yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Nexus 6P Accessories] heleos:
The micro USB cable would need to be rated for 5V/3A
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
Chargers with USB-A ports will most likely only charge a Nexus at 5V * .9A (4.5 watts). Worst case would be 5V * .5A (2.5 watts).

Those are far less than the charging rates you will see with with the charger which comes with the phone, which is 5V * 3A (15 watts).
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sluflyer06:
I completely disagree that using a standard USB brick with an A to C cable is "most likely" going to be .5 or .9 amp at best....that makes absolutely zero sense no matter how you look at it.

Typical/Average/USB 2.0 devices with Micro-B depending on the device will charge at 1.3amps or more. Look at various tablets that are even a few years old and they do this. They do not have QC, no Type C, no USB PD standard, just plain old USB. For some resason you made the assumption that without a TypeC charger that you will only ever get "USB Charging" rate and not "AC Power" rates...which is IMO illogical.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Fenzox:
Nice post, thanks :)
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
I'm glad we disagree! Let's talk about it. Perhaps you can use a tool such as Ampere (link) to measure and prove your hypothesis on charging rates? Once I get my phone, I plan on doing this. =) Until then, all of the official specifications and documentation concerning this point to the phone being able to draw only specific currents at 5v from USB devices. If you have data which counters this, I'd love to see it.

This might be an interesting read for you as well. I'm quoting [MENTION=788304]aaron_huber[/MENTION] again, as he knows more about all of this than I do. The original thread is here: http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=63308227&postcount=47
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sluflyer06:
I can do that. I actually can do one better, I have a hardware inline USB current meter and voltage meter so I'll be able to use that.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
OK, now that's very cool. I look forward to seeing what you find out!
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Chilidog:
Anyone see this yet https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B013...+c+charger&dpPl=1&dpID=31BWckmM7ZL&ref=plSrch

Says it can do 5v 4a max with a USB a to usb c cable
[Nexus 6P Accessories] vido.ardes:
I must admit I'm still of the belief that there is no reason a type-A to Type-C can't do 3A/5V, especially as Google sell a cable and specificity state it is capable of it.

I have bought a car charger that claims to output 3A over a type A port, so I will be trying it as soon as my device turns up. GSam battery is a good app to test, it clearly states the current being drawn.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
We will definitely find out when we get our phones!

:fingers-crossed:
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sirxdroid:
Ampere is another good app to measure the charging current.

Also, one of these dongles will settle all the charging theories better than any app (just make sure you buy one rated to measure up to 3A).

Note that cables do make a huge difference, as I learned the hard way with my N5. I was surprised to see that what I thought were high quality OEM cables from LG and Samsung would only be able to supply 600mA to my N5 while some other no-name stiff cables could go up to 1.2A

Bottom line is that short, thick gauge charging wires make a huge difference, it's not only about the specs of the charging adapter. PortaPow charge only cables worked very well for me. I hope they make a Type C cable soon.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
http://www.droid-life.com/2015/10/19/nexus-6p-nexus-5x-quick-charge/
[Nexus 6P Accessories] dwswager:
Great original post. Unfortunately, it still leaves everyone in the lurch for what to do and what to buy. The real issue is what does Google believe to be "Fast Charging" Is it merely pushing more amperage at 5 volts? 15W is significant compared to 2.5-5W. However, most Fast Charging schemes are designed to vary the voltage and amperage based on the charge level and internal resistance of the system to get the most power possible into the battery as quickly as possible without simultaneously damaging the battery.

Our problem going forward is will companies build 5V/3A Type C chargers or will they instead build USB Power Deliver compliant chargers that support 5V/2A and 12V/1.5A? Considering that those specs also coincide with Qualcomm Quick Charge Voltages....hence, it can be both USB-PD and QC compliant in the same device, but not fast charge a Nexus 6P! 5V/3A is a valid Type C power option, but not a valid USB Power Delivery option.

Google had 3 options and they chose number 3.

Option 1: Support USB-PD where standard chargers would have appeared and we could have gotten up to 18W.

Option 2: Don't engage the configuration channel and just allow 5V/3A chargers. Hence, we could overcharge a Type A to Type C cable with 5V/3A and maintained backward compatibility with lesser chargers (5V/2.1A, 5V/0.9A, 5V/0.5A) similar to what all the QC compliant phones do.

Option 3: Engage the configuration channel, but don't support the full Power Delivery Spec creating an orphan product that plays nice with other PD compliant devices.

I would love to know what Microsoft chose for the Lumia 950XL.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
Thank you!

I think it's a headache because Google was one of the firsts to market with a Type-C phone. That being said, I believe that if we give it a few months, we'll have plenty of options. This opinion is backed by the apparent adoption of Type-C from companies such as Intel (Thunderbolt is adopting Type-C plugs), Asus, Google, Microsoft, Apple, etc. No one is going to want to miss the accessories-sales-bus when those heavy hitters are already on board.

So... yes, we are (begrudgingly, in some cases) being forced to step into the future. Look at it this way though: Your Nexus 6P is so future proof, the future doesn't even sell your accessories yet. Kind of annoying when you have to wait on the future to catch up, isn't it? I hate it when that happens...
[Nexus 6P Accessories] dwswager:
Type C isn't the problem. Yes, we are early adopters and the cables are more expensive. The problem is Google not picking a power delivery/charging standard and simply adopting the high current 5V power spec in Type C. Had they chosen either USB-PD Profile 2 or QC 2.0 as the fast charging methods we would have all been better off.

There is no reason we couldn't have had 5V/3A USB Type A Female chargers other than Google implemented the configuration channel. Type C can do 15W (or 18W). Type A can also do 15W (or 18W). What Type A or Micro B can't do (without a special, passively marked (and therefore detectable) cable is USB-PD compliancy which The Nexus 6P is not fully compliant and doesn't include 5V/3A anyway.

The question remains: Will companies produce 2 USB C chargers or will the build one that is both USB-PD and easily made QC 2.0 compliant, but won't ever produce 3A and therefore never "Fast Charge" a Nexus 6P?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
Yes, but adopting full USB-PD would be pointless. Further, you really only get 2 choices when implementing Type-C. Standard or PD. The Nexus will never need to charge beyond 15W. No current phone needs that much. Besides, standard Type-C fast charging is already better or comparable to QC, doesn't require extra chips/controllers and special compatibility.

On your second point, Type-A ports don't have a CC pin, so they COULD NOT have made this happen anyway.

View attachment 3513370

It's not that they didn't CHOOSE to do this, there was no option for it to begin with.

I firmly believe that Qualcomm's QuickCharging is a great technology that will hold us over until Type-C is widely adopted - and I don't think we're more than a year or two away from that.

Edit: Also, if you dig into the internet deep enough, you'll see 5v/3a chargers and car chargers already are in production. It's just a little early for them to hit retail at this point. =) They're coming! Don't worry!
[Nexus 6P Accessories] kboya:
It's transitional tech. Nothing more nor less. Could've been 3.1, but isn't.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] jimv1983:
This whole issue is confusing.

I bought a few of the Type A to Type C cables mentioned by someone else here.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B013187HZS?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s01

The product specs say "Supports USB Fast Charging @ 5V 3A" so I would think that it must support the faster charging.

I'm also kind of curious how fast a phone needs to charge to be considered "fast charging". At my desk at work I have a USB A to MicroUSB cable hooked up to an old iPod USB power adapter that is 5V @ 1A and it fully charges my Nexus 5 in 1hr 15min. At home I use the 2A(I don't remember the wattage) charger that came with my Nexus 10 and it seems to charge a bit faster than the charger at my desk at work.

Also, I've heard that charging a battery faster can decrease its lifetime. Is there any truth to that?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
There are no definitions for fast charging that I could find. I personally consider fast charging to be 5v 3a capable charging. Now, the phone may not draw that much current from the charger, like if the battery were 75% full already, but at least it could if needed. Anything else, let's just say 2a or less, will still charge your phone pretty quick but that's still 33% slower. .9a would be over 66% slower. At what point do you say it's not quick charging? 50% slower? 25%? I don't know.

As far as battery health is concerned, I haven't researched it, so I couldn't speak intelligently on the topic. Sorry.

Now... The cable you bought, I'd be concerned about that. Since there are no clear definitions for fast charging, and as the droid life article shows USB Type-A chargers can produce respectable results, they can probably get away with saying it is compatible. That doesn't mean it isn't misleading...
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
Just found this teardown of the Nexus 5X by iFixit. Included on the motherboard is: Qualcomm SMB1358 Quick Charge 2.0 IC.

Very interesting. I won't speculate as to why it is there, or if it is enable-able through software (maybe it secretly is already, which is why QC chargers performed like they did in the Droid Life article? <tinfoil hat time> I smell a conspiracy! ), or if it simply is required to let the power management chips work.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] combat goofwing:
This fast charge,USB 3.1 or USB2.0 etc is all very confusing,so I hope you can help.

So the Tear down of the 5x shows it has 3.1 on board but not enabled .So it's safe to say the 6p will have the same.So can this be enabled with a SW update ?.Is it correct to say the 6p only has fast charging from the charger supplied and will not work with other 3rd party fast chargers?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
I don't see where in the teardown you are getting USB 3.1. Can you point that out for me?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] combat goofwing:
Maybe I'm getting g mixed up ,I read that in the tear down of the nexus 5x it had some sort of USB or charging connection chip or something like that but it was not enabled
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
No worries, I was confused too. Would be cool of it had it!
[Nexus 6P Accessories] d60:
Nice post , keep up the good work :)
[Nexus 6P Accessories] km8j:
If we get A to C cables that only support 2.1a,what will happen. Do the charging bricks know not to send more current through in that case? How do we know the cables won't overheat
[Nexus 6P Accessories] ylexot:
The chargers won't know and the cable will fail.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] km8j:
What does fail mean? If what you are saying is true, no A to C cable should work since the max of A it's 2.1A
[Nexus 6P Accessories] ylexot:
The specification may say 2.1A, but it's easy to build a cable that is capable of handling more power. It just takes a heavier gauge wire. By fail, I mean that the wire will heat up and break leading to an open circuit that won't conduct electricity.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] km8j:
So the oneplus cable can only do 2.1A. You are saying that cable just won't work on any relatively new chargers? I don't get it
[Nexus 6P Accessories] ylexot:
Edit: just ignore what I said. I could be wrong. I thought voltage and amperage were important for wire power handling, but I can't find a chart that takes voltage into account.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Brandito:
Just curious where you found the following info pertaining to qc 2.0 and usb type c compatibility.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
I've not been able to find QC documents to support that and the DroidLife article does show the phone drawing higher current from some QC chargers. However, given that the results are so inconsistent between them, and that there are no type-c devices with certified QC, I can't rule the statement as being false either.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Brandito:
Thanks, it seems plausible since no type c device offers qc at the moment, but qualcomm claims that qc 2.0 is compatible with usb type c. I guess we'll find out sooner or later.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] TonyStark R.I.P.:
[MENTION=5550688]Elnrik[/MENTION] thank you for your excellent USB informational thread:good:

[MENTION=4153349]Heisenberg[/MENTION] This may be a good candidate for index placement?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
Thanks! I'm glad it was helpful.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Heisenberg:
Agreed.

Added to Nexus 6P index thread:

[INDEX] Huawei Nexus 6P
[Nexus 6P Accessories] gtg465x:
Regarding type A to type C cables, here's some info from someone in the know...

"Hi. I'm an engineer at Google who has worked on USB Type-C on the Pixel and Nexus projects.

The reason that the Google chargers and cables are capable of 5V 3A support is because not only the cables but the port on the other end is certified for the higher 3A ceiling. You will notice that the cable that came with your Nexus 5X or 6P has USB Type C on both ends.

This ensures that not only the cable, but the connectors and the charging circuitry on the other side of the cable can support 3A before the phone starts to charge.

When you have a legacy cable like this one, the connector on the other side is a USB Type-A connector, which can be plugged into any USB port built since 1997, for example your ancient Pentium II PC may have a USB port that this cable could be plugged into.

NONE of those USB Type-A ports are rated to support 3A, so many of the USB Type-A to Type-C cables available on Amazon that claim they are rated at 3A and configure the identifier resistor to tell the phone to charge at 3A are not in compliance and could do damage to your charger, hub, or PC if you try to charge at 3A.

When you have a legacy cable like this, 2.4A, which is negotiated over a BC1.2 protocol like CDP or DCP, is appropriate over the Type-A connector. Any cable that you buy that claims 3A support I would be extremely wary of plugging into any of your hubs, PCs, or dedicated chargers."
[Nexus 6P Accessories] staticx57:
Perhaps he didn't share this bit of knowledge with the rest of Google because ahem https://store.google.com/product/usb_type_c_to_usb_standard_a_plug_cable It claims support for 3 Amps at 5 Volts. :D
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
That is pretty huge, and the specifications documents I've read support this exactly. I'll edit the OP with a link to your post. I feel it deserves attention from the community. Thanks for posting it!
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
Also, http://www.androidheadlines.com/2015/11/usb-type-type-c-cannot-charge-3a-heres.html
[Nexus 6P Accessories] TonyStark R.I.P.:
He idid in fact respond

This coversation can be followed on Amazon.com HERE
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
OP edited for readability, clarification of information, remove redundancies, added new information, etc...
[Nexus 6P Accessories] RogerPodacter:
Just to be sure, will either of these 2 cables damage my 6p?

I bought from frys a USB type c 3.1 to type c 3.1 and use it with the official wall wart. Purchased from frys (see pic). This shows rapid charging at about 1700 mA.

The white cable is type A to C I got from amazon, using with my old nexus 5 wall wart or my old laptop. This shows AC charging at about 1000 mA using old wall wart.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B010VFFSL4/ref=gp_aw_ybh_a_18?ie=UTF8&refRID=PRVZP1016DRVBM5KWNZC

Thanks for any feedback.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sirxdroid:
I don't think the cables will damage your phone. They may damage the charger or a USB computer port. How are you measuring the mA?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
The one you purchased from Frys should be ok. Type C to C cables use a different method to negotiate current with the charger, and should work up to 3A just fine on the oem charger.

The iOrange cable you purchased has been tested by Benson, the now famous Google engineer, and was found to be compliant with USB specs.

I'd say you're good to go.

If you want a better idea on the abilities of the Frys cable, get your phone down below 50% to 40% battery and measure current then. I like the Ampere app, but anything similar should show you what you want to know.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] RogerPodacter:
Thanks guys. Using good old current widget I've used for ages, love it. Ampere is also giving me reasonable current readings. Current widget is my preference though.

BTW today on ATT LTE speed test I got 84 Mbps down and 35 Mbps upload on this 6p!:good:
[Nexus 6P Accessories] cxm0429:
Exactly! :)
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
Concerning Type-A adaptors & cables

What's the difference between a Type-C to Type-A cable rated at USB 2.0 vs 3.1?

Let's find out.

A USB 2.0 rated cable literally has less wires in it. A Type-A USB 2.0 port only has 4 pins. Power, Ground, Data 1 & 2.

View attachment 3536022

A USB 3.1 rated cable has the extra shielded pair high speed data cables in it which match up with legacy USB 3.1 pins on a Type-A port.

View attachment 3536023

Keep in mind, both cables/adaptors need to have the correct pullup resistor in it to identify proper power delivery capabilities. For more info, see http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=63732463&postcount=228.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] aksd:
Doesn't the Nexus 5X and 6P support PD? http://www.androidpolice.com/2015/1...-but-its-sketchy-on-older-phones-and-tablets/
[Nexus 6P Accessories] staticx57:
Just a thought but that DL article uses software to estimate current draw :confused: I've seen the app ampere which is highly regarded tell me my old phone (lg G3) tell me it was drawing 4+ amps from a charger not even capable of that. I was using a Qualcomm certified charger (meant for QC2.0 devices I do own so not a no name) so it wasn't a dodgy charger either.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sirxdroid:
Here's a test that can be done from the phone to find out whether an A-C cable is compliant:

https://plus.google.com/+GeoffHoff/posts/eMsr1cyw75s

I have this Pleson cable and it failed the test. All 5-star ratings seem to be from people who got the cable for free for review.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] cxm0429:
I will keep my eyes out for more people to confirm but I have read the opposite from many others. One stated he tested it and get a good result. Odd:p
[Nexus 6P Accessories] RogerPodacter:
Strange, this black cable I bought from frys only works half the time. It worked once to fully charge the phone, next time it just doesn't register anything when I plug it in. Very weird.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sirxdroid:
I ran some tests on this cable, see here:

http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=63781153&postcount=25

It's not compliant according to this test, but in practice it seems safe to use, in fact it's kinda disappointing that it's not pushing harder the chargers that can supply more.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] xspeedy:
I don't believe any of this nonsense about the cables not being good enough to handle power because they use "A" type connectors. These type of cables and hardware have been used for Quick Charge 2.0 which performs at similar power levels to USB C rates.

I use Cable Matters A-C cables for my Nexus 6P on a legacy charger (one that can do 2.1A) and the

phone says it is charging rapidly. You don't need 3A for the phone to show this. I certainly don't want a cable that plays by all the rules to legacy USB and will throttle to 0.5A or whatever. That would be utterly useless for charging anything modern.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sirxdroid:
It says "charging rapidly" but have you measured how much current it's actually pulling? I have and I could only get 1.8A out of an Anker 2.4A charger. Not sure how the 6P decides to show "charging rapidly" whether it's simply by looking at the cable resistor or by the actual amps it pulls and if it's the amps where the cut off is between Charging and Charging Rapidly (I think there are 3 levels it shows: Charging Slowly, Charging, Charging Rapidly).
[Nexus 6P Accessories] NCguy:
I think it's the resistor. It will attempt to pull more than the charger can deliver. Either the charger will handle being overloaded or it will try to cooperate until it literally melts. YMMV
[Nexus 6P Accessories] TonyHoyle:
If I plug in a 'compliant' C->A cable into my laptop that can only deliver 500ma, does it catch fire because the cable says it can deliver 2A? Of course not. That's just not how it works. The phone gets 500ma.

If your charger is so broken as to be dangerous then it would fail in all sorts of scenarios and the cable is the least of your problems.. don't import cheap chargers from china.

I think the phone is doing some kind of measurement of max current as I don't get 'charging rapidly' with a cable plugged into my laptop as I do my proper charger - and of course it takes many times longer. I've never seen 'charging slowly' though.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] SymbioticGenius:
If you plug a 500 mah cable without proper resistors into a 2k output, you might get an issue then.

I've only seen charging slowly plugging into my pc at work. Also it seems as though charging rapidly isn't based on speed, but based on source. I plugged the provided small cable into my car charger and it hit 2200 consistently for some time in Ampere. No "charging rapidly". But when I plug into the provided C-C charger at slower speeds it still says "charging rapidly".

Sent from my Nexus 6P
[Nexus 6P Accessories] MrKaon:
Problem with cables is some of them are not using 56 kΩ resistor, so your phone thinks can draw electricity at 3A while clearly legacy charger cannot provide that amount of current, this confusion can harm either side.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] xspeedy:
Re: Sirxdroid

I used Ampere but get varying results. I saw 1.5A and then 1.25. This is on an Anker charger.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] BillyTheRatKing:
So if you have, for example, an Anker Powerport 2 with 2.4A per port and plug in a compliant USB-A to USB-Type C, will the Nexus 6P draw 1.5A or 2.4A? And for that matter, how much would it draw with a non-compliant cable?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
Using a complaint cable, it [your phone] should not draw more than 2.4A. There is no way to ensure it will do this much, as current draw depends on what can be negotiated between the phone and the charger. It also depends on how full/empty the battery is at time of charge - the lower the battery, the more current it tends to pull.

Using non-compliant cables, the possibility exists that it could draw up to 3A.