yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Windows Phone 7 General] z33dev33l:
agreed... HTC hasnt put anything innovative out in some time sadly... same crap, faster chipset, nothing revolutionary.
[Windows Phone 7 General] vangrieg:
Well, I didn't say we need 80 devices. I said that without new devices you can't grow sales. When a phone becomes old news it's hard to sell.
[Windows Phone 7 General] vetvito:
Please stop this lie. A quarter have lag fix kernels? Do you mean converting file systems on Samsung devices only? Your graphic acceleration argument is BS, ask a developer.

Its like every time someone points out a problem with WP7, you bash on another OS for no apparent reason.
[Windows Phone 7 General] z33dev33l:
"out of box perfect setup"

"Android you can do the same with out the lag or having to flash a rom"

"the avarage joe blow noob can pick up the phone and change his or her ui and not cause they have to hack android to make it run are not freez"

That'd be my exact reasons behind attacking android taking into consideration the fact that most android devices require at least a daily battery pull just to keep a decent phone. Android, regardless of rom or kernel almost requires a reset and roms flashed just to keep it functional. It runs into ALL the same issues WM did aside from the lack of being finger friendly. I owned somewhere in the area of 16 android phones and the only ones that gave a good android experience were the nexus one and the G1. I'm sure there are others out there but I tried a lot of them. Also, I developed 3 apps myself for android so I'm a developer in a sense and I do know that that's going to cause your UI to not be AS smooth as an OS with GPU accelerated UI. I honestly didn't think it'd be a huge difference til I bought my first WP7 though.
[Windows Phone 7 General] doministry:
Listen. This is serious forum not kindergarten.

If you are happy than it is very nice for you.

But stop trolling here with disgusting lies. Please deal with it somwhere else.

Android devices I know, and it's dozens of users I met, are working nice and seamless.

Nobody needs any reboots or other things you mention.

Please stop blocking discussion here.

Make your own thread for this.
[Windows Phone 7 General] z33dev33l:
Last I checked this was a WP7 forum, I believe that would make the person who comes in saying "Here's why android is better." the troll. Not one word of what I said is a lie. I have yet to do a battery pull on any one of my WP7 devices and I think that speaks testaments about an OS after dealing with android.
[Windows Phone 7 General] ohgood:
I'm curious what caused the daily battery pulls ? I believe you were insinuating it happened on all of the many handsets you owned.

as a developer, wouldn't you investigate and fix it if it was in your niche of knowledge ?
[Windows Phone 7 General] -WP7User-:
But the truth is, that Android devices don't run as smooth as WP7 devices. I had a SGS and the HTC Desire (two High-End Android Smartphones) and my HD7 just gives me a way better experience...
[Windows Phone 7 General] z33dev33l:
My knowledge on the subject is limited, I certainly couldn't make a career of it but I am capable of building apps. The battery pulls were a number of things from flashing roms (which was pretty much required if you wanted a functional phone) to running so low on ram even after ATK that it was nothing more than an expensive paperweight and the reset option would take a lifetime to show up. I still keep my moms vibrant updated with the latest and greatest and despite the fact that the hardware is very similar to my Focus I am much less than impressed...
[Windows Phone 7 General] orangekid:
WP7 is pretty nice, and I do like running it, but it is the clear loser in the OS batter.

Android is different, offers more options, and a better UI experience, and for people who like to mod, it's a dream.

WP7 has that nice, sleek, locked-down, smoothness that people like, the only problem is that iOS is the same thing but does it better. It's runs faster, apps run smoother, it "just works" with no resets, etc... and it actually has apps! And will have a CDMA device out before WP7!

Microsoft's usual operating basis of "copy what Apple is doing but mass-market it and make it cheaper and more widely known and used" may not work this time, but then again, it might. We'll just have to wait and see.

Like I said, I am glad I have WP7 on my phone and it's pretty nice, but I could never use it as my ONLY os, as limited as it is, maybe after a few updates I could consider it, but honestly I'd rather just unlock an iPhone 4 and use that.
[Windows Phone 7 General] z33dev33l:
The OS is certainly not smoother than WP7 and I can't understand how one could find it more enjoyable (iphone part I mean) it's the grid system, it's ugly as sin and has been kicked around like a dead horse. I'll admit the apps are more limited but I think it more than makes up with its flawless integration with exchange and social networking integration.Also since when does apple "copy what apple is doing but mass-market it and make it cheaper and more widely known." Apple has stolen from Microsoft tons of times and we've never called foul play. In saying that we are copying apple because we have a locked down OS you sound like the people who say android copied iphone because they have a grid system.

I understand your other arguments but with the lag I just can't understand how you can call android a "better UI experience."
[Windows Phone 7 General] sure haven't:
Subjective. I like wp7's UI more than any Android one I've seen. Android is just so.. cluttered.

1) better?? It's the exact same. Have you ever even used these two devices side by side?

2) Uh... wp7 also has the "it just works". Well at least it did for me, right out of the box. No tweaks, no battery pulls, nothing. Who on earth has had to tweak it? My wife has an iPhone. And iOS is far from perfect. There are apps that crash, freeze, etc. But both iOS and wp7 at their base, native performance, are at exact par.

3) Define "actually has". wp7 marketplace has, at last check, 7500 apps. It's been out since October. It was at 7000 last Friday.

I'm not sure what limitations you're talking about, unless you're an engineer or something. I use it every day for personal and business and there's nothing I'm missing because of it.
[Windows Phone 7 General] orangekid:
points taken,

I meant that you have more options. Widgets galore, more homescreen options, etc...

and ok so the Desire HD roms lag a lot, but running CM6.1 I get zero lag on my HD2 even running from SD (since I use WP7 on NAND)

As far as the copying apple goes, it just seems they took their latest model from Apple as a general idea,

and check out this new UI for the iPhone.

you can have all of the awesome that WP7 brings with it's UI with iPhone apps and features :)

http://www.wpcentral.com/metro-ui-theme-iphone
[Windows Phone 7 General] z33dev33l:
and you said that we're the copycats ;)

Eh, I personally couldn't use the hardware if I tried after getting used to the HD series. Even so I probably wouldn't use it though it's obviously a veritable clone. I sort of enjoy being part of a new OS again and this time one that feels solid. I could never go for the hardware limitations or music/video player of iphone nor the social integration and I couldn't go with the fragmentation and general slowness (if that's a word) of android. I understand WP7 isn't for everyone but at the present time it seems to have more to offer developers as it's the only system that is actually tough to get free paid apps on. If it was between getting my app pirated with android or having people buy my app with WP7 I'd personally choose the latter.
[Windows Phone 7 General] lqaddict:
With all this Chevron talk about this and that, HD2 "illegal" way of running WP7 your point of Android as a pirate paradise is a moot.

Have a nice day, you've shown little of knowledge of either OS, back to my ignore list.
[Windows Phone 7 General] emigrating:
But that's the thing though - with WP7 you get a perfectly fine working OS out of the box. With Android it's like a lottery, you never know if the latest droid phone will be great or not. For general consumers this is important stuff - for those of us who post here, not so much. But we stand for a mere percent, if that, of total sales.

Uhm. Ok. I think you're misunderstanding something here :)

The WP7 UX is more than just the native UI, it comes with guidelines on how to make third-party apps feel like an integrated part of the OS. That means that while you can create as many launchers and menus you want for iOS, mimicking WP7, you will never get the same awesomeness. You won't magically get the panorama views in third-party apps for example.

But to each their own. There is no one-size-fits all OS. Some people like to tinker and like Android/WM other people like phones that just work and choose iOS/WP7. Whereas others yet again need their crackberries or love living on the edge with WebOS.
[Windows Phone 7 General] orangekid:
well I thanked you for probably the soundest and most well described reasons for getting WP7 instead of the constant "WP7 is better than Android because you're a fanboy and WP7 is gooder in every single way possible because it actually proves the existence of higgs-boson..."

I get your points and honestly that's why I'm sticking my HD2 until a SIGNIFICANTLY better device comes out, so I can rock WP7 and Android to my heart's content. Because right now if I want to rock Flash, I have to use Android. If I want to control my DVR from my phone, play Zuma's Revenge, mount my SD card as storage, tether internet, or do some "android only" things, then I go ahead and load up one of my Android ROMs,

but more and more I find myself using WP7 as a daily, I just don't know if I'll ever be able to permanently ditch Android.

But I think we can agree that MS needs to step up the advertising of these phones and really show off what they can do.
[Windows Phone 7 General] sammy_user:
The problem is, api is very limited, so devs cannot do what they want, for example no whatsapp, etc.
[Windows Phone 7 General] orangekid:
lol, why did you even take me off?
[Windows Phone 7 General] lqaddict:
You never were there :) -- the *dev* is there
[Windows Phone 7 General] orangekid:
wut?

either way, please don't put me on your ignore list, I want you personally to see all of my posts.

In fact, the only reason I joined XDA was because I thought maybe one day you'd see my posts and opine on them.

But now that you've publicly stated that I am BACK on your ignore list, even though apparently I never was there, but the dev is there (whatever the hell that means), I am shattered emotionally.

I do not know how I can survive this ambiguously cold day.
[Windows Phone 7 General] z33dev33l:
Glad to be there :) Chevron's unlocking thing did allow devs the ability to sideload apps and if you were lucky you can get some of the paid apps side-loaded. Unlike android however devs have instilled security measures to at least hinder this and microsoft is actually trying to do something about it. That certainly instils faith in my book. I would enjoy having some of those apps but I mean it's not a necessity for my phone I guess. When they come out I'll be on them but til then I'm glad to have a UI I can enjoy. I do know microsoft needs some more impressive hardware out there and that the team behind the advertising needs to be shot but as a base it's something profound. I do hope I can become better versed in app developing to be able to write up some WP7 apps. I will not deny WP7 has it's shortcomings, however, what it DOES do it does best.
[Windows Phone 7 General] z33dev33l:
He's talking to me, the same post you praised he called ignorant and invalid citing the chevronWP7 argument.
[Windows Phone 7 General] doministry:
If you pull the battery out of Android device every day, it clearly states you can't operate the device.

And yes, everything you post here about Android and Apple here is full of silly hate and unreasonable agression which results in lies. You are just a fanboy who doesn't even use half of the devices potential and are unable to admit any disadvantage of WP7.

This disables the discussion.
[Windows Phone 7 General] z33dev33l:
Glad to admit it's shortcomings, I know it lacks a lot of features that other phones offer right now. My primary argument is that what it does do it does better than any other OS. A lockup on something as simple as flashing a rom is not the fault of the user, that's just a few simple taps of the button. Android just feels hastily built to me... I used to love it but after WP7... just doesnt feel that hot...
[Windows Phone 7 General] blahism:
anecdotal evidence

WP7 is selling like hotcakes.. I've managed to convert everyone i know just by letting them mess with my focus.. and i live out here in the middle of nowhere
[Windows Phone 7 General] orangekid:
woah I am totally confused now :S

the dude saying "omg chevron is so illegal I are stupid you ignore now" was the dude I was talking to, as if I want someone with that type of idiocy reading my posts.

The other dude had some intelligent points and I'm glad to converse with.

Back on Track though, one thing you gotta love about WP7 is the boot up time, can't be denied that it beats everyone else. My iPhone takes for-freaking-ever to start up, and so do most android devices :S
[Windows Phone 7 General] z33dev33l:
No, I understood and I thank you. His argument was the one I was combating. I do truly appreciate your statement, he's just one of the 3 or 4 people who enjoys spending their time in the WP7 forum spreading nothing but negativity. I prefer a happier side.
[Windows Phone 7 General] doministry:
Boot time was great.

I was however shocked how fast HTC HD7 can start.
[Windows Phone 7 General] ohgood:
why are you rebooting your phones ?
[Windows Phone 7 General] z33dev33l:
Boot time? Oh that time I cut it on? Yeah, havent needed to reset it since.
[Windows Phone 7 General] sure haven't:
I need to reset mine, it's the only way to get the marketplace working again once it freezes :(

Sometimes it freezes 3 times a day, sometimes not at all.

But on that note, the boot up time is astonishingly fast.
[Windows Phone 7 General] z33dev33l:
Everyone says that but aside from the day the marketplace went down I havent experienced any issues.... and this is while downloading like 11 xbox titles to a new phone at once. I just ordered my second DVP off of ebay for my work phone because it's tough to use anything else now :) That phone is amazing if you swap out their measly 8 gig for a nice class 6 32 gig
[Windows Phone 7 General] vangrieg:
It seems that there are lots of phones with poor quality firmware. After chatting with some people in the US who have issues, they run like 1.07 versions of ROMs. I have 1.25, and current is 1.28. I don't have any of the issues people are complaining about.

it's also interesting to note that the OS version is the same everywhere. What makes ROMs different is bootloader and some low level device drivers. You make your own conclusions.
[Windows Phone 7 General] slighmd:
MS really dropped the ball I think by not partnering with Verizon from the get-go. Allowing iPhone to get the jump on them was a fatal mistake. When the Verizon iPhone goes out to the public, only a few people would get the CDMA WP7 by then. Also, the iPhone 5 is also coming out this year, along with dual core Androids, with service support for a whole lot of countries and not just the US. MS needs to rush this.

Am I living in an illusion, believing that Microsoft still has a future in the mobile device market? Still sticking to WP7 for the moment, well until the illusion fades and I see reality or until maybe MS steps it up, if it ever happens. Still hope they succeed though
[Windows Phone 7 General] sure haven't:
Success pretty much depends on useability. Someone said it in this thread; it'll be ok, wp7 is awesome.
[Windows Phone 7 General] amtrakcn:
U call that a "Metro UI" ?

I would say it's nothing comparable to the actual Metro UI. It's nice for iOS users to have a new launcher but puting blocks onto desktop is not Metro UI. There is not animation, the iOS styly menu doesnot match. Zune Home on Android can do something similar to this, but that could not turn my captivate into anything like focus.
[Windows Phone 7 General] premiumdude:
Verizon or not, iPhone already had the jump on them. If it was only a matter of whether or not iPhone was an option, WP7 wouldn't exist at this point on AT&T. Every single person who owns a WP7 device on AT&T (which includes myself) has already had the option of purchasing either an iPhone or an Android device.

I personally chose WP7 over iOS and Android with the full knowledge of what both platforms offer, and I'm not alone. It blows my mind that so many people think that those 2 platforms display the end-state of the smart-phone.

WP7 is a slick platform that has a ton of potential. If you have a quality product it will appeal to enough customers for you reach the first step: survive. Once you do that you improve and evolve from mere survival to success.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
Which DHD ROM are you using? The one I'm using is lickity-split fast, smooth and oh-so-sweet. It isn't as fast or as smooth as WP7 but it is perfectly fine and I'd say better than an actual HTC DesireHD.

You do know that the DHD ROMs require a settle-in time, don't you? You have to allow them to finish with the Market and finish settling in and after a few reboots and after they settle and a few days, they are perfectly fine.
[Windows Phone 7 General] emigrating:
But that's the thing - it's not as smooth as WP7. That's all that really matters.

It may be all fine and super fast compared to any other Android device available, but compared to WP7 it's still lagging. Perhaps not very much (depending on which ROM you're running this week) but the overall experience isn't as good as WP7 or iOS.

Here's a video I came across yesterday showing exactly what I'm talking about.

[YOUTUBE]NgF0cSUJE4I[/YOUTUBE]

Gingerbread isn't bad, but it's still not as smooth as the competition. You feel a definite lag when changing screens or zooming out to all etc.

Personally I'll take the UX of WP7 over Android any day of the week, even with lack of [to me] important features.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
I know what you are talking about and do agree that WP7 is the best there is for smoothness and speed. But the HD2 Android ROMs are all different. And I have experienced that after a settle in time, they do smooth out to the point that any lag or slowness as compared to WP7 is inconsequential. That isn't to say all of the HD2 Android ROMs are that way. You have to try them all to see who the talented devs are. And even they have a few duds every now and then. For Gingerbread, there is only one ROM that is probably 99% perfect. And it is as smooth as a Sense ROM...after, as I said, a settle-in period.
[Windows Phone 7 General] emigrating:
I know, I've been thru a plethora or Android ROMs on my HD2 before installing WP7. But that's kinda the issue I have with Android - it's not that the OS is bad, it's not, in some [many] ways the core OS is better than WP7/iOS.

The problem is that, for the average consumer, going out purchasing a new Android phone is like the lottery - you don't know how well it's going to perform out of the box (and it's the OOBE that's important to most people). Had Android (or rather Google) set some minimum specs for GPU/CPU and offered HW acceleration it would likely have blown everything out of the water as even the cheapest device would run great.

While people will call me crazy I think the Android bubble is about to burst. The marketplace isn't doing developers any favors, a lot of users will try something different once their contract is up because of their sub-par experience with their Samsung (or other notoriously "bad" OEM) droid and there's just too much choice available where you may still, today, get yourself a v1.6 if you don't carefully check specs before buying.

Android is now going thru what WM did in it's heyday. Coming out left right and center with people raving on about how great it is - only difference is that WM was before it's time, like so many MS products. Fast forward a few years and WM was all but dead. The problem Google faces is that they cannot even make a clean break (like MS did between WM/WP) as even if they did impose minimum specs there would be OEMs who continued to ship their own droid flavor diluting the "brand". This is already happening as the general public doesn't buy an Android phone per se, they buy a Sense, MotoBlur or TouchWiz phone which just so happens to be droid.
[Windows Phone 7 General] vetvito:
Picked up a Dell Streak 7, Tegra 2 if you didn't know. Pawns the smoothness of WP7. I thought my Vibrant was fast and the old HD7 was faster but the Tegra 2 is pawning. All I can say is WoW! Just imagine the Tegra 2 phones. Now I can't wait to see what Apple is doing.

Did I mention the browsing experience is just as good as my 3ghz PC. With flash and all its glory.

Any way, sorry for the rant.
[Windows Phone 7 General] orangekid:
you obviously didn't watch the video. The tiles do animate, that's all metro UI is, big ass tiles, some of which tell you some information. If you want to get all technical about this brand new beta stage theme not doing every single thing that WP7 can go ahead, but you missed the concept. The fact that you can modify iOS to be themed in so many different ways and do so many different things while keeping it's speed, fluidity, and stability makes it much more customizable than WP7. The point of my post was that someone attempting to imply that WP7 Chevron Unlocked had even an iota of the options that iOS and Android have to offer.

While WP7 has some great points to brag about, options and ability to customize are at the bottom of the list.

yeah I;m using the DL DHD running from SD magldr. It's pretty fast in most ways, but try to change the skins and it lags, adding widgets sometimes makes it lag, and every once in a while it just hangs for like no reason for about 30 seconds.

I have had this issue with every single DHD ROM I've used, even NAND ones, It's not hardware, just it seems to me a little more work on drivers is needed, that's all. Try using a good CM6.1 ROM and you will notice the immediate difference where everything runs faster than ****, even UC @ 700mhz! and the battery life is comparable to "real" android devices, even though I am running from SD (since I run WP7 from NAND).

Also the PS3/wii remote apps don't work on Sense, and for other reasons I just prefer CM builds, but like to have a Sense on my SD card saved just in case I want to roll with "eye-candy" over more function for a night :)
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
I just tried to use that one...the SD one. Couldn't get it to work. Chose AD SD in the magldr options and pressed the green button and it gave a kernel open failed.

How is it?
[Windows Phone 7 General] orangekid:
sounds like you have the wrong directory listed in boot options fro AD SD (under services).

Also, do not change the name of the folder from it's default name, since it is built into the ROM to look for the kernel in that folder name, just extract the folder to your E: (or whatever it loads as), set the AD SD Dir in boot options, then boot AD SD
[Windows Phone 7 General] orangekid:
sounds freaking sweet, I may just get one, I wonder how it compares to the xoom. I don't like that UI too much (stage launcher)
[Windows Phone 7 General] vetvito:
Xoom will have Honeycomb so I can't really compare the two.

Price comparison

Xoom 800usd not confirmed

Dell 7 200usd

HD7 200usd

When we returned the HD7 they said we weren't the only ones. I mean you wouldn't even know they sold HD7s, its in a corner with old Black Berries and featureless phones. Absolutely no signs or anything, not even a working demo.

Hooked the WiiMote up to the Streak and I'm loving it. PlayStation games are awesome on this thing.
[Windows Phone 7 General] z33dev33l:
So does that thing work as a phone too or not? Might pick up one to tinker.