yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Windows Phone 7 General] addicus:
The closed system was implemented so Microsoft could still have multiple manufactures create the devices and maintain a standard user experience. Streamlining makes it appealing to developers who can make a game/program that works on the PC, XBOX and WP7 in one swift move. Less cost and more profit. Also we won't be hearing bad reviews on the OS due to handset manufacturers being chinzy with the memory and processors. Personally I find WM 6.5 and 6.5.x work great on my HD2 and I know most of that is the high speed processor and larger amount of memory.
[Windows Phone 7 General] ahmadashar:
Am I the only one who noticed this?

:confused:

Yes the UI is very speedy and the looks kinda cool BUT am i the only one who thinks the 2 colour tiles are extremely tacky!!! come on WM6.5 + looked great. Atleast they could have used some 3D graphics. WHY on earth 2D.. it just puts me off....The home screen is very good but it looks crap.. DIDNT ANYONE ELSE NOTICE THIS?????

OK don’t know if it will fail or not but it’s a baby OS which is trying to compete with giants, it need about a few years before we can truly say what’s going to happen.

But come onnnn. Those tiles look something out of 1990.. Even my first smart phone had a better looking home screen (Magician)

P.S. Yes i do the its functionality is very good
[Windows Phone 7 General] johnlujl123:
I totally agree with you. The overall UI of WP7 doesn't look right in some way. It just doesn't attract me, no matter how smooth or fluid the transitions are. When it comes to functionality, it may be in a good race with other OS's. :)
[Windows Phone 7 General] propagandax:
I agree completely with the two previous posts.

And I have a PS3 and do not own a Zune :eek:
[Windows Phone 7 General] naviru:
agreed...

actually I miss the old fashion theming...

I want my phone looks different and looks nice.

now everything looks the same, even on other OS like iOS (right it was even quite difficult to change the ringtone of iphone). Android has themes but not officially supported (well, symbian has it but the system is too old fashion anyway)

Why can't they make a official theme creating program and allow everybody to change every graphic of the system...

Also , since when do people start to ignore the importance of a wallpaper? I always want a homescreen with only a transparent clock and a wallpaper. maybe some social feeds in a box with transparent background. Nothing too much that cover the whole wallpaper like a huge flip clock with many quick links, fancy weather animations...I want my own customisation to stand out..
[Windows Phone 7 General] qipengart:
I suspect after today's announcement that iOS and Android will still have greater market share than WP7. I am sure that the lack of customization options won't be too helpful. In fact, I still prefer WM6.5 better for .cab installs, etc.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Intervenient:
Lack of multiple calendar support killed it for me. Most likely will not be picking up one of these. I was so dang excited too.
[Windows Phone 7 General] rgr81:
no copy & paste ?

this long time animations are funny at the first time i saw it, but not usefull when i have to do my work.

I think most business users will stay at 6.5
[Windows Phone 7 General] vangrieg:
It supports multiple calendars, what do you mean?
[Windows Phone 7 General] warenbe:
sorry? no navigation app?

i mean, there is a GPS in the phone, so navigation apps will be here soon?
[Windows Phone 7 General] MalekoUK:
I'm really interested to see a proper hands on review (any been done yet?), then make up my mind...tempted to sell my HD2 for the new WP7...
[Windows Phone 7 General] truffle1234:
i will love to have devices like HTD HDD concept, but right now i will buy either HTC HD7 or the Dell ...

now all those ppl who thought that WP7 will fail have nothing to say......
[Windows Phone 7 General] makku12:
He's talking about Google calendar sync... that's google's fault, not microsoft's.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Intervenient:
How is it Google's? I'm talking even about Hotmail syncing and how it only syncs the main calendar instead of all the calendars in one account.
[Windows Phone 7 General] cgdams:
Actually, it's a strangely mixed situation. WP7 does indeed support multiple calendars, but not from one and the same account. So if you have hotmail calendar and a google mail calendar, it will show both calendars. But it won't show multiple calendars on the same hotmail account.

AFAIK, this is planned to be fixed with an update.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Intervenient:
I hope so. I just managed to score a sweet Windows Live login and wouldn't mind migrating.
[Windows Phone 7 General] truffle1234:
i have gone through the 4 pages and all i can see ppl are saying it do not have Nav app, and no cut and paste....

from where i stand i know WP7 will not fail, for the following reasons:

1. MS has a US$400 mil marketing budget

2. its a new OS from MS and as they know they will be against ios and android they will try and make this os better than both of them.

3. the tiles look tacky but if you look at from marketing point of view, older ppl will like to have such big buttons, and when the tiles change the info and show u weather info or the pic of the person calling... and more... i think it will be better then the rest of the OS in the market right now

i wanted to try android os but the damn thing do not sync to my Outlook... i cant put my business contacts on the gmail...

come on guys the os is not even launched and ppl are saying it will not do well..

from what i know MS is dishing out something new and the MS ppl i spoke with are very proud of what they are putting to the world....

WP7 will not fail...
[Windows Phone 7 General] Andrewtst:
completely agree.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Sledgeman:
I don't think WP7 will fail globally but it will fail in certain client categories. It will really fail for me. At least in the beginning. No XBOX Live and no market for buying apps and games in Sweden. They don't have a plan for when it can be upp and running so i will pass on any buy of a WP7 phone for now. :(
[Windows Phone 7 General] addicus:
Well if the public worldwide didn't gobble up the iphone then the ipad then boast about the awesomeness of having an incomplete and inferior product we wouldn't be in this situation.

Beyond that the jobsian theory of locking things down works for the developers who have an easier time of getting paid and seeing less piracy while working on a streamline product.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Chainfire:
I have a WP7 device and its actually pretty nice. I like it more than I thought I would have, actually. The hub-style things actually works very nicely.

A lot can be said about the restrictions in WP7 - something I myself aren't to happy with. However, I can still see it become big in the consumer market. I have written pages and pages about these things in the past, so I will not reiterate them here now.

However I do want to point out one thing:

This is something that will really bit WP7 uptake. In many countries that are literally nothing you can do with a WP7 phone. For example, in mine. You cannot access the market, not even to get free apps, and it will take about another year before it will be possible.

This seriously limits what you can do with the device. There is no way to sideload, so this means you are stuck with what is already on the phone. And there isn't that much on the phone to start with.

Two things that immediately struck me were:

(1) No YouTube

(2) No Twitter

I clicked on a video someone posted on Facebook (the facebook intergration does "own") and the it open YouTube in the browser. Unfortunately, WP7 cannot play YouTube videos directly in-browser. Tapping the video screenshot gave me a popup that I needed to download the YouTube app from Marketplace. Click OK, and I get an error I cannot access the Marketplace from this country.

Another thing I missed was: no Twitter integration. Of course, there is an app for that. But I can't download it because I can't access Marketplace.

For people in these countries, WP7 is pretty much a useless toy.

I find this non-access of Marketplace very strange, as we do have the WM6.5 Marketplace available here, including payed apps, since the day Marketplace was launched (we were NOT added later).

What also struck me as odd is how "picky" WP7 is about home/smalloffice Exchange servers. These regularly use self-signed certificates. It took me over 3 hours of changing server configs, recreating the certificates slightly different, and getting the certificate on the phone before I was able to use my Exchange account from the phone. Note that connecting without SSL didn't work at all.

This worked on my Samsung Galaxy S out of the box. 30 seconds work.

I haven't had much time to play with the device yet, I've only had it for a few days and have had very little time available, but these were the first things that struck me.
[Windows Phone 7 General] GeoMil:
I'm hearing the load times for 3rd party apps are 2 min+ and when you lock the screen you have to reopen the app.

That's a deal breaker for. Dam I was psyched for hd7. Guess its desire HD then. (Which seems to cost £80 more?)
[Windows Phone 7 General] addicus:
Thanks for the information Chainfire. Please keep us updated as you grow with the device. MS not making the marketplace open to all from day one is a confusing strategy but that is one reason they catch so much crap from so many people.
[Windows Phone 7 General] vangrieg:
I don't know about your country, but here they explain the delay by the fact that a) they need to make sure the keyboard and autocorrection and all that is present and works well for local languages; b) other services such as Bing Maps with POI data and such are present and work well; c) their initial push is through carriers because they want to control how things go as well as possible, so this limits the geo scope; d) sometimes the social networks popular in specific countries aren't so much Facebook and the big league, so they want to have partnerships established for a responsible launch.

All in all, this sounds like a "if we can't do it really well, we don't do it at all" approach. It's somewhat frustrating but understandable.

On a side note, people who have developer devices here say that they can access Marketplace from Russia, but can't purchase anything, they can get either free apps or those that have trial modes.

I was afraid of that. WM is also very picky in this area, but there you can at least install a certificate. I really don't know why MS have to be such a PITA with Exchange.
[Windows Phone 7 General] TheMyx:
As a professional developer (not for the phone, but nevermind), I retain myself an advanced user. And personally my Samsung i900 with its Windows Mobile 6.1 (but even 6.5 if someone wants to) has just bored me. Honestly, Windows Mobile was a good OS until 3-4 years ago. Now with Android on a side and iOS on the other, it's just outdated. There are no UI layers and no HTC Sense interfaces that can change this. And about UI layers, the "closed-ecosystem" thing is the perfect thing. Even for a developer or an "advanced user". Who would ever think to replace the squared tiles with hexagon-shaped tiles, for instance? My answer can only be "a maniac". Which isn't a bad thing, but since the majority of the people aren't phone maniacs, they just expect to have a good-looking, fast, working phone without too much trouble to deal with. Even though I write several hundreds of lines of code a day (like many developers), I just can't stand the complexity and the roughness of any WM anymore. And no, I don't want to deal with the Android interface, which changes from phone to phone and is still messy to me (widgets? We're in 2011!). With all its huge problems and bugs, obviously (still changing from phone to phone). So welcome simplicity, welcome sandboxes, welcome certified apps. As long as I can use my phone nicely, easily and smoothly. Because of this, I don't think Windows Phone 7 will fail. It's for the common person, and it costs less than an iPhone (half the price here in Italy). Its interface is consistent along all the device park, which is a great value added. "Oh, you've got that app? ...no, that's an LG, my is an HTC..." "don't worry, you can buy that too!"

In a really distant future it could even overtake Android. But sure, first the "entry devices" should be a lot, lot cheaper (like 200$ at most).

The only thing I can complain about is the stupid absence of the OBEX protocol for bluetooth, and some small things that I hope will be fixed fast.

As for developers, you can complain that you don't have access to the underlying OS or even to the hardware, but really. You can do almost anything with the WP7 api, and if there's something you can't do you can always work it around in some way.

Last thing, if you really want hexagons instead of squares on the main tile screen, I think that cooked roms will make their way soon.

Come on, they're not "long time" animations. And I prefer to waste 0.3 seconds of my life and see something transitioning smoothly rather than seeing crappy pop-up events styled after Windows 95.

Most business users already switched to the iPhone.

Uh, you can definitely teach Microsoft a thing or two about project management.

That's just not true. Only the second might be, meaning that if the device is running out of memory and another app (e.g. the lock screen) is on the foreground, the background app will be put apart. However if it is closed with the tombstoning method you will find it as you left it, and if it is completely closed developers are encouraged (or forced, don't remember) to simulate the tombstoning by recreating its last state at load time.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Chainfire:
I disagree in this case. I do not know how it is over there, but over here there will not be localised WP7 devices until next year. The UK version will be sold (separately, not by carriers, for the die-hards). The UK version does not have any localisation for my country (though personally I have a LG GW910 / USA AT&T version - interesting side note: it works on European 3G). It would have been far more logical to allow these die-hards (and the occasional developer like me) access to the UK or US market, if it only for free apps.

There does not need to be a Dutch marketplace until we have Dutch devices - and according to what I heard, these will be released at the same time.

I've heard that you can get free apps if you create a new live account and make up an address from the USA - but still you can only buy if you also have a USA credit card. Have not tried it yet, it is possibly a viable work-around, but I just think how it is arranged right now is ... stupid (as a LOT of other things MS decided with WP7). Also, "normal" people will not know this.

WM was indeed also a PITA, but not as much as a PITA as WP7 was. Importing certificates was much easier on WM, also the certificate DNS names did not have to match - they do have to on WP7. If I wasn't personally the admin for our exchange server, I would never have gotten it to work.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Chainfire:
You can do very little with the WP7 API, device wise. System/tools category apps are hardly possible at all. However, if you are talking about web-frontend-apps, gimmicks, productivity apps, i.e. everything "normal" apps, then the WP7 API is quite nice.

Though as a developer what annoys me most is the absense of background processing. I understand the design decision, I just think it's a faulty one.

It just depends on what sort of stuff you want to make.

Be that as it may, I think WP7 is actually a nice device for the average non-IT office worker. Nice integration with social media, office, outlook, etc. All I really really miss in that area is Swype. But iPhone doesn't have that either, I believe? (not sure)

I hardly think anyone would dream of disagreeing with you on that one!
[Windows Phone 7 General] vangrieg:
It looks like every third person in this forum knows better than software companies how easy it is to add features. :)

If they officially sell UK devices in your country but don't let you add a local credit card that's indeed weird. It's more of a Google style of support (until recently, Android Market was only available in 13 countries).

From what I heard, the "second wave" of rollout will happen no earlier than next fall.

Ouch! This truly sucks.
[Windows Phone 7 General] TheMyx:
Yes, I was referring to the common, "user" apps. As for specialized tools or apps, I hope I won't need them on a phone that claims to be simple :)

I've gotten used to it, though it stunned me in the first place. As of today a very few apps actually need to work in the background on the phone. Multimedia apps on WP7 can do something (like launching a playlist), others will use notifications and tombstoning. That cuts out things like putting Skype calls in the background or background downloads/transfers (aside for the marketplace transfers), but I think that in the end what we get in return (easy app switch and more battery life - or equal battery life with crappier batteries) is at least fair.

It sure is. I recently wrote an article about the old "business users" forced to switch to the new, minimalist phone OS's, too bad it's written in Italian.

What came out was that even these users preferred usability over advanced features in the end. And since WP7 goes straight in this direction, I think it will succeed. My dad, who is this kind of user, got very intrested in the OS when I told him about it.

Anyway, iPhone shouldn't have Swype either. If it does, i never noticed it.
[Windows Phone 7 General] gerryjoson:
Mr "professional developer" [TheMyx]....would be nice to know what, you have been/are, a part of developing, so I can avoid the possibility of ever buying anything that you have had anything to do with.

Thanks
[Windows Phone 7 General] ozy944:
Its interesting seeing all the different views regarding the success/failure of win pho 7.

Coming from an ex symbian, then win mo, now android user, Im happy to sit out and wait for the right combination of phone + software and get it. I've got no major brand loyalty and believe that most of these changes in the smartphone industry are fantastic for the end user.

Do I honestly think win pho 7 will be super duper successful, my guess is as good as yours, but its a guess. I think Win pho 7 will sell to the crowd that buys an iphone, the ubiquitous smartphone. I believe quite a few devs will feel alienated by microsoft in its aim for mass market adoption.

What will ultimately rule based on business model? You know what? for the foreseeable future, it will be symbian and android. Symbian because outside the US, especially inthe middle and far east + subcontinent, Nokia is what everybody buys because of the brand name and hardware. Remember smartphones are not the phone industry.

Both iOS and Win pho 7 will never target the low end, it devalues the premium brand. At the moment, android is heading to the low end of the market as well and has a better resemblance to a smartphone os than symbian.

Android actually looks like the best business model, but quite likely not the most profitable....unless you are selling search ;)

Edit: Oh and btw, look up confirmation bias .... seems we are all guilty of it :D
[Windows Phone 7 General] TheMyx:
I thought that anyone meant that "professional" as I did. I was wrong.

Anyway...yours is such a great contribution to the topic, please keep it up.
[Windows Phone 7 General] domineus:
I'm quite happy that you have a device in hand chain honestly you have no idea =)

however from looking at things from a programming perspective, do you see any holes that would allow users/third party programmers to get really low in the kernel code like 6.5/6.1 programs (eg a file explorer!)
[Windows Phone 7 General] Chainfire:
Haven't had the time to properly investigate, but I see a few possible attack vectors. As I haven't investigated properly yet, though, it remains to be seen if any of them is viable at all.
[Windows Phone 7 General] ozy944:
I imagine in due time, the devs among us (XDA) will figure out how to get additional functionality. What irks me a bit (although I understand microsofts thinking here) is that dev work is required at all to add basic functionality.

Multi tasking, I can overlook for better battery, copy paste, well...okay fine....but a friggin file manager is useful!! Perhaps the hubs look after this area so cant say for sure but it seems like microsoft is pulling an apple. Start really basic and simple. Attract the masses...then add little incremental features with great fanfare...hey guess what, windows phone seven now has a file manager. Its that sort of capitalist logic that sells in the world but it drowns innovation and thats sad to see....bleh
[Windows Phone 7 General] domineus:
y know stupid thought

for the moment I don't see why we can't ssh into our device to get low level management ...

it would be an extra few steps but it would be functional
[Windows Phone 7 General] gerryjoson:
Hey, don't go getting all insulted over it, you were the one that started off your post with "I'm a professional developer" like you think your of more importance than the people you are developing for [presumably]

Since WP7 was announced, it seems every 5 second wonder kid and his pet dog are now professional developers according to what gets posted on this forum, yet no one will say what they are developing, so you have to excuse my yeah...yeah...right oh attitude.

You mention things being "boring", you mention "animations", you mention that "actually" business users prefer a simple, functionally worse platform to a the old school configurable/versatile way of thinking that isn't necessarily super friendly [but is hardly difficult].I'm here telling you this one doesn't care about animations or whether it's boring looking, or whether I can have a square box update on the homescreen to tell me someone I know is taking a dump, versatility, function, efficiency [especially with input, text, documents, font size and connectivity] is where it's at for what I want in a business device.

On a personal level, it annoys the hell out of me that microsoft is chaining control of everything to themselves and their services so they make more money because they saw apple do it, I want to buy software from the people who made it, not microsoft, why should they get a cut, same with music, movies [even though I wouldn't personally use it].Will some of you people look forward to MS doing the same thing with desktop OSes, where they will get to dictate the hardware and software on those as well under the subterfuge of "user experience" and "services" as well?, the whole WP7 thing is a bit like the horse riding the jockey from a hardware v software perspective in my eyes.

I have no interest in their servers or cloud services and the associated security responsibility when I have 2TB at work accessable via the remote desktop client among the other advantages with this technology, although I must admit that I haven't looked at the cloud stuff that deeply because I can't really get past my distaste with the rest of the platform to begin with.

I voted no idea, but it definitely fails in it's current form for me.