yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[G2 and Desire Z Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] n3ph:
I'm actually surprised many people preferred Stock Android UI over Sense. I was using the Milestone (Droid in the US). It was in all ways a solid phone. However, due to Motorola's delay in upgrading it to the much-needed Froyo, I had to make an eventual switch to another phone. Not having the speed boost from JIT, App2SD and 30fps cap is horrendous.

Once, I saw Sense in an advertisement, I was immediately captivated by it. It became part of the reason why I want a HTC for my replacement phone. MT4G isn't available here in Singapore, so my struggle was between the Desire Z and Desire HD.

Long story short, I chose the Z primarily for the hardware keyboard. I don't like my fat fingers covering the screen when I type and also having the soft keyboard squeezing in the already-small screen. In addition, after overclocking the DZ to 1ghz using Godspeed, I find that there's no noticeable different from the lack of 200mhz. In fact, it gave slightly better battery life to the Z.

It's kinda off-topic, but in the end the reason I chose Desire Z is for Sense and hardware keyboard. I wish the keyboard could have been screwed tighter so that I could lay upside-down and use it though.

Another keyboard phone I could have chosen is the Milestone 2. But after knowing that its XT720 brethren will never get an update to Froyo, I'm glad I jumped out of Motorola.
[G2 and Desire Z Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] dustrho:
Well, I just received my FOURTH MyTouch4G today, and it has a creaking/squishy back button. WTF!?!? This unit I received by mail is one from China, so that's a good thing because everything else about it is great (minus a couple scratches/dings in the silver part of the bezel). So I'll be shipping my third MT4G back tomorrow, and will need to make a decision to either keep this phone or exchange it for something else (possibly the G2). I seriously don't understand how HTC could choose these cheap-ass plastic buttons over capacitive ones.

What would you do? Keep the 4th MT4G with annoying physical buttons or swap it out for the G2?
[G2 and Desire Z Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] mrbloo:
If u don't want a keyboadd just get a nexus s
[G2 and Desire Z Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] elbarto7:
nexus s no hspa+
[G2 and Desire Z Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] androidcues:
There is nothing wrong with the hinge. That was a total anomaly of a few people making such a big stink about these hinges and basically that has died down because people realized it is basically a brilliant contraption, and I think htc tightened up the hinges after the first batch. Like myself, a lot of folks gravitated towards the G2 from the G1 and if you had a G1 -- those are impenetrable phones fit for the construction worker. The G1 was the first ever android phone so naturally it was made so solid and so snappy and people expected the G2 to be like it. I do treat my G2 more delicately than the G1 (i treat it as if the Queen of England was sitting in the palm of my hand) but it is solid. Sure, if you tried to rip the screen off the phone you could, but then that doesnt prove its a ****ty phone it just proves your a ****ty phone owner.

as for the mt4g -- im seeing people complain about the cheap plastic already tearing apart around the edge after one month. It is still a great phone but im going to stick with metal over plastic anyday and twice on Sunday.
[G2 and Desire Z Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] pdxrealtor:
I had 3 G2's before I went to the MT4G. The only killer for me was the G2 radio. Hands down the reception on the MT4G smokes the G2.

When you rely on the phone for biz that counts. Plus the G2 ended up being just too thick for me.....:(
[G2 and Desire Z Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] Anartic:
The reception isn't the best, but as long as it holds the HSPA signal I'm fine with it, 1 HPSA+ bar is still fast as heck. I still don't like the hinge, though I prefer the G2's solidity over the MT4G. Though I would've liked if T-Mobile made more push for the G2, advertising and feature-wise. You would think the G2 has higher significance since it's the follow-up to the phone that kicked off Android, guess not.
[G2 and Desire Z Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] jboy15:
i have both phones.

but all i can say is that g2 smoke mt4g all day!

keyboard is what makes the g2 wins.

other than that same feature! except mt4g's mysense ui! and the g2 clocked to 800mhz while mt4g is at 1ghz.

pure android for the g2!, SOLID build for the g2!

mt4g has front face camera g2 dont!
[G2 and Desire Z Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] detox702:
I used to think like you re: Sense. Keep in mind, the G2 is just the Desire Z, which imho has a much better Sense than the MT4G uses. But, with all our wonderful devs, most of what I missed about Sense has been picked up and built into the current roms.
[G2 and Desire Z Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] the orange bandit:
I have a Sense ROM on my G2 and overclock it to.a conservative 1.2Ghz and its freakin awesome. Everything on the Sense ROM works, too, btw
[G2 and Desire Z Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] deliberate187:
Here's what I would suggest. Before buying anything, go to a T-Mobile store and try out one of their live demos of each phone you're considering. Try out everything in the interface. Settings, menus, lock/unlock, basically the entire interface. Decide based on what feels most intuitive to you. NOTE: The DesireZ is not sold here in the US, and will most likely have to be ordered from abroad or a G2 rooted and booted to support DesireZ/Virtuous ROMs.

Basically, if Sense feels better to you, then the choices are obvious, either MT4G or Desire Z.

If the keyboard is a necessity but don't care about Sense either way, then it's the Desire Z or G2.

Need Sense and the keyboard? Desire Z.

If you like stock Android best, then go with the G2.

Making a purchasing decision based on what others tell you about the interface is probably not the wisest thing to do. For example, I hate Sense with a passion but some people I know swear by it and wouldn't touch stock FroYo with a 10 foot pole. I tried a Desire Z (Sense) firmware on my G2 and flashed it back within the time it took me to get off the phone with my girlfriend and get back on my computer to copy the ROM file. The dialer and text messaging apps felt clunky to me and the text too small for my fingers to accurately touch. Had I bought a MT4G I would have been sorta stuck with Sense.

I also like the stock Android because it feels more natural to me. Text is larger, icons don't "scream" at me and I feel as though the codebase is more well-reviewed because of its open source nature. Contrast to Sense, which is largely proprietary to HTC and parts of the system libraries are modified on a low level, which could possibly break some apps built for stock Android.

I came to the G2 from the G1 too, so the G2 just kind of "made sense" to me as an upgrade, no pun intended.

So in essence, it all comes down to choice. I've given you my reasons. The best thing you can do is try the phones yourself and see what feels best to you.
[Desire Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] supriz:
when downloading a app from the market why does it restart my phone for like 15 seconds

WHAT THE HELL WHAT HAPPENED

can anybody help me with this issue?

it happened from after i manually updated to the OTA2.2 telus stock rom

done factory reset and is okay now
[Desire Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] mblaster:
This might help:

settings->applications->manage applications->market->delete data
[Desire Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] StuMcBill:
What app are you trying to download?

Mine did this before when trying to update a system app.
[Desire Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] supriz:
i tried erasing data and i downloaded many types of apps ones that i wanted and random featured apps

please help
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] chimerical26:
Firstly.... go here and read this -

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/charging_lithium_ion_batteries

The battery is fully charged when it is at 4.2 Volts and fully discharged at some predefined voltage (Lets say 3 volts).

The phone can measure these voltages directly from the battery. To see the voltage of your battery type *#*#4636#*#* into your phone and go to battery information.

If all that is so then what is the point or need of "recalibrating" and deleting battery stats and all that.

It seems logical to me that battery stats is just the place where your battery usage history is stored and nothing else.

Can someone confirm this or convince me otherwise?

(I rotate between 3 batteries and cannot grasp the idea that my phone can't consistently measure the charge level of the battery and operate accordingly.)
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] Ashath:
Measuring the Voltage to get the charge level is not very accurate, and has to be done with no load on the battery (that is, when its not in your phone).

So the phone has to count "energy used from"/"energy stored in" the battery for an accurate display. (called "Coloumb counter")
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] xufos:
Did some test

I did a test on new a battery a while ago. Measure voltage when the battery completely empty and fully charged.

Empty battery

1% remaining, using SystemPanel

Take the battery out and measure it with Multimeter

Fully charged

100% charged

Again, measure it with Multimeter

The voltage showed on the phone using SystemPanel app is quite accurate with 0.04V margin of error. Most smart electronic measure lithium battery capacity according to the remaining voltage. In this case, fully charged SGS is 4.2V, empty is 3.5V.

Me too, don't know why we have to delete batterystats.bin to recalibrate battery indicator :confused: But I do know that SGS keep track on power consumption on each of its component/application. Its a little bit silly if SGS reads batterystats.bin and display it as battery indicator.
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] torres76:
Yet again how is this android development.
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] hardcore:
Thanks for that, but you were actually measuring the Voltage, not current (Amperes).

In any case, for laptop Li-ion batteries there is normally a capacity counter (Coulomb counter) that reports the capacity in terms of mAh (milli-ampere hours). It can normally report the remaining capacity, maximum capacity, design capacity, and can be used to measure the *actual* power drain (in terms of Watts).

I wonder if Android has APIs that let apps access that kind of information?
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] captive:
Not really sure about this, but:

Phone seems to measure both voltage & discharge speed, "predicting" remaining charge.

It happens that after a flash battery indicator jumps to a higher value (not compatible with the couple of minutes of dc connection it had), and fall to a way too low value after any battery intensive task (a few minutes of audio call are enough), once more not compatible with the real usage.

I should inspect android code to be shure of this, but I suspect batterystats.bin is used to keep track of battery usage and to this sort of prediction, while a firmware flash seems to mess somehow the measurement.

Edit: this is based on my direct experience, even if on just "empirical" tests. I'll take a look to code asap
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] harrydg:
'mkay, battery talk... always interesting to see what people make of this.

Let's help out all the misunderstandings here and start with the basics

First of all: read the basics on Li-ion batteries:

http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/lithium-ion-battery.htm

second:

you DON'T measure your voltage when your battery is disconnected. Because it will rise to the normal values of the battery after a while. When you connect it, and use it, the voltage will lower. Compare it to a garden hose. if you let water run out, the presure drops and water starts flowing (presure is voltage, flowing is the current). If you measure the presure when there is no water running, the presure will always mount to the default value, even if there is "not much water left in the tank". But when it starts running again, it could very well run out very fast. So in comparison: voltage says something, but only when you "use" it.

Third:

When a battery ages, it's characteristics change, it will be full... and then all at once, empty. It's not linear. So calculating the capacity is always a bit "guessing". (compare it to stones in your water tank... they don't give you water, the tank doesn't change, but all of a sudden, you're out of water).

conclusion:

capacity of a battery is a very tricky thing to do, it's a combination of voltage, current, age... so the best way to determine capacity is by using the history of the battery as the "guide" to the future. Resetting the battery statistics will remove that history and your phone will have to "learn" it's behavior again. If you don't reset your stats, your values will become more reliable over time (depending of course on the time the stats are kept ;))

For those who speak dutch, i put a complete battery description/howto/misunderstandings post on www.modelbouwforum.nl (search for posts of "harrydg")

If there are more questions or so, just ask, i'll try to help out as much as possible...
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] mike.sw:
wow harrydg that's great explanation, wish you were my physics teacher back in high school ;)

someone add this post to the main FAQ! :)
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] bilboa1:
I just wanna write it in a simpler way:

You've access to the battery stats from the kernel. And of course its current consumption which is measured not voltage. Voltage doesn't tell all that much. During high draws your voltage (at the battery level) can fluctuate quite a bit.

There's a regulator (or probably a bunch of them) get a stable voltage no matter what the input voltage is (well, still it has to be in the 3.3/5v range probably else the regulator burns)

Anyway, that's also why the battery stats have to be calibrated, while you can measure how much current is used (in maH aka milli amp per hour, or in mA aka "instant" milli amps), you don't know the battery capacity.

Not only the battery capacity changes from battery to battery but it also changes during the life time of the battery.

The *only* way to calibrate the battery, is to delete the stats, have a fully charged phone and let it drain out the battery until it turns off. That way the kernel will measure for example 1457mah used until it ran out of juice, and that's your battery capacity then. Having the full capacity allows the kernel to give you a rather precise estimate of your current battery status (eg "80%" that you see on the top of the screen) (of course the actual calculation is a bit more complicate but that's the basics)

If calibration stats storage is changed for any reason (probably kernel upgrade or just a whacky samsung implementation that gets corrupted for some reason) you need to delete it and make a new one to recalibrate.
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] harrydg:
If you want to make it simpler, make it at least correct...

"Anyway, that's also why the battery stats have to be calibrated, while you can measure how much current is used (in maH aka milli amp per hour, or in mA aka "instant" milli amps), you don't know the battery capacity."

First of al, it's mAh, which means milli ampere hour, NOT per hour, that would be mA/h, which it is not.

mA is milli ampere, which is a current

there is a significant difference between the 2.

the first is "capacity"

the second is "current"

it's like a bottle. The capacity is 2l and you pour at 1l per minut...

so... make it simple please...
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] crypta:
My guess is, that android is measuring the known min and max by the battery reported values, stores them and calculates the percentages.

So it is device and battery independent.
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] bilboa1:
Sorry a typo and no caps deserve heavy flaming
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] harrydg:
hehe, sorry for the rant, but if you want to put it simple, make sure the terminology and abbreviations are correct. If not, people will take over the mistakes and conversations will go totally wrong because of misunderstandings... :)
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] chimerical26:
Thanks very much for the feedback guys. It makes more sense now.

It's using batterystats to get familiar with discharge rates in order to give an accurate estimation of remaining charge and a prediction of when it will run dry.

Can it misreprasent these values and forcibly power down the phone when there is still charge remaining?

And likewise can it stop the charging process prematurely, estimating the battery to be at 100% charge when it is lower?

Is this the reason to recalibrate?
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] EarlZ:
Heres one thing what I noticed about the battery stats, some say deleting it fixes the guage and does not really recalibrate the battery, I really doubt there is a way for end users to do that, even if you never delete the battery stats bin and your drain is pretty fast, it significantly slows down when your battery hits around 25~35, the lower the power on the battery the more accurate it can be represented regardless of the calibration. This is applicaple for the SGS only.
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] vosszaa:
Now it comes to the question..

If the phone create battery stats every time the phone reboot, then when is the best time to delete and the best way to calibrate?

This is what I normally do..

..delete stats at 5%, let it run dry til it turn itself off, dont turn on but connect the charger til it fully charged. Turn phone on and ill have fully charged battery along with fresh stats.

Is this correct?
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] EarlZ:
On the SGS theres no real point in deleting it, unless you dont really wanna see the battery go down to 35% and stay there for a while, how ever busted your battery indicator is it gets very accurate as the lower it goes.
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] android53:
I never found batterystats made any difference. What did make a difference is the rom or kernel, what widgets, lagfix e.t.c

If you get more than 1% battery drain per 5hr standby then something is wrong
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] BronzedDroid:
I find that conclusion quite flawed.

First of all, what's your definition of standby?

3g on? Wireless on? Autosync on? There are also noticeable differences between different firmwares and between 2.1 and 2.2.

In addition, most people are reporting somewhere around 1% per 1 hour standby or 1% per 2 hour standby, which it what I have been experiencing as well. Sometimes, apparently for no reason, it can drain faster than that, maybe 1% per 0,5 hour or more. I think this might be some widgets fault.
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] android53:
1%/5h standby 3g no sync

i get 1%/2h with data and sync

Depends on your reception, im just basically saying if your losing say 8% battery overnight or more then something is wrong unless your polling several push email accounts
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] djudjix:
I think that Li-Ion battery should never be emptied at all, since the cells need some voltage on them so they don't get ruined. Every time you drain you battery to "the end" you ruin cells, and therefor you put your battery life to the faster end.

There are a lot of different factors affecting your battery, not just one, but mostly it is about heavy processor usage (games, ...), cell reception (bad c.r.), wifi, and what is using our batteries the most - screen, especially big screen devices like my SGS and yours. It is nice article that harrydg pointed out in earlier post about li-ion batteries, so it will give a lot of clues of what not to do, and it is not only article that states the same,

(not possible to drain it fully, there is always some voltage in it, just not enough to power your phone).

There is a good application called BatteryDoctor you can find it on Market, it can help with its full cycle charging.

So my advice if you are deleting batterystats.bin, do it when your phone goes down as low as 5% (though you can do it at 10% also, it is a small change in voltage) - reboot, charge it to full 100% with BatteryDoctor turned on (just leave it on with pressed "charge" tab), and use your phone, no need to fully discharge battery ...

I hope someone finds this helpful.
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] EarlZ:
It should not, since it is a record of what consumed your battery.. current battery charge is never calculated from that file.. thats where the phone pulls up the information about "last boot" or "last unplug" battery usage.
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] ppeccin:
So you're saying you get 1% per 5hr on standby?

That means you get 100 * 5hr stand by time for a full discharge, which is equal to 500 hours.

500 hours = 20,8 days.

Sorry, but I can't believe your battery can last for 20 days on standby.

Please do the math.

Paulo
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] Peacemanibk:
Just my experience:

After flashing a new kernel over the stock one (not at full battery), the battery sign in the notification bar showed different values then any other battery widget (100% was 3/4 of the bar). After installing the circular battery icon, it was ok again.

Now, i flashed a different kernel - again not at full battery - and now all battery widgets and the circular battery icon showed me just 98% after a full load overnight.

The funny thing: After some days it shows me now 99% - magical :-)
[Galaxy S I9000 Accessories] ragin:
It happens to me too, my stomach says FULL even when there are delectable dishes to eaten, & my stomach says EMPTY when there's a deadline.

A battery is just a battery, :D:D:D
[Touch HD General] dzeen:
i would like everyone to share your experience with android apps which work on our devices.

i want to start with news on "Angry Birds" game - its latest version (1.4.2) works correctly on blackstone (previous builds failed to launch), but instead of gameplay you'll get an awful slideshow. but maybe it will be more or less playable on OCed devices. please try it. fyi, i've run the game under kenia's eclair build.

also, i'd like to say that one of the most popular iphone games - doodle jump - works like a charm on blackstone.

you can download both games from market for free.
[Touch HD General] dzeen:
anyone succeeded at wifi tethering? i've tried this app, but it gives error
[Touch HD General] maxiomb:
Same problem here with tethering apps, i tried many without luck..-(
[Venue Pro General] Se4nH4x:
Hey...

I just want to know about the build quality. Is the chrome plastic? Or metal?

Is anything plastic?

Thanks.
[Venue Pro General] ericc191:
I know the battery cover is plastic. Pretty sure the chrome sides will be too.
[Venue Pro General] Se4nH4x:
ya i saw a video saying cover was plastic...

if the chrome sides are plastic...that may change my mind (paint could scratch off easy...) =.=.
[Venue Pro General] Se4nH4x:
Bump...someone please answer me.
[Venue Pro General] Se4nH4x:
BUMP. ANYONE?

common, I know someone of you got the phone.
[Venue Pro General] Lenas:
I went to use one in the Microsoft store here in San Diego, and if I recall the sides seemed like actual metal. The phone feels very sturdy in the hand and I didn't question the build quality at any time.
[Venue Pro General] Peew971:
Thanks for the answer.
[Venue Pro General] Se4nH4x:
Thanks, just what I wanted to know.
[Venue Pro General] gshocker:
I am pretty sure that the sides are plastic. The back is also plastic and I am not to sure that I like that texture. Overall the slider is well built and seems like it will last for some time.

I am not really concerned about the build as it seems quite good. The back is flimsy but really it is not doing anything but covering the battery and the SIM. Not as structural as some phones back covers.
[Venue Pro General] Se4nH4x:
So you have the DVP and you think its plastic?
[Venue Pro General] ericc191:
Well, if they were metal, that could explain why the phone weighs 6.74 oz. :)
[Venue Pro General] Se4nH4x:
I want it to be metal heh. makes it feel like a superior product.
[Venue Pro General] Sangheili:
The build quality could be better. The phone is plastic and some of the fit is less the perfect. It's not a Nokia E series or an HTC - but I think it will stand up.