User1: doko, http://www.teutonici.com/Alinux/OOo_2.0.4-ka-GE.gsi   Voila!
User1: it's pure gsi ;)
User2: pure, uncut, powdered gsi :)
User3: doko, if some problems just ping me.
User4: eek! console-setup questions!
User5: umm.. anybody uses OpenOffice from Edgy? it seems that when you try to save the program crashes
User5: same when opening documents using File>Open
User6: dbus lib issue, I think there'a a bug filed about it
User5: User6 that saves me from reporting this. thanks!
User6: bug 58508
User7: Malone bug 58508 in openoffice.org "cant save under edgy" [Untriaged,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/58508
User6: looks like that one
User5: ok. reading...
User5: the fun thing is that you can quit OOo
User5: it keeps coming back!
User8: hmm, not even triaged...
User9: User31 I would like to point you to bug 58500
User7: Malone bug 58500 in ubiquity "The resize operation is impossible" [Medium,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/58500
User10: Anyone around to bump that OOo up to High/Critical? It got me on Friday...
User11: So uh. LaunchPad thinks my key has expired. Which, is true. It has an old key. I've increased the date.
User11: How do I make LP refresh it?
User11: Old key info, that is. Same key.
User10: Just reupload it to the server.
User10: (keyserver.ubuntu.com)
User11: Ahh that's a keyserver.
User11: Was trying to use hte web interface
User12: User17 are the xen changes you just uploaded significant?
User13: I just made a minimal edgy install, I love it. it boots and shutdowns much faster, and everything looks cleaner
User13: now I can make ubuntu windows-like by rebooting every 5 min, I'll do it just for fun
User4: http://lists.linux.org.au/archives/lca-announce/2006-September/msg00000.html
User6: User4 is that a gentle hint for us?
User4: User6 s/gentle hint/vicious kick in the behind/
User10: It can be a rough hint if you want :P
User10: Yeah, what jdub said.
User4: though i believe current ubuntu innovations have already been covered in proposals
User4: to date
User4: (scott on upstart)
User14: User4 do you think my proposal needs more words/rewording?
User4: User14 haven't read it
User15: so hmm.
User15: has anyone considered integration of FUSE into HAL to get things like ntfs-3g and sshfs easy to set up
User15: (no I have no idea how the heck this is supposed to work, there are security considerations though I think the proper way to handle it is to make sure only what the user can get to some other way can be mounted via fuse-- which is normal, as long as the fuse file system module is run as the user)
User2: User15 I think that's on the big Linux utopian todo list... next to good tasting diet soda, open source ATI and nvidia drivers....
User2: swap management up to par with freebsd...
User16: Goddamned ioapic suspend/resume code
User17: User12 yes, they are
User12: User17 how? (wnat to add something about them to UWN)
User15: User2  the swap management thing sounds easy.
User17: User12 added a bunch of 3rd party drivers, new snapshot, some bug fixes
User2: User15 heh, it's not as bad as I make it sound... linux already pretty good at it
User12: User17 the third party drivers appear to be mostly networking ones
User17: ie: ndiswrapper, bcm43xx, etc
User2: User15 just my experience on ram-limited old hardware is that freebsd still does it better
User17: User12 true..
User12: User17 ok, just wondering
User15: User2  Get Nitan to get his patches into mainline when they wrok
User2: :)
User17: User12 no problems, they werent there before though :)
User12: User17 no, I wanted to clarify. Adding somethign to UWN now
User15: User2  that'll make ram-limited twice as efficient and ample ram basically no faster/slower at all :)
User17: ok..ill probably blog something about it later as well
User15: User2  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CompressedMemory
User2: yeah, the whole compressed memory thing sounds very nice
User16: Hngh stabby stabby
User2: hope to see it in action soon
User16: This code is approximately unreadable
User12: User17 cool
User12: User17 ping me with the blog url
User18: mjg59, try running rot13 on it
User15: User2  the nice thing is it runs UNDER the swap cache
User15: User2  swap cache caches recent swap-in/swap-out and thus prevents write-back of non-dirty pages to swap when being swapped back out (they're on disk already, if they're not dirty there's no reason to write) and prevents read-back of recently swapped pages (because they're kept in memory until we really need them gone)
User15: User2  with compression this translates to avoiding compressing/decompressing pages instead of avoiding swapping pages; so compressed memory can't really make the problem of swapping any worse, which is a nice magic touch.
* bluefoxicy coughs a bit and gets back to something else
User19: Howdy
User17: User12 no problem
User20: does anyone know the commandline to regenerate the debian menu system like debian packages do after they are installed?
User20: is*
User20: hmm maybe not
User20: it seems no one know not even the people who created debian
User20: knows8
User20: *
User20: well if anyone here knows
User20: just ping me
User21: User20 This isn't the channel for support, or debian support, but the command you're looking for is update-menus
User20: User21 tried it it does not work
User20: User21 also i doubt anyone in #ubuntu whould know i have asked before
User21: Are you doing this is debian, or ubuntu, first of all?
User20: ubuntu
User20: and not on gnome either
User12: User6 where woudl I find the final report for your SoC stuff?
User16: Menus in gnome are not generated using the Debian menu system
User16: And this is still the wrong place to ask
User21: AFAIK, menu entries are handled differently on Ubuntu, using the newer menu editor
User20: User16 20:29 < administrator> and not on gnome either
User22: that's the correct command. If it "doesn't work", perhaps you need to log out and back in or otherwise tell whatever app providing the menus to reread its conffile(s) [sighup?]
User6: User12 I'll get back to you on that, I'm at work at the moment
User12: User6 sure, thanks
User17: meh...wife calling ttyl
User23: Can I close a bug in lp if I am not the maintainer? Some glaring ones that I just commented on like this which I am trying to triage: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/31925
User7: Malone bug 31925 in compiz "Please package new upstream version" [Wishlist,Unconfirmed]
User24: User23 if it's fixed, yes
User23: Thanks, they told me how in #launchpad
User25: morning
User26: hi
User27: hi
User28: good morning
User29: hey dholbach
User28: hey pygi
User30: Good morning
User24: hey dholbach, pygi, pitti!
User30: User24 Good morning Mrs. KDE!
User24: User30 mrs?  who'd i marry? :P
User30: User24 KDE of course :)
User24: User30 ah right
User30: 'until the CVS server breakage parts you'
User24: lol
User31: User4 it shouldn't ask questions, so please file a bug with all your details (/etc/X11/xorg.conf, 'echo GET debian-installer/keymap | debconf-communicate', /etc/default/console-setup)
User32: User33 mind taking a look at https://launchpad.net/bugs/49977 ?  It looks more like an apt bug than anything else.
User7: Malone bug 49977 in linux-restricted-modules-2.6.15 "After kernel upgrade to 2.6.15-25 X server cannot find nvidia module " [Untriaged,Confirmed]  
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-devel.log
User33: User32 looking at it now and trying to reproduce it on my dapper box
User34: why mp3,divx  and rar are not supported by default?
User10: vehbi, please see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RestrictedFormats.
User10: (and try #ubuntu, here isn't the right place to asK)
User34: I know it , I am asking this question because some distrubitions support this out of box, and people think that they are better
User10: vehbi, those formats are patented, so have questionable legal connotations.
User13: some distrib doesn't even provide it with official repo
User32: User34 we can't, for legal reasons.  This has been debated to death on the mailing lists and I think there's a discussion on that page too.
User34: how can other distrubitons can add them?
User32: User34 they're probably willing to take the legal risk.  We aren't.
User31: we believe that those "some distributions" are taking a legal risk, and we'd rather Mark's money went towards employing developers than fighting lawsuits
User31: more to the point, so would Mark, in this case ...
User31: (we discussed this stuff extensively back in the beginning)
User34: ohh, I got it but as I said people think -who knows linux a bit or nothing-other distrubtions are good:(
User31: I'm afraid our orbital mind control lasers are not yet operational
User32: User34 well, there's nothing we can do about that, really.
User34: Can you make a package that installs all this stuff easily for home users?
User34: one big package
User32: no
User34: ok:)
User32: sorry.  We'd like to make MP3s and DVDs and flash and all that work out of the box, but there are legal reasons why we can't.
User32: it's not that we're evil or anything like that.  We just can't.
User10: EasyUbuntu is for this sort of thing.
User35: User32 flash as in Macromedia Flash or as in memory cards? :)
User32: User35 the former.
User34: User10yes thats what I try to say
User10: Treenaks, Adobe Flash nowadays :P
User35: User10 same thing, same thing  ;)
User31: User34 https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/easy-codec-installation outlines ways to improve the user experience for multimedia codecs; https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/common-customizations goes through the rest of EasyUbuntu et al and tries to figure out what we can incorporate. Unfortunately neither made the Edgy feature freeze, but they'll stay on the list for the future.
User4: User31 heard of the desktop installer hanging after clicking next on the keyboard page?
User4: bork, it's not doing it now
User4: the installer formatted the windows partition as ext3 earlier
User33: User32 I commented on the bug (I don't think its a apt bug, more a problem with the users install)
User4: i'm going through it again because it had some python spew last time, and i want to make sure i did / didn't tell it to ext3ise windows
User32: User33 well, one could argue that apt should try to install as few extra packages as possible.
User33: User32 right, that would be a valid claim. feel free to retitle/reassign it to apt with a wishlist think to imporive the resolver
User33: User32 OTOH if just no linux-restricted-modules package is installed
User31: User4 I'd much rather you filed bugs about this sort of thing
User31: I don't mind getting duplicates
User33: User32 and the user wants nvidia-glx, apt has the choice between install l-s-r-2.6.15-23 or l-s-r-2.6.15-26. in both cases just one additional package
User4: User31 determining if it's a bug or not first :-)
User31: User4 and shit, you went through it again? did you save the logs from the first time?
User4: User31 pretty soon after the installer horked, the machine froze
User31: User4 at what stage did it freeze?
User4: the installer tb window was up, i left it for a while, and it was frozen (blank screen, too) after that
User4: so no evidence of connection
User31: I mean how far had it got
User31: the traceback window can appear at any time, so that says nothing
User32: User33 well, if the -23 kernel isn't installed, it shouldn't try to install that one.
User4: oh
User4: back to the larger window after the small install progress window had finished
User32: User33 unsure what would be a good heuristic to break cases where it can install either of two packages -- almost sounds like it should handle kernel packages specially
User33: User32 right, but if -23 is installed than this heuristic won't work
User31: User4 it doesn't go back to the larger window normally
User31: you mean to the "installation complete" dialog?
User33: User32 *nod*
User4: User31 yeah
User31: User4 in that case, it had almost certainly saved the logs to the installed system already
User31: User4 but by reinstalling before talking to me, you've probably erased the evidence :(
User36: User37 ping?
User30: User36 hi
User36: hi pitti :)
User30: User36 please tell me how apport 0.20 works with mono
User31: User4 also, we recently swapped out the keyboard backend, so hangs are quite possible, but I'd need the logs
User36: User30 ok :)
User32: User30 do you have an eta for when we're able to get at the debugging symbols?
User30: User32 I hope this or next week, depends on infinity's work load
User37: User36 I'm away, please send email
User36: User37 ok
User31: mbiebl: ok, fixed your console-setup issue in 1.7ubuntu8
User31: mbiebl: the stty error is something else; I don't know what
User10: Hm.
User10: With the latest upstart/usplash update, I've got my tty1 back..
User10: But mknod spews a `File exists' error for tty[1-8]  on tty1.
User31: yeah, likewise, I think it's harmless but
User31: oh, it'll be in usplash
User31: I was about to upload that anyway for powerpc - I can easily fix that
User10: Why would usplash be doing that?
User31: it needs to create the ttys so it can switch to them
User31: usplash (0.4-11) edgy; urgency=low
User31: * Take over responsibility for ensuring that the tty device nodes
User31: exist in time for usplash
User31: -- Matthew Garrett <edwardortiz@example.org>  Mon,  7 Aug 2006 21:02:09 +0100
User31: in fact it was done earlier, usplash 0.1-17
User31: * initramfs/scripts/init-top/usplash:
User31: - mknod tty0-tty8, tty8 is the terminal that usplash -c switches to
User10: Ah.
User10: How will you fix that?
User10: Redirect their output?
User10: Or eliminate them?
User31: -                mknod /dev/tty$i c 4 $i
User31: +                [ -e /dev/tty$i ]  || mknod /dev/tty$i c 4 $i
User13: sounds good :)
User31: possibly [ -c ]  actually
User31: if it's not a character device, you at least want the error
User10: I'd say so.
User10: :)
* Fujitsu likes the look of the first changelog entry of apport 0.20.
User31: init-top/framebuffer creates those devices too; maybe that should be eliminated per Matthew's changelog entry
User31: but shrug, not urgent
User13: is that where the "extended states" come from : "added support for aptitude like auto-install tracking" ?
User32: User33 are you aware that update-manager fails to start ATM?
User32: User33 ImportError: No module named dbus_bindings
User13: where does apt development happen?
User32: actually, that's a bug in dbus.py
User30: User38 can you please test the current edgy daily langpacks? we plan another update today
User38: User30 from where?
User29: xav, come to #synaptic, ask there =)
User30: User38 deb http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/langpacks/daily/edgy/ ./  (usual location)
User33: User13 yes
User13: User29 but I also would like to know how debian and ubuntu deal with upstream, if any
User29: xav, mvo is upstream and he's here :) come to #synaptic pls :)
User30: User38 oh, please postpone that, we need to wait for today's dailies (in the afternoon)
User32: User36 dude, your dbus-python upload broke stuff; it doesn't clean up byte-compiled files properly.
User36: User32 yep, already noticed it although it worked fine here :/ seems to be a bug in pycentral, i'll look into it soon
User36: User32 bug #59775
User7: Malone bug 59775 in dbus-python "dbus-python is broken" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/59775
User32: User36 thanks.
User4: HOLY CRAP
User4: the new console font makes me feel like i'm using AIX
User39: where is gsmitty?
User10: Which font, jdub?
User35: User39 gsmitty?! for _gnome_?
User35: User10 terminus
User39: User35 you know you want it.
User31: it's designed to reduce eye fatigue
User31: (terminus)
User31: I might change the default though, depending on script coverage
User31: yeah, there doesn't seem to be anything that Terminus supports that Fixed doesn't
User31: or VGA16
User31: but jdub whining doesn't really count :P
User40: was that a whine ?
User35: I think it was a compliment :P
User32: User40 comparing Ubuntu to AIX?  Yes.
User32: User31 I got console-setup questions too now
User31: User32 can you get me details?
User32: User31 sure, what do you want?
User31: User32 /etc/X11/xorg.conf, debian-installer/keymap, /etc/default/console-setup
User31: and if you can, a DEBCONF_DEBUG=developer trace
User32: in a bug or just here?
User31: a bug would be good
User4: hooray for new laptop netcat!
User4: User31 i quite like it, but it does remind me of AIX. all it needs is green.
User39: and then synaptic needs a smitty theme
User31: User4 heh. can probably be arranged ;-)
User32: User31 https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/console-setup/+bug/59883 now
User7: Malone bug 59883 in console-setup "Asks questions on installation" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]
User35: User39 just adapt yast2 ;)
User31: User32 thanks
User4: User31 my housemate was wondering if i should suggest it.
User31: User32 do you remember which questions it asked?
User32: User31 origin and then exact model
User31: User32 ah, right
User32: User31 for some reason, console-setup is marked as unpacked about half a zillion times in dpkg.log.. Unsure if that has anything to do with it.
User32: User31 also, I got the xkb-data/xkeyboard-config upgrade at the same time
User32: hmm, no, xkb-data has the same "status unpacked" half a zillion times
User31: "origin" actually means layout - crappy text
User31: User32 model is normally before layout ...
User31: unless you mean layout then variant?
User32: Country, then variant, I think it's called, yes.
User31: ok, xorg.conf is probably the one I really need, then
User32: variant being the one where it asked about norwegian, norwegian without dead keys, norwegian (sami), etc
User31: right
User32: maybe it got confused about my XKbOptions compose:caps
User31: what's your XkbLayout?
User32: Option          "XkbLayout"     "no"
User31: oh, you're right, XkbOptions compose:caps will confuse it
User31: though I'm surprised it asked for layout/variant at all then
User31: you should have got console-setup/dont_ask_layout
User32: doing a dpkg -P and then reinstalling does not cause it to reask the questions.
User31: well, FSVO "should"
User31: oh, no, compose:caps *is* handled
User31: compose:caps)
User31: default_compose='Caps Lock';;
User31: I just can't read
User31: User32 silly question, but what's debconf/priority set to?
User31: User32 and did you have /etc/default/console-setup before this installation of console-setup?
User32: User31 high.
User31: if you have /etc/default/console-setup but the questions aren't marked as seen (which seems unusual), then it will ask
User32: User31 no, I don't think I had /etc/default/console-setup beforehand.
User31: as far as I can see, that's the only way this could have happened
User32: User31 maybe. :-/
User30: User31 maybe it relates to this matter, on this morning's dist-upgrade I had postfix' general configuration debconf question
User30: User31 such as postfix would have forgotten that it already displayed this question
User30: I suspected a postfix bug, but it might be related to this console-setup bug somehow
User25: hmmmm
User25: this new console-* thingy doesn't have the concept of "No keyboard connected"
User28: User31 seems like upstream is going to release gparted 0.3.1 soon - just wanted to let you know in case you still considered it
User32: User38 you might want to poke whoever has done http://wiki.kubuntu.org/EdgyEft/Knot2/Kubuntu in the past to do a Knot3 now; we're getting close.
User38: User32 what's our target edgy 3 release day?
User32: User38 Thursday.
User38: ok
User38: nixternal: ^^
User36: User32 i'm completely unable to reproduce the dbus-python bug here :( i'll upload a dbus-python which checks for this files in postinst when upgrading from a lower version and then removes them for now... fine with you?
User32: User36 sure, that's fine.
* Fade updates his xemacs bug
User32: (I'm drafting a mail to ubuntu-devel now asking if anybody has any big changes they want in before main freezes tomorrow)
User41: User32 I got emacs rebuilt with the requisite deb_build options.
User31: User30 seems unlikely; that's orders of magnitude more likely to be a postfix bug
User30: User31 ok
User41: s/emacs/xemacs
User31: User25 please file a bug or I will forget
User25: User31 what's this new source?
User25: User31 (name)
User32: User41 console-setup
User25: thanks
User32: uh
User32: s/Fade/fabio/
User25: yeah gotchat
User41: I was very confused there momentarily.
User32: User31 should we move the "Tell Jeff about upcoming milestone" a bit earlier on the milestonerythm page?  It makes more sense for us to warn QA and Jeff that we'll need resources soon rather than "We need them now, immediately", doesn't it?
User31: User32 yes
User42: User30 BTW, I'm about to upload m-f-l-all with Breaks in it.
User30: User42 ah, great
User30: User42 instead of the Conflicts: ?
User30: User42 (I'm not sure whether Breaks: is supposed to handle this rather special case, but you certainly know better than me)
User43: pitti, i assume you didnt get a chance to look over the SCP MIR ?
User30: sorry, not at Friday; I plan to do another review session today
User44: User30 is apport supposed to actually work already?
User30: User44 sure, is it not for you?
User44: User30 I got an error when it wanted to send a crash.
User30: User44 can you please file a bug with the details?
User43: pitti, i assume you didnt get a chance to look over the SCP MIR ?
User30: sorry, not at Friday; I plan to do another review session today
User30: User43 ^
User44: User30 I will, if I can reproduce it.
User43: pitti, thanks :)
User43: sorry, very flaky WLAN over here
User45: User30 can yo uplease just note on the wv mir that youve approved it verbally?
User45: User30 so Colin doesnt give me dirty looks for using it :)
User46: User30 hi ;)
* tseng hugs pitti
User46: User30 I was looking at bluez config, and it looks like hidd is disabled by default
User30: User45 yes, I will
User30: hi Tonio_
User46: User30 why not activating this, since one always have have to connect the peripherical once at least ?
User42: User30 Yes, this is just what Breaks is for.  I'm not sure why you think it's a weird special case.  It seems perfectly normal to me.
User30: User46 no idea TBH, I never looked into BT affairs until now
User46: User30 activating it just avoids  performing the sudo hidd --connect at every boot
User46: User30 you just do it once and for all
User30: User42 it's 'either it depends on ffox >= 1.99 and <= 2.0.99 or it depends on language-support-de'
User46: User30 is there someone I should ping concerning this ? cause hidd hardware is really hard to manage for Joe currently :)
User30: User46 that seems to make sense; is there an existing init script for that?
User30: User46 yes, the bug tracking system
User46: User30 well the config file is /etc/default/bluetooth
User46: just one line to change and it become far more usable :)
User46: okay I'll bug about this
User46: User30 thanks
User42: User30 Ah, I see what you mean now.
User30: User46 that seems easy to achieve; please subscribe 'pitti' and 'mdz' (mdz has to approve this change, since it is a feature, I guess)
User46: User30 sure
User42: User30 But yes, Breaks is an improvement even if it can't exactly express the complete situation.
User30: User46 so it just seems off by default to work for older kernels
User46: User30 ah ! Well I'm reporting with all informations and probably mdz will decide ;)
User30: User46 I'll check this out and write a comment, that's why I'd like to be CC'ed
User46: User30 hehe
User46: User30 bug 59894
User7: Malone bug 59894 in bluez-utils "HIDD periphericals are disabled by default" [Wishlist,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/59894
User43: Mithrandir, i'll be travelling on thursday ...
User43: so its unlikely i can test CDs
User32: User43 can't you get somebody else to test them for you?  Or just make sure they're perfect on Wednesday.
User43: having thme perfect on wednesday wont guarantee that ltsp-build-client works fine ... there are some packages that are edubuntu-specific, if they break it wont work ...
User43: (i often had that in the past)
User43: but i'll try my best
User32: User43 thanks; this schedule was drawn three weeks ago so it would have been helpful if you had complained then rather than now
User43: it would be very odd to not have edubuntu knot3 since thats the one that contains *all* ltsp changes for the first time
User43: i can probably find someone for i386 testing ...
User43: but the ltsp stuff needs a lot testing and i dont know if i can find someone with the right HW
User43: well, i posted the dates of my travel since 4 weeks in the dev meeting ...
User43: i wasnt looking at the knot schedule, sorry for that
User30: User42 btw, you know about m-f-l-a's magic of generating debian/control?
User42: User30 Yes, thanks.  I got bitten by that last time :-).
User42: This time, I ran update-debian-files after editing just the template.
User30: right
User47: hmm, there's a new xmms uploaded in late June, but it still isn't built :)
User30: User47 hrm, we totally need email notifications about FTBFSes...
User47: :)
User32: User30 we have the code for doing them now, AIUI
User30: oh, wow
User10: pitti, that'd be good...
User47: a friend of mine told about xmms hanging on dapper/sarge (mp3 streams), on etch it works so wondered why edgy still had the same version as dapper
User48: User53 who's responsible for the xorg driver packages (notably ati driver) in ubuntu?
User30: User48 rodarvus ATM
* rodarvus raises his hand
User30: User49 hello Rodrigo, how are you?
User49: hi pitti :)
User49: I'm better, thanks
User49: thankfully we were able to prepare the last rites and attend the funeral of my father in time
* pitti hugs rodarvus and wishes him all the best
* pitti waves to pygi 
* rodarvus hugs pitti 
* pitti waves to pygi
User49: thanks dude, appreciated
User29: hey pitti, how are you?
User30: User29 I'm fine, thanks! got apport rocking a bit more, and now back to security :)
User29: pitti, nice. congrats ^_^
User29: pitti, I made libburn rocking even more :)
User30: pygi!
User30: User29 did you notice that Debian just forked cdrtools? (mainly due to license issues)
User30: User29 let's hope that will be only temporary then, thanks to your work
User29: pitti, I know everything about cdrkit, yes ^_^
User50: User30 i doubt it's temporary
User30: User50 I perfectly see the need for it for etch
User30: User50 but eventually something like libburn seems like a better approach to me?
* popey shrugs
User50: anything that doesn't have the "baggage" that cdrtools has
User30: User50 'baggage'?
User51: having been writing by a sociopathic crazed person
User51: er... I mean, nothing
User50: heh
User50: the flame wars that go along with it whenever the kernel changes something to do with scsi or ide
User48: User49 hey, you're aware of some rendering issues with ubuntu with the ati drivers, right?
User30: User29 how difficult would it be to write some python wrapper around libburn that emulates an useful subset of cdrecord's command line? and what about mkisofs?
User49: Remenic, yes. I got an UVF exception approval I had requested last week
User29: pitti, I know that you'll have a python bindings for both libburn and libisofs, and that we have cdrskin (written in C tho) which emulates useful subset of cdrecord command line
User48: User49 Benjamin Otte (aka Company) has written a patch that fixes this, but it hasn't been applied upstream, and probably won't be for a while. So I'm really hoping that you could apply this patch for ubuntu
User49: in a few hours, a new version of the open source ati driver will be uploaded
User48: UVF exception?
User49: Remenic, I appreciate if you could point me to the bug report describing his patch
User29: pitti, we are also planning to write genisofs, the emulation app which will emulate mkisofs command line (it'll also be written in C)
User48: User49 here it is https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8134
User7: Freedesktop bug 8134 in Driver/Radeon "Render Composite with POT sources broken" [Normal,Resolved: duplicate]
User30: User29 that ... simply rocks :)
User48: User49 ok it's basically a workaround, but it's better than nothing
User29: pitti, if you really need command line cdrecord emulation which is written in python, it would be trivial once the bindings are out, but I don't see why when you already have cdrskin
User49: Remenic, thanks, I'll take a look at it later today
User48: User49 thank you! I'll poke you again tomorrow ;)
User30: User29 cdrskin seems to be exactly that, doesn't it?
User49: no promises it will be applied yet, though :)
User29: pitti, backward compatibility is important :)
User29: pitti, indeed :)
User48: User49 that's ok :)
User29: pitti, and you wouldn't believe how close are we to making -tao work...
User30: hi BenC_
User52: hey pitti
User31: User29 if you could make HFS+/ISO9660 hybrid filesystems work as well as HFS/ISO9660, I would love you
User31: User29 as would a lot of Intel Mac users
User29: Kamion, you mean this? :)
User29: http://libburn.pykix.org/ticket/68
User31: User29 that's HFS (needed for powerpc Mac booting)
User31: User29 HFS+ is a different filesystem
User31: so yes, http://libburn.pykix.org/ticket/68 will be needed too, but wasn't what I was asking about. :-)
User29: Kamion, ok, then file a ticket about both of your requests pls? :)
User31: both of them?
User29: oh, one. sorry =)
User29: HFS+ only :)
User38: User31 where is this new grub setup button on ubiquity-gtk?
User31: User38 on the summary page
User31: was the easiest place to put it where I could get debconf out of the way while the page was being displayed
User29: Kamion, I'll try to make sure you get it for libisofs 0.3.0 ^_^
User29: feature freeze for 0.2.1 is in 4 days :P
User31: User29 http://libburn.pykix.org/ticket/71
User31: thanks!
User29: thanks for the ticket
User29: Kamion, I assume this is correct spec for HFS?
User29: http://developer.apple.com/technotes/fl/fl_36.html
User29: (regular HFS)
User29: brb, lunch, would be glad if you could confirm the above Kamion so I don't end up implementing wrong stuff :)
User53: User48 rodarvus but I see you figured it out :)
User31: User29 I'm not sure - I thought mkisofs just overlaid the filesystems, rather than using the Apple extensions, but I'm not certain
User31: User29 http://developer.apple.com/documentation/mac/Files/Files-99.html is the full HFS specification
User48: User53 hehe yeah, but thanks :)
User31: User29 I'd compare both of the above with mkisofs and see which is the best match :)
User48: User53 if rodarvus can apply that patch, then I'm going to apply a new progressbar style
User29: Kamion, ok, thanks :)
User53: User48 is that the same issue than bug #34435 ?
User7: Malone bug 34435 in gtk-engines "Cairo and ATI RENDER extension cause scrambled buttons in UbuntuLooks" [Unknown,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/34435
User48: User53 I Think so, yes
User53: ok
User48: User53 one that has been haunting ubuntulooks for a long time now
User53: right
User53: how does it make difference for progressbar then? ;)
User30: User48 ooooh, don't tell me there's finally a patch for that?
User48: User30 yup!
User48: User30 a workaround, but still ;)
User53: I mean the bug would be really nice to fix
User48: better than nothing
User54: User7 is that the Xorg 7.1 ABI change---or something else?
User30: User48 anyway, if the standard theme would be unf**ed on my laptop, I'd love the world even a bit more ;)
User53: but theme already are scewed, so one extra screwed part will not make that of a difference
User48: User30 exactly :)
User48: User53 well, this part would hurt even more I think... because a crappy looking button doesn't hurt much, but a progressbar that won't show the progress anymore becomes pretty useless :)
User38: User31 updating kubuntu-meta all the recommends packages end up removed, is there something I need to update to have them not removed?
User53: Do people having that issue keep using the theme?
User53: I would switch to an another theme if that was on my desktop
User30: I switched long ago for that reason
User44: User54 you're talking to the bot?
User38: User30 any chance of a main inclusion review for python-qt4 before knot 3?
User30: yes, I think so; I'll do reviews after my lunch
User38: User33 actually my question should probably be for you
User29: Kamion, you mean someone is actually able to read mkisofs code? :)
User31: User29 heh
User31: User38 you're only looking at the changelog, right?
User31: User38 there's an arguable bug in germinate-update-metapackages where changes to entirely new files (*-recommends-* in this case) don't get changelogged
User31: User38 I bet you'll find that the files are there
User31: User38 if so, just add a note to the changelog saying that all the above have become Recommends
User38: User31 yep, -recommends- file are there so I'll upload, thanks
User39: User55 this ping is merely a thank you for 3.0.2+hg111412-2 and 3.0.2+hg111412-3
User39: User55 building now...
User55: no problem, you'll have to grab the .config from xen-source-2.6.16
User39: oh?
User55: yeah the kernel is doing different things now
User39: ahhhh
User55: i guess i can make a backport for you
User39: okay, I'll look into it
User55: actually if its amd64 i cant :(
User39: heh
User39: it's okay, I just need to finally make my own chroot for Xen builds.  The need for the newer gcc led me to Improper Practices on a shared chroot :)
User55: heh..
User31: User56 ok, keymapper uploaded to Debian
User31: User56 I need to figure out how to make it fast enough to generate a full decision tree for console-setup rather than a drastically reduced one ...
User31: but not right now
User56: User31 what are you doing to reduce it?
User43: ogra@edubuntu:~/packages/edubuntu-artwork-0.1.0$ LC_ALL=C dpkg -S /usr/lib/usplash/usplash-artwork.so
User43: dpkg: /usr/lib/usplash/usplash-artwork.so not found.
User43: where is that supposed to come from now ?
User43: i think it used to be in the usplash package before
User57: I saw a usplash package in the NEW queue
User57: usplash- something that is
User58: right -theme
User58: usplash-ubuntu-theme, IIRC
User57: Sounds like it
User43: argh
User58: usplash-theme-ubuntu is right name
User43: that means i have to ship it in edubuntu just to make a update-alternative call to change it ?
User43: thats silly
User43: no, there is no such package
User43: in fact there is not even anything that ships the /usr/lib/usplash dir anymore
User43: ah, in NEW ...
User43: but still ...
User43: thats a huge waste ... 2M of pics edubuntu will never use just to set a symling
User43: *symlink
User31: User56 hardcoding a list of keymaps to look at
User31: User56 basically just the set that console-data provides at the moment
User31: User43 huh?
User31: User43 ship the /usr/lib/usplash directory in your own package if you want to use update-alternatives
User31: if you're providing your own usplash theme then of course you do not have to depend on usplash-theme-ubuntu
User43: well, i still need the original file, dont i ?
User31: why?
User31: (hint: no)
User56: User31 what's the runtime (reduced vs. full) right now?
User43: becuse update.alternatives complains ?
User59: I just installed edubuntu-artwork-usplash, lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 35 2006-09-11 16:27 /etc/alternatives/usplash-artwork.so -> /usr/lib/usplash/edubuntu-splash.so
User43: hmm
User31: User43 it's complaining that the *directory* is missing, I'll bet
User43: right ...
User31: User43 just ship the directory in your package
User43: silly me
User43: sorry ... i'm confused :)
User31: User56 not much vs. lots and lots
User43: _ion, thats still the old one :)
User31: User56 don't have current figures, but I think it's under a minute versus hours
User56: Yeah, the idea "some characters look substantially the same" causes some (i.e. lots of) recursion when the thing realizes it has painted itself into a corner, but doesn't know how deep the corner is
User31: ah. doesn't it do an initial simplify pass to avoid traversing one tree multiple times?
User31: one bit of the tree, rather
User56: User31 the best bet to reduce that would be to run the full table once, then assign lower weights to the characters/keys that end up tried first
User56: User31 it does, but only for the "this keyboard is a superset of another" case
User31: I think that's deeper into keymapper than I've so far ventured :(
User56: User31 Another way would be to fiddle with the weights assigned to the "which character to try next" decisions so that it doesn't run into the dead end in the first place
User56: pending some analysis of the trace output -- you'd need to identify the dead end first ;-)
User30: User60 btw, thanks for fixing the pcspkr in the latest kernel - nice to have beeps again :)
User24: hey pitti
User60: User30 hehe, they do come in handy :)
User30: User60 (I just closed bug 54657 again)
User7: Malone bug 54657 in linux-source-2.6.17 "PC speaker does not work any more" [Untriaged,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/54657
User31: User56 if you want to try it, I basically built console-setup, ran ckbcomp-mini for all possible layout/variant combinations, dumped all that into a temporary directory, and fed it to gen_keymap
User31: User56 the reason I added gen_keymap --interactive was that I got bored of having to rerun it from scratch all the time ... it doesn't quite work properly though, I think because it doesn't prune the deselected keymaps from points further up the tree
User56: User31 "all possible layout/variant combination" are to be found where?
User31: User56 Keyboard/KeyboardNames.pl
User31: User56 or I think I might have just done it by cutting off the first and second fields from pc105.ekmap
User31: (produced by the console-setup build)
User31: you get stuff like this:
User31: hu:standarbd6c:f4c4:4f6:c742:59d8:35db:68f6:4d5f#include hu:102_qwertz_comma_dead
User31: hr:alternatequotesbd6c:f4c4:4f6:c742:59d8:35db:68f6:4d5f#include ba:alternatequotes
User31: trbd6c:f4c4:4f6:c742:59d8:35db:68f6:4d5f#include tr:sundeadkeys
User31: ckbcomp-mini knows how to unpack it
User19: Howdy folks
User56: User31 OK -- I'll have a look in a few (I'm being threatened with a short vacation ;-)
User31: User56 yeah, no rush at all, what we have now is basically working I think
User31: just thought it was worth mentioning
User56: User31 sure
User30: User38 pyqt4 approved
User38: User30 you rock
User30: sorry for the delay
User19: You should be.. ;-P
User38: User19 wheesht
User19: j/k
User61: heh
User61: why does libgtk2.0-0 depend on libcupsys2?
User61: seb128?
User19: User38 wheesht?
User30: User61 new printing backend of gtk 2.10, I'd presume
User53: User61 because GTK printing API
User29: seb128, poke? I saw you was responsible for first libburn package in debian :)
User38: User31 could you move python-qt4 and its binary packages into main
User53: User29 I was?
User53: was I?
User61: User53 neither the .la file nor the .pc file mention it, and ldd on the .so doesn't show it either?
User29: seb128, acording to this, you was: http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/main/libb/libburn/libburn_0.2-2.diff.gz
User32: User61 it's probably dlopened, then
User30: User61 then it probably deserves a -Wl,--as-needed
User53: User61
User53: $ ldd /usr/lib/gtk-2.0/2.10.0/printbackends/libprintbackend-cups.so | grep cups
User53: libcups.so.2 => /usr/lib/libcups.so.2 (0x00002b99a5534000)
User53: $ dpkg -S /usr/lib/libcups.so.2
User53: libcupsys2: /usr/lib/libcups.so.2
User61: ok, how did I miss that... nevermind
User29: seb128, you interested in poking at it again? :)
User53: User29 I'm waiting for the page to load, looks like my internet has some issues atm
User29: oki
User53: not really, I'm sort of busy enough already
User53: though I'm fine updating the package when there is some new tarballs upstream
User53: but I'm too busy to code on it or debug issues it might have
User29: seb128, no tarballs, I want svn checkout
User30: User53 you sponsored the upload, nothing more
User29: ah, that :P
User53: User30 ah, that would make sense ;)
User53: I'm still fine to sponsor updates for it then :p
User53: or to update to SVN
User30: User43 SCP looks fine to me (haven't tested it, of course, I trust you with that)
User29: seb128, would be fine if you could update to svn, and we could sync it to ubuntu :)
User43: yes, it runs :)
User43: YAY
User43: pitti, thanks so much
User30: User43 what does it do with dbus?
* ogra hugs pitti
User43: pitti, there is aq hook script that runs on ltsp sessions so all IPC is done via dbus ...
User30: User43 I'd like to take a look at the dbus interface, since it is a privilege transition
User54: Q-FUNK: {k,ed}ubuntu-artwork-usplash
User43: i.e. the teacher can execute apps in the users session
User29: seb128, ah, ignore, some more packages would have to be updated then
User29: we'll just get in "ubuntu only"
User43: jdong|laptop, ??
User29: sivang, poke?
User43: i havent touched either of them :)
User30: User43 the hal conf file seems to indicate that only root can send these commands, right?
User43: pitti, yes, only the admin user can use SCP for now
User30: User43 that's good
User30: User43 that with some gksudo magic should do fine
User29: sivang, poke?
User43: SCP sends the exec command on the system bus ... in the LTSP users session sits a listener that waits for the username, and if the username is in the selection it executes the command
User41: scp from the openssh suite?
User30: User43 and sorry for the delay, I was just too busy; I hope it didn't disrupt it too much
User41: oh, sorry.
User29: Fade, no :)
User43: pitti, totally not
User41: I was about to inject a 'huh?!' ;)
User43: as long as its in all is fine :)
User54: Q-FUNK: the testcard is in usplash itself, the overide will be in 'ubuntu-artwork-usplash' if/when it's uploaded
User43: Fade, SCP != scp :)
User29: Fade, student control panel ^_^
User43: Fade, SCP == Student Control Panel
User62: User32 ping
User43: heh
User29: o joy, three answers :P
User43: pygi, nobody can say our community isnt responsive ;)
User32: User62 hi
User29: ogra, indeed, hehe :) one could even claim we are OVER responsive ^_^
User62: User32 I had a request for Knot 3
User32: User62 let me her
User43: seb128, my evo doesnt jump to the next message in the messagelist after i deleted one anymore ...
User32: hear, even
User62: User32 I want to update three packages slightly
User24: User32 how long do we have before freeze?
User43: seb128, i always need to click on one to use my keyboard again
User32: User24 until after I finish reading email and IRC backlog tomorrow morning.
User62: User32 edgy-gdm-themes, edgy-session-splashes and edgy-wallpapers
User41: User32 I updated my bug report.
User28: troy_s: heya - did you manage to subscribe ubuntu-art to the art packages?
User63: re
User32: User62 well, we're not frozen yet, so if those aren't big disruptive changes, just do it.
User62: User28 Hi
User24: User32 right.  when is tommorrow morning - how many hours?
User28: hi fschoep
User62: User32 OK, thanks
User43: seb128_, gah i talked to your ghost :)
User43: seb128_, my evo doesnt jump to the next message in the messagelist after i deleted one anymore ...
User62: User28 Can I borrow you for a few seconds later today with updated artwork sources?
User63: User43 dholbach knows about it
User43: seb128_, i always need to click on one to use my keyboard again
User63: he complained about the same
User43: ah, k
User43: then im fine
User28: User62 sure
User63: works fine for me ;)
User32: User24 I'm guessing somewhere in the range of 16-18 hours from now.
User62: User28 If you can explain to me which runes you enter and what links you click on Launchpad I'd be happy to update stuff myself in the future.
User28: User43 i suffer from the same bug, slomo too
User24: User32 right, good.  so as long as i get off my lazy rear end, and do some main work between now and then, i'll be fine.  i've been playing in universe again, as i dont have to get sponsors for that.
User28: User62 update what? the packages? bugs? bzr branches?
User63: User29 have you tried libburn SVN? does it work?
User62: User28 update the packages
User43: seb128_, dholbach, i also see a problem if evo ran but my network connection died over night ... evo dies then with a "too many open files" message
User29: seb128, I'm the upstream, thank you :)
User63: User43 that is weird
User32: User24 yeah, I'm trying the novel idea of warning people beforehand this time.  Wondering how it works out.
User43: imaps ...
User62: User28 BTW, I'm also gathering data for the optipng / pngcrush discussion which I'll probably have completed tonight
User63: User29 I see, you are upstream so it has to work ;)
User43: well, i guess it opens a file/socket whatever for every mailcheck or something like that
User28: User62 nice
User24: User32 hehe!   surely it's against the secret, private canonical rules.
User63: User29 I'll do a SVN snapshot then
User28: User62 I'm going to write a wiki page about that (updating stuff)
User29: seb128, right, it has to work :)
User62: User28 that would be so awesome, I really hate to call you for help
User28: User62 so if people use the art packages as an example to branch from, they'll have an easy life
User32: User24 well, we're trying not to keep all those discussions in secret -- it just means more work for us in the end.
User29: seb128, ok, so you package libburn, libisofs, and cdrskin
User28: User62 don't hate it, do it :-)
User62: User28 cool, thanks :)
User29: seb128, libburn and libisofs = 2.0SVN, Cdrskin = 1.5SVN (http://libburn-svn.pykix.org)
User29: seb128, thank you ^_^
User24: User32 true that
User59: Hi q-funk. I think we've met at #altparty.
User29: seb128, you'll need quite a lot modifications to packages ^_^
User64: Kamion / User30 postfix debconf hasn't changed in ages, afaik
User63: User29 np
User30: User64 hmm, curious
User58: User63 if you are busy, I could work on that (pygi's packages)
User63: User58 if you want to do it you are welcome, thank you
User58: User63 ok
User30: User58 that reminds me of the 'Warning: condition is always true' gcc warning :)
User58: User30 :)
User58: User30 i've been quite busy these days with faculty, so I was not much of a help... (this stage will continue whole month :/)
User30: User58 don't worry, uni should have precedence :)
User58: User30 it does :)
User65: User30 do you remember that you fixed attr's .pot file to include a valid .po header?
User65: at least I think you did it for dapper
User30: User65 vaguely
User65: User30 anyway, Edgy's attr's .pot file lacks a header, are you still in charge of that?
User65: or should I ping someone else?
User30: User65 it probably got lost when we synced with Debian
User30: User65 I can fix it again
User65: User30 ok, I'm going to file a bug report with you as the assignee
User65: User30 thanks
User30: User65 hm, I never touched attr as it seems
User30: User65 and dapper has an unmodified Debian version
User30: User65 I'll fix it anyway
User31: User38 done
User65: User30 ok, hmm, maybe it was acl and I got confused...
User65: User30 thanks
User30: User65 apparently that was another package -- yes, acl could be it
User30: User65 nevermind filing a bug, I'm fixing it right now
User65: User31 btw, I forgot to confirm you that latest debian installer .po and .pot files were uploaded into Rosetta
User31: User65 thanks
User38: thanks Kamion
User65: User30 in fact, attr doesn't have translations in Dapper, so you are right, you didn't touch it ;-)
User31: User43 student-control-panel promoted
User31: User45 wv promoted
User65: User30 ok
* ogra hugs Kamion
User30: User65 fixed attr package uploaded
User65: User30 thanks
User30: freeflying: ping
User30: freeflying: do you have any idea about bug 47597?
User7: Malone bug 47597 in language-support-zh "doesn't display chinese properly" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/47597
* ogra twiddles thimbs waiting for the seeds to sync ...
User43: *thumbs too
User43: Kamion, could you demote blender so motu has a chance to get an UVF exception through for it ? 
* jdong_ waves to BenC
User43: (was dropped from edubuntu-desktop a while ago)
User31: User43 done
User43: thanks :)
User43: lfittl, ^^^^
User66: I don't suppose I could convince anyone to cowboy swap xvncviewer for xvnc4viewer in main?
User66: even in dapper, the gnome TSC programs works (as well as it does) with both
User67: User43 ah perfect, finally :)
User43: :)
User55: hey simon
User68: User55 Hey.
User68: How was your weekend?
User55: good...went to a baby show
User69: User38 the kubuntu-meta package needs a small patch to fully support the recommends stuff, I can do it and send it to you if you it is still a issue (sorry for my late reply)
User38: User69 please
User69: User38 give me 5min
User58: i know i'm asking too much...
User58: but, could it be possible to implement graylisting for @ubuntu.com? :)
User29: Mithrandir, poke?
User30: Riddell, User53 fresh new edgy langpacks, can you please test them?
User38: User30 URL/
User38: ?
User30: deb http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/langpacks/daily/edgy/ ./
User58: User30 bug 55828
User7: Malone bug 55828 in cupsys "PJL output from 1.2.2 client over IPP" [Unknown,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/55828
User58: User30 could it be possible to implement that patch? I know 1.2.3 is out, but due it's bugs, I would rather wait for 1.2.4 :)
User70: So why the tmpfs for restricted modules?
User70: I don't get the reason.
User30: User58 ah, that means it's fixed in edgy, but needs a dapper backport?
User58: User30 right
User58: User30 but don't backport 1.2.3 yet
User30: I know, there are some regressions
User58: User30 it has nasy 100% CPU consume bug, which isn't fixed yet
User58: ok
User30: User58 there is a patch upstream, btw
User58: is it?
User30: but I didn't see the issue yet, thus I didn't patch
User58: i didn't check ML for couple of days
User30: User58 http://www.cups.org/str.php?L1968
User30: User58 if you get the issue, can you please test and reply upstream?
User58: i can test that right now
User30: User58 I updated bug 55828 accordingly, now needs mdz's blessing
User7: Malone bug 55828 in cupsys "PJL output from 1.2.2 client over IPP" [Unknown,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/55828
User58: ok
User30: User58 (asked mdz in the bug for approval)
User43: mvo_, does that apply to edubuntu-meta as well ?
User30: seb128, User38 langpacks seem to work well for me
User30: User69 is there a way to tell apt-get to not install recommends when I try apt-get install ubuntu-desktop?
User69: User43 yes, if you want to use recommends, then yes. I can send you a debdiff (or just upload it)
User69: User30 yes, but only hackish
User43: mvo_, as you like ...
* pitti tried --no-install-recommends, but that didn't work
User69: User30 yeah I know. only hackish
User69: User30 do you want to the hackish one?
User30: sure
User30: I'd like to have -desktop installed again, but without the auxiliary stuff I don't want
User69: User30 apt-get install ubuntu-desktop -o APTbd6c:f4c4:4f6:c742:59d8:35db:68f6:4d5fInstall-Recommends-Section="none"
User30: that's not quite as hackish as I feared :)
User30: User69 however, it makes no difference; it still wants to install bug-buddy and mono sttuff
User43: is mono already recommends ?
User38: User30 langpacks work, but still the stock strings lacking in KDE which I need to look at (probably my fault)
User53: User30 language pack update looks good to me too
User43: pitti, it shouldnt install gnome-screensaver thats for sure a recommends
User30: Riddell, User53 thanks; thus good to upload?
User53: as far as I'm concerned it's good to upload yep ;)
User30: User43 well, I have that installed :)
User43: heh
User43: as anyone :)
User38: User30 yep
User69: User30 I will have a look (once I finished kubuntu-meta)
User30: User69 oh, f-spot and bug-buddy are still depends, thus not your fault
User69: User30 aha, ok. I guess changing the seeds is ok for this
User69: User38 do you want a debdiff or should I upload the changes?
User38: User69 debdiff would be nice, I have an update pending anyway
User69: ok
User69: User38 http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/23136 <- should be what you need
User38: User69 worth pinging ogra and xubuntu with that too?
* ogra already reads the patch
User69: User38 absolutely!
User69: User43 I have a update for you too :) shall I send it or upload it? (upload without any other modifications)
User43: upload is fine ... as you like
User43: if it causes extra work for you, just send it to me
User69: User43 no, that is fine. I uploaded it now, please let me know if it works (should pick up recommends automatically when you do your next seed change and use " * (pkgname)" instead of  the regular " * pkgname"
* mvo_ will do the same modification for xuubntu
User43: yup, i already merged the seed changes ...
User69: User43 ah, nice! my upload was without runing ./update because I was not sure about this
User69: note that germinate does not yet get the changelog right, it may write funny stuff like "removed foo; added foo"
User43: i'll do the update ... need to add SCP to desktop anyway ...
User43: well, it looks right in ubuntu-meta
User69: User43 because I ran a "querry-replace" over it *cough*
User43: heh
* mvo_ whistles inoccently
User31: User69 I fixed that
User31: it'll say "added foo to desktop-recommends-i386" or whatever now
User69: User31 oh, great! 
* mvo_ hugs Kamion
User31: however it still won't list the additions to the new file the first time you add recommends
User31: you can probably work around that by touching all the *-recommends-*
User31: first
User30: how can it be that both i386 buildds are idling around when there are a bazillion langpacks waiting to be built?
User30: well, now they at least build something
User31: User30 I've accepted usplash-theme-ubuntu straight into main, FYI; I assumed it was at least conceptually a split-out from usplash
User30: sounds sensible, thanks
User45: User31 thanks alot
User45: User31 will upload beagle when i get home
* mvo_ is out for ~30min
User43: Kamion, edubuntu can default to dhcp network setup again btw ...
User43: we should change that before release ...
User31: User43 please file a bug on /products/ubuntu-cdimage telling me what to do
User43: ok
User71: User30 does apport display a progress indicator now?
User43: bug buddy does ...
User71: User30 and what do you plan to do about interaction with the gnome segv handler?
User30: User71 progress> how should apport do this?
User30: User71 bug-buddy> I asked seb128, and he prefers to keep bug-buddy installed by default
User71: User30 isn't the slow part basically dpkg -S?
User30: User71 yes, about half of that time is used by dpkg -S
User30: User71 but apport is called by the kernel, not from the user's session, thus it would be quite hackish to display a progress bar
User71: User30 is there nothing running in the session that it could send a message to?
User71: User30 maybe not a progress bar, but just a notification
User71: "A program has crashed, information is being collected" or such
User30: User71 we could try a update-notifier hack
User30: User71 basically we don't even need to change apport for that
User35: and: is the 'OOPS' when you kill apport intentional?
User30: User71 the 0-byte report is created, then apport collects, finally the file is completed
User30: User71 but apport now runs with nice 5, thus should be much less disturbing
User30: User35 ?
User71: User30 given that it takes some time to create the report, I think we should display something immediately
User35: User30 I've had a few kernel OOPSes when killing apport
User35: User30 (as apport was hogging memory/cpu, and I didn't have a clue about what it was..)
User30: User35 that's news to me, can you please file a kernel bug?
User71: User30 in my experience it seems I/O bound, so scheduling priority doesn't make much of a difference
User30: User71 in my experiments it behaves much better
User71: but I haven't seen it run in a while
User30: User71 previously it made the desktop session sluggish, music playback stuttering, etc.
User30: now it's smooth as silk
User30: User71 I'll discuss that with mvo, if you want that feature
User72: hello all: someone knows if its possible to reuse a partition table using preseeds? Thanks :-)
User53: User71 I've added a gconf-key (/apps/bug-buddy/run_on_crash) for bug-buddy, if it's set to false the gnome_segv handler is not set
User71: User53 so we can set that to false by default?
User53: we can yep
User53: I advice not doing so
User53: since we don't get automatic debug bt yet
User30: User53 do we with b-b?
User53: and we don't have the workface to handle the hundreds of crashers week that we would get
User53: User30 no, that's my point, we would not won anything and increase the workload a lot
User53: s/won/win
User30: ah, I see
User53: my opinion will probably change the day we get debug backtraces for everything
User53: there we will win a lot over bug-buddy
User35: User30 https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/linux-source-2.6.17/+bug/59935
User7: Malone bug 59935 in linux-source-2.6.17 "OOPS when killing apport" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]
User53: User30 did you fix the coredump limit issue BTW?
User53: like evolution bt would work now?
User30: User53 oh, not yet; can you please file a bug so that I don't forget?
User30: User35 I believe today's version (0.20) should fix/workaround this
User30: 'k, I gotta run now
User30: cu tomorrow!
User35: Bye
User53: User30 linux bog?
User73: uh cool i get MD5Sum mismatch if i use the universe repo of it.archive.ubuntu.com.
User74: anyone got any idea about Bug #59691, "vmware-player fails to start"? got a similar crash here when i try to start, the only thing it writes to the console is: "/usr/lib/vmware-player/bin/vmplayer: /usr/lib/vmware-player/lib/libpng12.so.0/libpng12.so.0: no version information available (required by /usr/lib/libcairo.so.2)"
User7: Malone bug 59691 in vmware-player "vmware-player fails to start" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/59691
User53: User74 mvo_ might have an idea
User74: User53 ok, we'll wait for him then :)
User75: seb128, desrt was mumbling someting about a dbus issue
User69: User74 this only happens on edgy, right?
User53: User75 something specific?
User74: User69 don't have any machine with dapper, but i'm on edgy yes
User75: seb128, something about being linked to 2 and 3 at the same time?
User69: User74 ok, thanks
User74: User69 no problem. let me know if you need more info or whatever, got a generated crash report as well
User76: User74 does the LD_PRELOAD workaround work for you?
User74: User2 point me in the right direction please? haven't seen that
User76: User74 LD_PRELOAD=/usr/lib/libdbus-1.so.3 vmplayer
User74: sec
User53: User75 not sure of what he was speaking but thank you for mentionning it
User53: User75 ah, was about vmplayer?
User74: User2 seems like it yes, it started at least
User76: User74 cool; there's a dupe bug report with more info
User76: bug 59232
User7: Malone bug 59232 in hal "libhal1 91.69.162.6-0ubuntu8 with new dbus breaks vmware" [Untriaged,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/59232
User74: User2 cool, thanks. probably the same as the other bug i mentioned
User76: yep
User76: the png warning is not the real warning
User75: seb128, yep. He was looking into the oo.o crashing issue and said "this solves the vmplayer issue as well". He said nothing further and I didn;t question
User76: just a throw-off
User76: User75 the OOo crash is related to the vmplayer issue?
User75: jdong, no idea, again, this is 2nd hand. Check the logs for saturday or sunday
* jdong_ ld_preloads oowriter
User76: gasp!
User76: it works!
* jdong_ hugs Burgwork
User77: hey
User75: mark si the on the front page of cnn http://edition.cnn.com/
User45: whoa
User45: where..
User75: left, little box
User75: also first story on their tech section
User55: http://edition.cnn.com/2006/TECH/09/11/space.tourist.microsoft.reut/index.html
User55: still old picture though
User75: space is cool
User75: linux is not
User77: User75 that's right, linux is hot and it's way to cold in space :D
User75: heh
User14: In space, nobody can hear you run closed-source products.
User77: User14 yes they can, vista startup sound is getting mandatory, at least co-workers in the space shuttle or the ISS would know ;D
User75: zyga, does that mean, when the shuttle launches, the noise will be overpowered by a massive windows login tune?
User77: User75 now it makes sense why the launch platform is so far away from casual viewers
User75: right
User77: microsoft would have to pay for running the sound on national tv
* bluefoxicy sighs as he idly hammers the package servers
User15: you know what would be nice
User15: all this talk about zeroconf and avahi, how about mdnsing a package server
User15: once you enable avahi, you find that -updates and -security for any distribution you're running has multiple mirrors on your network
User15: and when you update, they all communicate, determine who has the package, mirrors it across eachother; if it's not there it's downloaded from the main server and streamed to whoever else wants a copy at the time
User15: network of 5 billion PCs?  No need to clog the point of presence link
User76: User14 any chance for updated readahead-lists in time for knot3?
User78: User15 we need apt-torrent :)
User15: (I would not mind such a server being set up as a proxy either, mind)
User15: User78 Nah, I mean organizational.
User15: At a school district they decided to install winxp sp2
User77: User15 hmm?
User77: User15 apt-mdns?
User77: User15 is there such a thing already?
User15: so somene decided, hey, send all 1000000 PCs to windowsupdate
User15: User77  no clue!  :)
User77: User15 that would be kind of cool :)
User15: anyway, what happened was, for 3 days there was no internet.  The pipes were totally clogged.
User2: User15 hasn't anyone thought of putting up a caching proxy? :)
User77: I don't know much about bonjour/avahi but I guess it's perfectly possible
User77: the workstation would have to publish an ubuntu mirror service and apt could somehow sniff that
User15: And I am thinking, with apt, you could have deb http://91.69.162.6/ubuntu edgy-security main restricted
User78: http://packages.ubuntu.com/dapper/admin/apt-proxy
User15: and then when you contact the web server it'll proxy through it yeah, and cache it
User15: except at home you may have 3 computers in bedrooms and 2 laptops, and you won't set up an apt-proxy yourself
User78: "apt-proxy automatically builds a Debian HTTP mirror based on requests which pass through the proxy.  It's great for multiple Debian machines on the same network with a slower internet link."
User15: which is where an apt-mdns would come in
User15: User78 mmhmm.
User15: User78  the automation would be good for home users though, who don't normally do anything but click "update"
* bluefoxicy checks out apt-proxy anyway, since it'll do what he wants most likely.
User2: apt-proxy is great...
User2: if you have more than one edgy box on a lan, it's a requirement :)
User2: only thing, needs that dedicated apt-proxy server
User2: and sources.list editing
User15: (I want something that can be around by default and working automatically for everyone using Ubuntu, though)
User2: not to mention it's damn inconvenient if you have a laptop that can roam onto a apt-proxy-less network
User2: so yeah, bluefoxicy, make apt-avahi happen :)
User2: aptvahi
User2: there you go
User15: heh
User2: a name for it
User15: User2  Maybe after I get Steel finished.
User14: User2 depends when the Knot 3 freeze begins
User14: I want to take some time to actually play a little with readahead again
User14: do some test runs and see what effect different tests have on it
User2: User14 awesome
User14: (e.g. sorting it by block at boot, not at generation time
User2: User14 yes!
User14: running it in the foreground, not the background
User14: etc.)
User19: Man, I read readahead as something else.. Heh.. ;-)
User2: thank you!
User14: and I obviously want it to be tested on the live cd and real system, etc
User14: that's a few days work
User2: User14 at the forums, there's mixed results from reprofiling their systems
User2: User14 most people reported 5 or more seconds better bootup
User2: User14 some reported no change
User2: User14 I just posted a follow-up asking for daring people to test foregrounding readahead... will let you know how that turns out
User2: but from that, I think definitely reordering deserves a look :)
User14: User2 did anyone report worse?
User2: User14 nope. that's the good news :)
User14: that's good, at least
User2: User14 but I'd expect maybe a "worse" report or two from foregrounding
User77: User14 hey, does X die moment after login due to upstarf
User77: upstart?
User2: User77 I read that as upsnarf :P.... good nickname for when it fails :)
User78: is there a right way to draw attention to a bug report?
User77: User2 I was not trying to be mean
User77: User78 bounty
User14: User77 no
User2: User78 I usually whine about it :)
User14: User77 at least, there's no reason it should
User2: User77 gdm or kdm?
User77: User14 X sigsegvs regularly about 5 seconds after logging in on ati driver
User77: gdm
User77: radeon X300
User14: oh, that'd be the driver at fault then, no? :p
User78: edgy alternate and server aren't installing, which seems pretty bad: Bug #59938
User7: Malone bug 59938 in debian-installer "edgy alternate installer: No kernel modules were found" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/59938
User77: User14 well it didn't used to :-)
User14: upstart can't magically induce segfaults in proprietary drivers <g>
User2: User14 that's an open source driver, thank you very much :)
User77: User14 note: ati != fglrx
User77: :)
User2: and for the record, my fglrx is running gdm just fine :)
User14: nor open source ones
User77: bah, I know I want to buy intel next time
User14: upstart can be blamed for something not starting
User77: now after intel both ati and nvidia are just crap
User14: it is not responsible for your fonts looking funny
User77: User14 okay I got the message
User14: (yes, someone really thought upstart had caused that)
User77: User14 heh
* Keybuk looks pointedly at ogra
User77: User14 I just remember you saying that upstart pulled VT from X and that was kind of deadly
User77: User14 BTW, why does VT gets killed twice during startup?
User2: User77 you should be looking at blaming usplash for that :)
User14: User77 no idea
User14: which vt?
User77: User14 anything I can set to make upstart much verbose
User77: User14 tty[1-6]
User14: boot with --debug on the kernel command-line
User77: User14 will do, it happens at work
User77: for some reason it didn't affect my laptop at home
User15: is it just me or does Planner have no native file extension
User31: User78 shrug, probably transient
User31: that error message is symptomatic of mid-transition images
User78: User31 ok - I'll try again in 24 hours
User31: oh, it's because debian-installer failed to build
User31: infinity: could you give-back debian-installer on all architectures, please? those build failures look transient
User79: hi
User79: I'd like to ask a question
User79: is there a chance to pack a given program to use tango icons even if that's not the default?
User79: I'm thinking gaim, or gimp
User80: User79 you should contact the artwork team
User79: how could I do that?
User77: User79 #ubuntu-artwork is there but I don't know how occupied it is
User77: User79 try the mailing list
User80: User79 or subscribe to the mailing list. you could push your wish if you already have got a patch or a plan
User79: thanks a lot guys
User80: User79 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributeToUbuntu this site is a good starting point
User32: User29 hi
User29: hi Mithrandir
User32: User29 you pinged me?
User29: Mithrandir, just wondering how your student(s) passed SoC
User32: User29 not very well, I'm afraid.
User29: Mithrandir, ahm? :-/
User75: Mithrandir, ajmitch keeps promising me updates for the UWN, but so far nothing
User32: User75 well, SoC is over now anyway so whatever is done now, though nice, can't affect those evaluations.
User29: Mithrandir, so he failed the final eval?
User14: my god, this md guy is so pessimistic
User73: User14 why?
User14: it's a bit "it's all doomed, it can't possibly fixed, it'll never work"
User75: Keybuk, md?
User14: uh, md != marco in this case <g>
User14: mdadm
User81: User14 neil brown?
User14: bug #54002
User7: Malone bug 54002 in udev "LVM/MD root filesystem not found by uuid" [High,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/54002
* desrt feels sort of that way about edgy sometimes :)
User82: wow.  this bug has a lot of commentary
User53: User14 is xdg-utils binary stucked to NEW?
User13: will 2.6.18 go in when released?
User53: no
User53: 2.6.17 for edgy
User13: I would still like to see this bug, kernel-package needs to be updated for working with 2.6.18-rc kernel, so probably 2.6.18 as well.
User13: to see this bug fixed, even
User71: User31 around?
User62: Does anyone know whether or not the Firefox Human theme is going to be included and set to be default for Knot 3?
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