yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] aknotts415:
damn...The s7 shot is better.

---------- Post added at 03:34 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:30 PM ----------

S7 pics do look better when comparing both. 10 still blowing out flares on lights. Also the focusing is better on the s7 too :( :rolleyes:
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] regalpimpin:
The s7 has noise in all dark areas, and it over sharpens every single picture I've ever seen it take. This one included.

While that looks great on an inaccurate amoled screen. It's actually not as good of a picture.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] aknotts415:
Im looking at it on a computer screen. The s7 pics while sharpened do look better though. Highlights are also in check on the s7 while on the 10 are a bit blown. Just look to the left of the pink sign in the bottom left corner. The sign is blow out so much in the 10s you cant tell what it is, while in the s7s its legible.

---------- Post added at 03:49 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:48 PM ----------

Id also rather have a bit noise like the s7 shots do and highlights in check than no noise and blown highlights. I hope software updates help this.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] One Twelve:
There is camera shake in the 10 shot that is why it isn't as clear. This is not a camera problem.

Also controlling those lights is easy with some comp as hamdi showed. In nigt shots like this auto isn't going to do the best. You have to assist a little and the shot almost invariably comes out better. Lowering ISO is the most common way to do it, is done on all cameras now for years. When you do that you need steady hands. There is OIS and it works.

Another thing to do is some time go into manual focus and set it at infinity as AF may not get it completely sharp. The AF on the S7 is quick and works well. How well does it work on the 10 we have to see. This could be another reason why shots don't come out as sharp, focus not setting on infinity. An update can fix it.

But the manual option exists and has existed since the M8. You can get tack sharp night shots on the ones for some time now.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] aknotts415:
Well of course you can go into manual mode or adjust the exposure and improve the shot but it still doesn't mean the s7 shots don't look better in auto. In auto the s7 seems to take better low shots than the 10.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] duowing:
It almost seems like Samsung pulls off better shots in auto simply by aiming for settings that will best accommodate user error/movement. They're a little bit noisier, but it gets the job done quicker and people get to say "Look how fast it is!" Using the super slow camera on my Moto Maxx has gotten me accustomed to holding steady and waiting an extra moment or two before I move the phone.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] One Twelve:
I'd be more convinced of that if there were no manual options available on either :)

This was the case in the old days not any longer. There are times the S7 or any other camera won't get it right too. Same answer again.

See the engadget chinese flickr link i posted earlier. There the attempt was made to get the best out of both. By using manual.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] FalconFX:
Most ppl shoot in auto and expect the best possible results. besides, the S7 is so confident in its hardware trhat it actually lowered the ISO and cranked the up the shutter speed to a very unnecessary 1/60s, this shot could have been shot at lower shutter speed for a 100 ISO or so. That's says alot about how powerful its hardware is. Meanwhile the 10 needed 1/30 and 130 Iso (slower shutter speed & higher ISO) to produce a subjectively worst result, with worst focus :)
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] starbase64:
I prefer Photoshop Express.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] Haldi4803:
Yeah,looks pretty good.

To be absolutely sure we'd need a painted grid over the picture.

Hard to see from eyes only
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] hamdir:
Yes I have the device and posted samples to debate that already, bash somewhere else please
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] richii0207:
It's because the lens has smears on it. The fact that most of these "camera critics" do not know how to tell or the fix something so basic like that is mind boggling.

HTC does not have issues with glare. Again, HTC does NOT have issues with glare. If you know how to clean or wipe your lens you will never get these glare effects.

This is quite silly if you ask me, I'm sure if you were to show pictures like that on a camera forum they will tell you the same exact thing I'm telling you. DSLRs will do the exact same thing if you do not clean the lenses good. Same goes for all glass items such as glasses, windows, etc.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] rkial:
The same reviewers test other phones too. Then why is it only an issue with HTC phones? Do their lenses get smeared more easily?
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] ImagioX1:
The HTC 10 does have a sapphire glass lens cover that is nearly scratch proof unlike most other phones that use cheap plastic or glass lens covers that will scratch much more easily. The camera on the 10 is phenomenal however I do seem to be having more issues with smudges on the lens ruining shots much more often than I have with other phones I have had in the past. Maybe sapphire is more prone to fingerprints than some other clear materials used to make camera lens, but either way I prefer sapphire over plastic or other materials for its scratch resistantance. You can always clean the lens, but you can't remove scratches.

Some people on XDA seem bent on trying to find a reason to criticize HTC for even the smallest of things, that are complete non-issues. I have never seen such extreme level of scrutiny on any other phone....
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] RSK01:
From Little India in Singapore
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] ImagioX1:
This would have been a tough image for any camera to take but I think the 10 did an amazing job. I was driving and took this photo that is pointed directly towards the sun. Full auto with HDR.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] Stephen:
Moderator Information,

Thread has been cleaned. Remember if you have an issue with a users post, do not reply to it, but simply report and move on.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] Nosferatu.:
The two in the middle...the outer two are my other friend's rides. The honeycomb GT-R is being sold to our mutual friend since he doesn't need both an R8 and a GT-R. For me, well wife likes fast cars so I primarily drive the GT-R and she drives the Corvette. :cool:
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] richii0207:
Lens cleaned incorrectly, looks familiar?

View attachment 3767149

After wiping lenses properly.

View attachment 3767150

It's improper camera use aka user error. Case closed on imaginary glare issues.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] ChronoReverse:
Some indoor, medium-low light pictures of food. Automatic only.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] RSK01:
Foodie shots :

Indoor low light.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] Jbb3393:
Nice comparisons, what about snapseed? And what's your personal favorite?
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] starbase64:
[MENTION=1919733]Jbb3393[/MENTION]

i prefer photoshop express
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] TheMadcapl:
That make me wonder about my phone lenses, so I took some close shots. Here is the album for close shots of Galaxy Note 2, Htc One M8 and my sapphire glass watch. I cant post link so I put "-" signs.

imgur ---> /a/SDbK2
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] Haldi4803:
Auto: (1/9 iso 2500)

Pro Mode iso 400 (1/15)

Iso 100 1/4

Iso 100 1/2

Full size Pics all on gDrive.

P.S anyone else Problems with .dng files and Photoshop Express?

Strange graphic Bugs and it crashes all the time.

https://youtu.be/W_ueWV4VvTA
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] RSK01:
Pro ISO100, everything else auto.

Auto - HDR Enabled

Just for comparison, S7E

Sony RX100 M4 Auto

Sony RX100 M4 Auto + PSX
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] One Twelve:
What is the url for that drive ?

can you try with manual focus, push it all the way to infinity.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] starbase64:
2016-05-31_04-41-26 by Maik Reifschneider, auf Flickr
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] West Coast Charlie:
What a Difference! How should the lens be cleaned? Just windex and wipe? Many people are going to do just that or use a dirty cloth which can smudge the lens and blame the phone for it's "crap pic taking capabilities"
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] Haldi4803:
Same link where all my pics are, which I post every 3rd or 4th post in this thread ;)

This one https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0BwqG3liwGXQHcTUxT1pCQkdfcE0

Sadly I'm already back from the Tokyo Metropolitan government Building. So nope can't do that sorry.

[MENTION=456666]starbase64[/MENTION] your Photoshop express never crashes and doesn't show any strange color artifacts in night pictures?

P.S I love that blur effect in the Background. But honestly it looks better with Beer in front!

Gonna order an Asahi Super cold at -2°C tomorrow and try to redo that picture xD
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] One Twelve:
A little water and an optic micro fibre cloth. Ones used to clean reading glasses.

The cloth does the cleaning. Can also use it to clean your screen.

Give it a wash in mild soap now & then.

no windex.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] starbase64:
[MENTION=3056043]Haldi4803[/MENTION]

no problems with photoshop express or others
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] aknotts415:
Why is this lens cleaning issue so prominent on the HTC 10 though? I have never experienced this on the Galaxy S4, Nexus 6P, Nexus 5X, Nexus 6, or LG V10. HTC had to use some terrible coating or not coating for the matter.... You may say its user error but this isnt an issue on most phones except this one.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] One Twelve:
No need, the shots are fine :)

the DNG's are much sharper (in google preview!!) than the jpg's you posted. Why are they so soft. Must be crappy resizing from tapatalk. Resize yourself, add a little sharpen then upload so tapatalk does not mess with it. is that possible ?

Did not realise you shot them in raw. Though it was sotc.

---------- Post added at 09:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:15 PM ----------

it isn't usually a factor if you use a case that protrudes a little over the lens.

it can be an issue if you don't use a case.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] aknotts415:
thats not true because I have had the lens issue and mines always been in a case. All my other phones were in cases too. I think its just evident that theres either no coating or a terrible oleophobic coating on the lens that is really a pain in the but and it hurts the camera experience on this phone.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] CommanderROR:
Hi there,

I'm currently on the lookout for a new Smartphone and the HTC 10 is one of candidates. I like the fact, that it uses a pretty clean Android version and also the general build of the device.

Two things I'm worried about though: Screen brightness and Camera.

Currently I own the Moto X Play, and while it's a great device (including a very bright screen) the camera is a bit lacklustre. It can take great shots, but the limited dynamic range (even with HDR) is a real problem for me. The two Samsung devices I used before (S4 and S5) could handle any lighting situation without "whiteouts" and even though the HDR shots tended to look a bit artificial on occasion, the pictures usually came out really nicely.

Since Samsung is completely insane about ruining Android though, they are no longer an option for me. So it comes down to the LG G5 or the HTC 10, possibly one of the new Moto devices that will be announced next week.

Long text short story: How well does the HTC 10 handle HDR in your experience? I've heard both good and bad reports about that, just like the Camera Reviews tend to be all over the place in general...

Thanks!
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] y2jdmbfan:
It does Whiteouts consistently in low light situations.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] One Twelve:
Which case is it ?

On my devices when they're in a case i've never touched the lens. Why would it be different on the 10.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] aknotts415:
Spigen rugged armor, spigen clear case, spigen neo hybrid, i-blason prime(thick case). I think from many reviews and photos. Its pretty evident the lens smudges much easier than other phones and anyone that wont admit it is just making excuses lol...:eek:
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] One Twelve:
Which of those cases do you own ?

rugged armor or the neo hybrids should not be a problem.

Why is your finger even touching the lens in the first place. There is no reason for it to be any where near the lens.

On earlier LG's there were buttons there and in spite of that the lens was always clean.

Anyway, if the lens smudges for any reason, clean it, end of story. It can happen with any phone. Better to give it a wipe now & then.

Which reviews ? reviewers dont use cases generally or cheap thin ones that dont really protect the lens.

Point isn't about making excuses it about taking care of your equipment. That just good practice.

Stop trying to blame the device.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] RSK01:
Ever since this shot on the M8:

I've always have the habit of wiping the lens on my t-shirt, jeans, etc... Just before I shoot. Fortunately, I caught it in time, as not to ruin my Santorini holiday. With a clean lens you get this, from the same '****ty' 4M ultra pixel camera.

The lens on the HTC is just very big and is located where you will put your index finger when using the phone... So it gets oily, I don't think it has anything to do with coating. The lens cover seems to be very tough, don't think it scratches easily.

More samples on Flickr here : https://www.flickr.com/photos/31191230@N07/
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] aknotts415:
There have been a couple reviews mentioning a haziness and lens flare from the camera. Krystal Key was the most recent review that I have watched on youtube. Its not that I dont protect my equipment. I own all the above cases. What I am saying is that I have never had a problem before like i do with the HTC 10 and the lens staying clean. IDK about you but I hold my phone in the palm of my hand. Or sometimes when I take it out of my pocket my hand is on the back. Maybe you only hold your phone by touching the sides or have small hands but I never had this problem with my Galaxy s4 and the phone is the same size almost as the 10. I'm just saying I have never had issues with lens flare or smudginess like this.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] One Twelve:
Angle. Point it one way no problem, another and its different.

I use my other hand to block light even indoors if it is a problem.

I do hold my phone by the sides. I make a claw with my thumb and forefinger whenever pulling it out or putting it back, improves grip. Phone is my pants pocket lens first. The lower half rests in my palm and use my other hand to swipe. I have a bigger screen device so one handed operation isn't easy.

If its in your shirt pocket it will be lens to the top and every time you pull it out there is chance it will get smudged. lens to the top means more chances to get smudged regardless of where you carry it.You are gripping it then by the upper half.

if you have a smudge problem use a micro fibre cloth, otherwise you're just shifting the dirt around not removing it. oleophobic coatings wear with time and can affect optics so i doubt any lens is coated with it.A scratch resistant coating would be preferable.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] aknotts415:
Nope no shirt pocket.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] mariorenz:
Now, I even get no-greenish pics from my M7 since when I accidentally broke the protection glass of the rear camera. Incredible! I thought it was a sensor fault (after the replacement of the previous one due to purple issue). Thus the protection glass can surely impact deeply to the camera performances!
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] Haldi4803:
Always use Raw Mode in pro Cam especially at night.

You can get so much more out of it.

I think it's the Tapatalk resize algorithm that makes the pics here so Bad.

But it's the easiest way to upload pics via phone.... or not?

+4 brigthness

+1.5 brigthness and other stuff.

Dngs edited via snapseed.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] sercos72:
New update is out for Taiwan, camera and system improvements. 1.55.709.5 ( 529 MB )
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] Haldi4803:
Jep....

Why is it .5 and not .1 anymore?
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] sercos72:
Camera app updated: 8.10.751237
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] CommanderROR:
I hope somebody prepared some comparison shots...

---------- Post added at 10:14 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:35 AM ----------

Hi everyone!

I asked about HDR performance on the HTC10 and did not get much of a reply. So, to specify what I'm talking about I'll post some samples from my current phone, the Moto X Play so you can see where my problem is.

The image with the dog shows the extremely limited dynamic range of the Moto X Play. Areas in the sun (grass, flowers) go completely white and lose all texture.

The image with the snail was taken in bright conditions, but with more filtered light, and show what the camera is capable of...if you get lucky...

How would you compare that with the HTC10 Camera?
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] rizevnarastek:
Report what's new and improved asap ?

Sent from my HTC One_M8
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] One Twelve:
It's hard to give a generic answer, because if it does not work with HDR you try other ways.

Generally if the dynamic range is smaller HDR will do a better job than otherwise.

HDR is a not a panacea so don't rely on it always.

Pets with dark hair have magical powers that can fool any camera. Mess up their light meters. The camera thinks its looking at darkness and picks a slower shutter speed, which in your scene will blow out the background. It's not unusual for this to happen in auto with any camera.

There is an extra point of metering. The moto's are average metering only shooters. They look at the whole scene and then set the exposure. So outdoors average metering will be fooled less often in daytime and is a good setting to have outdoors. It work less well indoors which is where centre weighted metering works better. So the 10 with centre weighted metering only will blow out the light possibly more unless they have checks against it. There are trade offs with either metering system. Too much light with average gives a haze in the day which isn't there with CW albeit with overexposure.

So how to get the shot with either

- use flash, hope its bright enough which it might not be given its only led and be done.

- don't focus on the dog but on a spot of similar distance as the dog that isn't as dark.

- expose for the brighter area, which will underexpose your subject. You then bring back the shadows in post. Your subject will be completely dark and it will look like it was a mistake. But you can recover underexposure, you cannot recover any detail from over exposure. If you shoot in raw then you will have still more control.

- focus on a spot that is middling in brightness that is at the same distance as the subject and get the exposure balanced that way.

- frame differently so as to avoid very bright large areas in the first place or reduce how much space they take up in the frame. Which is the case in your second shot. Either camera would get this as there isn't anything to throw things off.

The difference is the light is more even here compared to the first. Softer lighting always wins. Weaker shadows over sharp.

---------- Post added at 03:53 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:49 PM ----------

use flickr.

Its the best way.

tapatalk should either improve their rezing algorithm or not be used in these photo threads. Causes too much misunderstanding.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] CommanderROR:
Thanks for the comprehensive reply!

I'm aware of the special properties of black animals... ;)

However, the issues I have with the Moto and it's camera are not mainly due to that (understandable) thing, but mostly due to the fact, that the dynamic range the sensor can handle is vastly lower than on my Samsung Smartphones. The example was not well chosen...

Thing is: As soon as there are strong contrasts in a motif, no matter whether it's sky, spotlights, sunspots or whatever, i get whiteouts or blackouts. Activating "HDR" mode doesn't really change a thing then. The sensor apparently just can't cope with it. Whil my Samsung S4 and S5 could easily handle a lot of dynamic range, in HDR mode they even manage to iron out the image if you take a shot with the sun right in front of you. It might not be perfect, but perfectly useable.

From what I've seen in various reviews, HDR and Dyunamic Range on the HTC 10 seems to be more like on the Moto X Play, while the G5 and S7 (and the iPhone 6s) seem to have no issues.

Of course, most of those reviews were done before the "Camera Fixes" HTC pushed...that's why I'm asking for impressions here...

---------- Post added at 01:53 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:36 PM ----------

One more sample from me: this one was taken during thr eclipse (partial) last year. It was shot straight "from the hip" with my Galaxy S5, Google Camera app in HDR mode

Despite the brightness of the sun, you can still see the surroundings. With the X Play it would likely be a white spot with black around it, even in HDR mode.

Btw... The "flare" effect is caused by the eclipse, the small reflection below the sun is some kind of lens reflection effect that shows the eclipse quite clearly. It's a "bug" but a useful one...
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] Haldi4803:
Ookkkayyyyyy.....

I can't Use my SDcard anymore.

Anyone else has that Problem after the newest 55 Update?

P.S

Night pictures still sucks at Auto.

Pro Mode all the way.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] One Twelve:
So the thing to do is for you to post more samples that you consider good with whatever camera and have people replicate them with the 10 ?

How close can they come with the 10 and mention what workarounds were used to get the shot.

http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/mobi...one-camera-2016-lg-g5-vs-samsung-s7-vs-htc-10

How far behind is the 10 here ? You could reproduce all of them with just one camera by twiddling around in snapseed.

What i'd do with any of these cameras ?

skip HDR because its a crap shoot, works well sometimes or does not do much or gets it wrong.

Frame, decide how i want it to look. Auto, otherwise get into pro mode, start twiddling the shutter speed until the exposure looks right without underexposing or overexposing. Done.

if that did not do it, play with the raw file.

You couldn't do that on the play.

well, this is clearly one example that can't be replicated until the next partial eclipse rolls around, in

September

:)

I've witnessed one a few years back and the sun's output dropped 40%. It appeared bright but the ambient temperature was suddenly much cooler.

Depends how dark the foreground is. You could brighten upto 2 stops with jpg. More with raw.

An

example

with a 5 yr old camera.
[HTC 10 Guides, News, & Discussion] CommanderROR:
Yeah, I was looking through my gallery to find a shot that was directly pointed at the sun. I don't usually do that... ;)