yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] beta_boy:
Chainfire..... I'd like to give you 25 copies of CorePlayer Mobile 1.1.3 (Qtv Edition) to give out to whom you feel has been helpful and or wants to help you test our Qtv API findings. ping me at: betaboy AT corecodec DOT com if your interested.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] jlebeane:
I like to get things stirred up. Its really fun sometimes! You get the chance to see those who are passionate about this and those that are just bored.

There is another post about the tilts video driver. In that the person who created the post received a response from htc stating they know about the problem. It will be something they resolve in there next model. Which is exactly what will happen here. If they even resolve it at all. When it comes to advertising which is the foundation of this venture into a lawsuit. The fact htc says this is the most powerfull ppc out there. It gets real tricky. Because you have to prove that they were decietfull in there advertising. Then you have to prove that they new it before hand. All of which is hard to do. It would be great to see something come of this but i just dont see it. HTC has to many ways around this. And it does blow!!!
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] borealcool:
Well Mr. Optimistic, why bother posting here if you're sold on your convictions? You may be right concerning litigation dragging on endlessly, but there is plenty of precedent where respected Companies do act on the bad rep these kinds of initiatives bring with them. And what do you know, there is a case in point today as a matter of fact.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] omikr0n:
Really? Do you? Why is that? Isn't it sufficent that they refuse to fix it when they have already been alerted (by us)?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Imsaffor:
That seems almost too easy... >.>
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Farsquidge:
As if someone on here is already on the coporate mailing list do you think?? :rolleyes:
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Doug2873:
SPAM time...I'm posting this on engadget
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] tyeo098:
Spam?

Im going to spam BOMB them.

They'll be down in about 3 days.

MWAHAHHAHAHA!!!!
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] donatom3:
And now all our efforts go down the drain. Smart thinking let's appear like the bad guys in all the media now.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Chainfire:
Blah

Well after several hours trying to 'dumb down' the site, I am completely unhappy with the result (not uploaded, btw). I will retry tomorrow. I must also admit that this has caused me to not contact the lawyers I was going to contact, I hope to rectify all this tomorrow. I must also warn you all that I will be away friday afternoon 'til sunday afternoon, just FYI.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Chainfire:
What ^^^^ said and implied.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] ?Glitch:
Hey, give the court a chance, in the least don't screw it up for us that would seek justice... We all know that this is capitalism at its finest with the basic exploited/exploiter model, maybe patent problems with the consumer unrightfully picking up the tab. A system must be proven to fail before it is torn down, we don't need any 'Anonymous vs. Scientology' at this point. At least not yet anyway, if it fails then contact the botmasters...

?Glitch
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Doug2873:
i personally didnt spam, but i did post it on engadget
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Chainfire:
... and pretty much guarantee somebody else will do it.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Digitaltigre:
video playback

I don't want to stray off topic too far but I have a quick video question.

I am downloading the new coreplayer 1.1.3 to try it out but I have to say I don't see any issues when playing back video on my TyTNII with the current version of cp. I always re-encode my videos to 320x240 using xvid around 700kbps keeping the files between 500-700Mb for movies. Is this why they play smoothly?

My device does choke when I slide the screen during playback. I hate that. Sometimes I want to open it and set it down but like I said it chokes then continues to struggle to maintain sync for a while after it recovers.

*update*

I did a benchmark of an encode of Live Free or Die Hard before and after upgrading CorePlayer and my average speed increased from 150% to 250%! Also sliding the screen doesn't cause the same problem it did. Still skips a beat but it's a huge improvement.

Props betaboy and to the whole CoreCodec team!
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] at10ti0n:
Had anyone here tried to disassemble his tytn 2 and check for the ati imageon chip if it exist or no and maybe take some pictures of the inside?

Before you try we should see if the we can find pictures on the FCC site if theres any available.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] dperren:
Utterly ridiculous. Remember a few pages back where someone said they had the addresses, but didn't post them? This kind of idiocy is why: it's counter constructive, immature and is going to send us backwards if anything.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] eska007:
Did anyone read this?

On the Brew developer forum i read this:

someone asked if there were openGL ES drivers for the MSM 7200

""You need to contact a Qualcomm representative from Developer Relations or Marketing to hear about OpenGL ES support for MSM 7xxx platforms with Windows Mobile. This support is being worked on but has not been released to the general public. In other words, there is no OpenGL ES DLL (libgles_cm.dll) available to add OpenGL ES support for existing devices.""

Very strange. Maybe htc needs to pressure qualcomm.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] cr2:
Yes, it was disassembled and there is no ATI chip there.

They speak about "Imageon technology" inside MSM7x00, whatever that means.

Android uses MSM7200A CPU which DOES have some kind of video acceleration support.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] randyman:
Got reply from HTC

I emailed HTC from their site and got reply in 1-2 days. Comments? Yes I have a AT&T Tilt (8925 Kaiser). Completely stock. That will change but for now... here's the text of what the reply was. Thanks for the forum.:)

from HTC

"

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Thank you for your inquiry regarding video performance on AT&T Tilt.[/FONT]

Please note, “HTC is committed to delivering a portfolio of devices that offer a wide variety of communication, connectivity and entertainment functionality. HTC does not offer dedicated or optimized multimedia devices and can confirm that its Qualcomm MSM7xxx-based devices do not use ATI’s Imageon video acceleration hardware.

HTC believes the overall value of its devices based on their combination of functionality and connectivity exceeds their ability to play or render high-resolution video. These devices do still provide a rich multimedia experience comparable to that of most smartphones and enable a variety of audio and video file formats.

HTC values its customers and the overall online community of mobile device enthusiasts and fans. HTC plans to include video acceleration hardware in future video-centric devices that will enable high-resolution video support.”

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]I hope we have answered your question in detail. Feel free to contact us again if you have any further questions.

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]HTC Technical Support[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]http://www.america.htc.com[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]http://www.htcwiki.com[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]http://www.cingular.com/support/[/FONT]

-----

Editted...have been reading and obviously the above blanket statement is being spread around or shoveled or spun to other people. Sorry, thought it was new and didn't read before posting. My email to them did cover the broad range of poor camera, slow, pdf scrolling, etc. Thought I could help.[/FONT]
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] unksr00t:
Freaking bastards.. They dont see that there are 9xxx votes on engadget saying the drivers should be there...

They are playing with fire IMO.. which leaves me to suggest that there are no easy fixes else they wouldnt have gone the road of pissing of their loyal enthusiastic customer base....

Perhaps the ATI hardware isnt there for all devices.. (2 dif sets of chipsets.. taking into account Qualcomm struggles to meat HTC chipset demands lately...) and they dont want to open another can of worms..

I think its ebay time before it gets worse and we loose even more money...
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] picardgk:
I want to clarify. CorePlayer doesn't use the Qtv HW MPEG-4 decoder, but just the Qtv video overlay (with colorspace conversion and bilinear zooming). This also means the feature is usable for all video formats not just MPEG-4.

Also: HTC does ship the device with HW MPEG-4 supporting Windows Media Player. But it's very limited. Only .mp4 files are supported and some standard motion comensation MPEG-4 features are missing. I had some working files with Nero Recode (but no success with mp4box or ffmpeg). As far as I could see the performance was probably little worse as CorePlayer's software solution, although the battery consumptions is probably lower. Also the HW video overlay is not used with any other WMP codecs as far as I could tell (like WMV or h264)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] ceevee369:
the verdict has fallen

I did not found this HTC official reply posted.

http://www.htc.com/press_room/03-press-4-2008-0122.htm

(sorry if double post)

No hardware support now - but indeed in further "video centric" devices.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] rachidnl:
You could try this MP4 video file:

www.rachid.nl/video/f1.mp4

On my TyTN II, it plays almost flawlessly in Windows Media Player. It seems to be down to the file type, as Microsoft's own WMV video files are a true mess on TyTN II.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] manaaa:
http://www.htc.com/press_room/03-press-4-2007-0905.htm

to quote
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] mahjong:
Why Athena is not in the list? HTC X7500 Advantage Dopod U1000 and may other likes.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] jgermuga:
All, If this thing ever does go to court, it is highly likely our conduct will be examined just as closely as HTC. Please, I ask, keep things professional. Spamming HTC will most definitely be viewed as a hostile and unprofessional. If you do contact anyone on the email list, please keep in mind that depending on what you say and even how you say it could just as easily hurt our cause as help it.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] ceevee369:
believe me, the name@htc.com is not correct. they use different domains - extensions, though i will not share themas I am not in favor putting their server down by hundreds/thousands of spam mails.

We might do our best to write drivers, or go for the classaction, but we are NO net terrorists. (as much as I hate HTC for what they did)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Chainfire:
As the site is for a large part being redone anyway, votes on adding the Bluetooth and Speakerphone issues?

EDIT: Away 'til sunday, will read but not work :)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] dizzy33:
HTC, in a way, lies !

Check this on their website :

http://www.htc.com/press_room/03-press-070905.htm

At the bottom of the web page, you will see they talk about the video and 3D capabilities of the Qualcomm chip.

So let's be logical :

they say the Qualcomm is video / 3D capable ; they say the Kaiser has got a Qualcomm ; so logically the Kaiser has got video / 3D capabilities ...

I think this point is very important for a lawsuit action.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] richard.n:
"As the site is for a large part being redone anyway, votes on adding the Bluetooth and Speakerphone issues?"

One here! for both :) and thank you for your tenacity so far....
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] RemE:
I vote for Bluetooth because it's such a core function for a PHONE! It appears to be a fixable software issue since BT Stereo is OK and the low volume seems limited to BT Phone use.

The speakerphone performance seems more of a feedback for the next generation since it's a hardware design issue that I don't think they can fix, just my guess. I was in a meeting the other day and a guy had a blackberry that he used as a speakerphone in a room full of people and it worked flawlessly. Microphone sensitivity and speaker quality was excellent. I was impressed at what is possible from a phone and don't think my Kaiser would have passed that test.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] rfarnell:
PointUI performance improvements

After finding out about PointUI recently, I have been using it on my HTC TyTn II with much glee as it seems to have masked many of the graphics performance issues that we are all having.

The current version is v1.01b, but they have released v1.01b test 10 which I'm having excellent performance with (See here: http://forums.pointui.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=687 ). Simply download the cab file followed by copying the new files from the zip in the forum topic I posted.

Once it is fully loaded, I see very quick graphics transitions and redrawings. The only time it completely cripples in performance is when changing from Portrait to landscape and vice versa. It is really noticeable how poor the performance is when going back to something as simple as the telephone keypad.

I suggest you try it for yourselves since it is free. It may be worth asking the developers how they are utilising the graphics chip.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] kymbadrumz:
Pointui

Pointui is nice but doesn't solve the issue with the overall display performances of the kaiser.It's an additional layer over WM , contact,calendar,explorer are still with wm display.:o
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] ray6:
It is correct.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] 94wolfpack:
+1

It is TOTALLY useless in my car. I can't rx a call in hands free mode and the only way to make a call is to initiate it and then switch to the car's BT. So much for handsfree. That is actually the most pressing issue for me. I use Sprint TV very infrequently but when i did use it it was glitchy... I just thought my data connection was slow(never had the problem on my A900.)

I have the TOUCHy btw.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] donatom3:
With the Uconnect in my Dodge Charger I was having this problem with my Touch too. It turned out if I answered the phone from the handset the phone automatically switched from handsfree to the handset. If I answered the phone using the car's answer button it stayed in handsfree mode.

So far if i initiate the phone from my handset it's been fine. Once in a while on the first call it'll switch back to the handset instead of handsfree butthis only happens if I just turned the bluetooth radio on.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] ?Glitch:
You are 100% correct in identifying the case of false advertisment, they've made their bed, made their choice in refusing to correct the problem, now it is time for the judge to make them lay in their bed...

?Glitch
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] mrmega:
Yes , absolutely! If you are interested, I responded to Mike the moderators request for information regarding performance issues (including bluetooth and speakerphone issues). I detail my experience here in this thread if you are interested

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?p=1849566#post1849566

As a side note, I also want to echo what has been said by others.

When speaking in public or private to the press, HTC etc, it is absolutely VITAL that we all remain courteous, professional and articulate when explaining the issues or sharing our experiences.

Any kind of rude behavior will only hurt our cause.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] cctang:
I do not know if this is mentioned anywhere else, but did you any of you catch the response by HTC (posted on Engadget)?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Bronx31:
I was just getting ready to post that .. good find:)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] DarkDvr:
Funny thought...

What if... what if we ask HTC to provide us with whatever info they have on the issue so that we can develop nessesary drivers ourselves? Kinda like.. "you don't wanna do it - we will do it ourselves. Just give us the info you have and we'll get off your backs, we'll just make it ourselves."

They can always "leak" some info out. Hopefully they don't have some crazy confidentiality agreements with Qualcomm... I mean it's a chipset for christ's sake, not a UFO.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] donatom3:
and HTC's newest response

http://www.engadget.com/2008/01/25/...eo-driver-issue-will-improve-future/#comments
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] undac:
Ah so they finally admits that the hardware is there.

So the reasons for not implementing it (even though touting the features in their own press release are:

Licensing costs (from what i've gathered by talking to AMD and Qualcomm we're not exactly talking big bucks here).

Development costs (sure there will be some but let's be honest here, the basic driver code for the OS of their choise is already there, the rocket science has already taken place so again not a biggie)

IP issues (probably referring to the Broadcom/Qualcomm lawsuit, this could actually be the whole reason but if it was I don't think they would bother listing all the other reasons, seems a waste of time. It's possible that they can't hand out full support on the specific MSM implementation of the Imageon though which would probably make driver development exceeding difficult for HTC)

Personally I think there's ONE major reason.

HTC don't want to take a bite of their own future sales by making our devices run video and games TOO well.

Personally I was almost hoping that it was only due to IP issues stemming from the Broadcom lawsuit. It would make sense and HTC couldn't really be blamed for it. (Well they could of course be blamed for not providing the driver in the first place but it would give some sound reasoning as to why they refuse to release it now.)

That, and pretty much only that, could make me consider HTC again.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Radeon123:
Looks like they worded that clever again :), so the full 3d chipset maybe there and they may release drivers for but they just don't want to, or don't want to pay royalties for it :)

"HTC does plan to offer software upgrades that will increase feature functionality, over the air wireless speeds, and other enhancements for some of the phones being criticized, but we do not anticipate including any additional support for the video issues cited in customer complaints. It is important for customers to understand that bringing this functionality to market is not a trivial driver update and requires extensive software development and time.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] DarkDvr:
You know what that makes me think? That it wouldn't be THAT difficult to just make the damn drivers ourselves. Reverse engineer from working devices, steal from HTC, rip from future HTC PDAs that will have them... w/e.. + we have collected a pretty good sum of money for this. Kinda makes me hopeful, since hardware is there.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] undac:
Google: broadcom qualcomm

it's not "just" a chipset. :)

besides there certainly are confindentiality issues:

ATis driver contains licensed code (ie they couldn't release the source dode even if they wanted to).

thus Qualcomm can't just hand it over either

and also because of the broadcom lawsuit what Qualcomm can and can't do in regards of support and updates for these chipsets is very sketchy to say the least

and since HTC probably doesn't even have the driver nor code then that would mean that they would have to get it from qualcomm to begin with

ie: not as easy as it may seem :)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] DarkDvr:
Ok, well but there are devices like LG that have full support of the chipset. And, we have a confirmation that hardware is all there. If they said "we will not release drivers because we'd have to update the hardware on all PDAs" - now that would make me sad.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Bronx31:
But doesn't this news release contradict what they just released...:confused:

HTC is the first company to introduce cutting-edge devices based on Qualcomm's latest dual-core chipsets, the Mobile Station Modem™ (MSM™) MSM7500™ and MSM7200™ solutions. The flexibility of these chipsets has enabled HTC to develop a variety of devices with different form factors that meet the needs of a variety of customers. Having already launched the first Smartphones based on the MSM7500 chipset and now launching devices based on the MSM7200 chipset, by the end of 2007, HTC will have launched more than 10 devices based on these two dual-core solutions from the Company’s MSM7xxx-series platform. Some of the devices already available include the Mogul by HTC, HTC 6800, HTC 5800 and HTC TyTN II

"Qualcomm is pleased to continue our long relationship with HTC with these latest innovative devices utilizing our industry-leading mobile broadband and multimedia technologies," said Dr. Paul E. Jacobs, CEO of Qualcomm. "Our MSM7200 chipset, powering the latest UMTS Smartphones from HTC, will prove to be as compelling a combination as our previous successes with the popular MSM7500-based HTC 5800 and 6800 CDMA2000 Smartphones that are now shipping across North America."

"Since working first beginning to work with Qualcomm in 1998, the company has demonstrated a tremendous commitment to providing HTC with the most cutting-edge technology in the industry," said Peter Chou, CEO of HTC. "We are pleased to have a close strategic relationship with Qualcomm and look forward to bringing continued industry-changing devices to market.”

The MSM7xxx-series chipsets from Qualcomm are the industry's first to integrate two distinct processors – each dedicated to modem and multimedia functions – to provide support for third-party operating systems, including Windows Mobile. The MSM7500 for CDMA2000® 1xEV-DO Rev. A and MSM7200 for HSPA also feature rich multimedia capabilities – such as VGA video encode/decode, 8 megapixel camera, and 3D graphics – as well as advanced data functionality with unsurpassed levels of integration. The MSM7xxx-series of Qualcomm chipsets are designed to expand the reach of compelling, connected Smartphone devices into mainstream consumer markets.

Well I guess not since it doesn't specifically state that they was including it with these phones. Just the hardware is there,, huh??

# # #
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] DarkDvr:
aaah! big letters!

Don't really see the contradiction. Chipset can do many things, but HTC is using it only for some of them... so what? I mean I'm no lawyer, but that seems like a weak case. We gotta have better indication of false advertising.