yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[EVO 4G General] Freelancerx:
well i hate to be the devils advocate guys but... i really doubt that they got people working overtime in shifts to solve this problem lol... i mean from the looks of it its mostly us here at xda that are causing up a stir about this (this is where all the big tech sites are getting their tip from) and from sales accounts its estimated that htc/sprint has sold about 1.5 million evo's. now according to the front page we have about 315 thousand members here, and i want to be optimistic and maybe hope that 10000 of us got an evo. and furthermore id like to say that maybe another 10000 from the other tech android sites... so thats 20000 people who really feel this is an issue, (and thats not even the case for everyone personally i could care less about whether the evo does 60 or 90 or 30 fps as im not trying to run crysis on my phone...its still a waaay better phone than i anything else ive had and i wont be returning it because of this...i suppose if i was obsessed with killing my battery by playing videogames on it all day then i guess id be worried about.) well anyway back to my point, you know us tech guys are the minority....theres probably 1.45 million evo users out there who are perfectly happy with their phones, (the people who are happy dont usually come on forums to give their praise)i know i am one of them....so like i said im sure that if they can fix the issue they will but i wouldn't hold my breath.... so if you really feel that strongly as some people say "deal breaker" you might as well pack it in and return this awesome phone right now....but for me im still very impressed with the phone and its capabilities sure it isnt perfect but no phone is...
[EVO 4G General] Mecha2142:
Yeah, no phone is perfect, but then again, not many other high-end android phones have such ridiculous limits intentionally placed on them by the manufacturer. Why would anyone who purchased this device not care about an issue like this because it's 'good enough'?
[EVO 4G General] MechaWolf:
I just called HTC tech support 30 minutes ago. The representative didn't even know the problem existed. All she told me was that the EVO is suppose to do 60 fps. I told her that I used a third party app to test the frame rate and it's stuck at 30 max, and her response is that they don't support 3rd party apps. I then asked her if HTC have an app that can test FPS and her reply was no, there was no way of doing it. Not even they can do it... At this point, I gave up. I hate HTC.

I also emailed HTC twice and have yet to hear back from them. I emailed spint once and they response with a generic response about not having a solution to this problem and i should check their website in the future for updates....
[EVO 4G General] chim4ira312:
dude im sorry but i totally disagree. i love this phone, i love so many things about it, but there are quirks. quirks its heaviest competitor the iphone4 most likely wont have seeing how polished and aesthetically pleaseing apple keeps their os most of the time. just run the game asphalt 5 on your phone. its horrible. if im suppoesd to compete with the iphone, and the iphone is showing games with great graphics running at great speeds - why can't my phone with the bigger and better specs do the same if not better? the 30fps issue is a big one to me. scrolling, transitions, they all drop from the 30 fps once the phone goes under pressure, and 30 to 20 fps drop is so noticable to me.
[EVO 4G General] EliWay:
That was tier 1 support, you pretty much have to expect that kind of response. I've been told by Sprint that HTC has a ticket open on this issue, and I believe them. The REAL question is when will they release this update? Well,The engineer at HTC (they even told me his name) stated that the quickest way to get this fixed is to gather support and send lots of emails to HTC customer support here. I hope we are all doing that!
[EVO 4G General] timkdodson:
EECB to HTC?

I say we write a well-crafted Executive Email Carpet Bomb about the issues the EVO is having and send it to th executives. Consumerist has a link on how to get ahold of HTC execs, but since I guess I am a "new user" (lurker turned user) I cannot post the link ... (GRRR)
[EVO 4G General] themyst:
My concern is that this issue is really deeply embedded in the OS or perhaps the hardware. If it can't be addressed in the binaries, where would it be addressed?
[EVO 4G General] Aridon:
*It can be addressed*

This issue right now is the kernel needs to be changed and there is difficulty with it booting properly because of some of the revisions. It will get ironed out but the device has been out for a week, we just got nand write access and people's expectations are set way to ****ing high.

(last line not directed at the quoted person.)

Once we get the source things will be much easier. Its coming.
[EVO 4G General] themyst:
Don't worry, I'm not offended :)

I would rely on xda more so than HTC or Sprint for a fix. Hell, most of us were running 2.1 on the Sprint Hero for months before the "official" update came out.

How's this for a bounty though, Let's start a petition for the first person to resolve this issue gets a $1.00 from every user that signs up. That's a fairly large bounty :) I'll be first to pay.
[EVO 4G General] SPENONE:
...and i'll be second!
[EVO 4G General] ChadMichels:
Hehe, ive been lurking for awhile, but I will give 10 dollars to whoever fixes this if its from within Android.
[EVO 4G General] docmalc:
I'll add $10 but it has to be just an apk file cause I'm not rooted nor will i :D
[EVO 4G General] KyleK29:
Just sent HTC a support request for this issue. The more the merrier.
[EVO 4G General] AssassinsLament:
After a few days of this issue, I'm beginning to think that HTC knows they are at fault, and doesn't want to admit to it or fix it. Reasoning... An Android developer has already stated they have always and will always strive for 60fps for Android. And it's true, look at the Droid Incredible, same cpu/gpu, and they're not having this 30fps cap. It can't be sprint because I'm sure they just bought what they thought was a top device. So it has to be HTC, but their quiet take on it alarms me, because for sure they know about it. 30fps is a not a random number, it's a number someone chose as a cap so that no one would really notice. Any lower, and even normal every day users would notice. So HTC being quiet, probably means they'll just brush it off. If they were going to fix it, they would fess up... "Yes, we capped graphics at 30fps because blah blah blah blah, we will work on taking the cap off"

Their reasoning probably is... "we were too cheap to purchase the driver packages from qualcomm, so our developers just developed basic drivers for the EVO. Too bad, so sad."
[EVO 4G General] Pops_G:
Before I got this phone I had the HTC Incredible on Verizon (29 days before I returned it to get this 4.3" screen :D )

Now let me say that the Incredible was great, I had very few complaints about the phone, I just wanted the bigger screen and the smaller monthly bill. That said I did have the expectation that I was getting the exact same phone with a larger screen. On paper that is what a person would expect, same hardware and same company.

Before anyone even put a number of "30fps" on this issue I noticed a difference. It is not huge, but it is there. There is no reason we shouldn't expect a fix for this, and it truly does have a impact on users. Not even choppy scrolling but things like voice search take longer to popup on the EVO than it did on the Incredible.

I am writing an email now to HTC. All we need to do is bug them and things will happen, that is how life works. Go with the flow!
[EVO 4G General] AssassinsLament:
But what I don't understand is... the Droid Incredible is made by HTC also. So what's the reasoning of the 30fps cap?

Darn you HTC!
[EVO 4G General] knives of ice:
well... i had an htc mogul, an htc touch pro, and an htc touch pro2. all of these phones had a TON of problems that were never fixed. i'm not holding my breath on HTC fixing these issues unless sprint finally has their heads out of the sand and force them to.
[EVO 4G General] Dougie2187:
So, I've read through this a few times, and haven't ran across this. But has anyone checked just to be sure that this isn't a bug in fps2d?

Not that I think it is, but it's probably a good idea to check to make sure. Especially since so many people are blowing up at HTC and Sprint over this issue.
[EVO 4G General] bcnice20:
If you watch quadrant when its preforming its test it says the same thing
[EVO 4G General] Mecha2142:
Well, I'd link to think that HTC will fix this problem soon because they're now a major and well known player in the smartphone business. When the Touch Pro and Touch Pro 2 were released, not many people outside of the tech world knew what HTC was. Nobody was lining up in stores for the Touch Pro 2 on launch day. With the Evo, people now recognize the company as a competitor among the likes of Apple. If they don't fix this, people will recognize the company responsible and will refrain from buying their products in the future.
[EVO 4G General] EliWay:
Well said. You should email that to htc to remind them. :p
[EVO 4G General] gman8966:
I sent HTC, sprintcare and Dan Hesse's office all a long email two days ago about these issues. Haven't heard anything back from any of them except an automated response from Dan's office.
[EVO 4G General] itmustbejj:
Not sure how pertinent this is, but I was digging through the build.prop file on /system for something completely unrelated and saw this:

#

# This file describes the media capabilities and profiles

# using system properties.

#

# Note: The property key and value has some length

# limit as defined by PROPERTY_KEY_MAX and

# PROPERTY_VALUE_MAX, respectively

#

# WARNING: We may not use system properties for specifying

# media capabilities and profiles in the future

#

ro.media.enc.file.format = 3gp,mp4

ro.media.enc.vid.codec = m4v,h263

ro.media.enc.vid.h263.width = 176,1280

ro.media.enc.vid.h263.height = 144,720

ro.media.enc.vid.h263.bps = 64000,8000000

ro.media.enc.vid.h263.fps = 1,30

ro.media.enc.vid.m4v.width = 176,1280

ro.media.enc.vid.m4v.height = 144,720

ro.media.enc.vid.m4v.bps = 64000,8000000

ro.media.enc.vid.m4v.fps = 1,30

Edit: Looking at this some more, this probably has to do with video encoding as opposed to decoding. So this is likely a red herring. But still, I'll let someone smarter than me comment on that.
[EVO 4G General] samfreese:
Got a response

I emailed them last Friday, and got a response today(albeit not much of one). I'll keep updating as things go along.

Me: Why is my HTC EVO capped at 30 frames per second?

HTC: Hi, I’m Joe, and I will be glad to assist you today. Thank you for your concern about your Evo. However, the phone was designed to run at 30fps.

Me: I think it seems to be capped, considering I had an HTC Hero(I'm a long time HTC user) and in multiple Android applications, it clocked faster than my Evo. I wouldn't think it was just designed to run at 30fps. I'd like to know why there was a cap implemented.
[EVO 4G General] Mecha2142:
You can't really trust the answers you get from HTC Support. They're probably given a list of responses to questions like that.
[EVO 4G General] Dougie2187:
If you're unhappy about it you could always flood their customer support satisfaction survey that's on their site. Just submit it a couple hundred times about how dissatisfied you are with their service and response. Maybe it will get elevated quickly.
[EVO 4G General] Minjin:
Or maybe they'll start ignoring this complaint completely because it would appear to all be coming from a few bad customers.
[EVO 4G General] asrebel:
HTC Support Official Response fo 30fps (As designed!)

Normally I wouldn't want to start another thread for this issue, but the other thread is getting very crowded with random tangents.

I thought this thread would be a good chance to place official responses to this issue.

Here's what I just received for HTC support.

"Hi Tony, My name is Sara and I will be assisting you today. I understand that you have concerns about the EVO 4G with Sprint running 30 FPS. This is actually how the phone was designed to work. This was a decision made to enhance overall performance of the device, and also to enhance battery life. This may be further enhanced in a future update, but at this time I can neither confirm nor deny this. Thank you for interest in HTC products! I would like to take this opportunity to encourage you to take our Customer Service Satisfaction Survey. This lets my boss know how I’m doing, and also helps us improve your Customer Service experience. I look forward to hearing your feedback about our interaction!"

I'm flabbergasted.
[EVO 4G General] oOflyeyesOo:
That is ****ing stupid!!! I hope someone figures out how to fix this crap!
[EVO 4G General] lenderachu:
That's a bit disappointing! Hope our wonderful developers fix, modify or otherwise circumvent this cap and increase it in the future. I don't game at all on my phone but would still like to unlimit my device. Still not happy about HTCs decision to cap fps. :'(
[EVO 4G General] MOBGangsta184:
Ehh sounds like a canned response. Rumor has it that the Nexus one has been suffering similar issues after some OTA update that was released.
[EVO 4G General] themyst:
Sara needs to be slapped silly for making such an outlandish comment.

HTC needs to release the damn source or make it an option for us people who don't give two ****s about "battery life" if it is as prevalent as they think it is.

I sincerely hope she was just giving you the runaround.
[EVO 4G General] asrebel:
Oh I agree it's definitely a canned response, but it does say volumes. I for one, find it very interesting HTC acknowledges the issue and takes responsibility for it (and then calls it by design).

I mean it's somewhat understandable after Google developers basically out'd them by saying Android will support 60fps, but still very very interesting.
[EVO 4G General] asrebel:
I completely agree that the issue needs resolved (or that we need to have an option to remove the limit).

However, I don't think she was giving me the runaround. Her response sounds far too much like an official comment to be generated by someone from 1st level tech support or customer support. Their runaround response is usually to either reset the device, blame the carrier, or get a replacement device ;)
[EVO 4G General] frifox:
I say, worry about fixing that touch input lag and THEN worry about 30 fps cap... its like taking care of your 1,000ms latency BEFORE you uncap your 20Mbit cable internet.

PS: i see that lag in just about everything on the Evo. Touch input, buttons (but not those 4 soft keys on the bottom), scrolling, etc... makes Evo feel as if its seriously underpowered, even though spec-wise its a beast.
[EVO 4G General] ukcatsfan:
got the same exact message back from Sara today after i told them it was disappointing.
[EVO 4G General] toastcfh:
its sad but its also same reason they under clock the devices and such. its just htc trying to get a little more battery or a little more stability. i suspect things will change for froyo.
[EVO 4G General] Mecha2142:
Even if they somehow manage to not lose a ton of sales over this issue if it isn't fixed, they have NO choice but to release an update to fix the touch sensor lag.

I mean, there's no way HTC could possibly claim they made the touch input lag behind as well 'in order to preserve battery'. Not when its this severe: [YOUTUBE]5j7cYb7EtUM[/YOUTUBE]
[EVO 4G General] chim4ira312:
mad gay. just got the same email sent to me says the same exact things.

bs. returning evo.
[EVO 4G General] toastcfh:
well the touch input could be the result of the mods htc made to the driver they are using. on the heroC htc made some serious mods to the touch driver just for htc_ime (keyboard) to respond to multible touches better. the result of there driver modding ended up breaking touch all together in AOSP builds and touch a little funny all together. but htc_ime worked like a champ :rolleyes:. the code was so worked into the kernel and the htc builds that when i reversed there changes and use like a nexus input setup i ended up with a gang load of other issues.

that said i guess i went a little off topic sorry. but i was just giving some context to what i have to say and thats... htc most likely did the same things to the EVO (i hope not). but knowing the way htc likes to code and do things, i wont be surprised
[EVO 4G General] Mecha2142:
Whatever HTC did, I certainly hope they fix it. If a first-generation iPhone can play table tennis on it just fine, why shouldn't a phone three years newer than it be able to do so as well? I suppose this is one disadvantage of trusting a faceless company.
[EVO 4G General] bobdude5:
im really started to despise htc..i hopee the iphone 4 gets an android port like the 3g
[EVO 4G General] DaytonaZ33:
This is the nail in the coffin. I could overlook the improper grounding on the touchscreen, the screen separation issue, the weak wifi, as these would likely be fixed by improving the manufacturing process and would be covered under the manufacturer's warranty.

But to say that a phone running at basically half speed is working as intended is just too much. Evo goes back. Depressing day.
[EVO 4G General] Mecha2142:
Make sure to tell them exactly why you're returning the phone. The sight of people returning these phones because of this exact reason should be more than enough to get them to convince HTC to release an update.
[EVO 4G General] toastcfh:
well its not just htc. its every device maker. each device is different, along with each UI the device makers come up with. they obviously wanna make the device work its best with their software. they arent worried about us tweaking and modding the thing to our hearts content. were the minority and the enemy.
[EVO 4G General] mrono:
I really dont think HTC gives a crap about our problems, we already bought the phones, it's not like fixing it is really going to get them anymore money. They have already moved on to their next phone design.
[EVO 4G General] Samzebian:
This is total bs, I just got the same email from 'Sara' and I'm seriously considering returning my Evo. This is just utter bullcrap from HTC, the same crap they did to us when I bought an AT&T Tilt, I will never trust HTC again!
[EVO 4G General] denny_1986:
im sure they already have the fix for it otherwise how would they have "optimized" something if they didn't even have the "uncapped/unoptimized" version? My guess is that uncapping the 30fps limit completely destroys the battery life to the point where you cant classify this device as a daily usage phone.
[EVO 4G General] Mecha2142:
I don't know; them not fixing it can result in them losing quite a bit of money if we get enough people riled up about this.
[EVO 4G General] AshMa:
Wondering if someone here does figure out a fix, will the battery drain increase as HTC hinted at. So we get 60fps but at what cost to battery life that we already need more of. HTC seems to have some issues but they do make clean, nice looking devices unlike most of the others; Moto and Samsung designs are not the best in my little opinion.
[EVO 4G General] mrono:
If that's the truth then they REALLY did a bad job with this phone. Look at the N1, it's got 1ghz, 720p video, 60 FPS, etc.
[EVO 4G General] Mecha2142:
Agreed. The Droid Incredible is also the exact same device as the Evo with the exception of a smaller screen and a 4G radio. That radio doesn't even use power when its not in use, and the Evo has a larger battery than the Incredible and Nexus One, so there shouldn't be a huge difference in battery life.

It seems as if HTC is just grasping for reasons to impose this limit on the consumers.
[EVO 4G General] timothydonohue:
actually, given that the screen is an lcd, not led, it requires a backlight, and it has to cover more real estate, given the screen size. that's where your battery is going most of the time, i'll wager. screen off i get oodles of time. screen on? bye bye juice.

the OLED was probably more expensive, and given the complaints people were making about the nexus (can't see in daylight kind of thing) they probably just made an executive decision.

and, given that this thing is having to push sense along, that's going to drag more than stock android. so, if they didn't cut down the fps, you guys would probably be complaining about how much slower the phone is than the nexus.

believe me, in the nexus forums they were complaining about the advantages this phone has, before it even came out. it's like nobody will ever be satisfied with what they have.

does your phone make phone calls? congratulations. it's a phone. sorry it doesn't give out happy times and bring you beer too. it's just a phone, lol.
[EVO 4G General] AssassinsLament:
If this is true, then can someone check the differences before and after OTA files, and see what's changed? Maybe that can help us find a solution to our issue.

I'm really dissapointed in HTC... but I like this phone and the carrier's data plan too much.

What to do? :(
[EVO 4G General] mrono:
IMO that's the difference between a smartphone and a stupid flip phone. I use my phone as a phone VERY little, but I use it as a mini computer constantly.
[EVO 4G General] toastcfh:
i seriously doubt it. they want the devices as awesome as possible and as stable as possible. they dont wanna put out devices that are surpassed by previous devices or else why would someone move up. there goals arent to make the device suck for sure. they have their reasons and im sure we will see them also once we have source
[EVO 4G General] AssassinsLament:
toast, hoping/assuming that it's not a hardware cap, will the source have everything we need to change the cap? Give us some scenarios so it'll give us more hope.
[EVO 4G General] notown775:
effin sig material right there!!! LMAONADE
[EVO 4G General] Mecha2142:
Oh yeah. You know, it's just a phone. A phone you're paying 200 dollars for along with an $80/month plan for two years, but it's just a phone. We should be happy that it can make calls.

I'm assuming there's a reason phone manufacturers added the word 'smart' to it.
[EVO 4G General] psn1819:
I agree with that...i just wish they would have given a more thorough reason for the capping. it feels like they are saying"tough titty" lol..but i still agree.because it would be a mess to find out that uncapping it would cause worser bsttery life or even worse effect the phone's usability
[EVO 4G General] themyst:
Absolute bull****. Some of you who received a reply from HTC should state that the Nexus One which runs on nearly identical hardware was running at the full 60fps without issue until a recent OTA update "crippled" that device to a 30fps cap as well. We need to scare HTC into another class action lawsuit.

I'm sure the gurus on xda will figure out the source of this problem since they have full read/write access to system, but HTC should get on the ball and "leak" the source so that we can at least figure out the technical aspect of "why".
[EVO 4G General] mrono:
the what?

10char
[EVO 4G General] netarchy:
Somehow I get the feeling that as a public face HTC is saying "working as intended" while behind the scenes they're scrambling to find out where they messed up.

Of course, that could just be the optimist in me. :D
[EVO 4G General] xavier1022:
Slogan

That should be their new slongan instead of the

"Quietly Brilliant"

"Working as Intended"
[EVO 4G General] AssassinsLament:
Trust me, it is intended. You don't get a nice number like 30fps, if it's not intended. 30fps is the the least they can go down without making the phone laughable. They think no one will/would notice.
[EVO 4G General] bendotson:
I'm glad I returned mine today... I had the screen issue and the Sprint store manager tried to tell me that it was normal on capacitive touch screens. Idiot!