yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Flying Kiwi:
Full drivers are only avail to OEMs/Developers so....

I'm hoping that when Coreplayer 2 is released, there's an option to buy a Qualcomm MSM7200 Windows Mobile 6 compatible driver pack with it. As that software publisher is heavily involved in developing software that gets the most out of the hardware in our phones, they're ideally placed to buy the latest and fastest drivers from the chipset manufacturer. If they can negotiate with Qualcomm to get them for a modest cost, I'd imagine many Tilt/TyTN II owners will be willing to pay for them (not to mention the owners of many other HTC 'driverless' models).
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] DickeFix:
I guess this problem is solved now?

I think this driver issue is a thing of the past. The graphics benchmark results I get with my Tytn II with Windows Mobile 6.1 are very good and I don´t understand why there still are complains about the graphic speed. I have no problems at all. If it is dark the camera needs to lower the frame rate to reduce noise but that is normal. Here are benchmarks with Tytn II:

SPB Benchmark 1.6

================

Graphics index of 3984

CPU index of 1560.

TCPMP (Zoom 100%)

======================

RL_MQB (320x240):164.96%

RL_XQ (640x480): 84:40%

TCPMP results are dramatically better figures than reported for TytnII at Smape (97.62% and 23.38%)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] parkhaus:
Have a look here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1T4UY-8kG_w

Qualcomm is just.....:mad: .'Nuff said.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] dazz245:
I hope there is something still going on
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] wallsg:
Probably not. This would be "obsolete hardware" now, or at least soon. Not worth anyone's trouble.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Flying Kiwi:
Link to relevant other thread

Don't be so sure about that. The MSM720x chipset is still in use in many devices and there's another thread here at xda-dev where additional drivers have been developed and tested. Have you seen this thread 2D/3D Driver Development for MSM720X devices (DriverPack Beta 2)?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Alcibiade:
I have a TP2, same Chipset. When you see how it ranks compard to old dvices it's a pitty

So yeah until all the devices are Snapdragon or Tegra you have a hope they'll be pletty of people with nice recent devices in need for drivers...
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Dukenukemx:
Doesn't the new G1 phone have essentially the same chipset, but just higher in clock speed? So long as there's a phone with a Qualcomm chipset, drivers are still needed.

So far I've seen the Kaiser, Touch Pro, Touch Pro 2, and G1 having essentially the same chipset.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] daedric:
Essentially... not completely.

What does matter... is that someone found a way of enabling OpenGL ES, on Android. So the kaiser must be OpenGL ES compliant..
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Dukenukemx:
How's the performance on the Android OS? You think it's possible to run that OS without Windows Mobile?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] sallal:
where to download now the hardware acceleration ?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Mr-B:
not sure if this what your after but i tried three or 4 of these drivers and this 1 seemed to work best on kaiser 6.1 the sample package on same page tried first was sloooow then tried a few drivers and got better but the only 1 that made the 3d text work was http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=416474
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] sallal:
Is it also compatible to LG KS20 ?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] goodeffort@comcast.net:
i wouldnt be surprised if there wasnt a DDI driver for GDI to use with windows mobile for msm7k chips. i think if a few people worked hard enough, you could tunnel a driver into OpenGL when implementing a GDI DDI driver. there arent that many function calls.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] dany547:
3D drivers for WM 6.5 (HTC Kaiser) exists? i cant find anything on google :(

i'ved installed the Drivers for wm 6.1 but they are not working,same for Omnia 3D drivers (i'm useing wm 6.5.5 build 29020)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] dany547:
i have a problem,when i cooked the d3D and 2D drivers in the ROM the 2D drivers are working just when i align the screen,if i restart the device i have to do the alignment again,what is the problem here? :(
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] omikr0n:
It's been two weeks since I contacted HTC with the issue. They haven't replied since then. Therefor I wrote them today again mentioning my dissatisfaction with their slowness of responsing. Hopefully I will at least get a reply this time.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] stekern:
At least Qualcomm is hiring graphic driver developers:

http://jobs.qualcomm.com/staffing/S...&txtReqID=&chkIntern=&chkNewGrad=&chkExpProf=

"Position involves developing embedded software graphics drivers to support OpenGL ES, D3D and SVG graphics API's with hardware graphics cores in CDMA, UMTS, and GSM handsets."
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Menneisyys:
This means they themselves have no drivers at all......... *censored*

All in all, it takes at least half a year for us to see 3D support in *any* Qualcomm-based Windows Mobile device.... asshole Qualcomm!!!!!!!!!
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] omikr0n:
IMO it means nothing. The fact that company is hiring developers for graphic driver developement does not say anything about the company having or not having any drivers at the moment.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] mikeeey:
if they never had any drivers in the first place then how were they able to give out the specs that we've read? how can they even test it?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] jym04:
Actually I don't think it means that they never had any drivers. It says "...Position involves developing embedded software graphics drivers...".

Maybe it's a generic driver that should work on all devices using their chips.. not just Kaiser specifically. Maybe. :)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Menneisyys:
According to the latest news (see for example http://msmobiles.com/news.php/6914.html ), the XScale + GF5500-based 6150 and 8150 have not been cancelled.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] MAK11:
Regarding the lack of drivers thing. I pretty much 100% sure that it's a Qualcomm prob and not HTC (MS). I'm toying with an LG KS20 that has the same 400Mhz MSM7200 chipset as all the latest HTC phones and Video performance is kinda crappy (as I expected) My P3600 just kills it (and totally annihilates it with Imageon acceleration)..

OH and if somebody knows how to enable GPS on this damn thing (It's disable like on the Touch Dual and S730) As there's a bunch of GPS entries in the Reg (and some guys were able to enable it on some S730..)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] QwerkY:
HTC s730 Is good for something else

It's also interesting that the HTC s730 has the Qualcomm 7200.

Between the HTC s730 and the LG, somthing's got to have the ruddy hardwarde acceleration working right.

HTC has three more phones coming out by the end of the year. Do we speculate that they all will be sans proper display drivers?

Anyone have the s730's ROM handy?

I mean come on. I'm deciding between the Touch Cruise and a Kaiser. If I can't vid/conference or watch movies on the plane, forget it, I'll wait and see what's wrong with the Tytn VI.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] saudi-brazil:
ONLY WMV

First I was also very sceptic about the performace, I found out my device has only problems with play back of WMV, MPEG is absolutly fast!!! great quality
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Lowenski:
I don't know how can I help becuse I'm not programmer but I'm graphic designer and 3D Modeler if I can help in any way let me Know

lowenski@gmail.com
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] ladytoast:
From what I understand there is little to be done until a driver exists on a platform somewhere. As soon as it appears on a device with the similar/same chip set it's is likely people will starting getting excited about cross porting it.

I for one hope that they keep this chip set around for a long time, makes the chances of getting accelerated hardware rendering more likely.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] QwerkY:
I just didn't realize

The capabilities for this chipset are being so radically underused, it makes me feel ill. I just saw a demonstration of one of the imate Ultimates using this chip. I then revisited that stats. Consider the Ultimates:

The screen has VGA resolution in place of QVGA

The screen is 18 bit color, not 16 bit like most screens

The Ultimates sport either a VGA or XGA out:

So the device screen has 4 times the resolution and 4 times the bit depth, so 16 times the processing, unless it’s hooked up to the video out, then it’s making up for ten times the resolution: 40 times the processing. I have a box of old video cards looking on with jealousy. Maybe the 9502 is the way to go instead of getting a Kaiser or Cruise, or do I hold out for the Omni, assuming it’s not Vapor. I – can’t – choose!
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] irvo:
VGA must be nice, but I think I can live with QVGA. But I too cannot wait for the Ultimates --- and someone gutting out their ROMs.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Menneisyys:
1, having 18 color bit depth (as opposed to 16 bits) only introduces a 1.125-fold overhead, not a 4-fold one. Nevertheless, the OS itself is 16-bit only so I seriously doubt the 18 bit capabilities of the screen hardware are actively used.

2, I seriously doubt the 9502 will have 3D or optimized video drivers. Not even Qualcomm has the former.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] QwerkY:
jeez

I'll take your word on it. I figured 4x the instruction set, 4 times the processing required; but i'd have to ask why the processors being used are 32 bit if they OS only needs 16.

Anyway, the tech (and nitpicking) aside, my point is can you imagine the absoulte potential we're missing in the 2d realm by not having drivers for HTC products using the 7200... And besides, if i-mate did create any 3d driver (not necisarrily optimized, but at least engaging the harware), why would they have let anyone in on the coding. It's possible they invested themselves to an extend that Qualcomm has not.

Maybe I should just save 400 bucks and get a Tytn I.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Menneisyys:
BTW, I have 4 VGA Pocket PC's: the PL720, the hx4700, the x51v and the Universal.

Of them, only the x51v has a dedicated hardware accelerator. The other three (even the hx4700, which has the ATI chip, but it doesn't deliver ANY speedup in ANYTHING, it seems) are, in general, far slower in games than the x51v (in MOST of them - I'm not speaking of 3D accelerated titles). However, in evveryday tasks (incl. video playback), they are prefectly usable, speed-wise.

All in all, in a VGA device, not any kind of hardware acceleration is needed. (As long as HTC / i-mate don't consider video playback useless and not-needed and release a VGA device that is 5 times slower at VGA video playback than the Kaiser :) ).
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Monrad:
You know, I've been comparing my TYTN II performance against a Palm with Windows Mobile and my TYTN II feels like a Windows XP without video drivers.

I also noticed that Garmin Mobile XT can't render 3D maps fast. I thought it could be a GPS problem but I turned it off and I simulated a route and guess what... 3D performance sucked. Maybe... with proper drivers that wouldn't happen. Am I right?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Menneisyys:
Frankly, I don't understand. Are you referring to the color depth (16 bit) or the instruction set (which is, because the StrongARM architecture has always been 32-bit, 32-bit)?

They have nothing to do with each other. A 32-bit CPU can only drive a 2 / 4 -bit display - as was the case with early, WinCE 1/2 monochrome models.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Ralph Smeets:
Some LG KS20-info

I've got a LG KS20 since two weeks and I've been browsing all the directories on it. Since this phone is based on the same MSM7200-chipset as the HTC TyTN II, the following information might be interesting to you:

In the registry (HKLM\System ) there is a folder D3DM (Direct3D Mobile?). Under D3DM is a folder Drivers, which contains one field, LocalHook. This field is a string value containing the string d3dm_ati.dll. This file can be found in the \Windows directory. I've attached this file to this posting.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] omikr0n:
Locally hooked drivers are software renderers. So no hardware support I guess. It might be at least MSM7200 optimised, though.

Could you post it here, please? The file is most probably hidden and marked as "system" which is why you couldn't see it. But you should be able to find it and copy it with 3rd paty application such as Resco Explorer.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] ZiYi:
Here are the steps:

1. Open Control Panel.

2. Swithc to Classic View.

3. Open "Folder Options".

4. Click the "View" tab.

5. On "Advanced Settings", scroll down and look for these 2 items:

a) "Hidden files and folders", select "Show hidden files and folders".

b) "Hide protected operating system files (Recomemded)", uncheck the checkbox.

6. Connect your KS20 as you normally did, browse to /Windows directory, you should be able the see the file in question.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Ralph Smeets:
done (see previous post).
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] RacerII:
Could you post the exact reg entry?

I know some of it is in your previous post ,but i dont know if thats all.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Ralph Smeets:
Here you go:

HKLM\System\Drivers\LocalHook = d3dm_ati.dll
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] RacerII:
thanks.

I do wonder if this driver is any different then the htc_d3dm.dll thats on our kaisers.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] FloatingFatMan:
As well as the htc_d3dm.dll file, I also have a d3dm.dll file on my Vario 3...
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Ralph Smeets:
I'm running the GLBenchmark (CM-version) on my KS20 right now. I'll upload the results asap.

http://www.glbenchmark.com/phonedetails.jsp?benchmark=pro&D=LG KS20&testgroup=overall

Judging the results, part of the 3D hardware is working under OpenGL.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] omikr0n:
I've downloaded the .zip but it seems to be empty (and has less than 4kB). Could you please reupload it?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] intothevoid:
i just downloaded it seems fine. it comes to 66.4kb after unzipping. i am assuming you hidden files visible as it appears to be a hidden file
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] omikr0n:
Strange. I tried it twice. Would you mind uploading it to rapidshare or something?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] intothevoid:
http://rapidshare.com/files/74508874/d3dm_ati.zip.html
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] NuShrike:
32-bit architecture doesn't mean 32-bit instruction set in terms of code density. Just like 64-bit doesn't mean 64-bit instructions, but 64-bit data.

ARM has option of 32-bit instructions, or the Thumb 16-bit instructions. Both do pretty much the same thing but Thumb has better code density.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] bouaroudj:
link is not working

edit : sorry my mistake link is working
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] omikr0n:
I've used it a few minutes ago and it worked.

Haven't yet time to try the driver though. Will inform you about the results.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] draxredd:
wierd. on kaiser localhook is defined under HKLM\system\d3dm\Drivers... witch i just modified with uploaded file.

googd news: my kaiser is not bricked, at least... i'll follow up with info asap.

edit: the cube does feel smoother...
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Menneisyys:
Good news :)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Farsquidge:
VERY good news....

It would be great if you guys solve it within the spirit of this forum (that is to get on with it and not petition or moan).

I should say 'power to your elbows' but in your case its braincells and finger tips. :)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] intothevoid:
Can you check if you any opengles dlls on your device and I can't run the gl benchmark i keep getting the application not certified error after i install it.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] draxredd:
can someone point me to an .avi benchmark file to test tcpmp ?

edit nvm, i found some : http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=1343163&postcount=29

brb...

320x240 video : using ddraw option : 102%, 273kbit/s

640x480 video : using ddraw option : 87.45%, 426kbit/s

320x240 video : using rawframebuffer : 198.91 %, 592kbit/s

640x480 video : using rawframebuffer : 84.14%, 416kbit/s (weird as it visually plays MUCH smoother than ddraw test, very near full speed...)

mmm... well

edit: added HKLM\system\d3dm\Drivers\RemoteHook=d3dm_ati.dll and soft-reseted( do ya feel lucky, punk ?)

640x480 video : using ddraw option : 27.78%, 101kbit/s (weird, as not looking THAT abysmal...)

640x480 video : using rawframebuffer : 102.3%, 465kbit/s

edit2 : also just noticed camera seems less laggy under low (very low) light...
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Phil1987NRW:
I've got a LG KS20 too, and i'm very impressed about the 3D-Management.

I found a bug - and i think it's gonna happend becouse the MSM-Platform is new to several Programms. On my LG KS20 there is no SPB-Software running fine - of course only the Games are making trouble with black screens. Only if i disable "GAPI" the Game runs - but slow.

We should test if the MSM-Platform can do more than we ever now - becouse it runs with a very strange GPU. Is there any chance to overclock the MSM7200-Platform?! =)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] bouaroudj:
Same problem for me, can't run the bench too

quake mobile opengl isn't working too

can anyone try call of duty 2 free demo :

http://www.aspyr.com/product/info/62
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Bouloama:
Nice..and now we have to wait for the drivers from the Polaris / Crouse device ;) Bring it on!
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Bratag:
A quick file search of my kaiser reveals

d3dm.dll - 50kb

netcfd3dm2_0.dll -

default_d3d.dll - 196kb

htc_d3d.dll - 93kb

One imagines that for direct draw to work better we would also need to update the ddraw.dll/ddi.dll
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] draxredd:
@Ralph and other LG owners here

could you manage to dump all of the files bratg listed, please ? i gather ddi.dll is the one really mattering anyway.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] omikr0n:
Sorry, but LG's d3dm_ati.dll doesn't work on kaiser. Try my utilities from the first page of this thread.

First of all, this D3DM driver is locally hooked on LG KS20. There is no point in trying to add this driver to RemoteHook. It won't work.

Second of all, neither video playback nor camera software has something to do with D3DM (Direct3D Mobile).
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] omikr0n:
Just tried to run GLBenchmark on my TyTN II and it didn't even start. Looks like LG KS20 really does have some hardware graphic acceleration implemented. GLBenchmark uses OpenGL ES. Does anybody know where drivers for OpenGL ES reside? Because I'm not familiar with it.

LG KS20 users: Could you try to run my D3DM driver detect app and post results here? Link: http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=1621876&postcount=16
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] jym04:
Maybe this LG KS20 would be the light at the end of the tunnel?

I wish Nokia would release those drivers for all of us =D.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Menneisyys:
If you need more publicity, let me know and I frontpage the story and your request for LG KS20 users everywhere.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] omikr0n:
Let's just wait a day or two and try to solve it within this thread. If that wouldn't work out then we will going to need to spread it across the world :-)

Thank you very much for your support.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Chainfire:
Ralph can we get a ROM dump?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] the_ape:
trying to hack in the ATI drivers I get a nasty stack trace.

Microsoft.windowsmobile.directx.direct3d.invaliddeviceexception

So that's def a no go... unless there is a reliance on another OS file....

A dump of the ROM would be a good place to start.....
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] nEuDy:
Hm.. i tried to get any benchmark to run on my TyTN II

But ony Call of Duty 2 runs.. but very very slow :(

GLBenchmark will not run

i found also BenchGLES .. but it says "Failed to load OpenGL|ES - DLL" :mad:

i think there is NO opengl es driver on it..

@omikr0n: i ran your D3DDrivers.exe on my tytn II and oribt..

TyTN II says:

Ordinal: 0

Name: d3dmref.dll

Description: Microsoft Direct3D Mobile Reference Diver

Version: 222101509.67086

On Orbit1:

Ordinal: 0

Name: D3DM TI3D Driver

Desciption: Default Config loaded

Version: 0.0

What do you read out on the device with this Program?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Chainfire:
Hopefully the guy over here http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=342866 dumps the ROM soon. Or maybe Ralph will beat him to the punch :)

You cannot use a D3D driver without having the correct DD driver as well :/
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] omikr0n:
List of all D3DM drivers and some info about them.

Seems like your Orbit has some kind of accelerated D3DM drivers.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Chainfire:
Heh... playing with drivers is fun, until you need to hard reset :X

At least I can verify with 100% certainty now that the DDI drivers from ATIDrivers.zip posted on the first page don't work on the Kaiser ;)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] draxredd:
but from this package we know what files and registry settings we need to adapt... or NOT.

safest route is get our gruby hands on a LG rom i guess.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Ralph Smeets:
I've tried to run that one, but the app won't work, it gives an "InvalidDeviceException" and then brags about "Microsoft.WindowsMobile.DirectX.Direct3D.GraphicsException.TrowExceptionForHr() and other exceptions.

I would be glad to dump the rom for you guys, but I have never dumped a rom, at least not from a Windows Mobile device ;) . While I could use the search, look into the Wiki, or whatever, it would save me a lot of time if one of you guys or girls would explain me how I can dump the rom. Or just point me to a page explaining it in details ;)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] unksr00t:
Ralph Smeets Have a look at this

Also please check here for ROM-DUMPing detailed instuctions:

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=342866&page=6
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Chainfire:
And don't forget the registry dump :)
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] jym04:
You guys that understand of OS's and stuff think we have a real chance of getting those drivers to work? That this might be it? Or there are great chances that this is hard-coded?
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] neilson:
This is xda-developers. Where there's a will, there's a way. There's no such thing as "it can't be done", only "a way hasn't been found yet". This is a lab for all to chip in and help for the greater good.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] nEuDy:
THATS´s RIGHT!! ;)

Together we are the best!

And there´s nothing, that cannot be done :D

And never give up the hope!!
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] intothevoid:
Still no dump that sucks.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] gibs:
:(( interesting topic s'ad that htc do nothing !
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] intothevoid:
Come on LG people you gotta help us out here.
[Tilt, TyTN II, MDA Vario III General] Chainfire:
@ Ralph Smeets

http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=1718401&postcount=51 this is how I dumped my Kaiser ROM...

It'd also be great if you could run the attached utility... and post the two files it creates