yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] jonnyp4l:
I am still languishing with my unbranded Kaiser and I never had to go through much of the torment that a lot of the Tilt owners had to go through with keyboard remapping, etc.

I was wondering, since AT&T will probably try and find some way to keep me from using my phone for Internet Sharing, how difficult will it be to trash the ROM to a more standard, unlocked version and then correct the key mappings. I know this may sound simple and I should probably know the answer but anyone who had experience with the Tilt in this regard or has any idea, I'd appreciate the feedback.

j.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] WatermelonSlim:
Once there is a hspl for this device it will be easy. But you can't install a cooked ROM without a hspl. There are a few different apps to do internet sharing though. You don't need a cooked ROM to set up internet sharing. You just need to install a sharing app (assuming it is removed from the stock AT&T ROM).
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] dannyedilber:
Don't flame me

november or december is what everybody is saying!!! I think so too. why? becuase of WM6.5... i really hope is before or I'll be back with sprint.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] YodaJM:
And where are you hearing this?

It doesn't really make much sense to wait for WM 6.5 because it'll be a free update anyway. Especially when all of your competitors are launching the phone in the next 3 weeks or so.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] Toleraen:
I think it's entirely possible they waited. They have two options.

A) Releasing the TP2 in September with WinMo 6.1, then offering the free 6.5 update two months later.

B) Delay the release by two months with and release with 6.5.

Look at it from their view, in the end what lands them more profit?

A) Releasing early gives them more time to generate sales. However this means they have to go through the entire software development process (develop software, test, QA, etc) twice. At this point they then have to support two baselines, their 6.1 release and 6.5 release.

B) Lose out on early sales, making up the potential profits in reducing the maintenance cost associated with option A. Could also make up for it in a big marketing push for a serious WinMo 6.5 phone, "first to come standard in the nation" type deal.

I hate to say it but I'm seeing B at this point. Man I hope I'm wrong!
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] petard:
I still find it ridiculous that they launched the Kaiser with AT&T's 3G bands and the 2 generations afterward didn't have them in the unbranded version. AT&T MUST have asked them not to because they would sell more if they did (and not many other than AT&T use 850 and 1900MHz).
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] Toleraen:
Don't foget since the kaiser launched there was that whole qualcomm/broadcom/whoever 3G chipset patent fiasco. I'd wager that has something to do with it.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] solsearch:
No. The Qualcomm Broadcomm issue was resolved and after some money changing hands they are now allowed to use the technologies in question wherever without any problems.

AT&T uses those bands, as do companies in Canada, and in Mexico, and parts of Latin America...

It's not just one company. But AT&T is the one with most clout. And Latin America doesn't really excell in smartphone sales as far as I know.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] poetryrocksalot:
Son of a *****. I am moving to T-Mobile. ATT disappointments me more and more.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] jonnyp4l:
I'm not as concerned about getting my hands on the application as I am with AT&T putting spyware/custom code in their ROM that will report to their systems whether or not the phone is being used as a modem or not. With their "internet sharing" plan being a huge rip-off, I'm not interested in getting my phone bill jacked by my carrier.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] jonnyp4l:
I'm sure one, if not all of the carriers asked them to not release it. These companies want to sell their self-branded versions of the phone and make money/contracts off of it. With HTC releasing easily accessible unlocked phones, AT&T et al can't get their claws in with all of their crap software and bloatware that they fill their phones with. I mean, it's pretty obvious when HTC's US website doesn't even have unlocked phones on it. It only shows branded versions of the phones. We're so far behind the rest of the world it's pathetic. </rant>
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] Tempest790:
I wish ATT would leave in the Ctrl and Tab keys. I do like that they added an OK key that the others appear to be missing. The number buttons notwithstanding, here is a mock keyboard that would work good for me:

I added a Ctrl key and Tab key under the blue function set. The Function key and the Shift key were swapped. I think this would be a better layout.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] poppinpengawen:
yea I agree that is a better layout. but I doubt they'll deviate much from the picture posted in this thread. I'm just going to stay open-minded about it. I'm just glad that there's FINALLY a picture of the at&t version. and instead of complaining, we should just be grateful that we finally have some form of visual evidence of the at&t version. now, we everyone can decide whether to stay with at&t or jumpship to another carrier:D
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] jtoyz2:
im with ATT no matter what...this is not the only reason why im with ATT they have serve me well bringing great phones after great phone...to me after tilt, fuze, and then xperia...this keyboard is how it suppose to be...
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] WatermelonSlim:
Take a look at your keyboard on your laptop/desktop computer. THAT is how it's supposed to be.

One of the main selling points of the Touch Pro 2 is that it has the offset, 5 row keyboard- that is identical to a real keyboard on a computer. AT&T decided to change it.

And, again, the "number pad" AT&T created is NOT like a phone pad. Why? Because the keys are still offset.

There is no way anyone is going to slide out their keyboard and dial numbers to place a place a phone call with it. Everyone will be dialing numbers with the huge touchscreen dial pad. You know, the one that really does resemble a real phone's dial pad. It also happens to have huge buttons that are easy to press with a finger, a nice vibration feedback when you hit a button, and it doesn't feel ackward when you use it.

If even ONE person comes back and posts that they prefer to slide the keyboard out and dial numbers on the hardware keyboard when they make a call (after using the device) then I will be utterly shocked. And if nobody, not even ONE single person is using this "number pad" for its intended purpose, then AT&T really screwed up when making it.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] mcspikesky:
Agreed. My sister has the Xperia and the keyboard on that is awful, when i want to type numbers im forced to use the crappy Fn + whatever to get them to work. Vodafona branded UK TP2 here. The way keyboards are supposed to be. (H)
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] KD8DNS:
Hey p1tater and Alltheway, guess what!!:D:D:D
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] ashwincr:
^^^ you have an at&t tilt 2 in your hands??!!!

I haven't posted much here, but have followed these boards for a long time and know the people who have solid information! Any nformation on the release date?
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] ashwincr:
double post... please ignore
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] WatermelonSlim:
I don't have a Tilt 2. I have just the regular old Tilt. I also have an unlocked European Touch Pro 2 (which is what the Tilt 2 was before AT&T butchered the keyboard).
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] RodneyMnemonic:
A) Releasing early gives them more time to generate sales. However this means they have to go through the entire software development process (develop software, test, QA, etc) twice. At this point they then have to support two baselines, their 6.1 release and 6.5 release.

are you kidding me? i doubt that ATT has ever gone through the actual "test" and "QA" process with their software (judging by the crap i have seen over the years as an ATT victim).

their software development life cycle looks more like this:

a. have a bunch of monkeys randomly type on a keyboard. given enough time

and monkeys, you will eventually get something that complies.

b. package up whatever the monkeys churn out and release it to your

unsuspecting 'customers' (victims) - the ones held hostage by your

bull**** 2 year contract.

c. ignore any and all complaints by said 'customers' (victims)

d. repeat
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] ashwincr:
My question was for KD8DNS... sorry for the miscommunication..
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] sdlopez83:
Does not make it so. The omnia was approved by the FCC for ATT and that never saw the light of day.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] poppinpengawen:
exactly right. the omnia 2 was also approved with ATT's 3G bands but I doubt there's any chance we'll see it on ATT.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] HeavyComponent:
WM 6.5 AKA Windows Phone oh yeah!:D
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] Hamburg:
I'm not supporting the number pad or anything, but really... You use all fingers when typing on a PC and only thumbs when typing on your phone. I'm sure they made so called "advancements" based on that thought.

<tangent>

Really, I say we get rid of the qwerty all together and go with Dvorak! Afterall, qwerty was designed for typewriters to keep the most commonly used letters seperated so the hammers wouldnt jam and it has nothing to do with typing efficiency. Can we say obsolete??

</tangent>

I dont really mind the numbers, but I am annoyed about the lack of the Ctrl and Tab keys (I do like the 'OK' button though).

AT&T contract is up in Oct. I'm thinking of making a switch. We'll see if I can hold out that long.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] WatermelonSlim:
I don't see how using only your thumbs should make things any different. Your subconscious knows where things are. You type on a computer keyboard all day, your subconscious will remember it. You start using your phone keyboard, you will be more efficient with it if it is layed out the same as your computer keyboard, based on your subconscious alone.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] petard:
I like the way AT&T makes the numbers. Different strokes for different folks. And couldn't whoever took that picture have taken at least 2 more? Bottom and left to see if they added 3.5mm and a PTT button (I LOVE remapping this to the Gmail java application and Camera on hold, I miss my buttons)
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] BoostedSR20:
Ok.... I know I'm gonna get flame broiled for saying this, but I think I like the ATT keyboard better. I've had my Touch Pro 2 for about 3 days now, and I miss the way the keys are laid out on my Fuze. I miss the OK button, and you have to hit the FN button *alot* more to get to all the punctuation. I'm sure after time I'll get used to this and be alot quicker with it, but by then I'm sure the ATT version will be out and I'll be getting that. :cool:
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] Twenty4:
I don't think I have ever used the OK key on my Tilt.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] BoostedSR20:
I used it constantly on the Tilt and the Fuze.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] alwayslearning:
i too like the keyboard but i would rather have a ctrl key than ok. the enter key on my TP2 works for "ok" when you need to press "ok"
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] BoostedSR20:
What do you use the ctrl key for? All I can think of it for is copy/paste, but I always just tap and hold for that...

My main use for the "ok" button was going back. Such as, sending a txt, hit ok it would take you back to the txt thread list. The enter key doesn't do that.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] alwayslearning:
some apps don't let you copy/paste, the crtl key still works in those apps for copy and paste. "ctrl -a" as you know lets you select all, very fast to use if you want to delete a list.

your right about going back i have to use the back arrow soft button which is still close to your thumb and it works for going back.

another use for the crtl key is in a long list of text or email, you push crtl then any letter and it high lights that letter in your list.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] fortunz:
I'm hopeful that I can find a program that will let me set up new crtl combos so I can use unassigned Crtl+letter as a program launcher. I think I read about one once, but I can't remember what it was.

Is there any reason you couldn't use ok+something as ctrl+something and use crtl alone as OK?
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] BoostedSR20:
What back arrow soft button? I'm using the hard back arrow (next to the end call button) am I missing something easier?
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] daviddt:
I agreee, and oh how i hope there is NO PTT button... that is why i took back the Fuze. constantly hitting it and having to back out of the darn window
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] alwayslearning:
i meant to type hard button.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] alwayslearning:
I believe there are remapping programs out there, i'm sure one will work with the TP2
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] Methadras:
Guys. This phone should be super configurable. Besides, with MS's new initiative to port Apple App store apps to WinMo, it will make this phone even better. Now do you think there is a better phone than the TP2? If there is name it?
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] BoostedSR20:
The PTT button can be remapped. On my Fuze I had it open the comm manager. I'm cool with it being there or not being there.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] omaralt:
the nokia n97 :) im currently using it while waiting for the at&t tp2. Each phone has different pros and cons and excel in different areas. What im dreading losing is the 3.5mm jack, amazing camera, and amazing podcasting app
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] BoostedSR20:
I tried the G1 and the N97 while I had my Fuze, (for giggles) and sold them both in favor of keeping the Fuze. Now I have the TP2 and its a keeper. My Fuze is pending sale right now. IMHO, the TP2 is king. WM is also the best for me, with andriod in a fairly close 2nd. Symbian however is absolutely dismal.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] c_legaspi:
any word when this phone will be release. i am interested in it but my sony x1a seems to be doing what i need it to do. i just would like a larger screen.

i am still debating whether to wait for at&, or get the t-mobile, or just keep my x1a. i really dont want to buy another phone or get stuck with a two year contract but i am very tempted:(
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] petard:
Horrible news!

http://www.engadgetmobile.com/2009/...r-dead-warhawk-and-fortress-coming-in-octobe/
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] srsaleenstang:
YUp just saw that and posted it in other thread
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] poppinpengawen:
dammit. I'm getting so irritated with AT&T. the only reason I'm not going to T-Mo is because I like AT&T's 3G network better. if they're going to delay it that much, then it better be running WM 6.5 outta the box.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] fortunz:
I'd really prefer it run 6.1 out of the box. Even if it doesn't come until October.

There will be tons of 6.5 Roms, and the official upgrade will be easy enough to apply. I'm not sure the market for 6.1 downgrades will be as large, and I have no desire to upgrade until all of you guys have found everything MS broke for me and I can make a measured decision in my own time as to when to upgrade.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] c_legaspi:
thanks for the update. maybe ill just wait for an htc touch pro 2 running a 1ghz. thats the ideal model i would like to see.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] petard:
According to this

http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/19/windows-mobile-6-5-touch-interface-update-in-february-to-coexi/

WM 6.5 should launch October 1. Hopefully AT&T releases the Touch Pro2 then with 6.5!
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] t-readyroc:
If true, that'd be worth waiting for. Throw TouchFlo 3D 2.6 in there while they're at it...
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] tduck:
ATT vs Consumer-driven WM upgrades

I'm wondering if maybe ATT is so control-happy coming off all the iPhone fiascos that it didn't want to release another WM phone with Win 6.1, and then let the consumer upgrade (probably via HTC, not ATT) to 6.5 by themselves, instead opting to try to control and tweak the features of 6.5 themselves, bypassing HTC altogether.

What if they've been holding off on the release of the Rhodium so that they can put their specially locked out versions of 6.5 on it? I know that with luck changing the ROMs will be easy... but you have to wonder.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] argoldst:
I'm sorry but this is crap. You can try to put any positive spin on it you want (how it is good to wait till win 6.5, or wait for a 3.5mm jack) but it is pure BS.

The fact that the phone will come out about 2 months AFTER Tmobile and more then 3 months since it was released overseas is just sad.

At this point, I almost want to buy an omnia i8000L (which has att 3g bands) just to not support htc. The reason I blame HTC is simple. Why not just release the touch pro with USA 3g bands and give customers an option instead of forcing us to deal with this ATT BS?

There is NO reason HTC can't release the touch pro2 with US 3G bands and the fact they won't makes me want to speak with my wallet and take my business elsewhere.

PURE CRAP!

(sorry for the rant, just pissed)
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] EvilDeadFan:
That huge branding is so unfortunate. I've never liked that keyboard layout, either.

I'm glad my Telus branded one isn't actually branded looking. No markings except for HTC in the stock positions, and the normal keyboard.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] jtoyz2:
dont give up yet man...you gonna regret getting the Tmobile one...you gonna get it lets say today or sometime soon and its almost september...and only one month after that its gonna release on ATT...you agreed the ATT is much sexier and slick than Tmobile

plus HARDSPL is not even released yet...and we XDA member do not do stock what so ever...just wait it be worth it...6.5 out of the box should be very intresting wouldnt you say...i can see ATT commercial now...fastest 3G on the first windows 6.5 device
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] fortunz:
That's an odd thing to blame HTC for.

If omnia works for you, go crazy. But it sounds a little like cutting off your nose to spite your face.

HTC managed to get the TP2 on all 4 major US carriers in a very short window of time. Yes, it involved MONTHS! of waiting, unlike the TP1 which VZW just released (what was it, a couple of days ago? okay, it's been like 10 months, whatever) and which TMo never carried.

To me, that's way better than phone exclusivity for devices like Pre and the iPhone. HTC is giving you the option of dealing with the company you've chosen to deal with, rather than forcing you to go to the company who bid the most for their 'loyalty'.

It's not perfect for people who want an unlocked phone that will work with all GSMs and US3g, but that may still come, and not releasing it may have been part of the bargain to get all US carriers on board so quickly. And a US unlocked version may still come someday, but there are in fact some reasons why they felt that wasn't the best call. I bet more people buy the phone on contract with subsidy than not, even if I personally want it at retail (I'm going prepaid).

Best thing you can do is give HTC your money since I believe they really want to be consumer-friendly, in hopes that eventually they have so much clout they don't have to bargain and hee-haw with carriers to provide the most options to consumers, then they can just do what they want and carriers will beg for scraps.

For the above reasons, it seems like impure crap. HTC seems like a pretty cool company to me, and they are surrounded by a whole bunch of comparatively crappy companies. You can't please all the people all the time.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] solsearch:
I agree with fortunz. And HTC does seem to be very consumer conscious. In this generation of phones they have incorporated many of the suggestions/fixes to complaints that were made on their last gen. This shows they listen and "care". And they are somewhat at the mercy of the carriers as very few people are willing to pay full price for phones (though I am on the same boat as fortunz as I also opt for prepaid).

Of course I don't find it hard to agree with anyone who has a Hobbes avatar :D
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] Toleraen:
Did they ever fix the whole graphics driver issue? I think that's about the only big complaint I've heard against HTC.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] petard:
While it could be made better, I don't think its possible to "fix". The Qualcomm chips that they have used for 3 generations now just plain old suck. It looks like this will be the last generation to use it though! Hopefully it is because they are just so horrible. That processor is the biggest problem with the Touch Pro2. Old Intel XScale from 5 years ago are faster.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] poppinpengawen:
i went into my local T-Mo store yesterday and played around with the TP2. the build quality seems like it's a step up from the European model, based on what people who bought the Euro model have said about it.

the color actually doesn't look to bad, but the 4 hardware buttons on the front still make it look like a cheap LG phone. (good thing ATT's aren't going to look like that [: )

the way the keyboard snaps out really shows you that it's a superior phone. the tilt screen sort of feels like it's "magnetized" when you push back to its flat position, as it snaps back into place. the keyboard feels like it's going to take some getting used to, especially after coming from a tilt/kaiser or a fuze/touch pro. the buttons don't seem to "click" as much on the TP2. but otherwise, it's a very nice typing experience.

one of the biggest selling points for me, personally, is the sensitivity of the screen, particularly with the SIP. the typing experience on the onscreen keyboard is BY FAR one of the best I've ever had. all those phone sites weren't lying when they said that the screen is almost as sensitive to touch as the iPhone. I feel like I wouldn't even need the hardware keyboard. I was able to type out a 3-page text message without making one mistake.

well, that's just my little summary of my experience with the TP2.

I sorta wish I didn't go see it tho....cos now I'm even MORE impatient for ATT to release their variant!!!! HURRY UP ATT!!!!!
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] Aisorik:
http://www.boygeniusreport.com/2009...smartphone-data-plans-starting-september-6th/

Looks like I won't be getting this or the Topaz. Either get the LG Incite right away or look for a dumbphone...
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] argoldst:
That is a dealbreaker for me.

I can't believe ANY company would force you to get a data plan. What if you are happy just using wifi. Complete BS!

Guess no TP2 for me. Omnia 2 here i come.
[Touch Pro2, Tilt 2 Windows Mobile General] YodaJM:
That's really lame.

But reading that, if you already have a smartphone, such as the tilt or fuze, and a data plan, then you are grandfathered into your existing data plan right?

I have a tilt with $20 medianet unlimited + 200 txt, I just hope it stays that way when I get my TP2. Otherwise I might buy it unsubbed.