yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] egzthunder1:
@all,

Thank you for your support on this issue. Yesterday night, I found out that there was someone selling FreeStyl as well (suprised they haven't done PointUI yet). I have already taken action by posting on their forums and reported the ebayer as well, but that is a different fight (well, same fight, different forum :) )

I guess we can put this thread to rest. What do you guys think?
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] motisu:
I agree. It was a fight well fought.:)
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] egzthunder1:
Actually, before closing the thread, feast you eyes with 4goodeal's latest reply.

"Dear egzthunder1,

I don?t think you are a developer because you don?t even know that everybody can capture the picture of the device?s screen. I don?t know why you guys are not happy. I stated clearly in my transaction that I don?t sell any software and only help people where to get free stuff as I did from thousands of forums out there. Your world is too small and your mind is too narrow when thinking that everything came from your forum."

Now, I am truly convinced that this guy truly is f*cking stupid. Word of advice (if you are reading this), if you get busted and they show you the evidence, just give up...
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] F2504x4:
Someone needs to be sure to archive/save the Ebay auctions for future reference before they dissappear. Just incase this fool tries this again.

Good work, ("no scratch that") GREAT Work guy's!!
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] egzthunder1:
I am actually having a little fun with the guy. He truly is an idiot. All of the sudden, he went from "I am not selling it" to "you guys stole the icons and concept from HTC too" Take a look :)

"Dear egzthunder1,

You did steal icons and concept of HTC TouchFlo ASA Touch Commander. It?s so stupid when saying all I?m selling came from your forum. If you have the power to shut down all forums posting what I guide people to, just go ahead. I know for sure that many sellers will sell the same stuff that you are concerning about in very soon. I can drop my price to 0.99 to compete with them but not right now."

Besides, now he is admitting selling the stuff. His argument now says that it did not come from here. What a tool!
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] egzthunder1:
Last E-mail (Hopefully)

Here is his latest reponse. He caved in and admitted :D

"Dear egzthunder1,

I assume that you are a developer. Now we talk seriously. I did mistake in the past but honestly I didn't want to. Initially, I just wanted to sell the ebook of technical instructions relating to many fields and unintentionally ran into this problem when I included freeware/trial SF. Now, as you see in my ad, I insist that I don?t sell software and people still buy it. I also don?t distribute them but I show the information of where to get them from official sites and from thousands of forums (simply, I can point them to your forum but right now I point them to many other forums. You know the reason WHY). I was advised that I have the right to sell information. If I continue to sell my products realting to what you concern, what you suggest. Do you have dealer price or anything that I can affiliate with. Finally, I just want to do a business and doesn?t want to harm anybody."

Now, I am happy! Time to move on to more important things like Slither's cube, tene's calendar... or work :D
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] klmsu19:
well heres my issue. He says hes just directing people where to get free info, yet charging them $15+ to get free info?

I think i said this before but if he charged $1-2 and just emailed the info then thats one thing. I dont see why he needs to mail a CD with directions if hes supposedly not supplying the programs, which i still believe hes not admitting to.

But hes full of it if he thinks he can convince us hes not trying to rip people off at $15, even if it involves mailing a CD. You can get 100 CD-R's from Best Buy (just a retail US electronics store) etc for 100 for $30 normal full price, not even on sale- thats $.33 a CD. So wheres the $15+ hes charging? Hes out to make people off money who dont know better using xda software. He gives no credit to the developers in the auctions or that the software isnt his own.

Honestly the idiot still is selling Tomtom maps on a 1gb card...also selling Google Maps...highly illegal. So i REALLY dont trust anything he says as his morals are highly suspect.
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] egzthunder1:
I don't disagree with you one bit. However, if he truly is selling the information on where to get the stuff, he is free to do so. This is perfectly legal as per eBay rules and policies. I know it might sound like a rip off, but a lot of people do not have a clue about any of the development sites for pdas and they are too lazy to do a google search. People's ignorance can be quite profitable for some.

Now, whether he is sticking to what he says he is doing and selling sw instead of just the info, short of someone buying it, we cannot prove anything to anyone. As far as I am concerned, we have reached a bottleneck that only his morals will dictate what will happen from there on. Whether he will ship instructions only, or both instructions and software... I don't know. Keep in mind that a lot of people are fairly anal about item descriptions versus what they get. If the items are not as described in the auction, they will get reported to eBay. Specially since eBay changed the feedback system last month, where now sellers are more vulnerable than ever.

He wrote one last email asking why we were complaining about the iphone package. He said, he purchased a few licenses for the skin and the programs from a trusted website. I just wrote back to him explaining that he might want to get his money back if that is the case, since the package consists of the following:

*Skin by aleksander100

*S2U2 by A_C

*PCM Contacts and Keyboard by tene

...and I also believe that he had mortpalyer skinned as the iphone, but I could be wrong on that one. Anyway, as far as his morals... well, let's just hope he does the right thing and listens to the white guy on his right shoulder, and not the red on the left one :)
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] Jay2TheRescue:
Yeah, but would you report a seller for giving you more than what he advertised? The only buyers that complain are the ones that don't get what was advertised. Say you bought a 30 gig hard drive on Ebay. The seller was out of them, and sent you an 80 gig drive instead. Are you going to report him? Probably not.

-Jay
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] egzthunder1:
True, but there is always the chance that you could use this argument to get your money back from Paypal. You see, that is all you really need. If the item is not exactly as described, then you can go to Paypal and say: "hey, this guy sold me something else, I want my money back!" Two things will arise from that: 1. you will get you money back, 2. you will not be forced to ship anything back. So... well, I guess you can understand where I was going with this. I didn't want to be this explicit :)
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] ronfin44:
This arguement is never-ending it seems. Its like if someone gives u a free lawnmower to cut ur grass but u pay someone else to do so for whatever reason, a service, then the person that gave u the lawnmower n the lawnmowers manufacturer whine that u didnt cut ur grass yourself. Geeze. Now I don't condone making money by ripping someone off buy since our whole community is based in taking material and tinkering with it and redistributing it without consent, many of us here are hippcrites for getting pissy that someone who takes the time to flash this to a device n sell that device to people either unwilling or too lazy to come here n do it on their own just makes little sense to me. If people are trying to sell software developed from here then Im strongly against it, but phones that are unlocked n flashed I think is pure capitalismat its best. Time is money people. Time to do this for someone incapable is the grey area of this debate. The preflashed device vs the outright stealing of software. There is a huge difference that this arguement seems to keep merging into one fight.

PS, sry for my shorthand n typos but I typed this from my phone. Ugh!
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] klmsu19:
its not the same thing, someone is profiting off of work done by developers here who offer it for free for the community and SPECIFICALLY say on most not to distribute without permission. Theres no reason some douchebag should be profiting off other people's work and charging unsuspecting people.

I think, sad to say, maybe it gotten to the point developers here need to put serial numbers on their software. Not for charging for it like the major companies, but make each serial specific to each phone. the person has a trial period say 3 days and they have to email you for the free serial. then you can keep a master list of who owns what serial and when someone tries to resell it you know who the person is (let alone the software would be undistributable without a custom serial).
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] KyleK29:
That's a lot of work for a freeware app.

Some notes (previously covered):

- He's allowed to sell informational instructions. In doing so, he can provide links to where someone can attain the software.

- The reason he includes a CD is most likely because (to my knowledge, last I checked) Ebay requires that all auctions have a physical item (no "digital information"). This is why you often see "digital" things sold with a trinket. "You're bidding on this triket, but will get such and such in email". Often the sellers will ask if you want to just get the item through email instead (faster for you, cheaper for them).

One way to counteract things like this is for someone to do the exact same thing and price-fight him. Make the cost of the item the exact cost of the listing on Ebay. Use his keywords/etc. He wouldn't sell much as people would flock to the cheapest Buy It Now. *shrug*
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] egzthunder1:
You gotta be careful not to copy his listing too well. Otherwise, you can get reported by someone since that is against rules and regulations.

@ronfin44

You do make a good point. The only difference is that the roms that are cooked here are not sold. They are free. Do you have any idea how much time, work, and effort it takes to port a ROM? Since M$ will not do it for us (simply because they want us to buy new devices every time a new OS hits the market), people (devs) have decided to take the matter into their own hands. We don't do it for profit, just for the love of it. That is why this issue pissed off everyone so much.

All in all, while it might seem a little hypocritical to condemn someone for doing what 4goodeal did, it isn't. I am sure that there will be more cases like this (I have already found 3 more, one of them including FreeStyle). I believe that I share the view of a lot of users in this site when I say this. That's all..
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] bonnyvun:
Promote XDA DEV

My friends or colleagues always ask me what type of phones or pdas to buy. I always promote XDA DEV/HTC products. Eventhough there are driver issues with my tytn ii, I still feel extremely fortunate coz I have all these great cooks here. All I know is that if I buy another phone that is not htc... I wouldnt know where I can get roms, applications, etc for it. GUess what I am trying to say is that the more 1 promotes xda and the great contributions it has made to us all... be it just to friends or colleagues... perhaps there will be less people 'suckered' by fellows like that ebayer...

Whilst I dont know what can be done to that guy.... since he has written several times to you... in some way stating some of his correspondence also suggest that he is stealing stuff to sell... cant that be sent to paypal or ebay to 'incriminate' him and get his a$$ kicked??

I do know what the sweetest revenge would be though. It is a nice fantasy. "All the developers whom he has ripped off. To take a crap and make him eat it." Ahahahahahaha... sorry... too much work... not enough money.
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] ronfin44:
Its irrelevant how long someone took to take M$ software, "cook" it, and redistribute here since M$ never gave anyone permission to do so. Hypocritical? To the highest degree. Its not your software to cook and redistribute whether its free or not. Plain and simple. That wont hold-up in a court. "Um your honor, I stole that guys car but I didn't sell it. I gave it away for free". Yeah, good argument. So now that we covered the legality of what our chefs are doing, the fact that someone just wants to flash this non-permissions ROMS for someone else and CHARGE for THEIR time, don't throw rocks in this glass house of ours. I think I share a lot of users views that actually understand whats going on here also and say wake up. Redistributing copywritten material for FREE is a bull**** excuse as to justifying it. :rolleyes:
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] egzthunder1:
Hey! Relax, no need to get worked up. Like I said, you do have a good point and I respect that. However, there are some aspects that I do not share of that view. You put up a good example with the car. Now, let me throw a little curve here. What if this car was completely abandoned in the bushes, or maybe a dumpster? (whatever rocks your boat, really ;) ) You know for a fact that the owner is not coming back for it. If no one else claims it, would it still be a crime to take it? You take the car and paint it (maybe it was rusted for being there all that time), but you keep all the markings and branding (stickers, or anything that denotes that this was someone else's car). You see where I am going with this metaphore? I guess I just wanted to illustrate my point :D

One thing though, I still think that what this guy did was wrong. It might not seem too different from what you are stating, but the truth of the matter is that it is a completely different scenario...
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] erickbryce:
Simple Solution

I am more amazed every day that people find all sorts of personal justifications for why scamming someone else is ok so long as they are benefiting financially. Even deluding themselves their reasoning is actually good and fair. It's amazing what suddenly becomes ok to someone if they think they might get some money, oooh, ahhhh, mooooney, droool. Maybe with circular reasoning by nothing more than a bull sh*t artist, it may not be within the brackets of Unlawful. I think we can all agree it is just plane "Pathetic!" If it were the other way around, my the story would play very different.

Anyway, that is an abuse of this community. What kind of snake does that, shame, shame, shame.

My solution:

How many of you would buy an individual product from some hustler if it said "NOT FOR INDIVIDUAL RESALE" you'd probably think twice, especially if you could buy the whole box for what he was trying to scam you for.

How about simply putting a splash on future software: "THIS PROGRAM IS FREE YOU SHOULD NOT HAVE PAID FOR IT AND IF YOU DID PLEASE NOTIFY THE AUTHOR. THANK YOU."

Just an idea. but it's probably a loosing battle people are more and more lazy these days. They want to get large sums of money for just planting their a*s in a seat some where for a few hours a day. Heaven forbid you ask them to actually do their job. I know of people who actually deploy cracked software into corporate networks all so they personally profit some how. It's one thing if you think that app developers shouldn't get paid for their works and want to screw them because you think you’re entitled some how, but it’s a whole other thing to put the company in jeopardy and liability just because you think you wont get caught.
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] mabru2001:
Um yes you have to ship the item back. I just had some girl try that same thing when I sold a ipod on ebay. She tried to say it was broken and get her money back, well paypal said ship it back and they would refund her. Suprise suprise when she ignored paypal and never sent it back, so she dient get her money back.

Paypal has changed their polices to protect sellers more... now if only ebay would do the same. I'm sick of the damn Nigerians trying to scam me every year after black friday.
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] egzthunder1:
Thanks for that. I just learned something new :)
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] trjons:
Selling info is perfectly legit.

There are people selling Coupon codes, discounts, info where to buy things for wholesale prices. None of that is any different.

As long as his listing is clear that he is selling the info to valuable free software and not indicating the software is his own, I have no problem with it. Then again, I'm not the author of the software either.
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] egzthunder1:
Like I said on various occasions throughout the thread, he was selling the software. After we started raising flags, he modified every single one of his auctions to "only selling the info"

Even if we were against the selling of the info (which I am not), eBay considers it a legal practice, so no good would come out from complaining about that.
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] touchlasvegas:
I guess I stumbled on this thread a little late, but I read through every post on all 18 pages and was just amazed at what that guy was doing! Very glad to hear that with everyone working together we were able to get him to change his practices!:D
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] klmsu19:
i guess the way i see it is would one of the developers rather post an ebay listing for $.35-.45 (or whatever the listing costs) and give out the info for free since we all get it free anyways or keep seing some bum scamming people at $15 a pop for something thats free. As i said too i think the price indicates his motives plenty, and its not about "helping people out to get here," its clearly trying to rip people off who dont know any better.

Thatd be liking charging every noob here per issue to explain how to get some program or other thing to work- taking advantage of someone not nkowing. None of you would do it to them, so why should some douchebag do it to people on ebay? Doesnt make it any more right because we dont know the "victims" and theyre not physically here in this community. Thats how i see it.
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] ronfin44:
How can you justify the legality of redistribution based on a monetary value, when NO ONE HAS PERMISSION from M$ to do what we do here? Your reasoning is based on the people that take software and sell it, but not all of these people are, or even should, be grouped into one category. If I take my phone for example, flash some cooked ROM from here that was made with M$ software onto it that NO ONE HERE HAD PERMISSION TO TINKER WITH, how do you have the audacity to say it's wrong? By flashing your device with these ROMs you yourself have violated the copyrights. We all have. This witch hunt for people flashing their devices and deciding to profit from it is one thief telling the police he knows a bigger thief. Wake up. Anyone here that flashes a ROM should look in a mirror first before they attack the morality of someone else's actions. This thread is full of righteous hypocrites. :rolleyes:

EDIT: and just so I'm clear, again, I'm arguing the justification to be paid for a SERVICE to do something someone is too inapt to figure out on their own (i.e. flashing a custom ROM), or just to lazy. Taking MY time, if I so decide, to do this for someone and be reimbursed for it is justifiable. Not sell software or anything else that was developed. Pay attention to what I'm saying before responding. If M$ made lawnmowers, and Slueth took one, rebuilt it and made it better, and decided to give copies of them away for free, and I cut someones lawn with one because they did't wanna do it, I can charge them for the time and service of doing it. *sigh* Case closed.
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] Jay2TheRescue:
Personally I charge $25 to flash and hex edit (+ another $25 to unlock) some Motorola models. My feeling is after I pay for insured shipping back to them I get $18 for about an hour's worth of work. If someone is too stupid to flash the phone on their own, why not profit from it? I know I could charge more, but I feel its worth it to not have to deal with "I can't get the USB drivers working" (Motorola USB drivers for flashing are very tempermental with Win xp SP2), "Help! I have no sound!", and my personal favorite "Help! My phone's dead!". You can easily spend several days holding someone's hand and walking them through the steps, or they can just send me the phone and $25, and I can do it in an hour. I find it a much better use of my time.

-Jay
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] ronfin44:
Jay excellent post. Exactly what I was saying. If someone wants to ***** about the ROM being flashed they should ask M$ how they feel before they claim anything was theirs to redistribute after they "cooked" it. I'm just shocked at the level of arrogance and hypocrisy in here. Putting serials on ROMs someone suggested? Insane! Its not your software to begin with. We're all guilty of hypocrisy to some degree just by benefiting from what we do here with m$ software etc. but don't lash-out at others when you're all guilty too. Whether you take this "stuff" as FREE is not a valid arguement. :/
[Windows Mobile Development and Hacking General] klmsu19:
i dunno why youre twisting the situation to ONLY ROMs. Most of the stuff hes selling is developed stuff from here- ftouchflo, slither's cube, pocketcm, etc etc. This has nothing to do with M$ or what not so your agruement is moot there. Hes clearly stealing stuff people took hours and weeks to produce (from scratch)for the good of the community and in turn selling it to unsuspecting people. Also selling google maps, which is free, is illegal. also selling copyrighted Tomtom maps is illegal too. Quit justifying a theifs actions. Theres a HUGE moral distinction between using M$ stuff as bases for the good of a community for 100% free and some leecher solely trying profiting off unsuspecting individuals. Notice how M$ visited this site, knowing about the ROMs, yet never pushed legal action. Think about it this way then- MS takes ideas from smaller developers and how we mod ROMs its a fact of life. They for sure partol boards looking for new ideas, theres no doubt there.

And Jay's situation is totally different. He actually gets shipped the phone and manually does the work himself, theres no pre-compiled "stolen" package he pops on a CD and says $20 please, i only marked it up oh 95% above the CD cost. I dont think making a little money off having the phone shipped to you and actually doing the work yourself for the person who cant themselves is even the same situation at all.

But if someone was ripping me off for a free service then Id for sure want to know because Id rather get it free than pay a scam artist, which is what this guy is. Hes taknig credit for other developers original work. ROMs are only a very small part of what hes selling.
[Xiaomi Mi 5X Themes, Apps, and Mods] Ritwik Rahman:
Get "Google Pixel2 Launcher" and "Google Phone" on Mi 5x

Download :

Google Pixel2 Launcher : https://xdaforums.com/android/apps-games/app-rootless-pixel-2-launcher-google-t3688393

Google Phone : https://xdaforums.com/android/apps-games/app-google-phone-v14-0-175904292-bubble-t3708218

Special Thanks to [MENTION=6018897]paphonb[/MENTION], [MENTION=1935572]martin.[/MENTION]007

Regards.

Ritwik Rahman.

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