yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Xperia Z5 General] swooc:
^ah, that sucks. but i think i'm still going to purchase it. the histogram is well worth the 3 bucks.

i think people need to stop putting faith into sony for releasing a worthy camera app. users have been asking for a more hands-on camera app as early as the Z. it seems they are focused towards automation, given how neutered the app is on the z5. one can only hope they continue to refine their post-processing, which is currently not that bad. just needs a little more sharpening and less noise reduction.
[Xperia Z5 General] N0whereMan:
I'm not expecting for Sony to make a worthy camera app. They are clearly too lazy for that. However, i do expect for Sony to fix the camera software bugs, so that 3rd party camera apps could be used properly.

Personally i am quite happy with Sony's post-processing. Sony already applies the least noise reduction compared to other manufacturers. I like Sony's "detail preservation" approach more. The pictures don't really need more sharpening. Of course i would like to see RAW-format support, but i think this is too much to ask from Sony.

All in all, this is the first phone camera i am exited about. The unique ultra wide-angle lens is of good quality and the sensor is good. The camera app has big limitations and it is needlessly difficult to use, but i am willing to live with it.
[Xperia Z5 General] rajkant1984:
Macro shot from Sony xperia z5

https://flic.kr/p/DdAkk9
[Xperia Z5 General] rajkant1984:
Two more macro mode:

https://flic.kr/p/DnDbco

https://flic.kr/p/CRstfr
[Xperia Z5 General] doministry:
Actually, can't agree here.

I love the camera app. It's clean and extremely practical, I liked the older one but this one is so much better and cleaner.

I have no idea what are all the complaints about.

The only things which I realy really wish for are:

- improved full 23mpx performance in some situations

- manual shutter speed control

- manual ISO on 23mpx

That would make the camera even better.

I still love it anyway.
[Xperia Z5 General] N0whereMan:
I have explained most of these issues in my previous posts, but let's recap:

- No histogram (every respectable camera app has a histogram)

- No shutter speed control

- No ISO control in 23/20MP modes

- In manual mode, 1/8s max shutter speed

- In scene modes, 1s max shutter speed (can't control ISO in scene modes)

- Shutter speed and ISO not displayed while shooting

- No custom white balance

- No RAW-format (most of the serious competition has the option to shoot RAW nowadays)

- No focus lock option (in addition to half-pressing the shutter button)

- Switching to review mode takes waaaaayyyy too long (takes 3-4 seconds, which is by today's standards unacceptable)

- Very long shutter lag. Relative (compared to focusing speed) shutter lag most likely worst i have ever seen. Meaning, compared to focusing speed, shutter lag is many times longer

- In video mode, no expose lock, no white balance lock (makes high quality moving video shooting practically impossible)

- Sony's marketing of 'Manual mode' disgustingly misleading, there is no such thing on this phone

- The most severe flaws are the software bugs that make 3rd party camera apps practically unusable

All in all, the Sony's camera software is absolutely disgusting. Most likely the worst camera software implementation i have ever used anywhere. And i have used a lot of different cameras. There are difficult but doable workarounds to many of the problems, but the software implementation does make photography too difficult or even impossible in too many situations. Completely needlessly.

As i have said, i am willing to live this crap of a software. The unique high quality ultra wide-angle lens is the main reason for this. Also the image stabilization when shooting video is groundbreaking. Too bad that the software otherwise makes high quality video shooting impossible.

The camera hardware is of very high quality in this phone, that's why it's so disappointing and frustrating that the software fails to deliver even a decent performance.
[Xperia Z5 General] rajkant1984:
Totally agreed on software stuff of sony...disgusting post processing, hardware is perfectly fine
[Xperia Z5 General] N0whereMan:
I am not complaining about Sony's post-processing. I actually like the post-processing. It's in my opinion the best on the market at the moment.
[Xperia Z5 General] rajkant1984:
I have posted certain pictures, you can review if you want.☺
[Xperia Z5 General] swooc:
^your photos shows refined post processing, compared to older iterations and of competing brands. but again, my personal opinion is they are just a tad soft, and could do with a tiny bit more sharpening.

the overall design of the current camera app is not bad. it's just the way it has been implemented that is laughable. specifically the manual mode, after using LG's camera like interface and the freedom to control, you can only wonder why sony even call it manual mode.
[Xperia Z5 General] doministry:
Thanks for this. Well, we don't fully agree here.

For me the manual ISO and Shutter speed are important and should be implemented.

And sorry, but I actually think the software helps to use the phone in almost any scenario.

At least when you know what you're doing which is obvious.

Shutter lag? I have no idea what you're talking about.

You say they shouldn't call it Manual.... Than you're wrong here.

They can call it this way. It still gives you a great control (over smartphones camera).

Anyway, what I think is to call the software sh..t we should have bad photo/video quality.

And that is great on this phone.
[Xperia Z5 General] N0whereMan:
Let's keep in mind that i have been a photographer for a long time and i have used many different kind of cameras, including many high end phone cameras in recent years. So i look at these issues from a photographers perspective.

So you are honestly going to tell me that Sony is correct when saying this phone has a "manual mode"? That is a weird statement. In this "manual mode", you can't control ISO, shutter speed (or aperture) or white balance. The longest possible shutter speed is 1/8s. There simply is no justification for calling this a manual mode. Z5's camera app does not have a manual mode.

I have seen A LOT of different cameras, and i have never seen a more misleading name for a camera mode. Can you give me an example where "manual mode" is used as misleadingly as in Z5? Having an exposure compensation slider and a few white balance presets simply CANNOT be called a manual mode. This is disgustingly misleading marketing from Sony. This is not acceptable.

Z5 has a long shutter lag. Longer than the competition. Yes, i have noticed this problem when actually shooting moving objects. Z5 has one of the fastest focusing speeds i have ever seen in any camera. It gives an impression of a snappy performance, but the shutter lag ruins this aspect of the camera. It is a camera software issue.

How can you say this the software helps to use this phone camera in almost any scenario? The camera app simply does not give you any information while shooting. You can't see ANY photography related parameters. No shutter speed, ISO, exposure compensation or white balance values without diving in the menu. You can get to shutter speed value ONLY by switching to review mode (which takes way too long on the camera app) AFTER the picture has already been taken. I even don't know how Sony could make photographing with this phone more difficult and annoying.

As i have already said multiple times, Sony's camera hardware and post-processing is very good. You can get high quality photos in most situations. In most situations, high quality videos cannot be shot with the camera app, because there is no option to lock white balance (exposure lock is not as important, in my opinion).

From a photographers point of view, Z5's camera software (excluding post-processing) really is a joke. What makes this situation is even more embarrassing for Sony, is the fact that 3rd party camera apps cannot be used on this phone properly. This also is an issue with Sony's camera software.

This really is just laziness from Sony. I own a Sony NEX-6 mirrorless camera, and it has a very good camera ergonomics and software implementation. So Sony undoubtedly does have the know-how to make a good camera software. We as end users should not be happy about the current situation.
[Xperia Z5 General] Chirag22ster:
Hello everyone.

I am looking for a high end phone with a very good camera. I have always been a Sony user, currently using Xperia Z1. I had almost decided to buy Z5 dual thinking its a no brainer with great camera. But after reading many mixed reviews about camera, i am confused. LG G4 is supposed to have the best camera. Dont wanna spend 45k only to find out that the camera is poor or weaker than other cheaper counterparts.

Headphone music quality of Sony and waterproof features are another plusses which i prefer.

Please advise.
[Xperia Z5 General] Rogoshin:
Good thing I am no photographer, because then I can enjoy the camera app. I don't know much about many things written here, but I enjoy the app.

Sendt fra min E6653 med Tapatalk
[Xperia Z5 General] zacharias.maladroit:
[MENTION=7146050]N0whereMan[/MENTION]:

you're right software can play (and does !) a HUGE role in image processing

currently having a Note 3 with a Note 5 port ROM and Note4 (or Note 5?) camera software which is by all means superior in speed and picture quality compared to the old "stock" camera software - also the software is way more user-friendly, customizable and versatile

(when taking the focusing time part into account with the old software had slightly better picture quality but oftentimes there's no time to give it that much exposure time, e.g. during lectures, etc.)

Sony is really shooting themselves into their feet (and probably even other body parts) by offering this bad camera software - and not only in the camera department;

judging from the phone reviews the Z5 doesn't even offer app permissions management which in my books nowadays is a clear must to enhance privacy and security (see Note 5)

but this is getting off-topic ...

anyway: I'm looking forward to the Z5 - didn't have a sony smartphone so far ...
[Xperia Z5 General] EQ2000:
If you are rooted and have recovery then use this camera update (comes with Z2 or better libraries that improves image processing greatly). Just installed it last week and the difference is superb! The first link in the post. http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=63794286&postcount=264

I use it and just been testing it at home first hand with Z5 Compact Rev 2, latest updates and the difference is minimal in most conditions. Kinda a tradeoff due to post processing libraries where Z1 is better in some conditions and Z5C better in others. Medium light the Z1 with update in link above does much better white balance according to real life scenery (warm colored scene, orange/yellow lights) but in low light (ISO 1600+) the Z5C does better with more blue where the Z1 goes for more yellow. Z1 photos though has more intensity and clarity but part due to different shutter speed and ISO balance. Looks nicer though although not closer to reality.

The Z5C though gets a more muted image which comes by increasing the blue color channel which naturally dims and black areas get a bluish tone while the Z1 has no 'leaking' colors. The ideal would be a result inbetween both phones which would be near perfect!

As for post-processing the Z5C goes for more noise reduction and then sharpening along pronounced edges which is IMO kinda ingenious to do in 23MP mode as most will downscale the images thus removing a lot of the noise but smoothed out finegrain detail wont come back and so it will give less detail than my Z1 in 21MP (after dowscale, 2048x1536) and barely any difference in noise amount. It is damn good though in SA 8MP mode.

Else the Z5C is quite aggressive with the ISO and I think part of it is for stabilisation (SA and manual mode) and also to compensate exposure to take into account for the increased blue and how it lowers intensity. Also the camera app leaves a lot to be desired as you can only counter ISO by changing the EV and that is a pain as you cant be sure how it will change the ISO to shutter speed balance as it is different for different lighting conditions and live preview viewfinders on phones never show exactly what you will capture. Also focusing is damn fast but 'shutter lag' just makes it take photo in par with my Z1.

Seems to me there is room for improvement regarding the Z5C in several areas. That said it produces superb photos but unless for other reasons than camera then keep your Z1. :)
[Xperia Z5 General] gm007:
??true story thanks
[Xperia Z5 General] Chirag22ster:
[MENTION=6922850]EQ2000[/MENTION]

Many thanks for your response. I dont have rooted phone, not much into rooting n all.

My Xperia Z1 for some reason now produces very soft images. Dont know why. And its got too slow with battery drain issue. After a full charge at 8:00am, my battery reduces to 30% by 1 pm.. I am still on kitkat.

Has sony planned dor a camera update?
[Xperia Z5 General] pressytcn:
Not bad but compared to the sgs5 it lags detail like the vains in the leafs
[Xperia Z5 General] N0whereMan:
Nice to see another photographer who has ended up on a Z5.

Yes, the camera app is sometimes slow to launch. Also, switching to review mode to check focus/blur takes about 3-4 seconds. That it ridiculously long time. If X-reality engine is on, it takes about 6 more seconds to render full resolution image. So in total, it takes about 10 seconds to check the focus :) This is beyond ridiculous. Fortunately, by disabling the X-reality engine, the rendering happens in less than a second. In addition, X-reality engine makes the photos look horribly unrealistic on the phone's display, so i strongly recommend disabling the X-reality engine from the settings.

The corner softness is a feature of the bright ultra wide-angle lens. It really can't be called a flaw. No other smartphone has as wide-angle lens. Also, Z5's camera (like every camera phone) does not have a diaphragm, so the aperture is not adjustable. Aperture value will always be f/2.0. If the aperture was adjustable, corner softness would most likely be less severe when stopped down.

You are right, the 'manual mode' is far from a real manual mode. It really can't be called even a P mode. Every P mode that i have seen let's you to control ISO at full resolution. Z5's 'manual mode' does't even allow that.

In low light Z5's algorithms keep the shutter speed at 1/32s until ISO 1000. This is a stupid feature. Even without a OIS, most people are able to take blur free hand-held pictures at 1/16s with an ultra wide-angle lens. That's why, in low light situations, best image quality is achieved by controlling ISO manually (ISO is controllable only in 8MP mode).
[Xperia Z5 General] TheWarKeeper:
Yes, shooting low light pictures with xperia z5 should always be done in 8mp resolution a 20mp manual picture in low light looks like crap compared to the 8mp picture of same phone, try it ull be amazed.
[Xperia Z5 General] Zratul:
Oh yeah you're right, we cannot change the aperture on a smartphone I totally forgot XD

I never shoot with 23MP, as the Sony algorithms and apps are optimized to work in oversampling
[Xperia Z5 General] N0whereMan:
I agree that Sony's algorithms are optimized for 8MP mode. Still there is no doubt that 20MP will give you better image quality in every situation, if you post-process your images. Personally, i post-process all my images that i consider worth saving.

Whether shooting in bright or low light, 20MP will get you better quality if you are ready to do some post-processing by yourself. It's just that we are forced to switch to 8MP in low light to obtain control over ISO.

The extra detail and information in 20MP mode gives you more wiggle room for post-processing. I'm impressed how well 20MP images hold up in post-processing. In addition, because Z5 has an ultra wide-angle lens, the camera is unsuitable for normal everyday use without cropping, in most situations. For example, if you are going to shoot single people (portrait style), you need to crop quite heavily to avoid the ultra wide-angle distortion. Only 20MP mode gives you enough detail for heavy cropping in the center of the frame. This naturally only works in good light. In low-light, high quality portrait style shooting is practically impossible with this phone. This is the trade-off that we are making when we select a camera with an ultra wide-angle lens for everyday shooting.
[Xperia Z5 General] RiTCHiE007:
I just want RAW support to come in the marshmallow update but i doubt it will ever happen so maybe we should demand this now because android 5.0 camera api supports raw!

So anyone knows them twitter account of them sony phone devs?
[Xperia Z5 General] N0whereMan:
RAW-format would be nice, but it's not my first priority. RAW support would increase the dynamic range a bit, and white balance could be set afterwards.

First and foremost i would like to have a RGB-histogram. On such a small sensor, RAW-format would not increase the dynamic range that much. Optimizing the exposure with a histogram would increase dynamic range more.

Next feature on my list would be displaying the shutter speed while shooting. That would make low light shooting and ISO optimization significantly easier.

After that I would like to have access to longer shutter speeds in "manual mode". Currently longest shutter speed in the "manual mode" is 1/8s. There is absolutely no reason why 30s exposures are not available, like on LG G4.

After these features, RAW-format would be next on my list.
[Xperia Z5 General] swooc:
^i agree. that would be my list of priorities as well.
[Xperia Z5 General] TheWarKeeper:
Even with post processing youll never reach the same quality in low light as the 8mp mode, no matter what post processing you do, 8mp mode has much bigger ISO range, also in low light 23mp pics come with several artifacts which even after removed they do not look as great as a photo shot at 8mp.
[Xperia Z5 General] Zratul:
I also want to add that post-processing in RAW is fine me but for JPG, I would only crop/resize as JPG doesn't really store all the lighting data.
[Xperia Z5 General] doministry:
I really appreciate your experience and I'm not going to argue with that.

I also don't want to force you to change your mind or whatever.

What I want to say is that for me the UI is perfectly fine. It's logical and f... simple.

I mean sorry, but there are some other Sony cameras which have quite unintuitive UI (this was stated in reviews).

I also went through menus of some other DSLRs and you have to be a photographer to get to anything actually.

I just say for me it works like a charm, I learned the new Z5's UI in 5 minutes.

How did I dare to say it actually HELPS? Because I use it every day and yes it's HELPFUL.

Just everything is there, from some manual settings to the Scenes mode.

I mean I understand your needs, but honestly I am not that dumb to forget the ISO settings I just set a minute ago,

that I'd need it displayed onscreen all the time. It's maybe just me but I feel some of your complaints are just made to complain.

What I totally agree with is lack of some manual controls. ISO in 23mpx and shutter speed just should be there!!!
[Xperia Z5 General] N0whereMan:
I still don't understand how you can claim that Z5's camera app is helpful. It DOES NOT show ANY photography related information while shooting. Absolutely none. From the perspective of photography, we are forced to shoot completely blind. What kind of camera UI is that? Absolutely horrible. It simply does not get any worse than this, from UI perspective. Yes the app is simple. It is simple because it lacks majority of BASIC camera functions.

If you really want to continue shooting completely blind, go right ahead. I do believe you are in the minority on this issue.

For example, digital camera software without a histogram is a joke. There is no way around this. Digital camera software without a histogram simply CANNOT be taken seriously.

I think my list of features lacking in Z5's camera app is very reasonable. I am only complaining about the lack of BASIC camera functions. For example, on Sony NEX-6 these basic functions are readily available. It's true that some more advanced and rarely needed settings are buried in unintuitive menus, but the BASIC camera functions are very easily and logically available.

At full resolution, on Z5's camera app there are NO manual functions available in the "manual mode". Not even one. At full resolution, there are NO scene modes available.

Sony really should be called out on marketing Z5's camera app as having a manual mode. This is absolutely disgustingly misleading marketing. There simply is no way around this issue.
[Xperia Z5 General] Paninno12:
I've been testing my brothers Z5 camera in comparison with my S6 edge +.

The Z5 camera is nowhere near the quality of the S6 e+. When you start zooming on a picture the details are just not there. I've attached a couple of pics to show you the image processing effect applied on the Z5.

I'm not an expert with camera, I just expect them to work on auto mode. Even my old LG G3 on marshmallow is doing better in term of details when zooming (and takes the pictures faster)

Really disappointed :crying:

Pics: Z5 / S6 e+ / G3
[Xperia Z5 General] EQ2000:
I see no ISO and shutter speed info and where is the crop from, center, edges? Anyway the Z5 is actually giving the best natural detail there. S6+ is overprocessed and to a certain part the G3. Z5 photo looks underexposed. G3 and S6+ looks to have unatural white balance. You also aint taking into consideration the wide angle lens which means even if you stand at same distance as the other cameras the Z5 photo will look like you are standing further away which of course impacts pixel peeping detail but in return you capture more scene detail. Either you move closer with the Z5 or further away with the S6+ and G3. Then you will see how the Z5 easily beats them.

Anyways well done comparisions done properly and with info have shown the Z5 has the upper hand. So does the whole Z1+ series, give or take. Especially in low light (ISO 1000+).

http://www.manilashaker.com/sony-xp...v10-galaxy-note-5-nexus-6p-camera-comparison/
[Xperia Z5 General] fabiooli:
Not satisfied as well. Bought my last week, I was using a Samsung Galaxy edge +. Z5 camera is light years behind...

And mine unity is so laggy, the camera app is the worst, takes 5 secs to open and crashes very often.

Miss my S6 Edge + like hell.
[Xperia Z5 General] doministry:
So exchange your faulty unit for a good one.
[Xperia Z5 General] TheEndHK:
There are a couple of guys here keep defending if you read the whole thread, so I ignored this thread for a long time. They will just try to put everything out in all effort and said Sony is best and Samsung and LG are all suck only bad while in reality, there is no perfect or best phone camera(or even DSLR) in the world. They clearly are attempting to misleading others here but I just won't have time to discuss with them.