yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] MooGoo:
While I agree that HTC's Sense is generally more trouble than it's worth, aside from increased memory usage and occasional stuttering, it works just fine for me. I simply prefer the default WinMo interfaces. And I do not think anyone likes HTC Messaging, that part is horribly bugged and slow.

There are many ROMs or variants of which that do not have any Sense components built in, I believe there is an Energy ROM that uses Titanium as the default shell.

I would suggest to you the Cosmik Debris ROM here:

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=608009

It is based on WinMo 6.1 so it will probably be familiar to what you were using on your Uni, and out of all the ROMs I've tried it seems to have the least amount of HTC software built in (there always seems to be some left, you will defiantly want to disable the HTC dialer).

If you do not mind the classic WinMo (pre-titanium) today screen, or plan on using a third party one such as Spb, I think 6.1 is a good way to go. I've not found any advantage at all to running 6.5 besides a startmenu that looks like it was just carpet bombed.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] XERO_Racer:
got no problems using Sense 2.5....if you dont like it, try Sense 2.1 which is hecka quicker than 2.5 just no Twitter tab....im only on Sense for the sake of twitter and the fact all info is there all in one piece :D
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] RADRaze2KX:
I'm with the OP... My Sprint Rhodium was working fairly well prior to my update to WinMo 6.5 (stock ROM)... Afterwards, the boot time was slow, sometimes Sense just wouldn't load at all. Going to any tab was initially, painfully slow. Loading apps was not TOO much slower than 6.1, but it was still leaving a lot to be desired. So about 4 days ago, I switched from Sense to the WinMo 6.5 default today screen.. BAM! Problems gone.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not hating on HTC's Sense, I think it's great, the UI is awesome, it's just buggy... Perhaps there's some versions of the phone (think: manufacturing batches) that have issues with the newer software. Because OP is definitely not alone.

Sticking with WinMo's 6.5 Default - Mark
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] nrfitchett4:
I just don't think the rhodium has the ram or the processor for sense 2.5. I gave up on sense a while ago. and even though 2.5 with cookie 1.8 is very nice looking, I'll take my custom cooked 23563 sys with 3.5.3 mobile shell on top. very fast and not buggy at all. everything works as it should.

since you have tried it with sense off, try the trial version of mobile shell or just stick with titanium. Some people are happier with that.

fyi, I have never had a SOD with sense not on my phone.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] DeathmonkeyGTX:
I second the previous poster's recommendation of SPB Mobile Shell 3.5.3. I've been using it since V2, and it's great. It only uses 4-6 MB of RAM. It's about as customizable as one could wish for right out of the box. As for ROM, I've been using Sergio76's Leo Cell Pro version 9.1 for a few days now, and I haven't had any hangs requiring restart or SOD. I've had SOD's without Sense, but that was only in the 23xxx branch. Serg's Pro series is on the 21xxx branch, the latest being 21901 in V 9.1. It's made of win and profit. Make sure you grab the one with no HTC Messaging or CHT.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] FeareX:
Best combination stays the stock HTC 6.1 ROM with TouchFlo for me. The TouchFlo interface is very light on the hardware and looks smooth.

The newer Manilla 2.1 looks nice, but slows down here and there, together with WM6.5 it eats RAM!

I tried the Manilla 2.5, and it looks ugly (to me) with the big fat icons at the bottom together with allot of lag :( It's very noticeble that it's designed for the HD2, wich has allot more horsepower!

I like the fact that TouchFlo still keeps things finger-friendly ^^

Grtz,

FeareX
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] stevedebi:
The bottom icons are not Sense 2.5; they are the newer version of WM6. I am using 2.5, and my start menu is in the upper left, not the lower left.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] ridolfo:
The new Sense 2.5 has those 3 big shortcut icons at the bottom (which turn to 9 when sliding up); that's likely what FeareX means.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] stevedebi:
Oh, is that Sense? I thought it was any WM 6 version with 6.5.x instead of just 6.5?

EDIT: Oh, the shortcut icons. I'm using Co0kies Home Tab, which has currently 25 shortcuts on 4 pages under my settings - 100 shortcuts. My ROM burned CHT into the mix and I've not used the "stock" sense 6.5.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] burtonsnow8:
You are confusing Sense, which is an HTC UI, with Windows Mobile, which is an operating system.

Sense UI comes in three different versions for our phone:

Sense 2.0 no eye candy, stock

Sense 2.1 colored slider, programs tab

Sense 2.5 Twitter, facebook tabs, quick launch icons on homepage

Then there is WM, which has too many versions for our phone:

WM 6.1

WM 6.5

WM 6.5.3

WM 6.5.5

Here is info about WM:

http://www.modaco.com/content/i9x0-...m/299717/com-branches-explained/#entry1153714
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] stevedebi:
Actually, I think the OP was the one confused.

I don't think the original author was talking about Sense. I'm assuming he has the large soft keys found in the newer WM, which has the taskbar on the bottom rather than the top. Mine is OS build 21x; the bottom taskbar is builds 23x. That is OS, not Sense. But it was actually a bit difficult to make out what the OP was having problems with.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] burtonsnow8:
Not quite. He is saying with Sense UI loaded his phone is slow. Without Sense UI his phone is responsive but looks like crap.

I would suggest trying SPB mobile shell if you don't like Sense UI. Also titanium has some nice mods which can look good.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] MooGoo:
I must be the only one left who thinks good old classic Windows Mobile today screen looks just fine.

Absolutely every piece of information you need on one screen in a simple functional list. Easily customizable as well.

It is a beautiful sight to see how quickly WinMo boots up without having to load Sense.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] Xcellweb:
Thans for the all info folks, I have spent the past week or so plodding along with the standard WinMo interface, and considering my options, using the info in this thread a guide...

Anyway, I am pleased to say the slugishness and text messaging problems of the stock ROM even with Sense disabled got too much for me, and I ended up changing the ROM...

I took a risk and decided to throw a Sense ROM on to begin with, thinking what the hell, if it struggles, ill just change it as ill notice problems pretty quickly.

I went for the Leo Cell Evo 9.1 23562 running Windows Mobile 6.5.5 and Sense and WITHOUT the HTC Messaging crap that plagued the stock ROM... and so far, I have to say, I am extremely impressed, everything runs smooth and fast, with no crashing, no SOD (yet), no massive slowdowns or hangs, and Sense is at last a dream to use, it is working how it should be!!

I am absolutely made up with this ROM, but I am also appalled at HTC's decision to expect the stock ROM to be suitable for this phone, as its only really suitable for odd call every now and again (its a £400 smartphone ffs, people dont buy them for the odd call now and again).

The ROM totally puts HTC and their development team to shame, and they should be ashamed of themselves - I have emailed them to let them know of my complete disappointment with the phone compared to my old Uni (out of the box) as I felt it was not fit for purpose with the stock ROM installed, and have mentioned the fact I have changed to a custom XDAD ROM and finally have a phone that works as it should - but why should I have to do this, and how can they expect to sell these phones to people who are not so involved or interested in modding and ROM's etc (the TP2 is aimed solely at the business user as far as im concerned, indeed the conference calling features, and the fact only Vodafone Business sell it through their retail channel in the UK suggest this to me - I got it on o2, but from a 3rd party supplier, o2 themselves dont do the phone). A business user does not want a phone that gives them hassle, they simply want on that works and is productive, with the best efficiency and no problems.

Maybe its HTC's way of saying to the world "get over to Android and save us the license fee's for WinMo" because I can't honestly see why they would release such a flawwed product when the hardware itself is fine, when using a working ROM, which HTC are either unable to, or don't want to release.

Anyway, once again XDA Developers have come to the rescue, and a well earned donation will be going to the team behind the Leo Cell ROM's next week!!

THANK YOU!! :-D
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] twiggy159:
I installed the Android OS on my phone that was found on this post:

http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=5480057&postcount=7353

I updated it and everything to what he has but occasionally my hard buttons at the bottom will either stay lit or not respond at all. Or it will even go crazy as if I were sitting there spinning my finger around the middle hard button thus making it highlight everything on my menu. That also causes trouble because then it thinks that when I press the home key it decides to bring up the call log screen.

Is there anyway to disable the "iPod Scroll" on the center hard key?
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] TheDeadCPU:
Dude. You should update to the newest build. And update Rootfs and zImages.

everything is in the XDAndroid thread in this forum.
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] twiggy159:
I updated to the one found here:

http://forum.ppcgeeks.com/showthread.php?t=104276

And my scroll wheel and hard buttons still mess up from time to time.
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] TheDeadCPU:
What device do you have? RAPH100?
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] twiggy159:
Sorry I don't know the developer names but its the HTC Fuze for AT&T so it's either the RAPH100 or just the RAPH. The start up config I'm using for Droid is the RAPH config.
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] babijoee:
Its best not to touch the capacitive DPAD and scroller during boot up. (safe time is when you can see a n d r o i d or the bootscreen.) This and having the pad clean is very crucial if you don't want it going crazy.

Try cleaning it with a wet cloth/tissue and try again.

I also had a screen protector which was massively scratched which caused problems. Ever since removing it the DPAD has been working great.
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] naviru:
dude i totally have the same problem.

i ve tried wipe it clean but no luck.

sometimes everything work great but all of a sudden the buttons go wild and start flashing. after that, nothing will bring it back to normal. maybe after a few minutes if will stop blinking, lefting one or two LEDs on, and the button is then less responsive, though still works if you place your finger on the button you want for a few seconds before pressing.

I've seen a few people complaining about this but other says its because of our own device...

However everything works normally in WM... so i guess it might be about the sensitivity or something like that.

no matter it get fixed or not, I do want a method to disable the scrolling too, and maybe the left and right buttons, because they never work even under WM...
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] reverendkjr:
Yeah, mine does that too. Its random, sometimes not happening for days, then all of the sudden it starts. And this is within the same boot. Very odd. BTW, I keep up on all builds, always update asap, and my pad is spotless. I can't really figure it out.
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] m0nk89:
also getting the exact same problem a lot, with everything up to date, clean, and not touching on bootup. would it be difficult to implement a code where we could just disable the middle scroll wheel? thats the thing that causes the most problems, and its not really that useful anyway.
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] twiggy159:
@reverendkjr

This may be off topic but, you say you leave your phone running Droid all the time? How do you not drain your battery in like 4 hours unless you leave it charging all day?

But I'm pretty sure I'm as up to date as I can be and I still get this issue.
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] reverendkjr:
Its not off topic at all. I have been using Xandroid as my one and only OS for about a month now. I do charge it quite often, and I leave it on my desk at work on a charger. I also charge it at night as I sleep. I start off the day with 100% and can go 6 or so hours without issue. I continuously get 3-4 days in a row without a reboot or a failure. I find that it has become a suitable alternative to Winmo. The difficulty that I have is that there are primary functions which I miss a bit (camera mostly). But I feel that in order for me to fully understand and appreciate this, and to be able to contribute as a quasi beta tester, I must be willing to spend as much time with it as possible. I keep up with these forums on a regular basis , checking them sometimes 2-3 times a day. It is difficult to distinguish helpful info sometimes, since there are several versions floating around, and not everyone has the same setup & environment. I search as much as I can to find my own solutions, and for the most part, I'm relatively proud of myself. I usually only chime in when something is really bugging me, or I see something valuable that I can add to a conversation.

This issue was one that I had seen a few people talk about, and it had always been chalked up to being a dirty sensor type of thing, or someone touching the pad while it was booting. Having tried all of these solutions with no success, I had come to the determination that it was not constant, it could be ignored or dealt with, and eventually someone would fix it. It is most definitely not a "hot" item, so I never made a stink about it. Now that others have brought it forward, I decided to add my experiences.

I have loads of respect for the developers, and realize that they are not doing this for me. They are doing it for themselves, and fortunately, they share it with us. I am envious of their ability to make this project possible, and have no expectation or demands. I just take what they give us, and try to make it work for me.

Just my two sense, I'll step away from the pulpit now.:cool:
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] spideyngo:
+1 for Navigation Wheel or capacitive D-pad issue

May I appeal to the developers to move Raph110 Navigation wheel to "Not working" so further development can occur. I do not touch the wheel during boot, but it still randomly flips out. My screen is clean. I did the clean cloth thing. The Navigation wheel not only flips out going all over the place. It actually rarely works the way it should in any application.

All I really need is to turn it off or disable the Navigation wheel if at all possible. Is it necessary to load the Nav-wheel capacitive drivers or can we disable them? Would it disrupt the function of the D-pad if disabled because all I need is the D-pad.

Chime in RAPH110 guys. Would you care if the Nav-wheel was disabled, because I actually think this is what is causing the issue.

I just want to make sure that I communicate to any developers that this is not a major issue. To me, I feel as though this is the only issue that I have at all. With the build I use, I honestly have no other issue which means that the Raph110 Android end product is 99% complete. To be direct, Thank you! I feel as though you purchased me a new phone, so this is no way a complaint. It is only the last 1% quality assurance analysis. ;-)

Edit: I just re-read this thread and the common denominator is HTC Fuze or RAPH110 users are having this minor issue. RAPH100 posting are saying "Just read the thread" or "use updated packages" or "clean the screen" which I think may all work and be valid for you RAPH100 users. I can indeed say without a doubt that this does not work for RAPH110.

In order for me to stop the random D-pad/Nav-wheel random scrolling, I have to screen lock it, let it go to sleep, then it might stop. It does stop mind you, but it is quite random how I am able to stop it.
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] naviru:
I think mine is a RAPH100... i cant take out the battery and double check... but mine is a unbranded version fron 3 australia... which i remember is raph100. and i totally have the same issue :( so this is not only happening on raph110 i believe.
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] kendachi:
Hey guys,

I was having the same problem in wm6.5 using many different energyroms, i disabled the scrollwheel altogether within the registry, never used it anyway. I am now getting the same problem in Android. is there is a registry parallel in android?

btw using a RAPH100 (all above fixes did not work)
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] m0nk89:
devs, is there no easy way to implement a disable scroll wheel setting?? i swear that wheel will drive me crazy at times :p
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] nkrick:
While this could be an issue with all Raph 110's (AT&T Fuze), I think it is just a subset due to hardware problems. For me, the problem only happens occasionally and it does not only occur in xdandroid, but also in WM. There is an HTC tool (for WM) named NavDbgTool.exe that will show you what is happening with the capacitive buttons/touch area on the Raph. For me, when I have issues it lights up all over and shows touches occurring that are not occurring. I know of at least one XDA member (Captain Throwback) who was able to get a replacement phone (a Tilt2) from the insurance carrier because of this issue.

Perhaps this is a problem that eventually happens with all Raph 110's due to a hardware flaw. If that is the case, maybe enough complaints to AT&T will cause them to replace all of the devices (similar to how Sprint is replacing all their Touch Pro's due to overheating issues). In the meantime, if you have insurance, you should be able to get a replacement phone, just use the NavDbgTool.exe to document the problem in WM.

Also, due to this issue, it would be nice to have the option to disable the capacitive touch area on the Raph 110 in xdandroid (while keeping the D-pad working). I don't use it for anything now that zooming doesn't work for recent versions of Opera in WM.
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] reverendkjr:
I'm starting to think that this is Winmo ROM related. I noticed that since I've used the ROM that I have installed right now, the amount of times this issue has affected me has been slim to none. I am currently running the an NRG rom from june 12 with sense 2.5.

link: http://hotfile.com/dl/47992175/ccd8b44/Energy.RAPHAEL.21905.Sense2.5.Jun.12.7z.html

I'm not guaranteeing anything, but its working for me.

Maybe it has something to do with a package that is built into certain roms. I have noticed a few times where the winmo ROM i have loaded will affect Android's performance as well. The ROM that I am currently running was also what provided me with the ability to get GPS working in Android.

I hope this helps some of you.
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] martinamw:
I don't think it has anything to do with WM. For me, it only happens in Android.
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] naviru:
firstly i have a raph100 that has this issue too, so its not just raph110

secondly, for me, this happens in wm too but a lot less frequently and seems to repair itself. It happens in android 70% of time when i boot, the 30% else happens later...

newly released zimages seem to shutdown the capacitive panel when sleeping, and this solved my problem a little bit since every time it goes crazy I can put the device in sleep then resume it...
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] martinamw:
But when it goes asleep the two buttons on the right act as back, the two on the left act as home. I think there is only one physical button on both sides, the touch figures if you are pressing back or end.
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] siulmagic:
i to am getting this no matter how many times i clean my capacitive panel and not touch it during boot process, it will always go crazy, if you want to trigger it just do a full circular motion and the bug will happen, capacitive panel goes crazy on you
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] xecuter2:
I have the exact same issue, usually it happens after I have been in android for awhile and the only way to get the buttons to work properly again is to reboot. I will have to try sleep/restore next time it happens to see if that fixes it though I'm pretty sure I have tried that already.

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[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] anthonydw:
Rubbing alcohol and some tissue worked great for me. Didn't think cleaning the button surface would work, but it did. Try it.
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] naviru:
nah didnt work on mine, i was like rubbing it all the time with wet tissues that came from KFC (definitely contain alcohol).
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] martinamw:
Bump!

It's really nothing to do with it being dirty people !! This only happens on the Fuze for some reason. Simply touching the wheel will invoke it so obviously if it's dirty that will too.

The capacitive panel doesn't wake up from standby, this is not a solution because there is only one physical button on each side. One for Home/Call, the other for Back/End. Without the capacitive panel enabled, the buttons behave as Home, and Back. So no longer have Call or Back buttons until reboot.

If the wheel could just be disabled I think that would fix it. Do real android phones have a stupid zoom wheel?
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] naviru:
I think it's more like a calibration thing that differs on each device...

Mine is a touch pro and it happens too.

but the panel does wake up on my device from standby since a update of the kernel image a few months ago.

anyway I'm really looking forward to a zoom wheel disabler too... this is really causing problem and I hardly use this.
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] nkrick:
This seems to be a much more common problem on the Fuze than other TP's. Even disabling the zoom wheel may not help. It would keep the selected item/area from moving all over, but would not fix the fact that when the capacitive area has this issue, you can't press the buttons. For me, sometimes I can only press the back button, other times I can only press the hang up button, and other times neither button works and I have to soft reset the phone. It used to be that as long as I could turn the screen off, when I turned it back on the issue would be gone. Recently that has not always been the case. Of course, if I can't press the hang up button, I can't turn off the screen...
[Touch Pro, Fuze Android Development] slack04:
Me too

I've just installed the newest Xandroid build and having the same issue as everyone else: the capacitive scroll wheel goes randomly crazy. I have an ATT Fuze, and I'm running It seems to stop for a second when i leave the phone alone for a bit, but then comes right back. I'm loving android on this phone (seriously, works much faster than WM6.5) but this may kill the experience. Congrats to the dev that figures how how to kill the stupid scroll wheel (since no one uses it anyways...). BTW- thanks for making android work on my device, devs!