yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
Maybe he is also not married?
[Windows Phone 7 General] z33dev33l:
1. The update was never stated for December, don't know where you're getting that info from.

2. iOS doesn't have to jump through hoops to get their updates past OEMs and carriers and their updates are also small even in comparison to NoDo. They were pretty much the first of their kind so they could tell ATT to bend over and do whatever they wanted to the contract.

3. NoDo is primarily bugfixes. C&P was tossed on so those of us with perfectly functional devices gain something to. I still doubt most people will use it.

4. Again, no idea where you're pulling these time frames out of.

I agree, their pacing is too slow but they're new at actually being competitors in the smartphone market and like it or not what it has now is enough for most people regardless of the numbers because people are loyal to android/iphone/RIM. Do you really think the vast majority cares about C&P and multi-tasking? No, us XDA members are a niche market and though I'm sure they'd love to cater to all of us most cellphone users are complete morons and would be amused just as much by a ball in a cup.
[Windows Phone 7 General] nathantw:
I'm starting to believe that the Windows and Office patch was what was being released today (Tuesday). http://news.cnet.com/8301-27080_3-20040672-245.html
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
I can see a dead end before I need to reverse. Your logic is broken so where can anyone go?

1 - "The update is 4 months overdue" very simply states your obvious obstinance to the whole situation. So WP7 was supposed to be totally new and completely perfect. I bet you are not a developer. Anyone else think that is a reasonable expectation?

2 - iOS update history. Maybe if you were indeed talking to someone clueless that actually did not own an iPhone that statement would have fooled me. Yes, the iPhone got 4 updates in 4 months. Adding an icon to the home screen, Safari security update and other small details. Where was copy and paste? 2 years later. You, sir have zero credibility when you say that.

3 - So that is your choice and I do not believe it is fair. Development is development even if you are behind. I reiterate you probably are not a software developer.

4 - I lost the ability to comprehend and hence interest. Maybe I am limited. I will try to improve.

I am not defending Microsoft, I am chastising people. I have owned every smartphone OS except for a BlackBerry, WebOS, and Windows Phone 7. I have no agenda.

When I look at your post and read the whole iOS got 4 updates in its first 4 months b.s. that summarizes your thinking in a nutshell.
[Windows Phone 7 General] mKTank:
For the millionth time, it's not the update contents that matter, but the fact that Apple was dedicated enough to fix issues right away instead of wait 5 months. Stop being so daft.

God, it's as bad as MacRumors in here sometimes. Fanboys everywhere.

Sent from my Samsung Focus using Board Express
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
Here are the bug fixes you got with iOS

1.0.0 1 - June 29, 2007

- Initial release on iPhone

1.0.1 1 - July 31, 2007

- Safari security update

1.0.2 1 - August 21, 2007

- Items deleted on phone no longer sync back to phone

- Able to process multi-line addresses in Maps

- Custom ringtones no longer lost on restore

1.1 - September 14, 2007

- Initial release on iPod Touch 1st generation

- iTunes Music Store with home screen icon

1.1.1 September 27, 2007

- Louder speakerphone and receiver volume

- Home button double-click shortcut to phone favorites or music controls

- Spacebar double-tap shortcut to intelligently insert period and space (i.e.: ". ")

- Mail attachments are viewable in portrait and landscape modes

- Stocks and cities in Stocks and Weather can be reordered

- Apple Bluetooth Headset battery status in the Status Bar

- Support for TV out

- Preferences to turn off EDGE/GPRS when roaming internationally (Data Roaming on/off option)

- New Passcode lock time intervals

- Adjustable alert volume

- New interface for the Calculator application.

How many of these problems translate onto Windows Phone? I admitted do not own one so I do not know.

Here is my list of missing features on WP7:

Cut, Copy & Paste - missing in iPhone til 2009

Custom ringtones - missing in iPhone

Turn-by-turn Navigation - missing in iPhone til 2009

Multitasking - umm.

Adobe Flash - right.

HTML5 - only recently.

Silverlight - nope

Tethering - with jailbreak

Video Calling - facetime is the best you get and that is very recent

VoIP Calling

Smart Dialer

Mass Storage Mode

Bluetooth Transfer - won't ever make it

Universal Search

System Wide File Manager

On-device Encryption -

VPN
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
I did not read your posts prior stating your opinion. So you are happy with any update just once you get them?

Then WP7 got 1 update. Yippee!
[Windows Phone 7 General] mKTank:
The update didn't do anything. And it came out ater 4.5 months.

Sent from my Samsung Focus using Board Express
[Windows Phone 7 General] FishFaceMcGee:
You realize the update you have isn't NoDo, right?
[Windows Phone 7 General] mKTank:
Yes. That's why I said it did nothing.

Sent from my Samsung Focus using Board Express
[Windows Phone 7 General] sure haven't:
*facepalm*
[Windows Phone 7 General] mKTank:
Lol at all the fanboys defending MS.

Sent from my Samsung Focus using Board Express
[Windows Phone 7 General] steve10:
The problem is that Microsoft won't commit to a timeline. All of the early adopters, who are primarily dedicated customers who gave Microsoft the benefit of the doubt that they would get this right unlike the many update issues (primarily lack of updates, especially ones that didn't involve wiping the phone to install them) that plagued Windows Mobile, are now left with disappointment. Many of those people paid $199+ under contract for their handsets (which are now only $99 on most US carriers), and yet they continue to be strung along while Microsoft sits in silence. If the update is finalized, then they just need to say so. Another blog post, like the pre-NoDo update posts is all we need. Nothing can happen in the six days between today and March 14. Nothing. If the update has to be changed, it would add 4-6 weeks to the deployment. So if it is ready, they are doing nobody a favor by holding it back an additional six days, or even one day.

If it is the carriers holding back these updates, it is also doing them no good. Everybody says "carriers want to prevent updates from going through to sell more phones." Who is going to buy a new phone right now? Any Windows Phone 7 user with a phone purchased under contract is going to be under that contract until at least October 2012 (November 2012 in the US). And those who dropped $500+ to stay out of contract did so for a reason. Most people who buy phones from other parties aren't going to go back to the carrier to buy their next phone. Most customers who spend the extra $300-400 always do so to stay out of contract, and avoid carrier locking and branding. Regardless, there are so few of those customers out there that I doubt the carriers are even thinking about ways to only affect such a small minority of users.

Ultimately, this isn't an issue of Microsoft or the carriers blocking updates. This is an issue of Microsoft trying to be Apple and pretend a problem doesn't exist when it does. Nobody likes somebody who keeps secrets for no good reason. Well, maybe Apple can get away with it and keep their customers loyal. But when it comes to Microsoft that kind of behavior just p***es people off and makes people recommend the iPhone and Android to their friends and family instead of making new WP7 users out of them.

If Microsoft really wants to do the best it can, it doesn't need to deliver this update today (though in a perfect world, that would help). They simply need to post to their Windows Phone blog once or twice a week and let us know where things stand. I don't need to know (nor do I really care) which carrier is blocking this update, if they are. I don't need to know what sort of problem Microsoft might be having that is holding things up, if that is the case. All I need to know is that I shouldn't get my hopes up that today might be the day that the update finally comes, only to be let down again. If it is coming out March 14th, then just say so. If it's coming out no earlier than March 9th, we should have been told. My complaint is not with delays. Delays happen. Just keep the lines of communication open and don't become like Apple.
[Windows Phone 7 General] FishFaceMcGee:
How is it defending MS when we're talking about NoDo and then you come in and talk about how the pre-update didn't do anything to your phone?
[Windows Phone 7 General] MrLuigi:
You mean official updates. At least with Android if there was an issue that needed fixing the community could fix it.
[Windows Phone 7 General] emigrating:
No, there was also documentation mentioning a "January update". The page previously linked by a january Uri for instance mentioned january also in the header for a day or two before being changed.

That's not all though, the developer tools update we received earlier this year was called ... wait for it ... Windows Phone Developer Tools January 2011 Update. Do I even have to go into the irony of this update not being released until 3rd February? The OS version included in the emulator in these tools is 7.0.7389 (you can factcheck this by using System.Environment.OSversion in the emulator), the same version (or possibly one iteration earlier) which is expected to hit actual devices when NoDo is finally released.

Believe me, Microsoft had all intents on releasing this in January. Something made [forced?] them hold onto it. This isn't necessarily bad news though as it means any code written since January is previously unseen features/fixes - likely leading up to a summer update.

My bet is that the OEMs are the ones responsible for the delay though. They're the only party who has a financial stake in delaying updates. Of course, it could be held by MS due to the Update mechanism being broken (as seen by the Samsung "fiasco" - although IMO that was entirely Samsung's fault). We will likely never know for sure what the reason is/was.

Personally I don't really care. I'm not bothered by this update either way, and I'll likely hold off installing it for a few weeks or months anyhow. I've actually gone back to 7004 from 7008 due to the later build being less "smooth" - as in, the device would crash on me, something it's never done on 7004.
[Windows Phone 7 General] hboos:
wow..

it's the same as ever here...

people complaining about the lack of updates

people complaining about the people that are already complaining

and me complaining that there is so much complaining whichever way.

why won't the mods just close these pointless threads!

PLEASE CLOSE!
[Windows Phone 7 General] microhaxo:
Update: Surprise, surprise. Neowin has been informed that the "NoDo" update has been delayed, due to Microsoft itself. Carriers worldwide have approved the update, but Microsoft has likely delayed it due to issues with the pre-update on Samsung phones. We're told that we should see the update "this week" still.

- neowin
[Windows Phone 7 General] Michael-Dallas:
Awesome thread. I love reading threads about people getting worked up over phone updates.

Michael.
[Windows Phone 7 General] mKTank:
Sigh.

Saw it coming a mile away.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Tim.Smith:
I think they should just release it. It's going to mess up for a small percentage of people but oh well, it's impossible to avoid. There is no way for 100% of the phones to update without problems.
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
"The update didn't do anything. And it came out ater 4.5 months."

The update did do something. It did not do anything that you could appreciate. Which leads right into this:

"For the millionth time, it's not the update contents that matter, but the fact that Apple was dedicated enough to fix issues right away instead of wait 5 months."

The pre-NoDo update does do something - it improves the way future updates will be delivered. Which is a bug fix.

iOS had many bug fixes and missing features that 1.x and 2.x did not address and were addressed in 3.x and then 4.x.

If I am a fanboy then you are a hater? I do not know what your expectations were when you purchased your Samsung Focus, nor what you expectations are now that you own the phone but again if you find the phone unsuitable due to insufficient updates maybe you are better off getting an Android phone.

There are many good reasons to own an iPhone, and Android Phone, and a Windows phone. Get the phone that in its current state suits you best and you will have zero issues. The only thing that stops me from owning a Windows Phone is the lack of Skype and Whatsapp. I am confident that it is a matter of time but I am following my own advice.

I cannot figure out if to get an HTC Trophy or Mozart.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Tim.Smith:
You should just go get an android or iphone. You appear to not like Microsoft or Windows Phone so I don't understand why you're using one. Oh and calling anyone that defends the phone/Microsoft a fanboy is one step below using "M$" on the douche scale.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
If I could, I would get the Dell Venue Pro. Such a nice phone. But otherwise the HTC HD7 suits the need.
[Windows Phone 7 General] bennyj71:
As a Focus owner, I would understand the delay, but no ATT or T-mobile phone has gotten an update. I understand the people complaining as well as the people saying calm down. I think the bigger issue that worries people is this: Considering all the mystery of receiving Nodo what happens with Mango? After all the carriers will now be freed to skip it. So this may be the only update many of us ever get. Nokia should be online by then and that will determine if many of us stay with WP. I never got the update for the update. Hell in six years of WinMo phones, I think I got 3 official updates. I found this site for workarounds to getting updates, this doesn't exist for us yet. The fact that MS has slowed the homebrew development by embracing the hackers may be good longterm. Unfortunately, it has slowed work arounds for some current problems.
[Windows Phone 7 General] mKTank:
Basing your entire argument around insults. How typical.
[Windows Phone 7 General] uryu_ishida:
Internally, they were planning for a January release. What happened? Nokia happened. Many developers were siphoned off to begin developing a version for Nokia's hardware and with Nokia-specific features.

Not speculation, this is from a reliable source.
[Windows Phone 7 General] swanny78:
So is it out today or not? I think reading between the arguments.....no one knows. I think we should just wait and be patient.

btw, while you guys are stuck in traffic not ringing your wifes I am b*l*s deep in her showing her hows its done.... :D
[Windows Phone 7 General] z33dev33l:
Oh cool, another sad lonely kid trying to sound cool on the internet :/

Early January is speculation, always has been.
[Windows Phone 7 General] nok_fusion:
now we Can wait peace of mind for the update This week :)
[Windows Phone 7 General] emigrating:
I call bull****. There will be no Nokia specific hardware or features as such. Also, the people working on that layer of the OS would have little to no involvement in the kind of updates we are currently getting.

Sorry, but it just isn't. Read my previous post for more in depth info.
[Windows Phone 7 General] uryu_ishida:
Perhaps. It is merely one person's perception who is quite in the middle of all of this.

Do we know this? My impression was that there will be quite a bit of Nokia-specific stuff, or at least changes to cater to Nokia as a manufacturer. Otherwise why wait until winter to release anything.

Could you be more specific?
[Windows Phone 7 General] emigrating:
Sure. The people who would be involved in creating support for different hardware are those writing drivers and other low-level code (which, for WP7, is provided directly by MS). Sure, some of this is included in NoDo (CDMA support being one) but generally what we're getting is UI and functionality fixes.

In any case, the update has been sitting at the MS campus ready for roll-out since January so even if Microsoft had provided their entire WP7 team to Nokia it would have no bearing on why the NoDo update hasn't yet been released.

Why wait until winter? Because it takes that long (usually even longer) to take an actual device from planning to prototype to manufacturing.
[Windows Phone 7 General] amtrakcn:
6 Days left for "Early March", still waiting...
[Windows Phone 7 General] N8ter:
I agree. I think WP7 is a bit similar to iOS in how it handles some things, but I don't think I'll ever buy another Windows phone. After my contract is up I'll probably switch carriers to get an iPhone or one of the new QNX Blackberries.

I'm not exactly pissed (hard to be pissed after the vibrant debacle), but Idont think Microsoft has a chance in this market with how slow they move. Nokia will help them, bit not much. The biggest thing from that deal will be the cheap phones Nokia will whore out to some overseas market.

Sent from my HD7 using Board Express
[Windows Phone 7 General] N8ter:
My post above quoted the wrong post. Too lazy tofix it. Blame Board Express...

Sent from my HD7 using Board Express
[Windows Phone 7 General] N8ter:
to try to get people to buy Nokia devices.

Microsoft is letting Nokia use their crappy off display resolutions, so I wouldn't touch their phones anyways. Nokia phones use good materials and are sturdy with good reception. However they have always insisted on using that Crap ass display resolution. That ruins it for me.

Additionally, the Nokia deal gives them an alibi to delay an update that was probably due to arrivelate anyways. The update schedule for wp7 is going to be worse than Android. By the time you get two updates "worth mentioning" toll be due for a new phone. Given the feature disparity and lack of some ridiculously useful apps(WhatsApp etc.)... I only find wp7 enjoyable to use because its not hard to pick up my Vibrant to fill in the gaps...

Sent from my HD7 using Board Express
[Windows Phone 7 General] domineus:
hate to the add to the name calling, but I call bs for a few reasons

Brandon Watson openly stated frequently via ppcgeeks chat that the only announcement for late january/early february was nodo developer tools updated. He clarified that the tools will be released first followed by the nodo update before the end of Q1 spring.

In his mind, users were going to get the update in Q1 and after january. There wasn't much he could disclose, but he could clarify on that.

And developer strength of wp7...
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
I actually do not think this will be the fate of Windows Phone. I am not knowledgeable enough with the WP7 experience yet but it seems from what I read that WP7 feels snappier than Android when comparing two phone with similar internals.

I know in programming one thing is true: It costs resources to provide flexibility.

I think an HTC HD7 will be a more relevant after a year in the WP7 ecosystem than an HTC Desire HD will be after a year in the Android ecosystem.
[Windows Phone 7 General] emigrating:
What name calling?

If you go back and check you'll likely find that all statements contradicting a January release was made after it was clear they would not be able to meet that goal - prior to this it was said to come "very very soon" (there are videos of JB saying this at launch), which 4 months is not. Also, there was just too many references made to January for this not to be the plan - not to mention, yet again, that the January developers update wasn't released until February...
[Windows Phone 7 General] phoneguy 4567:
I just put my SIM into the N1 with Gingerbread & so far I find it just as quick as WP7. I think I will stick with the N1 until NoDo comes out, & even then I will wait a few days to make sure the update doesn't have any nasty surprises :).
[Windows Phone 7 General] Michael-Dallas:
I'm going back to Nokia as soon as they launch an unbranded WP7 phone for AT&T 3G bands.

You've been looking at the wrong Nokias. My N900 has 800x480 resolution and the phone was launched around the same time the Moto Droid was launched. And the N9 MeeGo phone is running the same resolution or even qHD. I have the utmost confidence that they will continue to use at least 800x480 for their WP7 phone.

Michael.
[Windows Phone 7 General] The Gate Keeper:
this is correct. i believe shortly after it was confirmed from microsoft that the resolution would not be changing. someone based the use of "crap" resolutions off those prototype images which were all photoshopped because they were just images, not an actual phone.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Crimson Lotus:
Sadly, I don't think anyone CARES. If this means one less baby in WP7 form then I gladly support your decision, well done.
[Windows Phone 7 General] truffle1234:
MS is paying Nokia to use wp7 and at the same time MS will use alot of Nokia tech software licenses such as nevi and other apps. Nokia will pay for wp7 license and will use it for at least 5 years...

The money paid to Nokia will be for development and marketing....

And just to let the Android fanboys that in Europe wp7 have incremented there market share by 100% means they sold twice as much devices as last year.. So wait till Nokia start shipping there phones with wp7...

And to all those ppl who think wp7 will fail... Ms never fails...
[Windows Phone 7 General] N8ter:
Most of Nokia's candybar phones use a lower resolution.

The N900 is a failed Meego experiment and will remain so. It also has a resistive touch screen IIRC, so that would explain why they could go with a higher res screen for it.

Resistive screens are cheap as hell, and a 800*480 resistive screen is probably factorably cheaper than the AMOLED low res screen they use in their other high end smartphones (N8, C7, etc.).

Also, the Processor, RAM Speed/Size, etc. in the N900 left much to be desired... That "Phone" (sometimes it's hard to figure out what to call it, like the Dell Streak) was a huge flop.

Nokie will be using the low resolution on some of their phones. It's the only way they'll be able to offer "cheap WP7 phones," especially in bulk. That, and using the older snapdragons (the ones we have) since those chips may continue to drop in price as time goes on...

RIM does the same thing with their phones...
[Windows Phone 7 General] phoneguy 4567:
LOL sticks & stones :)

I mentioned speed because I keep reading how snappy WP7 is, which is true but so is Android. I don't expect anyone to care about my opinion, & I don't care that you or anyone else doesn't care :). I bet a lot of people who own WP7 phones are using other phones as well, until some features & or software they use come to the WP7 platform.

I haven't given up on WP7 & will come back to it, but with the snails pace approach MS is taking updating it there is no point in using my Focus until improvements come.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
Count me in on that. If it wasn't for my HD2 and iPhone I'd be in hurtsville. For a gadget junky like myself, WP7 is keeping me strung out. :D
[Windows Phone 7 General] nrfitchett4:
I concur.......
[Windows Phone 7 General] lip:
MS must be embarrassed by this...I went to a Canadian meetup for the launch of MS and the MS Canada employees went on and on how there would be release after release of updates throughout the year. One of the guys let it slip that the first update was already ready and would be released in January...wow...talk about a massive let down.

There are so many basic features that I totally understand why they didn't have on release and was ok with it but now it's months later with no updates...MS has really disappointed and I'm probably going to have to give up my waiting game for them to support at the minimum tethering and get the company standard iphone...

MS you have really failed us loyal supporters...

:mad:
[Windows Phone 7 General] ohgood:
do you have a source for the information about using lower res screens being allowed ?

interesting