yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Touch HD General] mackaby007:
how the 3D rendering and video accelleration on the Hd compared to iPhone 3G?

hiya.

Does anyone know what type of hardware accellerator the Touch HD has....if any? If it's the same CPU as the touch pro, then 3D accelleration will be weak. From what I've gleaned from several benchmark sites, the touch pro only performs at just under 1/5 of the power that the iPhone uses.

I've always been a windows mobile man before I got an iphone 3G and I have a great dilemma in that a WM device can do so much more, but what the iPhone does it does so much better. The GUI and it's intuitive feel is second to none I have experienced.

I'm kinda biased towards the iPhone but would love to be swayed back to the devices that do so much more without jailbreaking etc I (wouldn't own an iPhone if it were not for jailbreaking).

If the touch HD can even just match the hardware of the iPhone in this particular respect, I'll ditch my beloved iPhone 3G in a second. Otherwise I'll wait for a better solution with Nvidias technology on-board.

Back to my original question once more, does the HD have anything better to offer in this department?

Maybe this is the difference between:

1) a business mobile office king/ multimedia capable phone

And

2) a multimedia thoroughbred/ multi-communications phone

I know they are different devices and this shouldn't be directly compared, but I think most of us would like the perfect combination of both. So what I'm really looking for is the device that has the most features (that I actually use as opposed to just having a feature rich device) and it must be handle movie playback and intensive 3D graphics rendering in real-time whilst retaining the look and feel of a slim phone.
[Touch HD General] Rob_Quads:
There are quite a few golfing applications for the iPhone and no doubt more even better ones will appear soon. The problem is to see if they do what you need you will need to start spending some money which for me is one of the biggest stumbling blocks for the iPhone. I don't want to have to buy lots of app to find the one that does what I need. They should have some form of 24h trial facility
[Touch HD General] miky7:
This is a forum dedicated to WM devices manufactured by HTC. Posting a question for iPhone is a little bit irrelevant, not to mention that you would receive more answers in forums dedicated to iPhone.
[Touch HD General] Boinng:
But there are plenty here that have switched from WM to the Iphone, and can therefore give a good comparison between the two, and any problems in the transition etc. That's why its useful to post such questions here.

To the (potential) switcher - I think there are some things which will dissapoint you about the iPhone, for instance you're asking about TomTom - not only is TomTom not available for the iPhone in any form, but neither is anything else remotely like it. No turn by turn GPS apps, period.

The other stuff like Golf apps, expenses, bible readers etc - there's a huge array of stuff like that in the Appstore, some free, most very cheap. No proper Office suites yet, but Quickoffice are working on a version apparently, and in the meantime there's a useable spreadsheet app at least. It's difficult to link to the apps themselves in the Appstore as it's all in iTunes, but have a browse around http://appshopper.com/ - it's a useful site which lists most (if not all) the apps and shows which have had recent price changes etc.

There's no limit on the number of email accounts that I'm aware of - that all works very well.

At the moment it's NOT as functional as WM, but it's expanding all the time, and (as so many have said) in what it does, the iPhone is pretty unbeatable. I switched to it from a Tytn II and haven't been dissapointed at all, but of course needs vary.
[Touch HD General] eaglesteve:
Thanks Boinng.

I appreciate the view especially from those who have experienced both winmo as well as iPhone device.

I'd explore the link you've provided and see if I can get answer there.

Thanks again for being helpful.
[Touch HD General] mackaby007:
XDA developers forum.....not HTC developers...

with all due respect... HTC have given us here absolutely zilch over the years in terms of occasions ROM updates based on what our developers here have found solutions to. Secondly as we have no direct affiliation to HTC other than owning some device they designed and built. We are free to discuss and compare other technologies for whatever reason we wish, but being at xda developers we usually strive for the best we can achieve, as these devices usually come with, as I'm sure you know, a truck full of bugs.

And if you check the thread title it is obvious that iPhone will be mentioned and that some people may be curious about it's capabilities. And to some people it is important that the information they read comes from either a reliable or trusted source, hence you ask in a forum where you are already established and know which posts to ask specific questions.

Anyway, hi Eaglesteve. Long time no see. If you want be to answer all those questions for ya, drop me a quick email and I'll post back some info that should be of interest to you. I've pm'd you.
[Touch HD General] Boinng:
Putting an accelerometer in for the camera (as Nokia did) was not innovation - camera manufacturers have been using them for years. The innovation came when Apple used one for something completely different, and integrated it into the whole UI - that's what Nokia later tried to copy, when they realised they had the potential to do similar in an existing handset.
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
I started this thread REALLY wanting to love the HD, and like anyone, after spending £525 on a phone, you kinda of hope if will do the job. When I wrote the above, I meant every word, looking back with great hindsight, I see I was trying to justify the cost somewhat.

It was day one, if I regret anything, it would be that I should have waited a couple of days before posting, but I was aware people at that time were very keen for information.

Early on in the thread it became clear several people were close to buying an HD, and I felt a responsabilty to those people, so I spent more time with the device.

I think that Kev went away quite quickly once I admitted (to myself) that in terms of screen brightness, touch screen, and the abilty to keep the device looking good (what I mean here is that the glass screen is gonna stay nice MUCH longer than a plastic one), the iPhone was quite a lot better.

I then had a little problem, I had been very keen and upbeat about the HD, and could look silly if I changed my mind.

I guess a lot of people at that point would have sent the HD back and stopped posting to the thread, but I felt (and still do) that would be unfair to people, so I began to change my view.

For some clarity, I don't HATE the HD, for most of you that have one, it will be the bollocks, and the fact you are WM users you will love it.

In fact, I don't see how anything I say about it will affect anyone else.....unless of course they have spent the money, don't have a return option, and just will not admit that the HD is not the ultimate after all.

Thanks anyway for looking back over the thread, I really would recommend everyone does the same.

Kev
[Touch HD General] ryaninuk:
Here is a dumb question... one of my worries is bricking my HD if I do something idiotic. Is it like the iphone where you can restore it no matter what? If so what is the process for doing it? I did clear the memory before and it seemed to set it back to factory settings. Is this my all purpose panic button? I also know about the hard reset is there anything else I need to know about? Any good typical troubleshooting tips?

As long as I know I can bring it back from any state I will probably feel more at ease playing around with it more.

Thanks
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
Um, if you click the link, then click on BUY NOW, you can choose an 8GB at £349 or a 16GB at £399.

Kev
[Touch HD General] rovex:
Actually the N95 DID make use of the accelerometer at launch, it used it to correctly orientate camera pictures and i forgot that it used it in the music player as well.
[Touch HD General] drzoid:
As I said, apart from tilting it is not used by the user interface.

Apart from an additional part which can fail and is subject to error, the click doesnt make a difference to me.

Apart from that you were even proven wrong meanwhile, it definitely is what Apple did. They just took a handful of known hardware components which might not have been already present in most phones and call it innovative, but thats not what it is.

Oh? We are talking about innovation and that Apple lacks the most fundamental features and you are simply ignoring this point but prefer to discuss features to simulate light sabers.
[Touch HD General] ryaninuk:
Another quick question, is there not a way to zoom in on pictures? I used this on my iPhone a lot to give mini slide shows. Quite useful when things in pics are too small to read like the text on signs.

For instance I was teaching about the killing fields in Cambodia and I was able to zoom in on the various signs and landmarks they had there so people were able to read them.
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
Well, the plans in the UK are dirt cheap, £35 for 600 mins, 500 text and unlimited wi fi and data.

How is jailbreaking illegal?

I do miss multi tasking, it would be great to have, no question (I mean proper multitaking like WM guys, I know you can do it via jailbreak on iPhone)

I don't owe any answer, although I am happy to still try, its all in the thread...have you read it all|

Kev
[Touch HD General] rovex:
Make a clockwise circular motion on the screen in the area you want to zoom.
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
This 150% you talk of, you mean resolution rather than the 3.8" screen actually being 150% larger right?

Shame of it is, in most cases, the brightness of the iPhone screen makes it look less, and in other cases, one could argue that the res is actually too high, making fonts very small (or when you enlarge them, you end up with less on screen than before)

Kev
[Touch HD General] ryaninuk:
Sweet! thanks for that! Works great this is very useful for me.
[Touch HD General] drzoid:
I wouldnt call this cheap :).

It violates the license agreement.

Yes.
[Touch HD General] ryaninuk:
Breaking your license agreement isn't illegal. Unlocking your iPhone is also not illegal.
[Touch HD General] drzoid:
Tell this your lawyer or better the judge.
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
I am not even sure I have any COMPLAINTS against the HD, after all, I sent it back, got all my money back.

Certainly the screen played a huge part in my decision, it was certainly not the only one, and all the others are in this thread.

But I would say, even if the screen was the only issue, as its the way you use everything on the phone, it may be a good enough reason on its own.

All the advantages you mention of the HD, may or may not be advantages to me, so why would I care.

Everything about this is a compromise, the iPhone is no exception, I want Sat Nav for example, so I keep my vitrually worthless Trinity around for this.

Kev
[Touch HD General] drzoid:
Well, I am also used to a capacitive screen and havent seen the HD's yet, nonetheless I am excited about it and from the comments expect a good one.

If not, there is still Asus where I hope the rumours are true.

But Apple? Never with all those limitations.
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
Don't get me wrong mate, I would never use RebelSim, and in the UK you don't really need to as the iPhone O2 contract is damn good, I know that ATT and others are ripping people off though.

My answer to that poster was purely correcting falsehoods. First he posted that you 100% needed itunes to activate. Wrong, and once I pointed that out he decided to go down the illegal route, also wrong as far as I am aware.

I don't accept the answer that just cos iPhone is only on O2 it automatically makes it a bad choice. It may be for some people of course.

Kev
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
Have you got an HD?

Have you got an iPhone?

Assuming you have (otherwise you could not say that), please turn the Auto thing off on both devices and turn both to full.

Now tell me the HD is brighter?

Repeat outside in sunlight.

Kev
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
Hey, its not so bad, I am often called fatboy, so its only one letter to change :-)

Kev
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
That is the bottom line mate, thanks for your input, good luck with the HD.

Kev
[Touch HD General] drzoid:
Activating without Apple's application requires jailbreaking which is illegal, which you do not seem to be aware of.
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
Yes, until the guys over at

http://blog.iphone-dev.org/

Get it sorted, although RebelSim is supposed to work.

Kev
[Touch HD General] arfster:
What judge? Has anyone ever been fined for jailbreaking an iphone?
[Touch HD General] Insaneboy:
9 pages in a few hours...

If that's not spam i don't know what is...
[Touch HD General] ryaninuk:
I have no idea where you got that from but jailbreaking isn't illegal. Cite the law it breaks if you continue saying this. It is at worst a civil matter and the penalty Apple imposes is to void the warranty.
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
Thanks Ryan, let us know maybe if you do get any joy with Apple, I reckon they may just swap it out for you.

Reading your post about signal reminded me how poor it is on my Trinity, so I guess all formats have there plus and minus points.

You know, we all view things in our own way, for me the iPhone is just simply about the same as all my other recent devices, so its no biggie here, but I 100% accept for others it is critical.

Of course, anyone here in the UK can try an iPhone for 14 days, and return it is not happy with signal or anything else.

I did notice prior to 2.1 that signal bars could go up and down a bit oddly, but since 2.1 I just have not had any issues.

A bit like you, if I had an issue with signal, I would ditch this and use something else, which I am also lucky enough to be able to afford.

Kev
[Touch HD General] drzoid:
The law of which country?

Of course it is a civil matter, just like pirating software. You do not own the software you are modifying. By the way it also violates the DMCA.
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
OK, innovation Apple style.

MobileMe.

OK, lets get the terrible start out of the way, it was bad, they admitted it was bad and I have had over 6 months free to compensate.

Get an iPhone and a Mobileme account.

Every contact you type on the iPhone gets put online. You do nothing, no setup once you put your account details in.

Every appointment you put on your iPhone, it also appears online, again nothing to do.

The reverse works, hate the iPhone keyboard? Type all your contacts online, and sort out your calendar online, everything gets zapped to your iPhone.

It really does just work. Are there similar services for WM, and the HD, I am sure there are, but I have tried GooSync, just does not work half the time, locks up, needs a reset.

Kev
[Touch HD General] ryaninuk:
The topic has been beaten to death on other forums that lawyers frequent and you do not violate the DMCA by jailbreaking or unlocking. It voids your warranty plan and simple. For your purposes let's say you are right. Apple would never even push it anyway. They tell you to take a leap if you try getting repairs and they know what you did which is unlikely.

Is reflashing an HD illegal?

Jailbreaking and pirating software are two different things. They can prosecute criminally those that pirate if they want to. One is stealing intellectual property.
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
Extends into other areas, like the new Google search app, have you seen it yet, just move the iPhone to your face, and it beeps, ready for you to tell it what you want google to look up.

Works well, a bit USA focused I think, but not played with it much yet.

Kev
[Touch HD General] darthbane2k:
Someone wants to say hello.....

Windows mobile devices have been doing this for years, and with hosted exchange (which I use) anyone can use this functionality. What you have proven is that Apple is the undesputed master of misinformation and misconception. Thanks to clever marketing, they have you believe that the functionality of MobileMe is something new and innovative. Its a shame mobileme wont let you sync task though- I honestly dont know what I would do without tasks syncing on my desktop PCs (yes all 3 of them including work), laptop, outlook web access and WM device
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
I simply don't get this?

Surely if there is just ONE restriction on the iPhone that you can not live with, it simply does not enter the race?

As an example, quite early on in this thread, eaglesteve made it clear that battery life would not work for his specific use on the golf course.

Another member here suggested as this was so fundemental, he needed to go HD, or at least, not get an iPhone.

Kev
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
YOU can stop anytime you want.

This is a relevant thread looking at differences between iPhone and WM, shut down threads like this, you may as well close the whole damn site.

Why not rename it WM6Fanboys.com while you are at it :-)

Kev
[Touch HD General] darthbane2k:
try freedom of controlling my media any damn way I want to. Thats the deal breaker for me,and one restriction of the iPhone that my wife is very quickly getting frustrated with
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
Honestly, I think that is cheap.

Is the licence agreement actually a low though, I doubt it?

Anyway, I break the law everytime I get in my car :-)

Kev
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
Which mobile do you have now?

Kev
[Touch HD General] darthbane2k:
Im stiil calling you out on your MobileMe statement,Kev.

Come on.. retort!
[Touch HD General] ryaninuk:
Well is it a law where? There is no law that covers the whole world. I am an American living over here in the Uk and I realise that laws are different according to jurisdiction.

It seems like people from the states send threatening letters to people like pirate bay about laws that aren't applicable in their country. If it is even a law at all where is this law applicable or did US law become the defacto working legal system for the entire planet?
[Touch HD General] Boinng:
That's nonsensical - what else do you with an accelerometer but tilt it? That tilting is an essential part of the interface, and much of the software written for it.

Your sentence is a bit like saying "apart from touching, the touchscreen is not used by the user interface".

Oh yes, those proximity sensor failures are a ***** aren't they. Very common problem. If only I could just click a button, rather than do absolutely nothing at all.

I don't think I was proved wrong, you know :)

I've already provided a quote from the Nokia blog, posted months after the iphone released, describing how they never even knew the N95 had an accelerometer. It wasn't until the iPhone that Nokia, or its users, had any idea what it was capable of.

No, for starters it's you with the light saber fetish. Secondly, you don't seem to understand the meaning of the word "innovation". It has absolutely nothing to do with following the same standards and conventions as everyone else - in fact it's the exact opposite of that. Is it a bit of a pisser that the iPhone doesn't do MMS without jailbreaking? Perhaps. But does that have any bearing whatsoever on the iPhone's innovation? Absolutely not.

The Touch HD supports MMS and video recording, do those things make it innovative? Of course not.
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
Missing the point, of course I know about Exchange, but the innovation (which is the point being made) is that Apple made it truly damn simple.

I would consider myself a fairly advanced PC user, and Exchange confuses the hell out of me.

If you can get me setup on Exchange for £59 a year, with 20gig of online disk space, and does not require me to use that horrible virus called Outlook, let me know by PM.

And I have not been conned by Apple marketing, did oyu not read, I signed up and used it for 3-4 months, and decided it is superb.

Kev
[Touch HD General] Boinng:
This whole argument is very silly when made on XDA devs - if jailbreaking is "illegal" then so is virtually EVERYTHING the devs do here in terms of ROM cooking and the like. The exact same technicalities over software copyright and licensing apply to every cooked ROM, most of the cab files people rely on, all the support that most of the WM owners here tout as a strength of the platform.

Criminalise jailbreaking, and you may as well shut this forum down tomorrow.
[Touch HD General] mackaby007:
why so much animosity here?

hi again all. I've just read through 20 odd pages of argument, regardless of valid points on either side.

Why don't we all just cool it. I'm sure no progress has been made at all of late.

Let's just accept that neither WM or any incarnation of iPhone can cater to most peoples expectations. If you own the best smartphones on the planet from Symbian, WM and iPhone etc, then you have the best available mobile comma technology with best in class multimedia performance, but most cannot afford it and most of the rest of us will make do with just device and accept some shortcomings. That's basically what all of us here are doing right now.

WM and iPhone are 2 totally different devices that share some common features to all smart/phones.

Let's all just try to get along again. We have much to Lear from each other.

I would rather see a colaboration in how to get certain features from each device over to the other one, so we can all be pleased with what we have rather than arguing or defending one's material possesion or foolish pride.

This is not aimed at any one person, but to those who accept that they are a part of dragging out a dead thread.

All necessary points have already been made. Choice is a beautiful thing, let's force our choices down each others throats.

Peace and love my virtual friends otherwise become a soldier or politician!
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
Do you mean itunes downloads?

Why use them then, no need too.

Buy the CD, rip it in itunes and use it how you want.

Use www.mp3sparks.com and import to the iPhone.

Why do people think they HAVE to buy from itunes?

Kev
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
Good god, I gotta eat :-)

Kev
[Touch HD General] ryaninuk:
That's exactly what I was thinking earlier.
[Touch HD General] darthbane2k:
No,I mean I am round someones house and I want to grab some music to listen to, or some pictures - with a WM device I can do this quicikly with just a USB cable or bluetooth and no additional software. With iphone you need itunes on the PC and have to go through the hassle of a sync
[Touch HD General] darthbane2k:
no, its because you have NO COMEBACK.

You called mobileme an innovation and I called you out.

Did you even explore the potential of the HD or any WM device before ditching it? Or were you too excited with the social potential of joining the 'white earphones club'
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
Yep, WM is better for that.

Kev
[Touch HD General] rovex:
No they make it functionally adequate, something the iPhone isnt.
[Touch HD General] darthbane2k:
Correction, ANY OTHER MODERN PHONE is better for that

And thats the deal breaker.

I have 1 TB of music at home on a media server , there are many devices in my home which share this media. Id be damned if I 'surrendered' it to an itunes libary. I want to be able to use it when and how I want without this syncing nonsense. If I want a new album that I recently put on the NAS, I simply copy and paste. Its that simple.
[Touch HD General] kevwright:
You really need to read more carefully?

http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=2926485&postcount=420

Surely that was quick enough?

As to your last bit, again, had you read the thread, you would know I already owned the iPhone for 6-7 months, and for the record, I NEVER use headphones :-)

Kev
[Touch HD General] ryaninuk:
Isn't that illegal?