yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] j.bruha:
While I think you're right about all of your points about the 3.5mm jack (and that there still isn't a good enough reason to remove it in the first place for any companies doing it), I think a lot of the whining from people is more due to an unwillingness to change their existing behaviors. That, or they don't know what Bluetooth solutions are out there (or a combination of the two).

Before it was even a conversation forced on everyone, switching to Bluetooth was arguably a good idea for the convenience alone, and that has only gotten better as the tech has aged. Quality has been improving constantly to bring it on par with a physical connection, battery life has improved on both phones and accessories, and the pool of options has grown exponentially and brought the cost of these items down in the process. There's still plenty of expensive solutions, but there are definitely options out there now that are inexpensive enough for people to adapt to a phone without a headphone jack and add more conveniences not available with a wired connection, and without a noticeable difference in quality (if at all). You also don't need to replace your entire car to get Bluetooth in your vehicle, or even the radio. There's hundreds of adapters out there now that make the switch extremely easy and preferable, even if you still have a phone with the 3.5mm jack.

When you really think about it, the behaviors are the same, more or less, depending on the person. Most people charge their phones overnight and maybe a second time throughout the day. With a 3.5mm headphone jack, they're also plugging their headphones or aux cables in and out on every car or train ride (or anywhere else they use headphones). With Bluetooth and, *gasp*, another device to charge, they're just plugging in the charger into their headset at night instead. That reduces the overall amount of times you're plugging something in and out, and if anything only replaces the action with turning the headphones on and off, at best. Even with the occasional troubleshooting of a repairing issue, it's still arguably less effort than the amount of times saved in having to physically plug in the headphones every single time you want to use them. Batteries absolutely do go bad, and there's no argument in favor of this over something that just plain doesn't have a battery to eventually fail. That said, the only Bluetooth headphones I've ever had an issue with over the years was any pairs of LG Tones I've purchased, and that's from one of the buds failing, not the battery. Aside from that, a good pair doesn't seem to be an investment that needs to be replaced every few years as you might be led to believe.

Sorry to go off on a rant. My intention is not to direct these points specifically at you. I just don't think the removal of the jack is as big an issue as people want to make it seem and we tend to get a very vocal minority of people who would rather complain about it than start to process how simple switching over would be and what new features they would gain by doing it.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] cb474:
I get your points, but I don't really think people are just whining. I think the 3.5 mm jack is just far far simpler to use. (And the adapters for cars you mention are just another complication and expense.) Also, people already know how to use a 3.5 mm jack.

At the end of the day, most people are not gadget nerds who hang out on XDA. They are busy, don't want to learn new things, and need a good reason for change. But, for example, just about everyone I know would be befuddled and annoyed to have to figure out bluetooth pairing. And when it failed and they had to troubleshoot they would give up and call me or something.

So the average person doesn't want to learn new things if there is not a significant benefit. And at the end of the day, audio quality and everything else aside (which most people don't care about one way or the other), the real and only true benefit of bluetooth is not having a wire. For that benefit you have to deal with chargers, remembering to charge, buying new headphones when the headphones you've had your whole life has always worked with everything, adapters for cars, pairing and troubleshooting pairing, etc. and so on. That's a lot of extra things just to not have a wire.

For the aveage busy person that is extremely not worth it. So, to me, it's not whining, it's the reality of having other things to do in their lives, because they just want their technology to work without thinking about it.

And again, I think the fact that the 3.5 mm jack has been in use for more than 60 years and the phone jack of any size for more than a 100 years--a period of time in which people have adapted to lots of things, going from horses to cars, flying, space travel, television, VCRs, DVD players, computers, cell phones, every type of kitchen appliance, from radios, to records and cassette tapes, to CDs, to mp3s, to streaming, and on and on--all this suggests that maybe there is more to the stalwart unchanging 3.5 mm jack than people give it credit for. And maybe bluetooth headsets are less of a benefit than people claim.

In general I agree with you that people whine about change and don't want to deal with it. But with the 3.5 mm jack, I don't think that's the case. I'd even argue from a useability standpoint, for the average person, bluetooth headphones are a step backwards. They add complexity, rather than get rid of it.

Honestly, I think the only reason phone manufacturers are dropping the 3.5 mm jack (especially in a very large phone like the Pixel 2 XL that could easily accomodate one) is planned obsolescence. They just want to force people to buy new headphones. I don't think they believe their own reasons for arguing that bluetooth is better.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] BootsSiR:
Enjoy Android 7 for the next four years :o
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] sn0warmy:
For me, it comes down to the lack of wireless charging and the overall size of the phone.

I know wireless charging is not a necessity for most. However, wireless charging on the S8 has spoiled me. I've got a wireless charger on my night stand, in my office, and one next to the couch in the living room. In addition, at this point a large majority of family on both my side and my wife's side have adopted wireless charging with their various Samsung/LG phones and also have multiple wireless chargers in their houses. It really has become a very convenient creature comfort that I use daily. Not having to mess with cables has been a very welcomed change. I couldn't tell you the last time I used a USB-C charger. In fact, I never even took the OEM charger out of the packaging that came with my S8.

So, in my case, the thought of having to go back to wired charging and always having to bring a charger with me just sounds archaic and is a deal breaker in and of itself.

The other factor is the size of the Pixel 2 XL (157.9 x 76.7 x 7.9 mm). That is a very large phone and is roughly the same size as the Note 8 but with a worse screen to body ratio (76.4% for the Pixel XL 2 and 83.2% for the Note 8). This is another area where Samsung has spoiled me over these past 4 months or so. The S8 is the perfect size to me (148.9 x 68.1 x 8 mm) with a 83.6% screen to body ratio. In my opinion, the Pixel 2 XL is unnecessarily large due to those front facing speakers. I get that they produce better sound but I'm one that would prefer a smaller form factor, instead.

With all that said, I truly was looking forward to the new Pixel lineup and while I've found myself disappointed with the options Google presented, I am still looking for a change-up. Which is why I plan on using my JUMP! On Demand with T-Mobile to pickup the LG V30 in a couple of weeks. The V30 is everything I wish the Pixel 2 XL was. It has the same size screen but with a smaller form factor, so the screen to body ratio is better. It also has an excellent camera. Plus it's the only phone on the market that's currently capable of using T-Mobiles 600MHz band.

I know many will throw out the S8 and V30 as alternative options, simply due to the lack of a pure Android experience. I used to be that way myself, so I get it. But I've been pleasantly surprised with the current Touchwiz experience on the S8 as it hasn't slowed down or began to lag for me at all, after a few months of usage. I've read that LG's take on the Android experience is even more fluid.

A good read for those swaying towards the Pixel 2 XL or the V30:

https://www.androidcentral.com/google-pixel-2-xl-vs-lg-v30
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] SquallLHeart:
While I have weighed in so many options and have always been the skip a generation/year person to upgrade phones.. It was a nice jump from the Nexus 6 to the Pixel XL.. and it seems it was a good thing i skipped out on the 6P due to hearing about bootloop issues and other things about the huawei built nexus phones. The only times I have broken this cycle is from device failures.... well.. not this time. I am breaking this cycle to upgrade from last year's Pixel XL to the Pixel XL 2 despite how great my Pixel XL is still running.

Unlike a few others who have the 128GB, my 32GB and its trade-in value of $400 played a bit of a factor in my decision.. if i had the 128GB, the $410 option would've been less appealing and seeing that they priced it only $10 difference? yikes.. and a free Home mini is a nice bonus too..

.. and while I mostly probably would prefer an HTC built phone, I want the bigger screen size and the XL is well.. LG built.. I hope that the LG build quality has improved and with the more recent flagships from them (like the V30).. I am hoping for the best.

I have a Nexus 5 that actually still works, but not without some surgery I performed a few years ago... the reason why I also didn't skip a generation and went to the Nexus 6 was because after a year, the motherboard in the N5 died.... it's only alive now because I was able to get another one for free from a friend that was going to throw his device away... and by then I had gotten the Nexus 6 to replace it.

Alas.. size of the phone isn't a problem for me.. at times, I still miss how gigantic the Nexus 6 is.. (and oh hey.. I still have it too and it runs fine!) so that's not a factor at all. Even when I had wireless charging capabilities, I didn't really use it very often. I am a power user and wireless charging was never fast enough to meet my power demands.. it was only useful and cool to use it at night when I'm going to sleep... but then again, I was using my phone in bed as well and needed power.. and only wires can provide power when I have the phone in my hand.

Headphone jack? yea.. i use it every so often.. can I live without it? I think so... times when I need to.. yea. thanks for the dongle.. but otherwise... not a dealbreaker like for most. audio wise.. another reason I'm switching is.. oh hey.. front facing speakers again! i don't use headphones often so I rely on the phone's speakers.. and while the Pixel XL single bottom firing one is ok... it was time to switch back to dual front facing ones..

Camera.... one of the main reasons I'm upgrading so soon. I stopped investing in my DLSR and have been more focusing on just being able to take wonderful candid shots. phone cameras are just that and while I love the photos I'm taking now, I am planning to maybe branch out to do more things that aren't so candid at times. For those times, the Pixel XL 2 sounds like a great deal.

so... yup.. here I sit... pre-ordered and awaiting my shipment.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] martyfried:
Old is not always better, either

Playing devil's advocate here a bit...

I agree with the first part, but as is often the case, there are tradeoffs. Yeah, you have to charge them, pair them, replace them, etc. But no, you don't need wires to catch on things, get tangled, and get in the way; pairing to me is as easy as plugging in the wire; wired headphones rarely last as long as a battery for me. The need to charge them is a minus, but not that big a deal. I don't wear them all day, and the stereo speakers should be a nice relief for listening to a lot of things. Also, I have an extra bluetooth mono earphone that I got for $20 that works great for audiobooks, podcasts, conversations, radio, etc. No wires at all, and so comfortable I forget it's there.

Also, the phone jacks have been around for years, but not with portable devices. I personally think there are problems with it due to the leverage of a long, thin plug sticking out of a long jack. It is easy to over-stress and cause problems if you're not careful. I guess it's worse if you carry the phone in your pocket, though. I have an old Macbook Pro that I can't use the headphone jack at all, because it gets screwed up and doesn't always know when the plug is in or out, making the speaker not work sometimes.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] tkoreaper:
You could trade in your Pixel XL on the Google Store for $410. You don't have to send in the phone until you get the new one.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] cb474:
I think I already responded to all of this in my first couple posts, so I'm not going to repeat myself. You have given a lot of reasons why you are fine with bluetooth. I never suggested that there are not people who prefer it or don't mind it. I never suggested that many people don't find pairing to be easy. I only suggested that the arguments for why it's more convenient objectively for everyone or "simpler" are easily countered. One particular person's individual perferences don't really respond to the more general points I was making. Bluetooth headsets, I think, are objectively much more complicated, adds more steps, still involves wires (with chargers), and are a far less elegant and simple solution than the 3.5 mm jack. If some people find the benefits of bluetooth to outweigh the extra complexity it introduces, that's neither here nor there to the points I was making.

The original 6.35 mm (1/4 inch) phone jack was invented in 1878, for phone systems. But the smaller 3.5 mm and 2.5 mm jacks were created in the 1950s for transistor radios, the original portable audio device. And of course the 3.5 mm jack was extremely widely used with the Walkman starting in 1979. So, you could not be more wrong about that. The 3.5 mm jack was invented for and has been used with portable devices for over 60 years.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] meboy:
No headphone jack

SD card

Fingerprint reader on the back

Poor stereo speakers

Poor lg display

High price

No thank you
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] martyfried:
Most of the portable devices were not small enough to be carried in a pocket. But even so, just because it has history doesn't mean it is without problems.

But, I thought this was a general discussion; I didn't realize you just wanted confirmation that your opinion was the correct one. So, I'll just bow out and leave you to your glory.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] cb474:
It is a general discussion. But you weren't actually responding to what I said, nor disagreeing with what I said. You were just talking about yourself, as if what you were saying was a response to what I was saying. Your post was about what you like about bluetooth and how you find it not to be a big deal and not at all a response to the more general point I was trying to make and the relative simplicity of 3.5 mm jacks versus the relative complexity of bluetooth. I'm not sure you really read and certainly did not understand what I was saying about 3.5 mm jacks.

That aside, you remain completely wrong about old portable devices with 3.5 mm jacks. The first pocket size transistor radio was manufactured in 1954. There were tons of these pocket size radios in the 1960s and most had earphone jacks. Heck there were some tiny transistor radios with earphone jacks that fit on a keychain. http://imgarcade.com/first-transistor-radio-1954.html https://www.collectorsweekly.com/radios/transistor https://www.collectorsweekly.com/ar...ntage-transistor-radios-of-the-1950s-and-60s/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transistor_radio http://www.collectornet.net/radio/pocket/ http://www.collectornet.net/radio/pocket/e304-aiwa-ar-665-gy.htm https://www.flickr.com/photos/51764518@N02/23249238234

You can just make stuff up and talk about yourself. all you want, but that neither makes you right, nor makes what you're saying a response in any meaningful way to the points I was making, You don't have to agree with me. But pretending you're responding to me, when you're just talking about yourself is not a discussion.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] zathus:
I guess I'm Fringe but I'm happy it's going away. I NEVER use it. Just an area that gets dirty.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] liam_davenport:
Way overpriced all they did was give us a refreshed 6P and doubled the price. OG Pixel XL was overpriced but this is taking the p**s
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] cb474:
I don't know. I'm happy that people who like bluetooth are able to use it. And I think that people who want 3.5 mm should have that option (especially since it seems to be the majority of phone users). Just because I prefer 3.5 mm jacks, doesn't mean I think bluetooth should be gone and I'd be happy if other people didn't have the option they want. The two things are not mutually exclusive, after all.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] Larzzzz82:
I haven't used a headphone jack in years. It's a phone first, I'm not looking for the same audio quality as my home stereo.

I have no use for the fingerprint reader either.

Definitely more $$ than Shamu here, but it's getting tired now.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] SlimJ87D:
My wife and I are only getting it thanks to the T-mobile deal. Otherwise, probably wouldn't have got it at full price.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] FUZER384:
I don't think any of us would be whining about a headphone jack or the price if it was ip68 rated, 80% ish screen-to-body ratio, 5.5 or 5.7", and some wireless charging or hi dac audio
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] bajasur:
I'll admit, the stereo speakers are not that loud.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] Zorachus:
EXACT spot on :)

Don't get me started on my rant, that this Pixel 2 XL is just a Nexus 8P, that should be selling for $599.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] zathus:
Yeah, but the 3.5 mm jack takes up a lot of internal space. I guess it depends how they use that extra space.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] B3501:
The Pixel 2 is an absolute joke. The XL is only slightly better. Why do Google do this?! They never seem to learn.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] force70:
Now this will be a deal breaker for me, the front firing speakers were the biggest selling point for me.

But in any of the videos Ive seen they arent Loud and sound muffle. Damn google if you go to the trouble of fitting front firing speakers into the design at make them sound amazing

sent from my Note FE
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] bkrickles:
Wait until you get the phone. I went to Verizon store and played new star wars trailer on the 2 xl and it sounded good. Not muffled and pretty loud in the store. I definitely liked it and I'm looking forward to getting mine this week
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] cwalker0906:
So are telling me I can't use the speakers as the main music source for my next party???? Damn you Google, seriously some of you really make me laugh. I have never been on a forum of a phone I don't own,or planning to own, to say how bad o think the phone is. The pity I feel for your life is beyond words. I am sorry
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] force70:
What makes me laugh is when people get butthurt by others simply expressing their opinion.

Dude why are you even here in the thread if it bothers you so much the pity you feel is beyond words lol.

sent from my Note FE
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] robstunner:
You lost me at "I'm an audiophile" "I have a pixel XL." Those two do not go together.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] rzracer2:
I canceled my order for the XL. Already have an S8 and V20 so for me to shell out $900 right now the P2 would have had to check off all the boxes which it clearly does not. I really enjoy the DAC in the V20 which is why I won't let it go but I like size/display of the S8. Can't anyone put the whole package together for $850?
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] meboy:
We used to have only Apple apologists and thankfully those idiots weren't here.

Now we have nexus/pixel apologists.

Please XDA make some other home for them. I don't want to read such idiocy.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] cwalker0906:
Dude you have been all over this forum since it was created. We get it, you're not getting the phone. What compels you to keep visiting a phone you're not getting? I'm just saying, find something to do with yourself. Go find a girl or something
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] meboy:
In the market for a new phone so watching closely

Keep reading stupid **** and feel compelled to bring some reason.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] aohus:
stopped by the Google Pop Up Shop in Los Angeles. Wanted to check out the color shift issue. Can confirm, the shifting is definitely noticeable. I understand if theres some shift, but its quite DRAMATIC even when you tilt it just a bit. You would have to view your phone dead on to not see the shifting. But a slight off angle view of the phone and it turns BLUE. WTF Google?! I wouldn't buy the LG V30 neither as it has the same issue. POLED is straight garbage. Don't get me wrong, I love LG's OLED TV panels but holy moly does their mobile display need improvement.

Still have the XL 2 on preorder but about to cancel this order due to this. I love the form factor and camera is 10/10, but the display is something I will not deal with considering its ~$1,000 after tax. I would have been okay with the lack of auxiliary port but the subpar display killed it for me. A real disappointment to say the least. Guaranteed many others will start returning their phones once they notice the color shift. I'm just glad I got to preview the issue.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] cb474:
That's what people say often, but I don't buy it.

Smartphones used to be much smaller than they are now, but they had 3.5 mm jacks without a problem. The original HTC One had dual speakers and OIS, supposedly things that take up space and excuses for dropping the 3.5 mm jack on later phones, and yet the HTC One had a 3.5 mm jack and it was the same size as the current Pixel 2. Same thing for the 2015 Moto G (actually it was even smaller).

And then of course there are these huge devices like the Pixel 2 XL or iPhone 8 Plus which have tons more room in them and yet somehow they don't have room for the 3.5 mm jack that every phone for years has had. Or look at the regular Galaxy S8: same size the the Pixel 2, "bezelless" screen, microSD card, OIS, larger camera sensor, and yet plenty of room for a 3.5 mm jack.

I think the "no room" claim is just an excuse used by phone manufacturers. The real reason they are dropping the 3.5 mm jack is planned obsolence. It just forces people to buy a whole bunch of new accessories.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] zathus:
No room and making room are 2 different things. Like the iPhone. The space used was the larger vibration motor. Is that needed? Is it a good sacrifice? That's up to the market. And the market spoke when the iPhone 7 sold well. So, the 3.5 will go away completely at some point. Or, be very rare. Like removable battery's.
[Google Pixel 2 XL Guides, News, & Discussion] mdonnelly1127:
https://www.theverge.com/2017/10/24/16519530/google-pixel-2xl-screen-issues-deep-and-unfixable