yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
When a pullup resistor is used, it is put on the CC line and then "grounded" to the vbus line.

However, a resistor isnt always used. Between the Nexus and the Pixel, for example, using the Type C ports to connect both devices, the CC wire is used to intelligently negotiate power - no resistors used. Actual communication occurs on that wire between each device, constantly.

But, let's say you then use a type C wall charger with your Nexus. The charger is never going to be sending or receiving USB data. It will never need to reverse which direction charging is going to happen from, nor will it ever need to reassign data pins to support display port connections (like the Pixel can do). It just has to supply power. So Instead of the charger manufacturer putting all kinds of expensive controller circuitry into the charger to get that same negotiation to happen as it does between the Pixel and the Nexus, they can just use a resistor on the CC wire as a road sign for the phone to see - it hard codes it's specific power delivery capabilities cheaply and efficiently. Different resistors mean different power delivery abilities.

[IMG="table4-13"]http://xdaforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3529027&d=1446518448[/IMG]

Now, when you make a type A to C cable or adapter, you have way more pins on the C side than you do on the A side. For example, any Type A port you plug the cable into will never have a CC pin. That didn't exist until Type C was invented. So, the cable itself has to do the power delivery identification work and must have the correct resistor built on to the CC line to act as that road sign. Of course, You can't just solder a resistor onto a wire and then not connect it to anything - if there is no circuit, nothing will happen. So they connect it to the vbus line, which is conveniently there on every USB device ever made, and is supplying a constant 5v.

On a type C to C cable, there is no resistor at all - when one is needed it will be built into the device which needs to use it.

Hope that helps.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] MoNsTeReNeRgY22:
Wow thanks for the excellent clarification!
[Nexus 6P Accessories] chmcarro:
How do we know which USB type C to A cables support more than 2.0A, up to 2.4A?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sirxdroid:
The non-compliant ones. Even with those I haven't been able to get more than 1.8-1.9A even when using 2.4A capable chargers. But with the compliant ones I'm "stuck" at 1.5A
[Nexus 6P Accessories] chmcarro:
Is this due to too low gauge on the power wires, a limitation set by the negotiation with the charger and host, or the host self-limiting?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
Negotiation between charger and host.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
This is a... misstatement. (I'm trying to be kind.) Cables which do not follow USB specifications do not "support" higher charging rates. They create situations where charging rates vary out of specification due to faulty negotiation between the device and host.

I'd like to avoid creating false impressions in this thread that something is safe or supported when it's not.

1.5A from a Type-A host and correctly built cable is the highest rate per specs. If you require more than this, I would suggest obtaining a Type-C charger instead of using an incorrectly built cable.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] chmcarro:
If a a non-compliant C to A cable is connected to a 2.4A charger and Nexus type-c phone, will they always negotiate 3A? If you see charging at 2.0A, is gauge of wire the limiting factor?

---------- Post added at 03:33 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:09 PM ----------

What happens when you connect a 2013 Macbook to a 12W IPad charger using a compliant USB cable? Will it negotiate 2.4A on BC 1.2 on Apple's proprietary protocol?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sirxdroid:
What you are saying is correct from strictly a spec perspective and safety concern. However, what I observed in practice on an admittedly very limited sample (i.e. 1 cable only) is that the actual current didn't even get to 2A with a non-compliant cable and 2.4A charger. It may be because the charger is "smart" or the gauge of the wire is not thick enough to carry more (I've seen this in the past with microUSB cables).

True, one day it may fry my charger, but until then I will use it; and if that happens it will be an excuse to buy a new USB-C charger.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
It depends on how the cable was made incorrectly. I believe some (if not most) incorrectly built C to A cables have a 10kΩ pullup, and assuming that, it would incorrectly signal 3A charging capability to the device. It also depends on what the power supply (charger) can provide and/or if it has any intelligent limitations or failsafes. It could also be the battery level of your phone. You phone doesn't always draw a full 3A. It will taper the charge from 3A down to 0 as the battery charges. So if you're testing charging rates while your battery is at 70% charge (for example), you'll never see the device try to draw the full 3A.

I would imagine that the gauge of wire is not a significant limiting factor - which is to say that as long as the wire gauge isn't incredibly high (extremely tiny wires), it shouldn't impose a much higher resistance on the circuit.

Beats me. I don't have a 2013 Macbook to test this, nor am I overly familiar with their proprietary protocols. In short - I'm not a huge Mac fan. Sorry.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sirxdroid:
You would be surprised how many crappy cables there are out there that use thin wires, just like there are non-compliant USB C-A cables. They do make a huge difference, I know that for a fact. I had a bad experience with an OEM cable (Samsung or LG, I forget). It looked nice and well made, but the phone could not add charge while being charged in the car, the battery would slowly drain with the screen on (GPS). That's when I bought the USB dongle to measure the current and it was only delivering 600mA and the phone was using something like 800mA. I thought the car charger was fake (it was supposed to be a high quality Scosche 2.4A). The charger was fine, I switched to a charge only thick gauge cable and I was able to get 1.2A from the same charger (max that phone could ever pull). Problem solved. I'm still using the same charger today with the 6P and a non-compliant cable (I know, I know ...) and I'm getting between 1.8-1.9A when the phone battery is at 30%.

Cable length also makes a difference. The longer the cable the thicker the wire gauge needs to be.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
I'm comfortable with my reply. Specs and safety are the scope of this thread.

I would like to direct discussion of using out of specification cables to their appropriate threads, such as this one: http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=63837910&postcount=10
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
I feel you there. I had that issue on my N6 when I first picked up some cables for it for use at work. Unfortunately, Caveat Emptor applies. =( It is also why I greatly appreciate Amazon.com's return policies. =)
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sirxdroid:
Absolutely. People, listen to what Elnrik has to say, if you are risk averse and don't like to experiment, measure things and possibly destroy things in the process.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] chmcarro:
Is there any host that will negotiate 2.0.A, 2.1A or 2.4A with a Nexus device using a built to spec Type C to Type A cable?

I ask because the Google engineer Benson who has been doing all the reviews says yes:

https://plus.google.com/+BensonLeung/posts/HakwCMmd346
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
It entirely depends on the negotiation for power between the Nexus and host. It always will. Further, Benson's post doesn't exactly say yes - it states that while the Apple proprietary protocols are allowed, they are optional. Both devices (host and Nexus) need to support them.

I hate to say it, but I don't know what chargers will actually do 2.4A with the Nexus. I've tested several 3rd party chargers which have some kind of intelligent charging features (such as Anker's Power Port 5), several Qualcomm Quick Charge certified chargers, as well as a few Apple OEM chargers - none of them have charged beyond 1.5A for me.

IMO - You might be better served spending your time and effort obtaining a good Type-C charger and avoiding the entire mess of figuring out which legacy devices will charge beyond 1.5A.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] chmcarro:
Benson just replied on this topic:

"The Nexus 5X and 6P phones are capable of negotiating using Apple's proprietary 2.4A, 2.0A, and 1.0A iPad/iPhone charging protocols. If you get a charger that supports said protocols, it should be able to support up to 2.4A if the cable you use is of good enough quality."

https://plus.google.com/+BensonLeung/posts/4WHE2Spjd63

There is also a Reddit user claiming 2.4A with the stock Google A-C cable on the Vinsic charger's A port.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Nexus/comments/3zqaur/nexus_5x6p_charging_over_usb_typea/
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Afghan39:
Hi Guys,

Here's my experience with some cables and chargers.

Using Stock Charger:

Stock CC; 1.5 - 3.0

Choetech CC (9ft); 1.4 - 2.6

Using Samsung 2A Charger:

Google AC; 1.2 - 1.9

Choetech AC (9ft); 1.1 - 1. 9

As for my experience for a third party cable I would recommend Choetech. For the quality and price u can't beat it.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] davidjan1:
Very nice. But do this Meenova smart & security fast-charge cable/adapter work? It charges smartphones 2X as fast and more than 3X as fast for some phones on the computer USB port. http://www.amazon.com/Fast-Charge--MicroUSB-Samsung-Android-Smartphones/dp/B017LPY7PU/ref=sr_1_17?m=A3UZZ0M53CX865&s=merchant-items&ie=UTF8&qid=1452182613&sr=1-17
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
I have no idea what that thing is or how it works. I also am not here to review or certify products, just to help educate as much as I can.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] kyleruggles:
Finally! a link I can send to people to educate them about USB-C. It's amazing that sooo many people out there think that usb-c is the fastest and does everything. Nah uh! Even professional youtube reviewers think the 6p and 5x has fast data transfers. Oye...

Thanks mate!
[Nexus 6P Accessories] jason-tech-uk:
Just came across this video which goes over 5 top Type-C chargers as mentioned by Benson Leung. All brilliant, but as all are Type-C compliant, for value for money the Orzly one is by far the best! At $4.99 for each cable in the whole pack you can't go wrong!

[YOUTUBE]-sSgoTkujU0[/YOUTUBE]
[Nexus 6P Accessories] 0reo:
But a wire is NOT just a wire. Aside from all that USB technical stuff, more copper is better then less copper, and it was horribly limiting on the micro-usb cables. I fear it may be even worse for the Nexus 6p.

On my old SGS4 I found that even the OEM cable used with OEM charger eventually wouldn't give a full 1.9a charge rate. After much experimentation over the course of months I finally discovered the source of the problem. First, many cables were cheaply made with copper wire that was too thin, which caused resistance to limit the charge rate. The longer the cable the worse the problem. Then there were good quality cables that would support the full 1.9a charge rate for several months and gradually get less effective after that. What I found was that the constant flexing of the cable at the phone end was deteriorating the copper wires inside causing high internal resistance again. The problem all but stopped when I switched to quality 90° right-angle plugs/cables.

Still, even the best cables were only good up to 2m length. Beyond that the internal resistance is too high to support 5v @ 1.9a. The solution is to increase the voltage to compensate for the resistance of the wire. This is why we see standards of 9v and 12v USB being developed.

I fear my new Nexus 6p will suffer for being limited to 5v while requiring 3a. I foresee making my own chargers that will output 6v @ 3a just so I can actually get a full 5v at the end of a 2m or 3m cable.

Type C may be the future but until the devices start using the higher voltages I see it as a cluster-f.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Shaftamle:
He's ☝right about everything! Good post! I had the same issue with sgs4.

Sent from my Nexus 6P
[Nexus 6P Accessories] treezy26:
So I left my charger at work and now I'm phoneless. And since the 6p requires a different cable, I'm screwed. Just a friendly reminder to all who own a 6p, buy an extra charge. I have thousands of the "normal" Android charger, but they're useless to me!!! ???? Just me ranting...ignore me lol.

But seriously, buy an extra charger...don't be like me.:crying:
[Nexus 6P Accessories] jesssiii:
I'd be taking a trip to Best Buy or Radio Shack if I were you!
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sirxdroid:
Buy some microUSB to USB-C adapters, keep one in your wallet. Problem solved. You will not get 3A charging but being able to charge at all beats fast charging. Almost everyone has a microUSB charger around if you are at a friend's house, etc.

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_n...-c+to+micro+usb&rh=i:aps,k:usb-c+to+micro+usb
[Nexus 6P Accessories] treezy26:
Oh trust me...I've already got one on order:good:
[Nexus 6P Accessories] nvigplx:
I understand that most A-C cables are causing problems when charging the phone but I'm not thinking of using any A-C cables/adapters, because I want to charge the phone as quickly as possible. So I will have to go with the C-C cable/adapter, but the ones coming out of the box may or may not work as long as I would want them to so getting some back up C-C cables/adapters(15W) seems to be the solution. I suppose that the C-C cables and appropriate type-c adapters won't cause the same problem as the A-C ones but will it charge the phone in a similar pace as the ones coming out of the box.

The C-C cable I have been thinking of is this: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...rue&ref_=ox_sc_act_title_1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
I don't have that cable, so I can't speak to it's build quality. That said, it should work just fine. Another USB 3.1 C to C cable that I believe many have said was very good was this one: http://www.monoprice.com/product?c_id=103&cp_id=10303&cs_id=1030319&p_id=13034&seq=1&format=2

If you are only looking for a cable for use with your Nexus, consider a USB 2.0 rated Type-C to C cable instead. They tend to be cheaper and you can get them in longer lengths. Such as: http://amzn.com/B0188IB9IC or http://www.monoprice.com/product?c_id=103&cp_id=10303&cs_id=1030319&p_id=13010&seq=1&format=2
[Nexus 6P Accessories] roofrider:
Ok. Can a Benson approved C->A adapter that clears CheckR pull 1.9/2A from a 2A Samsung Galaxy Tab charger? Mine does, and also shows charging rapidly. I'm yet to test it thoroughly though.

The moment I plug in the LG charger, the device pull about 2.5 or more amps, and when i plug it back into the Samsung charger, it hovers at around 2A or less. This also applies when connected to a MXPE 2A charger -- it says charging rapidly with the amps at around 1.5 (sometimes more). However, when connected to a USB port, neither does it pull an excess of 500mA nor does it say charging rapidly (same is the case when connected to a 1A charger; it behaves as it is expected).

So, in my case, my 5X draws an excess of 1.5A when connected to chargers that output 2A. I'm a little confused. I believe it has something to do with the way these chargers are built. The Samsung charger consistently supplied 1.9A (sometimes without indicating that it's charging rapidly; this might depend on the battery level i'm assuming) whereas the Moto quick charger was a little moderate with 1.3-1.5A even though it was apparently charging rapidly.

If my adapter was non compliant, the 5X should have been pulling an excess of 2A (or 1.5A as per the spec sheet) irrespective of the host, which clearly wasn't the case here.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
As the adaptor is compliant, it should be directing the 5X to negotiate for current correctly. The amperage draw from the 5X will depend on this negotiation. As the Samsung is rated for 2A, and it correctly pulls that much, we can assume the negotiation includes 5V @ 2A as an acceptable amount. The Moto charger is a Qualcomm Quick Charge 2.0 power supply I believe? (Your post is a little unclear on this.) As such, Quick Charge 2.0 will supply 5V @ 1.5A, 9V @ 1.6A*, 12V @ 2 to 3A*. ( * = QC specs are unclear from what I've found, so values are approximate. ) As the phone will only accept 5V, it is forced to negotiate for the 1.5A draw.

Because of the negotiation that takes place, the phone may not draw the full rated output of the charger. Look at it this way: Each charger has a list of charging rates stored inside. When the phone connects and examines the list, it has to pick the one it knows will work. Anything QC offering 9V or 12V won't work, so it won't select those values. Further, if the charger's list includes values the phone doesn't recognize - such as proprietary charging rates for other devices - or if the list is missing values despite what it is rated to provide, the phone is still going to pick from the list what it knows is safe.

So, while the device may be rated for #A, you may not get it. Further, the Charging Rapidly text on your phone seems to be arbitrarily displayed, and I haven't been able to figure out with 100% certainty when or why it will display that on legacy host connections. In other words, it's a bad indicator of when you are or are not actually charging rapidly.

I hope that helps.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Nitemare3219:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B017JZX35C?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00

This cable looks really decent and is cheap. I plan on using it in my car with the Tronsmart adapter.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] roofrider:
Thank you. I was beginning to doubt my adapter. I was planning to test it further since I noticed the 5X pull about 2.4A from the Moto charger earlier today. But guess what? I just had a closer look at the charger and it is a Motorola TurboPower 25 that can output 5V @ 2.85A (standard), 9V @ 2.85A (Turbo 1), and 12V @ 2.15A (Turbo 2). In light of this, it doesn't seem usual that the device was drawing 2.4A.

However, isn't all this directly contradicting the OP and spec sheet (and a few other posts in this thread)? I thought no matter what, when connected to a 2.4A charger, the draw should not exceed 1.5A.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
I'm not sure it's a contradiction, as much as an exception to a generalization... ? It's a generalization to say that base specs allow 1.5A on Type-A ports. With that said, dedicated charging devices are all built vastly differently in this regard, and should probably be spoken of separately from computer data ports. Bottom line is - If power negotiation occurs correctly, then that negotiation is going to determine your charging rates. Period.

I could (and probably should) clarify the OP concerning negotiation. I was actually thinking of rewriting the whole thing, but damned if I can find the time.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Cerberus123:
The choetech cables are pure garbage. Those that left 5 star reviews on Amazon got them for free. Stay away.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] chmcarro:
Can anyone explain why manufacturers have now started creating 5V/3A car chargers with USB-A connectors instead of USB-C? If I understand, a Nexus device will never negotiate 5V/3A using a USB-A port, so this would seem like a design flaw. Is it true that no USB devices can negotiate 5V/3A on USB-A? Here are 2 examples that appear to have the ports specs switched:

http://www.amazon.com/Qualcomm-2-0-...p/B019OSX8UC/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top?ie=UTF8

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B018K7LHBU?ref_=cm_cd_al_qh_dp_t

I would think they would benefit from having Quick Charge 3.0 on the USB A port for upcoming phones like the Samsung Galaxy S7.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sirxdroid:
They may just be easy to design and implement this way. The port can support up to 3A but if the device doesn't need it or negotiate for it, it won't use it. You could go up to 3A in theory with a non-compliant cable.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] chmcarro:
Ideally, I would have the tronsmart charger but USB-C for 5V/3A on a Nexus phone, while simulateneously charging a new Q.C. 3.0 device over USB-A. I don't know why manufacturers got this reversed.

---------- Post added at 11:59 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:40 AM ----------

Is there a recommended out of spec USB C to A cable with a electrical gauge good enough to reliably carry 3A?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sirxdroid:
That's a tough one. I bought one of the early Pleson cables from Amazon and it was non-compliant, but I haven't seen it even go above 1.9A when using 2.4A capable chargers. The cable has been fine for a few months now. I asked them if they have any left as I wanted one more non-compliant cable. They don't, the new ones are compliant and they max out at 1.5A for me, which is correct per spec.

As time goes by, USB-C 3A chargers for cars and home will get cheaper so we can just buy the proper thing.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] roofrider:
I have no clue why I'm able to go over 1.9A with a compliant adapter and most are not.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sirxdroid:
Maybe it's not compliant? How are you checking?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] roofrider:
Current Monitor. The cable seems to be compliant according to CheckR, Current Monitor, and Benson. I've discussed my case in the previous page.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sirxdroid:
Enjoy it, buy another one :)
[Nexus 6P Accessories] roofrider:
Haha. I'm in India and the Xiaomi adapter is the only Benson approved adapter/cable I could get my hands on. I bought it from eBay though. I will test it with every charger I have. This weekend I'll pair it with my Innergie Duo 21 Watt car adapter and see what happens.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Nitemare3219:
Disregard. This cable, and almost all other USB 3.1, 1 meter (3.3 foot) braided/aluminum cables on Amazon like this are faulty in some way. They don't charger at the full 3A. Best I could get was 2.6A and that was only one time. Mostly 2.4-2.5A. The iOrange cables are supposedly good, but are a minimum 6.6 feet. Anker Powerline cables are probably good to go though at the shorter length. I was just really wanting a short braided aluminum cable for my car.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
I just purchased the 1.5 foot USB3.1 C to C from monoprice. I'll test what rates I get on charging and let you know. (You can search their site for product ID 13034 for the exact cable I'm talking about.)
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Nitemare3219:
iOrange cables are good - charge at 3A and at 6.6ft too. Using it with my OEM wall charger rather than the OEM cable since it's so short.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] mobile-freak:
hello,

quickcharge 3.0 with USB C from Choetech is it compatible with the Nexus 6P or does it damage my N6P?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
Do you have a product link?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] mobile-freak:
Hi,

of course. This link is from Amazon Germany LINK
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
The cable charges at 3A and is solidly built. Unfortunately, the plug molding is too large to use with my RhinoShield Crash Guard bumper.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
It should work, assuming you use a complaint cable. Keep in mind, your charging rate with this device will depend more on the current negotiation between phone and charger - just because it is rated for 3A does not mean you will get 3A.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] 8en:
im using these cables which are working great.

http://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B0119OI9XU?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00

http://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B019QCZPH0?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00

I'm using this wall charger

http://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B019FCIOI8?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00

and this car charger

http://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B01A6TQJ40?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o08_s01

All charging 3A
[Nexus 6P Accessories] mobile-freak:
I have send my Choetech Chargers back to Amazon and ordered one Charge incl. Cable from Google Store.

I think it is the best way for me