yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Windows Phone 7 General] KukurikU:
first let me introduce myself. i am an engineer, a devoted wm user for more than 6 years (you also can see it on my sig:)) i am not new in this forum (check out my profile) and i am over 50 years old. not exactly the new kid on the block:D

from the title of this thread: "And more WP7 Defence (sic)". why are you doing it? who asked you? don't you really see anything wrong in m$'s butchering the wm? doesn't bother you that such a huge company isn't capable to do anything more than copying the iphone? they said they redo it from scratch...ha! they "copy exactly" the iphone.

i like to flash, tweak and use apps that do not need any approval, change the looks of my home screen or decide how many programs i have on it, i am never bored with the way my device looks or behave because i am changing it each week. i use to swap my "business" SD card with the "multimedia" one when i am on a flight or waiting before e meeting and i do sometime use my HD2 as a memory card. e-mailing to myself a file to have it on my device is ...ridiculous.

Q: why they need such a powerful device when there is no multitasking no....nothing! what for? for the big tiles :p?

i am happy with my HD2 and with the fact that right now, i do not have to wait for "official releases" of a new ROM and i do not have to worry if next update will include my device or not and i'll have to buy a new one. yes, they want us in their claws, exactly like the iphone users who have to buy a new device just to be able to enjoy "the new version".

and more...why each time i am *****ing about what wp7 is going to be, there is always some smart ass that starts explaining to me what a good business decision this is for m$? do i care about how much $ M$ is going to earn? i do not give a rat's a..s on how much cash the wp7 is going to add to the milliards of m$!:p

if somebody is wondering how a devoted wm user/fan (me) became exactly the opposite the answer is simple: iphonize the wp7 and give him hubs, hubs, hubs and tiles. a kinder garden toy..yes, i know, a profitable kinder garden toy!

and u know what? eating sh...t is bad but eating it, saying that it tastes like strawberry and asking for more...that's plain stupidity!

P.S. excuse my language but there is no way to say it elegantly.
[Windows Phone 7 General] riotman:
I think this thread already shows it why WP7 wont have a good reputation when it is released.

Everyone uses his smartphone for different aspects. To be able to do that u need to be able to have as many features as possible.Taking them away would mean taking away the freedom of every Individual. I still don't like the IPhone's restrictions, nor do i like missing features and restrictions in WP7. The argument that restrictions and missing features would improve the user's experience with the OS is pure BS. If they want to have their OS as simple as possible, fine, but they should also give advanced user the opportunity to enable features, as they are needed.

As far as i can tell i'm wonderfully contented with WM 6.5 and Mobile Shell at the moment.

The only improvement i see with WP7 is the game sector... I think there are already some nice eyecandys to come... but to be honest im also contented with pac man and tetris :)
[Windows Phone 7 General] jakem:
It's a real shame that MIX has finished and we are left with more questions than we had previously. A lot of the blame for that seems to lie with this Todd Brix (is that a real name?) character who's been dropping all sorts of vague information.

As the dust settles though the one thing that's becoming clear is that Microsoft just don't seem to have made a final decision on some of these key features. First we hear the there will be no copy & paste and then we're told that it's in the works and may be included in time for RTM or shortly afterwards. Similarly, we were told that there'd be no multitasking and now it looks like there will be limited 3rd party multitasking built in by default and that MS will decide whether full multitasking is allowed on an app by app basis through the Marketplace.

It would have been better if Todd Brix had just kept quiet or MS should have finalised these decisions before making an announcement.
[Windows Phone 7 General] vangrieg:
I think that it was exactly Todd Brix that gave some quite straightforward information, we just didn't like to hear it. :) He said that copy/paste isn't a core use case, and they'll focus on "smart" features first - they won't do C&P before they finish their first priority stuff, "delighters" etc., however long it takes.

After a geek unrest wave that followed, MS PR Dept. Damage Control folks kicked in and changed the pitch a bit, making things vague to the rescue. But if you think soberly for a second, they didn't change the message at all. "We are putting a lot of thought into it", "it will come in future updates" means absolutely nothing. It's not a commitment, it's not a promise, it's just cool air. And it doesn't in any way contradict what Brix said.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Balkin:
I think theres just way to much mis-information being thrown about here and all over the net.

This was a pretty good article on the subject!

http://www.windowsitpro.com/article...lly-Questions-Emerge-About-Windows-Phone.aspx
[Windows Phone 7 General] Kloc:
No matter what the speculation is, we'll find out the truth for ourselves eventually.
[Windows Phone 7 General] rorytmeadows:
I don't care if they come afterward. All of the things that have been missing should come out with the original release. They had ALL THE TIME IN THE WORLD to plan this. I have the right to expect higher.
[Windows Phone 7 General] KukurikU:
Have a laugh!

everything in a short flic:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdbaMOcwgUc&feature=player_embedded
[Windows Phone 7 General] fusi:
bang on m8.
[Windows Phone 7 General] qatramiz:
wtf

games.... xbox..toy ... what about people doing business!! wp7s has crap office , crap internte research, I think its A TOY FOR TEEN AGE PEOPLE.

NOT FOR ME THANKS
[Windows Phone 7 General] Geo_Ros:
amazing how these discussions go. Not that I have anything more useful to mention than what I read in this thread...

What do you want MS to achieve (Or Android, Linux, or any OS...)?

Each of them wants to get as many users as they can; from the business guy, gamer or geek.

Only thing is, you can't get all people satisfied...

Everything I read, it are all just speculations, companies will keep developing their operating systems regarding to their reactions, complaints and improvements:)

And if not, there are loads of people who will do it for them if they don't (in example XDA-developers, who rules them all...)

My opinion; just wait and see what they give us...

Whatever we get, everything gets hacked, edited, enhanced or what so ever...;)

Nothing human made is perfect, but respect to everyone who tries to.

I'll wait, see, and try to help where I can; as I like playing with all of it, to get what I like, which differs for everyone...

Decide yourself what to achieve with these discussions;)

I have loads of respect for all contributers of XDA-developers, Microsoft, Google, Symbian and all others... Don't you all agree?
[Windows Phone 7 General] zibbie:
yes...

I often am talking on the phone, WHILE looking at Bing to get directions. I need multitasking for that eventuality. So, say you are meeting friends at a local bar, that is new to everyone. And someone calls to ask where you are, and how close you are to getting to the destination. Even better if Bing 2.0 would have actually worked with the walking directions in say, NYC.
[Windows Phone 7 General] -IK-:
I agree totally.

Anyone worrying about Windows Phone 7 being locked out only need look at the past history of this community, and what it's talented device developers have managed to achieve.

I just hope MS don't lock down the phone in a way that requires hardware modifications to unlock it.
[Windows Phone 7 General] vangrieg:
I'm not worried too much about lockdowns (although 3GS example shows that it can be a real pain in the neck). Copy/paste is a different matter, it's difficult to implement as a third-party thing.
[Windows Phone 7 General] eaglesteve:
This is only the first version guys. It will improve. If they don't hackers will try to do it for them. Just like in iPhone. After jailbreaking, I can download a hugh movie file with one third party browser, listen to internet radio (second third party application), and read my RSS google reader news (third third party application) all at the same time. Copy and paste is really a must. In some forum, it is not possible to include quote of a post you're replying to unless you can copy and paste. This sorts of requirements are not unreasonable for many of us. After jailbreaking, you can install program without going through MS or Apple, so it is no longer locked down. MS is mimicking iPhone too closely to my liking. I think WPS7 would have been a hit if they had mimic the jailbroken iphone's functions and features rather than the out-dated stock version. In this regards, I'm a little disappointed with MS. Having said that, I wish them success, and hope to see more competitions to spur Apple on. I hate Apple's continous attempt to block the jailbreaking.
[Windows Phone 7 General] JAmerican:
As I always say, never get the first of anything! Look at the Zune HD. It's the first of its kind and yet Microsoft has already ditched it because it won't get the advancements of Windows phone 7 series. Same for the first version of Windows Phones. I bet they won't receive updates for Copy and Paste or other essential features. You will need to buy a new phone with 7.1 on it. I'm getting the HTC Supersonic with Android and when the Windows Phones come out with 7.1, I'll consider it then.
[Windows Phone 7 General] blanket:
this thread just serves to remind me of

1. how the iphone has lowered the expectations of us ppc users to the level of an iphone user

2. why was the term 'ppc' coined for our devices (the apple is a SMARTPHONE! my ass. it's more like a stupid device trying to act smart. just ask your friendly iphone user if he thinks he's using a smartphone)

3. how the mighty have fallen. just look at how hard m$ is trying to follow the tail of apple by trying to imitate their iphone

also, xbox live on my phone? zune?

i would like psn on my phone instead please. and my cowon s9 satisfies my mp3 craving. my phone's battery can be better conserved for other things
[Windows Phone 7 General] blanket:
i wonder if this guy remembers what does the acronym PPC stand for

http://www.windowsitpro.com/article...lly-Questions-Emerge-About-Windows-Phone.aspx
[Windows Phone 7 General] cadorna:
I propose a new campaign:

"I'm people... and I use copy & paste !"
[Windows Phone 7 General] redoxy:
Awesome video enjoyed watching it.

Well i have decided not to comment on WP7 until tte final release and i see what it can do and cannot do. But as it stands now if it is released in the current state then i will stick with my WM6.5. Since it provides all the functionality i need as well as the freedom i want in a device.
[Windows Phone 7 General] clubbtraxx:
Well said, 'Nuff said...

WP7 already sucks before it even comes to market, for me the HD2 was the last of many wm phones I had...

with all info about missing features in wp7 it's byebye winmo for me. I mean c'mon no SD support, no multitasking, no C&P, an ugly interface...

What's left to even slightly consider this OS? I'm switching to Android as soon as the Desire is out in the shops.

CT
[Windows Phone 7 General] CoderHead:
No, it's the seventh version. Revamping the UI to make it more finger-friendly and getting rid of menus/nested menus is a great thing. But why remove basic functionality that's been a part of the Windows smartphone experience all along? That's why I have a WM phone instead of an iPhone - because the iPhone just doesn't give me what I want!

I don't want to fall into early-on, uninformed speculations but if Microsoft really is pulling every bit of geekiness out of the Windows Phone and dumbing it down for the technology-deficient soccer moms, then I'll take my business elsewhere.

And seriously...XBox and Zune on my phone? Who freaking asked for that crap? :confused:
[Windows Phone 7 General] vangrieg:
Most certainly a lot of people want games on their phones, a lot of them for some weird reason care about XBox achievements and PS3 Trophies, and even I would love a good media player on my phone.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Seraph321:
Just got back from MIX and am starting to read the forums. Wow, some quite misguided things in here; some of it subjective, some just plain wrong. Keep in mind while reading my comments that I'm currently a huge Android/Nexus fan. My current WP7 verdict: I LOVE the UI, but it can't replace all essential (imo)functions of my Nexus yet, so I'll be watching future versions.

Now, to be a bit more specific:

I liked your post overall, but you'll be disappointed to learn that your Pandora example actually will NOT work in the first release. I asked two developers about this directly. There is no api for 3rd party apps to use that will just hand off an arbitrary media stream (like internet radio) to the built-in music player so that it can continue playing in the background. I listed this to them as one of the things that will keep me from switching and that it would be fairly easy for them to fix this. It was nothing they hadn't thought of, but it's not there yet.

I also talked to them about why I care about multi-tasking, and that 99% of the time I really only need it for services. Things that add underlying features the OS doesn't have by default. Like Locale, or even simpler things like turning the ringer off if the phone is face-down. They need a UI-free service app model, but again, this will not be in the first release.

You can obviously be disappointed if you want, and demand whatever you want, but the fact is that MS didn't make the critical decision to break with WM and build WP7S until this time last year. They've designed and built an entire OS and all those first party apps in 12 months! That's crazy fast. It's staggering. I still find it hard to believe. It's thanks in large part to the freedom the team was given, and the quality of its people; but it's also thanks to them leaving out a bunch of stuff. You can argue they should have made the decision earlier, but I'd rather just be glad they did it. I think they are going to push Android and iPhone to be that much better, and I'll just keep using whichever fits me best at any given time.

Talk to the team for five minutes and see if you still think that. I see SO much evidence to the contrary that I just don't understand how you maintain that position. The WP7 team is packed with highly skilled and passionate designers. I would argue the opposite; I don't think many of the people on the WP7 team give a crap about Microsoft in terms of its overall business, they just want to make an awesome device, and they were given incredible freedom to do that. This is how companies change.
[Windows Phone 7 General] rorytmeadows:
haha, you're exactly right.

I want my pocket pc to run like a motherfu**ing pocket sized pc. That means registry, file explorer, copy and paste, and installing whatever apps I want to.
[Windows Phone 7 General] WhyBe:
Hey, I bet a device like that would really dominate the smartphone market...:rolleyes:
[Windows Phone 7 General] leonatan25:
The dumber the OS, the larger the influx of idiots coming to defend their precious crap. :rolleyes:

It has happened with every WM forum that has added iPhone sections, and it is bound to happen here as well. Scratch that, it seems to have happened already. :rolleyes:
[Windows Phone 7 General] cerealfreak:
I agree with most of you, I don't want an iPhone clone, which is what WP7S is turning out to be. The very core of Windows Mobile since its conception has been PocketPC, and that's the reason we all currently buy WinMo devices. We want the PC feeling in the palm of our hands and we get that.

Another big thing is customisation, I change my ROM to one that suits my needs (Thanks NRG) I choose what is displayed I choose what shortcuts people can see and I choose whether my phone acts like everyone else.

MS want to tap into the Apple Sheep and claim some of that market share back, I can understand that I am sure we all can, they are a business after all. But to do that they are sacrificing our loyal custom? That's just poor business, any decent business manager will tell you to always stick with your core business.

Fine MS make it appear dumbed down for those iClones out there, but give us the ability to change it as we see fit, it is our device and it is the way you have operated for years.

I like the minimum hardware specs they're great, the one thing always missing from my WinMo device is a decent camera with a flash! But I like getting apps people have created, I like storing what I want on my SD card and then accessing it how I see fit, I like the fact at present I can copy a paragraph and paste it anywhere I see fit. MS are taking this away, not to mention the lack of multitasking, this is needed, regardless of what the iClones say. I need to be able to use my SatNav/GPS, whilst taking a call, or sending an email or even playing some music. There are many legitimate reasons, and before anyone says anything no I wouldn't be sending an email whilst driving I am the passenger and she drives I use my phone to navigate!

They are thankfully going to continue support for 6.5.X but for how long and are they going to start locking it down as well? I can't upgrade until Summer 2011 so I have plenty of time, but I would have happily bought one on the release date if I could do everything my current HTC TP2 with Energy's Leo w/Cookie monster and my chosen app set can do, and then some.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Spike15:
That's the stupidest load of crock I've ever heard.

Windows Mobile users everywhere are quickly turning into Stockholm Syndome affected iPhone users.

You shouldn't have to defend the deficiencies of your product. You should take the producer to task on it, withhold your money, and force them to change.

That's the way the consumer model is supposed to work, something people have forgotten, which is why you have companies producing products no one likes and yet still making money -- people have forgotten how to speak with their money, and thereby force corporations to appease their consumers.

All the arguments are null and void.

Why?

BECAUSE THE PERSONAL COMPUTER EXISTS.

You say that locking down devices and operating systems is OK because networks don't want to deal with botnets/their network being compromised, and because IP distributors want assurances of DRM adherence.

NULL AND VOID.

My ISP hasn't kicked me off their network for running my own network of 10 PCs and 5 servers, and I can still buy music and movies on my PC, even though I, not Microsoft or Google or Apple are in complete control.

Pull your head out of your ass for Christ's sake.

Your analogy is dumb.

Windows -- the successor to DOS, just in case you've forgotten -- had all of DOS' functionality, and more.

They had DOS -- which did not have multi-tasking -- and then ontop of that they build Windows, which did have multi-tasking.

The features that Microsoft is taking out of WM from 6.x to 7 are features that Windows added to DOS.

No one complains about Windows being too complex, and yet in Windows you have multi-tasking, copy and paste, and file system access.

In fact, I can guarantee you that if multi-tasking or file system access came out of Windows, it would very rapidly lose its ~92% marketshare to Linux.
[Windows Phone 7 General] WhyBe:
No it wouldn't. That's just conjecture. No one wants Linux now, and no one would want it then. The people that want Linux now, have it now.
[Windows Phone 7 General] Spike15:
You clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

No multi-tasking and no file system access would have Windows thrown out of every business setting instantly. There goes an extremely large part of Microsoft's market.

And then what's left is the home market. My computer illiterate mother multi-tasks constantly. My semi-computer illiterate photographer father multi-tasks constantly. My computer illiterate brothers multi-task constantly.

Linux isn't the only option you know, there's Mac OSX as well.

This is a ridiculous move.

I think everyone's forgotten that multi-tasking was one of the biggest breakthroughs in computer history:

See here
[Windows Phone 7 General] rorytmeadows:
My IQ is above 100, so of course I want a "more complicated" phone. I can handle it.
[Windows Phone 7 General] K159:
Have you ever considered using System Center Operations Manager? Or something similar from a 3rd party (CA, IBM, Novell, ...)?

Would make your life so much easier and more productive. You would be able to monitor and manage your servers and PCs from a web browser so need to waste your time with RDP and ping.

What I am hoping for is a decent Metro styled WP7S app for System Center Operations Manager plus Push Notification support for SCOM so that I get notified when somehting went wrong. From the notification I would launch the SCOM app and the app will give me some options to fix the problem (restart service, server, call someone on site, ...).
[Windows Phone 7 General] KukurikU:
best post on the wp7 forum! you r so right! kudos! i tweet the link to yr post.http://twitter.com/hvoltage/statuses/10834744819
[Windows Phone 7 General] cerealfreak:
How high over a hundred? The average IQ is 105-110? I know I've been in Mensa since I was 4
[Windows Phone 7 General] bestfan:
i welcom c&p back, but i can't stand WM without multi-task, i don't want to shut browser to reply SMS then open it again while i am surfacing internet likes iphone does...
[Windows Phone 7 General] WhyBe:
What's with this cliche that people who want easier phones are dumb or unintelligent? :confused:

This may have some truth, but doesn't tell the whole story. Some people get to a point in their lives where they don't want to tinker with their devices, they just want a powerful device that works really well. I love the WP7 OS concept and was wishing for something like it long before I knew about it. I've flashed ROMs, built PC's, ran music studios and just got into professional photography. IOW, I am not a dumb or non-technical person by any stretch of the imagination.

What ALL people have in common is the 24 hours in a day. We all choose how we spend most of that time. Some choose to do physical activity, some are social, some sit in front of a computer. Your choice doesn't make you dumb. Some individuals just choose to spend more time tinkering with gadgets.

If people with iPhones and WP7 phones have low IQ's, then that would mean no one at NASA has an iPhone, no doctors have an iPhone, no engineers and no college professors will buy a WP7 device, etc.. So the low-IQ generalization just doesn't hold true.

Isn't the browser in WP7 one of the system apps that DOES multitask ?
[Windows Phone 7 General] Kloc:
All of the core features are multitasking enabled meaning you can do ALL of the following at the same time (if you needed to):

Read Email, SMS, MMS

Surf Web, Load web page

Listen to music

Edit Documents

People Hub

Pictures Hub

Use one 3rd party app.

etc.

Basically anything you would need to mulitask for is there. You just can't run two 3rd party apps at the same time.
[Windows Phone 7 General] eaglesteve:
The third party application must be in the foreground though.
[Windows Phone 7 General] C:Sharp!:
That's exactly why NOT "anything you would need to mulitask for is there".

As soon as you put Pandora to the background, it stops playing. Useless.

If you put your GPS tracking app to the background, it stops tracking. Useless.