yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Moto G General] lost101:
Android 5.0 (Lollipop) Bootloader and KitKat Compatibility

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Everyone wants Lollipop, however it is worth considering some of the possible consequences of upgrading via OTA update.
​

Flashable zip of Android 5.0.2 'Soak Test' now available and boots with KitKat Bootloader: http://xdaforums.com/moto-g/development/rom-retail-brazil-lollipop-soak-test-t2998793

Downgrading to KitKat also possible even with Lollipop Bootloader.

Bootloader:

A new Bootloader (BL) will almost certainly be is included in the OTA update. It is also very likely no KitKat Kernel, stock or custom will be able to boot properly with the 5.0 BL. Perhaps the Kernel DEVs can find a workaround.

Root: (DONE)

It may take some time to gain root access on Lollipop as on other devices this has required a custom Kernel. A custom kernel itself may require kernel sources to be released - something that has taken weeks / months in the past.

Chainfire releases Android 5.0 Root for Moto G (2013) (All Models)

In addition; apps that use root access in KitKat, require further development to have functional root access in Lollipop.

Xposed Framework:

Developer has said he will wait for CyanogenMod based on Lollipop before properly starting development of an ART version of Xposed. CM12 may take a few weeks to release. Expect to do without Xposed for at least a month, probably longer since root is also required (see above.) Related: Alternatives to popular Xposed Modules

Custom Recovery:

This has not been an issue before, but it is always possible a new Bootloader could break compatibility with existing Custom Recoveries. Obviously, you would not be able to restore a CWM / TWRP backup without a functional custom recovery; but even then, it is unlikely you will [not] be able to boot your KitKat backup. CWM unaffected, TWRP not fully supported yet.

Custom ROMs:

This is another area that could be affected by a new Bootloader. It is unknown if existing custom ROMs will require new Kernels / system changes in order to work with the new BL - something that could take days, weeks or months. CyanogenMod 12 (Lollipop) for Moto G (Falcon) now available and does not appear to require a new BL.

Performance:

Currently the performance difference between KitKat and Lollipop is unknown. If the first release of Lollipop for Moto G has performance issues, you may be unable to revert back to stock KitKat.
​

Possible solution:

Wait for a flashable zip [NOT OTA Update zip] of Stock Moto G Lollipop ROM - this would mean your Bootloader remains at it's current version and potentially allowing you to change 'back and forth' between Stock KitKat and Stock Lollipop. However, it is currently unknown if the newer BL is a requirement for Android 5.0 Kernels. Flashable zip of Android 5.0.2 'Soak Test' now available and boots with KitKat Bootloader.
[Moto G General] MarckozZ:
That is what I thought, since something like that happened because of the upgrade from JB to KK. Taking all of this into account, I'm not sure to upgrade immediately when the OTA comes out, maybe I'll try to still alive waiting for reviews from someone who dares to OTA right then. :eek:
[Moto G General] juanchotazo99:
You can be pretty sure it'll bring a bootloader update too because of all the fundamental changes lollipop brings in almost all areas of the OS. Major relase, as was gingerbread -> ICS.

It's pretty safe to say that once you upgrade, it won't be easy to downgrade, if at all possible... Many changes are in the security area and everything is getting tightened up a lot... Loads of tempting things we'll get in this upgrade, yes, but we'll have to give up much of what we're used to (in terms of rooting/etc), at least for a little while. I'll also wait until the dust settles a bit and it's clearer on where we stand with the upgrade once it gets released.
[Moto G General] Sandivisi:
nice info
[Moto G General] sub77:
UUUUUUHHHHHHHH iam afraight. a little. who needs bootloaders. i dont.;)
[Moto G General] MarckozZ:
Will you be able to wait when you see that little notification saying there's a new system update awaiting you?? :p I'll eat my nails until then!
[Moto G General] Drift0r:
Can i still get the OTA update even though my bootloader is unlocked and rooted? (Kitkat 4.4.4.)
[Moto G General] talhask:
I don't think so.... :rolleyes:
[Moto G General] lost101:
Bootloader doesn't matter. Root doesn't matter. What does matter is the software on your phone that checks for OTA updates. As long as that is functioning; you will get the notification.

You can ignore the update notification and will not be forced to install it.
[Moto G General] MarckozZ:
The only real thing you need to install the OTA is stock recovery, doesnt matter bootloader or root, only stock recovery to install the OTA! :good:
[Moto G General] BaghiXDA:
As always, very informative thread [MENTION=1006674]lost101[/MENTION].
[Moto G General] Drift0r:
How do I know what recovery I am on? I entered recovery and it is like this http://i.gyazo.com/1c3fa4923e85db7042ad6e36b97a31cc.png then when I click recovery on that screen I am on CWM, does that mean I can't or can do it?

Also I am not using any roms or anything, just rooted it for Xposed.
[Moto G General] eemgee:
You need stock recovery and rid of xposedand any modules:)
[Moto G General] S0bes:
And another real thing is pure/stock system. Which means no system apps were deleted or frizzed no mods were installed through custom recovery no custom kernels no luckyputcher stuff. And I think you have to delete xposed framework (manually via xposed installer).

And a lot of users think that it's enough just to flash back stock recovery and install ota. But then they are just wondering why is it can not install. So, untouched system block is mandatory for applying ota as well as stock recovery.

Root, unlocked bootloader and custom boot logo are things you could keep.
[Moto G General] Drift0r:
Is stock recovery and stock firmware same? If not how do i get stock recovery back?
[Moto G General] vdbjg:
How about if you are using Adaway?

I know this will change something to the file hosts.

Do you need to get this original hosts file as well?
[Moto G General] MarckozZ:
I'd reccomend to you this: when the OTA comes up, restore stock 4.4.2 firmware, then OTA to 4.4.4 and then to 5.0... Or if you find a 4.4.4 firmware just flash it and then OTA to 5.0... But the best you could do is to install the Lollipop OTA in a fresh new installed system.

Yes, maybe the best thing is to backup everything and restore all things to stock... then OTA to Lollipop... :good:
[Moto G General] S0bes:
Almost always it is enough to flash only system img files without erasing userdara. It should rewrite system block so it becames stock
[Moto G General] Drift0r:
How do I restore it to 4.4.3? Im currently downloading this file to flash via mfastboot RET-EU-SS_4.4.3_KXB21.14-L1.31_cid7_CFC_1FF.xml.zip from this guide. http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=2542219 would this work?

my phone moto g 4g lte - xt1039
[Moto G General] MarckozZ:
You can try the guide I've done with some help from other users here at XDA...

http://xdaforums.com/moto-g/general/guide-restore-moto-firmware-gpe-t2914884
[Moto G General] Drift0r:
Im from UK and have a UK Moto G 4G :d

---------- Post added at 08:40 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:12 PM ----------

I've got a issue :(( http://xdaforums.com/moto-g/help/please-help-android-red-t2924722
[Moto G General] MarckozZ:
Maybe you've flashed some XT1032 firmware... but you have Moto G 4G right? search for a propper firmware for your device and try again...

http://xdaforums.com/moto-g/general/guide-restore-moto-firmware-gpe-t2914884 use this guide!!! and search the firmware here :good: and search for this (Moto_G_LTE_XT1039)_RET-EU-SS_4.4.4_KXB21.14-L1.46_cid7_CFC_1FF.xml.zip firmware
[Moto G General] vikasb32:
OTA just doesn't copy all file to system it check checksums of file then patch it if checksum of 1 file is different then OTA fail that's why untouched system is needed but OTA didn't check all file like host file so adaway doesn't affect OTA.
[Moto G General] methuselah:
Well hell yeah. Whats the fun if we mess up with root and again relock our bootloaders. Well everybody loose warranty to have the benefit of the development. People mostly gain if they stay away from updates for few days.
[Moto G General] eemgee:
So, I'm on 4.4.4 rooted, supersu and stock recovery with only root app installed being adway.

I'm good to go when the update comes?
[Moto G General] djpailo:
I don't see why anyone would wait. Bit of scaremongering.
[Moto G General] Real550:
I believe a lot of people are converting to gpe in order to get 5.0 asap
[Moto G General] talhadabest:
don't really think this is such a big issue. i mean android 5.0 is gonna come out on GPE moto g much much earlier and i guess some developer will put it in a flashable zip. which we can all use.
[Moto G General] lost101:
I am not trying to scare or put anyone off updating to Lollipop.

It is a fact that people can no longer install Jellybean

(4.3), after flashing the Bootloader included with KitKat. This thread will be updated as and when more information is available.
[Moto G General] Zerelth:
Btw, can I OTA with a modded system? I've installed mods like Ultrasound Audio Mod and PurePerformances X Mod...Just wondering whether those will interfere with the update process...
[Moto G General] :
What's the problem with 5.0 BL ? I'm on 4.4.4 unlocked BL so should I worry about BL or not ?

Current Device : Moto G XT1032
[Moto G General] lost101:
Do you care about root?

It could take a while before Lollipop is rooted on Moto G.

Do you want to be able to return KitKat?

Chances are there will be no going back if you upgrade to the Android 5.0 BL, but it won't be known for sure until the update is released.
[Moto G General] :
Yeah I care about root. Why would I want to go back to kitkat when lollipop is gunna be awesome ???

Current Device : Moto G XT1032
[Moto G General] MarckozZ:
Imagine that you are in Lollipop now but then it becomes unstable, freezes all the time, lags, game performance drops down, your phone overheates, etc... All those things could happen with a bad system update. And what if we couldnt go back to KitKat? You will be "trapped" with a bittersweet Lollipop!

But those are just speculation... We still dont know if bootloader will be that tricky to allow us to go back to KK. Hope not!!
[Moto G General] lost101:
A Lollipop nandroid backup would allow people to test with the 4.4.4 Bootloader.
[Moto G General] MarckozZ:
If you do a nandroid backup of Lollipop to others to try maybe there will be a md5 checksum fail.. Besides, since Lollipop has very different system files and organization inside it, CWM wont be able to copy everything as it is... Also, there will be no CWM for Lollipop and Moto g in monts since the release, everyone will die and will desperately OTA to try 5.0!
[Moto G General] lost101:
I disagree on every point, except for the end being nigh.
[Moto G General] droidx8:
And we can't get back to kitkat BL once upgraded to 5.0, right?
[Moto G General] eemgee:
Isn't most of this just speculation until someone actually gets the ota?
[Moto G General] S0bes:
Exactly. We don't know anything yet
[Moto G General] lost101:
Currently no-one knows for sure. It's no longer possible to go back to Jelly Bean, the same may happen again.

True, but not baseless speculation. A precedent has already been set by Motorola in preventing Jelly Bean (4.3) being installed after the 4.4.3 update.

This thread is to help some people avoid updating blindly and then regretting it. Hopefully none of the points will occur, but history suggests that that is highly unlikely. I personally would rather have a phone that offers the possibility of running KitKat or Lollipop - if I decide the experience is better (for the time being) with the former. I also have little interest in Lollipop until it is rooted and has a custom kernel.
[Moto G General] ficki yahya:
Can i have the stock recovery for moto g retail asia dual sim? I want to uninstal cwm without loosing my root acces and without flasing stock rom. Because i am still on stockrom but with cwm.... May be anyone can help me with this situation... Thx before.
[Moto G General] aravbb:
Use this http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=2635706
[Moto G General] siddharthnair96:
Here a question

I have flashed back to stock with everything intact and even locked my bootloader for just the sake I had the unlocked bootloader screen so i simply flashed the correct powered by android logo the original one.. Will i be able to retain this or not
[Moto G General] sahil_arora05:
I think I should wait too. This time I will check out the reviews for Lollipop then only I will update my MOTO G. Anyways, guys anyone know till when we will have Lollipop on our moto G?? O_o
[Moto G General] eemgee:
You need to change the stock recovery file in that tool for a up to date one. If not you get 'hab check fail'
[Moto G General] craagz:
Update notification will come, but with Root and unlocked bootloader, the upgrade will fail.
[Moto G General] lost101:
Can we please stay on topic. If you have questions about how to update: start a thread in Q&A.
[Moto G General] Zerelth:
In fact, the OTA would still work with the Unlocked Bootloader. For root, I'm not sure @.@
[Moto G General] :
The OTA to 5.0 should work. Well i hope anyway otherwise we are doomed :(
[Moto G General] Drift0r:
Correct me if I am wrong. If bootloader is unlocked, you have no root and you have the default recovery, then you should have no problem getting the OTA.
[Moto G General] MarckozZ:
No, unlocking the bootloader doesnt modifies any file inside system, just allows you to modify some other partitions. Its like a pre-root. If you unlock it, you can now root and change recovery, but to receibe the OTA and to install it without problems, you have to rerstore the stock recovery and if possible remove root to avoid errors. Or restore the firmware completely, thats better... But it doesnt matter what you do to your phone or which rom you flash, your bootloader will remain unlocked. :cool:

EDIT: I dont remember, but I think unlocking the bootloader the first time, it erases and formats all user data inside the emulated SD, am I correct?
[Moto G General] eemgee:
You can relock the boot loader, but it's considered unnecessary.
[Moto G General] AgentChaos:
It looks like me might get locked to Lollipop after updating, I dont think it will be possible to downgrade to Kitkat.

It will update the bootloader and since the lollipop kernel is version 3.10.x I dont think it will be possible to downgrade.
[Moto G General] lost101:
I've updated OP to clarify that when I said "flashable zip," I did not mean the 'OTA update zip' - which includes the new Bootloader.

Looking at this Android 5.0 custom ROM for Nexus 7 - new Bootloader is a requirement.

It's looking like there won't be a choice in this; other than you can update when rollout begins and wait for Root, Xposed and custom Kernels / ROM or delay updating until those things are available. There will be no going back to KitKat.
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If you do update and have problems, you are stuck until the Motorola firmware images are available - because re-flashing the KitKat images probably won't work, or any KK custom ROM.

I would suggest at the very least, wait until those firmware images are available. They sometimes appear within days of the OTA update.
[Moto G General] xtrover:
It's a good point...due to my experience OTA can be buggy...when the KK OTA came to my moto g xt-1033 it was rooted, moto apps deleted, with philz recovery so I decide restore firmware 4.4.3 and do the OTA update....with the kk firmware the phone became a little laggy and sometimes freeze...So, I have to search for the firmware IMG and flash it, after that everything was fine...

Sorry bad english

Enviado desde mi f@|¢0π XT-1033
[Moto G General] juanchotazo99:
http://xdaforums.com/nexus-9/orig-development/root-t2929118

lol, chainfire already rooted the Nexus 9. So much for all that extra security and root being doomed in Lollipop. Well, seeing that now I don't think we'll have to give up much customization once the upgrade arrives to our Gs.
[Moto G General] MarckozZ:
Just to clarify all things, some of us maybe can OTA to Lollipop and after that try to downgrade to KK... If results are possitive, we will have the option to revert to KK, but if doesnt (this is more likely to happen) the ones who OTAed will remain in L until some solution comes up. All in the name of science!
[Moto G General] classic757:
Wow! That would be great if it we can update to Lollipop and root it!
[Moto G General] MarckozZ:
Maybe it wont take too long to root 5.0 on our G, so thats great news!!! :good:
[Moto G General] moralesnery:
Why step back?

Waiting for the root for MotoG on Lollipop will be the hardest part, but I won't lose sleep for not being able to return to kit kat. With all the new freatures and the good performance of the G, why would I return?
[Moto G General] lost101:
When someone does install the OTA update, send me a link to a nandroid backup (factory reset if possible), and I will create a flashable ROM zip. This would be useful for people that experience any major problems with their own OTA upgrade; at-least during the period when no Motorola Stock Firmware Images are available.
[Moto G General] siddharthnair96:
If I'm not mistaken it is kernel version 3.14 not 3.10.x as of today or yesterday there was an article on this on XDA..
[Moto G General] AgentChaos:
yeah the kernel version is higher, from what i saw it is 3.14 actually
[Moto G General] MarckozZ:
Can you or someone else tell me where the OTA is placed after the download?? I mean, when you receive an OTA notification, it has to download the update package... Where is that package placed? In which system directory? :confused:

I want to know that to copy the Lollipop OTA..

---------- Post added at 11:14 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:10 AM ----------

I saw a leaked screenshot from a Moto X 2014 that has 3.4 kernel... I saw a Nexus 6 photo with 3.10 kernel some time ago, so I think that a last minute update to 3.14 kernel is reasonable...

Link here..

Maybe wi will stick to 3.4 kernel.. Anyway I hope that works for our devices... I mean, no lags or instability.
[Moto G General] lost101:
Traditionally, OTA Update for Moto G downloads to /cache/ and has a name like: Blur_Version.174.44.9.falcon_umts.Retail.en.DE.zip
[Moto G General] MarckozZ:
Perfect. I'll take taht into account.... :good:
[Moto G General] :
I'll update

I'll update my phone, and create a flashable zip :)

---------- Post added at 02:49 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:47 PM ----------

Yes you are right, same happens with locking the bootloader!
[Moto G General] lost101:
Motorola should be petitioned about allowing Bootloader downgrade. They are obviously open enough to allowing BL unlocking. It would appear Nexus devices are 'truly unlocked,' in that their BL can be downgraded.
[Moto G General] ivesdotkom:
Im all set for my lollipop upgrade. returned to stock everything and locked my bootloader just in case. I personally cant wait to upgrade.
[Moto G General] lost101:
Here is a video covering how Lollipop (5.0) is currently being rooted on the Nexus 9. Also mentioned is the fact that apps that support root in KitKat (4.4) need to be updated for Lollipop (5.0) - another reason to wait, if your favorite 'root' app lacks Android 5.0 root support.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hukQmcDeTfk​
[Moto G General] fireball0093:
I know personally when it comes to being rooted, as long as I can flash SU for just a few minor things I can live without until whenever they get updated, I'll be happy. Lollipop for my personal tastes for Android pretty much makes it so I don't need to install almost anything root-wise ;p
[Moto G General] wihzard:
Not really worth losing all the progress in ROM customizations and the great work XDA devs have done. Plus I've been planing on finishing plants vs zombies sometime and I always lose my saves from all this flashing lol.:o
[Moto G General] lost101:
This might be useful to Xposed-heads who flash Lollipop: Alternatives to popular Xposed modules
[Moto G General] Dhiraj:
Everything changes, everything passes ...don't worry , we will get root support for android L soon .
[Moto G General] h2o64:
And we can't work on Ubuntu Touch anymore...

We need a way to downgrade the bootloader.
[Moto G General] lost101:
Maybe one of the Moto G (2014) users can tell us if they lost KitKat support after updating to Android 5.0.

Until someone creates a thread on the official forums, Motorola won't know people even want the ability to downgrade.
[Moto G General] nirmalbalaji:
We can't be able to downgrade to KitKat once we updated to Lollipop via OTA. Its been clearly stated in the Motorola release notes for both Moto X and Moto G 2014. Link: Moto G 2014 Android 5.0 Lollipop release notes
[Moto G General] MarckozZ:
Forma an average user that is impossible.. But here at XDA always comes up... At least with other phones...
[Moto G General] OldYellowBricks:
well..if your head over to the moto x 2014 forum, there was this user who requested to motorola to get back to kitkat and motorola linked him a special firmware. I dont know if that counts.
[Moto G General] lost101:
A link to the actual thread / post would be helpful since there are so many Lollipop threads. Thanks.

In other news, it looks like Custom Recovery still works with the new Bootloader, and root is already available:

http://xdaforums.com/moto-g-2014/development/xt1064-lollipop-root-t2938051​
[Moto G General] OldYellowBricks:
Well its here somewhere http://xdaforums.com/moto-x-2014/general/ota-pure-edition-lollipop-5-0-t2932625/page98
[Moto G General] nirmalbalaji:
It's always possible for us. There is no doubt in that. People who have less knowledge about Android unlocking and rooting stuffs are the one who end up in troubles.

We can't leave without root and root apps afterall. It's just a matter of time to root the Lollipop firmware. :cool:
[Moto G General] lost101:
As far as I can tell from what is being said in that thread, the user simply flashed a 4.4.4 firmware image and there was no error. No special files required. We'll just have to wait and see if that is actually the case for Moto G (2013).
[Moto G General] lost101:
CyanogenMod 12 (Lollipop) for Moto G (Falcon) does not appear to require a new Bootloader, however going by the Moto X (2014) discussion; Lollipop uses a new partition table. If flashing the 4.4.4 partition table (gpt.bin) is possible, then we can downgrade.

UPDATE: This build of CM12 is using a 3.4 Kernel - same as KitKat.
[Moto G General] juve2lia:
[MENTION=1006674]lost101[/MENTION] I want Stock 5.0 optimized :D
[Moto G General] lost101:
Custom recovery survives Android 5.0 OTA Update on Moto G (2014) - and functions as before.

Performance reports suggests Lollipop brings a nice boost.
[Moto G General] hacktrix2006:
Did OTA come with a new bootlogo?
[Moto G General] h2o64:
Does the backup process in recovery would be touched by the encryption by default? (I had this problem today ^^)
[Moto G General] lost101:
Unknown. Quickest way to get an answer is to ask in the Moto G (2014) forum.

You can turn on or off encryption in most custom recoveries. It may be enabled by default, but that has nothing to do with Bootloader, downgrading, or Lollipop.

In other news:

Moto G (2014) user [MENTION=6124571]savnex[/MENTION] claims downgrading to KitKat is possible by simply flashing a KK firmware image, but specified using fastboot.exe.

http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=56780036&postcount=4​
[Moto G General] h2o64:
How to turn off encryption from recovery ?
[Moto G General] lost101:
In TWRP it is Backup > No Encryption.

If you have any other questions on this subject - please start a thread in Moto G Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting, because it is not related to this topic.