yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] ray.andy:
HTC P6500 on ebay.

Maybe someone could contact the seller and explain the situation. He may be willing to give us a copy of the rom !!

http://cgi.ebay.ie/HTC-P6500-PRO-BRAND-NEW-MODEL-GPS-WIFI-BLUETOOTH-pda_W0QQitemZ150230332492QQihZ005QQcategoryZ3312QQcmdZViewItem

Anything is worth a try.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] sswalia:
I tracked down a p6500 owner- he had posted on xda in novmber i believe- this is what he said about his sedna

-----------------------------------------------------

Re: htc sedna

Hello

Yes it has the 7200 chipset

I tried few videos on it with TCPMP and I did not find any issues with playback

I hv already made a ROM dump and I think posted on xda dev..there is nothing special and it is same as Kaiser/Cruise etc etc

The phone is a pre production unit so really can't say much about it.

FInger print scanner works, but the app in the Programm files gives the execution error.

GPS is good, nad camera as well.The display is not so bright as others, may b due to preproduction unit

Quote:

Originally Posted by sswalia

hello hdubli, I was hoping that you could help me with some specific questions about the htc sedna.

First, i just wanted to verify that the sedna does infact cary the qualcom 7200 chipset.

If this is the case, how is video playback on your phone- does it lag more or less than the htc kaiser/touch/touch dual?

I would also love a mini review of your phone to get a better all around impression about the sedna.

Finally, i was wondering if it would be possible for you to dump the rom from your sedna so that it could be explored to find the infamous "qualcom graphics driver" that has been plagueing so many htc owners.

thank you so much for your time,

sswalia

-----------------------------------

I searched xda for the rom- but i dont really know where to look, and google wasnt being nice to me-- maybe ya'll will have more luck
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] rovanesyan:
hey guys i dont know if any of you have got this email, simply because i dont feel like reading through 60 pages. i sent htc an email with my concerns and this was the reply.

Hello Rafaiel Ovanesyan,

Thank you for your inquiry about the AT&T Tilt.

We know it is important for you to have all the latest software for your device. We are happy to report that the information about drivers is false. In regards to your research about missing drivers, with reference to the official statement concerning the issue, HTC does not develop exclusive or dedicated multimedia based devices. The Qualcomm MSM7xxx-based chips do not use ATI's Imageon video acceleration hardware and were never intended to do so. Simply put we cannot release drivers to utilize hardware not implemented in our devices. Furthermore HTC values its customers and the overall online community of mobile device enthusiasts and fans. HTC plans to include video acceleration hardware in future video-centric devices that will enable high-resolution video support

I hope we have answered your question in detail, Rafaiel. Feel free to contact us again if you have any further questions.

HTC Technical Support
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] NikMel:
Dear laurent,

As I can see there is a difference between polaris and SE device.

The CPU of SE is 7200A and ours (polaris) is 7200.

That could be the point of HTC developers.

Dear MDA-Fan,

We should know that these devices are running on different OS's.

These days I’m having some performance problems with the VISTA on a really good/fast computer (Intel Quadcore). When I install on the same computer win XP it runs very FAST!

WM 5 is more faster then WM 6 for some hardware.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] MDA-Fan:
I thought of that too. WM2003SE is/was faster than WM 5, so i don´t really know how to handle those benchmarks and as mentioned before, I´m not sure the drivers are the only reason.......

BUT the Kaiser is slow, and the fix from HTC (whatever it should have been) isn´t there!
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] hidavi:
Ask him very niceley if he could come back and dump it again for us :)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] hdubli:
Hello Guys,SOmehow I missed this thread.I hv the Sedna ROM dumped from a preproduction unit, in raw form, sswalia pointed out me to this thread.I hv also dumped the SPL, if people interested.Raw.bin can b easily converted into OEM and SYS, and is not a big deal.If u want I can upload to rapidshare.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] hidavi:
OMG!!! Do it and open a new thread in the Kaiser ROM Development forum. Explain that you did it in response to the need for ATi drivers in the Kaisers and everyone will be happy!!!

:D :D :D

Gah, I know I shouldn't get my hopes up, but its kinda nice to hope...
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] mikeeey:
lol im not sure if im supposed to be excited, i guess well find out. hope this has the drivers? HTC did say end of march...think this is it? comming soon?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] hdubli:
http://rapidshare.com/files/103706855/Part02.rar.htm

Here u go..

raw file can be easily dumped using kaiser kitchen.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Isaygarcia:
aaahh!! i have reached my download limit so i need wait 46 minutes o.O!!...

and tomorrow school at morning >.<...

Edited+: Make a new thread in the ROM development with this .
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] mikeeey:
hahaha im on spring break! sucks for you!

i can download it but i dont wanna flash my rom to something thats not ment for my kaiser, so ill wait till a rom cooker can do something with this.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] hakushox:
I was suppose to come home and go right to sleep! Fat chance of that happening now lol.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] neilson:
I hope the Sedna project proves successful. I have a Sprint Mogul(MSM 7500 chipset). That's the CDMA equal to the MSM7200 chipset.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] sswalia:
@hdubli

@ hdubli:

Would it be possible for you to run the spb benchmark program on your device just to make sure that is indeed the same as the phone tested in the benchmark test on todosmartphone.com . The reason why i ask is because the preproduction phone that you have may not have the most updated rom and drivers as the Sedna that is scheduled for release next month. (you got yours in november of 07 i beleive). Thank you so much for your time.

Oh yeah the spb benchmark program can be found here http://www.spbsoftwarehouse.com/products/benchmark/?en

thx again,
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] rovanesyan:
how do we even know that this ati imageon chip is inside this qualcomm msm7200 chipset? I got a very disheartening email from htc when i tried to contact customer support, although i wont post the whole thing here ill post the part that made me uneasy

------------------------------------------

"We know it is important for you to have all the latest software for your device. We are happy to report that the information about drivers is false. In regards to your research about missing drivers, with reference to the official statement concerning the issue, HTC does not develop exclusive or dedicated multimedia based devices. The Qualcomm MSM7xxx-based chips do not use ATI's Imageon video acceleration hardware and were never intended to do so. Simply put we cannot release drivers to utilize hardware not implemented in our devices. Furthermore HTC values its customers and the overall online community of mobile device enthusiasts and fans. HTC plans to include video acceleration hardware in future video-centric devices that will enable high-resolution video support

------------------------------------------------------------

Any chance that what they sent me was true? If it is im definetely gonna go get my money back on this phone.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] _Alex_:
Actually, the SPB benchmarks for graphics are extremely crappy. If hdubli could run VSBenchmark 2007 (found here), it would be a much better comparison. I'll edit this post w/ my Kaiser results once the benchmark is done.

*edit* As you can see here, the HTC Kaiser performs between 1686 and 1440, depending on what's been tweaked and/or installed. My own (ATT 1.62 Cube) benchmarks resulted in scores of 1576 (while running activesync) and 1713 (soft reset / run). The second run came up with the following breakdown:

Test 1 - Graphics - 1311

Test 2 - Others - 2308

Test 3 - JPEG - 2774

Test 4 - Games - 1621

Test 5 - Sound - 0552 (FWIW, had sound set to vibrate)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] DaneMaximus:
It's all semantics. From what I've gathered, the Imageon chip is not included. However, the 7xxx chips are based on the Imageon chip. Meaning: the chip is capable of doing the things that the Imageon chip is capable of.

And seriously, if they've never made multimedia devices, why do their phones come with Windows Media Player, and why do they claim that the Kaiser - in their own description - delivers a rich multimedia experience? But then again I think it's semantics. The base isn't multimedia, they just tried - and failed - to add the multimedia later.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] hdubli:
I wud have love to do that, but unfortunately the device is not with me..so I cannot run..It did not strike me somehow to do these stuffs earler.(dumb me) I can offer the SPL dump..if needed..
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] axonn:
Donate

I haven't spent a day reading the whole thread BUT... why doesn't Olipof or somebody open a paypal account so we can donate enough money for him to buy a Kaiser and start having fun with the video driver. I would be happy to donate.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] tranaee:
Why noone is mentioning the new drivers coming along with P6500..?

Check here..

HTC is publishing them and Dutty will include them in a Kaiser rom coming out these days..

Check the above link.. The specs and graphs are impressive!!
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] sswalia:
@hdubli

Yes please, could you dump the spl as well. Folks are really workin hard with this rom. also please have a look at this forum... i think ur name comes up a few times ...

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?p=2074094&posted=1#post2074094
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] itcrackerjack:
Humorous

I found this to be humorous. It was found here.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] NuShrike:
It's humorous when most of the OS is compiled for an ARM9 or lower. Maybe it's a Microsoft habit since desktop Windows itself is compiled mostly for a generic i686 (Pentium II or III) without targeting any of the newer CPUs.

This would be fine except phones are embedded devices where such sloppiness is inexcusable; we don't have the ram/cpu for that, and the compiler tools aren't really that efficient. I've seen many cases where writing C-code one way makes really crappy asm, whereas moving some lines around and bam, it's much better.

I like recompiling my FreeBSD for nocona.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] storino03:
Hope something comes over this in the next few days!

--James
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Flying Kiwi:
It'd be false advertising if imageon capabilities weren't built into the chip. The device was advertised as having the MSM7200 chip and that chip comes with hardware on it similar to the imageon. They didn't advertise it as having the MSM7200 modified to take out the graphics acceleration part so the hardware is there.

------------------------------------------

Note the choice of the word 'use' rather than 'contain'. In order to 'use' that hardware that is contained on the chips, drivers are required and since HTC hasn't provided them, the hardware is currently going unused.

Note that they chose the word 'implemented' rather than 'contained', again a clue that the hardware is in there alright and of course they could release drivers to use the hardware in that chip, they just choose not to at the moment. If you read up more on this site you'll see the HTC official line has been heavily discredited. It's very easy to misinterpret what they've written so don't fall into that trap.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] ulupong:
hello any update about the software optimization??.. htc said end of march they will releaese..:mad::confused::confused:
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] pinx:
Yeah, they said. As for many times before. Damn it. Well have to wait furthermore :mad:
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] vampyre:
Guys, according to HTC the ATI chip isnt there to begin with!! that's why no drivers will be release for the chip that doesnt exist!!

First of all try to confirm that the chip is there and then try creating or raising money for the drivers.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Flying Kiwi:
They've not mentioned that the supplied MSM 7200 chip doesn't contain Imageon type functionality only that the functionality is not being used. Without drivers, of course the functionality is not being used. Can you not see that while they're not lying, the wording is somewhat deceptive.

A reveiw of the TyTN II service manual shows the MSM 7200 chip having pride of place on the motherboard, what other proof do you need? If you're so sure the hardware isn't there then why are you suggesting we need to confirm the chip is there, I'm getting mixed messages from you. I believe graphics chip specific drivers are a basic thing which should be included when the hardware is there (which it is, be in no doubt). It's no wonder people are so annoyed with HTC.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] ChumleyEX:
Where have you been and why haven't you read the posts above yours?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] seelanj:
I'm from the component factory. There are future called “Fusing” where the silicon chip may have multiple function but base on the customer requirement or silicon yield and then component factory can burn some fuse (register in the silicon ship) to enable or disable some function in the chip. For this 7200 case it may be the silicon have the ATI graphic function but was disable by fusing option where firmware or OS unable to use the this future. :mad:
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] sswalia:
if they would chop the legs out from under a chipset just for ****s and giglles that would make me even for furious...

if that is indeed the case- i'm sellin it; buyin the next gen iphone, and saying screw htc and its attempts to squeeze even more money out of me. (and yes i realize the iphone is a complete and udder money suck- at least they tell you, hey i'm taking ur money - u ok with that?)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Flying Kiwi:
Not if they keep the same name

Then they wouldn't be able to call it an MSM7200 chip or they'd be guilty of false advertising. I've heard of this sort of thing happening with some types of chips but the chips with reduced functionality as a fesult of having bits of hardware disabled are always rebranded with a different name/model to signify the change.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] danielherrero:
Exactly. The chip would be named with a different model, for sure¡¡
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] ChumleyEX:
Not if they say it's an OEM MSM7200. The oem lets them get away with anything.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] malestrom:
Hi everyone.I have read all 65 pages and I wanted to ask if the member mentioned(I forgot his name) had a 2nd device,could he find a solution?I have 2 devices and I just want to know.

Chris

P.S.

http://www.intomobile.com/2008/01/29/5000-reward-for-working-htc-kaiser-video-driver.html

http://www.intomobile.com/2008/02/2...ove-video-acceleration-for-our-customers.html
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] sswalia:
are you saying that you have 2 p6500 sedna's? if so, please join the Rom driver search forum.

Could you please clarify what you mean by

"I have 2 devices and I just want to know"
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] AlacrityF:
I realize I have not posted on here before, but the above statement is correct, the OEM is a time honored method of selling you less than you are expecting.

Here is the deal with some chips, it is cheaper to set up production to make one model and disable the functions not sold. If this is the case, HTC may have bought a chip with the functions in the chip, but the inability to access those functions. Intel has been doing it for years with their CPU's.

I do not know this to be the truth, but the line HTC is following certainly seems to imply this. They made a business decision based on cost, which by the way comes back to the consumer sooner or later in one way or another.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] storino03:
so the physical ati gpu may be there, but no wires going to it? Is that what you mean by not being implemented based off of whether the qualcomm 7200/7500 were bought as OEM ?

--James
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] ChumleyEX:
Yes, for instance you can buy a Dell PC with a specific ATI video card. You can take that card out and compare it to a retail version of the card. The OEM one (that Dell supports and ATI doesn't ) might have things missing and will also have drivers specific to it.

In this case the chip probley went through manufacturing and the process wasn't completed, making it easier/cheaper to produce. Now it is HTC's Qualcom MSM7200, made special just for all of us.

As mentioned above, it's how Intel has a cpu that is almost the same but dif speeds or less cache. Sadly it's almost like a women that has a still born child inside of her.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] hidavi:
I suggest we wait till the final verdict given by the pros here before any further discouraging commentary is made. Jesus, its not that hard...
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] storino03:
Yeah, it's not like we know it's an OEM chipset that was used, nor if Qualcomm has any OEMs at all.

--James
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] ChumleyEX:
If Qualcom won't support it then it's oem.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Jasperrr:
eh no...

Your post doesn't make any sense >.>
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] storino03:
Most likely their reasoning for not supporting all the features, is that the device manufacturer it's going in has chose to not pay rights/driver for X feature. Doesn't mean the feature isn't there by default

--James
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] KyleK29:
Why would they be happy to report that? Seriously ...
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Jasperrr:
Like everyone else already said, a feature might be there; but it's probably disabled. And this can probably not be undone because most manufacturers use lasers to burn the stuff away.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] :
I'm with you. iPhone 2.0, 3G, GPS (hopefully). That nice sexy PowerVR chip, nice screen, and OpenGL ES 2.0. I really hope some good games and apps come out for it. You're really getting something for being bent over, no question.

I'm not one for brand loyalty, but compared to what old Jobsy is offering, I'm having a hard time justifying spending this kind of cash on the next HTC device.

-James
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] dperren:
Let's play a game. You are a phone manufacturer who has physically disabled one of the features of the phone. When a storm of requests come in demanding it be enabled, since it's lack makes the phone intensely frustrating to use do you:

a) Lie, and say the phone does not 'use' the hardware, prompting mass outrage from some, and comments about 'told you it didn't exist! lol' from people with no critical reasoning skills... Or:

b) Be honest, and say that the hardware does not exist, and accept the frustration about this, but there really is nothing you can do, so this rapidly abates.

Now, lets imagine the hardware is there, but you don't want to pay for licencing, and (maybe) someone to write the drivers. Do you:

a) Lie, and say the hardware doesn't exist, opening yourself to litigation.

b) Tell the truth, and say you don't 'use' it, hoping that everyone with your device is an idiot with no critical reasoning skills.

It's pretty simple.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Straputsky:
Indeed it is. I use the service staff to produce some unsureness about what's right. Till the problem has been discussed by everyone I have produced some new phones which doesn't lack these issues anymore. Time goes by and only a few people remember about the video insufficiency of these "old" devices.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Jasperrr:
Woot I like games :)

I would pick B

B
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] bandit2xx:
I wonder if that issue affects all Kaiser models Kais120, Kais130, etc... i have a KAIS130 and honestly regarding to games i didn't felt the bad performance when compared to Ipaq h1940 and hx2750 i owned before! In general this device is slightly slower and scrolls way bad compared to the models i mentioned above... Video performance is terrible if DirectDraw is select in core player and surely hangs more with PIE than any other device. I would to see a boost in speed generally and wifi since i never got the touchscreen bug in games.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] dperren:
Which is why our phones *do* have the enabled hardware within them.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] coolsun85:
Touch Cruise with TI OMAP

Guys I live in India, Yesterday I saw a touch cruise of my relative and it was working very smooth and swift, so checked the specification and was suprised to see a TI OMAP 200 Mhz processor with 64MB ram, how is possible when htc site says that it has MSM7200. Does it mean that HTC is not able to solve the problem with MSM7200 and has given up on them.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] hidavi:
^That would be an HTC Juno, sold in the US as the T-Mobile Shadow.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] virgoean:
Lets see what HTC Dream is going to offer now that Google is overseeing the development of the phone. Most probably coming on May 6th

http://www.phonemag.com/special-htc-invitation-may-6-in-london-for-launch-of-the-dream-042292.php
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] frag999:
Imate Ultimate 9502 sounds to be kind of a dog when it comes to basic video. It is a VGA device and is available in Australia. Here is a link to a discussion forum: http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies-archive.cfm/846217.html A post by a person named "Xuhavon" on April 2, 2008, says that the display becomes garbled when too many things are bogging down the unit.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] dyetheskin:
nearly perfect tilt

Hope this comes out soon. I finally got a custom rom on this sucker,had few issues with gps and camera but now those run great.Once the drivers are released I'll be 1 step closer to a perfect tilt once ivisit is released for our devices and how to disable the annoying vibrate on bootup and stopping the lame battery drain issue or perhaps i should buy another 3000mah battery and never letting it overchrage.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] vampyre:
Hey Guys , any news about this hacker mentioned on the htcclassaction site?

Is she posting any updates on the situation somewhere?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] coolVariable:
I started a new threat (http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?p=2101809) with the intent to get some of our efforts more organized.

Bad press/publicity is one of the ways we might get HTC to move on this issue, so we should coordinate our efforts to generate both.

- Leaving negative comments is one step

- Contacting authors of blogs/articles about HTC is another

- Contacting consumer groups (e.g. consumerist) is a third step

Please only post links or email addresses in the other threat.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] sdlopez83:
OMNI/ Dream

Oh man i googled the HTC Dream/ Omni... and I think I creamed my pants when looking at these phones. These are the next gen android phones.

http://www.unwiredview.com/2007/11/06/htc-omni-surfaces-at-google-as-htc-dreamwith-android-os/

http://www.engadget.com/2008/03/20/htcs-dream-again-rumored-to-be-first-android-phone/