yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] runningnak3d:
After digging through this firehose I did find that it is a debug programmer, and it permanently enables the serial console port that can be accessed on the headphone jack. Unfortunately, it looks like that will mean nothing but bluetooth audio. That is not a deal breaker for me, but it might be for some of you.

I still have not actually tested this yet, because I really want to know what other potholes I may run into -- for example, incrementing ARB to a version that I don't have firmware for.

Please bare with me. This crusade has been going on for 6 months, might as well take a few more days so I don't end up with a brick that LG won't fix :)

-- Brian
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] BROKEN1981:
So are you saying this means wired headphones would not work? I'm a huuuugggeeeee noob, so I'm just trying to understand.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] dudeawsome:
Well yeah because that would turn it into a console port and so it will disable its audio capabilities so no DAC or headphone jack. Not sure if you could use a type c to 3.5 but dongle life? lol
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] runningnak3d:
Until I actually use it, I can't say for certain. But yes, that is what it looks like -- no more wired headphones.

-- Brian
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] ph4nt0m117:
Hmmm, well I guess thats not a HUGE issue.... It is a little annoying though. Any advantage to having the serial console available? Debug apps?
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] askermk2000:
Or kernel.

Though this has got to be the worst phone for this particular scenario. I mean that's half the phone right there... lost :crying:

Isn't it also possible to interrupt the boot process through uart, and send commands and such. Though not really important when we have the firehose programmer.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] BROKEN1981:
Dongle life would be a fair trade off, assuming the DAC would still work. Would it suck, yes, but at least you have root.

For me, if I can't have a working DAC, I would not root. The DAC and second screen are the main features of this phone.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] dudeawsome:
Yeah I agree but I don't think the dac has a pass through to the type c port
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] toastyp:
I think you're right about that. Someone would have to test with adb while routing audio through usb to see. But I'm pretty sure the dac only works when outputting audio through the headphone jack. No headphone jack no dac. A shame because it's the best feature of this phone.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] Zacharee1:
DAC means digital to analog converter.

Unless LG has an analog route to the USB port (which would be proprietary), the DAC isn't going to do anything without the 3.5mm jack.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] BAFLGV20:
Have you guy's herd of a this device called a z3x BOX. From http://www.fonefunshop.co.uk/news/january_2017.htm it says it has one that

supports the H918 (imei repair, flashing, qcn read/write, nvm read/write, sec zone read/write/reset in flash/adb mode, FRP reset)

- support H918TN (imei repair, flashing, qcn read/write, nvm read/write, sec zone read/write/reset in flash/adb mode, FRP reset) would that be of any help to root the h918 in arb01.

Mod edit: warez link (and virus laden site) link removed
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] steadfasterX:
I'm already in contact with the OP regarding that.

I have infinity and octoplus here ;)
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] BROKEN1981:
I don't understand what this is, but I know talking about imei repair is against XDA. Also this seems to be a (crack), also against XDA. I don't know if an admin would lock this thread over this or not, but best to stick to PM's over this sourt of thing.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] pyrorob:
No. Imei repair=/= Imei changing.

And a "box" is not a "crack"

He did link to a cracked app though, which is a no no
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] steadfasterX:
Well.. Crack. You can say every hack here on XDA which achieves root or unlock bootloaders is a crack and so against someone's rules.

The same goes for this thread. Leaked files like firehoses are nothing made for the public but they are needed to be able to unbrick or like here to find out more about how things work.

On top of all this: Reverse engineering of things like laf is against many laws in many countries so what are we talking about here?

Yes I know that GUIDES for imei changing (and btw NOT repairing) is against XDA rules but z3x and other boxes can be used to recover your device from a hard brick (they use own firehoses)

So if you want unofficial root you have to leave the safe path or live without.

And yes linking a crack like he had done is for sure a nono. [MENTION=5631635]BROKEN1981[/MENTION] : pls remove it from your quote too ;)
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] ph4nt0m117:
I potentially have an in on a job at sprint! So that'll make access to other V20's a bit easier. IDK what that'll give me in the end, but they'll be available at least.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] Josh McGrath:
Ah you must be going for the tech position but that's with Assurant not Sprint if so. But you are right, but hopefully they'll have the software but when I worked there it was all basic and they didn't even know what ODIN was and used the other crappy software (can't remember the name) so you can teach them some things too ?

Hope for some good news, keep us in the know
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] runningnak3d:
Well, after going through this firehose (btw [MENTION=6814590]askermk2000[/MENTION] it was the same as the one you sent me a link to 7 or so months ago), I have determined three things:

1 - it will work

2 - having your phone permanently in debug mode has a lot of consequences. In addition to losing the headphone jack, it looks like you lose auto focus.

3 - I will not be flashing with it. The downsides that it creates far outweigh the positive of having root. There may be other issues that I haven't even come across yet.

If someone else wants to, I will be glad to send you the hose, the XML files, and talk you through it.

So the search goes on.

-- Brian
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] BROKEN1981:
I'm sure this will sound like a dumb question to you, but how come you can't flash with the hose, install twrp, delete system or any partition needed, then flash a kdz via twrp to fix everything back to normal?
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] jimenezboy:
Just what I had in mind.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] askermk2000:
[MENTION=5631635]BROKEN1981[/MENTION] [MENTION=2257825]jimenezboy[/MENTION]

Seems like you two have been reading this thread, but all along understood practically nothing.

Suffice to say, that will not work.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] storm68:
Wow! It was just a thought. No need to badger like that.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] steadfasterX:
I own a G4 and here it is the same:

It will not work as it blows a (debug) fuse which will not boot any other aboot then a debug one.

I can say this for 100% sure as I have all here and played around a LOT regarding that issue.

-
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] storm68:
Thank you. For your good, respectful answer.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] BROKEN1981:
ahhhh see, it's a fuse. I did not know this. I just thought it was a plain old mode that could just be turned on and off.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] jimenezboy:
They are not the same I know, but the angle I was coming from was like how the root process for the Sprint V20 (in the firmwares with ARB 0) was done, how one could flash custom firmwares and LOS ROMs after rooting the phone. Rooting the V20 has brought out the noob in me, the kind that simplifies stuff beyond practicality :)
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] toastyp:
Not totally knowledgeable but i believe this process physically changes the hardware on the device by blowing that debug qfuse. Since the hardware is changed, no amount of software can fix or change it. Have to have components replaced in order to go back.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] runningnak3d:
The firehose blows the debug qfuse in the CPU -- no software can fix that. You couldn't even patch around it, since it physically disables parts of the CPU when being used in debug mode.

It also looks like the battery no longer charges. They are just super d**ks. They really don't want the phone to be usable as a PHONE when in debug mode.

-- Brian
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] BROKEN1981:
I can't be expected to understand all aspects of hacking Android.

If we were talking about computers for example, I've been a user since windows 95. How many people in my age range would even know what powershell is? Or that you can use it to delete some of the crap in W10 such as Xbox and MS app store?

No different then Android. That's why people like the OP shares the info on XDA. Not everyone is so technically inclined. So if I don't understand something, I ask. It may be a dumb question to the person who understands this stuff, but it's not a dumb question to the person who does not understand.

When it gets explained, I understand. That's how learning works. That's why I can't stand some of the senior members on XDA. They can be pricks.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] storm68:
A big thank you to all of you involved trying to make this happen. You gave it all that's for sure! I'll check back from time to time. Thanks again. :good::good::good:
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] Septfox:
I know this is going to be an unpopular post, but: it sounds like a security thing. They don't want someone getting ahold of a phone, whacking it with a firehose and compromising it, then getting back to its owner...all without being detected somehow.

A normal user would never notice the phone is rooted, but they'd certainly notice when half the phone no longer works properly/at all.

Not disagreeing with you, effectively destroying the hardware for enterprising enthusiasts isn't nice of them to do at all (nevermind that it wouldn't be necessary if they'd knock it off with all the other lockdown bull****), but I can see the reasoning behind it.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] runningnak3d:
What is sad is that it would be very easy to implement a way to give us full access, but also still have a locked down phone. The exact same way that PCs with Secure Boot are handled.

I should be able to:

1 - turn off Secure Boot entirely. There would be no chain of trust, and as long as it is a valid xbl, the CPU would just load it.

2 - Install my own RSA key so I can run firmware that I have signed. This way my phone is secure, but I have control.

3 - A hybrid mode where the firmware is validated with the stock key, but the boot kernel, and OS are verified with MY key.

4 - Be able to toggle debug mode so that I can see the output from the PBL (and even interact with it).

This will NEVER happen without people with real money putting major pressure on OEMs. They are selling throw away devices, and that has to stop. They saw what happened with the PC industry (how many of you have or know someone that has a PC / laptop that is 6-7 years old -- or older?), and they didn't want that to happen to them. Gotta be able to make $600-$800 every two years at a minimum!

*sigh*

-- Brian
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] BROKEN1981:
My next phone will be either Razer or Essential. I know the Razer has an SD card slot, not sure about the Essential phone. They are both dev friendly. I still think taking away the SD card slot is going backwards. Especially since SD cards are getting bigger and bigger.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] runningnak3d:
Taking away SD cards is all part of the "just throw it away" mentality. Why sell a phone with 16 or 32 gigs of storage that can be expanded, if you can sell a 64 / 128 model that can't. Oh yea, let's make it so that the battery is not removable and almost impossible for the average person to replace while we are at it. Pulling the headphone jack -- why not?!? Heck that will make people that don't have bluetooth headphones spend more money. At the very least, they will buy this USB C to 3.5mm adapter!

It is really really really getting irritating.

I wonder how hard it is to start a kickstarter. Sell a phone with the intention of it being HARDWARE -- be as open as it can possibly be. Heck, go all out and make it hardware upgradeable. SD845 comes out, just pop off the back, and pull out the CPU module, download the latest firmware, and viola, you have a faster phone without having to throw away everything else.

-- Brian
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] storm68:
With the way things are going as stated above, which is very true, devs on XDA will slowly die out. Give it time. The power of having complete control for marketing purposes is among us. Unfortunately.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] Snakecharmed:
I still run an i7-2600K overclocked to 4.6 GHz and I'm only beginning to consider that I might build a new system by 2020. Even before that becomes a necessity, I would still have gaming headroom by upgrading from my 980 Ti to a 1080 Ti. SSDs took care of the major bottleneck in the system. Even though Sandy Bridge didn't natively support USB 3.0, most motherboard manufacturers supported it with a third-party controller. I don't have DDR4, NVMe, USB 3.1, or PCI Express 3.0, but none of those are transcendent features, and on the whole, I haven't missed out on much in the last seven years.

On the mobile front, we're past the transition from ARM to ARM64, the 820 is no slouch, and the V20 is feature complete other than certified water resistance. I'm not seeing much reason for me personally to go out and upgrade to a new phone for the next several years. I should mention though that I rarely do anything taxing with my phone because I play mobile games on my Shield K1 for the larger screen. Although mobile SoCs still have more potential for performance improvement in successive generations, I think phones, like PCs, have reached a point where performance doesn't matter as much as the features now. The V20 is the phone that I always wanted from the day it came out, but honestly, I might have kept the G4 for another year if it wasn't built to self-destruct.

The cycle of getting a new phone every two years feels like a product of service plan contracts, general human clumsiness, and exploiting human psychology. Now we're at the point where OEMs are taking away features, so who cares if your nonremovable battery can't hold a decent charge a year later? They just fool you into thinking something is more trouble than it's worth to repair, or Google releases a new version of Android that actually doesn't improve your life at all, and that's how they get you. They're not going to make it easy for you to want to keep these devices, so why should you need root access for something you're going to toss out in a short period of time?
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] whojabacod:
Quick everyone flood king root w requests!
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] Zacharee1:
>_>
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] flips13:
Damn... Should we create campaign on Kickstarter for dev friendly device on Android?

And as I right understand, root story is reaching the end?
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] Septfox:
What's sadder is that it would take effort, but not scads of it, and it would set LG apart. They know they can't compete with Samscum regardless of how solid their hardware might be, so it's kind of puzzling that they don't try a bit harder to fill this niche.

A flagship-specced phone with OLED screen and a separate DAC that I can unlock and completely control? Sign me right the hell up. Half of XDA would rush out to buy one, and the word-of-mouth/social media-driven sales of "the phone that will never be forced obsolete" would be substantial. And it would fit perfectly with this mode that they're slipping into where they're not trying to sell a new phone each year anyway.

But no. Heck, the US998 still doesn't officially have bootloader unlocking (though it's present in the backend and a key can be received by temporarily editing the form on the site...apparently updating a couple webpages to make it official is hard), and the US998+ is completely without unlocking thus far. They can't even seem to do things in a consistent and timely manner for the limited dev support they offer, let alone anything further. The V30 has really shown that their marketing and development departments are complete cluster****s.

You shouldn't need pressure from someone with a lot of money, to convince a company to stop acting idiotic and take advantage of blindingly obvious gaps in the market.

I have a feeling modern Qualcomm wouldn't cooperate with such an effort. I can't really give a clear reason why I'm saying that, but more and more the last couple years, QC has been slowly oozing that "monopolistic scum of the mobile universe" impression. We really do need one of the other SoC manufacturers to get their act together.

Also, Google tried this a couple years back (Project ARA), and nothing came of it --- after no doubt pumping a couple million cashmonies into trying. Maybe it was because they found it unworkable, maybe it was internal politics, who knows...but it doesn't exactly fill me with hope for a comparatively underfunded Kickstarter effort.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] Snakecharmed:
Unfortunately, half of XDA is still a statistically insignificant userbase compared to the overall population of Android users. Add that to LG's obvious marketing incompetence, and an enthusiast phone would barely move the needle for their bottom line. The overwhelming majority of the population isn't going to be swayed without extremely heavy and intelligent marketing. As much as many tech enthusiasts would love for planned obsolescence to go away, most people are far too eager to show off the newest toys they bought on a regular basis.

To add, the goals of Project Ara were drastically different. The idea there was to make a cheap core phone that would help smartphone adoption in developing countries. The purpose was far more mainstream than "give us devices that we can mod because the average enthusiast consumer doesn't have access to customizing phones like desktop PCs." As for why the project failed, that just feels like it's par for the course with Google. Their skunkworks projects get pretty high public visibility because they're Google, but ultimately, those types of projects usually end up as abandonware.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] Septfox:
Should have worded it better. They would have a good portion of XDA and their word-of-mouth in addition to normal sales that they manage.

If they put out a phone with flagship specs, actually market it properly and deliver it less than half a year later (seriously LG, jesus christ did you screw up badly there), and in addition provide developer support...the numbers still aren't going to equal S# sales, but they would be much closer to parity than they are now.

If they do it right, there's absolutely no reason that they couldn't provide a phone that's both a strong flagship - fulfilling the "newest toy" status and thus appealing to the common user - and an enthusiast device.

They could even take it a step further and nudge some of the marketing of it towards it being a powerhouse platform for learning on. Consumers that otherwise wouldn't have, might take up developing and expand the enthusiast community. Who would they have to thank? Certainly not the majority of other manufacturers.

I'm not saying that it would double sales, not at all. But it would certainly help, and it would be something to help them stand out, rather than just being known as a Samsung copycat.

They could even spin the developer support to hurt the aforementioned company, if they wanted, by playing up the fact that locked bootloader = partial ownership, no sources = what do they have to hide, etc etc. Sow some seeds of doubt and suspicion, get people to stop and think for a minute.

If it was intended for developing countries, they probably couldn't get costs down enough to be viable, hmm. The licensing costs alone was probably a big killer...

*shrugs* Couldn't hurt to try a Kickstarter or somesuch, I suppose, if anyone wants to take up the project. Might even be able to grab some previous Project ARA members, so as to not have to figure out issues they already had.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] Snakecharmed:
Don't get me wrong; I agree with you in theory and I would be glad if a developer and enthusiast-friendly flagship phone would hit the market that checks more boxes than the Google Pixel line, but I just don't see a large audience for it regardless of circumstances, especially if LG's making it. Would it help improve LG's image? Sure, but they have a major uphill battle with negative brand equity thanks to the G4 and V10 bootloop issues and the G5 whatever-the-hell-that-was. LG is not a serious player in the smartphone market and they clearly aren't willing to commit the resources to become a serious player. They're not a T-Mobile trying to stick it to AT&T and Verizon. They're not even a Samsung before Samsung got fat, lazy, and hypocritical.

I said this before, but some geniuses at LG actually thought it made sense to not release the V20 in Europe, even after they were given a free pass to have the entire premium phablet market to themselves in late-2016 thanks to the Samsung Galaxy Molotov 7. I couldn't be happier with my V20, but it has very little to do with LG actively doing the right thing. They just happened to luck into the right combination of features for once that would please a power user. Then they mucked it up anyway with a string of decisions that signals to all of us reading this thread that we aren't wanted as customers.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] runningnak3d:
[MENTION=5521404]Septfox[/MENTION] [MENTION=4278683]Snakecharmed[/MENTION] Thanks for the insight from your posts. What is funny is that I started this post last night, and finished it up this morning before I had a chance to read your replies. I am still going to go through with it. I mean the worst that happens is that I fail. If you don't try, then you have already failed....

-- Brian
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] BAFLGV20:
Is the H91810s update arb01?
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] dudeawsome:
Yep it's ARB 1
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] bpc4209:
Is it safe to upgrade to h91810s if we are already on H91810r? Or should we wait?
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] dudeawsome:
I'd say wait but there is nothing different expect new security patch
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] Swordknight27:
I enjoyed those words of wisdom Brian. I'm stock with sprint so even with all of the negatives to this method, I will root my phone if it works. I can live without some of the basics, what I can't live without, is root. Keep us posted and keep up the awesome work!
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] BROKEN1981:
You won't even be able to charge your phone. So this root method is a very big no no.
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] Swordknight27:
Well technically I have a extended battery and wall charger...
[LG V20 Guides, News, & Discussion] BROKEN1981:
Ahh, well then PM the op.