yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] noellenchris:
Da_G is on to something that might help

"On a side note, just curious.. when you guys flash a new radio ROM, are you also grabbing the rilphone.dll that goes with that radio ROM?

Reason I ask is the rilphone.dll driver is what sits inbetween the RIL abstraction layer and the radio ROM.. so any new/changed features in the radio ROM that require different commands from older versions would never recieve the newer command without a rilphone.dll that's aware of the changes.. of course any fixes to problems with existing commands would carry over.. but one such new command in the blackstone radios vs. the raphael radios is AT@AGPSFeature.. it defaults to 0 and the raphael rilphone.dll never issues that command (because it's not aware of it) but the blackstone rilphone.dll does..	__________________"

He is working on cooking that rilphone.dll into a rom to match with a radio. This may solve some issues for us.

I agree messing w/ the reg seems to have little effect. Speed lag is always there and I can't seem to change it no matter what I change...keep your fingers crossed that Da_G get's to the bottom of this.....:D
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] nitroblu:
good update noellenchris :D!
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] mindfrost82:
All I've done is flash the radio, I've never changed anything else.

Is it possible to just copy over the rilphone.dll file without cooking it in? If this is a possibility, then I would be more than willing to test it if someone can get me the file from a Blackstone ROM with either the latest 1.09 or 1.10 radio.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] mike99:
Would it be worthwhile asking someone from the forum with a perfectly working GPS to upload the GPS drivers so that others can try them and see if they woud fix the problem?

Thanks
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] mindfrost82:
I just got to thinking, if its the rilphone.dll file, then wouldn't the problem be fixed in the Blackstone ROMs that use the correct radio and rilphone.dll combination?

Its my understanding that they have the same (or similar) issues that we do.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] mike99:
Well, maybe it is worth trying to reload the entire ROM from someone who claims GPS works fine. Can the ROM be uploaded on this site by individual users?

I am on Sprint, and there seems to be several ROM versions floating around, depending on the build date. The last number in the ROM version varies from 1 in very first models to 4 in the most recent. I am not sure if this is related to GPS issues. I have the latest version and marked lag.

So, maybe we could try to upload a "perfect" GSM and CDMA ROMs from people who tested GPS and have no problem and test it on other phones.

This way we:

1. would know for sure if this is a hardware issue or not

2. would be possibly able to fix it without knowing exactly where the problem is.

Any thoughts???
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] mindfrost82:
Not sure about CDMA, but as of right now there's no "perfect" GSM ROM in regards to GPS. I believe everyone is having some speed lag. Some isn't as bad as others though.

I'm still willing to try the rilphone.dll and see if it helps.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] mike99:
So did some more testing today. Looks like the voice commands are on time, but the image lags. My refresh rate (using TeleNav and Google maps as well as Amaze) is one every 1.5-2 sec, compared to 3-4/sec reported by others here.

The compass tools on telenav also shows pretty accurate speed driving steadily (with 2-3 mph) but accelerating or decelerating, takes 7-8 sec to get to the right speed.

I am on stock sprint ROM build date 12/26
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Da_G:
I've been doing some private testing with a bluetooth GPS and the internal GPS side-by-side, with interesting results.. today it seems almost perfect.. yesterday it was off by almost 50 feet..

Check this out. Point 147 is from the internal GPS, timestamped :38:35.8 (minutes:seconds:10thsofasecond)

Point 143 is from my bluetooth gps (which is known not to have any lag or positional issues, and is accurate to sub-1 meter), timestamped :38:35.0

So the internal gps is showing me a couple feet behind and to the right of the bt gps. The difference is within the margin of error of the dilution of position (note the vehicle in the upper part of the image, the difference is less than one vehicle-length)

This is with blackstone 1.10.25.25 radio/rilphone/dsm/smd/smd_com/rpc (all related parts to serial ports etc.)

I was not able to look at the screen at the same time as doing this test, so I can't say if positional/speed lag showed up on the screen or not. But if it was, it would be due to a buffer somewhere, as the raw NMEA output when synchronized with a common time source (GPS satellites) shows it to be accurate.

Definite discrepancies I can see: Speed reporting on the internal GPS seems to be off when accelerating/decelerating, and almost spot on at a constant speed. This reinforces my theory about some kind of averaging algorithm coming into play..

Altitude differs by a rather large margin (836.614 ft on bluetooth GPS, 709.646 ft on internal GPS) - but altitude is something consumer gps units are not very good at, gotta look to aviation GPS units or higher end business class units for that.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] noellenchris:
Ok, tried the quartz ril and my rom doesn't like it...darn....I guess I will have to eventually cook up my own rom. I hate reinstalling everything. I install so much stuff it takes me ages to get the phone back the way I like it....lol:(

I wonder if Da_G had any luck replacing his ril in his rom? I know he posted above, but did the ril make a difference?:confused:
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Da_G:
So far I haven't come up with a reliable test case scenario to make a judgement call on it. Subjectively, it feels better. Could easily be placebo effect though.

It seems to have introduced an issue that I don't recall having in the stock radio though, occaisionally my gps position is exactly n feet west/east and exactly n feet north/south of my position.. don't know why it happens, but when it does it'll stick until a soft reset..

(what I mean is that every position report will be, for example, 10 feet west and 10 feet north of my real position, and it will be off by exactly 10ft/10ft until a soft reset) - it seems to happen once out of every 10 soft resets using the gps or so.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] mindfrost82:
Can someone export all of their Multiplexer key settings?

I accidently deleted the whole key lol.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Sleuth255:
Yep. Have speed lag in both Raphael and Kaiser. Raphael is a bit worse though. I don't think we can fix this; only positional lag. It's pretty clear in my video on post 400 especially when I make the turn onto Davidson road. Not an issue for navigating though so it doesn't concern me much. Since its doppler based, it might have something to do with SNR. Somebody should duct-tape their fuze to the hood of the car and go driving to see if speed lag gets better.

JK!
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] fourcc:
why don't use sprite backup? it usually (+90%) gives to me good results restoring backups after HR or ROM upgrades.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] crazyC:
Or use UC/ Sashimi?
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] CLShortFuse:
On my GPSToolPro application, I'm now working on making your own psuedo AGPS server. Basically, you input 127.0.0.1 and port# you want into the HTC\SUPL AGPS registry settings and the application will listen on that port and respond with your Lat/Long from Google. I've already got AGPS working with Google's servers, but the only thing I can't do yet is feed the GPS device that information.

Can somebody who has AGPS working from their ISP/Cell Provider packet sniff and send me the info so I can make this application?

Discussion thread is here:

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=474582&page=3
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] MIQmiq:
New ROM on its way

Hi all

Just had a debate with HTC support, where they now say, that HTC will release a ROM update mid-february, maybe it will remove the GPS lag problem.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Sleuth255:
ahh... the 'ol "they will release a new rom shortly" ploy from HTC ;)

Good to see they haven't changed a bit.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] crazyC:
I too would be rather cynical but understand that O2 over here have confirmed a Q1 Rom update as well - I would expect that to be on the same base.

So maybe there is hope. Maybe.....
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Flying Kiwi:
Sleuth255 is spot on

What, the same HTC that told me and many other users of the TyTN II unhappy with it's graphics performance, that a new ROM with better video playback and improved graphics was just around the corner? In the end what they told me would be about 2 weeks or so, took about 6 months and even then it didn't address the real issues most people were complaining about. Worse, it contained more bugs than the original ROM and caused more problems than it fixed. Take it from someone who's been on the end of lines from HTC like this, believe it only when you see it and keep up the complaints until it's proven you've got somewhere :(
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Da_G:
I've got some NMEA logs if anyone wants to take a look, PM me (please don't ask if you don't know what to do with them :)), I did several drives around town on several different days, with my bluetooth gps and my phone sitting side-by-side, logging pure nmea data, using timestamps from the gps satellites (this eliminates any graphical lag as a possible source)

And there seems to be a clear 1 second lag in the output of the internal GPS. This is most likely occuring at or above the level of gpsdriver.dll, so no amount of tweaks to the gpsid_htc.dll parameters will help the issue (please, prove me wrong, i want a working gps too! :))

CLShortFuse: I've been checking your tool out, looks like a great idea :) You probably want to look to the CDMA forums for a user with a working PDE <--> AGPS system communication, I don't think any of us on the GSM side have a working implementation.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] misfitwrx:
i have noticed in igo8 the signal strength for each sat. never gets anywhere in the green(max) and i noticed the higher the signal str. for each sattelite it seemed to update faster and work alot better, like on a clear sunny day it not only locks faster but is more responsive over all. i dont know much about the technical stuff with these things, but maybe the radio rom or another setting can devote more power or something to the gps chip ? i could be completely wrong and im sure i am but its just something i noticed
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] dez93_2000:
HTC Touch HD update

Sorry for being lazy all, but there are 86 pages!

The apps on p1 haven't been updated since november - can anyone give me a quick overview as to whether it's possible to improve the GPS performance of my touch HD?

I've not used it much, but it doesn't seem to update location if I'm stationary, or sometimes if I'm moving. I've already read reports of horrendous lag when driving but yet to test. Is there a solid fix yet, or are current attempts getting lots of "it didn't work"/"it crashed my system"/"it killed my poodle" responses? :D

Cheers in advance!

Dez
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Operation619:
I experienced pretty bad lag when using it with iGuidance as well as a few other GPS software programs I use.

However, once I installed Franson's GPSGate all of my issues were resolved. The implementation of the Intermediate GPS ID driver was not done well by HTC.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] ajmiller:
One additional observation that might be relevant. I have just enabled speed camera warnings on Copilot 7. Normally, it gives a verbal warning and a visual indicator as one nears. On the TP the verbal message is repeated many times over and the visual warning flashes annoyingly on and off. This seems to confirm other observations that the GPS signal is being interrupted in some way. The signal indicator bars also seem to fluctuate alot even when completely immobile. With a BT GPS device its rock solid and none of this occurs.

The TP for me is only a little bit better than stock with all the reg changes and other tips suggested through this thread, radio and rom flashes tried and tested. The lock is now quicker but its performance other wise remains laggy and inaccurate.

We havent really got to the bottom of this and despite earlier hopes HTC doesnt seem to be taking the problem seriously
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] kk0813:
Da_G was right. I received the new IGuidance 2009 (which uses eGML for graphics) two days back and I still have the gps lag both positional and speed. I tried with and with out GPSGate, with and with out registry fix mentioned in this thread.

I hope HTC wtill come up with some solution on this.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] mindfrost82:
What settings are you using with GPSGate? Do you have it reading COM4 or the Intermediate Driver? Do you mind going through all the settings and sharing them with us?

I found no difference when I used GPSGate.

Its been a known issue that iGuidance (atleast older versions) needs an app like GPSGate though, so that might be what you're noticing.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] kk0813:
I am using AstroGPSLauncher and the attached files. This will start the GPSGate (if not already running) and will launch the IGuidance. I have set GPSGate to COM4 and baud rate to 4800, output to COM1 and in IGuidance COM1 and baud rate 4800.

The attached files are originally from

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=364199

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=363431 (check post #4 for IGuidance)

Only thing I changed is, the script was pointing to IGuidanceQVGA.exe and I changed to IGuidanceVGA.exe

I am using IGuidance 2009.

Instructions are in iGuidanceInternalGPSLauncher.msc

Even I didn't find any difference using with GPSGate.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] mindfrost82:
And do you have speed lag? Does iGuidance 2009 have a speedometer? When your car shows 0, how long before iGuidance shows 0?
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] CLShortFuse:
Guys, if you want to check if there's speed lag, don't use TomTom or anything like that. They aren't transparent enough to know what it's doing. Maybe TomTom checks every 1 second and caches. You don't know where the latency is.

If you want to check if the lag is with the GPS Intermediate Driver (GPSID) use my GPSToolPro. It's really basic. It shows the speed. You can set the timer poll interval (default at 1000ms/1sec).

If you want to check if the lag is with the GPSDevice, find a SIMPLE program that accesses the COMM port directly. I'm not sure which one does.

Don't use programs that are processor intensive, use the microSD and do other background checks. You don't know what TomTom is doing in the background. That's my point.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Da_G:
As I posted before I have raw NMEA logs that clearly show a 1 second lag on the internal gps.. :( So it's certainly not graphic or processor related :()

This is something that will most likely need a fix from HTC (or maybe even qualcomm if the fault lies there, it seems to affect quite a number of msm devices)

My only hope for us lowly people without source code to fix it is NVRAM parameters..
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] CLShortFuse:
Ah, I guess TomTom is even slower since it give me a 3-5 second speed lag.

Da_G did you see my post about requesting AGPS network packets. I'm thinking of running a TCP server on the device that answers AGPS calls with Lat/Long coordinates from Google's server. I got the coordinates, but I don't know what packets to send to emulate the AGPS server. Got any AGPS logs?
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Da_G:
Unfortunately no one on the GSM side of things has working AGPS at this point.. (at least it seems)

Do you know of a packet sniffer that works over GPRS? I can certainly give it a shot..
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] CLShortFuse:
It doesn't have to be GPRS. Think about it. It can be sent over WiFi. You can use a packet sniffer via a man-in-the-middle attack. Just disable the GPRS connection and have it send over WiFi. Technically, getting what packets shouldn't get an issue since I can just make a TCP server and read what's been sent. The question is, how do I respond?

We can also proxy it. I'm sure AGPS servers do an IP check to see your provider, so I would just need a proxy server on the network (or a phone and I can just pass packets with an application.)

I just need somebody with a working AGPS server to know how to respond.

I'm going to look online on how to make your own AGPS server
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] fourcc:
I think, this is the way to go. i repeat again, your idea is brilliant!
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] CLShortFuse:
In an effort to keep threads relevant, I made a new one about the AGPS thing. This thread is GPS Lag

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=477430
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] petard:
I was trying to use my GPS yesterday and it was giving me trouble. I think the GPS sometimes stores corrupted data about the last fix to use to speed up the next fix. I had the GPS on for 8 minutes to get a fix outside in clear skies. Then I reopened it and it whenever it got a fix it would lose all satellites and start the fix all over again. I restarted TomTom many times and it just did the same thing. Then I went to HTC GPS tool and cleared data and opened TomTom again. Now, in less than 1 minute it got a steady lock indoors.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Operation619:
Most North American GSM carriers have AGPS working. It's a requirement for E911. However, the degree of network-assisted positioning implementation and methods differ by carrier.

Current FCC guidelines require that wireless E911 solutions provide public-safety answering points (PSAPs) with automatic-location data on the caller that is accurate within 50 meters 67% of the time — and within 150 meters 95% of the time.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Da_G:
I was curious, so I checked out the FCC's requirements re:E911, and it seems to be an accuracy requirement rather than a requirement for AGPS. The GPS more than meets these accuracy requirements without AGPS..

I'm referencing FCC document here.

It discusses seperate requirements for handset-based location services and network-based services, but both AGPS and standalone GPS are handset-based.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Operation619:
It's not only accuracy but time as well. E911 would be no good if it took 5 minutes to get a fix. The network assisted position data used for E911 is also used for LBS data (well, for the most part).
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Da_G:
Truth! Time is also a requirement. But mainly I wanted to point out that AGPS is NOT a requirement.. if it was I believe the last several HTC GSM devices would not be in compliance.. :)
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Operation619:
Positioning compliance via handset and network assistance is a requirement for meeting phase II E911 compliance. Every handset sold in the US must meet this minimum specification as of '02. Furthermore, the 3GPP specification allows almost every single GSM handset made today access to the location requests on the control plane. However, allowing LBS data on the user-control plane is very much carrier-specific and is not required.

Most handsets, including our Raphael, meet the spec using various forms of AGPS. A blend of network-assisted position data along with a fully autonomous GPS RF front-end augmented (in HTC phones anyway) by artificial ephemeris data (aka "QuickGPS").
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] labrok:
i had for many months great problem with gps lag, diamond was anout 50-60 m behind my position in all programms, till last week when i tried destinator8! its great no lag at all, not even 1 m , i think that the only problem are the maps! now i have radio 1.08.25.20 and only with destinator 8 has no lag!
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Da_G:
New program highly relevant to helping us diagnose this issue:

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?p=3255338
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Da_G:
I was successful in porting the LG Incite GPS driver, HTC GPS Tool won't work with it though because it uses the standard microsoft GPSID and HTC GPS Tool talks to GPSID_HTC.dll..

So far it hasn't given me a magically working AGPS, but it functions :) I haven't had a chance to do a driving test for lag yet.. but if there's going to be a fix other than NVRAM or a radio ROM or new hardware, this will be it :)

Edit: except it wont spit me out any satellites! :( i dont get the PSTIS string either.. interesting.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] noellenchris:
Awesome find, now I can remove the SirfTech tool before I brick GPSOne...lol... Let's see what we can play with in this one!:D
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] maw:
Hi guys

great to see that you haven't dropped this subject as yet and are still working diligently on trying to get the GPS to work acurate. I just wanted to say that I gave up.... I read a couple pages back that HTC will be coming with a new ROM most probably mid February?? Now it's mid feb, before it was end dec, then jan... I wish they would get off their lazy butts and spend some quality time and effort in solving the problems. Or they are probably waiting for you guys to fix the problem for them, they copy the solution into a ROM and distribute it. I was wondering, if and when this new ROM comes out, please take it apart and see if they indeed copied a solution you guys developed here!

Keep up the good work!
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Black1982:
Works!

Hello everybody!

i have not posted for a while as the lingo has become a little bit too complicated for me!

Anyway, i tested my TT 7.450, Western Europe Map and it works like a charm right now!! (Tested on my bicycle and in my car, speeds 20-120 km/h)

I use GPSToday for a very quick fix.(set to manual) (within few seconds even inside in front a a window)

With the settings below my TT is spot on (audio AND VISUAL)!!

Settings:

Performance:

file system cache: enabled

file system cache size: 2 mb

File system filter cache: 4096 sectors

pnp both : 1500

Glyph cache: 32 KB

GPS registry:

- Drivers\GpsOneDevice\PollInterval 250

- Drivers\InputBufferSize -> 512

- Drivers\OutputBufferSize -> 512

- Drivers\SleepOnNoData -> 1000

- Multiplexer\MaxBufferSize -> 256

AGPS disabled

No GPSlogging:

HTC Touch pro GSM

Rom: 1.90172.4 NLD (Vodafone original Rom)

Radio: 1.02.25.19

Protocol: 52.33.25.17H

Sandisk 16 gb SDHC Class 2

I also did the SD speedup tweak, dont know if it did anything

I believe it also helps to soft reset before using TT, but i have to test this some more!

I hope this can help some other people!

Thanx everybody!!:D
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] MrRalphMan:
I have tried these settings, but they seemed to have made the lag worse then it was before.

Previously I was getting a 'normal' 1 to 2 second lag, now it seems to be in the region of 3 to 4 seconds.

Shame, the fix was fast, but I had just downloaded the quickgps data.

I'll prob have to pick these setting out and put them back to normal.
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] jeblond:
haveyou seen this post ?

http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=3254886&postcount=1087

I hope it's not a hardware problem...
[Touch Pro, Fuze General] Operation619:
SiRFDemo wouldn't brick it. You couldn't send a NMEA command which would harm the receiver. If you had GPSOne binary and relevant software, now that's a different animal. :)

In my initial playing with GPSOneApp, I think it's more of a basic test and configuration tool than anything. I don't see a way of interfacing with binary which would could potentially give us much greater access to the receiver.

That being said, it's a very, very welcome app with me! :)