yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[EVO 4G General] kennyc1:
This is the one I got... HTC figured out how to use ctrl-c and ctrl-v keys.

Hi, I'm Anna and I will be glad to assist you today. Thank you for taking the time to contact HTC America Technical Support via E-Mail with your inquiry about your Sprint EVO 4G by HTC. I understand how important it is for you to have this information about your device. The EVO 4G does have a maximum frames per second (FPS) of 30. This decision was made to enhance the overall performance of the device. At this time, we do not have any information on when or if a software update will be available to change the FPS. Thank you for contacting HTC Technical Support. There is also a customer survey that you can take as well at http://survey.htc.com/worldwide/ about your recent contact to HTC have a great day.

To send a reply to this message or let me know I have successfully answered your question log in to our ContactUs site using your email address and your ticket number xxx.

Sincerely,

Anna
[EVO 4G General] nestersan:
I got my cut and paste response too....:mad:
[EVO 4G General] Rhys'Droid:
I am in the camp that thinks that the HDMI port has something to do with this. If you use dmesg after turning the screen off and back on, you can clearly see where it changes states:

When coming back from sleep:

[hdmi/fb]hdmifb_resume

[hdmi/lcdc]lcdc_resume

[hdmi/tx]hdmi_panel_init

[hdmi]suc_hdmi_gpio_on

[hdmi]hdmi_power(5)

When going to sleep:

[hdmi/fb]hdmifb_suspend

[hdmi/lcdc]lcdc_suspend

[hdmi/tx]hdmi_panel_uninit

[hdmi]suc_hdmi_gpio_off

[hdmi]hdmi_power(4)

So it (at least from this person who can use Linux, but is far from an expert on its inner workings, especially as to how it is implemented in Android) appears to have HDMI on and running from a frame buffer at all times that the LCD is on, and turns it off when the screen is off.
[EVO 4G General] AssassinsLament:
Nice find, that is my thought also, I really think HTC took a shortcut at coding.
[EVO 4G General] gman8966:
I was messing with my father's Incredible today, man that thing is snappy compared to this Evo, even with sense on it was way smoother. I am definitely going to switch to that and verizon if this isn't resolved at the end of my 30 days.

Only bad thing is the downgrade in screen size.
[EVO 4G General] eduardmc:
I would take 30fps cap remove instead of hdmi if thats the case
[EVO 4G General] d.cooper:
Do you think thats why the FPS jumps up when the screen is off?
[EVO 4G General] kennyc1:
no question.
[EVO 4G General] Rhys'Droid:
That is my (admittedly relatively uneducated) guess. Throwing it up there for the real experts to chew on ;-)
[EVO 4G General] eduardmc:
This is all bull$hit. Nexus one has the same processor and hardware that would affect perfomance just like the evo and it does not have a cap. HTC incredible the same.
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
Assuming the system can only handle 60fps with the screen on, then yes, this would make sense, because it would split resources for each necessary component. If it can handle more than 60 fps, then it wouldn't make much sense.
[EVO 4G General] kennyc1:
I guess you read my reply to them! :)
[EVO 4G General] butterbuns:
Canned Responce i got From HTC.. I got a call from the email i sent to dan@sprint.com which i was told "they were aware of the issue and working on correcting it"

Dear XXXXXXXX,

Hello XXX. Thank you for taking the time to contact HTC America Technical Support via E-Mail with your concern about the fps rate of your HTC EVO 4G. I understand how important it is for your device to function to your specifications and I apologize for any inconvenience this situation has caused you. Please be aware that our technical team has been tracking this issue and, although I don’t have a time frame for a fix, we are diligently working toward a resolution for our customers. Please continue to monitor our website for future postings, or call customer service at 1.866.449.8358 Sunday through Saturday 6:00 a.m. until 1:00 a.m. EST.

To send a reply to this message or let me know I have successfully answered your question log in to our ContactUs site using your email address and your ticket number 10USCW25ENA002135.

Sincerely,

Richard

HTC

Want to see what others are saying? Have a question to ask other HTC fans?

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We are unable to receive replies to this email account. Please visit us at htc.com if you have any questions or need further assistance.
[EVO 4G General] mobilemaniac:
Has anyone tried to run fps2d connected to an external display through hdmi? Also, what happens if you turn the phone display off while connected to an external display? Does the external display go dark as well? It seems clear that hitting the power button doesn't just turn the display off. Is there an app that just makes the display go dark and doesn't take you back to the lock screen? Just throwing out ideas here...
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
Someone do me a favor. Pack the attached board-supersonic.c (it's .txt, you need to rename to .c) into the godmode kernel and load it up for me and see if it works.

/arch/arm/mach-msm/

I made these changes:

static void suc_hdmi_gpio_on(void)
{
[color=red]suc_hdmi_gpio_off(void);
/*HDMI_DBG("%s\n", __func__);

config_gpio_table(hdmi_gpio_on_table, ARRAY_SIZE(hdmi_gpio_on_table));*/[/color]
}

static struct hdmi_platform_data hdmi_device_data = {
.hdmi_res = {
.start = MSM_HDMI_FB_BASE,
.end = MSM_HDMI_FB_BASE + MSM_HDMI_FB_SIZE - 1,
.flags = IORESOURCE_MEM,
},
.power = hdmi_power,
[color=red].hdmi_gpio_on = suc_hdmi_gpio_off,[/color]
.hdmi_gpio_off = suc_hdmi_gpio_off,
};
[EVO 4G General] ffolkes:
as i've mentioned before, i, and others, have completely deleted all the code relating to hdmi in board-supersonic.c, board-supersonic-audio.c and msm_hdmi.h and that didn't help anything. it did remove all the mentions of it in dmesg.

but that does give me an idea i want to try right now..
[EVO 4G General] Rhys'Droid:
Which is why I posted that...to stimulate thought ;-) I do wonder if rather than deleting the mentions, you have to actively turn them off. (as it appears someone was thinking above.
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
Yes, this is what I did (I think). Unless it's also handled elsewhere, my code should at least treat the gpio on as an off command.
[EVO 4G General] techs1200:
Sorry for the naive question, but where can I score the kernel source you guys are working with?
[EVO 4G General] :
http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=686240
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=686240

It's the incredible kernel with Evo board files.
[EVO 4G General] AdamLJ:
I got the same reply from "Richard"
[EVO 4G General] clamknuckle:
You're out of your mind, or just trying to convince yourself that the incredible is faster, because it's not.

I've played with both, extensively, and the N1, and there is no noticable difference, unless you are looking for one.

I really wish someone had never found out about this "cap" because then no one would notice any differences at all.

The FPS thing is silly. Did you know Halo3 was locked at 30fps MAXIMUM? I've logged countless hours of H3, not to mention CoD4 and MW2, and I cannot tell a difference between the 3. I also cannot tell the difference between the N1, Incredible, or the Evo. I really find it hard to believe that anyone else can either, at least not to the point where it would cause you to return the phone or notice a decrease in performance.

If you are convinced the Incredible is "snappier" than the EVO, go on over to VZW, pay more per month, and enjoy your soon to be tiered data plans. That just seems silly to spend more money per month, and get less, for what is basically a non issue, except for when you run an FPS app.

I've played tons of games on my EVO, they don't stutter or lag. This really isn't that big of a deal. I hope it is a hardware cap, so I can feast upon the internet rage that will spew out, and laugh as thousnands of smelly nerds get up in arms over nothing.
[EVO 4G General] hawkyman:
wow take a chill pill buddy.
[EVO 4G General] techs1200:
srsly.

HTC needs to fix the FPS cap... not that big of a deal.

Calm down bro.
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
clamknuckle, there is obviously at least touch input lag. I notice it in the UI and in games, and it's frustrating as ****. Especially with a program like Solo (guitar app) where it's impossible to strum in time because it's always a bit behind. It's worth it to me to see if this 30fps cap is contributing to this, because it's making my experience worse.

And if you can't notice it, you're not looking. My gf's Hero outperforms my Evo in the speed of the UI...dramatically.
[EVO 4G General] Mecha2142:
You, you, you. Those of us who care about this issue don't give a damn about what you think of it. The people who are demanding a fix for this are obviously suffering from it. It is 'that big of a deal' because HTC is purposely screwing us all with their underhanded tricks. If you were to order a hamburger at a restaurant, you wouldn't accept it if it looked like it was slapped together messily by a five year old. We're paying thousands of dollars just to OWN this phone, and we shouldn't have to suffer because HTC decided to be cheap.

Why don't you try listing some games you've played? I don't know what counts as 'tons', so there's no credibility in that statement. Have you ever tried playing ANY of the games people have listed in this thread as exhibiting frame rate issues?

It's also funny how you generalize everyone complaining about this issue as 'thousands of smelly nerds'. We aren't the ones logging countless hours of Halo 3 and Call of Duty, now are we?
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
ROFL!

Sent from my Evo
[EVO 4G General] themyst:
Utter fail. You play Halo3, MW2 and COD4 and do not notice the difference between the three? Halo3 = 25-30fps. COD4/MW2 = 60fps. Either your monitor/TV sucks or your eyes need a checkup.
[EVO 4G General] SPENONE:
Srsly i was going to say the same exact thing!. What a douche.
[EVO 4G General] redct:
I'd love to, but I can't compile the kernel... >_<
[EVO 4G General] AssassinsLament:
Just tried it, no change.
[EVO 4G General] cordevil95:
You must have a defective Evo or you are extremely exaggerating. My Hero can't even come close to touching the speed of my Evo. Both devices on a fresh boot, the Evo loaded applications at least 3-5 times faster then the Hero. And my hero is running a stable, optimized, "fast" custom rom as well.
[EVO 4G General] mobilemaniac:
The Incredible absolutely is faster in the UI. This really isn't even debatable. I'm surprised you can't see it. Every time i pick up my wife's Incredible, it's the first thing I notice. I still prefer my EVO, but I'm not a fanatic to the point of delusion.
[EVO 4G General] :
Pretty much.
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
****. :( I'll keep digging.

Yes it loads apps faster, so what? That is NOT what we're talking about. Try swiping the home screens quickly on both devices and you will absolutely notice the Hero is faster.
[EVO 4G General] donatom3:
I have to agree here. The incredible has a smoother UI. Otherwise programs and anything else aren't faster, but the Sense does run smoother.
[EVO 4G General] EliWay:
I actually went to a verizon store to check it. There is absolutely no question the incredible is smoother. Even when you open the browser you can see the address bar animation, it's butter smooth, just like the iPhone. The UI is much more fluid and enjoyable to use.
[EVO 4G General] asrebel:
The Hero is grossly "under-equipped" from a hardware standpoint.

However, if you load a good ROM, close all un-necessary apps/services and play a game that's capable of over 30fps the Hero performs better. Sad, but true. I have both devices.

I think some people (not necessarily you) are confusing issues here. The EVO is a much more responsive device, especially with Sense, but Hero is capable of more than 30fps...the EVO is not (yet), which is just silly.
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
My gf's Hero with official 2.1 is MUCH more responsive than my Evo. I'm not confusing issues here. There may be two issues, but they may be related.
[EVO 4G General] asrebel:
I didn't quote your post, and I wasn't saying you were confusing the issue. In fact, if you read my post I'm mostly agreeing with you ;-)
[EVO 4G General] redct:
Some more thoughts on stuff to try (in board-supersonic.c):

static int hdmi_power(int on)
{
HDMI_DBG("%s(%d)\n", __func__, on);

switch(on) {
/* Power on/off sequence for normal or D2 sleep mode */
case 0:
gpio_set_value(HDMI_RST, 0);
msleep(2);
gpio_set_value(V_HDMI_3V3_EN, 0);
gpio_set_value(V_VGA_5V_SIL9022A_EN, 0);
msleep(2);
gpio_set_value(V_HDMI_1V2_EN, 0);
break;

Maybe set it so hdmi_power() always turns off HDMI, no matter what's called?

In addition, it seems that HTC might actually be 'fixing' this:
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
I thought about this as well. Simply putting on = 0; as the first line in that proc would force it. I'll try this later.
[EVO 4G General] ffolkes:
this kernel definitely isn't complete. most of the hdmi debug output from the stock kernel doesn't even exist in the source we have.

i forced hdmi debugging on, but it's never called...ever. unlike the stock one that outputs a lot about it. so i added hdmi_power(0); and suc_hdmi_gpio_off(); to the end of the supersonic_init(), and that activated the debug code in the hdmi functions, so i know it got the message. didn't help. i tried different power modes, even though i'm certain 0 is off, but just to be sure.

unrelated, i figured something out about the fps2d thing i posted this morning. people were saying they were getting really high numbers, and i think i know why. when you start fps2d, then go into standby, fps2d is still in the foreground running. but when you wake it up, the lock screen pops up and takes the focus off of it, at which point the graphics drivers focus their attention on the lockscreen. kind of like revving your car, then yanking the transmission off suddenly. oddly, that seems to indicate the gpu doesn't underclock itself when it goes into standby, as the cpu normally does.
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
I think we need to make sure these calls will always be 0 no matter what, so we need to change the procs themselves to default to "off" for the params so whenever they're called, it will always be off no matter where the code to call is.
[EVO 4G General] Mecha2142:
Alright, I recorded some videos that demonstrate the touch input lag and/or the 30fps cap. Make of it what you will. It's just some video proof to anybody who doesn't believe it.

[YOUTUBE]ZJsQY6CW08Y[/YOUTUBE]

[YOUTUBE]xe-Lxr-8x7g[/YOUTUBE]
[EVO 4G General] gman8966:
Here is the response I got from HTC.

My name is Casey, and I would be happy to assist you. The device has been locked at 30 FPS due to enhance overall performance in the device. By lowering the FPS of the device the CPU works less. This increases the battery life of the device. There may be third party options available to remove this limitation; however HTC does not condone the use of, support the use of, or offer technical assistance with regard to these third party solutions. This type of application could harm your device. Are you having issues with your screen? I understand you have read about other customers' issues regarding this complaint. While HTC has been looking into this issue, knowing if you have the issue, will help us better track the concern. Not all customers will face the same issues. I want to apologize for any inconveniences you may have experienced. I want to thank you for contacting HTC. In order to help improve our service I’d like to invite you to take a survey at http://survey.htc.com/worldwide
[EVO 4G General] jayv1717:
wow i can notice it on yourz..but my evo doesnt seem to have that problem..itz just as smooth and snappy as your hero if...even with all the 3d games i've tried it has been smooth with the exception of doodle jump..but i definitely still want this fixed..
[EVO 4G General] redct:
More random stuff; it seems that the HDMI output is a Silicon Image SIL9022A. The weird thing regarding speculation that the framerate has been halved due to HDMI:

So, the HDMI output can handle 60—why halve it to 30?
[EVO 4G General] EliWay:
Here's one more argument for our "arsenal", like someone else said.

This issue is now the 20th most popular "bug" of the entire android project on Google Code. There are 5,419 bugs total. This should help HTC understand how important this issue is.

http://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=8942
[EVO 4G General] timgt:
To me this just means there are 19 more issues to fix before they consider fixing this one, I guess that should be a few months :(
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
THanks for posting that. Hopefully people can see now that this is a big problem. Hero is SOOO smooth.
[EVO 4G General] EliWay:
Not at all. One update can usually fix several hundred bugs. Also, this is the ONLY issue that is actually HTC's doing. Everything else is Google's.

EDIT: Actually, if you want to get more specific, if you sort bugs to only show DEFECTS and not "enhancements", this issue is actually the 2nd most popular. The first one has been reviewed and is fixed in Froyo. This effectively makes the FPS cap the most popular bug-defect of the ENTIRE android project.

http://code.google.com/p/android/is...ct&colspec=ID Type Status Owner Summary Stars
[EVO 4G General] Cicatrize:
We don't know what the HDMI output is, but that's not the issue anyway. What I was saying is that the system, while the screen is on, is capable of 60fps output, but it's sharing the output with the HDMI. Of course, we still don't even know if that's true.
[EVO 4G General] djthirst1:
Let's hope everyone keeps sending in those emails to HTC...
[EVO 4G General] ffolkes:
i think people are getting confused with these numbers.. myself included. sometimes it helps to take a step back. the physical refresh rate of the screen, and the max framerate of the images the graphics hardware/drivers are pushing to it are two totally different things. old crt monitors were always at least 60hz, some 75, 85, 95, 100hz, etc. that meant the higher the refresh rate, the less the screen would flicker less for ANY IMAGE displayed, even static ones. setting your old pentium mmx pc's monitor to 100hz didn't mean you'd be getting 100fps 2d/3d graphics performance! of course that'd not a perfect analogy, since lcd's don't refresh like crt's, and therefore don't ever flicker.

i really don't think the lcd is limiting us in any way, anyway (haha play on words). i still think the 29/30fps we keep seeing is oddly similar to ntsc, but really, it could be a coincidence. 30fps is often used as an arbitrary "looks good to human eyes" number, and that coupled with the laggy touch tracking, makes me really wonder if htc isn't reducing a clock somewhere simply to save battery life. i just hope it's a clock we/they can edit, and not a physical crystal. :/
[EVO 4G General] RogerPodacter:
Yeah someone already posted HTC's response that the cap is to save battery.

Also remember Google's stance they say on their forums is that android OS has always been and still is 60 fps for the UI. So this evo cap definitely stinks.
[EVO 4G General] d.cooper:
Dont know if this would help anyone. Its a tear down lists some of the key chips in the EVO.

chipworks.com//HTC-EVO-Teardown.aspx
[EVO 4G General] apollooff320:
dammit you made me want to return my EVO after looking at that video. It also didn't either that I actually was able to get out today with my phone for the first time since my daughter gave me the chicken pox. I actually felt like I was going to drop my phone every time I pulled it out of my pocket. Phone is too big but when I'm at home it feels perfect.
[EVO 4G General] clamknuckle:
Sorry, I don't sit and freak out about frame rates. It works. There's nothing wrong with the EVO guys. Sorry.

Unless you all have bad EVOs or something. Mine doesn't lag, everything opens pretty much instantly, theres no jittery scrolling, there's no delay in swiping between screens, and this is with a live wallpaper.

I've been able to look at multiple evo's and they all perform just like mine. So even if is capped at 30, the phone works fine.
[EVO 4G General] AdamLJ:
Ignorance is bliss.
[EVO 4G General] clamknuckle:
There's absolutely no way your hero is more responsive than your Evo. Post a video of this. I had a Hero since launch, and got an Evo on the 6th. There is no comparison between the two. It's like saying your PC runs better on Vista than 7. It's just not possible.

I'm starting to think you guys have bad phones or something. Seriously.
[EVO 4G General] nsxla:
Incredible has a different screen technology, if this is a limitation on the EVO's screen (hardware) then i shall be returning mine, not paying $500 for a phone with this rubbish issue. :D Though granted i haven't noticed any sluggishness around the OS, web browsing, i should load a games to test

Tried Roadthunder 2 lite, no sluggishness. Where are you guys noticing the lag?
[EVO 4G General] Shidell:
Note that during the Froyo boot sequence, the screen is displaying at 60 FPS, so it's clearly not a hardware or screen issue, but a software one.
[EVO 4G General] nsxla:
How are you benchmarking the screen at start up?
[EVO 4G General] Young_e:
wxact same question i was going to ask
[EVO 4G General] EliWay:
You don't need to benchmark to see extreme fluidity. Flash it and see for yourself. The fact that the loading screen starts at 30fps and then goes to 60fps makes it even more apparent. Turns out we can tell the difference between 30 and 60fps. Otherwise we wouldnt be complaining about sluggishness, would we?
[EVO 4G General] eduardmc:
Can anyone with froyo on evo do fps2d and tell us what their frame rate were
[EVO 4G General] nsxla:
lol! he stated its running at 60 FPS, thats why i asked, not flashing Froyo thank you.

So no one know as of yet if the phone can exceed 30 FPS.

Okie Dokie
[EVO 4G General] EliWay:
It's 60fps. Absolutely no doubt about it. Like I said, flash it and see for yourself.
[EVO 4G General] l33tlinuxh4x0r:
No it is defiantly 120fps I know... I have good eyes. jk I'll wait to see benchmarks
[EVO 4G General] EliWay:
You know its quite ridiculous all this talk about it needing a benchmark for simply telling the difference between 30 and 60 frames per second. The different is striking and real. Maybe its not apparent to some of you guys. But I work with A/V, and It's ridiculously easy to spot.

Sure, you can only get fine measurements using benchmarks, but 30fps to 60fps is night and day, c'mon now. It might not be 60. It could be 59 or 54. but it sure as hell isnt 30.

Enough said. This is the last time I will talk about this.
[EVO 4G General] muf454:
I thought I read in an earlier post that toast's froyo rom benchmarked at 30fps as well? And couldn't the boot screen have been smoothed out/blurred like on movies like someone mentioned earlier? Just a thought..
[EVO 4G General] vboyz103:
Let's the unlocking hack begin...come one everyone let's get at it and show HTC who's da boss around here.
[EVO 4G General] exSD:
This is a pile of crock.
[EVO 4G General] EliWay:
That is correct. However, when booting his rom, the nexus "X" loading screen will clearly start moving around in an incredibly fluid 60fps just as its about to throw you into the OS. This is not much, but it shows the screen and gpu can handle it. Hardcore pc gamers will immediately be able to tell the difference. Smoothing out helps but it'd still be noticeable.
[EVO 4G General] Young_e:
you are throwing people off by saying that its 60fps when you haven't tested anything to get that number. You should just say that it seems to be moving at a rate higher then 30fps if thats how you honestly feel. Only throw the numbers out there if you have proof to back it up.