yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Balthazar B:
I think you should post your thoughts about kernel-based location services in the Android Development and Hacking section (or maybe in the Android area of Chef Central) and try to get some traction towards a solution. I think the i9000 General forum is WAAAAAYYY off the radar (and of course the right solution would apply to all Android devices and be commonly available to all location-aware applications).
[Galaxy S I9000 General] bitbang3r:
Well, think of that as being kind of like a first rough draft that still needs a little bit of fact-checking and research before getting put out for wide public consumption. I have a lot of background in Java development & 8-bit MCU development, but the Linux kernel is still a disturbingly dark area, and Android-wise I'm somewhere in the awkward gray area between "way past HelloWorld" and "really feel like I know what I'm doing" (I'm still getting slaughtered daily by "You aren't allowed to do that with THAT kind of Thread" type problems) ;-)
[Galaxy S I9000 General] TravUK:
I think the post you refer to has missed the point a little, namely the behavior we see in GPS Test clearly shows a breakdown in the basic handling of satellites. Namely some satellites arent used even those they are seen, others are dropped completely with strong signals, and there seems to be a limit of 8 satellites used at one time.

I do hope to see a firmware update soon to fix the bug, but it'll probably be a one line code change of some silly oversight like a bad typecast or an array overflow. Sadly I dont think you'll see an Android developer re-doing the GPS HAL either. That's provided by the silicon manufacturer and we're not generally in the habit of publishing the details of how to program them.

The best thing ALL of us can do is report the problem back to Samsung to ensure they get the message that this is a big issue.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] sjdean:
Some good thoughts, but.... the HTC Desire seems to manage quite well. As does the HTC G1. Im not saying it doesn't have any flaws, but for what most people want, HTC seem to have a handle on it.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] sjdean:
That's mine!
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Beards:
What is the general census with those who have enabled Skyhook... Has it made any improvements guys?

I'm in and out between surgery in theatre for the remainder of the night so won't get a chance to check this out until late tomorrow.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Balthazar B:
So if I understand you, the manufacturer of the GPS chip itself would be the only one capable of improving the GPS HAL on Android devices as described in the post I referenced (actually, there's an equally interesting follow-up in that thread).

Sadly, because there's no incentive for them to do so, I shall be excused if I don't hold my breath waiting for that to happen.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] bitbang3r:
HTC might have a good implementation in some phones, but GPS in the CDMA Hero generally sucks, and Network-based location makes wacky, bizarre errors that are almost impossible to explain. I live in SW Broward County (basically halfway between downtown Miami & downtown Ft. Lauderdale, ~12 miles west of the Atlantic). Among other things, I've had my phone conclude at various times that I'm:

* Somewhere in the Atlantic ocean between Florida and the Bahamas

* in Belize or Guyana (I don't remember which one...)

* Somewhere in southern Brazil

* in the middle of the desert in New Mexico.

For the record, my phone has never been out of the country, or in any of those locations.

My main point is that Samsung's GPS hardware might suck, but it's unlikely to suck more or differently than HTC's GPS hardware. The good news is that means that almost all of the problems are due to software, which means they can (in theory, at least) be fixed. At least, on rooted phones.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] TravUK:
There is every incentive to fix it. It's business after all. But until Samsung (those actually involved) are aware of the problem, they cant report it to their own engineering team, or the manufacturer, and nobody knows there's an issue to investigate.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] cheetah2k:
No issues here in Australia running JF3 firmware

Locks on to 5-8 satellites within 10 seconds.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Balthazar B:
I'm sorry if I wasn't clear. I was talking about improvements in the HAL to include some of the enhancements described in the GPS thread I referenced, not fixes to the anomalies that seem to plague Samsung's implementation of your company's GPS chip on the SGS. Obviously the latter needs to be remediated, but the improvements would be very nice to have.

As I see it, any incentive to devote the engineering and QA resources to enhance the GPS HAL on Android devices would depend on whether the cost and effort are less than what your company stands to gain. While they may be competing with others in this product space (I confess I'm not familiar with that market), I fail to see much to gain from enhancing product already sold.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Seifer1975:
I was wondering. Could the GPS problem be application related, and not SW or HW related? I know many of us have been using GPS Test to test out the performance. Same for me. But what I noticed is

1. When using GPS Test, it fluctuates very much when locking on to satellites. It can go from 8->2->4->0->6 etc within seconds. I cannot get a consistent lockon for a meaningful period of time.

2. However, when I tried using Ndrive in the same location, I observed that NDrive locks on to 6 satellites for a start (all green) and remains locked on to the 6 throughout. It occasionally fluctates between 6 and 7 but remains locked on to at least 6.

And the truth is that I have been using NDrive for all my navigation needs and have never lost a signal or shown a wrong location before.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] SgtJoe86:
Bro, how much does NDrive cost you? And how long does it takes for your phone to get a good lockon from a cold start?
[Galaxy S I9000 General] yaronkle:
Most GPS Turn By Turn applications work differently then the GPS test.

The GPS test shows the current GPS status.

Most Turn by Turn apps filter out fluctuations in GPS signal.

They also assume that you are still on track and show that there is a signal loss only after a period of no signal.

Most of the time this filtering is better since you don't get distracted but there are cases where they assume your position on track even if you sidetracked.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Beards:
Locking on is one thing but to notice how much your position is running around like a dog chasing the cat you need to run something like My Tracks and set it to record.

Only then will you see just how much your position is marked so wildly inaccurate.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Seifer1975:
NDrive is free. I paid 19.99 euro for the SG map. There is free 7 days trial. Cold start lockon usually within 10-20s.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] JaGuR:
Have to say, that mine seems much better with Skyhook on.

I had god lock of satelites before, but, when I was driving, it was skipping all over the place.

Now that Skyhook is on, it is seems to be like it should be.

And didn't have any problems with it skipping :/
[Galaxy S I9000 General] dakine:
I tried 3 different navigation programs none of wich were reliable, this may be a software issue but the problem is not in the apps. The phone simply lets go of signals lower than 22, thats ok if there are enough sattelites in view but not if it only sees 4 or 5 signals. It seems that it should be very easy to fix.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] sjdean:
Maybe he knows when the driver will actually be released full/final/proper.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Beowulf_pt:
I liked the usage of the term proper. Maybe Samsung/Broadcom should invite Razor1911/Reloaded to code it aha; bet it would be fixed in a week.

I just got back from the store and have this funny comfortable sense of relief.

They first surprised me by refusing to refund me and stated that I could only a) get a new unit instead or b) leave it for "repairs".

Seems the "30 day money back guarantee" stopped applying to phones "last month", unlike what the salesman 2 weeks ago "forgot" to tell me.

But I digress. The interesting point was that I ended up having to talk with 3 guys from the first line of support, who then called the supervisor who then called someone at Samsung Portugal and then talked to his boss (store manager I assume). They were treating me pretty much like the average clueless customer, e.g. "what software did you use for navigation?" or "but what do you mean the GPS does not work?" It sure took a long time to try to explain to them what was going on (especially since at the store they had "never heard of a GPS problem" and the source from Samsung.pt also had no oficial know-how. Oops...should have brought some of those nice jaggy pentagramish MyTracks tracks to prove how pathetic it is.

The thing that saved me was that bit of blog news posted everywhere Friday about Samsung's product manager (Carla Saaverda) mentioning the problem and a theoretical future fix. Ironically I did this by pulling out my fugly non-touchy Nokia E72, googling a bit and then showing the recent news to the manager. Eventually the guy got convinced that I wasn't just making the whole thing up and agreed that another brand new unit or a "repair" would be no solution.

I might buy the SGS again in a distant future, but this time I will want proof that the thing does have a GPS. Perhaps the vapourware fix will come and it will indeed be a matter of drivers/firmware and not poor hardware design.

Case closed for me, adios Samsung and back to Symbian. Good luck for the rest of you....
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Kilack:
Well the fact that the scene uses propers shows they don't get it right the first time either :). Then you get the real propers, the real real propers even real real real propers.

I wonder what we would be up to if samsung used scene lingo.

Anyway I'm a bit more relaxed about the whole gps issue, I of course hope it will be fixed but not going to spend time worrying about it anymore.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Beowulf_pt:
I know what you mean. These days nothing comes out right and you need the fix, the proper, the proper proper, the fix to the proper and so on. But there is a substancial difference... the scene does not charge me 599€, keeping the money while I wait for a fix that might never come. :-)

I need a big LCD for my living room. Was thinking about a Samsung. But being a spiteful, bitter and resentful man I will now just buy Pioneer or Sony instead.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] foxbat121:
Unless the GPS driver in Canadian JH2 is significantly different than the leaked JH2 for Captivate, I seriously doubt Samsung has anything fixed related to GPS. We have been discussing JH2 GPS *fix* since last Thursday. The conclusion is there are still a lot need to be fixed.

Yes, maps are not always accurate and GPS positions are not always right on bullseye. But the issues I personally encountered with JH2 (as well as old firmware) can't be explained by the map error -- a few hundred meters away from the correct position, although not often but frequent enough if you run the actual Google Nav for some time.

That's why Samsung sent out words last week to both North America and Europe that the GPS will be 'optimized' and released in Sept. That's directly from hourse's mouth.

Don't you think if Samsung really has the fix, they will release it TODAY instead of wait until Sept.?
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Beowulf_pt:
They probably want to include the "fix" in the official Froyo release. It might make the logistics a bit easier. Or at least the suc..er, customers will be distracted with the new features/bugs and not notice that the GPS is still an unreliable, schizophrenic piece of buggy coding paired with a faulty antenna design and a rather weak Broadcom chipset.

Yes, I'm speculating. But that was what was so nice about this topic here for months. Lots of speculation, fixes, ideas, reverse-engineering and excitement. It had all the drama and it surely was captivating, it had everything... except a solution.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] brunes:
The GPS in the new Bell firmware is head and shoulders above what it was before, because I have had both.

And it is at least as accurate as my wife's iPhone, because we were comparing driving down the street, and A-GPS is next to useless around here since it is not urban.

These are both facts.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] foxbat121:
Compare to what? JH2 version of Captivate or previous verison of your Bell phone? We knew the JH2 made some fixes as I've already outlined in previous post but still have a long way to go.

And you can't make any judgement on SGS GPS improvement/fixes on the first day of re-flashing the firmware. Give it a few more days.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] foxbat121:
But they are up against a lot of anygry customers who will return the phones back to carriers, eventually back to Samsung's own hands. Here in US, a lot of Vibrant and Captivate customers are about the reach 30-day return period this week.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Fatherboard:
That's why Samsung rather wait 'til next month... the worse thing is that an ETA for European SGS's is still unknown.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] TriC_101:
This is not the JH2 Version that is for the Captivate.. this version of JH2 is for the i9000 there are 2 verson of JH2 one for the captivate and the newest for the i9000.. it was an official release from Samsung not something that was leaked on the forms. and ported over from the captivate to the i9000 I don't know why Samsung named them the same when they are different.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] boomerbubba:
For most U.S. Vibrant customers, if they bought with a two-year contract, that period is only 14 days. When that deadline came, I and many others returned our phones already. (But I am willing to risk, temporarily, using an off-contract phone to see if there really is a fix. If there is, great. If not, I'll sell it at a loss.)
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Fornowagain:
I'll consider myself one of the lucky ones. But the GPS has been fine. I can even get a quick lock inside my two story brick house.

Indoors

h ttp://img405.imageshack.us/img405/8478/snap20100817012121.png

Outside

h ttp://img29.imageshack.us/img29/7589/snap20100817014024.png
[Galaxy S I9000 General] foxbat121:
Because there are basically based on the same build with different carrier customizations.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] foxbat121:
Didn't know T-mo only has 14-day return period.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] AllGamer:
difference

http://xdaforums.com/wiki/index.php?title=Samsung_Galaxy_S/GT-I9000

here

http://xdaforums.com/wiki/index.php?title=Samsung_Galaxy_S/Vibrant_GT-I9000M

it's just radio
[Galaxy S I9000 General] AllGamer:
instead of arguing people should just do the upgrade, and get over with it.

or wait until froyo gets released in about 2 weeks, if all goes as planned
[Galaxy S I9000 General] boomerbubba:
Yes, it does. The only Vibrant customers with 30-day return periods are those who paid full retail price (no new contract or renewal) or who live in California. I think the most common purchase model is the subsidized phone with the low teaser price, coupled with a two-year contract.

(Mind you, we're talking about T-Mobile in the U.S. I have no idea how they do business in Europe.)
[Galaxy S I9000 General] mickeko:
Sorry to burst your bubble here....

Firmware version:

2.1-update1

Baseband version:

I9000XXJM1

Build number:

ECLAIR.XWJM2

This is (supposedly) the version-info from a brand new i9000 sold by 3 (sweden). Assuming it's accurate we can probably assume that (atleast parts of) the theory is wrong.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Beards:
You don't think I know what I am talking about.........and I should check my facts.;)
[Galaxy S I9000 General] andrewluecke:
Optus in Australia has said that they are getting a fix next month.. And they are pure I9000 hardware (not I9000M).
[Galaxy S I9000 General] andrewluecke:
It doesn't eliminate the branch theory.. They may have simply decided the branch was a better choice at the time than trunk. We'll see if the next XX series released is a JH
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Case_:
What goes kind of against this theory, though, is the fact that there are sometimes regional releases with the same code, yet with quite different behavior. Case in point - I9000JPJG8 vs I9000UGJG8. According to this theory, both firmwares should be the same. Yet JPJG8 is (at least in my experience) probably the fastest fw available with no need to apply any lagfix, whereas UGJG8 is quite slow and has terrible lag issues.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Beards:
Latest message received this morning from Clove:-

Mike

Thank you for the email,

We have forwarded your comments onto our Samsung representative and have asked when the GPS fix will be available for Samsung Galaxy S i9000 customers. This will be followed up on and a response will be provided to you as early as possible.

Regards

Sales Team

Clove Technology

TEL: +44 (0)1202 552936

FAX: +44 (0)1202 552937

Email: sales@clove.co.uk

Website: www.clove.co.uk

Blog: blog.clove.co.uk

Unfortunately I can't go into the comments I mentioned here but suffice to say believe me when I say I am taking this fight right to Samsungs front door.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Fatherboard:
I wouldn't count on CLOVE.

They claimed that the last batch of the Galaxy S is "gps-fault-free". as it seems, this batch's running the same "JF3" Firmware.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Tyxerakias:
I think I agree. We all know you love Clove, Mike, and that they have helped you in the past. However I don't think it's up to them, they can only ask Samsung, and Samsung does to them what they do to everyone else, i.e. ignore them.

Last month Samsung promised Clove a 'JF6' firmware inside a week, which never happened. Then they said we don't know anything, we'll let you know.

Clove might be doing their best, but with Samsung apparently that's not good enough.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Beards:
I have absolutely zero pro-interest, control or support for Clove.

The only reason I mention them is because I have known them for 20yrs and they have helped not just myself but countless others when there was a problem.

When the HTC HD2 had a major problem when released with it's lens it was Clove who were at the front in sorting this out.

They continue to challenge companies where others would simply sit back.

Yes, the information I pass on may not always be right or seem incorrect/lacking in detail but there's a lot more going on in the background that you are not aware.

If you are not interested in my news or simply do not think it is of value, no problem.... I'll keep it to myself.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Tyxerakias:
Don't be so touchy, no one said that :)

Maybe you didn't read my comment carefully, I said that Clove is not to blame. You mentioned that they helped you with the HTC HD2. Fine, but HTC obviouly gave a toss when they contacted them...

But Samsung doesn't. Many people from other countries have tried to ask Samsung about the GPS, and they flat out refuse a problem exists, even today, after the worldwide publicity.

Samsung might be great in hardware, but they really need to work on their software and support. HTC is miles ahead. I updated an HTC Desire to Froyo the other day, over the air, the whole thing happened in about 10 minutes, nothing was wiped, nothing was lost, perfect experience.

But everyone knows all this, so I'm not going to elaborate...just look at all the Kies threads...gawd.

Again, we appreciate (at least I do), your efforts through Clove, and all the updates, but I have kinda lost faith that Clove have some magical way of making Samsung listen to them. They are just ignored and misinformed, just like everyone else (e.g. the JF6 thing I mentioned above).

That's all I'm saying.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Fatherboard:
^^

True that. nothing personal against clove or you here.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Beards:
Understood... and yes, sorry if I do seem touchy on this.

It just annoys me when I know someone is trying albeit in vein as it seems and the comments seem lacking in support for that said company.

I do understand what you say and agree with you but I choose to try and accept Clove's problem and instead offer them my continued support.... call it frustration on my part ~ as which we are all feeling.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Beards:
Understood..... Thank you.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] AllGamer:
is good that you noticed that, because the same is true about the USA variant of the JH2 vs. the i9000M version of the JH2 in which it works better on all the known issues, but the USA version of the JH2 have no improvement according to some users feedback.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] dakine:
It's getting more attention: http://www.engadget.com/2010/08/17/samsung-galaxy-s-gps-gate-two-problems-not-one-and-what-to-do/
[Galaxy S I9000 General] sanktnelson:
gotta love all the xyz-gates... bumgate, antennagate, GPS-gate (why not navi-gate actually?).

I didn't think watergate was about water?

Anyway, no such thing as bad publicity. Maybe they'll actually fix it with enough press coverage.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Beards:
Spot on.... Bad Press Publicity is the key word and part what I sent to Samsung via Clove.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] ssj4Gogeta1:
Thank you for your efforts. The GPS issue is really frustrating.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Rizlo:
Ehm... it puts it in August... nothing strange here
[Galaxy S I9000 General] srini09:
Issue fixed for me

Hi,

I had a huge problem in getting my GPS fix on my Galaxy S. I am based out of India btw. And I tried the solution that worked for my previous model, Omnia HD.

In the lbstest mode (*#*#1472365#*#* for those who don't know), I went into Application settings, made the Operation mode into "Standalone" with start mode as "Hot Start "

I have enjoyed an amazing lock in since then. My phone's gps locks in 10-15 seconds flat.

Hoping this is the universal solution for all.

Srini
[Galaxy S I9000 General] AllGamer:
the guys are not complaining about the lock

they are complaining about the accuracy is not down to 1 mm to bullseye :rolleyes:

also about the early releases that had jumping position, where you would be north one sec, then south on the next.

but AFAIK that major issue was corrected already with newer firmwares, however the cloud is still not satisfied.

ohhh well to each their own...
[Galaxy S I9000 General] MoWa22:
You have the potential to become a disciple of Jobs... The GPS problem is NOT fixed, and it's very, very real.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] andrewluecke:
It isn't fixed in JM5, so exactly which firmware?

I'll be happy to confirm.. This is the major issue I'm seeing with the JM5 firmware I tried..
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Bynar010:
You sir are p155ing me off.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] andrewluecke:
Btw, I hope you aren't referring to the I9000M firmware, because the exact reason for changing the model number still hasn't been identified. It might be because whoever rebranded the I9000M wants the flexibility to change the start screen and such later, or they get a special price deal (which affects the warranty or other virtual benefits).

Or, it might be because there are minor changes to the hardware we aren't sure of (such as 850MHZ support). The fact their firmware works might only be because the drivers happen to include support for the I9000 too (because they haven't stripped them). Either way, we shouldn't be mixing up the firmware.

So, is there firmware designed for I9000 which specifically fixes that GPS issue.. I can download it and test it...

He may be right, as the condition he speaks of is quite clearly a software one (with drift whilst sitting around). So I'm willing to give it a try before saying it's wrong, but I need to know exactly which firmware..