use it.Industrial Designer: Yeah. Instead of you don't have to like make sure it's in the right place to charge and {gap}.User Interface: Yeah, I suppose.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Alright. Cool.Industrial Designer: K okay.Project Manager:'S that the end of your presentation.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: Alright.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Thank you.Industrial Designer: There we go.User Interface: Thanks. Oh. {vocalsound} It's not on my screen.Industrial Designer: {gap} it wasn't on mine either.User Interface: Why {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: I don't know why. I think, I just, I just used the mouse on there.User Interface: You don't know why Oh okay. Is it that oneProject Manager: Yeah. That's um {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yeah.User Interface: Um, I'm just gonna go through the interface concept with yous now. Uh, first of all I'll explain what a user interface is. It's the aspects of a computer system which can be seen or otherwise perceived, for example, heard or felt maybe, or {vocalsound} by the used.Project Manager: Yep.Industrial Designer: Yeah, it was minimaMarketing: Do you remember thatIndustrial Designer: well, it wasn't the lProject Manager: Yeah, it was hardly ever used really.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: {vocalsound} I w {vocalsound} Should I bring it upProject Manager: Yeah. And most televisions will come with a remote.Industrial Designer: Yeah. That would be good. Yeah, and surely that would be like quite specific to the individual television,User Interface: Yeah, each television.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: so {disfmarker}Project Manager:'Kay, well we know we want numbers.Marketing: The ch t Screen settings was used um zero point five times an hour. So tw twice every {disfmarker} once every two hours. Um, and it was considered a one point five relevance, on a scale of ten. That's brightness, colour, tone, all that.Industrial Designer: Mm. I think most of that comes like on the i individual television set itself,User Interface: You don't change that often, yeah.Industrial Designer: doesn't it I'm sure it has its own buttons, so you don't necessarily need to have it on remote.Project Manager: Yeah, it does.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Yeah, and different televisions.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Like we, I don't know if we can make a remote that would be universal to all the different kinds ofIndustrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: changes like that.Industrial Designer: So we're just going for power, channels, volume,Project Manager: Volume.Marketing: The other one was audio settings. Mono, stereo, pitch. I mean I sometimes use that. Some T_V_s will have the option of like living room style, movie style, um {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: and that, they say that's used zero point eight times an hour, which is actually somewhat high. Like almost once an hour.Industrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Um, relevance of two.Project Manager: Oh. We have five minutes to finish our meeting.User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Crap. Okay, um, let's do this fast. Um {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} Well that didn't some up on mine.Project Manager: Should we have audio It only comes up on mine usually.User Interface: It w {vocalsound} it would seem silly if we'd {gap} having anything else, just have an audio button though.Marketing: Oh.Project Manager: Yeah,User Interface: Do you knowProject Manager: I don't, I {disfmarker} it's, it's a problem with the international uh appeal, I think. Um, if we have audio because we don't know how other televisions work. But we know that everyone has this and it's the same.User Interface: But we {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: I've {disfmarker}Marketing: Yeah I guess that it affects the marketing,'cause it, {vocalsound} mm it is a good sales ploy to say, aren't you annoyed with remote controls that have all these buttons.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: This one has channel, volume and your channe and your power.Industrial Designer: Yeah, that's it. We can just go for, make it a selling point that it is just the basic.User Interface: That could be a sales pitch.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.User Interface: Simple and {disfmarker}Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Yeah uh I {vocalsound} {disfmarker}Marketing: Okay.Project Manager: Alright.Industrial Designer: brilliant.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Good. And, okay, in closing,'cause we only have five minutes. We'll be meeting again in thirty minutes. Um, you'll be working, Poppy will be working on the look-and-feel design. Wait a minute. Is that rightIndustrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Yep, and um the user interface design, so this is where the trendy stuff comes in. And you'll be evaluating the product. Um, Poppy and Tara will have to work together, using modelling clay.User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: And, um, your personal coach will give you the rest of the information of what needs to happen.Industrial Designer: Okay.Project Manager: Alright. So, anyone else have something to sayIndustrial your time to shine.User Interface: We decided on the component. I, I I'm sorry, I've lost my um {vocalsound} PowerPoint thing, so I can't remember what it's ca it's the component {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Your screenMarketing: Think it was called command interface.Industrial Designer: Was it {disfmarker}Project Manager: Oh, yeah. Yeah.Marketing: Command interface, {gap}.User Interface: The command interProject Manager: Command interface.Industrial Designer: Ouch.User Interface: The command line interface yeah.Project Manager: Did you say command line Okay.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Line interface.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Alright, and supplements. What's that all aboutUser Interface: Um, I think that is {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: well we haven't really made any decisions about what we're gonna do about the cluster of button functions, colours and forms, in the {disfmarker} in consistent use. Like what what are ideas to combat these problemsProject Manager: Um {disfmarker}User Interface: You know how um different interfaces are very different, and can be confusing because because of their difference, and because of the different clusters of buttons that they have.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: We haven't really decided what to do about that.Project Manager: Um, what are our choices hereUser Interface: {vocalsound} Well it's just um w where where shall we locate the buttons. What kind of functions wi shall we haveProject Manager: You mean like we'll have the numbers of the channels, and we'll have the channel-changer, and volume, and powerIndustrial Designer: The power. Volume.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um {disfmarker}User Interface: So pretty {disfmarker} just just the basic button functions.Project Manager: Yeah. Like I don't know if we should go into like adjusting light levels, things like that, because different televisions will have {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: May yeah.Project Manager: Um, yeah.Industrial Designer: Tone, contrast, and things. That's a bit {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound} That was on, um one of my presentations. About how often it was looking for here.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Um, titanium is not gonna be possible, even though it just it beyond our budget really. But, would've been maybe for future projects. Um right our choice for buttons as well. We've developed some {disfmarker} we've got some good advances in technology, with our research team have found some uh new multiple um option scroll buttons. I think that was brought up for, um, {disfmarker} they're basically quite a flexible design, modern, you don't have to use individual buttons. You can just slide up and down. I'm sure we're all quite familiar with those on mobiles or computer laptop pads.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Um one thing with the scroll buttons though. It, it {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: we would have to have an L_C_D_ umIndustrial Designer: Yeah. That's true.Project Manager: display, and the glow in the dark thing might be difficult.Industrial Designer: And that would lead to an advanced {disfmarker} yeah. If we have {disfmarker} yeah. We're going on to that later with the advanc with the L_C_D_ that means we'd need a really advanced chip.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: And it's unlikely that that's gonna be in our budget.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Um, also we've got the integrated pushbutton, which is what we're most familiar with. It's the most straightforward. But you can in like incorporate that with a scroll button as well. {gap}. Got decisions to make there. And this is what I was just saying before. Linked in the different {disfmarker} depends on what type of buttons we have and the inputs. Um simple would go with the pushbutton. Um, regular you could link with the scroll button. And the advanced we'd have to go with a L_C_D_ s display.Project Manager: Right.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} My personal preferences I think we could

What did User Interface think about the command interface when talking about user interface types

User Interface regarded the command interface as useful for remote control. It was less complicated and more user-friendly. In comparison, the interface consisting of many buttons, colors, and functions wouldn't improve the use of the product and was challenging to understand. As for expense, the command interface was also cheaper. Therefore, more budget could be targeted to the design area.

Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Like a few hours a day. {gap}.Project Manager: I think that might be a little impractical though.Marketing: Yeah. I think sometimes it's just shoved under, under a cushion,Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: and {disfmarker} yeah.Industrial Designer: That's true. It could easily {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Like people don't wanna have to worry about that.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: I suppose it would be really annoying if you get to think, oh no, I forgot to charge my remote today.User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Like if the kinetic thing, I think what's best about that is that it's instant energy.User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: You don't have to, you know, you can shake it a few times, or whatever.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: And it works.Project Manager: Or just like pick it up when you're gonna use it.Industrial Designer: Yeah. Instead of you don't have to like make sure it's in the right place to charge and {gap}.User Interface: Yeah, I suppose.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Alright. Cool.Industrial Designer: K okay.Project Manager:'S that the end of your presentation.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: Alright.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Thank you.Industrial Designer: There we go.User Interface: Thanks. Oh. {vocalsound} It's not on my screen.Industrial Designer: {gap} it wasn't on mine either.User Interface: Why {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: I don't know why. I think, I just, I just used the mouse on there.User Interface: You don't know why Oh okay. Is it that oneProject Manager: Yeah. That's um {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yeah.User Interface: Um, I'm just gonna go through the interface concept with yous now. Uh, first of all I'll explain what a user interface is. It's the aspects of a computer system which can be seen or otherwise perceived, for example, heard or felt maybe, or {vocalsound} by the let's do this fast. Um {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} Well that didn't some up on mine.Project Manager: Should we have audio It only comes up on mine usually.User Interface: It w {vocalsound} it would seem silly if we'd {gap} having anything else, just have an audio button though.Marketing: Oh.Project Manager: Yeah,User Interface: Do you knowProject Manager: I don't, I {disfmarker} it's, it's a problem with the international uh appeal, I think. Um, if we have audio because we don't know how other televisions work. But we know that everyone has this and it's the same.User Interface: But we {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: I've {disfmarker}Marketing: Yeah I guess that it affects the marketing,'cause it, {vocalsound} mm it is a good sales ploy to say, aren't you annoyed with remote controls that have all these buttons.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: This one has channel, volume and your channe and your power.Industrial Designer: Yeah, that's it. We can just go for, make it a selling point that it is just the basic.User Interface: That could be a sales pitch.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.User Interface: Simple and {disfmarker}Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Yeah uh I {vocalsound} {disfmarker}Marketing: Okay.Project Manager: Alright.Industrial Designer: brilliant.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Good. And, okay, in closing,'cause we only have five minutes. We'll be meeting again in thirty minutes. Um, you'll be working, Poppy will be working on the look-and-feel design. Wait a minute. Is that rightIndustrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Yep, and um the user interface design, so this is where the trendy stuff comes in. And you'll be evaluating the product. Um, Poppy and Tara will have to work together, using modelling clay.User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: And, um, your personal coach will give you the rest of the information of what needs to happen.Industrial Designer: Okay.Project Manager: Alright. So, anyone else have something to sayIndustrial used.Project Manager: Yep.Industrial Designer: Yeah, it was minimaMarketing: Do you remember thatIndustrial Designer: well, it wasn't the lProject Manager: Yeah, it was hardly ever used really.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: {vocalsound} I w {vocalsound} Should I bring it upProject Manager: Yeah. And most televisions will come with a remote.Industrial Designer: Yeah. That would be good. Yeah, and surely that would be like quite specific to the individual television,User Interface: Yeah, each television.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: so {disfmarker}Project Manager:'Kay, well we know we want numbers.Marketing: The ch t Screen settings was used um zero point five times an hour. So tw twice every {disfmarker} once every two hours. Um, and it was considered a one point five relevance, on a scale of ten. That's brightness, colour, tone, all that.Industrial Designer: Mm. I think most of that comes like on the i individual television set itself,User Interface: You don't change that often, yeah.Industrial Designer: doesn't it I'm sure it has its own buttons, so you don't necessarily need to have it on remote.Project Manager: Yeah, it does.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Yeah, and different televisions.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Like we, I don't know if we can make a remote that would be universal to all the different kinds ofIndustrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: changes like that.Industrial Designer: So we're just going for power, channels, volume,Project Manager: Volume.Marketing: The other one was audio settings. Mono, stereo, pitch. I mean I sometimes use that. Some T_V_s will have the option of like living room style, movie style, um {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: and that, they say that's used zero point eight times an hour, which is actually somewhat high. Like almost once an hour.Industrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Um, relevance of two.Project Manager: Oh. We have five minutes to finish our meeting.User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Crap. Okay, um, that.Project Manager: Yeah, we'll be doing {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: It'll be more the on the numbers and the volume.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah. It'd be more a command interface, and then {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: I suppose we need to think of symbols for like the volume, display, and stuff like that.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: So it's just draf graphical for the pointing aspectIndustrial Designer: I {disfmarker}Marketing: The infrared is like, that's considered a {disfmarker}Project Manager: HmmUser Interface: No I think it's to do with the actual symbols that are on the, that's on the buttons of the remote control, and perMarketing: Okay. So when it says pointing device that doesn't include {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: For inpUser Interface: Well it could be a wee scroller thing, and something could come up on the screen.Project Manager: Yeah. I think they're talking about L_C_D_ type things.Industrial Designer: Mm.Marketing: Okay.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Okay.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: But um I think we're gonna go with the command interface anyway,Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: to make it more simplistic. But the, we could incorporate some of the graphical user um points,Marketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: as in {disfmarker} just to make it m um nicer to look at maybe. {vocalsound}Project Manager: What do you meanUser Interface: Like {vocalsound} I can't think of an example, but {disfmarker} Sort of like little pictures rather than {disfmarker}Project Manager: Oh yeah, like how the buttons {disfmarker}User Interface: Like a little sound. Instead of saying volume, like a little speaker or something.Project Manager: Yeah, as a button though.User Interface: Yeah, something yMarketing: Mm.Project Manager: So, it's a keyboard in the shape of it, rightUser Interface: Yeah m perha yeah. Yeah. Maybe.Project Manager: Okay. Yeah. I like that idea.User Interface: Um, the co uh {disfmarker} we've decided that the command interface would be the most useful for Project Manager: Is everyone ready to startIndustrial Designer: Yeah. {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: {vocalsound} Yes.Project Manager: Okay. Great. Well, welcome to the third meeting of conceptual design. I'll just get the PowerPoint presentation up and running. Okay. Um, on the agenda for this, um, for this particular meeting, we'll have your three presentations on what you've done since our last meeting, after we came up with um some general ideas of our design. And, um, then we have to make some key decisions on, on our remote control concept, and how we're gonna make it, what uh materials we're gonna use, and that sort of thing.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: The meeting will be forty minutes long.Industrial Designer: Okay.Project Manager: And um we will once again have Poppy as our first presenter.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Okay.Project Manager: Alright, and I will switch up PowerPoint.Industrial Designer: Thank you.Project Manager: Okay.Industrial Designer: Should be just loading. {vocalsound} Okay. Oh, although I can't see it on my screen. That says go here. Okay. I've been doing some research into the different components that we could use, um what's available to us f to actually make the remote control. Um, first of all we have to look at how the remote control is actually made, and what is it happens inside the casing, which is more your field. Um, thes main internal feature is a circuit board, which contains all the elec electronics and also the contacts with the power source.Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Which is not necessarily a battery, as we're about to see. Um, there are several components of, um, the circuit board that we need to consider, where we'll be getting them from, what they'll be made of. Um, including the integrated circuit, which is also known as the chip. Which is where all the

Summarize the discussion about the trend-watching for remote control.

In the presentation, Marketing listed the three most important aspects of remote control. The priority was to have a fancy look-and-feel instead of the traditional one. Secondly, the remote control should be technologically innovative. Moreover, it should be easy to use. Marketing also mentioned that fruit and vegetables would be the popular theme this year. In this way, the group turned to discuss some ideas about combining this theme with their design, like applying an abstract design and putting photos on the product.

Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Like a few hours a day. {gap}.Project Manager: I think that might be a little impractical though.Marketing: Yeah. I think sometimes it's just shoved under, under a cushion,Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: and {disfmarker} yeah.Industrial Designer: That's true. It could easily {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Like people don't wanna have to worry about that.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: I suppose it would be really annoying if you get to think, oh no, I forgot to charge my remote today.User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Like if the kinetic thing, I think what's best about that is that it's instant energy.User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: You don't have to, you know, you can shake it a few times, or whatever.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: And it works.Project Manager: Or just like pick it up when you're gonna use it.Industrial Designer: Yeah. Instead of you don't have to like make sure it's in the right place to charge and {gap}.User Interface: Yeah, I suppose.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Alright. Cool.Industrial Designer: K okay.Project Manager:'S that the end of your presentation.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: Alright.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Thank you.Industrial Designer: There we go.User Interface: Thanks. Oh. {vocalsound} It's not on my screen.Industrial Designer: {gap} it wasn't on mine either.User Interface: Why {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: I don't know why. I think, I just, I just used the mouse on there.User Interface: You don't know why Oh okay. Is it that oneProject Manager: Yeah. That's um {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yeah.User Interface: Um, I'm just gonna go through the interface concept with yous now. Uh, first of all I'll explain what a user interface is. It's the aspects of a computer system which can be seen or otherwise perceived, for example, heard or felt maybe, or {vocalsound} by the used.Project Manager: Yep.Industrial Designer: Yeah, it was minimaMarketing: Do you remember thatIndustrial Designer: well, it wasn't the lProject Manager: Yeah, it was hardly ever used really.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: {vocalsound} I w {vocalsound} Should I bring it upProject Manager: Yeah. And most televisions will come with a remote.Industrial Designer: Yeah. That would be good. Yeah, and surely that would be like quite specific to the individual television,User Interface: Yeah, each television.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: so {disfmarker}Project Manager:'Kay, well we know we want numbers.Marketing: The ch t Screen settings was used um zero point five times an hour. So tw twice every {disfmarker} once every two hours. Um, and it was considered a one point five relevance, on a scale of ten. That's brightness, colour, tone, all that.Industrial Designer: Mm. I think most of that comes like on the i individual television set itself,User Interface: You don't change that often, yeah.Industrial Designer: doesn't it I'm sure it has its own buttons, so you don't necessarily need to have it on remote.Project Manager: Yeah, it does.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Yeah, and different televisions.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Like we, I don't know if we can make a remote that would be universal to all the different kinds ofIndustrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: changes like that.Industrial Designer: So we're just going for power, channels, volume,Project Manager: Volume.Marketing: The other one was audio settings. Mono, stereo, pitch. I mean I sometimes use that. Some T_V_s will have the option of like living room style, movie style, um {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: and that, they say that's used zero point eight times an hour, which is actually somewhat high. Like almost once an hour.Industrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Um, relevance of two.Project Manager: Oh. We have five minutes to finish our meeting.User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Crap. Okay, um, let's do this fast. Um {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} Well that didn't some up on mine.Project Manager: Should we have audio It only comes up on mine usually.User Interface: It w {vocalsound} it would seem silly if we'd {gap} having anything else, just have an audio button though.Marketing: Oh.Project Manager: Yeah,User Interface: Do you knowProject Manager: I don't, I {disfmarker} it's, it's a problem with the international uh appeal, I think. Um, if we have audio because we don't know how other televisions work. But we know that everyone has this and it's the same.User Interface: But we {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: I've {disfmarker}Marketing: Yeah I guess that it affects the marketing,'cause it, {vocalsound} mm it is a good sales ploy to say, aren't you annoyed with remote controls that have all these buttons.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: This one has channel, volume and your channe and your power.Industrial Designer: Yeah, that's it. We can just go for, make it a selling point that it is just the basic.User Interface: That could be a sales pitch.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.User Interface: Simple and {disfmarker}Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Yeah uh I {vocalsound} {disfmarker}Marketing: Okay.Project Manager: Alright.Industrial Designer: brilliant.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Good. And, okay, in closing,'cause we only have five minutes. We'll be meeting again in thirty minutes. Um, you'll be working, Poppy will be working on the look-and-feel design. Wait a minute. Is that rightIndustrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Yep, and um the user interface design, so this is where the trendy stuff comes in. And you'll be evaluating the product. Um, Poppy and Tara will have to work together, using modelling clay.User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: And, um, your personal coach will give you the rest of the information of what needs to happen.Industrial Designer: Okay.Project Manager: Alright. So, anyone else have something to sayIndustrial your time to shine.User Interface: We decided on the component. I, I I'm sorry, I've lost my um {vocalsound} PowerPoint thing, so I can't remember what it's ca it's the component {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Your screenMarketing: Think it was called command interface.Industrial Designer: Was it {disfmarker}Project Manager: Oh, yeah. Yeah.Marketing: Command interface, {gap}.User Interface: The command interProject Manager: Command interface.Industrial Designer: Ouch.User Interface: The command line interface yeah.Project Manager: Did you say command line Okay.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Line interface.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Alright, and supplements. What's that all aboutUser Interface: Um, I think that is {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: well we haven't really made any decisions about what we're gonna do about the cluster of button functions, colours and forms, in the {disfmarker} in consistent use. Like what what are ideas to combat these problemsProject Manager: Um {disfmarker}User Interface: You know how um different interfaces are very different, and can be confusing because because of their difference, and because of the different clusters of buttons that they have.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: We haven't really decided what to do about that.Project Manager: Um, what are our choices hereUser Interface: {vocalsound} Well it's just um w where where shall we locate the buttons. What kind of functions wi shall we haveProject Manager: You mean like we'll have the numbers of the channels, and we'll have the channel-changer, and volume, and powerIndustrial Designer: The power. Volume.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um {disfmarker}User Interface: So pretty {disfmarker} just just the basic button functions.Project Manager: Yeah. Like I don't know if we should go into like adjusting light levels, things like that, because different televisions will have {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: May yeah.Project Manager: Um, yeah.Industrial Designer: Tone, contrast, and things. That's a bit {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound} That was on, um one of my presentations. About how often it was looking for here.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Um, titanium is not gonna be possible, even though it just it beyond our budget really. But, would've been maybe for future projects. Um right our choice for buttons as well. We've developed some {disfmarker} we've got some good advances in technology, with our research team have found some uh new multiple um option scroll buttons. I think that was brought up for, um, {disfmarker} they're basically quite a flexible design, modern, you don't have to use individual buttons. You can just slide up and down. I'm sure we're all quite familiar with those on mobiles or computer laptop pads.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Um one thing with the scroll buttons though. It, it {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: we would have to have an L_C_D_ umIndustrial Designer: Yeah. That's true.Project Manager: display, and the glow in the dark thing might be difficult.Industrial Designer: And that would lead to an advanced {disfmarker} yeah. If we have {disfmarker} yeah. We're going on to that later with the advanc with the L_C_D_ that means we'd need a really advanced chip.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: And it's unlikely that that's gonna be in our budget.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Um, also we've got the integrated pushbutton, which is what we're most familiar with. It's the most straightforward. But you can in like incorporate that with a scroll button as well. {gap}. Got decisions to make there. And this is what I was just saying before. Linked in the different {disfmarker} depends on what type of buttons we have and the inputs. Um simple would go with the pushbutton. Um, regular you could link with the scroll button. And the advanced we'd have to go with a L_C_D_ s display.Project Manager: Right.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} My personal preferences I think we could

What did Industrial Designer think about vegetable and fruit themes when talking about trend-watching

Industrial Designer thought that the vegetable and fruit theme could be applied with a more abstract design, like stripping it down to basic shapes or curves. Also, as a result of market research, design development should stick to this theme rather than moving to animals.

that.Project Manager: Yeah, we'll be doing {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: It'll be more the on the numbers and the volume.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah. It'd be more a command interface, and then {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: I suppose we need to think of symbols for like the volume, display, and stuff like that.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: So it's just draf graphical for the pointing aspectIndustrial Designer: I {disfmarker}Marketing: The infrared is like, that's considered a {disfmarker}Project Manager: HmmUser Interface: No I think it's to do with the actual symbols that are on the, that's on the buttons of the remote control, and perMarketing: Okay. So when it says pointing device that doesn't include {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: For inpUser Interface: Well it could be a wee scroller thing, and something could come up on the screen.Project Manager: Yeah. I think they're talking about L_C_D_ type things.Industrial Designer: Mm.Marketing: Okay.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Okay.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: But um I think we're gonna go with the command interface anyway,Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: to make it more simplistic. But the, we could incorporate some of the graphical user um points,Marketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: as in {disfmarker} just to make it m um nicer to look at maybe. {vocalsound}Project Manager: What do you meanUser Interface: Like {vocalsound} I can't think of an example, but {disfmarker} Sort of like little pictures rather than {disfmarker}Project Manager: Oh yeah, like how the buttons {disfmarker}User Interface: Like a little sound. Instead of saying volume, like a little speaker or something.Project Manager: Yeah, as a button though.User Interface: Yeah, something yMarketing: Mm.Project Manager: So, it's a keyboard in the shape of it, rightUser Interface: Yeah m perha yeah. Yeah. Maybe.Project Manager: Okay. Yeah. I like that idea.User Interface: Um, the co uh {disfmarker} we've decided that the command interface would be the most useful for let's do this fast. Um {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} Well that didn't some up on mine.Project Manager: Should we have audio It only comes up on mine usually.User Interface: It w {vocalsound} it would seem silly if we'd {gap} having anything else, just have an audio button though.Marketing: Oh.Project Manager: Yeah,User Interface: Do you knowProject Manager: I don't, I {disfmarker} it's, it's a problem with the international uh appeal, I think. Um, if we have audio because we don't know how other televisions work. But we know that everyone has this and it's the same.User Interface: But we {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: I've {disfmarker}Marketing: Yeah I guess that it affects the marketing,'cause it, {vocalsound} mm it is a good sales ploy to say, aren't you annoyed with remote controls that have all these buttons.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: This one has channel, volume and your channe and your power.Industrial Designer: Yeah, that's it. We can just go for, make it a selling point that it is just the basic.User Interface: That could be a sales pitch.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.User Interface: Simple and {disfmarker}Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Yeah uh I {vocalsound} {disfmarker}Marketing: Okay.Project Manager: Alright.Industrial Designer: brilliant.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Good. And, okay, in closing,'cause we only have five minutes. We'll be meeting again in thirty minutes. Um, you'll be working, Poppy will be working on the look-and-feel design. Wait a minute. Is that rightIndustrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Yep, and um the user interface design, so this is where the trendy stuff comes in. And you'll be evaluating the product. Um, Poppy and Tara will have to work together, using modelling clay.User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: And, um, your personal coach will give you the rest of the information of what needs to happen.Industrial Designer: Okay.Project Manager: Alright. So, anyone else have something to sayIndustrial Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Like a few hours a day. {gap}.Project Manager: I think that might be a little impractical though.Marketing: Yeah. I think sometimes it's just shoved under, under a cushion,Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: and {disfmarker} yeah.Industrial Designer: That's true. It could easily {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Like people don't wanna have to worry about that.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: I suppose it would be really annoying if you get to think, oh no, I forgot to charge my remote today.User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Like if the kinetic thing, I think what's best about that is that it's instant energy.User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: You don't have to, you know, you can shake it a few times, or whatever.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: And it works.Project Manager: Or just like pick it up when you're gonna use it.Industrial Designer: Yeah. Instead of you don't have to like make sure it's in the right place to charge and {gap}.User Interface: Yeah, I suppose.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Alright. Cool.Industrial Designer: K okay.Project Manager:'S that the end of your presentation.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: Alright.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Thank you.Industrial Designer: There we go.User Interface: Thanks. Oh. {vocalsound} It's not on my screen.Industrial Designer: {gap} it wasn't on mine either.User Interface: Why {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: I don't know why. I think, I just, I just used the mouse on there.User Interface: You don't know why Oh okay. Is it that oneProject Manager: Yeah. That's um {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yeah.User Interface: Um, I'm just gonna go through the interface concept with yous now. Uh, first of all I'll explain what a user interface is. It's the aspects of a computer system which can be seen or otherwise perceived, for example, heard or felt maybe, or {vocalsound} by the used.Project Manager: Yep.Industrial Designer: Yeah, it was minimaMarketing: Do you remember thatIndustrial Designer: well, it wasn't the lProject Manager: Yeah, it was hardly ever used really.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: {vocalsound} I w {vocalsound} Should I bring it upProject Manager: Yeah. And most televisions will come with a remote.Industrial Designer: Yeah. That would be good. Yeah, and surely that would be like quite specific to the individual television,User Interface: Yeah, each television.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: so {disfmarker}Project Manager:'Kay, well we know we want numbers.Marketing: The ch t Screen settings was used um zero point five times an hour. So tw twice every {disfmarker} once every two hours. Um, and it was considered a one point five relevance, on a scale of ten. That's brightness, colour, tone, all that.Industrial Designer: Mm. I think most of that comes like on the i individual television set itself,User Interface: You don't change that often, yeah.Industrial Designer: doesn't it I'm sure it has its own buttons, so you don't necessarily need to have it on remote.Project Manager: Yeah, it does.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Yeah, and different televisions.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Like we, I don't know if we can make a remote that would be universal to all the different kinds ofIndustrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: changes like that.Industrial Designer: So we're just going for power, channels, volume,Project Manager: Volume.Marketing: The other one was audio settings. Mono, stereo, pitch. I mean I sometimes use that. Some T_V_s will have the option of like living room style, movie style, um {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: and that, they say that's used zero point eight times an hour, which is actually somewhat high. Like almost once an hour.Industrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Um, relevance of two.Project Manager: Oh. We have five minutes to finish our meeting.User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Crap. Okay, um, your time to shine.User Interface: We decided on the component. I, I I'm sorry, I've lost my um {vocalsound} PowerPoint thing, so I can't remember what it's ca it's the component {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Your screenMarketing: Think it was called command interface.Industrial Designer: Was it {disfmarker}Project Manager: Oh, yeah. Yeah.Marketing: Command interface, {gap}.User Interface: The command interProject Manager: Command interface.Industrial Designer: Ouch.User Interface: The command line interface yeah.Project Manager: Did you say command line Okay.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Line interface.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Alright, and supplements. What's that all aboutUser Interface: Um, I think that is {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: well we haven't really made any decisions about what we're gonna do about the cluster of button functions, colours and forms, in the {disfmarker} in consistent use. Like what what are ideas to combat these problemsProject Manager: Um {disfmarker}User Interface: You know how um different interfaces are very different, and can be confusing because because of their difference, and because of the different clusters of buttons that they have.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: We haven't really decided what to do about that.Project Manager: Um, what are our choices hereUser Interface: {vocalsound} Well it's just um w where where shall we locate the buttons. What kind of functions wi shall we haveProject Manager: You mean like we'll have the numbers of the channels, and we'll have the channel-changer, and volume, and powerIndustrial Designer: The power. Volume.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um {disfmarker}User Interface: So pretty {disfmarker} just just the basic button functions.Project Manager: Yeah. Like I don't know if we should go into like adjusting light levels, things like that, because different televisions will have {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: May yeah.Project Manager: Um, yeah.Industrial Designer: Tone, contrast, and things. That's a bit {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound} That was on, um one of my presentations. About how often it was

What was the decision of the discussion of the chip

The group selected the regular-style chip without the LCD display. It only had simple push buttons except for a more advanced one for the interior lighting system.

used.Project Manager: Yep.Industrial Designer: Yeah, it was minimaMarketing: Do you remember thatIndustrial Designer: well, it wasn't the lProject Manager: Yeah, it was hardly ever used really.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: {vocalsound} I w {vocalsound} Should I bring it upProject Manager: Yeah. And most televisions will come with a remote.Industrial Designer: Yeah. That would be good. Yeah, and surely that would be like quite specific to the individual television,User Interface: Yeah, each television.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: so {disfmarker}Project Manager:'Kay, well we know we want numbers.Marketing: The ch t Screen settings was used um zero point five times an hour. So tw twice every {disfmarker} once every two hours. Um, and it was considered a one point five relevance, on a scale of ten. That's brightness, colour, tone, all that.Industrial Designer: Mm. I think most of that comes like on the i individual television set itself,User Interface: You don't change that often, yeah.Industrial Designer: doesn't it I'm sure it has its own buttons, so you don't necessarily need to have it on remote.Project Manager: Yeah, it does.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Yeah, and different televisions.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Like we, I don't know if we can make a remote that would be universal to all the different kinds ofIndustrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: changes like that.Industrial Designer: So we're just going for power, channels, volume,Project Manager: Volume.Marketing: The other one was audio settings. Mono, stereo, pitch. I mean I sometimes use that. Some T_V_s will have the option of like living room style, movie style, um {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: and that, they say that's used zero point eight times an hour, which is actually somewhat high. Like almost once an hour.Industrial Designer: Mm.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Um, relevance of two.Project Manager: Oh. We have five minutes to finish our meeting.User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Crap. Okay, um, Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Like a few hours a day. {gap}.Project Manager: I think that might be a little impractical though.Marketing: Yeah. I think sometimes it's just shoved under, under a cushion,Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: and {disfmarker} yeah.Industrial Designer: That's true. It could easily {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Like people don't wanna have to worry about that.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: I suppose it would be really annoying if you get to think, oh no, I forgot to charge my remote today.User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Like if the kinetic thing, I think what's best about that is that it's instant energy.User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: You don't have to, you know, you can shake it a few times, or whatever.Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: And it works.Project Manager: Or just like pick it up when you're gonna use it.Industrial Designer: Yeah. Instead of you don't have to like make sure it's in the right place to charge and {gap}.User Interface: Yeah, I suppose.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Alright. Cool.Industrial Designer: K okay.Project Manager:'S that the end of your presentation.Industrial Designer: Yeah.Project Manager: Alright.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Thank you.Industrial Designer: There we go.User Interface: Thanks. Oh. {vocalsound} It's not on my screen.Industrial Designer: {gap} it wasn't on mine either.User Interface: Why {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: I don't know why. I think, I just, I just used the mouse on there.User Interface: You don't know why Oh okay. Is it that oneProject Manager: Yeah. That's um {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yeah.User Interface: Um, I'm just gonna go through the interface concept with yous now. Uh, first of all I'll explain what a user interface is. It's the aspects of a computer system which can be seen or otherwise perceived, for example, heard or felt maybe, or {vocalsound} by the your time to shine.User Interface: We decided on the component. I, I I'm sorry, I've lost my um {vocalsound} PowerPoint thing, so I can't remember what it's ca it's the component {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Your screenMarketing: Think it was called command interface.Industrial Designer: Was it {disfmarker}Project Manager: Oh, yeah. Yeah.Marketing: Command interface, {gap}.User Interface: The command interProject Manager: Command interface.Industrial Designer: Ouch.User Interface: The command line interface yeah.Project Manager: Did you say command line Okay.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Line interface.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Alright, and supplements. What's that all aboutUser Interface: Um, I think that is {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: well we haven't really made any decisions about what we're gonna do about the cluster of button functions, colours and forms, in the {disfmarker} in consistent use. Like what what are ideas to combat these problemsProject Manager: Um {disfmarker}User Interface: You know how um different interfaces are very different, and can be confusing because because of their difference, and because of the different clusters of buttons that they have.Project Manager: Mm-hmm.User Interface: We haven't really decided what to do about that.Project Manager: Um, what are our choices hereUser Interface: {vocalsound} Well it's just um w where where shall we locate the buttons. What kind of functions wi shall we haveProject Manager: You mean like we'll have the numbers of the channels, and we'll have the channel-changer, and volume, and powerIndustrial Designer: The power. Volume.Marketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Um {disfmarker}User Interface: So pretty {disfmarker} just just the basic button functions.Project Manager: Yeah. Like I don't know if we should go into like adjusting light levels, things like that, because different televisions will have {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: May yeah.Project Manager: Um, yeah.Industrial Designer: Tone, contrast, and things. That's a bit {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound} That was on, um one of my presentations. About how often it was let's do this fast. Um {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} Well that didn't some up on mine.Project Manager: Should we have audio It only comes up on mine usually.User Interface: It w {vocalsound} it would seem silly if we'd {gap} having anything else, just have an audio button though.Marketing: Oh.Project Manager: Yeah,User Interface: Do you knowProject Manager: I don't, I {disfmarker} it's, it's a problem with the international uh appeal, I think. Um, if we have audio because we don't know how other televisions work. But we know that everyone has this and it's the same.User Interface: But we {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: I've {disfmarker}Marketing: Yeah I guess that it affects the marketing,'cause it, {vocalsound} mm it is a good sales ploy to say, aren't you annoyed with remote controls that have all these buttons.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: This one has channel, volume and your channe and your power.Industrial Designer: Yeah, that's it. We can just go for, make it a selling point that it is just the basic.User Interface: That could be a sales pitch.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: Yeah.User Interface: Simple and {disfmarker}Project Manager: Yeah.Industrial Designer: Yeah uh I {vocalsound} {disfmarker}Marketing: Okay.Project Manager: Alright.Industrial Designer: brilliant.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Good. And, okay, in closing,'cause we only have five minutes. We'll be meeting again in thirty minutes. Um, you'll be working, Poppy will be working on the look-and-feel design. Wait a minute. Is that rightIndustrial Designer: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: Yep, and um the user interface design, so this is where the trendy stuff comes in. And you'll be evaluating the product. Um, Poppy and Tara will have to work together, using modelling clay.User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: And, um, your personal coach will give you the rest of the information of what needs to happen.Industrial Designer: Okay.Project Manager: Alright. So, anyone else have something to sayIndustrial that.Project Manager: Yeah, we'll be doing {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: It'll be more the on the numbers and the volume.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah. It'd be more a command interface, and then {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: I suppose we need to think of symbols for like the volume, display, and stuff like that.User Interface: Yeah.Project Manager: Yeah.Marketing: So it's just draf graphical for the pointing aspectIndustrial Designer: I {disfmarker}Marketing: The infrared is like, that's considered a {disfmarker}Project Manager: HmmUser Interface: No I think it's to do with the actual symbols that are on the, that's on the buttons of the remote control, and perMarketing: Okay. So when it says pointing device that doesn't include {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: For inpUser Interface: Well it could be a wee scroller thing, and something could come up on the screen.Project Manager: Yeah. I think they're talking about L_C_D_ type things.Industrial Designer: Mm.Marketing: Okay.User Interface: Yeah.Marketing: Okay.Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: But um I think we're gonna go with the command interface anyway,Project Manager: Yeah.User Interface: to make it more simplistic. But the, we could incorporate some of the graphical user um points,Marketing: Mm-hmm.User Interface: as in {disfmarker} just to make it m um nicer to look at maybe. {vocalsound}Project Manager: What do you meanUser Interface: Like {vocalsound} I can't think of an example, but {disfmarker} Sort of like little pictures rather than {disfmarker}Project Manager: Oh yeah, like how the buttons {disfmarker}User Interface: Like a little sound. Instead of saying volume, like a little speaker or something.Project Manager: Yeah, as a button though.User Interface: Yeah, something yMarketing: Mm.Project Manager: So, it's a keyboard in the shape of it, rightUser Interface: Yeah m perha yeah. Yeah. Maybe.Project Manager: Okay. Yeah. I like that idea.User Interface: Um, the co uh {disfmarker} we've decided that the command interface would be the most useful for

Summarize the whole meeting.

This was the third meeting of conceptual design, including three presentations and a conclusive discussion to make some specific decisions. First, Industrial Designer introduced and led to a discussion about different options for the components of the circuit board, the energy sources, and the materials of casing and button. Next, User Interface gave the second presentation about interface concept and two types of user interfaces: the graphical user interface and the command interface, and strongly recommended the latter. The last presentation by Marketing reported the trend-watching for remote control and the relevant discussion centralized the trendy theme of vegetable and fruit. Given all of the information, the group eventually decided on some special designs, such as the kinetic energy, the regular chip, the plastic rubber coat, the interchangeable plate, the command line interface, and the basic buttons.

to me in the usual way. I will call the Deputy Minister to speak on each group. For the record, in accordance with the convention agreed by the Business Committee, as Chair I will move amendments in the name of the Deputy Minister. For expediency, I will assume that the Deputy Minister wishes me to move all of her amendments, and I will do so at the appropriate place in the marshalled list. Deputy Minister, if you do not want a particular amendment to be moved, please indicate to me at the relevant point in proceedings. In line with our usual practice, legal advisers to the committee and the Deputy Minister are not expected to provide advice on the record. If Members wish to seek legal advice during proceedings, please do so by passing a note to the legal adviser and, if necessary, we can adjourn. My intention is to try to dispose of all amendments during today's meeting. I will call a short break in proceedings at an appropriate time, if necessary. Okay, thank you. So, we will proceed, then, to group 1, which is the duty to promote public awareness. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 1 in the name of the Deputy Minister. I move amendment 1 in the Deputy Minister's name and call on the Deputy Minister to speak to her amendment and the other amendments in this group.Julie Morgan AM: Thank you very much, Chair. My amendments 1 and 4 will place a duty on Welsh Ministers to provide information and increase awareness about the change in the law to ensure that the public are made aware of how the law will change as a result of the defence of reasonable punishment being abolished and that physical punishment would be prohibited once the therefore agreed. This takes us, then, to the fifth and final group, which relates to commencement. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 9 in the name of Suzy Davies. And I call Suzy Davies to move amendment 9 and to speak to the amendment and the other amendments in the group.Suzy Davies AM: Thank you very much, Chair. Amendment 9 is actually consequential on amendment 10 passing, but it's the lead amendment in the group, so I'll move it to begin the debate. Minister, I'm speaking here now to amendments 10 and 15 specifically. You've said repeatedly, and I believe you, that you do not wish to criminalise parents but just to stop them physically punishing their children. You could have chosen to try and achieve this through awareness raising and civil enforcement, but by choosing to remove the defence to a criminal act you have entered the arena of criminal law, where the logical consequence is opening parents up to liability--not necessarily getting prosecuted, but liability to prosecution, not just liability to civil sanctions. I'm sure you'd prefer parents not to be prosecuted, but that decision does not and cannot lie with you. You, like us, have no agency in this, because the powers and the duties of the police and the Crown Prosecution Service sit outside our competence. You cannot and we cannot, by law or otherwise, instruct either of them in the delivery of your policy intention of not criminalising parents. You've acknowledged to this committee and the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee that revised CPS charging guidance and any other guidance on, for example, out-of-court disposals, are key to delivering your policy objectives. You'll remember how concerned this committee was when we learned that your advisory group--the strategic implementation group, is it--was only in and amendment 4 will fall. Deputy Minister, do you wish to proceed to a vote on amendment 1Julie Morgan AM: I do.Lynne Neagle AM: Thank you. Okay. I move amendment 1 in the name of the Deputy Minister. The question is that amendment 1 be agreed. Does any Member object [Objection. ] Okay, we have an objection, so we'll take a vote by show of hands. All those in favour of amendment 1. All those against. So, there voted four in favour, two against, and amendment 1 is agreed. We'll move on now then to group 2, which relates to the duty to report on the effect of the legislation. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 2, in the name of the Deputy Minister. I move amendment 2 in the Deputy Minister's name, and call on the Deputy Minister to speak to her amendments, and the other amendments in this group.Julie Morgan AM: Thank you, Chair. The amendments in this group are to do with the post-implementation review of the Bill, and I believe there was also a committee recommendation to this end from your committee, so you strongly influenced this amendment. It's clear from Members'contributions to this group and recommendations by the committee at Stage 1 that they share my commitment to the importance of post-implementation review of the effect of the abolition of the defence of reasonable punishment. I've already provided assurance that I agree with the importance placed on such a review, both in the explanatory memorandum and during Stage 1 scrutiny. I also made a commitment to bring forward a Government amendment to put a duty to undertake a post-implementation review on the face of the Bill. I have done this with amendment 2. Amendment 5 sets out that this provision will come into may have less of a commitment. This places further weight on the fact that the Welsh Government should be under a duty to promote awareness and understanding of the Bill beyond its commencement. Furthermore, the Children (Equal Protection from Assault) (Scotland) Bill quite clearly notes that, under section 2, the Scottish Ministers must take such steps as they consider appropriate to promote public awareness and understanding about the effect of section 1 on the abolition for the defence of reasonable punishment. Therefore, I would be grateful if the Deputy Minister can respond as to the reasons why the Welsh Government has deviated from this course of action in their amendment. [Interruption. ] Should our amendment be agreed--Lynne Neagle AM: Are you taking an interventionJanet Finch-Saunders AM: No. I'd rather crack on, to be honest.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay. I can call you in the debate, Hefin.Janet Finch-Saunders AM: Should our amendment to be agreed, we also request that a printing change be made to ensure that the new heading reflects promoting awareness of the changes to the law made by section 1. Amendment 1B: amendment 1B is in line with the committee's recommendation 9, which stated that, as part of a public awareness campaign, there should be details about the support available to parents to use alternatives to physical punishment when disciplining their children. During evidence at Stage 1, the witnesses we saw before the committee raised serious concerns about harder-to-reach groups who needed to be made aware of removing the defence. For example, Children in Wales, Action for Children and Play Wales stated that some families and communities may be harder to reach with information and support. Welsh Government needs to make sure that they receive the information they need. Now, while the Deputy Minister states that she would work 2D, to 2K, which relate to the Deputy Minister's amendment 2 on preparing a published report on the effect of abolishing the defence of reasonable punishment. Again, I must stress the importance of getting this right due to the controversial and long-lasting effects of removing the defence of reasonable punishment. Amendments 2E to 2K outline what we would expect to be within this report, and we would wish to see a commitment from the Deputy Minister to ensure the National Assembly for Wales is fully apprised and able to scrutinise the result of this report. Amendment 2C requests that the Welsh Government prepare a report on the awareness-raising campaign and lays it before the Assembly before section 1 commences. As I have outlined under my amendments in group 1, the understanding of the public about the implications of the Bill cannot be sidelined. Although the Deputy Minister has repeated her commitment to a public awareness campaign, we, as the National Assembly for Wales, must be able to scrutinise its effectiveness before section 1 begins. As I noted under amendments 1B to 1E, there are specific groups of people who need to be evaluated on their understanding of the Bill's effect. I'm sure that the Deputy Minister will agree that the harder-to-reach groups are undoubtedly the most vulnerable to any negative impacts that the Bill will have because of the greater potential of a lack of awareness. It is, therefore, important for the Assembly to be able to determine whether the awareness-raising campaign has had a positive effect on these groups of people. As will also be elaborated under amendment 2D, it is extremely important that we, as the Parliament of Wales, are fully apprised of the awareness-raising campaign's impact. Before we implement what will be a criminal offence, it is

What did the group discuss about amendments in group 1 that related to the duty to promote public awareness

There was a debate of whether amendment 1 and 4, and 1A to 1E should be accepted or rejected. The Deputy Minister firstly expressed her opinions. She was in favor of amendments 1 and 4, but against 1A to 1E, mainly because she thought that level of details were not necessarily on the face of the Bill. However, Janet Finch-Saunders thought the Deputy Minister's amendment lacked a number of key points that the committee were actually keen to address at stage 1 and explained one by one from 1A to 1E why those amendments were important. Afterwards, there was a short debate about whether to accept those amendments from Suzy Davies, Dawn Bowden, Hefin David and Sian Gwenllian. Suzy Davies supported amendment 1A to 1E, while others all against them. At last, they took a vote and it ended up with rejecting amendment 1A to 1E and agreeing with amendment 1.

take a vote. All those in favour of amendment 2, please show. All those against. So, there voted four in favour, two against, and amendment 2 is agreed. That takes us on to group 3, which relates to the regulation-making powers in the Bill. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 3 in the name of the Deputy Minister. I move amendment 3 in the Deputy Minister's name and call on the Deputy Minister to speak to her amendments and the other amendments in this group.Julie Morgan AM: Thank you very much, Chair. Members will note that I've brought forward an amendment to provide certainty on the date of commencement of the core provision in the Bill, which is obviously to abolish the defence of reasonable punishment. And that is going to be debated under group 5. So, we're obviously debating that after we deal with these particular technical issues--these are technical issues here, basically. As a consequence of proposing to remove the power for a Welsh Minister to make an Order for commencement, the power to make transitory, transitional or saving provisions in connection with section 1 of the Bill coming into force would also be removed. So, I'm not seeking here to add any new powers to the Bill; amendment 3 will simply add this existing power back onto the face of the Bill where amendments 7 and 8 remove it, and amendment 6 will bring the power into force the day after Royal Assent. In fact, removing the power for the Welsh Ministers to commence the provision in section 1 by Order means the statutory instrument will actually do less than originally intended. These amendments are technical in nature and while I acknowledge that the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee raised the issue of what procedure to me in the usual way. I will call the Deputy Minister to speak on each group. For the record, in accordance with the convention agreed by the Business Committee, as Chair I will move amendments in the name of the Deputy Minister. For expediency, I will assume that the Deputy Minister wishes me to move all of her amendments, and I will do so at the appropriate place in the marshalled list. Deputy Minister, if you do not want a particular amendment to be moved, please indicate to me at the relevant point in proceedings. In line with our usual practice, legal advisers to the committee and the Deputy Minister are not expected to provide advice on the record. If Members wish to seek legal advice during proceedings, please do so by passing a note to the legal adviser and, if necessary, we can adjourn. My intention is to try to dispose of all amendments during today's meeting. I will call a short break in proceedings at an appropriate time, if necessary. Okay, thank you. So, we will proceed, then, to group 1, which is the duty to promote public awareness. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 1 in the name of the Deputy Minister. I move amendment 1 in the Deputy Minister's name and call on the Deputy Minister to speak to her amendment and the other amendments in this group.Julie Morgan AM: Thank you very much, Chair. My amendments 1 and 4 will place a duty on Welsh Ministers to provide information and increase awareness about the change in the law to ensure that the public are made aware of how the law will change as a result of the defence of reasonable punishment being abolished and that physical punishment would be prohibited once the therefore agreed. This takes us, then, to the fifth and final group, which relates to commencement. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 9 in the name of Suzy Davies. And I call Suzy Davies to move amendment 9 and to speak to the amendment and the other amendments in the group.Suzy Davies AM: Thank you very much, Chair. Amendment 9 is actually consequential on amendment 10 passing, but it's the lead amendment in the group, so I'll move it to begin the debate. Minister, I'm speaking here now to amendments 10 and 15 specifically. You've said repeatedly, and I believe you, that you do not wish to criminalise parents but just to stop them physically punishing their children. You could have chosen to try and achieve this through awareness raising and civil enforcement, but by choosing to remove the defence to a criminal act you have entered the arena of criminal law, where the logical consequence is opening parents up to liability--not necessarily getting prosecuted, but liability to prosecution, not just liability to civil sanctions. I'm sure you'd prefer parents not to be prosecuted, but that decision does not and cannot lie with you. You, like us, have no agency in this, because the powers and the duties of the police and the Crown Prosecution Service sit outside our competence. You cannot and we cannot, by law or otherwise, instruct either of them in the delivery of your policy intention of not criminalising parents. You've acknowledged to this committee and the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee that revised CPS charging guidance and any other guidance on, for example, out-of-court disposals, are key to delivering your policy objectives. You'll remember how concerned this committee was when we learned that your advisory group--the strategic implementation group, is it--was only in and amendment 4 will fall. Deputy Minister, do you wish to proceed to a vote on amendment 1Julie Morgan AM: I do.Lynne Neagle AM: Thank you. Okay. I move amendment 1 in the name of the Deputy Minister. The question is that amendment 1 be agreed. Does any Member object [Objection. ] Okay, we have an objection, so we'll take a vote by show of hands. All those in favour of amendment 1. All those against. So, there voted four in favour, two against, and amendment 1 is agreed. We'll move on now then to group 2, which relates to the duty to report on the effect of the legislation. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 2, in the name of the Deputy Minister. I move amendment 2 in the Deputy Minister's name, and call on the Deputy Minister to speak to her amendments, and the other amendments in this group.Julie Morgan AM: Thank you, Chair. The amendments in this group are to do with the post-implementation review of the Bill, and I believe there was also a committee recommendation to this end from your committee, so you strongly influenced this amendment. It's clear from Members'contributions to this group and recommendations by the committee at Stage 1 that they share my commitment to the importance of post-implementation review of the effect of the abolition of the defence of reasonable punishment. I've already provided assurance that I agree with the importance placed on such a review, both in the explanatory memorandum and during Stage 1 scrutiny. I also made a commitment to bring forward a Government amendment to put a duty to undertake a post-implementation review on the face of the Bill. I have done this with amendment 2. Amendment 5 sets out that this provision will come into may have less of a commitment. This places further weight on the fact that the Welsh Government should be under a duty to promote awareness and understanding of the Bill beyond its commencement. Furthermore, the Children (Equal Protection from Assault) (Scotland) Bill quite clearly notes that, under section 2, the Scottish Ministers must take such steps as they consider appropriate to promote public awareness and understanding about the effect of section 1 on the abolition for the defence of reasonable punishment. Therefore, I would be grateful if the Deputy Minister can respond as to the reasons why the Welsh Government has deviated from this course of action in their amendment. [Interruption. ] Should our amendment be agreed--Lynne Neagle AM: Are you taking an interventionJanet Finch-Saunders AM: No. I'd rather crack on, to be honest.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay. I can call you in the debate, Hefin.Janet Finch-Saunders AM: Should our amendment to be agreed, we also request that a printing change be made to ensure that the new heading reflects promoting awareness of the changes to the law made by section 1. Amendment 1B: amendment 1B is in line with the committee's recommendation 9, which stated that, as part of a public awareness campaign, there should be details about the support available to parents to use alternatives to physical punishment when disciplining their children. During evidence at Stage 1, the witnesses we saw before the committee raised serious concerns about harder-to-reach groups who needed to be made aware of removing the defence. For example, Children in Wales, Action for Children and Play Wales stated that some families and communities may be harder to reach with information and support. Welsh Government needs to make sure that they receive the information they need. Now, while the Deputy Minister states that she would work

How did the Deputy Minister speak to her amendments in group 1 that related to the duty to promote public awareness

Her amendments 1 and 4 would place a duty on Welsh Ministers to provide information and increase awareness about the change in the law. She had already made a commitment to a high-intensity awareness-raising campaign over about six years from Royal Assent if the Bill passed. She thought amendments 1A to 1E which relate to the duty to raise awareness were not necessary. In specific, amendment 1A was open-ended on promoting public awareness. All the raised points would be considered by another group, but she thought the level of the detail on the face of the Bill was not needed, and same reasons for amendment 1B and 1D. As for the amendment 1C which was about how to raise concerns, the Deputy Minister thought the safeguarding was everybody's business. In conclusion, she asked for the support of members for amendments 1 and 4, and asked to reject amendments 1A to 1E, as those were unnecessary provisions in terms of what the awareness-raising duty needed to achieve.

to me in the usual way. I will call the Deputy Minister to speak on each group. For the record, in accordance with the convention agreed by the Business Committee, as Chair I will move amendments in the name of the Deputy Minister. For expediency, I will assume that the Deputy Minister wishes me to move all of her amendments, and I will do so at the appropriate place in the marshalled list. Deputy Minister, if you do not want a particular amendment to be moved, please indicate to me at the relevant point in proceedings. In line with our usual practice, legal advisers to the committee and the Deputy Minister are not expected to provide advice on the record. If Members wish to seek legal advice during proceedings, please do so by passing a note to the legal adviser and, if necessary, we can adjourn. My intention is to try to dispose of all amendments during today's meeting. I will call a short break in proceedings at an appropriate time, if necessary. Okay, thank you. So, we will proceed, then, to group 1, which is the duty to promote public awareness. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 1 in the name of the Deputy Minister. I move amendment 1 in the Deputy Minister's name and call on the Deputy Minister to speak to her amendment and the other amendments in this group.Julie Morgan AM: Thank you very much, Chair. My amendments 1 and 4 will place a duty on Welsh Ministers to provide information and increase awareness about the change in the law to ensure that the public are made aware of how the law will change as a result of the defence of reasonable punishment being abolished and that physical punishment would be prohibited once the therefore agreed. This takes us, then, to the fifth and final group, which relates to commencement. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 9 in the name of Suzy Davies. And I call Suzy Davies to move amendment 9 and to speak to the amendment and the other amendments in the group.Suzy Davies AM: Thank you very much, Chair. Amendment 9 is actually consequential on amendment 10 passing, but it's the lead amendment in the group, so I'll move it to begin the debate. Minister, I'm speaking here now to amendments 10 and 15 specifically. You've said repeatedly, and I believe you, that you do not wish to criminalise parents but just to stop them physically punishing their children. You could have chosen to try and achieve this through awareness raising and civil enforcement, but by choosing to remove the defence to a criminal act you have entered the arena of criminal law, where the logical consequence is opening parents up to liability--not necessarily getting prosecuted, but liability to prosecution, not just liability to civil sanctions. I'm sure you'd prefer parents not to be prosecuted, but that decision does not and cannot lie with you. You, like us, have no agency in this, because the powers and the duties of the police and the Crown Prosecution Service sit outside our competence. You cannot and we cannot, by law or otherwise, instruct either of them in the delivery of your policy intention of not criminalising parents. You've acknowledged to this committee and the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee that revised CPS charging guidance and any other guidance on, for example, out-of-court disposals, are key to delivering your policy objectives. You'll remember how concerned this committee was when we learned that your advisory group--the strategic implementation group, is it--was only in may have less of a commitment. This places further weight on the fact that the Welsh Government should be under a duty to promote awareness and understanding of the Bill beyond its commencement. Furthermore, the Children (Equal Protection from Assault) (Scotland) Bill quite clearly notes that, under section 2, the Scottish Ministers must take such steps as they consider appropriate to promote public awareness and understanding about the effect of section 1 on the abolition for the defence of reasonable punishment. Therefore, I would be grateful if the Deputy Minister can respond as to the reasons why the Welsh Government has deviated from this course of action in their amendment. [Interruption. ] Should our amendment be agreed--Lynne Neagle AM: Are you taking an interventionJanet Finch-Saunders AM: No. I'd rather crack on, to be honest.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay. I can call you in the debate, Hefin.Janet Finch-Saunders AM: Should our amendment to be agreed, we also request that a printing change be made to ensure that the new heading reflects promoting awareness of the changes to the law made by section 1. Amendment 1B: amendment 1B is in line with the committee's recommendation 9, which stated that, as part of a public awareness campaign, there should be details about the support available to parents to use alternatives to physical punishment when disciplining their children. During evidence at Stage 1, the witnesses we saw before the committee raised serious concerns about harder-to-reach groups who needed to be made aware of removing the defence. For example, Children in Wales, Action for Children and Play Wales stated that some families and communities may be harder to reach with information and support. Welsh Government needs to make sure that they receive the information they need. Now, while the Deputy Minister states that she would work 3 and 6, and we discussed those in the previous group. I've listened to the arguments put forward by Suzy Davies and Janet Finch-Saunders for the amendments in this group that they have tabled. These amendments are all about making the commencement of the Bill conditional on something else happening, whether it's waiting for the revision of Crown Prosecution Service guidance, or the establishment of a pathway for diversion from the criminal justice system, or for the provision of parenting support services. And, really, I don't think that we should be going down that road. As I set out in my letter of response to the Stage 1 report from the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee, we've got good working relations with the CPS through the strategic implementation group, and we work very closely with them. But the CPS are an independent body, as Suzy Davies has said in her contribution, not answerable to Welsh Ministers or this legislature, and it's not appropriate for a Minister or the National Assembly to seek to influence the CPS guidelines. We're discussing the issues with the CPS in the implementation group. And, in fact, I think that these amendments--Suzy's amendments in particular--wouldn't just seek to influence the CPS, but would actually give power to a non-devolved body on the way that we legislate in Wales. So, I don't think we should make it conditional on those guidelines being decided. I think you have to rely on the fact that we have got this very good relationship, very close working relationship. And I know they did give evidence to your committee, I believe, the CPS. And I think legislating to effectively give a non-devolved body a power to commence, or not, Assembly legislation would be highly unusual and would raise great uncertainty, I think, issue. I have already said I will expand the age range of the'Parenting: Give it Time'campaign, and I think--. I know Janet Finch-Saunders has made the point that it is an online facility. It is very widely used. It is a very successful tool. But, of course, the universal services are also there. For example, the universal service of the health visitors is absolutely crucial, and that is a service that is for every child. And, of course, the health visitors welcome this legislation very strongly. And the expert group is considering what it'll recommend for the future, and it needs the time to be able to do that, to support the Bill as well as to support parenting more widely. So, as I said, I think these are important points that you have raised, but I don't think they are appropriate. So, I therefore urge the committee not to support amendments 9 and 10, nor 13,14 and 15.Lynne Neagle AM: Thank you. Suzy to reply to the debate.Suzy Davies AM: Thank you very much, and thank you very much, Deputy Minister, as well. I'm disappointed that you haven't seen what's behind Janet Finch-Saunders's final amendment there, actually. Maybe it's something we'll raise again with you at Stage 3, or maybe in the conversations that we have between now and then. But I want to go back to amendments 10 and 15 that I've raised and your assertion that we're giving, or attempting to give, power to the CPS here. We are not. This amendment is drafted very specifically and in full knowledge that we have no legislative competence in this area. And this is why I go back to where my contribution to this started, and it's your choice to try and resolve the problem of--or, sorry, to try

What did Janet Finch-Saunders say for amendments 1A to 1E when discussing the amendments in group 1 that related to the duty to promote public awareness

While it was imperative that the public were made aware of this controversial change in the law, she thought the Deputy Minister's amendment lacked a number of key points that the committee were actually keen to address at stage 1. For example, Amendment 1A changed amendment 1 to include the promotion of understanding changes to the law. Amendment 1B stated that there should be details about the support available to parents to use alternatives to physical punishment when discipline their children, which she thought was very important to parents. Amendment 1C explained that the Welsh Government should ensure clear advice was provided on what people could do if they had seen a child being physically assaulted, and this could help raise public awareness of how they could report and in what situations they could report.

take a vote. All those in favour of amendment 2, please show. All those against. So, there voted four in favour, two against, and amendment 2 is agreed. That takes us on to group 3, which relates to the regulation-making powers in the Bill. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 3 in the name of the Deputy Minister. I move amendment 3 in the Deputy Minister's name and call on the Deputy Minister to speak to her amendments and the other amendments in this group.Julie Morgan AM: Thank you very much, Chair. Members will note that I've brought forward an amendment to provide certainty on the date of commencement of the core provision in the Bill, which is obviously to abolish the defence of reasonable punishment. And that is going to be debated under group 5. So, we're obviously debating that after we deal with these particular technical issues--these are technical issues here, basically. As a consequence of proposing to remove the power for a Welsh Minister to make an Order for commencement, the power to make transitory, transitional or saving provisions in connection with section 1 of the Bill coming into force would also be removed. So, I'm not seeking here to add any new powers to the Bill; amendment 3 will simply add this existing power back onto the face of the Bill where amendments 7 and 8 remove it, and amendment 6 will bring the power into force the day after Royal Assent. In fact, removing the power for the Welsh Ministers to commence the provision in section 1 by Order means the statutory instrument will actually do less than originally intended. These amendments are technical in nature and while I acknowledge that the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee raised the issue of what procedure about developing methods to collect data, we will be putting forward some of the suggestions that you've made on those issues. So, I don't see any problem with that at all.Suzy Davies AM: Thank you.Julie Morgan AM: So, as I say, I can't support the amendments. I'm hopeful you may withdraw the two amendments--I think one of yours and it was one of Janet's, wasn't it--so that we could work together on those before the next stage. Because I am sympathetic to your views on these matters, and I think they do reflect some of the discussions in the committee as well. So, I'd be happy to work with you to bring forward the amendments at Stage 3. In line with the recommendations of the Finance Committee, further details of the costs associated with the post-implementation review will be provided in a revised regulatory impact assessment at Stage 3. So, I think at this point I would ask that Members reject the non-Government amendments and agree to my amendments 2 and 5, which will ultimately achieve the same policy aim without the need for unnecessary detail on the Bill, with the exception, obviously, of those two amendments, which I'm prepared to look at a way of moving forward on.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay. Thank you, Deputy Minister. Before disposing of amendment 2, we will deal with the amendments to that amendment. Janet, do you wish to move amendment 2CJanet Finch-Saunders AM: I move.Lynne Neagle AM: The question is that amendment 2C be agreed. Does any Member object [Objection. ] We have an objection, so I'll take a vote by show of hands. All those in favour of amendment 2C, please show. All those against. So, there voted two in favour, four against. Amendment 2C is lost. Suzy, do you wish to to me in the usual way. I will call the Deputy Minister to speak on each group. For the record, in accordance with the convention agreed by the Business Committee, as Chair I will move amendments in the name of the Deputy Minister. For expediency, I will assume that the Deputy Minister wishes me to move all of her amendments, and I will do so at the appropriate place in the marshalled list. Deputy Minister, if you do not want a particular amendment to be moved, please indicate to me at the relevant point in proceedings. In line with our usual practice, legal advisers to the committee and the Deputy Minister are not expected to provide advice on the record. If Members wish to seek legal advice during proceedings, please do so by passing a note to the legal adviser and, if necessary, we can adjourn. My intention is to try to dispose of all amendments during today's meeting. I will call a short break in proceedings at an appropriate time, if necessary. Okay, thank you. So, we will proceed, then, to group 1, which is the duty to promote public awareness. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 1 in the name of the Deputy Minister. I move amendment 1 in the Deputy Minister's name and call on the Deputy Minister to speak to her amendment and the other amendments in this group.Julie Morgan AM: Thank you very much, Chair. My amendments 1 and 4 will place a duty on Welsh Ministers to provide information and increase awareness about the change in the law to ensure that the public are made aware of how the law will change as a result of the defence of reasonable punishment being abolished and that physical punishment would be prohibited once the and amendment 4 will fall. Deputy Minister, do you wish to proceed to a vote on amendment 1Julie Morgan AM: I do.Lynne Neagle AM: Thank you. Okay. I move amendment 1 in the name of the Deputy Minister. The question is that amendment 1 be agreed. Does any Member object [Objection. ] Okay, we have an objection, so we'll take a vote by show of hands. All those in favour of amendment 1. All those against. So, there voted four in favour, two against, and amendment 1 is agreed. We'll move on now then to group 2, which relates to the duty to report on the effect of the legislation. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 2, in the name of the Deputy Minister. I move amendment 2 in the Deputy Minister's name, and call on the Deputy Minister to speak to her amendments, and the other amendments in this group.Julie Morgan AM: Thank you, Chair. The amendments in this group are to do with the post-implementation review of the Bill, and I believe there was also a committee recommendation to this end from your committee, so you strongly influenced this amendment. It's clear from Members'contributions to this group and recommendations by the committee at Stage 1 that they share my commitment to the importance of post-implementation review of the effect of the abolition of the defence of reasonable punishment. I've already provided assurance that I agree with the importance placed on such a review, both in the explanatory memorandum and during Stage 1 scrutiny. I also made a commitment to bring forward a Government amendment to put a duty to undertake a post-implementation review on the face of the Bill. I have done this with amendment 2. Amendment 5 sets out that this provision will come into saving provisions are actually enough powers for you under the course of this Bill. I'm wondering whether you want to consider actually amending this to give yourself the more usual unrestricted power to make regulations in order for you to get section 1 implemented, bearing in mind that it has now been amended from that original, very short and simple--or at least simple in terms of drafting--initial draft. As I say, in anticipation of you rejecting amendments in group 1 I tabled this, in order to make sure that an opportunity remains for the Assembly to bring anything you may wish to introduce under section 1, when it comes into effect, onto the floor of the Assembly. Because while I completely accept that you've acknowledged that statutory instrument is the process for introducing things from now on, it's still possible to do that without procedure, and so I have no idea whether you think what you introduce would be better suited to be introduced by a negative or affirmative procedure. Amendment 3A is a holding position, which we will return to you in Stage 3, because I think, again, this is an area where it might be valuable for us to discuss quite what kind of powers you're looking for, because I think you probably need something that's beyond transitional, transitory and saving.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay. Suzy, have you finishedSuzy Davies AM: Yes, thank you very much.Lynne Neagle AM: Are there any other Members who wish to speak on this group No. Deputy Minister.Julie Morgan AM: I thank Suzy for that input. We don't actually think it's necessary to have wider powers, but we will keep this under review and at Stage 3, I think that--. When I was looking at this, I was concerned to know what the transitory

Summarize their discussions on the amendments related to the duty to report on the effect of the legislation.

The Deputy Minister firstly expressed her opinions. She thought amendment 2C would require Welsh Ministers to prepare and lay before the Assembly a report on the effect of their promotion of public awareness before section 1 was commenced, and she thought this was unnecessary and was in conflict with what she thought was a priority for the implementation of this Bill. She also thought this amendment was not required because they were preparing to assess the effectiveness of the awareness raising. Then Janet Finch-Saunder expressed her opinion, and spoke to amendments 2C excluding 2D to 2K. After this, Suzy Davies proposed several opinions against the Deputy Minister. In specific, Suzy Davies did not think the amendment should affect the commencement date at all, to respond to the comments the Deputy Minister made for amendment 2C. At last, they took a vote and ended up with losing 2C - 2K, and accepting amendment 2.

take a vote. All those in favour of amendment 2, please show. All those against. So, there voted four in favour, two against, and amendment 2 is agreed. That takes us on to group 3, which relates to the regulation-making powers in the Bill. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 3 in the name of the Deputy Minister. I move amendment 3 in the Deputy Minister's name and call on the Deputy Minister to speak to her amendments and the other amendments in this group.Julie Morgan AM: Thank you very much, Chair. Members will note that I've brought forward an amendment to provide certainty on the date of commencement of the core provision in the Bill, which is obviously to abolish the defence of reasonable punishment. And that is going to be debated under group 5. So, we're obviously debating that after we deal with these particular technical issues--these are technical issues here, basically. As a consequence of proposing to remove the power for a Welsh Minister to make an Order for commencement, the power to make transitory, transitional or saving provisions in connection with section 1 of the Bill coming into force would also be removed. So, I'm not seeking here to add any new powers to the Bill; amendment 3 will simply add this existing power back onto the face of the Bill where amendments 7 and 8 remove it, and amendment 6 will bring the power into force the day after Royal Assent. In fact, removing the power for the Welsh Ministers to commence the provision in section 1 by Order means the statutory instrument will actually do less than originally intended. These amendments are technical in nature and while I acknowledge that the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee raised the issue of what procedure should be applied, their report did not call for any change to no procedure being applied. The absence of an Assembly procedure does not mean that Ministers'decisions in relation to transitional powers cannot be scrutinised by the Assembly. Any concerns about the Welsh Ministers'proposals could be put to me in the Senedd. This was a point made to CLAC and, as I say, their final conclusion was that no procedure is the appropriate procedure for such a power. For those reasons, I encourage Members to reject amendment 3A from Suzy.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay, thank you. Suzy Davies.Suzy Davies AM: Thank you very much. Well perhaps, Deputy Minister, I can begin by saying that one person's technical issue is another person's essential part of the legislative procedure and a keen element in scrutiny. But I thank you for noting the Assembly's observations on the ministerial powers granted in this Bill--this time by CLAC, as you say. Moving this--and I'm glad actually that amendment 8, I think it was, has removed an Order provision and we're moving into an area where at least statutory instruments do feature here. I have to say that amendment 3A is something of a probing amendment, and I'll explain why now. Your amendment 3 seeks to give a familiar range of powers in connection with the coming into force of section 1, but it's actually in a substantive part of section 1 itself now--it's not a separate commencement power. And, actually, I've been listening to the rest of this debate, and thinking that, if you're going to be introducing an awareness campaign and a report, the chances are you're going to need some regulatory powers to introduce some of the aspects of both those policy areas, I think. And I'm wondering whether the--what is it--transitory, transitional and about developing methods to collect data, we will be putting forward some of the suggestions that you've made on those issues. So, I don't see any problem with that at all.Suzy Davies AM: Thank you.Julie Morgan AM: So, as I say, I can't support the amendments. I'm hopeful you may withdraw the two amendments--I think one of yours and it was one of Janet's, wasn't it--so that we could work together on those before the next stage. Because I am sympathetic to your views on these matters, and I think they do reflect some of the discussions in the committee as well. So, I'd be happy to work with you to bring forward the amendments at Stage 3. In line with the recommendations of the Finance Committee, further details of the costs associated with the post-implementation review will be provided in a revised regulatory impact assessment at Stage 3. So, I think at this point I would ask that Members reject the non-Government amendments and agree to my amendments 2 and 5, which will ultimately achieve the same policy aim without the need for unnecessary detail on the Bill, with the exception, obviously, of those two amendments, which I'm prepared to look at a way of moving forward on.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay. Thank you, Deputy Minister. Before disposing of amendment 2, we will deal with the amendments to that amendment. Janet, do you wish to move amendment 2CJanet Finch-Saunders AM: I move.Lynne Neagle AM: The question is that amendment 2C be agreed. Does any Member object [Objection. ] We have an objection, so I'll take a vote by show of hands. All those in favour of amendment 2C, please show. All those against. So, there voted two in favour, four against. Amendment 2C is lost. Suzy, do you wish to to me in the usual way. I will call the Deputy Minister to speak on each group. For the record, in accordance with the convention agreed by the Business Committee, as Chair I will move amendments in the name of the Deputy Minister. For expediency, I will assume that the Deputy Minister wishes me to move all of her amendments, and I will do so at the appropriate place in the marshalled list. Deputy Minister, if you do not want a particular amendment to be moved, please indicate to me at the relevant point in proceedings. In line with our usual practice, legal advisers to the committee and the Deputy Minister are not expected to provide advice on the record. If Members wish to seek legal advice during proceedings, please do so by passing a note to the legal adviser and, if necessary, we can adjourn. My intention is to try to dispose of all amendments during today's meeting. I will call a short break in proceedings at an appropriate time, if necessary. Okay, thank you. So, we will proceed, then, to group 1, which is the duty to promote public awareness. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 1 in the name of the Deputy Minister. I move amendment 1 in the Deputy Minister's name and call on the Deputy Minister to speak to her amendment and the other amendments in this group.Julie Morgan AM: Thank you very much, Chair. My amendments 1 and 4 will place a duty on Welsh Ministers to provide information and increase awareness about the change in the law to ensure that the public are made aware of how the law will change as a result of the defence of reasonable punishment being abolished and that physical punishment would be prohibited once the therefore agreed. This takes us, then, to the fifth and final group, which relates to commencement. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 9 in the name of Suzy Davies. And I call Suzy Davies to move amendment 9 and to speak to the amendment and the other amendments in the group.Suzy Davies AM: Thank you very much, Chair. Amendment 9 is actually consequential on amendment 10 passing, but it's the lead amendment in the group, so I'll move it to begin the debate. Minister, I'm speaking here now to amendments 10 and 15 specifically. You've said repeatedly, and I believe you, that you do not wish to criminalise parents but just to stop them physically punishing their children. You could have chosen to try and achieve this through awareness raising and civil enforcement, but by choosing to remove the defence to a criminal act you have entered the arena of criminal law, where the logical consequence is opening parents up to liability--not necessarily getting prosecuted, but liability to prosecution, not just liability to civil sanctions. I'm sure you'd prefer parents not to be prosecuted, but that decision does not and cannot lie with you. You, like us, have no agency in this, because the powers and the duties of the police and the Crown Prosecution Service sit outside our competence. You cannot and we cannot, by law or otherwise, instruct either of them in the delivery of your policy intention of not criminalising parents. You've acknowledged to this committee and the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee that revised CPS charging guidance and any other guidance on, for example, out-of-court disposals, are key to delivering your policy objectives. You'll remember how concerned this committee was when we learned that your advisory group--the strategic implementation group, is it--was only in

How did the Deputy Minister speak to her amendments in group 2 that relate to the duty to report on the effect of the legislation

The Deputy Minister had provided assurance that she agreed with the importance placed on the post-implementation review, and made a commitment to bring forward a Government amendment to put a duty to undertake a post-implementation review on the face of the Bill. Amendment 2C would require Welsh Minister to prepare and lay before the Assembly a report on the effect of their promotion of public awareness before section 1 is commenced, and the Deputy Minister thought this amendment was unnecessary and was in conflict with what she thought was a priority for the implementation of this Bill. The Deputy Minister did not want to support amendments 2A, 2C and 2E to 2K, because these amendments made little difference in terms of practical effect to what they had in the Bill already. In conclusion, she would ask members to reject the non-Government amendments and agree to amendments 2 and 5.

about developing methods to collect data, we will be putting forward some of the suggestions that you've made on those issues. So, I don't see any problem with that at all.Suzy Davies AM: Thank you.Julie Morgan AM: So, as I say, I can't support the amendments. I'm hopeful you may withdraw the two amendments--I think one of yours and it was one of Janet's, wasn't it--so that we could work together on those before the next stage. Because I am sympathetic to your views on these matters, and I think they do reflect some of the discussions in the committee as well. So, I'd be happy to work with you to bring forward the amendments at Stage 3. In line with the recommendations of the Finance Committee, further details of the costs associated with the post-implementation review will be provided in a revised regulatory impact assessment at Stage 3. So, I think at this point I would ask that Members reject the non-Government amendments and agree to my amendments 2 and 5, which will ultimately achieve the same policy aim without the need for unnecessary detail on the Bill, with the exception, obviously, of those two amendments, which I'm prepared to look at a way of moving forward on.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay. Thank you, Deputy Minister. Before disposing of amendment 2, we will deal with the amendments to that amendment. Janet, do you wish to move amendment 2CJanet Finch-Saunders AM: I move.Lynne Neagle AM: The question is that amendment 2C be agreed. Does any Member object [Objection. ] We have an objection, so I'll take a vote by show of hands. All those in favour of amendment 2C, please show. All those against. So, there voted two in favour, four against. Amendment 2C is lost. Suzy, do you wish to move on to group 4, which relates to the duty to ensure sufficient funding. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 11 in the name of Janet Finch-Saunders. I call on Janet Finch-Saunders to move amendment 11 and to speak to her amendments. Janet.Janet Finch-Saunders AM: Thank you. I speak to both amendments in this group. As I outlined under amendments 2I and 2J, there are ongoing concerns about the potential costs for Welsh devolved authorities and the lack of quantifiable costs within the regulatory impact assessment. Now, it was absolutely clear from evidence that we received in this committee that unknown costs would be challenging and potentially problematic. As I have mentioned previously, these concerns would doubtless be most keenly felt in our hard-pressed social services. Furthermore, the Welsh Local Government Association stated that there must be a commitment that whatever the costs are, those costs are met, because it is legislation that is being led by the National Assembly for Wales. Now, during evidence, the Deputy Minister, when asked about the reliance on a limited number of reporting of cases likely to happen and the potential for a degree of unknown costs stated:'we are doing our very best to prepare to cover all eventualities that we can anticipate.'But you couldn't commit to a broad figure, instead telling us that:'we have to rely on what the people who run those organisations are telling us.'And:'We have to measure it as we go along.'Given that devolved authorities need to plan their budgets for these changes, we only think it is fair for the Welsh Government to provide sufficient funding to alleviate the cost implications of this Bill. Now, while amendment 11 makes reference to costs borne by local authorities and health boards, I note that amendment 12 takes this further evaluation of this, unless I follow--Hefin David AM: I won't intervene; I'll speak.Suzy Davies AM: Is that okayHefin David AM: Yes, I'll make the point.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay, I've got--Suzy Davies AM: Yes, I'll take the intervention.Lynne Neagle AM: No, he doesn't want to make an intervention--Hefin David AM: I won't do an intervention; I'll speak.Lynne Neagle AM: --he'll make a contribution.Suzy Davies AM: Oh, apologies--Hefin David AM: Just to say--Suzy Davies AM: I'll wait.Hefin David AM: Well, let me put the intervention--. I'll do it as an intervention, then. I just feel that--I take your point, and I was expecting it. The point I was making about 1D and 1E is they close down choices to Ministers in future Assemblies. An evaluative practice would actually open up those choices and give future Parliaments more options with regard to this Bill, so I think it's entirely consistent. I don't think the Minister, in putting in amendment 2, was trying to undermine my argument. Actually, I think she's being constructive by doing that, and I think amendment 2 is a practical amendment that's quite helpful, and its consequence will be to open up choices to future Parliaments, whereas my objection to 1D and 1E is they close those down.Suzy Davies AM: Okay, well, as I say, I think, actually, the Deputy Minister's offer of a three-year interim period might be part of a resolution to this. Because I'm not 100 per cent sure I accept your argument, either, because it closes it down for the interim period if we don't move on with the Deputy Minister's suggestion--which I'll talk about now, actually. Because I am tempted to accept your offer. It absolutely makes sense and it's clearly made with the best good faith here. But I need some clarity on what to me in the usual way. I will call the Deputy Minister to speak on each group. For the record, in accordance with the convention agreed by the Business Committee, as Chair I will move amendments in the name of the Deputy Minister. For expediency, I will assume that the Deputy Minister wishes me to move all of her amendments, and I will do so at the appropriate place in the marshalled list. Deputy Minister, if you do not want a particular amendment to be moved, please indicate to me at the relevant point in proceedings. In line with our usual practice, legal advisers to the committee and the Deputy Minister are not expected to provide advice on the record. If Members wish to seek legal advice during proceedings, please do so by passing a note to the legal adviser and, if necessary, we can adjourn. My intention is to try to dispose of all amendments during today's meeting. I will call a short break in proceedings at an appropriate time, if necessary. Okay, thank you. So, we will proceed, then, to group 1, which is the duty to promote public awareness. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 1 in the name of the Deputy Minister. I move amendment 1 in the Deputy Minister's name and call on the Deputy Minister to speak to her amendment and the other amendments in this group.Julie Morgan AM: Thank you very much, Chair. My amendments 1 and 4 will place a duty on Welsh Ministers to provide information and increase awareness about the change in the law to ensure that the public are made aware of how the law will change as a result of the defence of reasonable punishment being abolished and that physical punishment would be prohibited once the may have less of a commitment. This places further weight on the fact that the Welsh Government should be under a duty to promote awareness and understanding of the Bill beyond its commencement. Furthermore, the Children (Equal Protection from Assault) (Scotland) Bill quite clearly notes that, under section 2, the Scottish Ministers must take such steps as they consider appropriate to promote public awareness and understanding about the effect of section 1 on the abolition for the defence of reasonable punishment. Therefore, I would be grateful if the Deputy Minister can respond as to the reasons why the Welsh Government has deviated from this course of action in their amendment. [Interruption. ] Should our amendment be agreed--Lynne Neagle AM: Are you taking an interventionJanet Finch-Saunders AM: No. I'd rather crack on, to be honest.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay. I can call you in the debate, Hefin.Janet Finch-Saunders AM: Should our amendment to be agreed, we also request that a printing change be made to ensure that the new heading reflects promoting awareness of the changes to the law made by section 1. Amendment 1B: amendment 1B is in line with the committee's recommendation 9, which stated that, as part of a public awareness campaign, there should be details about the support available to parents to use alternatives to physical punishment when disciplining their children. During evidence at Stage 1, the witnesses we saw before the committee raised serious concerns about harder-to-reach groups who needed to be made aware of removing the defence. For example, Children in Wales, Action for Children and Play Wales stated that some families and communities may be harder to reach with information and support. Welsh Government needs to make sure that they receive the information they need. Now, while the Deputy Minister states that she would work

Summarize Janet-Finch-Saunders'opinion on amendments in group 2 that relate to the duty to report on the effect of the legislation.

Janet Finch-Saunders spoke to amendments 2C, excluding 2D, to 2K, which related to the Deputy Minister's amendment 2 on preparing a published report on the effect of abolishing the defense of reasonable punishment. Amendments 2E to 2K outlined what they would expect to be within the report. Amendment 2C requested that the Welsh Government prepared a report on the awareness-raising campaign and laid it before the Assembly before section 1 commenced. It was important that they were fully apprised of the awareness-raising campaign's impact, which was elaborated under amendment 2D.

take a vote. All those in favour of amendment 2, please show. All those against. So, there voted four in favour, two against, and amendment 2 is agreed. That takes us on to group 3, which relates to the regulation-making powers in the Bill. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 3 in the name of the Deputy Minister. I move amendment 3 in the Deputy Minister's name and call on the Deputy Minister to speak to her amendments and the other amendments in this group.Julie Morgan AM: Thank you very much, Chair. Members will note that I've brought forward an amendment to provide certainty on the date of commencement of the core provision in the Bill, which is obviously to abolish the defence of reasonable punishment. And that is going to be debated under group 5. So, we're obviously debating that after we deal with these particular technical issues--these are technical issues here, basically. As a consequence of proposing to remove the power for a Welsh Minister to make an Order for commencement, the power to make transitory, transitional or saving provisions in connection with section 1 of the Bill coming into force would also be removed. So, I'm not seeking here to add any new powers to the Bill; amendment 3 will simply add this existing power back onto the face of the Bill where amendments 7 and 8 remove it, and amendment 6 will bring the power into force the day after Royal Assent. In fact, removing the power for the Welsh Ministers to commence the provision in section 1 by Order means the statutory instrument will actually do less than originally intended. These amendments are technical in nature and while I acknowledge that the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee raised the issue of what procedure should be applied, their report did not call for any change to no procedure being applied. The absence of an Assembly procedure does not mean that Ministers'decisions in relation to transitional powers cannot be scrutinised by the Assembly. Any concerns about the Welsh Ministers'proposals could be put to me in the Senedd. This was a point made to CLAC and, as I say, their final conclusion was that no procedure is the appropriate procedure for such a power. For those reasons, I encourage Members to reject amendment 3A from Suzy.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay, thank you. Suzy Davies.Suzy Davies AM: Thank you very much. Well perhaps, Deputy Minister, I can begin by saying that one person's technical issue is another person's essential part of the legislative procedure and a keen element in scrutiny. But I thank you for noting the Assembly's observations on the ministerial powers granted in this Bill--this time by CLAC, as you say. Moving this--and I'm glad actually that amendment 8, I think it was, has removed an Order provision and we're moving into an area where at least statutory instruments do feature here. I have to say that amendment 3A is something of a probing amendment, and I'll explain why now. Your amendment 3 seeks to give a familiar range of powers in connection with the coming into force of section 1, but it's actually in a substantive part of section 1 itself now--it's not a separate commencement power. And, actually, I've been listening to the rest of this debate, and thinking that, if you're going to be introducing an awareness campaign and a report, the chances are you're going to need some regulatory powers to introduce some of the aspects of both those policy areas, I think. And I'm wondering whether the--what is it--transitory, transitional and about developing methods to collect data, we will be putting forward some of the suggestions that you've made on those issues. So, I don't see any problem with that at all.Suzy Davies AM: Thank you.Julie Morgan AM: So, as I say, I can't support the amendments. I'm hopeful you may withdraw the two amendments--I think one of yours and it was one of Janet's, wasn't it--so that we could work together on those before the next stage. Because I am sympathetic to your views on these matters, and I think they do reflect some of the discussions in the committee as well. So, I'd be happy to work with you to bring forward the amendments at Stage 3. In line with the recommendations of the Finance Committee, further details of the costs associated with the post-implementation review will be provided in a revised regulatory impact assessment at Stage 3. So, I think at this point I would ask that Members reject the non-Government amendments and agree to my amendments 2 and 5, which will ultimately achieve the same policy aim without the need for unnecessary detail on the Bill, with the exception, obviously, of those two amendments, which I'm prepared to look at a way of moving forward on.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay. Thank you, Deputy Minister. Before disposing of amendment 2, we will deal with the amendments to that amendment. Janet, do you wish to move amendment 2CJanet Finch-Saunders AM: I move.Lynne Neagle AM: The question is that amendment 2C be agreed. Does any Member object [Objection. ] We have an objection, so I'll take a vote by show of hands. All those in favour of amendment 2C, please show. All those against. So, there voted two in favour, four against. Amendment 2C is lost. Suzy, do you wish to to me in the usual way. I will call the Deputy Minister to speak on each group. For the record, in accordance with the convention agreed by the Business Committee, as Chair I will move amendments in the name of the Deputy Minister. For expediency, I will assume that the Deputy Minister wishes me to move all of her amendments, and I will do so at the appropriate place in the marshalled list. Deputy Minister, if you do not want a particular amendment to be moved, please indicate to me at the relevant point in proceedings. In line with our usual practice, legal advisers to the committee and the Deputy Minister are not expected to provide advice on the record. If Members wish to seek legal advice during proceedings, please do so by passing a note to the legal adviser and, if necessary, we can adjourn. My intention is to try to dispose of all amendments during today's meeting. I will call a short break in proceedings at an appropriate time, if necessary. Okay, thank you. So, we will proceed, then, to group 1, which is the duty to promote public awareness. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 1 in the name of the Deputy Minister. I move amendment 1 in the Deputy Minister's name and call on the Deputy Minister to speak to her amendment and the other amendments in this group.Julie Morgan AM: Thank you very much, Chair. My amendments 1 and 4 will place a duty on Welsh Ministers to provide information and increase awareness about the change in the law to ensure that the public are made aware of how the law will change as a result of the defence of reasonable punishment being abolished and that physical punishment would be prohibited once the and amendment 4 will fall. Deputy Minister, do you wish to proceed to a vote on amendment 1Julie Morgan AM: I do.Lynne Neagle AM: Thank you. Okay. I move amendment 1 in the name of the Deputy Minister. The question is that amendment 1 be agreed. Does any Member object [Objection. ] Okay, we have an objection, so we'll take a vote by show of hands. All those in favour of amendment 1. All those against. So, there voted four in favour, two against, and amendment 1 is agreed. We'll move on now then to group 2, which relates to the duty to report on the effect of the legislation. The lead amendment in the group is amendment 2, in the name of the Deputy Minister. I move amendment 2 in the Deputy Minister's name, and call on the Deputy Minister to speak to her amendments, and the other amendments in this group.Julie Morgan AM: Thank you, Chair. The amendments in this group are to do with the post-implementation review of the Bill, and I believe there was also a committee recommendation to this end from your committee, so you strongly influenced this amendment. It's clear from Members'contributions to this group and recommendations by the committee at Stage 1 that they share my commitment to the importance of post-implementation review of the effect of the abolition of the defence of reasonable punishment. I've already provided assurance that I agree with the importance placed on such a review, both in the explanatory memorandum and during Stage 1 scrutiny. I also made a commitment to bring forward a Government amendment to put a duty to undertake a post-implementation review on the face of the Bill. I have done this with amendment 2. Amendment 5 sets out that this provision will come into

Summarize their discussions on the amendments in group 3 that relate to the regulation-making powers in the Bill.

The Deputy Minister proposed that she encouraged members to reject amendment 3A. She said she was not seeking to add any new powers to the Bill. Amendment 3 would simply add the existing power back onto the face of the Bill, where amendments 7 and 8 remove it, and amendment 6 would bring the power into force the day after Royal Assent. Then Suzy Davies said that amendment 3A was a holding position, and they would return this to the Deputy Minister in stage 3. Suzy thought this was an area where it might be valuable to discuss quite what kind of powers they were looking for, because Suzy Davies thought the Deputy Minister might need something that was beyond transitional, transitory and saving. At last, they took a vote for this and ended up with rejecting amendment 3A, and agreeing on amendment 3.