yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Fascinate General] beray5:
Lithium-ion can't absorb overcharge, you need to keep the time remaining at stress voltage level as short as possible, steps 2, 8, 9 is forcing the battery to stay in at stress level. The result effect is similar to the no no -> "trickle charging", you're plating out your battery.
[Fascinate General] jonagpa:
hey thanks, did not know this was the case, you learn something new every day. I will update the OP.

I did this several times, I would say 7 or 8 times. I read it degrades the battery so I am prob screwed...
[Fascinate General] luke949:
very useful guide thanks!
[Fascinate General] ilogik:
So it seems my phone does not go to sleep and wheres my droid power is reporting that the dialers is at 13.19%, everything else is in the 2-3% range...
[Fascinate General] jonagpa:
anyone can correct me if I am wrong but I believe if you make calls the power you use probably gets logged as you dialer. I am just assuming this because my phone shows 8.02%

on a similar note, my beautiful widgets has 11.97%, It is the highest power consuming app. Anyone has same results?
[Fascinate General] r0ckstar:
adb debug of Wakelock issue

I have the battery drain issue on SC2.9, and I followed the example of troubleshooting the froyo battery drain by searching the logcat output. The only line that I see that contains Wakelock in my case is:

D/KeyguardViewMediator( 2468): pokeWakelock(5000)

I don't know what this means, but there doesn't seem to be any sort of 'counter' message to this one. Is this normal? I started logging after the screen was already dark. It's not clear if logcat should be started earlier than that to catch different activity. Also, SC2.9 comes with auto-rotate on by default, so I turned it off. I'm not sure if that will help or not, but I guess we'll see.
[Fascinate General] Sophos1:
Thank you for creating this thread. Using the Where is My Droid Power app I was able to track down a few apps (switcher pro, widgetlocker & WordsWithFriends) that were killing my battery. After deleting them off my phone I have nearly doubled my battery life! These screenies were taken the at the end of the first cycle after removing the apps. I hope others have similar success.

Cheers
[Fascinate General] xjestersdeadx:
This research tends to go against the overcharge statements made by that anonymous blog post mentioned by Beray.

To be honest, I don't know how much credibility a post made by someone who claims to not be able to reveal classified information, then decides to reveal SOME of the information, should be taken. I would take the detailed research of someone on this forum over an anonymous "I'm a secret agent" post anyday. :D

Bump charging definitely can degrade the battery, but it also (according to the link I posted) can give you increased battery life, although the battery life overall will be shorter. Also, it says you should NOT be draining the battery down all the way.

I've read this elsewhere as well- your battery has a certain number of cycles, say 300, and one cycle is a complete drain and recharge. Android and your battery are more than smart enough to figure out and "calibrate" your battery indicator based on a 20% drain and recharge. Thus your only using 1/5 of the battery life.

This is the research I've read. I keep seeing this "full drain" theory over and over, but literally no hard data to back it up. It might work, but the 20% drain method worked for me also without costing you a recharge cycle.

Everytime I install a new rom I'm not going to drain my battery all the way. Seems exactly opposite of what our smart technology is all about. But that's just me. I would love to see some hard data from consumer reports, a scientist, MIT, etc to prove me different.

Bottom line is I think the same thing can be achieved by a 20% drain replacing the full drain, and less damage to your battery. It has worked for me on three different Fascinates.
[Fascinate General] beray5:
I'd never mentioned any anonymous blog post, I normally never provide links nor other supportive opinions. I preferred people who read my posts to use their own brain and do whatever necessary for their own clarification. I had very little use for credibility, claim, belief, faith, etc <- more useful with PR, salesman, lawyer, and others where brain power is less important instead of paramount.

The Samsung Fascinate will maintain short minute topping charges once already fully charged, the very brief occurrences is approximately once per hour, this (pseudo trickle charge) is equivalent saturation charging. There is no need to perform bump-charging the Fascinate on your own and especially if you don't know what you are doing, while the built in saturation charging is perfectly good enough for the job.

The phone will not let you draining the battery down and depleted all the way, it will always automatically shut off at ~3.3V.

Lithium-ion battery charge levels can't be depended upon just voltage level readings, can't be depended upon just current readings, can't be fully depended upon with full range charge level readings. How would puny inaccurate 20% drain allowed for accurate full range calibrations?

I don't do anything to my battery when flashing, I only do something to it when my battery calibration got wiped out.

I'd used 20% drain calibrations often very successfully, but only on lead-acid based batteries where the battery charge reading is more, much more predictable.

For those who had read and still didn't quite understand "This research", it can be summarized succinctly as "saturation charging" for a better retained charge capacity.
[Fascinate General] andrewhat:
I am curious how long it is taking people to get a full charge from 0% to full. Mine seems to charge awful fast in about two hours or so from an outlet. My battery life is all over the place from 18 hours to 7 hours with minimal to moderate use.
[Fascinate General] beray5:
~2 HRS for wall power, ~5 HRS for USB power, and both apply only to fast charge level and not saturation charge level.
[Fascinate General] nirmdroid:
Sensor Issue

I assume this is what shows up when the sensors are having wakelock problems:

So I went ahead and logged it for about five minutes. In the log I saw a bunch of these:

D/KeyguardViewMediator( 2468): pokeWakelock(5000)

And one occurrence of these two:

V/WifiStateTracker( 2468): mWakeLock.acquired

V/WifiStateTracker( 2468): mWakeLock.released

Can someone help me figure out what exactly is causing the problem? And hopefully, how to resolve it as well?
[Fascinate General] imnuts:
Given that wifi is on and running nearly the entire time, that would probably be the reason for any battery drain you're having.
[Fascinate General] nirmdroid:
Thanks for helping figure this out. I guess I should have mentioned that I use wifi when I am at home. So then how can I verify that the screen and sensors are not causing any significant battery drain?
[Fascinate General] imnuts:
The easiest method would be to just put the phone in airplane mode, then restart it. Let it sit idle for 10-20 minutes and open up spare parts and see if running is at ~100% or not. Given that your wifi running is about the same as actual running, I'm inclined to think your drain is just being caused by wifi use.
[Fascinate General] jonagpa:
I dont think is your wifi because wakelock is been release. it must be keyguardviewmediator. I do not have any experience with this so hopefully someone can post an answer for you here.

try to do the same test, but try turning 1 thing off at a time and see what you get.

1 the auto rotate off

2 wifi off

don't know what other sensors could be bad, but the light sensor was mention somewhere. to fix that someone had to flash back to stock then flash back to what they were using. are you using SuperClean? if so go here after you flash back to stock. it uses odin to flash SC in ONE step, and thats it.

EDIT:

actually keyguardviewmediator sounds like the light sensor, it guards the keys in the di
[Fascinate General] hhp_211:
OK guys I have done a battery stats wipe.

... ... will now discharge, charge, wipe again and be good...hopefully

I am really curious as to how long it takes you to RE-Charge the battery.

up till this point, and the reason for me searching about the battery life topic, which my life has been pretty poor,... the charge time is ridiculously long ... like more than 4 hours either the USB [2 different usb and 2 different pc's] or Wall plugs [2 different ones], even if I have a % on there.

I have rarely seen the 100% u can unplug popup people talk about.

I have not seen any time spec on it either.

but it seems with an 800ma charger it should take approx 2 hours to charge a dead/discharged 1500 mah battery,... right?

I am hoping the wipe will help with this too, but I have not heard anyone talk about charge times long or short.

One other thing I have the 'battery indicator' program/app and it shows discharging from 86% when the phone said 100% and unplug.

maybe the conditioning will fix this , I did not see a place to clear it's cache or anything... ...

...and still shows "shows discharging from 86%" 16+- hours later when other regular status shows 28% now

Sorry if I have a lot of questions rolled into one post here.:o

.
[Fascinate General] quarky42:
To the post above: WiFi usage eats my battery very fast. If your WiFi is turned on, it will eat your battery. Try turning WiFi off and see how long your battery lasts. (I only turn my WiFi on just before I'm going to do something that needs it.)

To my power drain issue, I found a lot of pokeWakeLock and I found several PARTIAL_WAKE_LOCK and FULL_WAKE_LOCK entries. The Partial was for the GpsLocationProvider and the FULL was for keyguard.

I also found one instance of an acquire_wake_lock : AudioOutLock with a related release for it.

I also noticed a ton of entries for the Elixir widget I use. I may try turning that off to see if I get any better life. I hope not, 'cause I really like the Elixir Widget.
[Fascinate General] beray5:
I wished it was so simple. Charging and discharging used different battery status reporting.

The battery voltage level during discharge cycle is fairly linear and predictable enough to use for capacity status, but for charging cycle it's nearly useless as shown in the picture below from Battery University by courtesy of Cadex.

It also shown the battery capacity to be the most predictable with "time", it's the only thing linear enough to be usefully predictable enough for battery status despite the hump and bump.

Your phone shuts off at ~3.3V and normalized 3.5V as 0% charge level, obviously then the phone charging status is operating in the hump and bump time region instead the most precisely predictable linear time region; as well as not fully used 1500 mAH capacity. (~2 HRS for wall power, ~5 HRS for USB power)

For measuring capacity more precisely I'd rather not going into it but this may do for you.
[Fascinate General] andrewhat:
I noticed when my wifi is on it continually scans every 2-4 seconds for other networks even if I am already connected. I am pretty sure this is my battery problem because I turned off wifi and overnight only lost 6%. I thought I read something about this but couldn't find any thing about a fix.
[Fascinate General] DownRiver_Droid:
I have been getting better battery life since I bought the charger/battery combo from VZW. It was only $35 and I always have a spare.
[Fascinate General] jonagpa:
bump

come one guys keep this thread alive, I saw someone asking for help on the forums, he probably did not see this. Its up to everyone to keep this alive, I don't have all the answers so what ever you post (that's useful) I will add.
[Fascinate General] beray5:
The phone will not let you discharge all the way down until the battery completely depleted. It will always shut off at ~3.3V, 1/3 of battery capacity is used solely for the purpose of maintaining the phone integrity.

"~2 HRS for wall power, ~5 HRS for USB power" for charging meant at the best possible only 1000 mAH capacity is dedicated to end user phone usage and 500 mAH reserved for maintaining the phone integrity from a 1500 mAH battery.
[Fascinate General] landshark68:
Thanks for the info. I did not know about the phone not discharging the battery to completely depleted. Just passing on info I read in my research on the battery issue. Thanks again.
[Fascinate General] jonagpa:
welcome to the forums here at xda.

Thats a lot of info, I would like to link to your thread over at AC instead of C&P to the OP, that way that info stays current. If you have a link post it and I will add that info to the op. Thanks for the post.
[Fascinate General] jonagpa:
I just want to confirm before adding this to the op, that when your phone reaches 0% and shuts off that does not count as a complete discharge? if so do you have any proof? your post seems logical but if you had an article or something along that line it would make it concrete.
[Fascinate General] landshark68:
Here's the link:

http://forum.androidcentral.com/ver...8399-how-discussion-improve-battery-life.html

Thanks for the welcome.
[Fascinate General] landshark68:
From another article I didn't post in my long winded diatribe:

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/charging_lithium_ion_batteries

Over-discharging Lithium-ion

Li-ion should never be discharged too low, and there are several safeguards to prevent this from happening. The equipment cuts off when the battery discharges to about 3.0V/cell, stopping the current flow. If the discharge continues to about 2.70V/cell or lower, the battery’s protection circuit puts the battery into a sleep mode. This renders the pack unserviceable and a recharge with most chargers is not possible. To prevent a battery from falling asleep, apply a partial charge before a long storage period.

Battery manufacturers ship batteries with a 40 percent charge. The low charge state reduces aging-related stress while allowing some self-discharge during storage. To minimize the current flow for the protection circuit before the battery is sold, advanced Li-ion packs feature a sleep mode that disables the protection circuit until activated by a brief charge or discharge. Once engaged, the battery remains operational and the on state can no longer be switched back to the standby mode.

Do not recharge lithium-ion if a cell has stayed at or below 1.5V for more than a week. Copper shunts may have formed inside the cells that can lead to a partial or total electrical short. If recharged, the cells might become unstable, causing excessive heat or showing other anomalies. Li-ion packs that have been under stress are more sensitive to mechanical abuse, such as vibration, dropping and exposure to heat.

I'm no engineer, but to me this supports what beray5 was saying, but also seems to say it is possible to go past the threshold. If it were completely fail safe that you could not discharge a Li ion battery past the useable threshold, why would there be warnings all over the place about completely discharging a Li ion battery? I'm just living by the adage "better safe then sorry."
[Fascinate General] beray5:
As far as your Fascinate goes, discharge battery voltage at 3.5V is 0% and the shut down discharge voltage limit is 3.3V.

Simplified facts often sound logical, you should independently clarify and validate them for yourself with your own phone, no other article/proof required.
[Fascinate General] landshark68:
Not everyone here is an electrical engineer and understands the voltages and all of that. In fact I'd be willing to bet the majority of the people on these forums don't completely understand the voltages. So spouting out numbers doesn't tell us anything without showing us something that backs up those numbers. I went so far as to find an article that supported your contention that the phone will not allow the battery to completely discharge the battery. But the same article also said there are ways to go past the useable threshold.

But what you are suggesting is we take your work at face value, discharge our batteries until the phone is dead to clarify and validate them for ourselves, despite every article I read and linked to all having the same warning about not completely discharging a Li ion battery. We are all trying to help each other here and provide as much helpful information to each other. So thanks for you "help" and for being such a jag about it.

Sorry mods about the name calling, but I felt it needed to be said.
[Fascinate General] beray5:
The article failed to state that despite multiple safeguards, there is no 100% idiotproof safeguard preventing someone from doing something really stupid.

I said "independently clarify and validate them for yourself". I'm the single source, and I'm repeating them to you in a variety of methods which would have made them into "facts"? Other articles repeating them to you would have made them into "facts"? Or is it credibility, believability, trust, faith which would have made them into "facts" for you?

Assuming you believe your own mentioned article above, 3.5V and 3.3V are well above the limit that would kill your battery, you can verify them without ever risking your phone.
[Fascinate General] jonagpa:
alright guys keep it friendly, I know its hard but its also hard to effectively convey tone in the forums. Thanks :)
[Fascinate General] ssignature:
I have been through and through the battery recalibration, turning off almost everything that is not essential (including turning off background monitoring) and little seems to help. I have found that, at least for me, whenever my phone sits on the table in sleep state, the phone stays cool and the battery declines slowly but if it's in my holster (with a magnetic closure) it gets warm and eats through battery life. The screen does not stay on, nor does the phone indicate it's going into any dock mode. I need a few more days to be 100% sure of this.

The new undervolt kernals seem to help a little, as does SetCPU. It could be that my battery is damaged from rapid discharge. I may buy a second to find out.
[Fascinate General] pntballer505:
If I have Juice Defender can I trash CPU tuner, or

is that still good to have?

Thanks.
[Fascinate General] beray5:
It's probably my broken "Engrish". :)
[Fascinate General] landshark68:
No, not a problem. Sorry I got so pissy. Just that I would imagine most on the forum are like me. Know how to root and flash and understand all that, but get lost on some of the technical side. You were talking over my head at least when you just laid out the voltage, so it would have just helped if you could have at least pointed me or us in a direction of somewhere to read to better understand what you were saying. Thanks for the info.
[Fascinate General] jonagpa:
Have never used it, does it let you set when the phone uses data? if so what options does it give you?

you can try juice defender free too, not the full version but it might give you and idea on what it does.
[Fascinate General] beray5:
No worry there, I'm not a Lithium-ion expert either, my specialty is graphic hardware.

Proof that the phone would never completely deplete the battery...

1- The phone will shut down at 3.3V discharge voltage.

2- Voltage based devices in the phone such as the processor would tolerate even what little voltage a compromised battery could put out, but other power based devices would not. For example...

Let say I needed 3W of PEP (peak envelope power) to reach a cell tower 2 miles down the road (power required to go long distance).

POWER = VOLTAGE x CURRENT

As voltage drops down toward zero, current heads up toward infinity to maintain required power. The phone simply is not made to handle infinite current. (current is what heats up the phone and burns things out)

eg, no engineer would ever allow the phone battery to be completely depleted and compromised other hardware integrity.
[Fascinate General] PIX3LPUSH3R:
I tried 2.2 out a few weeks ago and decided I couldn't live without Voodoo Sound and BLN so I decided to wait it out. Obviously we have these enhancements available for Froyo now, so I made the jump to JT's initial EC10 release.

Everything worked fine, I just didn't feel that "snappiness" I had before. I thought maybe it had something to do with being undervolted (even though only slightly.) I saw that there were some problems with imnuts initial kernals he posted and waited to flash the updated (fixed) link for 0328_imnuts_sv_voodoo.zip. I flashed last night, booted up, and played around for a little bit and everything was working great. I had it plugged in to charge overnight. That brings me to my issue...

I woke up this morning, reached over to turn my phone on and I got NOTHING. No boot, samsung, lights, nada...I thought "****, I really bricked my phone now." I tried booting into recovery using the 3-button combo, plugging it in my computer to try download mode, plugging my charger in different outlets,etc...The phone seemed like there was no sign of life. I was ready to head to Verizon before work then decided to plug in my car charger for ****s and giggles and sure enough...IT WORKED! It started charging and I turned the phone on. Now I am at work and the phone seems to be working just fine...I even have the usb plugged in my computer and it is charging now (The same one that didn't work this morning.) This has never happened to me before and it was pretty scary. I have had to ODIN before, but I was worried that wasn't even an option. Thanks god everything SEEMS to be working fine right now, though that made me a little concerned.

Do anyone have ANY idea what might have happened!? Thanks in advance.

Update: After a couple hours, I saw my battery start to wig out. It went from being at like 34% to flashing the "low battery" warning. It then turned off and did the exact same thing. I had to go out to use my car charger to get into recovery. I wiped cache/dalvik cach, and re-installed SC. Not sure if it's kernal/ROM/Theme....This seems more complicated than just re-calibrating the battery stats. Maybe I did permanent battery damage??

Update 2: It looks like the problem was a bad charger!

Voodoo'd Samsung Fascinate

Kernal: 0328_imnuts_sv_voodoo

ROM: Superclean 2.9.2

Theme: Nitro's Ultimate Honeycomb v3.1.2
[Fascinate General] beray5:
Damaged, intermittent, USB cable connection?
[Fascinate General] landshark68:
Thanks, beray5. That makes sense to me and clears up some confusion.
[Fascinate General] landshark68:
Well if your car charger is working, and the usb cable connected to your work computer is the same one you were using to try and charge the phone overnight, the one element that isn't present when it is working is the ac plug the usb cord connects to. Might want to look there.
[Fascinate General] pntballer505:
Well i realized Cpu tuner or Setcpu was making my phone freeze..

so I have the ultimate Juice defender and am getting some pretty good results

so far.
[Fascinate General] o0HERO0o:
To figure out what it is, adb is the easiest. Run adb logcat > logcat.log with you phone plugged in and allow it to sit idle for 2-3 min, at least long enough for the screen to turn off and the phone to idle a minute with the screen off. Then, press Ctrl+C to stop the output and open up the logcat.log file. Search for Wakelock and make sure that everything that creates a wakelock also releases the wakelock.

So if it is creating a wakelock and not releasing how do I get it to release?
[Fascinate General] jonagpa:
A sure way is to go back to

original

stock using odin, then flash the rom, kernel and radio that you need to get you back. You can also try to do a factory reset and clear the cache through CWM. There might be other ways so hopefully someone post how to do it with out resetting your phone.