yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] Contrarian:
To tell you the truth I don't really want things such as flash 10.1 slowing down my phone/browser. I've actually become quite accustomed to Skyfire, which uses cloud servers to broadcast compressed video in a much more efficient manner. I do miss live chat on some sites, but then again more and more companies are launching their own apps anyhow, so it probably won't matter in the end.

Give me 16 million colours with longer battery life and I'll be more than happy. Throw in Flash lite 4 and I'll be over the moon.

Android is way over-rated imho.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] tigger69:
Someone posted on here, looks like no 16M colors :(
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] Contrarian:
"Someone posted on here, looks like no 16M colors"

Nah, that's BS. We won't know until it comes out. The x10 was limited to 65k colour because of 1.6 but 2.1 has no such restriction. One way or another (probably through a root) we'll get what we want from this phone. Don't forget, it's a lot easier to build things into 2.1 than it is on 1.6.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] arizhasan:
likewise :)
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] ialian:
Don't fool yourself into thinking you are going to get Android 2.2 from SE. Android 2.1 is not even out yet for most and I can tell you Android 2.1 from SE has limited some functions ie 16M, MT, Flash and more but you just have to find out for yourself.

Still got my X10 because I am a collector, especially the crap one.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] biktor_gj:
Well, I always thought the only reason why the x10 doesnt have multitouch is because SE didnt want it. Lets say it doesnt support it hardware wise. Who cares? You can always patch the kernel driver and play with scan times so even if it picks one at a time you can see the two points in two scans and emulate it. (if you can boot your own kernel)

About the colour, we should see the difference, the only problem is the framework and limitations on colour depth are gone in eclair.

I only wish we can finally crack it all down and do what we want with our phones...
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] vt2000:
biktor_gj, how far are you from achieving this? From the dev forum looks like you're getting close to booting into custom ROM image. Could you give us some high-level info here?

Appreciate your work!
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] chris_knows:
They actually have it done, they just get joy out of making us wait :p
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] vt2000:
...or maybe waiting for the prize amount to go higher :-)
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] berbecverde:
some may take this as an insult.:)

I hope they do not.:p
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] vt2000:
Never meant to insult anyone :-) Just a friendly tease
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] biktor_gj:
@vt2000: didn't take it that way, no worries :)

First of all I'm not trying to be rude, I just try to explain what I think, but english is not my main language, so don't take anything the wrong way!

You guys keep asking the same thing over and over, and it's not that nobody wants to say, the fact is nobody knows. Everything surrounding this phone is a problem. Boot loader is a problem (at least without a good-cracked-emma with a developer certificate and ways to put it in the phone, or good assembly skills and access to the bootloader area on the nand), good mtd access to certain partitions is another, executing a second kernel without crashing the modem is another one. God knows, maybe when eclair hits we just have to replace the system partition and the thing boots, maybe they release the 2.6.32 kernel source code and we find a way to soft-reboot the mcpu to allow a new kernel to do a fresh start without making it reboot the full phone, or maybe someone gets to do it tomorrow. Or we get some leaked files and everything is magic and funtastic :P, or maybe we aren't lucky.

There are a lot of ways of getting more or less the same:

- Patching the bootloader (not easy imho) to allow flashing anything

- Booting a second kernel through a loader and starting from there (half working right now, not easy but more than the bootloader)

- Replacing the system partition and running post boot scripts to finish booting a custom image (crappy but might work)

- Reusing the framework and making themes and mods to running image (which would be garbage in the end)

Right now we are trying to get something working on the second point. This will probably come handy too whenever eclair surfaces, but when will it be "done"? no idea. There's always a lot to do, and It's three of us on this, and we work, so when we have a bit of time, we do what we can. This is the same as when we were trying to root the phone, there's no way to measure the time you need to do something when you don't know how it's going to work... ...and now, to keep reading code... ;)
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] mezo9090:
Thanks for the info,

Knowing that you guys are working on it and giving us a light up is all I was hoping for. Even If you finish it at 2020.

Take your time :P
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] fig_jam_uk:
God damn Sony and there lock it down tighter than a crabs arse attitude.

Thanks for the update bud :)
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] Reeonimus:
Thanks biktor_gj, i'm sure a lot of people will appreciate your post here. For english not being your main language you sure explained it well. I hope some of the impatient people here aren't getting on your (and the others) nerves too much.

I appreciate the work you guys are doing and hope you find some luck in the process. I envy your knowledge and wish I could be a part of it all. It seems so exciting to do what your doing. I should have gotten into coding!
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] ballubas:
@ biktor_gj your hard work is appreciated!
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] ghidda:
@ biktor_gj

Thanks to info

Thank you and your work, your knowledge and above all of your time.

I sincerely hope in your success because you would be a great satisfaction and gratitude to the dedicated work more just.

I have more hope in you that if, if I think the development of HE in this phone comes to me just want to sell it.

Thank you very much
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] mootmaina:
no offense to the devs i think your doing the best you can. But since this isnt a popular phone all the 1337 hackers out there would be getting a desire or samsung or droid X and concentrating there skills there hence them being cracked already. Since we only got 3 people working on this its going to take a while here and im actually happy that its being worked on at all!! There is a slim hope it will get through.

This is my last post on the matter and ill sit back and play with 2.1 when SE releases it in the next few weeks. As for the custom rom, good luck and keep the effort but im not fussed as this version of andriod is good enough for me....
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] HunteronX:
Thanks for the info, biktor_gj.

It seems very difficult to crack any of the choices, but thank you for continuing to try so hard for everyone, even if a solution can't be made quickly. :)
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] erilis:
I know a lot of people have already said this, but still I must thank you biktor and rest of the devs for working so hard on this, really appreciate it.

What baffles me is why Sony always go for the lockdown on their products instead of dedicating more time to make software updates.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] bl@ckadder:
Hi.

I've browsed through most of this thread and I'd like to ask this:

What would cracking the bootloader (or some other means of using custom ROMs) on the X10 mean for the Mini Pro?

Would it then be possible (or easier) to do the one on the Mini series, or are they a totally different animal?
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] drdownload:
A lot easier, since SE wont use complete different paths to bring android on their phones.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] naveen_reloaded:
thnks a lot...

but if something is very challenging , shouldnt the developers be jumping on it ? i know u guys love challenge...

anyway my heartythnks and good luck for ur effort and time..

SE has given us the best hardware and they are ruining it with thier customization and locks ... we (x10 owners ) now have no hope of SE , and we solely rely on u guys to give us the the best OS and make x10 breathe a fresh life and take on its competitors...

again thnks for ur time and effort u guys are putting in....
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] Contrarian:
A mobile phone with dual OS boot - now that would be something else.

@Biktor_gj

We all appreciate the work developers on XDA carry out in their spare time. If you do manage to hack the bootloader it would be a bonus, but don't feel pressured by some of the impatient clowns on here.

I know I'll be crucified for suggesting this, but take a break until 2.1 comes out. IMHO it would be easier to work with a rooted Eclair kernel than trying to load a new ROM, but you guys may have a different objective.

Good luck, whatever you decide to do.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] arizhasan:
I don't think biktor meant dual booting.I think he meant let the phone start booting and then, his code or hack jumps in and steals the show.

by the way, dual booting is already there, my brother has a n900 with the default os and froyo on it. though the phone bit is not working for now on android boot but I hear the devs for n900 have got a temporary solution and working for a permanent and stable one.

edit: I hope they are late in fixing the phone features in n900, he already flaunts the froyo in my face, it'll be terrible if a device that is sub par, not meant for android will get an update than x10 :)
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] naveen_reloaded:
ok this may be stupid ... but when a chip is made .. there wont be anything written on it .. SE goes on to write and secures it

cant we hard erase it and put the image / rom on it...

ya sounds like a easiest job in the world... but where is this bootloader starts ? i mean cant it be erased easily ?

sorry for a noobish question... jsut wana understand things. ..
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] biktor_gj:
Youre right, i didnt mean dual booting, but we are trying to boot from sd card first without touching stock os so we dont have to reflash so... Dual booting should came sooner than the rest... :)

On a side note, if anyone if you want to thank somebody thank jerpelea & goroh who so far have done the hardest part :)

@naveen reloaded: in few words, the bootloader (acpu) should be on the very first sectors of the nand. We cant erase it first becuase nobody knows exactly where it is, and second because we dont have a safe method for writing. So even if you manage to overwrite it, and your bootloader crashes, 400$ to the trash. Unless you find correct jtag headers, which no one, publicly at least, has found so far. I half killed a main board trying.

And one thing is stopping an initialised working system and execute arbitrary code (like we do with usbloader), and another thing is starting from scratch, even if you have reference code from the kernel and the architecture.

You would really need a lot of tries to get a really nicely working bootloader..
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] Vilam:
Dual boot with 2 android version is not really usefull but cyanogen + other linux dist.(like ubuntu) = epic win
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] consolation:
biktor_gj, are you having problems running unsigned code on the baseband? Hmm, this sounds awfully like iPhone hacks c.2.0. Perhaps reach out to the iPhone dev community, in case you are re-inventing the wheel? Hackint0sh irc might be a place to hit up first, or hit up planetbeing and co on twitter. My 2c.

Sent from my X10i
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] naveen_reloaded:
Thanks a lot for taking time and replying to us..

surely u guys would have given all tries and thought of all sort of possible ways to get bootloader hacked..

one last thing ... is SEUS is of any help to us ? i mean , se will be updating its 2.1 through it ? if its possible can we make it to run our roms ?

also will SEUS do anything to bootloader while changing from 1.6 > 2.1 ?

pls reply if u have time ... if not , its totally fine..

all the very best guys ...
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] mezo9090:
The new update ( 2.1 update ) can't be rooted, the root method is not working.....

And you cant flash back to 1.6

Guess we spill start from the beginning...

Got the info from the 2.1 news thread, the guy there is reliable enough for me.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] biktor_gj:
Seus was of help until they patched it, though im pretty sure the bootloader wont change between releases, and if they do, it might even be useful, at least we could see how it does it :)

About rooting 2.1 we still have some options :) and if you dont flash it completely, you should still be able to downgrade. We'll have to see how the definitive version works and if they fixed it all or left some hole... Cant say more :p

Btw, where is that thread you're talking about? Could you link it here?
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] misterzak:
I'm not a dev, but I know the answer. They seem to have been trying to use SEUS and the files it downloads to find a work around, or something to that effect. In theory, the bootloader shouldn't change while updating from 1.6 - 2.1, but who knows!
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] tigger69:
I think he means this thread-

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=770570
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] naveen_reloaded:
thnks a lot ... hope SE leaves us some holes ... with current rate .. SE should i think leave the whole bootloader open... and make it under some service menu to open it .. this way only advacned users might take the risk and use it .. just a thought but we all know they wont..

anyway thnks a lot ... for taking time and replying..

lets see how they put 2.1 in there .. may be that will open up many things for dev
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] mezo9090:
Yes, that thread, check the last 4 pages, someone attached a few pictures there with some info...

Sorry I couldn't link our since I am using my phone only these days..

Btw, for me I think making the bootloader open by a secret menu ( with warranty warning ) is a good idea, but what I really can't understand what's in there that is so important that much that they don't want us to miss with..
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] Bad5ector:
Just a thought...

Maybe the reason the bootloader for the x10 is locked so tight because of the eventual PSP / Android combo. They might be worried that if they let the whole android dev community access to this bootloader that when and IF they release such a product that having a weaksauce bootloader could lead to CFW on the PSP side of things or however they plan on implementing it. But as I said... just a thought (and the android/psp phone is still a rumour for all the flamers out there, I am aware of that.)
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] arizhasan:
se should understand the fact that primarily, android is an open source project, there is no point in putting so many restrictions, they should not have even bothered with android but used something of their own on x10 and it might have made sense considering it would be their proprietory software. but using android and then not letting anyone play with it?? may be se designers and developers have a better reason for it than me,a lowly consumer, might understand.

secondly,I paid a good amount for this phone, in business dictionary, when agreed exchange of money takes place, the ownership of the product in question is transferred. on essence, the moment I paid for this phone, its mine,I could do whatever I want with it- burn it, dip it in sauce, bury it and hope for a Xperia tree, its my wish. who the hell are they to tell me what os should I use on my phone? I had been a loyal customer of sony till date. purchased their tv, phones,laptop and what not. but this attitude of sony is surely unacceptable. they should rethink their strategy for being in android market. it aint gonna help them to jump in on the bandwagon for now and hope that people will wait for their updates when other brands are two updates ahead already.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] naplesbill:
And you think this is somehow limited to SE? Motorola has some of the most locked down bootloaders around. Just look how long it took for the Milestone bootloader to be hacked. There are many reasons that manufacturers have for doing this and it is only a small portion of potential customers who even notice or care about it. The Devs usually prevail anyway so I think they are up to and enjoy the challenge.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] Keithod:
Totally agree with you. Also made me laugh, xperia tree? Ha ha
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] fig_jam_uk:
Seems like Sony's attitude since the PS3 and PSP, its like going out with a super model but not being allowed to touch, you can just imagine the capability's :D.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] kitsVA:
I agree with you. In general I buy lot of Sony made products mainly because I like their designs. I even own the freak'n Sony Dash and I actually like it. But, I am not sure if I will be buying SE Android phones in furture unless they release with latest Android versions. I feel like HTC is the best option for most of us on XDA forums who like to get custom ROMs and updates faster. I enjoyed Xperia X1a until very recently only because of all the cool ROMs made by XDA developers.

I recently sold my X10i (on craigslist) as I moved from T-Mobile to AT&T when I had to purchase X10a. The buyer asked me if it has the Swype keyboard like on Samsung phones. He offered to buy if I installed that for him. I guess more and more Android users will probably like to have their phones free to be customized. Imagine if the Dell Laptop we buy can only be updated with a Windows upgrade from Dell and not from Microsoft?

I think over time SE android share could tank at least among gadget freaks who actually pay premium price for phones if SE phones bootloader can't be hacked. It's just a matter of time before HTC learns to make phones as sexy as our X10.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] drdownload:
Just in a side-note, you can of course install swype on the x10 and it works exactly the same way as on the galaxy s.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] Slave1:
I can never get it to work. Always FC's after a few seconds. Sorry for OT.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] kitsVA:
I know that and I even use it on daily basis. What I am trying to say is even the average Joe who felt installing Swype is too hard for him knew that apps not in market can be installed on Andriod phone.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] drdownload:
I have tried the version for the specific screen resolution of the x10 and it worked flawlessly with 026 unrooted.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] Izzy_Deadyet:
Can someone post a link to where "Excellent Progress on CyanogenMod" was moved to. Nothing here but OT chatter.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] djsikhbeatsz:
I agree, I'd like to know the progress as well. :)
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] MeZmeriZe_:
If someone was to post a link, most of this lot would go there and fill it up with OT rubbish. Better this way. Devs work for free and don't need the hassles of this thead. They will tell you if they do something cool.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] arizhasan:
I get it with psp and ps3, they were sony's home brewed devices, as far as I know, from hardware to software. making it super strong is understandable, but android is not something that sony made, they laid their ui on top of an os that is solely an open source project from the day it started.I think google, if they really cared for the open source projects and seeing their initiatives I believe they sincerely do, they should not allow manufacturers to use strategies like this, it undermines the whole idea of the project. its like, WELL OK, YOU CAN INSTALL APPS, JUST LIKE ON ANY OTHER PHONE, ON ANY OTHER OS, BUT NO YOU CAN'T INSTALL CUSTOM ROMS, WE KNOW WHAT IS BETTER FOR YOU, OUR OWN JUNK LOADED OS!!! AND WE HAVE INCLUDED APPS WHICH YOU WILL NEVER USE, BUT THEY ARE THERE, TO REMIND YOU THAT OPEN SOURCE PROJECT, IT'S AN ILLUSION.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] arizhasan:
little preview of what we're expecting

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tfWNKe8800Q&feature=youtube_gdata_player

I don't know what he's saying though, if only someone could share a brief translation.

edit:I think he's speaking German
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] PoTi_96:
Yea it is german...

But i'm too young/stupid to translate everything he says...
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] Wolfbreak:
He talks about the new Slider,Live Wallpapers,720p Recording and in Phone Contacts you can now synchronize with Facebook and so, HTML 5 supported in Browser now and Autofocus with Camera. If you want more Details about something in the Video you can ask me.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] skyleth:
Don't know if the devs have tried, but cyanogenmod says they're looking for new devs and to support new devices, may be with their help it's easier to crack sony's system.

http://www.cyanogenmod.com/home/whats-up-with-cm

2nd paragraph
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] arizhasan:
now am thinking, why is se even bothering with am update. it should be too much of a job for se slob devs to get up and do something, they should simply tell xda devs the code to break in the boot loader and let them handle it, that might eventually boost sales, coz this friggin attitude isn't.

http://www.xperiax10.net/2010/09/20...-no-16m-colours-for-xperia-x10-eclair-update/
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] arizhasan:
I think by now every one knows that the super awaited update is postponed ( read- cancelled), here is sony's response on the thousands of " lovely messages" they received after thus announcement.

http://www.xperiax10.net/2010/09/24/more-details-on-android-2-1-xperia-x10-delay/

am checking for other options now, specially htc, se is nothing to count on and our devs even after trying everything that they could, unfortunately are unable to crack the loader yet.

edit: just checked desire hd, that is something worth going to, don't know if and when is it going to be released in India, but I think that will be a good option, also checked custom ROMS for desire, God am I more pissed at se after looking at the options htc customers have.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] Keithod:
I think the collective response by x10 users was brilliant. It should put them under pressure.

He mentioned that as a result the second stage of the update is delayed until early 2011. That must mean they were only planning on starting development for it after the release of the first stage. In other words they had planned to develop and test it in less than 3 months? Not realistic is it. Someone else on this forum mentioned that SE seem to be pulling parts of later kernel versions into older ones. Parts from 2. 2 into 2. 1. Maybe they should stop trying that. Why not just use a 2.2 kernel to start off with. Surely it be less hassle that way.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] biktor_gj:
It was me who said they were backporting, but it was on the kernel side of things (and from v 2.6.32 to 2.6.29), not on android itself.

I think we are all equally pissed off by SE, they will se how they want to handle this issue, but Im sure if we are 1000 x10 users on this forum 950 wont buy another phone from SE. Im not even buying new headphones from Sony since I saw low cost mini & mini pro have better headphones than the good x10...

Well, we will keep trying while we wait!
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] Gentimp:
yep, never an SE again. But we'd better make the best out of it while we still have it. I mean we're not rich or something...

I think ill go for an htc next. They seem more hackable.
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] DAXGr:
Agreed! SE is a major sucker!
[XPERIA X10 Android Development] ghidda:
my next device will not the SE :rolleyes:

htc first and Samsung second