yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[EVO 4G Android Development] mattykinsx:
So many flaws? lol what in the world...

And your insurance stance is, in a general sense,

exactly

why so many people are "willing to take the risk"

You're not willing to take any risk, you're just willing to defraud insurance for an extra 10% of battery.

I can only hope that Sprint catches on and doesn't cover someone that does that.

But that's all a separate issue...
[EVO 4G Android Development] mcampos7:
Alright forgive me for my ignorance, with past HTC phones, I've been able to properly charge battery's, I assumed that this phone could have been built to do the same. Darn those laws of physics.
[EVO 4G Android Development] Agfadoc:
I know that's what you guys here, now, are saying.. and I am good with a caution warning.. I thought caution should already be assumed when I am rooting my phone changing the software, etc, but since we need warnings on the 02 absorber in the beef jerkey bag to tell the dumbasses to not eat it, then I guess it wouldn't hurt to put another warning about SBC on each of the threads.. I don't care about that.

But you do know the conversation began a few weeks ago differently when this whole thing started.

People were carrying pitchforks and torches (figuratively) to ban MS and stop all production, remove it from the site, and all kinds of radical, irrational, emotional, opinions. "don't even say the word.. Ahhhhh!!!!

I just think stopping any and all research into why is irresponsible for anyone here on the forums of enhancing technology.

Lets just agree to disagree and keep moving forward.. I hate this rehash of the same crap.. to be frank about it.
[EVO 4G Android Development] :
:clapping:

the nay sayers have managed to bring in the negativity from all 100 OTHER threads into this one where people have supported ms and each other who use the kernel. Using the words like "idiot" and "are you stupid" only justifies the credibility of the person.

another thread where a pissing contest has developed.

if people dont read - its their own fault - just like knowing the issues that will stem from flashing anything not OEM. ITS GOING TO HAPPEN.
[EVO 4G Android Development] mattykinsx:
I think you'd better re-read who has done the name calling in this thread.

Certainly since yesterday.

http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=10560942&postcount=4139

http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=10564649&postcount=4165

http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=10564649&postcount=4165

http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=10566769&postcount=4175

http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=10567605&postcount=4186

Just to name a few...
[EVO 4G Android Development] Product F(RED):
Actually, quite the opposite.

But look, enough is enough. I HAVE HAD IT WITH THESE MUTHA****IN FLAMES IN THIS MUTHA****IN THREAD :P
[EVO 4G Android Development] :
thanks but ive moved on from all the reading - it was not pointed in anyone's direction and i apologize if you felt it was in directed solely towards you. i just skimmed through the last 20+ pages. IDK - maybe it was you or maybe not that i saw those .. i wasnt keeping record of who said what.

however:

yesterday i flashed back to pri 1.90 (nova 002) and the battery sip wasnt as low as 1.77 .. so i flashed back this morning and it has sipped on 2% for around 2 hours. :)
[EVO 4G Android Development] mattykinsx:
I'm glad to hear you have good battery life but please keep in mind:

SBC only ensures that you get the battery from 100 to 0 percent as opposed to the stock kernel which only ensures you get 90 to 0 percent. [Although that doesn't mean it will be as low as 90 when you take it off the charger]

It's merely an add-on not a kernel itself and therefore any battery performance, under 90 percent [just to be safe] is due to whichever kernel and NOT due to the modification ms has applied to it.
[EVO 4G Android Development] :
i realize that - but since im using this kernel i post my findings in here about MY combination.

i didnt want to go into the whole mV numbers i pulled my phone off at and the current it was drawing while on the charger vs. when i unplugged the charger (because you will not have the same mV when its on as when you pull the phone off)

ive been testing these pri's with the kernels and have been reporting back here as a result of users request
[EVO 4G Android Development] NewZJ:
Dont diss on my jerky bag flavor packets!
[EVO 4G Android Development] xlGmanlx:
This thread has officially melted down
[EVO 4G Android Development] HondaCop:
I would say it was overcharged.

PS. My name is HondaCop and I approve this message.
[EVO 4G Android Development] xlGmanlx:
More likely exploded
[EVO 4G Android Development] thenewguy821:
Must be the kernel... LOL
[EVO 4G Android Development] grimstar:
Too soon...:D
[EVO 4G Android Development] thedemonic:
evo battery probs before this kernel was even made

http://androidforums.com/htc-evo-4g/93647-hot-hot-battery.html

http://androidforums.com/htc-evo-4g/93597-evo-spontaneously-combusted-no-joke.html#post882836
[EVO 4G Android Development] mattykinsx:
That shows is how absolutely dangerous playing with this is.

Watch the video.

What if that happens in your pocket?

Further testing is needed and a warning to users is absolutely required.

I realize it's a different situation and I am not saying the SBC kernel will do this or even could, I'm just saying that the potential is pretty severe.
[EVO 4G Android Development] HondaCop:
Do you charge your phone while it's in your pocket?

PS. My name is HondaCop and I approve this message.
[EVO 4G Android Development] mattykinsx:
Doesn't mean you can't take it off the charger and it could already be in the process of whatever...

Want a better one?

What if that happened with your phone laying next to you while you're sleeping in bed?

I really don't see why it is that example was even necessary. If you didn't have pictures and sarcasm you'd have zero posts.
[EVO 4G Android Development] jasonl99:
Your Supreme Mattiness:

The quoted statement that you've made a number of times is insulting to a lot of people on this forum. Why do you assume that all of us who are running the SBC mod are going to use insurance if we have a problem with the battery? I won't presume to speak for everyone else, but I would be reasonably sure that most people in here have morals and understand the risks they are taking. If the battery fries as a result of this mod, that's my fault. I understand that, I accept that. What little you must think of the world for you to assume that everyone's first instinct is to commit fraud. I would imagine it is not a happy place inside your head.

And, while you're enjoying the view from your glass house, I wonder if you would file an insurance claim if you have a problem with your phone. Assuming you've rooted your phone, any insurance claim you make would be every bit as fraudulent because you've also violated the terms of your warranty.

Please go away and don't come back.
[EVO 4G Android Development] ms79723:
Do you know why there are side effects listed for certain medicines? That's because through drug trials they have found out that certain things (unwanted things) come coupled with their results, so they list those side effects as a warning. Key thing: drug trials aka experiments. Now, you're saying without any experimentation I should put up a warning....you're saying that we should always go with the worst case scenario...well hell if thats what we should be doing, might as well put up signs underneath windows that say "dont stand underneath this window...objects may fall out." Anything could happen, but you're stressing what others are saying just because they managed to pull up graphs and whatnot yet they still probably dont know anything about our phones hardware wise. They are going off of things that have absolutely nothing with out phone other than the battery. Now if this was going on with an external charger..then alrighty then I'd see the problem..but does any of them know how the charger inside our phones work? If my kernel could override everything charging related with the phone, it probably would've gone to crap a long time ago because the earlier builds had no cut off limit. Hell, the builds for the Droid Inc had no limit and their chargers can reach 4.228V easily before they even hit 100%.
[EVO 4G Android Development] Product F(RED):
So why don't you test them already? Saying there's even a 10% chance your battery will get damaged or, worst case, explode is not good enough. People who actually work in these fields have repeatedly said that you don't know what you're talking about. Read back a few posts when I listed links to such posts.

And Yes, I do think we should all just stop already.
[EVO 4G Android Development] mattykinsx:
Feel free to show me where I said "absolutely every person is going to commit insurance fraud if something goes wrong."

I didn't.

So stop putting words in my mouth and "go away".

You have multiple reports of people that, while using your kernel, have had battery failures.

I have said, among with other people [Product F(RED) would be a perfect example], that you should post a warning and do complete testing.

If that testing shows that it does not, in any circumstance, cause an increase in likelihood of these issues, then the warning can be taken down.

However, if you want to continue to post the kernel then post the warning until it can be proven otherwise.

Really, it's not that big of a deal to do yet you seem to take it to personal offence that it be done.

Also, all kernels come with a risk.

Period.

That's why every kernel post on this board has a warning with it.

So why not just put up a warning, continue to release the kernel, do the testing and be done with it?

Give me one good reason.
[EVO 4G Android Development] tmwilsoniv:
Indeed.

Welcome to the 21st Century. In another couple of years, will we see Black Box Warnings on aspirin and cheese burger wrappers? Lest we forget the now infamous "Crack-baby Study" presented by the medical experts at the A.M.A., which claimed in-uturo exposure to cocaine would (not might) cause irreparable damage to the fetus. The A.M.A. was forced to retract their findings only after their follow-up study, this time subjected to scientific methodology, ie. peer review, double blind studies, etc., found the first study to be pure bunk.
[EVO 4G Android Development] Stevenskii:
I honestly was using an SBC kernel and stopped because of the "dangers" or at least the supposed dangers, but you better bet that I don't blame the devs for making them possible. Has there been legitimate proof that it was ONLY the SBC kernel causing the issue?

Also, doesn't every dev test to some degree? You can't get every last thing completely hammered out. I don't know, I just don't see why everyone is getting so worked up about a few batteries. Personally, I monitor my phone and if it gets too hot or even feels too hot, I unplug it. Simple. I just am not using the kernel anymore cause I honestly didn't notice much of a difference, and figured that I would be on the safe side until someone brought real facts to the case, other than, "my friend says this, and he is of this profession."
[EVO 4G Android Development] Product F(RED):
Nobody is blaming him for creating bombs out of our Evos. He put work into it. But until you can say 100%, without a doubt, there is little to no risk (with test results), slap a warning label on and keep them up. Remember, it was your own choice, ms, to take down the kernels. You said it yourself. We never made you. You took them down and blamed it on us.
[EVO 4G Android Development] ms79723:
Ok, so multiple reports and I wasn't notified or anything? I mean were they legit reports? Or just claims without any evidence? I saw the one post about with some battery overheating and he posted pics, yet I dont think I saw anything about usage..or any logs...none of that. If I can't investigate the reports and go through all the factors at play, then I'm just not gonna take them seriously. And I seem to be taking personal offense because of the way this has been handled...multiple unnecessary threads by alleged electrical engineers just looking out for the common individual -.- why not just put it in this thread? Why not just send me a message or something? You want to know how many messages I got that was full of data from electrical engineers? 0. So when someone is posting all of that in other threads, that's a sign of not concern for other users...but a sign for removal. They want to be noticed. They want to show off their knowledge..just to make themselves feel better and they'd feel even better if they were the ones to get SBC removed. And that may seem like a silly thing to say, but people are like that...My example...when people post things like "first" or post up links from other websites talking about when something is released but 10 mins later we find out that it in fact isnt released, that person just posted it thinking that it was just so they could be first...people do things for attention.

And here's what I dont get? Why target SavageKernel? Why did they say that that kernel has caused harm when it uses the same code as my other kernels, zendroid and netarchy's builds. Shoo, MIUI uses SavageKernel. You know how many users that is? I havent seen any complaints from them. You want to know why? Thats probably because they dont know they are using SavageKernel...if you tell a ton of people that something may happen, they will look for the smallest thing to prove that it is happening to them "oh, yeah, my battery is a little warm on the charger" Meh, w/e.
[EVO 4G Android Development] mattykinsx:
http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=909763

raiderinks has claimed to contact you.

And if the attitude that you were displaying earlier is any indication, I can understand why they chose the route they did.

Also, why did you eliminate the most important part of this post?
[EVO 4G Android Development] thenewguy821:
That video is a very poor example of what can happen. First off, that is a hobby grade Li-Po battery, which ida about 10x the size of the batteries in our phones, with at least 2x the capacity and made to with under HIGH current draw. The battery ida an older style "soft"pack, which is not enclosed in a hard plastic shell, as our batteries are. That was an intentional overcharge, which can only be done by bypassing the safety features of the charger (fuses as one example). In order for THAT to happen with our phones, someone would have to intentionally design a kernel that would never step down the charging cycle, pushing a continuous 4.5+ volts at a high amperage into the batteries. even then, long before the flame, there would be warning signs. Heat and smoke from the cell venting would far preclude the "Pop" of the cell rupturing.
[EVO 4G Android Development] Agfadoc:
What interest do you have in this since you don't use the SBC kernel? You don't have a dog int he fight yet you place yourself squarely in the middle..

Can you please stop your attack so we can move along?

You are putting more effort into this which makes me question your motives.
[EVO 4G Android Development] mattykinsx:
You know what it generally means when you try to pick apart posts for certain words [like swaze did to Product F(RED)] or when you completely ignore significant parts of a post?

That your argument is pretty freakin' weak and even you realize it.

Why should someone potentially go through this because they weren't informed?

I don't really give a **** what you think my motives are.
[EVO 4G Android Development] Product F(RED):
"We" is the people who think this kernel needs a warning label and needs to be tested before people go around saying it's 100% safe. I can tell by your language that you're not even worth the trouble. I guess anyone who posts something intelligent and/or constructive "looks like they wanna be xda police" to you. And fyi I don't care for policing user around; I'm already a moderator another forum and I can tell you it's not a pleasant job.
[EVO 4G Android Development] dblock3nine:
I been using the SBC Kernels since day 1 on three different Evos and I have had ZERO issues. I'm currently using it on my Evo now, my old Evo and its on my sister's Evo also. You're 100% right MS, if people are going to come and start saying your kernel is the cause then please show the data not just pictures. When anyone has a problem with a product or anything like that, sent your concerns to the maker (developer) and I'm sure it would've been taken care of. People need to stop putting blame on you or anyone without

FACTS

to back up their claims. I'm glad you standing up for yourself and I do wish you would put back the kernels. Keep up the great work either way.
[EVO 4G Android Development] mattykinsx:
My grandpa smoked cigarettes for most of his adult life and is still alive and cookin', without cancer, at 85.

What is your point, that cigarettes don't cause cancer?

To the rest of your post:

Just because you choose to ignore the facts that have been posted, doesn't mean they aren't facts.
[EVO 4G Android Development] swaze:
You're right, im not worth it. So why not go moderate on your forum and stop creating alot of unnecessary drama. It could have stopped after your first post about it, but were on how many pages of nonsense?? And take the green hornet and cato with you while you're at it.
[EVO 4G Android Development] Agfadoc:
Wow.. You sure are a tough guy.. Pigeon chest all puffed out.. probably in your moms basement. But hey, I guess even the lowliest of the group needs some attention.
[EVO 4G Android Development] mattykinsx:
made a mistake, my apologies.
[EVO 4G Android Development] thenewguy821:
What happened to this being America and"innocent till proven guilty"? Where is the PROOF that SBC is to blame? 6 out of hundreds or thousands of users claim the kernel caused their battery to die, so now people are demanding MS proves it wasn't his tweak? Why doesn't someone PROVE the kernel was the problem? Speculation from self-proclaimed "professionals" is NOT proof.
[EVO 4G Android Development] HondaCop:
LMAO

Only problem here is that trailers don't have basements.

PS. My name is HondaCop and I approve this message.
[EVO 4G Android Development] Agfadoc:
See another uninformed post.. You really must lack the skills to make it out there.

Would you please show the studio audience where I said that?

Oh.. You can't.. so, is the rest of what you say just as misaligned?

I say that it is.. Getting enough attention here buddy? Hey your mom is calling.. She says you need to go get a job and move out of her basement... and get your laundry upstairs.
[EVO 4G Android Development] mattykinsx:
First off, that philsophy [if it ever actually existed and history kinda shows it didn't] no longer exists here.

Secondly, accusations have been made based on issues people had when using the kernel. People have chimed in with very good reasonings of why it should be tested further.

That is more than enough to warrant it.
[EVO 4G Android Development] mattykinsx:
I read too fast, saw swaze's name because it's the post right above yours, and deleted my post.

I'm a big enough man to admit a mistake, my apologies.
[EVO 4G Android Development] scooter185:
It has to do with the nature of the batteries, which don't deal well with overcharging. It would be circumstantial evidence I suppose if this were a court.

As for the poster who was mad at htc for th battery design, be mad because htc didn't include a circuit so the phone runs off of AC when on the charger.
[EVO 4G Android Development] dblock3nine:
First shows your grandpa is one lucky man, I hope that continues for him and lives a very long life. Now my point is that if there is no proof, as in facts, to show it does cause damage so why blame it on the kernel. See there are studies (Facts) to show that cigarettes cause cancer, thats the point and difference. Also what are the facts? Pictures, videos or is it the so called "experts" telling is why this type of kernel isn't good. Now if data would be collected and solid proof showed that the kernel is the cause then it should be taken down and not use. Until then lets not assume because things tend to not always seem to be how they look.
[EVO 4G Android Development] GadgetMonger:
Who are you to "request " anything? Sounds more like demands to me anyway. If the mods were having an issue with the thread they should be the ones to handle it. Not a wannabe like yourself. Got an issue with a thread or dev? Report it to the powers that be. There's more than enough information out there on these kernels for anyone who wants to research and form their own opinions. Hell, I'd guess 50% or better don't even read the op before they go flashing things on their phones anyhow. These threads are full of questions and compaints because people don't bother to do any research. So I don't see how you figure your "request " would change much of anything. How about you go to work developing something, then you can start your own thread and run it anyway you see fit.
[EVO 4G Android Development] thenewguy821:
LMFAO.... This comment from the person who picked 3 statements from a post I made earlier and decided to only comment on them. Now you are going to say that means, AND I QUOTE, "That your argument is pretty freakin' weak and even you realize it." I think that in itself speaks VOLUMES. BTW, Nice job of increasing the text size in your quote of your own post to TRY to pull attention from the fact that YOU said "Watch the video. What if that happens in your pocket?"
[EVO 4G Android Development] tmwilsoniv:
Made my day!
[EVO 4G Android Development] mattykinsx:
Many members of the community are requesting it.

I didn't ignore any issue that you posted.

At all.

Read what I did.

You can try to put any spin you want on it.

I also didn't try to redirect the conversation to a separate issue.

Which is all that has been going on in this thread.

Comment about the video was simply that, if the chemical reaction starts and you pull it off the charger and put it in your pocket during that, yeah...

I followed it up with another comment that was more applicable and likely.
[EVO 4G Android Development] Trident:
Really sorry to see this go this way.

I've been using one of these kernels for a few weeks now- I've tried new ROMs and other kernels and various combinations. While the ROMs do change I keep coming back to this kernel. It charges the fastest and discharges the slowest of any. But that's just my observation. I also noticed that my EVO was cooler most of the time.

Hopefully the development will continue and we'll see more in the future.
[EVO 4G Android Development] islandreamer:
I just want to thanks MS for his work and hope he continues with it!!!
[EVO 4G Android Development] raiderinks:
Does anyone realize how obnoxious this statement is? MS, have you seen what a 1000F fire does to a building or a persons body? And you are seriously suggesting that HALF of the people running SBC would need to have CATASTROPHIC failure, possibly maiming them for life or destroying their homes, before you would acknowledge that it is dangerous?

These systems are designed with the intent that they will NEVER EVER EVER fail catastrophically. If it happens to 10 people, that is a major departure from design. If it happens to 10 people, could it be bad manufacturing? Absolutely. But you are absolutely not contributing to ensuring that you will have an argument because you seem not to care.

I honestly can't even believe you would take this position.
[EVO 4G Android Development] jelive:
Where in the link?
[EVO 4G Android Development] runsoverfrogs:
well then buddy, you obviously don't get it.
[EVO 4G Android Development] ken135:
Download no longer available?
[EVO 4G Android Development] HondaCop:
If the Salvation Army employed a handful of you guys, this world would be such a better place. You are all so caring about others and worry about them getting hurt.

PS. My name is HondaCop and I approve this message.
[EVO 4G Android Development] GadgetMonger:
Unless any of them are mods, I direct my post to all of them then...