yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
About .00002% :) This only gets rid of the market, replacing it with the themed one. Worst case: the market gets deleted and won't show up, and then a nandroid or push of the market to system/app will fix it ;) Changing recoveries should go smoothly as well, as clockwork keeps it simple and easy, all you have to do is select your phone and it'll flash the recovery.
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Awesome thanks! Sorry that I'm a bit new to all this, I'm still learning... ill go download clockwork mod right away.
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
No problem, I'm happy to help out :D Let me know once you've done the clockwork step, and then we'll go from there.
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Well I did the thing in clockwork and downloaded the blue market zip again. I still had no option to install zip so I renamed the file to update so that "reinstall packages" would find it. It said it was installed successfully by when I rebooted my market was gone... any suggestions?
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
There is an install zip option for clockwork, where you can choose a zip to install.... it's in a sub-menu I believe
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
I don't see the option... could it be in the premium version of clockwork?
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
No..... hmmm... boot into recovery, hit install zip from sd card, and then select choose zip... should be there
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
It doesn't give me the option to install zip from SD card
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
.... :confused: Hmm, it does say clockwork at the bottom of the recovery yes? Plan b then, just push to system/app
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
I entered it through clockwork, but it just said android system recovery.
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Ah, that's the problem! Ok, you need to manually boot into recovery, try that as opposed to doing it through the clockwork app :)
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Nope, it still brings up the android system recovery.
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Your phone is not letting you properly boot into recovery then for some reason. Like I said, for now, just do plan b. ;)
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Ok, so do I just stick the zip into the folder you specified then? Or do I extract it?
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Extract it, and then place the vending.apk in system/app, either with a root capable file manager or push it with adb :D
[Android Themes] hero32:
awesome

looks awesome as usual
[Android Themes] chris6278:
Hey impaler have u had a chance to update the neonblue to 2.2.11 yet?
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Thanks man :) Glad you like 'em! :D
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Still no luck... I put the vending.apk.file in the folder but there I still don't have the market.
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
No market at all?
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Nope, it is gone from my app drawer
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
What rom are you on?
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Stock
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
And on a captivate that's 2.1 correct? It should still work though, that's the thing... can you ask someone from your forum to try this out too for me? If it works for them, then I'll help you get it up and going. If it doesn't, I'll look at why this doesn't work on the captivate :D
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Sure thing. Ill post over there in a bit. Do you know how I would get the regular market back in the meantime?
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Rename this to vending.apk and then push to system/app and reboot :)
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Cool, thanks... I posted in the captivate Q and A forum also.
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Awesome, thanks a ton man :)
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
My mistake. I meant to say captivate themes. You can watch the topic there.
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Ok cool cool, will do :D
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
New problem: now the stock market apk you gave me doesn't show up either.
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Hmm, I know that market works..... perhaps your 2.1 rom isn't recognizing the new version of the market?
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
It should. My market had already updated to the new style a few weeks ago.
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Yeah, but there's no reason why the stock one didn't work... how did you mive it to system/app?
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
I downloaded it through dolphin HD, accessed it though my file manager to rename it to Vending.apk, and moved it to the system/app folder.
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
What did you move it with? A file manager? Which one?
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
I think I used astro to rename it, and then root explorer to move it.
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Any you're making sure that you're in read/write mode, not read only when you move it?
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
I'm not sure how to check really... I would think it would be read/write since I'm just moving the file without doing anything else.
[Android Themes] MWBehr:
A safe bet is using Root Explorer only. Some apps will allow access to the system folder without giving r/w access. Also, make sure you don't have two Vending.apks in the app folder. Files are case sensitive, so you could have a vending.apk and Vending.apk in the same folder. This would cause the issue you're experiencing.
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Yup, agreed, and in RE, there's a little button in the top right that allows you to toggle r/w and r/o. You want it to be r/w
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Looks like it was already in r/w. Still not working though...
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Bah. This is very odd, did you have a nandroid from before? Forgive me for my lack of great advice on this, but it's difficult when you don't have a phone/when you're not able to recreate the problem :o
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
No, unfortunately...
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
And you're rebooting after you add it?
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Yes, every time
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
I honestly have never seen this problem.... you may want to add that to your post ;)
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
I wouldn't be surprised if it is just a problem singled out to my phone. It wouldn't be the first time it has happened...
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
For future reference, how do I do a nandoid?
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Well, let's wait for more testers that you asked for. If they don't have issues, then yeah, it'd just be your phone/rom/setup :(
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Boot into clockwork recovery, and choose the backup option :)
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Its hard to do that when it just goes to the regular android recovery even through clockwork.
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
That just makes no sense.... you may need a custom rom to properly do that on your phone
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Looks like I have really gotten into a problem then... I would love to flash to a new rom but I never found out why my phone isn't found in odin while it is in download mode. Once my phone got bricked, I would probably never fix it l.
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Your phone's just an odd one isn't it :o Lol
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Sure is... do you think it has something to do with how i rooted it? I used one click lag fix but I was supposed to select the zip in the recovery menu to install it. It didn't show up so I used reinstall packages then also. It seemed to work though since I got superuser access.
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Root should be either you have root or you don't, but different methods could yield different results
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Do you think a master clear in odin or a factory reset would get my market working again?
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
You could try, a reflash of your rom most certainly should
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Could be worth a shot... but ifit bricked, then it would be the end of this phone
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
I mean, it shouldn't brick.... but you never know with these I guess.
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
I was able to download an older version of the market and install it like an application instead of putting it in the app folder. It appears to be working fine now, even if it is a little outdated.

Not only that, I was finally able to get into the clockwork recovery menu. Didn't help at all though...
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Well, at least you got to it :p :D
[Android Themes] :
@ impaler Hey brother not feelin too good tonite and gotta get up early. Have to drive to Harriburg,Pa. and back tommorrow and everyday so I'll hit ya back soon as I can.
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
Hey, no problem, hope you feel better soon!
[Android Themes] yentlequible:
Definitely leaned my lesson about not backing things up. Ill back it up and try it again. Hopefully I can eventually get that awesome neon blue market. Thanks for all the help you gave me l.
[Android Themes] theimpaler747:
No problem, and we'll keep trying. We WILL get this! :)
[EVO 4G General] quickbird144:
Very well said, and thank you! Must of us wouldn't have even thought twice about the sbc kernels cause of what they offered. More battery life! Thus in turn it's doing more harm than good.

Folks, face it. We are basically carrying around mini mini laptops. These phones come eqquiped with 1ghz processors. Nice vibrant screens, the works. They were made to chew through battery life. If the sbc kernels are doing harm, then count me out.
[EVO 4G General] raiderinks:
I should point out that based on what the developers have said and the performance people are reporting, it seems likely that they are overcharging the batteries. However, that is all pending us getting some hard answers from the developers.

I would like to further add that no matter the method you use, if you are able to reliably charge your battery to the exact rated voltage (not give up the 10% capacity) then you are much more likely operating it safely. It is something I would personally be comfortable with, pending the input of an actual battery applications engineer. HOWEVER, I AM NOT A PE and I DO NOT HAVE A STAMP. I AM NOT YOUR EE DESIGN CONSULTANT AND IF YOU DO THAT AND IT STILL BLOWS UP, IT IS NOT MY FAULT.

Of course, the most accurate and reliable way to charge to that level would be using the scheme used in the stock kernel, but raising the maximum voltage to the rated voltage of the battery.
[EVO 4G General] quickbird144:
Just saw a thread on a few peoples evos that did have the sbc kernel, blew up. I'm now on htc's kernel #15
[EVO 4G General] indagroove:
Thanks for this post, and IMO this info should be obvious to even a non-engineer. These are the reasons exactly why I have never once even been tempted to try these kernels. The reason for the charging policy set by HTC in the stock kernels is similar to the reason the bartender never fills your drink up to the rim -- it's likely to overflow and make a mess.
[EVO 4G General] raiderinks:
I should also point out that rereading my first quote of MS79723 shows a clear contradiction in his explanation. He says they are using a trickle charger, but he is describing a constant voltage scheme. MS, please clarify exactly what you guys are doing so the engineers here can provide input.
[EVO 4G General] NewZJ:
I dont deny facts are there, I dont overlook them. I will continue to use SBC kernels because I like the battery life "now" not longevity, I wont have this phone long enough for the battery to be rendered useless by charging and if I do then I wont second thought purchasing another battery.

thank you for the very informative post, im positive it answers lots of questions that many have about SBC kernels affecting battery longevity

you can tell smokers that cigarettes cause cancer but it wont stop many of them, ms has given an option to those that so desire the absolute most out of their batterys at a cost of longevity and I appreciate that.

there is still no proof of how much SBC shortens battery life or how quickly, my battery has been using SBC kernels since testing periods along with a few others and I or them have yet to experience reduced battery life. I will report if ever my battery has less than expected life and I do carry a new unopened backup for if that day comes
[EVO 4G General] |Jason8|:
Remember the FPS fix created by the developers on these forums?
[EVO 4G General] raiderinks:
Charging a battery is driven by device physics, not software. You can't abstract yourself away from the fact that a battery is a fundamental device that behaves according to the laws of physics and those laws direct us to only a few safe methods for charging. Without some legitimate answers and clarifications from the developers, there is a clear and real danger that you are overcharging your battery every single day. Furthermore, heat is not the only way to tell that a battery is overcharged. That is how you tell it is overcharged to a critical failure point.

Now, I don't doubt the merits and the tremendous skill of the developers on these forums. In fact, I have been partaking in their efforts since the PPC6700. However, this is an area that ***NEEDS*** clarification because it is putting people and property at risk if done improperly.
[EVO 4G General] matt2053:
Question: if I'm using this tweaked kernel and my battery never goes above 4.2 v does that mean it is not being overcharged? Because that's what I observe. It charges to 4.2 v and stays there with 0 mA, no matter how long it is on the charger. Does this not indicate that it is working as designed?
[EVO 4G General] xlGmanlx:
you would be better suited to get a response if you PM'd him directly instead of asking him a question in a thread you started. What you say may be true seeing as you have more formal instruction on the matter however what is clearly obvious where as much command you have in the other arena you posses the exact opposite in the development cycle. Also, all of his information is posted online in his github which he clearly links to in his posts would probably be an excellent starting point to gain additional perspective before continuing your research.
[EVO 4G General] raiderinks:
That depends entirely on the reliability of the voltage measurements. If we assume that they are flawless measurements, then it would suggest that your battery is not being overcharged. However, I have no idea what kind of error exists in the onboard measurement devices, if they register false values outside of an operable range, etc.
[EVO 4G General] raiderinks:
I didn't know he had linked his github page. Looking him up now.
[EVO 4G General] GadgetMonger:
Ok.... that was all very hi techy and you sound as if you are very educated and know what youre talking about. Means very little to me as a user. What do I look for as a user? My batt life is noticeably better on the sbc kernel. Its not over heating in the least, in fact Id go as far as to say its cooler now on the charger than when I was using the stock HTC kernel, and I have my phone on the charger a lot. Id consider myself a power user for sure. Ive been using different apps to monitor mA's and I can say that when my batt reaches full charge the mA's the batt is absorbing (0-2) are far less than what the phone is using even when just sleeping. So how could the batt be getting over charged? How would I know? I know it cant be sustaining a full charge the entire time its on the charger as long as the phone is on, simple mathematics tell me this, right?:confused: This is what Ive gotten from all that Ive read on this, please correct me where ever Im wrong and please keep in mind Im no engineer. In order for the batt to sustain damage it needs to take in more mA's than its puttng out for a period of time. Thats how it becomes "overcharged", right? So if I turn my phone with the sbc kernel off, place it on the charger and walk away from it for a day or so... that would result in over charging. Correct or no? Now if I take my phone with the sbc kernel and plug it in to the charger while on and walk away from it for a day its using more mA's than its pulling in... no over charge. No damage to my batt. Yes or no?
[EVO 4G General] ms79723:
My work is on my github and yeah there probably was a contradiction. I pretty much write everything in "one take" so I dont ever go back and re read, I write everything that I'm thinking.
[EVO 4G General] Biggest Fro:
I believe some of the problem is that there were several different SBC Kernals.

When my battery gets to 4200mA, it bounces between 4195-4200 but NEVER exceeds 4200.

This could be looked at the same as overclocking, plays nice with some phones, kills others.
[EVO 4G General] pardonmyownage:
did you even read the whole OP for SBC? its been there since he started
[EVO 4G General] bwcorvus:
Just went through my log for the last 8 days and same as you my highest charge is 4204 (hit this only 2 times).

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/18315605/battery_history.txt
[EVO 4G General] pardonmyownage:
Exactly my feeling on the matter. the only short term way to damage the battery/phone is temperature. there are a lot of people who dont care about the long term affects on the battery seeing as they are fairly cheap. (most people should replace their batteries after a year anyway).

Thank you very much for the work you do, i kept up with your post when you first started the project. you were VERY enthusiastic about figuring this out and bringing it to the public. personally i think we need more devs as spirited as you.

i believe most people and discussion is related to v7. (at least i hope)

with all this said. since immediate damage is due to temperature of the battery. wouldnt it be easy to add another failsafe in the kernel that would shut off charging if the temperature exceeded a certain amount. i'm no dev, but i wouldn't think that would be very hard. then we could let the end user decide on the risk of prolonged battery degradation.
[EVO 4G General] z28marols1:
In all of my reading I have found that it is known that holding a Li-ion battery at its max rated voltage is bad for the battery and can have similar effects as overcharging over time. Charging to that point and then stopping the charge is ok.
[EVO 4G General] xlGmanlx:
ha! so we don't really know what we don't know at this point. in all seriousness though, it doesn't look like we have any more data to present other than there is potential for issues if the code from MS's isn't wired tight but we also might be fooling ourselves since there is potential risks involved in the entire charging enivronment not limited to the kernel but the physical chargers themselves. I think the more we actually look into this and disect what is going on the better off it will be. who know's this might be akin to the FPS or it could be a safety hazard, i don't feel confident saying either way with the data we have at this time
[EVO 4G General] pardonmyownage:
But does he know what SBC actually does? No. He is waiting for someone else to tell him how it works. He doesn't know.

I'm not saying he is wrong... I'm saying he can't relate it to SBC.
[EVO 4G General] pardonmyownage:
Ill admit MS doesn't explain it very well.
[EVO 4G General] gpz1100:
I think this has already been stated, but let me restate it in a different way.

For the devices that don't have that initial drop in battery from 100% to 90%, but the drop is more linear and steady throughout usage, how do we know that the software isn't compensating for this? In other words, what's not to say that they too are employing similar charging limitations (90%) on their batteries, but the software is programmed such that it uses a skewed scale to present battery level to the user. Perhaps htc omitted this in their implementation, causing the battery indicator to more truly present battery capacity - and now it's causing this uproar.
[EVO 4G General] deallocate:
Don't know about other chargers, but my cheap e-bay charger just stops charging, it doesn't trickle charge. This is also the same way as all of my rc car battery charges work (with lipo batteries). These batteries can stay at a near max charge for a long time because, so once the charge is done, it doesn't need to keep charging.

As I understand it this is different from the phone, where the phone always operates on the battery. So it sounds (in my uneducated, non-code reading mind) that the SBC kernel is trying to match the phones current usage with the amount of ma the battery needs to maintain 100% charge by monitoring the voltage. That sounds a lot different that how my wall charger works.
[EVO 4G General] xlGmanlx:
Could we mod the kernel to have power the phone off of ac only? It can be done now old school, plug in phone, take out battery haha. Once phone gets to 4.2 only run off house power and shut down battery charging
[EVO 4G General] nYdGeo:
The thing about this that no one seems to address, unless I missed it, is the constant referral to 'overcharging'. Yes, overcharging a battery is bad, even dangerous. Same with laptop batteries, same with car batteries.

However, I've also been made to understand that all Lithium batteries must have overcharging preventative circuitry to prevent them from...here it comes...overcharging. Oddly, I have as yet to see anyone critical of the SBC kernel technology acknowledge this, much less address it.

After reading thousands of posts and many articles, etc, on this topic, my conclusion based on the evidence as I interpret it is that the SBC kernels may indeed contribute to a detrimental or even dangerous battery condition, but only in conjunction with a battery with a malfunctioning overcharge prevention system.

Please note that the above is my logical conclusion based on the data I’ve consumed.

I do not claim these to be iron clad facts, but neither is it simply my opinion. I have no emotional ties to this whatsoever, and have read all the same things that people continue to post, repost, re-re-post (and whatever comes next to the inth power), along with everything from wikis to university engineering blogs.

Logic would appear to say that if someone’s phone battery has malfunctioning overcharge protection and they are not using an SBC kernel, they may be less likely to experience something unpleasant. If they are using an SBC kernel and the overcharge protection malfunctions…this could be bad.

If, however, the overcharge protection on their battery is working properly, and they are using an SBC kernel, the worst thing that should be possible is for the life-span of their battery to be shortened.

For those few that have had a bad experience, I am indeed sorry to hear of it. However, there are also hundreds if not thousands of folks using the SBC kernels, many including myself for as long as they’ve been available and have not experienced any negative effects.

Nonetheless, I believe that this should be a concern as unless there is an ‘event’, none of us has any surefire way of knowing whether or not the protective circuit in our battery is working properly other than being observant, and periodically verifying that the charging rate is indeed lowering as it should, and that our batteries are not charging beyond that 2.2v limit.

Thank you for the opportunity to offer my thoughts on this matter.
[EVO 4G General] DGreen1:
So I just took apart a standard wall charger. Here are the guts. Can anyone tell what some of the components in here are for? Just trying to help!
[EVO 4G General] dschoenike:
Here are my questions. why do you feel "obligated" to warn us? What are you planning on getting out of all this? A pat on the back? a couple more "thanked posts"? a better nights sleep knowing you tried to save us from ourselves? How many threads are there now, explaining the "possible" dangers of using this kernel? Please dont have the feeling of banging your head against a wall, to get your info into our thick heads. Nobody asked. why can't those of us who use the kernel, and have not had ANY!! problems with said kernel, just be left alone to use it. You don't want to run it on your phone? Fine, I'm not gonna start thread upon thread telling you why I feel obligated to get you TO use it. Enoughs enough. The devs are going to put a disclaimer on the kernel. Hurray!! you win. Now just please stop.