yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] EastExpert:
That, my friend, is what I suspected... The program itself would run, but Universals are famous for their lack of RAM to operate programs. Even MN|5 required so much memory, it would leave 4-6 out of 22-24 available... shame actually, 'cause the program was really lovely and had that "luxury" feeling oozing from it. I guess MN|6 requires even more, probably as much as 20+MB. This makes a lot of swapping and this is probably why you experienced such slow operation... :( -- and why the NAVIGON decided to deem Universals incompatible. The processing power in Uni is abundant - Bulverde 520MHz is not bad at all!

For comparison, TomTom 6, which I decided to try as an alternative, happily lives in 6-8 MB (not forgetting to give the memory used by it back at the end of the session). Having seen this, I reenabled PocketBreeze on my XDA Exec and it still has plenty of memory to operate -- I feel so much happier after these few months... I intend to try playing MP3 while navigating and see how it fares along. Pure tests :)

Also TomTom showed Tunnel mode, availability of TomTom Plus service where you can subscribe for ~£33 for a year of Traffic updates (via mere GPRS - no need to buy yet another £170-210 TMC-enabled receiver!) and Speed (err, Safety) Camera updates... that's nothing if you ask me :) Operated very fast in my tests, 2-3 seconds long route recalculations, convenient & configurable menus (yes, you can make your own ONLINE!).

You also get camera data freely available from the Net if you don't feel like paying for TomTom Plus subscription. Other things I liked about TomTom is gradually increasing precision as you approach the maneuvre point (.1 miles then .05 then 50 yds then 25 etc... till 5), Race Against Time mode where you enter time you wish to be at your destination and it shows you how are you faring on it! Also very sensible routing algorithms (btw compared to MN|5 -- I just get there faster!). What totally killed me was Full UK Postcode search that just required me to copy a few files into installation directory and it worked straight away! Only AA Navigator had a comparable Full UK Postcode database... the problem is, it didn't support Address search (as in "Town/Street/Number" mode). So TomTom won here as well.

Re: iGO 2006, some colleagues of mine have tried it and have split feelings: 1) the program they say is just excellent, but 2) the map coverage in the UK where we are is disappointingly incomplete. I guess this is just a teething problem (growth problem) since iGO was designed in Hungary, so they say its Eastern European coverage is much better. And I think iGO definitely has future. I read the manual and was pleasantly impressed by amount of features available. (And a bit disappointed by reviews that said UK coverage is currently far from perfect).

In other words, I now have moved to TomTom 6 for now.

As for MN|6, seems like while we retain our Universals, we're in the ditch with it. Oh, tough. Until there's a comparable device (VGA and Phone and GPRS and 3G and WiFi and even GPS may be) -- I'll cling to my Universal.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] dape16:
Seems like I was wrong about the compatibility after all...

I have done some more testing here and it seems like it is the Universals lack of RAM thats the problem.

When I tried to do some door-to-door navigation with MN6 the Uni gave me memory allocation errors or it would simply freeze.

I have Helmis AKU 3.5 ROM and about 22 MB RAM free after soft-reset. Maybe I should try with Ivans, I read in his thread that with his ROM you start with about 30 MB free.

But I am not sure that would solve the problem, I found this thread and some people there have been testing MN6 with Ivans ROM.

http://www.ppc-welt.info/community/showthread.php?t=102846

By the way, I cant belive that MN6 is eating so much RAM. They have had a couple of years do redesign MN5 but still it needs more then twice as much as TomTom.

Since Navgions maps are the best where I live, I am thinking about trying MN5. EastExpert, did you get it to run well on your Uni? Was it compatible with VGA?
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] fishtastic:
My test with MN|6, wasn't encouraging.

1st Out of memory.

Reset. Next 3 or 4 goes, it was very slow and lagging in switching between dialogue boxes to the point were it would be doing the same thing 3 times because you thought you had not pressed the on screen buttons.

It looked very nice and certainly more polished than TT, but certainly not something to use for your daily business unless someone comes up with a superROM with a large amount of free mem and no leakage.

You can use it, but you need to be really careful, press a button and sit there, wait for the result, then do the next thing. I'm going to try i-Go next, to see if it fits my needs better than TT.

Shame; MN|6 looked pretty cool.

Cheers

Fish
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] dape16:
There is some interesting info at the thread I linked to earlier, some guy saying that according to Navigon support the Universal will be compatible with the next update for MN6. Exciting!
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] EastExpert:
dape, yes I used to run MN|5 on my Uni. Granted, it wasn't without problems. When I went somewhere far away, I always soft reset the beast, otherwise it could easily run out of memory somewhere on the go.

Another thing that really peed me off was that if I tried to do something beyond usual navigation (i.e. enter the address and press go), like select a car park nearby, or a petrol station, it would start to mix new screen on top of the old one... same would happen if I were to enter next destination after having arrived at the first one -- clear signs for me (a long-ago former software developer) that there's not enough memory.

It was a properly bought version (used an upgrade offer from AA Navigator I've been using before) and I lived with it for several months, but never was quite content with the fact I hadn't free memory enough to run the program -- this could build an inferiority complex in some other person! :p . Then eventually I've gotten sick and tired of it and decided to seek for alternatives.

I dropped the forum link you provided into Babelfish to translate into English, and there was an interesting phrase there -- the sense was that there will be an update to MN|6 that will make it compatible. Hmm. That could be interesting! I guess I'll keep watching the arena! :)

UPDATE: You have just posted the same and you were faster :)

fishtastic, looks like your findings actually corroborate the theory of MN|6 being all too big for the usual memory amount in Universal.

One can't really work like that -- not freely using all the MN|6's advanced features and having to wait and soft reset without end.

iGO seems not an option for me yet -- all the reviews I've read mention far from ideal coverage of UK where I dwell. Nice software, though, I'll give it a go when the next version arrives.

O2 UK is now providing XDA Orbit (= HTC Artemis) and recommends ALK CoPilot 6 with it. I wasn't too impressed by its screenshots, looks like TomTom and iGo are better. Haven't got my mitts on a version of CoPilot I could install and try though. May be O2 had their reasons when selecting CoPilot for their XDA orbit.

P.S. I wonder what happens next -- me finding anything better than TomTom 6, or me moving to a next BMW with in-dash Sat-Nav support?... :p LOL
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] fishtastic:
Are these BMWs that you speak of more or less expensive than a universal? And do run WM5? ;-)

Er, seriously, a lot of guys in work, have beemers and several use TT-ToGo, the only guy with dashboard satnav drives a Jag. Me being the poor IT guy doing the essbase and SQL Server stuff surrounded by these rich accountants catches the train to work. Boo.

I suppose the thing with TT is that it works fairly well. I just wish they would tart it up a bit and tidy the interface.

Oh well,

Good Luck to anyone else trying. Oh, I should have said before that I'm using the original shipping Rom on an O2 Exec from Nember 2005.

Cheers

Fish
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] EastExpert:
Being in IT myself, and not a sales, solicitor or accountant, I think the first is more likely to happen :) and my next BMW would probably cost about as much as a new Universal...

Err... but I digress. :)

You're right about TT - it "just friggin' works", period. You just start it and it does what's on the tin. And compared to version 3 it's really a much better product (that was my previous experience with TT).

I'll be watching the space though - the hint about potential update that will support Execs is taken. Next iGO will be worth trying, I guess. And that's about it -- sometimes you just want to have something that works for a while :)

Many thanks to you guys for your feedback. Now, we know :)
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] fishtastic:
Small addition:

MN|6 appears to switch off the power management i.e. the turn off the backlight after 3 mins bit. Confused me when I opened it and it was on.

Also, anyone with the problem with their battery is getting a bit old and turning off at 30odd%, if you have installed MN|6, at what point does it now do it at? Has it changed?

Cheers

Fish
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] dape16:
The battery problem you mention is quite strange, because my 5 months old Uni suddenly started to turn of at about 30% power...

I can confirm that this is a battery problem, it has not anything to do with ROM version or something. Only a new battery solved my problem.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] fishtastic:
Yes, it's well known that it's a battery problem, but mine went from 30-odd% to ~90% just after installing, that prompted the question. Personally I believe it's a coincidence that it changed so dramatically. My battery is 1 year and 3 months old and I think it's heart just gave out. I ordered a new battery a few days ago, before MN|6, and so hopefully it won't be too long before the new one arrives.

I was just wondering if anyone had experience such a jump? I'm guessing it is my battery's particular circumstances in this case.

Cheers

Fish
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] EastExpert:
The whole thread http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=267448 is dedicated to Exec battery problems. I have added my 2p there recently, too...

In a nutshell, it looks like even the original batteries have only about a year's life and then start to suck big time. And replacements from third parties are rare sh!te, most displaying problems with short life, having not enough energy to operate Exec's parts like phone or SD card too early, some always displaying charge at 100% and all of them not even approaching the stated capacity of 1750 mAh...

Only a few people tried to generalize, but I'd say: some report problems starting when they installed AKU 3.x from this forum, some blame charging via USB connection to PC, some blame just abysmal quality of batteries (probably true for 3rd party replacements), and some blame age (probably true, too - 1 year and then you gotta replace your battery or it gets less and less capacity until you get something like I have... unable to support phone already at 92% by meter and turning off at 85%...)

One day I'll just peddle it off eBay. I had many, many problems with this device. XDA I and II were (and II still is :)) flawless and fast. I don't know what's wrong with Exec, but it was problems from the very beginning.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] Laurentius26:
Good news!

With Ivan's new Rom (AKU3.5 beta 2), MN6 is working!!!!!

I installed MN6 to storage card, not to main memory.

I'm testing it for two days now, no problems at all.

I'm using Navigon's Trireceiver with tmc and even tmc works.

YOU SHOULD GIVE IT A TRY!

Best regards, Leo:D
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] dape16:
Can that be true?

I will try as soon as I get home to night, I will install Ivans new ROM and give MN6 a go.

I had been thinking about trying MN6 with Ivans new ROM, since other users have been reporting about more RAM availible with Ivans then Helmis.

But I hadnt decided if it was worth the all the work with a new ROM yet. But since you have this great experince, I will definitly give it a try!

Thanks!
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] EastExpert:
Very interesting results.

We the others have been using stock ROMs mostly.

The reported problems were all revolving about lack of memory.

If Lt.Cmdr.Ivan's AKU 3.5 ROM provides for more memory, the problem may not be insurmountable at all.

As additional tests I'd recommend navigating somewhere, arriving at your destination, then entering another destination.

Also try looking for POI's - POI search requires lots of memory.

Also route simulation.

If you have a today plug-in that shows amount of memory free, please try to note figures before you run and right after you close it -- we need figures here :)

In other words, do many tasks, not just "enter your destination and drive and quit". We are interested how it actually releases memory...

The trademark signs of memory lacking -- problems with screen redrawing (background stays and new picture goes on top making things hardly readable), sluggishness, crashes. I wonder very much if we would see them on Ivans ROM as well!
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] Laurentius26:
Destination

I already tested the first option. I drived to one destination and than did another, on the road I tryed the MN6 options like TMC, zoomed in to maps with no problems!:) No errors at all!

I will have a look at the memory changes and let you now later.

Cheers, Leo
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] Laurentius26:
Busy?

Did you flashed Ivan's test already, tested MN6...?

I'm very curious what do you think.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] dape16:
Yes, I have been playing whole night with the new ROM and MN6.

Just like you did, I upgraded to Ivans latest, and did not install the extended ROM. After the first soft reset without any extras at all and a completely empty Today I would have 29.6 MB free RAM.

Then I installed MN6 which absolutely runs better then with Helmis ROM. But its still slow. Too slow I think. Response time for some actions is more then often a couple of seconds, really frustrating to work with.

And I did a search, ended the navigation, started another search and then it was very obvious that the memory was low and it just froze.

Right now I have soft reset my Uni and am waiting for MN6 to start a simulation for a 11km travel. 90 seconds and counting...

Coming from I-Go MN6 is painfully slow! But at least it works OK sometimes now, thanks for that!
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] Laurentius26:
MN6

Hi, thank you for your repons,

I do agree it's a bit slow in startup, but when it runs it's ok with me.

Did you install the app to storage card or to main memory?

I install most of my apps to storage card

(4gb), (Sprite backup, Egress reader, Resco Explorer, CodeWallet, PocketInformant, Chronos Alarmclock) and even now my memory after softreset is

29,98mb

, how is that possible? Did you cleared the extended Rom before flasing the new AKU?

I'm going to test today again and than I give you some memory figures before and after a ride.

Cheers Leo
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] Laurentius26:
MN6

One more thing i forgot to mention, I don't use MN6 today plugin.

Also on storage card in the map 2577 I deleted the autorun.

Sorry for this I didn't mention it before.

Keep up the good fait please, I don't tell you stories.

Leo
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] Laurentius26:
New beta 2?

Wow, I've reading Ivan's thread (page 11) about AKU 3.5 beta 2 this morning and as you can see he uploaded a new beta test 2 with the same name!

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=287270&page=11

Maybe this has something to do with it.

Leo
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] Laurentius26:
Day 3 MN6

Ok, here are my findings for day 3 with MN6

First things first, softreset, memory:

Storage 32,86mb, Program 29,62mb.

Rotated screen to landscape.

Opened Navigon, didn’t find my Trireceiver over Bluetooth so I closed it again.

Looked at memory again:

Storage 32,86mb, Program 28,45mb.

Started Navigon again, this time the treireceiver was found, gps fix in about 20/25sec.

Did a small drive (5 minutes) and closed Navigon again.

Memory: Storage 32,86mb, Program 28,04 .

Didn’t softreset my device

this time and started a second drive.

Landscape on again,

Opened Navigon, found the GPS in ones (20/25sec GPS fix again).

First destination, 10 minutes drive.

Played some with TMC settings, and added some POI’s (tankstation’s, atm’s, shopping, speedcams etc,etc)

Started driving, did a telephone call over bluetooth headset (MN6 was still running!).

At my destination point I didn’t close MN6, but started a Second destination (25 minutes), did some checkings again with POI’s, and started driving again.

While driving I mate a telephone call again, belief me everything was working smoothly.

Again, at my destination I didn’t stop MN6 but started Third destination!

Ok, then I did a

simulation

, also this is working.

Closed the simulation and drived home, while driving home I made some mistakes on the road to see how fast MN6 is calculating a new route, also this is fast (2 or 3 seconds)

At home I did one more simulation and than I closed the app.

Memory: Storage 32,86mb Program 27,30mb, that’s it!

As you can see, it’s still working with no hiccups!

I'm a happy man:D

Tomorrow I'm going to see how it will run with PocketBreeze on the Today screen.

Leo
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] dape16:
Thanks a lot for your input!

I have been trying MN6 more today.

I flashed with new ROM, and pressed reset before customization, and then unlocked and deleted everything from the Extended ROM.

So with a completely fresh device I had about 29 MB free after soft reset. I checked with the built-in memory meter in Settings.

Then I tried MN6, planning routes, simulating, browsing the map etc. Its faster then with Helmis ROM but still slow I think. Starting a simulation of a route can take minutes!

Thereafter I have installed some programs, like PocketBreeze and Pocket Weather. After a softreset I had 23-24 MB free. Then MN6 was slower and gave me some memory errors, froze etc. I deactivated everything on the today screen which would give me about 26 MB free, but thats not enough for MN6, still memory errors when planning/simulating routes, although browsing map seems to work.

I find it strange that it needs SO MUCH RAM! I was worth the try, but having PocketBreeze on my today is more important then a working MN6.

Thanks Leo for your suggestions!
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] Laurentius26:
MN6 and Pocketbreeze day 4

OK, I'm going to tell you my story of today.

Today I was thinking what the hell, I'm going to try a lot of apps and see what happens with MN6. So I installed:

Pocket Informant,

Wisbar Advance (great skinning Vista look a like)

Chronos (great alarm clock with beatiful skin),

CodeWallet,

Flexmail,

Dinarsoft HanduMenu,

Lispro,

PocketBreeze (Am I stupid?)

Pocket Mechanic Pro,

PocketXPDF,

Resco Explorer,

SK Tools (Great tweaking opportunities),

Helmi's Dialerskin,

1-Calc.

HTC X-Button, (for me better than Magic Button)

Start cleaner. (Great after softreset)

Without MN6 these apps running easy together!

I installed them all to Storage Card except Wisbar plus the utils Handymenu X-Button and Start Cleaner in the startup folder.

Ivan's Rom is still really fast!

After softreset my memor was:

Storage: 28,31mb

Program: 23,13mb

But...., than I started Navigon, startup took 35 seconds, than I filled in a destination and pushed the button haha.. frozen:( , needed to do a softreset.

Ok, so now I no Navigon needs a lot of memory while running!

You already told, I know, but I'm a hardhead!

I still don't give up because before this little accedent it was running pretty good by me (also the simulations where not a matter of minutes but seconds).

Now I removed Pocketbreeze, Wisbar and the dialeskin.

Cleared up the Windows/ AppMgr and the Program files.

With SKTools I cleared up Ram, it's called hybernate.

(I forgot, afterwords I also installed Pocketmusic an AEButton.)

After Softreset with all these apps installed:

Storage: 30,55mb

Program: 29,13mb

I tested MN6 at home and it's running again!

Tomorrow I'm going to do some driving again and tell you then my final result:D

MN6, and the world is yours!

One more thing, do you think that MN6 runs faster on a supported device with al these apps installed?

Greetings, Leo
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] Laurentius26:
MN6 Running!

One more thing I forgot to mention as well.

I do not synchronise 'My Documents and Favoriets with Activesync to keep the memory as big as possible, Data I keep on storage card (4gb).

Leo ;)
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] Laurentius26:
MN6 day 5

It's guite in here, no tests, no respons, everybody is busy in the weekend I think?:( It would be nice if we good find a solution together!

Anyway one more time my final results with MN6.

With all the apps installed now I've got the following memory numbers after sofreset:

Storage: 28,77 mb free.

Program: 28 mb free.

Navigon is running again :), startup takes 25 seconds.

Simulation, new route calculations are all functioning ok by me!

Apps installed:

@nywhere Cyberon Voice dialer,

Activekitten Chronos,

AE Software AE Button Plus

Anton Tomov Pocket Mechanic,

Ateksoft Coolcamera and Webcamera Plus,

Developer One CodeWallet Pro,

Dinarsoft Handy Menu,

Garishkernels Egress,

HTC X-Button,

Ilium software ListPro,

Omega One 1-Calc,

Paragon Software Interkey Pro,

PocketMind PocketMusic,

Pocketxpdf.net PocketXpdf,

Reensoft PiePlus,

Resco Explorer,

Resco Ftp add-In,

Resco Photo Viewer,

Resco Registry Add-Inn,

SK Software SK Tools,

Skype,

Sprite software Sprite Backup,

Tillansoft PocketNotepad,

WebIs Flexmail 2007,

WebIs PocketInformant 2007,

WebIs PocketInformant Colorschemes.

As you can see even with al this apps installed MN6 runs ok,

so it is possible to run the app!

MN6 needs a lot of free memory while running, minimum is 25 mb.

For now this is the final configuration of my device, I hope more people are going to give it a try and for now I wait till there will be an update from Navigon or that Ivan is coming with a new Rom with more memory available, I red (I thinks Ivan's post?) that in the near future maybe it's gonna be possible to include the Extended Rom for extra memory avalability, that should be awsome :D

That's it for now!

Goodluck everybody!

Leo
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] dape16:
Thanks for all your input in this matter. Just one question. What do you have on your Today screen?
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] Laurentius26:
Today screen

No apps, only tasks, Messages, date, time and agenda :rolleyes: