yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Nexus One Android Development] temasek:
Okay, several recommendations b4 I talk about your case.

Recommendations

1. Set your min charge to 40. Currently yours is set to 80. ==> 0x65 0c

2. Set your Empty Voltage to 3201mV. Currently yours is set at 3416mV. ==> 0x66 a4

3. Set your age capacity to 1600mAh.===> 0x6a 0f , 0x6b 00

Back to your case

Your full40 currently at 1603. This value is manufacturer set and also can only be changed by yourself and not the application nor learn cycle.

Don't mistaken the Capacity (mAh) with your full40 (mAh).

A simple explaination.

Full40 can be considered your max capacity (mAh) that either set by manufacturer or by yourself. Capacity is your actual mAh level that is currently within your battery. During a learn cycle, your capacity MAY exceed your full40 level during the high 90s% charging and when its fully charged, your capacity will drop below your full40 cuz thats YOUR LIMIT that u set.

That is why we kept saying, if without loginwithnoname, RogerPodactor & of cuz dvgrhl (dev of battery app), u will never realize your potential of your battery.

So I believe u misunderstood Capacity (mAh) and full40 (mAh)

Hope my explaination is clear for u.
[Nexus One Android Development] discostu1:
Thank you. I decided to just do a calibration with the default 3416mV setting, but now I'm having more problems.

Every time it gets close to 3416, like to 3450ish and 9mAh, always 9mAh, my phone auto shuts down. I have the ACR Adjustment setting clicked to add capacity so it doesn't auto-shutdown but it still does.

Now I'm really at a loss. The learn mode flag never gets set, so I never get a chance to plug my phone in. I even tried doing a battery stats wipe and it still shut down at 9mAh. Sigh.
[Nexus One Android Development] temasek:
Many have this problem. By right ACR adjustments will auto bump more mAh for u when necessary but in some situations it doesn't kick in.

Well, we do have manual way of doing that. When you see a need to bump up more mAh, simply use the app and input

Register 10

Value 03

Register 10 is the manual change of mAh. Value 03 is to add around 300mAh. Keep manual bumping up of your mAh when necessary till u hit Empty Voltage value.

Good Luck! :)
[Nexus One Android Development] ellesshoo:
That last screen shot was from when i hadn't changed anything. I set the min charge to 40mAh, age 100, and full 40 to 1630 when I did the learn cycle that generated the two log screen caps I posted. Sorry if that last screen cap confused things. Please advise...
[Nexus One Android Development] temasek:
I don't see anything wrong.

Only thing I can think when u set full40 to 1630, you probably forgot to save it. :eek:
[Nexus One Android Development] discostu1:
Thanks again. It works now. It appears that it wasn't giving me any extra capacity, even though the flag was set.
[Nexus One Android Development] temasek:
You are welcome. :)

U shld thanks Roger and its team. I learned alot from them, especially Roger.
[Nexus One Android Development] ellesshoo:
hmmm... i don't see how that can be since my current full40 is 1630 and I haven't changed it since that learn. I'm pretty sure you understand what I was trying to convey but just to confirm it once more:

the picture showing the full40 @ 1603 was taken a long time ago before I had ever edited anything about the battery.

I then set full40 to 1650, aevolt to 3.201, min charge to 20mAh and did a learn cycle and watched it charge up to about 1626mAh... I then decided to change the min charge current to 40mAh, full 40 to 1630mAh, and redo the learn cycle which produced the log file I posted where the charge got up to 1617mAh and then when the it hit the min charge current of 40mAh the capacity went to 1603mAh.

So I've done two learn cycles with changed values (from the stock values I posted). I just found it interesting that the capacity went down to 1603 at the charge full when it appeared to be climbing higher to 1617mAh with full40 at 1630mah and min charge curr at 40mah.
[Nexus One Android Development] temasek:
Oh ic.........thats a long story.

Okay simple explaination.

As I explained your full40 was set by yourself to 1630mAh, the capacity when fully charged, may varies depending on several factors

a. Did the Current (mA) turned from charging current to drawing current prematualy? ie before actually complete to 100%, due to current turned negative (ie draw current), it stops charging and your capacity will be much lower than your full40.

b. Your min charge value. When your current falls below your min charge value, it will stop charging and your capacity may not reach your full40 level.

c. What type of charger you are using. If its USB charging then good luck, your fully charged capacity will be even lower than using a normal charger.

Basically even if I set full40 for my battery at 2500mAh, I will never get a fully charged capacity to 2500mAh. It will be slightly lower than 2500mAh, depending on the above factors.

Also upon almost fully charged, its normal to see your capacity drop a little. Try plugging out your charger after its fully charged, u see immediate drop in capacity, usually.

So nothing is wrong, everything is good. :p
[Nexus One Android Development] ellesshoo:
to answer your questions:

a. it got to 100%, with a capacity of 1617mAh and charge current just barely over 40mAh. Then when the charge current dropped below 40mAh the capacity immediately dropped down to 1603mAh and the charge current turned negative.

c. I'm using the stock/OEM AC charger so I don't see a problem there. It registers as "fast charging" as it should.

I guess I'll give it another shot. I know I didn't drop the current myself by peeking a look since those log screen shots were about halfway through the log (meaning that by the time I unplugged and took those screen caps much time had passed).
[Nexus One Android Development] temasek:
Yes.

Your point (a) says it all. U are limited by your min charge of 40mA. So when current goes 40 and below, it stop charging. Its normal to drop a little mAh when that happens.

So really nothing is wrong.

EDIT: To reinforce my point

Min Charge value 80mA = When charge current goes 80mA and below, it stops charging

Min Charge value 40mA = When charge current goes 40mA and below, it stops charging

etc.

etc.
[Nexus One Android Development] Smokeaire:
Is the above explanation the reason why the battery discharges during phone use while on the charger? I've never understood why the battery % reduces even though it is connected to the charger.
[Nexus One Android Development] temasek:
Nope. That explaination is a different stuff.

As for your question, if u plug in to charge but the battery % already at 90% or above, it will not charge though you are connected to the charger. So u will see a drop in battery % in such situation.

Battery will only start charging below 90% battery level. At 100% draw current will be from charger instead of battery so your battery will remain 100%.
[Nexus One Android Development] Smokeaire:
Great. Thank you. I thought there was something off with the phone or the battery.
[Nexus One Android Development] RogerPodacter:
hey guys, i missed the last few posts. but i think your question above is why did the mAh drop down like that, when your full40 is set to a higher value? that is normal. the full40 value is the maximum mAh your battery can reach. the "40" stands for 40C temperature, because the hotter the battery, the better it performs and more capacity it can hold. so full40 is the maximum capacity you can hold at 40C.

depending on the temperature of your battery it will reduce capacity as temperature drops. there are 4 temperature breakpoints the battery uses to determine mAh. so i just made up an example below of what happens depending on your battery's temperature:

0-10C: 1959 mAh

10-20C: 1971 mAh

20-30C: 1982 mAh

30-40C: Full40 2000mAh

so your full40 was 1630 and it dropped to 1603, meaning you were probably close to around 33C or somewhere in the 30's. so it was completely normal for it to drop, the chip is extrapolating the correct full point mAh at that time and temperature.

you would only ever reach your full40 point if your temperature is AT 40 celsius...and of course your age was 100 too at the time..
[Nexus One Android Development] RogerPodacter:
can you explain exactly what happens in this situation? cause i've heard people having this problem before, but i have never seen it and i thought it was the way the old battery driver was written which has since been changed.

some people have it charge to 100%, then start draining to 89%, then charge back up again, all while still connected to the charger. but i dont see this, when i charge to full, once it reaches 100% it stays there for hours until i unplug it. so i'm confused how it can happen...

unless talking about a car charger which may not be able to replace charge fast enough as being used by the phone...
[Nexus One Android Development] theloginwithnoname:
Correct me if I am wrong, but I think it works like this:

if you charge until it reaches "full" and leave the charged plugged in, it will maintain 100% charge - you may see additional charge put (falsely) into the battery and your top voltage may diminish.

if you have reached "full" charge and disconnected, then re-plugging in should maintain the same charge as when you plug in, without it putting any additional charge in. If you plug in < 90%, it will start charging again

if you have not reached "full", the battery will be charged until it reaches a "full" state.

it's how mine works anyhow!
[Nexus One Android Development] RogerPodacter:
ok duh, i'm dumb i completely knew this but forgot about it. so yes, if i charge my phone up to 100%, then unplug it and use it for 10 minutes and it drops to 95%. if i then plug it back in, it will not charge back up. it will stay at 95% indefinitely. only when i unplug, let it drain below 90%, THEN plug it back in will it charge back up to 100%.

this sound right?
[Nexus One Android Development] theloginwithnoname:
correct, RP

sent via XDA app
[Nexus One Android Development] waylo:
There are some kernels/roms however which will have changed this so that charging can occur at anything <99%. See my sig for one of them.
[Nexus One Android Development] temasek:
That kind of charging hopefully its not on my rom that I use. Personally I don't like it.
[Nexus One Android Development] RogerPodacter:
actually now that i think about it, isn't it the CHGTF that comes on at full charge, and stays on until dropped below 90%? meaning the driver can't do anything about it, its the chip that sets CHGTF? maybe i'm imagining that but i thought i remember that happening...
[Nexus One Android Development] temasek:
Yes Roger. My CHGTF stays on till below 90%. But I remember once I used a kernel that wasn't so. My battery was above 90%, I plugin and it was charging. Such charging could really hurt the battery life.

I like what presently set, no charging at 90% & above. :)
[Nexus One Android Development] mtw4991:
Iirc, wildmonks kernels allow charging at greater than 89%, our at least they did. Not the best solution.
[Nexus One Android Development] temasek:
Agreed, its a painful death to the battery, especially if one is performing USB charging and tethering at the same time. The draw current may even exceed the charge current at times and one maybe hitting 100% -> 99% -> 100% -> 99%, etc.

Battery is bleeding........... *ouch* :eek:
[Nexus One Android Development] schizophrenia:
a. NOTE: to hit learn mode you must keep your current mA above -200mA draw! Turn on some apps but make sure the current (mA) is >200mA in Learn Mode tab

b. turn learn mode on in Learn Mode tab

c. wait for mV to drop to <3201mV (learn popup will appear & learnf button will light up)

d. insert charger QUICKLY! (You will see a message saying Learn Mode is active on Learn Mode tab.)

e. turn off and close any open apps.

f. you can use the phone normally until charging current drops to <100mA, then put phone into airplane mode so that you don’t get unexpected current draw near the full point and prematurely end the learn cycle

Quick question:

1) Sometimes even after I turned on the "Detect Learn Mode" my Current occassionally dropped below -200mA (e.g. 160mA) for a quick while... will it affect the result?

2) "Turn off" means turning off the Detect Learn Mode right?

3) where can I see the "Charging current"? Capa.?

Thanks

EDIT:

After first run, after reboot, Batt Age shows a 100% and that means i failed right? What could have been wrong?

Right after full charge at around 4hrs+ on airplane mode, the Cap is at 1424mAh or something while the Aged Capa is at 1393mAh

does that mean anything?

After tested for a day, well, just 12 hours, the phone turned itself off at 15% again. damn

Thanks
[Nexus One Android Development] Omiclops:
Please ignore I think I figured it :)
[Nexus One Android Development] RogerPodacter:
1. it doesnt matter if the current drops below -200mA. all you care abou tis that at the precise instant that your battery hits empty volt, the current is greater than -200mA. and i mean more negative, so -250, -300, or so on is what you want.

2. learn dtect should turn off automatically for you if you hit learn flag. turn off meant leave the phone alone and let the screen go blank, but dont turn off the phone. really you can use the phone, but once it gets close to finishing charging you should stop using it as current draw is very sensitive up near the top and can ruin your learn cycle.

3. current and capa is right at the top of the learn mode tab screen, refreshing very quickly so its easy to see the status when approaching empty volt.

yes if reboot shows age as 100%, it failed. from the sound of it, your age likely will be around 83% or so. so look for that result. take note that if you see 94% age, the battery reset itself, the learn failed. so its a good idea to periodically check the phone and make sure the learn flag stays on the entire time of the cycle. if anytime you see it is no longer on, stop the cycle and try again rather than wasting hours charging up when its already failed.

we added a message alert to tell the user it failed in the next version of the app. so hope that will help soon enough.

aged capacity means nothing for you for now so i wouldnt worry about it.

if you are unable to do the learn mode, i'd suggest manually setting your age value to 83%. then see how far you can drain your battery. it will likely fix it and drain close to zero percent. but FYI the manufacturer considers a battery dead when age is 80%, so you are getting pretty close!
[Nexus One Android Development] madjsp:
I guess this is where I am going wrong too. I get the learn flag to pop up, and I plug in the phone. Then it says to close the apps. I assume that doesn't mean the battery calibration app, right?
[Nexus One Android Development] RogerPodacter:
well...the safest way is to close all the apps (but not the battery calibrator app), set down the phone and leave it alone. however, its not the end of the world if you use the phone a bit. worst case the learn fails and you try again. pushing the phone hard is what usually causes it to fail, like loading large websites or navigation with maps.
[Nexus One Android Development] madjsp:
I've been closing the battery calibrator app. D'oh!

On an unrelated note, it's funny when you see an old HoFo name elsewhere on the web. You were/are there, right?
[Nexus One Android Development] RogerPodacter:
Well you don't really need to keep the battery app open. The learn flag will still stay on and finish the cycle no matter what. I say to leave it running so you can easily check to see if the learn flag is still on or not without having to open the app again.

And yes I'm still a moderator over at hofo but my posting has gone down a little. I do visit everyday and participate when I can! But the battery app took a lot of my time lately...
[Nexus One Android Development] madjsp:
This is what I do.

I put both of those lines in SetReg (1 at a time, and after the first one, the second one seems to disappear?).

start the learn mode. kill the battery.

as soon as the pop up comes up, i put my charger in. Then, I put the phone into airplane mode and leave it.

Woke up and turned it off/on. battery life is at 94%.

I gave up on Symbian. I just read that Nokia is in agreement with Microsoft now, and the "update" for the n8 was just some polish for a turd. I enjoy Android so much more.
[Nexus One Android Development] buginside:
Official link on Android Web Market:

http://market.android.com/details?id=net.jonrichards.batterycalibrator.ui
[Nexus One Android Development] schizophrenia:
2nd trial already. .. still battery age at 100%....... failed again. damn

what is the problem.......?!?

i have to add, everytime when i want to turn off/on the phone, it gets stuck at the Nexus screen. I have to take the battery out and put it back and turn it on again. could this be the problem? i am running on CM7?

Other than that, I was 100% sure i was at over -200 when it hit the "Learn"... and I put the phone on airplane right away after killing all apps (including the Battery Calibrator, well some apps might respawn but thats nothing I can do about that i think).

Any clue?

Thanks
[Nexus One Android Development] RogerPodacter:
absolutely the phone on/off thing is killing your age value, that's why its not working. it needs to be a clean reboot for the battery chip to set the age value proper to its newly learned one. whatever glitch that is you have is what's blocking this whole thing. maybe its cyan 7, i dunno. try on cm 6.1 perhaps.
[Nexus One Android Development] waylo:
What evidence do you have that this is actually bad for the battery?

Don't most chargers continually top off batteries?

This seems to be the only situation I've seen where a charger doesn't just charge when it's connected!
[Nexus One Android Development] ellesshoo:
I'm pretty sure it's not good to charge to full, let the battery discharge just a little and then recharge to full again continuously.

Many Lenovo laptops have a feature intended to prolong the life of your battery. If you always want a 100% charged laptop everytime you undock you can turn the feature off and it will always charge your battery to full and top it off whenever possible. With the battery life extension feature enabled it will allow the battery to discharge, even while docked, before charging it up again. You can set this threshold percentage to a fixed value or allow the power management software to handle this automatically. I believe in auto mode it changes the threshold to different values. Obviously some engineers put some thought into this and found continuously topping off decreased battery life.

EDIT: just to be clear, when I referred to "battery life" in this post I'm using the term as the physical/chemical life of the battery, NOT how long you could use a device before the battery hits 0%.
[Nexus One Android Development] EliteNewbz:
So I did a learn cycle and it worked fine. Set my battery age to 83%. However, it looks like it's drawing a lot of current, the -mV is sometimes over 250 when I have nothing open, before I did the learn cycle it was only at around 100-150ish before I had to turn on navi+pandora+ screen brightness to drain it to around -200. I don't think its a rogue app because it didn't go past 200 before and I haven't installed any new apps. I left the phone overnight and it went from 84 to 64%, no calls or anything. Before it wouldn't drop that much (about 9 hours).
[Nexus One Android Development] temasek:
You have the right to your opinion.

I'm quite sure there is a reason if u plugin with the battery at 90% and above and its not charging. I support this action.

That's all.
[Nexus One Android Development] xzr3b0rnzx:
Er does this work with kernel 2.6.37?
[Nexus One Android Development] mtw4991:
It isn't that it is necessarily bad for li-ion as they don't have memory per se. The battery is set to age based on a formula and full charges as well as partial charges count as "charges". I think the number is 300, not sure, but if your battery is constantly draining/charging your battery will age faster due to excessive partial charges prematurely aging the battery thereby reducing capacity. At 80%, the battery is considered dead.
[Nexus One Android Development] waylo:
I'm not hating here :)

Just curious. You're super active on this thread so I thought you might be privy to some info the rest of us may have missed.
[Nexus One Android Development] mtw4991:
wsylo, did you read my post before you posted the above? There are several reasons why it's not good to be constantly charging the battery, however some kernels do allow constant charging and it's not considered an optimal situation. Temasek and I have between here from the beginning and have tested several different scenarios over time and you can trust his opinion as he is usually right on! Fyi, I wrote the instructions and when I have questions I ask Temasek or Roger or Login. Sometimes, ya just gotta accept things even if ya don't totally get it lol.
[Nexus One Android Development] temasek:
Why don't u try do the test and let us know? There is a supported kernel that let u do that and pls do it over and over again.

It's basically simple logic. There is so much charging (xxxx times) u can do to a battery before it is considered dead. In our context, if a battery age is 80, its as good as dead though the battery is still "useable". Age 80 = time for replacement battery.

I have nothing against u but when I read post about "give me evidence, proof", etc, it really turn me off.

If someone wish to turn the tables and say "you are wrong" why don't he proof it.

While talking about battery calibration, I have had users skeptical about it being bad cuz draining till 0% is bad for battery. I don't wanna repeat my reply to him but this is exactly same issue.

Simple logic.

Have a good day. :)

Edit: a user saying its bad for battery and my reply.

Its not the issue here. No one will really go to 0% every time. Its more of a assurance that u can and u have more control over your battery with led blinking red at 10% giving u a warning. U wont be thinking oh no when my battery will die at what %.

You are missing the whole point of calibration. Also not forgetting finding true capacity potential rather than the pre-set capacity of your battery. Many times the pre-set capacity, aka full40 are wrong.
[Nexus One Android Development] waylo:
No insults meant of course by any of this questioning. In retrospect my phrasing could have been improved without the insinuation, so yes, apologies. But if you read it without emotion, as I meant it, it is simply asking if you could provide the info (which was very quickly provided afterwards) which makes sense.

When someone states something so matter of factly (that that particular charging profile is such a bad idea), and it hasn't been mentioned recently, I'd like to hear more about it.

I respect all the folks on here who have tirelessly been working on this, and have been so happy to help me out in my calibration.
[Nexus One Android Development] waylo:
Yes, I did read your post, and it was a stellar explanation. And I certainly don't refute any of you guys. Or repudiate. Or refudiate even :)
[Nexus One Android Development] britoso:
is it just me that finds this way too complex, even with the app ?

And I have worked with assembly code...
[Nexus One Android Development] temasek:
With battery drivers & app, one has more controls over the battery registers.

Still one has an option to enable learn cycle in an old fashion way.

- plugin charger immediately when one sees the powering off dialog box
[Nexus One Android Development] temasek:
No apologies required.

U have a great day ahead. :)