yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Windows Mobile Software Development] Shasarak:
Indeed, I think it's fascinating.

Yes, but you don't know what it would be like in China and India if you put in lots of pavements, road signs, and traffic lights, do you? When experiments have been done using both approaches in the same area one after the other, the conclusion has been that "shared space" results in fewer accidents and faster traffic flow. So, introducing pavements, road signs and traffic lights in India would very likely make things worse rather than better.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] irdawood:
There are places that have traffic lights and such...however very few abide by them and require a warden to monitor them 24/7 otherwise drivers would not stop at the red light.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] vangrieg:
All this talk about driving in India is definitely exciting, but doesn't it fit some National Geographic forum rather than this thread?
[Windows Mobile Software Development] chiks19018:
fewer accidents? I concur. The reason is simple. Nobody is able to drive fast, and everybody is afraid to be hit or hit somebody because it is chaos. So they are very attentive on the roads.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] rosebud:
Just wanted to reply to the people bashing android, I've been a member here since 2005 and until 2 weeks ago had only windows mobiles... I purchased a motorola milestone... and I have to say I will never look back... its stable does what you want it too my only gripe is the signed bootloader..but even that appears to be motorola being stupid next phone wont be motorola... but it wont be a windows phone either...
[Windows Mobile Software Development] Shasarak:
But what is also interesting is that the average speed of traffic flow gets faster, not slower.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] chiks19018:
for some, not for all.

The hardcore people would navigate through the chaos faster (fasterh than waiting at stoplights) due to experience/skill/talent. The noobies end up holding traffic. So it all depends on how many hardcore and noobies are on the road any given day. More noobies = slower speeds. More hardcore = faster traffic flow.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] wrsg:
is that you again, ballmer? better get those chairs ready for when android takes over ms's share of the mobile market completely.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] seed_al:
That probably won't be long from now... WM has less than 9% market share left... oO

But Google does a lot of things right, so I think they'd earn it. MS - not so much.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] ramdroid77:
yes, but the thing is that Android is stealing marketshare from Apple all the time. For Apple's response, see the patent war with HTC. I doubt anyone seriously switches from WM to Android except few geeks on this board.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] flashpanda:
Windows Mobile may 'only' have a 9% market share, but equally, the iPhone's share isn't exactly massive at under 14%. Android's 2.8% is again, nothing. RIM and Nokia are the completely dominant forces in the market, with 20% and 50% shares respectively. Marketshare wise, WM is actually doing rather well, and that will likely go up significantly with WP7S.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] vangrieg:
What exactly is Google doing right in the mobile space, apart from being the source of incredible amount of buzz? They have created a level of fragmentation unseen even in the WM world in like a year, they screw their partners by competing with them directly and even making apps not available for partners' phones, they mumble something when their key OEM, HTC, gets in trouble with Apple. With regard to developers, they have a crappy NDK, nobody knows what's going to change in the next version of their OS or whether current APIs will exist in a year. They make an OS which may be great for geeks, that I admit.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] seed_al:
...not. Cause WM and Symbian are the only ones constantly losing share.

@vangrieg

Better a crappy NDK than none at all.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] vangrieg:
Neither will allow you to make a video player, for example. So in many areas these things are equal.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] seed_al:
Sorry, but... nonsense. Having one is ALWAYS better than not having one.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] Docwiz:
Andriod? Are you friggin serious?

Read: I am not a windows Mobile fanboy.

I have tried an iphone but I don't own any smart phone.

However, I did see a guy in my office who brought in a Droid phone and

I have to say that I am simply not impressed at all.

The applications are very poor for the most part and

some of them are like palm or Windows mobile from years ago.

I did some research on the top 10 applications for Android

and then did the same for iphone. The Android is just around

because it is free as in beer. Nobody would take that OS seriously when

it comes to quality. It's an over-hyped OS that companies are pushing because there is really no competition to the iphone.

Andriod applications are seriously lacking on quality and the freedom to develop applications is also lame because it is a friggin phone. It is common sense to limit development on a phone because it is a consumer phone.

Imagine this, you are taking your droid on a trip and you install some applications on a trip and then you drive out and your car dies along side of the freeway, you take your phone out and it crashes because of that wonderful new application you just installed and now it is a useless brick and you are stuck out in the middle of no where.

This is why you can't have a completly open platform on a phone with no limits and this is why Apple is restricting development and that is why Microsoft has toned down their development.

The Android platform is just windows Mobile with simpler apps and it is free for phone manufactures.

It's like Linux and Windows 7 or Mac OS X. You guys can take your linux I want to crash and install drivers and do all kinds of kiddie command line stuff and we will get more done in a much easier way and be more productive and still program for our machines and not have them crash all of the time and just be more usefull and productive.

Free isn't better, free can just means a lot less quality and more problems most of the time.

Sure you do have your open source stars like php, apache, and mysql which all run on Windows 7 and MacoS X anyway and are the same builds. This is why I said MOST of the time.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] Shasarak:
Android is about 5%, I think. But the important point is that Android and iPhone are increasing their marketshare very, very fast, while RIM, Symbian,and WinMo are all declining.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] seed_al:
What are Windows Mobile applications then?! Like, total crap or what? ROFL.

Yes, Android is just like Windows Mobile. Except that Windows Mobile is doomed, whereas Android has lots of potential. It took Android only a year or so to surpass Windows Mobile in application quantity AND quality. And the OS itself is almost there, too (and already better in many aspects).
[Windows Mobile Software Development] vangrieg:
Here we disagree. Having one can be a bad thing if it's going to change in a year so you'll find half of your applications not working. There are optons between "There'll never be a native DK, ever. Period" and "There will be a native DK when it's really ready". Where Microsoft stands on this I don't know. And I'm not even sure they know. Ot that this won't change in a year.

They decided to do the unthinkable - dump backward compatibility. They'd better do it very right this time. Because if they break it once more a year from now lots of people will really be pissed off.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] seed_al:
Well, OK there, but that's a bit of a different story. If they say: "We aren't ready to release it yet, we want to make sure it's really good when we release it" then I'm OK with that. Of course, due to the huge lead of iPhone and Android, they have to hurry up a bit, but it's true, a rushed release that's unfinished isn't good.

But if they say "there will never be one", then I definitely prefer Androids not-so good one to not having one at all.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] gogol:
That's true, WP7S has not been released yet and for sure they are not sitting and sleep reading people reaction.

I believe they are working as hard as they could to bring it to the best they can for the release date (see notes: ).

The thing is ... how do you believe in them? Do you want to invest on WP7S later or Android now?

Sure Android is nice, open, it has already lots of apps, good dev community. But I still have doubt on it because it is more and more fragmented, hardware wise is quite obvious, upgrade is not certain.

We also could speculate on iPhone 4G next mid-year, if there will be any.

Just my thought.

notes:

Someone asked Charlie Kindle (MS Phone Developer) on Twitter:

http://twitter.com/ckindel

@wp7dev @ckindel I've gotta say: I'm really concerned by the poor scrolling response that I keep seeing in demos. What's up with that?

And Charlie Kindle answered:

@nzben We gotta have _something_ to work on before we ship! It wouldn't be any fun if there weren't any bugs to squash. ;-)

Some feedback on one of the Xbox dev blog:

http://www.ozymandias.com/your-thoughts-on-xbox-live-and-windows-phone

User Gordon wrote:

Xbox integration with WP7. What I want is simple:

* Some very nice online multiplayer games are already available when WP7 phone is released.

Not just tech demo or trailers NOW, but never (not yet) materialized on time when the consumer has WP7 phone.

That would be certainly a let down.

Btw, you mentioned turn-based multiplayer game, does it mean that MMORPG games like “Ragnarok Online” is NOT possible? Because that would be awesome, MMORPG games on the phone. I imagine some kind of “WoW” would be possible

Xbox dev replied:

@Gordon: You will see games at launch. I have no doubt of that – lots of great interest (and action) from partners!

MMORPG games are certainly possible – all it takes is the right partner with the right idea… but the platform can absolutely support it. Time and space… time and space.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] vangrieg:
Well, that's exactly what Charlie Kindle said about APIs/SDK - that they won't throw around unfinished stuff, and will work real hard to make it really good. He didn't say it specifically about native APIs, it was a more general statement. But nobody ever said that native development will never be allowed. My guess is that their focus is just on UI-heavy stuff for the simple reason that that's what will win the hearts of "ordinary consumers", so everything is thrown in that direction. I don't even think they have a choice there - if they don't establish WP as a strong consumer brand, serious developers won't ever come. In addition, they have a huge challenge to overcome the image of a buggy, lagging and unstable OS. And sandboxing the hell out of everything at least at first will definitely help them do it. They just can't screw up here. Of course, if that goes too far in limiting my experience I won't buy their phone anyway, no matter how sympathetic I am for their reasoning. :)
[Windows Mobile Software Development] ENERQI:
Excited.

I for one am really excited about the new OS, and I love my ZuneHD too.

I will be going to school to become a programmer because there are so many possibilities now. When I took VB6 in 2002 (i think) getting my degree in electrical engineering, the software side didn't excite me enough, there wasn't much to do that I would want to do. Now with GPS/triangulation, cloud storage, prox sensors, accelerometers and more, there are a million ideas, ok maybe dozens, that I have using this teck. MS is not only making it a requirement to have these sensors and such and the power to use them, but they have an easy but powerful development platform to create with.

Tho android is a great platform IMO, its not my choice OS. Luckily the market has a handful of OS to choose from, and even better that XDA has support for more than just one now.

XDA FTW!:D
[Windows Mobile Software Development] chiks19018:
14% market share with 2 phone models.

How many models does Nokia need to make it's share?
[Windows Mobile Software Development] Chainfire:
I've stated my opinion in a lot of posts in various places so I don't want to repost it here yet again (and it is subject to change), but there is one thing I want to say:

This is the most awesome post I have ever seen on XDA, and that includes my own, which I assure you I am very fond of.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] ramdroid77:
I think the funny - or not so funny - part is that Microsoft defended the restrictions in the new OS by stating "It's only a phone, not a PC" but then one of their main selling points of their new OS is a full blown 3D game environment . Alright. So is it now closer to a phone or PC? ;)
[Windows Mobile Software Development] gogol:
It is still a phone, it does not have the estate (size) and comfort (big keyboard/mouse) of a PC.

It is far far away from a PC.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] ramdroid77:
We're talking about the OS not phsyical dimensions! ;)

And then after heavy phone usage I feel that my laptop is sooooooooo uncomfortable!! Try to touch it or swipe down a window and nothing happens! :(
[Windows Mobile Software Development] gogol:
I don't think we can talk about that based on the OS alone.

It is about experience of the user using the platform.

Certainly different experience and it will never be the same.

If you think only about OS, then run the phone OS in emulator on a PC, that would help :)

Still, even if a phone can run any desktop PC apps (because phone is PC!), then the experience will not be the same (user interface and control). Thus phone is not a PC.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] ramdroid77:
what the heck are you talking about?????
[Windows Mobile Software Development] gogol:
Because it seems you only interested on the OS, and not the whole experience:)

That would help means you can use mouse and keyboard (probably).
[Windows Mobile Software Development] ramdroid77:
Yes, first I'm interested in the OS from a developer point of view.

Yes, the user experience is only coming after that.

What does this have in common with mouse and keyboard? Like I said, I'd rather have a touch screen on my laptop because I'm already used to the phone touch UI and try to scroll with my fingers on the TFT when browsing the internet.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] gogol:
I got the point, you think that in the future, the phone OS like WP7 would be used not only for the phone device.

Thing like iPad ... bigger hardware using phone OS :)

I like that idea though, but that always confuse me during buying decision.

Five device types:

- Desktop

- Laptop

- Netbook

- Tablet/slate

- Smartphone

I think the phone OS is not there yet.

I dont know, I cannot imagine in the future ... there will be only 1 OS for all devices: Windows 2110 ... :)
[Windows Mobile Software Development] kazzxtrismus:
ok ive read a bunch of this thread so far and am a little stumped.

what has happened to Microsoft in the last say 5 years...

that..

1. A has lost them market share

2. Not gained them market share

3. Been a total flop

etc

what products have been released by other vendors that...

1. have been a huge success that makes complete sense

2. have been a huge failure that makes complete sense

and the sames questions but .... makes no sense

at the end of the day if anyone at MS has any sense theyll be asking these questions...

simply put why doesn't anyone at MS know that they are losing tons of market share to MAC the app-store and the hype associated with it AND the money that goes with it

they have lost the battle for the MP3,4,5 player due to their dragass-ness on making a device that is cool and fun to use.

simply put my TOMTOM is more useful & capable than half the mp3 players out there... and it was $150

wheres the little device that goes in ur pocket plays music and video and has proper GPS functionality (WITHOUT A DATA PLAN) and will run WINDOWS 3.1??

the next step in mobile environments is a true:

touchscreen XP (desktop icons) device with

multitouch

BB like messenger (READ FREE MESSENGER)

TRUE internet browsing via wifi or 7mb data connection (desktop PC's speed)

---i mean c'mon i have a 54mb wifi connection and the internet is 10x slower than my pc---

true media player functionality

all fully skinnable and adjustable

oh ya i think youll find this is where our phones will no longer be crippled by the carriers ( at least as much)

MS doesn't spend millions to develop this stuff and lose market share to a carrier trying to offload Iphones or justify the carriers poor market placement theories or program.

mac broke the mold refusing to allow a lot of things happen to their product or OS... wp7 may leak through the same crack

don't forget that it looks like MS may have learned about bloated software.

windows 7........WP7.....hmmmmm
[Windows Mobile Software Development] Docwiz:
Well here is what I see with the problems of Windows Mobile Classic.

1) Palm started the pre-smart phone market back in 1997 when it was known as a Personal Digital Assistant (PDA). I first saw them when I used to work in NYC around the mid-1990's. They were black and white and didn't do any of the fancy things you see now.

Microsoft followed Palm into this market in 2000 with Pocket PC's and these were much better than palm at the time and were mainly for the business market.

Later on PDA's were really dying out and they kind of turned into phones and so microsoft was always prepped for the business market, but never the consumer market.

2) Microsoft tried to stuff a PC interface on a phone using Pocket PC or Windows Mobile and that doesn't work as the device is just not the same as a PC. It has different features and it is not really made for something like this. So, Microsoft was pushing an Interface that just didn't belong and it was not very consumer friendly.

So, Windows Mobile UI looks outdated later when the iphone comes out which is more consumer friendly.

3) Windows Mobile is too open and has no standards as far as phone hardware and they had three different versions of the windows mobile OS and the market became fragmented. Since there wasn't any standard an app that could run fast on my phone would run slow and unusable on yours. etc...

4) Windows Mobile is too open in software and there are no UI standards for the phone because each manufacture tries to make their own interface and the applications make the phone slower and basically usuable.

5) Everything was made for a sytlus and not a touch and easy expericence for consumers and the multimedia features were afterthoughts. Remember these were phones for business.

6) Microsoft dropped the ball in advertising a consumer platform and mutlimedia. They have been far too worried about their windows product and office product to take this product seriously in the consumer market.

Windows Mobile Classic had a lot of applications but a lot of them are old from 2002 or 2003 and a lot of them are crap and have a terrible interface and are very basic.

This is why I see so much Android in Windows Mobile Classic. It's the same thing but Google has not learned from the past.

Microsoft was ahead of almost everyone else and that is why I feel that WP7S is so much of a better product and is very progressive. Microsoft has learned a lot from their own experience in this market and what Apple has done and they are pulling out all stops to be in this market.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] Fdo35:
If you think about it, WP7S has just about everything a developer could want. These include:

A non-GPU app scaler (devs can user just about any resolution they want)

A very high list of minimum specs (so they can make high-quality games and apps)

XBOX Live (a very big deal, some people may come to WP7S just for that)

OEMs can't edit the OS to the extent that it would interefere with devs' apps

Great 3D APIs

High code portability between Zune, XBOX, Windows, and WP7S

It would be extremely difficult to pirate apps*

Possible support of the free versions of Visual Studio

Devs will know specifically what to expect in WP7S devices

I'm sure there are other reasons, but these are justv a few obvious ones.

*This is probably part of why Microsoft won't allow access to native APIs, and (likely to happen) the devices whole file system. Without these, it would extremely difficult, if not impossible, to create malware for WP7S and to pirate software. Always a plus.
[Windows Mobile Software Development] ramdroid77:
Silverlight doesn't allow access to file system by definition as far I know, so if I think about it then this scenario might be very likely. Seems like I'm out of the game then as well. If not proven wrong my Microsoft (I doubt that) then I'll keep sticking to my Topaz with 6.5.x until I'm old and grey and take my focus back on Windows desktop development (until they'll forbid the win32 api there as well haha). Bye bye WM! :(

In the end WP7 is good for Microsoft and it's the only way to take down Apple from their throne so it's definitely a good thing - but just not for me! A phone which you can hack up to basically anything you want is good for freaks like us but is of ZERO interest for the mass market for which it's clearly targeted for.

Oh and don't come along with Android. Just like WM 6.x it is already outdated by the "new standard" that WP7 will bring...
[Windows Mobile Themes] killkyo:
Carbon Fiber looking clock, background and slider tab for Sense 2.1

Hope there will be someone who likes it. Thanks....
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] see:
hey there,

do anybody know a solution to repair the acive sync problem?

Since about one month my active sync does not react about a usb plug in... FileTransfer and Internet Shareing is working perfect!

yesterday i flashed an original rom but i still have the same problem.

when i plug in the usb the win mob center does not activate anything...

all the best

seb
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] purk_7:
I would check under settings, usb, if the advanced USB is NOT checked.

If checked i can't sync, and without the advanced mode i sync ok.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] see:
hey man!!

how stupid is this??? it's working....

thanks alot!
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] brandonhall517:
having same issue, but that doesnt fix it, i have tried EVERYTHING. stock rom att tilt2
[Touch Diamond2, Pure General] kyleong:
Solved, Thanks
[Touch Diamond2, Pure General] leemoss84:
wm 6.1 is in this thread but its not the one that came on the td2. check out htc's site.

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=582081