yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Nexus 6  General] ttabbal:
I really hate the various companies using "unlimited" to describe what can only be defined as limited plans. There are 2 kinds of "unlimited" right now. The type that charges you extra after you pass the cap, and the TMobile style slow you down version. Then TMobile also has real unlimited, no throttle, no caps. You pay extra for that service, of course.

For users like me, that use a lot of data under a real unlimited LTE plan, Fi makes zero sense. For low data users, it makes a lot of sense and might have some advantages using two LTE networks and wifi. I'm interested to see how it shakes out. I use a fair bit of streaming, and misc data. I'm also rarely near wifi I can use. At work they don't let uncontrolled non-company owned devices use the wifi. At home I do use my wifi, sometimes. It's often faster to use LTE as I can't seem to get any decent internet service there.

What I find odd about Fi, is that data costs are high, but Google is all about the cloud. No SD cards for Nexus, saying to use the cloud. At $10/GB, the cloud is too damn expensive.
[Nexus 6  General] norwoodesteel:
this is stupid fast
[Nexus 6  General] david279:
Now you're just showing off ?
[Nexus 6  General] JulesJam:
Idk about AT&T but with Verizon, they have never gotten rid of a domestic plan, not ever. And they don't need to wait for you to go off contract to take away your UDP as the contract states they can change your service at any time for any reason. They would just have to let you out of your contract w/o an ETF if they did.

There are fewer and fewer UDP lines out there each day and Verizon has increased its capacity by adding Band 4 in many places. So it seems unlikely that Verizon will get rid of UDP. If Verizon does anything it will be to get rid of contracts by eliminating subsidized upgrades. Since those of us on legacy plans don't get an Edge discount, it would make our UDP lines more expensive. Technically you are not supposed to be able to use a subsidized upgrade on Verizon and keep UDP but there are myriad ways you can depending on your line situation. All 5 of my UDP lines are still on contract, some through 2017!!

http://slickdeals.net/f/7743625-ver...-avoid-a-2-year-data-plan-on-a-basic-line?v=1

There is no reason to believe this at least with Verizon. Verizon has never discontinued any domestic plan no matter how ridiculously cheap it is. They still allow the Alltel plans, which are some of the cheapest around. And better yet, some people with UDP have the Talk & Text discount so they are only paying $10/mo for their UDP and Verizon let's them keep that discount.

Bottom line - Verizon has NEVER discontinued a domestic plan. No reason to think they will now.
[Nexus 6  General] _Dennis_:
Past performance does not indicate future performance. They could, and probably will at some point. As you said, fewer and fewer UDPs each day, at some point the only people with them will be the ones using 100 or more GBs a day.

The tricks used for obtaining a subsidy are just that, tricks. If Verizon wanted to be well Verizon thru could claim that you used a loop hole in their system and that you do not qualify for the UDP, move you to the 6GB plan, and you would have no recourse, not even leaving ETF free.

Verizon is not getting rid of contacts, that is their bread and butter. They had all the opportunities to do that when T-Mobile did, but they priced their contacts to be cheaper in most cases then their edge program. They tried to throttle UDPs already, but to many vocal customers still had one. Wait a few years, less people have UDPs, and they will do it again, this time without saying anything. They have to right to manage their network, so if they decided to do that by throttling I don't think the FCC will get involved.

The previous statements are my predictions, they are just that, predictions. No one can know the future and so these should be taken with a large grain of salt.
[Nexus 6  General] JulesJam:
Past performance VERY often correlates STRONGLY with future performance. And it is all we have to go on. Everything else is pure speculation.

You are just speculating. I am looking at the track record of a carrier and the fact is that Verizon has NEVER discontinued a domestic plan no matter how ridiculously cheap it was.

Could they change in the future? Sure, but there is no reason to think they will. People have been saying that Verizon is going to eliminate UDP altogether for a few years now. Hasn't happened.
[Nexus 6  General] Mudavo:
Those worried about data, this article says you would have access to millions of special WiFi hotspots.

http://www.droid-life.com/2015/04/22/google-project-fi-faq/
[Nexus 6  General] JulesJam:
They are nothing more than pure speculation with no basis given the track record of the carrier.
[Nexus 6  General] akellar:
The things some people argue about around here is hilarious. Nobody knows what a carrier will do in the future, no matter what they've done in the past. CALM DOWN!
[Nexus 6  General] JulesJam:
LOL! Um, no. You couldn't be MORE wrong here. Verizon is making a HUGE push towards Edge phones - they even pay the 3rd party retailers and indirects higher commission so they will push Edge phones over 2 year contracts. And in response the indirects and 3rd party retailers offer better incentives for the Edge phones than the 2 year contract phones. Just read a best buy ad and you will see. Or log onto Verizon's website and see all the promos that are for Edge phones only.

And on the ME plans, Verizon is giving those off contract $15-$25/mo line discounts to encourage them to STAY OFF CONTRACT!

Verizon wants to end subsidized phones and 2 year contracts and it couldn't be more apparent. You obviously aren't knowledgeable about Verizon's practices at all.
[Nexus 6  General] Trina9:
I'm in South Carolina and people always tell me my Nexus 6 is an iPhone 6.

Anyway, I'm disappointed because for some strange reason it's only listed as 3G in my area when Sprint and T-Mobile have LTE. And I use a lot of data.
[Nexus 6  General] _Dennis_:
OK. Cool thanks for 'schooling' me I guess. I really don't care about Verizon, as I can't justify paying nearly that much for sub par service. Good luck with them, I honestly hope they don't hurt you to badly.
[Nexus 6  General] JulesJam:
I could tell you didn't know much about Verizon.

I have 5 UDP lines on the 700 Any Mobile Talk & Text plan at $57/mo per line. For that price we get unlimited data, unlimited texts, unlimited calls to/from mobile phones, unlimited calls to/from landlines on nights and weekends, 700 peak minutes to share for calls to/from landlines from 6am to 9pm M-F and subsidized phones. We rarely use more than 200 of the shared peak landline minutes per month as almost all of our calls are to/from mobile lines and those are unlimited.

So for our usage, it works out to be $57/mo for basically unlimited everything and I don't qualify for any employer discounts - it would be even less if I did. If you add in the cost of a $200 subsidized phone + sales tax + $40 upgrade fee, over 24 months that adds $10 to the bill per line per month so $67/mo per line for basically unlimited everything and a new phone every 2 years. Usually we can do better than the $200 subsidized phones by waiting for a sale or a black friday/cyber monday promo. I have no complaints about the customer service I receive from Verizon.

The current Verizon offerings are expensive, but those of us on Verizon UDP legacy plans (NONE OF WHICH HAVE EVER BEEN DISCONTINUED BY VERIZON EVER IN THE PAST) generally have good deals depending on how much data you use.

However, a relative of mine and her family are not big data users and she and her family have a ME plan with 3 lines sharing 10GB of data with unlimited T&T, free MHS. All 3 have 16GB iP6 on Edge with $25/mo line discounts. They pay $15/line and $80/mo for the data so $125/mo then with their employer discount it brings it down to $108/mo. Each Edge phone is $27/mo so the bill is $189/mo before tax including the phones, so about $63/mo per line and that includes the cost of the phones. They aren't big data users and rarely go above 6GB of data because they use WiFi at home and don't stream music or videos to their phones and at least the 2 adults aren't on social media.

On top of that they got a bill credit of $100 for each Edge activation back in the fall. They paid about $40 in sales tax on the phones so the $100 bill credit not only covered the sales tax it covered 2 months of the Edge payments. So not only is their bill only $63/mo/line INCLUDING THE COST OF THE PHONES for 3.33GB of data each line plus unlimited talk and text, free MHS, with the $100 bill credit for each Edge phone, the phones came out to be sales tax free and $590 each instead of $650 each.
[Nexus 6  General] akellar:
We get it, move on. This still has nothing to do with Google Fi.
[Nexus 6  General] _Dennis_:
[MENTION=5983610]JulesJam[/MENTION] cool, good luck.
[Nexus 6  General] ronaldheld:
What about long term? I doubt Verizon is going to disappear anytime, but what if after a few years Google ditches their network?
[Nexus 6  General] cam30era:
Google give up on an experiment and leave their users high and dry? Are you kidding me?

:rolleyes:
[Nexus 6  General] _Dennis_:
Then you would port your number to a different prepaid service, that's what prepaid is.

It happens less then you think though. The failures get high publicity, but no one mentions the fact that a lot of google experiments turn out to be long term money makers. Gmail and google voice stand out, along with ad mobs and some others.
[Nexus 6  General] ronaldheld:
I am reluctant to give up my current data plan as well as wondering which phones will be allowed on their network.
[Nexus 6  General] cam30era:
I agree. I just couldn't stop myself from the sarcastic reply. ;)
[Nexus 6  General] JulesJam:
This. If you have a good deal now and give it up, you may not be able to go back to a plan that is as good.
[Nexus 6  General] ronaldheld:
That is true. If I had to return to Verizon I would be on an inferior plan. Maybe I need to be wait a year or so?
[Nexus 6  General] JulesJam:
If you have a good deal now, I would stay put. If they take away your good deal, or if better deals pop up, then reconsider.

For those of us who have good deals now, it makes sense to stay put. Of course it all depends on your usage too. I use a lot of data. I am staying put.
[Nexus 6  General] cam30era:
Here's some interesting info. Answers a few of the questions about how this works on our device > http://www.androidpolice.com/2015/0...s-v3-2-comes-out-with-support-for-project-fi/
[Nexus 6  General] ronaldheld:
I've been using a lot of data since I got the phone rooted. Unless Verizon forces me off of my grandfsthered plan I will stay put.
[Nexus 6  General] hockeyplayr:
Do you mind linking me to the 20gb plan. I keep hearing people mention this but all I can find is 10gbs for $55.
[Nexus 6  General] uvbeenzaned:
I am so sorry! That was only a promo up until the beginning of this month.
[Nexus 6  General] lightfire:
I got in on it and love it - can now not worry about the data I use.

I am really surprised at Google for not offering a more liberal data plan. After all, we get a 64gb phone with large screen for video and then they say - "but we really don't want you to use it as anything but a phone". May as well have a star wars flip phone. One can use a nexus 7 on wi-fi.
[Nexus 6  General] uvbeenzaned:
Hit the nail right on the head, wonderful phone and then BOOM junky networks to put it on with loads of restrictions. At least Cricket is doing a little bit for me right now. I am also not running the stock image on my phone as well because they lock down the tethering. I got Euphoria.
[Nexus 6  General] robber:
One thing to consider is that you can access the "millions of high quality" WiFi hotspots and when you are on these you are not charged for data. It is hard to quantify exactly what this will mean but it could translate into a lot less lte traffic for many users.
[Nexus 6  General] TiltedAz:
I'm pulling for Fi. I signed up on the link. Most of the time I need a secure link so not sure how well the wifi connect would be for data. I hope there's an option to refuse unsecured wifi.

Someone needs to address the poor security in these phones. Unfortunately, it isn't in Google's financial interest to button-down these phones.
[Nexus 6  General] mwalt2:
Google is promising Wi-Fi*security via automaticVirtual Private Network*(VPN) connections.

Copied from mashable story.

http://mashable.com/2015/04/22/goog...zYEcFYTB4C9w8RzGA&sig2=Yo4QQMgMla9ow4dmSLRzJw
[Nexus 6  General] JulesJam:
If you are surprised then you don't have a clue about what the whole point of this service is. It's ALL ABOUT USING WiFi.

It is NOT AT ALL about using cellular data. That is the complete opposite of what this service is about.

You all who are surprised about the data cost don't get what Google is trying to do. Google is trying to move away from cellular data toward WiFi phones. It's like what Republic Wireless is doing.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...w-wireless-network-has-been-around-since-2011

---------- Post added at 05:31 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:26 AM ----------

No, they want you to use it as a mobile hand held computer BUT ONLY ON WiFi. THAT is the WHOLE POINT of Fi.

Do you get the name is "Fi"? As in WiFi?
[Nexus 6  General] akellar:
Why are you so worked up about this? Calm down. :beer:
[Nexus 6  General] hockeyplayr:
Ah that is what I figured. I'm on Verizon Edge right now. I'll just slowly pay off the device until the promo pops up again then hop. Even at normal rates 10gb for $55 is pretty solid though. Thanks again!
[Nexus 6  General] lightfire:
BUT I can already use my phone with wi-fi for zero dollars plan. Google hangouts works fine. For a phone, I want data when I am AWAY from wi-fi. So I guess I do have a clue! And google's Fi's Wi-FEE doesn't understand the needs of the majority.
[Nexus 6  General] vvveith:
They understand all right.

They understand your NEEDS completely, but they are going after your DESIRES. (Wants)

Everyone wants affordable (free) data to use on the go, so we don't have to sit in our offices to surf the net and such. We could do what we want, when we want. But such freedom does have a cost involved. I checked how much data I consume on T MO in an average week. They charge me for about 4 MB per week on average. I have the 5 Gig plan. I stream Pandora when in my car, all day, everyday for free. I use Google Maps at least once a month, for about ten cents an hour. My phone plan cost me 80 dollars split between three phones. I'd say that's pretty cheap.

At home I have TWC for my Internet, I pay around the same thing for their highest tier. 65Mbs downstream and 5.5 upstream. So if Google made their plan as inexpensive as T mobile, I could drop my TWC, I'd have no need for it at all. But when I'm home, all phones are on WiFi. Guess I can't complain much, everyone needs to get paid.
[Nexus 6  General] JulesJam:
But Fi gives you cellular service when WiFi is not available, for instance when you are driving in your car. On your "zero dollars plan" you don't have any cellular service at all. So when not on WiFi, your phone is useless. With Fi, Google will have you using WiFi whenever it is available and then cellular service as a backup for when WiFi is not available.

Fi is just like Republic Wireless. That is all Fi is - a clone of Republic Wireless service.

---------- Post added at 05:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:20 PM ----------

And you can get that with Fi - and you have to pay for it. The primary user who Google is targeting is someone who is on WiFi most of their day at work and at home but who needs cellular service as a backup to make calls when WiFi isn't available, for instance while driving, but uses most of their data on WiFi.

---------- Post added at 05:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:27 PM ----------

Nah, you are still confused as to why Google is doing what they are doing. Obviously you didn't read the Bloomberg article I linked to or worse if you did read it, you don't understand it.

---------- Post added at 05:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:28 PM ----------

You don't understand what Google is doing. They are not targeting the majority. They are targeting those people who are on WiFi most of their day and only need cellular service as a backup for instance when they are driving.

The WHOLE POINT OF Fi is to wean people OFF of cellular service as much as possible using cellular service as a backup only when WiFi is not available.

Anyhow, I have done my best to explain it to you if you still don't get it my advice is for you not to think about it anymore as the concept is going over your head.
[Nexus 6  General] Locklear308:
10 dollars per GB is laughably outrageous. Maybe like 5 dollars max... But even still

---------- Post added at 01:33 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:31 PM ----------

Do you people even use data? I average 20 to 30gb post month on tmo.

:/
[Nexus 6  General] JulesJam:
The goal of Fi is to use WiFi, not cellular data. In that context, $10/GB is reasonable.

---------- Post added at 06:45 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:43 PM ----------

Clearly Fi is not for you then.

But my relative who uses less than 1GB of data on her iPhone b/c she doesn't use it for anything but a phone, texts, email and is on WiFi all of the time pretty much, she would significantly reduce her bill if she had Fi. On Fi, her bill would be $30/mo.

Now to be fair you have to include the cost of the phone, too. A 32GB N6 is $27/mo over 24 months. So Fi for 1GB of data is $57/mo if you include the phone cost.

My other relatives who have a ME plan sharing 10GB of data all with 16GB iP6 on Edge (same price as a 32GB N6), before the employer discount their bill is $206/mo, which works out to be $69/mo per line including the cost of the phone. None of them uses more than 2GB/mo so with Fi using 2GB/mo, their bill including the cost of the phone would be $67/mo. They wouldn't save much on Fi unless they could cut their cellular data use to below 1GB/mo.

So clearly that is who Fi is targeting - those who use less than 1GB/mo of cellular data. There are a shockingly large number of people who fall into that category. None of them however, post on XDA, lol!
[Nexus 6  General] votum:
Weird argument.

Most people have WiFi in range most of the time. Comcast areas have public WiFi everywhere. Most businesses have free WiFi.

I bet you googles code switches between unsecured networks all the time. Meaning you'll be using WiFi a lot without knowing it.

I have WiFi at home and school, and don't use it often because tmo unlimited is fast in my area, but if I could pay 30 or 40 bucks a month for tmo plus sprint and have google as my carrier then I'm down.

If it doesn't work well just stop using it, its not like its a contract.

Not sure why people are arguing though, its real clear how the whole thing works. Why wouldn't we use all the WiFi networks instead of cellular. Free WiFi all over the country and we have four cellular carriers continually raping us for so much money (look at Europe's cellular cost)

I'm waiting for my invite now.
[Nexus 6  General] HankStorm:
Good idea but for one thing I worry about that screwing up my grandfathered unlimited plan somehow. But more importantly, if the coverage sucks on Fi, I have a backup that I can switch over to immediately. Or rather than carrying multiple phones I could just swap the SIM's if I have any problems. Just saying that I'm going to give myself options and not cancel my Verizon account too quickly.
[Nexus 6  General] JulesJam:
It doesn't affect the plan at all. I kept 2 UDP lines suspended w/o billing for 6 months in order to run out an AT&T contract before porting the numbers into the Verizon UDP lines.
[Nexus 6  General] JoshRH:
Does anyone know when the first round of invitations will be sent out or better yet has anyone received an invitation?
[Nexus 6  General] cam30era:
This is what my "pre" (?) invitation from Google says:

"Keep an eye on your inbox. We're sending a small number of Project Fi invites each week, so hang tight. If you don't receive an invite soon, you'll get an update from us within a month."
[Nexus 6  General] jbdan:
I do :sly:

Me, the Mrs, and her dad use approx 3GB total of data a month. WiFi, for us and our uses, is in abundance.
[Nexus 6  General] Locklear308:
Agreed. I hate that everything now days is CLOUS CLOUD CLOUD.... yet the internet in the us is the crappiest in the world.
[Nexus 6  General] JulesJam:
Well there you go! But for it to be a fair comparison, if your carrier gives you subsidized phones or discounts for Edge/Next, you have to add in the cost of the full price phone to know if Fi saves you money or not. Now if you are on prepaid, no, then you don't need to.
[Nexus 6  General] jokersax11:
I think people here are judging the LTE prices without looking at googles cost. As a mvno fi has to pay both sprint and T-Mobile for network access, then supply a VPN and who knows what kind of WiFi deals they made. If they made a twc/Comcast/att deal that could open up 1000's of secured access points. Then you have city internet and open access points. Where I am T-Mobile LTE sucks at my work(use WiFi due to this), but everywhere else LTE is available its great. I have WiFi at home but no T-Mobile service. So this works perfect for me. Not to mention sprints Verizon roam in rural areas near me. With fi I might have full coverage for once without att.

I would love to see VPN compression on LTE to reduce high speed use, which google might be doing and why its 10 a gig. Before unlimited days I used to use a VPN to compress and it helped. Another thing people are not reading is that high speed access. The 20 connect fee covers 3g internet speeds. Which if done off LTE would run 256k. Not good but usable. I Dont even get that on T-Mobile LTE at my work. So being able to piggyback spark at work and Tmo everywhere else would be perfect for me.

This is the point of fi. Not massive downloads a months.
[Nexus 6  General] antiochasylum:
Here is the big question, will you need to be on the stock 5.1 image for Fi to work? Or can you be on a compiled aosp ROM?

Anyone post a list of APKs from the stock image?
[Nexus 6  General] gravitywell:
You're not alone.

Fairfax.
[Nexus 6  General] 8Fishes:
Google has actually many failures in terms of products but they have many 'wins' at the same time.

Search engine of course is the meat of it. They got maps. They got gmail.

Some failures as you might recall not recall are wave, and most recently google code.

This 'project' will probably shut down in about 4 years if its a failure.

Will not work on 5.1. Google IO is coming up. I think they will drop 5.2 and official Fi announcement and go live around that time.

A lot of you don't seem to be tmobile users, with probably good reason too so I might as well enlighten you all.

Project Fi parallels the tmobile business model perfectly. It has essentially all of the features described, except for the zero rate plans consumer plans get, but at the same time cost 'savings' on the business line tiers. I can't imagine that they will launch with less than 1k subs, which on tmobile translates to $10 per line per month.

You are paying 20/month for a line, which leaves 10 dollars for google to pick for expenses and profit.

On top of that the data rates are tiered at basically $10/gb. They will probably not offer an unlimited tier because tmobile does not want to hemorrhage customers to another 'company' when it can get those users himself. The whole idea is to keep you on wifi. You leave wifi and they will punish you for it. All in all, if you wanted something like Project Fi, I would suggest harbor mobile which does nearly an identical offering but starts at 30/month, or just goto tmobile and get unlimited everything. Find a buddy and you can get 2 lines for 100 dollars, and you both chip in about 55 dollars (this includes tax) for unlimited data/talk/text.