yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Android Apps and Games] fraschi51:
I also know this with the mails which cannot be marked as 'read' in FE as easily as others, mostly they are mails in the GMX or t-online junk folder (not 'spam suspected'), but which are shown as read in TB at the same time. Although the folders are also set to synchronized, the mails appear as read in FE only after a manual synchronization of these folders.
[Android Apps and Games] jaholm:
Hi,

I like the dection of tracking images in FE but currently the use did not benefit from this while reading a mail.

What about this suggestion:

* tapping on the "show remote image icon" will show (with a warning) remote images but not the detected tracking images.

* after remote images displayed: tapping once again on the "show remote image icon" shows all images and the icon vanishes
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
I have no idea why the message wasn't set to read.

I am also experiencing comprehension deficiency regarding 'shortcut'. Only the launcher icon can have shortcuts on Android.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
This seems to be another problem to me: the provider didn't send push messages to update the message state.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
What was exactly the problem? Tracking images are images with very few pixels, so even when detected wrongly this should not matter much because the image won't show much.

The suggested solution is not very intuitive in any case. Maybe the original message view should just show all images.
[Android Apps and Games] fraschi51:
If I change the read status in FE, FE could know that (and display it accordingly), without having to "ask" the server about it.

And how then does TB know that I have set the mail in FE to 'read' (if not via an info from the server)?
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Next time, please check if all operations are executed.
[Android Apps and Games] fraschi51:
Yes, no pending operations. Doubbletap a mail to change the read-state, but the changing isn't displayed. Once you synchonize the folder it changes.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
This might be related to this issue:

https://issuetracker.google.com/issues/139490292

There is a workaround for this in FairEmail, but maybe it isn't covering all cases.

IMO the referenced issue is a critical issue, but Google seems to ignore it completely.
[Android Apps and Games] fraschi51:
In addition I can say that this here only happens with bounce info mails (e.g. GMX Mailer Daemon). For all other mails the read status *immediately* is displayed correctly also in FE.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
It seems unlikely to me that this affects only certain messages. Do you maybe have rules set for these messages?
[Android Apps and Games] jaholm:
I like to see remote images, but I will reduce the probability to be tracked. If you say: "detected tracking images won't never be loaded" there is no problem an forget my suggestion.
[Android Apps and Games] fraschi51:
Yes, these bounce mails should always be moved to the folder 'Deleted' by FE rule and marked as read - that works quite well so far. Why they still appear again in the folder 'Junk' and there as 'unread' may come from TB ... no idea.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
If will double check things later this week.

What you can do is check if the target folder of the rule is still correct.
[Android Apps and Games] fraschi51:
Thanks, but as I said the FE-rule works so far very well.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Please check the target folder anyway. To be sure, save the rule again as well.
[Android Apps and Games] m0d:
It is not confusing. It is just different and new to what people are used to.

But, if peiple take the time to read and try to understand the differences it is all seemless, as it makes perfect sense.

The problem is that people know everything, and expect everyone to bend to their all knowing knowledge.

"Wisest is she who know she does not know."​

The main differences that I came across:

Set up both Account and Identity. Usually default identity is automatically created for user. So the concept of Identity is abstracted, unless of course users specifically create aliases and identities, but even then k9/thunderbird - you need new account/identity. So, fairemails approach is more accurate and gives users more options/control.

Never had to think about folder sync days. Again, ot is simple just something I never came across. FairEmail handles all cases for all users wishes.

The other thing that people might be confused about is all the options available.

I remember when settings page was not wanted. But, now there are 5/6/7 tabs of options. If removed someone will complain and maybe give a bad review.

So, confusing probably means user does not want to take the time to set up settings once, too lazy perhaps. Instead they want their smartphone/smartapp AI to read their mind, connect to the clouds and set up everything automagically.

:rolleyes::eek:

Experimental features list needs updating, or has reply feature been merged already?
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Only the listed features are experimental. Feedback is appreciated.
[Android Apps and Games] maybeme2:
"detected tracking images won't never be loaded" might be a useful feature.

How accurate is that detection anyway?
[Android Apps and Games] jaholm:
That's a good question!

But I think I'ts safe to replace all 1x1 Images with a white (or red, or...?) pixel.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Tracking images are indicated with a text and a broken image symbol. The latter should be a strong sign the image won't be loaded and shown.

The heuristic to detect tracking images is simple: images with less than 25 pixels. So, basically images that will not or hardly be visible and likely serve another purpose, which is likely tracking you.

Yesterday I saw the attached picture on a wall ;)
[Android Apps and Games] Nordlicht_13:
Maybe you could add an envelop icon next to the trash icon in the open message

that brings you back to the email-list and mark the just opened email unread.
[Android Apps and Games] maybeme2:
Seems too simple.

Can't a larger legitimate image also be used for tracking? If so, the visual/labling distinction of small 'tracking' images may be false security to the enduser who may assume that images not marked as 'tracking' are therefore safer.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
I am pretty sure people will hate such an extra icon which will be used hardly.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
I know nothing better, do you?

In my tests it have been shown pretty reliable. The only disadvantage is that there are occasionally false positives.

Also, there is a pretty clear warning when showing images or an original message IMHO.
[Android Apps and Games] jaholm:
Some apps solve the problem of the overwhelming number of options by hiding options under "extended" and/or "expert".

So many users think that they don't need to have a look into the expert settings if everthing goes out of the box?

See yatse app (remote control for kodi). Maybe that's a possible solution.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
There is already a similar 'more' menu for less used actions.
[Android Apps and Games] maybeme2:
Yes that is very clear and I realize what you're saying.

I'm just curious how the tracking occurs. Is there specific code embedded in the image to detect the user, place a cookie, etc., or is the mere need or internet mechanism to 'fetch' any image automatically track the user without needing any special code?

I ask because the message text is also 'fetched' and downloaded. Is the tracking distinction that the message text comes from your mail server while the images come from the sender's server? Or something else?
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Giving the comments/ratings coming from Brazil and Russia it seems to me that the philosophy of FairEmail is generally incompatible with the culture of these countries. Therefore FairEmail is not available in the Play store for these countries anymore. This is in addition to Indonesia and Thailand for which I mostly had negative experiences with NetGuard. People from these countries can use the GitHub version instead.

I like to say this is not meant as discrimination in any way, but based on objective statistics.
[Android Apps and Games] Nordlicht_13:
I don't think so, the mark read after X sec or never was a big wanted feature in K9.

I thing that the unread envelop icon would be used more often than the snooze icon.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
The message text is coming from the email server, but external (not embedded) images are downloaded from the internet. The fact of downloading can and will routinely be used to track you have opened a message.

Recently I reported a local government doing this and they removed the tracking images within a day! Under the EU GDPR there needs to be a very good reason communicated upfront to be allowed to do this. The authority watching this needs to investigate any report within three months, which seems to be enough to let institutions take reports seriously. Therefore, I am advising to report any abuse like this to the authority in your country.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
I respectfully disagree. I use mark as unread almost never and snooze very often. Anyway, choices have to be made, which I need to do for the good or the bad and my choice is to leave it like it is because I think that is the best.
[Android Apps and Games] jaholm:
My be I'm blind, but cannot see a more menu on the settings page with the 8 tabs with may options we are talking about.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
I meant the message 'more' menu in the grey action bar. In this menu there is 'mark as unread'.
[Android Apps and Games] jaholm:
Sorry this was a misunderstanding.

I referred in my post #8247 to #8238 that people might be confused about is all these options available under the 8 tabs on the settings page.
[Android Apps and Games] sylvn:
I prefer 8 tabs than 1 endless tab. I love all the options but I will not install this app on my mother's smartphone, a lot of users only looks for the basics.

Maybe during set up the user could have a choice between a standard and simple configuration (which could also be the free version) and an expert setup with 8 tabs and everything available.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Options are just that, options. They are not in plain sight and on the other hand still easily accessible. I am afraid that less accessible will result in questions like there were before the tab pages were introduced. So, I think as it is now is the best balance and therefore I am going to keep it this way.
[Android Apps and Games] gc01:
I have no problem with non-tech users - the standard setup and usage are very straightforward - the only current "question" i've received regards pinch/zoom which many folks expect.

Not sure why you would discourage any user - I encourage all users ... well not the apple users :)
[Android Apps and Games] jaholm:
I like all these option too. I am happy with this settings page. But the questions is:

What is your target group?

If you want to reach many people you should consider that, 95% isn't willing to read. When it gets complicated or seems so, then FE will be quickly deleted.

If your target group are computer-affine people, all is fine.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Pinch zoom is not really possible in a scrolling window, see also the FAQ. You can use the original message view instead.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
IMHO the options and their organization is fine for people looking for a privacy friendly email app. It is impossible to do it right for everybody anyway. As said, IMHO the current solution is a nice balance between several factors and therefore I am going to keep it as it is. People around here longer know that the organization has been changed several times already, which is another reason to keep it like it is.
[Android Apps and Games] gc01:
Hiya - ok I found the box button which does offer to show original message in browser - however it seems awkward and it warns about privacy leakage.

gmail app has no problem zooming a scrolling window for what it's worth.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
There is a difference: scrolling a message vs scrolling a list of messages. I think the conversation view with expandable messages is a pretty unique feature. Showing one message a time is what most (all?) other email apps do. Scrolling and zooming a single message view is possible and simple. Scrolling a list and zooming a list item is another matter.

Technical background: the question is where the touch input should go: the list or the list item?
[Android Apps and Games] gc01:
Sorry if I wasn't clear on this.

All she was asking for was ability to pinch/zoom while viewing one single individual message content.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
FairEmail doesn't have such a view.
[Android Apps and Games] gc01:
The view is simply while reading a message.

Maybe "view" is the wrong word. Whatever you call it when the app allows a user to read a message.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
As a workaround you can change the text size and you can see pictures full screen by tapping on them (and pinch zoom them).

What is she exactly looking for?
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Basically you always read a conversation in FairEmail, not single messages.
[Android Apps and Games] gc01:
She is aware of text size change and has chosen a setting for that - however there are times when she just prefers to pinch zoom occasionally - and toggling the text size requires restoring it which is multiple clicks. Its also discrete not continuous.

I think this is pretty standard - and above I think you said its simple to code ?

Its not a big deal, but was triggered by the 'what non-tech' users expect - since pretty much all mail apps offer pinch/zoom it may well be what many users expect as part of the UI experience.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
I will look into pinch zoom by occasion again, but please read again why this is more difficult and maybe impossible in FairEmail. The simple solution would be to remove the conversation view.
[Android Apps and Games] gc01:
The only place it would be helpful is while reading a message - nowhere else. This should not affect any other view - so no need to modify conversation view or any other list.
[Android Apps and Games] TheMadRuffian:
Suggestion: To include GitHub page and XDA thread hyperlinks as buttons under "About".
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Using 'Support' in the main navigation menu will go to the FAQ on GitHub and at the bottom of the FAQ there is a link to this XDA thread.
[Android Apps and Games] jaholm:
Hi,

Anybody tried the rule everything?

I added an enabled rule, sender contains @, date sun-sun, time 0:00-00, snooze.

Check select the correct messages, but no new incoming mail where snozzed.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Which snooze time did you set?
[Android Apps and Games] jaholm:
OK, I trap into this problem because I don't change the default 0 hours.

From the end of the time condition was checked!

New mails arrived with "Rule snozze schedule not found" (only in english, no translation to German.) ?
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Since there basically is no time condition this way, what should at the end of the time condition mean? I will make this next Sunday at 00:00 in the next release to have some reference, but this doesn't really take away the ambiguity.
[Android Apps and Games] jaholm:
OK,

but why should I set a hour > instead of the default 0 after specifying a time range (or every time) for snoozing?

I will only snooze all messages which arrive in this time slot until the end of this range.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
You just can set 0 hours.
[Android Apps and Games] jaholm:
Exactly this didn't worked under these circumstances.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
The earlier mentioned error message does tell something else: there is no time condition and therefore no end time.
[Android Apps and Games] jaholm:
This config will not snooze. Is this want you in tension is?
[Android Apps and Games] heinhuiz:
[MENTION=388926]MB66[/MENTION], maybe it is more clear of you let the user choose one condition only for the end time using a radio button.

Then, when a specific end time is selected, it must be minimum start time + 1 minute. When the 'spinner' is selected, it counts from the start time.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
I have already explained what the problem is: basically no time condition and therefore an unclear end time.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
IMHO the current solution is clear with the exception of an ambiguous end time when there is no time condition, which I will address with a default in the next version.
[Android Apps and Games] beeshyams:
Marcel

If I filter out trash (Gmail) for read to see unread and revert to inbox, the filter remains. Shouldn't the filter be folder specific and not universal?
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
That is debatable and can even be confusing.
[Android Apps and Games] beeshyams:
Thanks. My vote is for folder specific and not universal

Edit : It can be more confusing to find inbox empty if you forget that you had applied that filter in some other folder. That's why I brought this up

Even if you don't forget, filters on a certain folder are meant for a purpose in that folder and not universal
[Android Apps and Games] Nordlicht_13:
But what do we need two Trash-Icons for, one at the top of the message and one at the bottom of the screen.

Why not replace one? Would be nice if the mark as read after x secondy/never don't have a chance to get in the settings.
[Android Apps and Games] fraschi51:
As far as I have understood, one icon affects the mail, the other one the conversation.
[Android Apps and Games] jaholm:
OK, got it.

My fault was to use this function to snooze all mails while I'm on vacation for 10 days.

So, the only way is to stop sync for this account.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
The trash icon at the bottom is for all messages in the conversation, see also this FAQ:

https://github.com/M66B/FairEmail/blob/master/FAQ.md#user-content-faq53

I will add an option to not mark messages as read on expanding in the next release.
[Android Apps and Games] wirdSchoon:
Hi Marcel,

I would be happy if you can also freely set in FairEmail how many kilobyte are loaded when retrieving (not viewing) the mail.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
You can do that in the receive settings already.
[Android Apps and Games] Nordlicht_13:
Thanks for the patient answer.

I will recommend FairEMail with pro-features to my friends.
[Android Apps and Games] gc01:
Question - Does FE TLS work correctly with servers implementing SNI

(a la 4.4 in https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8314 )

Some additional info on dovecot wiki - not sure how up to date it is - implies most modern email clients support - but better to use 1 IP per domain ...

https://wiki.dovecot.org/SSL/SNIClientSupport

Thanks
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Yes, this will work. Note that the domain name used to connect to and the domain name in the security certificate need to match, unless you enable 'insecure connections', which I advice strongly against. See the FAQ for more information.
[Android Apps and Games] gc01:
Good to know.

I usually use one of these schemes:

(a) wildcard certs (*.dom.com) with CN=*.dom.com where the mail servers use imap.dom.com and smtp.dom.com

or

(b) CN=dom.com and SAN=imap.dom.com, smtp.dom.com, www.dom.com

As long as mail clients support SNI (i.e. rfc 6066) then servers may use SNI or unique IPs (more expensive when lots of domains).

This has been working well with web browsers but am in the process of adding several email domains now as well - so helpful to know if SNI is a reasonable choice.

I just found some small updates to this

https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8446#section-4.2.11
[Android Apps and Games] maybeme2:
When a user opens an email he/she encounters 2 reply icons. See screenshot.

But they are not the same. One contains 'forward' the other does not. That is confusing.

They should be the same or one icon needs to be different. Maybe the one on the menu bar should have an arrow pointing both ways (?) or something else. But it is inconsistent to have 2 similar icons for differing content.

Fwiw
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
It is already on my to do list to change this ;)
[Android Apps and Games] gc01:
Good morning.

Today I received an email which was sent directly to me, as well as I was cc'd via a mail alias. Webmail and Thunderbird shows the email twice - once for each recipient - this is correct.

FairEmail showed the email once. Which is incorrect.

Also this acts very strangely now, as after viewing it on FE it seemed that the message was still "unread".

In fact what happened was 1 of the 2 messages was marked read - I verified this as thunderbird now shows one message read and the other unread.

If i now use thunderbird to read the 2nd email - then FairEmail shows the message as read.

However FE still only shows 1 email not 2. I think it should show both copies and try to hide the second copy - since their are two different recipients and showing only 1 leads to strange behavior.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
If the 'to' and 'cc' email have the same message ID and are received by the same account, which I suspect is the case, it is the same message. So, check if both messages have the same message ID. Also make sure you have the 'duplicates' filter disabled.
[Android Apps and Games] gc01:
1) It shows as 2 messages when conversation mode is off. Shouldn't the display be the same in conversation mode?

I see it now in the conversation thread - sorry this is all my own error.

Its definitely visible (and I see duplicates in conversation thread).

Ignore me, sorry for noise - all is well - just user being silly.

thanks
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
If the message ID is the same, it is the same message, see also here:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Message-ID

It basically is a bug in the email server if it stores a message with the same ID twice. One of the messages should be discarded. Maybe a workaround for this needs to be added.

There is a filter in the conversation view to filter duplicate messages. Please disable it and let me know if two messages show up (one dimmed). I guess there will be, since in single message mode two messages seem to be stored. I also like to know if the messages are stored in the same folder.
[Android Apps and Games] fraschi51:
In landscape format, the heading "Filter out" is missing above the terms.
[Android Apps and Games] gc01:
I edited my reply above - I can see both messages fine in the conversation list. User error ...

Now I have collapse on back setting on, its really obvious.

Sorry again for noise.

Nothing to change in FE - its doing the right thing!

Mail is handled by postfix - which says this:

http://www.postfix.org/faq.html#duplicate

that faq is out of date ... will look further
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
In landscape mode both the message list and a conversation can be shown, which raises the question which menu should be shown: of the message list or of the conversation. It seems most logical to me to show the menu of the message list.
[Android Apps and Games] gc01:
duplicate envelope recipients are removed - and it seems like post alias expansion should do similar - at least when using the postfix local delivery agent

http://www.postfix.org/local.8.html

While expanding aliases, ~/.forward files, and so on, the program

attempts to avoid duplicate deliveries. The duplicate_filter_limit con-

figuration parameter limits the number of remembered recipients.

However, this server is using it's imap server's lmtp agent so that it can do filtering using Sieve rules - my guess is lmtp is not doing what postfix local delivery agent does in avoiding duplicates as you suggested. So indeed seems to be a bug with dovecot local delivery.

Thank you for that!

In case its of use to others - duplicates as here can be removed either by postfix local delivery or by dovecot lmtp delivery with (pigeonhole) sieve duplicate extensions.
[Android Apps and Games] fraschi51:
Maybe we misunderstand each other. I mean, if you click on the filter icon in landscape format, you'll only get the three boxes without the appropriate headline.