yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Kurni:
Draiko:

At the end of the day; it's just business... investors looking for ROI blah blah blah... that's why I'm moving away from programming because I still love programming; but it's no longer fun as investors continuously push me to cut corners.

I'm just learning to swallow the jerky video and holding back my next purchase. **** happens :lol:
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Draiko:
lol, I'm about to get into programming... this is just perfect!
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] unwired4:
I am amazed that people are only just realising that HTC's hands are tied by the ongoing patent disputes between the chip manufacturers. If you spend a few minutes over at The Register, you will see reports of the disputes between all of the players for many months.

Maybe HTC should be applauded for not blaming other people for the problem.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] fredisco:
Here is where Microsoft should step in and help out. It should really also be in Microsoft's interest, or Apple will come in and walk all over the WinMobile phones.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] jym04:
Hmm because it's cheaper?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] mav42:
hmmm What i believe could have happened was HTC was already neg with Qualcomm before a order was made and as such already made a deal but as they were getting pumped out the land of law suits shut qualcomm down and left HTC with hobbled devices.....another question that is raised is this a world wide order????? as i dont think the US courts have the power to do this.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] greenbrd:
Wow. What flavor Kool-Aid does HTC serve at your cult meetings?

Let's see, HTC either a) committed fraud by deliberately releasing a crippled device, or b) didn't do their due diligence before entering into an agreement with Qualcomm and wound up getting conned bigtime.

Either way, the consumer gets screwed. Those of us who aren't living in denial, at least.

But let's all line up to applaud them for taking the high road. Yup. They're doing a FANTASTIC job.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] tsadek:
roflmao. :D
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] drownage:
Umm but isnt Google Android using same chipset WITH working drivers?... even SONY XPERIA will be using same chipset... I think the problem is with HTC... not with Qualcomm... I think the responses HTC has given just kinda tells us... that this was HTC's fault... and they are not willing to fix it the correct way...
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] sroussey:
Apple writes drivers for their stuff....
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] unwired4:
Put your money where your mouth is. Sue HTC. Good luck.

Or open your mind and realise that HTC aren't a bunch of crooks out to shaft Winmo device owners - as even a complete idiot could realise that a company trying to build its brand loyalty would not last long if it did.

Don't you think HTC would release drivers if they could?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] greenbrd:
A lawsuit will never happen. I already know that. I will, however, put my money where my mouth is and never again buy another HTC product. I will also dissuade everybody I know from buying an HTC device, and will write truthfully negative reviews of the Kaiser everywhere I can to help prevent others from buying one. When the next HTC device comes out, I will write truthful warnings everywhere I can about HTC's poor customer service and tell people to think twice about giving their money to a company that that will take it an run.

When HTC provides a fix, or recalls all existing Kaisers, or offers current Kaiser owners a hefty credit toward the purchase of the next "new and improved" HTC device, then I'll cut them some slack. But as long as their official position is, "If you don't like what you've already bought, then buy our next product," then what exactly are they doing to build brand loyalty?

Why weren't the drivers part of the original package? Did they rush the Kaisers to market and figure they'd provide a patch at a later date? Or did they hope nobody would notice? Or did they know that the drivers would never be available but they continued to use Qualcomm chips anyway? Or did they get shafted by Qualcomm?

It doesn't matter one bit whether it was deceit or ignorance on HTC's part. The fact is that a device that bears the HTC name is flawed, and the responsibility rests 100% on HTC's shoulders to make it right. Until they do, those of us who paid good money for that device are not getting what was promised.

unwired4 - You're such a hypocrite, it's disgusting. I sure hope you're an HTC employee. Otherwise, there's no excuse for your apologist behavior. You continue to insist that the Kaiser is a great product, yet you flash cooked ROMs and install other XDA-provided software fixes to improve the performance of your device. But when the rest of us want a fix for the crappy graphics performance, you tell us that we're being unreasonable. Yet we all know that if some sort of fix is ever made available, you'll be one of the first to install it.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] unwired4:
In order to avoid being accused of trying to hijack this thread, I will desist from pointing out the countless errors in your post, other than to confirm that I am not an HTC employee nor am I associated with them in any way.

Have a nice Sunday evening.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] bronx:
sorry for the offtop, but I've seen THE BEAST in it's true nature...

unwired4 just reached his 666 post... damn. I'm scared :P

and about this whole situation in this thread... I think it's going to be locked soon because of all those narrow minded people, who just cannot realise, that htc cannot be blamed. again - they didn't intend to create a 3d accelerated device and their 2d is decent, so stop moaning. they are even going to tweak it bit more for You this month, so stop moaning again. try to dig for locked (maybe even trashed) "happy user thread" and read through.

then think.

damn. I am not htc employee (actually I am a building contractor (joiner) in UK) so f.o. with Your stupid comments.

PLEASE KEEP THIS THREAD CLEAN!

use it for vital info.

thank You

br

bro
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] 4Site:
What a load of trollop. How can they not be blamed?

I recently had to go back to using my Tytn I for a week and this made me realise performance wise just how crap the Tytn II is.

Do not distort the truth... the issue at hand is not accelerated 3D graphics, that is a myth HTC has brought about to make gullible individuals like you believe nothing is wrong with your device. The issue at hand is performance and how our devices have been purposely crippled so as HTC can bring to the market a hardware wise similar device that they will tout as an upgrade.

There will be no need for this thread to be locked IF individuals like yourself and your esteemed colleague unwired, who publicly state that they are happy with their device, and by this admission have no real reason to be in this thread stop coming in here and posting hidden agenda fuelled posts that do nothing but cause tension.

[/rant]
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] greenbrd:
In that case, it is mind-blowing that you have the unmitigated gall to say that a company that has more loyalty to its vendors than it does to its customers should be "applauded."
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] belon_cfy:
I don't really need the 3D accelerator , but at least can HTC improve kaiser 2D performance ? Seem kaiser 2D performance much slower.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] regisiskingabby:
:) :) :) Well Said!! Thanks for taking the words out of my own mouth.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Revin:
whoa! I didn't read this discussion for a long time and I am very surprised - I see, that some of the members are actually satisfied with HTC Kaiser??? So it is okay if new, expensive device is slower than old, cheaper one? Maybe HTC will sell some limited edition of Kaiser for you, which will be ultra slow??? :confused:

If you check HTC pages, Kaiser is not presented like multimedia device, that is true (I don't know how is it presented by AT&T and others providers). But check Cruise, which is the same device, just without the keyboard:

"Highlights

Full multimedia experience with the large 2.8-inch touch screen"

I still think, that even with Kasier did HTC wrong, but with Cruise it is obvious. I bought HTC Kaiser, not Quallcomm Kaiser, so it is clear that it is HTC fault. I don't care if they have problems with suppliers and partners, that is their problem, not mine. Just check arrogant official statement which HTC gave us! They maybe put it in nice words, but it still sucks bigtime (we don't care, don't do anything for our customers, but we can buy next very expensive device from HTC - very nice from them).
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] gogol:
People, move on ... Dont you get tired?

HTC will not give you any fix (or maybe, but at that time there will be a lot more new products).

It is not worth the time and energy to put up or debate this issue, because they just dont care.

For sure, this will put some dents in their (future) sales, but apparently they are ok with it.

I dont say that I am satisfied with my Kaiser video/graphic performance, but it is OK ... at least at this moment.

When the time is come, it will be replaced by a new product :) ... as always, I am a gadget lover, I changed my PDA/phone every now and then.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] unwired4:
Wrong again but its pointless to argue with you as you are obviously extremely upset that HTC managed to rip someone as clever as you off.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] greenbrd:
Which part is wrong? The part where you say:

Am I misquoting your direct quote???

Face it - HTC ripped off all of us. But I guess the unclever people still don't realize it. Must be nice.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] saprydion:
I have been following this thread for a while now, and I have a few questions.

Are any of the "slow Kaisers" slow after hard reset? If yes, which version is it? By version, I mean (take out the battery and check out the back):

KAIS100 - without camera

KAIS110 - 3.0MP back camera with autofocus

KAIS120 - 3.0MP back camera with autofocus and front VGA videocall camera

KAIS130 - same as above but with a customized front panel sold by T-Mobile as the Vario III

(above info from Wiki)

Mine is a KAIS130 but it is HTC branded, not T-Mobile.

I am curious because I am wondering if these problems are more inclined to occur to a specific version of the Kaiser.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] rfarnell:
Mine is the KAIS130 which is HTC branded on the front with a orange logo on the back. It was sold as the TyTyn II.

Mine is definitely affected by the problems.

Rob
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] LiaoLiao:
I agree with the above post. I will buy iphone if it has 3G, GPS, Third party App, and Handwriting Recognition. Heck, I don't even need the microsd slot and removable battery. I am a simple man and these simple needs can satisfy me.

I am a HTC Touch Cruise Owner. I thought this device can counter iphone (well not exactly, but at least close to iphone). However, I am very VERY disappointed, upset, and frustrated in the video driver issue. Don't get me wrong, I still like TC, but when it comes to multimedia, I am irritated. I tried to take some pictures and watch some wmv on the device. I only found out the camera is useless if you are taking pictures of moving objects. The video has obvious LAG when I play it. (It doesn't happen on iphone)

I am especially pissed about the following official statement:

"HTC will utilize hardware video acceleration like the ATI Imageon in many upcoming products. Our users have made it clear that they expect our products to offer an improved visual experience, and we have included this feedback into planning and development of future products"

HTC "WILL" utilize hardware video acceleration... in many "UPCOMING" products. Does that mean I am only a GUINEA PIG? It sounds like..."we can have the driver now... but for us to make more money, you have to buy our next product to have the driver."

What I am trying to say is... if HTC does not solve this issue (and from the looks of it, they will not solve it), I will not buy any more phone with their brand on it and will not recommend their brand to my friends. I know it's not much, but I just want to show my feeling about their way of exercising business...
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] bronx:
for all You haters: I have been using Vario II for over one year and tytn II is really step forward. saying that it's slower is a huge pile of crap. speed of it is very comparable + gps + tilt + stock sdhc + 3mp camera with autofocus (****ty in lo ight, great otherwise...).

humm... sounds like an upgrade to me.

sorry for all of You living on hype and misunderstanding.

to make it simple: I would be really p..... off to find out, that se xperia is w/o drivers after what I've read and seen.

tytn II is more or less as powerfull as advertised by htc.

get over it.

any fix/patch/driver/tweak/miracle is an extra. I WOULD LOVE TO HAVE IT, but I just simply cannot moan at this thing at the moment. show me the better option with all of those goodies above + qwerty + many more we all know.

br anyway

bro
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] greenbrd:
Now THERE'S a ringing endorsement from a happy owner.

I wonder if HTC can use that theme as their new marketing slogan: "Our products almost do what we say they'll do. Buy several!"
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Suleeto:
Bronx, that's absurd. By your reckoning, we should all be running with XP pre SP1... not to mention the countless updates/hotfixes sent over the past few years. I don't wig out at companies that make mistakes so long as they fix them at some point, and not by building a new product but by issuing patches. Software is fixable always. Revisions and patches are considered an industry expectation. Why should these HTC drivers be any different?

Nobody is wigging out. It's just that finding out that these things are severely handicapped unnecessessarily tends to piss people off, especially when paired with the fact that this judgement error spans a wide assortment of phone models, including the most current ones.

You can't just throw your hands up and say, "oh well, that's what ya got.". That's how the poor quality of products produced around the world has gotten to be as bad as it is.

I would define your opinion (and that of those similar to yours) in one word:

apathy.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Draiko:
Hey, is anyone else pissed off that the new HTC.com Touch site says this...

"Optimized for entertainment, the HTC Touch lets you enjoy your favorite music and movie clips through the integrated media suite. You also have the versatility to upload, store and share your media files with microSD™ removable memory."

While the official HTC statement for all devices with the MSM7x00 chipset is that they were not Optimized?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] bronx:
hm...

"It's just that finding out that these things are severely handicapped"

can You tell me why do You think it is severely handicapped?

can anyone point me in the right direction to device, which can handle windows mobile 6 much better than kaiser?

if there is such a device, why are You here still with us on kaiser forums??

all I'm trying to say is, that in my humble opinion this device is not severely handicapped, although I'd like to have extra speed. I am not praising htc, but I believe that my vario III in it's current state is better than any other device like nokia e90 or any other pda. I am not comparing it to iphone or any other phone like se k800i or whatever, as it's main purpose is and target buyer is completely different to those.

simple version of above text for those with tight braces over their brains:

I just can't wait to get more speed from upcoming fix!! :D sorry, that htc is not willing to pay from their own pocket for 3d acc. sorry, that they couldn't squeeze in better camera (with carl zeiss optics preferably)... oh well... maybe I'm not moaning as I got my vario III for free... :/

P.S. "Bronx, that's absurd. By your reckoning, we should all be running with XP pre SP1... not to mention the countless updates/hotfixes sent over the past few years." You are talking rubbish. You are giving us a system as an example... blame microsoft then. ALL WE ARE TALKING ABOUT IN HERE IS LACK OF PROPER DRIVERS FOR HARDWARE...
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Suleeto:
Bronx, you seem to have a lot of pent up anger dude lol... look, save the insults for anon forums. You get more mileage from civil responses.

I would define something as "handicapped" if it was capable of doing something but was not given full range of its abilities. The hardware can support far better speeds than HTC has allowed. It would be like in a car, putting in a gas pedal setup that only opens the throttle body half way; the engine could perform more, but your accelleration is limited.

I bought a Tilt last weekend, even understanding these issues, because yes, it's one of the best PocketPC phones on the market. That doesn't change the fact that HTC has not taken advantage of something that would resolve media issues.

Again, industry standard in all software-based technology is not to make the consumer pay for patches/fixes. Since HTC writes the software (the drivers), they are the ones ethically obligated to write them to work with the features that are in the hardware. You shouldn't have to buy one model only to discover it was treated like a "beta" for a new model one year later. That's how Microsoft did business with Windows 95 (ver. A, B) and 98 (A, SE), and Millenium Edition. That entire run was all about "buy this now, and when we fix the glitches, just buy the new one a year or two later". All it did for them was increase piracy, so by the time of XP they changed their approach, and Service Packs and hotfixes were released.

But you can't do that when the issue is with drivers tied to hardware, like these phones.

Oh and BTW, if you understood windows products (ALL of them), you would know the difference between MS drivers and vendor drivers. Microsoft makes the generic OS, and it's the responsibility of the vendors to make the drivers specific to the hardware (in this case, again HTC who makes the phone). If you think Microsoft makes drivers for every kind of device ever tied to a Windows machine, you're sorely mistaken.

It sounds to me like you're one of those trolls who wants to start a war, without even knowing facts about the subject. Please go learn more about Microsoft development, software development in general, and come back with more knowledge and a more civil tone before you try to "school" us.

Honestly, I'm not writing this for you, but for others who are actually interested in discussing this topic. I don't really expect you to be civil, but perhaps you'll surprise me ;)

And anyways, I like my Tilt a lot. I think it's one of the best PocketPC phones on the market. I am still disappointed that HTC cut it off at the hardware knees, and have yet to give us what we need to take full advantage of things. It's not like we can design the drivers ourselves. Or should have to.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Digitaltigre:
I like my TyTNII also. I have liked it ever since I got it. My problem is that I imported it early ($700) and only found out later that the graphics core is disabled. That’s the problem I have. I feel duped. I actually thought it would have the accelerated graphics that the chip had. If I had known they were going to cripple the hardware and implement software rendering only, I would have waited and got it in the Tilt flavor for next to nothing from AT&T. Anybody who knows this situation and still gets this device I envy you. You are making an informed decision having knowledge I didn't have when I made my purchase. I like my device, but I’m unhappy with both HTCs initial bait n switch and their current stance on the matter and I feel I was swindled out of my hard earned money.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] fusi:
i also love my kaiser BUT i feel really ripped off i was aiming to play loads of emulated games and watch stuff on it but i cant and i am really gutted :/ shame on htc for misadvertising - if they hadnt of made reference to its non-existant capabilities i wouldnt of bought one :/

this class action needs to happen - they shouldnt be allowed to get away with this, its underhanded and intentionally decietful.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] bronx:
well well well... finally a wise response from the other side. see? You can say that You are somehow unhappy without spitting venom around.

I really feel sorry for You man. well, at least You seem to understand the situation now. the only problem is that this bait was set by qualcomm, which never stated, that this whole 3D accel. may be just an option. htc have chosen cheaper solution. end of story.

as You can see, it is one big misunderstanding and the reason why I am defending htc in here is that they promised some sort of tweak to make winmo run at least bit more better. if it's going to happen, I will seriously consider upgrading with their product in the future.

...but... I will read and read and read before I'll shell out any money.

ok guys. back to the topic. what is the current status of this case at the moment? is anyone dealing with it? just beeing curious, as I've never heard before about similiar action.

it's quite clear after reading my posts that I am quite pessimistic/realistic bout this, but I wish You all who are pushing it forward all the best and good luck.

peace and much kaiser love :D

bro
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] unwired4:
There are loads of examples of manufacturers selling kit which isnt running at full capacity/speed. Car manufacturers regularly use the same engine for different variants but down tune some or simply don't use all the output.

Similarly some new WM devices are being launched with a QVGA screen even though the actual screen can offer VGA...