yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[General Questions and Answers] ColonelZap:
Thank you so much for this detailed instruction, I really appreciate it!:)

I tried it, unfortunately it didn't work for me :(

After + 1 hour it still says: GPS on Seek: 0

I'm starting to believe that this phones actually has a hardware defect?!? Whatever navigation software or GPS tools I use, GPS is ALWAYS found, Comport is open and it looks like data is flowing but never does this phone find any satellites :(

Anything else I might try?

Thanks :)
[General Questions and Answers] ronp76:
There are two more things you can try (actually three but I will save the worst for last):

#1 - To help your GPS, it is best for WM to manage it (a recommended feature from Microsoft). Go to the Settings tab, External GPS (why it is called that on my Settings tab is beyond me). Then click through the screens to have WM manage the GPS. On one tab you will asked to choose a Port from which all your programs will access data. You need to use an unused Port. I recommend Port 8 but that is up to you. Previously Ports 1 - 4 have been used by other programs. 5 - 8 are free and supposedly TMS uses Port 9.

The reason for doing this is if WM manages the data, it will keep the GPS on and provide the resolved info to all applications. If the programs managed the GPS, they could selectively turn on and off the GPS and also block each other from using the GPS. You don't want that to happen. That is why MS recommends WM manage the data.

#2 - While I have never used this option, Assisted GPS (AGPS) is the second option. You activate Assisted GPS by going from the Today screen to Settings and then System. AGPS is one of choices on this tab. Once selected, AGPS settings page will offer the chance to Enable this utility. Click the circle next to Enable to activate this feature.

Assisted GPS will use an internet or cell tower connections to download Epheremis data to aid your GPS to determine what satellites are available to you during a given time period which is why charging is recommended. Be advised that AGPS can your data plan to access the internet and could cost you some money. Supposedly AGPS should be able to download epheremis data within a short period. The file is a small text file. But I don't do it this way and can't really advise on this although I do know theoretically how AGPS works.

#3 - While this is not the worst of options, you can plug in your phone nearest a wall that is not obstructed by being in the middle of your house or apartment and turn on the GPS. If there is a room with a window where you can leave the charging phone, that would be a preferred location. In some cases, it can take hours for a phone GPS to be found. You could do this overnight if not having use to your phone is a pain for you. Yes, you might to leave it unattended for a long time.

There is one more option but that involves downloading another program which hopefully will not be necessary. Please try the options one by one and see what happens.

Good luck!
[General Questions and Answers] ronp76:
Correct time set and its importance to GPS position resolution

Pardon me for what I now say but, I made an assumption and would like to cover that base. Is your time and time zone correctly set?

Global Positioning Satellites (GPS) use the time set by a GPS receiver as the entering argument to determine where your GPS is. When your time and its time zone settings are received, the overhead GPS will transmit to your receiver the epheremis data which is the location and times satellites will be overhead where your time is set.

Being off one minute, a couple or even an hour *might* not be too bad. But three hours (a time zone) or using AM versus PM will seriously affect what epheremis data is transmitted and used by your receiver.

Time zone is also a similar error. Off one or two zones and the wrong epheremis data will be transmitted and used.

To use an example, this would be like telling a friend you will be in Paris at 10 AM sharp when you actually are in Milan and it's 8 PM. If your friend were to look for you at the Eiffel Tower at 10 AM, do you think they would ever find you if you actually were in Milan?

GPS receivers suffer too when incorrect time or time zones are set by the user. Granted, the user should sync the time with their computer but even some users have incorrect time set on their computers.

Hopefully this is not one of your problems.
[General Questions and Answers] ColonelZap:
Thanks again for putting so much time into my problem! :)

I just checked the time, date and time zone, it's all correct.

I tried it with and without having WM manage the GPS, right now I have this function ON in the external GPS settings. Program port 5, Hardware port 6, Baud Rate 4800. I KNOW these settings are supposed to work because they did when I first received that phone. Igo8 worked perfectly with these settings :)

about #2: This phone does NOT have any A-GPS settings. I'm SURE I looked into the right place, I have another phone (a T5355+ Touch Diamond2 clone), that phone does have A-GPS settings and they are found right where you wrote they should be. So, nothing I can do about A-GPS settings on my P3470+ phone with the problem :-(

about #3: I have my phone in a room right under my roof right now, underneath a huge window, charger connected, hoping for a positv result. In that spot I was always able to find some satellites :)

What else have I tried before:

I tried using Quick GPS, I downloaded the data, no result. I also deleted the Quick GPS data, just in case, but it also didn't do the trick.

Anyway, I'll leave my phone under that roof window for the night, I'll post the result tomorrow :-)

Thanks again for all your help, I really appreciate it :-)
[General Questions and Answers] ronp76:
You're welcome, Colonel. Every time I see a post like this, I thank my stars that I have not had this problem. I was a Mod on another GPS forum and saw this frequently but half the time it was what we called in the military "operator error" or self-inflicted.

I wonder if you have installed other GPS apps and removed them? Reason I ask is that I've noticed with WM6.1 and above, that WM seems buggy when apps are installed and removed. I don't think it's MS's fault but what I call "crippled ROMs" that we are seeing. Not all ROMs are created equal if you get my drift. If you have a backup program like SpriteBackup or SPB Backup, you might want to do a backup and then a master reset or Mass Clear to bring your phone back to an initial state where the GPS drivers should all be present. I would save that for tomorrow if I were you.

I know it's probably about beddy bye time if you're in Germany. There is two more utilities I can recommend. The first I have a doc file on which I will paste here.

Winfast Navigator (WN) is the easiest to use in my humble opinion (IMHO). I have a Holux GR-271 that connects to my PDA as a NMEA receiver on Port 4 at a baud rate of 4800. Once installed, you can use your values to test your receiver from the first page displayed.

I have attached the zip file to this message. I think you can install the CAB file to your storage card. Once you do, you can use the settings you quoted in the first window.

Here's how another member reset his GPS using WinFastNavigator and how to set your values on the first page:

http://tjworld.net/wiki/Howto/ResetGPSReceiverToNMEAMode

While I would not recommend setting your SIRF chip to NMEA, one of WN's utilities will reset your SIRF chip if you want to go that route. I would have reinstall it to my phone as I did not need it for my phone.

Not sure why but xda could not attach the file. Here is a link to it:

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=VTSNORVT WinFastNavigator.zip

Good luck!
[General Questions and Answers] ssccll:
same problem

I have the same problem with a phone like, ask the chinese rom, but not how to install on the phone :( , because apparently I need the driver (my pc does not recognize the pharos downloading clone mode), you use if you send the original ROM? :)
[General Questions and Answers] ColonelZap:
Hi everyone and especially Ronp76 :)

The night under ste stars didn't do the trick :(

I was suspecting I might have a "crippled ROM", so I did a Clean Boot a "long" time ago, with no success.

O.k., I just installed WN, clicked on Port Setting, selected SiRF and tried to set it to Port 6, Baudrate 4800. I got an error message:

"Couldn't open the Serial_AGPS COM6 port!"

Same error message on COM1 and COM3, the only port I don't get that message is "Serial_BT COM2"

Bluetooth????

When I select that Port, WN tries to connect but nothing happens :-(

EDIT: I still had BAF GPS Toggle runnning, after turning it off, I didn't get the error message on COM6 anymore. But still WN is trying to connect to COM6 and is getting nothing :-(

EDIT2: I tried a tool called "GPS Port Scan" http://www.51spsoft.com/DownInfo/info30767.html, it searches for GPS, finds it on port 5 AND (?) port 6, when I open Port 6, I can see "data flowing" (see attached picture). But that's it, when I check the GPS status with this tool, it shows no longitude, latitude or anything :-(

I didn't, should I try this anyway???

@ssccll

I know what you mean, when I put my phone into that "download mode", connect it with my laptop, Vista is trying to find a driver which I also don't have. Since I couldn't find an English ROM for that phone, I haven't really worried about that (yet) ;)
[General Questions and Answers] ronp76:
SatCE rogram recommendaton

ColonelZap,

I am sorry to hear that Plans One and Two did not work. I think you're right that something drastic has happened to your GPS and now it is not being found. Hopefully you got a one year warranty with your phone and can return it if my next couple of plans do not work.

I have Plan Three ready now and will work on Plan Four later. Plan Four involves WinFastNavigator and resetting your GPS. I will have to reinstall it on my PDA as I took it off when I made it a dedicated iGO8 GPS with TTS support. iGO8 and TTS use just all available memory. Plan Three is a program called SatCE.

SatCE is a pretty smart program that usually finds a GPS regardless of whether or not the user knows how to find its settings. Download the CAB file and install it to SD card memory. Start up SatCE and you will see the Initial Screen. This screen has interesting information once the program is locked-on to satellites. Please note that since I launched my SatCE from a cold start with my Clone's GPS, it has no satellite information.

From the Edit menu on the taskbar, choose Location. The SatCE Location Screen will appear and you will see that SatCE is using the GPS location for its eperemis data. Change this Location to the city nearest you. Then tap the Calc button on the same screen and go back to the Initial Screen.

If your GPS works, the numbers should begin to change with the Sun and Moon information the easiest to verify. Based upon your time, you should be able to see that the Sun's azimuth and elevation are correct. By setting the Location, SatCE will force your GPS to use this Location as its present position in the epheremis data equation to locate satellites.

SatCE works really well and displays some pretty neat pictures if you click on the Icons next to the Edit menu.

Good luck and I will work on reinstalling WFN.
[General Questions and Answers] ronp76:
I am just about done setting up my PDA with WFN. In the meanwhile, I will post a more detailed URL for WFN as there may be more info there that I have glossed over:

http://www.pocketgpsworld.com/winfastnavigatorppc.php

To get back to one of your questions about changing from SIRF to NMEA, I am unsure because we are dealing with Clones and I yet do not know all the specs for SIRF III which is supposedly the chip used in our Clones.

Supposedly with previous or older SIRF chips, you could change back and forth between NMEA and SIRF because that was built into most chips. I don't know if SIRF III has this capability.

One thing unknown to the average bear or GPS user is that programs can tweak your GPS chip. GPS chips have flash ROM memory like our Clones' memory. Instructions or new data can be written to flash ROM which can affect how your GPS chip operates. OR, instructions can be written and cause your chip not to work.

I hope that maybe one of your programs wrote some bad instructions which did not damage your GPS chip but reprogrammed it making it invalid. Since it worked previously with other programs that is the more likely scenario versus it failing but hey stuff happens!

I will leave you with these thoughts while I go "play" with WFN on my PDA. Colonel - this is going to cost you beer (just kidding)!
[General Questions and Answers] ronp76:
WinFast Navigator Reinitialization of GPS chip

ColonelZap,

I think you broke the code on using WinFast Navigator BUT just in case and to allow others to follow along, I will now detail how it can reset a GPS chip.

From the previous Initial Screen, a user selects Port Setting and inputs the appropriate values. If these values are unknown, they can be found by going from Today/Settings/System/External GPS. These values are set from the Initial Screen using the attached WFN Port Setting Screen. Select SIRF and your appropriate Port which can vary from Clone to Clone and HTC to HTC (this stuff does apply to HTC regular phones too).

At this point if you had a working GPS chip, you could click Connect from the Initial Screen and should get a message to the effect that your GPS was found. If not, then we will now get into some of the tweaking found from this URL:

http://www.pocketgpsworld.com/winfastnavigatorppc.php

Once you have set your GPS chip values AND know them to be correct, you will reinitialize your GPS chip using the WFN Reinitialize Screen Page. This page is found on the Initial Screen by going to Command.

Click Command and you will see the WFN Reinitialize Screen. You will select Factory from the Reset Modes available. Click OK and go back to the Port Settings page to see that the values are what you initially set.

Click Connect again and cross your fingers that your GPS chip was reset and it now back to a working Factory Mode.

BTW, WFN's Reinitialization page is good for other things too. If you ever travel more than than 10 miles with the GPS chip off, epheremis data will be written to your GPS track log with your last known position. This last known position is used to locate satellites.

Like the previous example of telling someone you're in Paris when you're actually in Milan - if your GPS thinks it's in one place when it's actually in another, this can delay the Time to First Fix (TtFF). Basically your GPS chip is going from a Cold Start with bad data.

You can force the GPS chip with WFN to first Connect using the Initial Screen page. WFN remembers the values you set. If by chance, the Connect is taking too long OR you have travelled a long distance say by plane, you can exit the program and start it again.

Then you will go to the Reinitialization page and do a Cold Start. This will clear the track log and force your GPS chip to use its time + time zone to communicate directly with overhead GPS satellites.

One more note and I found this by accident. In the same way GPS chips can be tweaked incorrectly, they can be tweaked in a positive manner. If you look at one of my PDA's WFN Initial Screen, I tweaked the GPS chip from a baud rate of 9600 to 57,600.

Older GPS chips were set at lower baud rates when they were fully capable of higher rates which is kind of like a modem that can use various baud rates. By using the WFN Reinitialization Screen page, I reset mine on the NMEA tab to 57600. I have not checked this with the SIRF chip on my clone but will do so later this afternoon.

Good luck again to you. Hope this works!
[General Questions and Answers] ColonelZap:
SatCE Mission failed :(;)

I followed your instructions, my city was even listed :) Clicked on calc and numbers started to change on the main screen. No satellites, though :(

I couldn't tell if the sun's position is right, it's pretty cloudy, I couldn't see the sun.

When I clicked on the sat-symbol in the taskbar it reads

"GPS not activated":confused:

WN Mission:

Here's what I did:

Port Settings – SiRF – Com 6 – 4800 Baud – ok

Then I clicked on command, selected Factory, selected 4800 in the SiRF settings, pressed ok.

Now, here is the "funny" thing: As soon as I pressed the ok button, the main screen came back up and it reads NMEA in the bottom left corner? WHY NMEA???? :eek:

Other than that, nothing happened :(

Man, I really owe you more than just one beer ;)
[General Questions and Answers] ronp76:
Rule of thumb regarding Sun:

9 am - 090 degrees East

12 pm - 180 degrees South

4 pm - 270 degrees West

I think SatCE had the same problem as the other programs - your GPS has been reset.

I don't think I remember reading or seeing a WFN Factory Reset not bringing a GPS chip back to its original settings. On the WFN Reinitialize Screen page (attached), go from the Reset tab to SIRF tab. Insert your proper values and click OK.

You could go back to the Connect feature but if it was me, I'd do a soft reset after exitting the program. Do a soft reset and then run the program again. You may wish also to repeat setting up the SIRF values on that tab and then doing a Factory Reset to see if that helps. I seem to remember doing different combos but it has been a year or two since I did all this "black magic" but it was PFM when my GPS came back.

You might also want to look at the URL in my previous message to see if I missed something. I know that that URL reads like a doctoral dissertation but it saved my bacon when my PDA's GPS was reset by a program.

Then you can look at this page:

http://tjworld.net/wiki/Howto/ResetGPSReceiverToNMEAMode

That user wrote about how his GPS chip worked with both SIRF and NMEA. I would think our Clone's SIRF do the same. If nothing else works, you could set NMEA and use the values he suggests for making a SIRF act like NMEA with these values:

GGA 1

GLL 0

GSA 5

GSV 5

RMC 1

VTG 1

MSS 0

User 0

User 0

User 0

I have to run but will leave my computer how so I can tap into it and maybe respond on the fly! Good luck!!!
[General Questions and Answers] ronp76:
BTW, on one of your combos, please make sure you check the SIRF tab and then ACTUALLY do a Factory Reset by clicking the OK on that tab. I know you probably did this but just want to make sure you clicked OK on this tab.

You could also do a Factory Reset followed by a Cold Start immediately after that.

Gotta jam!!!
[General Questions and Answers] ColonelZap:
Hi again :)

I re-did everything, softreset and EVERYTHING.

The "bad news" is, when I use the Post Scan Utility (see my Post #9), NOTHING is found anymore:confused:

I also have the feeling, that WN is not really doing anything? Whenever I restart it, the baud rate is back to 38400, it doesn't take my 4800?!?

I'm also a little confused why I only get Port1, 2 ,3 and 6 offered when I go to the Port settings. The only port accepted is port 6 and this port is called "Serial AGPS" why "AGPS"?

I'll play around a little more, maybe I'm doing something terribly wrong? :confused:

UPDATE:

After I did the NMEA thing, I used the port scan tool again, this time it found GPS on Com5!!!! Too bad WN doesn't offer me that Comport:(

UPDATE 2: This port scanning tool always seems to find the GPS at the port I set under "Programs" in the external GPS settings, NOT the hardware port.
[General Questions and Answers] bipinsen:
Looks like the Colonel is getting plenty of help! :)

Sorry about the problems though. But this has been a really interesting lesson in how GPS chips work. Bookmarking this thread right now so I can come back to it later (here's to hoping that doesn't need to happen! :D )

BTW Colonel.. I forgot to mention to you (and in my little video) that I am also using the Windows Mobile utility for managing my GPS connection. I think its called GPSID Settings (cab attached). I have the checkbox clicked to manage the connection automatically. After doing that, I open the GPS viewer to bring the GPS chip to life before launching iGo.
[General Questions and Answers] ronp76:
AGPS usually stands for Assisted GPS which means that your GPS is being "assisted" by your data plan and/or cell towers to get epheremis data. I did not think about that. You will find AGPS on Settings/System/AGPS. If it is on, I'd recommend turning it off as it should be "helping" you. You can about SIRF and AGPS here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SiRFstar_III

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assisted_GPS

I noticed in your second picture that the GPS was found on Port 5 but you say that you have been using Port 6.

If and I do recommend WM6.5 being set up to have manage GPS data, WFN needs to know the real or actual Port when you do a Reset.
[General Questions and Answers] ronp76:
Serial GPS also means something but I have my mind on what I'd doing right. I've seen it some context and feel it may be a factor. . .

SIRF, Port 5 would be my bet if GPSViewer found it there.
[General Questions and Answers] ronp76:
Colonel,

When you go to Settings/System/External GPS, what Port does WM report your GPS as? That report or Port should be the one you focus on resetting or re-initializing.
[General Questions and Answers] ColonelZap:
Hi again :-)

As I wrote before:

So, there is nothing I can turn on of off.

I have Programs COM5, Hardware Com6, Baud rate 4800 and Manage GPS automatically ckecked.

I am SURE these setting are correct, I wrote them down when I first got the phone and igo8 and Google Maps worked perfectly with these settings :-)

@bipinsen

What does this cab file do?

Thanks again for all the help I'm getting here, I'm REALLY impressed :-)
[General Questions and Answers] ronp76:
Sorry, I don't mean to accuse you but it seems that something may have overwritten your ROM with stuff that is conflicting with what you had or knew you had. Even some of the pictures you have supplied demonstrate that conflict.

In asking you to double check what the system may say its state is now may or may not help the solution but at least it eliminates the obvious.

If I were you, I would back up my data; do a Master Clear or hard reset; and install nothing until you crosscheck what WM says about your GPS when you set up having WM manage the GPS data. Then I would install GPSToggle and see if it can turn on the GPS and get it to work. If that doesn't work, then I'd install the other utilities.

I thought this last night as I drove to an event across town. The primary reason I bought my phone was that it has a GPS and camera. That it is a phone is incidental. I am on a pre-paid plan and can easily switch over phone service if I like the phone side. The GPS and camera are meant to replace carrying my PDA and camera. My prime concern is the GPS.

If I were having the problem you have, it would override everything else and like you I would be doing everything I could to restore the GPS. Failing that, with a one year warranty, I would seek a replacement at my earliest opportunity.
[General Questions and Answers] bipinsen:
It is the Microsoft utility for managing GPS connections. Somewhere here you got the instruction to let WM manage the GPS chip. I don't have a native ROM setting for managing GPS. So this utility from Microsoft does the same thing.
[General Questions and Answers] ronp76:
Earth to ColonelZap, come in please. Request update on status of your GPS. Earth out.
[General Questions and Answers] dirlan2001:
Hi,

Look at this little discussion at Howard's , seems hardreset isn't hidden far away.

Besides, I'm not sure it's a SirF that's in this machine, rather it'll be some cheapo GPS-clone. Therefor, I guess it's better to have it running the NMEA 0183 protocol. That's the standard for GPS, and ALL chips understand it.

And err ... IMHO, it's best to set your GPSiD to HW : comm6 ; SW : comm8.

:D

Dirk
[General Questions and Answers] ronbo76:
Where does this CAB put this setting? I wonder why Sunno does not have this setting that is found on other WM6.5 smartphones?