yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] jcespi2005:
I agree with that. Think the better way to cut noob's urgency in resolv one issue is not allowing to post, and forcing to read the Wiki and the forum, to get same basics concepts before to play with ROMs.

Take a look to standar case: People who knows other peoples redirects other peoples to XDA, and then downloads ROM from rapidshare without any wiki read nor forum read. This is the eaysiest way to get in trouble.

Cause more of noobs posts with issues are caused by the unread wiki-forum, the fisrt ( and perhaps second ) month must be read only.

Regards.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] erad64:
I am a noob here too. Though this is my first time to post, I do agree that there were questions which are very redundant. That's why even when searching and reading it gets too tiresome and boring because all you can read are questions being repeated again and again. Being a noob and also with many questions, I feel so lucky that I was not able to ask for questions (lest I be called a stupid nood:eek: he he) because all my questions were answered by just reading and it was all there, reapeated again and again. But please don't ban the noob here (am I right in saying that:( ). This is where I learn a lot and have gained more knowledge about my hermes. This has been a part of my life already. I can't go through the day without opening this site. It feels like it has been a part of my system already. For the foul language, yeah I agree it's not appropriate, but considering the hardship those people have done, I think I have no right to question if at times the outburst from those redundant querries (without searching and reading ) turns out to be foul language.

But still the same, keep the good work guys. Looking forward more from you.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] iammaz:
Righto,

Presumably I'd still be considered a n00b here but that makes it more fun to flame me right?

A 24-hour ban on posting for stupid things is a good idea. Ban on IP. They can still search the forum and wiki and find their answer and if they asked such an incredibly stupid question in the first place then chances are you arent going to lose any helpful advice.

For now, just keep yourselves under control and politely point people to the wiki. Also try let the moderators know to close a post, if it adds nothing to the communal knowledge.

Or just keep doing what you're doing and it'll work out itself.

whatever

Maz

-------------

http://maz.net.au/

I'm too lazy to think of a witty signature this time
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] rufus001:
There's a lot of talk directed at managing noobs (thats me!) directly thru delaying posting and pop quizs etc. but maybe a different approach might work? Why not break a thread into three? One locked thread could contain info regarding the actual rom and any known fixes and updates. Another locked thread could contain known issues that are being worked on. The final unlocked thread would be for people to post questions. All you would need then is for some suitable seniors to scan the unlocked thread regularly and make any necessary updates to the two locked threads. That way all the relevant information is in two concise threads. Also if a nooby posts a redundant question in the unlocked thread you can simply ignore it. Or, if they want, they can ask for more info, then alter the two locked threads if sufficient relevant info is forthcoming.

This suggestion may take the heat out of the situation two ways:

1) Seniors will be more relaxed cause they wont feel any obligation whatsoever to respond to every little question. It will ALL be answered in the two CONCISE locked threads.

2) Noobys who are happy to read before asking questions wont have to wade thru PAGES of other noobys whining and dopey questions.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] asian4ce:
thats a really good idea rufus001, although it would take up a lot of space in the forums. meaning you'd only see maybe 3 actually different threads per page
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] iammaz:
A simple flag in each thread that marked useful posts that contained answers, questions, or valid input. Then have a way to filter posts in a thread based on status. I'd mod it.

Maz
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] rufus001:
True. This forum is H U G E!!

But I definately think some form of restructuring, if possible, may be the way to go. It just seems very messy. Maybe clicking a few more times to get where you want to go may still be better than clicking a couple of times to get to a 60 page threading full of whining.

I like the flag idea too! Just something to ease the clutter.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] CollectorTA:
I'm a noob, but I found all my answers on the wiki. In fact I purchased a Blackjack in march and searched google for windows mobile and I found a link here. :D

I then realized that the 8525 was the way to go so I called cingular and they exchanged me out. The first day I recieved my 8525 I loaded the contacts the second day I flashed WMVI Black 1.6 and here I set 5 Flashes later and I love Black ver. 2.0.

I would consider myself a noob, and I found all my answers in the wiki. I believe a 60 day restriction would work however, I think that the mods should have some discretion. ie lifting the post ban. What if I needed something or someone that has the basic experience like I do.

Needless to say it will be hard to find a good resolution. :cool:

btw: I had never owned a WM phone or flashed any roms before in my life.

The Wiki is very informative and what you cant get from there you can just read the various members post, and you'll get it.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] uniqueboy:
I still feel like a nooob, I would have felt happy to have been restricted to a separate nooob forum for a while, rather than keep making an idiot of myself in places where I just shouldn't go.

However I feel it is good for your souls to be kind to lesser mortals.

I can only chop wood.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] shogunmark:
We have valued everyone's input on this matter.. I am now going to lock this thread and unstick it, Us mods and admins are going to be coming out with some stuff shortly that will hopefully help us regain control of this board. Thank you to everyone who has expressed their opinions and feelings on this subject! Its the users that make this board a great place to be!
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] jasjamming:
gee why cant ppl just click search posts. its one click away....

i first search by thread, then once i click on a thread, i then search by post. its logical.

but as shogun mark pointed out, its getting difficult to search as there are so many redundant posts.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] ibanyard:
absolutely... but for these I've-just-joined-to-get-my-dirty-noobie-hands-on-wm6-so-that-I-can-show-off-to-my-helpdesk-friends who miss the option, it might cut down on a lot of the crap thats floating around...

Also stop these downloading now, and your great and can I suck you off if you let me have your next version before anyone else posts.... <SLAP>
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] jcespi2005:
Sametimes the ignorance makes US very bold (i speak myself).

and understud the point of view of ppl like jasjas, lvsw and lot of seniors and mods that put his free time in make ROMs for ppl that can't do basic rules (read before post).

Thanks again for all the contribution, but not so only for ROM Cockers, but for all the people that puts here his knowledge and share his experience.

And again, read before post, this is the max rule to get this forum continues giving us news ROM and news knowledges.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] Penske MB:
Hmmm......

Noob's question might be dumb, indeed very stupid because they don't read and just want a quick answer. But no one here has the right to use inappropriate language against others.

I have quit flash new ROM after LVSW 3-26 edition, mainly of the attitude on few chefs. I do appreciate their great acheivements, but I will not tolerant any deceiving language.

As a moderator, I think you know what is your duty. I have not been to any forums that allow fallacious language.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] Martinhdk:
Could the solution not be that SENIORS can create some kind of locked threads that only is open for other seniors to write in.

In that way only the "old" and serious members can put comments to certain threads. Threads for crappy ques and stuff could then be open for all. In that way we -the newer guys could write the crap and stupid questions in our own threads - and concentrate on reading in the serious ones.. It would also be a lot easier to look through a thread regarding a new rom..
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] athena1973:
I never use any of your ****s, so, pls go back to **** yourself and hold releasing of any of your rubbish things.

Do I react correctly? I think I got the right to use foul language as well since I dont need your ****ing ****s.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] jasjamming:
thanks for the laugh and your ****s, i appreciate it, now take your hermes and stick it up where the sun dont shine :P
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] ibanyard:
No the correct english is ****ing ****.

Read the wiki. If theres no article on correct use of the english language, its a community. Go create.

ThankYou.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] unwired4:
Wow I hope I posted enough helpful comments on the Black threads to be included in the select few...

It is interesting to note how many of the same problems occur with all the Wm6 roms.

I guess it also not that surprising that THE site where anyone can now come and pick up a WM6 rom is suddenly proving popular with Wm users who have never flashed a rom in their lives.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] kree:
idea?

How about making a ****tard hall to put all the alleged repeat noob questions. You know just a dev/null bottom of the heap section of the forum that such useless post and threads can be moved to, and then closed. Maybe not allowing new members to post until they have been members for x amount of time.

I know Im guilty of at least one of these but I do spend a fair amount of time lurking.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] athena1973:
Thanks for the reminding and actually I did it on purpose. civil language of human being is not suitable for them.

@#￥……*￥#W#

Thank you anyway.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] ach2:
Searching Problems

Searching does seem to be a problem, particularly with noobs. I haven't seen any mention of mikechannon's sticky which can make searching easier... http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=298893 ... I use this when the forum search doesn't work.

As the title of this post is so eyecatching (after all it's probably the news of WM6 which brought most of the new members) - maybe these links can be re-created in the first post of this thread.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] abubasim:
A full text search on "****" in the Wiki returns two hits . . .
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] dbaser:
I was just listening to RevCo's Big Sexy Land in the car...

"...dead bodies everywhere..."
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] Saber_007:
I just wanted to add somthing.

Anyone that complains about not being able to find the answer to a problem by searching is nothing but LAZY. Plane and simple.

I have been using this forum for ages. It is an amazing source of information.

To date i have been able to find everything i have need by searching.

I have only a few post, WHY, BECAUSE I KNOW HOW TO F#$KING SEARCH. I don't have to keep asking the same questions over and over again.

IT is not a new concept people.

Senior Members shoud not have to waist there time answering people who are just can't be bothered looking for them selves.

Just my two cents.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] unwired4:
You have to realise that its not always laziness. There's also stupidity to be taken into account...

But seriously, I usually google for answers to questions I have and often end up being pointed back here!
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] chrisjasper:
Wonder if you can break down the 'noob' posts by geographical location, could be fun...... :D
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] Arktronic:
I'm sure we'd get a fair amount of noobs from over here in the USA if we break them down by geographical location...

Seriously, though, people need to calm the **** down. Yes, this is a developer community. Yes, there are noobs present. While foul language is certainly not necessary, one can't say "you don't have the right to use foul language" because AFAIK there are no rules against it on these forums. And if someone wants to vent at a noob for being the unlucky 1000th person to ask the same damn question, let them do it. If one feels that foul language is bad, that person does not have to use it! I do agree that it doesn't help the community, but sometimes you just can't suppress the urge to tell someone to shove it where the sun don't shine.

Unless the noob question posting issue can be resolved in a normal manner, perhaps there should be a section of the forums where posting is restricted to members with a certain minimum number of posts.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] shogunmark:
Ok people, i have read all of those and appreciate all the feedback.. So lets try this for replies from now on... Lets come up with a viable solution to correct the situation at hand..

Some of my idea's are:

Create a locked sub fora under hermes for FAQ, then the mods can move posts with answers to them under this header to make for easier searching to cut out the crap.

a more iron fist solution of 24 hour user ban's for failure to abide by the forum rules (i like this idea, but dont want to turn anybody away so i dont think this is the best solution).

We all are developers/hobbyists, etc and we are smart, so we should be able to come up with a good solution to the problem...

we can call it Keep The Peacev1.0 :D
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] tadzio:
jj,

we completely agree about the flood of noob questions. I don't like that, either, and something needs to be done.

But having said that: this is still a public place here. I don't care if you use say f*ck twice in each sentence when you're among your friends, or in private mail etc. Even here I find it completely acceptable up to a certain level. And it's not even so much the language as it is the disrespect and arrogance some people show. And to be frank: no, I didn't have you in mind, when I wrote that. It was really directed to Legolas. Sure, noob questions are annoying, but they're still asked by humans. I get them too - not as many as you do, but some. So, what do I do? "Please read the Wiki and the forum. All information is there."

Probably for you it's not a big deal being insulted and insulting people. For me (and probably for people with other cultural backgrounds) it is. If anybody calls me a "f*cking idiot/moron" and is serious about it, that will quite likely end our friendship (or whatever we had). May well be that you find this unbelievable and over-reacting. But then, I (and others) may just live in a different world from yours. What I ask is that people respect that fact when they post in a forum accessible to all kinds of people.

Cheers

Daniel
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] lpsi2000:
JJ I completely agree with you and it is getting out of control here. You and many others have contributed a lot here. I think some of these noobs are actually here to do exactly what is happening now (stopping the great work that is being produced here). If you hold off then you are given them exactly what they want. Who knows, they may have been planted here to do exactly this because they already forced this site from keeping the ROM here. I suggest you think about it and reconsider your decision. Trust me, I do understand the frustration.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] JasenR:
"ROM cockers" ROFLMAO :D

Sorry to make fun of your misspelled word jcespi2005, but THANKS! It's only laugh I have had since the **** hit the fan today.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] rabdo:
How about a standard answer to noobs who post rubbish questions - polite of course - but along the lines of read the wiki, but also stating that posts will not be answered unless they expand on their question, commenting on solutions they have tried, inability to find the answer in the wiki etc. Also making sure that everyone makes use of their signature - it is easier to answer problems when we know what network they are on, what ROM and device they have etc. Basically the equation below is pretty accurate:

no signature=noob​
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] Arktronic:
If this is to be implemented, we'll have to make sure the thread titles are as clear as they possibly can be. Also replies should be prohibited so that we don't have a ton of questions and then an answer on e.g. page #6, like the Widcomm thread. If someone has a problem with something in the FAQ, there should be another place to voice it, and FAQs should not be neglected when new solutions for old problems are created or when additional information is available. That will mean a bigger job for the modmins because the original posters won't be able to edit their FAQ posts if all threads in there are locked.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] tadzio:
Isn't that what we have the Wiki for? Having two one-way mechanisms to provide information will only add to the confusion. My suggestion is to move useful answers to the appropriate Wiki article.

Manually banning users will provoke discussions and a lot of demands ("mod, can you please ban XYZ"), so it may not be very effective.

However, I do propose that there'd be a 24 hour waiting period between registering and being able to post. When registering, the new user gets an email with a few useful links and a short intro to the rules. I am confident that 99% of the new users will use that 24 hour period to search the Wiki and forum, and find the answer to their question before they can post it. If you look at the noob questions: quite a high percentage were the first post of a user. Getting rid of that percentage is certainly a big step. :-)

Cheers

Daniel
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] MyDraadloos:
Jas get's the award for being top "ROM Cocker" ; nice Freudian slip .... :D
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] moosefang:
Ideas
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] Arktronic:
That is a very good point. We really should be mindful of other cultures. However, that goes both ways. People from the more sensitive cultures should realize there are people here from more desensitized ones.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] mizzlefromtheroc:
in my opinion it really doesnt matter what you do, someone is going to complain, *****, or throw hissy fits. thats normal, this is the INTERNET. if you dont like the forum then dont contribute. but its crazy that all these "senior members" are getting mad. i mean you guys are acting like one minute you woke up and just knew everything, you were a noob just like every memeber on this site. without the noobs you wouldn't be ****. it's real sad yall sit here and ask for donations, or to the people who dont ask. do you guys discriminate then? does it matter if your a noob then? then i here oh it's a technical development site, last time i checked to develop you have to ask questions, yes all the stupid post are getting annoying, but if you check i see multiple "annoying noob" threads. regardless to why people come to this site ad use it, people are listening to you guys, people are interested in what you guys do, and just as much time you give to make the roms, people spend that much time learning them, and making stupid post, so at least give them that much respect, and not curse them out or make them feel even more stupid for asking the questions. yall cry about people sending you notes,put it in your sig, do not send me questions. give out a alternate email address to the people you want. i swear, i cant believe some of you call yourself men let alone adults. i never met sooo many whining men. if you can' take the heat get out the kitchen. just like jj did, its too bad though. but someone will come along and make a better rom and all will be forgotten, it's just technology, dont get too attached.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] Arktronic:
That is where you're dead wrong. The whole problem is that the noobs that we refer to here do NOT in fact spend time learning about the ROMs and other things. We all realize there are good newbies who read a lot and only ask a question if they're reasonably sure it hasn't been answered. We have no problem with that. We do have a problem when noobs don't read and just expect to be told everything personally.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] shogunmark:
This thread is not to complain about the n00bs, its about finding a constructive solution to a problem so please read the thread and post a solution, not another complaint.. and if you cant read then let me spell it out... the problem is the onslaught of redundant posts from new members which cause the senior/junior members to lash out and flame them, this makes for a hostile and unhappy board... so either bring some solutions to the table or dont post in this thread.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] UKMadBeef:
True hahah :o

I agree with shogunmark, locked threads and user bans, but 24 hours is *nothing*. Make it somewhere between 3 days and 1 week, just disallow posting, then the cretins will have no choice but to use the Wiki and forum search. It's not harsh, it's education. Just one word of advice to the mods, do not give this ability to those who are power hungry as that is always a recipe for disaster.

Also with regard to the swearing, personally I don't care the words people use, it's the meaning behind them. There has been a lot of nastiness recently, and whether swearing was involved is a bit of a side issue.

Except when the insults get REALLY creative ... then it's funny :)
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] Ryuerik:
New WIKI

We should make an "How To search" WIKI for those idiots who does not know how to find their behind to crap!

It is a real shame...:(
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] mizzlefromtheroc:
shogunmark:

your right, i just needed to vent, i had just finished reading a few of those threads. but only solution is a more dedicated wiki, you cant keep people from getting here, this is public, they will find ways to get what they need. but if you can find a way to make sure the wiki is updated daily, and its a little more intuitive, that should cut down some of the posts. it wont stop all the post, but it will cut them down a bit.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] panzer:
aha! both combined...that's really dangerous... :D
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] wbless:
I think we should also leave moderating to the mods.....

10 'you stupid noob' posts as a redaction to 1 stupid noob's question, isn't exactly helping matters.
[8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam ROM Development] lpsi2000:
I think waiting 24 hrs after you joined is too short. I would say 1 week after joining.