yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Android Apps and Games] :
There are probably a lot more users than in this thread, most people just install something off Google Play or F-Droid without ever visiting xda-developers or a github repository.

A poll isn't really going to reveal anything. What would you have on it? People who want encryption vs those who don't?

Usually feature polls have a bunch of things of what should be worked on next and the highest rating one would be chosen. Unless you've got some other ideas in mind, but it seems that M66B thinks it's feature complete, which is his choice.

You can quit sucking up to M66B lol. Nobody has been attacking anyone. There has only been constructive discussion.

It would be prohibitively expensive and unnecessary to pay for someone external who is not familiar with the code base to implement such a feature. M66B hinted he would consider doing it for 10€ as a pro feature, but it seems he has changed his mind.

All I said regarding that was that it would benefit pro users having it in both versions. Perhaps another solution would be to implement it in the pro version and then later add it to the free version.

I was making a feature suggestion because it seemed like it fit in line with the direction of the project being "privacy friendly".

Tor (not ToR), PGP and Tails have thorough developer documentation (specifications), defining how they work and have undergone external audits to verify it.

Regular attention is paid to these projects in various netsec communities as is by various cyber security consultants. The commit logs are public and have review board. From time to time various circumstantial things are discovered that could improve security, but to this day nothing exists as far as a "backdoor". If anything the disclosures made by Edward Snowden revealed that programs like PRISM are thwarted by things like PGP which was initially developed in 1991.

Just because something is funded (partially) by government doesn't inherently mean that there is some backdoor. Have you ever thought maybe the very governments which fund those projects might actually be using that software for secure communication?

Spreading nonsensical misinformation only reveals your own ignorance.
[Android Apps and Games] m0d:
I can do what I want. Thank you very much. :cool::p;)

He did. And, then you kept nagging about the poor, all riteous of you. No one is stopping you from implementing it.

So, make a fund, PR, or something instead of worrying about how prohibitively expensive and unnecessary any programmer can look into commits and learn the project, familiarizing themself.

Open your eyes to the universe of github, and you can see how it is all done.

Exactly, ignorance, spreading nonsensical misinformation:

Very informed observation, the above that is.

I see you are all for Privacy projects. Take a deeper step into it and invest more oF your time on it.

Pull a Request for encryption and make the world a more secure place.

EDIT: [MENTION=9262768]tya99[/MENTION]

I guess it is hard to appreciate when someone tries:

https://github.com/M66B/open-source-email/commit/ba96b02f84d11e1ad673b3f826260c5f19ba3753

https://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=77544698&postcount=789

https://github.com/M66B/open-source-email/commit/a64b7999f23c4265782ea129e905baee30cee3cf

https://github.com/M66B/open-source-email/commit/0c4566ddcfc2ce5fa08ec8c71d65dd488390e16c

https://github.com/M66B/open-source-email/commit/7d86e94613be155ef5b0c2b6d45bbcd4346f3d9f

https://github.com/M66B/open-source-email/commit/de266b1cdec8d26ecdc3e5dcce5839a388819a32

https://github.com/M66B/open-source-email/commit/b68aba25b778f9acd4f1ded11fbd432527196213

Someone can always take a look into above commits and give it a shot themselves.

This is getting out of hand. Last offtopic from me.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Can you please be nice to each other?

Also, I think there has been said enough about encryption support now.
[Android Apps and Games] Hida Sobu:
Is it possible to make the "original view" fit the screen so no vertical scrolling is needed?
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
It is an original view, so no.
[Android Apps and Games] ouzowtf:
That's the first message of this account. He's like the dumb ratings in the Play Store that vote 1-star for needing an email provider when trying to use an email app. He's a troll.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Maybe so, but for me it was the last drip.
[Android Apps and Games] Oswald Boelcke:
I apologise for the rant, Marcel. Thread has been cleaned and action taken.

Regards

Oswald Boelcke
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
I do appreciate that, but not recognizing my "personal affairs" by this guy is just a bridge too far for me. I heard very recently that the average life expectancy of my mother just one month. That's already dramatic enough and I just don't want this rudeness in addition. That's simply too much given the situation. Working a bit on FairEmail so far was distracting, but this is simply beyond frustrating. In other words: good luck with apps from big and ignorant companies which do not have this kind of personal attachments.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
@Oswald Boelcke unless the comment was violating an XDA rule, I would like to see it restored. I don't want a special treatment in any way.
[Android Apps and Games] de_Wolf:
Can or have you provided G***le with the graphical statistic of the token grand rate, @M66B? A picture says more than 1000 words...
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
There is an update of the app which will say at the top of the screen:

If Google increases the token grant limit, I will consider to resume the project, else it is what it is.

Edit: this notice can't be removed. See it as an end-of-life notice. If the situation changes, I will publish an update to remove the notice. The fact that the notice is there in the first place, means that I don't expect that this will be resolved. I have had the same answer from Google twice already after all.

Version 1.1942, without this notice, is still available for download, but not that you'll need to reinstall to downgrade.

Is the notice obtrusive, yes, it is, but the problem is too.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Of course and besides that, my messages was IMHO rather clear.
[Android Apps and Games] x2k13:
Sorry to say this, but that's a hard slap in the face of everyone supporting you and the app financially.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Although Google is to blame for this, this is a valid point. I will add an option to remove this notice for people using the pro version. Already typing code ...
[Android Apps and Games] Oswald Boelcke:
Marcel, I can assure you that post violated the forum rules otherwise I hadn't deleted the post and taken additional action. The affected user has e.g. no longer write permissions in your thread. I know you don't want a special treatment on XDA and you didn't receive a special treatment. We treat all members on XDA equal although long term, respected members with a good post history are probably more easily granted benefit of doubt if required. And it's our stance to defend developers and especially the very respected Recognised Developers like you. XDA was founded by developers, for developers - and we attempt to clearly keep this alive.

The post I've deleted was an extreme violation of rule no. 2 in conjunction with the much minor violation of rule no. 4. Marcel, I regret that I've deny your request, and I hope you don't mind.

Regards

Oswald Boelcke
[Android Apps and Games] de_Wolf:
Emotionally I assume that @x2k13 means/says something else...

I will not download the version 1.1943 at all...
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Version 1.1944 is available on GitHub now (and version 1.1943 was erased from history to prevent F-Droid from building it).

https://github.com/M66B/FairEmail/releases

The notice can be disable now, by everybody.

@de_Wolf maybe it was too much, but the notice is there to make people who are not reading here aware that there is a serious problem.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Somebody suggested to start a petition here:

The world’s platform for change

Change.org is the world’s largest petition platform, using technology to empower more than 200 million users to create the change they want to see.

www.change.org

Please feel free to do so and to share a link here.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
The token grant rate all of a sudden is going down rather fast and is now way below the average value of 37,500 tokens/day from before (below 33,500 tokens/day):

I have no idea why this is changing now and why it is going far below what it was before (which was a pretty constant level).
[Android Apps and Games] de_Wolf:
This is really strange. Only G***le could give an explanation for this, but you know that.
[Android Apps and Games] chris122380:
Quit paying attention to the one star reviews. Many of us have already stated that you are the highest ranked email app in the play store. No other email outranks you. If they don't like it they can go use something else. I would put a Gmail disclaimer in the app stating issues related to Gmail are Google issue that are out of the control of the app and give them an email address they can complain to at Google. Any star review complaining to a developer about functionality that is handled by a third party such as Gmail is irrelevant to you as the developer. I will repeat what I have said in here multiple times the one star reviews don't matter. You are still the highest ranked email app in the Play Store good luck finding anything comparable.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Highest ranked can turn in a few days into lowest ranked, which would kill the project too.

Although unjustified bad reviews, which is of course somewhat subjective, are sometimes pretty frustrating, there is a rational reason why they are bad too.

Of course, the goal is to have more users than Gmail in the end ;-)
[Android Apps and Games] chris122380:
A handful of bed reviews compared to the thousands of good reviews isn't going to tank your overall rating. I frequently will go into the Play Store and downvote one star reviews or any review for that matter that is irrelevant to the overall project. Besides being the highest ranked email app in the Play Store it is also the most developed app in the play store. As we have all suggested in here I would ignore most of those one-star reviews unless they have a relevant criticism of something you are working on. The problem is you're relying too much on reviews to tell you how good your project is and that is a false assumption. I will say that again DO NOT use a one-star review to tell you how well the overall project is or the current build is. A one star review doesn't take into account the incompetency of the user. You will always have a user who can't figure out the simplest of things or will complain about something that is totally out of your control. I have worked in IT supporting end users almost 20 plus years and there is still somebody out there who can't figure out the simplest task of turning on and off a computer. Don't allow the incompetency of the minority decide the functionality and the love of the app by the majority. The minority no matter how large they may seem to you should not cause the downfall of a loving app for the majority.
[Android Apps and Games] chris122380:
I would strongly recommend having someone else handle the Play Store reviews and the emails. That secondary person should be familiar enough with Fairemail that they can weed out junk without taking offense but also the ability to pass on relevant development suggestions to you. This way your main focus can be development and your family. If possible it would be nice to also get a second developer who can deal with Google or who can also help with the project when you need some down time.
[Android Apps and Games] heinhuiz:
I'm not sure what tires me more, Marcel's frustration over unjust 1 star ratings or the multitude of people trying to make him ignore his feelings.

Come on please. The man is entitled to his own emotions.
[Android Apps and Games] chris122380:
I can understand the frustration I'm not telling him to ignore his feelings. I can understand that the one star reviews are frustrating but they are not as relevant as he's making them sound. They could also be assigned to someone else to deal with if it's that frustrating for them.
[Android Apps and Games] xdaTanjiro:
Hi there, I have just been away for a few days and what a sad twist to this wonderful app that we have not seen in decades, and probably the only one in its race. I would wonder, what if OAuth was never considered in FE, maybe only in parallel universe, that it will reverse all the negative growth of the app and perhaps we will still live happily expecting a FE update everyday :-(

Now we can only wish, that you will change your mind. I hope you will :)

In any case, get some well deserved rest/break for now and be with your mother, put all these behind you for a week or month and take good care of yourself and your previous ones around you. Best wishes from all of us.
[Android Apps and Games] heisert:
Hi just installed K9 and some others (shame on me) to see if I could handle it if Marcel "this time" really quits the app.... But really Marcel you cant do this.

Urks are the others "now" bad. Its like i travel back through time.

Just read Nova launcher is sell their soul and after i install the newest Fairemail github release ive got the next shock. :-(

So i have to search a new launcher and maybe a new Email Client (if fairemail one Day never works) that both so not exist.

Back to the real important stuff:

Wish your mother all the best! Got similar with my dad right now...

Family is important not a app or some trolls with 1 Star Reviews! Take your time!

All the best Marcel + your Family!
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
In itself a few one star reviews are not relevant, true, but if many people start rating one star because they are not able to configure a Gmail account, or if this is harder than in other email clients (app passwords), it will become relevant soon. This is also why the token rate limit issue is a rather serious issue.

Also, people tend to review faster when they are not satisfied than when they are satisfied.

Moreover, you seem to approach this from a commercial view, while the project isn't commercial. Nobody is going to moderate reviews for free for years and the same applies to a second developer.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Maybe I am just not suitable to run a project like this because I am more an overly sensitive developer than anything else. Sorry.
[Android Apps and Games] chris122380:
I'd have no issues helping moderate incoming emails. I don't have the development skills to be able to help you there.

I wasn't looking at it from a commercial point of view I was looking at it from an open source point of view. If people really love a project they're willing to develop the time to support it. GitHub for example is meant to be a collaboration of developers so that it's not handled or maintained by one person.

Any thought of having a discord server where we (mid range to advance users) could help users that way as well? Maybe the following categories (I don't know what you call them in discord):

Builds

FAQ

Support

I am just trying to brainstorm ideas to help lift some of the burden off of your shoulders so you're not having to handle it all.
[Android Apps and Games] TooMuchSloeGin:
In the same spirit I am suggesting that perhaps splitting the project into two would be a good idea (technically this should not be overly difficult as M66B is already creating and handling different versions for different platforms).

So, one version could be the one for GMail users who are relying, for one reason or another, on the OAuth stuff.

The other version could be one which never ever does anything with GMail OAuth. This version would be perfectly usable even for GMail users if they are able and willing to deal with 2FA and app passwords (ie somebody like me: I am a heavy user of seven email accounts of which three are GMail but these all have their own app password).

The advantage would be that a non-OAuth version will be completely cut off from negative reviews re GMail OAuth not working as it should because there's no GMail OAuth in the first place.

Again... just thinking aloud.

Additionally, I would suggest that limiting the frequency of updates for one or even both versions could be helpful.

I also have a problem to understand the logic behind killing off the project (and consequently losing ALL income) when accepting that SOME reviews will always be 1-star could somewhat damage the standing but will certainly not lead to a complete loss of income. Put differently, learning to accept and live with 1-stars.

All IMO.
[Android Apps and Games] mkasimd:
There already are a few people answering to user questions on XDA. But not many people ask in the forum first, but email Marcel right away. A Discord server would probably be barely any different.

If a voluntary support team is going to be built we'd need to build a ticketing system with multiple volunteers having access to it and emailing in the name of Marcel. I'm unsure if Marcel wants that. If it was me, I personally wouldn't trust random volunteers with that.

An alternative to this would be a mailing list. But I don't know how appropriate that is in 2022.

That said, @M66B, not everything is about money. You of all people should know that best. If you ask for help, you will see that a few of us will indeed lend a hand wherever they can.

But apart from that, there are even companies that aren't out for each buck they can get. I could name you two Dutch companies in particular, and one of them, you know better than me. It's called FairCode B.V. 😉

I'm not saying you shouldn't quit FairEmail, though. If it impacts your life and wellbeing negatively, it's quite valid to take a break or even quit the project. So, whatever you do, there are no hard feelings on my side. Just stay well, mate, and enjoy your time with your mother and partner.
[Android Apps and Games] 30jp:
Hi Marcel,

Thanks for Netguard and FairEmail and their support.

I will continue to use them as long as possible and will remember you in a positive way.

The annoying decision with Google has been made, you're done with that now.

Now the family needs you.

I wish you all the best and a lot of strength with your mother and your girlfriend and think of yourself too.

Kind regards 30jp
[Android Apps and Games] fasznyak:
Hey Marcel,

I'm the guy who donated you a smaller amount the other day via wire transfer. Just learned with the most recent update about the situation.

Seriously, screw google with their tyrannical big tech, forcing nonsense on everyone left and right. Take the app off of the app store, and make it available via github builds (I use those anyway), and F-Droid. Alternative app stores will follow soon as google is now forced to open up their app store.

I'm staying as far away from them as possible. This email application is the best I've met a long time ago for android, ever since K9 has been abandoned and the other aren't privacy focused enough. If google doesn't want to have you, turn it around and make sure you don't want them.

What can we do to help?

I can offer my gitea server to continue the development as open-sourced, and also contribute to it, given I have time.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
I think every factor has been mentioned by now.

The app will continue to work and since I use the app heavily myself, the important bugs will probably be fixed. For the rest, we'll see what happens.

For some inexplicable reason, the token grant rate dropped to around 32,000 tokens/day over the course of the day, which is below the usual token grant rate around 38,000 tokens/day.

As a result, I restored the app to the Play Store, also to see if this has any effect on the token grant rate.
[Android Apps and Games] fasznyak:
Just my 2 cents, but in my eyes, gmail and privacy are two opposite things. Gmail admittedly reads their user's emails, hence it makes no sense to have gmail users imo. Besides, if someone is so keen to use the client with gmail, they can get the tokens for themselves and set fairemail manually up.

People saying "I'm using FairEmail with google because I want privacy" completely miss the point.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Mostly I refrain from advice about which device to use, but since there was just an Italian 1 star rating for just referring to this:

https://github.com/M66B/FairEmail/blob/master/FAQ.md#redmi

my advice is to never, ever buy a Xiaomi / Redmi device.

Reviews like this are pretty frustrating because even explaining a potential issue is resulting in 1 star reviews.

You should have noticed that besides today I didn't speak about 1 star rating for a while, except today in relation to the token grant rate issue.
[Android Apps and Games] deechte:
I was thinking in the same line. If Gmail is the problem, why not make the app unsuitable just for Gmail and communicate that clearly to everyone?
[Android Apps and Games] O_DoC:
Maybe they've ''corrected'' the formula about the 'acces' between 'refresh' token's types...

Could be daydreaming, but who knows...

Be well Marcel !

Take care of your family
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
How do you imagine that? Changing the quick setup wizard and when somebody selects 'Gmail' say "Not supported, install the Gmail app instead" ? How about the already configured accounts? Just remove them from the device? Are you going to answer all questions originating from this?
[Android Apps and Games] meisanerd:
Part of the advantage for this app vs Gmail isn't just the privacy aspect, it is also the utility aspect. Personally, I spend a fair amount of time outside of reliable cell service for vacations, and I can't control how well the Gmail app caches reservation emails for things that I might have set up a year ago. Nor manage having work emails only notify me during certain hours. Or the number of other features that this wonderful app provides, above and beyond just the privacy stuff.

1 star ratings suck, because as a technically-minded individual, you can see how stupid most of them are. And knowing the issues with Google, it sucks when you are getting ones for things that are 100% out of your control. It would be nice if G would pull their head out of their nether regions and act responsibly, but I'm not convinced their front-line support even has the brainpower to manage that. So hopefully you can get enough publicity to get the smarter engineers in the departments managing oauth tokens to figure out a sensible limit.

Keep up the good work
[Android Apps and Games] deechte:
Earlier today you released a version with a persistent banner or something like that, that said the project was terminated. If you were willing to take such a big step, you should be willing to take a smaller step: indeed either not allowing Gmail accounts at all or only allowing Gmail accounts with app passwords. Make that crystal clear both in the app and in the Play Store description, including the reason why.
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
I think this is the best comment of the day, because of the subtle understanding of the matter ;-)
[Android Apps and Games] de_Wolf:
You are absolutely right!

But every Gmail user who buys the Pro version supports the project and Marcel's wallet.

And after what I've read here so, apparently (unfortunately) very many people use Gmail...
[Android Apps and Games] M66B:
Please don't associate this problem with money. If it was about the money, there would be a subscription or a paid-only app. Instead, its almost completely free to use.