User1: Yep, cm 12 is android 5
User1: But in fact I have 3.0 kernel, not 3.4
User1: So does it means that I can't porting UT on my device with 3.0 kernel?
User2: https://redd.it/4hjrcr $250 bounty.
User3: Interesting. The bq 4.5 running Android has a few similar network issues to the bq 4.5 running Ubuntu. I wonder if they are hardware related rather than software?
User4: is there anyone using ubuntu phone?i want to know how many applications can be used on it
User4: weechat,qq,msn,irc,alipay
User5: User4 you can go to https://uappexplorer.com/ a lot will be webapps of some sort, chatter is irc client though
User4: davmor2 thanks
User1: Is there anyone who can help with porting?
User6: User1 there's a porting guide in topic, and the XDA forums might be usefull for existing projects aswell
User1: No, my porting process ended successfully
User1: But now the system doesn't want to start, because my kernel too old!
User6: User1 wich kernel is that
User1: 3.0.101
User1: And I have no newer version
User6: not sure whats recommended
User1: Yesterday I got answer that I should use 3.4.
User7: kyleN https://bugs.launchpad.net/canonical-scopes-project/+bug/1577767
User8: Ubuntu bug 1577767 in canonical-scopes-project "Scopes need general purpose location picker" [Undecided,New]
User7: hope that's usefull as a starting point
User9: is it possible to remove the phone and SMS app on the M10 tablet?
User10: SanderKSmit, they will vanish in the next OTA
User10: (there is a tracking bug somewhere)
User9: great! thanx for the reply ogra_
User9: how can i contribute to the development by eg submitting testresults and problems/wishes?
User1: Does it turns out that I can't run UT without kernel version 3.4?
User10: you need the apparmor patches, else you wont be able to execute any apps
User10: and you need a good bunch of config options enabled ... might be that some of them are not available with any kernels smaller than 3.4
User1: No-no-no, I know this. My kernel panics after initrd
User1: It says FATAL: kernel too old
User10: interesting, i wonder where that message comes from
User10: l(most likely not from any ubuntu bits)
User11: i am incredibly surprised that an android 5 tree would have a 3.0 kernel
User10: SanderKSmit, see the "Bug filing" link in the channel topic ... "whishes2 would just be bugs marked as wishlist
User1: No, not Android. It's just custom build that uses 3.0 kernel, because there is no other version
User1: Samsung officially KitKat build based on 3.0 too
User11: User1 cm12 is based on android 5, no?
User11: yes, kitkat is too old though
User1: Yep, CM 12 is based on it.
User11: err, wait
User11: now i'm confused
User1: Let me explain
User10: "now"
User10: ?
User12: is it possible to watch netflix on ubuntu phone?
User10: embrik, i doubt that ... since it needs DRM support from the browser ...
User11: well, or an app from netflix
User10: which would be a browser/webview with adeed DRM support :)
User11: well, a custom build of chrome probably
User12: User10 and dobey : ok, thanks, better watch films on ipad then :-(
User10: you could perhaps steam binary bits from chromeos :)
User12: User11 but chrome isn't avaliable is it?
User1: dobey, Samsung released 3.0 version on smdk 4412 as last version. No updates from 2012. This kernel is used by CyanogenMod images from 4.4 to 6.0.
User10: and glue something together yourself with duct tape
User11: User12 there isn't a general chrome build of arm, no
User1: CM works fine with it
User10: dobey, well, there is an arm OS built around it :)
User11: User10 yes, but you can't go to download an armhf.deb of chrome
User1: I recently looked at Ubuntu Touch tarball and noticed that some programs requires 3.2 kernel.
User10: no, but you can for example install an ubuntu on a chromebook and mangle the pepper plugin into your ubuntu chromium to have full flash support
 * ogra_ did that before ...
User11: User10 yes, but that doesn't help anyone use chrome on an ubuntu phone ;)
User11: and iirc, netflix isn't using flash
User10: indeed
User10: that was just an example
User1: My situation is very surprising. :D
User10: i assume there are hacks you could use to make it work ... by stealing chromeOS nbinary blobs
User11: User10 sure. but chrome is on android too and that's arm :)
User10: thats android :P
User10: bionic world ...
User10: doesnt help much on actual linux userspace
User11: User10 maybe. but not sure if oxide does enough to use them
User10: most likely not ...
User10: but hey, the oxide source is out there :)
User11: User10 and "buy a chromebook then try to find the pieces to copy off and then hope they would work" is not a good answer to "can i watch netflix on ubuntu phone" :)
User10: just saying ... it is surely not impossible ... but a LOT** of work
User1: Guys, maybe I need update kernel source tree or the game not worth the candles?
User11: well, and advising people to buy another $200+ device and steal proprietary binaries off it, is not nice, regardless of possibility :)
User11: User1 right, it sounds like your kernel is too old :)
User10: yeah, try getting 3.4 or newer
User11: not sure what requires at least 3.2 exactly
User10: udev perhaps ... or upstart
User11: but cm12 should be 3.10 anyway
User10: yeah
User1: No, upstart requires at least 2.6
User10: there might be options it uses from newer kernels
User1: Mount, for example
User1: It want 3.2
User10: mount ??
User1: Wants*
User1: Yep
User11: seccomp requires newer kernel for sure
User10: mount shouldnt care about the kernel version ...
User1: Justed watched
User1: Just*
User10: (perhaps some options in fstab ... but definitely not mount itself)
User1: for GNU/Linux 3.2.0
User1: STOP
User1: All programs that requires 3.2 kernel are available from boot.img!
User1: What a hell?
User6: User1 calm down please
User1: Sorry
User6: User1 they trying to help you here
User1: Why I can't replace tarball programms with progtamms from boot initramfs?
User11: like ogra_ said, i doubt mount itself requires 3.2, but some options might
User1: Interesting that mount from initramfs works fine
User1: What should be after touch script execution?
User10: yeah, rather a filesystem than a mount thing
User10: after the touch script assembled the rootfs with all its different mount layers the initrd calls run-init from klibc and switches to the rootfs
User1: Where is run-init located?
User1: Already found
User1: Err, run-init is a link to klibc, right?
User10: it is a binary
User1: Oh, really, I misunderstood
User1: In init script after exec run-init write panic "Could not execute run-init." Is it normal?
User10: well, that means that run-init couldnt be executed for some reason
User10: (most oftenn because you have a broken /dev/console in your kernel ... )
User1: No, you don't understand me. It writes in init script
User1: The last string
User1: By the way i have no /dev/console in my kernel
User10: fix that then, thats most likely the reason for your panic
User1: Err, previous build form another person has no it too
User1: And it works
User10: i doubt that
User10: run.init will not work if there isnt a proper console device
User1: Just rewatched
User10: it has to have some kind of console ..
User1: It's build has no /dev/console
User4: anyone use ubuntu phone now?
User1: Ohh, I think I will never be able to build UT successfully. :((
User10: CheeryLee, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/ContainerArchitecture see the first paragraph .. there are links to hacks i used to get a console on a galaxy S2
User13: oSoMoN I have on xenial the webbrowser-app as my main browser; if I use the webapp-container for anything else it opens as a tab in the main browser window. If I open a container instance first, opening the webbrowser app opens a new tab in the container instance. Is this known
User13: I asked a week ago, but I guess it got lost in the pool of text :-)
User10: oSoMoN, that sounds like a really bad security bug
User14: sergiusens, huh, thatâs unexpected indeed, would you mind filing a bug? Iâll look into it right away
User14: and yeah, that sounds like a bad one
User13: oSoMoN sure
 * sergiusens opens the onair video somewhere else
User1: So, /dev/console located in tarball, not in boot image
User14: sergiusens, how do you invoke the webapp container when it results in opening a new browser tab?
User13: oSoMoN like http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ogra/+junk/slack-webapp/files
User10: CheeryLee, i'm not talking about whats in /dev but what your kernel does
User14: sergiusens, I can reproduce the issue here, and I think I know whatâs going on, bug report welcome anyway, to track the issue
User13: oSoMoN great, I will log it without a video then :-)
User13: oSoMoN https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/webbrowser-app/+bug/1577806
User8: Ubuntu bug 1577806 in webbrowser-app (Ubuntu) "webbrowser app and webcontainer open under the same instance" [Undecided,New]
User14: thanks
User13: mhall119 that is the question I asked that you asked me to explain more ^
User1: It's very intersting. Saucy has mount that requires 2.6 kernel
User15: User13 ?
User10: the bug :)
User13: mhall119 I asked you about webcontainer and webbrowser app instances a week ago or so ;-)
User15: if you say so
User5: User15 don't act like you've been alseep since then and have no idea what he is on about
User16: My phone has been pretending to start up for the past ten minutes and now I am sad
User16: It shows the âubuntuâ logo and moving dots and never gets beyond that. Any ideas?
User10: weas there an update you installed ?
User10: (it might be re-creating apparmor profiles ... that can take 10-20min depending on the amount of apps you have installed)
User1: It maybe stupid question, but if I change kernel version in Makefile... does the kernel run?
User11: User16 either it's just taking a while after applying a full update and regenerating the apparmor profiles and such, or something keeps crashing and won't let it boot
User10: dobey, well, then it would force-reboot itself ...
User10: not just hang
User11: User10 not necessarily
User11: User10 the force-reboot stuff is time based; if the crashes happen slowly enough to make the count not fulfill the requirement, the phone won't reboot
User11: User10 apparmor constantly being run can cause the crashes to happen more slowly
User16: ogra_, I didnât install an update. Does that rule out apparmor profiles?
User10: kind of, yeah
User16: ogra_, User11 The only other clue is that at random intervals (~5 seconds, ~8s, ~27s, ~13s, ~62sâ¦) the screen flashes black momentarily
User10: mpt, looks like Mir cant start then
User16: aha
User16: Same after a force-restart â¦ guess Iâll have to reflash it
User10: well, grab john-mcaleely top tell you want logs he needs first :)
User10: john-mcaleely, mpt is left with a non-booting phone ... seems Mir tries to start but fails in a loop
User10: (i thought you might want him to grab some logs before re-flashing ... prehaps)
User16: john-mcaleely, I have never 0:-)
User10: sucha cute little halo :)
User16: john-mcaleely, happy to. Where may I find instructions understandable by a lowly designer?
User16: (e.g. which files)
User16: john-mcaleely, is it possible for âphablet-shellâ to run when Mir hasnât started?
User16: It says â* daemon started successfully *â but never gives me a prompt
 * mpt smells a catch-22
User16: * daemon started successfully *
User16: error: device not found
User16: ok
User16: Unable to open MTP device '[usb:001,003]'
User11: probably better to reboot to recovery and then grab logs from there over adb
User11: yes
User5: john-mcaleely, User16 adb won't work you would need to drop into fastboot mode and flash recovery with adb
User11: but a continually crashing unity8 kills i/o, so it's basically impossible to shell into
User17: User10 you keep saying 10-20 minutes. It isn't that long any more :) It should be <5 with a lot of apps installed (see previous email thread and bug report)
User11: especially if developer mode wasn't enabled and the phone isn't required to allow adb without screen unlock
User5: john-mcaleely: because of the new way that ubuntu is enabling adb you need to be on the system first to enable adb to be able to access the system :(
User11: plus, if it's a device where the key hasn't been accepted, you won't get the notification to accept the key :)
User16: john-mcaleely, I took the first option :-)
User18: john-mcaleely it was not issue with mir, mir was running fine
User18: john-mcaleely there was pending OTA, which sorted boot issue
User18: john-mcaleely it was stack in Ubuntu boot anim
User18: john-mcaleely yep
User10: I wonder why it blnked then
User10: jdstrand, indeed, my bad... that timing is stuck in my head
User19: User10 I'm trying to get ubuntu touch to recognize an arduino. First thing I see is that lsusb doesn't show anything when I connect the device. And probably, ftdi kernel module is not avaible. Suggestions?
User10: Not really.... apart fem... Build that module and file a bug
User10: *from
User11: User19 usb-serial adapter drivers are indeed not built in the kernel
User19: User11 :(
User11: User19 indeed. i have need for ftdi and keyspan; but alas, no drivers
User10: at least for the M10 we should enable a good bunch of additional modules
User11: why only for the m10?
User11: can we build modules that aren't in the boot.img somehow?
User10: Because it is more a 1x1 laptop replacement than the phones
User10: Why not
User10: the source is there, you should always be able to insmod them
User11: i don't know. i'm not an android-in-a-container expert
User11: that's why i'm asking :)
User10: has nothing to do with containers
User10: Ubuntu runs natively on the kernel
User11: and afaik, the boot.img has to be limited to a size
User11: User10 right, but the kernel isn't built in the archive
User11: User10 because yay proprietary kernel stuffs
User10: if you have a .ko you should be able to just insmod... If the symbols match
User20: enabling loadable module support would at least allow it
User10: And a ko can just be built from the kernel source
User11: so we'd need to build the modules, stick them in i guess the device tarball, and then unpack those into the root fs?
User10: greyback, it should be enabld
User10: iirc ufw requires even that we have  modules
User20: User10 I've not checked M10. All our phone kernels have it disabled
User10: what ?!?!?!
User10: thats a serious bug then
User17: /usr/share/ufw/check-requirements tells you what is missing for it to work
User10: dobey, nah, you can just insmod from ./
User20: I hit that when trying to enable kernel & gpu profiling tooling
User17: and it is a serious bug if we don't have netfilter configured for the kernel
User11: User10 i presume we want udev modprobe magic to work though, no?
User10: jdstrand, we might... but seemingly not as modules
User17: oh, some phone kernels have module loading disabled
User17: but so long as netfilter is configured, that is ok
User10: jdstrand, seems all of them... Which is really bad
User20: User10 I might be wrong about _all_
User10: I wonder who decided that
User10: it took us weeks to get the infrastructure for modules right in the device tarball
User10: odd that this isn't used
User10: but yeah, I don't see the bind mount in /lib/modules that should be there
User11: anyway, break time; might as well use it for a break :)
User10: so there is no way to make attached usb devices work ever
User10: :((((
User11: User10 my mp3 player works fine over otg :)
User10: Because it dosnt use a module
User11: some devices work, most don't
User10: yeah
User10: really bad
User19: The usb keyboard works
User11: yeah it's not nice
User5: User11 because it uses mtp I guess
User10: especially since it was designed differently
User11: User5 no. it's just a disk
User11: anyway, lunch break :)
User10: so just usb-storage
User11: yeah
User20: I doubt there's much real consistency between the kernel configs of the devices we ship tbh
User10: well, but there is infrastructure to support modules... We should really use it
User20: +1
User10: we desigbed it mwith the guy who wants to load home built extra modules in mind back then
User10: like android lets you load modules at the bare minimum via insmod with a path
User19: User10 Would be possible to ship modules on a click app?
User19: I guess it would, but won't have the permissions to make the kernel load it
User10: Yeah
User10: you could ship it but not load
User21: does the browser use a different useragent on the m10/tablet vs the phones?
User22: can't get plex to play video on the m10. it detects the session as Safari so I'm thinking its using some safari-ism that oxide doesn't like
User22: but there is a webapp in the store so it ostensibly works on other devices
User23: User22 The browser used in click is qt webkit, since webkit is also used in safari it is assumed that it must be a safari browser
User11: User23 it is not qt webkit
User11: it's oxide, which is based on chromium content api
User23: ok, I stand corrected
User24: we specify the UA string and it is different on tablet kurros
User22: is the list of quirk UAs in an editable file?
User24: kurros, let me look its in a js file somewhere
User11: User22 you can override it in a webapp
User11: User22 so if there is a webapp in the store, it might be doing that
User22: yeah the app doesn't work either. good to know, though. i'll ping the guy and see if he can add a tablet UA override.
User22: he's got a bunch of unfair 1 star reviews now
User24: yeah thats the best way
User25: mhall119 what is band aids for ubuntu on touch devices?
User11: User25 similar to papercuts
User11: User25 join the session :)
User25: the Ubuntu GNOME one is going on AT<
User25: ATM
User25: waiting for it dobey
User11: oh
User25: would love for somemore work on tablet side :)
 * ahoneybun has N7
User11: User25 is for general software issues, not device-spcific things though :)
User25: yea but helpful for us all
User26: Anyone know if Canonical is aware of the disaster going on with the sale of Meizu Pro 5 Ubuntu Edition?
User26: The announcement in the last ubuntu insights does not look like it..
User27: User26 what do you mean?
User22: about JD only selling the gold version, maybe
User26: Availability only in Gold... yep
User26: and their.. very.. high quality support..
User26: I mean.. the announcements are so positive and all -> then the disappointment when I look at the Q&A section
User26: Also.. why gold.. Is that an official decision, or just JD doing weird stuff? (I'd say selling the black version probably reaches more customers...)
User22: probably just JD. dunno why they are the only non-china distributor this time around
User22: meizu probably doesn't care
User26: as far as i understood it, the meizu pro 5 ubuntu is *exclusively* available from JD
User26: and no, they don't care..
User22: outside of china, yes
User26: I already tried kimberly54@example.com
User26: no reply from them...
User26: almost a week and not even a "we received your message"
User22: they did a weird arrangement with the MX4 for europe, i guess it wasn't worth continuing that
User22: i think the MX4 was the first time they sold anything outside of china
User26: well all the "regular" current models are, as far as I can tell, available on amazon (.de)
User26: Not all available yet, but still..
User26: As stated above.. Does Canonical know? (or even care?) This hits the image of ubuntu quite a bit if I were to guess..
User22: i think its out of their hands, unfortunately
User26: I'll try to reach out to them.. If you want to follow a long / spread the word [or just laugh at the outcome ;)] feel free: https://twitter.com/founderio_dhx/status/727596128066260992
User26: might be, but they still may care.. or try to prevent that in the future
User22: maybe time for a flight to shanghai? :)
User26: uhm.. sure.. you free on the weekend? ;)
User22: hopefully other OEM/ODMs will take note
User10: The gold is a choice from meizu.... Canonical has no influence on that
User22: i'd be happy for any official ubuntu phone that worked in the US at this point
User28: "invest in gold" they said :)
User10: :)
User26: doesn't it? "officially" it is "world wide" with "free shipping" aaaand advertised in black..
User26: heh, yah..
User22: yeah i think the problem is that canonical's blog posts and such have shown the black model
User26: still, I need a new phone.. and since I am on this channel you probably know which system I'd like on that piece of tech..
User26: and yes, would it be an agreed choice made between Meizu AND Canonical, my sentiments would be better I guess...
User10: Buy a gold one and get it painted  ;)
User11: black spray paint: $3.99
User22: hehe
User26: you forget... new display without paint: $299 ;)
User22: BeDazzle it
 * ogra_ is sure there must be professional offers to get a good paint job for a phone
User11: newspapers and paint are cheap. it's called masking :)
User26: to be honest, the color is probably the least problem.. I just fear that this whole affair -> and the obviously "top notch" customer support "Thank you for your support for JD!" -> will cast a bad light on something that is already very dim lit (i.e. not known to many people).. And if ubuntu-touch is discontinued due to that bad light... back to Android? iOS? the dark side?
User10: Ubuntu on phones wont be discontinued
User26: a) nobody can guarantee that
User26: but b) I ceartainly hope so
User11: a) it's open source
User10: It is just another formbfactor of the xesktop code
User11: b) so it will only be "discontinued" if nobody ever builds any images for phones :)
User10: desktop
User26: true..
User26: agh.. frustrating
User10: there will definitely be images for a long time still ...
User10: it isnt the userbase that counts ... else we would have stopped doing desktop long ago :)
User26: since we are already on this topic.. I've had a bit of a look around.. the info I found seems to indicate that installing ubuntu on - let's just say a nexus - is more like a dev-preview? or is that actually a full-fledged usable version now? (I don't care about fancy stuff.. Phone, wifi, contacts wokr as far as I have seen.. But what are the exact drawbacks?)
 * founderio is considering just buying a compatible device with good specs
User11: drawbacks?
User10: fully usable ... all devices use the exactly same rootfs
User11: i've been using ubuntu on a nexus 5 as my phone for over 2 years
User26: the page I read told something about "oem specific features"
User10: well, ports usually have limitations in HW support
User26: yeah, but since I want to buy a new phone anyways -> I'll just pick one with the best mix of support & features ;)
User10: the N4 as a fully supported device doesnt ... the N5 has its (small) share of issues
 * ogra_ would take a MX5pro then
User10: you wont find any petter HW ... with better support
User10: *better
User11: would be nice to have a retail device that was snapdragon though
User10: the MX5 is
User26: wait.. MX5 Pro or Pro 5? (there is both??)
User10: THE ONE YOU CAN BUY WITH UBUNTU :p
User10: EEK
User11: User10 eh?
User29: anybody knows a way to have flash install in ubuntu touch?
User30: Man, the N4 was something really great. The lack of LTE got me to move away from it, but in many ways I miss it
 * ogra_ whacks his caps key
User11: User29 adobe flash? no
User10: User11 eh ? ?
User29: bummer ;(
 * founderio is confused
User29: any other options?
User11: don't use flash?
User11: User10 the mx5 is what?
User26: User29 configure your browser to pretend to be an iPad -> *ding* -> HTML5 Videos
User29: Im trying to use spotify web, I cannt becuse of flash, what can I use instead?
User10: User11 oh, sorry, it is exynos ... i thought it was snapdragon
User11: User10 that's samsung right?
User10: yep
User10: same as the S7 i think
User29: User26 thanks!!
User26: User29 just an idea.. might not work!
User10: usually does :)
User26: it does work with various news sites
User11: isn't there a spotify webapp in the store?
User10: many webapps use that trick too :)
User26: hhehe
User29: yeah but you need to have the upgrade version
User11: or there was some other qml app that did spotify i think
User31: User11 should i release the battery fix, or release the 5.1 in about a week (much better battery then 4.4)
User10: but it indeed depends on teh site ... and how hardcore safari teh features are they use
User11: User31 yes to both? ;)
User10: lol
User10: yeah, stop slacking ... do both :P
User11: lol, i wonder what happened to my phone
User11: obviously hasn't been an update in a few days, but for some reason my battery isn't almost dead today
User11: still at ~77% after 8 hrs off the charger
User10: buy a new one, this is broken
User31: User11 I removed some part in android that had a wakelock + took battery
User11: User31 i guess you got 5.1 booted on a n5?
User31: that was about a week ago
User11: User31 well, my phone has still been pretty bad with battery, so either that wasn't in an update or you're asking about releasing a different battery fix :)
User31: User11 yeah 5.1 it's running fine, but I have to test it more before release it on the server, I don't want to break devices or break some parts that they had before 5.1
User31: User11 no, the new battery fix is a new "updated" kernel
User11: User31 does 5.1 provide some better clues to bluetooth btw?
User31: yes :)
User11: yay!
User11: User31 yeah, if you have an updated kernel that fixes battery for 4.4, pushing it now would be good, and 5.1 in a week or so would be fine
 * founderio just ordered Meizu PRO5SB32GB
User31: sure, i can do that, but I need to add apparmor patch to the new kernel first
User26: Now how to skip forward to Monday...
User31: User26 yey \o/
User11: User31 ok. thanks for all the work on it :)
User31: User26 download, libtimetravel and run that with skiptime.snap
User31: User11 np :)
User11: time is an illusion
User11: lunch time doubly so
User26: User31 aww dammit..
User26: I'm still on 15.10 :(
User10: User26 welcome to the club :)
User26: tx
User31: :P ogra_  has magic power, so he can probably teleport the device to you :) hehe :P
User10: (of meizu owners, not of 15.10 users)
User26: guessed as much ;)
User10: User31 you wish ... then i would have mine already
User26: about time.. that iOS began bugging me to hell
 * ogra_ ia also waiting
User10: *is
User31: :)
User10: and flying to a snappy sprint on sunday ... i really hope i get it before
User26: I even took the 32G version.. 64G was not available yet :D
User10: i doubt there will be any other offers then this one
User26: the 64G IS listed on amazon.de
User31: oneplus one :) hint hint
User10: at least this time around ... probably if meizu does some kind of re-fresh
User26: just "not available yet"
User10: User31 once you have all HW working ;)
User26: but tbh -> my playlist isn't THAT big, so that should work ;)
User26: more excited about the OS than about the free space
User10: SD cards are cheap
User31: soon soon ogra_  :) 5.1 brings some fixes, just camera and bt left
User26: also true -> I keep forgetting that.. iOS torture victim here...
User31: I haven't tried iOS,  it seems to be too locked down for me
 * ogra_ goes afk to do some non work evening stuff :)
User31: User26 spotify is coming to the music app, so you stream you playlist (if it was music that you was talking about) then you can save some space
User26: yes, was talking about music.. but I don't like streaming -> too much hassly in my opinion..
User26: I just want a music player that plays the music, can sync with ubuntu (rsync, duh.. ;) ) and does not bother me with Apple Music Advertisement EVERY GODDAMN TIME
User26: so the issue is not really that iOS is too locked down, but rather that I am being treated like an idiot..
User31: User26 yeah, btw there is no advert on spotify (paid version). but how does iOS do that? is it like, "too simple"?
User26: the streaming stuff is just my personal preference, I guess.. but thanks for the info.
User26: iOS does that my assuming that the Apple Solution is the solution for every user
User26: integration for third party apps is not good sometimes (or even impossible for some specific parts)
User26: and the default apps do stuff a bit weird sometimes
User31: oh, yeah I have heard that you need a mac to recovery it
User26: nah, iTunes is enough
User26: so Mac or Windows
User31: oh, ok then.
User26: for the regular user that may be enough, but for example the intrgration for caldav & carddav sync is a bit wobbly at times in the default apps
User31: can you remove the default apps? that is something that is a bit annoying on android sometimes, you need root to remove the "bloatware"
User26: nope
User26: every iOS user has this folder called "Junk" on their home screen
User26: with stuff like health, friends, stock info, etc..
User26: and -> all installed apps are on the home screen, period. (several pages & folders though)
User31: oh, there is no app list like android has right? is't just on the home screen
User26: yes
User26: also 1 app == 1 icon
User26: although there seem to be plugins like adblockers since iOS 9, now.. never looked into it
User31: what happens if you remove the icon (if it works)
User32: you cant
User32: there's a dozen or so you cannot remove
User32: technically you can't remove the default apps on ubuntu either
User32: you can remove the icon, but the partition is RO so the app stays
User32: just hidden
User26: better than iOS in at least 1 point then ;)
User26: I can live with hidden
User31: you "can" removed them if you make the system rw, but as i understand you cannot set iOS in rw mode
User26: and if I miss integration / cooperation between apps there is a good chance I could go ahead and implement it myself I guess...
User26: well you can set it to rw...
User26: that is called jailbreaking
User26: and very much agains what the fruit company thinks "legal"
User31: yeah like root on android, but on ubuntu it's just one command
User26: well.. wouldn't be ubuntu if it weren't
User26: I'll be off for today. 10 minutes to Wednesday here ;)
User26: Good conversation & thanks to all for the help!
User31: same timezone as me then :) thanks for your answer about iOS :)
User26: anytime.
User26: I guess I'll poke my head in here sometime.. see you around
User31: see ya :)
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