yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] cb474:
Yeah, I saw that article too. It seems like they are assuming that since the four microphone noise cancellation is not listed in the Nexus 6 specs that this means it does not have it. But I've seen so many omissions in specs from phone manufacturers that I wouldn't make that assumption.

On the antenna design, my understanding is that there is no reason to put the plastic separaters in the metal band around the edge of the phone if it's not an antenna. You need the plastic to keep the separate antennas isolated from each other. This part of the Nexus design is identical to the Moto X. So I think that must be the antenna. I don't know why that article concludes the Nexus 6 doesn't have the dynamic tuning, but it makes no sense.

Probably we'll have to wait for AnandTech to review the Nexus 6 to get an answer, since they're the only site that talks about these things and seems to actually understand all the technology behind them.

Good catch on the lack of the upper microphone hole in the photo. That does not seems like a good sign. I would not be surprised if the four microphone noise cancellation were left out of the Nexus 6, for a more standard two microphone solution. Motorola mainly developed this feature to allow Moto Voice to better isolate people's voice for voice commands in noisy places. Improved call quality is just a side benefit. Since the Nexus 6 won't have Moto Voice (just some lesser Android L version of it), perhaps they left it out. And maybe Motorola needed to negotiate with Google to keep some features to distinguish the Moto X. They wouldn't want the Nexus 6 to just outclass it in every way and make it seem like a lesser phone.

Also, as I note above, Google has really not given a s**t about noise cancellation since the Nexus One. To take such a big step backwards in technology is pretty bad. So it's completely believable that they can't be bothered on the Nexus 6 either and just used Qualcomm's Fluence again.

*

Some of the things you list as "TBA" we already know.

The Nexus 6 is QHD. The secondary camera is 2 MP.

I agree that there's no excuse for not using at least a 1/2.5 sensor in a premium phone these days, especially given the size of the Nexus 6. Samsung managed to squeeze a 1/2.5 sensor in the 8.1 mm thick S5. Sony got a 1/2.3 sensor in the 7.3 mm thick Z3. And besides, the curve on the back of the Nexus 6 and extra thickness, I think, is in part an excuse to fit the camera module in without having a camera hump (a camera hump in disguise, if you will). So why not take advantage of the extra room the 10 mm thickness allows and put in a larger sensor?

That being said, it does also seem like given the size of the phone, maybe they could have made it 9 or 8 mm thick at the center instead. No reason it should be thicker than the Nexus 5 and 4.
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] 0.0:
The QHD screen will not be as good as Samsung's one, especially if you compare the n6 to the Note 4. I read the new Super AMOLED QHD screen is a beast on the Note 4. Now for a slim design, there is a point where too thin is too thin. I don't like the route the iPhones are going (not that I will ever own one lol). I want to hold something, and not a paper-like object. I would say semi-check for design. It does slim toward the bottom, since it is curved (I think?). Everything else I agree with

---------- Post added at 11:24 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:18 PM ----------

You got a point. But it may just have the plastic separators, but not the capacitive thing that allows the antenna signal thing move according to where your hand position is. I mean, the device is so big, I doubt you'll be blocking the radio from getting signal :p

Don't forget Crystal Talk, which could have improved in the Moto X. I don't think the Nexus 6 will have it
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] spartanm99:
To 0.0 and cb474 thank you for your feedback; for some reason I cant get the multi-quote to work.

I agree with the points you both made however.

I'm just hoping the Nexus 6 replacement next year gets a 1/2 camera at least and a 4 or 5mp at the front. By that time the One M8 would've been close to 2 years old and have had the 5mp front camera and the Z3 would be a year old with the 1/2.3 rear camera. Seriously no excuses for Nexus not to have a decent camera (especially in a large body).

For the 'premium' title they are going for, the phone has only a 'premium' processor (currently), premium amount of RAM (3gigs), premuim casing (plastic/aluminium) and a QHD screen (which I would not call premium as 1080P displays can look just as good or better; e.g. iPhone 6+). Qi charging, big battery, cameras, NFC etc are not really qualities only found on 'premium' devices so they cant be passed off as such. Thus in my opinion the phone really has two main premium traits going for it, not really justifiable and not what I would've done if I was in charge of putting together a new Nexus. Oh well, such is life.
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] cb474:
Your hand is still going to touch a lot of the metal on the edge of the phone and attenuate the signal. The claim with the 2nd Gen Moto X is that Motorola would not have gone with the external metal antenna design, if they had not developed the dynamic tuning to counter problems usually found with this sort of antenna design. It's just hard for me to imagine they would transpose only half of the antenna design to the Nexus 6. The two things were designed to work together. But stupid things do often happen.

Blech, that would be so dumb if the Nexus 6 just has Qualcomm's Fluence noise cancellation.

Personally, I've been underwhelmed by Crystal Talk and found it to be not even as good as Fluence. On the 1st Gen Moto X it was really subpar, comparing it side by side to Fluence, let alone Audience. I know the 2nd Gen Moto X is supposed to be an improvement, but is that because of the Crystal Talk signal processing or just because of the four microphones?

And I still have experienced the 2nd Gen Moto X myself or seen it reviewed seriously by someone like AnandTech. I know there have been anecdotal reports that it's good. But I've pretty much seen that kind of claim about noise cancellation on every phone that has it, even when there are real and dramatic differences if you test it more objectively.

I also hadn't checked in a while, but there are some reports now in the thread I started on the 2nd Gen Moto X noise cancellation that aren't very positive: http://xdaforums.com/moto-x-2014/general/hows-four-microphone-noise-cancellation-t2896205. Those reports are making Crystal Talk sound like it has some of the same failings that I observed in the 1st Gen Moto X. It's a bit disappointing, sine I've been holding out high hopes for the four microphone solution. Maybe it doesn't matter how many microphones you have if you don't get the chip right, for the signal processing. The Audience chip on the Nexus One was the best I've seen with only two microphones.

(Audience does also have a three microphone solution, but I've never tried a phone that has it. On the other hand, the OnePlus One has three microphone noise cancellation that I think is Qualcomm's Fluence. It sounds like it has some of the problems of Fluence with two microphones. A lot of times they just add the extra microphone for stereo sound recording on video, more that because it is used to add a lot to the noise cancellation.)
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] mbonus:
I don't know if it is a manufacturing issue or a mic hole surrounding the camera module at about the 2 o'clock position? I see it in a couple of different images of the n6. (like the second from the right midnight blue) Could be a stretch
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] 0.0:
It's better to look at hands on photos than renders. Look at The Verge to see some good hands on photos

Edit: so I looked at the photos, and there seems to be a hole, like you said. Could be a mic. We'll never know until someone checks it out and/or explains. But idk why it would be in the flash ring

sent from my Moto X (2014)
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] cb474:
Nice catch, I see it too.

I'm just speculating, but I wonder if the distance from the other microphones matters, assuming this is a microphone.

My understanding is that part of how this technology works is that it times the difference between when background noise reaches the back of the phone and when it reaches the microphone by your mouth a split second later. That way it knows what sound is background noise (it reaches the back of the phone sooner) and what sound is your voice (it reaches the microphone by your mouth sooner). So perhaps since the Nexus 6 is so large, instead of positioning the microphone at the top back of the phone like on the 2nd Gen Moto X, it made more sense to put it by the camera ring. Here's hoping.

Another possibility is that, if it is a microphone, this it has something to do with recording sound in video. Having a microphone right by the lens could somehow allow the phone to properly center the sound on the video image? (I'm really totally making that up. And it doesn't make much sense since that's not how micing is done in high quality film making anyway. If fact, putting a microphone right by a lens is usually bad, because the mic picks up any sounds made by mechanical elements in the lens.)

Anyway, here's hoping there's some chance the Nexus 6 will get the four microphone noise cancellation.
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] Peter Baher:
just hoping

only thing making me hold back from getting the nexus 6 (aside from it not being for sale yet lol) is the mics thing and yes that matters to me cuz i ditched my htc one m8 for the moto x just for the voice control features but then the nexus 6 is announced along with android 5.0 lollipop with the "ok google" feature when screen is off which gave me hope and made me rethink whether to get moto x or wait for the nexus 6 so i am still waiting to see how many mics ... and as for customizing the launch phrase i am more than sure it will be ported over as a mod or rom feature by our amazing xda devs. community. one thing though thats keeping my hopes up that i just noticed today, despite the lack of the small hope on the back top along the metal frame of the nexus 6 unlike the moto x there is actually another hole on the camera frame but shows only in some pics not all of them but i guess it was removed while editing to make ring flash look more fancy [IMG="nexus 6 third mic around camera lens"]http://static.knowyourmobile.com/sites/knowyourmobilecom/files/styles/gallery_wide/public/Array/nexus-6-lolly.jpg?itok=9OwPg-aV[/IMG] this is the one that's not showing cuz of the effect [IMG="nexus 6 third mic around camera lens"]http://cdn.slashgear.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/N6-camera-1600.jpg[/IMG] here too its showing [IMG="nexus 6 third mic around camera lens"]http://www.androidcentral.com/sites/androidcentral.com/files/styles/large/public/article_images/2014/10/n6-1.jpg?itok=WDDd30Km[/IMG]

so after all there might be 4 .. heck i will be happy with three but if its 2 moto x it is !

let me know what u guys thing and sorry for the long reply lol

---------- Post added at 04:40 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:36 PM ----------

crap just saw that after posting :angel:

edit:

last edit i promise lol: found in a hands on video its actaully showing https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Fn8OnzDO5Y just jump to minute 1:15 so i am almost sure now it has 4
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] dazed1:
lol 4 mics is awesome, assuming stereo recording?
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] Peter Baher:
not only that but amazing voice recognition that works even with screen off that trains to ur voice specifically after a while.
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] dazed1:
So if it has more then 2 mics, it will have stereo recording for sure?
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] cb474:
More importantly (to me) improved call quality in noisy settings (your caller can here you better).

I'm trying to be hopeful about the possible mic spotted on the camera ring, but I don't really get why they would leave the four microphone thing out of the specs on the Motorola website (it's there in the specs for the 2nd Gen Moto X) and not promote the point, since it was promoted for the 2nd Gen Moto X when it came out.
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] dazed1:
One guy is saying that the mics are in the speakers, he got the phone, check out the thread Nexus 6 exclusive fist look or something like that :)
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] cb474:
I think I saw that comment and discounted it as making no sense and having no basis other than the author making an assumption.

The main mic for picking up one's voice may well be in the bottom speaker and this is sometimes done on phones. But it would make zero sense to put a mic in the top speaker that is pressed against your ear when talking on the phone and producing the sound of your caller. For noise cancellation purposes you want the mics on the back of the phone, facing away from your mouth and toward the source of background noise.

So that comment, to me, just seemed like someone who doesn't know what they're talking about making something up.

It would be interesting to know where each of the four microphones on the Moto X are.
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] Peter Baher:
actually i fix phones and interestingly enough that is true there could be mics in the ear piece and even more interesting is that iphone 5 and 5s have 3 mics where the third is located in the earpiece also moto x 2014 has the fourth in that location and since i already detected 3 visible mics on nexus 6 i wouldnt be surprised at all if the earpiece has a fourth one actually i am almost certain it does
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] cb474:
I stand corrected. That's interesting. What's the value of having a mic in the earpiece? To differentiate the noise at the ear from the noise at the mouth? Does that work even when the earpiece-mic is pressed up against your ear? Or is it there only for noise cancellation in speakerphone mode and for voice commands?

Also, you say there are three visible mics on the Nexus 6. Can you point out where they are?
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] rufflez2010:
There is the regular mic, one at the bottom on the back and possibly a third inside the camera LED ring around 02:00
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] cb474:
And the regular mic we assume is in the speaker at the bottom?
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] rufflez2010:
Yeah. Don't see anywhere else it would logically go.
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] cb474:
I could be on the bottom edge of the phone, as is the case with many phones. Though I guess no one has seen a hole there in the photos. And on a phone this big, the bottom speaker on the front of the phone is probably closer to one's mouth.

---------- Post added at 07:04 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:00 PM ----------

Found this pretty high resolution image of the back of the Nexus 6:

http://tctechcrunch2011.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/hand-nexus-6-rear.jpg

It seems to further confirm the presence of a notch in the flash ring that could be a microphone (especially if you download the image and look at it in full resolution). It's more clear than the photo posted earlier in this thread and nice because it's an actual image of the phone rather than a publicity render (which have so far most clearly shown the notch).
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] elementaldragon:
It's quite easy to assume there would be a mic in the earpiece for noise cancellation, as already said, to differentiate sound coming from one's mouth from sound coming from the earpiece. While the earpiece would be pressed against your head, A) it's not an airtight seal against your ear, so noise still does escape (as i'm sure we've all experienced with people who have their call volume WAY too loud). B) even if it WAS flat against your face, there's still the cavities (though slim) where sound could travel through the device itself.
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] Peter Baher:
now that almost everyone agrees that it would have 4 mics i hope google actually took the time to make optimizations for "ok google" voice training so it would be as stunning and personalized (knowing the owners voice and not launched by anyone) like moto x ... otherwise 4 mics wouldnt be that great i mean yeah noise cancellation is nice and all but having a voice command initialized at any time even while screen is off only by my voice is way more exciting .. to me at least lol. only the upcoming days and hands-on videos will tell now that its officially out for preorders, i can barely wait longer :rolleyes:
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] dazed1:
So we are looking at 3 minimum for sure right?
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] cb474:
There is clearly a hole on the back near the bottom of the phone. There appears be be a hole/notch in the edge of the flash ring. On the basis of other phone designs, I think it's safe to assume the hole on the lower back is a microphone. The hole/notch in the flash rings seems like a good bet, but who knows, it's a novel placement.

One has to assume there is a third microphone on the front bottom of the phone or somewhere close to one's mouth for actually picking up one's speaking. The speculation is that the lower speaker is the most likely place, based on other phone designs.

And then it's pure speculation that the top speaker has a microphone in it. Apparently it has been done on other phones, so it's possible, but who knows specifically with the Nexus 6.

So I guess I'd say there's definitely two microphones (otherwise the specs couldn't claim to have active noise cancellation). It's reasonable to think there are three, but I would not call it "for sure." And four microphones is a very huge maybe.

People have done some good sleuthing, but it remains odd (to me) that there was no mention of four microphone noise cancellation in the Nexus 6 specs or press release, given how much it was hyped on the 2nd Gen Moto X. Of course noise cancellation is often a feature that is ignored and not discussed much by phone manufacturers, so it's not out of the norm to have said nothing. And, except for the very notable exception of the Nexus One, Google has been especially inattentive to noise cancellation. Even Samsung, the only company to consistently use the best in class Audience noise cancellation chip (while everyone else is dropping it left and rigth for Qualcomm's inferior--but presumably cheaper--Fluence), even Samsung does not promote this fact, though the Audience chip would seem like something worth mentioning.
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] dazed1:
Another amazing aswer from you sir, thank you so much. Yes, i did noticed in Note 4, that the recording quality, was drastically improved from the Note 4, and i think N4 use 3 microphones, or 4? just i hope, even if Nexus 6 use 3, that it will have stereo recording option, i will be very much disappointed if it records in mono, but maybe there will be some mod to enable stereo mics? :)
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] mbonus:
Support for 3 microphones per Nexus 6 Support Page https://support.google.com/nexus/answer/6102470?hl=en&ref_topic=3415523
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] dazed1:
yesssssssssssssss!!!!!!!!!!!
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] chrisg1548:
If you check the link it's google nexus site you will see that the pic of the back of the Nexus has small hole that presumably is a mic hidden in the ring flash. Guess they did that for a esthetic look, but this is my opinion.

https://www.google.com/nexus/6/
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] cb474:
Hmm. I guess that means it does not have the four microphone noise cancellation found in the Moto X. It also suggests it may not be using Motorola's CrystalTalk noise cancellation and instead use Qualcomm's Fluence (which supports three microphones) as was found in the Nexus 5 and 4 (though they only had two microphones). Fluence has not proven to be a very good noise cancellation solution. It's middle of the road.

The "3-microphone support" specification is odd though. Saying a phone supports three microphones is not the same thing as saying it has three microphones. I don't know what to make of that. But I've seen enough manufacturer's post incorrect specs about their own phones to take this with a grain of salt and wait for the best review sites, like AnandTech, to hopefully give a more precise answer.
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] alangrig:
At least I do hope Nexus 6 will be the first Nexus which can record audio distortion free up to 150db pressure like does mine HTC M7 with HDR Mics.

In addition, noise cancellation will be at least the same like in HTC M7/M8.
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] dcrandon:
Thanks so much for your contributions about noise canceling. It is one of my hope for this phone that it is top quality. I drive in a noisy convertible and have found the N4 and N5 to be unacceptable to use with the top down. So, I use a Phiaton PS 210 BTNC (a bluetooth earbud set with active noise canceling for the bud and mic. It works very well. Even in the car with the top down people can hear me clearly.

BTW, any idea which type of noise canceling Phiaton may use for the mic in this unit?
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] cb474:
Unfortunately that is extremely unlikely. The first bastch of the HTC M7 used a "dual membrane" mic that allowed for it's recording abilities in loud settings. But they were being supplied the mic illegally by a company that Nokia contracted to manufacture it (Nokia in fact designed and engineered the mic for the Nokia 808 and completely owns the technology). Even later manufactured HTC M7s don't have this mic. So the only way you can get this technology is to get one of the Nokia phones that has it. No other cell phone company is really trying to innovate with recording technology and mics the way Nokia has.

I explain the situation with these mics more here: http://xdaforums.com/nexus-6/general/camera-discussion-t2906907/post56435343

I do think the noise cancellation on the Nexus 6 will probably be at least as good as the M7/M8, but that's not saying much. The M7/M8 use Qualcomm's mediocre Fluence noise cancellation (same as Nexus 4 and Nexus 5 and a lot of other phones). Being as good as them won't be hard.

I'm glad there are some other people who care about noise cancellation in phones and notice that there are differences between the technologies used by current flagships. I don't really know much about the technology in bluetooth headsets or if they use the same chips as phones. When I experimented around with headsets, I found the best at the time for both sound quality and noise cancellation was the Platronics Voyager Pro. But that's about as much as I know on that topic.
[Nexus 6 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] alangrig:
That's why I keep my HTC M7 from first batch production. Best Mics on Android phone every. Unfortunately, do not see any alternative flagship with same mics.