yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[EVO 4G General] asrebel:
Are we sure of that? In the dev section there is a comment saying "the hero's LCD panel uses MDDI as well and has no issues."
[EVO 4G General] eagle63:
Hey guys, I hate to post another, "I just called HTC and here's what they told ME!", but I'm going to anyway because I think there is a couple of worthwhile takeaways. Talked to a guy named Reggie who by all accounts seemed educated, well-spoken, etc. Before I had my first sentence out, he said, "let me guess, you're calling about the 30fps issue?" We discussed for a while, and I told him my concerns about this potentially being a hardware limitation (as others have been told by HTC), and he said that the current "official" response from HTC is that this was an intentional decision done to preserve battery life, and that it is software-based. He also mentioned the "... there may be 3rd party solutions to remove this 30fps limitation..." bit that others have heard.

I had him repeat it a couple of times, and he said that this memo came yesterday - it's dated 6/21/2010 and it is HTC's official response on the matter. He also made an offhand comment that I should call back in a week because things are changing weekly on this issue due to the feedback they're getting.

So there's no proof of anything here, but I think there are 2 interesting nuggets that are worthy of a little optimism:

1. His information seemed official, and is recent. (1 day old) There was no talk of any hardware limitations.

2. Clearly they're getting lots of questions on this topic and are well aware of customers' frustrations. It's important that we stay in their ear about this.
[EVO 4G General] schnozberry:
It's worth noting that Input Benchmark peaks at 34hz for the touch benchmark in on my EVO. If it was a true MDDI limitation, that would be theoretically impossible. I think the most plausible explanation is that this has something to do with the HDMI output. It's the only outlier between this and other Snapdragon powered Android Phones.
[EVO 4G General] asrebel:
What concerns me is that information seems to be the initial HTC response. The new response is that it's a hardware issue. I pressed HTC on the difference responses and got this:

"...this is a hardware limitation designed to improve overall performance of the device, with specific concerns to certain features. I can definitely understand that you are disappointed, as you did not expect this. Unfortunately, I do not have any more information than that. I can assure you that this is not something that can be changed with software updates or hotfixes."

I hope you are right, but since Richard's response is the same initial response I'm a little skeptical. I agree it's important we "stay in their ear about this issue". Could you share the contact number you used?
[EVO 4G General] Aridon:
Not true. The hero gets more than 30 fps and uses mddi.

Also, if you contact intel and ask then what the hardware limits are they are going to quote you the stock chip speed. We all know that can be modified though. I'd place good odds this will get fixed. If you can't wait for the source then return it. Hopefully your new device will be rooted before next year.
[EVO 4G General] EtherealRemnant:
Nobody knows exactly how accurate that program is.

I hope that I'm wrong but from experience with HTC in the past, I'm not terribly hopeful.
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
Input clock is not the same as the display clock. They are two separate panels.

Where are you getting this info? MDDI is capable of 60hz.
[EVO 4G General] CentroniX:
Just to add more uncertainty to the whole issue, here's a new response from my corporate Sprint rep that I hadn't seen in the last 108 pages....
[EVO 4G General] eagle63:
I don't have the number handy right now, but I pulled it right from their website. (under the support tab)
[EVO 4G General] AdamLJ:
I just called Sprint and the customer support rep said he's Santa Claus. I could hardly believe it. Oh wait, you can't believe anything they say. :D
[EVO 4G General] asrebel:
...but maybe he is. Everyone is switching to Sprint now. j/k

It's too bad HTC didn't stick with their initial story that it was for battery reasons and they might release a software update to fix it.

Ahhhh...I miss those days.

Now the question is who is more inaccurate on this issue. First/second tier HTC support or Sprint? ;-)
[EVO 4G General] eagle63:
It's hard to believe that anyone could be more inaccurate than Sprint. I'd guess that a magic 8-ball would be more clued-in.
[EVO 4G General] kurtwoodfin:
Watching the Dev Thread on the 30 fps cap

I don't know if anyone else is following the development thread about the 30 fps cap. It is amazing to watch them work an issue. I don't want to jump to early conclusions, but there is some indication the cap may be broken. Keep your eye on the thread and your fingers crossed.

Kurt
[EVO 4G General] EliWay:
I also don't want to jump into conclusions but....

IT SEEMS LIKE TOAST BROKE THE CAP!!!!!!!

YES! YOU READ THAT RIGHT.

[size=+2] TOAST BROKE THE 30FPS CAP!!!!!!!!!!!!!! [/size]

WOHOOOOOO!!!! TOAST FTMFW!!!!!!!!!!!

Follow it here

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=704889
[EVO 4G General] chim4ira312:
yup its true, he did :P

now lets see this ready for release :D
[EVO 4G General] Jykinturah:
Cap is broken for hardware 003 devices. 002 is still capped.
[EVO 4G General] EliWay:
I just flashed it. Indeed works like a charm... And to make it even better......

[size=+2] THE TOUCH INPUT LAG IS GONE TOO! [/size]

002 owners, dont fret.. this proves it's not a hardware problem.

Will update the first post as more info becomes available.
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
Please take a video of Multitouch Visualizer. I want to see this.
[EVO 4G General] Jykinturah:
I'm fretting. What if HTC said they couldn't fix it because 002 revisions are hardware capped? I am fretting pretty intensely right now...
[EVO 4G General] jerryparid:
If HDMI doesn't work after this, screw HDMI out. :p
[EVO 4G General] starplaya93:
callllm down...99.99% chance it will be fixed for 002 in a matter of hours...possibly a day...

The devs here are beyond remarkable. Their wouldn't be a hardware cap on the 002 and not the 003's...just doesn't make sense.
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
I flashed the godmode zip and I'm still getting avg 29fps but there are a TON more spikes above 30fps than there used to be.

I have 0002.
[EVO 4G General] Jykinturah:
I have faith in the devs. All the badassery that they have dished out so far is deserving in religious respect.

I am refreshing like 4 pages madly though... heh.
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
What I'm wondering is why the touch input lag is almost nonexistent on the 0003 as well. They have the same Atmel panel as the 0002.
[EVO 4G General] abrigham:
I agree. The devs here are amazing and I'm constantly surprised and pleased with what they are able to do. I have a feeling that HTC's newer position of saying it's "hardware based" just means the cap is in the driver. A lot of people tend to group the physical hardware and the drivers under the category of "hardware" even though drivers are software.
[EVO 4G General] d.cooper:
Hay Guys

So what i miss?
[EVO 4G General] Freelancerx:
lol i wonder how many people are going to shut up now and patiently wait lol....
[EVO 4G General] Beejis:
I hope they can find a fix for 002 or else I'll find something wrong with my phone, hahaha.
[EVO 4G General] Freelancerx:
the funny thing is once they fix this people will still complain... lol probably say "yeah its smooth but..."
[EVO 4G General] sfox8:
haha +1 for this.

But yeah, see, everything worked out in the end. People just need to learn to be optimistic for once. Everyone was getting ready to return this and burn HTC at the stake and the device hadn't even been out for a month yet! I'm beginning to think the xda developers just can't fail! Amazing work guys!

Someone should notify HTC once this is stable and see what their smart*** responses are this time.
[EVO 4G General] geyes30:
Can someone with an epson panel post his/her "somefile.txt" after using "adb shell dmesg > somefile.txt" command? Maybe we can glean some info about the sequence of events that occurs when we switch off the panel (which results in high framerates). The dmesg may potentially contain probe sequence of the devices in the same way that the phone does during normal operation. Perhaps there is something different about the way the epson panel handles these events.

PS: Pardon a noob, but I am getting more interested in solving this issue with every passing hour. :D
[EVO 4G General] nestersan:
XDA devs do not work for or are paid by HTC (As far as I know). We didn't pay monkey money for the phone, and it should not take a bunch of uber-boffins to do the work that the company rolling around in the cash from the phone sales should have done in the first place.
[EVO 4G General] drbadass:
you and just about everybody else in that boat, lol.

Sidenote, I wonder how much it would cost to order the Epson panel and just hand-replace it if you really got in dire straits..
[EVO 4G General] midri:
HTC EVO 003 with EPSON display

To big to host here: codepad.org/J1JJR9Qn (I can't post links, not verified yet)
[EVO 4G General] geyes30:
Noticed something called perflock_notifier_call in the epson kernel log, that is missing in my novatec one. Can anyone enlighten us on what this call is? I only have one epson and one novatec log file, so it might be application specific.

Update: I found another kernel log online for epson, and it also has the perflock_notifier_call
[EVO 4G General] toastcfh:
Perflock is actually short for performance lock. It's CPU related and is enabled on all stock kernels from HTC. Basically it gives min and max freq for the CPU in different circumstances. Like screen on, screen off, and boot time CPU freqs. Its suppose to help with battery life and such. On older devices its good for ramping up CPU freq upon screen on, to minimize delays and issues due to poor CPU freq code. On our devices its more for assuring CPU freqs to better battery life and such
[EVO 4G General] geyes30:
That's what I thought. Funny thing for me is (I have a 003 novatec) the perflock is nowhere to be found (I have 5 different kernel logs now from my device). Could this be contributing, in any way, to incompatibilities with the 30fps cap-breaking ROM?
[EVO 4G General] luisrcastillo:
Weird. I have 003 and Novatec and I see the perflock from the log: perflock_notifier_call: cpufreq recover policy 245000 998400
[EVO 4G General] geyes30:
Oh well..! Wish it weren't so!
[EVO 4G General] ibegriot:
I have hardware version 002 with the nova screen :mad: . I'm extremely disappointed and I guess I will have to return my Evo as well.
[EVO 4G General] Estimated Prophet:
Patience, my friend. It only works with the epson screen because toast has an epson screen. Just give it some time and there will be a kernel for you too.
[EVO 4G General] sfox8:
You need to be patient. The fix was only discovered late last night. It hasn't even been a day yet. People have day jobs and whatnot.
[EVO 4G General] kennyc1:
This is great news!
[EVO 4G General] madunix:
i don't understand... what's the difference between the 0002 and the 0003 hardware?? also... this phone has been out for only almost 1 month... how come they released the same phone with different hardware installed? i hope this isn't a silly question.
[EVO 4G General] asrebel:
Well the 02 & 03 hardware are usually (but not always) a different LCD panel. It happens all the time with all products (even when I bought a specific model Samsung monitor...the panels were different depending on the manufacturing date...it's a very, very common practice). Most 02's have Nova, and most 03's have Epson. They will make the "fix" work with the Nova panel...just give it a little time

FYI: I have an 03 rev, but I do have the Nova panel.
[EVO 4G General] RickBaller:
Where is this "fix"?
[EVO 4G General] asrebel:
If you have an 03 with an Epson panel you can go here: http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=704889&page=52

You need root x 2, fresh or damage ROM, and then the kernel they specify. It's my understanding that the new kernel disables your camera use.

It should be noted this is just a proof of concept. It's definitely not the final solution.
[EVO 4G General] RickBaller:
Thanks. I'll hold off for now until the fix becomes stable.
[EVO 4G General] madunix:
ty very much. i will remain patient... i wish more ppl here would too... i'm not even a dev n it's annoying reading how many ppl are just soo impatient... it's sad that ppl are that immature to just get the hint.
[EVO 4G General] asrebel:
+1

I think people should just be ecstatic that the 30fps barrier has been broken (especially after HTC said it was a hardware issue).

I feel like now that the 30fps has been broken and the lag seems to be resolved that this is the device I've wanted all along. I can wait for optimized code now that the proof of concept is there.
[EVO 4G General] jephyb:
I have an 02 model with the Nova screen and I love my Evo. :)
[EVO 4G General] RickBaller:
Does the fix break HDMI?
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
Looking at the code, it appears HDMI will still function.
[EVO 4G General] eagle63:
As someone who is interested in buying the Evo, but has been holding off to see the outcome of this 30fps thing, I have a question: Where does it indicate the 002 or 003 hardware rev? Is that in the settings somewhere, or is it labeled on the device/box? I found a thread on PPC geeks which explains how to determine if you have the Epson or Novatec screen, but it didn't mention where you find the hardware rev.

The reason I ask is because I'd love to know before I purchase the Evo at Best Buy if it's a 002 or 003 model. If I buy an 003, but it turns out that I have the Novatec screen, then I guess I'll return it and try again.
[EVO 4G General] muncheroo:
holy **** please do a search or read the entire thread
[EVO 4G General] SPENONE:
The fix will be available for BOTH SCREENS. Why would you return it?

Also...let's say you do get an 003 with epson screen, and then you fix FPS issue...........YOUR STILL NOT GOING TO HAVE A CAMERA AND OTHER THINGS because none of that is working at the moment with the rom's.

patience people, PATIENCE
[EVO 4G General] Xyber3364:
Awsome CAP is broken, Thumbs Up to ALL ;-)
[EVO 4G General] vinscuzzy:
I'm absolutely willing to be patient, but I just wish we had a more definitive answer that there WILL be a fix for the nova screens. I've ready every post here, and in the other thread. I've read a lot of people saying there will be a fix, but not from the brilliant people who actually fixed it. I even remember about 20 pages back someone saying until we get "something" from this obscure nova screen, we may be **** outta luck. Again, I do have faith, just getting a bit worried with the 4th being right around the corner....

Edit: Found the post I was talking about:
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
Yeah I've been trying to find documentation on the Novatec but it's almost like the company doesn't ****ing exist. Very frustrating.

I doubt the problem is in the init, and there is MUCH more difference between the code for the panels than just the init commands. I've been trying to use as much of my time as I can to figure out the processes involved with the LCD display and framebuffers, but I've been working overtime at my real job and have too much **** to do when I get home. I'm also trying to learn how to compile kernels so I can actually USE my code. :p
[EVO 4G General] vinscuzzy:
Awesome man! Its great to hear from someone who is actually working on it, rather than speculating(like Im one to talk!). But any way, someone else posted this a few pages back, not sure if its any help.......

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:LCNDXOrbmEwJ:www.htc-linux.org/wiki/index.php%3Ftitle%3DTopaz_LCDModule+htc+novatek&cd=4&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=firefox-a

P.S. Id love to give credit to who actually found this, but I cant find the post. I just pulled this from my browser history.....
[EVO 4G General] jjlee:
straight from toast himself... you guys who are freaking out and saying that you have searched obviously have not, and have been just reading the last few posts in each thread.

omg should we have returned all our phones with the epson panels when it was having trouble!?!??! /sarcasm
[EVO 4G General] eagle63:
First of all, I'm not freaking out or being impatient. If you had read my post, you would have seen that I don't actually own an EVO yet. That said, it seems sensible that if I'm about to buy one, I might as well do what I can do to put myself in the best position for fixing the 30fps problem - whether that fix is a custom ROM or whether it eventually comes from HTC. I'm not about to apply the current fix on a brand new device. I'm looking at this from a future-perspective. Since we know the Epson screen is fixable, I might as well try and get ahold of one of those right? I'm sure the devs will fix the Nova screen too, but again, if I'm about to go buy an Evo tonight I might as well attempt to get one that I KNOW is fixable (based on today's knowledge) right?
[EVO 4G General] vinscuzzy:
Awesome! I stand corrected. Guess I need to be following the kernel thread as well! You did notice in that post toast did say "possibly". It's ok, I still have faith!
[EVO 4G General] KyleK29:
For what it is worth, I think people are being too sensitive. I didn't see your post as anything but a question on what you should look for to avoid a certain device (Novatec) when you're going to make your purchase. Hell, I'd prefer an Epson simply because I know who Epson is. ;)

I don't have the info, or I'd be glad to answer your q.
[EVO 4G General] Grims:
For those who have applied the ROM to break the 30FPS limit, are you sure you are actually getting more than 30 FPS? Or is the GPU simply outputting more than 30FPS and hitting the 30hrz refresh rate on the screen which could be why there is so much screen tearing.
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
Judging from the videos I saw on youtube from a member here, it seems to truly be 60Hz refresh rate. The tearing is probably sync issues.
[EVO 4G General] clubtech:
Question:

Is the graphic stuttering in various games (even not the most complex ones) related to the fps cap or is this something else we need to look at?

For example, the game "drop" is stuttering on the evo while on the n1 it is butter smooth.

The game have extremely low end graphics. I actually noticed this issue on all games i tried to run on the evo.
[EVO 4G General] donatom3:
If the refresh rate was 30hz and not 60hz you'd pretty much be having constant tearing since it's above the 30hz refresh rate all the time. I only get screen tearing in games when the game exceeds my monitors refresh rate of 60hz, so that's the same case here.
[EVO 4G General] AssassinsLament:
I think since we figured out that we could uncap the 30fps on epson lcd's, doesn't it make sense that if we're not able to fix it software-wise eventually (because of a 30hz lcd or something), then the fix would be as easy as replacing the lcd?

Just speculating for those of us who are contemplating returning it or exchanging it.
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
Of course, you could do this, but it's expensive. High res small LCD panels are not cheap.
[EVO 4G General] AssassinsLament:
Just looking for ways/reasons to keep the EVO... ha ha.
[EVO 4G General] muncheroo:
someone over in the dev forums claims he actually managed to do this today
[EVO 4G General] shadowhawk2020:
Well I have a 003 Nova, don't mind waiting for a fix, I just hope we can get a fix and the cameras working :)

Thanks to all working on this in their spare time.
[EVO 4G General] sweteg:
It's hilarious since if this happened on the Nova instead of the Epson, you guys would be *****ing the other way.
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
Yeah but it would be less people *****ing. lol
[EVO 4G General] engagedtosmile:
It is now obvious that it is a software limit which means it can be fixed. The screen type doesn't matter, that is just what type toast has so therefor that one was first. Yesterday the big issue was the 30FPS cap, today is the screen type. Haters gonna hate.
[EVO 4G General] muncheroo:
i just thought up a crazy conspiracy theory

maybe the 30fps cap was placed because high frame rates cause vsync issues with the epson lcd's due to its hardware limitations?

i guess we'll know when we uncap the novatecs. wouldn't that be an ironic twist...
[EVO 4G General] JTOLOGY:
30fps fix

Anyone know if there is another thread on this issue from Toast? I can't seem to find any and the one link that was referenced in here by a few people seems invalid now. I'd like to follow up on this issue more closely (no offense.. but this thread seems to have more gossip, rants and questions than actual updates on the how the fix is going).
[EVO 4G General] engagedtosmile:
Seems like the research thread was closed because of people whining.
[EVO 4G General] SPENONE:
Am i the only one happy for that?....lol
[EVO 4G General] MadHatter01:
Well we need a thread to read updates for us Novatec people. I agree that the thread kinda got off topic, with people posting what screens they have. Also saying that they are taking their phones back if its not fixed. You have to give them time to fix the issue.
[EVO 4G General] SPENONE:
Well since this ones not closed i am sure they will let us know in here.
[EVO 4G General] ttieder:
Is there any video or any way to show the difference with cap on and the cap off I want to see the difference
[EVO 4G General] asrebel:
Well there's the benchmark. You can see the youtube videos linked through this engadget article: http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/23/evo-4g-loses-30fps-limit-thanks-to-devoted-community-video/
[EVO 4G General] ttieder:
I have seen that I mean performance of the phone with the cap on at 30 fps and when the cap is of at 54 fps what are the difference and is. There a video to see it I don't mean test I. Mean performance
[EVO 4G General] apollooff320:
yeah I want to see a real world performance also. I didn't buy my phone to run test.
[EVO 4G General] asrebel:
Well a lot of people have tested various emulators and stuff without the cap, but I don't know if it's been video taped. I guess you could make a video request for what you would like to see without the cap (aka, emulators, specific apps, just navigating menus, etc.).
[EVO 4G General] gammons:
I'm lucky enough to have an epson screen, so I decided to give fresh 0.3 and toast's special kernel a shot.

My thoughts:

- Feels ridiculously faster and more responsive. Feels like a phone that is 2x as fast. Screen transitions and scrolling are buttery smooth. Scrolling on a web page feels like an iphone!

- There is slight graphics tearing going on during transitions. Nothing too crazy, but it is noticeable.
[EVO 4G General] :
SHUTUP :(

iPhone smooth sounds nice...
[EVO 4G General] jeremydk:
We attracted some attention, it seems.

Hello Jeremy. Thank you for taking the time to contact HTC America Technical Support via E-Mail with your comments regarding the HTC EVO 4G that you recently purchased. I do understand how important it is for your phone to work to the specifications that you enjoy, and I apologize for the difficulty you have experienced with it.

We are investigating the viability of claims that the limitation of 30fps can be overcome by software changes. As soon as we finish our investigations, HTC will announce its findings.

Please continue to monitor our website at (can't post links yet).