yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[G Tablet General] roebeet:
:confused: I used the GTAB conf files to do that on the Xoom. GTAB has had that since Day One. I'm not that smart a guy, I used my GTAB as a template.

You think like an Operations person.

The problem here in XDA is that this has NOT happened. I tried to do this, but a lot of it was third party information so I had no idea if I could verify things.

From the posts here and PM's I've gotten (and I've gotten a lot), I found two major issues:

1. User tries to revert back to stock 3588, and recovery is borked. Generally, it seems like they were running clockworkmod prior to the reversion.

2. User installs the TNTL5 / TTx upgrade using clockworkmod, even though it's implicitly stated that it doesn't work.

I had more than a few PM's from people asking if they could use clockworkmod, even after the warnings we put in RED and BOLD on my first post. Imo, clockworkmod has been given out to noob users like candy and that is the main cause of the problems, from my own metrics. I understand the reasons why we had done that, but I think we are now paying for that decision.

Clockworkmod is a great tool, but it doesn't update the bootloader and the vendor does require a bootloader update, on occasion. It just seems that this latest UAT bootloader update, assuming it sticks with an actual release, will be an absolute requirement which means we will cannot use clockworkmod to update.

Lastly, there's the "x factor" - user had all the pre-reqs and followed instructions but still had problems. That's the one I wish I had more metrics on as there could be some other issue that eludes me. But XDA doesn't have a help desk or a ticketing system. And no problem management.
[G Tablet General] kekinash:
I don't get it, ok you go back after TnT 5 to stock and your tablet is borked... then do a nvflash, format all partitions (there is a too for that) and start again.. what's the problem, but not, you see a black screen, and you start to panic and scream mom mom mom please help me!

I just one to know one guy that borked the table beyond fix, just one. This thing is tank, unbrickable, I tested, I did the most stupid things with mine to try to bork it beyond repair and I was unsuccessful.

:eek:
[G Tablet General] Synman:
QFT
[G Tablet General] K J Rad:
I'm taking that as a compliment no matter how you meant it... ;-)

Yeah... I've tried going through the threads here but it's difficult to sort through the shouting. I really haven't found any that couldn't be addressed with some combination of partition, format, reflash but I'd still like to know what causes the need for more than just the reflash. Finding out could help to quash bugs elsewhere

At any rate... I'll continue to try to duplicate the issues and if anyone can provide further information feel free to PM it to me.

Oh... for those that want a real challenge... I'll need some help explaining to my wife why I'm on an endless quest to brick this thing...
[G Tablet General] ecejdt:
We are loosing the XDA original spirit. I joint this comunity in Nov. 2007, only 13 posts but I have been very loyal following Xperia X1 forum, G1, and now Gtab. I have been in serious troubles many times, my wife blaming me and my kids with no phone during coupple of days, but it was the idea. I knew that something could go wrong and usually someone in the forum helped me to solve the problem. I am just a good intruction follower, normally I do not know what i am really doing, but after 3 more than 3 years i know how to read and follow. And for that reason I decided not to update to TNT 5. I was not comfortable.

People have to learn by their own, and do not understand why we are loosing this great ROM for the rest of the comunity.

where is the XDA spirit

BR
[G Tablet General] Broken:
Well, biggest problem is more and more people are getting the attitude that they are never at fault. Always some excuse. Me me me me me screw you. Someone puts out an update and something goes wrong and it is like they were forced to do it.

Sad but true.
[G Tablet General] rsfaze:
why take the links down? There are roms all over XDA that can cause harm if the EU does not read the directions or know how to recover from a soft brick. I flashed this rom and yes I screwed up, but used Nvflash and my g tab is as good as new.

I don't get why this one rom out of the thousands on XDA has to be taken down =\
[G Tablet General] proneck321:
Yup.. this tablet is unbrickable... I still think the one or two that think they did bork their tablet just really got stuck in apx mode... it happened to me, because I was being stupid!!

much praise to ROE as always, and to all of the members here ( junior and senior alike). Almost everyone is willing to help, and there are only a handfull of whiners!
[G Tablet General] roebeet:
I'm a sysadmin, so it was totally a compliment. I had a big smile on my face when I read your post.

It's not permanent - once I know what VS releases, it's going back up (either here or on Slatedroid, if necessary).

When I was initially told to take down TNT Lite 5, I was on the IRC and what I wrote was not very nice, I'll be honest. I almost pulled myself out of XDA right then and there. But, when one of the moderators stepped in to mediate, I understood the reasoning more and agreed to fork it off. But the complaints continued even after doing that. I just keep hoping VS releases so we can finally put this to bed.
[G Tablet General] rsfaze:
if you are not willing to read and learn, you have no business being on XDA. Wait for Viewsonic puts out an OTA update. Why XDA wants to cater to the people that don't take the time to read and understand what they are doing to their device is beyond me.

I joined XDA back in my windows mobile days, over 5 years ago. If this was the attitude of XDA back then, there would of been no reason to ever join this forum.
[G Tablet General] thebadfrog:
You guys are more than welcome to jump on freenode server irc, channel #tegratab and help the guys who have soft bricked their tabs. On average it takes around 1 hour plus to get them back to a running tab. This involves setting up adb or nvidia drivers and walking them through the nvflash process. I agree that if you dont understand what you are doing you shouldn't be playing with experimental stuff. However there have been cases of people who do know what they are doing having some real big problems.
[G Tablet General] jerdog:
Ok - maybe I should set the record straight here.

After discussions with roebeet it was mutually decided that the high rate of failure with this ROM and the fact this is in no way official and the fact that the sun does come up each day - were enough to keep the thread going from a support perspective but to remove the links to the experimental ROM until more information is received from Viewsonic. The fact that this new bootloader dramatically changes things for the gTab is enough to slow down and wait to see what VS is going to do or else perpetuate a problem that may get worse if VS were to backpedal and then everyone would have to revert and then have yet more borks, etc.

With the large number of gTabs getting borked for lack of RTM - and then demanding someone fix it because the user didn't adhere to the warnings - it's a good thing to

continue to provide constructive information to roebeet so he can continue to analyze what's going on.
[G Tablet General] kekinash:
Ok, I bork my Sansung Captivate, My Xoom tablet, my droidx phone, all because I didn't read the warnings properly here, so please take down those ROMs too...

Sounds stupid, don't you?

Since when xda-developers has become xda-whiners? :cool:
[G Tablet General] jerdog:
Sorry - you might have misunderstood. The problem here with this unreleased bootloader is that it drastically changes how the kernel interacts with everything. And because of that the damage and disruption it can cause to all of the ROMs currently existing (due to CWM issues, etc.) is enough to hold off (and roebeet also was for this) on further distributing this until a stock, released bootloader is released by Viewsonic - or they choose to backpedal due to the issues this will cause even for non-rooted gTabs....
[G Tablet General] jerdog:
Post the links again and all those who want to go down this path can. Please understand that the tools to backpedal from any bricked device are provided in the original post.

It is the sole responsibility of those who use this experimental, non-released bootloader for any result (positive or extremely negative) they receive.

It's out of the kindness of someone's heart that they decide to help someone resolve any issues resulting from improperly doing this.

XDA is not responsible for any actions you perform which brick your device. You have been warned.
[G Tablet General] rsfaze:
thanks for the replies guys, I personally think knowing how to use nvflash is a good resource to have. Even with my knowledge of computers/electronics I did ask on IRC for some direction which saved me some time figuring it out by myself, which in the end badfrog and roebeet were both helping me when I figured out the Windows script for nvflash.

I can see how a complete electronics novice would be completely lost without someone holding their hand doing the recovery with nvflash, including finding and loading the drivers for apx mode.
[G Tablet General] sverbanic:
TwoTapsX "almost-brick" fix.

First, roebeet does a wonderful job and is one of the most level-headed OPs on this site, as evidenced by his willingness to cooperate with the Mods.

The biggest problem I've seen is not so much that this ROM has the potential to cause problems for people who don't read, rather it was due to MANY postings by Members, who contradicted roebeet's instructions, that gave the advice that you didn't need to nvflash and could use CWM.

I followed roebeet's instructions a few times (maybe 4 or 5) switching back and forth to this ROM and others on my dev tablet. ONE time, my tablet got semi-bricked. Even nvflash wouldn't resurrect it. What I think I found out was that installing CWM 3.0.5 (from SDCARD2) on top of this ROM instead of the special version .08/tnt_lite_5 version got me out of my boot-loop situation. Then, for some reason unknown to me, I could nvflash and start from scratch again and my tablet is working fine on this ROM.

I'm just mentioning this as a potential fix for others who may think their device is bricked. If anyone wants detailed instructions posted, I'll try to remember/duplicate what I did, as I was quite panicked for an hour or so.

In summary, I had successfully installed this rom using nvflash several times before I had a failure and I can't think what went differently the one time it broke, but the only fix I could come up with was recovering off of the external sdcard using a 3.0.5 CWM update.zip file (after trying every other update.zip file at my disposal with no luck) which allowed me into recovery mode boot into CWM 3.0.5. From there I wiped/reset everything and the got nvflash to work once again. I AM NOT SUGGESTING USING CWM 3.0.5. It just was the only .zip file I could apply which did anything other than bootloop. THEN I NVFLASHED. I'm sure that CONTNUING TO USE THE WRONG CWM (3.0.5) WOULD HAVE HAD DIRE CONSEQUENCES.
[G Tablet General] kekinash:
The same happened to me once, but I did full format and it worked again. :p
[G Tablet General] :
So happy I installed TTX after the first takedown of the links. :D

I actually did it yesterday and it was truly a breeze. The actual rom and supplement were easy. I love TTX, it's super fast and it just "feels" better than any other rom i have tried on my g tab. I have had no problems but then again like i mentioned i just installed it yesterday HOPEFULLY nothing goes wrong! I also like the recovery. It's functionality and look works well and nice.

Thanks Roebeet!
[G Tablet General] jerdog:
Thanks for your information on how you resolved the issue. The reality is that the ROM

does

in fact have the potential to cause problems for people who don't read the instructions or don't follow them precisely (as stated by roebeet in the OP) due to the bootloader. Having inaccurate information posted by others as to how to fix the problems doesn't help the matter - but let's keep in mind it is the non-released bootloader that is the problem and when instructions aren't followed precisely is when that problem rears it's ugly head.
[G Tablet General] roebeet:
3/22/2011 update - still staying down, will give this a few more days

I never thought this mod would cause such heated debate, and I apologize for that. It was never my intent.

Some of you are upset that I'm being throttled - I know I certainly was, at first. But at this point, I am keeping the links down strictly due to my own decision. I was given the OK to add them back today, but I have chosen not to do so.

The reason why is because I am waiting for Viewsonic to release their new firmware. I am hoping that it will be this week, and then I can test it and figure out how to proceed. At this point, I don't see the need to make things worse by opening up the links again - let's see what the vendor does. I will take the heat for that.

If the vendor does not have anything by the EO this weekend, I'm going to reactivate the TTx links. Now, some of you are going to be pissed off at this because it will potentially clog the IRC with user issues like it has before. To you I say this: tell these users that my post specifically states the risks, that this is not supported, and all the caveats were laid out clearly. If they chose to do this anyway, they can PM me and I will try to help them. But ultimately the decision was there's to make and we are not a support hotline if they screw up their device.

Between now and Sunday and I am going to pick apart my first post and completely re-write it (this is the other reason why I'm holding off for a few days). I am going to stress that, imo, anyone who tries this MUST master nvflash in advance. If at all possible, I will actually make this an nvflash only install (so far, my attempts to do that have failed). I might even hide the links in such a way that it forces you to read the instructions first.

With that in mind, if someone PM's me after Sunday that they used clockworkmod to install this and never used nvflash before, I am not going to be a happy person. If I'm going to be expected to support you like this is my day job, then I will treat you the same way I'd treat a Project Manager that releases a product into production without reading an installation document.

Again this is MY CALL. Don't yell at the moderators, this is not their decision anymore, this is my decision now.
[G Tablet General] kekinash:
OK, Roebeet if it is your decision I'm fine with it.

Thanks!
[G Tablet General] jrfree:
The great work that you have done on this and other ROMS and overall development is greatly appreciated. That being said, the warnings were obviously clear and if anything comes of this, perhaps it has forced some people to learn the important task of being able to nvflash their gtablets. As Android grows, so will the growing pains, however with people that give so much in helping others, it is the community that sets things above others :)
[G Tablet General] proneck321:
NV Flash

With all of the help from these great people.... even NV flash is a breeze.... its as simple as extracting to zips into one folder, and double clicking on a command. Oh yea dont forget volume- and power!!

I was considering a xoom next, but I see much better support and a better community here!! ( and better frame rates!)

Thanks Roe
[G Tablet General] roebeet:
Apologies for the semi-rant above

Getting pretty beat up this week..... I actually want to thank all the people here who have supported my actions so far, it's VERY appreciated.

One thing I can tell you is that my mods are not going away and, if we need to get off TNT Lite 5 / TTx if the vendor backpedals, I will test a solution to make you have a way off it. I already mentioned 3588 stock, but perhaps I'll have something better after VS releases something new.
[G Tablet General] karlkarloff:
First, let me say that I am a completely ignorant arsehole when it comes to nvflash, adb, or even android as a whole. I got my Gtab so i could read ebooks and so my 5 year old could play angry birds. I never play angry birds..cough, cough. With the help of everyone on XDA, Roebeet in particular, I was able to turn my kinda crappy tablet into something I show off in public. I'm running TwoTapsx now, and haven't had a single issue. I've never installed any other Rom except for TNT/TwoTaps and with every update or change, I have to thank Roebeet for the truly staggering amount of time, effort and patience he puts into them just so my sorry ass can fling birds across a screen. My hat is off to him, and no matter which way VS decides to go with the new update, I'll install whatever new ROM he comes up with. And if I say anything more, I'll have to propose marriage or something, and no one wants that.
[G Tablet General] P00r:
This is a very good idea! what is the issue? The partition arent readable back??
[G Tablet General] astb1:
I'm sure you may be feeling beat up.....but I know there have to be others like me out there that followed your directions, enjoy the ROM, and support you 1000%!!
[G Tablet General] roebeet:
Yeah, I tried doing a full nvflash backup and one of the partitions doesn't want to be saved. I tried doing an nvflash hybrid of old and new and it does install, but gets frozen after a short time. I haven't given up on it yet, however.
[G Tablet General] proneck321:
????? Im glad you know what your doing, sounds like spanish to me!
[G Tablet General] erraskey:
You have to wonder. ...

All the crap roebeet's taking. ... I wonder how many gtabs VS sold because of him and other devs. I bought mine in mid-Dec after visiting xda - never in this lifetime would have done so with the stock ROM. Three months in (and a couple of reflashes!!!) and I wouldn't second guess a thing roe has done. It's all FREE! Well OK you can make a donation.

But at this point you have to wonder what VS is up to. They're being passed in the marketplace left and right, and they soft release half-baked software through devs who're trying to make a functional tablet for users like me - something you'd think VS would do everything in their power to support.

Imagine where we'd all be if roe said screw it, I have a day job, I'm supporting other ROMs call VS if you have a problem.

So come on Viewsonic, act like a multinational and put some serious horsepower behind this product. And figure out what percentage of users are on stock vs an xda rom and get your corporate asses in gear and help support us too.
[G Tablet General] notsob2002:
Well the problem is that they didn't release the 3991 update in the first place. I think it was not intended for the Gtab and just because it was found does not indicate any direction of viewsonic now or in the future.

:(ale
[G Tablet General] malenhead:
Did I miss out?

Robeet:

Did I miss out on the Twotaps supplement to go over 5?

Just like that it was gone.......
[G Tablet General] notsob2002:
Have you the opportunity to try the bootloader with 3.0?

maybe the next official update will be that and 3991 would follow?
[G Tablet General] CARMELHILL:
I also wanted to voice my support for Roebeet. Without XDA and Roebeet I also wouldn't have bought the G Tab.

On the down side, I did the 5.0 upgrade without knowing how to use NVFlash or APX. I don't even know what APX, OP, CS, EU, and IRC mean. So I call myself extremely lucky that I din't screw things up. I also call myself extremely lucky and really anal, for reading the directions, step by step. Probably helped that I waited two days and saw all the posts with people bricking because they didn't

READ

.

So kudos to Roebeet for great work and lots of hours that he could have spent doing anything else.

Curiously too, I've never had to do a repartition. I don't know why I read about it all th etime, but I've never come across that as a problem. Again, I'm one lucky guy I guess.
[G Tablet General] roebeet:
That's one the first things I tried. :) We'd still need an AOSP image to really test it, however. The mish-mosh I have didn't work, unfortunately.
[G Tablet General] bkbrod:
+1 on that :)
[G Tablet General] Mikeg1969:
Another +1 here:D
[G Tablet General] Pazzu510:
Is TTx that good?

Sounds interesting in how many tweaks VS put on it but been honest, I saw all the "Requirements" i needed and backed up until something easier appeared.

I have two add that without the developers here, Not only reobeet, but specially him(because of tnt lite 2.2), g tablet would be just another tablet in the market.

So +1 on reobeet and the other Devs.
[G Tablet General] absorbers:
+100 from Russia on roebeet and XDA Devs.
[G Tablet General] markmac:
Just for note. I backed out of TNTLite 5.0 to stock with little to no issue. Used recovery to flash the stock Zip. A clearing of the data would have been preferable before, but it still worked. I then installed Clockwork and did a data wipe. Everything good and back to 3588 with enhancement.
[G Tablet General] roebeet:
You can also use adb and use this command with an adb shell:

wipe data

As long as you have adb, you can clear it out post-downgrade.
[G Tablet General] proneck321:
Cache issue

Roe,

I have been using the clockwork hack for TNT 5.0 (twotaps) and have noticed that when i clear cache, I lose stability, half my apps, and Titanium stops working.... is the cache containing way too much data or something? the same happened previously with the new bootloader from VS that came with this update. Just some info for you.

Thanks again for all.
[G Tablet General] kekinash:
I cleared the cache several times and did not see any problem. I think that Titanium is not restoring the apps properly. I never use titanium or other backups apps, they do more harm than benefits. I rather prefer just clean cache, and dalvik cache between rom updates.
[G Tablet General] proneck321:
are you on any supplementals? im just on 5.0 however im not sure how a build prop fix for market could have affected this..... im lost on this one
[G Tablet General] dony71:
I have installed CWM after update to TnT lite 5.0

Please confirm the step below and how to proceed with step 4 ??

Now if I want to recover 3588 stock :

1. Place stock 3588 update.zip + recover folder in /sdcard root

2. Reboot gtab

3. It will automatically flash update.zip

4. After flash update, gtab will not auto reboot? If not, which button

should I press to wipe data?
[G Tablet General] kekinash:
Running here 5.01. +CWM 0.8 special build for TnT 5, that's all (well and a few small additions of mine and modifications )
[G Tablet General] proneck321:
cache

thanks for the imput, back to the drawing board... its happened twice to me already (lost all my Angry Birds Rio data .... gotta figure out whats different about my setup.
[G Tablet General] danielsjam:
I will run this ROM until something better is available.
[G Tablet General] roebeet:
The Backout procedure is sound, I have tested it

I tested 3588 stock, TNT Lite 4.3.0 and gADAM reverson, with TNT Lite 5 / TwoTapsX standard recovery, and I haven't had any failures (yet).

I did do one shortcut, in that I've been testing TTx only. But, other than the name in the build.prop, TNT Lite 5.00 and TTx .900 are EXACTLY the same. So I think the tests are still valid.

Of course, nothing is 100% and my device might might act differently than yours. Assume the worst, which is that the backout might fail.
[G Tablet General] absorbers:
30 days and nights I studied this forum. Has learned by heart the decision of the primary goals: nvflash, CWM, ROM and kernel flashing. I have read many councils and opinions. Also has made the decision.

I will remain on 3588 stock until then while TwoTapsX won't be ready or VS will let out new updating. I will not flash CWM. All updatings I will do by a standard flashing.

roebeet

You think this decision optimum?
[G Tablet General] roebeet:
Stock is fine, if it suits your needs. Not everyone needs a rooted device.

I think we'll see something in a week - that's my guess.
[G Tablet General] absorbers:
Ok. We will wait.