yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Haskren:
Have you had any autofocus issues as pointed out in the response above?
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Mrxyzl:
So vivo has no bl unlock? Thats mean rarely update come?
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
Bl unlock doesn't mean anything about update frequency. But with official unlock (not unlock via Potential security bug) most popular phones will have a custom ROM community providing updates for a long time, while with without you are at mercy of the manufacturer. Just look up the update threads about older flagships like 50pro+ or 70pro+ to see how likely updates are on 90pro+. Does not look good to me.. . Vivo's update policy is only for international market. Right now X90 even with trial version is stuck on December security patches. S23U will receive February patches on 17 February (it's not officially available until then - strange release by Samsung this time)

I proved all my facts somewhere here before with screenshots or sources (or Link to fast connect 7800 at Qualcomm which states WiFi 7 compatibility which isn't advertised for X90 pro+. Not even WiFi 6e (though it could be possible it's supported but just not advertised in specs).

I reported vendetta17 now for breaking points 2.3 and 2.4 of the forum rules. He accuses me of lying without being able to prove a single lie.

And I posted positive points, quite a lot. This is one of the best cameras on a smartphone. I think even better than place 10 as dxomark indicates as their protocol doesn't value secondary lenses much. I see it as top 6 or 7 right now even for point and shoot. If you shoot RAW only and need huge prints then it's even the best (but I feel apple workflow with RAW is much easier, also s23U has better workflow with RAW as Lightroom comes already pre-installed but quality wise X90 Pro+ is better). Seeing basically very little mention of RAW and super RAW in relation to the X90 pro+ makes me feel professional photographers avoid Vivo phones no matter how much Vivo touts professional photography at it's press releases. Samsung or apple or google forums on the contrary are full with questions or remarks on RAW and comparisons to the jpg output.

If the X90 pro+ would be half price of s23U, iphone 14 pro max then I would praise it too. If it was even just the price of Pixel 7 pro and would have the same update policy I would recommend it all out. At current prices without any update policy and seeing that x50 Pro+ basically stopped getting updates after 2.5 years, and other Vivo x series being neglected after only a year I don't see it recommendable. It was the first phone with 8gen2 and vivo paid for that exclusive right to Qualcomm. It's not comparable to mate 20 pro or p30 Pro which were albeit slower updates great phones and aged well at cheaper price than other flagships back then. Yes right on hardware it looks great, just like s23U too, but not software.....
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] vendetta17:
You cant unlock bootloader yet .

No bootloader unlock yet . If you talk about updates , i got 4 of them in about 40 days .
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Vinzie:
What version are you on then ? I know only of 3 updates... (not counting the last trial version)...
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] jericho246:
13.0.18.3 is the latest one I believe.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Vinzie:
Latest official ? A week ago I heard this version was release as trial version. I just checked but 13.0.18.2 is the last version for me...
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] jericho246:
I got it earlier today in official update channel. Not trial.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
BTW - eSim is also missing from the X90 Pro+, S23U has dual physical SIM plus 1 Esim support. Dual Active, Tripple Standby. There is no dual e-sim on the S23U however so far (unlike Pixel 7 which now has dual e-sim plus 1 physical SIM. Not sure if tripple standby is supported by Pixel however).

Only Xiaomi 13 Pro so far has Wifi-7 (though not yet enabled because it's draft). X70 modem phones maybe in the future could get wifi 7 enabled - but if the X90 Pro+ has no Wifi-6e - then it's very unlikely it has X70 modem after all.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] djshotty:
Yes, but is there confirmation users can unlock the S23 Ultra's BL out of the box? I've had no end of trouble rooting my Note 10+ 5G over the almost three years I've owned it, so using an unrooted Vivo won't be that much of a biggie.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] djshotty:
Please explain how a person can "much" time...

if you believe Extremecaver has to do that.

It's TOO much time!
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
Well it's assumed to be the same process as on any other Samsung phone. Root is not the same as unlock! On my S7 and S8+ this was very easy. Root can be trouble with banking apps and so on. Bootloader unlock was super easy (yeah you void warranty on Samsung by rooting because of the e-fuse it will be forever but unlike Vivo no need for all that to get google apps fully working)
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Deleted member 11872899:
Triggering Knox is the worst part with every Samsung ever. Such a crap system
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
Well it's much better than outright not offering bootloader unlock. I find it's a great system - brick your phone by software - Samsung isn't responsible anymore. I'm pretty sure if the phone still boots but doesn't charge anymore or camera dropout Knox will not be important - but I do not know for sure.

The other way but that is more complicated to remove warranty for rooted devices would be to simply hand out unlock codes in your device account and giving you a warning about losing warranty that way.

I find it's understandable manufacturers do not like to warranty rooted/unlocked devices due to the high chance of someone bricking their device in the process. It's giving the user a choice (and after 1 or 2 years depending on the manufacturer it's end of warranty anyhow).
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Killuminati91:
Vivo also has some kind of efuse or check system. Portrait mode did not work anymore after unlocking the bootloader / changing firmware on my x70 Pro Plus, even after reverting to stock completely.

But it doesnt matter, since we wont see another exploit for the Vivo. Waited a long time to decide between S23 Ultra / x90 Pro / x90 Pro Plus and with Vivo's price policy for the international model I definitely wont go for the x90 Pro. Software support and official availability in the west are deciding factors here.

If you want to judge vivo's dedication to the western market you just need to follow a phones announcement.

Website with a countdown that ran until 0:00:00, then nothing happened. Website still displays NaN-Timer and there has been absolute silence from vivo on when the global version is available and how much it will cost.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Deleted member 11872899:
Didn't know about vivo has a efuse or check system. But when it's really there its also crap.🤣
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] rsr1:
In the control panel just long press the audio level and it comes up asking which device to output audio to
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
I don't get that menu. Maybe the problem is compatibility of the phone with echo dot? The only device correctly registered as audio seems to me to be my shockz. So the problem is rather that the phone software is too stupid to correctly identify the echo dot and only uses it in a fallback like falling back incorrectly to the Fenix 6X pro which clearly isn't an Audio device as it doesn't have a speaker that can do more than beep. Nothing happening on Longpress on audio volume
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Haskren:
Check this FB post. The S23u 10x zoom indoors https://m.facebook.com/groups/vivofansclub/permalink/911785783444762/

Tiny sensor can't handle high iso

View attachment 5878655
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
Well the Oppo Find X6 Pro destroys the Vivo X90 Pro+ on the Ultrawide and on the Periscope zoom in low light. In very good light the S23U destroys both. X90 Pro+ isn't the reference there anymore (and Xiaomi 13 Ultra should be another step up).
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Haskren:
Yes, it's no secret each phone has it's advantages. I just pointed out this aspect between the 2 phones as everyone is gushing over the S23u zoom. It wasn't an invitation to weigh up all camera pros and cons.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Dayuser:
Well that is not surprise because Find X6 Pro has bigger sensors on UW an Periscore cameras.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
Yep. In general I must say that from what I've seen on comparisons x6 pro vs X90pp the x6 pro has a much better/realistic exposure/colors vs Zeiss Vivo. The only point where the X90pp wins is portrait.

But then I would stay as far as possible from ever buying again an BBK China OS phone without root. OnePlus 11 pro is rumored to use x6 pro hardware for international release. That would at least mean non China OS and root (I still wouldn't buy it for BBK lacklustre Software, But BBK international versions still get far superior software support vs China OS ones...).
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] mbfamily:
X90Pro+ max "lossless" zoom range is a little longer than X6 Pro (approx. 10x vs 7x). Other than that, in most situations X6 Pro is equal or a little better (UW, colors). If you're not buying the X90Pro+ because it's a non-rootable China-only phone from BBK, you're certainly not buying the X6 Pro either. So there's no need for comparing them anyway.

And this thread is actually about S23U, which is no competition for the X90 Pro+ ;)
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Dayuser:
OnePlus 11 Pro is already cancelled.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
Nope there are rumours about a 3Q2023 release based on x6 Pro. But way too early for definitive facts.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Dayuser:
What i have read rumors is that company is said that both 11 Pro and 11T is cancelled.

Still rumors fly all year..
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
It was in the speculation about OnePlus future. OnePlus being pulled from China while pulling oppo and Vivo from outside Asia.

Like other manufacturers except Apple and Samsung most this year are faced with problems on economic downturn and looking to consolidate... BBK international strategy right now only sure thing is, it's in turmoil (and all that huge advertisment campaign last year for vivo failed spectacularly).
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] vendetta17:
Considering the small differences between Oppo and Vivo camera wise + the prices of both phones , i would pick the x90 pro plus in a heartbeat due to Oppo's way higher price
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] lemonade747:
Then choose which one has better battery life, screen, sound.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
No nearby share on the X90pp = no quick sharing of photos with other phones or windows PC (google yesterday introduced a software with nearby share for Windows 10 and later PCs)....

Ah yeah I forgot you can try to go on the hunt for one of those rare USB 3.0 cables that actually works with X90pp...

Even installing third party nearby share Apps won't help this. Besides the camera the X90pp feels like a decade old phone software wise...
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] mbfamily:
Image processing seems quite different, which is surprising, I would have expected BBK companies to cooperate more in order to save development costs.

Overall the two phones are mostly identical. I wonder why BBK releases two identical phones, both China-only, how is that a sound business choice?
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
Hans Tech Talk x6 pro vs X90pp whom in this rare case think is quite objective as I feel he's 100% on payroll by OPPO/Vivo/BBK...

It's not even that close.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] mbfamily:
Yes that's what I meant, the image processing is quite different. Which means the two BBK companies did not cooperate but instead made the development efforts twice. With the result of two mostly identical phones but twice the development costs. Doesn't make sense to me from a business perspective. Only companies with insane financial resources use strategies like that to conquer the market. Not sure where a company that is not even 30 years old got these resources from. But I guess, business in China works in ways us "westerners" can't understand o_O
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
I'm not sure besides the imx main sensor and the sd8gen2 platform and software in general those phones even are that close. Yes I guess that mari silicon x processor is the same thing as that Vivo co processor. But the camera and design ate the big differences. All sensors except the main are actually different. And considering the manufacturing price is identical then it shows how much better you can make zoom and ultrawide by skipping the 2.2x Sensor.

I really prefer how the oppo does night photos. That's the way it's supposed to be done. Make them night like with details but not try to just boost all shadows as if they wouldn't exist. Also the colors/exposure are somewhere in between the vivo vivid comic mode and boring Zeiss mode. That kind of balance ia what vivid should be...
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] mbfamily:
The sensors are different but the main differences come from the image processing. Either software or MariSilicon vs. V2 or both.

I can't see a winner here, just two phones with slightly different sensor setup and different image processing. I prefer Oppo but that's simply personal preference, also to me personally ultra-wide is more important than zoom.

All in all, I think it's two different phones with different sensors and most importantly, different ISP, but identical performance on average. I'm just wondering what's the point for BBK to fund twice the development effort, cause developing the ISP is a lot of effort. And then not even releasing one of them globally. But whatever, they must have their reasons 🤷‍♂️
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Haskren:
10x details:

Highlight retention at 3.5x:
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
The video review by Hans Tech Talk showed huge superiority on zoom on the Oppo at night.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] lemonade747:
if just look at those 2 examples then I could say Vivo is better for sure, especially the night mode below. way better than the oppo.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] :
Oppo is able to capture some better pictures sometimes but this happens with each phone! There is no phone which captures 100% perfect pics everytime!
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] lemonade747:
Yes, that's why I said if just look at those 2 examples. I know oppo is doing some better aspects than vivo by watching some youtube videos. To be honest, those differences are not big deals for me. Both phones have their own strengths.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] :
I think the oppo has a bigger "fail rate". Vivo seems to be more balanced all the time. Sure it depends how talented the photographer is but the oppo is doing crazy sh!t sometimes like heavy exposure for example. I have seen that from different people now.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] lemonade747:
It's just some days or weeks after it was released, so it still has a lot of rooms for improvement. I don't know if oppo also pre-installed a lot of spyware apps like vivo did, but I guess it does not.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] mbfamily:
Why would Oppo be different? Both are BBK brands.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] :
Oppo had a long time to do that even before release.

Honestly I haven't seen major improvements on the vivo for the camera. The pics are pretty similar to the first pics with first firmware or camera version.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
Both are virtually identical in this aspect. Only China OS affected however. I guess even Samsung China OS will be pretty bad, they need to comply with Chinese law. Though maybe BBK are overachieving here a bit.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
Yep, me neither. BBK isn't known to develop/improve anything after release. Best example them acknowledging broken notifications on dark mode yet they never fix it... Also basically no new features without a major upgrade in origin OS.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] bmw320cd:
As usual, you speak without knowing what you are saying

Vivo greatly improves/develops the camera/video sector of its cameraphones

Before X90 PP, I had X70 PP and I noticed CONSTANT improvements in video/photo management over time, both pre ORIGIN OS3 (ex ocean) and post ORIGIN OS3

Having said that for you after oppo x6 pro , xiaomi 13 pro , x90 PP is to throw away hahaha

Check out some serious reviews done by professional photographers and NOT paid/sponsored BLOGGERS
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] lemonade747:
Does Oppo have that annoying dark mode issue?
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Tiverask:
@bmw320cd Can you clarify which device to toss out? 😕 Can you please share some of these reviews? Cheers!
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] bmw320cd:
If you understand Italian here is a review done by an unpaid professional

The guy PRAISES the lens work done by zeiss which are co-engineered and manufactured for X90 PP..

13 pro instead has only an intervention on the software side by leica

The level of detail and texture of the X90 PP in some scenarios makes the 13 pro look like an obsolete mobile with the same resolution and main sensor

Look at the images shown with Lightroom and compare side by side
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] bmw320cd:
Honor 5magic vs mate 50 pro vs s23U vs oppo x6 pro vs Vivo X90PP
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] bmw320cd:
Zoom same phone same image same condition ...

All photos taken by a user who has all 5 phones which he compares in various ways

But as our friend said in a few posts ago, now the X90 PP is no longer the reference and is "destroyed" by other cell phones ...

I could post tons of pictures comparing these phones
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Tiverask:
@bmw320cd I will definitely take a gander, thanks so much!
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Eric-Mod:
Nearby Share uses Google Play Services, which you probably have installed. Usually it activates on vivo under Settings > System management > Google > and there should be something with "share with devices" or so, tap on it and there should be "Nearby Share". As far as i remember.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
That's not present. It's just another of the missing google services.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] bmw320cd:
Confirm and it works perfectly for me
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Eric-Mod:
Thank you for confirming. I admit, I'm still waiting for my X90 to arrive. Can you like attach a screenshot from the actual Nearby Share window from where you would send it? Just curious :)
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] bmw320cd:
select the devices you find in the list with vivoshare app (or easyshare for pc)

it's not direct with google , yes , but work no problem with vivoapp ( ah yes , every vivo app it's a spyware... )
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] jericho246:
There is no Nearby Share setting for me. When trying to use Nearby Share in Files By Google, it says it's not available on this device.

It pains me to say it but I think the extreme guy is correct

of course there is "vivoshare" but that is vivo's solution, not google's.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] bmw320cd:
Yes, I added and corrected that the nearby share via vivoshare or easyshare app, not direct with google

I forgot to specify it
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Eric-Mod:
Well, I gotta say "Snapdrop" on the Play Store is an excellent alternative to anything else I guess. Works via PC with any browser flawlessly.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] rsr1:
Share to computer is a fantastic implementation by Vivo. Works fantastically every time, and super quick.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] lemonade747:
Can you share photos to the iPhone? Or just to android phones with similar pre-installed software??
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Eric-Mod:
To be honest, you can't share anything from an Android to an iPhone (except with some 3rd party apps, Cloud storage,..).

But that's due to Apples restrictions since years.

You can share files with Android Phones using Easyshare, Snapdrop, Pushbullet, ... or old school bluetooth if the files aren't big. Nearby Share does obviously not work. You have options. :)
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] lemonade747:
So basically, what we need is the sender and the receiver must have the same app to transfer the files?
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Eric-Mod:
Yes Sir(y)
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] wolfgang212:
easyshare from vivo works perfect and has no ads, i installed it on a samsung phone and works with no issues
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Tiverask:
For what it's worth, I've used ‘Share to a computer’ aka Easy Share for the first time and it worked brilliantly. To my surprise I didn’t even need to install anything.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
It's not the same when everyone else has nearby share, and you need to tell them to install app XYZ to share something with you. Especially with groups not a-b but a to group....

Sharing to PC is just one example...

This phone in general is like be disabled. You can do nearly everything but nothing is simple and everything needs workarounds which only do specific things..

And other China OS phones have nearby share. It's just missing from rotten oranges.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] lemonade747:
I'm not using this feature a lot, so it's not really important for me. I asked because some of my friends are using iPhone then when we hang out together, we want to quickly share photos we took in group. If not, then just up load to drive and download them later. Not a big deal for me.

You said as if this x90P+ cannot provide that simple feature, but find me in 2023 any android phones that can transfer files freely to all phones without installing a specific app?
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
Since 2022 group sending feature is implemented in Nearby Share - just like on Iphone. That is what Nearby Share includes.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Haskren:
As this thread developed to be a general comparison with other phones - here is a comparison between the Vivo and the Xiaomi 13 pro
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] :
I'm waiting for comparisons against the Xiaomi 13 ultra. I have seen some pictures and it looks very promising. I'm thinking about to sell the vivo and buy the 13 ultra.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] maxel77:
I don't think there will be a huge difference between the 2 phones. Xiaomi usually has weak camera optimization as you can see with the main camera of Xiaomi 13 Pro which produces worse photos than Vivo X90 Pro Plus despite having the same sensor.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] maxel77:
It's very good but I prefer Oppo in many situations. I can't see a real upgrade if compared with latest flagship phones.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] :
Well everyone has their own taste and i can't agree with your comment. I don't say oppo is bad and there maybe also some shots where it looks better but overall it's not.

Xiaomi is finally going the "natural pictures" way. It's nice to see they try to avoid the heavy processed pics. Less sharpness, less exposure, with "real" dark shadows that's what I want. Just a natural pic similar to what i get with my DSLR.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] maxel77:
we will see with future reviews.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] mbfamily:
That's good. You can do the sharpening in post-processing, but you can not undo it. So it's better if the phone produces more natural images.
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] extremecarver:
Xiaomi used to be great with gcam - soemthing that cannot be said of the X90 Pro+ (colors of hell in gcam).

If they manage full integration of gcam like Xiomi 10 Ultra it will be the ultimate camera phone of this year by a big margin (for daytime at least).

Even if the integration is only as good as in Xiaomi 11 Ultra it will still be the most DSLR like camera by leaps.

At night in very low light I'm not a fan of gcam. Very low light as handeld somewhere with very little street lights. If it's night on a rather busy street / decent lightning I still prefer gcam by bounds over what Vivo photo camera does.

Also that those sensors are meant to complement each others - is a huge plus especially for gcam.

Plus you can take group photos with the main sensor - unlike on X90P+ or Xiaomi 13 Pro or Find X6 Pro or Honor Magic 5. F4 instead of F1.9 is a big difference.

Plus Xiaomi said they improved the optics a lot - Xiaomi 13 Pro had clearly inferior optics vs X90 Pro+ so maybe it wasn't as much the algos but the lense...
[Vivo X90 Pro Plus] Dayuser:
Did you know that you can also change color settings in gcam?