yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] HeartOfDarkness:
Excellent comparision, couldn't have put it better. :-)

And yet, I think some extremely useful (at least for me) phone-related functionnalities are very usually overlooked with PocketPC PDA-Phones in such polls.

What about seamless synchronisation with Outlook content ? This functionnality alone saved my *ss more than once when I had trouble with my phone. Instant search for directory numbers ? Etc. etc.

I once had a Nokia N92, an excellent multimedia device. Well, I returned it as soon as I saw that the "conduit" between the phone and Outlook mixed numbers up, and didn't synchronise properly (most of my contacts are business contacts, and have more than one phone number. The Nokia conduit handles this extremely poorly, mixing numbers for a same contact when they are synchronised on the phone until it is almost impossible to find a contact through his / her phone number).

True. But I always have trouble imagining how ANYONE would get an almost one-pounded, 5-inch screened *phone*. Who needs a 5-inch screens only for phoning ? To see 1-inch wide numbers ?? :-S
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] eaglesteve:
HeartOfDarkness,

You pointed out an excellent point, which did not occur to me until now. Your experience was exactly what my brother-in-law had experienced a couple of years ago. He had real tough time synchronising his contact. The last I heard, he manually maintains the two set of contact and just do his best to update both locations separately. I think that's crazy, but we do tend to take this for granted.
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] leoni1980:
Regardless of its size, for most people it will be purchased to serve as a phone and internet device. It simply doesn't do this very well out of the box which is pretty unforgivable. In my mind HTC should have given matching BT earbuds or a style-I-type headset with it rather than the silly magnetic keyboard.

I don't wish to slate the device unneccesarily - I did after all have two in all and got my first within weeks of release, but I dislike unfounded comments about it. Just because you own the device doesn't mean you cannot find bits of it annoying.

There are many other HTC phones which are more than capable of the features mentioned within this thread: the only draw of the Athena - and for me - is the screen.

To compare with the outlook capabilities of a non-outlook device is unfair; comparing it with other phones IS fair. It was sold to me as a phone by T-Mobile and it has had to go through the same GSM licensing as any other phone. Also to quote 'Athena gives very good 3.5G reception, far better than any other phones I've used', obviously this is your opinion and you are entitled to it, but I've owned a Samsung z560, Nokia N95 and Sony K850 - all HSDPA devices and ALL better than The Athena in terms of signal strength and reliability, although I will admit that in my experience all windows mobile phones are a bit inferior in this respect.

My perception of the device steadily worsened as the months grew on and the novelty of the screen wore off.

The design is also underdeveloped: why didn't they develop Vuoflo to change the orientation of the device when you turn it round? Why not think a bit more about the placement of the mic? Surely more people would wish to hold the device to their head (however silly it looks) than make speakerphone calls - I don't know anyone who makes speakerphone calls.

Why integrate a VGA screen if you can't be bothered to develop software to enable VGA?

For a lot of the features I came to love about the device I had to rely on developers here: without them we'd have a pretty crappy device would we not?
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] Confucious:
Out of the box it was a great device for me. The developers on here have made it a fantastic device - that's the joy of WM - it can be customoised and people can add the bits they want.

Just my 2d's worth.
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] eaglesteve:
Athena is not only distributed by Telcos. Mine was from a PDA supplier, who does not sell phone plan. Where you bought the device has no bearing on whether or not it is primarily a phone.

The earliest Dopod U1000 was sold with a bluetooth headset packaged in. Mine was only with a wired headset, so I guess HTC does expect us to use them in making calls.

Not all HTC phone has HSDPA capabilities, so I guess newuser888 was justified in listing Athena as among the best in reception. Here in Australia, only phone with HSDPA capability can receive signals almost nation wide. The majority of the other traditional phones are either GSM only or CDMA only, and their coverage is very limited. If I bring my Nokia or Samsung phone and go outside the major cities, I would not get signal due to the inadequate gsm or CDMA coverage. However, if I use my Athena, I get coverage even in rural areas, because of its HSDPA capability.

You cited the big screen as the key attraction. I agree. However, it automatically means bigger size to go with the screen. We can't be liking the big screen and hating the big size. It's like wanting the cake and also to eat it too(is this a correct english expression?). This screen size is not a novelty. It is currently the most unique advantage Athena has over the other HTC PDA phone. I say this because Tobias' realvga can only be used property on Athena. On the lesser screen, many is us won't be able to use even the 128dpi, let alone the 96dpi resolution.

I agree that more could be done on the device at the factory. I like to see the stock ROM incorporated realvga, wktask, tengo, mosquito ringtones, wm5torage, throw on LG style-I, and a good belt pouch.

But I think it is unfair to say it is crapy out of the box.
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] eaglesteve:
I guess I have to agree with you on this point although I mentioned LG style-I should be thrown in by HTC. I've up to now still been using the speaker phone, and with wired head set when making VOIP calls. Am still undivided which way to go. LG style - I is one possibility, blue voice wrist watch is another.

You are right, it's too subjective, so HTC should leave the decisionto us user.
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] spacecat:
nice to see this thread is warming up nicely :) and as usual down the normal lines :)

however as thread starter the main point i wanted to ask was the ATHENAS ability to

MAKE and RECIEVE Calls and how CONVENIENT or INCONVENIENT people find that.

The Pros and Cons of this device are well known, so the focus was HOW it is when YOU are using the Phone functions do u find it easy or not, do u feel self conscious or not using such a large device to talk into, do u mind or not mind not having to use another device i.e BT headset/mini phone etc to make calls
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] mahjong:
HTX X7500 Advantage... the way I use it...

Great for reading during my trips. PDFs mainly

Great for taking notes. Handwriting, typing and voice notes.

Great to keep track of my appointments.

Great to read my corporate mail using BB Connect.

Great for watching films when I'm tired of reading in a trip.

Great for listening music... I store tons of CDs in my microdrive.

Great as my main phone now that I own the Style-i (only 18 bucks at eBay!!)

Great GPS when I'm driving using my TT 6.

Great GPS when driving offroad using OziExplorerCE

Great when running presentations using the 4in1 cable and PocketPowerPoint

Great using it as USB storage using wm5torage

Great reading newspapers and some web pages... the speed is great (HSDPA)

Great external HDSPA modem if you use it with Windows PC

Great in videoconferencing... in Europe off course. This is very helpful for me to show my colegues some aspects of my job. Whenever I find a problem in a building I run a videoconferencing and shows it to my colegue.

Great camera... 3 Megas is OK. And the included program to generate landscape pictures is very useful for me.

Great screen to work with AutoCAD files... I can show people what we are doing in the field.

Gaming? I don't know I'm not using it to play games.

Excel and Word? OK... just to create simple files.

Price? Hmmm... I'm trying to forget how much I'd pay for it.

Other software I use? Webster dictionaries.

Before X7500 I traveled with my phone, camera, USB key, HDSPA modem and laptop... now I travel only with my X7500.

Is the greatest phone? May be not? Is the greatest device I ever got? Sure it is.

Best Regards,

mahjong
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] leoni1980:
Maybe us Brits just don't like big phones.

Or it's just me

"Contacts management is an EXTREMELY important phone-related functionnality for ANY phones IMO":

does EVERYONE use Outlook? Microsoft invented it so it's expected on a pocket pc, but not everyone uses it.

If you're going to knock Nokia (no pun intended) because an outside software company created outlook syncing software that isn't up to much I think that's a bit unfair in this thread at least. Outlook isn't the be all and end all for me. I have rarely used outlook, but since this is also unrelated to the thread I don't wish to dwell on it!

It's fair to compare their abilities as phones in this thread as they are both undoubtedly phones. Functionality need not come at a cost of usability as many here seem to believe: in other words, because there are lots of 'bits' on the Athena does this excuse HTC for making the call handling qualities of the phone below par? WHY did they leave out an embedded earpiece? Is it better to have calls on loudspeaker? I think a choice would have been nice, or perhaps we'd all prefer a silly magnetic keyboard which wipes your hard disks instead.

That's much more handy isn't it.

I didn't get any joy from 'tweaking' my device since most of the time I was doing it for functionality rather then pleasure, then having to do it all over again when a new ROM came out!

In respect to before "X7500 I traveled with my phone, camera, USB key, HDSPA modem and laptop"

Well there are a number of small phones with better HSDPA capabilities, just as much memory and infinitely better cameras.

If you can make an Athena a good laptop replacement for a train ride then you're a better man than I. Sure you can edit word/excel documents and browse the web to an acceptable degree but it's not a laptop replacement, I'm sure even Eaglesteve will agree with that.

I took my Athena on the train loads of times and it wasn't a great experience. I travel in company so the screen is too small to share, even if the device could handle videos - which it struggles with. Browsing and document editing is spoilt by the keyboard limitations, particularly on a shaky surface.

I still think that the point I made holds true. ALL the arguments mentioned herein in favour of the Athena apply to ANY new HTC device - aside from the screen, which I agree is good but doesn't really have any bearings on the phone quality and usability which is the topic in hand.

I think the problem here is that tolerence is embedded into the psychology of most long-term Windows Mobile users. If you were to give an Athena to a typical consumer for a week they would hate it. They would see that the device performs below par as a handset; they wouldn't accept wired earpieces or bluetooth devices as a viable solution. Maybe if you spent 800 dollars on the device you unwittingly feel OBLIGED to get over these failings.

Let's get back to basics. No more Nokia software versus Windows software: this argument belongs in a different thread; find it and add to it but leave this thread for its intended purpose. SPECIFICALLY is the Athena any good as a phone?
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] eaglesteve:
This is also the most stupid, deceitful, and biased poll questions I have ever encountered.

Actually, I think this thread started out of the debates between Spacecat and me, with Leoni to a lesser extent. Spacecat repeatedly criticised me as a person as the only person not saying Athena is a crap phone, which I had disagreed like most of you. So I guess he wants something to justify his behaviour.

I voted ok. When I read the poll question, I took that question s as being the same distribution as excellent, above average, below average, and fail. I selected ok.

Now, on the other thread , spacecat says that the survey result supports his claim that Athena is a crap phone! He now says that a vote of means undecided and therefore means half of them supports his case!

How cunning can a question be! I certainly do not think Athena is crap as a phone half the time!
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] spacecat:
I thought You didn't like getting all emotional?

FFS dude its a phone/PDA we are talking about not the war in Iraq!

I started the poll because the reason i got rid of my Athena was because eventually i found it TOO annoying as a phone and also had lots of unresolved faults.

I particularly found the speaking part a chore and wondered if anyone else felt the same.

You know YOU dont have to answer every thread and even if everyone in the world thought the ATHENA WAS CRAP as long as YOU enjoy it , IT WOULD NOT MATTER so why are you so bent out of shape?

You seem a tad defensive maybe you should chill a bit
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] apd:
Why don't you both just calm down....

And by the way - why did you bother starting a poll you don't own anymore! (this is a rhetorical question!)
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] leoni1980:
What does that mean?
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] spacecat:
this is an unrhetorical answer

Cos I Felt like it
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] leoni1980:
Hey,

I experienced poor quality, echoey calls on the Athena when using it against my head. I had regular complaints about it and eventually It was what pushed me to get rid. I'm not vehemently against the Athena by any means and I had two of the devices with which I tried different radios and different ROMs, but they both had the same call problem. It is present also on my Hermes when using the speakerphone instead of the embedded mic. Unfortunately I don't like using BT headsets next to my head all day as it give me a headache, aside from which it's just another battery to keep charged.

"I find, using TCPMP and encoding consistent with the screen-size, that it handles video quite nicely. And not many (and by that I mean none) multimedia players allow me to view a movie with my BT headphones on, without any wire, and to have it pause playback instantly when a call reaches me"

My N95 does all of the above, without re-encoding (via coreplayer) including the playback pause thing. Maybe that's just on my device....oh and

"Yeah well, it is your choice to have a bagful of cameras, HSDPA phones, GPS devices, mp3 players, etc. etc. Which, by the way, is I think on the whole much bulkier and, well, MUCH more expensive than an Athena." doesn't my phone have ALL of those features?

I can see why someone like Eaglesteve would use the Athena and find it the best device for him based on everything he's said about his needs. I'm seriously not narrow minded. My N95 is flawed and I'm always on the lookout for new devices, but by the way you put across your needs you would have been just as well getting a Kaiser or an N95 (bluetooth GPS music player camera) and a memory card coupled with a subnotebook or UMPC (with a bluetooth dun for HSDPA). I only say this because you say you carry a mini keyboard and mouse with you. They both add to the bulk and necessitate a bag and they both need batteries.

I don't mean to rattle your cage, I am perfectly willing to help you if you have any questions as I used the Athena a lot and am pretty experienced with it. I appreciate that the device is new to you and 'your baby' as it were, so I sincerely hope you carry on enjoying it ;)
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] newuser888:
Eaglesteve,

There is no need for you to respond to this. I've been following the thread where you guys were debating, and based on that, I could see that although you had tried to be reasonable, your opponent is not prepared to be reasonable and fair, as he likes to twist things to fit it into his narrow mind set and persepective. Yes, like you, I took the second question as having the same meaning as above averaqe at first glance, until our friend pointed to the second part of the second question. The question is a trick question in my opinion. With a normal bell shape distribution, our friend would be likely to claim that 75% of those polled think the phone is a complete crap.
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] leoni1980:
"This is also the most stupid, deceitful, and biased poll questions I have ever encountered."

I'm not so sure: ask Zimbabweians or - dare I say - Americans if their Govenmental Leadership polls were fair.

Kidding.

Anyway despite the vehemency, hair pulling and cat-fighting I'm quite enjoying this poll. I'm sure there are no hard feelings. I still follow windows mobile and I still have a Hermes.

Perhaps I shouldn't have my own opinion though as I no longer own an Athena therefore cannot possibly judge its usability fairly (!).
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] newuser888:
I think you meant to say spacecat-fighting??:D

Just kidding. This thread is interesting.
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] eaglesteve:
Leoni,

I suppose you would need Hermes if you need any of the ce based applications, which are going to take a while to replace with Linux based equivalents.

Do I understand correctly that you now uses four devices (eee PC + Nokia800 + Nokia95 + Hermes)? You mentioned that you also carry bluetooth keyboard in your bag?

How do you deal with so many devices on the road? I don't mean to question your decision to do this, as you seem rather happy with your choices. It's just very difficult for me to comprehend when Athena alone would meet all these needs reasonably well, although not perfectly.
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] leoni1980:
I think you misunderstand.

I had a bluetooth keyboard and mouse - much like many other Athena owners - for use with my Athena as I didn't like the Hardware keyboard to use. I also think the device looks a lot nicer and is more practical to use without it.

I still have a Hermes. It has a faulty camera so is not worth selling, plus I do tinker on it now and again at home.

I use an N95 every day at home and at work for call handling. I usually take my EEE with me which has a micro BT EDR dongle so I can seamlessly connect them. Because it boots so quickly I often use it on the bus or in transit - it really is a great device for me, and I need a bag for work so carrying it is no burden given its minimal weight and size.

The N800 is my toy really. It's slim and light and great fun to use. I regularly bring it out with me since i don't really notice its presence. It's a pleasure more than anything, though I admit I could live without it given that I usually have a bag and don't mind carrying the EEE.

I don't have a million gadgets on me at all times. If I want to browse and can sit I'll use the EEE, at all other times the Nokia N95 suffices for me. I won't attempt to promote the device excessively as Symbian is pretty unpopular around here. The screen is tiny compared with the Athena but the safari-esque browser does a fair job and renders pages quickly and well. I can get over the screen size as the primary functions of the phone for me are call handling and bt DUN with HSDPA.

On the rare occasions i need GPS Nokia maps works well, but there's also Google maps with GPS support, and I get my emails through the messaging client - which also supports attachments.

Mulitmedia is good as the handset has a (working) graphics chip and high quality sound. There's a great camera too. 'standard' mobiles aren't for everyone but I quite like it.

Each to their own.

I miss my Athena occasionally because there were bits of it I quite liked - If I'd absolutely abhorred it I wouldn't have stuck it out for so long, but I wouldn't go back as I really don't like bluetooth headsets, and the recurrent statement in all Athena-related threads about call handling - which i agree with - is that a BT headset of some type is more-or-less essential.

I fear I'm plummeting off-topic here.......but on the subject of 'topics', maybe the question at the top of this thread should have been about the Athena's keyboard, everyone seems to agree on that one!
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] eaglesteve:
Leoni,

Thanks for clarifying. I did'nt realise your dislike for bluetooth is the real stumbling block causing you to permanently stay away from Athena.

I personally do not use bluetooth, like I should. This is because I also did not like wearing that thing on my ear. However, I think the bluevoice wristwatch is a very good idea. The LG lifestyle-I is also very good. I hope bluevoice wristwatch would come down in price quickly.
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] leoni1980:
I saw that before I sold my Athena but it was W-a-a-a-a-a-y too much. maybe in their next device HTC will give a device like that away instead of a keyboard (or as well as!)

Inherently it was the voice calling I had a problem with over everything else. It rattles me a bit when people say the sound is ok without an earpiece, as I know from experience of two Athenas that it really isn't. I ended up ignoring calls and replying by text in the end as I lost my wired headset.
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] spacecat:
I dont know what all the moaners are *****ing about

IM the only one who creates HALF DECENT THREADS that start a debate in this place and i dont even have a F**Kin ATHENA ANYMORE! :)

I couldn't care less if everyone in this place said that making calls on an ATHENA was so good they practically **** GOLD as a result

I found it the most sucky experience ever phone wise and felt a fool using the damn thing with or without a BT headset or Mini BT phone or a F**Kin 'Man from Uncle' talking WATCH!

With a nomal phone using BT device is a CHOICE with an ATHENA its a NECESSITY so basically YOU HAVE TO have 2 DEVICES to have a halfway decent phone experience. HAVING to use 2 devices blows the whole convergent BS right out of the window

I cant think of anything I regularly did on my ATHENA that i cant do a LOT better on my current mobile , albeit my uses are more multimedia based than work based.

If you love it great im happy for yah goodluck, but dont assume because you do that everyone else does.
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] HeartOfDarkness:
Hummm, who's moaning ?

Well, this strikes me as a peculiarly pretentious, self-involved, useless and WRONG statement. If we take this poll as an example, from the start people agreed it was flawed. And discussion strayed from it quite quickly, even if it remained in quite the same "topic".

Well, don't know if you're the "only one who creates HALF DECENT THREADS", but you sure are the only one around here with a mouth as dirty as dung-beetle's.

From your previous comments, I'd be inclined to say that the Athena may not have been the reason why you felt a fool.

I don't really understand why you barge in this way and start polluting your own thread with coarse and largely irrelevent non-sense.

Anyway....

You shouldn't assume either that everyone's willing to cought up hundreds of dollars / euros without even thinking a couple of minutes (and reading the functionnalities and specifications of the device they're about to buy) because you yourself evidently didn't.

Enough said.
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] newuser888:
Wow, looks like spacecat-fighting is starting again :D

Half-decent thread = thread where there's lots of spacecat-fighting. :D
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] HeartOfDarkness:
lol Sounds like a Tom Jones song-title. :D lol
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] newuser888:
He ****s at his own thread everywhere:D Look here:

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?p=1817798#post1817798

Strangest guy I've ever seen, certainly the guy with the dirtiest mouth.:D
[Advantage X7500, MDA Ameo General] eaglesteve:
Spacecat,

You don't actually have to talk to your wrist. If you have done A LITTLE reading on bluevoice's website, you will see that the earphone can be unattached from the watch and put on your ear. When done, you put it back to the wrist. But please, stop talking like that for your own good.