yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Touch Cruise General] SoberGuy:
Is the timing of this and the court decision against Qualcomm just a coincidence?
[Touch Cruise General] brrrt:
True, I have just e-mailed the HTC company to ask for some more info about this... I just can't wait 2 weeks, and I'm getting crazy by the idea of waiting another 8 weeks:

I'll keep ya up to date, when I get a reply!
[Touch Cruise General] SabbeRubbish:
I've checked with my supplier (Belgium - http://www.sergevandermaesen.be/) and he confirmed me that my order will be on its way to arrrive Wednesday. So obviously not all suppliers have this issue?
[Touch Cruise General] Rudegar:
"But don't you think that your second option meets the HTC Kaiser/Cruise production too....??"

yeah thats the irony of it that they are being blamed for both not getting them fast enough to the users and for releasing a product which people feel is not compleat :)
[Touch Cruise General] isv51:
HTC S**kZ! :mad: They don't answered to my e-mail! I'm waiting for 3 weeks.
[Touch Cruise General] ianl8888:
Ho hum ... I was flamed for this all last week, but I stand by what I said: until the thing is actually in the retailers with known (demonstrated) specs and price, I will put out NO $$$
[Touch Cruise General] SabbeRubbish:
If my copy gets in Wednesday, I'll be sure to test it in the afternoon/night and let you know, price was € 530, about $ 778.
[Touch Cruise General] RaptorRVL:
Maybe the new delay is because of the Qualcomm issue, maybe it's not. First batch of Cruises was/is already out and is being sold in the retail (I got one 2 weeks ago).

Surely interesting to see there is yet another delay, even though it's already being sold. It seems that the shops that are selling the Cruise already are running out of stock quite fast.

Anyway, let's hope the delay is for the good. Maybe an upgraded firmware (dare I say:"Video driver"? .. nahhhh :D ) or perhaps something else that has to do with Qualcomm and their adventures. Let's just hope it's the last of the delays and more of you people can start and enjoy this new device.
[Touch Cruise General] SoberGuy:
I was ready to put out some $$$, but with the recent ruling, specs at online retail stores changing, and this delay, I just might have to hold out as well.
[Touch Cruise General] cedel:
Htc Touch Cruise Unavailable-uncertainty About The Gps Chip

I was also waiting since 2-3 weeks the new HTC TC, I was intersested because it had everything I wanted (except a SIRF Star III chipset).

I'm asking myself now if I will not buy instead the new ETEN Glofiish X 800 who except a 2MPixels camera (in place of a 3 MPixel for the HTC TC) has not only a better GPS receiver (Sirf starIII) but also a much better screen (VGA 640x480 in place of QVGA 320X240) , a faster processor 500 MHz for the Eten vs 400 MHZ for the HTC and a better battery 1530 mAh vs 1350 mAh for the HTC.

And it seems that the HTC will cost a bit more than the ETEN....

What do you think you guys ?

Christian

Belgium
[Touch Cruise General] SoberGuy:
Not intending to hijack, but what's the difference between a SIRF Star II and III?
[Touch Cruise General] Pawel062:
people here say the gps is same as athena(specifically raskell who has a athena) so im guessing if athena is sirf star III then the polaris should be too. i will though be able to put them side by side soon.
[Touch Cruise General] butzchan:
Gps is	NMEA 0183 , 20 channels.

http://www.pdadb.net/index.php?m=specs&id=801
[Touch Cruise General] JulianL:
This is terrible news. Are there any Dutch speakers here who can summarise for us any details that might be on that tweakers.net thread as to why the stop on shipments?

My big concern is that there are technical problems with the TCs currently shipping but maybe this is this some sort of legal concern. The worst case would be a hardware fault that is in existing units, not severe enough to trigger a recall but annoying to have (e.g. sub-optimal battery life or performance). If it's some sort of copyright or performance issue with software in the ROM then that can always be fixed in the field; HTC would need to stop shipments until they had the updated ROM but I wouldn't care if I somehow got hold of an old unit since I could field-upgrade it.

I wonder if the batch of devices expected to hit the UK on 18th Jan will be stopped. If these are shipping via container then I wouldn't be at all suprised if they were already in transit yesterday and, if so, then they're going to land in the UK anyhow and it would be pretty inconvenient to HTC to keep them off the market.

I'm in a real dilemma because my Artemis is totally dead and it's really hurting me not having a smart phone, but then it would hurt me even more to spend almost £400 and discover that my batch of devices had something like an out-of-spec chip that resulted in me getting 30% less battery life compared to if I'd only waited for the fixed batch.

I suppose all that can be done at the moment is to wait for info. Come Jan 15th I'll probably try to call HTC UK and see if I can get any answers if the internet doesn't come up with info before then. Of course this whole thing could all just be a false rumour, it's really hard for me to judge without speaking Dutch.

Thanks to Mr Jibe for reporting this though, any additional details would be much appreciated.

- Julian
[Touch Cruise General] isv51:
There is no Hardware problem because o2 sells thousands of devices and they are all the same like touch cruise! They are to stupid to produce the devices faster!
[Touch Cruise General] Rob CT:
"According to justamp, High Tech Computer (HTC) will see a 30% reduction in the availability of key Qualcomm chips used in HTC's USA CDMA Windows Mobile devices and Euro WCDMA devices.

"However, the Taipei Times reports: High Tech Computer Corp the biggest maker of mobile phones running Microsoft Corp's system, denied that first-quarter sales would be adversely affected by a shortage of chip supply from Qualcomm Inc. Shares of HTC slid 0.37 percent to NT$538 yesterday after the Chinese-language Commercial Times reported that the company could suffer around a 40 percent quarterly decline in revenues because of the chip shortage.

"Component supply is tight, but we have everything under control. The company does not expect the shortage to have an impact on its fundamentals in the first quarter," HTC spokesman Cheng Hui-ming said in a filing to the Taiwan Stock Exchange. Vincent Chen a technology analyst at CLSA Ltd Taipei, confirmed that there is currently a shortage of a number of components, but said "we are uncertain about the impact." He said, however, that "a supply constraint in the first quarter was "unlikely as it is usually the slack season." HTC's sales in the first quarter of next year could drop about 24 percent sequentially to NT$29.5 billion (US$908 million), compared with an estimated NT$39 billion this quarter, Chen said."

This story from late December probably has some legs based on the evidence we are seeing in the market. I have a TC and so far, other than the usual WM stuff, it's operating perfectly. Haven't had to do any soft or hard resets. Great phone. Now if only we could combine all of the TC features and software with the i-phone gui/multi-touch. Continue to dream I guess
[Touch Cruise General] JulianL:
Not in the UK they don't. I went into the O2 shop in Kingston Upon Thames the day before yesterday (Sunday) and asked about availability on the O2 XDA Orbit 2. The sales assistant went to the back office to check the availability date on their stock system and, as of Sunday, the O2 systems weren't even showing an availability date.

- Julian
[Touch Cruise General] brrrt:
I'm Dutch, and I'll try to tell you something more about this.

In the Netherlands, all of the HTC Touch Cruise (UK) devices are sold out. As in, I watched almost all of the websites selling this device, but it's all negative. I don't have my TC yet, because I wanted to wait for the HTC Touch Cruise NL version, the Dutch one. For the Dutch one, I had to wait until 15 Januari, so I pre-ordered the device and couldn't wait, until this news.

Fact is that all of the retailers have heard that it could take until the 9th or 10th week, but that nobody has heard any specific information. So some of the members of the tweakers forums tried to find out some more.

I sent an email to HTC, but got no response. The stores didn't know anything about it, only that it's delayed.

The member "Manshand" called HTC Europe and tried to figure out what the problem was. They've only told him that there's a delay, and that they hope it'll be fixed at the end of Januari. This was about the UK version. The HTC employee acted quite strange when he talked about the Qualcomm chip, and said that he didn't have the permission to talk about that.

They can't say for sure what the date will be, since they don't sell anything directly.

After this, you can almost certainly say that it's a chip-problem. But the question will be what they will do with it. Will they use another chip? Can that be made into reality in 8 weeks?

Only thing I know about the chips is that the US court said that "Qualcomm has to abort the sell of 3g chips with Broadcomm patents" (Dutch article).

I'm not that good in translating texts, so maybe somebody else can...

I hope I gave enough info, I think this will affect all of the sales on HTC Touch Cruise. Only time can tell, and once I know more, I'll keep you updated!

[edit]

link with the Qualcomm/Broadcomm issue in English
[Touch Cruise General] imfloflo:
I'm in france and I send a mail to expansys.fr they told me they contact HTC and they annonce the 21/01 for stock.
[Touch Cruise General] anonimo:
Expansys availability dates are one of the most unreliable things in life.

When a product is delayed they usually move the date back a few days at a time so that people are not scared and keep pre-ordering. They could easily move the date 10 times before the product is actually available. They have done it before.

To make it short: don't trust Expansys dates!
[Touch Cruise General] reyjabs:
They're busy fixing the video drivers:D
[Touch Cruise General] mat111:
I got mine in 24hours from expansys.de
[Touch Cruise General] isv51:
I can't believe because i'm called them to ask about the earliest delivery time... they said, that they don't get devices... They said that HTC delayed the next delivery time to the 21.01. just as on the website.
[Touch Cruise General] qtek_metanol:
I'm only thinking, what is really going on behind all this...??? :confused:

It is really a logistic management problem...??? meanwhile I'm getting used to my Orbit 2 in spite of the bad software for the camera and the lower quality sound.
[Touch Cruise General] ---Alex---:
Link to the original message:

http://www.reuters.com/article/technologyNews/idUSN3159063420080101
[Touch Cruise General] RaptorRVL:
Well on one hand I think everyone is making way more out of this than necessary.

On the other hand it could have something to do with the Qualcomm chip and the latest developments in that area. It could be Qualcomm can't supply HTC with the 'old' chip since they are not allowed to sell those anymore. And perhaps they are now busy supplying 'new' chips that avoid certain patents or something.

If that is the case, HTC sure keep their supply of chips kinda small. And they are not making that much Cruises as well (or they just can't keep up with the demand?).

Anyway, the Touch Dual has the same chip and doesn't seem to be having the same problems in terms of availability (so far). And this is also a relatively new device.

But I can't wait to hear why there is such a delay although I don't think we might ever get a good answer for that.
[Touch Cruise General] wis38:
Hi,

according to this post from phonesreview.co.uk dated today Jan/08, the HTC Cruise should hit stores in UK around Jan/18.

And on the French fnac.com site, the phone (fr version) is marked available with 48h shipment (even if at a quite expensive price)... ;)
[Touch Cruise General] brrrt:
lets just hope that it's all going to be fine and that they'll deliver the new shipment of TC's in a few weeks!

I seriously can't wait another 8 weeks!!

Maybe because my old phone crashed and I have a borrowed old nokia at the moment...
[Touch Cruise General] SabbeRubbish:
Blasphemy! :p
[Touch Cruise General] ianl8888:
Look at the actual situation:

1) very limited numbers of devices were initially retailed in late December in the US, NL, Greece, Portugal. These were quickly sold out and then the shell game of "supply date" started

2) the US Court (after a jury decision in May 2007) in late December prevented Qualcomm from selling the MSM7200 chip (amongst others) in the US because of patent theft

3) Retailers started another shell game with the 3G frequencies (because the US and other countries use frequencies other than 2100Mhz to cover larger distances with larger wavelength). These retailers are rightly fearing large loss of sales for a device they had counted on for its customer demand

4) we are now in limboland with no reliable information and guesswork on supply out to mid-March and beyond, with HTC putting up a stonewall

I'm afraid Pollyanna doesn't cut it here.
[Touch Cruise General] tomres:
Dear ianl8888,

Do you think this situation applies to the UK market as well?
[Touch Cruise General] ianl8888:
Obviously, from here on it's just a guess ... no Company involved is supplying any reliable information.

The reason that the "shell game" some retailers are playing with the listed 3G frequencies worries me is:

a) the US Court decision debars Qualcomm from selling the MSM7200 chip as it is currently configured in the US. So from a narrow legal viewpoint, crippling the ROM so the 850Mhz 3G frequency is not accessible (ie. US consumers would not be able to log onto the 3G networks) may be sufficient ... HTC marketing would go ballistic, though, and countries other than the US also use that frequency (including Aus) to cover more geographical space (as a lower frequency increases wavelength)

2) it seems to me that (eg) Expansys UK may have been pressuring HTC to do just that, since from their viewpoint this may sidestep the US Court decision, keep a reasonable release timetable for retail sales, and have no effect on the UK/European market since they use the 2100Mhz frequency (except if an end-consumer travels to another country where the 3G frequency is one of those missing)

3) but there are already a limited number of fully tri-band 3G devices with an English ROM now out in the wild (this forum has contributions from some of those people). How does one then stop dumped ROM's from these existing devices being "shared around" ? In fact, this forum has a project going now to do just that !!

4) so just shutting down the retail sales - kersplat!! - puts a stopper on this while Qualcomm/HTC figure out what to do

5) Qualcomm claims it has "pin-for-pin" replacement chips designed, but these are subject to a Court examination next month (Feb), and the duration/outcome of this cannot be predicted by dumb end-users like me

My 2c worth - but the confluence of these events is not a co-incidence
[Touch Cruise General] ydg:
En Suisse le Cruise est dispo mais avec 5 jours de délai à partir du jour de commande sur www.phonestore.ch

Perso je le reçois par poste lundi 14.01

Quoiqu'il en soit cette petite merveille de Cruise arrive tranquillement en ce début d'année (enfin !)
[Touch Cruise General] Borizli:
Bon, j’attends encore sur la version allemand, mais la version français est disponible depuis une semaine chez le distibuteur suisse. (d'après les infos d'un copain qui vend des HTC)
[Touch Cruise General] SabbeRubbish:
My HTC TC arrived today, (well about an hour ago), so obviously UK versions are quickly deliverable in Belgium. Came in Monday, today it's mine. Any questions -> SabbeRubbish [AT] gmail [DOT] com.
[Touch Cruise General] reyjabs:
Well, if you gonna wait another eight weeks, then, you might as well, take a look at this!

Nice huh! and a lot faster!:D
[Touch Cruise General] Hornet331:
hun... ok that thing will eat any battery alive. :D
[Touch Cruise General] mat111:
I order and pay mine 27.12.07 and I got 28.12.07
[Touch Cruise General] isv51:
OMG they told me, that they don't get any TC yet. Hmm.. that makes me angry! I would also take it with bugs. :(

Are you from Germany? If yes, congratulations, you are the first person in Germany! ;) If you want, you can register you @ ppc-welt.info there is a special Touch Cruise area.
[Touch Cruise General] brrrt:
well, I was lucky to get my SonyEricsson k800i back from reparations... so I have at least some decent phone in my pocket. I'll manage to wait just a bit more I guess...

And I'm sorry, but I think that that phone isn't available in Europe/Netherlands. Plus I miss the GPS and the way I fell in love as with the HTC Touch Cruise :D
[Touch Cruise General] hangloose59:
Polaris now on stock in France, selling !

I just got my Polaris this morning in France, Wednesday Jan 9th at Surcouf Paris Haussmann, out of 5 pieces delivered yesterday evening. I had dropped by to advance pay mine on Saturday.

The Distributor has delivered 300 pieces last week to a number of stores, la Fnac should have a good number on sale in the next few days (their logistic platform has received a decent delivery).

I also saw today via alerts that internet .fr sites now claim to have it on stock - all good.

Indeed, real nice to have in your hand...

HangLoose
[Touch Cruise General] isv51:
I don't understand it... Why does HTC deliver to France, Greece and so on but not to Germany? I think i know why. The reason: Because Germany got the Orbit 2 first.. Now the other german people should wait and wait and... :mad:
[Touch Cruise General] oppaunke:
@isv51:

why waiting??????

i'm @ E-Plus, too.... and bought my orbit2 just two weeks ago in an o2-shop near düsseldorf for 489€ (10€'s cash off, cause i had to drive 50km for nothing the day before i got my device, which was promised to be reserved for me)

@brrrt: that meizu device looks like an iphone... if it had gps integrated, i'd sell my orbit2 and try this one... great thing! is there more known about this manufacturer? quality? service? updates? communities? would be interesting :)
[Touch Cruise General] wis38:
Qtek.fr has just added Polaris to their product list.

They are not detailing about product availability, but the "buy" button is there. :)
[Touch Cruise General] imfloflo:
He is also available at fnac.com at the same price but the price is much higher as well. :s I will wait LDLC, materiel.net or pixmania ...
[Touch Cruise General] Ziggy95:
What a good news !

I consulted fnac.com but store have no stock actually. Maybe tomorrow.

I tried to phone but i couldn't join them.

Do you know if surcouf sell the phone with a sfr subscription ?

Bye

Ziggy
[Touch Cruise General] isv51:
I think you don't exactly understand what i mean... The germans must wait for the Touch Cruise and not for the Orbit 2.. Sorry but, i dont want a Orbit 2. If i want a Orbit 2 i'll need 1 hour to get one.. It's not the Problem here in Berlin.. Everything i need is a Touch Cruise..

_________________________________

Touch Cruise is "GEILER" 4 ME! ;)
[Touch Cruise General] Ziggy95:
I got one !!!

Thanks to hangloose59 from France who write HTC TC was available in Fnac.

They got 1 at Fnac Thiais and i got it (the only one).

I am so happy. I was the creator of this thread against HTC because of the delay.

I will spend all my week end to configure it.

I paid 449 € with SFR Subscription instead of 600 €.

be careful, SFR sells illimythic in 2G (they invent it since one week... bad joke), i must wait 1 month to activate the 3G.

It's amazing, they are thieves.

So, i will use wifi during this month.

Ziggy from France
[Touch Cruise General] isv51:
Congratulations! :'(
[Touch Cruise General] Abbsta:
Happy for you ziggy.

Enjoy.
[Touch Cruise General] MusicArt1st:
O2 UK were spoken to on the 12/01/08 who stated that the latest supply date for the Orbit 2 is now 28/01/2008.
[Touch Cruise General] anonimo:
And now Expansys UK has changed the date to 30/01 (as they always do) :D
[Touch Cruise General] isv51:
Hey anonimo, we are also waiting for the Touch Cruise, here in Germany..

Could you or someone else, call HTC Europe and ask why the delivery is delay.. In some countries you can buy it and in other countries you have to wait.. it's not "business" what HTC do.. It only business for amateurs to let the customers wait for a device that announced for november 2007.

My english is not good enough to talk with someone there otherwise i've called them self..
[Touch Cruise General] anonimo:
I'll see what I can do but, as you should know, contacts between HTC and their non-corporate customers (us) are dealt with by people who are not even HTC employees and can only read the script they have been provided with.
[Touch Cruise General] isv51:
Thanks.. This is unfortunately true.. The most supplier here say, that HTC don't tell the reasons. They only delay it (without telling a reason). What should the suppliers do? Due to HTC, the supplier disappoint the customers and they're waiting and waiting.. I think, that HTC build the wrong devices. HTC should build mobilephones for kids and not "business-mobilephones". This is apparently the wrong "league", they playin'. If looked for alternatives but found nothing... The Touch Cruise is the only one with WM6/HSDPA/GPS/etc. below 415 £ (GBP) The TynT II has the same issue with the videoperformance and is much expensive.
[Touch Cruise General] brrrt:
I emailed HTC too, right after they announced their delay, but I never got a reply...

And ISV51, if they should make phones for children, like you said, they sure need to get a nifty videodriver, since children find video's one of the most important things for their mobile phones... So business is more their "league" :)
[Touch Cruise General] pooh4o:
you may get 5% off if you buy it from qtek.fr with promo code CRUISE5 up to 18th of January. The new price will be 569 eur

Bonne chance ;)
[Touch Cruise General] isv51:
I don't understood.. Sorry, with business i meaned that they aren't solid and faithful.. I think this is very important when you make business..

Yes that's right, kids need the videodrivers too, like me :p

I thought, that i can play a little bit with my TC en route. Everyday i go one and a half hour to work by train and then the same route back..

Thank you HTC for a beatiful device with failures ;)
[Touch Cruise General] imfloflo:
We can easily find promo code for expansys (30€ or 5%) or other website so the new price around 529€ so i'll wait until 21/01/08 :eek:

On est plus à ça pret - Merci de l'info
[Touch Cruise General] brrrt:
Ah, I meant the public they were aiming at. If you aim at business people, you need Office, great agenda, tight looks and good service. If you aim at children, you need a good camera, games and video playback :)

But I agree with you that even business phones need everything on it, because grown-ups want to play too :D

Plus the fact that we pay for a good device, so we want something in return...
[Touch Cruise General] isv51:
Yes, that's right! Let's wait and hope to get it presently. Here are a lot of people who are sneaky to fix the problems with the device... ;) Let's hope! :o

I want my TC for the next 2 years and then never again a HTC!
[Touch Cruise General] brrrt:
Only because of the bad communications? Maybe they have an even more outstanding device in the near future, with a projector/beamer built in! Let's just hope... :)

But first I can't wait for the TC, too bad the projectors are still in the pre-production fase, since I'd like to have that in the phone before it's perfect!