yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[EVO 4G General] Doward:
Ah, nice. So now that we have the source code, has the problem been found, and do we have a description of it?

I'm not very active on here, I understand that, but now that I've got a little free time, I thought I'd start pouring over the source and try to find out what exactly HTC did, and whether it can be re-written to properly cap the FPS when running HDMI output ONLY.

Granted, this is just from research done about a month ago - I've been very busy lately, and only now getting to play a little catch up.

So, what's the latest?
[EVO 4G General] Matskat:
So is this thread dead?

Well for what it's worth, I emailed HTC...here is my poorly written email (I was angry and let a few typos get in there)

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I am VERY upset to discover, after waiting WEEKS for my EVO to arrive, after reading all about the specs on the phone and how the EVO is the next level of mobile devices, after watching four versions of the iPhone come and go, that the "HD" games that are available for my device do not play at their full potential. Due to HTC's poorly aimed implementation of HDMI-Out(which I do not and will not use) there appears to be a 30FPS cap on my $400+ phone.

I'm extremely unhappy at this discovery. Any graphically intensive application that I have PURCHASED runns choppily and is barely playable.

The fact that the HDMI cable required (MICRO-HDMI?) is not supplied with the phone distresses me as well, because all I have read on forums states that HTC's excuse for the 30FPS cap is the HDMI (which nobody uses).

It's like buying a brand new Mustang only to find that although the engine is capable of much more, Ford has limited the "available" horsepower to 100HP.

There would be class-action lawsuits, unhappy customers everywhere and Ford would be forced to make it right.

The other phones running the same CPU\GPU combo do not suffer from a 30FPS cap, and it is ludicrous to posit that the HDMI out WHEN NOT EVEN IN USE is the cause for the cap...that excuse is invalid.

In order to keep my warranty I have resisted rooting my phone and applying any of the available 3rd party fixes for the cap. There are several fixes that allow up to 58 FPS...

WHY can non-HTC developers implement CODE to fix HTC's alleged HARDWARE limitation?

What I want to know (and what countless other HTC EVO owners would like to know as well) is WHEN IS A FIX COMING?

Thank you.
[EVO 4G General] edtate:
Well, most of the people that cared enough to even know there was a fps cap have already fixed the problem; there's been fixes for a couple of weeks now...kind of a non-event at this point. I agree, it shouldn't have happened in the first place. But the average user probably couldn't give two ****s about it; as long as they can make calls, send some messages, and browse the web, then all is good in their world. You can't miss what you never had...
[EVO 4G General] xHausx:
You sure do miss it when you pick up a friends iPhone or iPod touch... and then it's more a feeling of disgust with the evo then anything else. I too haven't rooted yet because of worries about security and because I haven't found any good android drivers for XP64. This is definitely an issue to me still.

I still have hope HTC and Sprint will make it right but if not Im still buying Win 7 tonight and will be fixing the FPS one way or another.
[EVO 4G General] gmelchert:
I have a 64bit pc and it runs great with my evo
[EVO 4G General] hydralisk:
They make the hardware. They make the software. They make 1 phone every 1-2 years. This allows them to fine-tune every aspect of their phones. With android... you have so many different hardware manufacturers putting phones together with android. I really wish most android phones could be as smooth as the iPhone\iPod... but that's something I sacrifice.

Now... even when you remove the cap, the EVO still get's slow when scrolling. The more widgets\icons on your homescreens, the more choppy the animation will be. Especially when using live wallpapers. The cap will make the evo smoother if you don't have much on it.

I used a friend's stock Droid X... and the homescreen scrolling on that thing was atrocious. And there's no cap on that :P But the problem with that is mostly Motorola's UI and all the widgets they throw on the homescreens. Ditch that... Sense UI... etc... and just use Launcher Pro :) Very smooth :D
[EVO 4G General] treschie:
Everyone speaks of a fix as if it is a totally obvious thing that everyone should know about, and yet if I go searching I come up empty. I've found a couple mentions to fixes that require rooting of the phone and still break functionality, and that's pretty unacceptable.

Furthermore, as a developer, it doesn't matter so much what MY performance is, as what the performance of everyone ELSE is. If I'm creating a game that's designed to be smooth and fast paced, there's hundreds of thousands of units out there that do not get the full experience. 30fps is "okay." it's playable. But it's not great. When I'm gaming on my PC I always tune everything to run at 60. I've been running games at 60fps as a standard for over ten years on the PC. One of the big prospects that drew me to developing on android is the fact that we can finally get what I feel to be a "proper" gaming experience on a phone.

Oh yeah, and all those console games you loved as a kid? You know, like the Nintendo Entertainment System? Yeah, NES games ran at 60fps on its 8-bit, 1.7megahertz process. But the Evo can't.

I'm really, really frustrated that there was a HUGE amount of community momentum behind this problem, and the instant HTC came out and said "Nah, we don't feel like fixing it." Everyone just hung their heads and walked off as if it never happened.

Furthermore, we've just received Froyo and the device is running faster than ever, so now it's bottlenecked even more!

This is important, for a number of reasons! Yes, I want a better experience on my phone, even more so, I want the people who download my game to have a proper experience.

But MOSTLY, I want manufacturers to know that 30FPS IS NOT AN OPTION. This is not something we should let slide! We can't be "okay" with this. If 30fps becomes acceptable then it just gives everyone a reason to under-engineer things. Another way to sweep things under the rug instead of trying to push things forward.

Google was trying to set an industry standard of 60fps with android from the very start. We need this standard.

How can we get momentum on this going forward again? I'm willing to put in some of the heavy lifting if need be.
[EVO 4G General] vinscuzzy:
Here's a link to a kernel that'll get you between 53-55 fps. It's not perfect, but its DEFINITELY better than stock at 30 fps.

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=719763
[EVO 4G General] rican408:
Don't know if its been discussed in this 100+ pages of thread but what if the fps was just locked at 30fps. Instead of fluctuating to 10 up and down as shown on fps2d app... wouldn't that fix the problem for both being plugged in to hdmi and not?
[EVO 4G General] treschie:
Not interested in rooting, imperfect kernels, and hack fixes.

My primary concern is not for myself, but for the hundreds of thousands of other people with this phone that might be playing my games and aren't getting the experience that I worked hard to create. The people who are getting the wool pulled over their eyes, and being told that "movies run at 24fps and you like movies so that means that 30fps is good."

30fps is not good. 30fps is the bare minimum of acceptability. Anything below 30fps I would consider totally unplayable for a true fast paced action game. 30 is too slow. The eye needs the extra information in order to be able to accurately track and react to fast moving targets.

I'm not interested in compromise and sacrifice. I've waited to get into mobile game development because I'm not interested in building stuff that "is okay for a phone I guess." We finally have hardware that can make awesome stuff happen. Just let us do it, please!
[EVO 4G General] YenahsYenzow:
Okay this is my first post here on XDA...And I'm not gonna waste my little time to read thru the entire 100+ pages of posts just to find the answers I'm looking for, so bear with me.

What intentions does HTC have with this 30FPS limit? (anybody?)

Would capping allow better battery life or not?

If I were to un-cap the limit, could that affect the battery life by up to 10%?

If that 10% were true...I would rather keep the extra 10% juice on my rooted Evo LOL, although I love the smooth scrolling on my former iPhone 3Gs, when I first got the Evo on my hands....the 30fps limit is what disgusted me the FIRST THING!!! Luckily, I am getting used to this yet I still don't like it ha.
[EVO 4G General] wuclan48:
What intentions does HTC have with this 30FPS limit? (anybody?)

I think if it was going to get fixed by them it would have happened with the froyo release.

Would capping allow better battery life or not?

Maybe.

If I were to un-cap the limit, could that affect the battery life by up to 10%?

Who knows, try a kernel and find out.
[EVO 4G General] randymac88:
Considering the current build of the software, it might affect battery life. However, by re-tooling voltages, I think they could easily overcome whatever drain on the battery an uncapped version might cause.

I am rooted using Netarchy's kernel and the FPS is a complete non-issue. I get 53-55 fps, the OS is smooth as butter (certainly as smooth as my old iPhone), and I am getting considerably better battery life than most if not all users on a stock unrooted ROM. I would say my battery life is better than my old iPhone. I am extremely happy with the device.
[EVO 4G General] YenahsYenzow:
Thanks for the tip, I'll try it out now.

I'm surprised it didnt really affect the battery life!
[EVO 4G General] clamknuckle:
You're retarded. The FPS cap was one of the first things fixed. No one walked off as if it never happened. Devs got word from HTC that nothing was going to happen on their end, so this community got together and fixed it. It took all of what, a week or two to fix it?

I agree with you that the device shouldn't have the cap, but it does. You can whine on internet forums about it and stay capped at 30, or you can root, install your rom of choice (in which nothing is broken by the way) and then a custom kernel which removes the fps cap (which the the only thing that's broken is the camera is at 3 mp instead of 8, which will be fixed probably within about 15 minutes of HTC releasing the source for the kernel)

Root your phone and fix your problems, or don't. HTC isn't changing anything. The power to solve your problems is in your hands, and there is very little downside (I can't think of any, even if you just go with the rooted version of the stock rom, you gain the ability to create full backups on your SD card once you root.). But stop whining, the problem has been solved, and the community you say walked away is the one that solved it.

Don't come here complaining that you don't want to do things that fix the issue. It's all there is. You sound like a spoiled child when someone tells you the answer, only to say you don't want that answer, come up with another one.
[EVO 4G General] bl4cks0ul:
This was their awnser to me!

Hi people:

This is what HTC support awnsered me. Just for you to compare with another responses!. I was sad by the way specially when she made the movies and Tv analogies!...We are doome :D:eek:

Dear xxxxxxx,

Thank you for contacting HTC America Technical Support via E-Mail to let us know about the 30fps issue on the EVO. I apologize for any inconvenience this has been causing you I understand how frustrating it must be.Since the HTC EVO 4G employs a unique HDMI output to deliver video in HD quality to an external display, the hardware graphics driver interface on the HTC EVO 4G uses significant resources for the HDMI output and therefore displays graphics at 30 frames per second on the integrated display. This is hardware, and not software, limitation. It’s important to keep in mind that content including most movies and television, are created to run at between 24 and 30 frames per second. The 30FPS is a hardware limitation. We have found that some games may be impacted by this limitation. The HTC Evo 4G has been locked to 30 FPS . This should not present a major issue for most Android applications; however, the customer may have some issues with some 2D or 3D applications. The device has been locked at 30 FPS due to enhance overall performance in the device. By lowering the FPS of the device the CPU works less. This increases the battery life of the device. There may be third party options available to remove this limitation; however HTC does not condone the use of, support the use of, or offer technical assistance with regard to these third party solutions.

To send a reply to this message or let me know I have successfully answered your question log in to our ContactUs site using your email address and your ticket number x0Uxxxx2ExAxxxxxx.

Sincerely,

Christina

HTC
[EVO 4G General] Mecha2142:
Are you seriously still emailing HTC about this? This 30 fps cap deal has been a non-issue since the end of June. If you aren't willing to root your device, which is a ridiculously simple process, you're going to be stuck with the cap forever. There's no getting around it otherwise.
[EVO 4G General] splmonster:
So whats the best way of rooting to remove this cap? Or is there any new development on HTC fixing this officially?
[EVO 4G General] toneman1984:
I've been rooted with the uncapped kernel running at 55 fps smooth and slick. However I also emailed HTC to tell them that they failed. I figured the more emails they get, the less likely they will repeat their mistakes. Thanks to xda for making this phone really awesome and fast!
[EVO 4G General] YenahsYenzow:
Lol..that's hilarious...

For unrooted lovers, why not bribe HTC to remove the 30fps cap with a risk of never getting it to ever happen, haha that would be the dumbest thing! Rooting isn't a such bad idea anyway if you are willing to do some frigging research! Of course it voids the warranty only temporarily, that is if your able to revert it to the stock without smashing the phone! Simple as that.
[EVO 4G General] xenoetry:
The process is simple, and mostly painless...but it should not be needed in the first place. This is a premium phone with a premium price, and it should be expected. Period. It's easy for us tech heads(and semi-tech heads) to spout off about it, but it's still unofficial. Most of the people will never know of a fix, but they will see a difference when you compare it some other 60fps devices. Even my mother who can barely send a text message asked me why "it moved like that", comparing it to my cousin's Iphone. Once I applied the fix, she definitely felt much better about it.

I'm all for the scene and the great things it and the people involved with it have brought us, but its ridiculous that it even had to come to this. They shouldn't have had to waste their time fixing something that should have been given after purchasing a high dollar phone.

I won't be emailing anyone anything, as their hand was shown when such a feature was omitted in the first place...but we can't act like it's a non-issue. Until there is an official fix, its a problem. Not a problem for us lol, but its a problem for the phone and people who don't know how to "fix" it. Quite a few people I work with have purchased it, and are not satisfied with it due to this very issue.
[EVO 4G General] halorin:
Simple Root literally requires three clicks. If that's too hard, then maybe you should get a Razr or something.
[EVO 4G General] Vandam500:
Actually I think they got it down to one click :p
[EVO 4G General] xenoetry:
It should be as simple as powering on the device lol
[EVO 4G General] trojandnc:
I agree with the "premium phone" argument, but who sits around saying "ne ne ni boo boo, my premium phone is better than your premium phone. you show mw urs and i'll show u mine..."

The one time someone pulled out an iphone4 when they saw my EVO, I just gave a hearty laugh at the little phone. She immediately put up back up.
[EVO 4G General] TJDuckett:
Hey guys, is using the netarchy kernel fix still causing screen tearing? I recently just upgraded to rooted stock 2.2, and am interested in applying the fix, but never did before because of the screen tearing problems I'd read.
[EVO 4G General] jcalba89:
it doesnt void your warranty anymore
[EVO 4G General] xenoetry:
I don't believe anyone is speaking with such a tone in here, nor are they in the real world. Well, unless they are on their 5th grade lunch break. Comparing devices does not equal rubbish baby talk, because after all, comparing devices is exactly what any real person would do who chooses to exercise choice. It's what a smart shopper will do when spending a (subjectively) large amount of funds on a product which has valid competitors in the market. It's also the reason we know the Evo is as good as it is. That said, pointing out an obvious flaw is just that and nothing more. Just because you have the ability to patch a tire does not mean it's ok for someone to sell you a faulty one.

There wouldn't be a "fix" for it if it weren't a problem...all anyone here is really saying is that the fix be made official and mainstream for everyone. Rooting your phone is not "the simple answer" in mainstream terms. Chances are, if you aren't aware of XDA, you probably aren't aware of the fix...and that is a ****load of customers.

No one here is arguing how simple it is to do(looks what forum this is), its about it being there to begin with, and an official update being release due to the fact that it isn't. That's it.
[EVO 4G General] MrDSL:
Since when?
[EVO 4G General] jblazea50:
I agree, HTC should have addressed this issue and fixed it.

Also, those who updated to 2.2 via OTA, they can't root it to get rid off the fps cap as there isn't a root method yet.
[EVO 4G General] martyzidek:
Yeah i made the mistake of updating the phone as soon as i left the store and now im stuck.. this sucks
[EVO 4G General] YenahsYenzow:
OFFICIALLY? I recall the new law passed a few weeks ago that allows it legally, however, when I were to replace the Evo, HTC wouldn't be able to turn me down if I left it rooted and sent it back?

Would that also apply to my problematic jailbroken iPad?? (charging issues even with 10w pwr adapter that charges for 10 mins then stops regardless of battery percentage!!! Totally pissed me off on the 2nd day of owning it.)
[EVO 4G General] chandlerw88:
I think it sill voids warranty, it just makes it illegal short manufacturers to make it unrootable
[EVO 4G General] engagedtosmile:
Yes it does.
[EVO 4G General] mikeDCMDVA:
Anybody know where a download is for the apk "Clock FPS"?
[EVO 4G General] YenahsYenzow:
Crap...Well, at least I know now before sending it back (if it were to happen) thanks enagagedtosmile!
[EVO 4G General] martyzidek:
Fps2d in market :)

sent from my Evo
[EVO 4G General] chandlerw88:
I have absolutely no idea what you guys are talking about. Tried to read to get an answer, is the fps cap the reason why my videos are copy as hell
[EVO 4G General] :
What ordinary video goes past 29.976 fps?
[EVO 4G General] ritzbrie:
I took this route. I received a all about two hours ago and an email. Sprint's executive care wants to talk to me about this issue. I'll update after I talk to them.
[EVO 4G General] chandlerw88:
Haha I have no idea that's why I was asking, I just wanted to make sure my camera wasn't messed up because its choppy as hell
[EVO 4G General] splmonster:
In most cases, yeah you don't need above 30fps. Still with games it benefits largely. Not to mention when they release the cap, the refresh rate should also go up improving touch input lag and will make scrolling smoother.
[EVO 4G General] metayoshi:
Like someone said above, it's games that really benefit from a higher fps.

Truthfully, I wouldn't have minded a 30 fps cap on the EVO... If only the EVO stayed CONSISTENTLY at 30 fps.

For that reason, I welcome the modded kernels. The UI just "feels" that much better even when they raised the fps cap to 42-45-ish. Since the cap is higher in those kernels, the phone reaches decent framerates under a heavy load.
[EVO 4G General] netarchy:
The refresh rate is already 60hz. The framerate is artificially limited to ~28fps (test for yourself with fps2d, it's actually under 30).

Breaking out of the cap enhances the experience of the phone immensely. Swiping through panels is fluid, the touch screen is much more responsive, and you realize how WRONG everyone is that says "you don't need more than 30fps except in games." Seriously, it's just flat out wrong.
[EVO 4G General] Pierceye:
Using an unmodified Evo and this is definitely the most frustrating aspect of the device. The lag on screen transitions is a real pain. Compared the scrolling features to my roommates iPhone 3G and was shocked at the difference. Tried fps2d just to see and came up with the same numbers. 28 average. Oh well. I'd still take my Evo over anything else on the market. Suppose I'll need to look into rooting a bit more.
[EVO 4G General] Last-Chance:
Is it really that big of a difference? I got fresh mod, although its still limited to 30fps, i don't see a huge difference in browsing or anything really. the screen responds almost immediately after I scroll. Even when I scroll on skyfire while streaming videos, it's still instant.

I can probably compare my itouch and the evo tomorrow, but I really don't see a big deal, other than maybe games (although haven't found any good graphic based games for android)
[EVO 4G General] louforgiveno:
Yes its that big a difference,less[blur] when flipping through lists,lagless weather animations, games run much smoother, sense scrolling super smooth. it'll make your itouch feel sluggish.

So fps or pri??:rolleyes:

fps all day !!:cool:

"if your Evo don't look good, You don't look good" ;)Alpha Beta:eek: damn i'm old
[EVO 4G General] Success100:
U need ur eyes checked!

Sent from my Damn EVO!!
[EVO 4G General] ScaryBugThing:
If you haven't flashed a new kernel, yes, Fresh Evo is still at 30 FPS. You shouldn't say it's "no big deal" until you try it, seriously... It isn't earth-shattering, but the difference is definitely noticeable and a great improvement.

The main improvement for me is not games, but the UI. It's so smooth at 54 fps (using Netarchy's kernel). The screen seems to respond instantly to my swipes now, and I can actually use scrolling windows now because I can read the text as it's scrolling. Before, during fast scrolling, it was just a slideshow, and you needed to stop the scrolling before you could even make out what the text was.

It's easy to flash a new kernel, and I'd seriously recommend it just for the FPS fix.
[EVO 4G General] brol1k:
Which of the kernel you think I'd the must stable one? Better yet which one are you running?

Tapatalk'd on Evo
[EVO 4G General] tatnai:
couldn't agree more. I don't play games, and I can't live without an uncapped kernel. seriously, you guys stuck in sub 30fps land don't know what you are missing. the evo has a laggy UI with the cap, but you really convince yourself that it isn't that bad until you experience freedom.

to give you an example of how much it matters: I hate things not working on my phone. I stick with roms/kernels that are fully functional. when I switched to 2.2, I went back to the stock kernel as the camera wasn't working; in the end, I ended up switching to a uncapped modded kernel cause I hated the lag so much, despite the camera issues. thank goodness we have the new kernel source, now we've got everything working and uncapped FPS. thank you netarchy, and all other devs.

I'm running netarchy's latest 2.2. haven't tried many others, cause netarchy has always been rock solid stable. he is not an early adopter of all the brand new stuff, cause he tests it out first, and if it is not yet ready for prime time, does not incorporate. it's a great kernel (the best in my opinion) if you want stability and speed without the hype.