yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] rush242:
Again: The point being that generally ALL of the chefs here take someone else's work (HTC, OEM, et cetera), and do whatever they want with it, regardless of what that original entity wants or thinks.

This guy is selling what Dutty gave away for free. As was discussed earlier in Olipof's thread, it doesn't matter whether that is a book, a can of redbull, or a modified ROM. Once you've let it out of your control, what others do with it is their own business--no matter what you happen to think about it.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] rush242:
That is a different listing that states: "i worked really hard to provide this to you...." which is ambiguous at best. He may have worked really hard to provide it to someone. He does not claim that he wrote it.

Which, of course, could be construed as being misleading. But that really isn't the point. These listings would bother a lot of you REGARDLESS of what he says or doesn't say.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] todd737:
Least We All Be Hippocrates

No doubt, and it won't stop us from sending donations to those who whip together the ROMS we all love.

Anybody hacking together code found on the web knows that he isn't in a ownership position, he is just having fun and can't expect to have any ownership over MS or HTC or 3rd party aps because he played DJ and mixed them together.

I make donations based on the labor cooks put in researching, mixing, testing and sharing and that will not change because someone is willing to help the Luddites finally get that god-awful factory ROM off their freaking phone.

I have mad respect for Dutty and and at the rate he pumps out ROMS I don't think that it is any sweat off his back that someone is using one of his zillion old ROMs to help people have better cellular experiences.

My recommendation is that we do what HTC and MS are kind enough to do with us (and that auction on ebay) IGNORE IT!

Stop Snitching!

If you guys really wanna play police and go stop people from doing what you do then I really ask you to stop a minute and think about what it would be like if this was all shut down because MS and HTC had someone writing letters complaining that we are ignoring their REALLY ENFORCEABLE copyright.

As the old saying goes: "May he without sin cast the first stone."
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] yi3o8:
I'm not sure of the legality of selling Microsoft software (that was customized). It is like selling Vista for $5 and saying: "I changed the theme for you and it was very hard to do", but it is even worse because the theme was changed by someone else.

XDA should find someone savvy to research common licenses and burn in warnings to people at first startup saying that if they paid for it, they got hosed.

edit: Good point, but it is still very different. Microsoft is not going to waste resources to stop XDA from doing something harmless and then asking for donations. We are pointing out the fact that he is demanding payment.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] ramontrotman:
13.99????? wtf thats it???? the least he could have done is made it $14.00. i can't believe this scum bag is trying to short mr.throy's work of a cent. what a shame.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] rush242:
Exactly. It doesn't stop me.

Well said. MS and HTC and the rest sort of look the other way when it comes to this stuff. Rest assured with a little effort, sites like XDA and the rest would find it very hard to operate.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] rush242:
Which, of course, they didn't. If it's Dutty's or PDAVIET's or Q-Mobile's ROM, they're probably THRILLED.

Sure, they could have gotten it for free. But if they are capable of searching for and finding it on eBay, they are capable of doing the same thing on Google.

Which would eventually bring them here.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] outphase:
It's already removed by now (2:30 CDT)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] Dust2Dust:
Dutties is not the only rom being sold....also Alex work and some others are being sold on Ebay.

Looks like viperteeth05 (and a view others) made a lot of money with selling stuf he got from XDA. He has 300-some positive feedback, all on ROM's and iPhoneskins (yuk) ripped from XDA and other developersites
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] bengalih:
I guess ebay agreed with the OEM violation.

In addition to the previous posts... I don't disagree. However, just becuase cooking isn't entirely on the up-and-up, no one here is profiting from it (intentionally). Sure, the cooks might get some donations, but I'm sure not a single cook here does it because he thinks it will be worth his while monetarily.

These people selling on ebay and other places make themselves a large mark by actually charging for the stuff. HTC and MS are likely to take more of a look if people are selling their software for a profit. If they get interested enough they might enlarge their crusade and come after places like XDA. So these people making it higher profile is only bad for the community at large.

Legality aside, I don't think you can equate the morality of someone here downloading a cooked ROM with some tweaks with some dillweed taking something someone else worked hard to compile and not only passing it off as their own, but not crediting the cook, AND selling it for a profit.

If the guy was cooking his own ROMs and selling them, I wouldn't really mind. Of course that would still be against HTC, MS, and ebay's policies, but it wouldn't bother me because that guy was doing all the work.

What gets at me is he is selling off other people's software. If you look at his other postings it wasn't just cooked ROMs, but he was selling off skins and other such things which someone DID develop from scratch, DIDN'T break any IP rights, and DID offer the community for free.

I'm not on a witchhunt here, but if it passes by me again you can be sure I will report it and get it removed just like this last one.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] RizwanKhan:
this is just down right wrong. People like Dutty invest their personel time into creating such wonderful roms for FREE for people and these ba$tard$ sell it for money for their personnel gain..

Truly shameful; first olipro now dutty ... alas what is going on ??
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] rush242:
Meh. That's their usual MO. Pull it down, because they can always put it back up. Needless to say he's sold quite a few things.

Reading intent is quite a different thing--you can't speak for them any more than I can. Maybe they do think it will be worth their while because it's just gravy, and there seem to be a lot of "tip jars" out there.

Again, that term "profit" is subjective. Every tip jar is nothing but profit--on one of the highest profile sites (for this sort of thing) in existence.

If the cooks make a profit (and they do, given the number of tip jars, and every penny of that is profit) then there is no real difference if the seller doesn't pass it off as their own. Both groups, cooks and sellers, are doing the exact same thing: taking something that they did not create from scratch and utterly disregarding the wishes of those that did create it. Cooks don't care what OEMs think about what they do, sellers don't care what cooks think about what they do.

He doesn't really care what you think. Anymore than you care what he thinks.

I don't know why the hell you care what someone else does with something that they acquired freely. You can sell your can of redbull, your book, your car, anything you want. That includes things that were given away for free, like skins, themes, or whatnot.

All you're really doing is skrewing people who are perfectly happy to pay for the value he offers them. Judging from the number of people that do this, and their feedback, you're wasting your time.

I mean, more power to you. Ride on, Don Quixote.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] sanquar:
So creating a donation link in unintentional. It is still a profit stream. People who modify ROMs and post them here for distribution are breaking the law. It does not matter if or how they are profiting.

Ever heard of reverse engineering? Have you ever bothered to sit down and read the Microsoft EULA? By redistributing their original code to be modified is a breach. By simply modifying their code there is a breach. By redistributing the modified code there is a breach.

So before you continue to sprout out more of your unsolicited ****e, get hold of some facts. You continue to take the high moral ground on some person who has the nouse to make a profit from already illegal activities and it might actually be you who brings down sites like XDA; a site we all obviously enjoy the benefits of.

Now take your opinionated rhetoric and stick it back from whence it came. Don't pull it out to talk again on this subject till you have grown a brain!

cheers,
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] Nate731:
The facts have been checked, and history has found yours wanting...

Ok, fine. How many times has the big MS come knocking on the door of XDA? More than a couple... What's the gist of what they said? "We really don't care what you do as long as you don't host the roms here." Are you really that naive to believe that all the "leaked" stuff from MS isn't planned? Where do you think MS get's the ideas for the next generation products? They look at the communities for input as well. So if they shut the XDA down then their biggest outside source of input and ideas goes with it.

You have to look at the big picture. If we don't get outraged and help defend those that devote the time and effort to push the envelope, then at some point they'll arrive at the same attitude that you seem to have. I'd expect them to say "Why bother", and there goes all of the 3rd party roms that from your signature you are at least advertising, that you are benefiting from.

Profit from a damn tip jar? How much do you REALLY think is being donated? maybe a total of a 2-3 hundred dollars / 200 euros? For how much time spent in development? There is no way that anyone is eeking out a living on these donations. I'd like to see an average of donations versus time spent in development.

You have 12 posts primarily *****ing about others is utter crap. To speak up for others, "Either contribute something back or quit your damn hypocritical *****ing". Your signature states that you're using the Black, rom right? Your *****ing about those building the roms, and then turn around and use one? This site and the others like it are founded on contribution, either help out or leave. Nobody is forcing you to be here.

True, but at least he's standing up for his beliefs.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] yi3o8:
Why not be mad at the sellers?

Nicely said Nate. Really nicely said.

I totally agree that MS is losing nothing and gaining valuable R&D from XDA.

There is definitely a difference between a tip jar, that is continually and expertly supported, versus a bid for free software from someone who plays it off as though they have done all the work.

XDA developers are not profiteering for their creations.

eBay will shut down any auctions after someone has contacted them.

Why accuse anyone of being self-righteous for believing that people's hard work shouldn't be sold on eBay?

Using modified ROMs and/or tipping the people that are helping them customize their phones out of good will is hardly comparable to what these sellers are doing.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] sanquar:
So you are saying that every ROM cook here has written authority from MS to modify their code. Interesting.

Yes, Nate. Profit. Look up the definition. If you gain any value monetry or otherwise, you have profited.

Yep, was using black and I have used one other. I don't see anywhere I have *****ed about the cooks. I actually thought I was sticking up for them. I was just aslo sticking up for people who choose to sell on sites such as Ebay.

I was also trying to point out to bengalih that what the cooks are doing its technically wrong to the letter of the law; no worse than what the ebayers are doing.. By narking in the ebayer he / she is very well putting this site in danger. I thought you would have cared about that. Obviously not.

Now you apparently have a get out of jail free card from Microsoft. Other cooks might not have. As for my donations, the people who've received them can do with the money as they see fit.

If posting to state concern for the forum is in your mind *****ing then you Sir have a strange thought process.

cheers,

True, but at least he's standing up for his beliefs.[/QUOTE]
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] sanquar:
They are profitting in the eyes of the law. Just because you feel the cooks are doing the right thing (and I am in no way disagreeing with that) it is still illegal.

KAzza, anyone?

cheers,
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] binky11:
Well,

Here banned on Ebay ;-)

http://myworld.ebay.com/viperteeth05/

No longer a registered user
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] JimmyMcGee:
People, lets stop talking about the white elephant in the room. We all know that technically cooking ROMS is "not good joojuu."

We all know smoking is bad for us too. Have you ever noticed that if you walk up to a smoker and say, "Smoking Will Kill you." They keep on smoking. Ever Noticed that.

The point of this thread is that someone didn't even take the time to try and do

any

work to make this money. But Hitting on the fact of the legality of ROM cooking will get us no where. So before this becomes a flame war, lets drop it.

kthxbai.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] scotchua:
I actually can see the point you are trying to make, but i think that you are incorrect in saying that what the chef's (who accept donations, but do not require them) and the guy who SELLS the roms (which they did nothing to accept list them on ebay) are essentially doing the same thing.

I'm not here to argue the legality of chef's cooking roms, as in all fairness, copyright and IP laws are badly written, horribly outdated, and poorly enforced. Though I suspect that is a good thing considering the amount that legislation is influenced by big corporations and lobbying groups, and how little it is influenced by what is actually best of the consumers or even the creators themselves...but i digress.

Here is my major distinction: chefs actually do add some value to the software they provide. If they were to release a program that would essentially perform all of the tweaks and modifications which we see them do to each rom, we wouldn't be having this conversation at all...it would be innovative. The real issue is that rather than just create a program which makes the registry edits, and fixes all the performance issues that microsoft has done such a poor job of doing, they have actually deconstructed the rom and rebuilt it. Of course, while the end result may be the same, the methods are not, and as you correctly pointed out, modifying the roms and making them available to other people is a definite legal grey area. One which to this point, microsoft has not been willing to really push the envelope.

Now we get to the guys who take someone else's software and post it on ebay. Last i checked, people weren't giving things away on ebay, which makes it a completely different matter. They are not giving away software, they are SELLING it, and no I absolutely do not buy the argument that accepting donations is the same as selling. People donate for a great many reasons, MAYBE it's because they have used a rom and it was helpful. Maybe it's because someone like jocky created a program that can restore your phone from the dead, or someone built a program that lets you be sim unlocked (which cell phone companies don't like, but is absolutely not illegal).

Yet again, i'll say i'm not here to argue whether the work that the chef's do is legal or illegal. I have no doubt that should it be determined that rom cooking is against the law, then there will no longer be chef's releasing roms on this site, but until that day we should not lump these two issues together.

In conclusion I will say that anyone who would buy the rom on Ebay deserves what they get anyway, as they could download the same thing for free from the creator of the software.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] scotchua:
oh! that's what i should have said...i got kinda long winded...
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] sanquar:
Great post, Skatdawg.

I apologise for my posts. I have reread them and they do sound harsh. T'wasn't meant to be. Only had concern for the site.

*wanders off descretely*

cheers,
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] scotchua:
No worries, sometimes we don't quite communicate what we mean, then someone will take offense to something we said, but didn't exactly mean, and then it just kinda escalates. I was in no way offended by your posts. I think it's good to discuss differences of opinion. It is unfortunate that so often what starts as a healthy discussion ends up as a flame war. In the end, I think that none of us think it's appropriate for someone to be selling dutty's roms on ebay, and we all love this site and home that all the great chefs get to keep doing what they're doing. So essentially we agree on the big picture, just disagree on the details. I mean after all, without this site, there'd be a whole lot of people who might have to "get a whole new life" so to speak cause we spend so much time on here ;)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] XtreMe_G:
look at what i found:

http://cgi.ebay.com/WINDOWS-MOBILE-...ryZ20336QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

see his other stuff for sale too

http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQfgtpZ1QQfrppZ25QQsassZlnstantdelivery
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] Loco5150:
Microsoft benefits soooooooo much from XDA that I dont think they never want to shut the cooking down.

Im sure they would have done it a long time ago if they would have wanted to.

If these WinMo devices would be only available with stock OS I would have ditched my first WinMo device in a heart beat and Im guessing Im not the only one.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III Windows Mobile ROM De] Bronx31:
^^^^^^^^^^

:eek:I just wanted to say that that is one hell of a pic:D:D
[OnePlus 5T  Questions & Answers] Sjain11:
I am rooted with magisk.
[OnePlus 5T  Questions & Answers] Mr. Cube:
I deleted with Terminal Debloater magisk module apps like Chrome, Google Duo, Play Movies, Play Music and Google Photos.

Don't have any issues, so I assume it's safe to disable/delete at least this apps.
[OnePlus 5T  Questions & Answers] OhioYJ:
I don't have my 5T anymore. I'll have to pay more attention next time I update my wife's 5T. Perhaps my list from the 6T will be useful:

Safe to remove OOS Apps

I've since also found you can remove the shot on OnePlus without any problems as well. (Assuming you don't use this.)
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View attachment 5651909 View attachment 5651911 View attachment 5651913 View attachment 5651915 View attachment 5651917 View attachment 5651919 View attachment 5651921 View attachment 6055537View attachment 6055539 View attachment 5651925 View attachment 5651927 View attachment 5651929
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