yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] Illidan Pornrage:
Well essentially you just needlessly add another party to those you already trust....

You have to trust intransparent eveil silicon valley spooks anyway because they essentially run mozilla.

Its the only non chromium browser left.

All forks of firefox are complete dogpiles the last time I checked.

Considering maintaining my own mod but time constraints.

I'd rather trust gorhill with uBlock Origin and uMatrix instead of a guy with hybris and an inability to articulate technical matters and too much pride admit conceptual weaknesses in its own concept.

Trust is one thing, I might even install someones rootcert if that person seems trustable. But I'd only trust a rootcert provider if he didnt lie about the possibilites of a root cert.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] Mackie Messer:
uBlock Origin and uMatrix work only inside Firefox. This is less than you can do with AdAway. Do you know something else that works systemwide, like keweon or AdAway?
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] bhanupratap:
Blokada or personalDNSfilter or adway depending upon whether your phone is rooted or not. UbO doesn't work on chrome , if you like chromium based browsers then brave and bromite which are equipped with some sort of cosmetic filtering too.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] Illidan Pornrage:
wew

Finally a response that looks sane on the surface. Am on mobile right now. Will answer later in a more verbose way.

You still dont seem to get my initial gripe.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] micgeb:
If you are online you must trust many company. Is your OS secret? And so on. Use it or use it not. Go offline you are now secret ?

I will say thx for this nice projekt.

With a dns server you can only redirect a homepage but not steal user logins.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] MrT69:
He was right. If I would redirect internal to a Proxy an point this back it is possible. But if I really would do it I would run in serious Problems and German law is not a fun about this. And you can use any security solution. If its protecting it also can be a threat. Take Cisco, Checkpoint, PaloAlto to name a few big player. It doesn't matters. All the same. Of cause they can but why?

I have other goals. The only thing I want to proof is we can do something against all common Internet threats. I can't hear it any more its not possible to protect the people.

That's indeed all I want to show.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] AeolicLavender:
Keweon/AdAway/hosts-based solutions cant block everything, while uBO can.

---------- Post added at 03:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:08 PM ----------

uBO works on Chrome. it's just a proposed change to **** up the APIs that it uses.

---------- Post added at 03:24 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:09 PM ----------

Your DNS server does the same, for example for `www.googleadservices.com` and every other domain in the blocklist.

Example by running the following command in your command line:

# dig www.googleadservices.com @176.9.62.62 +noall +answer

; <<>> DiG 9.9.5-9+deb8u16-Debian <<>> www.googleadservices.com @176.9.62.62 +noall +answer
;; global options: +cmd
www.googleadservices.com. 229	IN	A	45.32.152.171

Then you can run

dig -x 45.32.152.171 +noall +answer

to get the reverse of the hostname:

; <<>> DiG 9.9.5-9+deb8u16-Debian <<>> -x 45.32.152.171 +noall +answer
;; global options: +cmd
171.152.32.45.in-addr.arpa. 3538 IN	PTR	redirector02-ger-01.keweon.center.

Keweon does the exact same redirection thing as the PoC server, only with multiple IP addresses/servers.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] Mackie Messer:
uBlock Origin is only a browser extension. It can not block anything outside of the browser. Therefore it's not comparable with keweon or AdAway. I think it could be an addition to keweon (for the paranoid ones) but never an replacement for it.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] MrT69:
Thanks a lot!!

The core question is - what will DNS Servers do? You almost get the answer:

It serves IP addresses.

That is fundamentally wrong. That's also the reason for the public IP addresses. No errors within the browser will cause that everything runs faster. That's the entire trick.

I was telling this so many times. But now the web is full of warning because of the usage of keweon. There is no reason to warn that I'm doing evil things and I'm still missing the proof of it.

And this hurts. Seriously.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] Nastrahl:
Hm, let's just see what are the other "authorities" here and there, like in Firefox.

Strangely, I don't know ANY of them either, and nobody can proove anyone they never did anything wrong. Many would trust more their grocery cashiers that some mystical ACCV/Camerfirma/??? third parties with their personal infos, than a nobody-knows-either authority. And especially if they are from the USA since their laws permit anything.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] O l l i X:
YOU can never protect people from themselves! THEY need tools like KeWeOn, to protect themselves..

I know it's sounds like the same thing, but read it a few times and you will see the difference! It's only the police who "protect the others".. And our legacy will in the future look back in disgust, just like we do now on the "darker ages"..

Anyhow, for my own online protection I use KeWeOn.. That's just me.. ?
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] MrT69:
I know this very well. This remembers me to a funny story.

In 1998 I was working for US Military Installations and the NATO Headquarter within 1st Level support. A US Soldier was asking me to fix his laptop because it causes some troubles.

He open it, logged on and he left the room.

I was taking a look at it and on the Desktop was a Smiley with "Don't click here". Now, I don't need to explain details. This was a joke which simulates Hard Disk deleting.

During the "hard disk deletion" there was running a film inside me. They arrest me, diplomatic crisis, I was the reason for the 3rd wold war, they are shooting me because of destroying high confidential military secrets. 30 seconds can be sometimes as long as a light-year.

A few moments later 2 soldiers and the owner enter the room. They saw my face and I guess they are still laughing until today.

Don't ask for details but this was a really healing moment about "think twice bevore you do one step".

You can't prevent idiotic behavior and I guess this is the best example for this. But no one should try explain to me that all the reports within the Internet about threats are 100% idiotic behavior related.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] O l l i X:
Don't ask for details but this was a really healing moment about "think twice bevore you do one step".

You can't prevent idiotic behavior and I guess this is the best example for this. But no one should try explain to me that all the reports within the Internet about threats are 100% idiotic behavior related.[/QUOTE]

You can educate and be educated, thats a well known way to prevent or at least minimize mishaps..

What you experienced wasn't idiotic behavior, but human curiosity!

You educated yourself, and it's a beautiful example of how humans from time to time will fail. -And it's OKAY!

If i have seen further it's by standing on the shoulders of Giants!

-Isaac Newton.

He became a giant by curiosity, and by doing "idiotic" fails! ?
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] MrT69:
Hi & sorry!

That's the point where any discussion with you is pointless.

I only read about evil things, concerns and contradictions. I know I have some kind of communication problems. My wife is a NLP Coach and Trainer and she's sometimes driving crazy with "my way of communication". People who knows me telling a lot of strange things about me. Genius, Nerd, Autist. But that's not true. OK, may be it's a mix of them ;) I just want to proof guys as like as you have no clue and they are wrong. Your Ideas and solutions would be the same if you take a kitchen knife and you fight with it in a tank battle.

If you have a better Idea then you're welcome. If you have troubles with this solution - your body, your mind, your problem. I only hear about this concerns and that concerns and I'm planing to do everything for the world domination as like as "Pinky and Brain".

Security is damn expensive and I don't know if this will be ever grow up because I don't know if I ever will have the money for it. I don't care. I just want to show - hey, things are possible. If it's at the end me or someone else I really don't care. Important is that it is possible to protect users against so many threats and I that's all what I want to show and demonstrate.

What you will see here is just a side product. Since almost 3 yrs I'm searching an Investor and you can believe to that this money would be not a problem if I would do User Data Collection.

And this you can proof easily. Tell someone you have an awesome idea and you want to have money. And in addition you tell him you will do no Data Collection.

Although we have in Germany by law and by the DSGVO (GDPR) a restriction NOT (!) to collect user data they will do it.

At this point you should think about this facts and have concerns.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] Timmmmaaahh!:
[MENTION=4159439]Illidan Pornrage[/MENTION] Please refrain from name calling; that's the kind of behaviour that gets posts deleted and I really would hate to see that happen here as I've read all of it and it's actually quite meaningful. Name calling (and your horrible username, lol) aside, you've made very interesting points and compelling arguments.

[MENTION=304818]MrT69[/MENTION] As a loyal keweon user I do urge you not to dismiss Illidan's arguments as if he'll never understand because to me it looks like he has a very sound understanding of the matter. It would not be wise to say discussion with him is pointless as you can easily make it very meaningful.

To the both of you I kindly ask to keep this a strictly technical discussion. This can mean a great benefit to security aspects of keweon. Keep an open mind and remain respectful at all times.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] MrT69:
Thanks a lot and I totally agree to you but I'm missing the point how to do it better or different. I do this also with my employees. I always hope (!) they disagree to my solutions because from only my point of few it's always the best.

For my understanding within a conversation disagree to something is nothing negative because this will shows this one is thinking about everything. But if someone disagree I also expect a different or better solution. Just complaining everything is bad or a threat is not a way I understand.

It remembers me to 1994 as Netscape invented SSL. Almost the half of the world was fighting hard against this technologies. And what's about today?

That's also the reason why I'm here on XDA. It's a proof of concept and collecting Ideas can do it better. But only telling to me I'm the living evil and I do it 100% sure only because to cheat the entire world?

I understand the points of him. If he would working within Advertising Industries or something else I would do it 100% same as he do it. That's the reason why I have concerns about the way of his argumentation.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] Timmmmaaahh!:
That's actually an interesting comparison. SSL 1.0 was never publicly released and SSL 2.0 was basically a security colander. A cryptographic disaster, you might even say. Netscape had to rewrite the entire protocol, with the help of Paul Carl Kocher, to achieve a worthy SSL 3.0 which was then accepted by the IETF. Also mind that Netscape based this on an earlier protocol and thus did not invent SSL completely on its own. Since 2015 we should only be talking about TLS anyway. TLS has not become so great today because Netscape protected its interests or stood by its own ideas. TLS has become the standard today due to its openness and because multiple instances were involved.

I'm not sure what proof of concept you imply. I did see a proof of concept on Illidan's end that proves sensitive information can be intercepted using a certificate. I know this is challenging but there must be some way to prove your certificate isn't doing the same.

I think your focus might be in the wrong place here. You are correct about the slander; that is completely uncalled for. But I would be open to the security improvement(s) he's trying to provide.

Illidan spoke of a "less risky way of doing the TLS termination." As a user, this sounds like music to my ears. Have we established yet what this way is? If not, I invite Illidan to share this in the thread or via PM. Though he will most likely only do this if you're open to it, Torsten.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] bhanupratap:
If I recall correctly, Illidan did share his "less risky version of doing things" before torsten decided to delete the telegram groups and gag the communications related to keweon.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] SacredDeviL666:
Thread cleaned/edited posts for the last time!!!!

Use the apps/hacks/roms/kernels here on XDA at YOUR OWN RISK .

Constructive feedback/criticism is always welcome and encouraged as that is the root of brainstorming/development of further ideas and technology, but thats it! It should stop there and not get personal let it to be prove you are right over the other or vice versa doesn't serve any purpose on public forums not atleast here on XDA

Let's have a civil conversation/discussion further on this topic/thread to avoid any further interventions by MODs against those users.

Forum Rules

Thanks

SacredDeviL666.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] MrT69:
I see and understand concerns of some users. I never said "my idea is perfect" or it's some kind of holy solution. But just telling it's evil and giving not an other option is something I will never understand.

It's working and it's doing the Job. Whatever idea you have to do it better or to offer more trust into it let me know this. I only can make an offer to work together and doing it better.

It's very easy to tell keweonDNS is an evil system but as long as there is no other solution for threats like this I wouldn't give up. Just a stupid warning with a raised pointing finger about threats within the Internet was never working and it also will never work within the future.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] Cookie Ninja:
Part 1 of above quote - rigidity, sticking to your own thoughts and views and rejecting that an alternate view could be true too. Please do understand, we respect your work, but the certificate business, (as explained by [MENTION=4159439]Illidan Pornrage[/MENTION]),is open to MITM attacks, and many of us are concerned. Please do follow part 2 of the above quote and introspect. Maybe there is a better method?

That's all I have to say.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] MrT69:
I don't see any MITM Attack, I will not do it and I wouldn't do it.

The DNS Server Database points poison URL's to a pixel. This pixel responds with 0 byte Data. To prevent errors user can (!) use the Certficate.

1. All evil HTTPS connections will be terminated by 0 bytes and with HTTP/200 confirmation.

2. All the HOSTS file blocking is almost 20 yrs old. If someone believes WebDevs hasn't learnd anything during this time then dream on. The entire Internet moves more and more connections to HTTPS. If you just block various HOSTS then they are able to see "Adblock" from users side if there is a successfull HTTPS connection then not. If not then Adblock is detected.

3. I force NO ONE to use it. I always say "IF YOU LIKE TO PREVENT THEN USE IT"

4. I have even 2 different Systems for user who are using the Certificate and some who are using it not.

5. Take a look at the debugger of your Browser. With and without the Certificate. This is exactly the reason why Browser and OS are acting faster.

I'm sorry, but I don't have the money as like as CISCO to pay for "Browser Vendors Trusted Certificate" or "OS Vendor Trusted Certificate".

What will a DNS do?

So named Experts are allways telling they are serving IP Addresses which is WRONG! It's false and it's easy to proof it.

A DNS Server is a system you ask and he will make sure that you get an "answer". No one should tell me this is wrong because then I want to see what kind of "Subnet Mask" the answer "NXDOMAIN" has. I'm also fine when someone teach me how to calculate the IP Address "NXDOMAIN".

Compared to OpenDNS - which are using a Proxy - I see not even a chance how to do a MITM even when I want to do it because there is no Proxy. Why no one

blame on OpenDNS? Why it is OK when they are using a Proxy? OpenDNS was the reason why I want to have NO PROXY. Be inspired and do the opposite. That's my way.

If someone has still concerns to use it I'm OK with this. I have spend round about 250.000 EUR within the entire developement because it is my Hobby since 2003. Although it is a hobby I don't expect to get the money ever back. If you think it's easy to do some kind of copy and do it in the same way then feel so free and do it. But you will see it's not easy at the end. There is a lot of work and also security inside because I'm sad since years about the entire data collections and no one will do something against this.

I don't care about the time and money because it was a lot of fun but I would never release everything as open source just because a few users are not able to understand the system and how it works.

EDIT:

If you want to have a proof that I don't do MITM then please let me know how I should proof this when I'm not doing it.

But let's asume I will do - how should I proof it? Would be the same if you ask I should proof that I'm not a murderer or I should proof that I don't have Million dollars on my banking account. What kind of proof do you expect??
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] bhanupratap:
What is that you don't see ?

This has nothing to do with money or being a default vendor certificate.

Did you do any research on opendns or just blasting them blindly ? Sure , opendns uses some kind of proxy.

Switch to opendns and query "bhargavi.org" which is blocked on opendns. Try connecting to both "http://bhargavi.org" and "https://bhargavi.org" . For "https" connection browser warns you with "certificate error" (those dollars didn't help here), so in simple "user gets notified with error and potential MITM can be stopped".

Sadly this is not the case with keweon and root certificate . When the root certificate is installed the "https" connections for the blocked/redirected domain if present , connection is trusted by device/browser by default due to root certificate. With root certificate present the users wouldn't know when the MITM attack is performed.

Well i would have provided the screenshots , but whats the point ? [MENTION=304818]MrT69[/MENTION] would blindly ignore the facts provided or bash people who are pointing out the security flaw in the design or try to deviate the conversion from the technical aspects.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] MrT69:
I want to phish a Phishing domain? Is this what I should explain to you?

The reason is very simple and I don't ignore blindly things. At this point I really see YOU ignore all arguments.

Let's assume you are infected by something which try to connect this domain. If you point it to 127.0.0.1 or 0.0.0.0 then the infection or the virus will get no answer. That's a given fact. It's now pointet to my "Zero Session Broker Provider" (sorry for the stupid name but I haven't found a better until today) and the virus gets a positive response. Just a HTTP/200 and that's all.

If you ever take a deeper look at this kind of threats you will see they are first calling home and if they don't get an answer they repeat and repeat and repeat. Within this way they will get a valid "Yes" or "OK" and that's it. No transmission, no longer errors on your side and no further communication. No errors means faster and until this threat is removed you are safe. And that's the reason for this certificate. Even if it's a HTTPS call then your system will get a valid answer.

That's why I say I see NO MITM Attack because there is no possibility to do it. I also can do it via a Proxy as like as OpenDNS but this is from my point of few a real risk. At this point I absolutely agree to you.

You are trying to tell me a Proxy based security solution is safer then my idea. At this point I really don't understand the arguments. Data collection, user identification, UFi and all other things would be much more easy. This kind of threat was the reason why I'm doing it within a complete different way. Stoping threats but without a proxy.

If I would use a proxy then I would understand you arguments. And until today I'm still waiting for a better and safer idea. But telling me a proxy offers more security and provides less chances of MITM Attacks is the wrong argument. In other words I will do nothing different compared to OpenDNS but I don't use a proxy and exactly this is something I want to proof. Security without a proxy is possible. There is no need for this.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] bhanupratap:
Again you are imagining things , i never ever said or supported proxy based solutions. But there is nothing stopping you from going rogue one day and perform MITM attacks silently , with root certificate you have all the ingredients to do it ( you still deny this fact ).

Tell me more about this , how did you come up with this solution ?. How long did it take for you to develop this ? As a user , i'm curious about this.
[Android Software/Hacking General [Developers Only]] Cookie Ninja:
[MENTION=304818]MrT69[/MENTION], I am very sorry, but you simply are not getting my point or the point in the post above....your method forces the user to rely on the keweon certificate to provide him his target / destination website THROUGH YOUR SERVER, where (maybe not you, but anyone else who has access/manages your server) a man-in-the-middle, can stop/inspect and alter the data in real time. the inputs from the user (username/passwords) can be seen and stored for misuse later. The user is blissfully unaware of the new/modified/copied data passing thru to his PC, coz your certificate validates the data/site as legit, which it is not (since data tampering is taking place mid-stream). If your certificate is deleted, an immediate warning will pop up on the PC of the end user that the site is not secure.

Please do consider this and try to rectify you process.