yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Vibrant General] Kienz:
What I don't get is, why do some of you who are against the idea seem to take the idea itself so personally. If your phone works fine for you, great. If you don't want to participate, great. If you don't want to have to waste your time reading about this, try, oh, not wasting your time reading about this. But the defense that "There's a fix for it in Eugen's rom" or "They said they were working on it, so just wait already" seems asinine. As someone stated, why should you have to hack your phone in any way to get it to work as advertised? And why should you have to wait for some analogous fix, slated to be released at some indeterminate time (yes, they said September... but, newsflash, September is 9 days away from being over) just to get your phone to do what it was supposed to be able to do months ago?

My .02
[Vibrant General] Kubernetes:
trust me on this - the lawsuit my company faced, the shocker was in finding out that "under the american rule of law" if we prevail, which we felt certain we would as the facts were not to the plaintiff's benefit, the courts expect both parties to swallow their own legal costs. think about it, if a lawsuit is weak, lawyers for plaintiff & plaintiffs are encouraged to file as their clients costs will be limited to their side's costs. If, as our atty explained it, under world court or other than american rule of law rules applied, the party filing the weak lawsuit would have to re-imburse the defendant costs of defense.

Yeah, but think about how the incentives work in a loser-pays system. It's always going to be the case that private citizen plaintiffs spend less on legal fees than corporate defendants. That means no one without huge pockets would ever sue a company. Nor would plaintiffs' firms ever take on contingency cases for poor clients. The threat of losing would nullify any lawsuits against big companies. What Joe Schmoe is ever going to sue MegaCorp if losing means that he loses everything?

Question? Would a class action lawsuit result in a much longer delay in the release of any updates? If they do take it to court, that would mean they will draw out to see what the outcome is before they are forced to put out a fix. If they do go trial, would we expect to even see an update within the life of our phone?

Probably the opposite. I don't know about other jurisdictions, but under California's Consumer Legal Remedies Act (and I'm going to guess they'll sue in CA... or TX), the defendant has a safe harbor if it can remedy the problem in a reasonable amount of time. The filing of the lawsuit will likely light a fire under Samsung's ass because if they can get out the fix before they have to answer the complaint (usually 30 days after it's filed), it can make the lawsuit go away and saves them huge amounts in legal fees. Having been on the receiving end, I can guarantee you that the first question from Samsung's lawsuit will be, "Can you get a fix out fast so we can end the lawsuit right here?"
[Vibrant General] PaiPiePia:
In that case, I don't know if I really want them to rush the update out in 30 days or keep working on it until it's perfect. ARRG! Samsung products are ooooo so nice, but their customer supports makes me want to jump back to Apple's controlling arms again.
[Vibrant General] jamesyl:
The engineers working on the fix will not be the ones negotiating for a settlement, so I don't see any reason why this would be true. The lawsuit should give Samsung incentive to push out a fix so that the lawsuit would be dropped by the plaintiffs.
[Vibrant General] jamesyl:
As others have mentioned, class action lawsuits have very little to do with regular consumer Joes (like us on XDA) trying to earn money and entirely to do with incentive and disincentive for Samsung to help the consumer Joe.
[Vibrant General] Tpavey:
And not only consumers. If you take a look at their list of victories and current cases there are a number of reasonable things. Unfair pricing for uninsured is the big one that stands out. For consumers they got Carrier to extend warranty and provide service. This isn't about attacking companies just because, this is to help ensure that monster corporatoins with power and money are fair to individuals without either.

Certainly some class-action suits are ridiculous. Suing drug companies for a side effect that is printed on the damn information sheet for example. Not all are bad though. It is frightening how many people here view the world in such a black and white manner.
[Vibrant General] N8ter:
Gave both of or info (two broken vibrants here).

The fanboys here are hilarious!
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
Hi all,

i have published an article about SLCD vs. AMOLED screens. I had the chance to compare two Nexus One devices and tried to mention every important aspect when comparing the display quality.

http://smartphoneblogging.com/2010/09/nexus-one-slcd-vs-nexus-one-amoled-showdown-which-screen-technology-is-better/

If you have any questions please let me know.

btw: i have seen that there are some threads about this on the DESIRE message board, but as i have reviewed Nexus One devices it makes sense to start a new thread here.
[Nexus One General] Jack_R1:
One question not covered: are they using the same digitizer (with the same axis swapping problems)?
[Nexus One General] willverduzco:
+1 on that question... That is the one thing I am dying to find out. Personally, I would consider swapping for an SLCD version only if they fixed the digitizer.
[Nexus One General] norazi:
Same here.. I could care less currently if my screen was amoled or lcd (both have the same performance as far as im concerned, as long as resolution and brightness are the same). The digitizer is what kills the nexus
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
Yes the touchpanel is exactly the same.
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
erm...the thing is that the slcd screen has much better resolution. Both claim to have wvga, but the effective resolution on slcd is superior. This is because of the bad rendering method on amoled screen called pentile matrix. See my article for details.
[Nexus One General] willverduzco:
I'm sure (at least I hope) that everyone here on XDA at least knows such a basic thing about his/her device. I'm sure what he meant was that it is much less of an issue than the axis-swap, which I am sure most people agree with.

What did you find when running the multitouch visualization test? Any axis swap and/or snap?
[Nexus One General] stuff:
Without even asking, I can guarentee they are using the same digitizer/ clearpad 2000.
[Nexus One General] codesplice:
OP, I don't want to knock your work on the article... but I do have issues with some of the test criteria and conclusions you draw. I've also compared my AMOLED N1 with a newer SLCD model, and I honestly prefer the AMOLED - though I will admit that I'm using the Calibrator hack to achieve natural ~6500K color temperature and saturation on my device, and couldn't be happier with the color and contrast after a bit of tweaking.

Many of the comparison pictures posted with the article are using different wallpaper backgrounds, which makes it very difficult for a reader to objectively state "this one is better than that." Having both phones set up the same (same launcher, same icons, same wallpaper, same brightness setting, etc) would be the only way to honestly compare based on the pictures you provided.

You also rag on the "supposed" battery savings of AMOLED vs LCD, and state that the AMOLED-equipped Nexus has a greatly reduced battery life compared to LCD-equipped Hero. This is not an objective, scientific comparison by any means as these are two unrelated devices. You might as well be comparing the battery life of the Nexus One to the airspeed velocity of an unladen swallow. Compare the battery life of an AMOLED Nexus with the battery life of an SLCD Nexus or don't bother comparing them at all.

Overall, a thought-provoking article, and I'm glad that you're pleased with the SLCD variant. I remain unconvinced.
[Nexus One General] yumcax:
Yes... there was an similar article on the SLCD vs AMOLED Desire, I'll see if I can find it. They tested battery life and found that the AMOLED screen consistently lasted longer (SLCD died at 5 hours while AMOLED always had 30% left) and even swapped batteries to make sure the data was correct. Informative read, anyone have the link?

EDIT: Found it! In my opinion, a much less biased opinion.
[Nexus One General] ericc191:
Even if I had the choice of SLCD, I'd still go with AMOLED because of the true blacks.
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
Sorry but the engadget test is also not 100% accurate or scientifical, because the outcome depends on the movie played. Does it have many dark scenes or more bright scenes? I honestly didn't have any big battery consumption differences on both devices overall.
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
ok, i don't know much about those color hacks. Is there also a way to minimize the pentile effect with some hacks?

yes you are absolutely correct. Let me explain: i made a lot of comparison shots, and of course i used the same brightness level for all shots, and the same background on many shots too. The impressions i have written base on the exact same setup of both devices.

But since i'm not a professional photographer, sadly the pictures with the same background were either focussed wrongly or not sharp enough. :) Thats why i had to upload the pics with different wallpapers, which were a little bit better. I might as well upload the other ones too and give a hint that those are only good for color comparisons and not more as they are a bit blurry.

The whole purpose of the article was to give impressions on a customers/enduser perspective. This article is not meant to be scientific, the only reason why i touched on some sciene with the PenTile rendering is, that i wanted to explain why the text on screen does look fuzzy for some peoples eyes. In the end the only thing which counts is the outcome. The HTC Hero was the flagship at its time, and the Nexus One devices also were flagships. As a customer i had to pay about 500 Euros for both devices. I don't think that customers do really care if there are any scientific reasons why the AMOLED can't be compared to the HTC Hero LCD, the only thing i see is that battery lifetime is a step back. Thats what i wanted to point out.

The same is true for the PenTile Matrix, some customers see that the resolution doesn't look quite right. And it doesn't matter that some scientific reasons speak for PenTile (i.e. pixel lifecycle) because as the enduser i can only see the fuzzy text effect.
[Nexus One General] djmcnz:
At sea level? I'd be quite interested. ;)
[Nexus One General] pwig:
So, in your opinion, under normal use the battery usage is a wash?

I imagine that in high brightness conditions, the AMOLED uses battery faster, but in low light it's better. So it kind of evens out I guess?
[Nexus One General] jurassicjockey:
well, is the swallow African or European
[Nexus One General] codesplice:
No. The color calibration hacks simply adjust the baseline rgb values to correct for the extremely cool (blue) tint the screen has by default.

The only thing I see is that you are basing this judgment on the comparison of two dissimilar devices. There are a lot of other differences between the Hero and the Nexus rather than just a different type of screen. It is therefor not fair (and completely inaccurate and misleading) to make such a comparison. That's what I wanted to point out.

Hard to say - the OP didn't specify during his scientific comparisons :p
[Nexus One General] chadti99:
I agree with the OP, small text is easier to read on an lcd of the same resolution. Although the color saturation and contrast on AMOLED win me over. Hopefully a color adjustment tool is released to correct the white balance.

Also the touch sensitivity is amazing on the Vibrant which I think is partly due to the amoled screen and digitizer being integrated.
[Nexus One General] diversificationied:
The OP is way too anal about "sharpness" to be speaking on behalf of regular users.
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
i don't think that any of us can speak on behalf of regular users.

There are regular users out there which hate the resolution on AMOLED PenTile screens, and then you got users which don't notice it at all.

The only thing which i can say is, that i believe regular users look more at text on their smarphone than movies and pics. Because you got text on every occasion, in nearly any app and with nearly any use case.
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
for me it was very even. Engadget came to the conclusion that AMOLED performs better (based on a movie that was loop played), but i didn't see that. Both didnt last for 24 hours with my regular use cases (which is NOT watching the same movie over and over again ;)).

I wanted to point out that the customer won't really care if it's technically "fair" or not. Only thing that matters is what you get for 500 bucks, and you get many cool things like a bigger screen, but NOT more battery lifetime. I wasn't expecting the AMOLED technology to rave about it's "little" power consumption only to provide 24hours the most. It just wasn't the big jump as everybody expected. On the technical side you are of course 100% right.

But it's like a sales person claiming: "hey guys AMOLED is so cutting edge, it has better contrast and better black levels, AND less power consumption!" And after confronted with the fact that it doesn't last more than 24h: "yes, in the end you get the SAME battery lifetime or slightly less, but you should be happy not to have much worse battery lifetime, because of all those other technical factors...thanks to AMOLED!" ;)
[Nexus One General] NexusDro:
The OP is a bit over obsessed about the lentils layout, IMO. =) no offense. A lot of us on xda, especially the nexus one owners, are somewhat already informed about this issue because n1 is a geek device, so many of us should have some kind of tech level. I haven't read the article yet, but judging from op's other posts, it seems like he didn't mention the amoled display having a very cool temperature. This is somewhat a well known issue and I hope Google can fix that instead of using hacks to correct it. I also wonder how Samsung managed to make the text appear sharper on their galaxy s even though the screen also uses the pentile subpixel arrangement.
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
some galaxy s owners claimed that the pentile matrix is less visible on their devices. But i can't really say much about it since i haven't got the chance to test the galaxy s.
[Nexus One General] :
I can speak for a large portion of people that can't tell the difference between a 150 ppi print versus a 300 ppi print. You move the screen one inch away from your face and your eyes ability to differentiate those resolutions drops by a large amount. I deal with paper printing on a daily basis and with "commoners" who could give three craps about the minor difference in standard pixel arrangement and amoled arrangements.

You, and very few can tell the difference, but I can guarantee you that you are in a very very small minority. My point being that the fuzziness you see is exaggerated due to your unique eyes. You are blessed (or cursed) with macro eyes.

The majority of other people can't tell the difference.
[Nexus One General] britoso:
Good article!

I feel the Pentile matrix difference is exaggerated. I cant make out any color problems or blurriness. My phone AMOLED screen is much better than my laptop or desktop LCD.

In any case nobody is going to use the phone for professional color matching purposes.

I will opt for OLED over LCD every single time, provided the cost is not too excessive
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
Well i wouldn't give three craps about the exact print quality of paper printing too. But for me buying some newspaper or magazine is something different than paying 500 bucks for a high end smartphone.

I also agree that many people might not see this effect.
[Nexus One General] :
The point apparently went over your head. It's not the final product (print) it's the resolution difference I was speaking on.

Oh and this people are paying MORE than 500 bucks on these print items.
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
Oh really? So the commoner doesn't see pentile problems and likes to pay more than 500 bucks for some print products. Thanks for explaining the mass market to me.

I see your point that many people won't notice this though, so I understand what you say. You might be right, but for those people which can differentiate the problem it's a real issue.
[Nexus One General] :
Which is what I said in my first post.

Resolution differences resolve quickly with a minute adjustment in viewing distance.

Those who can actually differentiate are in very small numbers. Don't expect screen manufacturers to address that small deficiency in pentile, since the saturation benefit of amoled heavily outweighs it.
[Nexus One General] RogerPodacter:
To my eyes the galaxy s screen text is much worse than the nexus. Text looks more fuzzy to me in person. It's very noticeable. And it makes sense cause both use the same pentile layout. But a larger screen makes it easier to see pixels.

Oh and I'd take amoled any day. I like the super colors and deep blacks. I like it looking larger than life cartoony, that's the whole point!
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
Yep. But I do believe that sooner or later we will get amoled displays without pentile and similar resolution like the Apple's retina LCD. What I understand is that currently the pentile approach is needed to make amoled displays production cheap enough. But after some time the technology will become more affordable and there will be no need for pentile displays. So even people like me will be satisfied...
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
That was my theory too, but on some message boards there were a few people insisting that the galaxy s screen doesn't have pentile issues like blurry text. I couldn't verify their claims because I don't have a galaxy s. I was supposing that this is due to better screen calibration and super amoled screen which minimizes the pentile effect.
[Nexus One General] ryusaeba:
First of all, thank you OP for your comparison article. It offers an alternate point of view, quite different from Engadget's results.

I just received my new Nexus One that is to replace my old one under warranty (the old one has gotten the unfortunate dust-under-the-screen problem.) The new one seems to have SLCD. I did some very quick and amateur comparisons between the two: in manual brightness (~30%) in a completely dark room, the SLCD seems to have sharper texts, whiter whites, and is also noticeably brighter; whereas the AMOLED version has truer blacks, and actually becomes noticeably brighter if I set both units to auto brightness (I wonder why). By comparing the two next to each other, I noticed that the SLCD seems to have sharper texts, but without the two side by side I would not think the AMOLED version has fuzzy text. As for battery life it remains to be seen (which is very important for me), as I just got my SLCD replacement and has no chance to compare yet.

In conclusion, both SLCD and AMOLED has its shares of pros and cons . It really depends on users' preference.
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
Yep it really depends on the use cases. If you want sharp text, then slcd is better. If you want high contrast and deep blacks then amoled wins.
[Nexus One General] themetatron:
i don't have special eyes, so i cant tell the difference between the sharpness. i like the amoled screen. when i purchased my phone, the amoled screen was a selling point. now that my speaker has blown, htc can't guarantee that i'll get another amoled screen. i know i can't really be mad at them. somehow, samsung got the entire market wrapped up with this fake shortage. kinda got a feeling that the retina screen is really some kinda hybrid amoled, and that's where all the amoleds went
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
The retina is an (ips) LCD screen. The shortage is due to Samsung producing a lot of own devices like the galaxy s and the Samsung wave. And is course they provide the amoled screens preferably for their own devices.
[Nexus One General] NexusDro:
Does anyone know where nokia got their amoled screens? Their upcoming flag ship phones all hav amoled screens.
[Nexus One General] vivanshah:
would have liked to see identical screens for the different comparison shots

and also, an actual battery life test conducted.
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
agree, both points are valid.

i made comparison shots with same screens, but sadly they weren't good enough (blurry) therefore i had to use the one with different screens which i also made during the photoshooting.

Battery lifetime difference is not huge by any means from my daily usage experience, regardless if the AMOLED screen can last 2 hours longer or not. In the end, you have to charge both devices daily. Thats why i didn't get too much into details because i felt that this difference wouldn't be a KO factor. Still i agree that ii would have been better to evaluate the battery lifetime in a more detailed way because many people care about this issue.

i will keep those things in mind for my next comparison article.
[Nexus One General] pik.:
so if i understood well...

all the Nexus Ones now in the market have SLCD ?

I want to buy one and want to see the difference.

can i see the production week of the Nexus somehow?
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
the easiest way to check this is to look at the package on the backside. It will say "Nexus One LCD" if its the SLCD version. If it only says "Nexus One" it's the amoled version.

But it's hard enough to get his hands on the nexus one anyway, so it won't be easy for you to have both versions side-by-side. I bought the nexus one as soon as it was available on vodafone. And later switched to SLCD.

I guess nearly all Nexus One from retail will be SLCD now. At least in germany this is the case.
[Nexus One General] pik.:
thank you very very much!

I m curious to see if the sLCD is better...

overall I think I ll better have sharp text and a bit of cold display... :D
[Nexus One General] mixxy:
ive had both side by side and i can say that the display on the galaxy s vibrant i9000 blows away the n1's.

the text is sharp and there is almost no pentile matrix effect.

there are a lot of things that are different in the samoled display. The binders are different, the space between the glass makes a difference etc etc.

unfortunately i returned my galaxy due to the absolute horrendous gps. It simply does not work.
[Nexus One General] Shahpur.Azizpour:
Yes, I'm also very impressed by the samoled displays. While the pentile matrix is not as visible i.e. on the Samsung wave (due to smaller screen) it's still there though. But I love how much less reflections those new samoled displays have.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] oiMio:
50% done, cant wait!
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] tigger69:
o'really O_O another troll?
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] SXUsr:
At least post a bit more info, country, network ect, what did it say before you updated?
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] telmoabff:
Is it finally?

All I get is network error...

Maybe too many people at the same time? T-Mobile UK.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] Reeonimus:
Bah, just look at his other posts, same crap the other trolls have been saying. (Or should I say the same troll who keeps making new accounts)

Close thread please.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] IxXxI:
still no update in Austria
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] Cablekevin:
Still nothing here, "Latest software".
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] damirbusic:
Admins please ban original poster. Thanks
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] fogozito:
no, update here telcel mexico.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] ansi_11111:
It's Now 100 but not finished

I started update before 3 hours but it still work and the progress bar is 100% how long it take to update?? anyone know???