yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Xperia Z3 General] radicans:
Ok, so here are some random photos I snapped hurrily over the weekend. I have no real complaints with these as they seem to showcase where the Z3 does perform reasonably well, close ups of flowers :)

I am aware that the camera settings might not be ideal, but there were kids in the company so no more than 1 sec per snap, or I would lose them! First three taken with 20MP manual mode, last one HDR in superior auto 8MP.

http://i.imgur.com/jbZ01uh.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/aHvx00K.jpg (really underexposed, but it was what the autoexposure gave me)

http://i.imgur.com/1iuvDRW.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/UQv5sXI.jpg

What I did notice is that the purple cabbage or whatever it is (pic 1) got extremely saturated, and somewhat hueshifted. It was more a blueish purple than a red purple.
[Xperia Z3 General] CandyAndy:
Here is again a comparison between z3 and htc m8. I guess that in this kind of scenery z3 is better but neither of them is excellent

https://drive.google.com/folder/d/0B0MUVjq_igOMVGV2bThGQnlReGc/edit
[Xperia Z3 General] One Twelve:
He says the ISO was not sticking, this is a major issue with a number of cameras because the camera libs are locked. No way for devs to access them. If you cannot set ISO then utility of a 3rd party camera app decreases :(

Apple opened their camera libs with ios8 and all sorts of magic happens. Now this is something other companies can implement.

---------- Post added at 08:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:45 PM ----------

Any camera will do well with macros. Older ones can hold their own quite well with new ones. This is one area where the new ones do not make that much of a difference.

The real innovation is the BSI or extra sensitivity showing more details in less than ideal light.

When you do close up work, macros or portraits make sure to use spot metering and not average.

The second photo is where the exposure gets tricked, similar when there is snow. Too much white and the meter wants to make it dark so you need to use EV+1.

General rules wrt to expsoure

snow scene/ white subject filing frame +2

small subject against white backrgound +2

large subject against white background +1

average scene with full range of brightness 0

larger subject against dark background -1

small subject against dark background -2

dark subject filling frame -2

credit

Spyros

The difficult bit to to identify this on the screen at the time. Unless the lighting is acceptable you won't be able to see it until you get home.

Colour shifting can happen at times but its an easy fix in post.
[Xperia Z3 General] sefelizrc:
Some macro shots! I love this camera
[Xperia Z3 General] One Twelve:
You are very modest but its me who has to thank you.

Check out this

book

.

Everything you wanted to know about composition but were afraid to ask. Comprehensive but not for beginners.

Applicable whether you have 2 MP camera or a Leitz camera.
[Xperia Z3 General] Elfsiren:
Coming from a Nexus 5 I have to say I was rather disappointed with the Z3 photos. I know people think the N5 camera was bad, but that wasn't the case. With the Z3 I've had a few very nice photos, some really bad ones, and most were just sorta okay. Links included to the full photos. Edit: With the exception of the first flower, all of these were taken on the same evening at about 5pm. They were taken in manual mode with different tweaks. No post editing done.

Good ones:

http://1drv.ms/1wtm8T5

http://1drv.ms/1nH6faS

[IMG="Macro School Flow"]https://uot3va.dm2302.livefilestore.com/y2p5K0mE0wWiDQGthL34xe988rg_3uLetadOXPNp9859Gz-LWiB7a7qNw55hP4jWLfCRj5SUZjrdJ-msoirJzko2WfYHoqLsdKcjUwt_4RpAgU/20141023_155514_Android.JPG[/IMG]

Okay ones:

http://1drv.ms/ZSjL0t

[IMG="Dragonfly, I think"]https://pj8tlw.dm2302.livefilestore.com/y2pNwU5r9ZXpDrDFjgbcSz2KpWvo4gsW_JfF18iTKx3b7h466x4t2CjQeSGm8BccjpLwq9RmVqGLazcKjhBvfy3H5siXuvkrDN4lT2Mp190wjY/I%20think%20it%27s%20a%20dragonfly.JPG?psid=1[/IMG]

http://1drv.ms/1nH6L8Z

[IMG="Artsy Thing"]https://ppqkja.dm2302.livefilestore.com/y2pvyyxDntUrS6_-fiEa2XmaEvbI-RvNhSFPSRtmkcROBSfvw8x9apBrXjNaPlAaXHNY109B3VuAJ0Mu8CnsGjm0MWwaotZkY1smEUC7DIWLUc/Artsy%20Thing.JPG?psid=1[/IMG]

http://1drv.ms/ZSk0si

[IMG="Lone Flower"]https://p58tlw.dm2302.livefilestore.com/y2p1XLgFRY_gY5vqlnW6xuA85q50cKutFt7PT8OCuRNZLh6FeylS25eu_gn64WwdvCe6qsiMGSiD2dm3fm_DVMGRqQoqYFkYW7Wo58ztsYimRs/Lone%20Flower.JPG?psid=1[/IMG]

Some bad ones:

http://1drv.ms/1tbbd0k

[IMG="A seemingly Dead Lake"]https://61ir0q.dm2302.livefilestore.com/y2pcuSn2W0METnsIRcVH5UEFfUgPmbmyJTNBE5PJ8PhvxuCkeUnRxQSFl8L_v8CElnFHj9fOsDoLV8DT7AYFG_rd52tGRAKEEnZq-AFZBN_K1M/A%20seemingly%20dead%20lake.JPG?psid=1[/IMG]

http://1drv.ms/1DPI7Xz

[IMG="Cactus"]https://pjpuow.dm2302.livefilestore.com/y2pMfNBc8FQTN6SBn_kgaM7ccwG0OpUa4Cc7c2rsFQ8-CXQ_yQ5_ee9TIg4U2pVgBfsdZAI_ey-CSCTCvHCmZq1ElMvFUY10u_l0REye93PcOU/Cactus.JPG?psid=1[/IMG]
[Xperia Z3 General] One Twelve:
Yes and that is the point. Manual will outbeat these auto jobs.

One more thing for you try with Corel.

Pan stitch. Try with just two photos. Make sure second photo overlaps first by 25%.

Don't pan by standing in one point and revolving with your hands out. You have to turn around the axis of the phone. The phone must be fixed and you turn yourself. Its difficult to do handlheld but doable for a few.

With a tripod you can stich maybe 12 pictures and get a very detailed pano.

Panorama is done in portrait instead of landscape.
[Xperia Z3 General] hanime:
[MENTION=6079771]radicans[/MENTION] - Thank you for the in-depth analysis of the camera and processing. The blurry or watercolor photos I've been getting for two of my Z3s have been bothering me since the first day I own them. I noticed this and thought the same thing, after comparing photos from iPhone 5s, 6, and Nexus 5. Photos on the Z3 are water-colored down for some reason!
[Xperia Z3 General] itsjustJOH:
[MENTION=6079771]radicans[/MENTION] Very good work there! I'd like to see more comparisons, especially low-light, if you don't mind. I just want to see how Sony is doing it wrong, and you're post is the best and probably the only review/comparison I've read that truly explains why in a very technical manner. :good:
[Xperia Z3 General] One Twelve:
First problem

imgur is a site that strips of exifs. These are cropped copies where are the originals ?

I've already told you to post on a site that does not strip out exifs.

Second problem

Did you compare the histograms of these two images. Here they are

Z3 compact

5s

5s got a better exposure than the Z3.

Well, if one is more exposed than the other i think it will look different and the rest of your analysis has followed off from two non-equivalent images. One better exposed than the other.

Bet the iphone used a different metering here compared to the z3.

You take the trouble to do an analysis like this but do not use equivalent images. why ?

You need lab conditions where variables are at a minimum to draw any meaningful conclusions. This is why i go with DxO's results. Which are avaiable on dpreview if anyone wants to know more about the intricacies of noise and how they compare. Both z3 & 5s are there.

Another point to note is DxO never does image comparisons for good reason, its a short trip to insanity. They assess each device on its own against a set of criteria and give it a score. Then we compare scores on different parameters on the basis of many tests.

That is the closest we can come to objectively comparing two different devices.

Z3 beats the 5s by two points when it comes to stills. What does that mean ? not a lot to seperate these two.

You will lose image quality unlocking the bootloader before sony tells you its ok. With the Z2 this only happened in Decemeber. Do not unlock your bootloader before that.

ok, which one will you go for ?

I've already recommended a couple of options to your friend but he seems to have made his mind up on the note 4 which was not what i recommended.
[Xperia Z3 General] radicans:
No, you don't need lab conditions to get a pretty good evaluation of a camera. The blurred out chroma channels have been apparent in every single Z3 photo I have looked at. And so has the cross hatch effect in fine detail foliage. Here is the redness channel as compared with the samsung galaxy note 3

Granted, the note 3 isn't fantastic either, but it's better than the Z3 by a mile. Plus, and more importantly, the Note 3 photo doesn't look like a pile of crap.

http://i.imgur.com/Zy3hzJY.jpg

Anyway, I'm still waiting for photo evidence from you where the Z3 beats the competition ;)

Ha ha, I'm not surprised he didn't follow your advice :) We seem to have wildly different opinions on what makes a good camera! I would have gone for the Note 4 also, if it wasn't for the big size. As for the photos I have seen so far, in my opinion it is by far the best mobile camera out there (not counting nokia, as I haven't seen any images from that series).

I will probably wait for Android 5.0 and see how things turn out. Quite keen on programming a camera app which treats the image all the way from RAW demosiac, with user control of all the processing steps. It should be possible without too much wait, if using the GPU and OpenCL.

---------- Post added at 11:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:20 PM ----------

Thanks, I'm very glad if my input can help clear things up!

I can try and have look at the existing low light photos in this thread, as posted by others. But I don't have much possibility to organize another side by side comparison test in the near future I'm afraid. I suspect the color information will be even more blurred in low light, although this is probably to be preferred over the strong chromatic noise in some of these situations. Take a look at Zanr Zijs low light photos in this thread (esp. the last one indoors), and see how much noise there is with an unlocked bootloader (aka less denoising). But having said that, in many semi-low light photos I prefer the unlocked bootloader. I would rather have a bit of grain, than have the photo messed up by over processing.

In daylight shots though, there is no excuse for denoising artifacts!
[Xperia Z3 General] admad:
More Z3 samples.

(Original: http://www.mediafire.com/view/fdg5dsl2m500bj6/2014-10-25 13.53.32.jpg#)

(Original: http://www.mediafire.com/view/0dbdslbkiz0x9uq/2014-10-25 14.25.48.jpg#)

(Original: http://www.mediafire.com/view/chlx8ev4hsdt1mk/2014-10-25 13.58.54.jpg#)

(Original: http://www.mediafire.com/view/9jpk13legb6175y/2014-10-25 14.19.03.jpg#)

(Original: http://www.mediafire.com/view/ehe858a0wq6knm7/2014-10-25 14.23.57.jpg#)

(Original: http://www.mediafire.com/view/shsig5kohr879f9/2014-10-25 14.09.51.jpg#)

(Original: http://www.mediafire.com/view/do2k4yknem273ok/2014-10-25 14.08.23.jpg#)
[Xperia Z3 General] One Twelve:
Pretty good ?

Who chooses a camera based on blurred out chroma channel ?? That you has to go to such an extent is rather telling.

Another attempt at exaggeration when points made are minor and lack substance based on invalid comaprisons. I've called you out twice now. I suggest you go elsewhere as you've wasted enough of our time and yours on what amounts to splitting of hairs in an attempt to show the Z3 isn't worth it.

DxO and dpreview for details.

As to why the Z's are not as bad as is made out to be.

btw i don't have to provide you anything, you started this off with your 'evidence' which i've trashed.

No, we don't have wildly different opinions. You and your friend have an agenda which i'm not buying nor should anyone here either.

If you cannot understand why i recommend those two devices based on your prefrence for better photos i'm convinced both of you haven't the slightest clue about what you pretend to have said to date.

Go troll some place else.
[Xperia Z3 General] G1_enthusiast:
I had a chance to own the Iphone 6, I must admit, Apple know what they doing with phone camera. Sony always F*** something up with their product, they built u up with this amazing features and spec and then failed miserably due to half ass programing. They want to be a top contender with HTC and Samsung and yet they release something that is not ready, their CEO should be fire!

I find it funny that some people would actually suggest using a camera phone in manual mode...lol its a phone at heart, the pictures you take shouldnt be about quality but about memory,if you got to calibrate your camera for a "in the moment" shot then its not a point and shoot anymore. If you want good photo go get a dedicated camera, I would never compare my phone to my Fujifilm.
[Xperia Z3 General] hanime:
Agreed. A phone should be a point-and-shoot for the majority of its users. The option to go manual is always a plus. And here, Sony is falling behind on their programming or software to process photos better. They have the hardware! Look at how Apple perfected their iPhone 6 or 6+ photo processing, given the hardware.
[Xperia Z3 General] Venacephalica:
Using 20 MP and all auto...

https://flic.kr/p/pPLxWT
[Xperia Z3 General] subhani:
[MENTION=3617690]juanmaasecas[/MENTION] thank you for a very prescriptive response to my Qs. I will try out pro cam and the other one too.

I think you are REALLY onto something here when you said it has something to do with the sensor size? That Samsung's and iDevices are in the 35mm category and Sony in the 25mm. The images produced on the iPhone 6+ simply look REAL! It's vivid, not the colour but the picture looks vividly crisp and real. So did my old Note 2 when compared to my LG G2 for some reason.

Then [MENTION=6079771]radicans[/MENTION] is also exposing another major issue, which is artificial softening to produce a oily image and still failing to hide the noise when compared side by side with my iP6+.

I've seen the Note 4 images and I'm so surprised they are even better than the iPhone's. The pureview lumias and the 808 are on another level altogether. I absolutely love the Sony no question over the iPhone. I still recommend the Z3 and i know two people who got it on my recommendation. I never mentioned the camera as a strong point. The OS on the iPhone, the price, the size, amongst other things fail to impress me. Even the design, more rounded and cute like the Samsung's and LG's are getting stale plus the back looks second rate compared to the Sony.
[Xperia Z3 General] jonmorris:
The Galaxy S5 overly softened detail, and the Z3 definitely does the same too. I've been saying that since I first got my Z3.

My Z2 retains more detail, so clearly something has been changed in the camera algorithms - as now 'proven' by the difference between the locked and unlocked bootloader. It seems that the unlocked bootloader produces more defined images.

Presumably these photos are noisier, but in some cases that can be better. Do you want the oil painting look, or something with genuine detail where you can make out leaves, grass, what signs say etc? Perhaps the solution is to give us the choice to decide ourselves?

I really thought Sony had finally cracked it with the very latest Z2/Z1 Compact software, so it seems like a step backwards. But as pictures usually look fine on a 5.2-inch screen, or reduced when shared, perhaps Sony believes it's the lesser of two evils?
[Xperia Z3 General] radicans:
I respect your enthusiastic defense and unwavering belief in this camera. But this is getting rather aggressive. In the best interest of everyone in here, I think we should stop replying to each others posts
[Xperia Z3 General] hanime:
[MENTION=6079771]radicans[/MENTION] [MENTION=5512893]One Twelve[/MENTION]

I believe at the end of the day, given the hardware, we know Sony really messed up something on the Z3, It is most likely the software or processing side, seeing that other manufacturer phones are doing the same (removing noise algorithm, causing water-colored photos), but less noticeable. It may be a hardware issue, but I would not like to think the latter. Let's focus on Sony at the moment so they get something right.
[Xperia Z3 General] Elysian893:
Decided while walking the dogs last night I'd try some night shots... Overall not too great, but these three shots weren't too bad:

Noisy of course, but not too bad on detail. I was also only at 7% battery when I left, and when I got home from the walk and snapping many pics I was still at 6%.
[Xperia Z3 General] radicans:
Agreed, I would love to have an option to simply switch the denoising on and off! In the daytime, denoising is unneccessary in most cases. But for indoor low light shots, I wouldn't want to be without it!

Seeing as one of Sony's biggest marketing points with the Z3 is the low light performance, I think they made the call to tailor the camera performance for those environments, i.e. heavy de-noising, no matter what the implications. And most people only watch the photos on the device, in which case the side-effects aren't noticeable. So in this regard it's a "fair" call, but this shouldn't leave out the option for the rest of us to turn it off!
[Xperia Z3 General] subhani:
Juan, sorry for the pestering, could you elaborate a little bit more on the 'max quality' and the 'HD improvements' for me? I can't seem to see a difference when using this app, not how your images do, in fact the colors vary wildly under the different presets in 'enhance' mode for me and the detail still lacking.

after your instructions, i'm gonna export the pictures into a larger display and see if i can tell the difference.
[Xperia Z3 General] hanime:
Your photos looks really bad. Look at all the details lost. I don't remember my HTC One M7 looking anything like this in the dark, and it was 4MP camera.
[Xperia Z3 General] One Twelve:
20MP camera used in Z1, Z1c, Z2, Z3, Z3c

Here we are saying the same thing when the Z1 came out. At that time the compression was over done, no more with Z2.

Do you really believe Sony messes up after 5 tries ? Only if you can be made to believe it.

I've followed the htc one threads and the xperia threads, lots of photo enthusiasts there and the usual lively debate. Htc one was/is the most bashed camera out there. Never stopped them taking good photos.

You ever been to the sony forums ? its like going to the doctor. You only find people with complaints and nobody to counter.
[Xperia Z3 General] costarricenze:
You should consider start taking in Manual Mode. I've been noticed a great improvement when people use Manual instead Auto.
[Xperia Z3 General] abhinav.tella:
I tried manual, my sister's GS4 still takes better photos. Sony really needs to do an update soon to fix this.
[Xperia Z3 General] costarricenze:
What a shame, I was really considering to get this phone.
[Xperia Z3 General] subhani:
The GS4 and now the Note 4 have the best smartphone cameras outside of the pure view beasts from Nokia. IPhone's in second place and the Z2 probably running up.
[Xperia Z3 General] Chefproll:
I guess we need to be a bit careful using statements like that...

I saw just too many biased reviews, using pictures taken in a special way, preferring a device's camera.

Example: A bench in a park. Field of view of all competing phones shows a white building in the background, but the field of view of one special smartphone does exclude that white building. Result: Picture of that bench looks far better with that one special phone because exposure is not mislead by the white background.

You'll see things like that very often with iPhone reviews.

So I don't trust reviews at all, I prefer a real hands-on.

Maybe I'll get a Note 4 today; let's see if it does better than the Z3. I am pretty sure it will as it didn't have the slightest chance competing against the GS4.

---------- Post added at 11:37 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:11 AM ----------

Here's another crop...
[Xperia Z3 General] iBuzman:
just for giggles.. these were taken in "complete" darkness, ignoring the flash of course.. just in auto mode before the thing ran away eg. the Australian possum on the power line [emoji205]
[Xperia Z3 General] One Twelve:
ISO 64 & 100

ISO 50, 200, 50

With both the ISO is 800 and the shutter is quite fast i/600+ meaning there was enough light. You want to get these with as low an ISO as possible. ISO 50-100. Anytime you find a shot looks soft or sub standard check the iso and try to get it with a lower iso.

The metering chosen was average here. With portraits or macros try spot metering this way the camera ignores everything else and only meters off the cactus. make sure you aim steady though otherwise spot will catch something else and mess it up. Centre weighted is a bit more forgiving than spot as the target is much wider.

Finally both show a big difference in light between foreground & background. Challenging scenes. You have to experiment where to meter off so as to keep the picture balanced. You could focus on something else and then recompose. If you want to get both you need to expose for highlights but it needs to be at the area where its starting to get bright. experiment.

Try to take the shot of the same subjects again at the same time of day and compare. Lower iso will easily improve that shot.. Pick a subject and just shoot that lots of times and see what works and does not given the lighting.

General rules are outdoors iSO:50-100 indoors 200-400 and low light 800 or more. if you then reduce thehigh iso from 20mp to 4mp you will elliminate some noise without any post processing.

If you can hold the camera steady you can use lower iso with longer shutter scene mode. But no 20mp from stock in that case.
[Xperia Z3 General] Elfsiren:
Thanks for the pointers. I'll definitely try those. I just wish the results were as good as the Nexus 5.
[Xperia Z3 General] One Twelve:
Good luck figuring out how to disable auto night mode :D

I saw a comparison with ip6+ and note 4. Daylight photos are good, evening time iso gets bumped up and you can't do anything. if you use low iso the shot is dark. How to slow shutter speed in that case. This problem was not there before. night mode was an option not some auto thing imposed on you whether you want it or not.

No program mode nor manual mode !! why ? its just software. Why can't samsung provide it. They do it with another model. So its not androids fault. Its things like this that are bigger factors than image quality.

The iP6+ otoh with ois took lots of low iso 1/4 shots. Why did apple leave out ois in the 6. Not everyone wants the bigger ip6+

Havig said that its possible to get those shots without ois but it takes practice. So consistency won't be there.
[Xperia Z3 General] darkrai:
Had to Whatsapp the pic to reduce its quality (xda restricts picture size to 2xxkb)

Sony needs to fix the sharpness on the pics they look too blurry to be of flagship quality

I dont really like switching again and again to manual with iso50 and take super dim pictures

For those who are excessively complaining, terrible pictures the z3 takes indeed! Terrible i say! Sony fix this!
[Xperia Z3 General] darkrai:
Is it just me or the selfie camera edits the pics and makes them look like I've applied a layer of makeup?
[Xperia Z3 General] Goronok:
So I've had my z3 (D6603) for a week and I love just about every aspect of it, but the camera is killing me. Maybe my expectations were too high, but compared to my old iphone 5s, the camera is (without too much exaggeration) abysmal. I have played with both the superior auto and manual settings and unless lighting is 100% ideal, this thing takes crap pictures. Background detail is gone, lens flare is atrocious, and many indoor pictures have a slight pink to them.

Is my phone defective? I'm seeing some glowing reviews, I just can't seem to reproduce what some have been able to capture.

Hopefully a software/firmware update will correct some of these issues =/