yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[G2 and Desire Z General] nighthawk626:
@superfly u must work for tmobile and they must pay you good. Tmobile just cares about their damn money and sales. This ain't volunteer work for hurricane HTC. They are paid to sell the damn phones. Nobody put a gun to their head and told them to sell it. They are in it all the way even if all they did was slap their name on it. It officially states "hey I'm endorsing this product and all it comes with" endorsement comes with being held equally responsible. Just like in elections whatever one person in the party does that messes things up could ruin the whole party therefore everyone is held responsible even if they were on vacation when it happened. Here in the military that I'm in, its called accountability. There's no way of arguing your way out of something you are in ties with because it obviously has your imprints all over it. Simple as that
[G2 and Desire Z General] gaalaagaa:
My dear brown nose friend Superfly:

IF tmobile cant handle that then they should close the company. Im sorry. I do as i please with what i paid for.Warranty only covers some things "which most of the time covers nothing" If i decide to wipe my ass with it then warranty wont cover it, if i decide to root it and brick it warranty wont cover it as simple as that...but then again i should do as i please with what is mine. We all know they could care less about you effin up your phone, all they want is being able to control what kind of os you got and bla bla bla only for sales porpuses.
[G2 and Desire Z General] asarousi:
When T-mo put thier name on it, they take all responsibility that comes with it.
[G2 and Desire Z General] franky1029:
First off, the article is trying to put blame on google... I just want to know how they cam e around to that. It feels like such a biased article. And how come there's no mention of Apple's practices? Or mentions of RIM? On top of that, it's already been said that this "rootkit" is bunked. Security measures are for the safety of the phone, usually. Why do they need to lock out the phone? You can cause a lot of havoc on the network with root access. (in fact, I kinda remember reading about an app that did just that when installed on rooted phones) It's in the interest of the customers to actually provide these security features. Just because we, as the technically inclined, get it, doesn't mean the average user should be punished.
[G2 and Desire Z General] SuperFly03:
I work for a public accounting firm and I'm a CPA... want to try again?

They make their money providing service for the phones they sell...

This is just silly. T-Mo might exchange handsets but all the costs end up back on HTC depending on their agreement.

Again, do you think they had any part in the dev of the phone?

Really? it's that simple?

So does Verizon, T-Mo, AT&T and Sprint take the fall for the Galaxy S debacle? They all have the same issue and all the customers are pissed off for the same reason so it is the carrier's fault? No, it is Samsung's fault. The fault lies with the person who made the phone and the software on the phone. Samsung should be held accountable for their failure of a phone... just like HTC should be held accountable if they are indeed in violation of this accord.

I have 0 loyalties to T-Mo. This is actually the first T-Mo phone I've owned. In the past 3 years I've moved from VZW to ATT to Sprint to VZW to T-Mo. I don't give a crap about any carrier specifically. Moving on.

Handle what exactly?

And what happens when someone roots their phone and takes it back and whines and biotches until they get a replacement? People abuse the warranty system which is why things are so tight these days. I don't disagree with your position, I wish I could basically "one click root" on day 0. It would be sweet but that's not the way the world is.

Only for sales purposes? There are 100 other reasons for control over the content besides "sales". What does "sales" even include?

Bull... I completely disagree with this. If their customizations caused problems then yes it is their fault but just because their put their name on it doesn't make it their fault. HTC designed, manufactured and marketed the phone... T-Mo printed their name on the glass and provided you with service. That's it.
[G2 and Desire Z General] xyrcncp:
LOL...another "class-action?" thread. Why not take the initiative and start the class action process if you are so curious about it? Speak to a lawyer, read up on the requirements for a class-action suit. I don't think anyone in a forum is gonna actually do that.
[G2 and Desire Z General] supergear:
For all you people *****in about the locked nand Stop *****in about it yesh. Don't like it get another phone. There are plenty of other phones you can root and such.
[G2 and Desire Z General] nighthawk626:
Nobody is saying that tmobile made the phone but don't sit there and tell me that when they were picking this phone as part of their lineup, they didn't play with it or even look at it at all. Bottom line is they knew what was in the phone, I'm sure they were hoping the hinge issue wouldn't blow up like it did and also they knew about rooting and tethering some that's why I'm sure they continued to put it in their line up. It wasn't just tossed on their lap. They have phone testers and possibly hired rooters and devs to test how rootable this phone is. Either way they are accountable
[G2 and Desire Z General] gaalaagaa:
Bull crap. Ill buy the phone i want and root the phone i want because i want. Point blank
[G2 and Desire Z General] flarbear:
Nobody has forbidden anyone to root this phone. They made it hard to do and they put up a very clever stumbling block, but they didn't forbid it.

You can crack the phone open and look at every part of it, nobody will stop you, but they don't have to put a button on the side that makes it fall apart so that you can do it easily.

Similarly, if the community figures out the mechanism used to protect the ROM, then you can root it and install the software you want, but that doesn't mean the manufacturer or carrier are required to make it easy for you to do so.

The zdnet article cites the recent DMCA exclusion as meaning that we have the right to put whatever software we want on the phone. That exclusion provided no such right. It says that the federal courts will not prosecute us for defeating electronic protections in the phone - it doesn't make it illegal for the manufacturers to put those protections in the phone in the first place.

It's like a law limiting the penalties for jumping a fence - such a law wouldn't make fences themselves illegal. In fact, such a law would likely lead to fences that are harder to jump since the property owners could no longer rely on threat of prosecution to keep people from trying. Similarly, the DMCA exclusion is leading to electronic protections that are harder to crack because they are now the only line of defense.

Also, if they sold you a general computing device, but restricted the software you could put on it, then we would have a right to complain because a device isn't a very general computing device if it only runs canned software. Unfortunately, T-Mobile sold us a phone and the phone has to make calls primarily, and a smartphone further should provide some data access for the phone and, nowadays, the ability to install apps through a designed mechanism. There is nothing about the class of device that we were sold that implies the ability to run an arbitrary firmware or system software. They may not be able to stop us from doing that, but they don't have to allow it.

Consider that even in a general computing device, like a PC, there are parts that run software that you cannot modify. The firmware on DVD or Blu-Ray drives tends to be fairly locked down. Nobody cries fowl about that because the DVD/BR drive was sold for the purpose of reading (and sometimes writing) approved discs, not as a general computing device that will run whatever software you choose to load on it...
[G2 and Desire Z General] TheMan42:
Gaalaagaa,

So with that logic, you can buy, let's say any car and then just decide that because "you want" or "you can" you'll remove the stock engine and drop in anything you want and then expect the manufacturer to cover it no matter what.

I'm all for root and using my G2 how I please, but that statement is moronic.
[G2 and Desire Z General] cbmm:
if little whiny *****es didnt try to get the phone fixed for free after "fubaring" it, then we probably wouldnt be dealing with this.
[G2 and Desire Z General] grivad:
Gotcha, this is the answer I was looking for. Thanks for answering my question specifically! ; )

For others in the thread, I'm not interested in starting a class action lawsuit nor do I want there to be one necessarily, I was just curious about implications of this DMCA exclusion, clarification on the exclusion itself, and was using this as an example for illustrative purposes, per se. I am also not complaining about the status of rooting or the lack thereof.

That is all.
[G2 and Desire Z General] HamNCheese:
Bull****. Who do you think provides HTC with the specifications (ie. the list of crapware they want installed by default?) HTC? No, T-Mobile gets paid for this. They get paid more if the user cannot remove the apps.

If T-Mobile has not influenced the design and implementation of this device, then a) Why is their logo on it? b) Why is it totally different than the Vision? c) Why is the software load different? etc...

The carrier is 100% responsible for the software choices on the device. Do you think HTC would disable tethering if they weren't required to by the carriers? Of course not - free tethering would sell a crap-load of handsets by itself.
[G2 and Desire Z General] HamNCheese:
Basically here's what it means:

HTC, T-Mobile, Apple, Google, etc, cannot claim a DMCA violation has taken place (ie. circumventing the "copy protection", which is clearly spelled out in the DMCA text as a criminal offense under the statute) if you root or jailbreak your device. Instead, the user has the right to load whatever software they want.

Now...that said, there's nothing in this exception that prevents them from circumventing your ability to do this. It merely says you have the right to do it, nothing else.

While they can't go after you with a DMCA violation, they can do other things (like say, make data plans for rooted handsets cost $500/month...)

They can also put any technical roadblocks in your way to prevent rooting or unlocking as they see fit (usually in the name of "network security", "preventing terrorists from gaining access to the baseband code and bringing down the phone system", or other such nonsense.)

Having the right doesn't mean they have to make it easy for you to do it.

So, look at this (and eFuse) as a sign of things to come. This is an arms race, just like any other. At least now we have a legal leg to stand on when it comes to prosecution of consumers under a ridiculous copyright law.
[G2 and Desire Z General] SuperFly03:
Well said ham.

Just because we can root... doesn't mean it has to be easy to root. Ah the world we live in.
[G2 and Desire Z General] gaalaagaa:
The problem here is how you ppl keep talking about getting warranties and ****. If I eff up my phone I can simply buy another cuz I can afford it. Then again ill buy it to do what I want cuz I want lol point blank
[G2 and Desire Z General] SuperFly03:
T-Mo gets paid to leave apps on the software and it's their Fault? Why it might be their fault for bloatware in a sense... that isn't the argument at hand.

Putting a logo on it isn't "influence". Isn't the Vision the G2... or are you referring to the Desire-Z or Lexicon?

I think we are getting off track... so T-Mo asked them to disable tethering until T-Mo could get the billing side setup and push tether out over an OTA. Is that "influence" not in my mind. Do they make decisions with HTC? Yes, but influence is more pronounced. Influence would be T-Mo some how affecting the design specs (i.e. telling HTC to add eFuse or the like, or saying they want a custom UI like sense but decorated in pink) not telling them "disable this apk". That's 2 seconds of work and not influence in my book.
[G2 and Desire Z General] SuperFly03:
Yeah, you may but others can't or won't.

Stop thinking that everyone is like you. You may be ok with F'ing your phone up and just replacing it but there are more people that would try and warranty it than you'd think.

Manufacturers/Carriers aren't going to make root easy going forward... and nothing will change that. Just because you own the device you still agree to T-Mo's ToS for the network usage and the warranty from HTC both implied and explicit.

Too much risk for HTC to just leave it open.
[G2 and Desire Z General] gaalaagaa:
Not only that. If I wanna brick my phone and get it replaced with the warranty then I will do so as well wether tmobile likes it or dislikes it because I can. Like I said before if they can't handle that they should close the conpany. Since I'm a customer ill do as I please with them and will do as I please with what I buy. Point blank.
[G2 and Desire Z General] xencor:
Tmobile, like any other company, can also do as they please and refuse to cater to self-entitled people like you.

Just because you give them your money doesn't mean they have to do everything the way you want them to. Why? Because you have the option to not give them your money.

This "i am a customer lol i am always right" attitude is ridiculous.
[G2 and Desire Z General] SuperFly03:
You love talking big and saying "point blank" don't you?

Self entitled irresponsible people like you are the reason warranties have become as strict as they are.

You are the problem...
[G2 and Desire Z General] gaalaagaa:
People like me make tmobile rich. They can put their warranty as strict as they feel like THEN AGAIN not getting out of subject it won't stop me from doing what I want with what belongs to me. And yes.....point blank. :)
[G2 and Desire Z General] Anartic:
So people like you cause T-Mobile to go out and replace your phone because you messed it up, is making money for them? I like your logic. Maybe I'm wrong here, maybe it's HTC that's to pay for the G2 that you ****ed up, but either way, you're abusing the system they have set out. What you're saying is that since then phone is your's, you should be able to do whatever you want with it, then why not take full responsibility if you brick it? Why say, "i'll just go get a warranty replacement" when you're so rich. Don't respond, you've already contradicted yourself.
[G2 and Desire Z General] gaalaagaa:
You ARE wrong cuz like I said I have never replaced by phone for any reason.
[G2 and Desire Z General] SuperFly03:
So really you are just full of **** when it comes to claiming you'd take it back under warranty and lied?
[G2 and Desire Z General] gaalaagaa:
To make things clear I have never tried or replaced any phone for any reason. I never said I support the whole idea of bricking and trying to get warranty to cover it "bcs warranty won't cover bricked phones". What I do believe in is if you have a phone and want to root it then tmobile shouldn't be trying to force you otherwise, if you decide you cry about it to tmobile that's yalls problem and tmobile not mine "nor do I care about multi millionaires companies" This website where you "anti rooting" ppl are posting was made for ROOTING and customise your phone of course under your own responsability so I see this as very hipocryt from your parts.
[G2 and Desire Z General] Anartic:
You are just full of contradictory buddy. Also, I don't think any of us ever established a position against rooting. The whole reason for your argument is whether or not you're responsible for what you do with your phone and expecting T-Mobile to fix it for you. You are just hopping onto both sides of the fence and making an idiot out of yourself.
[G2 and Desire Z General] Machoakarob:
I do not see how this is such a big deal with t-mobile or any carrier. Look I have an iPhone right now and I've had one since the first day it began selling. I've been jailbreakibg my phone since jailbreaking was invented. Apple didn't like it so they put roadblocks against it. That didn't stop jailbreakers, so apple gave up the fight along with all other phone developers and now jailbreakibg is perfectly legal because it is right to do whatever you like with your device that you want. It is absolutely idiotic to sell something and tell the person you sold it to that they can only use it one way. And warranty should not be an issue. How is it I can return a 400 dollar graphics card 3 times with no warranty to best buy and get another in exchange? It is because big companies have an obligation to it's costumers, the rich or boy- dumb and intelligent. Because every human is diff. And let's face it...for the price of these phones, they should definitely have some costumer care. Phones are overpriced these days and with all that money they can afford a couple replacement phones. Like cmon now. Most people love there phone too much to mess it up anyway, not like they are gonna replace every phone out there. Like I'm not gonna sell u a cheeseburger and say u gotta eat it with a fork and knife. I agree with gaalaagaa. If they are too overwhelmed with the simple fact that they have to replace a few phone than discontinue it or make it so it can be rooted fine that way u keep everyone happy. And if u are the person that doesn't know what u are doing and brick your phone then don't expect a shiny new one in return. You did something in ignorance than pay the consequences and suk it up. That's like saying " yah, I got mad so I like i smashed my phone and like now it broke and stuff so like can I like get another one haha like cuz I broke mine haha and stuff". That's dumb
[G2 and Desire Z General] gaalaagaa:
Anartic that was your point of the convo not mine. So not only read, anylize bfr jumping into ppls convos. MY point is to be able to do what I want with my phone withouth having tmobile to force me otherwise, lemme repeat it for you again "I don't support that you brick and try to replace it even tho I can since I'm paying their asses" hope you're capable of getting the point this time. I pay tmobile monthly service and I buy them phones....if I ever get my phone replaced for whatever reason its because I simply can. You obviously are the type who like to be told what to do, and I bet the type who gets played and cheated on too. Have a wonderfull day :)
[G2 and Desire Z General] SuperFly03:
That's some unacceptable ****. That was completely uncalled for.

Don't be an asshole.

T-Mobile isn't telling you what you can/cannot do... HTC is. Quit being such a douche but I'm thinking that isn't possible for you.

You could also work on your grammar.
[G2 and Desire Z General] gaalaagaa:
I'm sorry imma stop sine it touched your feelings
[G2 and Desire Z General] SuperFly03:
It has nothing to do with that... you aren't acting like an adult.
[G2 and Desire Z General] Anartic:
If you've read the red highlighted area, I'm positive that anyone with a mind could see that you're supporting the idea of warranty when you brick your phone phone, or at least the way you worded it. As for the green highlighted words, you're saying that just because you use their services you're entitled to your replacement for "whatever reason". Your whole argument is that you should be allowed to root your phone and take responsibility, but with the way you've responded, you've contradicted yourself and have given yourself the image of someone that will abuse the Warranty system for your own faults.

The reason for T-Mobile, or HTC, making it harder to root phones is so that they won't have to deal with that kind of bull****. If you've seen all of the threads in the G1 section, you should be able to have some sort of an idea of what T-Mobile deals with.

Also, I suggest you taking a firm position on what side you're on. You talk about you should be able to do what you want with the phone that you bought and that you're wholly responsible for it, yet you go around and say that if you wanted to, you could replace your phone since T-Mobile is supposed to do that, even if the fault is your own. Trust me, I've analyzed what you've said and it makes no sense.

And another thing where did you pull the whole idea that I am "the type who like to be told what to do, and I bet the type who gets played and cheated on too"? I can see that you've analyzed my posts, but you must have misinterpreted it.
[G2 and Desire Z General] davbran:
Good god, I've never seen a more motley bunch of arm chair lawyers in my life. I break this down real simple.

Developer's Phone - the current flag ship android developer's phone is the nexus one.

The G1 was the first, well because it was the first.

Quit crying about something that can't, won't be changed, and build a bridge and get over it.

The comedy in all this this what so many xda users wanted, a way to go back to completely warrantied stock. Lol, now you got it, and you want to whine about it.

As soon as someone finds the work around, those of you who will bork your phones will ***** and moan that you can't revert, like the EVO-4G crowd.

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Reboot to Stock with Tapatalk
[G2 and Desire Z General] gaalaagaa:
Thank u. You and me are the only ones that make sense.
[G2 and Desire Z General] Captainkrtek:
Thread getting off topic, Closed
[Vibrant Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] player4lifeov:
I'm trying to see how much i can squeeze out of my phone so does anyone know where I can find this kernel that is flashable through clockwork?
[Vibrant Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] ekoandrew:
1.6 is overkill, plus if you do want one badly, I would suggest you start reading some programming dummies and bibles how to make one yourself.

your question is more like an demand request. least chip in $$$ for the developers, they might let loose, and make one to brick your phone.

this are my thoughts and suggestions after reading your respond!!
[Vibrant Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] player4lifeov:
I did sound a bit demanding huh? ooops, but I'm just like anyone else out there. I'm trying to get all the best available resources for my phone. I am truly grateful for everyones work and I have donated to devs before.

Your probably right though, it is overkill but its just nice to have to show off ;-)
[Vibrant Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] ekoandrew:
what the point of showing off, when in the middle showing bling bling, and DIES...that will be a total embarrassment... wouldnt you say oh ****...hides in the corner...
[Vibrant Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] All~G1:
Early in development of JACs kernel (Maybe in the beginning of his original kernel thread) there were test pushing the .3 & .4 marks that ended up frying/bricking phones. I'm pretty sure there is a reason why no one has posted anything as "stable" past .3 or even .299 for that matter.

Im not sure how to do it our even how to read it, but I was under the impression that the cpu max is in a # value form. Worst case scenario plug in a #... What's the worst that can happen? :ekk: lol
[Vibrant Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] player4lifeov:
I doubt it...but ok.
[Vibrant Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] player4lifeov:
lol, I'll look into it
[Vibrant Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] player4lifeov:
Running at 1.6ghz and its running very smooth, thank you very much
[Vibrant Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] willsnews:
It runs pretty smooth indeed

Anonymous
[Vibrant Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] Insomaniac10:
Why dont you guys try it out before criticizing....ive been running it all day, my phone is butter

oh and if you still havnt found it, heres the link : http://ip208-100-42-21.static.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=821514
[Vibrant Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] willsnews:
Its awesome

Anonymous
[Vibrant Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] biigreen:
Those posts were made before the kernel dropped.
[Vibrant Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] demo23019:
It still has issues like when running 3D apps they run very slow even though its reading very high fps...

Even viralblack said that it still needs tweaking to fix problems like this .