yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[XPERIA X10 General] agentJBM:
I read an article about this recently. SE will be changing their strategy on their new devices, and jumping in to compete with other high end devices that offer the latest Android OS. Releasing a statement like that sheds a little light on x10.... It was never their intention for the X10 to have the latest OS. Someone nailed it on the head when they said it took 8 months of additional development to get 2.1 working on the x10. Another OS update is a lot to expect with that type of commitment. What if they cut corners and there were bugs or no improvement? Can you imagine the sh#t storm if that happened? When I figure in 8 months to the equation, it seems like a far stretch.
[XPERIA X10 General] loneLEE:
yeah. I don't hack my phone too, cos it's a friggin expensive phone, and I don't wanna lose warranty because of it.

And the fact is the custom roms are created by people whom I presume are Sony Ericsson/Timescape/Mediascape haters, seeing so many complaints of these elements in this forum, so The phone will not have the Xperia X10 feel anymore if I hack it and install a custom rom.

by far I'm already satisfied with 2.1, cos it gave us Live Wallpapers. I don't really care about stuff like multitouch or flash, cos we hace a built-in youtube player already, so flash is kinda unnecessary. And to be honest, to much multimedia enhancements will just make us play with it too much and the phone rendered powerless sooner than we think if we are on the go.

To me, it is a phone, and I need it to be contactable. Whatever add-on functions, they are just a bonus. I am being entitled to these bonuses, I'm satisfied enough. I will not ask for more since it's not really an obligation for them to upgrade my phone.

If there is, it'll be a bonus.

And you are right about the 90%. High chances are, many of those in the 90% don't even have any ideas that their phones are capable of OS updates.

lol.
[XPERIA X10 General] 24karat^:
the 90/10 % of users is not a fair assessment. Most users got fed up of SE reluctance to update their handsets while other Android devices were updating theirs to the newest Android OS. The average user does care what OS they are using, if they didn't you wouldn't see SE blogs all over the web with the average user complaining, I am an average user and i found myself here looking for ways to improve my overall phone experience, whether its SE way of doing things or not. I don't care if its the SE experience i am getting (and yes i am a Sony Fan Boy-Sony Led Tv, PS3, PSP 1000, PSP Go, Sony blu ray player too are my current Sony belongings), i just want the best performance and latest OS i can get on my SE without having to spend more money for another out of date Android OS from SE which lags because of apps stamped on the phone by SE. I really enjoy XDA ambitions for looking for ways to improve the xperia x10, thanks to the knowledge they have, i am able to learn how to flash my phone to Android 2.2.1 :). So far, i flashed my girlfriends xperia x10, and two of my co workers who them too. They are your also average users, and like me they were not happy with their phones either and ask me to help them. I told anything i do and everything i learned was from XDA experienced users who helped me understand. Now, they are all happy with there phones custom roms.

PS i would like to thanks xda for helping me like my phone all over again just like the first day i purchased it, thanks to XDA.
[XPERIA X10 General] 24karat^:
its rarely to hear people not expect the best bang for their buck, especially when you have dated software from day one when you picked up your phone. Me on the other hand prefer to have everything i can get out of my phone before it becomes unfashionable to even pull it out in a crowd to answer it ;). I know when i see some people use old phones with no other features other than make calls, i get a good laugh. After i am done with my xperia x10, i will be looking for the fastest, latest Android OS on a phone from company other than SE. I have enough...
[XPERIA X10 General] agentJBM:
Then why did you buy the x10 knowing it came with the oldest OS, and clearly stated updateable to 2.1.
[XPERIA X10 General] 24karat^:
LOL i am not sure if you knew this but i am a Sony fan boy, i'm sure i stated that, second it was the first phone to have 8.1 camera. I was impressed at that time with the xperia x10 hardware, with the promise they would update. Key word "would" update to a newer OS for Android. I liked the fact it was android, i was one of the first to get it on the day of release. So ya.........;) i didn't reallize that it wouldn't update to 2.2 or 2.3 :) but i guess you know everything, so you could predict the future. Even though the xperia can handle it. :)
[XPERIA X10 General] MrHassell:
Sony imx046

flash your phone to a 2.1 rom and everything works or get with Android SDK and start looking at how to get that wicked Camera working in 2.3.1. That's all we are missing from having Gingerbread - 2.3.1 fully working.. and some GPS tweaks.

Sony IMX046 8 Mp, CMOS Image Sensor is what we need to make for Gingerbread / Froyo - the reason this is made tricky is development aborted drivers at Froyo. Same camera in the Microsoft KIN 2 smart phone along with an NVIDIA Tegra APX2600, have to remember MS first used Tegra chips in Zune.

The main reason most people own an X10 is the camera being 8.1mp, pixel size of 1.4 microns and a big screen, snapdragon processor.. mmm it wasn't because it came with a free Donut! mmm donuts...

Nobody likes not being able to use Adobe Flash / Air without 2.2.1 + (Froyo) and I don't see the point in developing the driver for Froyo when Gingerbread is superior and in terms of drivers equally as complete on the X10.

SE are never going to release Gingerbread for the X10 but there is a chance that we can use the driver from an ARC - BUT - all we know is the ARC has an Exmor R sensor - Bravia HD Engine - so the specific sensor id's are hidden from public and are most likely not compatible.

Bottom line if you want a SE Gingerbread phone, buy an ARC or start developing drivers. Either way stop whingeing about how your so hard done by and how fast hardware and software obsolete these days etc... get over it! LOL :D
[XPERIA X10 General] stan.s:
Well this is not totally true since you can install all the SE apps and wallpapers if you wish back into the custom rom. There are threads with links to all the APK's in the SE firmware.

Here's one of my issues, Bluetooth. Even with the 2.1 update-1 BT doesn't work completely with my SE BT DS980 headset. Caller ID, Call rejection are not functional all the time. Voice Calling and the time doesn't sync. Track ID is iffy. Now, I don't blame SE, this is actually a Android problem, and it's not all fixed until 2.3 which has a better BT stack (2.2 is supposed to have everything but the voice calling). Of course it all worked with my prior SE java based phone. If the rom goes to another beta or two, I will give it a try, since I have Xrecovery installed and that should make updating (and returning to stock 2.1 if desired, easier).

The second category is the apps, I would like Google Docs available to me as well as others that are only available for 2.2 and beyond.

Even with the custom rom's we're not moving off of the 2.6.29 Linux kernel, we can't- the boot loader isn't cracked and it's tied to that particular kernel. So performance improvements, security bugs, and some other features that are tied to an updated kernel won't ever come to a custom rom.

Unlike some of my old phones, it doesn't look like I'll be able to keep the x10 for more than 2 years, I usually have kept my phones for 3 before upgrading.

I want a phone that either fulfills all my needs and is future-proof for at least 24 months. The x10 which I had hoped would be, isn't.
[XPERIA X10 General] agentJBM:
Lol. Just wanted to point out that having the latest OS wasn't a priority for any of us when we bought the phone. Your preference changed after you bought the phone. You can't hold SE accountable for you changing your mind. No, I can't predict the future, but I learned a long time ago not to assume anything when it comes to business.
[XPERIA X10 General] OmegaRED^:
True but when i bought my phone it didn't say hardware is full of **** on the box.

The shop assistant also said that it had multi touch..

She also gave the option of these android phones.. x10, x10mini, x10mini pro.

So yes.. i was made a sucker out of.
[XPERIA X10 General] MJ_QaT:
Calculate 10% out of 9 million devices sold world wide, then you'll know that all those who are complaining in SE sites and blogs are within the 10%

You claim that you are an average user, but then looking at how SE fan-boy you are I have to say that you are not

being able to flash your X10s and other stuff eliminates you from being an average user..
[XPERIA X10 General] loneLEE:
And to add-on, an average user = not knowing that there are upgrading options, support etc.

His colleagues were initially average users. But after introducing them to hacking the phone, they are no longer average users.

Just like they are no longer humans once they are bitten by a vampire.
[XPERIA X10 General] agentJBM:
Seems like the main complaint is lag due to system apps, namely timescape. All you need to is root your phone and remove the apps you don't use, and for even better performance enable JIT. I love playing with my phone, but I am so happy with how my X10a performs after doing those two things that I don't need 2.2. It would be nice to try it out to see the difference, but it is not a necessity by any means.

So now it's the hardware too? I'm happy with mine, except for no flash on camera, but I found an app for that, and we now have multitouch :-) Don't they have a 30 day trial/return policy where you're from?
[XPERIA X10 General] 24karat^:
:) i never said i was a SE fan boy :) LOL I said i was a Sony Fan boy, i had my phone since may and only with in the last month or so learned how to do things here. and yes i am an average user :), most of the stuff on this site is beyond my knowledge of phones :)

ps by using some of the simple tools that some of the developers posted here, its just as easy as a normal update that average users do with the SE updates with PC companion its not anything out of the ordinary following the guide lines for use. Which doesn't make me anything other than a average user looking for everything i can get out of my phone before its dated.
[XPERIA X10 General] agentJBM:
You may call yourself an average user, but you are now a noob :-) Once you started hacking your phone you stopped being just a user. User just "uses" the phone as intended. You even are flashing your friends phones, so you are definitely not the average user.

Are your friends happy with the unresolved issues of 2.2? Strange that someone would suddenly be happy with another OS that has issues of its own.

Yes you did say that the reason you bought the X10 was because you were a Sony Fan boy. :p
[XPERIA X10 General] 24karat^:
yes, i am a Sony fan boy and with the Sony name attached to SE phone i have a certain expectations from the product. Never said i as an Ericsson fan boy, didn't state i had an Ericsson phone before or a SE phone either for that matter until now. i recently flashed my phone but any update would be considered an more then just a average user? I still have no idea how to work a lot of the software available on this website still. So by your definition anyone who updates their phone isn't a user no more? which would include PC comp. because both update here and PC companion have flashing and guides for that not so technical savy dude like me to follow. I did say i was new to all this, so since you feel the need to call me noob to make yourself feel better sure :), never claimed to know it all.
[XPERIA X10 General] agentJBM:
Your right the average user can respond to a notification that an update is available and hook their phone up having no idea what is happening. Update and flashing are separate things. You didn't update via SEUS, you hacked your phone and specifically downloaded a hackers flash tool and flashed some homemade software on your phone (no offense to the awesome developers) knowing it could void the warranty and possibly brick your phone. The majority of us on xda don't know what the hell we are doing either, but we're learning just like you, aka noobs. All it takes is the ability to read, follow directions, use the search button, and ask questions. There are only a handful of people who really know what is going on. The fact that you have the balls and took the initiative to hack your phone is what makes you not the average user. The average user would never try and tinker with how the phone operates for fear of messing it up. Gezz, you are stubborn. You clearly are an above average user, but that doesn't mean you are an expert developer. Noob is not an insult, unless you are too insecure to admit it. I AM A NOOB AND PROUD OF IT. It's better than being a clueless average user.
[XPERIA X10 General] MJ_QaT:
I don't know why he is so stubborn about being an average user :S

As the Agent said, BIG difference between update and hack ( PC companion/flashtools )
[XPERIA X10 General] violentgoomba:
Ok, there are people who start out as average users but become rom users because of their interest, in this case, the x10. I know people who use their phones without any interest in customizations, flashing, themes or what have yous.

The point is, we can't underestimate average users because, like us, they started with just a spark of interest on the subject. Some may never get to see the light, god bless them, ignorance is bliss. For those who have joined the dark side... it ain't all roses.

And how did this get turned into a discussion about average-n00b-r0x0r users?

I have accepted that to SE the x10 will never be upgraded to Froyo or Gingerbread. It's all in the hands of our devs now.
[XPERIA X10 General] vivektiwari1986:
flash ur x10

i hope xda people continue working like this. i am more than happy with the custom 2.2.1 zdihu's rom beta 3.. works like a charm
[XPERIA X10 General] silord:
me too! everything is better then org SE 2.1 !
[XPERIA X10 General] agentJBM:
Here how we got here. Let me preface this with, I am a major noob with average computer skills for my age (damn kids these days :-). The X10 is my first smartphone and I got it in November. I have unbranded, rooted, removed junk apps, enabled JIT and MT, and updated to 2.1.A.0.435.

SE said they are not updating beyond 2.1 because the average user experience would not greatly improve (to justify the resources needed to do another OS upgrade), which has many people here incorrectly assuming that SE is screwing over the average user. To understand that statement you have to understand what an average user is, and that we aren't them. Average users just use the device as it was designed. They would never look under the hood to see how the engine works, let alone try and change the oil, regardless of how easy it is. Not to mention, after the latest SEUS/PC Companion update 2.1.A.0.435, the lag problem that seems to be the number one complaint appears to be nearly fixed, and we have multitouch.

Noobs, rookie hackers in the development forums, are the majority of the people who either (a) feel entitled to or (b) were hoping for 2.2+. (being that the number of advanced hacker is small) The entitled group (a) would argue that they are the average user, because they only have average computer skills or little hacking skills. However average they feel, they are not the average the moment they decided to fiddle with their phones. Even with a growing number of noobs, the overwhelming majority of average users will not become noobs within the next year and most likely never.

I'm afraid SE isn't underestimating the noob potential, but it is noobs who are overestimating theirs. If some noobs feel that strongly and want SE to reconsider, they need to do a lot more than whine on xda. This thread offers one possible strategy to get the word out, but most likely will not be enough. However, just assuming we are the target market for SE is not going to work, guaranteed.
[XPERIA X10 General] pngface:
I don't quite agree with your statement, but for the most part I think you summarized it well.

I think there are a few features in Android 2.2 that would benefit the 'average' user - Voice actions, support for more apps(off the top of my head - chrome2phone, real-time Google Latitude, push notifications for facebook, etc)

I'm afraid I don't quite understand SE's statement about why they are not updating. I guess they did it because they want to save money?
[XPERIA X10 General] agentJBM:
Time, money, and human resources. It's not as simple as just giving us 2.2, like it's a free app from the Market. It took many months of additional development for SE to fit 2.1 for the X10, and they are still working on it to get it right. What makes people think giving us 2.2+ would be any easier? First, it would be scrapping all that work. Second, they would have to start over again. Time, money, and resources. If it wasn't perfect, we'd ***** about it too and demand 2.3+. Those apps you mentioned are cool if you use those things, but I'm sure you'd agree they don't warrant a million dollar development project by SE.

It's not like you said.. that they are not updating to save money. They never promised anything other than 2.1 to begin with. They didn't take anything away from us. They were just honest, because people were asking for more. Basically SE said, "No, but thanks for asking. " BE honest, were you thinking beyond 2.1 when you bought the phone?
[XPERIA X10 General] pngface:
When I bought the phone, I had no idea that Android 2.1 existed. I just heard that it wasn't the latest OS version but they said there would be an update. I didn't think it would take them 8 months to release it. Heck, even the Dell Streak has Froyo now. Not to mention the Acer Liquid, both of which launched a bit after the X10.

I don't want to beat a dying horse here, because there's no Froyo for us anyway. I doubt all the petitions in the world will change that. SE just sees no financial gain in doing that.
[XPERIA X10 General] agentJBM:
They both have generic Android if I'm not mistaken. No extra cost of development.

True, especially with the Arc coming with 2.3. There would be no need to buy their new devices. The good news is that the Arc will help the x10 devs.
[XPERIA X10 General] gr00vy0ne:
Although I am displeased that they're officially stopping at the upgrades at 2.1, they should be given some credit for giving us a 2.1 that is better than the stock 2.1. Many people fail to realize that SE actually back-ported some 2.2 features into our 2.1 and had previously done so with our 1.6 version.

For example, the ability to Update All Apps or Auto-Update is a 2.2 feature and yet we have it in our 2.1. I also believe we have some extra Bluetooth transfer abilities compared to other 2.1 enabled phones (at least compared with a colleagues Android 2.1 device).

At any rate, I appreciate that some extra work was done and with some small tweaks, the latest 2.1 ROMs are very usable and perform very well. We can complain about specs and not having the latest/greatest but ultimately, we all have to ask ourselves, can we get stuff done with our phones?

For me, my main tasks are the following:

calling

e-mail (exchange, work exchange, and gmail)

sms/mms (with some fun added by picsay pro)

workout device (my tracks, runkeeper pro)

audio device (mediascape/doubletwist)

gps (google navigation/maps/latitude + vlingo)

news reader

gaming (angry birds, worms, game dev story)

social networking (facebook, foursquare, twitter)

mobile hotspot (barnacle)

I'd argue that my X10 does all the above very well and I'm often doing multiple tasks at the same time without issue. So, while I share the frustration of SE not continuing to give us updates, it's not like this thing is unusable in any way.

However, my tune might change once I start seeing more 2.2/2.3-only apps start popping up in the marketplace. Of course, by then...it will be time to upgrade. ;)
[XPERIA X10 General] 24karat^:
Why can't Sony use the same idea of turning time/mediascape into widgets to free up ram on the Arc, on xperia x10? With proof of android 2.2 being able to run smoothly on the xperia x10 through custom roms. There not much need to spend hours and money on research on 2.2 if they already have the resources to do it or even use 2.3 on the xperia.
[XPERIA X10 General] agentJBM:
They also gave some additional google.apps 2.2 support to the x10a in the Americas. Google Voice Search is there, which is a Froyo 2.2 app. I'm still trying to get my hands on Google Voice Actions for 2.2 to see if it works on my 2.1.

Also, won't the Arc allow the dev guys to bring us a very stable 2.3? So we really do not need to worry, or am I wrong about the similarity?
[XPERIA X10 General] Lohmatiy:
I just want to say, that TWO YEARS of update was included in $700 price for this phone. And the fact that SE stopped updating after less than a year after the phone is out is a steal in my opinion.

I wouldn' mind if SE said in the beginning - "you buy this phone as it is, we will not update it", I would buy for $200, may be for $300, but not for $700!

And yes, I want to get an update for $700 phone without going through all these "XDA" procedures. It should come easily from the SE.

I accept an opinion that "SE doesn't see any financial gain in continuing the updates for X10", but I strongly believe that it's in our power to make SE see "Financial losses after NOT keeping the promisses". No more updates - No more SE for me. The more people will join - the more chances there are that their next phone will be updated in a timely manner.

The most annoying thing about all this situation is that SE doesn't even see a problem in lying and ignoring their customers. I think, that official "we are sorry, we screwed up" would be enough. But what we have instead? We have Rikard, who only can give us "I don't know", "i have to talk to other people", and "I will forward you question to our department". What happens when apple screws up? Steve Jobs comes public and talk to people about the problem. What SE does? mmm... nothing.
[XPERIA X10 General] agentJBM:
You are misinformed. SE hasn't quit updating this phone. There is another update, 2.1.A.0.435, as we speak. They didn't say they weren't updating the x10 anymore. They said that they weren't updating to 2.2+. It's amazing how people are twisting the facts to fuel this debate.

SE would have been better off not releasing their final intentions so soon after the 2.1 update, because they are currently releasing updates every couple months, which is absolutely supporting the X10.

SE was just being honest. Sometimes the truth isn't what you wanted to hear, but it's better than not knowing. Again, SE NEVER said the X10 would go beyond 2.1. That idea came from our wishful thinking.

Some people are confusing SE with SC..... Santa Claus :-) lol.