yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] Vikas Gautam:
[MENTION=9110066]dondecker[/MENTION]

Heating becomes an issue only when CPU starts to get throttled. In my case, It happens at 60°C plus temperatures. Maintain some cool outside temperatures. Use fans, coolers and ACs. If winter season is ON already in your region, you are good to go. Also, don't play while charging.
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] STARK0711:
Pubg temp after 30 min with aex unofficial 5.4 !!!
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] Aditya@123:
Let me tell you all ,the best battery backup nougat rom and most stable rom is mokee 7.1.2 release latest redmi note 3. If you dont believe me just go and try ,no other custom rom has the balls to compete with this rom in terms of battery and stability ,I got around 9 hrs sot by using a default app ageis on this rom to freeze some apps and got such sot, go and try you wouldn't regret
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] Aka9413:
Bootlegger which build can u pls give direct link also at which graphics and fps you playing pubg ! Are you facing any lags ??
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
No lags at all no matter what settings you choose low or high

In low settings no lags + 9% drain after 30 mins

In high settings no lags + 13% drain after 30 mins

* I also use heliox 2.0 custom kernel and AKT XANA battery profile and sun cooling thermal mod

I'm on latest build 14th April
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] Aka9413:
By high do you mean HD graphics + high fps ?? Please attach a screenshot of your graphics setting also while playing on high which AKT profile do you choose to play on high and do you made any changed to cpu frequencies ??
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Yep I usually don't change AKT profiles

If I feel like and lagginess I change it to fusion performance
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] Aka9413:
Ok so you play pubg at what graphics ?? Also wats the drain when u use fusion performance ?
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
I play at low graphics usually

In low graphics with XANA 9% for 30 mins

In high graphics with XANA 12-13 % for 30 mins

I haven't tested fusion but burnout gives in high graphics 15% for 30 mins no lag whatsoever in any of these either XANA or burnout
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] Rahulnsharma:
I used Nitrogen OS for about 3 to 4 days with default kernel I liked the default kernel so I didn't change it & if you install sun cooling you might face some lags in PUBG as sun cooling will try to bring down temperature by reducing performance.

I didn't record temperature during PUBG but i could feel my phone's hot back it happened only during heavy usage otherwise temperature were cooler.
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
.yeah on which rom are you on?. I got a decent app to check free ram and works well.
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] Rahulnsharma:
Cardinal-AOSP-5.7.0-OREO-z2_plus-OFFICIAL-20180714
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
Well. You can try miui 10 global 8.8.11....a lot of good review .
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] alapan97:
My sister uses Note5 pro, so I would know about MIUI. Yeah you are right to say that MIUI has stable performance. But I don't like an unnecessary coat of interference over the stock like Mi or any other ROMs. So this is the best solution for gaming if you are willing to risk having high temperature. And I don't play heavy games while thinking about power consumption. Try Asphalt 9 on maximum brightness while you are outside. See if MIUI can give smooth fps on high graphics.
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
..well I too don't like bloatware....there are many apps which I don't use...and yeah that's UI is not that good.

But the rom is good.....don't know about asphalt. But I bet that it will 100% lag.....this a mobile not a PC.......the temp would go right 55'c on back and above....CPU -80'c above.

(I overcame this in pubg.....)...

Just calling in outside area makea the battery temp 40'c.....due to heat....
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] sharvanpn:
Which is the gaming rom right now.
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Nitrogen OS

Cardinal
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] STARK0711:
Nitrogen os 8.0??
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Yep the one made by devabhi

Modded Nitrogen OS

even liquid remix is good I guess
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] aaki_rocker:
latest bootleggers as well !

getting solid framerates with average heating, nothing to complain about. :)

flash gaming thermals after flashing bootleggers.
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] STARK0711:
Can u tell about temperature in nos latest build ... ??
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
For me it was kernel panics
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] STARK0711:
Okay
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Pls suggest something close to nitrogen latest build

Pls becuz of kernel panics I left that build

But in that rom pubg on 1080p was smooth asf all around
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] Rahulnsharma:
You can try July build it's perfect for gaming & is quite stable
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
July's build lags even after flashing boosts

No tooo laggy but lags to an extent

But not as fluid as latest build

Latest build is crazy asf
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] Rahulnsharma:
Did u give cardinal aosp a try? It's pretty similar to nitrogen os but a bit faster
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
I was on cardinal before coming to nitrogen

Cardinal latest = nitrogen July build

Same problem of lag after sometime

Thanks for suggestions bro

I'm thinking about trying oos 5.0.5

Or else I'll go back to bootleggers
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] STARK0711:
Try latest lineage with r17 too good i can say no lag in high setting
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Thanks bro but

A no treble I don't know why
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] STARK0711:
Means didn't get u ?
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
I know bro there are many great roms with treble

But many say it's not fast its not secure like that

Especially in our device there is no security for vendor partition created in treble compared to other devices with treble

Hence no to treble

I guess u were referring lineage by augustin

With nameless kernel r17
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] STARK0711:
Yes im referring to that particular setup only

Its different priority ?

If u find any non treble best rom than tell me also ill also try ...
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
Anyone here tried gpu boost module on magisk???does it improves performance?
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Gpu boost module is just making a little changes in build prop

It improves performance a little bit just gives a little more details with a little less lag
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
...

Some say it's useless.....well it did improve details....but not much....
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Obviously that's what I'm saying
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
Any other way to improve pubg?
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Try treble ROMs with over clocked kernels and sun cooling

Like los aex with nameless r17
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
Done that.....I am on nos modded....temp is 45-48....and in normal use back up is great...rather than in aex....

It was not giving back up in normal use. So switched to nos.......cardinal is quite good for pubg....will try later
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Don't flash cardinal it's only good initially for some days then later pubg starts to lag

Stay on NOS latest build
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
Still on July.......maybe I will go on August build.....but really confused.. can't judge the August build.......
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Aug build kernel panics :eek:
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
..

In pubg?? details?
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Smoothest with kernel panics
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] sharvanpn:
Any good rom for playing pubg with good battery and without lags.It should also support f2fs.
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
RR with nameless kernel r17

With sun cooling 4.4

GPU updated driver

GPU boost

Akt
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] STARK0711:
Which akt profile ?
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Xana battery
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] sharvanpn:
I read in the thread that in RR pubg is lagging.

By GPU updated driver u mean one present in thread of a mi device.
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Yep try los or aex eas
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] parag777:
Arrow os with moxie kernel set it to gaming profile awsum gameplay minor lag on medium graphics
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] sharvanpn:
I am currently on aicp with nameless kernel and GPU updated driver.Rom is providing decent performance with good battery backup.
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] MN:
I second that, updated GPU drivers make a considerable difference. I am on Xtended and one 30 min game drains around 9-10%.
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] sharvanpn:
in battery stats or in actual life use.
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Just battery stats dude

I have tried almost every ROM except some really worst roms give less battery backup

It's like 30 min 12-13 % is the average in actual life use
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Pls suggest some good ROM for pubg

I was using bootleggers 3 it was really good

Great performance

Suggest

Some speedest ROM

Plz

My choices aosip arrow pie dotos

Any other suggestions plz
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
Anyone here???? suggest a ROM for pubg....... this thread is not active?
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Dotos latest plus moxie kernel

Aicp / aosip with moxie / nameless
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
Will try.... carbon rom can handle pubg?
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Last time I tried carbon ROM

Im sorry

But it was worst asf
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
Some dude posted on page 1 or 2 saying that temp don't cross 45 and pubg was smooth....any idea which Aicp version is stable...I read the thread and many builds are not giving performance...I couldn't find any stable build... please do suggest the build date which is stable
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Bro right now only thing I can strongly suggest is dot os

Coz I'm currently using it with moxie

No frame drops except a few rarely

Temps below 45

Maybe I use ghostpepper akt

Plus sun cooling

That too I run game on 1080 p
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
Ghost pepper cause lags?in Normal use?...

Which sun cooling?I used once and it made the UI so slow..
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Very necessary is sun cooling I know it makes ui slow but do use it

It keeps temps below 45

Or try ubercooling

Ghost pepper uses medium frequencies and maybe makes changes in interactive governor so that performance in the game increases usually
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] STARK0711:
If u use moxie than don't use akt it will conflict ...

Because moxie at 41 lower the frequency ....and gives good performance ... On performance i used to get temp around 43-42.5 without akt and suncooling ... :)
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Oops sorry maybe I have disabled akt profile forgot to mention
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] djjerry171:
To be honest I've tried the non-treble as well as the treble roms(many of the both) I haven't felt that any of the rom with all the modifications done from different mods and stuff has been able to run PUBG according to my expectations. [MENTION=8498844]hf958[/MENTION] I would be happy if you give your views on this one.

And for the record I haven't tried dot OS till now as I wanted to ask the community about it as zuk is my primary device it takes a lot of time to set it up again and again for normal use.
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Well ur absolutely right

But u have to consider another thing that pubg is not completely optimised and still improving

Only ROMs on which I have seen exceptional performance were nitrogen os modded ( but it had kernel panics )

Dot os with moxie

I only talk about performance and not battery backup

I too have tried almost every rom available
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] djjerry171:
So If I needed a one line answer about which rom to use of u want to play PUBG on your zuk which one will u suggest?:D

Just one final ROM that I should install on my Zuk so that it works up to my mark and I don't sell my device due to a game that I love to play a lot.

---------- Post added at 09:03 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:57 PM ----------

And also I have tried Nitrogen Modded but I didn't felt anything great in the PUBg experience as it had the same frame drops and screen flickering issue that annoys me a lot.

About kernel panics I didn't have any:fingers-crossed:
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
Yeah nitrogen was quite stable......and to be honest many guys are think by using mods we can control the heat...but I don't find any advantage.....sun-cooling for example....it make some changes in throttle temp. ...or may be under volting freq......to be honest we have to find how much a sd820 chip heats..?..in our zuk it's a higher because of the bad thermal design...
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] djjerry171:
Exactly dude. I bought this device exactly 1 year ago just seeing the specs. I knew all the cons about it but I still had it.

I tried everything to make this device work according to my need but the Thermal design is seriously so ****ed up that I think I should sell it. Btw Should I, According to you:rolleyes:
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
.

Can't say dude.....if your main concern is about pubg...then I can't say....if creator of pubg make the game optimized... then no problem​....

I think you,me we all should do more test...in gaming not just pubg some other games too(high graphics one) .....if all games lags at a point where temp is high...then I don't think we can slove that issue.......it's what processor are made for...to throttle when temp reaches....and in our device it's rises very fast [due to glass back...F***ed up internals design,,,, less space(compact size)...]>

See the pics below..you will get an idea on how close things are placed.. ...

Sorry for quality. of pics ...it's a screenshot of disassembly of zuk Z2 video.....

I think it's front(1st pic... and back view(2nd pic..).....

Can anyone confirm that?.....also I think our processor is actually not facing the right direction....I think it's facing down...I have observed that mostly when we open other devices.we can open the processor cover (silver plate ). Just after opening the back cover.......but in zuk it's not the that way...we have to remove the whole motherboard..and the silver plate is facing down..(to the display)....so actually it heat starts from down???...

Extremely Sorry for off topic...I hope you guys understand
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] djjerry171:
Definitely I agree with you but the present day says you got to play PUBG. So if that's not running properly on your device it feels bad man. Even after with the 3rd most best processor ever made on your phone.:crying:
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
I think sd820 had a problem with day to day life....there are not many devices with sd820.....Also why would Qualcomm make sd821..just after sd820.....may be some big issue in sd820....also we have a quad core... So it can't handle much load...like new chips (ex-sd636).......also in many thread and telegram group.. Every one compares sd820 to sd636 ,sd625, sd710....sd820 is quad core as I said...and above all cores are octa core... Not sure...but has more cores than sd820...also these chips are new made...new method.. New architecture. 14Nm..or something like that....

Yeah bro we have to live with it that out pubg can't run as smooth as other device
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] djjerry171:
Thanks for the info. Appreciate the members still alive in the community supporting the device. I would love to help any Dev out there who wants to help develop for the device. [MENTION=8498844]hf958[/MENTION] any suggestions on the new pie roms. Also suggest a final ROM to use on this device also the mods ;)
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
Aex5.7/5.8. + nameless..R17 heats up ...R18 is good....

In pie Arrow pie.+nameless R18./or moxie....

Currently i am on viper ...will try pubg
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Bro there is no perfect ROM existing for this device that ur asking for

Every rom has different issues

Every rom works slight a bit different for everyone

In every rom literally every rom I experienced occasional frame drops

Not like frame drops occur always but they r present sometimes

But in many ROMs damn they were worst

I mean extreme frame drops totally

Right now for pie I guess

Nitrogen os is good

Arrow is good but there were a frame drops (medium amount )

Right now im on dotos and I fell its good

But I suggest u try aosip + latest nameless or moxie

---------- Post added at 03:48 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:47 AM ----------

Dude

Blame pubg and not the device

I know device is a little bad but for the price

What more can we expect

Damn even on iPad pro 2018 people experienced heating and frame drops
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] djjerry171:
I totally agree with that. I'll be installing the dot OS today itself and will give my opinion about it. Btw I am on jaguar right now the May8 version which has the volte working. The rom is good but again the screen flickering issue and problems with audio has asked me to install a new ROM. All the people saying jaguar is the best rom I think you are wrong somewhere:rolleyes::good:
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Jag is not only the best rom

The best is cardinal citrus etc

Even OOS nougat is best

Bootleggers was best

Dotos was worst now it's good after treble

Nos was bad now it's good

Aosip aicp aex all are almost same but good
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] djjerry171:
I have tried bootlegger, Nos, aex etc treble ones. All of them are almost same with different mods and kernels. Cardinal I don't remember as I tried it 2-3 weeks ago but the stock performance in cardinal was good with all the frame drops and hiccups in PUBG. I'll give a shot to dot OS in the evening today and will post my opinion about it tomorrow (only based on gaming experience as everybody asks for the same).:highfive:
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
Which aicp version??? I have gone through the thread....but the last updates are having performance down issue..

Yeah the device is not that bad....heat is our main problem.... If zuk made something too control heat while making this devices... It would be great..(ex- a heat pipe..or heat sink...)...

Any way how much a sd820 heats??in other device... Or generally.... I wanted to know how much can it heat.
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Approx 50

On op3

I guess it's best with sd820

If not aicp try aosip
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
The back panel of OP3 gets heated to 50°c?.
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Sometimes high but obviously less than z2
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] CaptPERSIE:
Try Pixel Experience Android 9.0 Pie ROM.....for playing PUBG.

THANK ME LATER!!!
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] djjerry171:
Dude i am on dot os with moxie kernel 5.1. I feel it is the best setup for our device who wants performance as well as battery life. Also if acc. to u that's the case then could you post some SS to let us believe this one.:p just asking as i woud definately try but i installed dot os yesterday so i'll have to w8 for at least a week for installing this one.
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
Which aicp version will be best for pubg?and kernel?
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Sorry bro maybe I accidentally said aicp

Coz it was mentioned by another user try latest aosip with moxie or prototype kernel
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
Just wanted to give review about viper....I am using it.....soory but pubg can't be played..it's lagging a lot

..major problem is that big core is at rest..it's not being used much while small core is maxed out....I tried with modern combat 5 still the same issue.

Below are the ss...see Freq in cpu float app
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Viper isn't good but citrus nougat is good
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
Which version?..I tried the unofficial 3.5 and faced same type of issue...temp won't give above 44°c though....but pubg was lagging
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] Arun teja:
For gaming install any treble build with moxie kernel it will be fine,
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] sharvanpn:
give a try to flyme os great performance with minimum heat there are almost no lags or frame drops while playing pubg except lags when enemy squad comes towards you in vehicle which is common for all devices.
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Nope not for me

I kill whole squad which is in vehicle

While moving in vehicle

No lags

Aosip + moxie no heat on 1080p with sun cooling 3.5

---------- Post added at 05:45 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:44 PM ----------

I doubt about aex and aicp and PE

But I don't know about RR and lineage latest versions
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] STARK0711:
1080 p how ?
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] Arun teja:
Use spectrum app in this ROMs it would be good...but with some heating issues
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] djjerry171:
[MENTION=8498844]hf958[/MENTION] pm me with the details about the Rom thread and other info about mods. I am sick of dot os now as the ram management has become worst(only 700-800 mb remains free). Also the whole gaming experience has become worst since I played it the first time.

And for those giving opinion about trying different roms based on their experience please try to give SS about different aspects while you play the game like temp, cpu cores, battery used etc., Then only the members would try the Rom. Hope you understand
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] hf958:
Gfx tool by tsoml

---------- Post added at 09:33 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:32 PM ----------

I never had heating issues
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] kunal sasane:
Which aosip build date?
[Lenovo ZUK Z2 (Plus) Guides, News, & Discussion] sharvanpn:
well u can kill them easily but before they reach you there will be little lag whn they will be in 400m radius ,it reals help in spotting camper.