yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Nexus 6P Accessories] rufflez2010:
Right... So it's cheaper on eBay for those without... As I said in my first sentence
[Nexus 6P Accessories] seezar:
Gotcha. Thought the last sentence was implying in general it was cheaper. Sorry :)

I received the charger today, I'll have to see if I can determine if it'll output 3A on a single port.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] sean222:
Dammit I wish I read this thread first. I thought official Google USB-C to USB-a cable + 5v/3A USB-A car charger would rapid charge...the cable cable is limited and this charger is useless, I'm out $14 :( Poop. Now I have to buy a USB-C car charger AND a USB-C to USB-C cable....PFFFFT.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Powell730:
from a cable thats in spec?? i didnt think that was possible... i believe they max out at 2.4a or something.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Gibodean:
See Benson's comments on his "USB-C Cables and Nexus Accessories" spreadsheet. I can't post links yet, but here's the excerpt :
[Nexus 6P Accessories] xxprodigyxx11:
≈ 30% Although I was getting low readings on the oem wall charger today too, so might be my phone. I'll try again tomorrow.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] andy o:
Guys, the "rapid charging" label has proven to be just short of meaningless. I was doing "rapid charging" with 2 different (cheap) C-C cables on the N6P, while they were charging considerably slower (about 1.6 or so IIRC) than the Google C-C and the Monoprice USB 2.0 C-C cable. Then there's this next thing that I just learned yesterday:

In-spec A-C cables can do up to 2.4A if the phone and charger support such proprietary protocols. After I saw someone mention on G+ that they were getting 2.4A on an Anker charger with an in-spec cable, I tested it and sure enough, my PowerIQ charger was giving me around 2.4A (measured both with Battery Monitor Widget and a hardware USB power monitor which were giving pretty much the same readings). The thing is, it only did sometimes, not even most of the time. Usually it gives about the expected 1.5-1.6A, but every few times I connected it, the current went to 2.4A after a couple of seconds of negotiation.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] aalupatti:
I have a quick charger 2 for my car. Currently using micro USB cable with USB c adaptor. I gets around 1.4 to 1.6 A per hour of charging... Not bad but would love to get so, e faster charging. But going to hold off for a couple of months till good 3amp chargers are out
[Nexus 6P Accessories] dwswager:
And Benson Leung, when he states "while the Type-A connector on the other end and any device you plug into cannot possibly support 3A" would be WRONG. Mr Leung is a SOFTWARE engineer. What he should say is that the USB specifications never anticipated a 3A current Type A device. But the Type A connector can support 5A and the cables can support 3A. Hence you can design and build a Type A 3A solution that works fine and is perfectly safe, but it is not part of the USB specifications.

But remember, the USB charging spec addendum to USB 2.0 came about because companies demonstrating the desire and need for higher power solutions than the in force specification was anticipating. Hence, we have higher power because people went around the spec.

BTW, this demonstrates the problem when people don't understand the technology and only understand what they are told to do by the specifications.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Brandito:
Start reviewing cables on amazon, assuming you have the credentials to be taken seriously, you might get the same respect he is.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] dwswager:
LMBO. Didn't know credibility came from reviewing cables on Amazon. I thought it came from being correct.

"Please pay attention, I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you!"
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Brandito:
His credibility comes from his occupation and experience developing devices that actually use USB type c. I don't know anything about you yet, so please don't be offended if I don't give your opinion the same weight as his.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] andy o:
I have seen you now for a long time trying to undermine Benson's arguments and reviews, even when others more knowledgeable here have answered your criticisms. What's so wrong about getting people to buy in-spec cables? Even if you are right that out of spec Type-A could support however many amps, Benson (and all the other people) are right in that that's not the optimal thing to do. You are talking in theory, but in practice it's way easier to stay within spec than hoping that that cheap "3A" charger is going to actually be safe to use at all times, besides the fact that there aren't many of them. Benson is getting manufacturers to wake up and follow spec. Why be against that?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] nrfitchett4:
USB Type-C Car Charger,Tronsmart 36W 2 Ports Rapid Car Charger with Quick Charge 2.0 Technology.Attached USB Type C Cord for Nexus 6P, Nexus 5X (Not Compatible with Google Pixel) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0146FK3G0/ref=cm_sw_r_other_awd_C5bwwbX2X9SFW

I've been using this one since I got my 6p and it charges just fine with built in cable, getting at least 1% per minute while in the car. Maybe it will burn out at some point but I find his methodology flawed because he is testing with a Pixel which I'm guessing is going to attempt to draw more power charging than the 6P, which is why it would blow the charger that doesn't have the right resistor. He really should test these with one of each device. I am hoping that they update it with the proper hardware but my phone likes this charger just fine and runs cooler on this than the stock wall charger and cable.

Edit: looks like manufacturer has updated title that it isn't compatible with Pixel.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] thephatness:
You're trying to reason with someone who has stated that a $20 product should be able to improvise and adapt to changing circumstances. He has cannonballed into the pool and now is tugging our arms to convince us that the water is fine. Just let him have this.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] andy o:
This charger doesn't appear to be a "real" Type C device, that's probably why they used a captive cable. Functionally is the same as a Type A with one of the bad cables attached to it, that tricks the device into requesting 3A regardless of how much the charger can provide. And this charger is only rated for 2.4A. The Nexus phones can charge at up to 3A, so the fact that he used a Pixel is not really relevant. Any device that can pull 3A will attempt to, if the bad cable is used.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] aalupatti:
So there is no car charger yet that can provide full 3amp charging power, right?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] evo5ive:
^^^ This! ^^^

Agree 100%. Benson is calling manufacturers out for taking shortcuts. End result - we get better quality, safer cables. If that means the cable will cost me $1 extra then so be it.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] andy o:
There is one that appears to be the same one but sold under different brands, most are buying the Vinsic branded one after Benson reviewed it: www.amazon.com/Charger-Vinsic®-Standard-MacBook-ChromeBook/dp/B014F2NQ36/ The one from Monoprice appears to be the same, only all-black.

If you need to use the 2 ports simultaneously though, you might have some trouble. I only quickly tested it and it appeared to pump out about 3A as measured with Battery Monitor Widget. I don't think any apps are going to be very accurate depending on your device, cause AFAIK they just extrapolate the current from other battery measurements, but on my N6P the readings from BMW correlate pretty closely with readings from a USB power meter (which can't be used on C-C, but can on A-C).
[Nexus 6P Accessories] dwswager:
It is never been my contention to undermine Mr. Leung. In fact, I have praised the fact that he is bringing to light not only the issue, but what cables are in spec and which are out of spec. The useful information he provides however is limited to whether the cable has the correct pullup resister, that the Chromebook Pixel 2015 will not charge with a cable that has the wrong pullup resister and that the Chromebook Pixel 2015 might attempt to draw 3A even when 3A is not available.

It is unequivocal that a Type A charger can deliver 3A if the power inverter is designed for to deliver 3A. The connectors and cable will handle 3A. How the 6P reacts versus the Chromebook Pixel 2015 will be different. As will every other PD and charger.

---------- Post added at 06:02 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:43 PM ----------

Hmm...so you believe the occupation of computer programmer qualifies someone to USB power delivery design? Or is it merely because he works for Google that provides that credibility such that the kid in the Google mail room is also credible?

I can't compete with that! I am just a Nuclear Engineer by education and analyse military weapon systems (having worked 187 systems and pre-systems acquisition programs) identifying critical components (hardware and software) that execute mission critical functions and then testing the components for vulnerabilities to adversarial threats. Prior to that all I did was spend 10 years analyzing nuclear power reactors, nuclear weapons systems and radio-isotopic thermal electric generators to determine operational failure mechanisms.

But the good thing is nobody has to "trust" me. Others on this forum have already proved that you can get 3A from a Type A charger to the 6P. Best of all, everyone can prove it to themselves by getting a charger verified to deliver 3A and testing it out. This is not nuclear physics folks. It is simple DC power delivery.

Let us be clear. To believe that you cannot get 3A from Type A to Type C you must believe that it is impossible to make a power system to convert 110V AC or 12V DC to 5V DC delivering 3A OR it is impossible to transmit 3A at 5V over wire!

What Mr. Leung means is that the specifications don't say to do 3A@5V over Type A to Type C. Of course, 1A, 1.5A, 2A and 2.4A were not in the specifications when they were first used either. This is what is called being "Specification" STUPID versus "Real World" SMART. Now, it is good to follow specifications, but not good when you somehow believe that is all you can do because you don't understand the technology.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Brandito:
Interesting... Benson still sounds like the guy with the most experience in this this particular field. It's not like the in spec cables are selling at a premium or anything, so I'm not sure why you're so dead set on this being a non issue.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] dwswager:
Please explain what in the written record indicates that Mr. Leung has any "experience" whatsoever with USB Power Delivery Systems. This started, as he stated in an early review, when he could not figure out why his Chromebook Pixel would not charge using a particular cable. He says he took the cable to the Pixel hardware guys who analyzed it and told him it had the wrong pull up resistor.

Over the years there has been concerted effort to get the software guys integrated into the systems engineering teams to give them at least a rudimentary understanding about how the system really works. We also try to get a technology guy with software background in charge of the software teams. But in the end, the software guys develop the software based on a detailed set of requirements. They are told what the software should do in fairly gorey detail. But if it's not in the requirements, it is unlikely the software guys will understand the technology well enough to know. Software guys have a particular set of skills, but generally operate in the cyber realm and not the real world.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] xxprodigyxx11:
Considering One Plus just came out and said, whoops, he's right. We'll refund you for our out of spec cable. Seems to say he knows what he's talking about.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] dwswager:
For the umpteeth time, he is correct that the cables he is negatively reviewing are not built to USB specifications. He is incorrect about the implications of this for various portable devices and chargers and is specifically incorrect with respect to his claim that you cannot get 3A from a Type A to Type C solution.

Look, if people are too stupid to understand the technology or too lazy to confirm things for themselves, then too bad for them. But when people continue to parrot incorrect information, then it does a great disservice to other consumers.

[IMG="Ugh!"]https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/8b/94/b6/8b94b66075ce8edfcf813493e6a12108.jpg[/IMG]
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Brandito:
Ok you're the smartest, we're plebs, move on.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] indianajonze:
i'm kind of with dwswager on this. love the work benson has done in calling out the ridiculous state of usb c cables and in effect embarrassing the usb consortium (who i think are a bunch of morons). at the same time, he states very specifically that he's a software engineer for CHROME PIXEL and is testing the cables for that device and that device alone. now, i understand that much of the findings are relevant to other devices, but the fact is that there are instances where a product will fail his specific testing but work perfectly fine for something like the nexus 6p. perfect example: the tronsmart usb c car charger mentioned throughout this thread. i bought it based on the positive mention on droid life and the very positive reviews on amazon from 6p/5x owners. then i started reading about benson saying it failed testing, etc. and i very nearly returned it unopened. it sat on my desk for 3 days as i was pretty much terrified to use it for fear of it damaging my car or phone. eventually i gave it a go and...it works. it works great, charges rapidly and didn't blow up my car. it's kind of an outstanding product actually.

now, i realize that every cable is different and there are some out there that might in fact damage your product. my advise though is to use benson's reviews simply as another data source in your decision making, not as the authoritative source in such decisions. i knew almost nothing about the usb c spec before owning a nexus 6p (and skylake intel motherboard), but even i uncovered (with the help of tronsmart tech support) some inconsistencies between what benson said and what is written (or NOT written) in the type a to c specs

my point is, use his info as a guide, not as gospel.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] subhani:
The Vinsic one that Benson reviewed is available on Amazon. I can confirm it juices the 6P with a 2.9A rating via the Current Monitor app . Mostly sits in the 2700's but can comfortably go higher. It fluctuates often.

Oh BTW, Current Monitor is the only app that seems to work flawlessly. I have uninstalled Ampere and gsam battery monitor as a result.

Last word on Tronsmart. Using Current Monitor app, the draw seemed to settle at 2.3A. The charger itself states it can only give 2.4A Max and I've not seen it spike higher than their rated spec of 2.4A.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] andy o:
I haven't seen any indication whatsoever from him that this is the fault of anyone other than the manufacturers. The specs are there to be followed, or not.

The specifications cannot say, "this likely works for the Nexus 6p and 5x, but not for the Pixel". They are general cause they have to be, and it's the manufacturer's choice to follow them or not. It's our choice to assess how serious this violation is, but most of all, we should be informed of it. Besides that, the obvious question is: will the cable/adapter work in the future with other Type C devices? You cannot know if it's out-of-spec, but if it's in-spec, it's guaranteed as long as the devices also follow spec.

The manufacturers just either were ignorant of the proper way to do it, or were trying to game the system by making the cables trick the phone into trying to draw more (though the ones with the floating CC lines that just didn't charge the pixel probably were just out of ignorance and rush to market). The fact that some of them have come around, and even are asking Benson for advice before selling their cables, attests to that.

Nobody said it will fail in all situations, but if it's out of spec there are more situations in which it may fail. Following spec minimizes that risk.

Could you be more specific? I have read Tronsmart's response, and it's not very convincing. Also, I have not seen any other bona fide engineers coming out against what Benson has analyzed. He published a very informative post yesterday on his G+ page, I recommend you to read it, it may address some of your concerns.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] dwswager:
I moved on along time ago. The 6P battery life and my usage scenario means I charge overnight and make it through the entire day with realative ease. Plus I already have my Type A to Type C and Type C to Type C 3A solutions.

Not too long ago, some smart poster demonstrated I was wrong on something. As it turns out, I was embarrassingly wrong. In response, I acknowledged my error, apologized for spreading wrong information and attempted to correct the posts. This is because I neither want to walk around ignorant nor do I want my ignorance to cause others to take action detrimental to their best interest.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] thephatness:
And back to our scheduled program.... As of now the Vinsic and Monoprice chargers with a C to C verified cable are currently the best options, correct?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
It looks like it. Until these ship and can be tested, those 2 are about all I would buy at the moment. I do have one on order, and will test as well.

On that BlitzWolf thing, I'm interested to see if it handles two devices any better than the Vinsic.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] akenis:
Here's a twin

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0172..._SL500_SR100,100_&refRID=14KSKRGW7BSAZZSRC3CG

Vinsic is off Prime, and after Christmas now. Where is the monoprice?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] subhani:
I can vouch for Vinsic
[Nexus 6P Accessories] ylexot:
Uhhhh..monoprice.com ;)
[Nexus 6P Accessories] I7210I:
is these charger

http://www.ianker.com/product/71AN2452CSS-WA

will be ok with using one of the cable's from benson?do i get 2.4 amp? is at armed the phone?

thanks
[Nexus 6P Accessories] zeitgeb3r:
Benson endorsed or GTFO
[Nexus 6P Accessories] I7210I:
i'm asking..didn't find it
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
Benson's reviews can be found here if you need to find one: https://plus.google.com/collection/s0Inv

Getting 2.4A is unlikely from a certified cable.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] I7210I:
so ....is the charger is ok?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Gibodean:
I think you mean 3A is unlikely. 2.4A is perfectly fine with a certified cable. It's the max that the spec can handle with a USB-A, right?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] twistanesh:
Hey would anyone know if this charger would work properly?

I already ordered a proper USB A to USB C cable to use with it. this one: https://www.reddit.com/r/Nexus6P/comments/3seq4j/psa_these_cheap_typea_to_typec_cables_are_fully/
[Nexus 6P Accessories] I7210I:
so if i buy an certificate cable + use these charger it's ok? iwant to be sure that i don't need to change charger

thank you
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Elnrik:
It will operate safely, yes.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] I7210I:
so i just want to understand, there is cahrgers that can charge in more than 2.4 amp that these my charger do i understand?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] subhani:
Yes. Only the Monoprice and the Visnic chargers can charge at 3A, for now. I'm sure more are coming to market soon. There may be others too that we simply haven't come across yet.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] I7210I:
so just now i'm need to buy cables? and these is one hall of a story
[Nexus 6P Accessories] andy o:
If you're already buying both charger and cables, maybe just buy a Type C charger and cable altogether, instead of a legacy USB charger. The Visnic and Monoprice chargers have a Type A output as well.

---------- Post added at 15:51 ---------- Previous post was at 15:49 ----------

I've had 2.4A measured from two Anker PowerIQ chargers with the iOrange cable and the Google cable, but it's very inconsistent, it works only some of the time after plugging it a few times. Most of the time it does the expected 1.5-1.6A.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] yakman66:
Bangood has a preorder discount on the BlitzWolf 3A Type-c charger. The preorder price is currently at $7.99 and goes up with more preorders.

In my experience their shipping takes 1.5 to 3 weeks to California. $8 was cheap enough for me to give it a shot without reviews.

The Tronsmart 2.4A is currently $9.99 from Amazon if you use the coupon code "TYPECCAR" at checkout.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Brandito:
I just received the monoprice usb c car charger and I'm getting strange results. It only wants to give the full rapid charge with the google supplied c-c cable. I tried 3 other usb c-c cables and the best they could do was 1.5a I used a cable matters 1m, cable creations 2m and a pecham 2m cable. The pecham is just garbage no matter what, but the other two give 2.5a+ on the google wall charger. So there's something going on between the car charger and the cable that it's not letting it pull 3a without the google charging cable. I'm assuming the issue lies with the charger since the google wall charger works fine with everything but the crappy pecham cable.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] subhani:
Did Benson approve these C-C cables you used? Are they on his list?

On another point, why are people looking for 3rd party cables when you can get them directly from Google for nearly the same price or less in some cases?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] NCguy:
Because USB is supposed to be an open standard. Open being the key word here.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] subhani:
I get that, of course. I'm speaking to those who are struggling to find C-C cables that give the 3A their phones can draw. Plus, if Google's cables are better value, plus just work, would we be buying 3rd party cables, simply to make a statement?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Brandito:
He doesn't review c to c cables, just a to c unfortunately.

The Google cables are twice the price of many cables actually, and they are limited to a single length in the case of c to c.

6 feet is just too much for the car, I need 3 feet at the most.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] NCguy:
+Brandito's remarks pretty much reflect my same thoughts on this.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] Brandito:
Coupon code xmas06 works with the blitzwolf for another 48 cents off, hardly worth it, but why not?
[Nexus 6P Accessories] subhani:
I understood [MENTION=2977078]Brandito[/MENTION]'s reply and gave it the thumbs up to acknowledge that. Cables being too long can be a nuisance. Seeing that Benson hasn't reviewed any C-C cables, it makes sense to look for shorter ones and test it yourself. Either that, or just put up with a cable that you know works but is a pain in the rear, instead of multiple buys of non compliant cables.

You're reply however, was a complete different point altogether. But anyhoo...
[Nexus 6P Accessories] subhani:
View attachment 3560887View attachment 3560892

I understand that prices may vary, region to region. I'm deliberately comparing a reputable brand with that of Google's. I actually had the Belkin saved in my basket but then ordered the one from Google. Longer, less expensive and guaranteed to work. Most people need length, but in Brandito's case, his needs are different and I respect that.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] subhani:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Anker-Devic...p/B01196VA52/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top?ie=UTF8

Have you seen this? I think it ticks all your boxes. Anker aren't the type to produce questionable cables. It costs less than Google's and is close to 3 feet long.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] NCguy:
I'll stand by both responses
[Nexus 6P Accessories] subhani:
ok :rolleyes:
[Nexus 6P Accessories] andy o:
I had similar results with Cable Matters and Pecham C-C cables, so I returned them. I'm pretty sure I didn't get 3A out of the Google charger either though. The Monoprice USB 2.0 cable is 3 feet and practically the same quality as the Google one, I'm using it without problem.

EDIT: Sorry, the Monoprice USB 2.0 cable is 6ft, I got confused because I think the N6P's cable is shorter and since the Google Store one is 6ft., I thought the shorter one was from Monoprice.
[Nexus 6P Accessories] RichTJ99:
So no USB-C to USB C cables that give 3 amps aside from the google store 6 foot cable?