yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] stevae:
i don't know what your problem is, but it's not the phone, as mine has excellent sound. i am using the exynos version, with poweramp, and i have it tuned to sound excellent on my bluetooth headset. even the speaker sounds good now, but not great. but who really uses the speak for much? but the point is that it sort of pisses me off to hear you guys ***** and complain about everything, instead of researching and doing something about it. this phone is easily one of the best smartphones to ever hit the market, and yet, so many on here are just looking for something to ***** and complain about. life's too short. get over it.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] pyrokinetic:
Bluetooth audio is entirely digital, with the conversion to analog happening in the headset. (You can also have issues there, but they would be from preprocessing). The reported problem with the phone is when its internal DAC/amp is being used, i.e when the phone has to provide analog output - speaker or headphones.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Willyman:
OK, let me share some insights about this whole V4A story, because I think a lot of people are missing the point or are talking next to each other.

The following signal chain is relevant when thinking about how music reaches your ears when you listen to it on your phone.

recording (analog or digital)

mastering (digital lossless PCM - or rare cases to DSD)

ENCODING (lossy - e.g. AAC/MP3 or lossless - FLAC/ELAC/AIFF)

streaming (e.g. Spotify) or file playback

DECODING to PCM

DAC to analog

analog amplified by amp

headphones

What is in bold happens on the phone, i.e. what can be influenced by the phone.

In order to have the most accurate audio, i.e. closest to how the artist and mastering engineer intended it to sound, you want

the decoding to be 100% accurate --> no issue here. MP3/AAC/etc etc DECODERS are STANDARD processes. That's the only way you can guarantee interdevice operability. Encoders come in different flavours, but decoders follow a dictated algorithm.

the DAC to be a good as possible, with the lowest distortion added (THD, IMD, Jitter)

You want the amp to have a frequency response as flat as possible when connected to an active load, low as possible distortion and low crossfeed

So where does V4A come into play then? I believe this is important to understand:

it cannot improve the decoding process (it's standard)

it cannot improve the DAC as it cannot remove the distortion (it is added in a later step in the chain and the system doesn't have lookahead or feedback))

The only argument you could have is that it can improve the frequency response of the headphones + amplifier combo

Now let's talk about that last point. As shown by me and others, the S7/Edge/Exynos/Snapdragon has less than 1 dB delta across it's entire frequency range. I.e. nothing to correct there. You headphones don't have enough bass? OR have a harsh peak in the highs? By all means, please use an EQ to make them sound more natural.

But... what I am trying to point out throughout this admittedly very long post is this: nothing that V4A can do is to improve the sound quality, from an accuracy point of view. What can it do? Funky types of processing that add some form of virtual surround, or make the spatial image wider, or dynamic bass processing, or a good EQ.

If you subjectively think that makes the music sound better, than that is great for your. But don't think for a second that it's making the music sound more real or accurate (bar the EQ to compensate for headphone deficits).
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] tofu-:
Hah, someone posting something logical
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] riso123:
So please explain how,over other eqs v4a injects it's own driver set and manages to produce great bass without forfeiting on vocal?

Until someone can answer that I still don't see it as a placebo as it is a total experience over standard eq apps.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Willyman:
Oh, but I'm not saying it can't be a great EQ. There are very good EQ algorithms, static or dynamic. And for correcting a particular headphone they can be excellent. Personally I'm a big fan of the one in the Onkyo player.

The reason why it needs those drivers is because to do some of the additional audio processing it does. Only a full media player could do the stuff V4A does without drivers. They need the drivers so all the audio from all apps gets routed through their audio processing.

But again, make no mistake it can only ADD stuff that wasn't intended to be in the music in the first place and it can't correct anything. Don't get me wrong, if you like some of their processing stuff, great. Enjoy. I'm just going against the people saying it's "Audiophile" cause clearly it's not.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] riso123:
That sounds a bit contradictory,however as I can't find any information on how v4a actually works I can add nothing to that argument.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Willyman:
? Please point out my contradiction

---------- Post added at 07:37 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:28 AM ----------

Also, something that isn't so well known about EQ app in Android (might come as a shock to some): all the EQ apps you can download in the google store that do not require root and work across all apps (Youtube/Spotify/...) ARE THE SAME except for the UI. Android has a very limited set of EQ parameters you can play with and some surround, bass and treble settings.

In a music player app, you can do whatever you want, but it's limited to the music played through that app. That's why V4A needs drivers, to change the audio routing in Android so all audio streams get their audio processing. I should have explained it better before.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] riso123:
Earlier in the thread you suggested only the phone can process the audio, then layer say that the drivers v4a use perform SOME of it.

In my mind and from what I've seen v4a injects and uses its own drivers in order to process and decode the audio itself, however this is opinion as I have no actual evidence due to the lack of technical information on how v4a works. I'm also limited in knowledge of that area myself.

Aside to that, my argument was and is still that anyone complaining and refusing to try v4a have no place to complain.

---------- Post added at 07:39 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:37 AM ----------

That does explain a bit more actually...
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Willyman:
V4A is certainly NOT decoding the audio. It will already be standard PCM format before it reaches their processing algorithms. The decoding happens in the app. Like I said, decoding algorithms are standard. Android by default supports a ****load of formats through its MediaCodec API. Unless you want to add something exotic like DSD decodign (again, see Onkyo HF player) you'll need to add your decoding algorithm on top op the existing API.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] The Gunner:
I will not root for now, i don't want loose warranty, with Neutron the things are fine.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] pyrokinetic:
While what you say is correct, it may be possible that custom drivers manipulate HW codec parameters directly. For instance, I am looking at the WM1811A datasheet at https://www.cirrus.com/en/pubs/proDatasheet/WM1811A_v4.2.pdf.

I see several configurable modules that would impact sound quality:

Dynamic Range Control (DRC)

Retune Mobile Parametric Equalizer

3D Stereo expansion

Charge pump control

Since most of these are in the digital domain, they would add some form of distortions if they are enabled. Although the android EQ may be disabled some of these may be still enabled because of default settings or whatever.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] chdloc:
Thanks [MENTION=6905437]Willyman[/MENTION] for starting a discussion on audio quality that is worth participating in. I agree 100% with every single argument he made. It is very unfortunate that there is a lot of misinformation in the audio consumer community and the effects of placebo and confirmation bias are widespread. On the other hand, audio "quality" is a very subjective experience and everyone is entitled to tune any available parameters to their liking. However, I have an issue with folks claiming that some black box is the savior of a poor audio reproduction chain. There are often other factors that lead to (objectively?) poor audio quality. I'm personally in the camp of "faithful audio reproduction" (linear audio processing only) and while I have not tried V4A myself, I have a solid background in audio signal processing to know what the offered effects are doing. Plus, the audio samples on their website are unconvincing to me.

As [MENTION=1106195]Williman[/MENTION] correctly alluded to, the headphones themselves (and the overall headphone-amp combination) are the weakest link in any modern audio reproduction chain and it makes more sense to use high-quality, high-sensitivity headphones rather than hunt for the supposedly best DAC.

I'm willing to bet that given all parameters being equal (source material, setup of playback software, and in particular playback levels, and headphones) most people would be hard pressed to correctly distinguish between DAC A and DAC B in a blind test with statistical significance.

Some shortcomings in the headphone's frequency response (or to account for personal preference) can be compensated for with wisely designed EQ, which can actually be done without using any library, see e.g. here for Qualcomm DACs and I'm sure the same can be achieved for Cirrus/Wolfson DACs as well.

To go back to the OP: I would first make sure that all Samsung audio processing is turned off and follow up on [MENTION=4849578]pyrokinetic[/MENTION] 's point to make sure that all "fancy" processing is turned off in the codec itself. If you are rooted, I believe you should be able to use the tinymix (tinymix_lollipop) binary that I attached to the second post I linked to above, to check the status of Cirrus' processing.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] riso123:
10
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Willyman:
Had you actually taken the time to read the spec sheet, you would have seen that those dsp features are in place for the speakers.

From the spec sheet: A programmable parametric EQ provides speaker compensation

in the digital playback paths. The dynamic range controller can

be used in record or playback paths for maintaining a constant

signal level, maximizing loudness and protecting speakers

against overloading and clipping.

There is a lot of dsp processing going on nowadays in BT speakers and smartphones/tablets to compensate for the lack of acoustical volume and driver size limitations.

---------- Post added at 03:25 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:20 PM ----------

You guys are actually straight up changing the biquads in the DAC EQs? Respect :D

I generally don't mock about with EQ, but then I have a Lot of headphones (my job). Only thing I do is have a preset with slightly elevates bass for outdoor situations.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] chdloc:
Neither [MENTION=1106195]Williman[/MENTION] nor I are saying that V4A is a placebo. (Although I admit that my previous post may have made it sound that way. My apologies.) It most definitely makes audio sound different, no question about that. If you like the sound it produces for you, then great! By all means continue to use it. We are not trying to take that away from you. All we are saying is that any sort of sound manipulation that goes beyond linear filtering within the constraints of digital representation of sound (-32768...32767 for 16-bit) will change the sound in a way that has not been there on the original master. That's all. Some folks simply prefer the sound as it was imagined/mixed by the recording/mastering engineer.

I'm not a classical "audiophile". I have fundamental understanding of audio, acoustics, audio signal processing, and associated hardware. I go by science not by claims.

Actually, it was my understanding after actually reading some of the details in the spec sheet that those sound "enhancements" can also be used for the headphone path. The codec itself does not care whether the audio goes to a speaker or a pair of headphones. That's why I'd make sure they are disabled when using headphones.

Yup.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Willyman:
Yeah, your absolutely right, but why would you they be enabled for the headphones path? Anyway, we're on the same page.

I get the feeling we're in the same line of work. I'm a headphones acoustical engineer. You?
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] pyrokinetic:
I read it. Perhaps you should have read it in greater detail as well:

That means headphones as well, and you can see it from the diagram very clearly. Everything in DSP section relates to all outputs.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Willyman:
No, you're right on that part. It could be used for the headphones output as well, but I've yet to measure a median player or phone with EQ applied to the headphone Jack in the standard configuration.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] victorinox1599:
Do you guys think it is just the horrible stock samsung EQ messing with the quality? Seems like a proper EQ in good players like Gonemad/poweramp/neutron would make the S7 a lot better?

S7 edge Exynos
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] pyrokinetic:
Speaking of measurements, at what volume level did you measure the FR on the SD version?
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Willyman:
Max and default. The differences are not worth mentioning.

---------- Post added at 02:53 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:53 PM ----------

Thr curve shown is at max.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] FalconFX:
I find the sound coming from it is pretty good, i use seinheizer headphones with my computer. So i know what great sound is. I use samsung headphones, and the sound is pretty good for a phone :)
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] pyrokinetic:
Unless you use an external DAC, allow me to doubt the second statement. Also, Sennheiser have a wide range of models, some of them are quite...average, to put it mildly.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] FalconFX:
I use Sennheiser PC350 SE, they are 150 ohms (250$), they sound crisp af, separation is incredible, bass after some tuning is fantastic, driven with a DAC that supports 600 ohms headphones, so plenty of power with more to spare.

I really like the sound coming out of the S7Edge (exynos), the sound stage might not be as wide as i want it to be, but still bass is good, vocals are crisp, as i said, good for a phone, i mostly use my phone for music when im out, so there is alot of ambient noise, otherwise, im wearing my headphones listening to some Tropical vibes :)
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] pyrokinetic:
PC350? Wasn't that a gaming set? You should try one of their open cans, sound quality is incomparable. Cannot use them everywhere though.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] FalconFX:
Yeah, they favor the high end to detect steps in fps games, which makes the vocals so damn crisp you coud eat them. But the bass a little underpowered, but with some eq tuning, they are amazing !!
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] @home:
Has anyone been able to do a side by side test with the S7 Edge & the Note 4 or 5 headphone quality test?
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] skivnit:
I'm waiting for my shure 425 to test the quality
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] tofu-:
Sounds perfectly fine in comparison to the s6/e on my se846...

but everyone seems to blow a gasket when you disagree with them
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Willyman:
But then people also say the sound quality improves when you turn the virtual surround on, so go figure :D
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Ausboy 2011:
broke my exynos audio in sounds even better now
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Akeel1994:
The sound is now amazing:

1. Download Poweramp Alpha2

(https://play.google.com/apps/testing/com.maxmpz.audioplayer)

2. Go to settings/Audio/Output and activate High-Res for headphones

3. Activate DVC under Audio/more

4. Now go to the player and open the EQ and set the poweramp slider to the top.

5. Enjoy the amazing sound.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] @home:
There is no Output tab, button or section after I go in to settings - Audio...

How do you turn that god awful equalizer visualization off & go back to album art.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Akeel1994:
Do you have the latest alpha2?

You can get the alpha here:

https://play.google.com/apps/testing/com.maxmpz.audioplayer
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] @home:
I do now, thanks.

Can the visualizer be turned off? It's awful

That setting doesn't work if you WMA files on like I do.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Akeel1994:
Yes, you can turn it off. Just open the player and then there is a new menu on the right side for EQ/visualizer.

Tap on normal there. It will change to full screen. Tap it again and it will be disabled.

You can also change the effect there if you do not like the standard one.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] pyrokinetic:
I have the feeling a lot of folks use compressed (lossy) music for their audio tests. I am sure you know it, but with lower bitrates it may actually sound worse on better audio setups. So here are two flac suggestions: http://www.eclassical.com/custom/eclassical/files/BIS1536-001-flac_24.flac

http://www.eclassical.com/custom/eclassical/files/BIS1447-002-flac_24.flac

On my Sennheiser Hd380P headphones the soprano sounds angelic at times. I tested both with samsung music and poweramp hd output without dsp. Obviously the volume does not go very high but the quality is undeniable.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] M@rs:
Try the poweramp alpha and boost the preamp in the replaygain settings.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] pyrokinetic:
I did try it actually. I prefer it without any form of DSP if the recording quality is adequate.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] The Gunner:
Neutron with 64-bit is still the King?
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] GermanGuy:
What poweramp slider are you referring to? Preamp?
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] dule2303:
thaaaanks thats the sound
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Akeel1994:
Yes!
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] GermanGuy:
So do replay gain and preamp cancel each other out or do they work together?
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Deezy88:
I always buy global version no matter what,i hate usa phone and carrier base,i always had a wolfson but is their a app i can find out on my sg7 edge g935f
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] BennyBenjaman:
If anyone's still seeing this here's some good**** if you already tripped Knox

Install ECHOE ROM (Google It)

It has some powerful headphone output. The best ive heard. Try it
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] The Gunner:
Is better powerAmp alpha 2 or Neutron?
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] @home:
When you look here

http://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_galaxy_s7_edge-review-1409p8.php

They give the earphone quality top marks.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] jayfiled:
I agree that this makes the sound amazing. Are we able to get the same quality of sound using apps like play music? Without root?
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] @home:
Doesn't work with WMA files though.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] jayfiled:
Maybe it is my headphones but i tried an iPhone 6+ for two weeks before i got the exynos edge and the edge sounds terrible by comparison. I got senheiser momentums. Placebo or not, i wasn't happy until i tried the power amp alpha. Now it's better. Pity i don't have any non streaming music to listen to.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Akeel1994:
Sorry, I don't know this.

Gesendet von meinem SM-G935F mit Tapatalk
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Willyman:
I'm 99.9% sure it's placebo...

FYI, you can actually open side by side the standard music player app and power amp. If you open the same music file you can go back and forth between the two players. Note that you need to max out the preamp slider in power amp to match the volume of the stock player. Make sure everything else is turned off (EQ, bass/treble boosts etc...).

If you can hear a difference... you have superhuman hearing :D

EDIT: poweramp pre-amp setting needs to be slightly less than max to match in volume.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Willyman:
Like so:
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] @home:
So much ars ing about to get a good sound from a device. I'm really shocked & put off.

I thought it would sound as good if not better than my Exynos Note 4, not looking like it.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Ausboy 2011:
Exynos sound is amazing for me now. Give the phone time to break in the hardware
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] dave7802:
Maybe i have this wrong.

But i was under the impresion PowerAmp took control of the Inbuilt EQ for Android.

I.e. What adjustments you make in Poweramp work Globally i..e on other applications.

I recall on my Note a year ago, i used Poweramp to control the Eq and then switched to Spotify

and the results reflected
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] @home:
What music app are you using?
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] NaimC:
Volume is still quieter with PowerAmp than using the Samsung Music player, even when DVC is turned off. I hope PowerAmp can solve this issue quickly. It's rather irritating.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Ausboy 2011:
stock music spotify and gonemusic
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] bloodomen2:
yea plugged headphone quilty suck but i noticed the Bt headphone quality is better then my previous Z5

even though its a cheap MPOW bt sport headphones its sounds better then Z5 of S7E plugged HP
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] C0derbear:
Take your headphones and some music on an SD card and go to a store and give a sample listen, and decide for yourself?

---------- Post added at 09:02 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:01 AM ----------

HA!

That must be my "problem" - I usually only listen over BlueTooth (with MPOW or LG Tone or whatever)!
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] M@rs:
Tried the alpha version? It's already louder with DVC and you can boost the preamp if needed
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] AndyBroke:
This phone is actually powerful enough to power my Hegel super usb dac porperly. I have been able to use it on other phones, but with very low volume.

Now my phone have awsome sound quality! :D
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] jayfiled:
It could possibly be placebo that you don't notice the difference. I did your test with Google play music playing seesaw from 'In colour' by Jamie XX, then playing it through power amp with the settings previously mentioned and there is a world of difference.
[Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge Guides, News, & Discussion] Willyman:
You sure you have DVC and other options like Smooth EQ turned off? The experimental Hi-Res output mode simply turns on the Samsung UHQA upscaler, so leave that off too.