yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Galaxy S I9000 General] sjdean:
Ok, but lets look at the facts. This phone was announced in March - so it's already at least four months. That doesn't include the time spent previously on planning and pre-production.

Additionally, the signs are worrying that the only fixes they seem to be providing are ways to smooth out the path. XXJF3 flipped between A-GPS/Cell Towers and regular GPS too often so you would see zig zag lines. XXJG5 would be more intelligent. If you lose GPS signal and it flips you back to Cell Towers and puts you 50m away, it then tries to work to produce a path between last known good position, where it thinks you should be 50 metres away and draws a path. XXJM2 doesn't put you anymore than a couple of feet away from last known good and works with heading and speed to plot a path in the event of a signal loss.

With JM2 therefore, if you lose satellite signal, you'll be pushed off track, off course, you'll see yourself overshoot roads and cut corners as it tries to smooth the path out.

Even with XXJP2, none of the firmware resolves the cause of the issue - the bad GPS signal, they don't allow the phone to use satellites < 20 SnR, they don't use more than 8 satellites in a fix.

Four months, and all they're doing is smoothing out the track, they're not actually fixing the issues with the signal dropping off.

Cya

Simon
[Galaxy S I9000 General] sjdean:
Go get a HTC Desire which will lock onto more satellites, even weaker ones, and give you an accuracy of a about 5 feet, or 2 metres!

Then take a look at these and tell me why they're different. Same car, same journey, same settings, different results:

Good

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=U...52.48542,-1.742063&spn=0.014138,0.045319&z=15

Bad

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=U...=52.48082,-1.761761&spn=0.01414,0.045319&z=15
[Galaxy S I9000 General] igniztion:
Now that is the best example of what we are experiencing with the GPS I've seen posted.

I used my HTC Hero to track my bicycle route to work, and now use the SGS, and can see the same as in the above example.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] nicoloco:
An other example of the track done with the Samsung :

http://www.mapmyrun.com/route/au/surry hills/419128047760917814

It's not that good but I must confess I don't have a lot of references

At then end I had a maximum speed of 74 km/h which is quite good for a runner :D
[Galaxy S I9000 General] geoair:
Never thought it would be so bad...

Wow, that's incredible how the second track is so imprecise, never thought that the GPS issue was that bad.

Must refrain my will to buy a SGS since a 'functional' GPS is mandatory for me.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] salvatordali16:
The samsungservice-twitter is from usa.... So, if they fix the problem - will it also work on european phones? Is it the same hardware?

Thx
[Galaxy S I9000 General] nicoloco:
I guess fix will apply to both ... the question is to know what kind of fix they will do

So patch to get an average gps ( like the smoothing of track described above) or a real fix
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Kilack:
Fingers crossed :).
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Beowulf_pt:
Hmm... all I wish I knew was if it is a software/firmware issue alone or if it involves faulty hardware. I have a chance to buy an SGS today and I can risk it if there is a way to eventually flash it to sanity... but if it is some faulty hardware design.. it might never get significantly better. :confused:
[Galaxy S I9000 General] sjdean:
I think the worse thing, is when the phone says yes, I have a GPS lock and Im accurate to within 16 ft, but the circle in MyTracks is 50 metres off from your actual location.

Hugely worrying, because at this point, it is nothing to do with A-GPS or SUPL or MS Based or Skyhook. This is the interpretation of the GPS signal.

More worryingly than that, is when you look at people who have GPS issues on their Spica or other Samsung phones.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Kilack:
Yeah.... the question on a lot of our minds...

I wish these companies would be more open.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] sjdean:
End of September. If it's not fixed by the end of September, Im selling it and going with a HTC Desire HD or something.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] jmreed97:
Many people have called Samsung tech support (you have to get to a level 3 tech to get any information) and they have been assured it is a software issue not hardware. I've called twice (once for my Captivate and once for my wife's Vibrant) and was told that both times.

As for when a fix will be ready, no answer...
[Galaxy S I9000 General] supercurio:
Perfect analysis !

And perfect example.

I got the same type of results with the "best GPS firmware so far" XXJM2 and walk tests.

GPS on the Spica isn't the reference for sure but it's really better (or less bad) than the SGS GPS performance.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] YellowGTO:
LoL the loop that the Galaxy S made cracked me up.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Beowulf_pt:
I remain skeptical but then again, do not know the device in detail.

Anyone knows of any other Android unit that is also using the same Broadcom BCM476 GPS chipset?

If others are working ok, perhaps it can be a good sign regarding rotten firmware and not hardware design issues.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Beards:
Okay..... I have news from Clove.

It's not the news we wanted to hear but it's not all bad, simply delayed good news.

Mike

We have attempted to update the firmware on a Samsung Galaxy S i9000 using the Keis PC Synchronization software. It has been found that there are currently no firmware updates available for the Samsung Galaxy S i9000. Due to this we have been in further communication with our Samsung representative who has confirmed that the update should have been available and that it resolves the problems associated with the GPS.

The Samsung representative has confirmed that the uploading of the update hasn't been completed and this will be investigated. This unfortunately means that the update has been delayed, with unfortunately no date being provided to us for when it will be available. We will keep in contact with Samsung and inform you immediately when the update is available.

Regards

Sales Team

Clove Technology

TEL: +44 (0)1202 552936

FAX: +44 (0)1202 552937

Email: sales@clove.co.uk

Website: www.clove.co.uk

Blog: blog.clove.co.uk
[Galaxy S I9000 General] jmreed97:
DAMN!!

Thanks for the update Beards! Keep them coming!
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Beowulf_pt:
Seems ZDNet picked up on the topic

Will a software update fix GPS and other issues with the Samsung Vibrant?

By Matthew Miller | July 30, 2010

[..]GPS receiver works quite poorly and the compass is unusable,[..] I was quite surprised with the poor GPS functionality since one of the major features of an Android device is the fantastic free Google Maps Navigation. I get a fix in seconds on the EVO 4G and it is accurate to within a few feet of where I am. The Samsung Vibrant kept placing me a couple blocks away from my actual location. [..]

Seems I can't post links... on zdnet.com go to /blog/cell-phones/will-a-software-update-fix-gps-and-other-issues-with-the-samsung-vibrant/4383

Maybe you owners should go there and shoot some feedback.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Bynar010:
Hi, first of all massively appreciate the effort you are putting in, communicating with clove on this...and I hate to be negative...but...basically we are waiting for a firmware to fix the issue and we still don't know when it will be available...so nothings changed then!!? Sounds to me like Samsung are just giving them the runaround.

I hope I'm proved wrong though, I really do.

Again, thanks for your efforts.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] andrewluecke:
Firstly, they might be doing that because it has a low development cost.

There is another way of looking at it though. Do you believe it's a hardware issue? Because if it was, wouldn't they have stopped manufacturing the phone to prepare another revision? This doesn't seem to be the case. Serious aerial issues would be trivial to diagnose (and would have been caught during QA). Perhaps the chipset they are using is buggy.. According to one site they are using the MSM6290, but that is being used in other phones too.

I'd say it's more likely that they are focusing primarily on getting froyo out. Also, whilst it was announced in may, it started shipping in June. It's entirely possibly they were cleaning up other bugs too after the announcement. Its been 1 month since release I believe, and the lag issues were the more serious problem before (and now they are mostly fixed).

The reality is, we don't know what the cause is, so I wouldn't speculate it's a hardware bug. We DO know though that Froyo was finalised June though, and we do know it uses another kernel and Samsung is working on implementing it. When it comes down to it though, if it is a hardware issue that is being hid under the carpet, it's either chipset, or aerial. And the aerial should be something which can easily be tested. So I think they would have only started manufacturing if they could prove either of those elements weren't to blame. And no, 1 month to fix drivers for a hardware device isn't long. It possibly isn't a simple fix

I agree the GPS issue is urgent yes. But, when it comes to trying to pressure Samsung by flooding them with tech support calls, all that might accomplish is Samsung rushing a patch through which is incomplete or causes other problems (seen it happen so many times in the IT industry, where people under pressure make major mistakes). If it doesn't get fixed after Froyo gets launched, then I think I'll try to return my phone, but honestly, there is no evidence currently whether its software or hardware, so we shouldn't assume either way.

For all we know, Samsung wrote the GPS driver from scratch (I haven't looked at the code btw), and that's why it's still so buggy.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] veper:
I've just noticed a comment from someone at the above mentioned ZDNet article:

I'd say the above makes some sense and applies to GPS + compass.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Kil:
Lol same here.. SGS's Drunken GPS
[Galaxy S I9000 General] enigmameusa:
This post from veper is quite interesting

xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=7418396&postcount=285

Can't post links yet

"Their Wave phone has a similar problem (not even an android phone). Seems all to be connected to the magnetics driver failing, and taking GPS with it.

They've promised a fix in the coming weeks."
[Galaxy S I9000 General] dan 6a:
I am very concerned with something...

Why do some people have brillant GPS or ****ty GPS?

It seems a hardware fault is some phones if this is the case yeah? I mean if people are using the same FW, how can there be such a divide?

Is there are way of checking what gps chips to troubleshoot what is the differences between others who love thier GPS and others like me who are upset every FW release the GPS is not meeting acceptable standards?

Is there a galaxyshelp.com for non US people? :( Would love to chat about no FM stereo with them and GPS :)
[Galaxy S I9000 General] AllGamer:
have anyone that believes they have a GPS problem, tried using another GPS software other than the GPS Test or Google Map to verify if it's an actual problem, or a simple misunderstanding of people using Google Maps.

Google Map in WinMob phones are known to be NOT accurate

heck i always had problem using the GPS mode in Google Maps on my old HTC Athena.

the first thing i did when i got my SGS was to install a decent GPS software like igo8 or copilot8 or many others alike as long as it's not google map
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Will Driessen:
I saw a samsung wave (almost the same hardware but running Bada) having similar problems. If a compass application is started (can’t remember it’s name) it points to the North. As soon the GPS is started the compass freezes. Can someone check if the behavior is the same on the Galaxy S.

This could be related to the magnetics driver. :rolleyes:
[Galaxy S I9000 General] dan 6a:
ive tested nav droid and co pilot

Samsung will replace them if it is deemed faulty hardware yeah? they are happy to give free phones to unhappy iphone4G users they should be happy to help unhappy i9000 users also..
[Galaxy S I9000 General] veper:
As far as I'm concerned, every SGS has GPS/compass problem. It's just that it doesn't show up right away for some people, others don't actually test their GPS extensively, but rather turn it on in front of their houses and that's it, etc.

GPS worked 'OK' on my SGS for a week. Then I noticed it 'works' when I was stationary, but will lose lock when tracking. Somehow enabling Skyhook 'fixed' it for another week (got fast and more or less stable locks) and now I'm back to having problems, ie. GPS will see 8-10 satellites, all with SNR from 20 to 40+, but won't lock to any of them for like 10 minutes. It really seems that there's software issue we're having and 'magnetics driver failing' at least makes some sense...
[Galaxy S I9000 General] sjdean:
Ok.

GPS Test, GPS Status, LBSTestMode, GPS Refresh, MyTracks, Waze, CardioTrainer, SportsTracker. See the tracks I posted earlier.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] sjdean:
Im just browsing through the phone and the source code.

If we do have the BCM20751 chipset, then I was quite surprised when I saw this in jupiter.xml:

which refers to the BCM4751 chipset. Other options for RfType include:

But I couldn't get GL_RF_2075_BRCM to work.

Now at the bottom of that file, we also have:

I've tried changing low_power to false, but I don't think it did anything for me.

One thing I did though, was just to delete /data/gps - that's right, the entire folder.

The following files are there:

I believe that this file gets created on bootup in init.rc:

I also thing the two .sto files are some kind of storage files for almanacs and ephemeris data. As they're stored on the /data area, where I seem to recall this being configured for sequential data access rather than random access, then using one of the lag fixes to move the data area might improve the speed of the GPS.

But deleting the everything under /data/gps allows these files to be recreated, and somehow, I went from having one of the worst GPS positions in MyTracks yesterday, to one of the best today.

SnakeOil Fix(?) Number 67: remove /data/gps

Reasoning: Unknown, perhaps this Ephemeris and Almanac data becomes a bit stale and doesn't refresh properly.

Success of Fix: Needs more testing
[Galaxy S I9000 General] jmreed97:
My compass works fairly well (+/- 5 degrees accuracy). There seems to be no connection between the GPS and compass on my phone (Captivate)
[Galaxy S I9000 General] appelflap:
Aha! No metaphysical speculation but real, down to earth investigation. Thanks for this.

Keep up the good work! Will do some testing tomorrow myself following your pointers.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] veper:
I learned my lesson not to jump into conclusions regarding SGS' GPS, but after deleting the contents of /data/gps on mine, I've got pretty quick lock after reboot, as well as 5m accuracy walking around my house using GPS Test. It will obviously take a lot more testing, especially tracking, but we *might* have something here..
[Galaxy S I9000 General] sjdean:
I fully agree - about the testing. I don't think it's a 100% fix, but it might be a good enough work around for now.

Im doing some testing with jupiter.xml at the moment.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] TravUK:
Do you get a lock from more than 8 sats in GPSTest?
[Galaxy S I9000 General] sjdean:
Haven't been able to achieve any of that. Tried a plethora of settings in jupiter.xml.

We may have a more solid way of resetting the GPS driver by removing the /data/gps directory and rebooting - this should recreate the ephermeris and almanac data files.

A few more tweaks to the jupiter.xml which I'll post tomorrow, may even boost the signal slightly. I went outside and got 8 satellites in the green (well, 30 to 40), but then after removing the changes it was still the same.

But it may be worth a further test, certainly the changes I've made haven't hurt, but it is a big question of whether they help.

So far nothing enables < 20 SnR or seeing more than 8.

Im guessing the sdcard fix might also make things faster, as that's where the almanac and ephemeris store information is.

Cya

Simon
[Galaxy S I9000 General] BA_Flash_GOD:
hah wow...

haha people actually USE GPS?! That's funny stuff! Seriously, why not get a REAL gps unit if you want something that precise?

To buy a CELL PHONE based on gps service just seems dumb, really dumb. Get a REAL GPS unit for like $50 and call it a day? hah enjoy
[Galaxy S I9000 General] MAMBO04:
Dude some people don't want the inconvenience of having a TomTom or whatever as well and they aren't $50 they're about 100+ quid here, what's the point when you get it AIO.

Just want to add in, i used Google Navigation today and i got a GPS lock in 2 seconds, but the accuracy was a bit crap today. So yeah, of course there is a problem but i'm not fully experiencing it YET...
[Galaxy S I9000 General] TravUK:
Ok. So still need an fw update. Im guessing we (Broadcom) didnt allow driver src as part of the samsung code release.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Beowulf_pt:
Interesting detective work Simon. I saw the links you posted on the other forum for the good (5) and bad (12) tracks files.

The good track is impressive, quite precise. I wonder if this is just in itself a good sign regarding the hardware's (chipset, antenna?) ability to perform well. Perhaps the problem is indeed drivers/firmware. Still not enough to make me risk money on a Galaxy S but it sure got my attention back; The second track file resembles something like what I tested today with my Nokia E72's GPS... miserable tracking especially at low speeds... fortunately navi apps snap and hide it most of the time. :p

I hope Samsung and Broadcom are working to sort out that mess soon. That big, fat, sun-proof SAMOLED screen would make it a fine, fine GPS toy...
[Galaxy S I9000 General] nicoloco:
I love you guys :)

Someone shows you 2 track done with the same sotfware on 2 dfifferent device to explain how bad the samsung is and you are suggesting it's a problem of software ??

Very funny ... you made my day

Next time I will do 2 tracks with imapmyrun on both samsgun and iphone3GS and we will see which one is crap ...
[Galaxy S I9000 General] ghosty_uk:
did another car run today with my SGS, using google navi (not yet installed gps test or any other gps test programs), before i set off i did the *#*#147..... test, and mine saw 11 sats and locked 7 within 10 secs. exited that and ran google navi.

i noticed yesterday that althought the test menu pick up quite quickly google navi still take up to 30 secs to actually find me and while driving the position does jump, also the blue circle appears (i prusume it works like in google maps saying that you could be anywhere in that area).

so today i enabled use wireless networks (this is the first time on this new phone i have enabled it at the same time as the gps), well to my suprise google navi locked on in under 10 secs. on driving around it traked me smoothly, with no jumping off the road i was on, no blue circle. it even placed me on the road relitave to the side roads (garmin has a slight lag on that), then again to my suprise i get outside my house and the vioce says arriving at destination on the right and the mode switched to street view, that is the first time i have seen it do that.

so to all you people who are having difficulties (i was one of them, but after only having the phone for a week the shop (phones 4 you) swapped it for me), i would love to know what is differnt about this phone that makes it work. could it be down to a fauly batch, ie phones built it a certain time frame will all have issues, if so how would we find this data out.

also someone refered to a compass, is this a std app (hidden ???), hoew can i find this.

all i can say is for now my gps is working, lets see how long it lasts.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] igniztion:
The previous example was with Desire and SGS, so the software was exactly the same.

I've used CoPilot quite a bit on my SGS and it works most of the time, but quite often it looses fix, or places me in an adjacent street to the one I am actually in for a few seconds.

Just look at how uneven the track is when using a tracking app like MyTracks, SportyPal or imapmyrun and compare that to e.g. a HTC device and you will clearly see that the SGS has serious problems with the GPS.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Kilack:
I still believe every phone has the problem and it is just something that makes the problem surface.

Considering I have had the problem a couple of times on my phone but other times its had almost perfect gps.

All the US variants seem to have gps issues too and different batches of them (people in threads were giving the batch dates of their phones etc)

Still, with the latest talk I am hopeful its now pointing towards driver issues rather than hardware.

Great you have a working one though, did your other one never work at all (accurately) ?
[Galaxy S I9000 General] sjdean:
Actually the tracks that I did, were in the same car, the same stretch of road, the same device, the same firmware, the same settings.

Albeit different days.

So unless there was a freak storm, Im not sure.

But curiously, after deleting my /data/gps directory, I get another track looking like the first.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] Kilack:
You are joking right?
[Galaxy S I9000 General] ghosty_uk:
no mate my other one would never get a lock at all, the olny time it worked was when i used google maps to get my location and that because it was using the moblie network not GPS.

i just find it wierd that some phones are presenting the problem and some arnt, its abit like russian roulette. whos will die next.

as for the "fix" that clove have, even thought mine works now its probably something worth while installing when it is availabe to make sure i dont get the problem in future.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] TravUK:
Simon, Im able to identify myself as a Broadcom employee and can report back what I see here. What I cant do is reveal information that isnt public knowledge or that might interfere with our customers plans.

Im holding on to my phone and waiting for an update like everyone else.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] sjdean:
Coolio.

If you need me to send you any logs, or debugs, lemme know.

Happy to help the cause.

We just need to figure out if this is a bug in the supplied Broadcom GLL driver, or a problem with the Galaxy S firmware.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] larryccf:
curious about the GPS chipset in the various galaxies - some folks here in the US have identfied the chipset in their Captivate (At&t) Galaxy as the broadcom bcm 4751

i think TravUK identified the on in his as the "InControl 20751 or InCrystal 20751"

are the chipsets different from the international models to the US models? has anyone else identified the chipset in their i9000?
[Galaxy S I9000 General] TravUK:
That was a mistake on my part after talking with someone about the x751 which i mistakenly thought to be the integrated chip, the 20751 but has now been revealed as the dedicated 4751.
[Galaxy S I9000 General] larryccf:
appreciate you clearing that up -

in that case, does anyone know if or is the FM capability incorporated in a different chip? and if so, the chip mfgr & model>
[Galaxy S I9000 General] teryz:
I dont know how official is this twitter account but it seems that samsung is working on the issue on the US GS version, hope the fix will be available in Europe as well :

http://twitter.com/Samsungservice/status/19861814931
[Galaxy S I9000 General] esiemi:
thats good news, hope the fix it soon so i can buy it :)
[Galaxy S I9000 General] sjdean:
I have some bad news. The potential fix I mooted with regards to deleting the /data/gps folder may not actually work as we like.

I have more testing to do, but I got really terrible results today:

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=U...4279,-1.846647&spn=0.003761,0.007081&t=h&z=17

This was while out driving. So not good.

Yesterday according to GPS Test, I had 6 satellites virtually directly overhead. So my results may have been a red herring.

More testing tomorrow though.

Given this, I might be tempted to think this is an antenna problem in part.