yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Windows Phone 7 General] Bleak Morn:
No, no, no... You misunderstand.

It's the fact that when I paste testimony from Apple laywers where they state that no reasonable person should believe what they say - then you assert (with hyperbole) that they have never lied to you in any way. :)

You want to believe in the face of any evidence to the contrary. That is what makes you a fanboi. :D
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
Oh, I get it now. Time for the ignore list. :D

By the way, I would have given you consideration if you hadn't made claims about me. Because of that, you have no credibility at all.
[Windows Phone 7 General] xThe Enforcer:
Amen, OP.
[Windows Phone 7 General] vel0city1:
Complete lie. I've had several devices with proximity sensors to turn off displays when you bring them close to your face and gyroscopes to change orientation automatically, many well before the iPhone was released.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
********. Complete and total lie and I charge you to name them!
[Windows Phone 7 General] naplesbill:
The Nokia N95 had an accelerometer and was released in March 2007. The iPhone wasn't released until June 2007.

The Gyroscope made it to the iPhone with the iPhone 4. The Wii controller had a lot to do with making this a popular technology.

The bottom line is, Apple rarely innovates (I didn't say never, so don't overreact), they just package hardware with software well. Compare the iPad2 hardware to the Xoom hardware and you will understand how packaging is what they do best. The Xoom beats the iPad in pretty much every hardware category. Unfortunately, Honeycomb is still new and needs a bit of maturity to equal IOS on a tablet.

The use of capacitive touchscreens was a surprise to most experts. The glass screen is fragile and many mobile users (at that time) relied on pen input. I give Apple credit for taking the risk of using capacitive glass screens. The only downside is that they are fragile and easily cracked. I do think the use of a glass back on the iPhone 4 is pretty dumb though. I would rather have seen an aluminum unibody that included the back of the device.
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
Umm Apple told a whale of a lie to deflect blame about Antenna-Gate. I am sure you remember this little white lie (pun intended)

White iPhone - End of July 2010

Which in a nutshell shows how absolutely unreasonable people are being when it comes to this whole NoDo delay. Has Apple EVER said up to this day why we never saw the white iPhone come to market?

It must clearly come down to respect or lack there of. Because people in here seem to have afforded Apple more patience than Microsoft.

We all know why NoDo has been delayed. The pre-update blew up on Omnia 7 phones. We see that new devices are coming out with NoDo on.

So Apple lied to all of us. Maybe you chose to forget. Conveniently.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Tone_:
Sorry but you are the least objective person on XDA and are what you seem to hate:
[Windows Phone 7 General] nrfitchett4:
Since we are all a bunch of losers, why don't you just stay off of this forum??? It's obvious that wp7 did not live up to your lofty expectations, so move on already. I'm sure there are plenty of people willing to take the device off your hands.

This is why I rarely come on here anymore....

and all this coming from an iphone user...

Why would you get an iphone4 so close to iphone5 release date? Is that so you can complain about the iphone4 down the road as being old hardware???
[Windows Phone 7 General] Tone_:
I see someone deleted most of martys rants on that link hoping WP7 fails badly etc

This sum up your objectivity (a phone you don't even own)
[Windows Phone 7 General] conantroutman:
Okay guys enough is enough.........

I've been trying to avoid having to step in and get involved in this in the hope that it would fizzle out. Obviously thats not the case...

I'm not going to close this thread as I beleive it has the potential for a reasonable discussion, however I'm going to clean some of these recent posts before this gets any more out of hand.

Also, as far as I'm concerned what happens on other forums, stays on other forums.

If you wish to contribute to this thread from this point on then please ensure your posts are on topic and not posted purely with the intention of provoking a reaction. If this thread does not get back on topic thn it will be closed.

Thanks for you cooperation.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Vintage144:
Last I heard this was the "developers" forum, which to me regardless of whether your a developer or not , this is the cutting edge. If you bought a wp7 and came to this forum, c/p , multi tasking and other nothings should never even be brought up . theres a wealth of info in the minds of the key people on this forum , read it all and use it , I dont have nearly the apps that some people have , I love testing beta and alpha , the wp7 phone isnt going away , it is here for good , the Nokia company says they wont have a wp7 for 2 years, well theres a lifeline !

Microsoft is a winner , your computer at home, at the office is running Windows , unless your at school somewhere Windows is in 90% of all computers , you dont think they have been paying attention ?

Sit back and enjoy the phone for awhile , dont get so bent on updates , im sure you dont sit at your office waiting for sp1 or sp2?
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
You obviously didn't read what I said about the tech the iPhone embodied. You get it all without having to own several devices containing each single piece of tech. The iPhone was the first to give it all in one device. But there was no capacitive screen before the iPhone.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
There never was a problem with the antenna. It was a bunch of Apple haters taking opportunity to bash an new idea. I own one. I never see that trouble. Yet my HD7 and HD2 have it worse.

The white iPhone 4 was held up because of painting problems. http://pocketnow.com/iphone/white-iphone-4-production-starting-march-shipping-by-april

I don't choose to get involved with any lies. If I did, I wouldn't have any kind of tech or products. Especially a WP7 device. Biggest lie told right there by MS...about updating.
[Windows Phone 7 General] nrfitchett4:
if it wasn't a problem, then why did they alter the antenna design in the verizon version???
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
Probably to be a kind of placebo effect for all the ppl who believed the lie about there being a real issue.
[Windows Phone 7 General] rhory:
Simple question, no semantics, WP7, Beta or fully fledged OS.

See plenty of conflicting opinions shooting in different directions, also the sterling defence of all things Gatesy by the uber microites.

I own a HD7 on O2, I reckon it WP7 has been released far to early and is nothing more than a public testing beta, for which the public is paying for that dubious privelege.

Back to using my HD2 on dual boot, until there is a big improvement in WP7 if ever, HD2 is where I will stay.

Taking the shackle off, as I have said before would be a big step forward, but I understand the ubers are all for lock-down retention, reminds me of Luddites.

Civil opinions invited.
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
No no no no no, Marty you are not going to dodge this one, You are not Neo and this is not The Matrix.

You said Apple has never lied to you. At the beginning of July 2010 they flat out lied and said the white iPhone was coming out at the end of July. That was a lie.

And that was not an unforseen circumstances lie. They sell millions of these things and you would need 100,000+ of these white iPhones ready to be sold in order to make that kind of announcement with that kind of timeframe.

They lied to you, me and everything else. Please retract your comment that Apple has never lied to you when clearly they did about the white iPhone.

Which is actually at best the same with Windows Phone 7 and the late update. And at worst a bigger lie because Microsoft had the update ready but encountered difficulties. I put money that Apple was flat out not ready to ship a white iPhone without problems.
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
People do not run a successful business like that. If you thought about it for one second logically you would not post those kind of things.

1 - It cost money to redesign stuff. You do not incur unnecessary bills for a placebo effect.

2 - Those things matter to techies that would follow a teardown of the phone.

3 - When the phone is analyzed and found to have been altered you look like a liar.

And a placebo is when someone thinks they are being treated when they are not, e.g. a sugar pill. Apple never made public the antenna redesign so that does not even apply.

All in all you just would not do it.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
You can't deflect the big lie of MS that easy.

Apple has never lied to me. I have never heard any kind of statement from Apple that turned out to be untrue. I apologize if that is hard for you to accept, but it is actual truth.

But I guarantee MS has lied to me. It's hard to avoid that lie because the device I bought based on that lie lets me down all the time.

By the way, I generally avoid any stories in the media...online and other...that talk about Apple. I especially avoid them from sites that are known to hate Apple. The reason for this is: I refuse to get caught up in the whole Apple hatred. The media can create it's own following which is why politicians love it so much. Tell a person something and they may or may not choose to believe it regardless if it is truth or not. The antenna issue is a classic example of this. There was no real issue. But since Apple made a new design that the Apple haters could made a big deal out of and have it appear to be partially legit, they took advantage of it. "OMG! The antenna is right there out in the open! Look everyone, it can be affected!"
[Windows Phone 7 General] vetvito:
Seriously? Cdma, GSM? Design improvements? Different radios?
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
So you are saying HTC needs to change the antenna on their phones? And every other company needs to change the antennas on their phones? I can prove my iPhone...from AT&T...has less signal drop than my two HTCs. You can analyze any phone and find an issue if you want.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
By the way, I was speculating why Apple changed the design. I know it wasn't because there was a real issue. But looking at the uproar the Apple haters caused, you would expect any company to bow to the wishes of such a vocal tiny group of ppl. And it is all about appearances as well. Verizon probably wanted Apple to alter the design just as an attempt to seem like they did something...to look good in the eyes of ignorant ppl.
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
I do not think you understand what I am saying. I will try to deliver my point differently:

It is not logical to go change an antenna design to make people feel better. And Apple would have had little motivation to do it as well.

The iPhone still sold well despite the whole fiasco. Why spend money to make people feel better?

Making unnecessary changes might cause actual problems. If it is indeed not broke then why tamper?

And placebo is not the right word to describe the whole thing.

And to say nothing is wrong then to make a change then makes them look bad. You do not expose yourself like that unnecessarily.

I think it is pretty simple, but I understand how I think.
[Windows Phone 7 General] truffle1234:
so how did MS lie to you... they told you that you will get your updates in Jan 2011??? you must have bought your phone from MS hardware shop???

come on MS never stated a date for update... all they give out is a 3 month period.... 1st quarter, 2nd quarter or 3rd quarter....

and if they promised you an update and did not deliver you will be suing MS by now insted of *****ing....
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
I know we will not get any further on this so this is me just putting this out there for any other person reading.

I know for a fact that MartyLK does not live under a rock. You want people to believe that you exist on the internet and read (because MS never made any other public announcement) about WP7 update schedule, yet you never heard anything about the white iphone 4 and its release dates?

No one in here believes that. Show me one person in here that did not hear that the white iphone 4 was supposed to be released sometime in 2010.

So the debate has degraded into some kind of deception. That you were unaware of the release date of the white iPhone 4 hence Apple is saintly and never lied to you. But MS, those lying ******** stole from us, spit on our children and kicked our puppies! Damn them!

Agendas... not limited to politics.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
I'm gonna leave you for the others that are going to eat you alive over that little statement...LMAO!
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
I get the point you are making. But I'm saying you don't understand the pressure of appearances.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
Sure they did. They didn't making any statement as to exact dates, but they did lead us to believe common, aggressive and plentiful updates would happen with WP7. Is no updates in 5 months common, aggressive and plentiful updating? And as for features, it will take a minimum of a year from launch to see them...if even then.
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
So that the other one does not have to be addressed right? Any other public announcement via newspaper, television, official statement on their website. But I will not follow that red herring.

The only point that I was looking for some kind of admission or clarification from you, but that sure did not happen. This is what stands:

Microsoft lied to you because they told you your phone would be updated by a certain time and it was not. That statement is true and you are right.

Apple never lied to you. If you were aware of the white iPhone then that statement is a lie. One that you are unwilling to own up to. Because you want to make MS a villian.

And okay I will go along with you for 2 minutes. You did live under a rock and were not aware that Apple deceived the public about the white iPhone 4. Now you know. All companies are liars. So let us not single out MS.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
Regarding Apple and the white iPhone, I keep forgetting to comment about it because being so overwhelmed by the statements of MS not lying. The updating was advertised as a feature of WP7, which MS would, themselves, do. As for the white iPhone, I was disappointed and actually pissed off that Apple didn't release it. They gave no mention, early on and for a long time...till actually just within the last month...as to why it was being delayed and a lot ppl, myself included, speculated that Apple was doing it for greedy reasons. I felt like they were being deceptive. But I got passed it and now actually prefer the black one to the white one. And the reasons are now clear as to why it was delayed.

Thinking about it, black has always been the sought after Apple device in the past. The iPods were always white and when the iPod Video was released in black, it was highly valued. Why would a black iPhone be any different? The white has always been the common shade. The black version of their devices has always been the more desired.
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
But Marty, and I am trying to be non-combative, it sounds like you are excusing what Apple did yet you are taking the axe to Microsoft.

Microsoft lied about the update release. There is no arguing that and I am not going to spin anything otherwise. But they did have challenges too and the delays are easily explained and justifiable.

Apple lied about the white iPhone 4. And told a horrible lie. Don't be tricked; they said at the beginning of July that they would ship out at the end. Yeah, right.

All I am asking is that we treat everyone the same.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
I agree. I am the choir to treat everyone the same. But I just don't see as big an issue with what Apple said of the white iPhone. It could be that Foxconn deceived Apple about being able to successfully produce the white ones and gave Apple an erroneous date. Things like this happen all the time. And it could be a similar situation with MS. But I feel cheated by MS because I bought a WP7 device. I don't feel cheated by Apple because I didn't have anything invested in it.

Foxconn could have felt pressured to say an erroneous date in order to keep Apple's lucrative business.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Tone_:
Marty you have already said you want Microsoft to fail miserably with windows phone, so everyone should take your posts with a pinch of salt as they cannot be objective.

You post on FUD on this and other forums..
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
I never hate a system based on the system. Figure that out, young grasshopper.
[Windows Phone 7 General] naplesbill:
And it appears you didn't get my point. My point was that Apple is good at packaging and marketing. They rarely create anything new, they just package it better than others.

So, without the others, Apple wouldn't be anything either. The bottom line is that we need ALL these companies in order for anything to progress. You could say that Microsoft was the first to package a touchscreen device with GPS and WiFi.

Sooner or later, someone will always do something better than the first. Don't get caught up in brands or individuals. You will eventually miss out on some great things.
[Windows Phone 7 General] naplesbill:
You really need to calm down and try to reason some of these things. This will be the first update for WP7. There are always pitfalls with the first update on a new platform. There is plenty of history on this topic for pretty much all platforms.

It is very likely that once this initial update is pushed out and working, future updates will come much easier.

All of the timelines you are creating are purely speculative and not based on any real data.

If you keep arguing for the sake of arguing, it will seem that you are just pushing your own agenda. Just relax and enjoy the discussion, it should not be taken so personally.

I am ticked at MS for not providing updates faster too! This is why I am currently using an HTC Inspire 4G. This doesn't mean I want MS to fail. I just decided that while I wait for the platform to mature, I need a device with certain features that WP7 doesn't provide. Turn by Turn Nav, Google Voice, WiFi tethering, etc...

I am fairly certain that all of these things will come to WP7. It will probably be 2012 before they are all there though.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
Didn't get past the calm down part. Why is it when I say something like what I have been debating, ppl think I'm not calm? I have no hysteria going on.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
Sooner has come...it's actually been here for a while. The iPhone is the most reliable phone I've ever used, but it doesn't do everything the best anymore. Android does some things better than iPhone. WP7 is smoother and cleaner than iPhone. WebOS has a better multitasking than the joke-of-them-all iPhone multitasking. No ****! The iPhone multitasking is an unfunny joke.

But the iPhone did bring it all together, like you said, into one simple and reliable phone. And there is a lot of tech the Japs and Chinese use that was invented in the US back in the '50s, '60s and '70s. But it takes sufficient organization to make use of it. Apple had such organizational abilities. And Apple does work their asses off to make iOS what it is.
[Windows Phone 7 General] naplesbill:
Nobody said anything about hysteria! Calm down is a statement used to try to relieve some heat in a debate. If you want to take it to the extreme you are more than welcome to.

If you can't find a way to be reasonable, then your only reason for posting is to incite behavior that is unnecessary.
[Windows Phone 7 General] naplesbill:
I agree with a lot of what you are saying here. But, I wasn't speaking about any manufacturer or device in particular. The point of my sooner or later comment is that you can't blindly follow any brand. That is how you will end up paying more for less. This applies across all industries. No manufacturer or brand is perfect. Keep your eyes open and don't let marketing fool you.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
I prefer to be very reasonable...at all times. But I do face a lot of irrationality in this forum. I have a super hard time dealing with it...when you are called a troll and labeled argumentative when you aren't tends to annoy super bad. I prefer to remain unbiased and criticize as well as praise any system. But some on here can't handle anything shy of lovey-dovey, kissy-huggy words about their system.

I realize MS might have their hands full of the carriers knocking them down. But you know what?? MS can beat them to a bloody pulp and tell 'em to get lost and still succeed. Or they can buy the frakkers and replace their idiot CEOs with friendly forces. But they cow down and let the carriers rule the roost. Let MS stop being a friggin wimp and take serious action, like they advertised they would..."Updates will come from us, not the carriers".
[Windows Phone 7 General] error_401:
We should start to see expensive things like smartphones more as an investment then just buy another one.

But that is the sad reality. I happyliy lived 6 years with my previous phone which is still sitting in its original box as a backup phone NOKIA 6820.

I'd love them to stop trying to chain users to manufacturers and cell phone companies but to develop a serious software OS which hosts applications. Looking forward to the linux build on HTC TP2. Hope they get it working this year - that would make a change.
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
Marty, Apple is a company that sells a million iPhones in a month. They announced a few days into July that the white iPhone will be released at the end of July.

Seriously, you do not make that kind of announcement unless you have a quite a few ready to put on the shelves. You know that. I know that. They lied with intent to lie. They knew they would not be able to deliver, but they had to put some positive news out there. There was no good excuse and we should not look for one.

Some people are out to crucify Microsoft.

Windows Phone 7 gives users a significantly different OS in look and feel. That is a win for the consumer. It also is a stable, fast, and well-designed OS. It also has given us a whole lot for an initial offering in terms of hardware options and software features.

If you think WP7 is a failure then what about WebOS? So much promise but killed by bugs, lack of apps, and limited handset choices.

Windows will get to the point where the missing features list will shrink to a handful. I cannot help but feel too much time and energy is spent praising and bashing the OS. If you do not like WP7 and you do not own a handset then move onto another forum. If you do not like WP7 and own a handset then get rid of it. To me it is pretty simple. I go to the Android forum when I want to find out things like why Angry Birds does not run properly on my Wildfire. I do not go there to piss on the OS.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
I truly don't believe WP7 is a failure. In fact, I must think it has superior potential or maybe, just maybe, I wouldn't stick with it. I do love WP7 in and of itself...without love for MS. Not saying I hate MS. Not saying I love them. I just am a bit peeved that they are letting the GD carriers rule it over them.

And as for Android apps running properly. I have been surprised how much higher quality the Android apps I choose are than iPhone or WP7 apps. I love card games and the ones to play are on Android. I find the XDA app on Android to be much better than Tapatalk...stuff like that. There are some excellent game apps on WP7...in fact I find the overall gaming experience on WP7 to be the best there is. But there is plenty of room for criticism of WP7.

I do fill prideful that Steve Jobs, an American, is the world's most valuable CEO, and basically a hippy, like me. But Apple is just another corporation among many. However, they do work their asses off to make iOS what it is.