yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] freyberry:
No, Windows doesn't run on ARM processors. Forget about it.

But you wouldn't be able to control the Windows GUI on a 3.8" screen anyway.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Rim1Flex:
Hope this helps everyone understand more about Windows Mobile Se7en. http://www.wmexperts.com/barcelona-and-wm7-what-we-expect-and-what-we-are-hearing

-----Go Cavs!-----
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] freyberry:
I already linked to this above, but thanks ;)

As said before, looks *really* good and it's really what I expect. It will take the competition years to catch up if all of that is true. Nice.

Now I hope full synchronization with Windows Live will be there, too. The missing caleandar sync feature is really annoying, especially when you look at how far Google's offerings have come. And PLEASE, finally a wothy successor to Voice Command, because that software was great.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] uniqueboy:
Like sorg says on the previous page, seven devices may well be atom powered. Also from your own link wvga will be the lowest possible resolution, the lg phone mentioned is said to have wxvga and obviously the whole point is the gui, that is the deal breaker for most users and with seven it seems a lot is going into developing the gui. Similarly on Windows 7 it is optimised for touch interfaces, so why not strip it down build a new gui for it and make that the core for the next gen windows mobile, pocket pc would literally finally be that.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] freyberry:
Those phones run ARM. That means WM7 runs on ARM. Windows does NOT run on ARM.

Conclusion: WM7 can't be Windows (based).

Forget about it. Maybe later Windows and Windows Mobile version will share the same kernel (MinWin?), but not WM7 and Windows 7.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Rim1Flex:
As more information comes out, I hope you guys influence family and friends to switch to a windows phone.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] freyberry:
You can bet on that! :D

Hm, my brother intends to buy a Nexus One (HTC Bravo). He's not a poweruser, so that's currently better for him. But, if a WM7 upgrade for the HD2 is confirmed, I'll tell him to buy an HD2. But of course, it must be confirmed before he can buy the HTC Bravo here in Europe ;)

Or at least, if we know enough about WM7 by then, I'll advise him to wait. I gave him my Touch HD, he likes it quite a lot and he'll certainly wait for a WM7 device if it is announced soon enough.

What am I trying to say? According to all the rumors WM7 certainly looks promising, but MS needs to get that thing out! :)

Important side note:

I've already converted many people to Tablet PCs. If that Apple 'tablet' thing is real, then PLEASE do not let Apple take all the credit for having 'invented' the tablet, like they did with smartphones!

You need to talk to the public a lot more about the great things you have and don't let others take the credit for 'inventions' you've had for years! It already happened once with the smartphone, don't let it happen again!
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] uniqueboy:
I'm sure your'e right but it's nice to dream.:)

Just one thing though (probably gonna sound even thicker now lol) but why can't windows run on arm? Microsoft could make it run on anything if they put enough effort into building it to run on anything.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] freyberry:
Sure, but for now they have WinCE. It may melt together with the Windows kernel some time in the future. Or phones will have x86 processors... http://blogs.zdnet.com/microsoft/?p=2953
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Duron23:
What's the point on putting such a heavy kernel for a Mobile. More over, people here are forgetting that PC os [ Windows 7] is not a real time OS. Mobile phone OS have to be a Real Time OS [RToS].

Think if a call comes in and your phone is busy in running some application and won't show you the call, or show's you after 15-18 sec's, will you accept such kind of performance from a phone, for its basic functionality ?? No.

That's why bring a PC's os to Mobile phone is a bad idea.

That's why MS has created a new kernel with RToS concepts and named it WinCE
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] snuk182:
heh... years ago Nokia made its Symbian leaped from 8th to 9th with no backward compatibility, cause it rewrited (optimized) the core. had nokia e70, which was rocket fast with just 220MHz and 16 Mb of RAM (but nokia has the other problem - the RAM was TOO small for all other apps... but those times are far away, thanks God). If Microsoft do so, plus it do this pretty (yes, simple but shiny UI), it will take back its number of applications very quickly. Despite the binary incompatibility. Nobody liked cars, nobody had believed, that they will be better than horses :)
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] harunjo:
FYI guys

http://www.neowin.net/news/lg-confirms-windows-mobile-7-devices-to-ship-in-september
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] freyberry:
Old 'news' as well, harujo. Sorry ;)

But there's something that still is very unclear to me. They have WM6.5.X, WM7 Business and WM7 Media. Three versions. Really? That would probably hurt the Windows Phone brand a lot. Imagine someone buys a high end WM7 Media phone, likes it and recommends Windows Phones to others. They then buy WM6.5.3 phones, expect them to have a modern UI etc. based on what they were told, but instead they find out the the UI is kinda ugly, no smooth experience etc.

I really can't imagine that this would do the brand any good.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] harunjo:
no problem..at least i tried :D
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] freyberry:
Have you read the article on wmexperts.com? It's really worth reading.

And maybe someone can enlighten me what's the point of those three versions and how is Microsoft going to position them, so that people don't get confused and upset when they buy a WM6.5.3 phone and find out that it's not even close to what they've seen/heard about Windows Phones?
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] harunjo:
yes i read that before, still unconfirmed news for me,

how about non touch device in win 7? is there any news for that?

i will defenitly change my phone to android next year if microsoft not release win 7 this year.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Eoinoc:
I'm pretty sure Symbian, iPhone and Android are not Real Time. I know you are right that Win CE is but that's because of it's heritage of being a general purpose embedded OS and not a critical necessity for a phone OS.

Real time OS reactions time are measured in tiny time scales, not on the order of 15-18 seconds.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] freyberry:
Source: http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2010/0...2-review-iphone-perspective-smartphone-robin/

Exactly what I said earlier. Microsoft has had all the great stuff for years, but they failed miserably at linking that stuff together and marketing it for consumers (and btw., every businessman is a consumer as well).

Maybe, if the rumors are true, they finally got it. And the result might be great.

But what's still saddening is that it took Apple to make Microsoft realize what they had to do.

And what's even more saddening is that I foresee the same things happen again, this time with tablets. Apple will "claim" to have invented the tablet, just like they did with the smartphone, and the whole world will believe it. Just like with smartphones and all the other great stuff, Microsoft has failed miserably at marketing one of the greatest technology of the last decade, the Tablet PC.

It's sad that 95% of all the people who see me inking on my laptop screen have never seen such a thing before. But when I explain to them what that is, they're all interested and I already convinced lots of them to buy one for themselves. Why can't Microsoft do that?

Well, at least for smartphones, that sad story might come to a happy end soon...
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] hdubli:
Well I agree what u say..

but i myslef tried using tablet, windows xip/7 based, somehow was never confoirtable..it is more towards show off value..people get surprised when u write on a big screen..but given a case of serious working say ROM cooking :p tablet might not aid much a good notebokk or a desktop is much preferrable.

But yes if the similar concept is on a handhelp and a true mobile device, like our windows phone, this can be a huge success..

I personally foresee a more future towards the handhelds rather than a tablet or something.This is am saying the eight years of experience in telecom and using various types sizes of gadgets and gizmos :)
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] hdubli:
Well MS can have a regeion wise thinking , if what u say is correct..6.5.xx for lower end phones target middle east, SEA countries..and WM7 can be for US only..this could be possible, and is just my logical guess :)
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] addicus:
When MS said WM6.5 was for lower level devices and WM7 would be for higher end devices I figured WM7 was no longer going to be backwards compatibe and was completely fine with it.

-

What I'm flabergasted about is how many people are pissed at MS for actually stepping up to create a brand new OS and have the ability to be media centric like Apple and Google hav done with their mobile OS's. The thing that has held them back the most (besides just stupid mistakes) is creating systems that connect technologies that aren't anywhere near each other and keeping the old stuff viable. I mean we are now speaking of 10 years of technology advances in which the way the world operates and consumers expectations have changed and matured. Windows Mobile CE has just about reached the max of what it can do when trying to fulfill the needs of the new consumer base and it's demands.

-

Although many of us respect the awesomeness of WM and it's ability to do just about anything, we must be aware the average consumer is not willing and/or capable of doing the procedures necessary to get the job done. The average consumer sees the simpleness of the Iphone OS and Android and think they are the more mature systems when they are actually trying their best to do what WM does and look pretty doing it. Let's see how well these systems are 10 years on the market. The average consumer is the trend buyer and they spend money in big bunches so if MS doesn't build a system that accomadates them MS isn't doing it's job as a business.

-

My request is for people to stop saying they are abandoning or leaving WM phones if they don't do what the other mobile systems do plus, plus, plus. The parameters aren't the same. Apple and Google had fresh slates to start with and no businesses to support. MS is the business platform the world uses when you look at the PC market and mobile market. Business wise only RIM with Blackberry can say they have the same type of business level penetration and they don't make major changes either because business hates large, broad changes. If WM7 doesn't have backwards compatibility it will be the ballsiest business move a large corporation has actually enacted in the last 20 years.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] littld:
They can. From memory, the early releases of Windows NT ran on different (non x86) hardware. The difference was a single kernel file in the install.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] TehPenguin:
Actually, that's a lot like MS thinking - you've completely forgotten Europe, Canada and Australia :rolleyes:
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] jagan2:
Exactly, i agree with u.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] freyberry:
Come on... the only reason to use WM is because it does much more than all the others.

If they take out multitasking, file explorer, registry editor... then I can as well use Android or an iPhone. And I will.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] ramdroid77:
yes, multitasking and the whole registry can be easily enabled/disabled for an OS.....

I don't get all the hate against WM. I don't think it's that bad at all. Actually I share a lot of love for my 6.5.3 - and if you guys are only looking at a fancy GUI you get this with Titanium, Sense, Mobile shell, Samsung widget things and whatever. Good luck porting them to gayphone or andruins.

WM 7 will be awesome I'm sure.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Badwolve1:
Well, i think i'm gonna add a poll, maybe then we can see if this thing i heard was true or not, we seem to have a pretty even balance of CE based and not CE based
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] freyberry:
Actually it is still good. But it WILL suck if they lock it down like Apple, with no multitasking etc.

If WM7 is a locked down dumbphone OS like the iPhone OS, then I will stay with WM6.5 and later switch to Android as soon as that is mature enough (and it almost is now).

The only things the current WM6.X lack is a pretty UI, APIs, better UI library for VS2008 and better integration with Microsoft's own services (Windows Live calendar syncing? Zune?).

I think they should not have started from scratch, but instead added those things to the current WM6.X and maybe port everything to CE6. That would not have taken them so long and would have been totally sufficient.

I hope that some Microsoft employee can comment on those rumors about the lack of multitasking etc. - and hopefully call them BS!

@Badwolf

Totally useless poll, sorry. Neither of those answers is true. It is CE7 based.

Anyway, it doesn't matter what it's based on, as long as they have not removed *any* of the features WM6.5 currently offers.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Rim1Flex:
No Microsoft employee will say any "insider" info.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] freyberry:
Well, at least it seems like they're spreading wrong "insider" info:

http://www.mobilecrunch.com/2010/01/18/everything-you-need-to-know-about-windows-mobile-7/

At least I hope it's wrong. But if it were true, your claim that 'no Microsoft employee will say any "insider" info" would be wrong.

Or that website just made up some BS.

One of those theories is certainly true.

EDIT: But hey, what if I'd say I take your unwillingness to deny the info given there as a hint that it is indeed true what they wrote (lack of multitasking etc.) and because of that, I'll switch to Android? Would you try to stop me?
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] brandall:
Very nicely put - totally agree with you.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] frmariam:
Breaking backwards compatibility sounds like a kamikaze move... Plus no multitasking... I'd dump the platform to Android for future devices.

The only reason I have a WinMo is the fact that some of the apps I use are only available for it and the loads of free awesome apps available for the platform (well that plus my shear Apple hate... and my biased opinion that the iPhone is an overpriced piece of hardware with a subpar OS).

If they break 6.X apps on 7 say bye bye to every piece of soft you ever purchased plus everything free and cool out there. All the things developed and the knowledge acumulated over the years will be useless.

Also devs don't quite like having to learn everything from scratch (lets face it Microsoft doesn't document their work quite that well). I also assume that companies won't love that every piece of soft they have suddenly becomes a heap of junk...

The actual core components of the current WInMo don't take so much space (I mean look at all the lite roms). Even if they need to bundle WinMo 6.5.X components I'm sure they can find a way to add a compatibility mode. Else the way I see it they'll lose their professional crowd to Blackberry (that will have more professional apps for some time after 7 is released) and the devs and casual users to Android and iPhone...

But hey it's just my 2 cents.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] freyberry:
Exactly. Though I don't care too much about backwards compatibility.

But if they take out only one single little feature that WM6.5 has now, then I'm done with Windows Mobile.

But seriously, can Microsoft be stupid enough to piss off all their powerusers (which happen to be pretty much their only WM customers)? I don't think so.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] l3v5y:
I'm willing to trust what conflipper said earlier. He's never been wrong yet :)
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] fards:
i think he may gave made a typo once upon a time... :p but i agree wholeheartedly!
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] freyberry:
I think this is the truth about WM7: http://bit.ly/MYk2M

Except for the kernel version. That's probably CE7. And let's hope that the article is right about multitasking being preserved.

But overall, it goes well in line with the article on WMExperts. I remembered this when I thought about Mel Sampat's words at WinMo devcamp.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] dfw06:
Microsoft just recently released its Marketplace, and now all the Apps will be thrown out because WM7? What a joke.!!..i'll wait for the official release..rather than speculation.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Duron23:
What non-sense talk is this " No Multitasking and Backward compatibility "

Guys, when the so called smartphone platforms, like iphone, andriod and alike are working day and night to bring the same kind of multitasking ability WM has, Why would MS dump it in its so called major most awaited release WM 7. It is really a dump thinking our part.

And if WM7 is non-backward compatible then why would they release Myphone, marketplace and other software's now, instead of waiting till WM7 to release and release with it ?

Really a dump thinking or speculation on our PART guys.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] anaadoul:
I guess this will end the discussion

http://wmpoweruser.com/?p=12295

WM7 is Using CE7
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] ramdroid77:
So far that's the most realistic spec for WM 7

O'right! So there's quite some changes coming after our applications:

- kernel changed from CE 5 to CE 6 (desktop windows memory model)

- Cellcore moved from WM to CE

Tools digging to deep in the OS are obsolete. About anything else we got good chances and it's still working. At least I see no reason why it shouldn't. The apps probably just might look "lost" in the new UI in a similar way like the old PPC 2002 design-for-stylus applications do today in days of Titanium/Sense UI.

The IPhone will look like **** next year.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Duron23:
When that happens and because of WM, then I will be one of the, Millions of happy people :D
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Badwolve1:
Lol

You said that i shouldn't get an iPhone :p
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] freyberry:
Well, currently, an iPhone would be a total waste of money.

What I said was: If they take out multitasking etc. from WM and make it as limited as the iPhone, then we can as well use iPhones. But in that case I would probably stay with WM6.5 until Android is mature enough.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Badwolve1:
Can we use our CE 5.2 code + apps :)

It would be much simpler than having to rewrite everything

:D

Badwolve1
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Badwolve1:
Note, Editing first post to look at that WM link :p
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Badwolve1:
OK :D

I could live with 6.5.3

Because its still CE, is there any chance of it on my Diamond?

Badwolve1
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] addicus:
Looks like we will be getting 2 versions of WM 7. A business version and a media version.

http://wmpoweruser.com/?p=12261

For those wanting/waiting for or having a HD2 here is a nice tidbit of rumor re: the Business Version:

"The HTC HD2 reportedly is able to run this version currently and it is slated for a possible October/November upgrade. Also, the HD2 reportedly runs Seven with "minimal lag" at this very early stage of porting." - http://www.wmexperts.com/barcelona-and-wm7-what-we-expect-and-what-we-are-hearing
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Badwolve1:
The HD2 should get an upgrade, i mean, look at its processor, 1GHZ!!! thats nearly as much as my 2133, 1.2 GHZ
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] freyberry:
Sorry to disappoint again, this is old news ;)

I don't think it will be two versions, rather two "experiences", which means there will be phones with custom UIs like HTC Sense and other phones with Microsoft's UI plus additional services (a bit like what Google does with the Nexus one, but in the case of WM7, the Microsoft controlled phones will probably offer additional features).

The HD2 can run WM7 and the necessary software exists. What remains is the question whether HTC will provide an official upgrade. That's very likely, but if not, the necessary software will hopefully be leaked.

The HD2 has the same specs as the Obsession (except for larger screen and no built in 4GB memory), which will come with WM7 and could launch as early as June-August.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Badwolve1:
Heck, I still like my Diamond 1, Hope someone ports :p
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] sonus:
It really confuses me as to why people think the HD2 will get an official WM7 upgrade. The HD2 shipped with WM 6.1 Edit: 6.5, which as it stands is 2 generations behind WM7. If anything, it'll get the official WM6.5.3/6.6 upgrade, and that's where HTC will stop providing updates.

Has HTC ever given 2 OS updates to any device? No.

Does HTC have a business model whereby they prefer to sell new devices than continue selling older ones (regardless of specs) with sofware updates? Yes.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] freyberry:
FYI, the HD2 shipped with WM6.5.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] vangrieg:
Bingo. Being Russian myself, I can read mobile-review before their articles get translated, and they certainly don't deserve the reputation they have in the English-language world. They make tons of stupid mistakes and often don't get facts right. They are also very opinionated in some areas. Their chief guy is an iPhone hater, and this Murtazin is a WM hater and a huge Android fan. He lied and exaggerated more than once.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Rim1Flex:
When has there Ever been a game changing OS? This is not a money issue, its a PR issue.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] pupakota:
such people are ideal consumers, look at that, LOL.

have fun with your ..phone, man.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] kholk:
Windows Mobile 7 will be based on CE Kernel 7.0.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Badwolve1:
Look at the specs of the obbsesion and rthe LG WM7 phone, you will find that they have a 1.0 and 1.3 GHZ, i wonder why?

Maybe because it needs more power than older WM build required
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] l3v5y:
But the processor doesn't indicate that the device will get an upgrade. I belief there will be an HD2 official WM7 ROM, though that's not certain yet.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] l3v5y:
I think that may well be what happens :)

And that would mean the hardware for the MS builds could be delayed, whilst HTC have hardware ready, leading to the differing release time frames.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Badwolve1:
My first iPAQ wouldn't run winmo 2003 V1, no processer power, 183 MHZ, rom flashed fine. enough RAM to run wm 2003

if i had a HD2, i would expect a upgrade,
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] RustyGrom:
That's like saying 6.5 requires a 1ghz CPU since it was first shipped on the HD2.

Those are just the fastest chips readily available when it launches. I wouldn't be too surprised to see a phone or two ship with lower clocked CPUs.
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] Badwolve1:
Probably, I was just p****ed at pupakota when i posted.

I still wouldnt mind having that LG Phone, 1.3 GHZ Isn't small :p

But if the LG one isn't put onto this forum, i will probably get an Obsseseion
[Windows Phone 7 Development and Hacking] uniqueboy:
A lot of people on this forum can already say "my phone is an obsession" :D